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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Pettitte to return to Yankees

Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Dec 03, 2007 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Less than a week after Jorge Posada and his father both said he was leaning to retirement, Andy Pettitte changed his mind and decided to pitch for the Yankees in 2008.

Details are still coming in, but it is believed Pettitte will pitch for the $16 million that was his original contract option.

Pettitte was 15-9, 4.05 last season and had a brilliant start in Game 2 of the ALDS.

The Yankees remain interested in Minnesota lefty Johan Santana, knowing that Mike Mussina and Pettitte could be gone after next season. But Pettitte’s return would lessen the sting of not landing Santana.

Pettitte’s return was first reported by the Houston Chronicle. Agent Randy Hendricks confirmed the story this morning.

 
 

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268 Responses to “Pettitte to return to Yankees”

  1. RonH December 3rd, 2007 at 9:43 am

    Yes!! Good news to hear!

  2. gayle December 3rd, 2007 at 9:43 am

    Guess this week’s Sunday call from Jorge must have been a good one

  3. RonH December 3rd, 2007 at 9:43 am

    Pete, once again on the cutting edge!

  4. Jim December 3rd, 2007 at 9:44 am

    Yesssssss!!!

  5. wood is good December 3rd, 2007 at 9:44 am

    YES YES YES YES!!!!

  6. Jonathan Everett December 3rd, 2007 at 9:44 am

    NICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  7. Andrew December 3rd, 2007 at 9:44 am

    Ron H, if by cutting edge you mean something that was in this mornings Houston Chronicle.

  8. G. Love December 3rd, 2007 at 9:44 am

    This is the best news we could have heard today. Thank goodness.

    I said from the outset that Pettitte returning was the key to the off season.

    If we get Johan and pair him with Pettitte, Joba, Wang and IPK, this will be the best Yankee rotation we have seen in many many years folks.

    Great news and welcome back Andy!

  9. yankees62 December 3rd, 2007 at 9:45 am

    great news.. made my monday morning a great one.

  10. swo December 3rd, 2007 at 9:45 am

    This is exactly the sort of leverage the Yankees needed going into the Winter Meetings. Even if we miss out on Santana, we could still get a good deal for Dan Haren, now that the whole “desperation factor” is no longer working against us.

  11. swo December 3rd, 2007 at 9:45 am

    Oh, and of course, it’s just plain good to have Andy back :-D

  12. yankees62 December 3rd, 2007 at 9:46 am

    GREAT NEWS!!!!!!!!!!! made my monday!

  13. Yankee Fan in Boston December 3rd, 2007 at 9:46 am

    Whoo-hoo!

  14. Ranting Guy December 3rd, 2007 at 9:47 am

    I just posted in a previous thread (sometimes I seem to find myself in the wrong thread after I post) so I’m re-posting in the relevant thread. I think.

    ***********************

    Does Pettitte’s return mean NY keeps Hughes in the Santana offer? If not, go for Haren instead?

    How does our 5 of 6 rotation …

    Wang, Santana, Pettitte, Moose, Chamberlain, Kennedy
    - or -
    Wang, Haren, Pettitte, Moose, Chamberlain, Hughes

    Match up against the Sox 5 of 6 …

    Beckett, Haren, Matsuzaka, Schilling, Buckholz, Wakefield
    - or -
    Beckett, Santana, Matsuzaka, Schilling, Lester, Wakefield

    Just tossing it out there to see who thinks which would be better …

    I’m assuming Moose gets the nod for the rotation out of spring training unless/until he has another noticeable decline in his abilities for any length of time, then one of the lads would get the call.

    Unless Joba’s got a chance of being the 8th inning guy again, despite being slotted for the rotation all along.

  15. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 9:47 am

    So after this upcoming season, if Pettite and Moose are gone:

    Santana
    Wang
    Chamberlain
    Kennedy
    Horne?

  16. Christine December 3rd, 2007 at 9:47 am

    What a way to start a Monday! This is INCREDIBLE news.

    Thanks, Pete! And thank you Andy for coming back, I had been holding out hope that you would.

  17. swo December 3rd, 2007 at 9:48 am

    Let’s not speculate on 2009 until our 2008 rotation is set in stone, lol

  18. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 9:49 am

    SWO: why? so we can “concentrate” on 2008?

  19. TTERB December 3rd, 2007 at 9:50 am

    lefty BABY ! A TRUE WARRIOR NOT LIKE ALL THE IMPOSTERS WEVE HAD THE LAST 7 YEARS

  20. Hoffa December 3rd, 2007 at 9:50 am

    INCREDIBLE NEWS!!!!!!!!

  21. hmmm December 3rd, 2007 at 9:50 am

    screw it, pull Hughes off the table. offer them the Kennedy package.

    if the Yankees pull Hughes off the table, the Sox will pull Ellsbury back.

    the Twins might just keep Johan at that point.

  22. mel December 3rd, 2007 at 9:50 am

    Well, Pete’s post makes it official. lol. Thanks, Pete.

    This makes the Santana/Hughes thingy a win-win situtation. We get Santana, win! Hughes stays, win! Either way Andy solidifies the rotation.

  23. sunny615 December 3rd, 2007 at 9:52 am

    With the Sawx at the table still (posturing or not) you don’t reduce or remove your offer. Hank (wisely or not) included a deadline with this offer and if they have any hope of future negotiations with anyone being legit, they have to follow through here or else no one will take Hank or Cashman seriously again.

  24. swo December 3rd, 2007 at 9:52 am

    Phil – It was a joke. It’s just because we have no idea whether or not we’re getting Santana. It’s like the people last offseason that were predicting our future rotations and included Daisuke Matsuzaka in them. Whoops.

  25. .....YO..... December 3rd, 2007 at 9:52 am

    Oh my god!
    That’s a fantastic news.
    And let’s get Santana.

    I love Andy~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

  26. Rebecca--Optimist Prime December 3rd, 2007 at 9:53 am

    Okay, I wake up and this is the first news I see?

    Wow, do I love my life right now!

  27. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 9:53 am

    Speculation is part of the fun of being a fan.

  28. A-Point December 3rd, 2007 at 9:53 am

    I can’t see it changing the offer made for Santana. Unless Santana has communicated his desires to be a Yankee to both the Yankees and the Twins. At that point – aside from all the tampering problems it could cause, the deal for Santana would be changed to Kennedy, IMO.

  29. jennifer- Hip Hip Jorge December 3rd, 2007 at 9:54 am

    I wonder if Joe T will show up at the meetings this week. It will be very interesting to see since he never showed up when he was manager of the Yankees.

