Brower added to roster
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Aug 06, 2007 
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Now this is curious, the Yankees have called up RHP Jim Brower instead of Edwar Ramirez or Joba Chamberlain.
The clubhouse is opening up in a few minutes. Back later with the lineups and the reason for the move.
Stick around today, lots of blogging with the day game.
Why all the reports of Chamberlain and others being called up? Seems strange to have so many media sources get it wrong. Who are their sources?
I hope this is the beginning of bullpen changes. I am curious to know why they did not call up Edwar or Joba. I get the feeling Bruney and/or Karstens could be sent down soon also.
WHAT????? No, Joba???? What happened????
Only thing I can think of is since Joba can’t be used today why call him up today?
IowaBoy,
Could Chamberlain be coming up also and they just havent announced who will be sent down or released?
Iowa Boy,
They didnt have any sources (well Morrissey didnt because he is a moron who writes for Murdoch) and was prob told just to assume that the Myers DFA meant Joba to the show.
Cash could also be trying to trade a guy like Bruney at the moment and wanted an extra 24 hours to try and get a prospect or something for him maybe?
Here’s hoping this is a TEMPORARY fix to the bullpen.
more than likely it’s a shakeup that is long needed. You cannot continue to give up 3+ runs a game in relief and expect to win them – especially with good teams right around the corner. Let’s hope these guys work out better than Myers, Farns, et al.
i likwe the move. brower has been great at AAA. and deserves a shot. So does Rameriz though. I think Henn will be brought(sp) back up when he’s eligible.
Isn’t the simple explanation that Brower is just being called up for one game (today’s), because Joba won’t be available until tomorrow? Since they just DFA’d Myers last night, they potentially need an extra BP arm for today. They could use Brower today, then send him down after the game.
LOL, why is everybody panicking??!!
Even if Joba was called up today, he is unavailable until tomorrow. I doubt they wanted to go with 11 pitchers today.
Seems to me, Brower, since he has been pitching great all year, is a logical option. Chamberlain, when he is called up (probably in the next day or two) replaces either Karstans or Bruney in the bullpen.
Unless, of course, they can find a home for Farnsworth. Then, he replaces Farnsworth.
Clearly, they are going bold (Thank God) and are beginning to remake the bullpen on the fly.
This is the best way to go, IMO. If it doesn’t work, you won’t hear any second guessing from me.
The bullpen, as previously constructed, was not good enough to win a championship. To be honest enough to realize it, and remake it now is gutsy but, the right way to go.
I commend the organization for going against the grain on this one.
When I saw that Mike Myers had been released I thought that they were going to have Joba Chamberlain start today.
Why wouldn’t this be Joba?
What more does he have to do in the minors?
I think Farns would go before Bruney. Karstens probably gets sent down when Joba is called up and Brower gets DFA when Edwar is returned to the big club.
It just seems strange in so many ways. But, IMHO, whatever changes are going to be made, need to be made soon. If, you do find decent BP help, you want that help to be eligible to play in Oct. (presuming we get there).
They’re not going to trade Bruney for a prospect just because he has had some struggles. You don’t find young guys who throw that hard and have had success. You always keep talent. He just needs some consistency.
“Karstens probably gets sent down when Joba is called up and Brower gets DFA when Edwar is returned to the big club.”
You have guys already DFA’ing Brower in a few days. Never let them say NY fans are fickle.
Maybe someone is on waivers right now and that is the next move to clear Joba? Who knows?
Having seen Joba on Saturday, I think he is ready NOW. If they just want Brower for one day (to give Joba 2 days after pitching 2 innings Sat. night), I can see it. It could be that Brower is there just for today, then tomorrow goes back and Joba comes up. Here is hoping that is the case.
Brower, 34, is 4-1 with a 1.65 ERA and 20 saves for Scranton.
This is a good move, a veteran with who we might be able to find lighting in a bottle(Aaron Small), his #’s were good at AAA…I’m sure Cashamn is still working to make another move or 2 to get Chamberlain up by tomorrow or Wed….the bullpen remake will be a work in progress even after Sept. 1….but at least they are finally making moves, doing what we have all been asking for….
what are the chances ohlendorf gets a chance to make an impression…?
Torre would rather have a 35 year-old retread than a potent combination of a superlative change and a white hot fastball (Edwar and Joba). Veterans are always better, right Joe. Do you think he ever remembers that Mo was 26 in 1996? Great article last week in Newark paper by Graziano saying that even if the team wins the world series team insiders say that Torre is gone, principally because he refuses to follow the front office mandate to use young pitchers (see Edwar sitting for two weeks). Could not agree more. And as much as I love Donnie, I think Girardi is the choice here that makes the most sense.
This is especially curious since they have to put Brower ont he 40 man roster and then DFA him if they try to send him back down. There MUST be more moves coming – like a package trade of BOTH Farnsworth and Myers? to say the Phillies?
I just realized it is Kyle Farnsworth every-other-day-to-pitch and also my ex-wife’s birthday. The alimony check is in the mail. Honest.
