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Via his agent:
“Joe Torre exhibits class, dignity and a winning attitude both on and off the field. Those of us who coached or played under Joe know he is someone very, very special.”
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on Friday, October 19th, 2007 at 4:52 pm by Peter Abraham.
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Chad Jennings joined the The Journal News in October 2009, having spent the better part of seven years covering baseball in Scranton, PA. He is a graduate of the University of Missouri and an award-winning beat reporter and features writer. E-mail me at cjennings@lohud.com
Sam Borden is an award-winning journalist who joined The Journal News
and LoHud.com in January 2008. He covered the Yankees for the New York
Daily News from 2004-06, and has also worked as a columnist for the
Florida Times-Union in Jacksonville. E-mail me at sborden@lohud.com
Josh Thomson has done some of everything since joining The Journal News in March 2003. He began working for the Gannett weeklies during the winter of 2002 as a freelance writer. He joined the daily staff soon after and has since covered various high school and pro sports. E-mail me at jthomson@lohud.com
Copyright © The Journal News, a Gannett Co. Inc. newspaper serving Westchester, Rockland and Putnam counties in New York.
interesting statement
What Torre said: “I just lost my job.”
What Torre should have said: “I just quit my job, because I didn’t think I should have to accept a measly $5M base and have to EARN the other $3M.”
PAH-LEAZE!!! An offer of $5M plus $3M in incentives–the next highest-paid MLB manager earns $3.5M–hardly qualifies as “undignified,” much less “insulting.â€? It’s public comments by Torre implying that he is some sort of abuse victim that are undignified and insulting–and a stain on an otherwise memorable career.
———-
What broadcast and print reporters are saying: “Joe Torre was humiliated by the Yankees and showed his integrity by turning down the offer.”
What broadcast and print reporters should be saying: “Joe Torre is really nice to us and makes us feel important—he used to be a broadcaster himself. Yankee ownership is mean to us and makes us feel unimportant. We’re going to print and broadcast biased, uninformed and unfair stories that make Torre look saintly, make ownership look like evil incarnate, and sow dissension among players and fans alike. ”
I’m glad Torre and the press get along so well, but I think Torre’s statements are intended to encourage the reckless reporting that depict him as the victim and the NYY as the victimizer.
Joe, cut out the passive-aggressive statements implying that you’ve been maligned. You chose to turn down an offer that would have given you a base 43% higher than any other manager in baseball. Denigrating the organization that treated you better than any other franchise ever did just because they wouldn’t give you the combination to the bank vault is hardly a dignified way to close the book.
———-
There’s an excellent article in today’s NYT about the end of Stengel’s tenure after losing the 1960 WS…at least partly attributable to bonehead decisions by the Ol’ Perfesser.
Torre should be grateful he wasn’t fired two weeks ago in the middle of the 8th when he failed to ask the umpires to halt play when his star set-up man was being eaten alive by bugs. After the loss, the umpires said they would have considered it but nobody asked.
———-
Casey Stengel’s record managing 1851 games with the highest payroll in MLB: .621 (1149 – 696), 12 Winning Seasons, 0 Losing Seasons
Casey Stengel’s record managing 1915 games with Brooklyn, Boston and the Mets: .395 (756 – 1146), 1 Winning Season, 12 Losing Seasons
Joe Torre’s record managing 1940 games with the highest payroll in MLB: .605 (1173 – 767), 12 Winning Seasons, 0 Losing Seasons
Joe Torre’s record managing 1897 games with Atlanta, the Mets and St. Louis: .471 (894 – 1003), 5 Winning Seasons, 10 Losing Seasons
———-
Managers don’t create dynasties.
Franchise owners committed to championships create dynasties.
i completley agree with you Eric, and randy levine isn’t helping us.
