Is Kei Igawa Japanese for Jaret Wright?
-
- March
- 15
I have the K man for 62 pitches through three innings, 29 for strikes. He has allowed one hit with four walks and five strikeouts.
Looks like another long summer for poor Ronnie Villone.
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on Thursday, March 15th, 2007 at 7:06 pm by Peter Abraham.
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Peter Abraham
seems more like 60 pitches, pete.
by far the worst decision the organization made this winter. which is not to say it was an especially bad decision, but it was certainly the worst of this offseason.
We should dump Myers too.
It just means they need to bite the bullet and have him start the year in AAA, like they did with Contreas, El Duque and Irabu.
Unlike other years, they have options for the 5th starter/relief pitcher role.
If he continues with 20-25 pitch innings, Scranton is calling him and that’s where he should start the season.
Kei doesn’t impress me at all. He walks the ball park, and he seems to get lucky with the outs. Melky scared me when he dove for the ball, he continued to flex his shoulder after he made the play. 40 million for what?
except, as i’ve said roughly 50 times, cashman and torre have already said that igawa is in the rotation.
so it’s highly unlikely that he’ll start the season anywhere but the bronx.
jennifer,
thing is, kei didn’t really impress ANYONE. most scouts believed he’d be a reliever at best in the pros. you’re not alone.
i like his stuff. he’s making a big transition from one part of the world to another. let’s not judge him too quickly.
The Yankees lost their heads when they bid on Kei. They were very cash conscious, made good decisions, except this one. Mark it down, he is another Irabu.
Well, it’s a good thing no one’s overreacting.
Well, he’s not another Irabu because he is not a “fat toad” smoking cigarette after cigarette in the locker room.
Seriously though, he has good stuff. Just can’t locate yet.
Its going to be interesting to see how this plays out.
He isn’t a lock to be here as many think. Torre even talked about some options for him today. We just have to see if he improves in his next two starts.
I never understood why people were down on Igawa to start with. His stats in Japan were certainly respectable. Baseball Prospectus projected him to be a decent fourth starter, which would make him worth his salary.
I don’t think Igawa’s unspectacular spring is cause for alarm. He still has time to make adjustments, and he’s pitching in a new country. Give him a chance in regular season games before burying him.
Jennifer,
Your comments seem extreme, to say the least. By the way, Irabu gave the 1998 Yankees a 4.08 ERA. If Igawa gives us that and doesn’t fizzle out afterward like Irabu did, his signing will look like an act of genius.
i don’t think he’s another irabu, i just don’t think he belongs in the starting rotation. but i do think he’ll be there.
He is another Irabu? How can anyone make that statement half way thru his first ST? There needs to be be some learning curve swithing leagues, countries, his entire way of life. I thinks he looks ok so far. Just need to pound the zone more. AAA may be the best thing for him.. and it’ll help keep Karstens.
cashman’s other lefty option in the offseason was ted lilly, who got $50M for five years from the cubs. with the yanks’ luxury tax, $10M is like $14M. so lilly wasn’t feasible. igawa is making $4M per year so he’s costing the yanks nearly $6M.
when you think about it, lilly and igawa are similar pitchers. good stuff, lot of nibbling.
I’m a little uneasy about Kei after tonight. His body language was clear even if his English isn’t. He’s way down. But, we won’t need a 5th starter for a few weeks into the regular season, maybe even into May. Igawa the work in progress still has time to come around.
He needs to R E L A X. He knows how to pitch. He’s leaving the ball up or away or way down because he’s overthrowing. Maybe he’s trying too hard to impress. It’s hard to know what the problem/fix is if the communication between coach and pitcher is not easy and productive. If we get lucky he settles down. Otherwise it’s going to be a long year, considering Pavs ain’t going deep into games. Maybe Joe will split Igawa’s starts with Karstens, each one throwing four innings and Mo finishing (joke)
kasey,
I think the Igawa signing will be, at worst, an intelligent gamble that didn’t pay off.
The worst off-season move was signing Mientkiewicz.
I’d rather Cashman take a shot with Igawa than to give Lilly and Meche the contracts they received this off-season. Those were two dumb deals.
I agree with murphydog. They have to find a way to get the guy to relax and just let it flow. He has good stuff. Frankly, better stuff than the so called scouts, who anonymously trashed this signing, had to say this winter.