  30. Jeff NJ December 3rd, 2007 at 9:54 am

    Seriously so much can change between 2008 and 2009, it is way to early to speculate. Heck we could have a rotation of Santana, Sabathia, Joba, Brackman and Kennedy for all we know. Let’s focus on 08. This great news was totally unexpected. I wonder if Andy was feeling the pressure, knowing the Yankees are close to getting a new young lefty. He wanted to take the offer before the Yankees rescind it.

  31. swo December 3rd, 2007 at 9:54 am

    I would think a package of Kennedy and Melky and prospects would be better than a package of Ellsbury and prospects (all of which are worse than Yanks’ prospects). So unless the Red Sox offer Ellsbury AND Lester, they don’t have a chance. That’s just my opinion.

    Melky has 2 years under his belt, and he’s shown what he can do. Ellsbury still has to be considered a prospect, despite the multitudes of hype that ESPN and Peter Gammons have thrown on him.

  32. A-Point December 3rd, 2007 at 9:55 am

    Andrew, being that you are so certain there is no God, then prove it. Otherwise, STFU.

  33. PK December 3rd, 2007 at 9:55 am

    Early reports say Oakland wants Hughes + Kennedy for Haren.

    That’s understandable because Haren is cost-controlled, and will have more teams involved in the negotiations.

  34. VOIII December 3rd, 2007 at 9:56 am

    Nice of Andy to anounce this now, to help the Yankees not over reach for Santana. He is a class act all the way….

  35. DMan77 December 3rd, 2007 at 9:56 am

    Not a bad way to start off the winter meetings..

    Wonder if anythign else happens today.. I wonder fi that deadline is set in stone, or if theres some wiggle room..

    Who knows, by this time tomorrow we could have Santana on our rotation, or we could all be sitting here talking about who to offer for Dan Haren..

  36. mike f December 3rd, 2007 at 9:56 am

    cash and hank have got to at least re-think the offer for santana now that andy is back. even if you end up still offering hughes, and i’m not advocating that, you have to reconsider your options. can you in fact get dan haren for ian kennedy and a couple of prospects?

  37. Rebecca--Optimist Prime December 3rd, 2007 at 9:57 am

    Oh, and for the record, G-d definitley exists.

    We have a love-hate relationship.

  38. A-Point December 3rd, 2007 at 9:57 am

    “He wanted to take the offer before the Yankees rescind it.”

    I sincerely doubt that. The Yankees would not pull back their offer to Pettitte, no reason to.

  39. mel December 3rd, 2007 at 9:57 am

    I hope that the deadline comes and goes and that the Yankees put a new offer of IPK, Melky, and prospect(s).

  40. PK December 3rd, 2007 at 9:57 am

    I wonder if Andy was feeling the pressure, knowing the Yankees are close to getting a new young lefty. He wanted to take the offer before the Yankees rescind it.

    Jeff, I’m not sure if you were joking about this or not, but there’s no way that the Yankees would pull Pettitte’s offer. That would be a slap in the face, and there would be no reason to do it. Even if we had already gotten Santana, Pettitte would have been a welcome addition to the rotation.

  41. Mike R. December 3rd, 2007 at 9:57 am

    I think that pressure keeps mounting on Bill Smith. First the Rosenthal report that Santana would not waive his No-trade during the season, next the Hank deadline and now the news of a Pettite return. The guy (Smith) can not be having a pleasant morning.

  42. On D Ball December 3rd, 2007 at 9:58 am

    We absolutely do not need Santana.

    Forget about it.

    Tell Minnesota where they can stick their deal.

  43. Mike NYY- Save the Big Three December 3rd, 2007 at 9:58 am

    1) Haren————1) Santana
    2) Wang————–2) Beckett
    3) Joba————–3) Matsuzaka
    4) Phil————–4) Schilling
    5) Andy————–5) Lester

    That`s at least pretty close.

  44. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 9:58 am

    Jeff: “Let’s focus on 2008 first.” You do realize the board has zero to do with personnel decisions, don’t you? I have no need to “focus” on 2008.

  45. mel December 3rd, 2007 at 9:58 am

    Please, no talk about religion or politics.

  46. J-Dawg December 3rd, 2007 at 9:59 am

    It’s so good to have Pettitte back for another season. He can make a great lefty one-two punch in the rotation with another lefty that we MIGHT get sometime very soon. By the way, I was referring to Johan Santana, not Kei Igawa. :)

  47. .....YO..... December 3rd, 2007 at 9:59 am

    Haren isn’t cheaper.

    We will not pursue him.

  48. migames December 3rd, 2007 at 9:59 am

    “Please, no talk about religion or politics.”

    for god’s sake!

    ;)

  49. mel December 3rd, 2007 at 10:00 am

    They would not rescind the offer, the players and manager were very actively recruiting Andy.

  50. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 10:00 am

    Smith is having a great morning, regardless of Pettite’s announcement. Either way, he gets a lot more for Santana than he would at the end of next season if he doesn’t trade him and takes the draft picks.

  51. Josh December 3rd, 2007 at 10:00 am

    Can the theological debate, that’s ridiculous. Stick to baseball or, on occasion, Pete’s music tastes.

    This is fantastic news, I really thought he was gone. This makes me feel much better about our season, Santana or no.

  52. swo December 3rd, 2007 at 10:00 am

    Phil – some fans just don’t want to get their hopes up too high, to have them come crashing down. That’s why we don’t want to speculate just yet. Not until the Santana deal is done, at the very least. It’s a tense time for a lot of fans, that’s all.

  53. rodg12 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:01 am

    Mike NYY, that’s assuming we’d get Haren without giving up Hughes. I just don’t see how that’s possible since the Haren market will, in all likelihood, be more demanding than the Santana market because more teams can afford Haren. I really hope we can get Santana and don’t have to get in on the Haren bidding. Haren is not as good as Santana and will likely cost more.

  54. Yankee Fan in Boston December 3rd, 2007 at 10:01 am

    Why do people think it would be easy to acquire Haren? The A’s are going to ask for just as much as the Twins, given Haren’s contract status.

  55. DMan77 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:01 am

    The Yankees still won’t walk away from Johan..

    A rotation of

    Santana
    Wang
    Pettitte
    Joba
    Ian, Moose, etc

    Thats very pretty.