Wait a second.
Brower actually throws strikes????
I cannot believe it!
Yeah, Donnie. That’s it. I’m sure Joe would love to have a retread vet over a flame throwing 21 yr old stud.
Torre doesn’t make these moves. Cashman does. Genuis.
No offence Peter but the lovely New York Post is reporting (under the headline “Here’s Joba!”) that the Yankees called up Joba Chamberlain and he’s in Toronto and will be activated in time for this afternoons game.
I think it’s fairly obvious Joba is more than ready to be brought up to the big club.
I don’t see what more he has to gain from pitching in Triple A.
guys, Joba *IS* coming.
relax.
he will be here in a few days.
they have their reasons for doing it this way.
they didn’t just call up Brower b/c “Torre would rather have a 35 year-old retread than a potent combination of a superlative change and a white hot fastball”. i’m no Torre lover, but we are overreacting here.
there are roster moves to be made, maybe Joba doesn’t have a passport, maybe they are being extra careful and want him to have 2 days rest after every appearance. who knows?
but relax, the moves are coming.
There are reports that the Marlins fired Girardi in part because he mishandled the young pitchers, specifically Josh Johnson who now needs Tommy John surgery. With all the young pitchers the Yankees have now, they may not want to hire Girardi. Mattingly, on the other hand, is someone they can dictate to exactly how they want the young pitchers used so I think he’s still the favorite to succeed Torre.
…………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………….. DONT FORGET THE BLUE JAYS LINEUP………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………..
Bring the kid up already.
Jim Brower might be up here longer than you think. He does have a lot of MLB experience and had success on a few occasions. Getting rid of Myers was a lateral move. Now, getting rid of Farns is a different story. That would improve the team immensely (maybe giving the team confidence in knowing that Farns isn’t pitching). I suspect that Ohlendorf will be up in September, if he continues to be consistent. He hasn’t any control problems since his velocity went up as a reliever which is a good sign.
As I voiced at the beginning of this thread, Joba ISNT available today.. its a 12:30 game today and since Myers is gone they need someone to throw TODAY if needed… thus Brower is the answer. It is as simple as that.
Girardi was fired because of a power play by the Marlins GM and the owner not taking Joe’s side.
He wasn’t fired because of pitch counts and young pitchers.
These guys were going to need surgery no matter who managed. They would have had that surgery if they pitched last yr in Triple A. it would not have mattered.
They need to get rid of the bad vibes that Farnsworth brings.
I doubt they would DFA Brower in a day.You dont waste your AAA closer as a filler.Hes going to get a look…might be a short look but a shot to see if he could do better.
http://mvn.com/mlb-yankees/2007/08/06/joba-up/
It looks like Joba IS on his way. At least according to the Post
Guys I just called my friend in the immigration office. Turns out Joba’s passport was rejected due to him being a Native American and not being able to produce his birth certificate. Apparently it got destroyed in the great TeePee fire of 1988.
Seriously though, I don’t have a problem with Brower coming up, he was having a good year as the closer at Scranton so maybe they can catch lightning in a bottle. I think there is room for both Brower and Joba.
Let’s see, 7 pitchers in the pen: Mo, Viz, Villone, Bruney, Brower, Farns and Karstens. Obviously it would be best if Cash can trade Farnsworth, as Joba would replace him perfectly. I like having a long man, although I am not convinced Karstens is the man for the job. I wonder if they would consider bringing up Ian Kennedy for that spot? They have promoted both Joba and Ian together every step of the way, so is that really so farfetched? That would leave a pen of Mo, Viz, Joba, Villone, Bruney, Brower and Ian. Works for me.
It’s the Torre, “I want a veteran presence”. The only way this is a good move is if Farnsworth is gone this afternoon and Joba comes up.
Oh wait, stop the presses! Jim Johnson is reporting that Joba is on the way! Guess that confirms that is not what’s happenning today.
I could see a deal with ATL with Farns going to ATL forthe proverbial “future considerations” ,”cash considerations” or the ever popular PTBNL. Tell ATL that the Yankees will pay half his salary just to get him out of the Bronx.
“Guys I just called my friend in the immigration office. Turns out Joba’s passport was rejected due to him being a Native American and not being able to produce his birth certificate. Apparently it got destroyed in the great TeePee fire of 1988.”
Talk about extremely unfunny and lame. I don’t think I’ve heard a worse joke.
Do some of you guys read? Joba Chamberlain is NOT available to pitch today.
Nardi Contreras said the other night they want to give him two FULL days of rest before using him again.
That means, he CAN’T PITCH today.
Why would the Yankees call him up if he can’t pitch today? They would be operating one pitcher short.
Like Hmmm said, Chamberlain is coming.
Think for a minute. Do you think they would move him to the bullpen if he was not coming to NY?
The Brower move is one of a series of moves. We just have to sit back and wait for the other move(s) to take place.
I’m reporting what Mike Morrissey and George King of the NY Post are reporting. Wiseass.
i’m surprised that it was bowden over joba . all the rumors and talk has been about joba and very little about bowden . hey , let him come up and show his stuff . maybe joba will be up in a lttle bit , i hope .