Torre said it wasn’t about money. Get over it.
dog is asking joe right now – ‘…levin wanted you out and that levin has control with the franchise. help us with that’
joe, ‘from my end of it, it is only second hand. you hear a lot of people talk and there are a lot on things….’
not really sure what he just said, but i think randy levin is satan. but that is my summary
Hilarious, I love the fact that people just see $$$. For a lot of people that isn’t the most important thing. Get pass the dollars aspect and he was treated like crap. Who among you would take a pay cut at your job. Who would want only one year, it was a crappy offer. Every person wants to feel wanted in his or her job, and a weak one year deal shows that the Yankees didn’t respect him or want him. I would have had no problem offering him a pay cut with the performance incentives if it was for two or 3 years. But the fact that people see this only for the money and not for the length of the deal is BS.
Steinbrenner and Co. needs to put one man in charge here not a group (and not Randy Levine)
Andrea -
If it wasn’t about money, why was $5M so unacceptable? Torre says it wasn’t about money becasue it feeds the media’s narrative that the NYY’s ownership team is evil and that Torre is saintly.
If Torre had some gratitude for the fact that the resources of NYY ownership is why he’ll be in Cooperstown, he’d say “thanks for the opportunity of a lifetime, it was a great run, no hard feelings” and then he’d SHUT UP.
this was more about the 1 year, if he got a multi year deal i think joe would be back.
Eric: Torre said that 1 year was unacceptable and that the fact that they felt that he needed incentives was insulting. That’s why he turned it down. He specifically said that $5M was nothing to sneeze at and said that no matter what he does this year now he will most certainly not be making $5M.
Believe what you want, but don’t criticize the man when he has explicitly said the opposite of everything you’re accusing him of.
i’m sick of this. i’ll talk to all of you in april.
Joe is a class act. He conducts himeself with dignity. The Yankee management, especially Randy Levine blew this. Randy Levine has been president since 2000. One of his teams has never won a World Series. Maybe it is time for Randy to go?!!!!!!
i really liked trey hillman he sort of was a combo between donnie and joe, sort of like Don Girardi a mix of the two and I think he could of handled the new york market, he has been with the organization before too.
Syracuse fan,
We are not talking about somebody who is a teacher or construction worker or even a lawyer. Under his previous contract, Joe was an overpaid sports celebrity who did not live up to the dollars he was getting paid. When a player or other celebrity comes up for contract renewal, he gets what he deserves at that time — not what his previous contract dictates. Bernie Williams contract ended in 2005. Did the Yankees give him an equal amount in 2006 so that he wouldn’t take a pay cut? NO! He took a 75% pay cut! When a hot actor has one hit movie followed by several mediocre movies, do you think he deserves to get paid the same amount he got paid right after the hit? Of course not.
You are right that Joe had a problem with the length of the contract — but he did not necessarily deserve more! He has shown poor judgment with a number of critical in game decisions in the past three years and he often appeared to be sleeping his way through the season.
Now that sounds a little overcritical, but Torre was offered a one year contract in which he would remain the HIGHEST PAID MANAGER IN BASEBALL by 40% over the closest guy! And that is without the insulting incentives! Torre certainly deserved to be well comensated and a chance to prove that he still had the passion and ability to win. The Yankees gave him that and he was insulted. Good luck, Joe. It was a nice run — especially the first 5 years. See you when you cool down and your number is retired in the new stadium.
that is a good point DC, we haven’t won since he has been here, time to get a new president
“i’m sick of this. i’ll talk to all of you in april.”
See you tomorrow.
I wish someone would insult me by offering me five million dollars.
#9 – you’re probably right. i think i’ll be back after i take a nap
I think we all need a good nap after the past couple of days.
The rest of Mattingly’s statement: And I am available immediately to replace him.
extenstion to mattinglys statement: fire randy levine if you want me
Time to move on.
Interesting that Joe Girardi is lapping Mattingly in the Pete’s unscientific poll for next manager. I think that Mattingly is thought of as the loveable, laid back, best-player-on-a-team-that-never-quite-got-it-done. Girardi was part of the Yankees World Series dynasty AND has managerial experience. Although, the fact that he got fired from Florida for standing up to management does not bode well for him being hired here.
