The Sunday links
-
- October
- 7
Once again, the Yankees turn to Roger Clemens to save their season.
Columnist Rick Carpiniello has seen comebacks before and has faith it can happen again.
The Indians believe in Jake Westbrook. Brian Heyman has that story.
The Sunday Baseball notes focuses on the potential for big changes if the Yankes lose in the first round.
This entry was posted
on Sunday, October 7th, 2007 at 10:23 am by Peter Abraham.
You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed.
Share and Enjoy: 
| 
Print This Post
| 
Email This Post
Peter Abraham
If the Mets arem’t firing Randolph, the Yanks definitely shouldn’t fire Torre. If your team can’t play in the postseason, I guess some of the blame has to fall on the manager, but what Joe did this year was fantastic. Without him the Yankees would never have seen the playoffs this year. Joe was huge. But. . . the Yankees are gonna come back and win the World Series so it won’t matter. I hope A-Rod, Posada, Mo, and Cashman stay too.
Maybe I should change my moniker. I quote the Curt VonSchilling from his press conference yesterday,
“Great example is you look at what Alex (Rodriguez) has done this year in New York. One of the single best seasons in the history of the game. And the media there couldn’t wait, couldn’t wait for six at-bats. He’s 0-for-6. They (the Yankees) had three hits (Friday). The focal [point] of the New York media is that Alex has screwed it up again. We know as players that’s not how it works. But there’s a perception in October that from a player’s perspective, that’s different than [the media’s].”
Must read for everyone in today’s bergen record
http://www.northjersey.com
Steinbrenner comments re Torre next year as well as Alex
PETE,
THANKS SOOO MUCH FOR YOUR WORK. THIS SEASON WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN THE SAME WITHOUT YOU AND THIS BLOG. WANKERS ASIDE (OR TROLLS… WHATEVER), REALIZE YOU RUN THE BEST B-BALL BLOG IN THE BIZ. BE PROUD. I HAVE BECOME, AND PRAY YOU STAY, ON THIS BEAT. THOUGH WE HERE ON THE LEFT COAST (LA) NEED FOLKS OF YOUR CALIBER, IT IS A TOUCH OF HOME TO READ YOU ON A DAILY BASIS.
YOU DA MAN.
PKANE
Jaewon,
If we lose in three straight, that’s three straight years with postseason collapses. Torre does get a raw deal sometimes, but it would really mean time to ride into the sunset and get a fresh start with this team if this happens again. This isn’t the Mets spectacularly falling apart with a flawed team.
dka- how does torre get a raw deal? he has been the skipper during some of the most brutal losses. Yet he still has a job.
What he did Friday night was a joke. He should have taken his team off the field. But, per usual he was asleep in the dugout. Don’t get me wrong, I LOVE joe, but time to sit matsui and stop this pride/honor stuff. Matsui has been a buckle machine in the playoffs since game 4 2004 ALSC.
Gayle :
No surprise with the article. If this were the Steinbrenner of old, Torre would have been gone after the 2003 season if not sooner.
Ian O’Connor on WFAN w/Mike Francesa now.
Who would have thought Kaz Matsui would be a playoff hero and Hideki Matsui would be a bum?
Interesting comments by Schilling. He definitely tells you what’s on his mind. Wonder how that’s playing in Beantown.
Also a quick but interesting article by Ian O’Connor, referenced above. It clearly portrays Steinbrenner as being alert and in charge. IF we do lose, and Torre is let go, I hope they at least orchestrate it (joint decision, whatever) so that he can leave with a little dignity.
Well it seems the writing is set in stone. If the Yanks lose tonight or tommorrow or weds. then Torre among others will be gone. Yanks can’t shake the playoff pressures this organization puts on them. This team needs to have some fun tonight. They have nothing to lose at this point because Big George has pretty much written them off. Win one for the Skipper -Go Yanks 27 in 07.
“I wouldn’t consider that in Game 4,” Wedge said. that’s what he said about bringing CC back to pitch in a possible Game 4! so that issue is out of the way, we really can win these next 2 games and then get Andy back out there for Game 5, I’ll bet my money on this scenario!
Elimination day !
I don’t see the point in threatening Torre in public the day before a possible elimination game by Big Stein. I guess it could have 2 effects: get the player’s heads out of their a s s e s and play for Torre or just be embarrassed that their owner talks like that about their skipper and just want to crawl in a hole. I dunno.
and I guess we can stop speculating about AROD’s offer from the Yankees, whether we make one or not as a result of tonite’s game and possibly the rest of the post-season.
“I think we’ll re-sign him,” Steinbrenner said of Rodriguez. “I think he’s going to have a good run the rest of the [postseason]. I think he realizes New York is the place to be, the place to play. A lot of this [postseason] is laying on his shoulders, you know, but I think he’s up to it.”
Maybe this team should take some booze shots B4 game. Worked for those damn 2004 Red sox.
