Game 131: Yankees at Tigers
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Aug 27, 2007 
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Here is the lineup:
YANKEES
Damon LF
Jeter SS
Abreu RF
Rodriguez 3B
Matsui DH
Posada C
Giambi 1B
Cano 2B
Cabrera CF
Mussina RHP (8-9, 5.22)
Pregame chatter: Yanks are facing RHP Justin Verlander (13-4, 3.63). … The Yankees are 2-4 on their road trip and fly home tonight to face Boston tomorrow. Andy Pettitte, tomorrow’s starter, has already gone ahead. … Jeter says he’s fine after sitting yesterday. … This will be back-to-back days at first for Giambi, which is inviting trouble. He says his foot feels fine, however, and this is a night game after a day game.
This is clearly their best, most-balanced lineup from an offensive standpoint. They’ll need it against Verlander.
UPDATE, 6:05 p.m.: The Yankees assigned seven prospects to Peoria of the Arizona Fall League, which starts Oct. 9. Right-handers Steven Jackson, Ross Ohlendorf, Kevin Whelan and Steven White were selected along with shortstop Reggie Corona, first baseman Juan Miranda and outfielder Brett Gardner.
UPDATE, 6:16 p.m.: I thought you’d find this amusing:
Actual exchange with Derek Jeter this afternoon
Reporter 1: “It’s been about 48 hours between games for you, has that made a big difference with your knee?”
Jeter: “Yeah, I’m fine.”
Reporter 1: “Is it improved since yesterday?”
Jeter: “I’m good to go.”
Reporter 2: “How much benefit to get from getting one day off when you’re banged up like that?”
Jeter: “Um, I’m fine.”
Reporter 3: “Derek, has your body had anything to do with the slump you’re in?”
Jeter: “I’m in a slump? Really? Well, we’ll see.”
UPDATE, 6:27 p.m.: The Tigers put Gary Sheffield on the DL. Had I to guess, he’ll shut it down for the rest of the season. Sheff would rather sit on his good numbers than play hurt and hurt his value.
Timo Perez was called up.
UPDATE, 7:21 p.m.: So we’re in the clubhouse today and suddenly I hear this weird sound. Kind of like a burp but also like a kazoo.
I glance around a corner and there’s Kyle Farnsworth with this thing that looks like a snorkel for a midget. Turns out he went to Bass Pro Shops and bought a deer caller.
I’m no hunter, but supposedly you blow on this thing, it sounds like a deer, an actual deer shows up and – bang – it’s bye-bye Bambi.
Mariano Rivera, sitting in the next locker, watched curiously as Farnsy worked on different sounding calls. When a few nosy writer types ambled over to ask what the animal the call was for, Mo laughed.
“You guys,” he said. “See, it worked.”
Kyle tooted away for a while but no deer showed up. Which is good, because I’m fairly sure he could have figured out a way to kill them.
UPDATE, 7:33 p.m.: Hey Mike, Joey from Westchester, long-time listener, first-time caller. Still think Melky can’t play center?
UPDATE, 7:38 p.m.: 30 pitches/19 strikes for the Moose. That can’t keep up.
UPDATE, 8:12 p.m.: Well, he knew what was at stake, he had four days to prepare and he’s getting rocked. At this point you’d have to be surprised if Mussina is on the mound against Tampa Bay on Saturday.
Steven White?
Kei Igawa?
Matt DeSalvo?
Ian Kennedy?
The Hank Aaron Pitch-Back?
Torre was trying to be optimistic before the game when he talked about it. But he didn’t hide the idea that the Yankees would be willing to make a change.
UPDATE, 8:40 p.m.: I truly thought before the game that Mike Mussina would figure out a way to at least keep the Yankees in the game and give himself another shot. What happened tonight was a scenario I didn’t envision. He wasn’t just bad, he was nearly as brutal as he was the other night. Sure, Cano could have dove for that ball. But would it have mattered? Carlos Guillen crushed those two pitches he hit. Mussina was throwing strikes like the Yankes wanted and the Tigers hit them.
Meanwhile, has the Edwar Ramirez Fan Club disbanded? It’s OK to be a reliever with one pitch if that’s a moving fastball. Not if it’s a changeup. His fastball is just not good enough for this level based on what we have seen.
Don’t you hate the idiots that get excited to be the first to post?
Verlander is a punk who got roughed up in his last start. no reason we shouldn’t pound him, especially with a line up like this one
are they booing or mooing?
i love the lineup
Verlander is coming off a 4 inning, 10 hit start and loss, his shortest outing since April, in which he threw 86 stressful pitches. His three prior August starts were 108, 114, 119 pitches respectively and his ERA is pushing 4.00. Note: that 119 pitch outing was the Aug 16th win against the Yankees in the Bronx in which he went 5 and a third and was charged with 3 runs.
Maybe he’s tired (I can hope, can’t I?)
This is their best offensive lineup. Let’s hope Granderson doesnt try dragging a bunt down the 1st base line.
To be honest Pete, they may have to go to that lineup the rest of the way.
Let’s be candid. The starting pitching isn’t good enough to get them to the playoffs. We have to stop believing it is. They have two reliable starters, Wang and Pettitte. The other guys try, grind, and fight but have very uneven performances.
They are either too old, too young or too shot. Definitely not in the “reliable” catagory. The only way they are getting to the playoffs is to bludgeon the ball and look to score 7+ runs a game the rest of the year.
Its not the best formula in the world to make the playoffs. Some would argue its a stupid one. However, its their only shot. They aren’t getting in on pitching and defense and we have to stop waiting/believing they can.
The lineups are going to have to be designed with an offense first mentality from hereon out. From the 7th inning on, if they are ahead, they can substitute for defense. Until then, it has to be offense first.
The bullpen is fixed with the new additions and the resurgence of Farnsworth. At this point, they have to hope/pray the bullpen holds up and Torre utilizes the arms effectively (or properly) the rest of the way to support the offense. Can it work? We shall see.
If Giambi can’t stay healthy, you deal with it when/if it happens. Until then, he has to play everyday at first place, IMO.
This team is what it is, at least for one more season. An offense first team.
In the off-season, I really hope they can begin to change the philosophy.
Until then, you gotta go with what you got.
They should have an insurance policy, literally, for when Giambi plays 1B.
To put things in perspective to the naysayers on this blog (SJ44 you know who you are), Coolstandings rates the Yankees at better than 50% favorite to make the playoffs. They use a pretty goo methodology taking into account record to date, run differential to date, strength of schedule to date and importantly, actual games remianing and against whom. If anything, I think this underestimates the Yankees chances because we are fielding a better team today than we did all year. Despite Hughes struggles, he is taking innings from Igamwa, Karstens, Wright, Clippard, DeSalvo etc. And, other than Rivera our bullpen rates much better going forward than it has to date.
I think the offesne is a wash relative to the season to date. Arod and Posada are the only ones playing materially better so faar than their career norms, and Jeter seems to be hurting. But Abreu, Melky, Damon and Cano should close the season out with better production than year to date. And the bench/1B is much stronger now with Betemit, Giambi, Molina and Duncan getting the Abs that went to Minky, Cairo, and the auto-out that was Wil Nieves.
http://www.coolstandings.com/b.....gs.asp?i=1
You can see that this is a must win game just by looking at the lineup. I’d like to see this from here on out, the best potential for offense comes from this lineup.
Hopefully we get to see Joba tonight. But that means Mussina needs to bounceback and wake up. If he has another Angel-esk start, they cant afford not to change something
Couldn’t agree more in re: offensive firepower in this lineup. Giambi’s defensive deficiencies aside, this gives us a very good chance to rip the hell out of the ball.
unfortunately for us, Verlander will probably pitch his best game of the month tonight. Just our luck right?
Michael T.,
And the cherry to top your sundae is that Accuscore is projecting the Yankees are the favorite in today’s game 54% Yankees/46% Tigers.
A win today would go a long way. We really missed out on taking advantage of some Seattle and Boston losses.
didn’t finish my thought – gives us a very good chance to rip the hell out of the ball and hopefully compensate for the potential disaster on the mound tonight
Let’s hope we DON’t need to see Joba tonight. If he doesn’t pitch tonight, he’ll be eligible to pitch in games 1 and 3 against the Red Sox.
Over and under line on Moose.
under five or over five?
Very good lineup. I’m keeping my fingers crossed that MIke will throw 6 solid innings, okay maybe 7. But I won’t get too greedy. Hopefully we build a nice lead over the Tigers and hand it over to the pen. We really need this win! Espically since we should be able to gain ground on Seattle tonight, they have to fae Lacky and he is due a good start. (plus i need him to help my fantasy team!)
Tim C,
Just in the first or the game? Just kidding!!!! Love the Moose on the mound. Don’t mess with a pissed off Moose.
SJ44
Do you really think Seattle’s rotation is better than ours? C’mon, get real and stop whining like a school girl who just skinned a knee.
Since you have absolutely no faith that this team will make the playoffs…can you promise to stop posting your whining drivel when they do? Deal???
Are we back to not worrying about our defense and think to outscore everyone.(ALA 2006)? Gaimbi= DH. We cant forget what got us to this point of the season. Burn Giambi’s glove so that Torre will never have that option again. Are we ever going to learn from our rescent mistakes. Phillips is our best 1b option,with Betemit going in once in awhile.
Kevin,
Hey! I’ve seen boys cry more on the playground. Girls rule there.
Don’t be so harsh on SJ44. It could be someone posting as him because I don’t think he’d go on and on in 9 out of the last 10 threads (exaggeration) about one particular pitcher.
Coolstandings says the Yankees are a good bet to the playoffs and that makes it a given? What does that mean, really? Nothing.
I think Seattle’s rotation is a little better than the Yankees at this time. The results bear it out.
Jeff Weaver is pitching better than Mike Mussina and Phil Hughes. In fact, look at Weaver’s last 7 starts. They have been damn good. As good as anybody’s in the league.
Washburn and King Felix are very good starters. Reliable, know what you get, type of guys.
They have 3 reliable guys in their rotation. Better than the Yankees at this point.
Ramirez struggles on the road, but is better at home. Nothing special but, he is a 5th starter.
The wild card is Batista. He is either really good or really bad. He may be the guy to watch.
If he pitches well in September, that could be a tipping point for the Mariners.
I don’t get caught up on names of players or past performances. I look at what they are doing now. That’s what matters. The Mariners don’t have to have 5 aces in their rotation. They have guys who have pitched well the past few months, a better than average bullpen, and a very good offense.
Everybody keeps waiting for them to fall apart. So far, in the past two weeks, the team that has lost ground has been the Yankees, not the Mariners.
Will they fall apart? I don’t know. But, until they do, they are in the race to stay.
Kevin, unless you have become the blogmaster, I don’t think its your call as to whether I should or should not post.
When you get that promotion, let me know and I will take it under advisement.
I don’t think it’s “inviting trouble” as much as it is “inviting offensive production.”
The difference Giambi gives in offense over Phillips outweighs the difference in defense Phillips provides.
Giambi is our best option at 1B because of the spots he opens up in the lineup for Damon and Matsui. Damon, our best left-fielder, is a pesky leadoff hitter. Although it may seem like Damon has been down this year, his on-base percentage is .356, .003 better than his career average. I would take him at the top of the lineup everyday. Plus, we’ve seen what Matsui has been doing for the last couple months, so there’s no reason to have him out of the lineup other than for occasional rest. Then there’s Giambi who is actually showing the ability to hit the ball to left field, as well as his usual power.
If George Steinbrenner were alive, he’d be all over the media about how ridiculous it is for the Yankees to be playing tonight while Boston rests and lies in wait.
SJ44
I don’t really want you to stop posting…you often make some very good points…but your negativity is just too much.
But please do the rest of us a favor who actually believe in this team – don’t jump on the bandwagon once we make it to the playoffs, OK??? You’ll lose all credibility once you do.
And by the way, I’ll bet you a $1 that Phil Hughes out-performs Jeff Weaver down the stretch. Deal?
Gaimbi is the best offensive option but he is not our best option. Phillips has been hovering around 290 and his glove has been valuable. That friday game saving catch by Phillips, Gaimbi could only dream of making one like it. We have to look at the game changing plays just as much as the hitting. Which Phillips has more than hit with runners in scoring possition. Im tired of watching a beer league team like in the end of 2006. Its time to have a well balanced team. This is the reason I didnt want Giambi to comeback this year, Torre would not be able to resist the urge of playing him on the field.
Giambi or Damon? That should be the only choise in this matter.
Do you think they can put all 7 position players on the warning track?! Hopefully that is not where they will need them. The competitive and no excuses Mussina better show up tonight. Anything worse then 6 innings and 3 runs is not exceptable, and then Kennedy should be brought up. Also his comment was pathetic about who would replace me..Doesnt he realize that someone in A ball can match or do better then he is right now.
I was thinking that Jeter would sit again tonight so he would be ready for the Boston series but I guess he is ready to play. Giambi has to be in the lineup almost everyday so hopefully he can play some 1st base and not hurt the team or get injured. Against Boston since they will need all the offense they can get Damon should play CF, and Giambi DH. That way they can have both in the lineup and dont have to lose Giambis bat in the late innings when he would be taken out for defense.
Seattle does not have a better rotation than the Yanks and their performance in the last 30 games against tough teams will prove it.
Not saying that the Yankee rotation is great, but they are superior to the M’s.
The Yankee rotation will perform better these last 30 games because the toughest part of their schedule is almost over.
Way too many Yankee fans overreact when this team loses.
steven
IF the Boss were alive…
How true and sad at the same time.
There is no way Cabrera should ever be taken out of CF so that Damon can stay in the lineup. To me Phillips not on first is the obvious answer as Giambi’s offense far outways any defense Phillips may provide. Phillips has absolutely no power and is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay worse on offense than Giambi.
Let this season be a lesson to next year’s manager (hopefully Joe Girardi) by using the old adage of a win in April is as good as a win in September.
Joe Torre loves living dangerously by fluffing off early season losses.
in a shocking turn of events, i once again agree with everything sj44 has posted. who knew?
although, i think we may disagree on this: i think mussina will pitch well enough to keep is job tonight. and then he’ll turn around and spit the bit in an upcoming series where they really need him to step up. mussina’s one of the most predictable pitchers in all of baseball. you usually know when a good or bad outing is coming. i think he’ll be fine tonight. whether they’ll win, i’ve no idea, but i think mussina will keep his job long enough to really blow it for them down the road.
Yanks will BOMB Verlander And when they face Weaver they will BOMB him.
I’ve been away a while and let me tell you, one thing hasnt changed, SJ44 still has his negativity.
Our rotation and offense are much better than Seattle. Pettitte, Wang, and Clemens are all good in big games. Hughes has a quality start most of the time and Mussina usually gives a decent outing. Look at their statistics. Honestly, How the HELL can you trust Jeff Weaver? He is just about the worst starter in baseball, in my opinion. He is absolutely horrible. Much worse than you could ever accuse Moose of being.. or even Jaret Wright or Shawn Chacon. He was the most useless piece of **** when he was with the Yankees and still is.
The biggest problem right now is making sure Mo is ok for the stretch and playoffs. Without him, we lose a lot of bullpen stability.
ORDER YOUR PLAYOFF TICKETS NOW.
May 29 with a 21-29 record, too early to panic?
Never.
Don’t you read Sun Tzu?
If Sun Tzu were to post here, he would get kicked out by Pete as a troll.
If there was ever a time for Farnsworth’s head to be on straight it’s now – - this week. He can be a difference maker out of the bullpen between now and September 5th.
Putting the bullpen in a worn out mode could be lethal and him stepping up can go a long way.
why exactly should SJ be positive? In case you haven’t noticed the Yanks have glaring holes in their starting rotation. And as we all know, good pitching always wins out.
“i think mussina will keep his job long enough to really blow it for them down the road”
sounds about right to me…
Guys, while driving home tonight I had the exact same thought as SJ44 about the team. Two reliable starters and three question marks. Unfortunately, starting pitching is what is going to make the difference, and Seattle – 80% or so through the season – ain’t falling apart. (Figures, with our luck, Jeff Weaver picks now to get it together, instead of 2003.) Doesn’t mean I’m not rooting for the Yanks – but you have to be realistic.
Kevin,
Hope you don’t think I’m lecturing because I think we’re on the same page, but really fans come in all shapes and sizes. You’ve got your crazies who literally turn red at the mention of the Yankees, your bandwagon fans, your analytical, critical, stupid, and your optimistic fans.
I think most of us are of the optimistic variety. We love our team, we love our guys, we love the enemy when they defect to us. It’s all about the pinstripes.
We love them no matter if they’ve lost velocity or the strike zone because they have other attributes like pitchability or good defense or homerun power. And no, we’re not burying our heads in the sand or being pollyannish if we choose to look beyond the warts and only see the good. Because there are no perfect ballplayers or perfect teams. They all have their warts. Being able to embrace your team despite the flaws is what being a good fan is all about.
So yes, it can get a little down here especially after losses. A whole island nation had to come onto this blog to scold Yankee fans for not appreciating Wang who is or isn’t our ace. I, like you Kevin, don’t like to see harping ad nauseum here, but like I said they come in all shapes and sizes.
Rant over, basically everyone needs to chill out and enjoy the team. It’s a good one, not the best, not perfect, but a good one nonetheless.
Hopefully we can get a win tonight and a split and disappear from Detroit faster than Barry Sanders did.
SJ44 only is negative when the Yankees are playing poorly – and is negative about their outlook. You should have seen him and kasey during the great stretch in July/early August, and of course, they proclaimed, they were projecting the Yankees to do great things all along.
SJ is good analytically, he provides insight and level-headed words, but he is the absolute definition of a go-as-the-wind-blows fan.
Guys, come on – the purpose of this is not to criticize one another, but to share thoughts about the Yankees.
Pete,
hard to believe, but the dude’s name is actually Reegie. whacky eh?
god,
Which is it? Pete has it as Reggie. Speaking of Reggie is Jackson’s real name Reginald?
Jason will sit tomorrow and Philips will play first. Matsui in left and Damon DH’ing. You really don’t have many choices. The bullpen should be good except, please don’t bring out Henn!!
Viz and Farns are out for tonight, use Bruney and Ramirez tonight and save Joba, Viz and Farns for tomorrow. Or use Farns tonight and keep his crazy head away from RedSox games
Mel,
thanks for addressing me as God. That was one of the main ideas behind my name switch. His name is Reegie Corona, not Reggie.
mel – I’m not telling SJ44 he can’t be a fan and be negative…just the opposite – to stick to his guns and when we make the playoffs he should still maintain that this team sucks and we had no right to make the playoffs and that Seattle was better than us..and that Jeff Weaver was better than Phil Hughes. Seems like a fair requesst.
Of course fans like that are the first ones to jump back on the bandwagon once the team starts rolling again. We’ll see what happens.
yes it is Reginald Martinez Jackson
. – your post re: sun tzu and pete was brilliant!
Jeff weaver has been better lately than Phil Hughes. There isn’t really any arguing about that. Weaver has 3.14 ERA in August. Obviously, long term, I’m taking Hughes anyday, but at the moment Weaver has been a better pitcher.
I’ll borrow a quote from a brilliant mind.
I’m raising the ante. Anybody that wants in, get in. Anybody that wants out can get out.
This team is going to the playoffs, OK?
This team is going to the playoffs.
Thanks, Gayle.
god,
You’re dontfirecash, right? Loss column guy. Stupid Seattle!
yes sir Mel.
Thomas:
Henn is at AAA Scranton/Wilkes-Barre. Bruney replaced him several days ago.
We are going to need divine intervention to make the playoffs.
Kevin,
Don’t be afraid to speak your mind! You’re just saying what a lot of people won’t, it’s all good.
