Boras is not to blame, A-Rod is
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- November
- 4
There have been several thousand posts here in the last week and half them are from people who want the head of Scott Boras on a stake. Columnists from across the country and ripping him as well.
It’s misguided anger.
There are dozens of agents available to a baseball player. When a player selects Boras, it is because he wants to maximize the amount of money he can make in his career.
Boras is great at what he does and gets his clients huge contracts. The downside is that he will generate ill will. Fans will become angry with you because of what your agent does and says. The media will criticize you. But in the end, you will probably be wealthier than a player with similar talent but a different agent.
Boras doesn’t work for the fans, the game, the team or the owner. He works for the player. The player decides what he wants and instructs Boras to get it done.
If Alex Rodriguez wanted to stay with the Yankees, it would have been simple. He could have called Boras and said, “Scott, I appreciate your advice. Now call Cashman and make the best deal you can for me.”
He didn’t.
Ron Villone is a Boras client. We were talking about it a few months ago and he told me that on several occasions during his career, Boras wanted him to sign with a certain team and he didn’t. “At some point you have to do what is best for you and your family,” Villone said. “You’re a man, you make your own decision.”
Villone is divorced and has two children who live in New Jersey with his ex wife. He made a deal to stay with the Yankees this season and turned down better offers because he wanted to be close to home. He even started the season in the minors.
Boras didn’t scream at him, he made the deal that Villone wanted.
Some people want to believe Boras has some sort of hypnotic hold on his clients and the poor player is a somehow a pawn. But these are adults. If A-Rod is capable of living to the age of 32, getting married and having a child, he is capable of telling his agent what he wants.
In the two seasons I have been around the Yankees, only one player has talked about his salary time after time after time. About how being the highest paid player is “pretty cool”, about the pressure of being the highest paid player and about the responsibility of being the highest paid player.
One guess who that is.
Scott Boras wasn’t above him manipulating any strings. If you want to be angry about Alex Rodriguez turning his back on the Yankees, be angry at Alex Rodriguez.
Blame Boras? That’s just what they want you to do.
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on Sunday, November 4th, 2007 at 7:14 am by Peter Abraham.
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Good point - Varitek wanted to stay with Boston and Bernie did not want another team this year.
I have mixed feelings about A-Rod, as much as I want him to stay, since he is the best player in the game today, it is stuff like this that will make me forget him. I never in my life thought I would agree with Steve Phillips, but he was correct, A-Rod is a 24 and 1 guy.
Pete, when do we get to start “blaming Joe Torre” for also choosing not to be a Yankee instead of throwing the organization under the bus?
I totally agree with you,Pete.Agents work for players,not players work for agents.A-Rod is all about himself and money.
In any given transaction it is fair to assume that the agent is the employee of the player. In that regard, Boras and A-Rod are no different. Boras does what the client wants limited only by Boras’ judgment, skill, common sense and the bounds of ethical behavior.
No agent who wants to stay in the business makes a client do anything. What if it turns out badly? Unless it was the player’s choice, the agent is either going to be sued or his rep will take a huge hit. The Villone case is a clear example. Boras’ continued representation of Villone despite Ron’s lower earning potential and unwillingness to go full bore in his pursuit of the dollar speaks to Boras’ understanding that the client makes the ultimate choice. A-Rod, however, is no ordinary client.
It’s unfair to make Boras play Rasputin to A-Rod’s inner Nicolas or Alexandria, but I do think that A-Rod has a very unique relationship with Boras. I have read that A-Rod was with Boras since he was 17 or so. Rod seems quite bright, albeit without the polish of college, law school or post grad academics, and could have met the academic requirements for doctor or lawyer. I have no doubt that Rod has understood and absorbed everything Boras has told him over the years. A-Rod in effect has applied his natural intelligence to leverage Boras’ formal knowledge into a Ph.D in baseball economics for Alexander Rodriguez. Thus, Boras is “father to the man” in some respects and it would appear that Scott has had a mentoring effect on A-Rod that is more profound than in most client-agent relationships.
All that said, who bears final responsibility for A-Rod the monster? Clear away all the smoke and follow the money: Boras gets his percentage but A-Rod takes home the lion’s share.
Pete-
Mad Dog Russo keeps on joking around about Boras brainwashing A-Rod in Cali before the negotiations got going. Apparently the element of Yankee fans who are detached from reality have bought in.
I’m just interested to see whether Boras has a $350M offer circling the airfields or if this is all just a huge bluff. At least it looks like Hank and Hal won’t being played like Tom Hicks was as the owner of the Rangers.
Earlier this season, when I made some ARod remarks, I was chastised because I dissed the ‘Best Player in Baseball’. What I want to know is, why did it take so long for all of you figure Alex out? This all started years ago in Seattle.
He’s just another spoiled brat and it’s interesting that two other spoiled brats (Hal and Hank) have spoiled Alex’s party.
Will any team take him now??????????
Peter, maybe you haven’t read the scathing denunciations toward Arod too, I know Arod is calling the shots.The reason Boras is getting skewered with Arod is because of two reasons.Guilty by association,and all year Boras was quoted as saying he’d advise Arod to opt out! Oh yeah, Three more reasons ,Boras ,is slime, bad for baseball and greedy,like some of the players he represents.
I personally hope the Yankees teach Boras and any player he represents a lesson,suspend dealings with him for a few years.Will he (Boras) go out of business,no but he won’t garner those huge contracts without the Yankees in the bidding. It looks like the jr Steinbrenners are up to the task of taking on Boras.Boras needs to be put in his place!
Don’t think for one moment he didn’t already, have a deal lined up for Arod. That’s why Arod was so focused this Yr,so Boras would have some bargaining chips to showcase to his new team.After what Arod endured last season,being booed
you know he told “Boras get me out of here.”That’s when the plan was hatched,for this year’s Greatness to come back with a new attitude and focus.Bunk!!!!
Peter; interesting take.
I don’t think a lot of the fans’ tirades have been directed at Boras himself, it’s more about seeing Arod and Boras as one and the same, guys who put pre-eminence on the green.
Either Arod is not as bright as Murphy gives him credit for and is stunned by the fans’ and media’s reactions or Arod made a calculated business decision and all this criticism was anticipated. I believe the latter scenario. Alex Inc objectives are to become the premium baseball icon by far. The fans, a ring and player respect are clearly secondary business objectives- Arod’s actions over the years say so.
He has taken quite a few hits this week in the media and he appears to be reeling, right? Or is he? Somehow, although maybe not played out exactly as they designed, I believe Arod and Boras have a plan, and a deal or two, at least in some sort of framework, so he’ll rebound, and meet his primary objective, somewhere. Arod will be ok.
And more importantly, so will the Yankees.
Yankee21, you hit the nail on the head. Since when in Yankees history have they ever allowed one player to dictate as to whether the team will be ok or not.Arod couldn’t get it done in the Bronx,He QUIT!!!
Hey Arod,Quitters never win,and winners never Quit!
Ahh, why not blame both of them? Or better still? Why not forget about it and move on?
You people don’t think for a second that if Arod came back to the Yankees for a discount and essentially got the Yanks 30 million back from Texas they wouldn’t embraced him? Do we really want the best hitter in the game who finally got comfortable in NY gone when we finally have a pitching staff being molded into something special? With Joba, Phil and Ian to add to Wang,Pettitte,Mussina to the rotation this team could be even better next year. Let’s not kid ourselves here, Without Arod, there is a hugh hole from the right side. Arod makes this lineup go. If he comes back and talks to the Yanks and pleads his love for NY. They shouldn’t turn their back on him.
It’s tempting to suppose there was some “tampering” going on, both here and with JD Drew. But if you examine the facts it’s pretty unlikely. Other than hard feelings, there is usually no evidence of tampering and thus tampering charges are never made. But tampering in a case involving the kind of deal A-Rod and Drew were seeking would mean some especially detailed negotiations were had on some pretty complex issues. And that tends to leaves a huge paper trail that is hard to completely cover up.