  56. gayle December 3rd, 2007 at 10:01 am

    Even with the question mark of Santana I would say the Yanks have had a pretty darn good offseason so far:

    Retain catcher – CHECK
    Retain best closer in baseball – CHECK
    Rtain best player in baseball – CHECK
    Retain/convinve Andy to play another year – CHECK
    Retain darn good bu catcher – CATCH

    IMO get Girardi – CHECK

  57. Martini6196 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:01 am

    I really don’t think the Pettitte announcement makes a difference in the Santana negotiations. Pettitte is only in NY for one more year.

    The only way it impacts this is if the Twins pull Santana off the block and keep him. Then the Yankees have Andy as a stopgap until Santana reaches free agency.

  58. Mike R. December 3rd, 2007 at 10:01 am

    Mike NYY- Save the Big Three
    December 3rd, 2007 at 9:58 am
    1) Haren————1) Santana
    2) Wang————–2) Beckett
    3) Joba————–3) Matsuzaka
    4) Phil————–4) Schilling
    5) Andy————–5) Lester

    That`s at least pretty close.

    I think that their top 2 would be stronger, but our bottom three would take their’s. I agree it is close to say the least.

  59. Yazman December 3rd, 2007 at 10:02 am

    AWESOME NEWS! Andy brings class, the tremendous work ethic, a ton of quality starts from the left side, and is a guy other teams do NOT want to face in October.

    My Dad had an interesting idea last night: would the Yanks consider a 6 man rotation?

    Limiting innings could be good for the 35+ year olds, and also for the 22 and younger crowd — all with an eye to October (not sure about Wang or, if he’s here, Santana — though it appears both could have benefitted from some additional arm strength in Sept/Oct).

    Is a 6 man rotation ever done, or just a bad idea?

  60. mel December 3rd, 2007 at 10:02 am

    Josh,

    I knew I left out something.

    Can we refrain from talking about religion, politics, and Springsteen?

  61. JRVJ December 3rd, 2007 at 10:02 am

    So Torre left, but in the end, the Yanks got back every one of their major FAs, including the big home-grown 3.

    Can somebody tell me again how Torre’s departure was going to wreck the Yanks ability to bring-in talent?

  62. Martini6196 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:02 am

    Can we stop arguing the existence of God on a Yankee message board!

  63. A-Point December 3rd, 2007 at 10:02 am

    Why are so many convinced that the Yankees were the LAST to know that Pettitte was indeed returning? I am sure he was talking to them long before the word got out.

    Think of the timing of all the different announcements, folks.
    1. Santana won’t allow a trade during the season (takes away Twins leverage a little)
    2. Santana reportedly says its either the Yankees or the Red Sox.
    3. Hank says enough – the deal is out there, either take it or the RS offer, but no more games.
    4. Pettitte announcing his return.

    The only sweeter thing would have been if Johan said the only team he will go to would be the Yankees, but no player would ever state that as it gives up their bargaining power.

  64. Mike NYY- Save the Big Three December 3rd, 2007 at 10:02 am

    Jeff: “Let’s focus on 2008 first.” You do realize the board has zero to do with personnel decisions, don’t you? I have no need to “focus” on 2008.

    So you think….. :D

    Didn’t the Mariners coaches actually read a post on a blog about Felix Hernandez’s mechanics that they themselves hadn’t noticed?

    Sooooooo, you never know. Let me live in my happy fantasy world in which Brian Cashman offers up eevery trade proposal we make on this blog. :D

  65. Doreen December 3rd, 2007 at 10:02 am

    Mike NYY -

    If Haren’s in the Yankees’ rotation, then Phil will not be, at least according to what the A’s want from the Yankees. I really think that with Pettitte coming back, the Yankees do not need to be trading their top pitching prospects for Haren. Santana, yes; Haren, no. And there will be more teams vying for Haren, so I doubt the requests for IPK and Hughes will change for the better.

  66. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 10:02 am

    Last season it appeared someone above was rooting for the Indians after sending the midges from the lake to attack Joba.

  67. .....YO..... December 3rd, 2007 at 10:03 am

    1) Santana————1) Beckett
    2) Wang————–2) Ben sheet
    3) Andy————–3) Matsuzaka
    4) MOOSE————–4) Schilling
    5) Joba————–5) Lester

    Let’s go Yankees.

  68. Dirk in Rockland December 3rd, 2007 at 10:03 am

    Imagine the possibilities…. for 2008

    Santana Pettitte Santana
    Wang Wang Wang
    Pettitte Hughes Pettitte
    Chamberlain Chamberlain Chamberlain
    Kennedy/ Moose Kennedy/ Moose Hughes

    And yes, I shouldn’t be thinking of 2009 already… but the possibilities are endless. For one…..

    Santana
    Wang
    Sabathia
    Chamberlain
    Kennedy/ Hughes

    Welcome back Andy!!

  69. Martini6196 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:04 am

    People who think the Yankees will get Haren without giving up Hughes are smoking something that I want.

  70. mel December 3rd, 2007 at 10:04 am

    Gayle,

    That’s a lot of checks with a lot of zeroes. :)

  71. swo December 3rd, 2007 at 10:04 am

    gayle – Excellent post. So many people forget that the Yankees had enormous question marks going into this offseason. Yet before the Winter Meetings, the Yankees are already primed to compete next season.

  72. El Comaduce December 3rd, 2007 at 10:04 am

    We absolutely do not need Santana.

    i wish that was true

  73. Kathleen December 3rd, 2007 at 10:05 am

    YAYYYYYYYYY. Now I hope the Yankees tell the Twinkies to enjoy Crispy Critter. LOL!

  74. Mike NYY- Save the Big Three December 3rd, 2007 at 10:05 am

    Can we refrain from talking about religion, politics, and Springsteen?

    May we discuss Ozzy Osbourne?

  75. SAndMan December 3rd, 2007 at 10:05 am

    Andrew-

    To bad dumb people like you exist.

    But glad to have Pettitte Back.Even if the Red Sox got Haren Petitte and Santana would be sick.

  76. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 10:07 am

    Tracks 1, 2, 6, and 7 off of Springsteen’s Magic CD are great!

    (I hear God still listens to Sinatra…in person.)

  77. Mike NYY- Save the Big Three December 3rd, 2007 at 10:07 am

    Bedard then instead of Haren? I`m not sure Haren would cost Hughes. Kennedy, Jackson, and a lower prospect might be enough.

  78. Mike R. December 3rd, 2007 at 10:07 am

    …..YO…..
    December 3rd, 2007 at 10:03 am
    1) Santana————1) Beckett
    2) Wang————–2) Ben sheet
    3) Andy————–3) Matsuzaka
    4) MOOSE————–4) Schilling
    5) Joba————–5) Lester

    Let’s go Yankees.