Why shouldn’t Brower get a look? He’s earned it.
I can see an argument to bring up Brower and keep Jabba the Hut in the minors a little longer to get used being a set up guy. But Dan Graziano of Newark Star-Ledger said Yankee officials fear that Jabba will 1)being good immediately and Torre will overuse him or 2) have some bad appearances and Torre will bury him. I wonder what Ron Guidry thinks of Torre’s bullpen management and if he disagrees, goes above Joe’s head.
Well, Jim Johnson also reported that Gagne was traded to the Yanks for Tyler Clippard, Brett Gardner, and a box of chocolates.
Forgive me if I save my excitement for a more reliable source.
Its not Brower over Joba. If Joba is unavailable to pitch today, explain to me the reasoning of calling him up?
Its Brower OVER Myers.
Relax. Joba will be up here tomorrow for Karstens who could use the regular work he’d get in Scranton.
OK…I knew I’d have to ask sooner or later…..
Is it Jah-Buh? Or, is it Joe-buh? Anybody know?
Jim Johnson is about as reliable as OJ Simpson
jah-buh
Jim Brower? Forgive my skepticism. Check out this guy’s MAJOR league stats: http://www.baseball-reference......ji01.shtml
There’s a reason this guy is 34 and is pitching in AAA.
Joba, Ohlendorf, and Edwar are all available…. And Cashman chooses Brower.
Why does this man’s decisions about pitching never cease to baffle me?
Let’s hope this is a temporary expedient necessitated by Myers assignment.
Still, I would have preferred to see Myers remain until Ohlendorf or Jabba was ready for the promotion.
Like Jabba the Hutt.
Could someone explain to me why they can’t DFA Farnsworth? Is it because they really want to straighten him out in the majors, or is there some kind of procedural hurdle?
Torre and Guidry are more concerned with winning games than feelings. Especially in relief pitchers who can’t get anyone out.
What young pitcher has Torre not used? He was proved right on Ramirez this year. You really think he wouldn’t use Joba if he was up here? He didn’t use Mo when he was a rookie???
i dont see them calling up ohlendorf until rosters expand
Why would they DFA Farnsworth now when they wouldn’t trade him and pay his salary a week ago and actually get a capable reliever like Wickman in return??
Think a little people.
SJ44- it is also Brower over Edwar- that is the part I don’t understand- unless there are more moves to be made.
They could have brought up Edwar and sent him back down in a day or two without any issues- since he is already on the 40 man and has options. With Brower, they will now need to make another move when Joba comes up (he will come up later this week). I just figure they would have waited to pull up Brower when they were planning on keeping him up. I am just hopeful this means a Farnsworth move is emminent.
I would also think that Henn is coming back up (for the second lefty at some point)- maybe he will take Karstens and
I’m sure Cashman has a master plan here. Can we let it play out a little before we second guess it?
HMMM and SJ44 great posts… They are doing exactly what SJ said bold. I agree with them no matter the results there is no way the pen they had would succeed so they are remaking it in a significant way..
WOW.. The Yankees will give there own players a chance what a novel concept.. Cashman is in control and makes more good moves by far then bad……..
Joba will be there within days and Bruney may go down, or hopefully Kyle will go away but I still think they need more moves..
There pen is so unreliable they need to score 8 runs a game or more to win unless there starter goes 7….
Bill in Boston…I agree with your main idea, but no, Rivera had gotten very important experience pitching in a pennant race in 1995 and was not a rookie in 1996.
You can DFA Farns, but then you are on the hook for all of the remaining money on his contract (this season and next for a grand total of 7+ million). That is why you keep him, let him clear waivers and see if you can move him to someone who will take on at least a portion of his salary (and maybe score a prospect in return).
This has worked well for the Yanks in the past as Cash flipped Ventura for Proctor (basically a throw-in), who eventually became our best utility player in years (Betemit).
Myers wasn’t effective as he needed to be this year but I’m still sorry to see him go.
Myers was a class act: articulate, accessible, a consummate professional, and a vigorous union advocate besides.
I never once saw Myers rebuff an interview or make excuses, no matter how execrable his performance.
Let’s hope Cashman has enough sense to send him to the NL, where he can’t hurt us down the road.
Matty – I’m not following. You’re saying that they won’t DFA him because they are hoping to steal deal him?
Cashman chose Brower because he has MLB experience and:
Britton just came off of the DL
Joba will be getting two full days (insiders fear Torre’s usage)
Edwar Ramirez didn’t perform (don’t give me that crap about not being used enough; look at Villone)
Ohlendorf just made the move to bullpen (brass wants to see more consistency; he’s doing well and will probably be up in Sept.)
Getting rid of Myers was an upgrade
Sorry, I meant to *still* deal him.
Miguel, Rivera had little to no experience in big games, he was the last man in the bullpen in 95. Torre will not bury Joba like he did with Edwar and he will be told to be cautious with him because he is the future #1 or 2 starter on this team.