Randy Levine is a A–. SO…Mike and the maddodg are bias an over the top..
Again Torre is a good guy, did a great job overall, but that dpes not mean he deserves to be the manager of the Yanks for life..
he has the 6th best winning % in yankee history for not being brought back the next yr.
The yanks fired Casey Stengal!!!!!!!!!!!!
The thing I am worried about is if Randy Dickhead and others get involved in personel decisions, then we are in HUGE TROUBLE…
Bernie Williams never called a press conference to say he found the offer to earn a roster spot was insulting.
Bernie accepted that it was over, respected and appreciated the opportunity the NYY had given him and, at the end, personified dignity and class.
That’s the way a true Yankee ends his career.
Torre could learn a lesson.
is ralph houk still living?? more seriously, if we don’t get torre II, how about Earl Weaver or Dick Williams? with hillman gone a geezer might be the only way out.
I LOVE Bernie, but I’m sorry. Not bothering to show up or take players phone calls is NOT class and dignity. Holding a press conference to clear the air and thank management, players and others for a wonderful 12 years is total class. You wouldn’t recognize class if it bit you!
Statement from Derek Jeter:
“Blondes have more fun with me than with ARod!”
So is the next manager’s contract going to be incentive based?
If you think the sympathy in the press for Joe is strong now, just think what it will be if they bring in someone else at guaranteed money.The Levinebrenners will really look stupid then.
“Bernie Williams never called a press conference to say he found the offer to earn a roster spot was insulting.”
I think Torre called that press conference so he could get those 900 reporters off his lawn.
GR -
My point is that Bernie didn’t air his grievances in the press. He kept it between himself and the team.
I’ll check to see if I have any bite marks.
Yesterday was one of the happiest days in my life. Today was great as well. (I loved Joe’s whole martyr schtick. Unbelievable. What a gargantuan, disrespectful, self-important, “entitled”, UNCLASSY ego that Joe Torre has.) Only when Girardi’s officially brought in can I feel any better than I do right now. (Ok, if/when Boston is eliminated this weekend I’ll feel even better – but this feeling I have right now is pretty hard to beat.)
Bring on Girardi and Eiland and the young, homegrown pitching dynasty. The winning commences next year!
Thank you, Girardi…your adjectives are dead-on.
Joe wasn’t airing grievances, he was clearing the air so the reporters could go home. I understand if you don’t like Joe, but to say it was anything but class is just wrong. He said he would rather have been fired outright, which would have been more honest! That you don’t see that this was a low class way to handle things is amazing.
#9: agreed. If he didn’t call a press conference, no one would leave him alone.
You know, I’m the biggest Girardi fan. I’ve been calling for him to be the next manager for a long time now. But after hearing how this classless Tampa group is conducting business, I’m afraid for Girardi to get mixed up in this mess!
If Joe had said he would have no public comment, the reporters would have gone home, GR.
And don’t think for a minute that I dislike Torre – I don’t dislike him and I’m keenly appreciative of what he did the past 12 years.
I’ve said over and over that there comes a time to move on, that someone has to make the unpopular decisions, and that owners are responsible for dynasties, not managers.
Regardless of the merits of Torre’s feeling insulted, it wasn’t going to end well – it never does.
What I don’t agree with, and what I take strong exception to, is, in essence, Torre’s character-assasination of Yankee ownership. It is not justified, it’s not necessary, and it’s flat out wrong.
“The winning commences next year”??
What do you call what they’ve been doing the past 13 years? As I understand it, you can’t get to the postseason without winning. A lot.
Eric Young: are you serious? if he said he had no public comment, they most certainly would not have gone home. The Bernie situation is nothing like this situation at all. The fact that Bernie was old and quite frankly there was no room for him on the team, as much as we all would like to deny it, was obvious to everyone.
This is a completely different situation, and I’m sure even despite the press conference, there’s probably a few people staking out his lawn.