    Do you think that Moose is a better option than Kennedy next year? Not trying to be an @$$, it’s an honest question.

  79. Doreen December 3rd, 2007 at 10:07 am

    A-Point –

    I haven’t seen anyone post that they thought the Yankees were the last to know about Andy. I always assume that since it’s in the papers, the person reading is among the last to know.

  80. Peter Abraham December 3rd, 2007 at 10:07 am

    If people start arguing about religion and/or politics on this blog, I’ll delete every single post. That is not the direction we’re going, trust me on that.

    Baseballl, pop culture, other sports from time to time. Not religion and politics.

  81. Dirk in Rockland December 3rd, 2007 at 10:08 am

    Edit button needed!! 3 possibilites for 2008

    1) Santana
    Wang
    Pettitte
    Chamberlain
    Kennedy/ Moose

    2) Pettitte
    Wang
    Hughes
    Chamberlain
    Moose/ Kennedy

    3) Santana
    Wang
    Pettitte
    Chamberlain
    Hughes

  82. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 10:09 am

    The God of this Blog has spoken!

  83. hmmm December 3rd, 2007 at 10:09 am

    the Yankees will still pursue Santana, but i think the Pettitte news means they won’t pursue Haren.

    Pettitte is fairly comparable to Haren.

    Haren is not worth the price.

    i am against trading Hughes, but i can at least see that Santana is worth trading for.

  84. SavePhilHughes December 3rd, 2007 at 10:09 am

    Save Phil Hughes.
    Thrilled Andy will be back.

  85. Fleas December 3rd, 2007 at 10:10 am

    Great News about Pet!

    I’m not playing games with Beane, he is asking more than the Twinkies just to start negotiations.

    “Billy Beane is happy to field offers on Dan Haren and Joe Blanton, but he’ll require a king’s ransom for either pitcher. Jayson Stark says Beane asked the Yankees for two of Phil Hughes, Joba Chamberlain, and Ian Kennedy for Haren. ”

    Forget it, I’d take Santana over Haren any day!

    Again, that is great news about Pet, but weird timing.. maybe it’s just a coincidence but in the mix of all this Santana stuff, Pet changes his mind before the result?

    ANyway I am not complaining. WB Andy!

  86. J-Dawg December 3rd, 2007 at 10:11 am

    Hopefully the Twins will like this “best offer” that the Yankees have made. Getting Santana would eliminate the Yankees from the Dan Haren sweepstakes, which is fine. They would have more than enough pitching depth, hopefully. It’s no easy task dealing with Oakland. Mr. Beane is a smart guy, and from what I have heard, a much better negotiator than Mr. Bean. :)

  87. A-Point December 3rd, 2007 at 10:11 am

    Andrew, that is entirely up to God, not us.

    SAndMan, there is no guarantee that the Sox will go after Haren if they don’t get Santana. Its not like there is a pressing need for another starting pitcher for them. They have 6 right now. I doubt they make much of a look there, as it will cost too much, and if the Yankees get Santana because the RS weren’t willing to part with certain players, then they aren’t going to get Haren for those same players.

  88. hmmm December 3rd, 2007 at 10:13 am

    “Baseballl, pop culture, other sports from time to time. Not religion and politics.”

    AMEN! Pete, you are a Godsend. this post is like my prayers being answered. Thank God you are here.

  89. swo December 3rd, 2007 at 10:13 am

    J-Dawg – But I doubt Billy Beane could take off his underwear without taking his pants off. That’s something only Mr. Bean can do, and something Mr. Beane can only wish he can do.

  90. Charlie Hayes for 3B! December 3rd, 2007 at 10:14 am

    Please please please don’t trade for Santana. Make the Twins keep him, let him become a free agent next year, then throw Giambi’a, Pettite’s, and Moose’s money at him!

  91. G. Love December 3rd, 2007 at 10:14 am

    If we make the deal for Johan, anyone else think the next announcement is Joba is back to the pen? With 6 SP’s for 5 spots, I can see it happening.

    It’s a win now team for next year with Joba in 8th all season in front of Mo and Johan, Andy, Wang, Mussina, IPK in the rotation.

  92. mel December 3rd, 2007 at 10:14 am

    All of us would rather see IPK on the mound than Andy, but the reality is that Moose is getting paid and he’s a veteran. I have no doubt that this team will embrace Joe G., but somehow I think that Moose/Joe G. dynamic will be the one to watch. Moose is a little curmudgeony and depending on how many bodies we have, his role will be in flux. Not saying there would be a problem, but it’s certainly possible.

  93. David December 3rd, 2007 at 10:14 am

    They should pull Phil Hughes out of the Santana deal right now. Put the Kennedy deal back on the table.

  94. Kill-Schill(ing) December 3rd, 2007 at 10:15 am

    Nice Work, Pete. Thanks for the update.

    Very fortuitous too. It enhances the Yankees’ leverage with the Twins. I bet Hank played his part in the timing of this announcement as well.

  95. vrsce December 3rd, 2007 at 10:15 am

    Pete,
    Re: your religion/politics dictum.

    What if your religion is the Yankees?

  96. El Comaduce December 3rd, 2007 at 10:15 am

    Pettitte is fairly comparable to Haren.

    Haren is not worth the price.

    Well said hmmmmmmmmm

    We are not getting bedard, we are in the same division… Teams rarely trade talented players within the division.

    Haren will be very expensive, because there is no money issues, there is a much higher demand..

  97. raymagnetic December 3rd, 2007 at 10:15 am

    Why are so many convinced that the Yankees were the LAST to know that Pettitte was indeed returning? I am sure he was talking to them long before the word got out.

    I agree. When Pettitte originally opted out didn’t he mention the 40 Man? Maybe it was all done so that the Yankees would have an extra roster spot. Sort of a gentleman’s agreement.

  98. BIlly December 3rd, 2007 at 10:16 am

    So on this blog we can’t talk about religion, politics, or the ins and outs of hyperlink coding.

    This is my kind of place. If we can put American Idol, Survivor and Meg Ryan movies on the banned list, I may never leave.

  99. DMan77 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:18 am

    Also, another season of having Andy takk to our young pitchers is a nice intangable..

    Experience speaks volumes, I think.

  100. In Joba We Trust December 3rd, 2007 at 10:18 am

    great start to winter meetings

  101. A-Point December 3rd, 2007 at 10:18 am

    Doreen, the point about the Yankees knowing Andy’s decision earlier means that they knew they could put up a deadline and not get burned by it. Andy’s return coming out on the same day of the deadline is no coincidence, and I really doubt that Santana’s words were either.