If they wouldn’t trade him for Wickman and pick up the salary why would they cut him and pay the salary and get nothing back???
Maybe someone can answer this question for me or provide a link w/ some info:
On Sept. 1st, rosters expand to 40, right? Can any 40 be put on this roster? What happens when the postseason starts – does it contract to 25? Are there limitations on which players can be put on the playoff roster?
Thanks!
Ramirez had his shot. You have to perform and you can’t complain about usage.
Edwar wasn’t given a chance. I would rather not look at Villone except for in mop-up duty. His first outing he struck out the side, then you don’t pitch a guy who’s effectiveness is based on a changeup for two weeks. Throwing a change-up with an over-rested arm doesn’t work. Torre never gave him a chance, he kept on throwing farnsworthless in there in situations that made everyone cringe
Brower is actually well deserving of a call up. Congrats go to him.
Also fellas…. Villone is a veteran who has a ton of experience… When your young like Edwar is you need to show him confidense by using him… not by making him sleep for 13 days then saying hey come in and shut the Devil Rays out!
great interview of joba on WFAN yesterday..for those of you who didnt hear it, here it is
http://www.wfan.com/topic/play.....oId=908894
Ramirez needs more seasoning.
That was wholly obvious to anyone who watched him get blitzed and cry after.
Rivera pitched in 3 playoff games and threw 5.1 innings in the 1995 playoffs.
http://www.baseball-reference......ma01.shtml
He was a sophomore, not a freshman, in 1996.
don’t worry edwar will be up in a few days. Bruney or Farsnworth will be gone be next week
Peter–Ramirez was given a chance. Pitched well the first two appearance, then wasn’t used for two weeks. On his third appearance, he obviously wasn’t prepared. This crap about not being used needs to stop. Look at Villone. It happened to him and he did his job. You are either prepared or not prepared.
Joba is pitching for Trenton TODAY. so much for him not being available to pitch today.
Brower replaced Myers. Giambi will replace Cairo. Joba will replace Brower. The biggest snag of all is Farnsworth. If he had the low contract Myers had, he would have been gone a week ago. Cashman is walking around with handcuffs on and it’s all from his own doing in signing a known headcase in Farnsworth. He didn’t do his homework.
Miguel, I know he had some but he threw 3 or 4 of those innings in the one 15 inning game. He was still hte last man on the roster and was not an integral part of that bullpen.
Why NOT call up Brower? Might as well see what he can do and then possibly trade him in the offseason. Clearly he isn’t in the Yankees’ long-term plans, but if the Yankees can get some teams to see that he can still pitch effectively in the Majors, he can always be dealt to a team in need of a cheap bullpen arm.
I never was a fan of Joba being called up because of what has happened in the recent past to other pitchers who made the “starter, to bullpen, back to starter” switch (Josh Johnson, Francisco Liriano). Especially considering Joba has had arm problems before and has managed to avoid them with his current routine. I don’t think it’s wise to upset that.
Jonathan,
Thanks for the link.
It was great to hear Joba.
He is so down to earth, I have no doubt he will have great success.
Also, the Yankees typically like to put relief prospects on the “2 innings every 3rd game” program. Since he JUST pitched 2 innings for the first time, maybe they’re waiting for him to make one more appearance, just in case?
Either way, don’t panic. And especially don’t blame Torre, for goodness’ sake. Cashman is the one that made the move.
Joba is “available” today, but does that mean he’ll pitch? They have to have him on a roster somewhere, but he may well be in Toronto. Unless I’m missing something…
Are some of you people seriously calling Ramirez a failure after 3 appearances and 2.1 innings? That is just asinine. The guy wasnt used for almost TWO WEEKS before he came in in that Tampa game was of course showed signs of rust. TWO WEEKS. No reliever would come into a game and be sharp after TWO WEEKS of not getting into a game, I dont care who they are. Everyone needs consistent work. You could sit Mo for two weeks and even he would come in and not have his pinpoint control and be rusty. We saw what happened to Mo in April when he didnt get emough consistent work.
Edwar deserves a real chance. By real I mean dont banish him for TWO WEEKS because he gives up one run on a seeing eye single by Chone Figgins.
It is amazing to read all this negative reaction to Brower call up.
Brower has been doing well at AAA, that too as closer. Why not give him a chance? When he was with SF around 2004, he did well. May be he just figured out….
As SJ and others pointed out, it is only the beginning of many moves to come. Brower is not promoted instead of Joba.
The only people safe in the bullpen are Mo, Viz and Villone (only because he is a left hander). Every one else is a fair game and may not be on the playoff roster.
So, calm down and let things playout in the next week or so. Remember the weak bench? How are we doing now? Have patience for a week or so…..
I’m going to be honest here guys… I really don’t think the Yankees cut Cairo this close to roster expansion.
As much as it sucks, I think Duncan is going to get sent down for a few weeks. It benefits him because he’ll get to get more swings..hopefully nothing throws him off his rhythm.