If anyone would like a Christmas Day WWI type armistice, you might focus on this on this interesting anecdote and find common ground w/ your adversaries on this blog:
Today I spoke with a Red Sox fan who told me that the Red Sox had a better pitching staff than the Yankees. His reasoning was, I swear to God, that the Red Sox had two pitchers with 16 wins. He claimed “wins are all that matter”, and used this statistic as the sole determiner of pitching effectiveness. When I told him his argument would be better served by focusing on a different stat., like ERA, he defended wins but asked me if the Red sox did indeed have a lower ERA than the Yanks.
I’ll just let that whole thing speak for itself.
Go Yanks!
Jeter certainly doesn’t like to give TOO much info. If he were Paul Revere, we would have never known the Red Coats were coming…lol
But, that is Captain Clutch…..
I’ve been praying to all the big gods out there; Regular God, Allah, Krishna(and various other Hindu Gods) and of course Confucious.
godhelpus,
Isn’t that your deal? Better call in those favors or make a deal with the devil.
And you got change your handle, I’m amazed it made it through the filter. god-hel-pus
haha, way to break the handle down Mel. I’m sticking with it until I feel that the big man is on our side again.
Pete,
Great exchange there with Jeter. Why so down on Sheffield? He may a have a real problem. Like age.
“A whole island nation”??
Geez, OK, I’m not one of them. But last time I check I do live on that island nation.
Of course Wang is not the team’s ace. He’s just who he is.
Keith –
I believe Henn is still up. We recalled Bruney when Villone went on the DL.
Anyone still want to criticize the sheff trade? I would have taken Kevin Whelan straight up for the aging/injured Sheff.
Did anyone notice in yesterday’s game that we pinch-ran Duncan for Giambi in the 9th?
With Rabelo catching, that was the perfect situation for stealing a bag. Trouble is, until Sept. 1, we have no such resource.
I know Jeter is immortal for fellow Yankee fans… but i hope you dont post his non-answers.. its worse than Geography
I like the lineup. Why is Damon playing left field a lot lately though?
Nathan,
I don’t know if you’ve seen Jeter do interviews in the lockerroom, but that’s his humor. Very dry, and actually pretty clever at outfoxing the media. You’ve seen him jokingly give Kim a hard time, right? She gets so flustered it’s actually funny and she gets a kick out of it.
I believe Matsui’s knees arent doing so good. So they are using the dh spot to rest them.
I love Derek’s comments. He’s the man.
Sheff would rather sit on his good numbers than play hurt and hurt his value.
ZING
I predicted Tigs. will take 3/4……I hope I’m wrong.
I believe Mussina was roughed up something awful during an ugly brawl early in his Baltimore career, which, incidentally, almost bought an untimely end to Cal Ripken’s streak, when the latter got clipped below the knee amid the squalor. It was one for the history books, something out of “Gangs of New York�. After that, Mussina, whose season ended as a result, if my memory serves me correctly, counted himself out of the retaliation business. Sounds logical.
On a random note, my God, how ‘bout his 1992 season, pitching in THAT ballpark, when it truly played like a bandbox… amazing, and interesting to consider, how badly were his statistics damaged pitching in Camden Yards, and later on, relying on decidedly shaky infield defenses? Well, in fairness… Greg Maddux had his best seasons with Jeff Blauser manning shortstop… but that’s the greatest pitcher ever.
If this is final chapter for Mussina, he has absolutely nothing to be ashamed of. People questioning his big game ability are simply ignorant. He had one of the best post season runs EVER in 1997, beating Randy Johnson twice in the ALDS*, before completely dominating the loaded Indians in the ALCS. The O’s had themselves were undone by Armando Benitez and a lackluster offensive performance in that Series. Mussina was sublime. In 2004, he would have defeated Curt Schilling and Pedro Martinez, in consecutive starts, if it weren’t for Tom Gordon being totally shot.
Mike Mussina is one of the best pitchers of this generation, period.
* “ We weren’t counting on Sandy Koufax showing up for them.� – Alex Rodriguez on Mike Mussina in the ’97 playoffs.
Hey Pete, I just want to let you know that Ohlendorf and Gardner do not know yet if he will be pitching in the Arizona Fall League, they told me today that their names were thrown around, and they were told of the possibility, but it was not 100% official yet. There is the chance that he had not heard yet, but I just wanted to let you know.
Also, if any of you are in the Scranton area, I’ll be on Yankee radio tonight for a short interview regarding the state of the team.
Glad we got rid of that clown Sheffield, breaks down and has a big mouth. He has great numbers, but I never liked him.
What sense does it make to keep Pavano on the 40-man roster ? The whole world knows he’ll never throw another pitch as a Yankee. By the time his rehabbing is finished (if ever) his contract will be finished.
Why would Shef worry about his value? He has a guaranteed contract for next year.
And good thing Detroit traded Craig Monroe – so they could bring up Timo Perez.
A Mussina start!
Time to settle in for what’s likely to be a VERY entertaining start.
I think the story about Mussina’s job under threat is over done. Surely the Igawa enigma would be worse. And Torre never threatens his player in the media. The point is just to light a fire under Moose. Timed like this before a big Detroit game, you know Mussina under pressure is going to pitch his balls off tonight. And that’s why Joe has created this little environment for him.
Bronxie Brenda,
The owners negotiated a clause in the cba that players lose their parking stall if they’re not on the 40-man roster.
Jeff Weaver’s last 4 starts: 4-0, 28.2 IP, 22 hits, 2 BB, 21 K’s, 10 runs allowed.
Phil Hughes last 4 starts: 1-1 (team record 1-3 in his starts) 23.1 innings, 18 hits, 9 BB, 20k’s, 14 runs allowed.
If Jeff Weaver is, “the worst pitcher in baseball”, as someone posted on here, what does that make Phil Hughes?
I said Weaver has pitched better than Hughes in the last month and I stand by what I wrote. Hopefully, that changes, both now and in the future.
However, as of right now, Weaver has outpitched him in the last 4 starts.
damon has a lot of power
Anyone been to Comerica? They used to have a really cool huge painting of whales on one of the sky scrapers facing the ballpark. The thing must have been at least 20 stories big. Then it got covered by a huge, ugly Verizon advertisement : (
Watching Jeter waddle in through the dugout kinda reminds me of Redd Foxx on Sanford and Son.
What sense does it make to keep Pavano on the 40-man roster ? The whole world knows he’ll never throw another pitch as a Yankee. By the time his rehabbing is finished (if ever) his contract will be finished.
-None, that’s why he isn’t.
geez, pete. could you make it any more obvious that you’ve got a problem with shef? is it because he insulted your best friend torre? he’s injured, so he goes on the dl. seems pretty simple. considering he negotiated his contract with the yankees without an agent, i’d say money isn’t always his number one priority. he may have a big mouth, but he’s always played his butt off, playing through injuries when he can. he deserves much criticism, but just not on this point.
A rare A-Rod hit against the Tigers.
Coming into today’s game he’s hit .222/.344/.370 against them in the regular season. Although to be fair, if the sun wasn’t in his eyes, there’s a good chance Thames makes that catch.
Dan:
Ohlendorf and Gardner are on the roster e-mailed out by MLB today, which is really all I can go on. These things can change, obviously.
To whoever thinks Sean Henn is in the minors: He’s not. Here, active and available. Villone was DL’d when Bruney came back
Pete- why would Sheffield “rather sit on his good numbers than play hurt and hurt his value.” He’s got a multi-year contract that runs until he’s about 40 years old. How would playing hurt now damage his value? Maybe he’s just hurt
School started today and already I’m late for Yankee games T_T.
Would have been nice to get an early lead for Moose but hopefully we can draw first blood. The Yankees just haven’t done well this year when they’ve been put in an early hole.
OOPS, back in my little spiel, A-Rod actually referenced Cy Young when referring to Mussina in the ’97 ALDS. Sorry for my lousy fact checking, Cy. Hate when that happens.
Peter, maybe sheff is hurt and he feels like he is hurting his team if he plays?
Mussina looks upset ALREADY! This is ridiculous.
Sheffield’s scheduled to come back in early September. Your statements about Sheffield are hardly accurate Pete. Try not to let your bias show so much.
Moose has got to have back pains from all the pitching he has to do from the stretch this year
What do you think of his location so far? So far he’s thrown all strikes except for the pitch out.
I’m watching ESPN and Rick Sutcliffe just called Moose an old man who can’t field position.
I must be twisted; listening to vets rank out each other made me laugh.
Everyone needs to bite their tongue and ignore our “friend” from up north.
Mike is pitched to bad luck right now.
Hit up the middle that he just missed, and a stolen base.
Man, that was a REAL hanger. He’s lucky his control was so off on that pitch, if it was closer to the zone it could have been crushed.
Could Kay be anymore excited. Makes me sick.
Rick needs to stuff a sock in it.
here we go with Moose pudding
ANOTHER hit. This is almost comical.
It’s not looking good for Moose so far.
“May be the last time, I don’t know-oh”
That Sheff negotiated without an agent (and was in a legal battle with his old agent- I believe Boras) is more an indication of how in love with the extra dollars he could save, than anything else.
He may have played hurt, but he’s still a jerk, and, lets remember, its Pete’s blog, and he can write what he wants, and push whatever agende he has.
If Mussina can’t retired Thames, he’s REALLY cooked. This guy’s hitting under .250!
“Jeff Weaver’s last 4 starts: 4-0, 28.2 IP, 22 hits, 2 BB, 21 K’s, 10 runs allowed.
Phil Hughes last 4 starts: 1-1 (team record 1-3 in his starts) 23.1 innings, 18 hits, 9 BB, 20k’s, 14 runs allowed”
With those four wins against the White Sox (twice), Rangers & Orioles (all of whom have losing records), Weaver is still only 6-10 for the year with an ERA well above 5. His ERA last year was above 6.
Stats over such a small sample are fairly worthless when they differ so greatly with a guy’s record as a whole unless there’s an explanation for the improved performance that would make one expect that it isn’t a fluke. If there’s such an explanation, I haven’t heard it and will take our chances with Hughes over Weaver for the rest of the year.
I look at the players on Seattle and I’m just not that impressed. I think they’ve been playing over their heads. If the Yankees can’t make up a few games on Seattle over the rest of the year, they don’t deserve to make the playoffs.
Mike is pitched to bad luck right now. Hit up the middle that he just missed, and a stolen base.
what is bad luck about it ?
Dr. I wish there was a way to ignore these idiots.
First I think they got the hitter at second. Second great heads up play by Cano.
I know I am going to get ridiculed but, my stomach is already turning….Moose needs to sack it up.
How are there two outs?
CANO!!!!
woww, nice play robbie.
The Yankees needed that.DP is on ordder, but they have to watch the double steal.
What a bad call. Granderson was clearly safe on the replay.
I guess even the ump felt bad for Moose.
No swings and misses by Tiger hitters so far. He has clearly lost his stuff. Even his “good pitches” are fouled off or put in play. Not good.
Listening to Sutcliffe is almost as bad as those ass donkeys from Chicago.
On Shef.
I speak with some authority, Peter is a good reporter. Peter has a way of passing along off-the-record comments from insiders, which in this case would be the Tigers’ front office.
Lets face it, Shef doesn’t unpack his suitcase for no reason – 7 teams in the past 15 years (one team every two years).
That’s 12 baserunners in his last 2 innings of work.
Looks like Moose is going to need more than 20 pitches this inning, and that’s WITH the help from that blown call at the plate.
F*** F*** F***
…13 baserunners in his last two innings of work
same old (old, old, old) Moose
They’re making Mussina pitch. All high counts. Mussina will never survive 4 innings.
Holy crapola. That was a great catch by Melk.
Nice, Melky.
Melky. Damn.
jen-
for the most part they’re harmless, its’ like the jealous guys at the local tavern. I find their envy to be a source of humor.
Wow, tantalizingly close…We can still get out of this with minimal damage.
Quite a play by Melky.
MAN has Moose gotten help this game. He would have allowed at least 4 runs this inning if not for the blown call at home and now the great catch from Melky.
Outstanding catch by Cabrera.
That’s gotta be #1 on web gems tonight
the melk is so fresh
86MPH is what high schoolers throw.
Moose is really pissing me off!!!!!!
Melky should get a gold glove this year!!!
get moose out already he is trash!!!
That was an AMAZING catch by Melky!!
He has to be the long-term CF for the Yankees.
Only thing that ruined that catch was Michael Kays call.
Yup, ONLY ballpark in the league where Moose didn’t just give up a Grand Salami.
I’ve never been a big Moose fan but, its always sad to watch players at the end.
He has nothing left. Only a heads up play by Cano and a great catch by Melky has kept this at only one run.
Looks like its time for Pete to start a new poll.
Who gets the next start in Moose’s slot in the rotation?
A. Ian Kennedy
B. Steven White
C. Kei Igawa
Approaching 30 pitches in the first inning. The guy is gonna kill the bullpen again for a few days. Sad.
You’re likely right Dr. But even passing over our “friends” posts hurt my eyes.
Man, he’s really hanging that breaking pitch…
Hey “Best Team” how many times are you going to call that play at home blown?
Well I am a fan of Mussina and it is very sad to see someone pitching like this.
He just hit 89 with a fb
SJ44, I’ve got to think it’ll be Igawa…
Got out of it, but had to work very hard.
Couldn’t have asked for better ending to the first considering what we had to work with.
SJ,
IPK should get it, innings cap be damned(jk). Steve White has a good fastball and that is about it, and we all know what Kei Igawa brings to the table.
Man, I’m cringing with every single pitch Moose makes. He’s cooked for sure. Looks like the Tigers will be scoring a lot more than just one tonight.
Igawa? The man walks the ball park and gives up homeruns? Do you honestly think he would be any better than Mike. The one that might, is approaching his innings cap.
How about Jeff, who is coming back from a broken leg, what was he hitting with his fb? How would he be any different?
Wow. 6 batters. Bases loaded/1 out & they only got 1? Cano/Cabrera saved the Moose’s goose. Let’s go guys.
Igawa? That’s a joke.
I love, absolutely LOVE the people who want Mussina replaced with a rookie pitcher or the rookie-ish Kei Igawa. I’ve even seen some posts praying Mussina bombs tonight so he can be replaced readily and quickly by the savior Ian Kennedy. These are the same people who are so quick to kill Phil Hughes, theres a shocker.
You all better hope Mike Mussina turns it around because having 2 rookies in the back of the rotation for a pennant race isn’t going to work. Pray he turns it around like Pettitte did.
Cano and Melky just saved Mussina!
No way to overstate what a wonderful catch that was by Melky. That came at a sensational time!
Scooter, did you see the replay? Even the Yankees announcer said he thinks Granderson got in.
You know the play was blown because YES stopped showing replays of it.
Hey, Pete:
“I glance around a corner and there’s Kyle Farnsworth with this thing that looks like a snorkel for a midget. Turns out he went to Bass Pro Shops and bought a deer caller.”
Midget. Very nice. Why are racist comments bad but midget is okay?
Mike “Rabbit” Mussina makes it out of the first inning. Every batter on the Yanks better be taking the first pitch in the second inning.
Time to watch a real pitcher. Verlander’s taking the mound.
Verlander is dominating. this one’s done.
K
They should just let him keep pitching tonight until he blows something out, then they can put him on the DL.
Man this is tough to watch…nice to see his younger teammates picking him up though
Very thankfully we got out of that with minimal damage. Let’s go Moose, gut it out!!
get rid of mike mussina that washed up piece of sh-t.
i cannot stand the sight of this idiosyncratic old man trying to paint the corners with his horrible stuff.
time to burn the forest my friends and bring up ian kennedy. you are terrible mike mussina (mr almost) one of the worst free agent signings this side of carl pavano.
KK
Pete…you are wrong…30 pitches per inning and only 1 run given up…that plays out to 90 pitches entering the 4th inning and only gives up 3 runs…so we only have to make up 3 runs in the first 3 innings, then we get to see ANYONE ELSE on the mound after the whiner says that he has had enuff…this is *perfect* !!! (LOL)
Do you have anything substancial to add to this coversation? Shouldn’t you be out buying clothes for the start of 5th grade?
That was NOT enough rest for Moose.
Andrew,
I understand that this is pete’s blog, and he can write what he wants, and if i don’t like it, i don’t have to read it, blah blah blah. but the point is, i like it, or i wouldn’t be reading and posting here. however, when pete makes such asinine statements that a guy who has a history of playing hurt and a contract paying him $14mil for each of 2008 and 2009 is going on the dl to keep his value high (for 2010, pete?), the blog loses integrity. yes, shef is a jerk, but this post just makes no sense other than pete doesn’t like shef, and that makes this blog look silly.
If Mussina ever throws another 90 MPH fastball again it will be because of a faulty radar gun ….in his favor.
9 pitches. Did Moose even get a sip of water? Yowza.
Also, great stuff about Farnsy and the deer blower. When I first saw that pic I wondered, why is Pete posting a pic of a hookah on the blog? Haha, took me a minute to fgure out what that really was.
The offense has to have its best game tonight for there to a chance to win. They have got to take pitches and battle at the plate..
Just sick to my stomach….
Rabbit Mussina hops back out to the mound.
Yeah, you didn’t know any better Pete, but the term “midget” is actually a slur.
Hey, Pete:
Could you track down Mussina’s BAA when he’s got 2 strikes against a batter? Seems like it would have to be high relative to league average. Just can’t put anyone away any more.
Its tough to watch, that’s for sure.
He just doesn’t have a pitch that can finish hitters anymore.
He can get ahead of ‘em, just can’t finish ‘em.
Only so many bullets in a pitchers arm and it looks like Moose’s are all used up.
Tough part is, he has to stay out there. Unless he suddenly finds it, this could get embarrassing for him. That would be sad if that happens but, the Yankees can’t worry about his feelings at this point. They have to save the bullpen.
He just has to suck it up, eat some innings and call it a night. No sense embarrassing himself at this point.
Whose next? No idea. Tough call all the way around. If Kennedy (my personal choice) is at his innings limit, you have two choices that aren’t appealing.
Not exactly what you want as you try to make the playoffs. What a bummer.
* Mariano Rivera, sitting in the next locker, watched curiously as Farnsy worked on different sounding calls. When a few nosy writer types ambled over to ask what the animal the call was for, Mo laughed.
“You guys,� he said. “See, it worked.�
classic!!!
Kay said: “Mussina really needed a good catch thereâ€? … a bit of an understatement wasn’t it?
This really sucks, Verlander is dealing
Should the Yankees just forfeit if they make the Wild Card? They’d be facing the Angels in the first round.
Cashman deserves alotta credit for keeping Melky.
so many – let me repeat that – so many talking heads in print and on tv kept saying Melky wasn’t an everyday player. And Cash balked at Pittsburg’s and Texas’ efforts to land Melky.
Raymondmagnetic,
LOL. Do you notice how Moose rebounds after a pitch? It’s a little hop!
I want you guys to know that I am holding in my hand a Mike Mussina rooking baseball card. My 2 year old is having spaghetti in her highchair in front of the TV watching the game with me. If he blows it this inning I am going to give it to her to put spaghetti sauce all over it and ruin it. Then I am going to frame it, blow it up real big and post it to the internet and say, “The only think Moose is good for is a messy job of pitching, but at least he can cover a 2 year olds plate (of spaghetti) if he can’t get the ball of home plate.”
After that hit.. it’s getting closer…
I am sick of this. He still can’t get anyone out.
It’s a bit to mearly to give up on Moose for the day, for all we know he is going to pitch 6 shutout innings from here on. And remember next week is against TB, a team Moose always handles, so he’ll probably get one more start at least. Don’t start planning his retirement party just yet.
man, more of the same to start the 2nd here.
Shock and awe, Moose actually hit 90 with that last fastball. Another shocker, Moose gets ahead and can’t finish off a batter (casey and his stupid back leg lift-i hate that thing)
Second legit out of the game! He almost has a full legit inning here.
