Update on Hughes
-
- May
- 1
Yes, it’s a left hamstring and it’s a “significant” one according to Brian Cashman and Joe Torre.
Given the Mike Mussina was just out three weeks with a minor tear, you can expect Hughes to be out 6-8 weeks at the very least.
Hughes told us that he reached back on that 0-2 pitch to really bury a curveball to Mark Teixeira. He extended his left leg too much and that’s how he was injured.
Could this have happened in Scranton? Obviously it could have. But Hughes would not have been reaching back to try and make a great pitch to a hitter like Teixeira in Scranton.
There’s a reason prospects pitch in the minors. It’s to develop their bodies along with their skills. Hughes was pitching in high school at this point in 2004. Tonight he was in the majors trying to finish off Mark Teixeira. His arm was ready. His left hamstring wasn’t.
It’s a shame the Yankees got to the point where they had to bring him up in the first place. Now he’ll be out two months and will have to start all over again.
Could this have happened in the minors? Sure. Would it have? That’s something we will never know.
Brian Cashman’s face was ashen after the game as we talked to him. Had this been the kid’s elbow or shoulder and not his hamstring, he would have had a lot of explaining to do.
Back later with some Hughes audio.
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on Tuesday, May 1st, 2007 at 11:51 pm by Peter Abraham.
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Peter Abraham
Good to know. He’ll be back. Thanks for the info Pete
Moose is also in his late 30s and Phil is 20, but man he pitched so well, and to see he’s gonna be out 2 months and probably won’t return to the majors this year I feel like it was a big tease, I mean who needs Clemens when you got Hughes? Anyways hopefully he comes back stronger.
Hughes will be on espn in a few minutes
jesus christ, what else is going to go wrong with our pitching? hopefully wangs “hangnail” will not turn out to be something worse
Thank you for the update! Some people on your blog are ridiculous. Great work Pete!
Hughes has had bad mechanics with the Yankees, you can look it up. Just way off on his mechanics really.
Can’t say I’m surprised you’re playing the “he was rushed” angle. Blech.
Cash should still have explaining to do for the bozo strength and conditioning guys he hired.
I am not sure we’ll see him in the majors again this year, but I am optimistic he’ll recover and be down in Scranton by July.
I’d be very surprised if they bring him back to the big league club at all in ‘07.
I’ve heard this one before:
“That was my favorite spring. I could do anything.
Full six feet tall and lean, I was just seventeen.
My fastball was nothin’ but smoke. My curve ball snapped and broke
My change-up made ‘em look bad. They couldn’t hit a thing I had.
“I was throwin’ a no-hitter the day McArthur got fired.
They were going down like ten-pins. I really had ‘em wired.
Bottom of the seventh throwin’ easy as can be
Something snapped in my shoulder. That was all she wrote for me.�
Tom Paxton, My Favorite Spring
I hope the kid recovers well and has a long career.
If you don’t think Phil would have reached back to bury a 0-2 curve in A, AA or AAA than you obvioulsy have no clue what kind of competitor he is. Sometimes I think you need to get off your high horse he overstrided its unfortuante it more bad luck for this staff but as you said it could have happened anywhere at any time.
I think its a stretch to try to blame this on the callup. If he had been pitching a no hitter through six in Scranton he may also have wanted to throw a big curve.
losersz.. his mechanics are perfect… compact and smooth.
you can pull a hammy mowing your lawn, the rushing him angle is a joke…...
he would push to strike out a loser in the minors no different.. he is 20 not 15…
BTW he has huge upside, he dominated those guys. The Yanks have not had a pitcher dominate like that since Clemens in the playoffs against the Mariners…....
Check this page out, got it in Pending Pinstripes. It might explain Hughes first start in the bigs.
http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/if-it-aint-brokea-video-review-of-phil-hughes-mechanical-changes/
It’s a shame about him, I hope he heals. I’m betting Rasner is comming up since DeSalvo only has 20 innings in 4 games.
Came home from LaGuardia airport to see this. Breaks my heart.
