Greetings from the Rogers Centre
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Aug 07, 2007 
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Wilson Betemit and Shelley Duncan were just on the field working out at first base with Joe Torre and the coaching staff. Shelley is no Don Mattingly but he’s not Herman Munster either.
Here’s a weird stat: The Yankees are 20-7 against the AL Central and 32-35 against the rest of the league.
A few other numbers:
Roger Clemens is 1-4, 5.90 on the road.
Derek Jeter is hitting .231 (9 of 39) in the last 11 games.
Wilson Betemit is 5 of 10 with six RBI as a Yankee.
Back later, hopefully with some audio from Joba Chamberlain.
Clemens will be booed off the mound again in disgrace.
I find that very interesting in terms of Duncan. Is this a sign that he is not going down when Giambi gets off the DL. Why would they be working with him today if he gets sent down tomorrow?? Any word on who was sent down for Joba??
Two words just popped into my head:
Goodbye Cairo.
I loved Cairo this year.
I know people here have stressed that Betemit is too heavy to play short. What about moving Ale over to short and having betemit play 3rd, and give Jeets a few days off?
* Alex
_briggs_
_August 7th, 2007 at 3:27 pm_
_Clemens will be booed off the mound again in disgrace._
In Toronto???? I hope u know Yanks are on road and not at home.
Cairo is a good guy and a good utility guy but betemit is much better….
the Yankee bench is better then it has been in the last 5 yrs….
the Yanks are back being a meritocracy(thank god) instead of a veteran club…
Cairo will not get picked up and will be back with the club as a pinch runner in 3 weeks..
A-Rod is not going to be playing SS. Damon is not going to play RF. Let’s get both of those out of the way ASAP, please.
How does Duncan compare to Josh Phelps?
Pete
I know that Damon is a favorite in the clubhouse. How is this being handled by his teammates? Is everyone ignoring the 500-lb. gorilla in the room?
Its pretty clear now Duncan is here to stay. Good news, IMO.
Hopefully, Cairo gets “hurt” in the next 24-48 hours. Sometimes, you can pull an oblique in BP.
He has been a solid contributor to the Yankees this year. Especially when Minky went down and prior to the Phillips callup. It would be a shame if he got DFA’ed.
Unlike some of the other non-contributors, Cairo did his job this year.
But, if he did get DFA’ed, I understand that’s baseball. Just would like to see him stick around until the rosters expand.
The DL is one way to do it.
how about letting jeets sit today, and use cairo in short. sort of a farewell deal/take advangtage of him while he’s still here. oh, and arod’s not going to be playing short unless jeet retires.
“I know that Damon is a favorite in the clubhouse. How is this being handled by his teammates? Is everyone ignoring the 500-lb. gorilla in the room?”
I think they like Jason too. And they can all see that Melky is outplaying him…and I think they all realize that putting Johnny at 1B regularly during a playoff push is silly.
They should have Godzilla work aggressively at 1B over the offseason, and have Johnny work on LF. Andy is a decent backup plan if Matsui just turns out to be a butcher over there. If he does, it wouldn’t be for lack of trying. And it could solve the 1B AND the OF logjam until they decide whether they want to make a move for Tex when he becomes a FA.
sj, i agree. you think maybe he could catch ‘pavano-itis’? then he could go to the dl for millions of reasons. he bruised an eyelash, or cut his nails too short, or maybe he got abrasion burns rolling over in bed. you never know what could happen.
“how about letting jeets sit today, and use cairo in short. sort of a farewell deal/take advangtage of him while he’s still here.”
Why not put Betemit at short, since he can actually hit pretty well from the left side? He’s adequate there defensively, Roger’s not a big ground-ball guy, and we don’t add an automatic out to the lineup.
“you think maybe he could catch ‘pavano-itis’?”
Or, he could throw his back out sneezing like Sosa did a few years ago.
You think any team would claim Cairo if he is DFA’d? I’m not sure sure.
I am nervous after reading this “Too Little – Too Late”:http://www.boston.com/sports/n.....index.html
Who is leaving to make room for Joba? I didn’t see the official announcement.
John,
Damon already made his feelings clear. Other teams want him, so I think he’ll seek a trade.
Will,
Jeter is .400 against Towers and Alex is .192.
i can see giambi playing firstbase for 3 games before he hurts something again .
“Jeter is .400″
Jeter is also hurting and slumping. If he doesn’t sit today, he should sit tomorrow or Thursday. Get him two days off without missing more than one game.
Cairo’s the likely candidate to get DFA’d. The Yanks have Betemit – who’s a big upgrade over Cairo.
Also – the Yankee lineup… Jeter, Arod, Melky, Matsui, Cano, Phillips, Posada – all are at .300 or close to it.
Abreu could get there…. Damon won’t. That’s seven .300 hitters in the lineup. Not bad.
I really hope Damon stays hot and finishes strong – the Yankees really need his trade value to get back up so they can shop him in the winter.