There is a big difference between Pettitte and Mussina right now global.
Pettitte still has his stuff. It doesn’t appear Moose does anymore.
He can’t get people out. They can’t just keep rolling him out there hoping he can do it.
If this keeps up, IMO, it will be his last start as a Yankee.
The other choices may not be appealing but, let’s be honest, its not like they are pulling Johan Santana out of the rotation.
They are pulling a guy who has nothing left.
I’m sick of Michael Kay scolding Mike Mussina. We can tell he’s not pitching well, but shut up.
Moose is more fried than the chinese I had for dinner.
get him out now!!!!!
To the guy giving me a hard time on the Sheff comment:
Give me a list of all the years that Sheff hasn’t asked for either a new contract or an extension. It’s what he does. Sheff is a heck of a hitter but he only allegiance is to himself.
Melky should have had that
would have been the third out.
I guess 7 runs were too many to ask the defense to save?
hey Ken,
the splits for moose are on espn’s site:
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/.....yerId=2557
BAA
count 0-2: .149
count 1-2: .271
count 2-2: .230
count 3-2: .288
not as bad as you might have thought. what’s scary is that batters are hitting .349 against him swinging at the first pitch.
Mussina will blame his OF’s for the run not the fact that Casey got a hit.
“Should the Yankees just forfeit if they make the Wild Card? They’d be facing the Angels in the first round.”
Best Team in BB,
This past year we all witnessed the 83 win Cardinals win the World Series. After that we saw the Peyton Manning led Colts beat the Patriots on their road to winning a Super Bowl…
Anything can happen.
that would have been a great catch by melky if he got it, that’s not a play you can expect him to make
Peter, there are a few people giving you a hard time on the Sheff comment. I don’t think it’s accurate to say he’s sitting on his numbers so his value doesn’t go down when:
1. He’s returning next month
2. He’s not in a contract year
Andrea I didn’t realize that Mike was having a tough time of it. I needed him to tell me for the millionth time.
Michael Kay can’t push back his hate of Mussina. It all stems back to when he asked Mike for an interview the day after he lost his perfect game. What exactly did he expect him to do. OH YEAH I can’t wait to speak to you about the perfecto that I just lost.
Oh, boy.
Mussina is bad. It’s hard to believe that people like Kasey vent on Wang, who will be just fine, when there’s someone else in the rotation who’s clearly totally and completely cooked.
mike mussina is a pathetic excuse of a pitcher who should be coaching his sons little league team in montoursville pa.
weak hit, but this is officially a disaster.
This is ugly. I can’t really think of anything else to say.
That my friends is game set and match… Time to head home with a 2-5 road trip.
Just sucks!
sheffield sucks
Mussina is a joke. Problem is, he’s the best the Yankees can do for the 5th starter right now.
oh god. This is tortorous to watch. So sad all around.
Mike isn’t long for this game. 50 pitches already!!
Congrats Mussina, you just pitched yourself out of the starting rotation. A must win game and you throw a stinker is just plain unacceptable.
Michael Kay is miserable. But it’s pretty hard to cover up the fact that Mike Mussina is lost for good. Just an unmitigated disaster. No velocity, not enough movement, and too many hitters who aren’t Brandon Inge and Timo Perez.
Ugh… I am on business in Pittsburgh… I’m listening to the game online and watching the gameday but the gameday is ahead of the audio and I am none-too-pleased. Is watching it on TV as painful as my situation?
kay hates mussina with a passion. kay is a good guy who despises the idiosyncratic mussina
pete,
i understand your point on shef, but your post was still misinformed. shef is under contract and is known to play hurt…end of story. you can try to backpeddle all you want, or you could just admit that you spoke too soon. your access to the locker room doesn’t exactly make you the #1 authority on all things baseball.
jennifer: oh, so it’s for people like YOU that he won’t shut up.
I’m really not a Michael Kay hater, usually, I understand his purpose. But he’s gotta stop.
Whoever thinks this game is over can leave now. It will make this blog alot more enjoyable to post on.
Edwar is already up…..
It’s three runs. Let’s not freak out yet. Maybe our offense will decide to answer.
Finally! I was starting to worry that I’d never see Verlander pitch again!
Gotta love watching good pitching, no matter who you root for.
Now, I’m starting to feel bad for the moose. No use hating on this guy anymore. It’s like hating the little old grandma driving 50 mph right ahead of you in the speed lane. They can’t help it. Time to go around, and leave them behind. Time to lead the moose out to pasture.
This is a re-run of game 4 2006 ALDS.
So hard to watch.
86
82
80
71
73
87
88
And the pitches have no break. There’s no deception.
Hopefully we can get to Verlander, although he seems to have some extra swagger to him tonight.
Peter,
Is there any definitive information indicating Sheff will be done for the year?
Also, Mussina needs to miss some bats. Some of these hits are just sneaking through but that’s what happens when you let the other team always put the ball in play.
I’m only a MKay hater when Mussina pitches.. it is literally unbearable how bad he sweats him and he has for years.
Get him out of here and do some damage control… this is not April! It’s F-in August!
Pete –
You say Sheff is only in it for himself? Uhm, what athlete does it for their fans and is truly altruistic?
That is a really weird thing to say.
People come down on Sheff because he is not all that smart and puts his foot in his mouth. At least he doesn’t sugar coat it and tell you (the press as well) like it is… or Pete, would you rather have someone okay you to death like most of the players do?????
As i’ve said before, for being the most storied franchise in baseball, we have some of the worst announcers.
I think Mussina should go to the Yankees and say, “I am going to do you a favor and pull a Carl Pavano so you can recoups some of the ridiculous money you spent on me”.
Pete, you’re wrong about Sheff. What you said about him simply doesn’t make sense. You’d actually gain a lot of my respect if you just admitted that instead of trying to address all the people who called you on it.
The game’s not over. The Yankees are going to win.
The only thing that’s over is Mike Mussina’s career. Hopefully, Joe realizes it before we start the 3rd. Letting him to pitch to Ordonez and Guillen is an invitation for another run, if not two.
Verlander and Moose are polar opposites tonight!
Scooter who are you kidding.
even IF we get those three runs back Mussina will just keep throwing these dinky pitches right over the plate to the second best offense in baseball. I hate to do this because ive NEVER given up. But if we dont get this game with a three game series against boston coming up. just put the white f-ing flags up.
yankees need to dfa mussina asap. he is a bonfide loser and his choking cost them the 2001, 2002, 2005, 2006 and possibly the 2007 seasons
Mussina just doesn’t have it anymore…Get him out of there before it’s 6-0
Well Mosse admit the obvious you are cooked…finished. Still nibbling, scared to throw strikes..doesnt have the stuff to get anyone out. Didnt even give them a chance in this game…again. The garbage he is throwing will not get anyone out, he is pathetic. Time to bring up Kennedy. Torre better not be stupid enough to throw him out there again.
Keep telling me now how they can’t take this guy out of the rotation after this one. I want to hear the reasons why he should stay in the rotation. It sure as hell isn’t for the “playoff run”.
Stop blaming everybody on the team for his failings. He’s done.
He’s out of the rotation after this start. There is no longer any time for them to wait for him. Time has run out.
You can’t keep rolling starters out there who put you in 3 run holes after two innings in each of their starts. I mean, you can but, don’t talk about the playoffs or the playoff rotation because that won’t be happening at this rate.
I don’t care about small sample sizes, WHIPS or anything else.
You don’t have to be a genius to see the guy has nothing left to get anybody. Even Stevie Wonder can see he’s done.
Only Cano and Melky have kept this form being another 2 inning, 8 run implosion. He still may get there at this rate.
Its a shame but, age gets everybody at some point.
Prepare another starter for his next start against Tampa and move on. Its time.
It’s gonna be more like a rerun of Game 7 2004 ALCS by the time Mussina gets out of here. He’s already thrown 50 pitches to get 6 outs!
I for one think what Pete said about Sheff makes PERFECT sense. For those who wish to ballwash Gary, I’m sure there are other bloggers on the internet who would not only wholeheartedly approve but join you. Why don’t you go find them?
Peter has it right. Sheffield’s allegiance is to himself. Always was, always will be. He’s carried a ton of baggage in his vagabond career. He’s burned a lot of bridges.
Does anyone else want to rip out their hair when Moose bends down and takes FOREVER in the wind-up w/ men on base…urgh
Talk about holding a grudge. 6 years later he still complains about Mike. One of the funniest lines Kay has said is. Mike wouldn’t throw a dixie cup of water on me if I was on fire. I have to admit I wouldn’t either. LOL
Based on the Poll on this blog about the Yankees winning the division by a landslide… Are you guys hear just trying to be hopeful and positive? Or are you really in total denial?
The Yankee’s have about as much chance winning the division this year as Gary Sheffied going back to the Yankee’s.
Seriously, if you really do think they will win the division for anything more than *wishful thinking* you might want to go to the doctors and get some meds.
oh snap, Leiter shut MKay up. “He might not have known Edwar was up, Michael.” he even used his name.
Shut it.
On Shef:
My favorite part about Shef, though, is when he goes on and on about how he can’t play injured and continue to hurt his teammates by trying to stay out there.
He’s the best at spinning his own selfishness to something altruistic. Bar none.
In other words, Pete nailed it — AGAIN.
I love how the posters on this site think they have more inside knowledge than a professional reporter who is in clubhouses every day and is always talking to other baseball professionals (incuding executives and their staff) about everything baseball.
Good AB by Melky. I’m impressed.
Green Tea:
I’m not backing off anything. Sheff was under contract last year and he complained about his deal. He does it every year, he either asks for a new deal or an extension. Every single year.
I’m not saying he isn’t hurt. I’m saying I’d be surprised if he came back this season because he likes to protect his value, meaning his statistics. Going 2 for 25 every week because of a bad shoulder hurts your stats. That his presence in their lineup would help Detroit is not his concern.
Thx, GTT. Those numbers are headed northward.
Moose needs a few more innings to settle. You can’t start burning the pen in the fourth inning with a series against Boston coming up.
Actually the ball that Granderson hit should have been caught by Abreu as he was closer to it. Abreu then should have nailed Casey at the plate. The Rabbit pitched better that inning than the first.
What’s worse than watching Mike Mussina essentially end the Yankee’s playoff chances? Watching it while listening to ESPN’s Dave O’Brien (who also doubles as the Red Sox play by play radio man when he’s not on ESPN) celebrate whenever the Tigers get a hit.
O’Brien is a total homer, and it’s tough to endure, but the fact that Mussina SUCKS is not because of him. Ughh. I can’t wait for this season to be over.
It cost them 2001?? How exactly? we had our best pitcher on the mound in the 9th inning to close it out and a bloop single won them the game.
The stupidity on here right now is overwelming.
Good god people, everyone feelin good up high on their pedestals tonight? This is a BLOG. What do people use blogs for? It couldn’t be to express their own OPINION could it??? Nah, that couldn’t possibly be it.
good timing Johnny!
this has better be it for moose. there is only a very small chance we make the playoffs with him in the rotation. and in the playoffs when we only face strong teams how in the world is moose going to win. he has proven that he cannot even be average against good teams.
SJ44,
there is only 1 reason moose should stay in the rotation, and unfortunately, it is the same arrogant gave to the press after his last start…who are they going to replace him with? nobody likes it, but i think it’s the case.
Sterling gets so frustrated when the Yankees are losing it’s comical. He’s as bad as any fan.
Hey Best Team In BB….
Babe
Bucky
Buckner
Boone
Boston – 7
NYY – 26
why can’t Kennedy replace him? I know he’s not on the 40 man, but these are problems the Yanks can get around. He still has a few innings to go until he reaches his cap, and it would certainly seem that he would give the Yanks a better chance to win than Moose.
Ok he doesn’t look good now, but I don’t think it’s at all fair to call mussina a bust of epic (Carl Pavano) proportions. He has gone 100-62 with the yanks over the past 7 years (of course record is not the best stat).
Right now it wouldn’t matter if Mike just gave up a run with the way Justin is pitching.
Pete, going 2-25 hurts your team a lot more than it hurts your stats. Are you considering that at all?
I haven’t heard Sheffield ask for a contract this year. Seems kind of strange that you’d assume he’s playing for a better one when he already has a great one.
Perhaps the only reason he used to want to renegotiate is because he didn’t use an agent when making his previous contract. That was a big mistake.
What’s worse than Mussina’s outings are, the DP’s are back with the offense. It seems 2-3 times a night now, they ground into DP’s, which really hurt them earlier in the year.
It all goes together. When your starter is struggling, guys always try to do too much at the plate. Its like clockwork.
Verlander is dealing tonight. Gonna be tough.
The real issue will be, what do the Yankees do next. Awful roadtrip all around. Its put them out of the east and, if Seattle stays hot, in a bigger hole for the WC.
Regardless of someone’s past history, they can’t keep running him out there to pitch when he can’t do it anymore.
Torre always says, “24 guys are bigger than 1″, when making lineup decisions.
Looks like that theory is going to be tested. He has to tell a 17 year veteran that’s it for him in the rotation.
Will be interesting to hear the post-game comments after this one.
There’s no reason to start burning pitchers now if the Yanks offense isn’t going to bother showing signs of production.
So typical Matt. Living in the last millennium…
moose really does seem to have to nothing left. maybe a few starts rest would help him. still think he might be a better option than igawa or white.
if we are done with moose torre should just let him take as much of this beating as possible in order to save the bullpen.
lol @ people’s refusal to believe that Pete might actually be more attuned to Sheffield’s opportunistic scumbaggery than they are. Seriously man…just accept it!
is the Moose cooked yet ?
Now he is going to walk the guy…
i think the only real option is to give kennedy a chance. even if kennedy isnt ready yet the fact that no one else has seen him yet may mean we get a few starts where he is good just based on the fact that there is no book on him. and at this point we only need a few good ones.
Wow, that ball would have been out in any other park in the league as well.
Good God, people. Enough with the Sheffield postings…the guys is a cancer in the clubhouse. Let it go.
There comes a time when you have to pull the trigger. Stop the bleeding and bring up Kennedy. Stick Mussina in the pen as a mop up man when games are out of hand.
Don’t even consider him for a playoff roster spot.
It’s funny. Pete has always defended Sheff on a personal level. When he sayas something that’s not a personal attack, people are treating it that way and arguging. weird.
Has he pitched inside ONCE tonight?
As hard hit as everything is, maybe all the outfieldes should move back 20 feet or so
Sorry, it is not a walk but a double…
i don’t know, pete. if i were a betting man, i’d say you forgot that the tigers signed him to an extension for 08-09 before you wrote that post. and now value=statistics? so this is all semantics? riiiiight! that’s even more of a reach than your original post, but hey, if it’s more important to you to never back down, than just keep pretending that shef wouldn’t play hurt if it would help lead his team to the playoffs.
Moose would have been better off he he walked him…
Oh, my god…
well this game is over. at least we can all go to bed tonight and can look forward to reading moose’s arrogant comments in the morning.
Oh for f**ks sake – get him the hell out of there. My pet goldfish could do better.
Green tea,
Respectfully, I disagree. You (the team) can’t look at it that way.
We don’t know if his replacement will be this bad. Its not about making the change for the Mike Mussina who was a borderline Hall of Famer.
We are talking about a guy who is pitching like a Single A pitcher.
They really have no choice.
JMO but, of the 3 choices, Igawa, White and Kennedy (if Kennedy is even an option in their minds) its probably safe to say they can’t do much worse.
Moose has set the bar pretty low for success at this point.
They do have other options and, IMO, they will be in place for his next start.
4-0, this one is done. They have to keep him out there for at least two more innings though. Can’t kill the bullpen for the next series.
Gotta hope the Angels can win tonight or the hole gets deeper for this team to try and make the playoffs.
I’m with you Green Tea. At this point the only thing Pete could do to gain my respect in this situation would be to admit he was probably wrong.
Was Torre crying?
Well, bright side is Yankees can take 2 of 3 from Boston and then need a 7 game winning streak. With the upcoming schedule it is do able.
Cleveland is playing better which could mean that Minn, Det, Cleve all beat up on each other.
81 on a fb? EEK
Sutcliffe is speculating that Mussina is pitching with an injuried leg, citing his lack of location and strikeouts.
concerning Kennedy as an option,
isnt he very close to his preset innings limit already?
May be we should have Wanger pitch tomorrow – BECAUSE WE NEED OUR PEN TO REST…
are they allowed to fire moose? hes pitching them out of the playoffs
Are they really going to let Moose play next year?! Unless they’re absolute gluttons for punishment, they’ll buy him out. The financial blow might sting, but it’s nothing compared to the pain of watching this over-the-hill clown “pitch” every five days!
LOL, the ESPN announcers are giving Moose his eulogy.
There should be a mercy rule in MLB…
Yikes, guys. I feel bad for Moose – he’s not going out there wanting to suck.
Edwar’s fastball will look like Joba’s compared to Mussina’s. C’mon Torre pull the plug.
As far as the whole Moose situation, here’s what I think.
As someone who is actually a fan of his, the idea of replacing him pains me. But what pains me even MORE is to see an accomplished veteran like him out there struggling like this. It is literally near-unwatchable.
So. We know Kennedy has an innings cap, but does anyone know how close he is to reaching it? I say let him come up here and pitch till he reaches it. I don’t know how many starts that is, but maybe it involves skipping Moose once or twice? When Ian reaches his innings cap then you re-evaluate the situation and decide if you’d rather see Steve White, Moose again, or what.
I know they have mentioned Igawa as a possibility, but I really have trouble believing that he is better than even what we’ve seen lately from Moose.
At this point, might as well leave Mussina out there until his arm falls off. Velander is dealing tonight, suck it up and save your bullpen.
DFA Moose and cancel his crossword puzzle membership.
I agree with Pete re: shef too, as do a lot of other people on the blog. I think all the shef supporters need to quit being self-righteous about their stance. I would argue Pete has more a right to lose respect for you over your stance than the other way around.
Sunny615′s goldfish has the ever elusive, unhittable “air-bubble ball”. This fish also actually throws a gyroball too, unlike that faker dice-k.
Keep the faith guys!
I’m playing the exact same match up on my MLB 07 and I was down 4-0 until top 4 when I rattled Verlander for 4 runs and chased him from the game. Jorge then homered in the 6th to give us a 8-5 lead. We’ll win this somehow!
Dr. it is a possiblity but he denies being hurt.
Historically, Wang hasn’t pitched very well against the Red Sox.
Man, Jeter is SO SLOW to his left. No wonder he’s dead last or near dead last in all range statistics for his position.
Why is everyone convinced that their respect is even worth anything? Who said that Pete even wants or needs your respect? What makes it so special? I’m not seeing anything special about. What I am seeing are people who like to put themselves up high and start things with people to make themselves feel better. Give it a break. All this self-righteousness tends to make people sick.
lol
“Well, bright side is Yankees can take 2 of 3 from Boston and then need a 7 game winning streak. With the upcoming schedule it is do able.”
How is that possible when only 2 out of your 5 starters are capable of throwing quality starts? There are only going to be more losing streaks if Mussina, Clemens and Hughes don’t start throwing excellent games…and I emphasize the “excellent” in that sentence. Simply “good” or “OK” starts will not hack it if they Yanks are serious about winning the WC.
I’d just leave Moose in at this point, and concede the game, rather than DESTROY the bullpen for the Boston series.
EY – I really admire your attitude…
JEEZUS – Can Moose freaking get an out?
Uncle! Uncle!
Some apparently think he wants to pitch poorly.
He is pitching to horrible luck.
just getting by the fields, just dunking in.
@PBL – Just read your post after I posted mine and I completely agree.
