No relief for Kennedy after brilliant start
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- September
- 13
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The Yankees are carrying 14 relief pitchers these days. But they somehow ran out of good options tonight in the ninth inning.
Joba Chamberlain was resting.
Using Mariano Rivera in a tie game made no sense, especially with the Yankees having the bottom of their order due up in the 10th. I’m sure the usual suspects will say Torre should have used Rivera. But he had thrown 1.1 innings and the night before and was used in three of the first five games of the road trip.
Kyle Farnsworth was out with a stiff neck.
Luis Vizcaino had just pitched the eighth on nine days rest. There was no reason to burn him out with three days at Fenway coming up.
So Joe Torre went with his most experienced right-hander, Chris Britton. Five pitches later, it was over.
The outcome spoiled a brilliant start by Ian Kennedy, who allowed one run on one hit in seven innings. He walked four and struck out seven. In three starts he has a 1.89 ERA.
The 22-year-old didn’t take it too hard.
“It’s just the way baseball is. You pitch your butt off and sometimes you don’t get a win,â€? he said.
Torre indicated that the Yankees will try and use six starters over their remaining 16 games. There will be a lot of mixing and matching. They have not announced a rotation beyond this weekend.
Tough loss, especially with Boston and Detroit idle. But you’ll take starting a road trip 5-1 every time.
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on Thursday, September 13th, 2007 at 11:08 pm by Peter Abraham.
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Chad Jennings
Sam Borden
First things first. I’m first.
Ya, using Joba with a run lead last night probably cost us the game tonight.
I meant a four run lead…
5-1 Road trip is fine. But every game is important with only 16 games left in the season and magic number for division down to 11 games. It’s a tough loss coz they were in a good position to win that game. It’s that simple and it hurts.
Im not too upset about this loss. Using Joba last night wasnt a bad idea, you always want to get the middle game after a victory so you arent pressured in the rubber game.
Did Farnsworth hurt his neck by turning it with all the hits he’s given up this year? Tough loss but Kennedy and Vizcaino pitched well. As did Burnett and the Toronto pitchers in holding the Yankees to 1 run. But a 5-1 road trip is pretty good.
Britton, grr.. worthless.
8-1 road trip after this weekend anybody?
Is it hubris to dream of Phil Franchise, Joba the Hutt and IPK all having a golden decade in pinstripes? As some one said after the 1997 season saw the Mets “Generation K” falter “Out of three top pitching prospects: one will be pretty good, one will be another guy and one will be a flop. You never know which one will be which.”
Look it just is not our year, we cant win every year, so I tip my hat to the sox, who played better this year, and wish them luck in the playoffs
[1] So we can only go 99-63. Get over it.
[2] Our magic # to win the division remains at 22.
[3] Exactly WHO was singing the praises of Chris Britton?
anyone know the last time we won a game going into extra innings? bottom of the 9th or later? it seems like forever.
I have a question to ask. Do we have a better choice other than Chris Britton today? Ross Ohlendorf was pretty sharp in his last outing. Would that make any difference? I would like to see him get more chance to show us what he got. Any thought?
I think the last time was on July 17th against the Blue Jay. Yanks tied the score on a balk in the ninth and Cano won the game with a hit in the 10th. Wow, that was a long time ago.
It was a tough loss tonight, but it all evens out. Honestly, coming into the series, who thought that Mike Mussina would be able to outpitch Dustin McGowan? We’ll bounce back and tomorrow can be the start of another winning streak!
I was hoping for Ohlendorf in the ninth myself.
I criticize Torre a lot and think he has outlived his usefulness here, but using Britton was a reasonable move even though he hadn’t pitched in a while.
I just hope Torre doesn’t bury him because of this outing.
It was a single up the middle, a stolen base, and another single up the lead. He didn’t hold the lead, but that was hardly what I would call being hit hard. It happens.
All in all, what a quick and deflating way to lose a game.
Ohlendorf would of been a great move.Britton has not been sharp in his last game. He is very overweight he needs to get in shape.
I can’t fault Torre for bringing Britton in either. He was low on options. We all know what would have happened if Brian Bruney was in. The winning run would have scored via walk more than likely!
I an’t kill Torre’s moves tonight. Nothing terrible. Not having Farnsworth hurt a lot. He always seems to get stiff backs and other ailments. Totally unreliable even though he can be outstanding at times.
Using Edwar for two innings a few days ago directly effected this game. he was unavailable. Using Joba for two innings yesterday meant you couldn’t stretch Viz out tonight since you need him tomorrow. Basically, Torre’s culpability in tonight’s loss comes from his bullpen mismanagement the past two days. Given what he had tonight, he did okay.
I think Kyle’s great, but his pay needs to be docked when he’s “unavailable”. This isn’t the first time we’ve had to work around him and ended up losing a game.
Well, it was a brilliant start by IPK
If this is what the future holds, sign me up.
“I think Kyle’s great, but his pay needs to be docked when he’s ‘unavailable.’”
Given the terms of the CBA and the standard players contract, as well as the power of the MLBPA, it would never stand.