How many of you would trade manangers Torre for Mattingly straight up I sure wouldn’t
A rather political statement from Mattingly. Ease up on the flatterly, Donnie.
Joe Torre never talked bad about management at all. The only thing he said was that the way it was done and the stupid incentive offer would have put pressure on his players, who love him, to win FOR him. I think that’s real class. He expected to not be back after the Boss’s comments. It’s all about the underhanded way things were handled. They were afraid of press reaction if they just let him go so they tried to orchestrate something to make it look like it was Joe’s choice. They had the right not to bring him back. But NOBODY deserves to be dealt with this way. And this has backfired BIG TIME!
I didn’ agree with alot of his decisions “ingame” either. I want Girardi to be the next manager. But this was just LOW CLASS!
Analyst on ESPN news, “Just because the Yankees have the [unrealistic] goal of winning the WS every year, doesn’t mean that Torre didn’t do his job”
That’s it in a nutshell.
But just like the soap operas, life goes on, you just have a different cast of characters. Our favorites may move on, but tell me that Yankee fans won’t embrace the young kids Joba,Hughes, IPK, Cano, and Cabrera?
Got to go with Donnie or Girardi, the fans won’t have patience for anyone who didn’t play for the Yankees.
Torre should have taken the offer, big mistake on his part.
The next mgr should be picked from this BLOG.
Bob Michaels,
How could Torre take the offer? The damage was done. And how hostile would the work environment be when you have one person in the war room that has your back?
It would have been much better if the Yankees announced that they were not inviting Torre back for his bullpen mismanagement. The team would have received criticism in this case, but at least it would not have put an extraordinary amount of pressure for the next guy.
Will the next manager receive the same incentive clause?? If not, the team’s stance is not consistent. If so, then I think a lot of potential candidates will balk.
And I for one have no worries whatsoever about Mariano or Jorge. They will be back with bnice three-year contracts. After all, it’s not like Joe will manage somewhere else next year, so even if they walk out, they will have to deal with new manager (as well as new teammates, new clubhouse manager, etc).
Before you assume the worst about Yankee ownership, consider this:
CBS Ownership of NYY (1965 – 1972): .494 (636 – 649), 4 Winning Seasons, 4 Losing Seasons
Steinbrenner Ownership of NYY (1973 – 2007): .563 (3116 – 2419), 29 Winning Seasons, 5 Losing Seasons
Change is sometimes painful, but change has to happen, but managers do not build dynasties. Franchise owners committed to championships build dynasties.
Mel -
A hostile work environment? $5 mil to go to work at Yankee Stadium for 6 months? How hostile can it be?
Prison guards make $70,000 a year. THAT’S a hostile work environment.
this is a sad, sad day. Joe deserved better than this. Randy Levine is an absolute stooge. He sounded like a bumbling idiot on the conference call. Joe said the meeting lasted 20 minutes with no negotiation. That is simply incredibly. You don’t refuse to negotiate with someone you supposedly want back. The Yankees just executed (poorly) the most pathetic PR stunt in recent sports memory. I’m going into a Yankee detox program. See you in a few months.
Torre said he was looking at a bunch of business men when he declined his offer. There is nothing wrong with the Steinbrenners, its the other part of the front office that just wants the money. I have never seen Randy Levine at a Yankee Game. NEVER. He needs to leave and we need a front office that doesn’t want money, but wants a championship. Look at the Indians and Mark Shapiro, he wants a championship badly so lets go from example from him, and get our team president to come to games, or fired.
Eric,
How about “how hot would that seat be?”
Your prison guard analysis has no value, they carry batons, guns, and mace to protect themselves. Who’s protecting Torre? -Pee Wee Herman- Brian Cashman?
Mel -
Fine. Offer Torre $5 mil and include a can of mace.
Just joking – don’t flame me for this one!! :-O
Eric Young:
Does the halfway house know you’ve escaped? Just say no to drugs.
The reporters would have gone home? Sure thing. Had Joe Torre not spoken, I’d be standing on his lawn right now with 50 other people.