    Is it tampering if some players talk and pass along messages from others? How would it be proven? I wouldn’t be surprised to find out that Santana has ties to Yankee players.

  102. jorge December 3rd, 2007 at 10:18 am

    Lets hope hank wants to be bold, pull highes out of the deal and tell them they can have kennedy, melky, and tabata.

  103. gayle December 3rd, 2007 at 10:19 am

    For some of us baseball is religon lol. Also I agree with G Love if we get Santana might the Yankees consider keeping JOba in the pen for another year it solves the 8th inning that is for sure. I am not baseball knowledgable enough to know how that effects his growth in term of starting ie innings etc etc but it certainly seems to be an idea wih merit

  104. sunny615 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:19 am

    The Yankees still need a unquestioned #1 – and that’s Santana. The return of Pettitte solidifies the rotation, but the Yankees should still pursue Santana.

  105. frits December 3rd, 2007 at 10:19 am

    normally i hate it when abraham gets dictatorial on this blog, but that was d@mn funny.

    “If people start arguing about religion and/or politics on this blog, I’ll delete every single post. “

  106. mel December 3rd, 2007 at 10:20 am

    Billy,

    What’s wrong with Sleepless in Seattle and When Harry Met Sally? They’re chick flicks, but Billy Crystal played an NBA ref and there was the fake orgasm in the diner scene.

  107. jay destro December 3rd, 2007 at 10:20 am

    GET ME SANTANA.

  108. Jeff NJ December 3rd, 2007 at 10:20 am

    Seriously, I often feel like my true religion is Yankeeism.

    Anyway, to answer a few other posters, no I wasn’t kidding when I said that Andy felt pressure or the Yankees might rescind it. I am not convinced that is right, but it is a thought that may have something to it. Bottom line is something prompted Andy to decide yesterday and announce today. Maybe he is doing it to put the pressure on the Twins and help his team get this deal done, that would be noble.

    Either way, the 2008 team looks to be improved over 2007 even though we haven’t signed one free agent or made one free agent signing. That’s the beuaty of counting on young player’s improvement. I am optimistic Girardi will help though.

  109. Ranting Guy December 3rd, 2007 at 10:21 am

    PK – if, as you say, early reports say Oakland wants Hughes + Kennedy for Haren then fine.

    If NY still goes for Santana, whether with Hughes or backing off to Kennedy, then maybe Boston would have to up their ante to at least 2 of Smellsbury, Laptop and Uncle Fester for either a Santana deal with the Twinkies, or a Haren deal with Billy Bibbit.

  110. rodg12 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:21 am

    Some info on Joba as a starter per Keith Law….

    The Yankees have issued a long list of untouchables — just as they did in July trade talks — but Joba Chamberlain clearly tops the list. Best known to casual fans as a dominant reliever and a favorite target of midges, Chamberlain also projects as a No. 1 starter should the Yankees follow through on their plans to return him to the rotation. He has a plus fastball up to 98 and holds his velocity deep into games, with an excellent slider. His curve and changeup are projected to be average pitches.

  111. Mister Delaware December 3rd, 2007 at 10:21 am

    Put the same Hughes-less offer (Kennedy/Tabata/Horne?) on the table for Oakland, Minnesota and Baltimore (and I guess Cleveland, just in case) and see who jumps first.

  112. Jeff NJ December 3rd, 2007 at 10:21 am

    edit button “even though we haven’t signed one free agent or made one trade”

  113. PK December 3rd, 2007 at 10:21 am

    People, say it with me.. NO JOBA TO THE PEN!

    We do not waste his talents in a set-up role. We put him in a position where he can give us the most innings. When you think of Joba, think Verlander and Liriano, NOT Broxton.

  114. Buddy Biancalana December 3rd, 2007 at 10:21 am

    So does Andy=Johan? Obviously not, I say pull the offer of Hughes & sub in Kennedy. The Red Sox will walk if the Yankees pull out. The Yanks have some new leverage. They should really use it.

  115. Mel (Welcome Back) December 3rd, 2007 at 10:21 am

    Thank you Andy man!!!!

    Woke up this morning to the great new england storm but my school REFUSES to ever cancel classes…thought this was going to be a crappy day but things sure are looking up.

  116. Joe from Long Island December 3rd, 2007 at 10:22 am

    Pull Hughes.

    Like they say in business, “Things changed.”

  117. ~Adam. December 3rd, 2007 at 10:22 am

    I agree with Pete. If you want to talk politics, go to The Neo-Con Fascist 38Pitches.com’s website.

  118. hmmm December 3rd, 2007 at 10:23 am

    “Maybe it was all done so that the Yankees would have an extra roster spot. Sort of a gentleman’s agreement.”

    if that’s the case, Sean Henn owes Pettitte a steak dinner.

  119. Joe from Long Island December 3rd, 2007 at 10:23 am

    And Do Not put Joba in the ‘pen.

    Would you have put a young Roger Clemens in the ‘pen?

  120. BIlly December 3rd, 2007 at 10:23 am

    Mel –

    No good reason, just can’t take her movies. In other words, a totally random reaction based on no special knowledge which leads me to make decisions without a valid reason.

    I think that qualifies me to run the Knicks.

  121. sunny615 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:24 am

    mel
    December 3rd, 2007 at 10:20 am
    Billy,

    What’s wrong with Sleepless in Seattle and When Harry Met Sally? They’re chick flicks, but Billy Crystal played an NBA ref and there was the fake orgasm in the diner scene.

    Actually, Billy Crystal played a NBA ref in Forget Paris not Sleepless in Seattle – that was a Tom Hanks/Meg Ryan flick.

  122. Jeff NJ December 3rd, 2007 at 10:24 am

    Same offer should still stand, Hughes, Melky, Gonzalez and a low level scrub. I think the the fact that Andy is back makes this trade even more digestable for the Yankees, we can withstand Hughes’ loss better.

  123. whozat December 3rd, 2007 at 10:24 am

    “Limiting innings could be good for the 35+ year olds, and also for the 22 and younger crowd — all with an eye to October (not sure about Wang or, if he’s here, Santana — though it appears both could have benefitted from some additional arm strength in Sept/Oct).”

    Wang was throwing too hard in October. He didn’t need more arm strength.

    And, while limiting innings could be a good thing…Moose is a feel pitcher and hates extra rest, Andy feels less comfortable with extra rest, and Wang is demonstrably worse with extra rest (not just last post-season, but whenever he gets too much rest he’s usually up with his sinker for a while).