I guess I feel a little sad about George’s ultimatum. I realize that’s just “how he rolls,” but that’s something that should be dealt with once everything’s said and done, between them. One characteristic I’ve generally admired about Torre is how he supports his players. His players obviously hold him in high regard, and I don’t think that’s something you take lightly. Is he perfect? No, no one is. I personally just feel that what he’s done this season which was admittedly referred to as a “rebuilding” year, is quite amazing considering where we were, and where we ended up.
I also realize that part of being in New York is getting to the World Series, and the players know this going in, as does Torre, but I guess sometimes I wish George, et al, showed the support to Torre that Torre shows to his players. This year could’ve gone a lot worse, and we have yet to see what will happen tonight, but I know this year, I’ve seen these guys turn it around and play as a team, and it’s been one helluva ride!!!
I have one thing to say.
The “midges” are not why the Yankees lost the game on Friday. The Indians had to deal with them as well. I hate that the Yankees lost too, but you can’t blame their barren bullpen on the insects that were covering BOTH teams. Joba is human. Who’da thunk it?
replacement level posted some numbers on the yanks vs westbrook that look pretty promising. granted, all bets are off once it comes to the post-season, BUT perhaps the yanks’ previous successes against him will boost their confidence…
http://www.replacementlevel.com/index.php/S=efa8c9b131413766f35b9ad42aed74a8f9352f59/RLYW/comments/mlbcom/
Instertnews – - you are 100% right. I think the difference in the way they handled it is simply that Carmona has more experience and was able to stay completely focused. Joba, as amazingly lights-out as he has been, IS still a kid with essentially no experience. He is, as you said, human.
Your defense of Torre is tiresome, Peter.
Torre is like a big time movie producer. He produces 4 hit movies out of 6, the other 2 being good draws but not hits, then produces one flop after another. At some point his movie studio grows tired of the flops and it reaches a point where the studio has lost so much money from the flops, the profits from at least 2 if not 3 or all 4 hits are cancelled out. Another anaology is Torre’s like a star actor who gets out of the gate strong and just can’t be part of a hit anymore. Torre is becoming the Joan Crawford of M.L.B. managers only will he win Manager Of The Year like Crawford (finally) won an Oscar for Best Actress? I think not.
If the Yankees get knocked out of the postseason in the first round again, Torre will basically have cancelled out half the World Series the Yanks have won under him. I pick 1998 and 1999 for this reason: In retrospect those teams were so good anyone could’ve managed those teams. With each passing postseason failure, it further cements that Torre was just along for the ride, a lucky retread mistaken as a genius. The Yanks’ competition got tougher and tougher after 2000 and Torre wilted e.g. his brainlock bringing in Mo an inning too early in Game 7 of the 2001 World Series; his bigger brainlock bringing in Jeff Weaver to hold a tie in extra innings at the away park in Game 4 of the 2003 World Series; his inability to manage the Yanks to one more win in the 2004 A.L.C.S. after he basically sat on his as s doing nothing but watch the daily batting romps Games 1-3; batting A-Rod eighth and not starting Wang who won Game 1 thus all but hoisting up the white flag in Game 4 of last year’s A.L.D.S.; this year, sticking with a slumping, psyched out Matsui, not taking Joba out with a 1-0 lead in the 8th (cuz he’s scared Mo will blow it? explain that to me), and being his typical bullpen management dufus leaving in Vizcaino to load the bases and give up the game-winning hit in Game 2. That’s not managing -that’s the reason why he’s called Clueless Joe.
Bottom line is he’s been living off 1996, 1998-2000 and that has to end if the 2007 Yankees are done after tonight, that’s it. You don’t reward him with another contract -are you serious? If they’re done after tonight, Torre is no longer a great manager -he’s merely a three times fired retread who lucked into getting a job with a team cuz the team’s owner liked him and had final say on who’s hired.
In conclusion, the Yankees wouldn’t miss a beat if they fired Torre (he should be fired immediately after elimination, no letting him go) and hired Tony LaRussa, and LaRussa’s right-hand man pitching coach Dave Duncan replaced Guidry, who is merely a figurehead hire and someone who can’t teach to save his life cuz name one reliever he turned around this year. A good pitching coach should turn around at least one guy, starter or reliever, he didn’t. He’s a pep-talk advice giver, not a teacher as well. He should just re-sign to save face and learn how to coach in the minors.
The bottomline is Yanks have been failing in the postseason for five years, sometimes early and sometimes later. When that happens consistently, the mangaer has to be accountable. Torre’s bonehead moves or non-moves (bugs, bloody sock bunt,...) are well documented. He is an honorable man, but results matter. I am glad Big Stein spoke up and took the mystery out of what will happen.
I beleive that Yanks have to make it to the WS for Torre to save his job. The reason is, if Yanks make past this round (I still beleive they will), then they will face Rex Sox in ALCS unless Angels make a comeback. If Yanks lose to Red Sox in the ALCS, no way Big Stein will bring back Torre.