Cairo is a valuable PR and defensive replacement late in games…which is going to be necessary for Giambi on the basepaths. He’s also earned his stripes – can’t take it away from him this quick and close to playoff time
I’m only a bit surprised that they dumped Myers instead of Farnsworth. Maybe there was more substance behind Joe’s recent comments about Farnsworth than just trying to pump up his trade value…Maybe he actually believes Farnsworth is a great reliever who just needs some more time to “find himself.” (Although if that’s actually the case, then I
think Joe has gone a bit soft in the head!)
Regardless, here’s hoping Farnsworth is the next one to go!
what I’m saying is it’s very different to have been up for half a season, around a team of vets making a playoff run, and have gotten to contribute (working three innings in a 15 inning close, exciting game in the playoffs is very valuable experience!)
You are right that his role in 1995 was nowhere near what it would be in 1996, but it was enough to qualify as valuable experience for him, as well as provide the Yankees with a real idea of what he could do come 1996. So I think that 1995 was an important part of Mo’s development…it’s hard to imagine him being as successful in 1996 if he had been a pure rookie at that point.
Chris- I agree totally with your post. Brower won’t be here for long.
Sucks for Brower…He pitched great in the minors, but I agree that he won’t be up with the Yanks for more than a cup of coffee (no matter how well he does).
They owe Farnsworth 7 million dollars. They owed Myers 400k. Simple reason why one is still with the Yankees and the other is gone.
Brower has 40 K’s in 43 innings and hasn’t allowed a HR this season. He has pitched very well in Scranton and deserves a shot.
You can’t rip the move, then cite guys with little or no ML experience as “sure things”.
There are no “sure things” in baseball.
Two things are clear. They are shaking up the bullpen and Chamberlain is going to get called up. Its just a matter of “when” at this point.
I am not a supporter of Joe, and I wat him out at the end of the year. Still, I am sure I am in a very small minority in supporting Joe that Kyle will turn it around very shortly. Then they can either keep him or trade him. Until that time, he will be probably the 7th guy in the BP.
Remember how many of you wanted Viz to be DFAed. Viz was worse than Kyle at that time. Now you all love him.
SJ44 – So does that mean we’re stuck with Farnsworth for the duration of his contract?
SJ,
Do you have scouting report on Brower. I am interested in knowing if he is a finnese pitcher or throws hard. What are his primary pitches?
BBFan – I think the key difference between Viz and Farnsworth is that Viz is willing to take advice and make adjustments; whereas Farnsworth seems adamant about not changing a thing. After all, Viz only really started to turn things around after Mariano started mentoring him. With Farnsworth, everyone and their mother has been trying to tell him that he needs to change his approach (i.e. mix in his slider more, etc.), but he could care less.
The difference between Kyle and Viz is in the head.. Kyle is a bullheaded dummy.. Viz is not. He was open to suggestions and tinkering and he fugured it out..
Kyle has cement between his head, look at his run ins etc. and you can see he is a friggin moron…
… Cairo as a pinch runner is needed!!!No he isn’t if they are pinch running for Giambi Damon probably would be available or Betemit.. Cairo deserves nothing, do not pass around the hat for him he will get paid in full.. Cairo is not needed now that the bench is better…
Also, to add to “…”‘s comment about Duncan being sent down over Cairo, remember that Duncan would be back in September, as well as in the playoffs, because Torre carries an 11-man pitching staff. So no need to worry about that if it happens.
Chicago Dave,
You have a very valid point.
I think we are just making assumptions he does not want to change. How do we know that? I am sure he wants to succeed as well. That incident with Jorge is disturbing. Still, it is possible that, like it happens many times with other pitchers and catchers, it could have been just a mix-up.
A few weeks ago most people here wanted Viz DFA’d.
Now he’s the second coming.
The lesson is show some patience.
Overreacting is great, isn’t it?
Adding Brower means that there’s still more moves to come. If the guy was killing in AAA, then he deserves a shot. We’re filling the frickin’ Mike Myers slot here. Whether he comes up now, and Edwar in three weeks, or vice versa, really doesn’t mean all that much. They’re all going to be up on Sept. 1st.
E ROC – even if someone buys into the idea that not pitching for 2 weeks in not a factor (when of course it is a factor)even u admitted that edwar had 2 good outings and 1 very bad outing. is that now the bar? if you have a bad outing at any point in your first 3 outings you dont deserve another chance? that seems like silly logic to me.
The Yanks aren’t just cutting Farny and sucking up the 7 million. That is not how Cashman does business now.
viz attended a crash course @ mariano univeristy…kyle farnswroth is way to stubborn to do that. big difference
How can anyone out there second guess the promotion of Brower?
With 51 games left to play for the regular season schedule, Torre doesn’t have the luxury of time to see if Farnsworth can “find himself”. Major league scouts following the Yankees have a read on Farnsworth already but can’t really gauge how the AAA pitchers are which works to the Yankees advantage as long as they know a pitcher’s demeanor or if he gets rattled. In the case of Joba, all reports show that nothing bothers him.