1. I’m assuming that by tampering we mean that Boras solicited or received an offer from another team before A-Rod opted out. I’m not talking about a general or well known interest in A-Rod by certain other teams that fit the economic profile, which we can pretty much presumed without a word being said.
2. Because of the fear of tampering charges, no pre-opt out deal would be evidenced by any documents, including e-mails. Why would any team generate and keep proof of their own misconduct, shooting copies of proposed deals with details and numbers back and forth with Boras? Without that detail, how do you lock down an offer sufficiently well to tell your client it’s a done deal?
3. Without a “lock” on all the details, A-Rod is not going to crap on the Yankees’ offer in favor of some specific other offer because he doesn’t know if the other offer is indeed better. Deals like this have to be analyzed down to the last detail.
4. If it’s in writing and it was negotiated before the op-out, the team could always walk away from the offer because the deal would be unenforceable since it was made and negotiated in violation of the tampering rules.
5. Forget tampering. Unless it’s in writing, any team can walk away from any deal. (What deal was that, Scott? Do you have it in writing anywhere?)
I cant believe ppl are blaming boras. Arod is the fraud. He is the one who left the yanks without even discussing a contract a week after he tells everyone how he cant imagine playing anywhere else. Blame him for everything. No one had any problem doing that when he was on the yanks as fans blamed him for pooor pitching and everything else under the sun.
I cant seem the cubs and angels giving arod 350 million. Th yanks and sox are playing the only teams that can afford a contract like that. The cubs spent 300 million in the off season last yr. The angels may be in third after the sox and yanks right now but i dont think they could afford 350 and if they give him that, they are not paying anyone else anything. No way the dodgers can afford that.
Annie Savoy,if you read some of the previous threads from
oct and some earlier,I was attacked too,for speaking ill about Arod. I personally had numerous “Stat heads” that only looked at his in season play stats,and looked the other way,when he was in postseason. That’s how you get fooled by Arod.He puts up big numbers in the season,goes on vacation in postseason,and let’s the “stat heads” argue how “GREAT” he is.On this blog you, me ,and anyone else better be able to stand the heat,when your thought is different from those who see it another way.I’m just glad a majority see Arod for what he really is,Greedy!!!! That’s his best Stat.
PT Barnum, one of the greatest students of human behavior other than Freud, observed: “You’ll never go broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people.”
Doesn’t A-Rod’s success depend entirely on his bet that to a greater or lesser degree we will all forget about this and move on to some other controversy? Hasn’t it worked fairly well so far, except maybe in Seattle, Texas, Boston and NY? There are roughly 26 other teams and cities left, and one of them will blissfully slide under the wave of denial that will take them far far out to sea with Captain A-Rod and his first officer Boras.
Let’s be clear: A-Rod’s greatest offense is not greed; it’s his exercise of an extraordinarily acute cynicism.
You can bet that Boras has conducted “conversations” with one or two teams who have indicated a market value close to what he is seeking for his client. Obviously, no organization will provide a written offer before the free agent’s deadline and risk tampering charges, but let’s be real, Boras is shrewd and has dealt with Front Office officals before. Just as politicians make their “backroom deals”, Boras has some reasonable verbal assurance of his client’s worth.
Remember Beltran?
he wanted to be a Yankee so Boras called to check if they wanted him with a pay cut.
Good points Pete. Boras is the one who gives A-Rod the directions, but A-Rod is the one who is driving the car. Boras tells Rodriguez every road to take. A-Rod is free to make a detour and drive down his own path, but he chooses not to do so.
Pete Abe does it again. The definitive Yankee writer makes the definitive A-rod statement. Love this guy.
Peter Arod is like that media hungry chick Brittany that lives through the press, So we wait now for that shot of Arod getting out of the car,to see if it’s boxer’s or briefs,or preytell the full monty!!! You know he need’s to be adored ,and all.yuk
Here’s my stance on A-Rod. As long as he was a Yankee, I was rooting for him. I rooted for him a little harder when he was first signed cause it pissed off the folks in Boston a little bit, so that was a little bit more fun. When people in NY started booing him, I became a huge A-Rod fan, because I hate when people boo players on their own team. I even hate it when people at the Stadium boo Farnsworth, as much as he deserves it.
So although I was a big A-Rod fan and what some on this board would call an “A-Rod apologist” because they can be somewhat ornery at times, it’s because I defend any Yankee in need of defense, because they’re Yankees. But at this moment, A-Rod is not a Yankee.
If he comes back with a paycut, then I’ll accept him. If he comes back without a paycut, I’m not sure how I’ll feel, and I’m not sure how I’ll feel about Cashman, but I know I’ll have to accept him, and I *will not* boo him. It’s just not in my nature. But I’m thinking that all these articles saying he could come back are all just because there’s not much Yankee news going on so they need something to write about.
Lathamjoe, I think boras has an offer that is over 250 million but I dont think that its 350 million. You say market value is on the table but what exactly is the market value for him right now. Nobody really knows. 350 mill is what boras wants on the table - i dont think that deal is on the table currently. Boras makes up numbers to try to get ppl to bid higher.
I’m curious to see who the Yankees will use as a replacement at third base. They can either trade for someone, sign Mike Lowell, or stick with Wilson Betemit. There is no absolutely perfect solution out there. Lowell is a terrific player and so are some of the other trade options, but if we look hard enough, we are going to find good and bad parts about any solution. I’m not necessarily worried about which player has the best stats. As a fan I want a player who is committed to the Yankees, plays hard giving it his all, is team first instead of me first, and who is also a good fit in the clubhouse. I want a third baseman who isn’t wrapped up in asking for a $350 million contract.
LathamJoe:
I feel your pain but Boras doesn’t need conversations with front offices to know what A-Rod would be likely to fetch on the “open market.”
Nobody works harder than Scott Boras. He has collected a server farm full of data back at Boras, Inc. Scott knows better than Hank and Hal what their gate receipts are, how much they spend on their minor league system and the cost of fuel for the chartered flight they take. The cost of parking, rent, tax breaks from municipalities are all factored in.
Data do not lie or posture or cry poverty so there is more truth and accuracy in what Scotty gets from the computers than what he would get from a GM. Using mountains of data also keeps Scotty out of dangerous areas regarding tampering.
Believe me, Boras has enough information to predict with a high degree of certainty who can afford what and who is likely to do what. That more than provides a starting point and allows Scotty to target possible suckers with a great deal of confidence int the numbers he throws out there.
Hey Peter
You lambasted Boras left and right as much as all the other media guys with the “he announced A-Rod was opting out during the last game of the World Series” reporting, so get off your high horse. Did you know Boras publicly blamed Mariano Rivera for the reason why A-Rod couldn’t hit a lick after Mariano blew the save in Game 4 of the 2004 A.L.C.S? ‘Guess not. Try reading articles beyond your own sometime. That act by Boras which he committed independent of A-Rod alone deserves the ire of Yankee fans. You’re not a Yankee fan (nor do you have to be), so you wouldn’t understand.
Boras is as greedy as A-Rod cuz newsflash: The more A-Rod makes, the bigger Boras’ 10% (or whatever % he collects) is. If he’s not out for #1, he’s out for A-Rod then himself. I don’t care what the relationship is between A-Rod and Boras. I along with legions of Yankee fans were infuriated that Boras, a grown man himself, announced his client A-Rod was opting out of a contract with the Yankees during the final game of the World Series the Yanks’ archrival was about to win. As if knowing the Red Sox were gonna win again and this overpaid primadonna choked in the postseason again wasn’t a bitter pill to swallow enough for Yankee fans. We were further incensed by this classless idiot stooping to new lows by being the first player’s agent to publicly blame his client’s ex-teammate for why his client choked. An ex-teammate A-Rod couldn’t shine the shoes of even if he hits another 300-400 HRs.
