Pitching matchups for Tampa Bay series
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Aug 31, 2007 
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Tonight: RHP Andy Sonnanstine (3-9, 6.38) vs. RHP Phil Hughes (2-2, 5.35), 7:05
Tomorrow: RHP Edwin Jackson (4-14, 5.51) vs. RHP Ian Kennedy (debut), 1:05
Sunday: RHP Jason Hammel (1-4, 7.44) vs. LHP Andy Pettitte (12-7, 3.70), 1:05
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In his must-read daily blog over on ESPN.com, Buster Olney wonders why the Mets weren’t ripped more for yesterday’s loss in the New York papers.
Good question, Buster. If this slide continues, the media honeymoon could be over for Omar Minaya and Willie Randolph.
Speaking of media, noted author John Feinstein has been following around the Yankees and Mets this season working on a book about Mike Mussina and Tom Glavine. It’s an interesting idea, looking at two smart, veteran pitchers as they try and remain viable starters for playoff contenders in New York.
But the process has become too painful for Mussina and he has cut off his weekly sessions with Feinstein. I hope he picks it back up again, as the book will be one worth reading.
Meanwhile, I’m working on a book of my own about the Yankees. It’s called “The MRI and Me: The story of Carl Pavano.” Look for it soon.
Thanks Pete for this great Blog. and i wish you good luck to your book.
Well, if Mussina isn’t going to pitch anymore, Feinstein won’t need him much. Sounds like it will be a good book, though. The Pavano book promises to be an epic. What 800, 900 pages?
Who are the Mets? NY has another team?
This series has SWEEP written ALL over it. Hughes to improve, Kennedy to WOW and Andy to bring the HAMMER down ! WIth Manny out, we can ride into Boston either with the division lead already OR have it IN HAND on our way out ! GO YANKEES !!
Lol i keep forgetting pavano is on the payroll.. its just better that way
Peter- good luck with the book. I will no doubt purchase a copy.
Thanks for all your hard work. This is the best yankee blog/news source on the web.
I dont think he was serious about the book, guys.
Pete – Too bad that Buster Olney doesn’t make his blog available to all viewers instead of limiting it to “Insiders” who subscribe to all the ESPN deals.
From last week’s power rankings: “So Billy Wagner blew a save Thursday night, and the Mets dropped two straight to the Padres? Where does that leave them? At No. 2 in this week’s ESPN.com Power Rankings.
So when today’s power rankings come out, does it read, “So Billy Wagner blew a save Thursday night, and the Mets dropped four straight to the Phillies? Where does that leave them?”
Angels, Boston, Padres, Yankees, Cleveland, Mets, Seattle is probably what they’ll have for this week.
Jennifer, have you talked to your uncle lately?
Where is Pavano?
Anyone listening to WFAN?
Benigino almost had a heart attack discussing the Mets.
guys, re: the Pavano book, it’s called sarcasm.
Peter:
An alternate title, if needed: “The Never Ending Story.”
Global Warming:
I was on the road, and heard that. Too funny.
I got back to my office, and sat in the car listening to him. Made my day.
That beningo stuff was funny, I almost couldn’t tell if he was joking or serious. I mean he sounded like a 10 year old crying about willy. Evan(think thats who he is) was at least using common sense.
Pavano’s number got painted over in the parking lot to make room for number 22, I believe. Kind of a cleansing of sorts.
If the Yankees had a dude who was 4-14, he would be a greater shame the Kei Igawa.
Big al Re: everyone knows, theyre firing sarcasm back
Carl Pavano: Or I How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Disabled List
benigno was great. i love how the met fans go to such extremes. a few weeks ago they were telling us how great wagner is and now joe b called him garbage and said he can go back to philly. it was great. nothing like having the yanks surging and the mets sliding.
Ian Kennedy against the one D-Rays pitcher that’s beaten us more than once?
Yea, that one I’m slightly concerned about. The others, not so much. I mean, I don’t take any game for granted, because you can’t, but they don’t worry me as much as Saturday’s.
I’m not writing off Seattle, they’ve had a great season and are still a threat in the WC race, but talk about smoke and mirrors. Seattle’s starting rotation is the 3rd worst in the AL. Run Differential is now at +7 through 132 games.
We still have to watch the Tigers, too.
But I feel much better about our chances than I did yesterday. Thanks Seattle! Feel kind of bad for Rick White, though. Why do they keep throwing him out there? Do they have no one else besides Putz?
Pavano is 3 credits short of his medical degree.
I’m writing off Seattle.
They were a good story for a while.
But no one can win with Weaver and Ramirez starting games.
Mets fans bug the hell out f me.
Jackson was good last time out but worried about him???
What did you do when the match ups were announced for the Sox series? Have a coronary???
Beningo is out of his mind.
They are up 2 games!
Actually, the Red Sox match ups didn’t scare me at all. Thought Beckett had a chance, but we won that won.
I’m just going on what the Yanks have done with the Devil Rays this year.
“”What did you do when the match ups were announced for the Sox series? Have a coronary???”"
Its called a trap game
I am writing off Seattle because their september schedule is brutal. 3 vs. us, 3 det,4 anaheim,4 clev.
I would keep more of an eye at Detroit with their soft schedule.
I wrote off Seattle before the season started. Except for their bullpen (with Putz and Morrow…imagine if Soriano was still there), they are really that bad.
how bout “Thank You Carl Pavano, the Ed Whitson story”
Anyone tune into WFAN today? Some woman was filling in for Evan Roberts and Joe Beningo and I swear she sounded like Evan if he was a woman lol.
The trap game would be tonight. Not tomorrow afternoon.
I’ll say this. Kim Jones does great work on the radio. She has a bright future if she wants to get into that.
Well, the books a good idea, just like signing Carl Pavano was. It shows a lot of promise and has a chance for success.
But there will probably be some delays. Some people will give up on it, but others will stand strong and argue that the book will soon hit the shelfs and change the look of bookstores everywhere.
Sadly though, the book will only have 1 chapter, and it’ll be pretty ugly to look at..
Peter:
Here’s you subtitle – “An inside guide on how to make $40M without even trying”
o.k. I was off by a little lol.
this week’s espn rankings are Angels, Red Sox, Indians, Padres, Yankees, Detroit.
And to add insult to injury, the Mets dropped from #2 and are sandwiched between #8 Phillies and #10 Cubs.
Can people please stop saying that Proctor hit Youk in the head with a pitch. He threw it up and in and it missed him. It was a ball four which is why he was awarded first base. Everyone and their mother is saying that he was hit, including Youk himself. The Redsox need to grow up.
Peter surely you jest? Why bother even thinking about Him?
Peter I really appreciate the way you keep us united in the blog. I’t's the best blog around. Pride Power Passion!!!!!! YANKEES!
Mel: Talk about insult to injury: Brewers are all the way down to 22!!
I think there is a simple answer as to why the Mets aren’t getting ripped. The Mets and Yankees are graded on two seperate curves among the NY Sports Media. Especially from the major columnists in the city.
Who can forget Lupica’s, “Its a Mets Town” column in June. Funny, he hasn’t filed an “amendment” to that column since that time and still rips the Yankees every chance he gets.
How much grief has Omar Minaya gotten in this city? Yet, Brian Cashman gets ripped all the time by the Lupica’s/Maddon’s, et al re: his moves.
The Mets have always gotten more favorable treatment among these types than the Yankees. Just the way it is.
Even if the Mets fall short, the criticism will be muted. It will be excuse laden. “No Pedro”, “injuries”, etc.
They will never do a complete rip job on Willie Randolph and Omar Minaya. Never will happen.