He just needs to locate. Plenty of time for him to make that adjustment, even if it means starting the year in AAA.
Okay maybe i’m over reacting, chalk it up to a bad day at work.
Cash should suck it up, put Karstens as the #5 and Igawa as the long reliever. I’d rather eat $46 mil and be in first place all year than stick another Japanese Jaret Wright into the rotation and be chasing everyone all year.
Mientkiewicz is only making 1.5 million for 1 year. Cashman is waiting for the FA market at 1B to be less barren than it was this past winter.
If Kei can throw more strikes he looks to be a fine 4th starter to me. Hes got a great change and a + Curve. He just needs to hit the zone a little more and hes gonna be fine.
[...] Is Kei Igawa Japanese for Jaret Wright? [...]
Let’s hope it’s a long year for Villone on some other roster.
JeterMVP,
“Mientkiewicz is only making 1.5 million for 1 year.”
Yes, I agree with you. And, in exchange for that $1.5 million, he will give us bad defense and terrible offense at first base, if he is able to play at all.
“Cashman is waiting for the FA market at 1B to be less barren than it was this past winter.”
Disagree with you on that one. Waiting means not acting. It does not mean wasting $1.5 million on a terrible player.
Igawa needs to start the season in the pen unless his control dramatically improves.
The MLB ball is smaller with the lacing feeling different that the NPB ball that he has used his entire pro career, which could very well be causing his control problems, this is a young man that averages about 50 something walks a year in 200 some innings, he has the talent and the stuff.
He is a 27 year old lefty, who has never had injury concerns who is under our control for the next 5 years at 4 per. He is a bargin, and if he doesn’t work out for us, I am very sure there is going to be a club interested in a young lefty.
Personally I would not be against the AAA/extended spring training deal, for his abilities to shine he needs to get used to the mound, the strike zone, and the ball.
Well the good news is that he didn’t give up no runs and he did have 5 strikeouts. Plus, they guy seem to have alot of moxie that every player or manager like in any player. Nevertheless, the walks are alarming and in the Major leagues unless your Nolan Ryan, you can’t get away from a bad game by issuing free passes. Look it’s Spring Training give the guy a break for crying out loud. Hey last year Jaret Wright was phenominal in Spring Training and what happen to him? Besides, the guy ceiling is probably a #4 starter and if he can have decent year that’s good in that regard.
Correction, I meant that the NPB ball is smaller…my mistake
if you look at Jaret last yr, he didnt pitch that bad at all cept he couldnt last 6 innings. People are gonna judge Igawa on 3 ST starts? we got alot more days to go! I dont think everyone in the Yankees need to be all star calibur. Every team needs it balance!
Unfortunately, becoming a “long man” doesn’t give you control. If Igawa can’t relax and get the ball down and get ahead in the count he can’t be a long man OR a 5th starter. Then it’s “Houston, we have a problem.”
Before we give up on a guy who’s never pitched in the MLB, who’s not even pitching in games that count yet, let’s fondly remember 2 other guys we drove out of town prematurely…Weaver and Contreras…
Do I care if Kei wins 20? No. I only care that he wins when it counts – Sept and October – which Weaver and Contreras did on new teams. I’d rather he stink now in Spring Training and work out the kinks. Let’s sound the alarm if he’s still bad in July/August.
like alot of people are saying, we need to relax, its still ST, hes getting 4 million a year, thats ridiculously cheap for a starting pitcher, even if he is our 5th man. seeing what was available i think cash did the right thing to take the gamble on a young lefty starting pitcher, worst comes to worst i promise some other team would take him off our hands for 4 million a year.
OK, everybody, take a deep breath….R-E-L-A-X…..
MelHall—while I agree it is early days but not sure I agree with you on the Weaver and COntreras comparison. Weaver had success with the Cardinals but lets rwemember he was cut by the Angels last year and I personally do not think Jose was going to make it in New York with all of the other issues he had going on while he was here.
Also I have heard that Igawa traditionally has ALWAYS had a slow start to his spring and season when in Japan.
MelHall27:
I actually agree with you. I just think a decision will have to be made about Iggy no later than the end of May about how best to bring him along. He doesn’t have to win 20 games, heck he doesn’t have to win 15. But if he cannot get ahead of hitters and develop better control, his MLB education cannot go on in the Bronx. I’m assuming there is a mechanism for a guy with his contract to go down to Scranton if necessary – I think he would have to agree to go. I believe I see enough talent there to stick with him until he comes around, but maybe not at the MLB level.