Hey Pete-
When do you think we can expect to see Phil in the Majors again? Obviously they will be overly cautious (and rightfully so) during his rehab, but do you think he comes back to the majors or they just put him in the minors for the remainder of the year?
Drew,
I don’t think he trained with Marty Miller. I could be wrong, but I think he left the big league spring training camp early and this is a fluke injury.
But Miller’s program should be under investigation, if only for the other injuries running rampant throughout the clubhouse.
Whether Hughes is on the DL or in the minors, he’d equally be of no use to the team. The only silver lining is that if this team IS able to make the playoffs, they should have a fresh Hughes to ride. Also, they no longer have to worry about watching his innings because the injury has taken care of that concern. Now, we just need someone to be the fifth starter: Clippard? Rasner? Pavano? That last suggestion was a joke.
I’m sure if he were 21 or 22, he’d have reached back to try to K Teixeira too.
And he’d still be young, and he’d probably still have pulled his hamstring all else being equal.
The “rushing him up” excuse is ridiculous. Do we wait until he’s 25?
The best way i can look at this is that maybe this will be a blessing in disguise.
This is a significant chunk of innings hughes will not NOT pitch and it means the yankees wont overuse him now in may to compensate for the lousy rotation
Wow! I am in utter shock. I can’t remember the last time I felt so “up” and then so “down” this quickly. The kid was amazing. What a lousy break. Just thankful it wasn’t his arm.
I’m not superstitious, but it’s hard not to think this team is jinxed. How much friggin bad luck can we overcome?
What’s next, a safe lands on Pettitte tomorrow? We better start bubble wrapping the starting staff.
Sorry Peter, but this time I really disagree. Should Moose be sent back to the minors because his “body isn’t ready”? How about Wang? Cano? How about the tons and tons of other players going down with Hamstring injuries already this year on all teams? I understand what you’re saying about “Well, he wouldn’t have been trying to hard to strike out Texeira”, but that doesn’t mean it had anything at all to do with the minors. He wasn’t at 100+ pitches, he was at 80, so it’s not like this was unseen territory for Hughes.
[sarcasm]Gee, I didn’t expect to see Peter on here talking about how he was right that the Yankees were bringing up Hughes prematurely![/sarcasm]
Seriously, give it a rest Peter. I know you’re having a rough night because Hughes looked dynamite while Boston blew a 4-2 lead going into the ninth with the next Mariano Rivera on the mound, facing the bottom of the lineup for Oakland. Even your updates DURING the no hitter were just buzz killers.
This injury could’ve happened in Scranton and has absolutely nothing to do with his early promotion. A veteran could’ve had this happen to them if THEY were excited about throwing a no hitter.
The idea that this happened becuz Hughes was pitching somewhere other than Scranton is embarrassingly simplistic. Seriously, it’s worth saying ‘embarrassing’ twice. The notion that he doesn’t ‘reach back’ when pitching in AAA? Similarly weird. And I use ‘weird’ advisedly. I understand you’re invested in being proved right regarding the call-up. Citing bad luck as proof of your wisdom is probably not the best way to go, however.
I cried when I saw that , but I’m glad it’s just the hamstring I thought hyperextended his knee at first, but I still cried no hitter in his second big league start , this kid has it. And it makes me sick to watch Pavano split screens of him on top of the dugout after watching what happened w/ Hughes
Also, keep in mind that THREE Yankee prospects have gone down to Tommy John surgery in the past year. Between the three of them, they have thrown NO major league pitches.
Well, maybe now we can use up his innings quota from August to October instead.
Get well, Phil.
I’d promote Darrell Rasner.
Thanks Erik for posting the link, because it is the truth. He has changed his mechanics drastically.
Thanks Pete. There was quite some ridiculousness going on in the comments for the post before this.
Out of curiosity, what are our (Pete’s) thoughts on the trainer?
I don’t think we should be firing anyone off the bat, but it seems like something the admins should be looking into. 3 hammy injuries in one month might be a coincidence, but it looks pretty bad.
Wang, Mussina, Pavano, Karstens, Hughes…what’s in the water in the Bronx?