I think we’ll win two out of three vs. TB, however I am concerned about tonight. Hughes has not impressed much lately and TB can hit and run the bases as well as any team. If we do win tonight it will be like a 10-7 game.
Steve,
Thanks for clarifying. I remember him getting buzzed (really buzzed, no like yesterday) but don’t remember him actually getting hit in the head. Can you imagine the brawl and the news for days if that happened. Apparently he learned a new word in his GED class: hy-per-bo-le.
Looking forward to the Pavano book.
Who’s gonna publish it… DC or Marvel?
Steve M: Agreed. When Proctor threw behind someone on the Mariners (Bloomquist?) he did it after he had already gotten 1 outs and on the 1st pitch. Youk was up before Ortiz and Manny. There is NO reason to put somoene on before those two, and he had already worked the count a bit. It was a pitch that had gotten away from him. And Proctor owns up to it when it’s intentional.
Still not sure what to think of Joba though. He’s got amazing command…. Maybe it got away from him once. But twice?
Rockin’ Rich: I’m a DC girl….
Rebecca,
Yeah and guess who also plummeted? The Mariners. I hope they suck big time because it’s one more example of why Steve Phillips is a moron.
Contrary to the numbers, I think both of Hughes’ last 2 starts have been quality.
The one against the Angels he only really gave up 3 runs and then Viz gave up the other 2 with 2 on and one out. Not to mention that Hughes only gave up the first 3 because Mathews rattled him and he walked 2 consecuative batters after the double.
As for the Detroit game, he only gave up 4 hits from what I remember, he just didn’t pitch very smart with runners on and he ended up giving up 3 home runs (even though the Granderson one was dumb luck and I was sure it was going to be foul when he hit it).
Basically, I’m not worried at all about him, I think he just needs to work on his pitch selection and work on staying calm and slowing down.
Pete, pay sites suck. Please don’t give them any linkage.
I’m not predicting a sweep (of course I wish for the best), but I say Hughes does good against the Rays. He needs to pitch to contact. If he starts walking those speedsters he’s in trouble. Jackson is worrisome, he shut us down last time. What are the chances of him pitching out of his mind 2 games in a row? O.k. don’t answer that, but pitching at the Trop and pitching at the Monument are two different stories. Of course, I’m not worried about Andy.
Yah, I wish just once that Steve Phillips would admit being wrong about something.. That would be the right thing to do.
Yeah I agree with you Andrea about jobas great control, but hearing him talk he just doesn’t seem like that kind of kid..ya know? The thing that worries me which was pointed out over at baseballmusings.com was that maybe he is hurt. He could’ve hurt his arm when he came back into the ninth. Also, even in the 8th inning his command wasn’t working.
Rebecca: Me, too, er GUY!
But in all honesty, they both kind of suck these days.
This is an important start for Phil Hughes. Plainly put, he has to pitch better than he has since his return.
The Yankees must be concerned because they dispatched Dave Eiland, his pitching coach the past 3 minor league seasons to NY for the rest of the season. He’s not just here for Kennedy. If he was, they wouldn’t have named Gil Patterson the pitching coach at Scranton for the rest of the season.
Eiland is staying in NY for the rest of the season and has worked with Hughes longer than any current Yankee coach.
Everyone assumes Kennedy’s spot in the rotation will go back to Mussina shortly. However, if Kennedy pitches well and Hughes continues to struggle, Moose may end up with Hughes’ slot in the rotation.
The Yankees have shown they aren’t concerned with hurting feelings. They are in it to win it. Nobody’s job is safe. You have to perform.
If Hughes doesn’t begin to string together some solid performances, his stay in the rotation may be a short one.
This is an important series. The Yankees need to dominate these bad teams the rest of the way. They are still under .500 on the road and have struggled in road series all season. That places greater emphasis on every home game. They have to win as many of them as possible, starting tonight.
Nine series remain in the season. Win 8 of them, and keep all losing streaks to one in a row, they go to the playoffs.
“Jackson was good last time out but worried about him???”
Well, I am worried about him. As I said last night, the Edwin Jackson of July and August has been a completely different pitcher than at any other time in his MLB career. The guy was once considered the jewel of the Dodger Farm system and was one of the top pitching prospects in the game. He has immense talent and is finally putting it togeather. Other than that this series should be a walk in the park.
I’m assuming the book will have maybe 2 pages of content followed by 40 blanks and will carry a $499.99 price point right Pete?
Yikes! “does well”. Missed GED classes this week to watch the series.
Law on what the Yankees should do with Mussina, “Well, if he was a horse, they’d shoot him.”
Oh and it will have 17 different opinions inside the book jacket as well.
Mel,
I don’t think the blog condones cruelty to horses.
SJ44,
Hughes is pitching strangely right now.. Hes giving up runs, but in his last 5 starts batters are hitting only .231 Off him, which is pretty good considering.
He’s just got to get those HR’s and walks down…
SJ,
You’re apparent hatred for Hughes is unfounded and annoying. Find me another 21 year old rookie starting pitcher putting up the peripheral numbers he is (Hint: There’s only one and he too is considered one of the top pitching prospects in baseball). I thought you were an intelligent guy, but in fact you’re just a reactionary idiot like 99% of baseball “fans”.
No one hates Hughes more than SJ44.
It’s becoming comical.
Steve M: I actually wasn’t watching: I had to work, and my boss unfortunately hovers over me, so I could only listen with headphones. So I had only John Sterling’s word to go on. Did he look hurt? that would be SO disappointing!
And anyone who is expected domination from Kennedy is in for a shocker. He has an 88 mph fastball, average curve, and above average change up. That’s not a recipe for big time success in the bigs, so I’m expecting a lot of people who are buying into his hype will be disappointed.
and what’s the story on Britton?
Yeah, let’s tear apart a 21 yr old rookie 5th starter who has only dominated every level he was at and has had some great outings with a few bad pitches.
Sounds like a great plan!
Yeah, Hughes! You stink! Damn your great stuff and ability. You should be firing off no hitters every time out!
“This series has SWEEP written ALL over it. Hughes to improve, Kennedy to WOW and Andy to bring the HAMMER down ! WIth Manny out, we can ride into Boston either with the division lead already OR have it IN HAND on our way out ! GO YANKEES !!”
Huh?
“Everyone assumes Kennedy’s spot in the rotation will go back to Mussina shortly. However, if Kennedy pitches well and Hughes continues to struggle, Moose may end up with Hughes’ slot in the rotation.”
interesting thought. you really don’t like hughes sj
Adam,
Hes always been considered a #3-#5 prospect. There are people who believe he has #1 or #2 ability as far as his control goes.
I really don’t know enough about him to judge either way, but, the Yankees obvousily see something and picked him over guys like Wright, Desavlo, etc
dontfirecash
August 31st, 2007 at 2:27 pm
“Jackson was good last time out but worried about him???�
Well, I am worried about him. As I said last night, the Edwin Jackson of July and August has been a completely different pitcher than at any other time in his MLB career. The guy was once considered the jewel of the Dodger Farm system and was one of the top pitching prospects in the game. He has immense talent and is finally putting it togeather. Other than that this series should be a walk in the park.
I’ll ask again.
If you are worried about Jackson you must have had night sweats thinking about Dice K, Beckett, and Schilling. How did you survive????
If we bring the sticks like we should against this triple A pitching staff, Hughes and Kennedy won’t have to be super.
4 runs in 7 should be enough.