Come on abreu don’t sit down while they are rounding the bases
mussina is pitching with a broken ego, he sucks, he knows it and continues to hurt the team by going out there every 5 days.
get this bum off the team right now. he is the equivalent of sheffield as a pitcher, blaming his mistakes on everyone else like a baby.
6-0 I officially called it…though I wish I had been wrong!!!
Suck it up Moose bc we aren’t blowing our pen over your crap performance.
“Why is everyone convinced that their respect is even worth anything? Who said that Pete even wants or needs your respect? What makes it so special? I’m not seeing anything special about. What I am seeing are people who like to put themselves up high and start things with people to make themselves feel better. Give it a break. All this self-righteousness tends to make people sick.”
Bingo.
Abreu has to catch that?
BTW…these announcers on ESPN stink.
Speed of Bobby Abreu? He was hustling? The guy was jogging and slowing down as he approached the ball, not accelerating.
- KMT
Abreau looked like he was having a picnic on the ground out there.
well if he doesnt lose his spot now then he never will. and kay is talking about how moose isnt getting “spanked” out there. now that last hit wasnt hit hard but did kay see the first inning? he got destroyed in the first inning and luck is all that saved him. but kay wants us to ignore the good luck moose received and feel bad for the “bad” luck he received.
I want Kennedy or White,but Igawa,how’s he doing? He might be the best choice.
If only Boomer would have waited a few days and signed with the Yankees! LOL
Fer F**K’s sake – did someone surgically replace Moose’s are with Kevin Brown’s??
This is painful to watch. Moose had a nice career but he’s cooked. What is Torre waiting for? Put him out of his misery.
After tonight, his record against above .500 teams this season will be 2-9. His ERA in those starts now tops 8 (it was 7.42 going into tonight’s start).
They have no choice. They have to get him out of the rotation after tonight.
They do have better options than 2-9 with an 8+ ERA.
Its a no brainer he is done after this.
Even the Yankees aren’t dumb enough to keep rolling Moose out there for these type of shellings. At some point, it just becomes embarrassing as well as counterproductive.
As Kay pointed out he isn’t getting crushed.
Well looks like the Yankees of April and May have returned…6-0. Joe don’t ruin the bull pen over this.. It is a loss, accept it and move on.
Leave him there Torre, remove every starter and make Moose pitch atleast 6 innings.
What’s up with all the people I’ve never seen post here before coming to Peter’s aid? That’s kinda strange…
And yeah, by no means should Moose come out of this game at least until after the 6th inning or his arm falls off, whichever’s first. We need to save the pen so he needs to take one for the team.
Also…man, am I ever glad I’m not watching this on ESPN. Not quite masochistic enough for that haha.
I feel sorry for the guy.
Look for Moose to be DFA’d tomorrow.
Kay is laying the groundwork for another chance for Moose. What’s he’s saying now(he wasn’t hit that hard, lots of bloopers, blah blah blah) will be the talking points we’ll hear from Torre and Guidry after the game and up until his next start.
Finally, 72 pitches at 3IP… I feel sorry for Moose…
bring in Edwar please.
Look at the pattern: 1 in the 1st, 2 in the 2nd, you get the idea.
Let’s go offense!!!!! Just be patient and make pretty boy Zoolander crack!
If this keeps up, Baltimore won’t have to worry about being the first team in 30+ years to lose by 27 runs for long.
Mussina’s eyes are like saucers. He looks like a soldier who hasn’t slept in weeks and is now caught between the enemy and friendly fire.
Would you guys rather Moose give up 50 runs or 6 and blow the pen for tomorrow against the Sox.
Hate to say it, but take this one for the team mussina
@Upstater – Does what we are saying not mean anything simply because we have never posted here? I’m saying something because it has gotten out of control and something reasonable needed to be said.
What was the point of warming Edwar Ramirez up and then have Mussina come out for the 3rd? Looks like that move backfired.
Mussina with a beautiful 18.00 ERA, and a nice 3.33 WHIP. If Mussina makes another start, I think we will all be surprised.
If Seattle beats Lackey tonight we are in serious trouble.
I post here fairly regularly. Why does the source of the post matter anyway if it’s a logical point?
Moose is a bum.How long did they lock him up for 2 years 40 mil anyone know?
KKKK
Wow. Mussina has nothing left. Save Joba for BoSox. Leave Moose in, then DFA him after game.
I don’t want to see Kennedy’s name again, for the 1000th time he is not going to be called up to replace Moose. If he is made a starter he will have pitched 160 innings or more this year and that’s not going to happen. There will be no Ian Kennedy in the Bx. this year. Get used to it.
With the Way Justin is pitching it doesn’t matter that this point. He is blowing everyone away.
Don’t feel bad for Mussina. He is making 12 mil a year. He will sleep just fine tonight.
This is the problem with atheletes, they don’t know when to call it quits. They all think they can play beyond their years. But this is why so many former “stars” and “15 minute famers” are in AAA and so few “Clemens” exist.
SJ44,
I agree with you on the “safe to say they can’t do much worse” regarding the other options for moose’s spot in the rotation. but i think that moose has proven himself for far too long to just take him out for a big giant question mark. i mean, let’s be honest here…if moose came out and gave you 6 or 7 innings of 3 run ball in his next 4 starts, would you be surprised, or would you just say, glad to see moose turned it around. on the other hand, do you really see igawa, white, or kennedy doing that on any kind of consistent basis, if at all?
i’m all for bringing up the youth, and i’m not much for the veteran-ness stat that torre puts so much stock in, but it’s just too late in the season to start experimenting. plus, we’ve had so many starting pitching woes this year that we already have a pretty good idea of what we’ve got in the minors.
Best Team in BB…
Uncle? Mercy Rule in MLB?
if that was the case, the Red Sox would have been out of the league around, say, year 82 or 83 of their losing streak…but who’s counting:)
Go watch your 2004 Wold Series DVD…i would say watch the other 6 championship seasons as well, but those occurred before the invention of the camera.
See you in October. You gotta be scared if your hanging out all night on a Yankees message board.
He’s not getting another chance after this. He can’t miss bats. He can’t get outs.
That’s it. This was his chance and he was awful again. Let’s not spin this start into another “he got some bad breaks” nonsense.
Look at his numbers against good teams this season. They can’t all be “bad breaks”. He’s done. Just move on and let’s discuss who they use against Tampa.
Given the results tonight, that’s more topical than trying to spin another putrid start by a Yankee starter into something special when its not.
Joba as a potential replacement in the rotation for Moose??
I know there’s an innings issue with him – and he’d exceed those as a starter as opposed to a reliever. But I wonder (Pete any insight) if the Yankees have tossed around the idea of having Joba take Moose’s spot? We’d lose his arm in the pen, but you can call up another reliever. I’d rather have a plus starter and an average reliever as opposed to the reverse.
My gut says Torre fights for Moose.. he gets one more start… then I think “damn the torpedoes (options, arbitration window etc)” and call up Kennedy.
The guy’s a strong candidate for Minor League Pitcher of the Year
Upstater, what does it matter if they’ve ever posted here before? Maybe they’re lurkers who read every day and decided today to post, who cares? All that matters is Pete is right on this and Sheff is an entire continent of wrong.
This is retarded… I honestly don’t care who they bring in to replace Moose at this point be it Igawa, White, Kennedy or Torre’s wife. Anyone is better than Moose right now.
Moose sure does look like he’s got nothing left. I hope they DL him (make up a leg injury or shoulder tightness (ala Schilling). But I’m surprised how much hatred there is for the guy here. It’s not his fault he’s lost it. Damon and Abreu seemed to come to camp out of shape, and THAT was their fault early on. But Moose probably is just like David Cone was, and he’s trying to deal but has no good cards left. It sucks for the Yankees, and we can blame Cashman/Torre for not anticipating this, but I feel more bad for Moose than angry at him.
I just think it’s kind of fishy. It’s quite possible that the same people are posting under different names because they don’t like Sheff either.
At least that’s more probable than people deciding to post here for the first time just to say Abraham’s right.
We are being mowed down. Just leave Mike out there. We need the pen for the upcoming series.
These guys can’t hit good pitching. Period.
WHy not just leave moose in there. we’re not winning this game anyway. why blow out the bullpen? Give moose two more innings. who cares at this point. moose is finished. it’s kinda sad really. the bell tolls for thee moose.
They cant be screwing with Joba like that I dont think. Im sure they will keep him in the pen.
I dont think Igawa or DeSalvo are upgrades over Moose despite how bad he’s pitched.
It remains to be seen whether White or Kennedy would be. Why not give it a shot at this point? Perhaps Moose has a tired arm or something.
I’m surprised any of the Tigets can keep their composure long enough to get hits off of Moose, given how hard they must be laughing at him right now…
Seriously, I’d like to see that Georgia Little League team (that just won the Little League WS) face this bum… They’d spank his geriatric butt all over the park, too!!!
Think Shelley can pitch?
sj44- not many teams can. that’s why it’s *good* pitching.
Yeah I don’t get the hate for Mike.
Wow, someone managed to get on base.
Adios, mike. fun while it lasted.
Joba is a 5 inning pitcher I hate to say it but its true. I saw him pitch here in scranton close to 100 pitches in 5 innings, but 10k’s to go with those 5 innings.
“The Red Sox added 2 1/2 games to their lead over the Yankees over the weekend and could bury them in a series that begins Tuesday. But they’re not thinking along those lines.”
MLB.com
“DFA Moose”
that makes sense.
rosters expand on saturday. even if he gets pulled from the rotation, you hold onto him and send him and half his salary to the NL in the off-season.
you guys just want to “DFA” everyone.
it’s idiotic.
is that a fake SJ posting? you never usually link your handle.
next year could be tough too..its all about the pitching, (just look at the Sox) and we would have Wang and Pettite and then Hughes and Jaba as starters…#5 Mussina, Igawa, Kennedy, tough to call we need another #2 guy and there are no free agents available of any value..I think its too much to count on young guys all year as starters…we may have to wait until 2009 for these young guys to be great….there just isn’t anyone to sign for next year…..ottom line we don’t have a true dominant starter and we won’t win until we do…..next years rotation will be a bit shaky….
At this point hope for a Seattle loss. If Torre throws Mussina out there again he might as well put a white flag on the top of his hat.
At this point it doesn’t matter who’s pitching. Not when we’re getting 2 hits every 4 innings.
Goodnight everyone. See you tomorrow.
“I feel more bad for Moose than angry at him.”
Ditto. I don’t get calling him a bum and such.. as if he WANTS to go out there and pitch badly?
if we don’t have a pitcher that is an upgrade over 6 runs every 3 innings, that’s pathertic. heck, kennedy would start against tampa next. after tonight, we can only lose *maybe* 10 games the rest of the way. throw moose, and it’s a loss. he’ll start 4 or 5 more times. so figuring we can only lose 5 other times…. gotta try someone else. this team is too good to throw in the towel at this point.
I don’t believe that Moose is just old. There has to be something wrong with him. In the 1st, he was rubbing his wrist. No one even mentioned it.
Did you guys see Matsui practically run down to 1st? Justin’s pitching good. Can’t do much about that. The fate of the Yankees season lies in the hand of John Lackey. (Hey it worked yesterday, Padilla came through).
The Red Sox hit a couple of great pitchers in Vazquez and Buehrle. When an offense is on, even good pitching can be hittable.
There goes the pen…
.
August 27th, 2007 at 2:01 pm
How many innings will Mussina last tonight?
(a) 1
(b) 1.1
(c) 2
(d) 2.2
(e) 3
Correct Answer: *(e)*
Is Mussina going to give up 4 runs in the 4th inning?
Ramirez, great. Poor Moose, it’s been a hard few outings for him.
It’s not impossible to score 6 runs.
Let’s win this thing.
“Well looks like the Yankees of April and May have returned…6-0. Joe don’t ruin the bull pen over this.. It is a loss, accept it and move on”
Yeah, time to go “underground” again, no ESPN.com, no Baseball Tonight, no unbiased blogs.
Also, Upstater is not saying new posters aren’t welcome. He’s implying that Pete is defending HIMSELF using pseudonyms.
ok, NOW I’m mad. What part of save the bullpen do they not understand??
Brutal….absolutely brutal!
great, just great. jorge, call for the f— changeup man.
So who is the next one after Edwar?
7-0
ouchy..
Keith FL:
You don’t suppose Schilling and Wakefield will get younger next year do you ?
And batting practice continues…
Oh jeez, why did I open my stupid mouth.
This is going to get ugly fast. Ramerez doesn’t perform well when his team is already down a lot. This is going to be a repeat performance of the slaughter by way of the Devil Rays earlier this year.
Al,
I was thinking the same thing about Joba. With Farnsworth and Viz doing well and Edwar holding his own, Joba could have value in the rotation. The question is now that he’s a reliever, is it feasible to extend him again? Probably not.
Suit up Ron Guidry to stop the bleeding!
It’s disturbing to see what a profound effect that inbreeding has had on the populace of Boston. I’m surprised they still have the mental capacity to be able to type…although obviously there is no substance or intelligence behind anything they write.
The BoSux win one measly World Series in the entire MODERN ERA of baseball and suddenly they’re the world’s best team?! Whoah, that’s genius! And this is the same team that couldn’t even hold second place just last year. Hmmm…makes one wonder, doesn’t it?
Oh, and just ask the St. Louis Cardinals just how much the best regular season record means once the playoffs begin…
1 out
The Red Sox aren’t resigning Schilling. They have Buchholz waiting to take a spot in the rotation and he’s one of the best pitching prospects in the game right now.
quan – i was about to completely agree with you but kay just said he would take moose over igawa but would take kennedy or white over moose. i hate to say it but i completely agree with kay.
Ahhhh F***….. When does college football start?
I think the Wild Card is going to be tough to get. Don’t care how many games are left. This team is in a funk.
God, even as a Sox fan I feel a little sorry for Mike Mussina. He gave you guys a lot of great memories, you’d think there would be a little more sadness and a lot less hate for the guy here.
“Also, Upstater is not saying new posters aren’t welcome. He’s implying that Pete is defending HIMSELF using pseudonyms”
Well then I’m implying that he’s on crack.
Or maybe just coming straight out and saying it.
C’mon…if you don’t think Pete has better things to do than post pseudonymous (sp?) comments defending himself on his own blog then why do you even bother reading the things he reports?
This is just an unacceptable perfomance.
@Quan – I don’t think any of us said that Upstater was saying new posters weren’t welcome. All we were questioning was whether what we were saying meant less simply because we aren’t frequent posters. All being said, I just want the argument to end. We never brought it back up after we said what we wanted in hopes it would die.
Maybe we can get Leiter out of the booth to take Moose’s next start.
StevefromScranton
I would have sample size concerns on that one.
Perhaps green tea. But, it seems to me Torre has been laying the groundwork for a change all week.
He was given numerous opportunities by the beat guys to give Moose a “vote of confidence”. He never did.
If Melky doesn’t make that catch and Cano doesn’t make a heads up play in the first, he would have given up 10 runs in the first two innings.
I just think he’s so bad right now, you can’t find any good to build on.
Hughes, IMO, is overmatched at this level. However, you can find some good in his starts and see something there.
Moose? There is nothing to build on. He’s done.
I don’t shock easy. But, I would be shocked if he makes his next start.
They blew out the bullpen and went to a rookie, who had never pitched in relief, to try and upgrade themselves.
Regardless of past pedigree, I don’t see them sticking with Mussina. I don’t see how its possible.
Its obvious to me he’s not only done after this start, he’s done as a Yankee. Regardless of his contractual situation, I can’t see them slotting him into the rotation next year. Ain’t gonna happen, IMO.
Therefore, it makes sense to put somebody else in his slot and see how it goes. Its going to be available for 2008.
One man’s loss is another man’s opportunity.
Whomever it is, I hope they can be decent. Even “decent” is an upgrade at this point in the game.
We are seeing Edwar falling in love too much with his changeup. If he doesn’t make that adjustment, he isn’t going to be in their future plans.
He has to spot his fastball better and trust it. Guys around the league are now just sitting on the change.
When a guy like Polanco hits something 400 feet, you have to make adjustments.
Time to pull the starters and get them ready for the homestand.
They need a 7-2 homestand now to keep themselves in the WC mix. Anything worse than that, and its going to be very difficult to make the playoffs.
Not everybody is going to lose, just because people want them to. At some point, you have to win games and not look for other teams to fall apart.
Magglio still has to get a haircut
i thought we got rid of jared wright.
“The Red Sox hit a couple of great pitchers in Vazquez and Buehrle.”
Do you have an iota of an IQ?!! Buehrle and Vazquez are “great pitchers” now?!!! I’m laughing so hard I think I just gave myself a hernia…
Ah, the phony SJ44′s are back. The bold SJ44 ain’t me folks.
Another night of the trolls being back.
Can’t wait to hear Mussina’s comments / excuses after the game. Chances are he’ll be in denial.
7 – 0
Man I don’t feel so good.
All the hitting in the world doesn’t help a team with lackluster pitching.
Does anyone really want to get to the playoffs with THIS team?
Hi Guys,
I’m done working for the night. I’m in the clubhouse checking out the blog. What’s everyone talking about?
Buchholz is a real character guy. What did he steal, 29 labtops from his high school? Real good guy…
Magglio’s hair rocks! You don’t know what you’re talking about…
I guess we can all agree that Mussina no longer has big league stuff …. or A ball stuff, for that matter.
But I’m curious about a trend that has existed all season, even during the Yankees’ hot streak. Specifically, why the big discrepancy in overall performance between the “home” Yankees and the “away” Yankees? They are like a good college basketball team – run the table at home, under .500 on the road. Is it the home crowd (intimidating the opposition? the short porch for the lefty hitters?
It’s probable that the Yankees will finish under .500 on the road this year. Are they good enough to finish 30 over 500 at home to make it up (and make the playoffs)? I guess anything is possible …
Just flashed on the screen (Detroit broadcast) that Edwar is officially the “lightest player in the league” at 150.
the one thing i’ve been wondering…if kennedy and joba are in the rotation next season for a full year, would innings caps be a factor for them? could be an interesting problem.
I’m sure you never did anything bad when you were that age, right YankeeJosh? If that’s all you got on the kid then he really is a hell of a prospect. No holes in his numbers, that’s for sure.
Mike will be with villone tomorrow…On the D.L.
They have to much respect for him to just bench him…DL stint for sure…Mark my words
ANYONE but MOOSE or IGAWA…..actually, how about either White, Kennedy or Horne ? If it’s any of those 3, I am happy ( like anyone cares ) Have a great night, ALL…I am toast…Moose digs us a huge hole, Edwar can’t find the strike zone and when he does….PAPOW !!!….Verlander has us shut down and we are continuing to master the art of hitting into double plays….other than that…a GREAT GAME for the Yankees…right ?….OK, so we are 8 games down and we sweep 3 games from the BoSox ( cough, cough, gag, gag )( I can still DREAM, right ? ) then being only 5 games back, Boston’s entire teams comes down with the 7 week flu ? ( ya gotta help me here, I am totally grasping at straws )
hi mike you pitch about as good as the stanford football team plays.what was wrong tonight? dirt to brown? ball to soft?
…and NOW I am relegated to rooting for the Angels ? I need a beer ( or 12 ! )
Oh Christ, now the would-be “cerebral” Sox trolls are back to posting on this board. Why is it so hard to concentrate on your own team?
Why did Torre pull out Mussina? Isn’t better to let him eat up as many innings as possible this game (i.e. concede the game) and save up for the homestand?
Sox have 2 # 1′s Beckett and Dice-K…I’m just saying we need a true ace for next year and we are not getting one, not in free agency at least…I just don’t want to be in this same spot next year, but as I looked at the list of free agent pitchers, there are no good ones available, might be time to trade some youngsters…..or next year could be a long one as well…..
this web server has the speed of a Boston Boston cop trying to do math
“Buchholz waiting to take a spot in the rotation and he’s one of the best pitching prospects in the game right now.”