Melky’s the CF here. Next year – let’s say Abreu leaves… you could put Melky in RF and Damon in CF…. but I’d rather have Melky in CF than Damon’s awful arm there. If that’s the case… there’s no room for Damon. There’s no one to play RF – not Damon and not Matsui. Matsui will still be in LF (RF probably addressed through FA or pick up Abreu;s option)
Giambi will be the DH… Damon? 1B? That’s the only real option unless you deal him.
I’d make the trade – and try to get a 1B – the 1B market is thin the next two years… and Eric Duncan seems a way away
Duncan may be getting instructions on what to work on in Scranton.
Bruney will probably be demoted.
“I am nervous after reading this Too Little – Too Late”
What did you expect from an article on boston.com?
Sorry Doug, but Shelley isnt going back to Scranton.
Eric Duncan should talk to Mark McGwire. McGwire helped Shelley Duncan with his mental approach to the game. Look at what happened.
“Duncan may be getting instructions on what to work on in Scranton.”
How exactly does that make any sense at all?
Getting rid of Miguel Cairo would make my day. He must have finally misplaced the naked pictures of Joe Torre that Enrique Wilson gave him.
Josh Towers vs. Cleveland on July 8:
IP H R ER HR BB K
8.0 3 0 0 0 0 4
Wait, Joba throws 97 AND speaks? Wow, this is getting pretty exciting. Hopefully, a veteran will pull him aside and tell him to put a little bend in his cap brim. It’s for the good of the team.
SJ — I totally agree.. I don’t think the Yankees can afford to just lose Cairo for nothing here. I was hoping he’d come up with the oblique injury myself once I saw Pete’s post about Shelley taking reps at first base.
I found that very surprising…but not necessarily disappointing. I’m torn on Cairo — he’s a good little guy to have around, but Duncan provides some pop off the bench (at least for now)..
I guess the combo of Betemit/Damon off the bench with the reinsertion of Giambi makes Cairo’s skills obsolete.
a Brower DFA and a Farnsworth trade could make this easier i suppose
“I am nervous after reading this Too Little – Too Late”
Sounds like someone has a short-term memory.
My response to that Pollyannaish article…that’s why you play the games.
How many times has our ace matched up to some guy we never saw with a 5.00+ERA, thinking this was a sure thing…then we lose.
Just because they are playing some easy teams coming up doesn’t mean they with tear them up like we did. Hey, they may even get hot.
Sounds like they are already greasing the wheels of the Rationalization Machine in Beantown. Hey they are verrrrry good at it. Years and years of practice.
NYY: Why do you read that crap?
What else do you expect from Boston sportswriters?
Eric Duncan shouldn’t ever be mentioned on this blog again. A bad back at that age, and he can’t even hit when he is healthy, is a pretty surefire sign that the guy is never going to make it.
That boston.com guy apparently thinks the season ends on August 31, because he didn’t check the Yanks’ September schedule – a whole heap ‘o Baltimore, Toronto, Kansas City and Tampa.
Plus the regressing-to-the-mean Mariners and 3 against the Sox. That’s a month where the Yanks can really do some damage.
Out of the pen, my current mancrush touches 99.
He hits 97 as a starter, and has done so in the 7th inning of games.
For those of you who haven’t seen the kid pitch, you’re in for a treat.
Why all the hate for Cairo? What did he do, run over your dog?
The guy did his job. In fact, he exceeded expectations with his play at first base. Especially since, he is not a first baseman.
3/4 of this roster underperformed for most of this season. Cairo did not. You don’t have to spew hate over the guy because he doesn’t fill a stat sheet. He helped the team win games.
Jeter isn’t sitting. Its not the first time he has been hurt, or in a mini-slump. They have games to win and he isn’t sitting.
He will play, as he should, tonight. Perhaps, if they win tonight, meaning they win the series, you think about giving he and Posada the day off tomorrow, since that would mean two full days off with the off day.
However, with another game needed to win this series, don’t expect Jeter to sit. Its not in his DNA.
Remember Torre’s roster checkpoints every year
Favorite reliever to overuse: Proctor is gone (Quantrill in the past)
Veteran lefthander that can’t get LH out: Myers is gone (Heredia…)
Futility infielder that can’t hit worth a lick: Cairo is coming up next… (Sojo)
I don’t think cairo is gone, but I sure hope so. Sorry Miggy.
But the cap. The kid needs work on the cap.
Adam August 7th, 2007 at 4:01 pm
Eric Duncan shouldn’t ever be mentioned on this blog again. A bad back at that age, and he can’t even hit when he is healthy, is a pretty surefire sign that the guy is never going to make it.
… Yea let’s write of a guy who was a former first round pick and at his age – AN ANCIENT 22… let’s write him off… I mean forget the fact that Shelley Duncan’s 27 and Ryan Howard didn’t debut till he was 25.
Duncan’s 22 and done. 22 and in AAA.
Get a clue
“Why all the hate for Cairo? What did he do, run over your dog?
The guy did his job. In fact, he exceeded expectations with his play at first base. Especially since, he is not a first baseman.”
He has not use on this team now and I’m sick and tired of hearing announcers like Sterling acting like the guy is a great player.
NYY: A boston.com blogger pandering to his audience shouldn’t make you nervous. Wait til the next time Kyle comes out of the bp to “protect” a lead – THEN you can be nervous.