Ohlendorf coming in the game may have looked good on paper, but he’s only made one appearance in the big leagues. Pitching in the bottom of the 9th in a tie game is a lot for a kid to handle. It’s probably better off for Ohlendorf and the Yankees to just get him into games and put him into high pressure situations later. Once he gets more outings under his belt, he’ll be more equipped to handle a situation like tonight.
*Ladies & Gentlemen, the Yankees have found their third pitcher for the playoffs*
Also, the Yankee pitching has been SHARP lately. The offense the last two nights has sputtered a little, but our pitching was the chink in our armor. Giving up 2 runs? I’m sure the Yankees would take that 6 days a week.
whoa,
yeah, but it would be nice of him to sort of earn that $4M.
Yankee pitching has been very sharp. It’s been our achilles’ heel and criticism all year long. I’m sure Joe & the gang would take giving up 2 runs 6 days a week.
Actually using Mariano would make PERFECT sense, especially with the only three legit hitters in the Toronto lineup coming up. Why? Because if you give up a run, the game is over. The mentality shouldn’t be “Let’s wait until we get a lead, so we can validate a silly statistic (the save).” It should be to keep the other team off the board as long as possible. To do that, you should use your best pitcher available.
Yes, the Yankees had the bottom of the lineup coming up, but they also had Giambi and Posada (not quite bottom-of-the-order guys, IMO) waiting in the wings to pinch hit. Of course, had Joe recognized this earlier, he might have been in a position to use Mariano for a save, instead of having him watch a loss from the bullpen.
Thanks guys. Thanks for the inputs. It is not easy to swallow this one lost but we have to move on. At least now we all learn how good Ian Kennedy is and what is he made of.
Even though Yankees did not sweep two series in a row, they still end a good note by taking 5-1. Yankees should just keep playing hard and keep playing Yankees baseball. Wining one game at a time to reach post season. This weekend series in Boston is not out of reach. It will be a great series. If Yankees offense can connect hits together to produce runs at right time, I say they can still nail the series. I am cheering Yankees to sweep Boston this weekend. Let’s go Yankees.
With his stellar performance, Kennedy should really have had the win.
to J-Dawg,
“We’ll bounce back and tomorrow can be the start of another winning streak!”
I think Yankees will and I am ready for it this weekend!
“Ohlendorf coming in the game may have looked good on paper, but he’s only made one appearance in the big leagues. Pitching in the bottom of the 9th in a tie game is a lot for a kid to handle. It’s probably better off for Ohlendorf and the Yankees to just get him into games and put him into high pressure situations later. Once he gets more outings under his belt, he’ll be more equipped to handle a situation like tonight.”
I got the point. Good thing I am not a baseball coach at any level.
Off-topic:
Former Yankee Mel Hall faces life in prison
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c.....index.html
“Using Mariano Rivera in a tie game made no sense, especially with the Yankees having the bottom of their order due up in the 10th.”
Too bad we never made it to the 10th because Britton lost the game. Does this mean that it was better to concede the game by using Britton than play to win by using Rivera?
Anyone who has followed the Yankees since 2003 should know that it always makes sense to use Rivera in a tied road game in the bottom of the ninth – because a run loses the game.
It amazes me that anyone could still dismiss the thought of using Rivera in such a situation as nonsensical.
Kennedy pitched a great game. We lost because it’s baseball; not because of some certain pitcher or pitchers weren’t used. There weren’t many people available and Joe went with Britton. He isn’t exactly a bum. It’s baseball. Let it go.
Kennedy pitched a great game. We lost because it’s baseball; not because of some certain pitcher or pitchers weren’t used. There weren’t many people available and Joe went with Britton. He isn’t exactly a bum. It’s baseball. Let it go.
To E-ROC,
You are definitely right! I just had a little doubt and the people here like J-Dwag kindly helped me out with great reasonings and points. Thanks for the advice though. It is nice to have lots people who knows baseball here to help out people like me with less knowledge of baseball. I have learned a lot in the past just reading through the posts.
Yanks lost the game because Arod came back to earth and didn’t deliver in a couple of key at bats with runners in scoring position. It happens, just wish he didn’t strike out so we had a chance to make something happen.
Last night was the first time I was able to watch IPK pitch. He was impressive, to say the least. The Yankees’ pitching future certainly looks bright. And while I’m impressed with the actual “stuff” and talent these new kids bring, I’m even more impressed with their major-league attitudes, for lack of a better word. These guys pitch like they belong. As they well should.
Too bad for the loss, but after the end of the top of the ninth it didn’t have the look of victory. I thought that Matsui’s hard liner being caught back in the earlier inning was the play of the game. He hit it hard, and 2 runs would have scored. Ah, well, they do say it’s a game of inches.
Plus, AJ Burnett brought his A-plus game.
Why would you use Mariano last night, in a tie game on the road, with the Red Sox series coming up? It would have been foolish to have burned Mariano last night.
They aren’t going to win every game. If Britton did the job, or they hit a little bit, nobody complains.
You can’t second guess every single move. Sometimes, things just don’t break right in a game. It happens.
They won another series and are 5-1 to start the roadtrip. For a team that began the roadtrip under .500 for the season, I’d say that’s pretty good.