I feel really uncomfortable lumping Pavano in that group, Will. I’m fairly sure everyone else there cares.
By “our” I meant “your”.
6-8 weeks sounds about right, but that stinks because Hughes seems to be a guy who we can rely on to pitch about 6 innigns, and give us a chance to win every time out. But of course, we won’t be seeing him for a couple of months now.
At least a Rocket/Mini Rocket 1-2 punch combo in the World Series is still possible.. ...alright fine, I might be getting a little ahead of myself now, but that does sound sweet, does it not?
Yeah, what do I know? The kid said he overextended on a curveball and his stride was too far because he was really wanted to bury a pitch against a great hitter like Teixeira.
I’m sure trying to finish off a no-hitter in the big leagues is just like pitching 6 innings in Scranton.
I’m sorry this happened because it would have made a great story. But you could see this coming a mile away. The Yankees have totally babied this kid for 3 years and now threw him into the fire. This is hardly a surprise.
Are you serious Peter? Hamstring pulls are the most unpredictable injuries in the sport. Wang hurt his hamstring in spring training while he was JOGGING. To blame this injury on the circumstances is absurd.
Pete, so I guess Wang’s and Moose’s hamstrings weren’t ‘ready’ for the majors either? Or Karsten’s leg?
Give it a rest. I know you want to be proven right, but on certain topics you get really disingenuous. You don’t get to be an iconoclast if you’re flat-out wrong.
Wow Peter, do you want to rain on the parade anymore? I feel like if Hughes tripped in the shower you’d say something like “Well in Scranton that showers have a big mattress inside of them for the purpose of catching a falling prospect. But in the bigs, the showers don’t have mattresses in the showers.”
Right becuz, for example, 20 year-olds simply can’t take the wear and tear. In the NBA. Or at AC Milan. Oh, wait. Except for baseball. C’mon, Pete. This is absurd. They weren’t babying anyone due to concerns about…his hamstrings.
As for what you know? Regarding athletes and injuries? Less than you should.
Er, a few typos in that last one.
Adam, heh. That makes about as much sense. No mattresses in the showers!!
You’re missing the point Peter. It’s not that he over strode. It’s that ANYONE COULD’VE DONE THIS. NOT JUST HUGHES. In the words of my friend Tony “It’s okay to be wrong”.
Pitching-wise, they’re running out of options and tricks. I guess they keep the pipeline open between the Bronx and Scranton, but that’s it. I don’t think Clemens is an option, and I don’t think they should make a trade, this problem is bigger than getting one more arm.
Of course, next year could be really special if they manage to hold on to the kids and not make knee-jerk trades. A rotation in the next 18 months that includes a healthy Hughes and a healthy and effective Humberto Sanchez would make me very happy.
Sorry guys. I’m not a fan. I can only report on what people tell me and write based on many years of covering sports. I really wish this hadn’t happened. But if you look at how they developed him, April was not the target date for going to the majors. September was.
There’s a reason Cashman said what he said in spring training. He and Torre both said he wasn’t ready and needed to get stronger, pitch more, etc. The only thing that changed in 3 weeks was that guys got hurt and they got desperate.
I’m sorry he got hurt, I like the kid a lot and it was fun to watch him pitch. But I can’t apologize for not being surprised.
I’m not not a fan. I’m a reporter.
“His arm was ready, his left hamstring wasn’t”
Wow. Not to call names here, but your constant mindless dribble proves you to be a media hack. A lesser man than I would just call you fat.
And when he was 11, he reached back to strike out Jimmy Smith, the pony league HR champ, but nothing bad happened that time.
And when he was 15, he REALLY reached back to strike out Joe Johnson, that punk from Valley High that stole his girlfriend, but nothing happened.
On his first minor league start, he threw as hard as he could trying to prove his first round pick status, but luckily nothing happened.
This time, he reached back and something happened. Life is funny like that.
Pete, he said he did the same thing in high school. Was he pitching against Texiera’s younger brother or something when that happened?