Boras is doing what’s best for his client, right, whatever, because it’s SOOOOO difficult for A-Rod to live on $92M the next three years. I mean $252M for 2001-11 just isn’t enough to live on! Why didn’t they ask Texas for a contract through 2018 if he was so good? And what’s A-Rod afraid of -he won’t be worth what he wants after 2010? Oh so he wants $350M and opt out clauses, but can the Yankees/ whoever opt out of keeping him, or is it a one-way street with A-Rod? A-Rod is no different than Latrell Sprewell saying how he has to put food on the table for his family, he just doesn’t come out and say it like Latrell did. Latrell was an a ss for saying it, but at least he not only had the guts to say it, he actually meant it lol and never apologized so for that he gets my respect. And that’s why Latrell wasn’t castigated like A-Rod and Boras should be. Latrell honestly meant what he said whereas A-Rod and Boras are phonies of the highest order. Sure A-Rod didn’t choke out his manager like Latrell choked out his coach, but the N.B.A. did allow Latrell to return -he did the time for the crime (one year banishment, his remaining contract voided, mandatory embarrassing anger management classes).
I don’t wanna hear “It’s just baseball folks” oh no it isn’t. Baseball is life’s reflection. We, the fans, are the reason A-Rod exists as who he is. He is the epitome of eternal greed which is the ruin of this country, and I am very proud that my fellow Yankee fans see through him and Boras (who are joined at the hip) and want the heads of
A-Rod and Boras on a platter. Are we killing the messenger with the anti-Boras comments? No, cuz Boras is just like A-Rod, just the agent version of yet another greedy athlete who wants to flee his team for more $$$. B.t.w. where has Boras ever talked about how A-Rod will statistically lead his team to a World Series championship for all his garabge about stats? All I hear about is how much A-Rod is worth to the YES Network and A-Rod is this and that. How does he help Jeter defensively? As if YES was a pile of crap before A-Rod came along.
Pete
You are absolutely right. The agent works for the player. Any player who hires Boras knows what they are in for but I do believe this agent/player relationship goes beyond a conventional business one.
“But these are adults.”
MANY successful 32 year olds carry emotional baggage that shape the men they are, not just A-Rod. I don’t feel sorry for A-Rod because of it but to discount that it doesn’t impact his judgement is naive. For every Derek Jeter and Joba Chamberlain story the media gives us about how well they were raised and are the men they are today because of it, there is also a story of a Gary Sheffield or a Doc Gooden who carry traits from that upbringing that work against them. The buttons installed in childhood can get pushed by the wrong people if they weren’t wired correctly to start.
“In the two seasons I have been around the Yankees, only one player has talked about his salary time after time… responsibility of being the highest paid player.”
In the 2 years you have been around the Yankees how many players have been asked about their salary time after time? How many players in the room were defined by their salary? How many players were held accountable for each at bat in relationship to their salary? A-Rod took the check and answers hundreds of questions about it. Have you or any reporter asked any other player to justify the money being paid to them? Pick one this spring and give it a try. Some of the answers might not be so pretty or smooth.
Unlike many here, I’m not angry at A-Rod or Boras or the Yankees. It is what it is, a business. Watching the difference in reaction of Cashman and Hank to the A-Rod opt out was very telling to me. 2 men got the same news and reacted to it quite differently. Probably in the same way that 2 men might react differently to being the highest paid player in the game. Neither was right or wrong. It just is what it is.
This was a good blog post, I agree ultimately Alex’s career is in the Alex’s hands. If he truly wanted to, Alex could have instructed Scott Boras to make a deal with any team he wanted for a reasonable dollar amount. I really think Alex wanted out of NY and the intense pressure of playing in pinstripes - so Boras tried to get him out of that situation. Well Scott Boras fumbled on getting him out smoothly. LOL I do think this does present an opportunity for the Yankees to intelligently reallocate those assests elsewhere, and Cashman seems to be inclined to do so. In my opinion I think hiring Joe Girarid over Don Mattingly shows that the Yankees brass is willing to make decisions in the best interests of baseball operations and not the p.r. operations. There is a lot of work to be done between now and spring training, but this is an exciting time since we seem to be on the cusp of building something new beginning with the young pitching that seems to be coming along.
Peter’s essay on ARod and Boras is right on.
I saw the Centerstage interview with Scott Boras about a year ago. It clearly comes out that he sees his job as getting the best contract for his clients. That usually translates into $$$. Occasionally, someone will, like Ron Villone or Carlos Beltran or Bernie Williams, instruct him to go in a different direction, for family reasons or whatever. He then complies.
ARod is the one driving the bus here. He was the one speaking all that malarkey about wanting to stay in NY. Maybe his wife was making a secretive editorial comment with that famous T-shirt. The only thing ARod is sorry about is the negative publicity he’s getting now. But he won’t cut his price for it. THAT you can take to the bank.
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Many of us were fooled that he really wanted to stay in NY for the Yankees. Not again. Like the man said, it’s all about the money. Unfortunatley, we keep having to learn that.
P.S. - I’m rooting for Jeff Karstens.
“In the two seasons I have been around the Yankees, only one player has talked about his salary time after time after time. About how being the highest paid player in “pretty cool”, about the pressure of being the highest paid player and about the responsibility of being the highest paid player.”
Wow. Talk about a money quote…
Pete,
You let Borat off too easy. Sure arod is the one in control but is he really responsible. Borat lays out the scheme and gets him pumped up. How does he back away after all “I’m doing it all for you”. Isn’t this why in real life we have laws to protect kids from adults.
After opting out, 11 years of A-Rod’s ’services’ would have cost the Yanks twice as much as they were paying after Texas $$. How could he as that and walk away unless he already knew he could get it elsewhere?
Right now, if he were to come back a the same salary he had before, it would still cost the Yanks 40-50% more for the next three years.
Even if the Yanks stance were to be ‘We’ll only talk if you subtract the lost Texas money from the offer we would have given you’ (which he/Boras would never do) there could still be too much resentment he’d need to overcome.
If NY signs Lowell to take his place, I wonder if that would pave the way for A-Rod to go to Boston. They’re out from under Manny’s ridiculous contract in a year so they might go for his 11yrs/$350M. He’d have to deal with a little resentment from the fans and in the clubhouse (a little?) but a few HRs into his career there they’d get over it. Considering the $$$ involved for both sides, and the entertainment value of watching Sox Nation have to embrace their favorite whipping boy, I’d take that switch.
If Boston re-signs Lowell, they could still be an option for him if he were to go back to SS.
Pete - What have you heard first hand on A-Rod’s preference of dealing with the atmosphere there versus going to LAD, LAA, DET or the Cubbies? Do you have a sense of which of those 5 teams would be most inclined to really cough up that $32M for anywhere from 8-11 years? How about Florida or someone else like Atlanta? With the exception of Manny’s salary, that’s got to be twice as much $$$ as any of those teams already pay any single player.
The blame is on both sides. Boras and A-Rod both screwed this up. It just seems I never hear from Boras how Alex will help a team win a championship, just how he will fatten the coffers.
On other news, Damon for Crede is in the papers today.
frankd yes yes yes, If you go back to when Boras got that contract with texas arod was quoted as saying it was an insane amount of money to play baseball,now a few yrs later,arod wants more. I guess he got over the shock.
I thought Detroit already signed a third baseman?
What an opportunity for the new 3rd baseman coming into the bronx. All he needs to do is be good at 3rd,hit well,and contribute in postseason,and we’ll forget about PAY-Rod.
It would be interesting to see if A-Rod goes to Florida, would he be the first player to make as much as the rest of the team combined? And, would he be the first player whose salary was enough to bankrupt his team?
Joe Crede is a career .260 hitter. Please, not him.
Pat -
Spot on!
ARod talks about the salary because ARod is asked about the salary. Period. I guess he could try to steer the conversation elsewhere, but I would guess that wouldn’t work - the media can be fairly persistent. LOL.