“The Red Sox hit a couple of great pitchers in Vazquez and Buehrle.�
LOL wow.
Drugs are bad umkay?
Mussina for 3,
Ramirez for 2,
Bruney for 2…. uh, oh…. that’s 7…..
Chicago Dave, both Buehrle and Vazquez had ERA’s in the low 3′s before facing the Red Sox. Even after his start, Buehrle’s still 11th in the league in ERA. Vazquez is 18th in the league in ERA and 7th in the league in SO. If that’s not good pitching, then what is?
Realistically, it’s extremely rare that you face two pitchers of that level in a single series.
BBB, you don’t think Buchholz is one of the best pitching prospects in the game right now?
“Dice-K” is a #1? Really? Tell that to Tampa. i thik they still have the receipt from the pawn shop they bought him at…
SJ,
I respectfully disagree about Hughes being over-matched. He gave up 4 hits yesterday. He hit some rough patches and is giving up too many homers. No doubt his season was hurt by the long layoff and his suff hasn’t recovered. Yet he still has kept the Yankees in almost every game he’s pitched. Certainly not great, but imo he’s there isn’t a better option than him now. If we miss the playoffs, at least Hughes has some learning experience.
Mussina isn’t going to be part of this team’s future. Even if he is back next year, that will be it. Gotta try someone else. My preference is Kennedy too. Or if the innings cap is a concern combine him with someone else.
The Yankees are going to have to burn their bullpen the night before facing the Red Sox. That doesn’t bode well. Boston’s a patient team who’s scored double digit runs in each of their last 4 games.
Don’t forget Sean Henn Bobcat. He is still here right? I think he owes us some innings after the other night!
I wanna see Shelley pitch though if the score gets really out of hand. I mean, why not??
I think wang and pettite or both having better years than daisuke. How he is a #1 but neither of them are? Beckett is having a great year, but he sucked last year. somehow i have a feeling that if either daisuke or beckett pitched for the yankees you wouldn’t consider them aces either.
“Buchholz is among the elite pitching prospects in baseball and has moved very quickly this season.”
-Rotoworld
I’m not the delusional one here. Try not to be such a homer.
Best team in BB?
Bucholz is not that great. Hughes is the real deal. Don’t think so? Look at Santana’s 1st year stats. I would take him in a heart beat over anyone in your rotation.
Hey Pete—too bad you don’t have another day in town. You could take Kyle to Belle Isle and test his deer call. The island, about a mile from the stadium has a good population of a European breed of deer. Pretty tame, they would eat bread out of your hand.
He is “one” of the elite prospects because Hughes and Joba are already in the pros.
BBB, you didn’t even get your insult right. It’s SUPPOSED to be “drugs are bad, mmmkay?”
edwar can pitch more than 2 innings. he started some games in the dominican winter league.
also, i got in trouble when i was in high school. for little things, like drinking. stealing several computers is a little different.
It’s geting late early
Every pitcher has to have a fastball to set up his other pitches. With Mussina, the hitters just sit on whatever he throws in the strike zone for breaking pitches.
He’s got rocks in his head if he thinks at his age he can suddenly discover a fastball over the winter and turn heads in spring training. He’s toast.
Michael Kay says that this lineup is the strongest for the Yanks offensively.
Wow.
Verlander is on fire tonight…
OK, let’s assume Seattle loses to Lackey tonight. Not that unlikely. We stay 2 back, and forget about Boston. If Moose drops from the rotation, and they run with a 4 man or a White fill in, or maybe even Chamberlain, is this necessarily a bad thing? Id rather see Moose outta there than continue to give us mediocre or downright awful performances. a 5 IP, 5 ER outing would have made this a harder decision. Moose made it easy.
three groundouts to second base. good lord. this sucks.
ROY, Hughes is the real deal because Santana struggled in his first year? Now THAT’S a delusion if I ever saw one. That makes no logical sense. Think about that for a second.
You know what really gets me…
The Yankees were so close to it this year.. they made a heckuva comeback and then they blow it just like the did all year. This streaky yankee team needs to be completely ripped apart for next year.
I am so pissed at having to admit that we do not have a shot in heck to make it this year. Even if Moose didn’t blow this game with his first pitch our bats are dead again.
Like I said a bunch of times this year.. talent without synergy = NOTHING! synergy without talent = HUNGER!
Someone tell Cash that Mariano is done too. If he want’s a job as a middle reliever next year give him a shot he has more than earned it but he has no closing talent anymore, unless he uses his change-up if his ego allows it. Don’t get me wrong I love Mo, but his days of fire are more than over.
Edward Ramirez has nothing, he was let go for a reason. So he added a change-up, big deal. If all you have is a change-up than all you have is a slow arm.
I am very frustrated right now right along with the rest of you.
If you need to contact me, I will be sitting on top of Fenway Park waving the white flag… that’s what this Yankee team has been doing just about all year.
UGHH!@
The Yankees dont’ even look like thy’re trying. This is sad.
Am I crazy to suggest trading Moose + Damon for Santana?
They only have Santana for 1 more year, and he’s ready to bolt… Having Johnny can help them negotiate with Hunter… Even if Hunter stays, Johnny can play left field… Moose would fill the missing spot in Min’s rotation for ’08…
Then the yanks have:
Santana
Pettitte
Wang
Hughes
Joba
He got another 1-2-3 inning (three already)…
No socky game tonight?
I can tell by the putrid stink of the smelly socks.
Andrea,
Good point about Mussina’s wrist. I’ve also noticed him rubbing it constantly in at least 2 or 3 other starts this year.
Our hitters refuse to be outdone by Moose’s horrible performance.
so now mo is done too??
Best Team in BB – Yeah, both Buehrle and Vazquez are destined for the HOF, right? Let’s see…Vazquez has a career record of 111-112 and a 4.31 ERA. If that’s “greatness,” then then the Hall has really been way too stingy in letting people in over its history. Oh, and of course you’re right that it’s really rare to face a pitcher with a losing record and an ERA over 4 for his career in any given series…That NEVER happens!
As for Buehrle…Nice numbers for his career so far but he intimidates nobody. He is a soft tosser who gets killed anytime his control is even slightly off. He doesn’t hold a candle to a guy like Verlander.
hey fleas! its edwar, not edward. Are you some sort of baseball scout??
Matteo, there’s NO POSSIBLE WAY the Twins would take Damon and Mussina for Santana. That’s not even remotely close.
“you didn’t even get your insult right. It’s SUPPOSED to be “drugs are bad, mmmkay?â€?
My fault lemme try another one…Crack is wack.
So put down the pipe, pud.
nomaas.org’s lead item is pretty funny right now.
J-Dawg: I thought I was imagining it. He’s a smart guy, so I’m sure he’d know if something was wrong…despite all the accusations that he’s an old man, I just can’t accept it. He’s ahd some really great starts. That’s not by chance. Someone’s gotta check him out!
pulling Edwar after 1? I mean, i think this game is over…why not leave him in…Henn surely isnt going to do anything.
can we resurrect a lefty that can actually get LH out??
Chicago, a pitcher doesn’t have to be destined for the HOF to have a good year. Both pitchers are pitching very well this year and Boston had no trouble scoring on them.
They’re good, just admit it.
Torre threw in the white towel, I see, our beloved Mr. Henn
I am actually glad Mussina stunk up the joint tonight. If he was borderline decent, we would have still lost today given that Verlander is dealing and would still would have owed another start for Mussina. Now we can just cut ties with Mussina or do whatever.
It would have made any difference tonight even if Wang or Pettitte was pitching. Unless they threw a shut out. And I can’t even blame the offense. Verlander is dealing.
yeah I’m with 89
Sorry, nope never committed any felonies. And I venture most young athletes don’t. I can’t vouch for Buchholz’ talent, I just know that as a fan I’m glad not to have to root for him. And Hughes is the real deal. You can see just watching him that he has it. He wasn’t helped by the injuries and long layoff this year, but I have no doubt he’ll be a star pitcher.
Pete was right. Sean Henn f’ing sucks. Ridiculous. At least Mussina’s last outing went as expected. Do you think they’ll give him a Viking funeral in the East River tomorrow? Honestly, the thought of Igawa coming back is nauseating.
BBB, you’re the one trying to say Buchholz isn’t one of the best pitching prospects in the game right now. I have professional sites on my side. Do you have any evidence at all on yours?
Probably not, cause you’re resorting to “crack is whack.” Guess you don’t know enough about baseball to talk about it.
Best Team in BB – STFU.
Hey Yankee Fans !!!!
Cheer up. You could have the sorry arse history of the Bahhstin Socks.
Ahhh yes …. that should make you feel better.
Buchholz is a great pitching prospect. Low to Mid 90′s Fastball, Change, Curveball, and Slider.
His Minor League numbers are very comparable to Phil Hughes where both have incredible K/BB ratios and similar ERAs.
Will be fun to see who is the better pitcher over the long haul.
no take edwar out and leave henn in, edwar can at least be useful against boston, sean henn sucks. we can use him for 5 games, send him down to the minors and call up britton. not that that will actually happen.
Well, this is a drag.
So, um, does Giuseppe Franco post here much?
I believe mike always rubs his wrist. I don’t think anything of it.
I am not pissed at mussina, i’m just sad that his career is ending like this. The guy is trying his hardest because he has nothing left.
9-0. Mercy rule. I’m changing the channel.
i’m going to put down my green tea for a minute and speak to the masses: my starting pitcher just went 3 innings and we’re down 6-0. we look hopeless at the plate. this game is almost surely a loss. we have a 3 game series starting with boston tomorrow. let’s see if we can give every relief pitcher one inning a piece instead of letting one of them “take one for the team.” actually, let’s see if sean henn is as bad as everyone (except me) seems to think.
on the plus side, maybe henn will be off the roster tomorrow…
Jesus, what a pain in the ass this guy is. Does he not have any friends? He’s got to hang out on opposing team’s blogs and comment about their pitching prospects?
The worst part of tonight is that you know that Torre will bring in Vizcaino at some point.
co-sign Frits. And I’ll add GTFO to that as well.
Well i’m out, tonight this blog is a toliet bowl. I can’t stomach reading the nonsense on here.
C’mon Torre. This would have been the perfect opportunity to test how long Ramierez can last as a middle reliever. So you bring in Sean Henn?? Do you want this to be a 20-0 route?
Matteo
…am I crazy to suggest trading Moose + Damon for Santana?….
crazy doesn’t do that trade proposal justice….more like insane…..batting practice just started for the Tigers…our starting pitching after Wang and Pettite is above average but too inconsistent…something needs to be done for next year..this year is not happening for us and again where will we get pitching for next year???..we cant count on Jaba and Hughes for # 3 and 4 all year, should be 4 and 5…
Lets some this up easily:
This is not good.
Pitching still wins ballgames.
jennifer: really? it looked like a wincing thing though. I don’t know. It looked weird. Maybe I’m looking into things.
I hate that we have to root for the Angels tonight, I hate the F— Angels
Best Team in BB – OK, so now suddenly you’re calling them “good” instead of “great.” And I should also add that you originally said both were “great,” period. You said nothing about “two pitchers having great SEASONS.” Get your lies straight, my friend!
The fact is, you know neither one of them is “great,” and, furthermore, that the entire White Sox roster went into the tank several months ago. You just want to pump up your own team…Be honest.
Jennifer,
Thanks. It must just be part of Moose’s routine. At least it isn’t nearly as bad as watching the way that John Rocker used to twitch on the mound!
I think it’s time to remove Jeter and Posada from this game. We can do Phillips at 3rd as well.
Laughable, cryable.. why is Sean Henn in the majors still????
If Guiseppe Franco was posting here he would say, “I don’t work for the Yankee’s, I don’t even KNOWN anything about it”
what the heck does that mean?
We’re all stupid for not putting every dime we have on the Yanks getting beat tonight.
Please let this be the last appearances for Mussina and Henn.
He might be wincing cause he is pitching so poorly.
I woudn’t blame mike if he is conviently in the trainers room when the media comes in.
Let Henn go as far as he can tonight. We’ll probably call up Igawa to be a long man/lefty before tomorrow’s game, which isn’t a terrible move.
I also hope Kennedy is put on the 40 man roster with the intention of pitching September 1.
mr. abraham,
i must disagree with your assessment of edwar. he’s had a few rough spots, but overall, i think he’s shown that he can be an effective reliever. after all, he does have 16 Ks in 10.2 IP, so it’s not fair to say that major league hitters have him figured out. i think he has a bright future with a little work and some maturity.
and as an aside, i had a really strong premonition that you were going to post an update somehow managing to trash edwar.
They should have an open roster spot with Brackman getting surgery.
I dont’ understand why Joe didn’t just leave Edwar out there for a second. Now Henn is getting it handed to him.
who was it who made the comment about henn being torre’s white flag?
PBL –
I think you’re actually on to something… That’s actually real smart to waste Henn here, and keep Edwar available. Then send Henn down and bring up Britton…
But that leaves no lefties in the penn to face Ortiz (not that it really matters…we dont get him out anyway) — Joba or Farnsworth vs. Ortiz – That’ll work for me.
I can’t believe Igawa might get a call up…
jennifer: i thought of that as I typed it. I still can’t help but wonder if there’s something wrong with him. He’s NOT this bad of a pitcher.
There is a mercy rule in baseball Best Team In Baseball, 1 World Championship every 90 years.
I think it is time to pull everyone. Clear the bench.
It was a nice run the Yanks had there for a while after the after the AS break. Now it’s back to reality. This is simply not a playoff-caliber team.
Let’s look forward to 2008, when Joba will get the opportunity to start full-time and (hopefully) Phil will be 100% healed and will continue to improve as a starting pitcher. (I still think he could use some more time in the minors, but clearly the Yanks aren’t down with that idea, so might as well root for him to mature quickly in the majors, right?!)
Now Henn is getting cooked… Who is next from the pen?
Today’s pitching is just awful
Not sure what Pete means about the Edwar Ramirez fan club disbanding as he made one lousy pitch ?
It’s the Sean Henn fan club that needs to close up shop !
Man, I was thinking about going to the game tonight, glad I changed my mind. Brutal. At least I don’t have to sit with a whole bunch of Tigers fans, like I did during the Division Series last year. Yuck.
This is really sad.
ughhhhh
Sean Henn had a fan club? Maybe the henn house. But thats it.
Since coming back up, Edwar has gone 8.1 innings, with 3 runs and 11 k’s. The fan club lives on.
This is so out of had, might as well let Melky pitch an inning. How much worse could he be then Henn?
How much you wanna bet Torre puts Chamberlin in this game, instead of saving him for 2 games against Boston?
there can’t be any conceivable way henn is on the roster tomorrow, is there??? Between his awful pitching this week, and the fact that he’ll throw plenty of pitches today and a bullpen move might need to be made for depth anyway, how in the world would he still be here tomorrow????
And to think, we could’ve traded him for carlos pena straight up. We then could’ve spun Pena for a reliever once Giambi was coming around in late July…
I wouldn’t care if Torre goes out there and pitch at this point. It couldn’t hurt.
Michael Kay asks the dumbest questions.
Cashman made the mistake of overpaying to sign Henn. Now he compounds that mistake by making Torre pitch this stiff.This guy has puked it up every time they hand him the ball. I’m all for lefties in the stadium, but they have to have some talent, Henn has NONE.
Yep, agreed…keep Henn in there as long as humanly possible and when you HAVE to remove him, use Bruney. I’m not gonna watch the rest of this game but I hope to god I don’t pick up the paper tomorrow to find that Viz or Farnsy pitched!
As for Moose, poor guy. It’s been fun while it lasted though, and I will always be grateful for all he has given us over the years, which really is a very considerable amount. Hope he can get traded somewhere to get those last 3 wins he needs for 250 and finish his career in some semblance of style. He deserves it.
At this point, Joe has to get Posada, Jeter and anybody else who is banged up, out of the game. No sense having the guys who are banged up finish this one.
As green tea said, when your starting pitcher puts you in a 6 run hole after 3 innings, strategy goes out the window.
Ripping on bullpen selections at this point is just dumb.
An awful roadtrip is ending, they have a 9 game homestand coming up, and its not worth blowing out the real pitchers on the staff for this game. Let’s not get stupid here.
Make the roster moves you have to make (new #4 starter, Henn goes back to Scranton) and hope they play, more appropriately PITCH, much better on the homestand.
They now have 10 series remaining this season. They have to win at least 8 of them to have a shot, IMO.
The rest of the season starts tomorrow. Tonight isn’t worth discussing anymore.
Bob,
I don’t think we’ll see Joba but I do think Farnsworth and Vizcaino will pitch this game.
My dad is in charge of the remote right now (we watch games together) and he is in charge of the remote….he switches between Yankee games and Met games. They showed Billy Wagner stopping into the PHillies bullpen before going into the Mets bullpen. The guys in the announcing booth–stupid Keith Hernandez–seemed to think that this is appalling to do. “you don’t do that during a game!!!!!” and then they commented on the beautiful flowers.
I hate the Mets broadcasters.
I agree…there is no way Henn should be with the Yankees in any form after tonight. He has been a disappointment his whole career, and his most recent outings have just put an exclamation point on that fact.
He better not bring in Joba.
Joe pulled Mussina after 72 pitches with the game lost, you wonder why. Verlander with a good lead, Let him stay out there throw 100. Mussina not only loses the game but then burns up the pen.
Sounds like they are just as bad as the yankee announcers.
One of the most painful things for me is watching how beat up that Derek Jeter looks. Jeet’s been such a warrior throughout his whole career and it was tough to see him hobbling in the dugout after his first at-bat. I wish that we were ahead in the standings just so he could take a few days off. He certainly could use a break, health-wise.
“ Meanwhile, has the Edwar Ramirez Fan Club disbanded?�
No. Why? He needs better location on his pitches. But having one plus pitch IS all you need out of the bullpen. What was Keith Foulke’s third option, beside his fastball and change-up? Trevor Hoffman? Not comparing Edwar’s ceiling to theirs, obviously, but the pitch selection is similar. The pure stuff is there for Ramirez, he just needs to strengthen his command. THAT’S IT. If you don’t think a reliever could be effective juxtaposing an 89 MPH fastball against a nasty change-up, which, by the way, has downward movement, I don’t know what to tell you, Pete.
It’s the location, not the velocity. Make a case he’s never going to learn to locate, fine, but be careful, this is a kid who taught himself how to throw that ridiculous change-up, without any coaching whatsoever. With time, the command will improve. Rafeal Betancourt is a guy who bloomed late, among many others.
My condolences that you have to stick around for garbage time.
Henn needs to go as far as he can and then have the SP who’s throw day it is to throw an inning. One good thing is we need to go only 8 innings.
Pete leave EDWAR RAMIREZ alone he’s actually a good pitcher !!!
P.S. Joe start taking out the starters we have Boston tomorrow
Bucholz is going to be sick… the only thing that is keeping him from being a legit starter is going to be injuries.
I admit that as a baseball fan.
Too bad Joba is running low on innings left before his cap… id like to see him start instead of moose.igawa.desalvo.clippard.karstens.
SJ
The only ripping I see on the bullpen moves is that Torre hasn’t left them in long enough. Even if Henn goes a few more innings the quality relievers will have to be used tonight which is not good. 2 out of Edwar and 2 out of Henn, followed by 1 from Farnsworth would have been a nice way to save Joba nd Viz tonight.
Do you leave the hitters in for one more inning? See what happens and if we get shut down again bring the bench in?
man I am glad I am out of town..
Moose is done I guess. any feeedback???