Attributing this injury to a competitive kid’s desire to finish off a great hitter pretty much suggests that no, you really don’t know anything. If Hughes weren’t this competitive, he wouldn’t be the pitcher he is. He absolutely would have just as much of a shot doing this in Scranton as anywhere else. But hey, I guess being considered the best pitching prospect in baseball with the New York Yankees grooming you to be their ace for years to come suggests he probably wouldn’t have tried to bury any curveballs against anyone in AAA.
Your logic is impenetrable. Way too dense for me to cut through.
Ok, by the way, no where in that article does it say that Phil Hughes is doing something new and terribly awful to his hamstrings.
Did you actually read it Gonzo? I believe (and this is from a cursory reading) it talks about how his shoulder is now flying open a bit and how, in general, he’s losing a little bit of velocity because it is taking a bit longer for him to flip his arm over because he changed his arm slot. Why is this probably? So his curveball would be more effective/devastating like it was tonight. He is still, as always, drifting his leg through the delivery. This is a good thing.
But in no part has anything with his legs changed whatsoever since his call up. So that’s just incredibly dumb.
Morever, I gotta agree with everyone here. It is without a doubt embarassingly simplistic and borderline idiotic to say that this injury has anything to do with being in the Majors. He could have done that whilst down by 4 runs in the 2nd inning in a crappy start at Scranton. He could have slipped on the mound and done that in a throwing session. Christ, he could have done that getting out of a hot tub. It’s a hamstring!
If anything, tonight is just one shining testament to the MLB-readiness of this guy. If anyone can say, honestly after watching this guy DOMINATE a MLB line-up that he needs to be in the minor you’re just an idiot. It would be a digusting waste to leave him down in the minors ever again, except for rehab. You know this guy is 6 foot 5, 220 right? He isn’t a baby. Conditioning (like working out) is something you do between starts—when he’s not pitching. He can do that in the show. He’s up to it physically. It’s not like he’s an inbred European Prince here who bleeds when you sneeze in his direction. What he actually needs is a guy like The Rocket around, to show him some trade secrets, like the routine that Andy and him used to do.
I mean, if anything, tonight is still a huge huge vicotry. It’s the most exciting pitching we’ve seen from a Yanks pitcher in a long time. We’ve got a real ace in the making.
Mad props, Phil. We’ll be waiting for you in July.
We all know you’re a Sox fan. You’re just upset about Papelbon’s velocity and blown save.
Peter – HE HAD THE SAME INJURY IN HIGH SCHOOL.
Wang & Mussina both pulled their hamstrings – Wang jogging, Mussina pitching.
Were they called up too soon?
“There’s a reason prospects pitch in the minors. It’s to develop their bodies along with their skills.”
How many years did Nolan Ryan spend in the minors? Or most pitchers who enjoyed long careers in baseball? If we’re going to keep Phil in AAA until he’s 27, then we’ve just wasted 4+ quality years on a quality arm.
In the end, it doesn’t matter. Whether he’s on the DL in the majors or on the roster in the minors, he’s still not pitching for the Yankees.
Posted this in the latter thread, but I want to make sure its seen. So once more with feeling.
Sox fan here.
I just want to say.. this sucks guys. Your ace was looking beautiful and you guys were clearly earnign the RIGHT to boast over us for a day. A no-hitter from your rookie and a blown save by Paps. It should have been YOUR day.
This sucks for you and I can not feel good about it. Indeed, I’m deeply saddened. Kid deserved more.
I don’t think ANYONE is suprised when a pitcher gets hurt. Pitchers drop like flies (particularly pitchers wearing a Yankee uniform this year). You’re really stretching here Peter. Was Dontrelle Willis’s hammy not ready in 2003? When he was gasp 21? I mean, come on Peter he’s not 95 years old. He’s 20 years old with young, fresh and strong legs.
Guys, Pete’s not exactly making stuff up here.
Sure, hammy injuries are unpredictable, but they’re not random. They happen for a reason, even if you can’t always predict those reasons. Hughes’ hammy didn’t just randomly get pulled, something in his motion on that pitch did it.
Yeah, it happens to a lot of veteran pitchers. But when your young top prospect gets pulled into the big leagues considerably ahead of schedule, and then gets hurt, then I think it’s reasonable to raise your eyebrow.