My initial reaction to ARod opting out was extreme disappointment. I really believed he was more than interested in staying in New York, and I truly believe that NY was going to be the team that could pay him enough to satisfy him. But the passage of time allows reflection and upon reflection, I have adusted to the idea that ARod is no longer a Yankees. I hope Cashman and Co. stick to their guns, but I also realize business is business and if it works to both their advantages, it would not surprise me at all if ARod was a Yankee in March. Things being what they are, the appropriate spin will be put on the situation, and everything will return to almost normal.
Also, I do not delude myself into thinking that Alex Rodriguez will remain a villain for very long. Whatever team he ends up with, and he will end up with someone, he will be hitting homeruns, driving in runs and scoring runs and the crowds will cheer him as long as he does so. If he strikes out and hits into DPs in big situations he will be boo-ed like no one else, either. In other words, life for Alex Rodriguez will pretty much be the same as it’s always been.
Hurray and Good luck to Jeff Karstens!
way to post personal info about villone
i hope brady tears his acl today
Good debate so far on this thread!
1. Peter is obviously skewing the facts, which I can understand. If you fully pay attention to his writings, he is neutral in his articles for Journal. That is because the bosses at Journal would not put up with any thing less. However, on this blog, he goes the extreme to start a good debate and I like it. However, he skews the facts all the time when he does not like a particular player. Every one who is regular visitor to this blog knows that there are many more comments bashing A-Rod than Boras. So much for it.
2. I have not commented much about A-Rod opting out other than saying Yanks will be alright without A-Rod. All they have to do is compensate for his lost production with upgrade at 1B and a decent 3B.
3. I do not care if A-Rod comes back or not. But if the three articles in NY times are any inidication, I would not rule out if A-Rod is the 2008 3B.
4. Right now the battle lines are drawn and they have to find a compromise so that neither loses face. There is a 50% chance this is what is going to happen.
5. Once Mo and Po are signed and Andy comes back, which will not happen before Wednesday (the original opt-out dedline), A-Rod/Boras could say that thier concerns are addressed and wants to come back and negotiate in good faith. He would also volunteer to compensate (discount) for the Texas money lost (Note that he will make much more than that discount in ads if he plays in NY). Yanks can tell them that any discussion will be in face to face meeting and there has to be deal by the end of that meeting and it can not be leveraged in discussions with other clubs. If not, Yanks will announce to the world what happened stating that based on what A-Rod said they met him but could not reach a deal within the same parameters of what they wanted to offer before opt-out. They will state very clearly that was the last discussion between A-Rod and Yankees.
6. What will happen? It is any body’s guess. Obvioulsy, Boras miscalculated Yankees threat and A-Rod trusted Boras advice to opt-out thinking that the Yanks were bluffing. Then all this negative reaction to the timing of the opt-out took a major hit to image conscious A-Rod. One way to repair all this is to give the discount and come back to Yankees and spin it any way they want. Because of the discount both parties will save face. Also, A-Rod once proved that he will entertain giving discount (Boston trade negotiations)
7. If A-Rod does come back, all he has to do is produce to win the fans back. If he does not, the result would be same whether he opted out or not.
The difference between Jeter and Chamberlain versus Gooden and Sheffield is that the first two appear to have overcome their issues in positive ways while the second two have not. The point is not that some people have issues, but rather how they deal with them. Willingness to throw off your crutches and be judged as an “adult” is the first sign that someone has overcome the issue. Evaluating someone by a common, reasonable standard like “adult” is quite fair.
Gooden and Sheffield came from a bad environment, drugs, violence god knows what all else. Sports were an escape. A-Rod? OK, A-Rod is emotionally stunted by his father leaving him and his family. But what was so really “bad” about his childhood. Did he get involved in drugs, or thuggery? Carry a gun? Face down a gun? Get robbed or do some robberies? BY all accounts, A-Rod got to play baseball, basketball and football all day long as a kid. He made his teams as the captain and star, and he got rich at 17 (17!)
Being “fatherless” impacted his judgment? Maybe. Is there a direct correlation - - that is, an inevitable cause and effect - - between being fatherless and being a wealthy, selfish, narcissistic cynic? No. None whatsoever. Those were A-Rod’s chosen responses to whatever his problems were. Sheffield installed a permanent chip on his shoulder and Gooden can’t stay clean and sober. Joe Torre’s father abused his family and Joe’s had his problems but never blamed his father for any of his failures. Now he gives time and money to fight domestic violence.
We all have issues. But we all need to find positive solutions for those issues.
murphy,
well said.
So I’m going to go out on a limb here:
The reason people get mad at Boras has less to do with what Boras actually does or doesn’t do (which seems to just be his job), but because of what Boras represents.
Boras does represent some of the highest paid players and the obscene contracts many of them have.
Now, I can’t speak for any other baseball fan but myself, but I know that I am repulsed by hearing about $350 million contracts and the insatiable greed they seem to imply.
Yep, this entire thing is probably Alex’s fault, but there’s so much too this–how fans, last year, finally did start cheering for A-Rod, etc-that we don’t want to blame A-Rod because it might hurt to much.
But I do hold firm in one thing: The only way A-Rod gets a pass in my book is if he cuts the Yanks a check for $31 million and voluntarily takes a paycut of about $100 million.
Guess I’m hard to please.
Hi Peter,
A suggestion for the improvement of this blog.
Is it possible to have a sequence number listed in front of each comment?
This would help us to start where we left off during the previous visit. Right now it is an adventure locating the last blog entry we read during last visit, especially when there are number of entries.
Thanks.
Boras also can’t make the money off of a Ron Villone that he can on A-Rod.
I really don’t care about A-Rod anymore. He opted out. Its over. Its done. No more talk about arod lets talk about something else.
For everyone saying that the Yankees should stop dealing with all Boras clients to spite him from now on, think about how many clients Boras has:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott_Boras_Clients
Oh, and Joe Crede is on that list. And so is Damon, so I guess he’d be out. and Andrew Brackman, so he’s out of the organization, as well as Ian Kennedy.
Hey Pete …
Not that this is a likely scenario or anything, but isn’t there the chance — if the offers being made by the rest of the league aren’t quite what Bor-Rod had in mind (provided he didn’t get one lined up before he opted out) — that A-Rod could force his way back onto the Yankees by accepting their arbitration offer?
The Yankees will offer arbitration, I assume, so they can get the draft picks when he signs somewhere else.
But, if he really wants to come back so badly (and I’m assuming he doesn’t), he could accept arbitration and the Yankees would be forced to pay him whatever the arbiter decides ($27 million?) and the Yankees will effectively be forced to pay it with no subsidy from Texas.
Again, I can’t imagine why he would do this, espcially b/c he would be without a long-term contract, and would be putting a lot of future $$ at risk if he got seriously injured.
But it is his right to do so, if he wanted to.
Well in response to directing my anger towards A-Fraud and not towards BoRASS…..I havent changed my stance…and Ill stand behind my comments and not change.
Yes we can all agree that BoRASS works for A-Fraud,so he does what he is told to….but he does give advise to his players,did say that A-Fraud should opt out,and makes that announcement during the WS!!
Ya it is true.. Boras doesn’t have some sort of mind control over all his clients. I’m sure he does push them a bit, looking for the big contract and such..
And I’d bet he pushes Arod more than anyone.. But, still, the player makes the choice.
It’s the players hand that needs to sign a contract.
All this Arod talk ,yada yada yada,He’s gone, next! There is life for the Yankees beyond Arod.Arod didn’t add any more value to the Yankees.He came to the Yankees to get in on the momentum of WS wins,and didn’t contribute.Who will Cashman get for third,it’s the question to answer,now?
Yes Peter, you made an obvious point. Indeed this is how the agency relationship works, the principal directs the agent.
I would, however, like to see a study of the degree to which Boras is in fact able to procure bigger contracts than other agents, if at all.