I guess Hughes is not there main problem…
WOW…
No Joba tonite. We need him for two of the three games with the Bosox. As for Edwar, I dunno. His fastball is usually around 90. That in and of itself should not be a problem. So the fanclub is not willing to disband as of yet.
jennifer: Keith Hernandez is so much worse than anyone else. He’s just awful. HE never ever ever shuts up. He talks about all his gold gloves blah blah blah blah. NO ONE CARES. People still liked Donnie Baseball better so shut up. And no one cares about the flowers. And no one cares about the t-shirt that randome dude is wearing. SHUT UP and talk about the game.
It also would have been good to let Mike get stretched out. He hasn’t thrown 100 pitches in a very long time.
You know what pisses me off the most is knowing that Boston is already in NY. I’m sure they’re watching this game. With every run this game the CWS score, their confidence must go up.
The game tomorrow will be in ‘our’ house but going into a big series (at least as far as the dwindling playoff hopes look) the Yanks are going in with nothing.
I amend my statement from before.
Pitching wins ballgames, but so does momentum sometimes.
And re: all the talk about trading Moose and Damon for Santana, stop. That’s just insanity.
But here’s something I have been thinking about today. What about trading Moose plus some prospects to Pittsburgh for Tom Gorzelanny? I think he has very good stuff. He’s young and still probably gets the lg min., but maybe something could be worked out provided we eat Moose’s contract and throw in enough viable prospects.
Just some food for thought…that one may not be totally realistic either but it is much more so than the Santana pipe dream…
I’ve always been a moose fan, I’ve had a hard time saying stuff negative about him in the past, but all that he has worked for over the years is done with, he is washed up.
im sure its already been discussed who will be replacing mike mussina but not sure if anyone pointed out desalvo is on the hill tonight for swb…heres his line thus far
6.0 6 0 0 2 7
yesh torre henn is fine!!!
better then britton, he is a lefty isn’t he?????
shocking a problem they did not deal with is still a problem,, wow such a shock..
Pete:
I hope he does end up pitching in Arizona this off season, he could use the experience as a reliever. Thanks very much for the info.
sean henn is good
This game may be a positive because in that it could get Henn and Mussina off the team.
The only reason Henn is here is because he’s lefthanded and could possibly qualify as a long reliever, if he were any good. But he isn’t, and he’s a waste of a relief spot right now. There isn’t a single good reason not to dump Henn for Britton right now.
I’ve been a big Mussina fan ever since he was a Carl Everett single away from pitching a perfect game in Fenway. Since then I’ve wanted him to see him accomplish something tremendous to make up for that lost opportunity. But this game was the nail in the coffin – while I think he’s been a good contributor as a Yankee, he can’t pitch anymore. Rolling the dice on someone else is a better idea than sticking with what we know isn’t working.
A lot of people are reluctant to drop Mussina because there’s no clearly good substitute available. Unfortunately, that’s the way it goes sometimes. The Yankees are in playoff contention despite having called up groups of minor league pitchers that most people never heard of because they were so desperate for starters. We’re lucky we made it this far but the well may just be dry for starting pitchers. The way Mussina’s pitching, we have to find out for sure.
Joe should let the vets go and shower, eat and get ready to fly home to NY.
“Meanwhile, has the Edwar Ramirez Fan Club disbanded? It’s OK to be a reliever with one pitch if that’s a moving fastball. Not if it’s a changeup. His fastball is just not good enough for this level based on what we have seen.”
Pitching guru, Nardi Abraham. Pete has the mind, if not the body, of an old baseball guy(that’s not a compliment), therefore Edwar’s 15 k’s in 9.2 innings isn’t good enough to overcome the fact that he’s sort of odd and oh yeah, he cried once. But seriously, it’s touching when Pete ventures outside of his skill set. Maybe he can work with Edwar in the offseason to develop a second pitch.
They dont need to use any of the key relievers, although Edwar has to be considered a solid 6th inning guy at this point and may be unavailable tomorow. Henn for one more, Bruney for 2.
It’s pretty brutal listening to this game on XM being that it is the detroit announcers. What will happen to Moose? will they put him in the pen?
Arod must be done, he isn’t on deck to hit.
god save this team…
Josh,
I wouldn’t have pitched Edwar more than an inning tonight. Makes no sense to burn him longer, IMO.
Henn? He will be gone after tonight, IMO. Torre and Guidry need to get his butt in the clubhouse and tell him to suck it up tonight.
That’s the guy you let stay out there, regardless of the result, because he is of no value to you.
At this point, does it matter what he does the next 3 innings?
Let him eat the innings and go from there, IMO.
They won’t use Joba tonight or Farnsworth, IMO.
Viz? If Henn can’t pitch three more innings, he looks like he may get some work.
Matt DeSalvo now putting his name in the mix for Moose’s slot in the rotation with his work tonight.
The options may not be appealing. However, they have no choice. They have to get Moose out of the rotation.
I think the Tigers are a bigger threat to the yankees than the Mariners. The Mariners have a tough schedule but the Tigers have a really easy schedule with a lot of games against the whitesox
Please not DeSalvo again…he’s AAAA
I stand corrected. I forgot Bruney is back.
Henn and Bruney can finish this game, regardless of the result. Its the best way to save the ‘pen.
SJ,
If you had to guess, who do you think it would be to replace Moose? I don’t know much about Steve White, other than that he isn’t going to come up and dominate, but do you think he has what it takes to get it done?
This would have been a good game for Karstens to get into
He may be AAAA but, what is Mussina?
They aren’t going to get Johan Santana to fill the role.
When your #4 starter falls off the map in Late-August, the options aren’t appealing.
They have no choice. Moose has pitched himself out of the rotation.
You can’t have a guy out there who gives you zero chance to win and kills your bullpen. Like it or not, that’s what Moose is at this point in his career.
Its “patchwork time” again for the Yankees. Its all they can do at this point.
pleeease save this team
if he was up with the club that is
I don’t understand why you are so hard on Edwar Ramirez. 3 of his last 4 outings were good. He had 15 K’s in 9 innings. You take away the outing in Tampa when he hadn’t pitched in two weeks and his stats aren’t that bad. I want anyone wearing the pinstripes to succeed. You seem more intent at saying “I told you so”, then pulling for the Yankees.
I think I know what to do with Mussina. Put him on 60 day DL citing tired arm, like the sox did with Schilling. The figure out what to do next over the off season and spring training. There is a decent chance 100% sure that an NL team like the Phillies will give us a B prospect (possibly more if we get luck for Mussina). Especially if we pick up 4-5 M of the 11M owed to Moose. That would save us 6-7 M and we have a spot for both Joba and Ian in the starting rotation for 08.
I would honestly rather see Igawa than DeSalvo — Igawa has some upside and has the stuff to get ML hitters out…when he can actually locate it, and not throw everything up in the zone or off the plate.
AND he’s lefty…which is nice.
I would give moose a few outings off, and then give him another chance. I know he normally doesn’t like to have his schedule mixed up, but maybe with a little rest he will be a better option than what we have at AAA
Igawa over Karstens as well — I can’t watch the AAAA guys pitch anymore — I’ve had enough.
Guiliani is in the Tigers broadcast booth right now. He said the last game he went to was the one where the Angels scored 18 runs on the Yankees. Maybe he’s the bad luck?
anyone dreaming of ipk getting the call (myself included) i doubt it will happen…20% chance. my money would be on igawa but with desalvo pitching well tonight he could get another shot at bronx salvation
Mussina has just finished the crossword puzzle of the Sunday NY Times in the clubhouse. Time to start on today’s puzzle. He wants to rest his arm for his next start on the flight to Newark Liberty. Torre has him penciled in to get shellacked against Tampa Bay.
IMO. Henn should pitch until his arm falls off, since he will not be on this team come tomorrow.
I liked Matt DeSalvo. Hate me if you will, but I liked him. I did NOT like him as a reliever. He was not suited for that.
Any news on Rasner? he was good, no?
Just came home,,,,Why am I not surprised by the Mussina outing……Now can we say goodnight to him….Several of us have been calling for his removal from the rotation for the last month if not longer……..
BBB,
I think it will be White. He’s a sinkerballer, throws strikes, works quickly, is a bit older (more innings, more experience) and has pitched quite well in AAA once he got healthy.
If I had to venture a guess, White will start against Tampa.
I would guess Moose either goes to the DL (a la Villone) or becomes long reliever.
If I’m Moose, I go to the DL and leave with some dignity.
After this latest Henn outing, I would guess they will bring up another relief pitcher tomorrow. I have to see who works in Scranton tonight to determine who that might be.
Sterling said something about a “heated discussion” (or heated arguement) between Guidry and Torre in the dugout…anyone know anything about this?
Can we replace Moose with Miss Teen South Carolina? She’s got a great “change-up,” though she has to work on “location”
I still think the Yankees have a great shot at the wildcard.
Once we’re in, anything can happen (ask the 2006 Cardinals).
“heated discussion�
maybe they were standing near the radiator
Henn gives us the first scoreless inning. That tells the story.
If someone already mentioned this, forgive me. Picking the proper starter in Mussina’s place could provide the offense with a mental lift. When you watch the offense during Mussina’s last three starts, you see all of our hitters pressing and trying to get all of the runs back with one swing. It’s like watching the offense during Game 4 of the ALDS when Jaret Wright was on the mound. Sure, Jeremy Bonderman pitched a terrific game, but the offense was affected by having to score so many runs to cover for mediocre pitching. When the replacement (White, Kennedy, Igawa, DeSalvo, whoever) goes out there, look for the offense to pick up when they realize that they don’t have to try to score 15 runs to win a ballgame.
I say get DeSalvo a start in the series against Seattle. He was dominant against them. In fact, they were the only team he pitched well against.
Also, Kei Igawa may seem like a terrible option, but he pitched complete games compared to what Mussina’s been doing lately. He rarely got knocked out before the third or fourth.
_Once we’re in, anything can happen (ask the 2006 Cardinals)._
maybe we should change our names to the “’06 Cardinals”
in addition in improving our post season odds, it would confuse the umpires, and open new merchandising streams.
pretty sure both starts for desalvo were against seattle…the first time he did well and the second he got spanked…i dont think another seattle start for him would be good…especially given the wild card
Mussina is the biggest piece of garbage I’ve seen in quite sometime. Hopefully Torre has the cojones to demote him to the bullpen or something.
I can’t scream it loud enough… Kei Igawa is NOT the answer!!!!!!!!!!!
J-Dawg
Rocker’s head twitching was due to generations of inbreeding and a regular butt knockin’ by his uncle daddy.
Mussina … whether he’s shaking his head, rubbing his wrist, scratching his butt, grimacing after another guy knocked his high school fastball … is just getting too old to be efective.
Gotta wonder if he’s secretly hurting if he’s fallen this far off while he’s still a couple years short of 40.
Mussina, not Rocker.
dr. acula…. escalators can never be broken, they are temporarily stairs, sorry for the convenience.
good point on igawa, he at least gives some length to his starts. i think his last start was in sf and he pitched a decent 4-5 innings
“I think the Tigers are a bigger threat to the yankees than the Mariners. The Mariners have a tough schedule but the Tigers have a really easy schedule with a lot of games against the whitesox”.
I agree 100%.
If anyone is thinking that replacing Moose is the answer WAKE UP!
There is not *one* answer to the Yankees problems, it’s not been like that all year. This team needs many changes to solve their problems, starting with a new manager!!
I hate this team.. I hate hate hate hate it!!!! Did I not say people need meds on this blog? I am including myself right now. I am totally destroyed tonight! Devastated!@ This team has absolutely no business in the playoffs. They are HORRIBLE as a team!!!! Three great players on one team does not equal a good team!!!
I can’t wait until this whole team is split up.. EVERYONE can go!!! Everyone!!! I can’t take it!
*Leaves Of Grass.*
how quickly the leaves turn in baseball.
Not two years have passed and houston has fired its world series skipper and chicago is on their way.
Geeez……Moose gone,Igawa coming soon.
It should be interesting what happens to Moose. Clearly his best days are behind him, but he has another year left on the contract. The Yankees still are looking ok for the wild card and lets not forget lots of wild card teams go on to win the World Series.
It should be interesting to see what roster moves are made. Also, towards the middle of September there are several off days. Perhaps getting a spot start from Kennedy and then skipping a fourth starter.
The Yankees have had several bad road trips in late August so lets hope they kick some butt against Boston and Seattle, and Tampa (they dont face Kazmir) but do face Yankee killer Edwin Jackson
If Kei Igawa is the answer, I will commit suicide before I hear the question.
I like SJ44′s approach, bizarrely, in concluding that the season starts tomorrow. It’ll be crunch time.
Fleas has totally lost it ….
Maybe the Yanks could bring up Humberto Sanchez….OOOPS, I forgot, he still can’t lift a fork with his right hand. Maybe Humberto and our new # 1 pick can rehab together. Until proven otherwise both of them are busts.
Where’s all our depth that we heard so much about all winter?
DeSalvo has made 4 starts. Twice good against Seattle. One terrible against Chicago and one bad against Tampa Bay.
DeSalvo thus far tonight: 8 IP, 2 runs 0 BB, 7 K’s. Winning 8-0.
Will be interesting who they chose to fill Moose’s role.
Just as interesting, who gets Henn’s role in the bullpen. You have to think he is on borrowed time.
take it easy there dude … breathe …
Carmine: EXACTLY what I was thinking. And it’s not like it’ll be like the Tyler Clippard thing with the Mets…DeSalvo had 2 great starts v. the mariners.
I hate how Kay says Rodriguez…”Rodge-ree-gizzz.”
Sorry, he had two more. Another bad against Chicago and another bad against Toronto.
Don`t be a bunch of quitters show some backbone you bunch of frontrunners.
The Bombers will regroup and win all 9 home games.
SJ44: can’t be 8-0 if he allowed 2 runs…..which is the typo? is it 8-2, or did he allow 0 runs?
Sorry. God’s a Red Sox fan! can’t you tell by the way you lost it in 2004, plus every year since 2001
SJ44
Have Faith Bro, the Best is yet to come.
SJ,
Good call so far on the bullpen. Henn’s at least eating some innings. Yanks don’t have to do a thing with Mussina. Rosters expand September 1. He can stay active and just not pitch.
Just food for thought, I dug up DeSalvo’s two Seattle starts:
13.2 IP, 10H, 3R, 0HR, 3BB, 2K
Wow, it COULD get worse.
Its the only way to look at it frits.
If Seattle wins tonight, they are down 4 in the loss column for the WC If they lose, it stays at 3.
10 more series left, and you have to think they need to win at least 8 of them. If they do, they probably get in the playoffs.
I am sure they will be looking at the schedule and figuring out their rotation after this game. They will be trying to mix and match the back end of it to fit Hughes and whomever takes Moose’s spot to teams they feel they can beat.
Its going to be tough but, you still have to play the games.
The best way of looking at it is what I am proposing. The season starts tomorrow night. Go from there and see what happens.
Make that 6BB. I’m on top of it tonight.
Well on a positive note, I’m really impressed with how much Melky’s improved since his first call-up. He was in over his head back then, he got playing time and stepped it up, and did you see that MF catch in the first? As long as he keeps getting better we’ve got a solid CF for a long time.
Too bad he can’t pitch …
And to think Boston is sitting in their hotel room watching this crap…..Speaking of crap, I loathe Rick Sutcliff….How does he keep his ESPN gig…..
Will Henn be pulled out if his count reaches 100???
With no hate or malice, parting is such sweet sorrow. Bye Mike
Was Andy Phillips a pitcher in high school?
it’s about FREAKING time.
Wow and here I was getting excited that Henn could put up two scoreless…bit premature I guess.
can they score 30 or win by 27?
Andrea,
Sorry, it was a typo. DeSalvo had 8 shutout innings tonight.
_Moose either goes to the DL or becomes long reliever. If I’m Moose, I go to the DL and leave with some dignity._
SJ, you think Moose doesn’t retires after the season or try to collect the final year in the national league central, for example?
Also, why would serving as a long reliver be undignified?
KidYankee,
As a devout Christian that offends me. Let’s leave religion out of this, that’s all I’m asking. God doesn’t care about a ballgame.
Cya Mike – wish it ended better.
hey, we’re only down two touchdowns. you never no, somone breaks ine and you get an onside kick, you never know what could happen. wait….. my bad…. it’s monday night and all.
I think God cares about anything humans care about.. and God created baseball (indirectly) and I think he wants humans to recreate otherwise we would have those options.
I think the very least you have to do is skip Mussina for a turn in the rotation. Call up Ian Kennedy, give him a game instead of Mussina and see how he does. If he gives you a respectable start, give him one more. You just ride Kennedy if he is giving you something better than Mussina.
Adam,
You saying this could be the Heidi game?
Please don’t let this turn out to be another Ranger /O’s game 30-3. I don’t think I could sleep tonight if it did knowing we’re facing the enemy tomorrow.
Oh man, if this wasn’t bad enough, I totally forgot this game was on ESPN2, I’ve been stuck with the Tigers broadcast on DirecTV. Yeesh. At least I was spared Procede ads for one night.
Sean Henn can carry Mike Mussina’s bags as well as his own.
Our options at Scranton are limited at best. We have Chase Wright,Matt DeSalvo, Tyler Clippard and Kei Igawa to chose from. That’s kinda like the executioner asking you how you want to go out.
Can somebody send Henn to Siberia PLEASE?
GoNYR…Ian Kennedy isn’t on the 40-man roster. Someone would need to be DFAed or put on the 60-day DL. So that isn’t happening.
Nick- You dont like Giuseppe??
Andrea: I like DeSalvo too… even if it is partially for aesthetic reasons
But aside from that, I was really excited when he faced Seattle twice within a week and mowed them down both times, they didn’t figure him out the 2nd time around, I thought there had to be something there. But then it all spiraled downhill so quick. I agree with the comments below that it might behoove us to start him vs Seattle though. I mean it worked twice already, so can’t hurt to try again! Same reason I wouldn’t mind having Igawa around to come out of the bullpen vs Bos..
jb- Um have you seen Sean Henn pitch lately??
is anybody worried about the fact that joba wont pitch in four games
jb
Brackman signed a Major League deal and is on the 40 man roster. If he gets TJ surgery, put him on the 60 day dl and you have a spot for Kennedy.
If any good can come out of this embarassing defeat, hopefully a loud wake up call will open their eyes.
Not much to say. My bet is on Steven White -the others had their chances, and apparently Kennedy is being protected for next year. This should also be the end of Sean Henn. Edwar will get another chance, I think, but not in close games.
SJ44: no worries, we all have typos. I was just curious which one it was! 8 shutout innings is impressive. I wonder if he could hack up it b ack up in the bigs.
SJ, thanks for the info. on White. I would definitely go with him then. With all the others, from Igawa to DeSalvo, it seems like everything would have to go exactly right for them to have a good outing. Igawa would have to have the luck of the devil. DeSalvo would have to have all the hard hit balls against him be hit right at someone. I’m just so tired of all the ifs and maybes and want someone who can go out and pitch a solid if unspectacular game. If White can do that, sounds like he’s our guy.
1) can anyone explain why Jeter is still playing? is there nobody left to replace him?
2) i guess this is better than losing 1-0 in 12 innings. Isn’t it?
Here’s what the Yankees need to do.
- Put Andrew Brackman on the 60-day DL.
- Put Ian Kennedy on the 40-man roster.
- DFA Sean Henn.
- Purchase Ian Kennedy’s contract.
- Put Mussina into the ‘pen as the long-man.
- Ian Kennedy becomes our fifth starter for September.
THEN, if the Yankees make the playoffs, they go with a 4 man rotation. Wang – Pettitte – Clemens – Hughes.
Kennedy’s season is now done, Mussina stays in the ‘pen.
DeSalvo should have an extra win of course. The worst call of the year happened during his debut. There was a great vibe for him at the time.