“… Yea let’s write of a guy who was a former first round pick and at his age – AN ANCIENT 22… let’s write him off… I mean forget the fact that Shelley Duncan’s 27 and Ryan Howard didn’t debut till he was 25.
Duncan’s 22 and done. 22 and in AAA.
Get a clue”
Shelley Duncan is having a good little run, but if anyone thinks this is long term then they’re crazy. Amd Ryan Howard didn’t debut until he was 25 because he wasn’t drafted until he was 21 and if you look at his minor league numbers, he hit at every level.
http://thebaseballcube.com/pla.....ward.shtml
Eric Duncan might be 22, but he has a history of back issues (which any Yankes fan should know can cripple a guy’s career), and has a .673 OPS this year in Scranton. He’s never going to hit enough to be a big league first baseman. Just give it a rest.
SJ,
I don’t ‘hate’ Cairo, but you can’t tell me that he deserves a major league roster spot at this point. He played OK-to-good defense at 1B – but not as good as Andy Phillips or Mientkiewicz. He was an OK option as a backup infielder – but not nearly as good as Betemit.
Cairo was slugging .318 and had an OPS+ of 70, i.e. he was 30 percent worse than the average player. Of his 27 hits in his 107 AB, 7 of them were not singles, and they were all doubles. I would be amazed if he did not clear waivers, because there just is not much interest in 33-year-old backup utilitymen who get on base 30 percent of the time.
No hate – just observations based on stats and watching the games. Keeping him on the roster so that he can pinch run while a competent bat is sent down is pointless at this point in time.
I’m not writing E Duncan off. I like him but until he can hit above .230ish, there’s no place for him. He was never a stellar third baseman and I watched him play several games for Scranton at first and they were quite an experience. The Yankees can afford to take the wait and see approach. He is only 22.
I agree. I don’t hate Cairo. I just think there are better options than him. Plus without Cairo, we won’t see Giambi get pinch ran for by Cairo in the 7th, just to see Giambi’s spot in a big situation come up in the 9th, with Cairo there to bat…
KEvin –
Cairo definitely doesn’t make it through waivers…
Did anyone else see how quickly Jeff Cirillo got picked up by the D’backs when the Twins placed him on waivers?
I have never seen Eric Duncan play but righting a guy off at 22 is idiotic….
He is hitting 230 or so with decent power and BB’s but to many K’s.. You do not give up on talent as 22.. He is in AAA not the rookie keague.
Cairo, there is no hate for him. I actually like him and he is a good utility guy but Betemit and Duncan(righty power off the bench) are better and more valuable for this team…..
I assume he does not get picked up and will be back in 3 weeks. He will get paid in full by the Yanks……..
Let everyone calm down on the savior, the coming of JC, it’s Joba Chamberlain, not Jesus Christ.
If he’s a young Johan Santana for the stretch run so be it, but at least give the rookie a chance to overcome any butterflies.
Maybe Bowa or Pena will get a job next year and Cairo can be like Luis Sojo, coming back to coach.
I may be wrong on this, but I think Adam is confusing Eric Duncan with David “Shelly” Duncan.
You are basing too many observations off stat sheets and not watching the games.
Its all about context. Judging stats with bench guys is fools gold.
Alex Cora is now hitting around .250 for the Red Sox. The “stats” say he isn’t good. But, if you watch the games this year, when Pedroia was struggling, Cora helped the Red Sox win at least 5 games this year.
‘Ya think we wouldn’t like to have those 5 games back Cora helped the Red Sox win in April and May in the standings right now?
Nobody is saying Miguel Cairo is an all star. But, when this team was in disarray, and playing worse than anybody in the league, he provided stability at first base, and helped this team win quite a few games, in the process.
Its not about stats or slugging % or any of that other nonsense. He is a bench player. The stats don’t apply to him. Its what he did in his window of opportunity to play and he did very, very well.
Nobody is saying he should be given a long term contract or a plaque in Monument Park. But, there is more to a bench players contributions than just the stat sheet.
Cairo has exceeded expectations this year. That’s something a lot of guys on this team can’t say so far this year.
I fully realize baseball is a business. The Yankees now have a better bench and that may make him expendable. However, don’t discount the contributions of Cairo because, when this team really needed him, he helped them quite a bit this year.
Off that, I hope he gets “hurt”, hits the DL and sticks around the rest of the season.
A recent study shows that Joba Chamblain loses about
2-3 mph on his FB because of that flat cap brim.
To the guy who keeps posting Josh Towers game line against Cleveland…WE DON’T CARE, it was a month ago and the guy has a 5.4 ERA.
“He is hitting 230 or so with decent power and BB’s but to many K’s.. You do not give up on talent as 22.. He is in AAA not the rookie keague.”
This is an outright lie. He has like a .310 OBP and .330 SLG. He is terrible.
Maybe Duncan can high-five Cairo in front of some TV cameras and sprain Cairo’s wrist, so that they could get away with a DL assignment.
“But, if you watch the games this year, when Pedroia was struggling, Cora helped the Red Sox win at least 5 games this year.”