Anyway, this is all pointless. Hughes is hurt, for whatever reason. The Yanks got the win, so they just need to stay on track and keep making up games in the division.
Don’t reporters just report and not theorize and backdoor moralize about what might happen in the minors rather than the majors? This is another example of trying to make news through spin than just giving the truth and whether or not this would have happened anywhere else is unknowable.
Seriously, what the hell are all you people doing here? Why come to this blog just to tear apart the guy who writes it?
I’m fine with disagreement, but even I’m troubled by the number of trolls on this blog. Disagree, fine, but don’t insult Pete for telling us his opinion. If you don’t agree, and a lot of you seem to constantly disagree, then stop coming here.
I just don’t get what the point of all this insulting is. Some of us are here so we can read what a great beat reporter is saying, and then have some good sports talk in the comments. We’re not here to read a bunch of anonymous jerks insult the author.
Grow up, guys.
“There’s a reason Cashman said what he said in spring training. He and Torre both said he wasn’t ready and needed to get stronger, pitch more, etc.”
His hamstring hasn’t been fully developed yet?
Concern from the franchise was, and is, about his arm. Something as unpredictable as a possible hamstring injury is not an aspect that teams groom prospects around. They are hurt randomly, by the old, by the young, by the experienced, by the inexperienced, by minor leaguers, by major leaguers.. If Phil had hurt his shoulder, his elbow, anything, you’d have some sort of point.
I don’t think I’m as upset about this as everyone else is, because it means less innings on Hughes’s arm this year. If anything, all it does is bring him closer to the original September plan.
This Hughes is up to early and should be treated like a little leaguer has to stop. Its easy to mention the two most freakishly injury-prone in Prior and Wood as examples. Or the painfully over the top violent motion of Felix Hernandez. Or Liriano. But what about Willis? Peavy? Oswalt? Or even Zito. These guys were pretty young when they came up and have been pretty durable work-horses. Its irresponsible to continually use 4 injury-prone pitchers as examples to why its bad to have a young pitcher up to “early”. Its clear from tonight that Hughes probally has the best stuff out of any Yankee pitcher. Why not use that? Its a shame he got hurt, but anyone who has pithed in their life knows you throw every pitch at every level like its the most important one you’ve ever thrown.
Pete, you sound like a total hack when you post garbage like this. He didn’t pull a hamstring because he was “rushed”. If you didn’t notice, the “rushed” prospect took a no-hitter into the 7th inning. It’s just an unfortunate freak accident that could have happened just as easily in Scranton.
The only thing funnier than Pete’s rationale for Hughes’ injury is commenters chastising other commenters based on what they write.
Kurticus Maximus = Peter Abraham = Peter Griffin = Spence from “King of Queens”
“Hughes’ hammy didn’t just randomly get pulled, something in his motion on that pitch did it.”
Word is that Wang was trying to jog “really hard” during spring training when he pulled his hamstring, according to an unnamed source.
Well, that does it. Apparently this happened to Hughes when he was in high school. Why they promoted him from middle school is beyond reason. No wonder he got hurt.
Wow. First, Jake tells me he’s going to “puke on my face.” Then Sassy tells me I’m Peter Griffin.
Clearly it’s time for bed. This place is just getting ridiculous.
Hey Peter you weren’t thinking about Hughes pulling his hamstring up until the point he pulled it with him pitching no-hit ball, and you’re an out and out liar if you tell me otherwise. Your “his hamstring wasn’t ready for M.L.B. yet” argument is ingenious at best and the classic second-guess. Your “he reached too far back to strikeout Texiera” is specious because what makes you think on some nights, maybe many nights in AAA, he wasn’t reaching back to strikeout the best AAA hitters? I’m pretty sure he was doing so with some if not many of those strikeouts. Some guys are so on your pitches you have no choice but to power it past them. No way he took it easy with all 10 strikeouts of Syracuse Sky Chiefs (his last minor league start). I just don’t see it.