BB,
He used to be a fastball/slider guy. Used to throw 93-95. I haven’t seen him this year so, I don’t know what he is showing these days.
He has pitched very, very well in Scranton this year and I remember Stick singing his praises in an interview a few weeks ago. Stick felt he could be an asset to the bullpen. We shall see.
I don’t think they are stuck with Farnsworth for next year. I think Cashman will be able to trade him after the season.
This year? Unless they want to eat a big chunk of change (which it seems they don’t want to do) they may be stuck with him the rest of the way.
Today is a GOOD day, not a bad day. Its showing us the Yankees are taking the bold step of remaking the bullpen on the fly. It takes guts to do it. Instead of complaining about it, why don’t we just sit back and wait for all the moves to play out.
Its pretty obvious Jim Brower is not going to be the only addition to the bullpen the rest of the way.
It’s one thing to accept help from teammates, but maybe it’s not being offered to Kyle? After incidents with Clemens, Torre, and Posada he’s probably not regarded as a team player. Kind of like the kid who thinks he knows it all. It’s like, “Why bother?”
Jonathan is correct. Farnsworth has to have the willingness to learn from Mo or others. He hardly speaks to his teammates much less ask for their advice or listen to it.
Thanks SJ.
If Stick feels Brower can help, he certainly deserves a chance, though it may be short.
helno51–I was merely defending the promotion of Brower. The Yankees probably still have a bad taste in their mouths from Ramirez’s last outing. Having two weeks of inactivity is no excuse for walking all of those hitters. Villone went 16 days without a single appearance. When Villone finally did make an appearance, he threw a scoreless inning.
I agree with SJ. They’re making big changes, but to one piece at a time. Proctor out, Karsten in, Myers gone, Brower in. Next will be Bruney out, Joba in, etc.
I know you guys love Ramirez, who doesn’t? But you’re seeing Brower here, because they’ve previewed Ramirez already. Granted he was very rusty, but in reality there’s a big difference between the majors and AAA. These really are auditions. Throw ‘em against the wall and keep ‘em if they stick.
RE: People knocking Edwar.
These same people would have given up on Mantle when he was sent down to KC in July of 1951.
They want instant results and gratification and don’t have patience with a youngster.
Get patience. Some kids without experience are good, but they aren’t going to be instant stars. See Maddux 1987 and Glavine 1988.
Giving up on a guy after 3 outings (1 of which came after two weeks of inactivity) is just asinine.
Peter- Further evodence. I know this does reference another paper so I’m sorry but I thought it might shine further light on the subject.
http://mvn.com/mlb-yankees/2007/08/06/joba-up/
Jim Brower! I loved him on SNL.
Mike S,
You have now said the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard.
Comparing Ramirez to Mantle.
Who’s saying anybody is “giving up” on Ramirez.
Fact is, Brower has pitched better than Ramirez. Perhaps they want to see what he brings to the table.
The guy has saved games all year in Scranton, not allowed a HR this season, and has ML/playoff race experience.
Its not out of bounds to give the guy a shot.
Brian is making some serious changes to this bullpen. Interesting.
With any luck, we can catch fire in a bottle in Joba, Ross, and/or Brower. Didn’t Brower used to pitch for the Giants? If so, that is never a good sign, but perhaps I am confusing him with someone else.
you cant compare a guy making his 3rd big league appearance to a veteran like villone. i agree edwars 3rd performance was awful and i cant say with certainty that it was defintitely the layoff but after the tremendous year he has had in the minors combined with our weak bullpen, i would think the team would want to find out for sure about edwar and the only way to do that is to put him back out there again. to me edwar could be part of the future, brower i dont think is based on past performance and age.
Mike S,
Surely you cannot be serious, granted I am an Edwar fan, but come on, Mickey Mantle! Settle down a little bit, this is a guy cut 3 times, nice story, but you cannot be comparing him to Mickey Mantle, that is just absurd.
lay off the timbits and post the rosters already
I think Brower is only going to be with the team for a couple of days unless he looks damn impressive.
The pen is obviously worn out — and the Hughes and Clemens outing didn’t help them.
Joba just pitched two innings on Sat, so they probably don’t want to call him up until he’s available to pitch again.
Brower hasn’t pitched since Thursday so he’s probably one of the freshest arms they have in Scranton right now.
I’m thinking Brower is only a stop gap until Joba is ready to take the ball and they want to make sure he’s rested.
Doug:
Reading comprehension, please?
I am not comparing Edwar to Mantle. I didn’t in my post. I didn’t compare Edwar to Glavine or Maddux, either. Show me where it says that I said Edwar was as good as that. I didn’t.
I am comparing the fans wanting instant gratification and not having patience to what I feel they would have done in July of 1951 to Mantle when Mickey was sent down that mid-summer.
These are the fans I criticize. The ones who give up on players WAY too early. In 40 years of watching the game, (probably twice your age?) I have seen plenty of players who were given up on who became decent players—maybe not a star, but certainly decent. You don’t give up on someone after three games, especially a reliever who is used to being used two or three times a week who suddenly doesn’t pitch in two weeks. He isn’t a starter, who is used to going every 5th day. He is a guy used to a regular routine, two-three times a week, who relies on a feel pitch. Feel pitches need regular work.