I continue to be amazed at what Pete continues to write that Posada will leave if Torre is not brought back. Once again, it is utter non-sense. If Girardi is the next manager, will Posada hold agianst him, given how Girardi mentored him and gladly accepted backup role when he was playing with Yanks? If Mattingly is the manager, will Posada hold against him? come on…..
Oh b.t.w. any of you think I’m saying the Yanks will lose tonight get a clue. I root for them as hard as anyone as unlike alot of you I don’t lay claim to “biggest Yankee fan”.
I truly hope the Yankees win the 2007 World Series, I’m not one to hope they don’t win so Torre can be fired. If they won it all, and the Yanks brought back Torre for another year, cool. To say “Oh I don’t want him back” after another ticker-tape parade is just not liking the guy, and truth be told, despite what will be labeled as “anti-Torre” au contraire: I have deep respect for him as a spokesman against child abuse, his charity work, and insofaras what I’ve read, being a regular guy with fans. It’s purely about his managing and did it ever occur to you that a manager can fade like a player? It’d just be in a different way.
Torre’s main problem is he doesn’t have the Mendoza to Nelson or Stanton then Mo combo. Yeah he has Joba then Mo, but what if he had a guy behind them good enough to pitch the 7th then Joba for the 8th and Mo to close it? You could say “Well that’s Cashman’s job.” Yes, but TO A POINT. At some point, the manager has to discern who to go to from what he has been given. He had plenty of time to figure out a bridge between the starter and Joba in September, but he took the easy way out and chose Joba to Mo. He didn’t figure out that 7th inning bridge. The Yanks paid for it dearly in Game 2.
B.t.w. Cashman should be fired if the Yanks get knocked out early cuz he clearly did not do his job putting together a deep bullpen besides lucking out with Joba who will be a starter next year, so there goes the bullpen -better take out the checkbook and spend about $20M on 6 new guys and another $22-30M to keep Mo cuz there’s no one in your wretched farm system outside of Joba, Hughes, and Kennedy to give a job to next year. Ohlendorf and Hughes are a former and current starter, respectively. Ohlendorf and Veras had
I think Posada and Rivera will give the Yankees a Torre discount. If Torre is let go they may stay but money becomes more of a factor. Torre is not as stupid as LaRussa who had no idea McGwire was juicing.
Girardi or Mattingly?
Jim Clark
More like LaRussa didn’t want to know..
“Your defense of Torre is tiresome, Peter.”
Careful, Pete doesn’t take too well to criticism of any kind.
The strategy of dogging it the final week of the season is wreaking havoc right now. ‘Setting up’ rotations and ‘resting’ players is a double edged sword, something that clearly hasn’t worked and has sucked the heart out of our beloved yankees.
The yanks are in a ‘rest’ state of mind right now. Unfortunately you need to enter October fighting hard and furiously. They can still reclaim that aggressive attitude, but it has to happen quick. Unfortunately we have a Torre instead of a Martin or Piniella.
Ballplayers need fire and determination, not rest, comfort or coddling.
This series is far far from over. A win today puts us just one lousy game behind the tribe. We need to catch fire fast and hope that Joe Weaver Torre doesn’t dismantle the house of cards at an inopportune time.
Yeah let’s look at that bloody sock shall we? Why didn’t Torre ask the umpire to order Schilling to take it off and put a new sock on? That’s a distraction if I ever saw one. Since when can a pitcher wear a discolored sock? Why didn’t Torre ask the umpire to look at that sock i.e. what if it wasn’t blood but a foreign substance? It’d certainly get under Schilling’s thin skin what you want and turnabout’s fair play for all the hijinks Pedro pulled. Schilling hurts his ankle in his first start of the series, yet Torre doesn’t start Kenny Lofton so Lofton could show no mercy and bunt on Schilling. Torre doesn’t bunt as much as possible to put strain on Schilling. It’s fair play, not dirty pool. When a guy fouls one off his foot, you bust him inside in that area so he doesn’t think about swinging.
As far as Posada leaving if Torre does, good riddance cuz that’s just being an immature jerk and an ingrate. The Yankees gave Posada top years and dollars. They NEVER talked about trading him or letting him go, ever. He’s probably made more money that prime I-Rod did adjusted to inflation. It’s none of his business who manages the team and if he wants to make it that, then let him go cuz then that’s letting the inmates run the asylum. Posada is too old to give 3 years @ $12M/yr. = $36M to. He’s one bad injury via collision or whatever away from being an overpriced Greg Zaun. His .338 BA this year is an anomaly, he will not hit anywhere close to that. He will not have anything close to Damon/ Cabrera then Jeter/ Abreu/ A-Rod/ Matsui batting in front of him. Remember no Yanks to offer him a contract means his leverage is severely damaged. Teams will think “He’s 36. When will he break down? Did he plateau in 2007?”
Ramon Castro hit 11 HR in
homegrown… i actually DO think posada is worth it – look at the catchers other teams have. a good catcher at any age is hard to come by. the key will be groom a young guy (or find one somewhere) that can start playing half time. let jorgie DH some times in a couple years. Part of his value is also that he hits equally well from both sides of the plate.