Murphydog – I’m with you. All for Kei to start the season in AAA to get him accustomed to MLB. My Weaver/Contreras point is you never know who’s going to be “The Man” (to quote Rick Flair) in the post-season, and there have been a few ex-Yanks to find their groove for other teams. I just feel like a lot of fans want/expect Cashman to roll out five clones of Cy Young every year or else the season is lost.
If you guys want to bitch about spring results, you should be concerned with Mike Mussina not Kei Igawa.
IF youre like me and are not going to concern yourself with performance on march 15, get over it
Heard from some friends, they said that Kei never throw in the offseason, he start throwing in Spring Training, so a slow start is expected..
Just hoped he can get ready by opening day..
calm down.
it’s spring training.
Mussina has a little better track record that Igawa.
God I dont wanna be here during the regular season.
So unlike you Peter to have such a biased slant. Guess everyone’s entitled to a bad day! Hope you have a better one tomorrow.
“cashman’s other lefty option in the offseason was ted lilly, who got $50M for five years from the cubs. with the yanks’ luxury tax, $10M is like $14M. so lilly wasn’t feasible. igawa is making $4M per year so he’s costing the yanks nearly $6M.
when you think about it, lilly and igawa are similar pitchers. good stuff, lot of nibbling.”
Actually Lilly got 4/$40M from the Cubs. For the Yankees, if you include luxury tax, that would be the equivalent of a 4/$56M contract.
Igawa cost the Yankees a $26M posting fee and another $20M for 5 years – so $5/$46M. If you include luxury tax, that is a 5/$54M deal.
So, it was either a 4/$56M deal for Lilly or a 5/$54M deal for Igawa. The right choice between those two was made.
The problem Cashman made was that he didn’t win the bidding for Matsuzaka. He should have bid $55M for him, then signed him to a 6/$50M deal. The total deal would have been about 6/$125M including luxury tax, which would have been a great deal for the Yankees given that he’s a front line starter.
@ Rich
Its spring training, having a track record doesnt mean anything on march 15th.
Mussina also has a track record of throwin higher than 85mph, want to talk about that?
the point is, stop rushing to conclusions on mar 15th, im not gonna say that again, i would think it should stick by now
the only significance of this date is that we now have a month b4 taxes are due
Once again Francesa was right, Melky can’t play Center field (sarcasm)
Damon would have never even got there!
“the only significance of this date is that we now have a month b4 taxes are due”
By far, the finest point made in this discussion.
...wait…it’s also the Ides of March.
Jeremy:
Mientkiewicz, terrible defense? Have you ever watched the guy play? If he could hit at all like he did when he first came up with the twins, he would win the Gold Glove every year, just like the one he won in 2001. He used to be a really good hitter, and for $1.5 million he is a great gamble by Cash. Who would have preferred they got for first base? Kevin Millar? I agree with JeterMVP, Cash is simply taking a great gamble until there are more viable options in the free agent market or one of the one guys proves to be an everyday player.
“Once again Francesa was right, Melky can’t play Center field (sarcasm)
Damon would have never even got there!”
Hahaah. Those guys continue to prove their ignorance about baseball everytime they talk about it. I really hope someone calls them up and asks them about that tomorrow. It is so annoying to hear those idiots tell you with authority that Melky can’t play CF because he wasn’t good there 2 years ago when he was 20 and obviously wasn’t ready for the majors.
The funniest part is that Mike thinks Bernie would be better in CF.
Josh:
Fair enough. Moose is not sharp at the moment. But over the last 15 years, Moose has been one of the most consistent starting pitchers in MLB. So there’s no doubt he’ll come around by his first regular season start (or shortly thereafter).
There is no MLB track record for Iggy. It’s hard to know for certain if his problem is transition or anxiety or the new ball or whatever. My point really is that making him the long reliever on opening day is not the answer to his control problems. I give it until the end of May because Cash and Torre won’t sit idly by if Igawa makes three starts and doesn’t survive the 5th inning each time. He may need to get out of the Bronx to relax enough to find himself.
he didnt give up any runs, and he figure out how to strike people out
he was able to strike out both jones boys
i’d say for his first 15 days in the majors it aint bad
calm down, he’ll figure it out, he’s a professional.