Owners build dynasties? How many titles did the Steinbrenners win from 1978-95? That would be none. The Yankees were a train wreck for years. Money does not buy titles. Charcter, talent and hard work does.
As for the character-assination of Yankee execs, you reap what you sow in that regard. Like your not, your squad has some weasels in important positions.
Seriously, just say no.
what’s amazing is how little return the steinbrenners are getting for their consulting and management dollar – little more than a cadre of lackeys pandering and parroting at every twist and turn.
i can’t imagine that george’s patronizing narcissistic flack of wasn’t in the loop, and certainly he could have spun this right. i could have spun it right without coffee. the “insult” is not about money and hope the media sharpens their message a bit over the next day or so.
the yankee’s message is definitely about money, the half a billion the players are aiming for over the next five years or so. remember, jeter has to renew, and in a flash, the jobas, kennedys and hugheses are eligible for arbitration and free agency.
with proper counsel the steinbrenners could have and still could use torre to sell the notion of “taking less to be a yankee.” he’d do it. the steinbrenners advisors should be ashamed of themselves – for not delivering. the steinbrenners are what they are. guess you just can’t teach grace. irony is that two premises that hold up between the lines are valid: hunger and shared risk.
levine is particularly disgusting only because he’s so obvious and looks the part. funny how some people look the part while others don’t. he looks the part. i could see that guy as prime competiton for the only “everything bagel” on the breakfast try and the extra diet coke on the lunch spread.
a sad aside is the joylessness of the whole thing. for all their wealth and fortune you get the sense the sons aren’t happy. george is ill. it’s like, “whoa.”
my only beef with torre in 12 years was that he didn’t pull the team off the field with the bugs, i suggest due to visceral fatigue due to chronic emotional abuse. funny he mentioned that as his only regret.
Gosh, you’re swell, Pete Abe.
> Owners build dynasties? How many titles did the Steinbrenners win
> from 1978-95? That would be none. The Yankees were a train wreck for > years. Money does not buy titles. Charcter, talent and hard work does.
And all that was in place before Torre was handed the job of his life. Seriously, just quit it.
JOE. TORRE. DID. NOT. “BUILD”. THE. DYNASTY.
Thank Gene Michael. Not Joe Torre. Joe just had to assume the role of Casey Stengall and sit there and play Papa Joe.
And I love the way you cherry pick your stats. (The 78-95 bit. Ha! That was a good one.)
And you might want to revisit “train wreck”. The 80’s weren’t always pretty, but the team itself wasn’t always as bad as people seem to make it out to be.
Next year is going to be great. Your beat job is gonna be even more fun when the Yanks are no longer laughingstocks.
Ok, I’m ready: call me some names now for disagreeing with you…
_The next mgr should be picked from this BLOG._
Thank you. Thank you.
I proudly accept!
Peter -
Ouch!! I’m thrilled to have earned a comment…and let me finally say directly to you how much I love and am grateful for your blog and your writing.
I’m sure you’ve read Henry Fetter’s “Taking on the Yankees.” If not I’ll be happy to send you a copy.
Surely, you’re not denying 29 winning seasons against 5 losing ones under Steinbrenner, the winning seasons under Ruppert and Topping – all owners willing to invest in the product on the field – or the losing seasons under CBS or Ferrell and Devery in the early 1900’s.
Rickey invested in farm systems, both with St. Louis and then with O’Malley in Brokklyn and LA with winning results.
The Red Sox were generally losers under tight-fisted Yawkey; a more freespending Henry and Company have made our rivals consistent winners since 2002.
And we can just go over to Long Island and compare the Mets under Mrs. Payson and Donald Grant against that team’s current ownership.
Statistically, it bears out that ownership is the critical difference that survives the emergence or decline of any one or two or three star players – regardless of the sport (ask any 49er fan still in mourning over the demise of Eddie DeBartolo).