There is absolutely no way Alex Cora is a 5 win player. A 5 win player is a near All-Star.
woops, Towers has a 5.17 ERA, shakin’ in my boots cause he pitched well against Cleveland a month ago.
Jeff NJ – from the previous thread – I was also at the game on Saturday, and although I sit no where near where Arod hit the ball to, the guys parked behind me did. They said that they were two rows away from the guy who caught it. He wasn’t in his seat when the ball was hit, he was walking throw the aisle and it looked to them like he caught it on the fly. Who knows if they are right, but that’s what I heard!
The best fastball still belongs to a Tiger.
That Tiger isn’t playing
Cairo has been let go according to Mike & the Man Dog.
And Bruney is out for Joba.
Too bad the tendon on Zumaya’s middle finger exploded…Doubt he’ll ever be the same.
Bruney got sent down? Or cut?
That Boston.com article is a joke — it leaves out how we took 2 series from Minnesota and Anaheim right before the break – 2 very good teams with winning records. You can cut up numbers all you want, but he fails to mention how KC handed Boston it’s lunch in July — the same KC team we crushed.
Boston’s offense is suspect. I find that quite unbelievable, but it’s the truth. While Manny seems to be heating up, other guys seem to disappear. Granted they have good pitching, but I think our lineup will beat the snot out of Schilling, Wakefield, Lester and even Mr. Beckett. We’ve already proven we can hit Matsuzaka. Those games will come down the bullpen and if Joba and the rest of the young guns can come in and ride to the rescue, we’ll beat them with Mo to protect our leads.
The Yankees walked into Fenway last season and swept a 5 game series — I don’t think there is anyone in the Yankee dugout who think the Red Sox (who often play down to their competition rather than blow them out, unlike the Yankees who demolish bad teams) have it in the bag.
If the Yanks get to 5 games back, Boston is going to come apart at the seams and the finger pointing will begin.
I can’t wait for all those toads on ESPN and Gammons (who I like, but can’t stand his homerism) to eat their words about the mythical Red Sox and their wunderkind GM of the Universe.
I’m excited to see the Yanks match up against some better competition and I think Boston and the rest of the AL are going to be surprised at the results.
Detroit has holes in the rotation and way bigger holes than us in the pen. Cleveland has no pen and rotation issues. Paul Byrd doesn’t strike fear in me or I’m sure any of the Yanks.
The soft underbelly of our team is our pen leading up to Mo, but the team is addressing it and they are bringing up fresh arms who can’t do worse than they guys they replaced. I like our chances in the wild card and winning the east.
The best thing Cairo could do at this point in his career is
go on the 15-day d.l. if he’s really hurt, say 8/9 (day off) through 8/23 (day off) then accept 8 days in AAA Scranton until he’s called up for September. It’s not a demotion unless he sees it as that. He should accept an assignment to AAA (ef the d.l.) cuz what contending team is gonna pick him up for the stretch run? Does he really want to be claimed by some other team and risk not being part of the Yankees winning it all? Does he really want to risk being claimed by Pittsburgh like Josh Phelps was so he can get X more at-bats in September than he would as a Yankee? I mean isn’t it about being a part of winning it all at this point? He took very little money to return this year ($750K), so I doubt he’s a stubbornly prideful man cuz what veteran takes less than double the rookie minimum $380K? If anything, he could get way more playing time and at-bats with Scranton. He’d always be in the game and maybe that could help the Yanks in a September game big time (key pinch-hit, defensive play, etc.)
Bruney for Joba is a good thing.
Now that means once Brower and Karstens start stinking, it’s Britton and Edwar.
I think “Mike and the Man Dog” is a typo, but the imagery of that is funny.
WFAN says Cairo DFA..
It is senseless to lose a versatile, consistently decent player in favor of a one trick pony (who is yet to prove he can sustain the success). Especially when you the one trick pony can be back in 15 days and the versatile player wont. It is a classic example of people being infatuated with the stat sheet.
Yes Cairo DFA’d.
Later man.
Zumaya’s fastball is sure worth a lot on the DL.
Words can’t explain how pumped I’m going to be to see Joba come out in the 7th and start striking people out. It’s going to be a huge shot in the arm for this team as it solves some of our bullpen problems and provides us with youth and enthusiasm. This is going to be great.
Passer by
Who are you talking about???????
DFA ing Cairo when they could have sent down Duncan for 15 days.
Why did they DFA Cairo AND send down bruney? I thought we only needed one spot!
I’m not going to set the bar too high for Joba. The guy was in AA ball this year. I give him 3 starts to start “taking out the trash.”
“It is senseless to lose a versatile, consistently decent player in favor of a one trick pony”
Betemit is versatile AND can hit. No point in having a guy that can sort of play a lot of positions, but can’t hit a lick.
Giambi is up and so is Joba
1+1=2
Yeah, it’s not reasonable to expect Joba to come out of the pen tonight and be totallu unhittable.
I have a question for all the baseball gurus. If a player is DFAed and a team claims him they does the other team have to do a trade for that player or is it staright out claim and done.
“I’m not going to set the bar too high for Joba. The guy was in AA ball this year. I give him 3 starts to start “taking out the trash.â€?”