That said, I do think Boras exerts more pressure on a signature client to test and set the market than say a journeyman player like Ron Villone, but that doesn’t change the fact that Ale Rodriguez bears the ultimate responsibility for how this process has unfolded.
But this post is quite telling:
# Mr. Faded Glory November 4th, 2007 at 7:50 am
Pete, when do we get to start “blaming Joe Torre” for also choosing not to be a Yankee instead of throwing the organization under the bus?
Than Alex should stop wondering why everyone hates him. He shouldn’t wonder why the fans in Seattle threw money at him, or why everytime he sets foot on the field they boo him, likewise in Texas.
Scott Brosius lifetime BA .257 avg fielder at best yet we won with him .245 BA in post season. We will win with Joe Crede more power, better fielder has already one ring. all we need is pitching, IPK Joba Hughes Pettite will do the trick
Annie Savoy November 4th, 2007 at 8:37 am
Earlier this season, when I made some ARod remarks, I was chastised because I dissed the ‘Best Player in Baseball’. What I want to know is, why did it take so long for all of you figure Alex out? This all started years ago in Seattle.
He’s just another spoiled brat and it’s interesting that two other spoiled brats (Hal and Hank) have spoiled Alex’s party.
Will any team take him now??????????
___
You were and are dissed because your posts are made with such a bizarre venom towards someone (A-ROd) that I would imagine has never done anything to you personally, that it’s obvious that your posts reveal more about you than they do about A-Rod.
Now you have expanded this inexplicable and inappropriae anger to include Hank and Hal Steinbrenner, who have shown laudable character by seeking to protect their father at a time in his life when he may be unable to protect himself.
But in the strange world that you inhabit they are “spoiled brats.”
You are a deeply disturbed individual.
How can you not be excited about Joe Girardi after reading this morning’s Q & A in the NY Post? The references to Lou Gehrig, I can’t wait for the start of the 2008 season.
Q: What won’t you tolerate?
A: Lack of effort; lack of preparation.
http://www.nypost.com/seven/11042007/sports/yankees/serbys_sunday_qa_with____618820.htm
Irrespective of what, A-Rod will not accept arbitration.
If he accepts arbitration, he will lose his no trade clause (he is not 10-5 with Yanks yet) and Yanks can trade him to any team during the season.
Okay, reading that Girardi article may have been enough to put me in a good mood for the rest of the day.
Favorite actor? Joe Pesci.
Thing you want someone to say about you? That he cared.
Favorite player? Lou Gehrig.
Guys, we’re in for something great.
longtime ,thank you .The yankees world will never revolve around Arod,we root for the team,Not a self centered prissy boy, that need attention and his ego polished,and to be validated constanly, by money!
“Scott Brosius lifetime BA .257 avg fielder at best yet we won with him .245 BA in post season. We will win with Joe Crede more power, better fielder has already one ring. all we need is pitching, IPK Joba Hughes Pettite will do the trick”
Of course, when Brosisus played, Mariano was at his peak and the bridge to Mariano was Stanton, Nelson, and Mendoza, and the rules that MLB has enacted to promote parity were not in effect. That is why “we won” with Brosius and not A-Rod.
Murphydog
The fact of the matter is your childhood experiences have an impact on the adult you become. With time and learning, some people overcome it more than others.
Jeter tells the story of his childhood as summers in NJ with extended family, his Mom pitching to him in the backyard and both his parents attending his games. Joba talks about playing catch with his dad even though he had a disability and his Dad being his best friend. A-Rod talks about hanging out at the Boys and Girls Club because his Mom worked 2 jobs and counting her tip money when she got home. 2 of those were stories about relationships, the other was a story about hard work and money. I do see a correlation there in the men they have become.
Joe Torre has said that his situation growing up impacted his life. He said it took him 2 failed marriages, 40 years and the urging of his current wife to get him to address the impact his childhood had on the man he was and the father he wanted to be. He credits his brothers for being a positive guiding force. He also says that the paths his two sisters took in their adult lives, one became a nun and the other never married, had a lot to do with their childhood experience.
Everyone does have issues. All people react to them differently and address them in the best way they know how. I don’t have sympathy for A-Rod because of his life experiences but I do have empathy.
Dave:
I agree, I don’t believe $350 Mil is a realistic figure, more of a lofty starting point for negotiations that Boras typically uses to inflate his client’s worth.
murphydog:
You raise logical points, but I still have a difficult time believing that Boras, a power broker who regulary speaks with Front Office executives routinely, has done more than just market research - at least in the high stakes situation with ARod.
There is an excellent article on Boras titled “The Extortionist” by Ben McGrath appearing in the 10/29/07 edition of The New Yorker. Its quite comprehensive coverage and interesting reading. Here’s an excerpt from the article:
“The conventional wisdom in baseball circles, as the regular season neared its end, had been that Boras would dangle the threat of free agency to force the Yankees into a long-term contract extension for Rodriguez. Tom Hicks, the Texas owner, is still on the hook for about a quarter of the eighty-one million dollars the Yankees owe Rodriguez over the next three years, which means that he effectively costs them no more than Derek Jeter. (Few people recognize Boras’s responsibility, incidentally, for goading Rodriguez into making the taunting remarks in an old Esquire interview—“You don’t say, ‘Don’t let Derek beat you.’ He’s never your concern”—that set his Yankee tenure on an uneasy path from the start.) Brian Cashman, the Yankees’ general manger, said that he would not participate in an open bidding session should Rodriguez opt out, thereby annulling the Texas subsidy, and Boras is technically—“academically” and “theoretically” are the words he likes to use—forbidden to have discussions with other teams in the meantime, under the rules governing tampering.
But Boras is by nature a divorce lawyer, not a family mediator, which is why the Cubs rumor, as reported last month by New York, seemed so ingenious: Boras was supposedly in talks about a deal—a technically prohibited deal, as it turns out—that would have given Rodriguez a deferred ownership stake in the team, with civilians who also happened to be prospective owners of the Cubs, who are for sale.”
F No-Rod, I’m sick of reading talking about him.
“Joe Crede is a career .260 hitter. Please, not him.”
Ranting Guy,
So was Scott Brosius, and how’d that turn out? Crede is exactly what this team needs rather than another “allstar”. He plays great defense and makes good contact at the plate. Most importantly, he plays hard. Guys like Crede, and Rowand for that matter, are exactly the kind of players that made the late 90’s teams so great. Crede and Rowand’s personalities and style of play remind me of Brosius and O’Neill.
We are not going to replace Alex’s offense, and that’s going to hurt in the short term. However, in the long run we are better off without him and his circus. Face it people, 2008 is a transition year. But, how many teams have a chance to win 90 games in a transition year? If Cashman continues to follow his current course, 2009 could be terrific.
Girardi’s favorite meal is Risotto!
ThatWasMe I love Joe more now than before!! Thanks for posting that!
Please come back Alex. This team needs you; this blog needs you!
BBFan
as a workaround, what i usually do is look at the times people post comments and pick up from the last time i logged on, seems to be a decent method to get back to where i last was.
on another note, i think that list of boras client’s is very interesting. also interesting that at least 10 players stopped using his services… (fired him)
That Girardi Q& A is great stuff. Calling his daughter his little peanut, overcoming the loss of his mother at 19, dealing with the loss of his dad now, the invocation of the spirit of the humble Lou Gehrig instead of Babe Ruth, his favorite movie being Gladiator (mine is a tie between To Kill A Mockingbird and Gladiator), even wanting to have dinner with Jesus. This is the guy you want with you in the foxhole.
I think Girardi would have gotten along well with A-Rod because of Rod’s work ethic. Joe G would have respected A-Rod between the white lines. I just hope Joe G can survive the media’s take on wanting to have dinner with Jesus. It goes with everything else he says about himself and it’s wonderfully refreshing to hear, but people always take it the wrong way.