    And the kids have never pitched on extra rest. And, are you REALLY going to pay 22 – 25 million dollars to a guy and then have him make 25 starts instead of 35?

  124. raymagnetic December 3rd, 2007 at 10:25 am

    People, say it with me.. NO JOBA TO THE PEN!

    We do not waste his talents in a set-up role. We put him in a position where he can give us the most innings. When you think of Joba, think Verlander and Liriano, NOT Broxton

    I really don’t get this argument right here. Having starters begin their careers in the bullpen is a tried and true method that has been very successful in the past.

    Heck, even Gator was in the bullpen at one point and it didn’t stunt his growth any.

    Truth is if the Yankees get Santana putting Joba back in the pen will only make the team stronger. One year in the pen is not going to kill Joba’s career.

  125. mel December 3rd, 2007 at 10:25 am

    Ugh. They save Henn, but not Hughes? Ugh.

  126. Josh T December 3rd, 2007 at 10:25 am

    Would is be a terrible thought to move Mussina into the pen?

  127. Doug December 3rd, 2007 at 10:25 am

    Guys this is great news, but we have the same team that lost in the first round last year. Our work is not done yet

  128. A-Point December 3rd, 2007 at 10:26 am

    Buddy, I don’t think the Yankees have new leverage that they were unaware of. That was why the discussion took days to figure out about offering Hughes. They knew Andy was returning. The announced return of Andy is meant to help make the Twins jump on the offer of Hughes before they pull it off the table.

    The Twins now see that there is no desperation on the Yankees to make the deal either.

  129. El Comaduce December 3rd, 2007 at 10:26 am

    Putting Joba in the pen for another year will stunt his growth… IF you really think he has 3 plus pitches and a decent fourth, he is worth more in the rotation…

    He needs to build the arm so he can throw innings…

    The yankees have a ton of righty talent – from what i have been reading, if horne can get some control with the heater, we might be able to do the same thing with him this year…

  130. swo December 3rd, 2007 at 10:27 am

    Not sure how acquiring Santana means Joba goes back to the pen. It’s the same amount of pitchers, just Hughes replaced by Santana.

    Santana
    Wang
    Pettitte
    Moose/Kennedy
    Joba

    Or if they stand pat:

    Wang
    Pettitte
    Moose/Kennedy
    Hughes
    Joba

    (in no particular order, obviously)

  131. mel December 3rd, 2007 at 10:27 am

    Sunny,

    Thanks. Knew the Tom Hanks/Meg Ryan deal, but I must’ve got my wires crossed on the NBA ref(erence).

  132. A-Point December 3rd, 2007 at 10:27 am

    Doug, how do you figure that, when the rotation really didn’t include Joba and Kennedy as starters?

  133. sunny615 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:29 am

    The difference between Henn and Hughes is that nobody wants Henn.

  134. Buddy Biancalana December 3rd, 2007 at 10:30 am

    A Point-

    December 3rd, 2007 at 10:26 am

    Buddy, I don’t think the Yankees have new leverage that they were unaware of. That was why the discussion took days to figure out about offering Hughes. They knew Andy was returning. The announced return of Andy is meant to help make the Twins jump on the offer of Hughes before they pull it off the table.

    The Twins now see that there is no desperation on the Yankees to make the deal either.
    ———————————————————–
    So isn’t that new leverage?

  135. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 10:30 am

    Perfect spot for Henn: Dodgers bullpen. Torre will find a way to use him in tight spots.

  136. ~Adam. December 3rd, 2007 at 10:31 am

    Cashman is going to have his way with Bill Smith.

  137. Juke Early December 3rd, 2007 at 10:32 am

    Who in G*d’s name IS Andrew?

  138. sunny615 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:33 am

    I don’t think there’s any new leverage because the Yankees need for a number 1 hasn’t diminshed just because Pettitte returned (and this is no disrespect to Pettitte). When Posada said we need a #1, he wasn’t referring to Pettitte, he was talking about Santana.

  139. Paul9 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:34 am

    Will the sox really give Santana 25 mil a year?

  140. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 10:34 am

    Cash will not have his way with Smith. The new Twins GM is a smart baseball man and knows this is his shot to get something other than two draft picks when Santana walks. He’ll get a good deal for the Twins. Both sides will win.

  141. ~Adam. December 3rd, 2007 at 10:35 am

    I don’t think joba out of the pen all year is a bad idea. He’s a kid. And he’ll learn pressure packed situational pitching at the same strengthen the hell out of our pen. Starting him too soon, or anyone ofr that matter is Tommy John waiting to happen.

  142. Bobkatz December 3rd, 2007 at 10:35 am

    1. What you are reading is true. Unless you are French and can’t understand. What you are reading is what they want you to read. If you read it backwards it will read, “Paul is dead, Paul is dead.”

    2. As I said many times, Santana will exercise his ntc if traded to Boston. The Bruins that is. That is all I can say. You will read only what they tell you to read or only what I tell you to read.

    3. If you build it, they will come.

    4. The Yanks will not relent and offer Hughes. Or they will. What ever I told you the last time. I forget.

  143. Joba the Great December 3rd, 2007 at 10:35 am

    Actually starting to really hope this deal falls through. Santana’s a stud, no doubt. But Hughes will only get better and will be a bargain at that price. And there’s this:

    – If Santana develops arm problems, you will regret dealing Hughes for him.

    – If Hughes develops arm problems, you will regret not trading him for Santana, but you’ll have $25 million a year in your pocket to address the shortfall.

  144. Seymour December 3rd, 2007 at 10:35 am

    I eagerly await posts from both Bobcat and Miller. Miller said last week that he will “for sure” have inside info as soon as the winter meetings began…I can’t wait for him to show up.

  145. El Comaduce December 3rd, 2007 at 10:37 am

    – If Santana develops arm problems, you will regret dealing Hughes for him.

    if aliens land in Yankee stadium – they will hopefully bring some help for our bullpen with them…

  146. A-Point December 3rd, 2007 at 10:37 am

    I would say that it’s new leverage for the Yankees to get the deal done, but I doubt it means they will change the offer.

  147. mel December 3rd, 2007 at 10:37 am

    It’ll be interesting to see what Matt and Minnysota think about this news and how it affects the negotiations.

  148. NCBRI December 3rd, 2007 at 10:37 am

    YES! Great news.

  149. Jeff December 3rd, 2007 at 10:37 am

    DON TRADE PHIL HUGHES!!!!!!