You say what do you know? Obviously not as much as I expected from a beat writer for a major N.Y.C. area newspaper. You come off like an arrogant, second-guessing knowitall, cuz what was Torre supposed to do? Take Hughes out after 6 1/3 IP of no-hit ball, only 83 pitches, and 0-2 on Texiera? I say only 83 pitches cuz Hughes threw 91 pitches (8 more than tonight) in 4 1/3 IP. Torre would’ve most likely pulled Hughes after 7 IP or giving up a hit with a 9-0 lead, whichever came first. I could even see Torre pulling him after 90 pitches no matter where he was at 90 (0-2 on whoever). Basically Hughes was an out or two away from being done for the night. Had Texiera walked or got a hit off Hughes, Torre probably would’ve taken him out. It was a bad break.
Hamstring injuries happen from improper stretching. I run track and you see it all the time. Recently, our team got a new coach and put in a new stretching style. Guess what happened, 4 runners were out for a 4 weeks with hamstring pulls. The new trainer on the yankees clearly doesn’t know what the hell he is doing. If the yankees kept there original trainer, we wouldnt be having this convo on Hughes. Plus, Pete if you didn’t see from todays game, Hughes is ready. He dominated a pretty potent lineup there at the age of 20.
You’d have to be a moron to think that Hughes shouldn’t have been brought up until September.
I think going forward, all Yankee pitchers should throw underhand, and use softballs. Not the actual softballs used in beer leagues, I mean actual *soft*balls. As in “Nerf”.
Blaming the Yankees for his injury is stupid—he didn’t hurt his elbow or shoulder; he hurt his LEG. It was a freak accident and it could have happened on any mound. Stop trying to prove you were right and just lament this kick in the gut like everyone else.
Some of you people are real nitwits.
We’re all upset this happened.
But taking out your frustration on Pete for his take on the situation is ridiculous.
matt desalvo is on the same rest as phil and has dominated in 3 starts in scranton. let’s see him on the mound sunday. that said, i am sick about tonight’s roller caster. get well soon, phil.
Made me sad to hear what happened to Hughes. He pitched well tonight.
Did you guys notice that all the younger pitchers really made efforts to pitch..as opposed to Pavano..
Karsten was trying to pitch on a broken leg.
Wang stayed and pitched ~6 innings even after he’s hit in his first start out of DL, and when he’s got a cracked fingernail in his second start.
Hughes pitched his tail off and pulled his hamstring..
Meanwhile Pavano is out indefinitely because of “sore forearm”
Bob, I don’t think anyone is taking frustration out on him. We’re pointing out that in out opinion, his opinion is off base and centered around proving that he was “right” all along.
the plan might have been to bring up phil in sept, the plan might have been to just use mariano one inning, and the plan might have been to start the season above 500. But then again, if everything goes to plan, we would have more than 27 rings. So they called him up in may, and so he got hurt, its baseball, its unpredicatable, its why you play the game. Its why he was called up in April, its why we need to use mariano for more than one inning and its why we are under 500. He got hurt, stuff like that happens, not because he is in the bigs, but because its bad luck, pure and simple.
Bob,
Bob its not displaced frustration we’re displaying. Its just that Pete has been going on for quite some time about how Hughes shouldn’t be up because 4 young talented pitchers are injured. So from the time he took that stance he has used it for every negative spin on Hughes. I like what Pete does here but I think he is way off on this topic.
You people are really lame. Why don’t you do some research on Hughes and you would know that he hasn’t really thrown all that many innings since turning pro. To be in the show right now is a bit of a stretch, no matter the talent. Dude is 20 years old!
Hey “I’m Always Right”
Peter had no suspicion about Hughes pulling a hamstring from his blog entry before this one cuz he asked everyone if Torre should pull Hughes after 7 IP. That right there shows you, Peter, were giving Hughes at least 7 IP and probably thought he would not get hurt to get the last two batters out to pitch 7 IP. It’s perfectly understandable and you should admit it. No one, not you, me, or anyone, predicted Hughes would pull his hamstring. Sure it’s a thought in one’s mind but you could say that about every player including Jeter. I’m pretty sure most people in the Yankees organzation were thinking more of an arm injury much, much more than a pulled hamstring.