Viper, good call.
I figured as much, but you never know.
So who exactly is our lefty specialist? I am not sure we have one and that is a bit unsettling.
The Yankees aren’t tossing Edwar aside. They just want to see what Brower has to offer. It’s not a knock against Edwar. He’ll probably be up in week or so, or in September. I doubt the Yankees have given up on him.
NICE NUMBERS:
Since July 1st, Hideki Matsui is batting .338 with 14 HR’s and 32 RBI. A solid contributor to the Yankees resurgence. Add Jorge, Robby Cano, and his buddy Melky to the list among several others.
the lineups are posted
Update on Jaba….Just saw a plane flying northwest over Lake Ontario….and I think I saw Jaba looking out the window… bullpen in Toronto reportedly shouting “de plane, de plane!”
Today’s Yankees !
Damon LF
Jeter SS
Abreu RF
A-Rod 3b
Matsui DH
Posada C
Cano 2b
Phillips 1b
Cabrera CF
GO YANKEES !
Brower = veteran bullpen arm who is having a real good AAA year… It’s playoff race time – and while Brower is by no means a go-to guy, he’s a better choice than Edwar at this point. forget the stats, you have to think about experience and mental makeup…I don’t care how many people Ramirez struck out with his changeup in the minor leagues.
Viper,
Your scenario is possible, but why release Myers and call up Brower? Myers wasn’t that bad AND he’s been what he’s been the whole year. Waiting an extra 2 days before releasing Myers would’ve been more likely. There must be something in the works, because this is a team that works very deliberately. Now the moves are fast and furious? The timing of the moves is puzzling, too. It’s a big mystery and I hope there’s a good ending. lol.
I am an Edwar supporter.
Having said that when he was promoted last time, one of the concerns was that he does not control his fastball well. That was the reason he was not promoted for a while and every one on this blog was creasming for his promotion.
Until the yankee brass is convinced he is controlling his fastball, he will not be promoted. AAA hitters may be hacking at his wayward fastball, but ML hitters will lay off from that fastball. Trust the people in charge at AAA who see him in every appearance and make the right decision when to bring him up.
Some people need reading comprehension courses–Doug? Matthew?
At no point did I compare Edwar’s talent to Mantle’s.
What I did state was that people GIVE UP ON PLAYERS TOO EARLY, and many of the people who give up on players like Edwar would also have given up on many superstars–like Mickey.
Yes, these people would have written off Mantle in 1951 when Mickey was sent down. Many did. They would also have given up on Maddux, Glavine and even Koufax. What I am saying is that these people give up on players FAR too early, esp. players who have a handful of major league experience. These people want instant results and won’t let someone grow into the job. They forget how many stars may have struggled early in their careers only to become good players later.
I never wrote that Edwar would be a star, only that these people not only would give up on an Edwar, but they also would have given up on MANY players who became stars because they are so impatient.
Larry, I’m not sure we had a lefty specialist.. Myers? I wouldn’t have called him the LOOGY anymore, lefties were killing him. So it’s not like we “lost” our leftie specialist.
Enough of Joba Chamberlain! He is nothing but alot of hype & hoo-ha right now. I could care less that he blows away A, AA & AAA hitters. Right. Let’s see him vs. an M.L.B. lineup with guys who you can’t get out w/ just a fastball or one pitch. Look at Phil Hughes 2 days ago. He’s blowing away guys w/ his fastball until the fifth inning, just about the time a team usually adjusts to a (dominating) starter. Kansas City Royals hitters figured him out & hit him hard. Welcome back to the bigs, Phil.
Brower got called up over Chamberlain for 5 reasons among others:
1. He has significant M.L.B. experience in the bullpen unlike Chamberlain (& Ramirez).
2. He has been doing a solid job for AAA-Scranton this year.
3. The Yanks don’t want to put pressure on Chamberlain to be (part of) the bridge to Mo. If he bombs, it could destroy or severely damage his confidence & psyche.
4. The Yanks want Chamberlain to begin his Yankee career as their fifth starter behind (fourth starter) Hughes next year. They should start him vs. N.L. teams only like Boston did w/ Matsuzaka in spring training this year, that way no one in the A.L. actually faces him until the regular season.
5. The Yanks don’t want to risk injury to Chamberlain. Remember, he’s been relieving for a short time thus could easily get hurt & then where does that leave him/ the Yanks?
Sure he could get hurt w/ AAA, but it’s 100X more demoralizing if he gets the call then gets hurt, cuz then he has the pressure of rehabbing then not suc king in his first appearance back w/ the Yanks. He’s really not supposed to be a reliever to begin with, it’s just creating a potential problem for him.
‘Best to have him begin his Yankee career next year, folks.
Brower deserves…
I SAW Joba on Saturday. He isn’t a one pitch or one trick pony, believe you me.
As for KC adjusting, I don’t think so. I think a guy who threw 75 or so pitches in a steambox just ran out of gas.