    WE WILL LIVE TO REGRET IT!!!!!!

  150. pat December 3rd, 2007 at 10:39 am

    be careful with alien analogies… look what happened last time some here used one of those :smile:

  151. Joba the Great December 3rd, 2007 at 10:39 am

    If the aliens bring a lefty, sign him.

  152. Buddy Biancalana December 3rd, 2007 at 10:39 am

    A Point-

    Yeah, just wishful thinking, not that I think having Kennedy is a bad thing.

  153. El Comaduce December 3rd, 2007 at 10:40 am

    We where kinda over a barrel before, we could not start the season with an andlyless johanless rotation… We are in pretty decent shape now… Plus we have karstens in reserve.

  154. hmmm December 3rd, 2007 at 10:40 am

    “The Yankees still need a unquestioned #1 – and that’s Santana. The return of Pettitte solidifies the rotation, but the Yankees should still pursue Santana.”

    which “unquestioned #1″ did Boston have going into last season? how about the 2005 White Sox? 2003 Marlins? 2002 Angels?

    if your definition of “unquestioned #1″ is Santana, how many are there in all of baseball, 5?

  155. jennifer- Hip Hip Jorge December 3rd, 2007 at 10:40 am

    So the Yankees right now have to clear 3 spots, assuming no trade is made.

  156. Jeff NJ December 3rd, 2007 at 10:41 am

    DOn’t worry about trading Hughes, if he is any good the Twins won’t be able to sign him in 5 years anyway. Guess who will his number one suiter with the biggest bank account? Look at is the Twins are getting a 5 year rental of Phil Hughes, once and future Yankee.

  157. The Dude December 3rd, 2007 at 10:41 am

    The timing is interesting. I still say Hughes is on the table, with Melky and a B-grade prospect. I think the sticking point for the Twins is that 3rd guy – they want an A, the Yankees won’t budge off a B. This is posturing – the Yankees aren’t as “desperate” anymore, and the thinking is that Minnesota might get scared to lose out on Hughes.

    I would be pleased as punch to aquire Santana, but I think Hughes will be very good pictcher in his own right, and it’s not as big a deal as some people might think. Andy, Wang, Hughes, and Joba is a great 1-4. Santana, Andy, Wang, and Joba is a better 1-4, but how much better? IMO, you’re not talking about playoffs/no playoffs, more like how tight is the race for the AL East crown going to be.

    Besides – the main need is the bullpen.

  158. bummy December 3rd, 2007 at 10:41 am

    What are the odds that they trade Melk, Hughes and someone else for Santana now? Hopefully zilch, I love the new direction of the Yankees.

  159. Guidryball December 3rd, 2007 at 10:42 am

    Wheres Mr. Bobcat when you need him?

  160. Don Capone December 3rd, 2007 at 10:43 am

    This is GREAT news!

  161. E-ROC December 3rd, 2007 at 10:44 am

    Getting Santana would be ”icing on the cake.” Thank God, Pettitte’s returning!

  162. Joba the Great December 3rd, 2007 at 10:44 am

    What is the general consensus on Horne? ESPN’s Keith Law said that he has better pure stuff than Kennedy, but his command is shaky. Maybe with the Big Three in the Bronx next year (hopefully), Nardi Contreras can make Horne the pet project in 2008.

  163. Nolan December 3rd, 2007 at 10:45 am

    Why do so many assume haren is going to be easier to get than Santana? If anything, he is going to cost MORE in prospects.

  164. CB December 3rd, 2007 at 10:45 am

    Andy coming back makes the yankees less desperate. He’s the perfect bridge as the kids mature on the job.

    But it also makes getting Santana for the 2008 season even more valuable.

    With Andy back adding Santana creates a very formidable staff. Not many staffs would be able to match either of those lefties, never mind both.

    Let’s see what Smith does. Will he really keep Santana for the season?

  165. Guidryball December 3rd, 2007 at 10:45 am

    Jeff:

    (All things being equal in terms of free-agent contracts proposed)

    Why would Hughes want to return to an organization that traded him off after spending the last three years calling him the jewel of their future? I sure as hell wouldn’t. The kid will be heartbroken and probably end up with Boston bc 1) it’ll be payback and 2) he grew up a Red Sox fan

  166. hmmm December 3rd, 2007 at 10:46 am

    at the end of the day, i think all this means is that the Twins will be forced to decide and i think they will accept the Yankees’ offer.

  167. Nolan December 3rd, 2007 at 10:48 am

    Heartbroken? Oh come on, he will go where the most money is.

  168. grafxkid December 3rd, 2007 at 10:48 am

    Nice. Great to have Andy back!!!

  169. DMan77 December 3rd, 2007 at 10:48 am

    hmmm-

    I hope its literalty ‘at the end of the day’..

    The waiting is the hardest part of this!

  170. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 10:48 am

    Gotta switch to the Kennedy package and build a deal from there. The Twins sat on the Hughes offer too long.

  171. Jeff NJ December 3rd, 2007 at 10:48 am

    Guidryball, 3 reasons why he or any baseball player would consider coming to a team: 1)Money, 2)Monetary Compensation and 3)Muchos Dineros.

  172. PK December 3rd, 2007 at 10:50 am

    raymagnetic,

    At some point, we are going to need to start building up his arm strength. It is vital for a pitcher at his age to increase his innings. Right now, he is on pace for 130 innings next year. If we use him as a reliever yet again, that’s only 80 innings, and in 2009, he will only be able to go 30 or so above that.

    Do we really want to waste 2 of his cost controlled years so he doesn’t even pitch over 150 innings each year? Seems like a waste of a perfectly good arm to me.

  173. Mister Delaware December 3rd, 2007 at 10:51 am

    “Why do so many assume haren is going to be easier to get than Santana? If anything, he is going to cost MORE in prospects.”

    I think some of us believe that Haren can be had for a package of 4 very good prospects rather than the one big name headliner package that Santana requires.

  174. CB December 3rd, 2007 at 10:52 am

    Did people who want Joba in the pen to develop or get used to “pressure packed sitations, etc. watch Justin Verlander pitch Detroit into the world series in 2006?

    Would Detroit have been better off taking it easy with Verlander and having him in the pen that year?

    How many times have the yankees gotten shut down by a dominant starter in the playoffs?

    Joba has shut down stuff and can bring it for 7-8 innings right now.

    The yankees are killing themselves right now to try to get santana because he’s a true ace.

    So we take the closest thing we’ve had to a internally grown true ace since guidry and put him in the pen?