“I really don’t know enough about him to judge either way, but, the Yankees obvousily see something and picked him over guys like Wright, Desavlo, etc”
What they see is that Wright, DeSalvo, and Clippard have already failed in the majors and really were just overhyped prospects with crappy stuff and decent MILB stats. Kennedy is better than them, but he’s no where near the level of Hughes and Chamberlain.
You really need to get a life if you are going to bash Hughes here.
He’s our 4th starter!
Name 3 better 4th starters in all of baseball right now.
What rookie isn’t going to go thru a tough time or two in a game? You see that Det game? After that 3rd homer when he set down baseballs 2nd best lineup?
Get your priorities in line.
I don’t have a hatred for Hughes. Your use of stats, to justify average to below average performances, is equally annoying.
Sorry, you give up 5 runs in your first 3 innings of work, that’s a bad start. “Periphrals” aside.
If they can pull a borderline HOF out of the rotation, they can do the same with a rookie.
I don’t hate Phil Hughes. Far from it. In fact, I have stated many times, I feel badly for him because he’s lost a lot, conditioning-wise, this year and is trying to make it up on the fly. Tough to do.
However, at this time of the year, if you are in the rotation of a team trying to make the playoffs, you are going to be graded on a tough scale. Its just the way it is.
Its more than just reading stats. Its actually watching the games. You can’t put your team in a 3-5 run early in games, which he has been doing lately, and then that’s a good start. It isn’t.
Obviously, the Yankees don’t think he’s been great. If they did, Dave Eiland wouldn’t be here.
Critiquing someone’s performance, and not gushing over everything, doesn’t constitute “hating” someone.
Adam,
Well I don’t think anyone is saying that… T-Clip came up with low-velocity and low-walk rates like Kennedy, and didn’t do so hot..
But people seem to agree that Kennedy brings something more to the table then T-Clip.
Even Joba was raving about him.. Thats got to at least make you feel pretty good about his chances of preforming decently.
A lot of pitchers who haven’t been called 1 or 2 type starters have been really, really successful.
It’s about locating, changing speeds and moving eye levels.
It’s pitching. You don’t need 100mph Joba like heat to win.
Kennedy doesn’t have to pitch like a 1. He just has to give 100 quality pitches and give them a chance to win.
Kennedy can crank his fastball up to 93 when necessary. His change is an above average pitch and his curve has above average potential. What the hell does being a number four or five starter mean anyways?
Pete
I Know Carl Pavano, Carl Pavano is a friend of mine and believe me your NO CARL PAVANO.
Way to spin it SJ44.
You have been anti Hughes now for a month.
I remember you being the same fella who called the Yankees done in May and they should rebuild.
You taking that back?
I am not bashing Hughes or hate him. Its just critiquing his performances.
If some of you think the radar gun is all you need to evaluate a pitcher, you need to take your heads out of the stat sheets and watch the games.
Phil Hughes has the potential to be a very good pitcher down the line. So far, the results, all we have to go on NOW, have been mixed.
That’s not HATING on him, its a fact.
Unless, of course, you think 2-2, 5.35 ERA, no home wins, are “great”. Then, there is nothing to talk about.
Chris Upper East,
I don’t sleep until the baseball season is over.
SJ, I take it one step further than Mussina possibly taking gover for Hughes. I actually think that if Kennedy and Hughes keep pitching like they have been recently, Kennedy could be the pitcher starting game 4 of a potential ALDS. Hughes would join Joba in the pen. Funny that we now have a mini-Roger in Joba and a mini-Moose in Kennedy.
SJ44,
I for one wasn’t trying to defend Hughes or give him a free pass. He hasn’t been pitching well.
My point by showing the BA agaisint him, was to show that he obvouisly has the ability to keep hitters off balance and get them out.
And, if you look at his history in the minors, and the lack of HRs hit off him, I think it’s only fair to assume that he can figure out how to keep the ball in the park to some degree.
“It’s more than reading stats, it’s watching games.”
Murray Chass? Welcome!
Any anti-Hughes diatribes should be laughed out of the room.
But there are some loony Yank fans out there. The same ones who boo’d Mariano.
Hughes is the face of mediocrity.
That’s understandable, since this has been somewhat a lost year for him. Let’s hope he’ll rebound nicely in 2008.
Now we got people putting Kennedy in Game 4 of the ALCS.
The comedy never slows down.
Can he start one game first please?
At this point in the season, Hughes’ age and inexperience can’t be an excuse “Find me another 21-year-old pitcher who…” is May-June talk. Right now, if you start a game for the Yankees, you need to get the team a win. Giving up 4 runs in 5 innings isn’t okay because he’s only 21. Win. Now. There’s no room for error.
My take on the situation is that SJ was just saying Hughes hasn’t been very good THIS year, which is hard to argue with. I am pretty sure he realizes his potential down the road.
throw out that almost no-hitter and his era rises again…sj has a point, yes hes young, but hes in this rotation he has to produce
Hughes. The youngest player in the major leagues.
You read that right.
Sorry if you expect him to be lights out every start because it ain’t happening.
Even Santana isn’t.
So relax.
So, who’s got predictions for this weekends series?
Andy,
Isn’t Justin Upton 19?
Ok SJ44.
Lets replace Hughes with Igawa.
You got it!!
A bunch of knee jerk bums here.
Its not “spinning” anything.
Answer me this. They pulled Mike Mussina from the rotation because of poor performances. If Hughes has poor performances, and Kennedy pitches well (just using this as an example), do you think they would pull Kennedy out of the rotation, put Moose back in, and keep Hughes in the rotation, even if he is pitching poorly?
That’s the point I am making.
I don’t hate Phil Hughes. Far from it. I do think its comical how some of you spin his bad outings, using phony stats to justify them, while ripping others to shreds.
I am not expecing HOF starts from Hughes. He just has to do a better job, especially early in games, of keeping the team in the game.
I hope he does great. I really do. But, its not out of line to be concerned it may be too much, too soon for him. Especially after missing so much time with his injuries next year.
Its not spin, its an opinion. That’s all it is.
“Unless, of course, you think 2-2, 5.35 ERA, no home wins, are “greatâ€?. Then, there is nothing to talk about.”
If you think any of those numbers are important or relevant when predicting Phil’s future then you’re a moron.
Dman77,
God told me this morning that the Yanks are going to sweep. The game against Edwin is going to be tough; luckily he can’t pitch nine innings and the TB bullpen has to make an appearance.
God forbid if Joba gives up a run or two.
You people want to send him down to???
I’d rather see Hughes out there every 5th day than Mussina or Igawa or White or Desalvo.
In theory SJ is correct, 3 pitchers for 2 spots.
While it’s scary to think that 2 rookies could round out the rotation is it any scarier than thinking that Moose could take one of those spots? I like Moose, feel for him right now, but his ERA for his last 4 starts was astronomical. 16 or 17? The Yankees don’t have the luxury of time or games to give up so that Moose can get back on track. Worse, it’s demoralizing when the offense dreads going out on days that you pitch (o.k. I’m assuming that, but realistically you don’t think they’re pressured to give copious amounts of run supports when he pitches?) And it adversely affects a bullpen that doesn’t even have a long reliever in it.
In another day and age, Moose would’ve taken that slot no matter how he was pitching. But there’s a different regime in Yankeeland. They’re going to live and die with this new merit system. So yes, Moose and Kennedy could take those spots if Hughes falters, but he’d have to really, really fall flat on his face to have that happen.
Gota love that D-Ray bullpen =]
Hughes does not get a pass bc hes the youngest kid out there, he has to produce hes up here for a reason.
“using phony stats to justify them”
His K/9 and BB/9 are promising for a 21 year old rookie pitcher. Those aren’t phony stats, those are THE stats you should be looking at when judging a pitcher. The other important stat, his HR/9, is too high, but I think there is a very good chance given his MILB history that it will decrease. He’s still very much on the path of becoming a great MLB pitcher.