That Girardi is openly a man of faith is probably the source of the rumor about Girardi and Jeter not getting along. Chad Curtis, a born again Christian with the team back in the late 90’s, apparently made no secret of the fact that he didn’t approve of Jeter’s lifestyle. That and Curtis’ criticism of Jeter over the famous 1999 Seattle-Yankee fight where Seattle’s A-Rod and NY’s Jeter were talking instead of brawling, allegedly led to his ouster from the team. (His performance on the field was a little less than overwhelming also).
“So was Scott Brosius, and how’d that turn out?”
Well, but not because of Scott Brosius.
I found it interesting that Bonds is a “former client.”
Boras SHARES the blame.
Nobody forced Boras to go on ESPN and stick a SHIV in Rivera’ back.
For the Yankees to thrive with a Scott Brosius type at 3B, they would also need a Tino Martinez type at 1st, a Paul O’Neill type in RF, a Bernie Williams type in CF and a few pitchers of the David Cone, Rogers Clemens, Andy Pettitte, David Wells, etc…. types pitching circa the 1990’s. If they do then, then a Scott Brosius type will be fine at 3B. If they don’t a Scott Borsius type isn’t going to cut it.
Geez Pete, let it go, you don’t like Arod, just let it go. lol. I’m only kidding aroudn but you may have issues.
I do agree with some who say the way Arod grew up has something to do with the relationship with Boras. Not growing up with a father,not being able to trust, seeing his mother struggle financially, maybe Boras takes advantage of that. Arod has known him since he was a teenager and everytime he’s listened to him it’s worked out for him atleast financially.
Man you have to admit though Pete Arod sells, if there is even a mention of him there’s 1000 posts lol.
Dr Acula, ha ha ha,Touche!! A Shiv,prison talk ,he he he.
yeah, Dr. Acula, that’s where my beef with Boras was. And the fact that he doesn’t seem to know when to just shut it. Maybe A-Rod is like “Scotty, damage control! damange control!” but as an agent he’s gotta know when to shut it.
All this talk about how the Yankees need to become more like the late 90’s version is useless IMO. The stars or planets or whatever alligned for the Yanks in the late 90’s. You can’t build a team of “tough, gritty” players and think that they are going to win the WS because of this. As Billy Beane said, :my sh*t doesn’t work in the playoffs” It is all luck, or in the Yankees case bad luck. A bloop single by Gonzalez in ‘01, Mo blowing game 4 in 2004, hordes of insects attacking Chamberlain in ‘07. God has not been on our side and that isn’t going to change because we have more players like Paul O’niell who will throw a water cooler when they strikeout.
I’m sorry, but I’m sick of reading posts about ARod that discount stats. I read a whole bunch of posts above about the “statheads” claiming that ARod is so valuable. OF COURSE HE IS! Come on! Baseball is built on stats, so you have to pay attention to them. If winning was the only important thing, why would we have stats in the first place?
People claim the Yankees can win without ARod. Yes, this is true. But don’t believe that they’ll score as many runs next year without him. I’m a huge Wang fan, but do you know why he won so many games this year? Run support. The Yankees pitchers have won a ton of games because of that very fact. The team ERA has been nothing special and that hurts in the postseason.
Stop pretending that ARod got “meaningless” hits in the postseason. That homerun in game 4…yes it didn’t lead to a win. However, if the Yankees ended up tying that game, that HR is HUGE. So, if you want to blame somebody for that, blame Jeter (blasphemy!) for grounding into 3 DPs. In that spot, with the Yankees down a few runs, ARod did the best thing he could do, hit one out.
Finally, let me quote from RSM above: “Crede is exactly what this team needs rather than another “allstar”. He plays great defense and makes good contact at the plate. Most importantly, he plays hard.” So you’re telling me that ARod doesn’t give great defense and make good contact at the plate? ARod doesn’t play hard? Simply put, replacing anybody for ARod makes the team worse, because he is the best hitter in baseball. Saying that somebody having a world series ring makes him better is not a valid argument. There are a ton of people with rings, none of them better than ARod.
I am a huge Yankees fan. Personally I don’t care that ARod is leaving, we can win with the young pitching (just like the A’s of early 2000s?) But to claim that ARod is no good, or that replacing him with an average player somehow helps the team is just nonsense.
End of rant.
What are the chances of A-Rod firing Boras to save his image? Will it help?
pat:
Empathy: the intellectual identification with or vicarious experiencing of the feelings, thoughts, or attitudes of another.
Empathy is fine with me. Past is prologue. But like most people, I don’t stop at empathy.
Life keeps giving you feedback. You can absorb it, get it and implement the lesson or invoke denial and become mired in the repetition compulsion. You can get wise to yourself and learn to laugh at yourself or remain painfully needy and wastefully, joylessly driven to fill the void. A-Rod claims to have learned to laugh at himself and find more of the human situation in himself. But his behavior of late belies that.
Ironically I do empathize with A-Rod. I empathize with him, not for his childhood, but for his inability to be comfortable in his own skin and for pretending not to understand what it is he does that makes people really not like him.
Colts battle Axis of Evil
http://tinyurl.com/2mtye5
Will Brady survive season???
This week I heard at least a dozen noted sportswriters, including Boston’s own Bob Ryan, raise the specter of head-hunting (see: North Dallas 40). Now, if cool, erudite scribes are openly describing Brady’s demise, think about what must the P.O.ed players must be feel’n.
Perhaps it’s for the best. Gisele Bündchen will dump him, and he’s wasting his time with her, anyways. Tom, find yourself a nice Yankee Grrl, like Bridget (click on my name) and settle, down.
Dr Acula what about Brady’s “Baby Momma?” She could use a good man,too.
Amen, Peter…..Great Post !
Latham Joe:
How about this: It’s Boras Incredible Database (movie title?) that makes those probes into the front offices productive. He knows when they are b.s. ing him. But the devil is still in the details on a deal like the one A-Rod wants. A GM can promise $350 million over ten years, but quoting a gross figure is meaningless unless the player knows how the team plans to get there. The back and forth on the details is what negotiation is all about and makes all the difference to A-Rod. Those kinds of detailed discussions, however, leave the paper trails that prove tampering. That’s why I think especially with A-Rod there is no possibility of a deal being place before he opted out.
But then again people go to jail all the time for thinking they are smarter than the cops.
Catya, - that’s the Babe linked to my name (wink wink), I’m trying to subtly nudge Tom home.
As for a good man, well, Bridget, if Tom doesn’t come around by X-mas, consider me your present!!
I, personally don’t care what team Arod goes to,Caveat Emptor!!Fasten your seatbelts you are in for a heck of a ride.
Dr Acula,now now, you bad boy!
The thing that amazes me with people like AROD is their desire for more.money. As indicated, clearly he hired Boras and has acted to maximize his income.
But after you have the “house on the hill” and the private airplane; both of which he can now afford, what does he need with more money.
Is not self respect and the respect of others important? Why is he sacrificing them for more money?
Why doesn’t ARod start his own Hedge-fund. He could call it Blackwater.
I call Boras and AROD “running eagles” because they are so full of BS that they can’t fly and have to stick to the ground.
A-Rod and Boras are like the car accident you can’t look away from. In florid terms, this is a story about a hero with a tragic flaw (narcissism) and a rapacious lawyer who helps the player shake down the moguls for his own obscene enrichment. This is about a player that unflinchingly maintains that he is worth a King’s Ransom but without success in the ultimate arena. This is a story about where to draw the line, how much is too much, where does the Puritan work ethic rub up against the Puritan fear of God and God’s punishment for gluttony? This is about our natural human reaction: How much higher can this phony climb before he takes his fall?
C’mon… you know why we love to talk about it.
When will we accept the fact that Pay Rod loves four things
Himself,Money,Boras,Madre.Oh yeah he does have a wife and daughter that fits in the equation some how,way down the list.
Dr Acula, I just clicked on your name,Hubba Hubba!I see what you mean. Brady is stupid,period.