Taylor is right – bidding $55 M (Hideki’s # for luck) would have done it – this will be a bad signing and tax the pen like Wright did
Exactly what I would have said, Andy.
Cashman should have bid $55 million? If we’re assuming the benefit of hindsight, wouldn’t it have made more sense to bid $51.11112 million?
Um, Cash bidding 55 million for Dice-K? The previous record bid for a foreign player was, I believe, 25 million. No one had any idea the Red Sox would blow precedent away and bid over 50 million. I don’t even think anyone considered that a team would bid that much – which explains why the Sox were the largest bid by around 20 million. I’m not sure how Cash was supposed to know he was supposed to throw 55 million down.
Josh,
I refer you to my earlier post:
Rich March 15th, 2007 at 8:03 pm
Igawa needs to start the season in the pen unless his control dramatically improves.
__
But Mussina’s ST does mean far less than Igawa’s. We know that Moose can pitch effectively in MLB. Whether ot not Igawa can is still unknown.
Thank you, Melky for proving once again that Francesa is a clown.
In fact, the Sox bid $51.1 because a) for some reason, they thought someone else might be crazy and bid $50 million, so they b) pulled a Price Is Right move and bid 51 million and then c) thought someone else might do the same thing so did the double Price Is Right move and bid $51.1 million.
Just clam down people, many people here are overreacting. Daisuke Matsuzaka is struggling too. It’s just spring training.
I don’t see why people would say it’s a bad move by Cashman, unless you don’t want them to add any SP this winter? Igawa was the best option out there.
Murphy, i agree, ifhes not performing after 3-4 starts in the regular season then yank him, but throwing the hook out there now is foolish
throw in the $10M salary for dice-k and he’s costing the red sox $61.1M this season. so far, he looks pretty good. orioles announcer buck martinez compared him to hall of famer juan marichal, if only because he throws four pitches for strikes.
haven’t seen his alleged 98 mph heater yet. more like 95 and it’s hittable. he’s got a long way to go to earn his stripes, same as igawa. but he does throw strikes and is in total command on the mound.
comparing igawa to matsuzaka is just going to disappoint everyone here
Mike and the Mad Dog watch TV and read the sports pages. This is where they get their expertise from. They also have a lot of “gut” feelings. These gut feelings should be treated with respect when it comes to, say, picking what teams from the Missouri Valley Conference should make the NCAA tourney. Nevermind the fact they’ve only seen one game from that conference all year, they know – and we should listen.
Does anybody watch these guys on YES? They just read the papers while they take calls and yell over anyone that makes them look bad. A Melky/CF call will not get through the producers on the phones filtering out embarassing questions.
Maybe we can get Schilling to be their third partner – now that would be a show worth listening too.
Daisuke Matsuzaka doesn’t throw 98. He only throws around 94-95.
The genius of the Sock’s bid (I give credit when it’s due) is that they overbid on M’zaka’s rights thinking they could underbid on his contract.
They were right. Kudos to them.
let’s send Mussina to Scranton, too…
that’s it- salary dump time we aren’t undefeated in ST!!! To the ledge…GERONIMOOOOOOOO!
Igawa has good stuff. Major League stuff. $46M ($20M of which is taxable) is a drop int eh bucket and a shrewd use of the Yankees resources…much better than all $50MM of Lilly’s or last Winter’s darling- Eric Milton…
I like Igawa- as a starter or a reliever, either one. But if he has control problems he is better suited for the rotation.
i live up in new england so i’ve seen him pitch three times on local TV. dice-k hit 95 tops so far this spring and i don’t think it gets better because he’s been throwing since january. he throws 100 pitches on his off-days, an entirely different training program than we have here in the states.
there’s a lot of hype about the guy. i compare him more to a younger greg maddux. whether he’s as mentally tough as maddux is something we’ll find out this season.
“It looks like a long summer for Villone.”
Peter, it’s spring training. Guys work the kinks out. If we’re writing people off based on ST starts, Moose is garbage.
Rich…
how come when the Yankees drop $100+MM they are “financial bullies” who are “ruining the game of baseball”
the Red Sox do it and it is “genius”?
double standard
So people are suggesting that whoever struggles during spring training, we should only give them two options: AAA Scranton or DFA?