I’m a bit surprised that I earned such a personal knock from you, Pete. Granted, I have been arguing loudly that, in this instance, the media has been biased in favor of Torre and against the NYY and that the bias is personal and unjustified.
You may well take umbrage at my statements, but I am hardly alone in my viewpoint. Indeed, there has been a fierce debate within this very blog as to whether the press is being fair to all sides these past few days. Without counting the number of pro- or anti-Torre posts, it seems uncontestable there is a sizable group of fans that do not think Yankee management has been out of line at all. Yet this is a viewpoint that we are hard-pressed to find being expressed except in the most cob-webbed corners of the reporting world.
I saw Ian O’Connor say “someone” dropped Big Stein’s private phone number in his lap, which led to the exclusive interview.
Being half Italian I shoulda picked up on this immediately.
To paraphrase the “Godfather”: “But I didn’t know until this day that it was Randy Levine all along.”
If ya interested Torre called in to WFAN this afternoon.
you can listen to the segment “Here”:http://www.wfan.com/topic/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=1076060
EY:
I got ya back….the media is self-serving. Joe could have well accepted that offer and no one would have thought any less of him.
PS-You’ve improved alot on Baseball Tonight.
What Pete Abraham forgets in his post about the Yankees of the 1980s is the baseball structure was different from the Joe Torre era. There were two divisions and no wild card. Most of the teams in the AL East had strong teams: Baltimore, Toronto, Detroit and Boston so the Yankees could only win two division titles (1980 and 1981). With Cleveland in the AL Central Torre was able to win the AL East in 1996 and 2000 that if wouldn’t have otherwise in addition to 1997’s wild card. Perhaps the Yankees would have played better and spent more money to over come Cleveland if they had, perhaps they would have lost like Minaya’s Mets did this, who knows. But the Yankees of the 1980s (as well as the Mets) would have had several playoff trips if there was a wild card. But certainly Steinbrenner was at his worst: always changing managers, changing directions, didn’t understand the need for pitching, obsessed with the Mets having Gooden he promoted Jose Rijo too early and Deion Sanders as well. But the Yankees contended most years, it wasn’t the CBS Yankees of my youth or the Dolan Knicks of today.
Eric Young’s comments about Tom Yawkey being “tight fisted” is very wrong. Racist, yes. But Yawkey from the beginning spent huge amounts of money to bring in stars like Jimmie Foxx, Lefty Grove and Joe Cronin. He did invest in a farm system that produced Ted Williams, Bobby Doeer, Dom DiMaggio and Johnny Pesky. However after about 1950 he seemed to lose interest in it. Gave power to too many different people who kept their cronies in jobs they couldn’t do. Was slow to integrate (dead last unless you want to count the NFL Redskins and a lot of southern college teams). What the current Red Sox ownership does is spend money wisely and have a plan to win. Sometimes a stupid one (Bullpen by committee) but a plan they will change if it fails.
LOL, BB…
I’ve gotten so frustrated with ESPN the past couple of years, I forgot I was even on it!!
BTW, if the OTHER Eric Young ever wants my web page, I’m open to a chunky offer…I promise won’t feel insulted if it’s below $1 million.
For the right price, he can buy my dignity.
Don’t feel sorry for any of these guys, Torre, Mattingly or Peña. They will all have jobs after this season. I love Torre and what he did for us but everything comes to an end. If Torre didn’t leave now it would be worse for him if the same thing happens next year. I am of firm belief that every well runs dry eventually and the same tactics that worked for Torre earlier is not working now, it has gone stale and it was time for a fresh start for the Yankees and Torre. What’s more upsetting is Torre’s comments about not coming back to the Stadium if he’s invited. That’s a slap in the face to all Yankee fans who supported Joe for over a decade. Some advise Joe, don’t take out your frustrations on the fans because you feel Randy Levine is a jerk (and he is cause I met the guy). If you are invited to the Stadium, you come because of the fans. Don’t take it out on us. That’s more upsetting then you leaving. A Rod, get out of here because we can tell, NYC is not the place for you.