He started the year in A ball.
giambi getting activated also? edwar coming back?
K I didn’t know Giambi was up. Any word on starting lineups?
Any link where this can be confirmed (giambi and chamberlain up)?
I still say they should try Tyler Kepner in relief. He’s got a great record, and he’s not afraid to pitch inside to Red Sox employees.
I would just like to say that Cairo savedour season for a few weeks when Minky went down and those who say he was a useless player are the same ones that wanted Cano traded, Melky traded etc etc. They were also the same people that said when Cairo was doing great that we didnt need to get another first baseman. he served this team very well during his tenure had some big hits along the way and will be missed. Bentimit was the reason he was gone plain and simple.
Thanks Kat, guy probably went out to get a beer and got back just in time. And he’s getting $100k! Just kidding, I know he’s a season ticket holder, which is something I intend to do after winning the lottery, but otherwise it’s just too many games to commit to and try to sell. Corporate seats are another story.
Hehe… Man Dog.
Yeah, Cairo DFAed and Bruney optioned to AAA.
The Yanks are hoping for this by Cairo’s d.f.a:
No one claims Cairo after 10 days (8/7 through 16).
Cairo accepts an assignment with AAA-Scranton like Wil Nieves did through the end of the month. He’d miss 14 Yankee games this month, big deal as how much has he played in the last 14 games since Phillips, Duncan, and Betemit arrived in that order?
They have Cairo back in September along with Nieves.
“Betemit is versatile AND can hit. No point in having a guy that can sort of play a lot of positions, but can’t hit a lick.”
Betemit played one game at 1B and missed a play on Jeter’s (or ARod’s) throw that Cairo would have made in his sleep. You want a back up player with strong defense. Betemit helps. Doesn’t mean Cairo should go. Cairo helps a lot too. In my opinion Cairo helps the team more than Shelley does. Anybody who expects Shelley to continue to hit like he is currently hitting is just dreaming. Once he fades a little bit he is good for nothing.
“I have a question for all the baseball gurus. If a player is DFAed and a team claims him they does the other team have to do a trade for that player or is it staright out claim and done.”
the team who currently has the player’s rights gets to choose. They can try to work a trade or just let the player go.
Adam,
i thought it was A ball but I wasn’t sure…anyway that just further proves my point.
Is it just me or has this team gotten younger in a hurry.
The so called experts have been saying for the last couple of years that we were too old and that we wouldnt make the playoffs. I think we have shed off some age now. What excuse are they going to use now.
Changing the subject real quick. I live near san diego and I happen to run into a Padres fan. I asked him who would you rather have Hoffman or Rivera in the playoffs. They idiot chose Hoffman. It just amazed me that with all that Rivera has done in the postseason that they would overlook that and strickly look at where his saves are at. Same goes for Pimplebut in Boston.
“In my opinion Cairo helps the team more than Shelley does. Anybody who expects Shelley to continue to hit like he is currently hitting is just dreaming. Once he fades a little bit he is good for nothing.”
Fortunately, Betemit is here in place of Cairo, and Phillips will be playing 1B most of the time anyway. Duncan will be figured out, but the hits he can get before that happens is worth a LOT more than the few defensive innings Cairo would contribute.
Jeter should sit a few days because he’s currently not helping the team win with his slump. I’d MUCH rather have betemit playing those games than Cairo. This is the right move, no question.
Problem is, we DO expect Cairo to continue to hit like he has. And it was Cairo’s 3 error game that allowed Phillips to get a start at first base after sitting for a week when he got called up. Cairo the ballplayer is not as much the problem as the manager’s use of him, taking playing time away from more useful parts of the team.
If Miguel were to wind up in Scranton, there’s no guarantee that he’d be back in September. The Yankees would have to get him back on the 40-man in order to call him up, meaning that someone else would have to be let go. Same with Nieves.
Just got back from Columbus, Ohio. A lot of things sure have happened in just a few days!
I’ve read through. SJ44 – I am in absolute agreement with your comments regarding Miguel Cairo. I hope there is some way the Yankees manage to hold on to him (AAA, whatever). Unfortunately, I don’t think he’ll pass through waivers. He’s a valuable team player and I can’t imagine that no one else would pick him up. I have a question: it’s premature, but IF the Yankees get to the playoffs (WS?), would Cairo be eligible for a share of the money? And if so, would he get a full share or a pro-rated share? I seem to remember that the team can (or does) vote for such things, but I don’t recall exactly how it works.
I’m so looking forward to seeing Joba get to do his thing for the Yankees. I’m sure he’s going to be a little nervous, so my expectations for tonight aren’t too high. Still, it’s exciting for the Yankees to have this talent available.
I also can’t wait to watch a game! First one since Friday, although we got to listen to most of Saturday’s game. This blog is a godsend; at least I got to browse the news while I was away (though not the very extensive comments!). I did get to watch Mike & Mike in the morning (I’d never watched OR listen to them before).
Would have rather seen Farnsworth DFA’d than Bruney sent down. I’d rather have Bruney’s toughness over Farnsworth’s crying anyday.
nice Joe L – awesome rebuttal.
that article exudes intense FEAR more than anything.