How can you even compare Moose’s last 3 outings with any of Hughes’???
That is just a terrible comparison.
Hughes has kept the Yanks in every game hes pitched.
With high K rates and showing a lot of stuff.
You keep going on about how they replaced Mussina. No. Mussina replaced himself.
He was shot.
Hughes hasn’t got shelled. He hasn’t been blown out.
So stop spinning it like hes a bum.
Joe Torre is also writing a book, It`s a must read for all Baseball Aficionados.It`s part of a series on Winning Baseball to be published by the Sporting News.
The title is “The Art of Managing a Bullpen” It should be a best seller, I have seen the proofs and it`s an easy read.
I love it how people on this blog keep saying “wait til Joba gives up a run.” Like there is going to be some sort of massive backlash against Joba because he gave up a run. I don’t think there is any Yankee fan on the planet who is stupid enough to think that Joba isn’t going to allow an earned run in his career.
I think it’s a pretty safe bet that Hughes will not lose his spot the rest of the season.
It’s been fairly obvious he would need to be Moose 2 for that to happen and it’s not happening anytime soon.
Anyone with half a brain could see how he recovered and regained his composure after the Thames dinger.
That was pitching.
God help us for the people who want Igawa in there over Hughes.
Apparently they havent watched any games this year.
Hughes isn’t the youngest player. He is probably the youngest SP in the Majors but thre are people under 21 starting now. We just played against Cameron Maybin, the LF for the Tigers, and he’s 20.
Eric,
The only person being “kneejerk” in the thread is you.
Calm down, take a deep breath, and don’t worry. Nobody is looking to banish Phil Hughes to Siberia.
However, he has to pitch better. I think we can all agree on that.
I, more than anybody here, recoginize his potential. However, in case you haven’t realized it, the Yankees are in a pennant race.
If you are in the rotation, you have to pitch well to stay in. Hopefully, he does so.
However, to think he is locked into the rotation no matter how poorly he pitches, my entire point in this thread, is foolhardy at best, given what the Yankees have done with Mussina and some of the other moves they have made to upgrade the team.
My biggest fear is that if Joba struggles a bit as a starter next year there will be an uproar to move him back to the bullpen and waste him as a setup man.
Ansky,
you asked for it.
Ansky,
you asked for it.
Not to make excuses but ..
Phil Hughes allowed 6 base runners against Detroit, one of them on error. 5 of them scored. What are the chances of that happening. It is definitely not a bad outing. Not a good one but not a bad one either. If he allows just 5 base runners over 6 IP every ball game he pitches, I can not complain. The runs he gives up will vary from 0-5.
Against Angels, even though they were scored otherwise, 2 runs scored on error by Phil on a low throw from Andy at first base. It would have been the 3rd out. Viz allowed two other runs to score. That is a poor fielding performance by Hughes/Phillips. Not a poor pitching performance.
I adont mean to say Phil has been great. He has been good enough. A little unlucky but good enough. I am not worried abt him.
The high expections come from the minor league dominance that Kennedy has shown. His numbers were actually better than Chamberlains this year. You dont have to throw 100 to succeed. He has succeeded in every level he’s been at. We dont need him to be the ace of the staff, just 6 innings 4 runs(which is dueable) will by fine.
The guys that were called up earlier had control problems without a plus fastball and didnt have a sub 2 e.r.a.
With that I prdict 6inn 2 runs and he keeps his spot in the rotation. NO LONGER UNDER THE RADAR.
Hughes won’t lose his spot..
Moose has been giving up a ton of hits. Hes not fooling anybody..
Hughes hasn’t been giving up a ton of hits.. Batters are hitting .231 agasitn him, which is very good.. It’s just the longball thats hurting him and the team.
I’m no baseball expert, but I think it’s easier to teach a kid to keep the ball in the park, then it is to teach a veteran to throw the ball faster and get fewer hits..
Don’t you people know by now that after tonights game when Hughes goes 7 and lets up 1 run that SJ44 will be on here tomorrow reserving his spot in Cooperstown and saying he’s the best pitcher under 30???
Have you not been reading this blog this year??
He was the guy saying DFA Vizcaino for a month and now he’s in his fan club.
The tide will turn quickly.
Dman77,
Right on. Hughes main problem has been his affinity for the longball which is in start contrast to his minor league career.
Just for the record Sj44
Who do you want to replace Hughes with?
Igawa or DeSalvo?
You do win King of the Knee Jerks award.
stark*
The league is really torching that Hughes kid.
What are they hitting?
230?
Someone replace him quick.
From a scouting report on Kennedy that came out yesterday:
“So now, before we go projecting stardom, let’s do a quick exercise based on what we know. Close your eyes, and try to think of every starting pitcher in the big leagues. Now think of every good right-hander who is six-foot or under and sits in the upper 80s. Done with your list? It’s not a long one, is it? In fact, it’s probably at zero, unless you count guys like Maddux who actually did sit consistently in the low 90s during his peak years.
Kennedy is pretty much the poster child for the kind of player who can put up ridiculous numbers in the minor leagues, but when it comes to the majors, he’s not as good. This is not a rip job on Kennedy by any means whatsoever. He’s a very good prospect, profiling as a solid number three or four starter in the big leagues for a long time. Those players are remarkably valuable (just look at last winter’s free agent market for evidence). But unlike Chamberlain, Yankees fans shouldn’t be expecting greatness from him, either now or in the future.”
godhelpus,
Which is probably due to his velocity being down, but I think we’ll see that going up. I actually think they’ve told him they’d rather see him throwing a few MPH under what he can do.. I think they still want to see him slowly build up to throwing as fast as hes capeable..
Put Moose back in with his 20 ERA.
I love being down 7-1 after 2 innings every start.
It’s more challenging.
LOL.
I don’t think sj44 was beating up on Phil Hughes.
The fact is that Phil was learning to throw a changeup this year in the minors and would have benefited from a full season in AAA. He was brought up because the Yanks were in dire straights. Once this kid establishes a 3rd pitch and fully recovers from his injuries, he’s going to be a solid major league pitcher,
Erik NY,
Read his 2:27 p.m. post. Mussina is your answer.
Good right handers that throw 90 with a good changeup and movement.
How about Hudson?
He’s not so bad right?
Kelly,
Woohoo! Thanks for picking up on that too… .231 actually in his last 5 starts.
Thats .231 not even counting the no hitter!
I know hes not the youngest player in baseball, you know what i meant…
i love murray chase – he writes great stuff
A guy like Kennedy doesn’t make scouts drool.
he’s not 6’5
he doesn’t throw 100
he doesn’t have a 12-6 curve
he just gets out and wins games
SJ44 and Joe Morgan are also writting a book, its called: “Take your heads out of the stat sheets and watch the games”
Adam,
As you know, that was Goldstien. He obviously knows way more about prospects than me but he has been a Kennedy hater since the Yanks drafted him.
Maybin and Upton are younger. They came up in the past week or two.
He is the youngest pitcher.
SJ44 is obviously not a Hughes-hater. What he is, is focused on the same thing that all of us are – #27.
For all sorts of reasons (not excuses), Hughes’ development has been stunted this year. It is unfortunate, but it does not give him a pass. At this time of year, no one gets a pass. It’s all hands on deck, and if you falter, pass the baton.
That is not to say that Hughes isn’t going to be great some day. Clearly he will, but with the proper development. He was on his way to that in Texas, but, alas…
In the meantime, Mussina, step aside… if Hughes falters, he will be asked to step aside, and it’ll be a loud, “NEXT” coming from Cashman’s office that you hear.