I think when people write here that Arod is misled, it’s because with Arod he’s a Yankee, it’s personal and we want to be in denial. With Boras it’s easier to direct the blame becausee Boras is not like family as Arod is.
When I read comments like “If he fires Boras and comes back then I’ll like him again” or “If he eats the Texas discount to come back then I’ll know it’s not all about the money”…it’s exactly like watching a buddy whose girlfriend is cheating, and hear the friend try to blame the 3rd party and talk about scenarios of how she must have been seduced or if she does this or that I’ll take her back.
Arod signs Boras’s checks. That’s precisly why Boras took the blame publicly for the WS opt-out timing, b/c Arod is the boss.
talk of arod led me to youtube today, to see when he and veritek got into it, and then other clips of the pedro v. zimmer hiptoss, and when that other idiot slammed posado at the plate this sept, sturtze getting into it, the boone homerun and on and on. seeing arod getting into the thick of it brought out some slight sentimentality for him. Man, i really cannot wait for the rivalry to take off again next year
We all hate you Alex!!!
I havent read every post here, but I have to disagree with Pete, a bit. I unerstand that Arod could have re-directed Boras ala Villone, etc. BUT Boras has a responsibility to steer his client in the right direction as well. Players are just that sometimes and arent aware of how other issues might affect them When they hire an agent, money is one (big) component of the relationship. Agents must look out for their client’s image and public persona…they get them to do charity work, smart endorsements, and when they are about do do something stupid, advise them against it. Boras didn’t do anything, he led Arod blindly into a public relations snake pit (created by Boras) which will define him for the rest of his career. Do I blame Arod? Yes. But Boras is getting paid to protect Arod form getting into this type of situation.
Is anyone else watching the maraton?
I’m tired of the Arod negativity. He carried the Yanks all season. Without his year they wouldn’t even get to the playoffs. He won games and hit meaningful HR’s all year long. He may have not been handling this Optout thing well, but if he apologized and wanted to come back at a reasonable price then fans should welcome him again. You don’t replace a hall of fame, potential HR king at 3B. Giambi gets a pass on this team all the time. He collects his paycheck and hasn’t even done anything for this team the last few years. So give AROD a break!!
“Boras didn’t scream at him, he made the deal that Villone wanted.”
run-on sentence
A-Rod & Boras will set an unbreakable record this Winter. The most discussed player/agent ever. Every team, the Yanks included will take A-Rod if they could get him. Maybe he will never produce in the post season, but he will surely help any team get there. Without him, the Yanks may not be a playoff team in 2008. With the “new direction” (young pitching and new manager) and increasing strength of the Red Sox we may not make the playoffs even with him. But, I’m excited about our chances for being the team of the next decade. I’m afraid the team of this decade is the Red Sox.
As far as Boras’s influence on A-Rod and the timing of the opt out announcement, I think it took Boras a week to convince A-Rod and he pulled the trigger before A-Rod changed his mind. If A-Rod could play SS in NY it would have been a no-brainer. I hear he wants to retire as the greatest SS ever and the best fit, money and all, may turn out to be the Cubs if Mark Cuban buys the team. Wow, just imagine #800 at Wrigley.
As a last thought I ask “Who amongst us would not seek a raise by any means”? Good luck A-Rod!!!
Dee: That’s exactly what I’ve been saying. A-Rod is like that boyfriend that cheated on you, and you thought he was perfect. All season long, he’s been saying “I love you baby, you’re the only one [team] for me. All my past relationships [teams] haven’t meant as much to me as you. I’d never leave you.” And then while he hasn’t exactly cheated yet, he just told us he’s on a break. So we want him to come crawling back, begging for forgiveness. If he takes a paycut, that means he is admitting he’s wrong. If he dumps Boras, that’s like his best friend that he always went out clubbing with or went to strip clubs with, so dumping him would show that he’s really committed to our relationship.
I think I thought this metaphor through a bit too much.
Arod over estimated his value to the Steinbrenners. You see Arod thought he wolud say” jump” to the yankees and they would say “how high.” Instead the Yankees told him “get to stepping,you over priced head case.”
Murphydog
For people that I don’t know personally, I stop at empathy. For people I know personally, I try to help them enact positive change.
Your statement of life gives you feedback is brilliant. I agree 100%. I guess where we differ is that I think all people respond to the feedback they get with different set of filters in place.
It’s been fun debating this with you but got to get a 5 year old to a soccer game. I appreciate the people here who have well thought out rational points of view.
Is anyone else watching the maraton?
anyone else drop-dead, yet?
Murphydog,
Awesome! I know that this is not the ‘done thing’ but your posts are among the most thoughtful, insightful and intelligent (all repetive compliments!)of any I’ve seen on any blog. And considering the many very fine posts of others here, that’s saying something. You’re one of the reasons this blog is so interesting to read.
I’ve been following the Yankees since 1953 and this has to be one of the most exciting offseasons that I can recall. While I don’t subscribe to Giradi’s personal views concerning ‘faith,’ I greatly admire his personal conduct and his view of life, as regards his baseball hero (Lou Gehrig) and his work ethic; a great choice for manager of the Yankees! Whatever happens though, this will always remain my team, ‘through thick and thin.’ If it means waiting a year or two for the Yankees pitchers to mature and the Action Jacksons, Tabatas, Gardiners etc. to come into their own, so be it. They’re doing it the right way and they will be back soon!
Hey Jennifer – have they figured out the cause of death of the runner yet?
Bob – interesting you think the timing had to do with Boras being worried Arod would change his mind. My theory is that image-conscious Arod wanted desparately to have an excuse so he wouldn’t look greedy. He got wind Girardi was getting named on Monday and Mo was taking a meeting in Tampa on Tue so Arod needed to use the “uncertainty” excuse on Sunday before the window was passed. The WS timing was bonus for PR.
Andrea – Exactly, but the thing is if he crawls back you can’t trust him anymore. It’s better to move on and start over.
Dee: but how many relationships are actually like that? How many people take back their cheating boyfriend or one they suspect of cheating?
Oh, how he hurt us. I think we all need a support group
Dee - I like your spin too.
My brother was supposed to run in the marathon today, but he hurt his achilles.
He’s run it twice before.
I also think he’s a masochist.
Dee - it has to be either EPO related clot (PED) or an undiagnosed heart arrhythmia.
“link”:http://www.yankees.com
Anyone know why this doesn’t create a link?
Hey Bob - would you “seek a raise by any means” if a) you already had all the money in the world and B) it meant that you’d ruin your reputation?
Just type in the web address
www.yankees.com
it should work.
Dee- I thought I heard it was a heart attack.
MLB Trade Rumors is reporting that serious talks between Chicago and Yankees for a Damon - Crede trade. Looks like they’re moving on from Arod for a new 3b.
pat:
You’re right about people having unique filters. Here’s an example of economic class filters at work: the more money people like A-Rod have, the less sympathy they can count on from ordinary people. None of us little people (and I speak only for myself) seem to have patience for graceless rich folk.
Hope you enjoy the soccer game. I remember when my daughter was 5 and played soccer. Getting 5 year olds to play soccer is like herding cats.
murphydog:
I, too, appreciate your insightful comments. In the Boras issue, we can agree to disagree.
If anything good has come of the ARod Opt out soap opera, its the fact that the media - and the bloggers here - have moved beyond the “Torre Story”. Hopefully, we can shortly move beyond ARod debacle.
I’ve always respected ARod for his gifted physical abilities, he is the greatest all-around baseball player of the current generation. But with his great physical skills comes the narcism, the self pity, the self promoting, and the media circus that is ARod. I’ll miss his presence in the Yankee lineup, I won’t miss the constant attention he seems to attract - negative or positive.
Time to move on and enjoy the new New York Yankees!
Several obvious points:
Pitching wins championships. Hopefully in the next few seasons we will return to the days when we had championship-caliber pitching like in the late 1990s. You can win with a Crede or a Brosius when you have that kind of pitching. Indeed, a Brosius can hit an amazing home run in a WS game if your pitching keeps the other team’s scoring way down.