Playoff shares are voted on by the players. They would most definitely vote a share for Cairo.
Thanks, Phi.
Doreen,
Cairo would get a full playoff share. He was a popular guy in the clubhouse and the players (who vote the shares) would do the right thing by him, IMO.
He was a good team player and served the team well. I wish him the best.
The team did get a lot younger in a hurry. They did so by solving their issues from within, and adding a 25 year old utility player.
Solid work by Cashman.
He’s added assets to the roster. Now, its up to the players to do their part.
They aren’t DFA’ing Farnsworth and eating 7 million dollars. That would be dumb.
Bruney can work on his weakness, control, in AAA. He will be back when rosters expand on September 1. He’s too much a liability (due to his inability to throw strikes) to use down the stretch.
_whozat_
_August 7th, 2007 at 4:56 pm_
_“I have a question for all the baseball gurus. If a player is DFAed and a team claims him they does the other team have to do a trade for that player or is it staright out claim and done.�_
_the team who currently has the player’s rights gets to choose. They can try to work a trade or just let the player go._
If they decide to work a trade then the does the other player(s) they plan to trade for this DFAed player have to go through the waivers as well?
“Would have rather seen Farnsworth DFA’d than Bruney sent down. I’d rather have Bruney’s toughness over Farnsworth’s crying anyday.”
This has been beaten to death, man. It’s a money thing. If they were going to pay Kyle to go away, they’d have made the trade with the Braves and gotten something for him. Also, maybe taking him out of an MLB situation will get Bruney to stop thinking “Hm…can’t find the plate, but I gotta get this guy out…MUST THROW HARDER!!!” Maybe if doesn’t think his job rides on every pitch, he’ll stop overthrowing and learn to control his stuff, thus becoming more successful and earning his way back to the majors. Bruney with control is a FORCE. Bruney right now is the same as many, many other guys: great stuff, but unreliable.
“If they decide to work a trade then the does the other player(s) they plan to trade for this DFAed player have to go through the waivers as well?”
Believe so. Not sure what the deal is with guys not on the recipient’s 40-man roster, though. I remember last year the Sox traded for someone after the non-waiver deadline and had to do it for a PTBNL because they were supposed to give Adam Stern in return, but the DRays or somebody claimed Stern when the Sox tried to pass him through waivers. He was at AAA at the time, but I think on their 40-man. So, the Sox had to pull him back and complete the deal after the season.
The Yanks need Duncan on this team right now more then they need Cairo. While Duncan is hitting they need to ride it out especially against lefties. When a lefty is pitching you cant have Damon, Cano, Matsui, Abreu, and Giambi in the lineup that is WAY too many lefties. Giambi or Posada are the only people on this team that you would run for..and Torre never does it anyway. If anything happens to Phillips then they can always bring up Basik. I am sure he can do the same things that Cairo did defensively.
I do not get the sending down Bruney move. they are getting rid of almost everyone that was in the bullpen now but they arent replacing them with anyone better!!! I dont understand who would pitch the 7th inning in a close game? Brower no, Karstens no… They needed someone with experience and I think they should of gave Bruney alittle longer time to work this control out. If the Yanks knew they were going to do this then when Ramirez or Britton came up Torre should of actually pitched them so we can see what they can do..Instead of just pushing them aside because they were not veterans and he was scared to pitch them. Chamberlain will probably walk someone and Torre will never want to pitch him again and send him down.
Since when does Cairo and Nieves have to be on the 40-man roster to be called up in September? I’m not saying I don’t believe that, just where does it say that? Are there two expendable guys out of the 15 on the 40-man roster but not on the 25-man roster for both to rejoin the team in September?
If Cairo can’t be called up, someone has to be let go so Nieves or Raul Chavez can cuz like either or not the Yanks need someone to be the third catcher for the final month in case Posada or Molina falls to injury.
“But, if you watch the games this year, when Pedroia was struggling, Cora helped the Red Sox win at least 5 games this year.
‘Ya think we wouldn’t like to have those 5 games back Cora helped the Red Sox win in April and May in the standings right now?”
SJ44,
You know what’s great about baseball? You don’t need to “watch all the games” and remember every single at bat in order to know how valuable a player is. People write down what happens and then calculate how many wins a player actually adds to their team. It’s called ‘WARP’ – Wins Above Replacement Player.
Cora’s WARP1 is 1.3, meaning he has added 1.3 wins to the Red Sox this year. Pedroia, when struggling, might have been slightly worse than a replacement player, so maybe being generous he added 2 wins. See? It’s not so hard. It took me 30 seconds to find that, I didn’t need to make guesses based on vague recollections of games that were played months ago.
As for Miguel Cairo? His WARP1 is .3. You know what that means? DFA.
CaptinsCorner,
A 80mph pitch called ball is the same as a 98mph pitch called a ball.
Chamberlain isn’t going anywhere and he is going to be the guy to pitch 7th innings.
Let’s not act as if Bruney rares walks guys. He does it in just about every outing.
The other day, with a 6 run lead, he did it again. Its pretty hard to expect the manager to have confidence in a guy who is averaging almost 7 walks per 9 innings of work out of the bullpen.