I am all for developing these youngsters, and was willing to let 2007 be the “hit” year. Not any more. The Yanks are in it enough to try to win it.
That said, this is an exciting time to be Yankees’ fan. It reminds me of 1993.
I’ll trust cashman and Kennedy’s numbers and stuff over some bloggers and scouts not even affliated with a team.
Because those guys don’t have an axe to grind or anything.
Anyone unhappy that Kennedy is pitching over Moose???
SJ44,
Sorry about the comments directed at you. These ought to be more rational once the kids go back to school on Tuesday.
Hey adam,
Can the Yankees sign up right now for Ian Kennedy as a “solid number 4 starter”? What’s wrong with that??
Considering our ’08 rotation could be project to be Wang, Pettite and Chamberlain as numbers 1 -3, Cashman would love to have numbers 4 & 5 be Hughes & Kennedy.
Maybin may be the only big leaguer with braces. Kinda cute, until the game against Clemens.
If SJ44 were really focused on #27, why would he wants Mussina or Igawa in there over Hughes????
I can see people defending him but come on. The guy has bashed Hughes for weeks now.
If he can’t take the heat, he shouldn’t be making off the wall comments.
Kennedy doesn’t have to be spectacular here.
He just needs to not pull a late Aug Mussina.
Drive 4-5,
Nothing is wrong with a solid 4. Just trying to temper expectations.
as far as i see it , moose is missing one start . he hasnt been ” pulled ” form the rotation . that being said , if keneedy goes 6 innings 2 runs he will certainly get another start . but what if kenedy gets lit up ? does moose get another crack ? i dont know .
Ah the incessant attacks on SJ44. Once again proving SJ44 is the A Rod of the Lohud Yankee blog. SJ44, don’t defend yourself against some of these reactionary’s. The regular readers on this board know that your opinion changes based on recent performance, as does the opinion of all rational people.
As for the specific point today, Hughes has to pitch better. If Kennedy pitches as expected, Hughes is the weak link in the rotation. I also agree with you that Hughes is missing something since coming back from the DL. I can only assume he doesn’t have his legs under him due to the injury. I also agree with you that maybe the Yankees babied him too much in the past as opposed to the new kids.
Keep up the great posts, don’t exercise your option!
What Yankee fan doesn’t want #27?
Some of us are a little more clear headed and don’t jump off a cliff after every loss, every at bat or every bad pitch.
Some of us sane ones didn’t try to run off A-Rod last year and we’re not throwing Hughes to the wolves because he hasn’t “dominated”.
What does being a four starter mean??? Can somebody please tell me? People assign these numbers to pitchers without ever explaining what they mean.
“As for the specific point today, Hughes has to pitch better. If Kennedy pitches as expected, Hughes is the weak link in the rotation.”
Now Kennedy is better than Hughes???
Oy vey
Yaniv, Berkeley: Gally, 1) If Jaba pitches 15-20 more scoreless innings, striking out 1.5-2 batters per inning, and the Yanks make the playoffs – any chance he’d be considered in teh ROY voting? 2) What would Wang have to do in Sep to be a top Cy Young candidate? 3) Pitching staff next year for the Yanks?
Keith Law: (3:15 PM ET ) 1) That would be a travesty, given how few innings he’s thrown. 2) I don’t see Wang in the top five, although I know that his win total will attract some voters who still don’t really know much about, you know, baseball. 3) Rotation has Wang, Hughes, Joba, Pettitte, and maybe Kennedy (man, that’s young). Pen has Rivera, Edwar, maybe one other kid from the system, and some imports. I wouldn’t be shocked if they re-upped Vizcaino.
*Kennedy’s all hype. “Experts” are putting him in next year’s rotation before a single pitch in the majors”*
Godhelpus,
Most of the people who were down on Kennedy as a pick were down on him due to reduced velocity. He was sitting at about 88-89 his last season with USC. In 2005 though he was throwing 91-92 and hitting 94, which is where he’s at now. It has a very visible tail on it also. He added a two-seamer this year to go with a change, slider, and curve all of which he can throw for strikes.
I think most scouts will probably agree that the Yankees now have 2004-2005 Ian Kennedy, not the 2006 one that allowed him to fall to us in the draft.
Mel,
Maybin looks like he should be getting ready for 9th grade instead of playing in the big leagues. He’ll be a great one, I just hope he doesn’t start torturing the Yankees like he did against Clemens.
Kennedy throws harder than high 80s, but hey, don’t let the facts get in the way.
http://www.hardballtimes.com/m.....rotations/
Spot ERA GS IP
#1 Starter 3.91 28.5 181.2
#2 Starter 4.61 26.6 165.7
#3 Starter 4.74 27.6 167.5
#4 Starter 4.82 20.8 123.4
#5 Starter 4.96 20.6 126.8
#6 Starter 4.77 15.5 95.1
SJ44 should have to defend himself. He’s made some bonehead calls all year. He’s been wrong more times than Omar Minaya this year.
Or should Cano still get traded, SJ44???
I can see his loyal minions defending him to to the death but they don’t have a leg to stand on.
He can throw out any opinion he wants. But he should admit when he’s wrong.
Like he’ll be with Hughes.
It makes me so sad that everyone puts Igawa and DeSalvo in the same category. I still like DeSalvo. He makes me happy
Anyone that thinks that Kennedy throws high 80′s will be pleasantly surprised tomorrow.
Mike,
Absolutely correct. People say he was one of the best college pitchers ever in his first two seasons.
Kennedy does throw harder than the high 80′s, but thats not even the point. Hes gotten to where he is with control and ability to throw all his pitches for strikes when he needs to.
Heck, look at Schilling yesterday? He was topping out at 88MPH and he shut us down for the most part.
Mr. Abraham:
This is my first comment at your blog. I want to thank you and your employers for the many hours of entertainment you have given me and other Yankee fans this season with this blog. I have been following the Yankees since the last game of the 1962 World Series, and the initiation of this blog is one of the best off-the-field gifts Yankee fans have received. (Ranks right up there with the guy who said “Hey, Aaron, wanna play a little basketball?”) It is clear that you enjoy your work. Thanks for all you put into it.
Now, for a question to you and to other readers. Chad Jennings on the SWB Blog reported yesterday that Brower had been released. That clears a spot on the 40-man roster for Kennedy. What about waiving two of the troika of Veras-Beam-Sardinha to clear space so that Mientkiewicz and Jose Cruz, Jr. can give the Yankees whatever they have to give in September. Realistically, I think that all three will be off the 40-man roster, one way or the other, before 2008 given the need to clear space for Pavano, Sanchez, Rasner, White, Ohlendorf, and others following the 2007 season. If they are claimed on waivers, the Yankees get the waiver cash. If they are not claimed on waivers, they can all three stay at Scranton and help in the AAA playoffs. In fact, Beam would not be eligible for minor league free agency on October 15, even if he leaves the 40 man roster. I don’t know whether Torre can get useful production from Mientkiewicz or Cruz in September or not, but 30 day rentals are not expected to have plaques in Monument Park. Cruz has evidently lost his speed, but other than baserunning, if one of the Yankees four outfielders is unavailable in a key game in September, I would have more confidence in the short term in Cruz than in Kevin Thompson. I don’t see how the Yankees could lose much on these 30 day rentals.
Hughes out of the roation???
That’s FUNNY.
Maybe the post season rotation.
Adam,
Thank you. Most people never assign actual stats when discussing number so and so starter.
