Cold day and colder bats in the Bronx
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Apr 08, 2007 
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The Yankees have sent 18 batters to the plate since A-Rod’s homer in the first inning. Erik Bedard has retired 17 of them and allowed only four balls out of the infield.
Yankee starters through 5 games:
21.2 innings
30 hits
24 earned runs
9.97 ERA.
13 walks
What a mess. I have to think Chien-Ming Wang will be here by the next time they need a fifth starter. If Rasner has a blister, he could be sent out. They need a long man in the worse way.
I’d be really worried about this team if Wang and Karstens weren’t on the mend and the possibility of Clemens and/or Hughes pitching later this summer.
What is the latest on Karstens anyway?
“Only twice (once by Pavano, once by Pettitte) have they retired the side in order.”
That’s just pathetic.
They don’t need a long man, they need 4 starting pitchers.
April or not, its pathetic to see a team like the Yankees roll out starters as bad as these guys.
In fact, its historic. Its the worst performance after the first 5 games in the history of the franchise.
Now that we know the starters either aren’t ready (in the cases of Pettitte and Moose) or can’t pitch (in the cases of Igawa and Rasner), the issue becomes what to do about it.
In the cases of Moose and Pettitte, you have to hope they will be better in another 2-3 weeks. Andy looked better today, so that’s a plus.
Moose? You don’t just find velocity and feel in a week. At best, he is 3 weeks away. Just have to hope he can finesse his way through his next 2-3 starts and is able to give them innings.
Both Igawa and Rasner need to be off this roster. I guess you can still role them out there if you like guys with no velocity and no ability but, if you are interested in winning games, both guys need to be gone.
Wang? Would be great to see him back. However, there is no way I pitch a guy with a tender hamstring in the rotten east coast weather the Yankees are playing in at the present time. I wouldn’t have Wang on this roster until May 1 at the earliest.
Between now and May 1, they have to find 5 guys willing to take the ball, throw strikes, and not pitch afraid. Believe it or not, Pavano showed more than anybody in the first turn of this rotation. Perhaps he is one part of the solution. We will know more tomorrow.
I call up Ohlendorf and Hughes and give them a shot. Before everybody says, “they aren’t ready”, they both possess better stuff than Igawa and Rasner, two guys we already know can’t pitch. You have no way of knowing who is ready until you give them the ball and put them out there.
You have these young arms for a reason. They need to stop being cheap and worrying about starting their service time clock, call them up and put them in the rotation.
What’s the worst that can happen? They last 3 innings and get shelled? If they do, then you know they aren’t the solution and you know you have to go outside the organization to find pitching help.
Rolling out guys who can’t find the strike zone and can’t break a pane of glass with their stuff and hope (pray is more like it) they can give you innings is nuts.
Give the young guys a shot and let’s see what they can do.
How do you know that Moose needs at least three weeks? Did he tell you that? My guess is that you don’t have a clue what you are talking about.
Hughes is NOT going to be brought up until the summer. They are babying this guy for a reason.
He needs to pitch in Triple-A for a couple of months. In case you have forgotten, Hughes was anything but spectacular in ST and you don’t want to shake his confidence or destroy his arm like Francisco Liriano for the Twins and Papelbon for the BoSox last season.
It makes no sense to bring Hughes up now because he isn’t ready. He’ll get his chance sometime during the summer.
They’ve only played 5 gamss — it’s not time to panic just yet.
Their starting pitching isn’t great, but it isn’t this bad either. They will pitch better when they get out of the frozen tundra of Yankee Stadium and pitching indoors at MIN and the West Coast.
Igawa is, and always has been a slow starter. Plus, his day game ERA is over 7.00, while his day game ERA is 3.00. He’ll be fine.
The very first game in which he made a debut in JPB, he couldn’t even get “one” out before he was taken out. And he allowed 5, 6 runs, however his team, Hanshin Tigers won, just like yesterday’s game.
Why do you think Hughes is “not ready”, because that’s the Yankees party line?
He had one shaky outing in ST. EVERY pitcher has one or more shaky outings in ST.
Look at his stuff and tell me who among the starters has better pure stuff than Hughes right now? Answer….nobody.
Its hard for me to buy the Yankees party line that Hughes is worse off than Igawa and Rasner. In fact, if you examine the situation, its nuts that Hughes isn’t in the rotation right now.
He can only throw two pitches for strikes? Its one more than both Igawa and Rasner can throw for strikes and his stuff dwarfs both of those guys, regardless of his age.
Cashman and the Yankees also thought Igawa was a ML pitcher and all we see is a guy throwing straight, 88 MPH fastballs up in the zone and being surprised he can’t get anybody out. A complete waste of $40+ million dollars not off yesterday’s performance but off the stuff he has shown throughout his career. Thing is, he isn’t going to get better. He is what he is. That being the case, he is a guy who, aside from money, they don’t owe anything to with regard to a slot in the rotation.
When he gets smacked around again this week, a given with his stuff, I hope the light goes on with the front office and he goes to Scranton and they give Hughes a shot, or Wang is ready to come off the DL.
Its why the rest of baseball laughed at the Yankees for overpaying Igawa. He is no solution to their pitching issues.
How do I know Moose needs another 3 weeks? Go back to 2005 when Moose left ST in the same position he left this yr…..no velocity, and trying to manufacture it by overthrowing.