That was an upsetting loss. I don’t get Torre. We have no games to spare. We were just screwed two games in a row where we thought that spoiler team might have beaten Boston and given us an opportunity to trim the division lead but we all know what happened there. Then today yesterday we get to trim it on our own to 4 1/2 and head to Boston red hot and Torre decides to sit Posada and then brings in that Britton fella’.
Reason why we are where we are is due mainly to the fact that our middle relief has sucked. We have gotten rid of a few faces, but with the larger roster I have seen a few recalled and I am out of myself.
Right now we have to leave it all on the field and play with what we know has been approved. I rather lose an important game with Mariano or Joba then with a Britton.
Joba wasn’t available. You can’t play Posada every day and you don’t burn Mo in last nights game when you need him fresh for the Red Sox series.
Why is that so hard to understand? If you are depending on the Tampa Bay Devil Rays for “help”, you are looking in the wrong place.
They blew another 7-1 lead last night to the Mariners and lost 8-7.
They have 3 games coming up with the Red Sox and they don’t need help from anybody. They just need to win their games.
If they do that, they make the East interesting. If they don’t, then you focus on the WC.
Either way, Torre didn’t cost them the game last night. They only have had 10 hits the last two games. That hurt them more than any lineup or pitching changes.
WHY ARE FATSO & AIRHEAD ALWAYS KNOCKING WANG. I GET SO SICK OF AIRHEAD I CAN’T LISTEN & WHEN FATBOY JOINS HIM IT’S EVEN MORE SICK. ISN’T IT TIME FOR THEM TO MOVE ON OR AT LEAST MOVE TO SAN FRAN?
Filthy: I think it’s just time to turn the dial! If they’re talking and nobody is listening are they really saying anything?
I agree with SJ. You can’t watch this team score only 1 run over 9 innings and then blame Torre for the loss because the opposing team managed to score 2 runs over 9.
Torre’s done a great job this year just keeping the team together to make a run. (They could have finished 20 games out the way things were going.) Torre not only kept the team together for a possible run, but the team in fact MADE THE RUN. They’re 4 games up in the loss column with 16 to play.
You folks were so ga ga over Chris Britton. I don’t think so.
I don’t agree with all the Torre criticism here. Britton didn’t do his job, period.
Where are all the posters who were screaming for this guy for weeks before he got called up? The first time I saw him was after he came up and I couldn’t believe how fat he was.
So what’s the deal is he out of shape, or was this just one bad outing? From what I’ve seen so far. I’m not impressed.
Ohlendorf is another story. That guy has nice stuff.
I would like to see him get some more use before (hopefully) they get to the postseason.
I also think Torre’s moves were fine. Going to Britton or Rivera in the bottom of the ninth was a toss-up. It just bothers me when the thought of going to Rivera in a sudden-death situation on the road is discarded as crazy. It would have been a defensible move.
I was among the people calling for Britton, and what really doesn’t make sense is burying him based on last night. He had not pitched in 5 days. He was ineffective but not hit hard.
The guy has pitched 11 innings as a Yankee, most of them good. He was excellent in the minors and had success on the Orioles last year. But he has a bad outing and suddenly everyone who wanted him on the team was stupid. Please.
Wow, after reading the nomaas take on last night’s loss, i kind of expected tons of comments here agreeing and bashing Torre.
Good to see a lot of sensible posters on this blog. SJ said it right, no need to burn out Mo before a boston series…
Doesn’t Bruney have more “experience” than Britton?
If I’m not mistaken, Chris Britton was the 8th inning guy for the Orioles all year last year. He has experience.
Single up the middle. Stolen Base. Single up the middle. It’s happened to every single reliever on the Yankees roster, and may even happen to Joba before the season is done.
While I normally am with NoMaas on their “Torre Losses,” I’d rather have Rivera available today anything else.
We “may” have found our third pitcher in IPK. Best case scenario is still Clemens and Mussina getting it together in time for the playoffs, and not having to thrust Hughes and IPK into that situation this year.
Problem I have was Torre using Joba for 2 innings 2 days ago, thereby guaranteeing only 1 appearance against Boston in a big STATEMENT series. Saving Mariano was SMART so he can hopefully pitch 2 or 3 times this weekend. The Boston games are far more important on several levels than not giving us the best chance to have won the Toronto game.
Farnsworth has actually pitched great in 10 of last 11 appearances. Only blemish was 2 run homer to Youkaliss. Some were even at times of games when it matterd, although still not sure if I trust him when the pressure is on, although would have loved to see him yesterday instead of Britton. Go Yanks (& Indians, don’t want aany part of LAA as they own us)
i do agree with most of nomaas ‘torre losses’, with the exception of this one. they seem to quick to jump on torre over there and have had to bite their tongue without knowing the whole story on several occasions. i go there to laugh at the pictures mostly.
Is the Chris Britton lovefest over?
Is the Chris Britton lovefest over? NO
What ever happened to Ron Villone? Isn’t he gonna be the lefty out of the pen in the playoffs? Shouldn’t he get some innings since he’s off the DL now? If he was available, I think he should have pitched the 9th.