You don’t have to throw 100 to be successful in the majors.
Cliche of the blog: “You don’t have to trow 100 to be successful in the majors.”
Just wanted to point out that since 08/04/2007 Hughes has given up 25 hits it 28 innings, clemens has given up 20 in 23 innings. Hughes has averaged 8k per 9 while clemens has averaged 7.2k per 9. They both have averaged the same amount of walks per 9. And hughes has given up slightly more homeruns per 9 than clemens (1.61 v 1.17). All in all, Hughes hasnt pitched that bad.
Please take the ledge jumping Yank fans with a grain of salt.
They’ll be here at 11pm tonight praising Hughes and forgetting they ever questioned him.
I don’t know if Pete’s around but if you are have you heard whether or not anyone other than Kennedy’s coming up tomorrow? Or will it be more gradual as SWB/Trenton finish up their playoffs?
Eric,
I don’t believe that SJ44 is “bashing”, I believe he is assessing, and because it is negative assessing, it comes across as “bashing”.
I’m not going to get into the “Igawa/Mussina/Whitson/Pavano should be there instead of Hughes argument”, because I don’t believe that any of them would do the job as well as Hughes.
I was defending SJ44′s right to assess, without us bashing HIM. I clearly don’t agree with much that he says/has said, particularly earlier in the season. However, at crunch time, all options need to be assessed.
This has been a challenging season, but it’s much more enjoyable to be the chaser than the chased. The last thing I would want at this juncture is a 10 game lead with a boring September on the horizon.
Give me a good ol’ pennant race any day.
Gotta love it.
Kennedy pitched against my team in a non-conference game. He was as good as advertised and the predictions that he’d be a major league pitcher are about to come to fruition. BTW this was in the spring of ’06. Spring of ’06!
What would actual stats and numbers and facts mean to these people migames????
They obviously don’t look at them or use them.
Whats to assess, Bobcat?
Has Hughes been fantastic? No. Has he been solid? Solid enough. He’s 21. He improves every start.
Again the real question is who are you going to replace him with thats better?
No one.
Hah hey, some of us like facts. *thumbs up*
“This has been a challenging season, but it’s much more enjoyable to be the chaser than the chased. The last thing I would want at this juncture is a 10 game lead with a boring September on the horizon.”
I would absolutely hate to be in the playoffs right now and comfortable!
Give me a break already.
I’d rather be up 10 games than down 5.
I’d prefer to be able to sleep at night with a healthy lead in the East.
If anyone makes a case for Igawa to come back into the rotation they should be banned from posting.
It is never boring when you are in first place.
I vote for 10 game lead.
Is it in even a choice?????
What is wrong with being in 1st place in August???
Isn’t that why you play the game?
To win?
Spotting good teams a 15 game lead isn’t wise.
I don’t know what’s worse.
SJ44′s Hughes rantings or the people defending him.
HaHa, Someone asked Keith Law about Hughes’ as potential #1? He said no way, #2 tops.
So here’s my train of thought in the split second after I read that: Hughes future #2–>Joba future #1–>Joba sends (or doesn’t) send a message yesterday–> years of batters thinking “oh $h!&”–> years of domination –> yesterday’s move brilliant
Keep the wins coming against DRays.
Haha… all I’m saying is that a pennant race is exciting.
As far as Hughes is concerned, I’m one of his biggest fans, and I’ve seen him pitch over 20 times in person the past couple of years.
I whole-heartedly agree with what Torre said after his last outing.. if he’d missed a couple of bats, he’d have been fine and we’d all be raving again. He only walked one and the Tiggers didn’t miss his mistakes. It happens.
That said, this is an important start for his team tonight. I expect and hope he will be just fine.
I wasn’t the one that said 10 games back was a good thing. I’m just a fan of pennant races.
SJ,
Comparing Hughes’ “bad” starts to Mussina’s “bad” starts is comical.
Hughes’ “bad” starts since coming back.
4 2/3IP 6R
6IP 1R
5IP 2R
6 1/3IP 5R
6IP 5R
Less hits than innings pitched in there, too.
Moose’s last 3 starts
5IP 6R
1 2/3IP 7R
3 IP 6R
25 hits in 9 2/3 IP.
No comparison between the two.
Kennedy’s all hype? All the guy has done is dominate every where he has pitched….So his fast ball is in the high 80s low 90s and his curveball doesn’t bulkle anyone’s knees, there have been many pitchers with less than amazing stuff who have carved out a nice career. Moose is a good comparison. Even Pettite did not have a plus plus fastball until he met Rocket. He was a better pitcher then as well. Give me a guy who knows where each pitch is going in a tuff spot any day. This kid will be our 5th starter not our ace we will have 3 or more of those at 1-4.
SJ,
There’s a big discussion on Law’s chat about Joba vs. Hughes ht. & weight. mlb.com rosters also show that Hughes is taller and that Joba’s only 10 lbs heavier. You’ve seen them both, can you clarify?
Pete’s Pavano book should be called “Take The Money And Run.” (or limp)
Feinsetin is a GREAT writer and he always seems to have the knack for picking the right subject matter at the right time. His book on Indiana basketball is a classic. I hope Moose changes his mind but perhaps at this point after listening yesterday he himself cant even articulate how he is feeling or what this means to him.
I would imagine tonights lineups may have some changes from eysterday perhaps Molina as catcher and Phillips at first??
The book referenced above has actually already been written. Roger Angell wrote “A Pitcher’s Game: Innings with David Cone” in 2001, about Cone’s horrific 4-14 2000 season. Mike Mussina was signed as a free agent to take Cone’s spot in the rotation after that year.
We can guess all day and night about Hughes, Joba, Ian, Horn, etc…
We all have NO idea what 2008 will bring but we can agree on 1 thing….it’s gonna be fun finding out!
Anyone notice on Kepner’s blog today a reference to Clemens indicating a sore elbow after his last start, or other issue? Kepner also alludes to Mussina possibly staying sharp on the sidelines to spell the Rocket a start or two, if needed…
All signs point to a strong need for Hughes to be strong through September, and as a #4 guy in a postseason rotation. Here’s hoping he can find that lost 3-4 mph on the fastball.
ND Yank,
Good research. It’s pretty clear which one is struggling.
VOIII,
I was just kidding. The subliminal message is that if he’s all hype, why are the experts projecting him as part of next year’s YANKEE rotation when he hasn’t even thrown a pitch in the majors. Of course we all know that the 2nd or 3rd Yankee starter might be an ace in the NL.
Also heard an inetrview with Harlan Chamberlain this AM on ESPN Radio with the horrible Max Kellerman. Nothing of great interest came out of it other than Harlan has now been medically cleared to come to new York to visit his some and see a game. It was funny he said he wanted to sweep in, see his son, see the stadium and monument park and sweep out with little notice. I dont think that is going to happen he will be swarmed lol.
Gayle,
Oh absolutly. If they find him with the cameras he might be on TV more than his son.
I will bet dollars to dugnuts that by the time hughes is 23 and has been the yanks 5th starter for 2 years he will be as good as , if not better than any pitcher the same age . take it easy with hughes . let him get his work in . only time will tell .
Joba suspended 2 games by MLB – complete BS he didnt even hit the jerk.
Keith Law: (4:14 PM ET ) Thank you all for joining me for Jobachat. Please visit us again next week when we’ll continue to take questions about Joba, Joba’s stuff, Joba’s future, and Joba’s Joba.
Haha, thats from the end of todays ESPN chat. Law answered 1 question about Joba’s fastball and then was bombarded by more. Every other question for the last 45 minutes was a Joba question.
http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/.....t_id=17033
MiketheMike,
Too bad we can’t stagger the days.