Chamberlain will be up within a week. there is no way the Yanks are rethinking there plan to use Chamberlain in the pen for the rest of the season.. NO WAY.
Yeah he will be a starter next yr. but will be in the pen for the next 3 months this yr…
Watch it……..
i don’t think anyone’s giving up on edwar. look at his ball-strike totals from his last start. there’s more to that than just rust. give him some time in the minors to work on his fb. when that’s there, he’ll be a good bullpen guy, but without it, people will just sit and wait for the change. at this point, browers a better option. as many have said, give cash some time to show what’s in the works. this isn’t the only move happening.
peter get your behind out of tim hortons and update your blog.
why would the yankees move him to the bullpen in AAA and then save him to be their 5th starter next year? open your eyes.
As far as the releasing of Myers, he got a bit screwed due tot he entire bullpen’s failures. If the bullpen was solid with a reliable long man and reliable middle inning pitchers then we could afford the luxury of a lefty specialist. Of course that’s assuming that he could get out lefties, but let’s ignore that for now.
With a good bullpen you could use a spot on a loogy. The Yankees bullpen as currently constituted cannot afford that luxury. Someone else will have to get Big Papi out in a big spot next time. Mike will catch on elsewhere, a guy like that can pitch until he’s 45.
Need some clarification. Newsday and now Lohud report that Brower got the call. The Post says Joba has been called up?
Ok – Torre just said on YES – Joba’s not on the roster – don’t know what the Post was printing
When in doubt, always trust Peter Abraham. The guy does not report rumors or innuendos. I’ve never seen him be wrong on breaking news type items.
Will, a lot are giving up on the guy after 3 outings. He’s been fine since going down and getting regular work, which a pitcher of his ilk needs.
If he got regular work for a while (2-3 times a week) and over the course of time stunk, that’s one thing. To give up on a guy who has 3 major league outings and who had a two week layoff between his 2nd and 3rd major league appearance is just nuts.
Who knows what Edwar will become? Maybe he becomes a half-decent reliever, maybe not.
People are too quick to pull the trigger. Too many mini-Bosses, if you will.
Mariano Rivera’s first 4 major league games were all starts. After those 4 starts, he was 1-2 with a 10.20 ERA.
Had blogs been around back then, I am SURE at least 2/3 of the Blog–any blog–would written him off, said he sucks and wanted him banished. Those people would have wanted the Yanks to trade him, and history would have been quite different.
Some people just have to have more patience.
have patience with me, too
Farnsworth, maybe you just need a team hug. They love you, they really do. They just love a little more when you don’t lose guys after 2 strikes or give up the long ball.
Why do people think it is funny to post as players? See right above and Farnsworth the Brawler….Its not amusing nor does it add anything to the community here.
For everyone else the lineup is posted on Yahoo sports. Pete let me guess Toronto has a bad network??
I understand the patience thing, but unfortunately, due to the hole we dug in the beginning of the season, we don’t have the luxury of patience. I agree that Edwar should have been used more regularly, but that wasn’t the sole cause of the failure in his 3rd game. Brower deserves a shot. I can’t fault them for bringing him up. Joba will be up soon, and Edwar will be up as well.
dont know if anyone posted it but the ny post says joba is the one called up, not brower http://www.nypost.com/seven/08.....e_king.htm
i’m going to make a prediction that the post article on joba will get mentioned another 3 times in this thread.
ok, scratch that. there’s a new thread to comment in now.
http://www.nypost.com/seven/08.....e_king.htm
there it is….so the Post are LIARS ???
When will people learn to trust Peter’s posts? He is always right with breaking news. The Post is wrong.
Brower may be getting his shot now but it’s a matter of time before he gets shelled. That’s what his career numbers have shown. I was at Joba’s bullpen debut in Rochester last week and came away more than impressed. It was something special. He can light up the gun with pinpoint control. I may not agree with moving him to the pen but he’ll get his shot soon enough and won’t disappoint.
That was what every one thought about Small too.
Why can’t Brower be Small of this year.
Think positive…………………………………..
The New York Post is wrong with a story? Mon Dieu!! The sun just rose in the west! Pigs can fly!! My ex-wife just got a job!!!
Will,
Unlike some people, I will gladly sacrifice 2007 if it insures 2009-2017. Many of my Yankee friends feel the same way. They see what the future holds and will gladly wait for it. We will sacrifice one year in order to have a dynasty. Others see the present only.
KAJ & others: Yes, apparently the Post messed up. Joba isn’t here yet, but he is coming. From what I saw in Scranton on Saturday, he is ready.
Well, got to go. I want to listen to the Yanks on radio, and I want to hit milb.com to check out Dan McCutcheon’s performance for Trenton this afternoon.
Joba ChamberlainCheck It out!
Let’s remember amid this much-needed bullpen shakeup, that the Yankees have not had a truly effective lefty reliever since Mike Stanton’s first term with the team many moons ago. Hard to believe when they know they’ve got to pitch to big Papi in September, and maybe October……