Joe- I think Edwar has shown he can get the job done, but he is just not good in the mop up role. If you look at his outings, alot of his bad ones have come in mop up roles
igawa or desalvo get mooses spot…they have both won at the ml level and the yankee organization does not want to risk putting extra innings on the young arms. having joba and hughes here right now are a plus and have been real exciting. sure i would love to see ipk but igawa and desalvo are expendable. also seattle is a much different team now then they were when desalvo faced them…pretty sure sexson was only batting .100 at that time, they are a much more dangerous team right now
Wow, Brackman actually is on the 40-man roster. He definitely has to be added to the 60-day DL.
well now we need two touchdowns AND two conversions!? forget it.
YankeeJosh August 27th, 2007 at 9:48 pm
Adam,
You saying this could be the Heidi game?
great line
Dan- Henn has options. DFA him at the end of the year but for now it’s worth keeping him in the Minors imo. Call Igawa up to be the lefty/long man, and call Kennedy up 9/1 to start for Moose. Get all the minor league arms you can up in September and use whoever is effective.
to add onto my last comment, bring BRITTON up also
16-0? Wow. This is a joke. I havent been watching since 10-0
For 7 innings, we had a combined 192 pitches from four pitchers while Verlander used 96 pitches…
desalvo pithed great tonight….8ip 1R 9Ks…..he will get mooses next start
By the with the Win today Detroit Tigers will be just a game behind Yanks in the Wild Card. So the Yanks not only lost badly to the Tigers they also gave lot’s of momentum for them in the Wild Card race. I don’t think the the yankee fans have to watch the Seattle game coz the Tiger will win the Wild Card coz of the momentum given by the Yanks.
why wasnt ipk moved to relief like joba?
BBB: I agree. Let’s do it! DeSalvo v. Seattle, Igawa out of the pen v. Boston. I’m not sure about Igawa though. Just cause that may have been a fluke. I don’t know if I trust him….
Unbelievable – the NY Fans are starting to waiver like Boston Fans. Clemens makes 24 million, Messina – 12 million and then you beat up on the young guys like Henn who continuously is taking one for the team making $385,000.00. So who should be beat up here?
The GREAT yankee offense has only 3 hits. Moose didn’t pitch well but that is not an excuse for having 3 hits. PATHETIC.
Dan,
I love your plan. If they DFA Henn to open a roster spot for Kennesy it’s a win/win. It’s too bad because Henn seems like a really nice kid,but so did Wil Nieves.
Since Igawa did work out so well v. Boston out of the bullpen, would it be worth it, does anyone think, to have HIM be the left reliever/long man?
Henn and Mussina should have to take the Greyhound back here after the game. Have 2 guys ever had more harmful roadtrips?
NYY
I actually think Detroit will win the Central. Even with the Yankees giving ground back, they are still in good enough shape in the wild card race.
“The best way of looking at it is what I am proposing. The season starts tomorrow night. Go from there and see what happens.”
Totally agree. Get out of Detroit and start things fresh tomorrow.
NYY-Great pitching stops great hitting. If Verlander is on, no one wins
Wild Card
Well said
the great yankee offense went up against the great tiger pitcher, i believe he no-hit the twins and was coasting a 10-0 lead 3 innings into the game. not much the yankee offense could do against that
Agreed NYY Moose along with the rest of some members of the Yankee BP are pitching putridly but only getting 3 hits…3 hits for supposedly the best offense in baseball is disgusting
Am I the only one not impressed by Matt DeSalvo’s minor league numbers? He and Chase Wright proved beyond a doubt that they don’t have enough stuff to get major league hitters out.
Forget the Pen – where is the offense tonight? Maybe if the fans stood behind the team they would be more driven and feel less beaten….?
Henn’s going down for Britton or Igawa. I don’t think Kennedy’s coming up.
September 1st is this week – really doesn’t matter now
YankeeJosh,
I thought the yankees were in pretty good position in the Wild Card before this series. They had to worry only abt the Seattle for the WC and Mariners have a brutal Schedule. But now Detroit is into the picture. I thaught both the central div teams are out of the WC.But Cleveland & Detroit r still in the wild card more so than Seattle.
Sean Henn’s numbers on this road trip:
0-2, 6.2 IP, 17 hits, 14 runs, 8 BB, 7K’s, 2 HR’s allowed.
Mike Mussina’s numbers his last 3 starts:
0-3, 9.2 IP, 25 hits, 20 runs, 5 BB, 3 K’s, 1 HR allowed
Honestly, its hard to think you can pitch any worse than that. I dare say, even Kei Igawa may not have approached this level of futility.
Regardless of how distasteful the options may be for some, you cannot have these two guys throw another pitch for this team the remainder of the season. That is, if you have any playoff aspirations.
Just can’t be done. Turn the page on both and move on.
one positive thing about tonight, the game did not end at 3:30 am by walk off home run. a 20-0 or 1-0 loss count the same. i think the bombers have proved themselves the last couple years that they know how to make the playoffs. the red sox still have gagne, were ok ha
DeSalvo had his chance (a couple of them, actually) in the major leagues and didn’t impress. He may be better than Mussina at this point, but that says more about awful Mussina has been.
Don’t fault the bats. The wind kind of gets sucked out of them when you have a starter doing what Moose did. Not to mention the guy on the mound for Detroit is pretty damn good.
Think about it. 5 losses on this roadtrip. 3 were by 1 run. The other 2 were because Moose is just flat out awful.
The bats are not the problem, Moose is.
Rest in peace, Mike Mussina.
NYY,
It was a bad performance by the offense, but it all goes back to them having to put extra pressure on themselves to make up for mediocre pitching from Mussina.
nick, maybe if the yankee fans were .300 hitters we could have been smacking justin verlander around comerica…or maybe if we were long relievers we could have won those two extra inning games. maybe you need to get a grip.
Nick- If you were in the lineup tonight knowing Mussina is giving up runs left and right, how would you feel? I remember last game Mussina pitched, the offense rallied against Kelvim Escobar, a pitcher with an era under 3, to have Mussina give everything back the very next inning. Would this give you any confidence? If you were to come back he would give it right back. Top that off with Verlander on the mound and you have a recipe for a shutout.
Henn “Volunteered” to pitch the other night to save the Pen for the next night – give a little credit for his taking the bullet and again tonight. He can only hope to get out of NY after the way he’s been treated
“16-0 Bengals” If Michael Kay wants to be witty, at least get the city/team right.
Hopefully Yanks don’t get swept by the RedSox then we can say goodbye to the Wild Card as well. I am not being pessimistic but the way they have played on this road trip doesn’t give me any confidence that a sweep by the Sox of Yanks may not be out of question. PATHETIC display of baseball by this yanks team. gutless.
Patrick Bateman: creepiest ever.
_where is the offense tonight? Maybe if the fans stood behind the team they would be more *driven* and feel less beaten_
Driven?
Hmm, sounds like a cool name for an after shave
foobar- The Lions are incapable of scoring 16 points, nonetheless a shutout
Options for Mussina?
Who do you want to see starting for New York five days from now?
Clearly Mike Mussina is not the same pitcher he was six years ago when he made his Yankees debut. He’s not even the pitcher he was last year when he looked like he still had something in the tank at 37 years old. Today, the Yankees need to win every game they can, and they can’t keep rolling Mussina out there if he doesn’t give them the best chance.
But what are the options? The Triple-A rotation, frankly, is full of them. A case could be made for any of the five starters in Scranton/Wilkes-Barre.
Matt DeSalvo pitched well on Monday and would be on regular rest to start for New York on Saturday. He’s on the 40-man and wouldn’t have to be called up until rosters expand, meaning he could go to New York without any other move being made. True, he didn’t inspire a ton of confidence in his most recent stint with New York, but was he any worse than Mussina has been lately?
Kei Igawa pitched well on Sunday, and frankly he’s pitched well in most of his Triple-A starts. He’s struck out 62 with just 13 walks, which is the best ratio on the team other than Edwar Ramirez. His past two starts: 12.2 innings, 3 earned runs, 10 K, 2 BB. Not bad. Just like DeSalvo, Igawa hasn’t earned a lot of trust in New York, but there’s if there were an established option, he’d already be in the big league rotation.
Jeff Karstens might be the most established of the Triple-A bunch. True, Karstens was terrible during his last New York stint, but he pitched well in spring training and he pitched well last year. Granted, he’s pitched just 19 Triple-A innings, but he’s 2-0 with a 1.89 ERA in those games. He’s scheduled to pitch tomorrow. If he doesn’t go more than an inning or two, we’ll probably have our answer.
Now we get into the two options not on the 40-man.
First is Ian Kennedy, whom several fans seemed ready to promote. Kennedy has been terrific. He was terrific on Saturday, and he’s been terrific all season. His 2.08 ERA in Triple-A tells you just about everything you need to know. But the Yankees also bumped his last start back a day to limit his innings (he was otherwise on track to pitch the last game of the regular season) so it’s hard to imagine they want him throwing in the high stress environment of New York. I’m not saying it won’t happen, just saying there is reason for the Yankees to hold back. Look at how cautious they were with Phil Hughes the past two years, and how cautious they’re being with Joba Chamberlain. Kennedy could be the answer, is it worth risking his future for five or six starts? Maybe. Maybe not.
Finally, Steven White. Buster Olney is apparently already saying he believes it will be White. Maybe he’s right. White has been incredibly consistent this season since coming back from a strange nerve problem in his right shoulder. I think he’s a major league pitcher, I’m just not sure that right now he would be any better than DeSalvo, Igawa or Karstens. If there is no reason to believe White will be any better, then why add him to the 40-man before you have to?
Tough call. If it were me, I think I’d give the start to Karstens. That said, I love it when guys who deserve a chance, get a chance, so I suppose I’m hoping for White. He’s earned the opportunity, I’m just not certain he’s the best bet.
http://emedia.thetimes-tribune.....ssina.aspx
IMO it should be Tyler Clippard replacing Moose. I think he can give you 5-6IP and 3-4ER. That’s a 4.5ERA at best but honestly even a 5.00 ERA is going to keep the Yankees in games right now. I don’t think Moose, Igawa, or White will give them that. They are in deep trouble if they can’t even get that (5.00ERA).
Pete, edwar ramirez will be fine. His fastball hits 90, which is alot faster than most of the pitchers currently on the Yankees, and he has a nasty chage-up. He is the least of our problems. Problem 1a is Mussina. Problem 2a and b are why is Sean Henn on this team anyway (he has been so so at AAA and horrendous in the bigs since late April). Tonight can be excused, but he was tagged with 2 of 5 losses on this trip, and a related question, why has Britton not been given a chance?
the Yanks still have the 2nd best *home* record in baseball +17 above .500 (Halos are first +24)
The Lions could score 16, but they would also give up at least 38.
DeSalvo sucks less than Clippard.
please not karstens. ill take white igawa or desalvo, in that order. ipk to the pen
Clippard’s confidence seems to be shot after his demotion so there’s a VERY slim chance that he would be the one.
Didn’t even realize Detroit’s next 3 series:
3 @ Kansas City
3 @ Oakland
3 @ Chicago
Then they play Seattle, so if we’re chasing both at that point, no matter what we won’t be making up ground.
Makes this loss tonight even more devastating.
We’re in deep trouble guys.
Just say no to Kei Igawa and Jeff Karstens.
We know what both of them have, and its not major league material. We’re looking for a replacement for Mussina, not a spot starter. Make the move, get Kennedy on that 40 man roster. DFA Kevin Thompson or TJ Beam.
If this team has any chance in September to turn it around, its going to have to be a guy who doesn’t give up 7 runs in the first inning, and both Igawa and Karstens are capable of that.
Sorry. God’s a Red Sox fan! can’t you tell by the way you lost it in 2004, plus every year since 2001
Kid Yankee, it’s obvious that you’re a Red Sox fan. The funny thing is, you can only “trash” us for 6 years of history. How about the 26 World Championships and the fact that you guys hadn’t won one since 1918. You don’t have a leg to stand on with your argument. It’s weak.
when the pitching is bad the bombers never hit well!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If Desalvo can pitch against Seattle every game, he’s alright. Look at his stats against every other team. Not good. I thought Clippard had the best stuff between he, desalvo, and igawa. none of them fared well, but at least I could see potential in Clippard with his pitches. obviously none are great options right now. this is a painful discussion.
Karstens, desalvo, or clippard all stink. .try soemone else..
tell me what torre says on the post game, I am in a hotel in SF..
What a nightmare game, also what did Mikey say??
I did not see the game but I did see 1 of his other 2 train wrecks, he looks like toast…
Maybe torre thinks Henn should be sent down now??Maybe…..
embaraasment
handle says it all baby.
The second post in this thread is hilarious.
how great was melkys catch in deep center tonight, look how well this team plays when they are in the game and have a chance to get a win. too bad that chance only lasted one inning.
Tough loss but things aren’t as bleak as they seem. We are still up one on the Tigers and within range of the Indians (if they get back in the WC race).
SJ is right. The season starts tomorrow. This team has played much better at home as opposed to on the road. Big series against the BoSox and Mariners. Pretty much need to win both. There is still a lot of time left. I still like our chances.
well, its basically an argument of which guy can get you 5-6 innings and a 5.00 ERA. pretty sad but the yanks would be lucky to have a julian tavarez right now. honestly, i think they have to make an effort to get an average pitcher who is overpaid via waivers. one of those guys that a team would dump for nothing to save the $$$. not contreras but something along those lines. if it doesnt work out, you let them go and absorb the lost money. the yanks need a 5th starter now or the season is lost.
What’s up, Mussina ? Can’t blame it on a rain delay… was the barometric pressure too high ? Cloud cover not right ?
Another pathetic outing when the Yankees can’t afford it, what will it take for Mussina to finally get taken out of the rotation ? I actually don’t blame this game on Mussina, I blame it on Torre, Guidry or whoever was responsible for keeping Mussina in the rotation. Time to wake up and smell the coffee.
boston dave, why would we go pay for a kei igawa when we already have a kei igawa?
Well, it looks like my sacrifices to the baseball gods went unnoticed.
Edwar’s fastball velocity is almost identical to Hughes (who, contrary to popular belief, does not usually throw 94-95 though he’s capable of it: he’s always been a 91-92 kind of guy), but with better movement. He’ll be fine when (and if, you never know) he adjusts and learns that unlike AAA, major league hitters adjust very quickly to his change-up if he doesn’t keep them honest by spotting the fastball.
I understand that i was just a guy who knocked around the minors, but at some point no matter how proud or good you once were there comes a time when you look at the mirror and realize it’s over….He’s hurting the club & his legacy…..Request DL time and rest your arm Mike Mussina…You’ll gain a waelth of respect in the clubhouse, and then maybe the fans will view you with a sense of knidness…..Do the right thing, it’s over……As for Henn, DFA……
It’s tough to lose 3 out of 4 but at least we’re out of Detroit. As for the loss on Friday, “blame it on the rain, it was fallin, fallin.”
In Joba – if Igawa can give you 6IP and 3 or 4ER, get him up here. Igawa’s ERA is almost 7, so no, it’s not the same thing. Maybe there aren’t many guys that fit that bill on KC, Pittsburgh, etc, but it’s worth exploring.
go with a 4 man rotation…
the options are bad. screw Igawa, no friggin way… I have not seen WHite or Kennedy, the guys who have already had a few starts are not options.. the yare in the minors because they are not capable…
henn is atrocious, he deserves better!!!!How about getting someone out????Yeah he took one for the team !!!!
after he lost 2 games for them this week…..
Any chance they put an APB out for Britton to try to locate him for Torre?????
Foobar, what are you talking about? Hughes sits at 92-94, can dial it up to 96-97. He doesn’t sit at 91-92, might wanna revise your scouting reports..
silver lining: now Henn may be a cool guy for all I know, so nothing against him as a person, just performance on the field…but the sample size should now be sufficient by Torre and Cashman standards to D him For Assignment.
no how can we DFA Henn he is a nice guy!!!!!!
He took one for the team(whatever that means)….
Bring up Britton for Henn(get rid of 1 more of the old junk) and deal with the Moose collapse…
What is up with that guy???
This really blows. A week ago we were looking forward to this series with Boston as being pretty significant. How quickly things deteriorated. Hopefully they can go back the other way just as quickly.
i doubt the organization throws ipk this late into the season with the innings cap they have on him. igawa was a proven pitcher in japan, and sure his stuff didnt translate immediately over here but he was considered a long term investment. he has good stuff but his transition was not as smooth as say dice-k. the two were placed in totally different conditions (sox even signed okajima to ease the transition and look how that turned out). i dont think the yanks are going to pay for another starter when they have a guy with good stuff in igawa who has been putting up better numbers recently. the truth is that there is a hole in the 4 slot, and it will either be moose, igawa, karstens, white, or desalvo.
i cant wait for tomorrow night to come. the bullpen is going to get a facelift soon enough…and andy/dice k is going to be a great matchup. lets hope we see some more production out of the captain and joe doesnt mess up the lineup
Peter,
How can you say anything about Edwar? He wasn’t the problem and is a serviceable middle reliever. The problem is going out to play a game when everyone on the team knows your starting pitcher doesn’t have what it takes to keep you in it. Mussina has to either go to the pen or the DL. He can’t be DFAd of course. And Sean Henn needs to go. What does Joe have against Chris Britton??
Hey Pete. Who are you to rip on Mike Francesca. Let him drink his diet coke in peace
Just got back, had to go after the 3rd. Glad I missed the carnage, tho. I can live with a blowout, I can accept that Mussina is never going to be Moose again, but it just kills me that they’re going home for the most important series to date with this hanging over their heads.
I have to take solace that these are professional ballplayers and they usually have good bounceback games. We also have our stopper on the mound tomorrow. He must be so mad that he has to pick up after the mess left behind by Mussina again. A Seattle loss to the Angels tonight would help, too.
In Joba – Igawa was a long term investment??? they expected him to pitch well right away. he has had multiple chances to adjust and the only time he’s been remotely good is when he gets ahead in the count against patient teams and can then get them to chase an offspeed pitch when they’re behind. he has had horrible control. when he misses its right down the pipe. if he could magically correct that, fine. but right now they either need to see what White can do or find someone else who hasn’t had a chance yet. Like I said, 5-6IP and 3-4ER is, gulp, acceptable and will keep them in games.
Yes I said Edwar is almost identical to Hughes who does not usually throw 94-95. Edwar throws 90-92. You just backed up what exactly what I said by claiming Hughes throws 92-94: a tidbit more than Edwar but not 94-95. So your point being? Might wanna revise your posting trigger finger…
“Sheff would rather sit on his good numbers than play hurt and hurt his value.”
What a moronic comment. The guy played his ass off in ’04 with a shoulder so bad he couldn’t lift his arm.
My comment may be hours late but I couldn’t let that pass.
Andrea, i agree with you. igawa pitchea a couple of good innings, then he implodes.He should be used as a lefty reliever for 1-2 innings. Cashman doen agree with us. What can we do? suffer
Johnny Twisto, the original comment might have been a bit extreme, but the point is that “Gary Sheffield cares about Gary Sheffield.” maybe there is nothing wrong with that, but you can’t look at his career numbers and say it’s a fluke that no team still wants him after a couple years. there’s gotta be something there.
i thought the yankees signed igawa to a 4 year deal and not just to rival the red sox signing of dice k. all im saying is he is a better option than going on the market and giving up prospects for a 5th starter we would ditch at the end of the season. new york isnt the easiest place to come over and dominate immediately. hes been working and has had good numbers in aaa so why not give him one start in place of mussina? id bet hed give us more than 2 innings and a 6 run hole.
if Igawa gets called up… I will need to move from Boston to avoid the humiliation and non-stop harrassment. I’ll stay a little longer if they go with Clippard, White, or someone new.
i know this is like beating a dead horse, but you think it’s time for chris britton yet? i mean lets get serious. it’s almost like they only want to promote the studs (which is great), but have no patience for developing or even sticking with those mid level guys that can give you some quality (bruney, ramirez, and probably britton). it’s almost like they want to have mop up type guys around as oppossed to just solid guys (3.75-4.25 era guys like the aformentioned). i know this sounds ridiculuos, but the fact that britton doesnt even get a SHOT is even more ridiculous, and points to this idea that they would rather have a mop up guy around (to blow extra inning games) than guys like him who can actually pitch.