As whozat said, Bruney needs to realize, the solution to his control issues is to not throw harder.
Pete wrote something in the blog a while back that said it all. He talked about the “influence” Farnsworth has had with Bruney and Proctor.
Perhaps that has played a role in these moves?
I’d like for the Yanks to keep Duncan because they need that kind of pop against lefties. With the loss of Sheffield, they really need another power-hitting righty. I love Cairo, too, but who is he going to pinch run for? Melky? Cano? Jeter? A-Rod? Abreu? Matsui? Remember, if Giambi is in the lineup at DH, Damon could serve in that role. If the Yanks deem Betemit adequate enough defensively to play short or second in a bind, Cairo becomes expendable. With Duncan or Giambi on the bench,it gives managers something to think about when they go to the pen in the late innings. Duncan’s threat off the bench means more to the Yanks then a pinch runner. Especially since six of the team’s eight starting position players can run.
“CaptinsCorner,
A 80mph pitch called ball is the same as a 98mph pitch called a ball.”
Unless it’s at your head….forgot that part…
Please remind me why we need Neives on the Post Season roster?
For his bat?
His power arm for throwing out runners?
Or was it to gently caress and massage Mussina’s ego?
A third catcher.
A big thanks from me to Miguel Cairo who helped this team this season in more ways than numbers can ever show.
While I don’t disagree to letting him go and keeping Shelley, I’m sad for a guy who played above his head and filled a huge hole at 1b for a part of this season.
For me, this one hurts a lot more than Will Nieves who basically did nothing for the team.
Miggy played an important part in this season and anyone who tells you any different isn’t a fan of this team. Whether it be giving us a temporary fix at 1b or actually being able to bunt a runner over (something rare on this team), he did the job. He may not have equaled what a replacement 1b produces on paper, but I felt that he gave this team a little bit of stability when they needed it most.
He’s a class act. If he doesn’t latch on with another team for the rest of the season, I hope he somehow ends up back with us in September.
I hope he retires
Alex Cora helped beat the Yankees in two of the Red Sox wins this year. One in Boston and one in NY.
You mean to tell me he isn’t responsible for any other wins for the Red Sox because of some new fangled stat says so? Sorry, not buying it.
I’d kill to have him as the utility infielder on this team and he has had a hand in more than 1.3 worth of Red Sox victories.
I am sure the Red Sox, who love the new stat era, would even disagree with his WARP rating.
Cairo helped the team this year. It’s unfortunate to see him go, but others bring more to the table. It is quite possible that he sneaks through, and goes to AAA, but I don’t know how likely those two things happening are.
I think Bruney has potential – after all, he did the job last year – but obviously has work to do.
Cash has really reworked the pen. And still two options left – Ramirez and Britton – if necessary. Not bad work on the fly. Let’s see what he can do with the Krazy one.
Why all the love for Miggy cairo? People are like mapping out the days until he can come back to the Yankees…why don’t you hold a vigil outside of Yankee stadium in the meantime! C’mon, it’s MIGUEL CAIRO, guys, please! He sucks and they don’t need him, end of story.
“Alex Cora helped beat the Yankees in two of the Red Sox wins this year. One in Boston and one in NY.”
And how many other games did his mediocre bat cause them to lose?
When you assume a player is going to do nothing, he looks clutch every time he doesn’t fail. The problem is that “a guy who never hits” is not the metric of comparison here. The metric is “the average player at his position”. Ok, you remember a time when Cora had an important hit. Do you remember all the times he didn’t? Do you have any sense of how often, on average, second basemen came through? No? Then you have no basis for a rational comparison.
The “Krazy One” is leaking oil and running at too high of an idle.
He needs a wine enema.
Yeah he “helped them” win the games but the key is he wasn’t solely responsible for the wins. In addition, a replacement level player would have “helped” almost as much as he did. All of his help adds up to adding 1.3 wins…which is actually good for a utility infielder.
The Red Sox might disagree with his WARP1 being his true value, if and only if Bill James has come up with a better way to measure win shares. Sadly, he is now a full time consultant for the Red Sox and can’t share his work with the public. That is scary.
Today’s Yankees !!!
Damon LF
Jeter SS
Abreu RF
A-Rod 3b
Posada C
Cano 2b
Phillips 1b
Duncan DH
Cabrera CF
CLEMENS to pitch a GEM ! Go Yankees !
First, the news you expected: Joba Chamberlain has been promoted to New York and Jason Giambi has been activated from the disabled list.
Now for the news that was a little harder to predict.
To make room for Chamberlain and Giambi, the Yankees optioned Brian Bruney to Scranton/Wilkes-Barre and designated Miguel Cairo for assignment. Apparently Bruney didn’t take the news very well, and Cairo isn’t sure he’ll accept the minor league assignment if he makes it through waivers.
Bruney pitched pretty well in New York, but he had a bad month of July — 10.81 ERA for the month — and apparently the Yankees want him to work on shortening his stride and pitching out of the windup. As far as I can tell, there were two things working against Bruney: The Yankees desire for a true long reliever, and the fact he had options remaining. Jeff Karstens stayed with the team as a long man, and Jim Brower gets at least a few more chances to prove himself without the Yankees exposing him to waivers.