The Red Sox are definitely doing something genius, they should dumb more than $210 million into the Pacific Ocean in less than 2 months.
i can’t believe some of the stuff i am reading here. on march 15th, kei igawa has already been declared a bust 2 weeks into his 5 year deal. wow.
asburyboss,
Whatever the Yankees do will always be subject to a more searching scrutiny by the local and the national media (similar to the A-Rod nonsense that only Johnette Howard has been able to view accurately).
So of course, there is a double standard.
That reality cannot prevent me from looking at the M’zaka signing as objectively as I can.
even the media in new england now concede the red sox and yankees are alike in their spending habits. the $51.M bid sort of ruined theo’s credibility when he pleaded that the red sox were on a budget and the yanks had unlimited resources.
the yanks and sox have become the same, as sean mcadam wrote in tuesday’s providence journal.
Give me Karstens or give me death
I’m just saying if Igawa’s salary weren’t a factor (or Karstens were equal to his $4 mil a year), I’m relatively certain the verbage coming from Torre would favor Karstens as the #5 AT THE MOMENT.
Japanese pitchers are taught differently who pitch for no contact – than MLB pitchers who pitch for bad contact. I’m certain there’s going to be some learning curve for Igawa, but I’m willing to wait this out and see where the cards fall. I just know that salaries are going to come into play here. Even if Karstens pitches 28 more hitless innings, and Igawa does the one or two run game but with 5 strikeouts per game, Cash is going to lean on Igawa because they dumped $46 mil into Igawa and only have the league minimum for Karstens.
Ryan,
It’s just spring training. Calm down!
The Pyramid. Can we start calling Karstens that. Carstenz Pyramid (one of the seven summits? Any climbers out there? Anyone ever read Into thin Air?)
Karstens comes off calm, cool, no pressure. He’s got decent stuff to be a back-end of the rotation guy. At this point I’d go to war with him over Igawa and Pavano. The jury’s still out on Igawa. But if he struggles all spring… starting him in AAA wouldn’t be a bad idea. He’ll get called up WHEN PAVANO GETS HURT!
“Um, Cash bidding 55 million for Dice-K? The previous record bid for a foreign player was, I believe, 25 million. No one had any idea the Red Sox would blow precedent away and bid over 50 million. I don’t even think anyone considered that a team would bid that much – which explains why the Sox were the largest bid by around 20 million. I’m not sure how Cash was supposed to know he was supposed to throw 55 million down.”
Cashman should have realized that this would be a great signing for the Yankees, even if they did bid $55M for the guy – and then done so to make sure they got him.
Last I checked, Cashman always has said that pitching wins championships. Wang, Matsuzaka, Pettitte, Mussina, and Hughes/Pavano/Karstens would have been a really great pitching rotation and one Cashman should have spent the money to get.
“He’ll get called up WHEN PAVANO GETS HURT!”
I hope Cashman trades Pavano before this happens.
[...] Original post by Peter Abraham and plugin by Elliott Back [...]
Sunny: I agree that Igawa is the favorite to win the rotation spot, but it’s not the money that’s driving the decision. More likely, the same evaluative process that led to the Yankees’ investing $46 million in Igawa also led them to conclude that he was a better option for the rotation than Karstens or anyone else immediately available on the farm. While the Yankees should be open to reevaluating their rotation options in light of ST performances, there is only so much Karstens can really “prove” in a handful of innings against other teams’ ST lineups.
two words: spring training
To the guy that said that Jaret Wright pitched well last year,
Jaret Wright killed the bullpen last year. He had 5 total starts where he lasted less than 4 innings, 17 total starts where he lasted less than 6 innings, and only 2 starts where he lasted more than 6 innings. And he never made it to 7 innings. He averaged almost exactly 5 innings per start for the season, which is not good at all. Those consistently quick exits from the mound wore out the bullpen. So in the typical Wright start the bullpen needed to baiscally pitch 4 innings. And Wright was the #4 starter in the rotation for most of the season. Considering the fact that that the Yankees #5 spot in the rotation typically required even more work out of the bullpen than Wright did, that is a whole lot of strain on the bullpen. This is the main reason that Proctor and Villone had to pitch so many innings last year. So although his ERA might look somewhat passable, the guy had a largely negative effect on the team. Also, the main reason the Yankees got Wright a couple of years ago was to add a guy who was more of a power pitcher (compared to say, Jon Lieber, who they essentially replaced with Wright). But Wright couldn’t even strike out 100 batters last year. And his K:BB ratio hovered in the 1.5 area, which is abysmal. Unless you have a crazy power sinker like Wang, that kind of K:BB ratio usually leads to disaster. And so Jaret Wright was a huge mistake and it’s a good thing that the Yankees can use him for batting practice when they play the Orioles this year.