Hughes looks absolutely amazing. His 3 pitches all look legit and that curve is dynamite. I don’t know what else you think this guy needs to do to get ready.
Hamstring injuries are freak accidents. There are no ways to prevent them by building muscle. You simply do your stretching and hope nothing happens.
M. Cain, Kazmir, C. Hamels, etc. were all brought up very young and seem to be just fine. There is only so much you can baby these guys. Clearly he has the stuff and is ready for the majors.
I enjoy the blog but the hammy comment is a total stretch. Sorry.
No DeSalvo in the majors—he still hasn’t fixed his walk bug. He didn’t give up any runs tonight, but he walked five in six innings. He has major control issues.
Rasner will be the first called up, and then Tyler Clippard after that, I assume.
I think the only rational reaction to Hughes’ injury tonight is: life really, really, reallllllly sucks.
” Wang hurt his hamstring in spring training while he was JOGGING. To blame this injury on the circumstances is absurd.”
he was running sprints. he wasn’t jogging. get your facts staight.
Hey rbizzler did you type this before or during Hughes’ no-hitter through 6 1/3 IP? No, and you didn’t think it either. No one did. Hughes was sailing along. Stop second-guessing.
Fluke maybe. Because of the conditioning program? Sure, because you know so much about it. People are lame because Hughes was rushed and they don’t want to admit it, they just want their new toy. Sorry, but it doesn’t work that way
The talent is there, the innings are not. He hasn’t thrown all that many in the minors (I think @ 235 total). That’s about what Santana threw last year, so he needs a little more time to get strong. Patience, people….
does anyone remember another pitcher overstriding to get more on a pitch and hurting themself? that’s seems like a very weird thing to do. a pitcher’s foot lands in almost the same spot every time. it’s hard for a coach to get a pitcher to change their stride. that was a clear case of overthrowing. i agree with pete. i don’t thing he would have done it at scranton.
hey Peter-
long time reader, first time poster-afraid I’m gonna join the crowd and respond to your bizarre assertion re the injury being because Hughes was rushed with a hearty WTF?Step back from all the details for a sec and just look at how a relative outsider would view what you’re claiming: the rookie pitcher, within his pitch count and throwing a no-hitter, overstrides and hurts his hammy. ON MAY SECOND.
You’ve been setting your readers up for an I-told-you-so if PH is overworked and comes up with a sore arm in August. That’s fine, that’s your right. But you don’t get to have it both ways and claim that ANYTHING that goes wrong is b/c he was called up to soon. HE HAD THE SAME INJURY IN HIGH SCHOOL. All you’re doing with this claim is discrediting your original, perfectly reasonable position re. caution.
What does innings have to do with a hamstring injury like this? Do Wang and Mussina need more innings to pitch for the big league team?
What did Phil do to show that he can’t get big league hitters out and that he wasn’t ready to handle this?
He didn’t hurt his arm. Outside of the first inning of his first appearance, he didn’t over-throw. Hell, even his maligned change up looked good. If they kept a check on his innings at the big league level just like they were going to do down in AAA, what was he going to learn down there that he couldn’t learn up here? The only people who really hit anything he threw hard were Thomas and Wells—he ain’t going to learn to get out those types down in AAA.
Oh, and the cw from non-partisan people who pay attention [eg, Baseball Prospectus] is that on any other team PH would’ve begun the year in the rotation.
“Fluke maybe” rbizzler? Oh please, you’re grasping at straws. At least come out and say it was a fluke. Aaron Small going 10-0 was a fluke. WTF do you know about it? You’re lame cuz you weren’t thinking Hughes was rushed while he was giving HANDS-DOWN the BEST performance by a Yankee starter this year. I guess one could say Pavano’s win was the best cuz well, it was Pavano haha, but Hughes certainly turned in the most masterful start by a Yankee. He dominated Texas after walking the first batter of the game starting with the 6-4-3 double-play right after that walk.