It took him until Mid-May to find it. If you think he is going to go from throwing 85 with no movement to throwing 89-91 with movement in a week, you haven’t followed his career.
There are times, and this is one of them, when he is a slow starter. This is a carbon copy of 2005 for Moose right now which is why I am not expecting much from him for at least 3 more starts.
Yes, its only one week. But, you don’t have to be Billy Beane to see that 2 of the Yankees 5 starters (Igawa and Rasner) don’t belong on the roster, two others (Pettitte and Mussina) aren’t ready for primetime yet and the other starter (Pavano) has thrown exactly 4 ML innings in over 650 days.
Not many teams would be 2-3 right now with a rotation in shambles like this one is right now. Its a tribute to their bullpen and their offense. That can’t last forever.
You can’t have the bullpen throw 6 innings every day and think they won’t be burned out by Memorial Day.
Guys with no track record don’t magically get better. Guys with a track record, if they are healthy, get better.
Right now, 3/5th of the Yankee rotation has little or no track record of ML success. Its the perfect time to give Hughes a start or two until Wang is ready. He can’t be any worse than the guys they have right now.
[...] Well at least he’s consistent with the rest of the Yankees starting pitching… [...]
Hughes isn’t ready because rushing pitchers into MLB from AA is a bad idea, especially when they don’t have the stamina built up to last through a full season. the Yankees have been careful not to overwork Hughes’s arm thus far, and he needs some work with higher pitch counts at the AAA level to avoid injury when he makes the final leap.
The starters have been awful thus far, but I can’t recall a single April in recent memory when the Yankees haven’t stumbled out of the gate. I don’t know if they have an inferior Spring Training program or if they just don’t care about April, but it always seems to take the Yankees a little longer than everyone else to get into the swing of things.
As I’ve said before, you don’t put a 20-yr old kid in this kind of situation where he has never pitched above Double-A and still learning in the Minors.
Remember when the young flamethrowers — Mark Prior and Kerry Wood — were mowing everyone down early in their careers but are now more injury prone than Glass Joe?
There is a long list of young phenoms who turned it up early and hurt themselves — never to be the same again. Cashman will not let that happen to Hughes.
I remember a guy by the name of Jared Wright who threw nothing but smoke for the Tribe back in 1997 and basically carried that team to the World Series — only to hurt his arm and he has never been the same.
Last season, it was Francisco Liriano mowing everyone down for MIN and where did it get them?
Nothing. Liriano blew out his elbow and had Tommy John surgery. Now, the Twins are screwed because he won’t play this season.
These examples are exactly why Cashman is taking it easy with Hughes while keeping him on limited pitch counts and not putting him on the big league roster until he is both physically and mentally ready to make that trip to the major leagues — and stay there.
Letting this guy air it out now is foolish because the kid could hurt himself trying to impress everyone or he could get hammered by major league hitters and destroy his confidence.
You don’t treat your future franchise pitcher like that for a couple of measly wins in April. He will be in the rotation sometime during the summer.
Also, Rasner is not part of the regular rotation — he is an emergency starter until the regulars come back. Igawa is in the rotation right now because of his contract and because his overall numbers in ST were actually pretty good.
Rasner will be the first one bumped from the rotation as soon as Wang and/or Karstens get healthy.
Moose has always been a finesse pitcher who changes speeds a lot. He is 38 years old and the temperature was 35 degrees so he probably had a hard time getting loose as a result.
The freezing cold probably affects older pitchers more than the young guys.
Moose was pitching at his normal pace in ST, so he should be fine.
Jeez, it’s only the first week of the season. It’s not time to panic.
It’s not like the Red Sox are mowing everyone down. They’ve been playing in much warmer climates (KC and Texas) and they are still having trouble scoring runs against not exactly formidable pitching staffs.
“Both Igawa and Rasner need to be off this roster. I guess you can still role them out there if you like guys with no velocity and no ability but, if you are interested in winning games, both guys need to be gone.”
overreact much? let’s give Igawa 4-5 starts before we declare he has “no ability”. 5 innings into a 5 year contract and you want to get rid of him. have a little patience.
“I wouldn’t have Wang on this roster until May 1 at the earliest.”
that’s just silly.
Based upon their track records and previous history- both Mussina and Iagawa are slow starters. Pettite hadn’t pitched in more than 1 week and was still getting over his back spasms. 35′ temp sure didn’t help him. Pavano is still building arm strength- he was fine until his velocity droped in his last inning. Rasner is a place holder until either Wang or Karstens comes back. If all are still struggling on June-1 then we have some problems to worry about.
I hope the rotation improves in the near term, otherwise the Pen will be fatiqued by summer. Over the course of the season, it is more important for the starters to throw at least 6+ innings then to have sub 3 ERAs. The way this team is constructed, a low 4 ERA and 6+ip = a win.
maybe it’s just me, but i’m not really worried about our starters. concerned, yes. but worried? too soon. our guys are older than most and i think the cold affects them more because of that. all of the games have been pretty much offensive from both ends. we’ll see a different rotation in minnesota.
oh, and with last wednesday’s rain out. i would have kept moose as thursday’s starter and let pettitte throw another bullpen on wednesday. igawa friday, pettitte saturday,…. but my last name isn’t torre