The Red Sox proved they could win without A-Rod, and if he goes anywhere else besides the Yanks it is just as well for them. A-Rod is a threat to their plans if he is a Yankee. He does not make any other team in the AL so good that the Sox have to worry, especially not in the Al East.
And Mr. Faded High and Tight Glory, since when did Torre throw the Yanks under the bus? I think the reverse could easily be said. Who got the three year offer? Not Torre.
I hope I am wrong but just wait for Girardi (Industrial Eng. degree) to show his intellectual arrogance for the sportswriters. You know it will happen, and they will pounce. Torre never did that to them (at least not in an intellectually condescending way). Girardi has shown this side during Yankee broadcasts on YES, even talking down to men like Ken Singleton, who knows his baseball. That kind of attitude will not play well with guys like Pete Abe or the writers at the Post or Daily News.
SNL’s Weekend Update anchors had a great line about A-Rod’s opt out. It went something like this:
“A-Rod has opted out of his Yankee contract making him available to any team with money to burn that doesn’t want to win.”
I’d rather Damon than Crede. But I’m not Cashman. So I don’t get to decide.
Is anyone else watching the maraton?
anyone else drop-dead, yet?
Doc, please never grant me an appointment with you. LOL
The NY Yankees were mentioned at least twice during the maraton.
Arod smells like butt.
I’ve run it a few times, after a few operations caused by running my running days are over. It’s quite an experience.
I hope I am wrong but just wait for Girardi (Industrial Eng. degree) to show his intellectual arrogance for the sportswriters. You know it will happen, and they will pounce.
Arrogance in New Yawk?? Oh, goodness gracious!
Just win, baby!
Bloggers will watch Joe’s back.
I think I would be exhausted just running over the Verazano Bridge.
Oy, guys, I’m all for being angry at A-Rod and whatnot, but can we keep the insults to above a middle-school level?
Rebecca-
I think gianthinker was being ironic.
Not!
The last time I ran in 1992 there was a guy relieving himself into the wind halfway across the Verrazzano bridge and spraying everyone running by. I guess he never spit into the wind.
Mr. Kielty:
You are too kind. (I am bowing deeply as I write this).
In fact, I am as pure a vacuum on “inside baseball” as you are likely to find here or anywhere. Nevertheless, I refuse to let a simple thing like ignorance prevent me from launching my opinions into the blogosphere.
Actual insights are, however, posted here most days from SJ44, randy1, doreen, LathamJoe, Randyhater, Rebecca, Jennifer, Andrea, Dr. Acula, kasey, Chris, Jeff, Joe, Bob, Rob, Tony, Annie Savoy and many many others too numerous to list. And last, but in no way least, our graceful and generous host, Mr. Abraham always leads the way with the real inside stuff.
Is anyone content with “all the money in the World”?
We’ll miss Damon more than A-Rod.
If I hear another person on this blog propose Damon for Crede like it’s a good deal, I’m gonna come out of your monitor and kick someone.
Why in God’s name would we trade a healthy productive offensive and defensive player, our only leadoff hitter, a clutch hitter who won a post season game this year with a big HR for a 3b with nowhere to play on his team with one good season under his belt coming off BACK SURGERY????
Are you kidding me? Enough with it. If Cashman is dumb enough to make that deal, I’ll become a Red Sox fan.
NO ONE knows if Crede will have his power, let alone be physically able to play defense at 3b like he once did coming off back surgery.
So we’re going to trade Damon, especially with Matsui going in for knee surgery, and go into the season with a question mark at LF, 3b and in our lead off spot.
Enough. Pull your heads out of the black hole. If they want to trade for Crede and it takes more than a Karstens or a Colter Bean type life time minor leaguer, it’s a huge mistake.
One time there were two women in sweat suits, running shoes on Staten Island about an hour before the start of the marathon, chain smoking one right after another, I couldn’t believe what I was seeing so finally I went up and asked one of them if they were race monitors, and one of the girls (20ish) said “no, but we figure it will be at least 4 hours before we can have another cigarette.”
Mr. Kielty:
You are too kind. You too, Latham Joe. One thing we can say for A-Rod he keeps the juices flowing.
Dr. I remember that, what year was it.
G. Love–you might want to get used to it, I’m hearing those rumors everywhere.
It’s not such a bad deal: We’ve got a LF, and a CF and RF, and it’s likely that Austin Jackson will be ready soon–maybe not in 2008, but in 2009 it’s extremely likely.
I’m a Damon fan, and he’s a great lead-off hitter, but Melky, when he’s on, has shown he can do it as well, and unlike Damon, Melky is young.
So would it be the best trade in the history of the Yankees? Unlikely. Will it temporarily fill a gaping hole in the 3B spot and not have us parting with Ian or Phil? Yes.
Heh, no one thought much of it when the Yanks got David Justice in 2000, and then the Yanks went and won the World Series because of him.
You just never know.
Colter Bean was granted free-agency.
1980 Boston Marathon
1980.
Great post, Pete!
Gardner will be ready before Jackson and will take over lead-off.
I was using Bean as an example of the type of driftwood we should give up for the likes of Crede.
Crede’s biggest asset is his defense and power. He just had back surgery. Remember what happened to Mattingly after he had back surgery? The ball stopped going over the wall and the defense at 1b took a hit. 3b is a much more physically demanding defensive position, so I’m not convinced Crede is going to be the next Nettles in pinstripes.
Unless the White Sox are sending over really good prospects or a good major league middle reliever plus Crede for Damon, it’s a deal that should never be made.
Crede will get non tendered if we don’t trade for him. Cashman is not this dumb.
Damon has 2 years left on his deal. He’s not blocking the progress of any minor leaguer.
Karstens for Crede is about the most we should do.
Damon is not Giambi. There is no reason for the team to cut and run from the money they owe him.
I think the trade rumors are just that, rumors. Perhaps it’s the Yankees trying to show Boras/Arod that they are seriously moving on. Perhaps it’s Kenny Williams floating the rumors trying to raise Crede’s value.
Regardless, it’s a terrible deal that only hurts the Yankees. Their LF defense suffers and their lead off spot is a void. If you want Matsui running around LF like Frankenstein again, you can have him. He was awful in the OF last year and he’s not going to get much better.
The deal makes no sense unless the White Sox are sending over something with Crede that is very valuable.
I can’t wait til the unauthorized biography of Arod to come out after he retires. There will be more drama in the next 8-12 years that will make this Yankees opt-out and the Toronto blond episodes look like two drops in a bucket, I guarantee.
I actually kind of liked the “ARod smells like butt” comment. We’re running out of reasonable things to say, so why not just accuse him of smelling like butt?
Pete, you can try to spin this as an Arod problem but I still FULLY believe Boras has a lot more control over Arod than he does over other clients. This is the PREMIER athlete we are talking about, and Boras’ gravy train, meal ticket, retirement client, all rolled up into one. If Boras goes to Arod and tells him that he has received feedback that he could get A LOT more money, then, being the woman he is, Arod will listen. Arod doesn’t seem like a guy who will man-up. I think his wife wears the pants in that family and all those sessions at the psychiatrist probably haven’t helped. He’s a GREAT athlete but a poor excuse for a man. And Boras may be a great agent but he loves the put himself out there for the WORLD to see and hear. You RARELY ever hear other agents talk, they just do their job. Boras puts himself out there to be viewed as a jerk.
LOL, makes me think of his infamous quote (from SI 2006)…”When people write bad things about me, is it because I’m biracial, I’m good-looking, I make the most money, or becasue I smell like Butt?”
Sorry I couldn’t resist:-)
Andrea–Touche, but I thought if you’re gonna go that route, why not call it what it is-a$$?
I’ve never kissed any butt. What does it smell like?
Boras doesn’t care what the World thinks of him.
Okay so maybe I don’t remember it, I was too young, But I heard about it.