As for Cairo, he became unnecessary after the Wilson Betemit trade. Betemit can play shortstop, which was Cairo’s greatest strength on this team, and he can hit better than Cairo. Ultimately, the choice must have come down to Cairo or Shelley Duncan, and Duncan’s been far too hot to send down. Now the Yankees get to keep Duncan’s huge bat in the lineup against lefties. The risk of designating Cairo is that there really isn’t another good utility option in the Yankees system. If something happens to Betemit, the Yankees will have to use either Chris Basak, Angel Chavez or Andy Cannizaro as their primary infielder off the bench. Granted, that bench player won’t play much down the stretch, and Andy Phillips’ versatility will help lighten the load, but it’s still not an ideal situation.
As for the 40-man, designating Cairo opens a spot for Chamberlain. Giambi already had a spot because he was never sent to the 60-day disabled list.
One more bit of news: Scranton/Wilkes-Barre outfielder Justin Christian went on the disabled list Tuesday with a strained left thumb. I don’t remember seeing a play that I thought would result in such an injury, but that certainly doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.
http://emedia.thetimes-tribune.....axCount=25
I think sending Bruney down is another way of taking away Torre’s toys and safety nets. If Joba was at all shaky, Bruney would have been next on Joe’s “trust” list. IMO, from a pure on-field standpoint, Brower should probably go. Joe still has Vizcaino and Farnsworth but his old fallbacks are disappearing forcing his hand to use the kids. Can’t blame them for that, though I’d rather see Edwar than Brower.
That’s all I mean though Bob, he helped them win games. I am not saying he is the “driving force”. I am saying he is a valuable guy to the team. In quintessential bench guy, if you will.
Don’t get me wrong, I love the moves the Yankees have made. Just unfortunate a guy like Cairo is expendable.
He did a good job. However, no question, Betemit is an upgrade at the position.
I was actually shocked by Cora’s WARP of 1.3, for reference A Rod’s is 7.2 for this year and Melky’s is 4.3. A 5 win player is very valuable.
Shelly Duncan vs a righty? This goes against everything everyone has been saying today about Duncan’s role on team: Power righty vs left handed pitching.
I admire very much the overwhelming support a lot of you have for the young kids.
Now that Hughes has come back I want to say something. I believe he will be good. Possibly as good as a #3 or #4 pitcher (maybe along the lines of a Steve Avery, effective for about 5 years). I think his comeback game showed what he is capable of. There was in inordinate amount of hype that (understandably) built up over his interrupted no-hitter back in May. As I stated before the trade deadline, I think Cashman missed a big opportunity by not trading him for Texeira, who is a proven young talent and can help the team every day as opposed to every five days.
Well, with Joba coming up, I hope he will be as advertised by all of you. Maybe someone like him can bring back a Santana in a future deal. Who knows. But I’ll be watching, mostly because of all of you posters who have built some compelling enthusiasm around the youngsters. Best of luck to him tonight.
Anyway, enjoy the game. I may not agree with all of your support of going with prospects, but I have definitely been struck by how supportive you all are of their endeavors. Reminds me of the old days before free agency when you knew Rizzutto was your shortstop for the next decade from day one.
Thanks for reading.
trade good starting pitching for Texiera?
I’ll be nice and not comment. How’s the Chowder?
Make the right trade…
You sound like the Yankees of old. You seem to be basing to much off of a performance where Hughes was solid til the fifth where he tired in 100+ heat index weather.
whozat,
Do stat people ever consider intangibles ? Worth to the team that don’t show up on stat sheets, heads up plays, drive, leadership, smart back up plays, good team mate, etc. ?
I’m curious about this because Jeter is rated poorly as a fielder, in range I believe, yet there are few that would question his value to the Yankees.
You can pick apart any player with certain stats but it’s the overall performance that values the player. Picking one flaw and saying that is the players downfall means little to the over performance to many fans.
Intangibles do not mean as much as statistical excellence over the course of a 162 game season. A clutch hit here and there does not make Miguel Cairo any less of an abomination. Leadership and fire is not worth as much as a .500 slugging percentage. The goal of a team is to score runs and not give up as many runs. That’s what matters.
It was Stick Michael who recommended that AAA SWB relief pitcher Jim Brower be promoted to the Bronx.
I don’t know about the rest of you people, but his word is good enough for me.
Give Brower some time and a chance.
And for the folks here who aren’t too familiar with Stick, it was Stick who GM’ed the team back in the early 1990s and brought into and developed within the Yankee system talents such as Bernie, Jeter, Pettitte, Rivera, Posada, and Mendoza.
As for Edwar, as exceptional as his changeup is, his fastball is only adequate. His control of it and his ability to hit his spots will decide if he will have any future in the Bronx. Use Edwar’s time at AAA to work on the control of his fastball and other secondary, non-mickey pitches. If he were to develop a good 2-seamer/sinker combo to go along with his Mickey Mouse, then he’ll be able keep hitters off-balance by changing speeds while keeping the ball down.
Getting lots of groundballs doesn’t hurt either.