*LOL WFAN WAS HILARIOUS TODAY ESPECIALLY THE OPENING HERE YOU GO GUYS IF YOUR AT WORK IT’S A GREAT LISTEN* ..
http://www.wfan.com/play_windo.....oId=978359
Joba suspended?!
UGH! Well, even still, if Joba doesn’t appeal, it would in essence only be a one game deal seeing as he can’t pitch tonight per the JRs…
Yes i know not a huge deal but why suspend the guy – you know get suspended 2 games for MAYBE ? not hitting a guy ????? It seems crazy to me and I would appeal it and reduce this to 1 day which would become a mute suspension at that point.
“Everyone assumes Kennedy’s spot in the rotation will go back to Mussina shortly. However, if Kennedy pitches well and Hughes continues to struggle, Moose may end up with Hughes’ slot in the rotation.”
This is an excellent point. Kennedy’s arrival is as much about putting a little more competition into the starting rotation as it is about giving Moose a game off. Veterans are at a huge huge advantage even when performing poorly over rookies. I think Moose will definitely make his next start in KC regardless of what we say tonight (save a no hitter or the like).
If we put up with FWorth’s antics all season, you gotta believe they will give a seasoned veteran, near hall of famer every possible chance in the world to get out of a terrible terrible funk. The plan as it stands is extra rest.
BJ
Where do you see that he is suspended?
I haven’t heard of any suspension either ?
AHAHAH Beningo is going berzerk that link is amazing.
WFAN: Joba suspended
he should of at least hit the punk
WFAN did a 20/20 update no news on Joba so IDK, I would think Pete would report this as soon as possible if it is true
Yeah WFAN is reporting it – I got it from a buddy at MLB – its public now anyways – I’m more upset now that he didnt hit the jerk.
I’d assume they will appeal, get it knocked down to 1 game and then just drop the appeal after one of his outings. in any case he’s gotta pitch 2 games in the seattle series
Michael Kay says Joba suspended for 2 games… but it fits in nicely with Joba Rules…
If the appeal is heard you then have to serve it right after. If anything they’ll appeal, have him pitch two innings at some point, then drop the appeal and have him serve it as his normal rest.
Sigh. Would there have been a suspension, or even an ejection, if (a) it was, say, Britton pitching, or (b) we were playing the Royals?
I just hope Joba doesn’t pull an Ankiel/Wholers/Knoblauch and have a complete meltdown…it seems highly unlikey given his personality.
Can’t he appeal, then pitch 2 innings before a day with no game and drop the appeal?
Let’s make the MLB eat the Joba rules!
It is BS that he is suspended!
- oh and whoever said that SJ is the A-Rod of this blog is 100% correct! I disagree with him often but I’ll never boo, it shows a lack of class!
Its critiquing people, not bashing. If you are incapable of distinguishing between the two, that’s your problem, not mine.
The same folks who argue, “who are they going to replace Hughes with (if he pitches badly) are the same people who said, “No way Mussina is pulled out of the rotation” and, “No way, it will be Kennedy”.
If we have seen anything this year its, absolute statements regarding the lineup should be taken with a grain of salt.
The Yankees have shown they will anybody out of the lineup for non-performance this year. Yes, its great to quote Moose’s last 3 starts. How about his previous 4-6 starts? Even pitching well, didn’t give Moose any breaks when it came to getting pulled for non-performance.
If it can happen to Moose, it can happen to anybody. Even Hughes. Hopefully, it won’t become an issue. Simple way for it not to be an issue is for him to pitch well.
As to “who” they would replace him (or Kennedy, for that mattter) if one doesn’t pitch well, its Moose.
If some of you think Mike Mussina will never start another game for the Yankees again, you are crazy. It will happen at some point. They aren’t just going to DFA Moose.
I don’t know where Law got that Joba is bigger than Hughes. Its not even close. Hughes is at least 3 inches taller than Joba. Hughes is a big kid. He towers over Joba, height-wise.
Believe it or not, Joba is around 230 now. I know it because it was confirmed to me by Luis Sojo when he was managing him in Tampa.
Law is way off on his height/weight assessments of Joba.
As far as the suspension, its a joke. Its what happens when the Red Sox whine to Bud. He always finds in their favor.
But, look at it this way. He serves it now, he’s back on Sunday. Its as if the “old” Joba Rules are back.
BOB WATSON CAN GO TO HELL .. STUPID PRICK !!!
how Dice K can throw in on Alex anytime he wants & was seen planning this on camera w/ Julian Tavaras and no punishment handed out, it sounds like a former ex. employee acting like a prick. Up yours Bob Watson !!!
What a joke! Suspended without a warning and without hitting the crbaby loser. Next time, he should aim for Youk’s wallet.
This is ridiculous if true. Joba clearly threw both of those pitches with the intent to send a message. He gets thrown out without a warning, which is a bit extreme but completely understandable. Suspending him on top of that speaks volumes about the immaturity of the league hierarchy. It simply makes no sense whatsoever.
The Yanks continue to get shafted by the league. Arod gets hit numerous occasions and its the Yanks who have two pitchers suspended. Completely unfair, but apparently the league holds the Yanks at a higher standard. The message is extremely dangerous as it tells other teams they can throw at us with complete impunity. Further, if the Yanks retaliate, as they clearly did here, they will pay the price without warning.
The Yanks have to shake this one off, and continue to do what Joba did the other night, repercussions be damned. If the league wont protect our players, Joba, the Rocket must step up.
What a laughing stock.
BJ
No worries. I will smash Youk’s head tonight. Watch for it.
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/press_.....8;c_id=mlb
The suspension wont hurt the Yanks like it would of if it happened to Rivera because of the “Joba Rules” and he needs 2 days off anyway. BUT the part that bothers me there were no warnings, the ball was no where near him, you have a player that overreacts about everything, is a cry baby, whines about every call and because of that he is able to get the umpires to act because of his little fit. If the same thing happened tonight with Joba against Tampa no one would even think twice that it might be on purpose. If Arod cried when he got hit in the ribs would Dike K of been thrown out of the game or even warned?? Probably not..
He will pitch 2 innings and then take the 2 days off. The important thing is that he now has instilled in the RS heads that they better not dig in. That, in itself, is worth the 2 games.
they just anounced it on espn…2 day suspension BS
wheres todays lineup?
The problem with the pitches is that they were towards the head. That is a problem…..
I’m sure if he wanted to hit him, he would have.
Joe Torre is late for his spot on the FAN – he must be yelling at that idiot BOB WATSON!
Talk about Joba Rules.. That’s the Yankee Rules. Any given situation, figure out a way to jam the Yankees.
So, basically, the MLB suspension protects the Joba Rules when Torre, Cash and co. did not.
Joba couldn’t pitch today, anyway, and with any luck we won’t need him Sunday so he’s available for two against Seattle.
Wishing Joba the best, and hoping this doesn’t get him down–if he is taking classes from Roger, though, he’s probably got an A right about now…
Buster Olney a must-read?! I’m disappointed in you, Peter. Buster Olney is so ill-informed it’s shocking. I can’t even tell you how many times I’ve heard him make a statement, either on TV or in his blog, that is just flat-out wrong (and I’m not talking about opinions, I’m talking about facts). Over the course of a week I heard him say five or six times that Hank Aaron is still the only player to have 2000 RBI in a career. This is just not true! Babe Ruth and Cap Anson both had amassed 2000 RBI before Hank Aaron was even born! The guy does no research and doesn’t know anything about baseball. Basically he’s the perfect example of why ESPN sucks. Okay, maybe that would be Steve Phillips.