There is still 2 weeks left before opening day and Igawa and karstens should have atleast 2 more starts. I think the backup catcher and 1st base positions are more of a question right now.
Wow, I wasn’t aware Spring Training performance was the be all and end all. He’s struck out 12 batters in 7 innings for crying out loud! Sure his control hasn’t been there, but neither was Hughes’s. Give the guy some time. If he can continue to strike batters out like this, he’ll be successful. The control will come, it’s only his 3rd start.
Igawa reminds me of Clippard in that scouts downplay him, yet he still strikes out a ton of batters. Who knows, but I like the results so far.
Its a spring start. Relax.
Pete…how do you see Villone making this team? if he is in, who is out?
“Cashman should have realized that this would be a great signing for the Yankees, even if they did bid $55M for the guy – and then done so to make sure they got him. ”
Taylor, you seem like a smart guy, but this is a ridiculous position. i know you know what a BLIND bid is.
the Yankees bid upwards of $30M fot Matsuzaka. $35M? somewhere in that range.
in other words, they bid an insane amount of money.
there is NO WAY on earth you would have said the Yankees should have bid $55M if i asked you 10 minutes before you knew the Sox bid.
you can’t apply hindsight to a situation where you had imperfect information.
there is NO TEAM that needed Matsuzaka more than the Mets. yet they were outbid by $10-15M.
what does that tell you? that most people in baseball thought the winning bid would be $30-35M.
Andy,
“Mientkiewicz, terrible defense? Have you ever watched the guy play?”
I saw him play a few times throughout the years. Not sure what this adds to his value, though.
And yes, he is a bad fielder.
2005 FRAA: -5
2006 FRAA: -6
“If he could hit at all like he did when he first came up with the twins …”
I assume you mean three years after he first came up with the Twins, as he was a dreadful hitter (when he played at all) until then. But yes, it would be nice if he could magically return to the days when he was healthy and could hit.
Instead, we most likely get numbers like these:
2005: .240/.322/.407
2006: .283/.359/.411
Those numbers would be ok if Mientkiewicz were a utility infielder.
”... he would win the Gold Glove every year, just like the one he won in 2001.”
He won a GG six seasons ago? I stand corrected. Great signing.
“He used to be a really good hitter, and for $1.5 million he is a great gamble by Cash.”
Yogi Berra also used to be a great hitter, and according to Pete he is still a recognizable presence at camp. And we could get him for even less!
“Who would have preferred they got for first base? Kevin Millar?”
Was he available? Because he’s a better fielder and a (slightly) better hitter than Mientkiewicz.
We should have re-signed Craig Wilson. Failing that, we should have stuck with Phillips/Phelps.
“I agree with JeterMVP, Cash is simply taking a great gamble until there are more viable options in the free agent market or one of the one guys proves to be an everyday player.”
Bad back, used to be a great hitter (but hasn’t been one in years), bad fielder (but apparently looks great when you watch him play), and won a GG six years ago + $1.5 million contract = great gamble?
Thank you hmmm – if I was not clear in my post – Dice-K, like most bids with Japanese players, was a “blind” bid. So no one knows what anyone else is bidding.
Unless you hire Rove/Cheney. I think they’d have figured out a way to plant a mole in the Red Sox front office so we would’ve known to bid $60 million. ($51.2 would’ve made it a little obvious…)
I would rather see the Yankees staying away from Daisuke Matsuzaka if it would take $60M to win the bid. Spending that much money on one single pitcher is just insane. I am glad that the Yankees are not like the Giants; because we spend smart and we spend it the right way.
Look at the pressure put on U-dog to perform, and he only gets $16 million a year. Can you imagine how much pressure would go on Matsuzaka if we spent $60 million on the posting bid alone? It would be excrutiating.
“Minky” looks done this spring. Anyone read what do the Mariners might want for Sexson? Then maybe Texiera in 09?