Oh for God’s sake Pete. Is it really necessary for you to take the polar opposite opinion of what the fans think ? Really ? Edwar pitched ONE inning today. Yeah, he gave up a HR, yet Sean Henn sucked OUT LOUD. And your insight is in regards to Edwar ? Really ?
Dude, seriously, you need to stop taking things personally. Because the fans are rabid in their admiration for Edwar, you really don’t have make it your personal mission to point out the guy’s flaws every time he pitchers. Really. As SMIDGE of objectivity – you might want to look into it.
sheff and the yankees dont have good relations after the comments he made. i think kay got that in to appease some higher ups and take over for cashman if hes gone, haha wouldnt that be messed up? wc update…m’s down 1-0 in top 3rd. and i agree with the idea of igawa to the bullpen…we need a lefty reliever not named sean henn
In Joba – so I guess you think Aaron Small and Shawn Chacon didn’t work out either. Just because someone is signed to a 4yr deal doesnt mean they can suck in years 1 and 2. They signed him to pitch well for 4 years. Your idea that Igawa is supposed to be given a free ride to suck it up because they have him for four years is ridiculous. it just shows how poor of a decision it was to sign him at all.
Paddy, Britton would be better than Small right now but I don’t think he’d be anything special. At best he is another Brian Bruney. That said… he deserves a chance.
p.s. If the Yankees do make the playoffs…. I think Joba should get some MVP votes
. The way their bullpen is going, they’d have no chance without him!
Angels are up 3-0.
I feel dirty rooting for them.
I meant to say “Henn” in my previous post, not small. had his name stuck in my head.
I love how the posters on this site think they have more inside knowledge than a professional reporter who is in clubhouses every day and is always talking to other baseball professionals (incuding executives and their staff) about everything baseball.
A. Pete is hardly professional on his blog.
B. Might want to clean the end of your nose. Got a little brown on it.
ROY: “Dice-K� is a #1? Really? Tell that to Tampa. i thik they still have the receipt from the pawn shop they bought him at…
2 runs and 2 hits in 6 innings. He can’t score runs. You’re an idiot Roy.
ha all ive been saying is he should be given another shot at moose’s spot in the rotation. you suggested signing a pitcher comparable to igawa (numbers sense). how does that make sense? i agree it was a poor decision to sign him, but he has upside and a few wins ml under his belt
Bob, I know…. I wish I could root for Seattle to win the division and have the Angels fall into a massive slump…. but the most realistic chance for the Yanks is to root for the filthy Angels. I just hope Kelvim Escobar gets hurt – he’s long overdue.
In Joba – if you aren’t going to read what I write then it doesn’t make sense to continue the conversation. can you find me where I said to sign someone who has close to a 7 (SEVEN) ERA ???
I didn’t… so you need to retract your post.
hey peter!! the edwar ramirez fan club is still here. he pitched better than all the other yankee pitchers today. why do you think joe torre took him out after 1 inning?? to save him for tomorrow’s game if needed. All he needs to improve a little is on his fastball command. but he has 16 ks in 10 2/3 innings pitched. If you take away the outing against the devil rays, after he hadn’t pitched in almost 3 weeks, he has done good. Here are some stats for you. After being called up again after that outing he has pitched 81/3 inn., allowed only 3 ER., only 3 walks, and 12 STRIKEOUTS. To answer your question if the Edwar Ramirez fan club has disbanded, the answer is, No.We are all still here.As a matter of fact, we invite you to join the club.
who are you going to sign at this point in the season that is better? provide some names and numbers that you have so readily available
I’m not gonna root for anyone to get hurt, but I agree with the rest of what you said Boston Dave.
Although I’m more worried about Detroit than Seattle at this point. I have a feeling we’re gonna live to regret not putting them 3 behind us tonight.
Dan, I agree that Daisuke could be a #1 on many teams. For some reason he doesn’t scare me though. The better offenses get to him. He walks too many and throws 120 pitches over 6 innings. He has the potential to be one of the top 10 pitchers in the league but right now he is hit or miss. Either way, he’s a very good #2 on his current team. Still, I’d rather face him (if I were the patient hitting Yankees) than most of the other #1′s in the AL.
The velocity you see now from Hughes isn’t what is was earlier in the year. Earlier he was hitting 92-94 sometimes 95 consistently. Now it’s 89-91. Kid just got off the DL after being on it for 3 months, give em a break.
I feel really bad for Mike. He sounds like a beaten man.
LOL. Fan-interference, ground-rule double to make it 3-0. Didn’t see the play, so I don’t know if it cost Seattle or actually saved them an extra run since the bases were loaded.
Bob, I respect that… but I have no problem rooting for a couple injuries here and there
I guess that makes me a mean Yankees fan but until you live in Boston you can’t understand 
I am not too worried about Detroit because I don’t think both Cleveland AND Detroit will pass them. If Detroit wins, it will be at the expense of the Indians and not hte Yankees. Of course if the Yanks tank, they won’t win. But if the Yanks win their share, they only have to worry about Seattle.
He is a beaten man.
Shame it is ending this way for him.
Yankee boosters will probably gnash their teeth lash out when they hear this (don’t bother with your Boone/Dent off-topic retorts) but here are the facts:
The expectations of New York fans for Hughes, Joba and now Edwar have gone through the roof in direct proportion to the suckitude of their more expensive veteran arms.
All three may have some real promise, but anyone who has watched baseball knows not to bet too heavily on prospects even when they have glowing scouting reports, impressive minor league stats and even initial success in the majors. The vast majority of rising stars fade.
So Yanksfans have basically put these young men in an untenable position, setting them up for failure.
If your initial rotation and pen had lived up to past performance, the expectations for these guys would not be so exaggerated on this board. Yankee fans are casting about desperately for hope, which is understandable. But the likelihood is that at best 1 of these 3 will survive in MLB.
Hell, I remember a time when Sox fans were similarly overoptimistic about young Casey Fossum, as if he were the second coming of Sandy Koufax. Look at him now.
I don’t know if this has been said or not.
But, I’m glad the Yankees got destroyed tonight.
Not that they lost, but if they were going to lose tonight they had to get absolutely embarassed.
Hopefully this is a wakeup call that there are only about 30 games left and if they don’t want to waste their season they need to play harder. I’ve noticed the last couple series (as I’m sure everyone has) that they’ve lost that fight which got them back into contention.
I suspect they’ll get that back now. Or at least hope.
Hudson, sure expectations were high but Hughes was the top rated pitching prospect in all of baseball – not just by Yankees fans. Joba has actually exceeded expectations and Edwar didn’t have any expectations. So I have to respectfulyl disagree with you. Hughes’ expectation for this season may have been too high, but over the long haul I think it’s a crime to compare him to Fossum.
Forgive me if this has been discussed already, but I want to know what other Yankees fans think.
We quite possibly saw Moose pitch his last game as a starter tonight. I strongly feel the way Torre kept him out there tonight was tasteless, thoughtless, and disrespectful to a career near hall of fame guy.
There was no rational reason to leave the guy out there at 4 nothing. The game was actually much worse than that and the managerial move should have been to get Moose out of there and try to win the game. Clearly Moose had already pitched much worse than 4-0 and there was no indication that things would turn around.
By leaving the poor guy on the mound after a near hall of fame career, Torre was slighting and reducing the guy to fill in mop up pitcher.
Moose isn’t a mop up guy taking one for the team. He is possibly a HOF pitcher at the end of his rope. Instead of trying to win the game, or at the least preserve Moose’s dignity, he lets him hang by this rope instead.
Of all the moves I have seen Torre make, this one is a tough one to swallow. He lost a tremendous amount of respect in my book by putting Moose through such a debacle.
Thoughts?
BJ
igawa is better than henn, kennedy is better than mussina.
hudson it sounds like youre very worried about having to face joba
so here’s my revised plan taking into account the advice i read on the blog.
-Andrew Brackman gets placed on the 60-day DL, opening up a spot on the 40-man roster for Ian Kennedy
-Ian Kennedy gets placed on the 40-man roster.
-Rosters expand on Saturday, September 1st, which is when Mussina’s next start is lined up for.
-Kennedy is amoung the September call-ups and takes Mussina’s spot.
-Mussina is put into the pen for mop-up duty and to be the long man.
-If the Yankees make the playoffs, the 4 man rotation is (1) Chien-Ming Wang, (2) Andy Pettitte, (3) Roger Clemens, (4) Phil Hughes. Mike Mussina stays on the roster in the pen because he has experience. Ian Kennedy does not make the roster unless he is lights-out in the majors.
You can’t say they haven’t showed some resilience this year Ted.
My brain says these 3 games with Boston are gonna be ugly. My gut says we’re gonna do OK.
p.s. Hudson – I live in Boston and there are no fans that grossly overestimate their prospects in all of baseball and the world of sports for that matter, more than sox fans. yankee fans are not excluded but I think you’re making a bad example if you use Hughes and Joba in the conversation.
Bob root for that Rally Monkey like you’ve never rooted before. I got to thank Moose for 2 things if anything he’s done after tonight, and number 2 is IT’S JOBA TIME !!! can pitch 2 games vs Bos
johnson – i think the yankees need to find a respectful way to move mussina off the team for now. he cant even be used as a reliever and as hard as it is, you cannot sacrifice the season to save his feelings.
and kennedy is not getting called up and i dont know why its assumed he would get the job done anyway. it was a tough decision to call up hughes or joba. they were exceptions, not the rule.
BJ -
I may be wrong but it was 4-0 with 2 outs and a runner on first with Brandon Inge at the plate.
Coming in Inge was at .238 and struggling at the plate, and against RHP he was .220.
No reason not to let a “near hall of fame” pitcher try to reach back and get him.
BJ, I disagree.
The team comes first at this point, not Moose.
Torre knew who was pitching for Detroit. He also knew the team is dead tired and has a tough 3 games after a flight home tonight. Who was he gonna send out there? Burn out the Viz, Chamberlain, Mo, Farnsworth(Gulp…did I really just say that?) in a game that was over already? Moose should have been left in longer to eat more innings IMO. He’s getting what… $11 mil this year and next? I think he owes the Yankees, not the other way around.
and, I’ve always been a Moose fan BTW, so this has nothing to do with me not liking him.
Take it easy.
We still have a chance of wildcard.
seattle will lose today.
HAHA~
I knew Mike was all washed up last season. The fact that he has been here this long really amazes me. I don’t care if we paid up to have him here, he’s done! There are so many better players on the team and it really must burn his butt when he gets pulled in the 3rd and the next night Pettite secures a much needed win. It almost seems like Pettite is there to pick up the pieces of the ol’ Yankees veteran. Torre really must let his feelings aside when making tough decisions like letting Mussina go. He could let Scott Proctor go after pitching a perfect season 2 seasons back and then moving him to relief? That was a stupid mistake. Moose has to go. He’s definitely the weakest link in the pitching staff. I would rather have Kyle Farnsworth from the spring pitch before Mussina. Hang up the towel, Mussina was done two years ago. This moose is overcooked!
it will be interesting to see farnsworth at the stadium this week against boston….maybe we can ride JoWorthMo to the wild card?
Tonight’s game exposed our beloved Yanks for all of their weaknesses.
Torre once again let his guys go from bad to worse without any inclination of stopping the flood gates. This kind of managing guarantees we lose every single time one of our starters gets whacked early. There is simply no way to recover if your manager allows your starter to give up 6 runs in the early going.
We have significant holes in our pen. We have no long relief pitcher of any worth. We also have a lot of dead beats that are making FWorth look like a worthy alternative. This is an extremely sinister finding.
Pitching – Our much vaunted offense was shut down once again by playoff caliber pitching. This is precisely why all the offense in the world wont win a playoff team. Defense and Pitching does it. Until we can compete with pitching, this team will be unlikely to succeed in the post season.
Defense – Melky tonight showed why he is a top 5 center fielder in the entire league. There I said it. Name 5 guys that can field and throw the way this kid is doing. Historically a solid fielding center fielder is infinitely more important than any offense this position brings to the table. Melky brings both. A highlight to what has thus far been a disappointing season.
Looking to the future – Ian Kennedy is not the answer that many think he is. He is unrefined and not ready to become a starter in a pennant race. I love young talent as much as the next, but this team is overwhelmed with upstarts, and this rotating door in and out of AAA is starting to take its toll. I’m not sure who makes Moose’s next start. Once could logically argue that Moose gets one more chance against Tampa, the perfect team to give him an extended opportunity to recapture just enough of a spark to make a playoff run. Whatever you may or may not like about Moose, he probably is still our best option in the five slot.
Bruney – Is there any surprise here. He was terrible before he went down, continued his dreadful pitching. There was absolutely no reason to believe he would be good now that he is up again.
What now – Does Britton come up. Henn is clearly not ready for the bigz. He may or may not ever be. We still need some help in that pen. I hate to say this, but Igawa may be here whether we like it or not.
BJ
The yankees will make the playoffs. The mariners will not win the wild card. Have some patience people. There are still 30 games to go, anything can still happen.
the yankees will prove steve phillips wrong.
uh, no, the Edwar fan club didn’t disband. Granted he does need another pitch.
But put it this way, anyone with 102 Ks in 56 IP in the minors does deserve a look, esp. when the bullpen you do have stinks.
“The team comes first at this point, not Moose.”
Bob, I know some of our more hysterical fans here will let many of us believe ‘the game is over’ at 4 zip. This is simply ludicrous. This team has far too much offense to give up that early with such a small deficit.
By leaving Moose out there with NOTHING in the tank, he effectively gave up. If you are going to give up, you can bring anyone else in there to mop up. It shouldn’t be Moose, or are we saving an extra inning of Henn for the big series in Beantown. Henn wont even be on the roster.
I agree that the team ALWAYS comes first. This move had very little to do with who comes first however, and a very embarassing and disrespectful play on a elite career pitcher who was trying his best. Unfortunately his tank is on empty.
BJ
i think as fans of baseball we should all be asking, how does steve phillips have a job?
Jesus Christ this team freaking sucks. I tried to tell all of you idiots that one team can only play KC so many times before water finds its level. I hate Mike Mussina, and about sixty percent of the rest of these losers. Jesus Christ. Somewhere, my Boston buddies are laughing their arses off at me for the crap I’ve talked for the last month. Even if we sweep, we’re five games back. ugh.
does steve phillips have a job?
Why? Because he’s been so wrong about yankee pitching? Because he was wrong about Damon or Matsui? What has Steve Phillips been wrong about? Melky? Really? Yeah, every night this bullpen shows us how we DONT need another bullpen guy.. This is just embarassing.
i bet you talked a lot of game when this team swept boston in that 5 game series last august. if you only pull for 40% of this team then i think its time for you to jump on a new bandwagon. the mets are winning their division, try shea out next year
At this point, I hope Phillips is right. I’m so tired of Cashman and Torre. I hope at the end of this year, Steve Phillips can look back at this season, lean back in that comfy ESPN chair, light a cigar, and have a long, hard smirk on his face knowing that he was right all year. This pitching sucks. Franchise isn’t ready, clearly. Moose is cooked, Pettitte is pitching well on a terrible team, Wand is wang but needs the ground balls to find gloves, and all of our hopes rely on a guy who has thrown less than 10 MLB innings named Joba.
Where has this all gone freaking wrong?
Boston’s two best pitchers are locked up, and under 27 years old, while Papelbon is as well.
What is Cashman hanging his hat on this year? Someone tell me? Ian Kennedy? Jesus Christ, please.
First of all IJWT, enjoy hell for even suggesting that I root for the Mets, I’ve been a Yankee fan my entire life, growing up in Brooklyn since I was 4. Next, this team sucks, and with a payroll like theirs, and the talent on it, you don’t think they’re underperforming. Whatever, you idiot. I can’t even tell you how stupid you sound for standing up for them.
And, this team was SUPPOSED to sweep Boston last year. They were playing with half of their normal lineup, and had four pitchers on the DL. What other past freaking games would you like to bring up to justify this train wreck. You know, this year?
Funny how when Matsui barely missed the ball in yesterday’s game he was a bum, but Melky missing the one in center tonight is not mentioned and it should have been caught.
Not to Melky biased are we ???
He also air mailed a throw to home that was way, way off line. Melky still has a lot to learn about this game.
One thing would be listening to the manager and coaches who have repeatedly told him not to slide into first base. He is a good player and makes some very good plays but if you are not overly biased, you can see his mistakes as well as the good things he does.
Big Johnson,
Funny how when Matsui barely missed the ball in yesterday’s game he was a bum, but Melky missing the one in center tonight is not mentioned and it should have been caught.
Not to Melky biased are we ???
He also air mailed a throw to home that was way, way off line. Melky still has a lot to learn about this game.
One thing would be listening to the manager and coaches who have repeatedly told him not to slide into first base. He is a good player and makes some very good plays but if you are not overly biased, you can see his mistakes as well as the good things he does.
Melky is a terrific center fielder and I never worry about him defensively although there is an outfielder whose defense really irritates me.
Hint- Right field. Right field!!!
im new to posting on a blog…but is hawk normally this funny, this old man (god as he believes) told me to enjoy hell. to answer your posts, new york was supposed to sweep boston last year? i dont know any 5 game series where any team is supposed to sweep the other, especially on the road so immediately you have lost any and all common sense. perhaps the old age community doesnt have cable internet and you dont have access to all the internets resources. and is the team underperforming? its a long season and for the first half of it they were miserable to watch (chase wright in boston, carl pavano… list continues and is mostly due to injuries) but the second half has shown us what the bombers are capable of. they took 3 of 4 from det and swept the indians. i dont jump ship as easily as you do
Uh, Hawk? The Yanks are still 13 games over .500, still within 2 games of a playoff spot and still have the best offense in the majors I believe.
And this is a TRANSITION year! When the Red Sox go through a transition, they win 82 games; when every other team does it, they win 65.
The Diamondbacks lost 111 games three years ago, and now they’re in charge of the NL West.
We’re in a season where our veterans from the 2001-2005 era are starting to come off the books, to be replaced by basically-unproven guys who were born in the mid-1980s, and we’re 72-59, two games back in the Wild Card with 33 games left.
Can we get some freakin’ perspective?
I guess what got lost in this game to alot of you was it didn’t even matter what Moose did.
Verlander was absolutely filthy. Watching the highlights, I didn’t even realize(because all I was seeing at the time was red because of Moose’s pitching) just how almost unhittable his stuff was tonight.
Edwar Ramirez is still a good pitcher. he will be very good when he commands his fastball better.
Johnson – Kennedy unrefined ? What ? He may not be ready for the bigs, but the one thing he IS is refined. His stuff is good, but his makeup and his command are outstanding. I don’t know where you formed your opinion, but it is about 180 degrees out from reality.
He is not some fireballing rookie who doesn’t have a clue where the ball is going, but gets guys out because his stuff is electric. The exact opposite is true.
I’m still a member of the Edwar fanclub. I’m registered in the “He can be a quality middle releiver” chapter as a opposed to the “He is the next Rivera, no wait, he sucks, no wait he’s the next Trevor Hoffman” chapter.
He made a mistake yesterday. He missed with his “get ahead” first pitch fastball and then was unable to find the corner with a second fastball. Pitching from behind is not going to work for him and he’s going to get hit from time to time.
Edwar Ramirez will prove everybody that’s against him wrong.
1 vote for Hawk as the biggest fool on this blog.