I think they will appeal it and have him take the 2 games after the Seattle series.
well the other night Steve Phillips said that ian kennedy was a 24 year old rookie…2 years off buddy
Correct, Rebecca. Roger is the professor and he has able assistants in Andy and Mo. They pass on all their knowledge and experiences to the young guns only too happy to listen.
I’m thinking a t-shirt with the words “JOBA RULES” would be even more perfect now – the Sox should know not to get too comfy in the batters box when the kid is on the mound. Rotten crybabies!
You guys have should not be getting so upset at SJ44. You just have to take him for what he is…a band-wagon loving fair-weather Yankee fan. Three days ago he told us the Yankees would not make the playoffs because of their starting pitching. After the Bosox sweep he was once again on the band-wagon – just as I predicted he would be.
Here’s another prediction you can write down…when Hughes pitches well tonight and in his next start SJ44 will be his “biggest supporter.” But don’t worry…I’ll be back to remind him that three days ago he said he’d rather have Jeff Weaver down the stretch than Phil Hughes.
P.S. Did you happen to catch Weaver’s latest gem SJ44???
damon DH
jeter
abreu
arod
matsui LF
posada
giambi 1B
cano
melky
Dude. What about a T-shirt with Squirrel on front and Joba Rules on back?
For whining responses, only Pedrioa or Varitek would be equally entertaining targets as Youkilis.
I haven’t looked up the stats, but I’d feel assured enough in saying that the Sox pitching staff’s HBP stats over the past decade probably spike on NY when you sort them by opponent. Ours may spike on Boston too, but not nearly as drastic as I imagine theirs spikes on NY.
As they, and their obnoxious fans whine: “But that’s not fair, commissioner Selig … they hit us back first!�
Actually, I admit I have a few friends who are a Sox fans (otherwise good guys, they’re just handicapped in the baseball intellect dept.) and they really see nothing wrong with Phillips having to duck a high wild one. But when Joba caused Youkilis make a poo in his panties half an inning later (intended or not) it’s a legitimate reason for Sox Nation to go Taliban on NY.
We lose Joba for 2 games? OK … nice to see MLB is in synch with the Joba Rules too.
Now … someone in the last thread mentioned (sorry I forgot who) that our pitcher would get suspended for retaliating the first time a Sox pitcher hits a Yank in the upcoming Boston seres, but the first Boston pitcher would get free reign to hit one of our guys first. Sad, but this could happen. But hopefully the 2-game Joba suspension for missing Yoki is a precedent for prevention.
Would the Sox have a starter do it anyways? Maybe not. Too risky with the season on the line. They’d have a situational relief pitcher come in to do it later in the game.
I am really surprised that Joba would be suspended. It’s really shameful to bow to Pukeless’s pressure on the field and then to suspend a 21 year old for just being amped.
The next series will be a war, and of hopefully Manny will continue to impersonate Carl Pavano and just stay home.
Did anyone else notice that about 1/3 of the Kieth Law chat was Joba and Hughes related? Cashman must be smiling. I can’t wait for these guys to get it going as starters.
the red sox organization and their fans are afraid of what joba represents and they are wearing their fear on their shirtsleeves.while they are focusing on how bad big bad joba is, jeter and the yankees are focusing on winning series.
new game tonight.first game of the rest of the season. it’s going to be that way right till the end of the season.
Does anyone have the chat? I had to meet with a professor, and I don’t have insider…
Bring the squirrel to Boston after training him to climb into Youkilis’ jock strap & chew his nuts off.
“P.S. Did you happen to catch Weaver’s latest gem SJ44???”
Kevin,
Settle down buddy. Sj is allowed to be wrong. So is everyone around here including present company. I wanted Vizcaino shipped a long time ago.
I think he/she would be more than thrilled to see Hughes, Moose pitch stunningly well down the stretch.
The one thing we all have in common, I hope, is an irrational and pathologic love of this team. If Torre is allowed to be wrong as often as we believe he is, don’t you think a dedicated blogger should be too?
BJ
Yes, bring on the squirrel!!
“We lose Joba for 2 games? OK … nice to see MLB is in synch with the Joba Rules too.”
It is a big deal regardless of whether it affects Joba’s ability to pitch in any particular game. It sends a dangerous message to the league that they can hit our guys with impunity. If anything, it should send the message to the Yankee staff that they will have be even more proactive as clearly the league has abandoned them.
BJ
So where is the game post?
MLB are morons.. yeah he was throwing at Youkilis and the reason was?????????????????????
MLB is a joke from checking Francona’s jersey to this move, they are just a friggin morons…
fight the suspension.. 1 game would be sufficient and that is a joke since he was not throwing at him on purpose…..
anyone who thinks he was throwing at him is a moron.. yeah he does not walk batters so, the ball can slip out of your hand………..
“Bring the squirrel to Boston after training him to climb into Youkilis’ jock strap & chew his nuts off”.
Sounds like one of the plotlines from South Park.
It’s total bull$hit that he would get suspended. Dice K plunks Alex, Rocket hits Pedroia, Joba throws two wild pitches (so they were a bit high), and he gets suspended.
BULL$HIT!
I wonder if this is the MLB throwing Boston a bone for their royal screw-up w/ Francona’s jersey.
F******* idiots.
BTW, nothing’s been posted by Pete yet but here’s the lineup:
Damon DH
Jeter SS
Abreu RF
Rodriguez 3B
Matsui LF
Posada C
Giambi 1B
Cano 2B
Cabrera CF
I wonder about the wisdom of continuing to insert Giambi into the 1B slot. Durability questions…
MLB has to take action in protecting the biggest wusses of the league against the terror that’s Joba.
Big Johnson – ‘Proactivity’. I like that … nice way to put it.
Every time the Red Sux come to Yankee Stadium the fans should yell out WHAAAAAAAA WAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH for the whole time they are at bat.
Re: Joba. I don’t think you appeal because you don’t want to risk losing him for the Mariners series. At worst it’s a 1 game suspension since he wasn’t pitching tonight anyway and would have been questionable for tomorrow (1.1 innings). I think the suspension is a joke for 3 reasons. 1. The balls weren’t close to Youkilis. If he didn’t move, he still wouldn’t have gotten hit. 2. Joba swears it was a pitch getting away from him. 3. If you start reading into intent that’s a very slippery slope. Stinks that Matsuzaka doesn’t get a 5 game ban for actually hitting A-Rod on purpose! Just like with Toronto, a Yankee gets punished but not the opposing team.
As for the Hughes debate, he’s been serviceable imo and should not be taken out of the rotation if Kennedy is brilliant. You can deal with Mussina next year or in the off-season. Pulling Hughes is a huge mistake. Mussina is what he is. We know what he can do, and he’ll do it if/whenever he returns. There is a tangible benefit to pitching Hughes. He is part of the long term future, Mussina is not. Each start he gets is valueable experience. He’s not pitching so badly where he’s not giving the team a chance in these games. His last outing which was admittedly bad he gave up 4 hits in 6 innings.
I’d rather go down with Hughes then go down with Mussina because at least some positive comes from using Hughes. Mussina’s not a better option than Hughes. At some point you can’t keep chasing starters out, and you have to go to war with who you have.
I like that lineup. Joe is serious about winning.
I wonder if the two day suspsension was designed to conform with the joba rules. Proctor got three days; Joba only two… Perhaps this is MLB’s way of appeasing RSN without doing anything (really) to Joba. I just hope now that if the Sox throw at our guys in the next series, there is an immediate ejection, with ensuing suspension and find. MLB can then rely on the Joba precedent…