Hughes was not rushed. He was called up because Chase Wright was barely good vs. Cleveland and downright awful vs. Boston thus a third start by him considering was unacceptable, Humberto Sanchez was placed on the 60-day d.l., Ross Ohlendorf wasn’t ready yet and might’ve not been able to pitch that day if he was, ditto for Tyler Clippard and Steve Jackson. Hughes’ turn was Thurs.4/26 then last night Mon.5/1. He was the best option outside of a trade and I doubt Cashman makes a trade for a 1-3 starrt guy, plus trades are rarely made in April although Oakland’s g.m. Billy Beane made a few recently.
He is young, that is the point. He is still growing into his frame. It has nothing to do with the talent.
So he hurt his hamstring because he is “still growing into his frame?”
This is getter better each post.
237 innings total as a pro and he wasn’t rushed? I enjoyed the performance tonight as he was nasty. That doesn’t change the fact that he could still use some time to grow.
And apparently he will be done growing into his frame in four months.
So what he’s still young? Dwight Gooden was young. So was Clemens and Dontrelle Willis, to name few of many. Look, if he’s ready, he’s ready. He pulled a hamstring. Mussina did. By your logic, Mussina is too old (39). You name me one starting pitcher in say the Mets rotation as good as or better than him besides Glavine. There isn’t any M.L.B. starter he couldn’t go toe-to-toe with on any given day.
Name me one AA or AAA starter in the Yankees farm system who should’ve been called up before Hughes. Wright was the best of AA and you saw what he did.I checked the stats for AAA Scranton, Ohlendorf has been crap, so forget him. Again, Sanchez is out (60-day d.l.) Now Karstens is out. I think Rasner is hurt too, but he was up here and sucked. Pavano is still out. Mussina hasn’t actually pitched yet, something could happen between now and before his start this Thurs. Something could happen during or any time after his start as he is 39. Clippard and Jackson couldn’t pitch the days Hughes started. Hughes was the man. He pitched 4 1/3 innings and 91 pitches 4/26 then 83 pitches. He would’ve done that with AAA Scranton. Anyone can pull a hamstring in case you haven’t noticed this year (Wang, Mussina, Pavano, Matsui).
Did Pavano actually pull a hammy? I always forget what fake injury he has at the given moment.
So if they waited until Sept. to call him up and he still pulls his hamstring would he still have been rushed?
Pavs is out with soreness in the ole forearm I believe, but it could be the elbow as well.
Guggisto, I agree that it was best for the big team that Hughes was called up when he was. Clearly a better option than anyone else. I just am not sure it was the best move for him (although I wanted it to be so). I am not playing the “i told you so card.”
I assume he would have been still “growing into his frame”
Pavano is still growing into his frame…..
A professional baseball player got injured. Playing baseball. Hard hitting sports journalism Peter. Even within an industry full of clowns, you have beclowned yourself.
Your wrong on this one. He could just as easily got hurt in AAA. Cashman is doing all he can do to keep this ship going till everyone gets healthy and we get the Rocket in here.
“If you don’t think Phil would have reached back to bury a 0-2 curve in A, AA or AAA than you obvioulsy have no clue what kind of competitor he is.”
To all the morons that think the competitve juices of an inexperienced 20 year-old flow in Scranton PA one tenth of those he had going during the second start of his MLB career as he closed in on a no hitter . . . .
Did I say morons? Who should be throw into the fire next?
What happened to Hughes tonight can happen to anyone, it had absolutely nothing to do with his age. I am sure the fact that he was pitching a no hitter didn’t help either to want and throw the perfect pitch. But whether it happened at 20 or they brought him up at 22 it could of happened then. Especially since he said he tried to bury a curveball and he extended his body to much. He could of tried to do it whenever he was making his first couple of starts in the majors.
For the other injuries I really think Cashman should look more into those clowns that he hired. Even Mussina made a comment about them today.
I’m never reading your blog again. Its disappointing that you’re resorting to such sensationalized crap.
Pete.
You are TOTALLY correct I hate to say.
The kid was rushed to the big leagues against plans.
My Yankees panicked.
I hate to say it, but when you are right you are right.
Nice…
Cool!
Cool.
Nice!