  175. Joba the Great December 3rd, 2007 at 10:55 am

    Project P40 worked. From Tyler Kepner of the Times:

    “Calls and requests for him to return from Brian Cashman, Derek Jeter, Jorge Posada, Joe Girardi, among others, influenced him, as did an outpouring of requests from Yankees fans,” Randy Hendricks said, after the news was first reported by the Houston Chronicle.

  176. Mike NYY- Save the Big Three December 3rd, 2007 at 10:56 am

    Project P40 worked. From Tyler Kepner of the Times:

    WHo says we don;t influence personnel moves :D

  177. hmmm December 3rd, 2007 at 10:58 am

    the Yankees are NOT going to go after Haren unless it’s a package centered around Kennedy.

    if i had to guess, i would say if they don’t get Santana, they are content to start the season with Pettitte/Wang/Hughes/Kennedy/Joba/Moose.

    that is a very solid rotation, even if it lacks this “true #1″ everyone has been obsessed about for the last 2 months.

    who knows, maybe Pettitte or Joba or Hughes are already your playoff ace?

    think about it like this: had the yankees simply switched Pettitte and Wang in the ALDS with Pettitte going first, would the Yankees have won the series? would Pettitte have won game 1? he might have. what about game 4? maybe.

    in other words, maybe the Yankees HAD the personnel last season, but they were under-utilized by Torre.

  178. Paul9 December 3rd, 2007 at 11:02 am

    Pettitie is a bulldog the guy you want to pitch in the post season but he is not a number 1. Someone made a good point with the phil hughes and a scratch off.

    If somebody offered you $75 dollars or a scratch off and the scratch off COULD be worth $100 $50 or $20 what would you take. You take the sure bet $75.

    Hughes has a great upside but he is not proven like Santana. He is going to be good Im sure barring injury, but Santana is the best pitcher in the game and put him on a team that wins. He could win 22 games.

  179. raymagnetic December 3rd, 2007 at 11:02 am

    “raymagnetic,

    At some point, we are going to need to start building up his arm strength. It is vital for a pitcher at his age to increase his innings. Right now, he is on pace for 130 innings next year. If we use him as a reliever yet again, that’s only 80 innings, and in 2009, he will only be able to go 30 or so above that.

    Do we really want to waste 2 of his cost controlled years so he doesn’t even pitch over 150 innings each year? Seems like a waste of a perfectly good arm to me.”

    This is one way to look at it. However, what I think they should do is have him be a 2IP pitcher on most occasions when he does pitch. This would keep his innings total at about 100 or so. He could then pitch in a winter league to add more innings to his arm and in 2009 he could become a full time starter.

    To me, Joba being able to pitch the 7th & 8th innings a couple of games a week would make the Yankees more dangerous. In other words, use him like the 1996 Mariano Rivera who pitched 107IP’s.

    As far as cost controlled years, I seriously doubt the Yankees are worried about that, otherwise they would have never brought him up to the majors a year after being drafted.

  180. Mister Delaware December 3rd, 2007 at 11:03 am

    Sweeny Murti will be on WFAN from 11:00 to 12:00.

  181. ~Adam. December 3rd, 2007 at 11:03 am

    CB-

    How many young dominant starters had a career ending arm injury? That list is a lot longer than young dominant pitchers that shut people down in the playoffs.

    Don’t forget, the Yanks got Joba cuz everyone was afraid he had an injury.

    I agree that Joba has dominant stuff, and I ‘d love for him to be a starter. But their are worse ideas than nurturing him into a starter in the bullpen for a year. It is, afterall, his 2nd pro season.

    And don’t say he can go 7-8 innings strong cuz he never has at a professional level over a course of a season.

  182. CB December 3rd, 2007 at 11:04 am

    “The Oakland Athletics want Hughes and Kennedy for their All-Star starter, Dan Haren, an idea the Yankees would reject.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12.....f=baseball

    Oakland leak – probably but this tells you the stratosphere Beane is thinking in. Since when has Beane started making reasonable demands when he trades the few valuable assets he has?

    Never.

    Just look over all of the trades he’s made. He rarely sells cheaply because he always trades his valuable players when he has the leverage.

    Harren is 27 and signed for the next 3 years for a total of $16million. Think about that – in 3 years Haren will make only 60% of what Santana will in one year of his new contract.

    Beane is not going to ask for a reasonable package because he really doesn’t need to.

  183. Mike NYY- Save the Big Three December 3rd, 2007 at 11:04 am

    Steve Phillips on 1050 ESPN

    Gee, tough decision

  184. sunny615 December 3rd, 2007 at 11:04 am

    hmmm
    December 3rd, 2007 at 10:40 am
    “The Yankees still need a unquestioned #1 – and that’s Santana. The return of Pettitte solidifies the rotation, but the Yankees should still pursue Santana.”

    which “unquestioned #1″ did Boston have going into last season? how about the 2005 White Sox? 2003 Marlins? 2002 Angels?

    if your definition of “unquestioned #1″ is Santana, how many are there in all of baseball, 5?
    ——————————
    That wasn’t my point. You’re misreading my post. The Yankees have a chance to obtain one. You don’t rescind your offer with the return of one of your better starters. If anything this means we should do our best to get Santana as our rotation will be even better upon his arrival.

  185. jennifer- Hip Hip Jorge December 3rd, 2007 at 11:06 am

    Thanks Mister Delaware. Switched off xmas music. :) Let us know if Phillips says anything interesting on 1050.

  186. Mister Delaware December 3rd, 2007 at 11:07 am

    Is he going to do a pretend press conference where rotates between being Cashman, Epstein and Smith?

  187. Mike R. December 3rd, 2007 at 11:07 am

    Max Kellerman is really ripping into Steve Phillips (Kinda kidding, but still).

  188. raymagnetic December 3rd, 2007 at 11:07 am

    “Pettitie is a bulldog the guy you want to pitch in the post season but he is not a number 1.”

    No, he’s not a number 1 and yet the Yankees were still in position to win his start after he didn’t allow a run to score while pitching into the seventh inning.

    I guess that’s not exactly ace like pitching though, I would say it’s something close to it however.

  189. Mike R. December 3rd, 2007 at 11:08 am

    Phillips is giving us his usual Yankee Haterade.

  190. Mike NYY- Save the Big Three December 3rd, 2007 at 11:08 am

    Well, Phillips apparently doesn’t know that Santana said he`ll only waive his NTC for Boston or New York and said he could go to the Angels.

  191. hmmm December 3rd, 2007 at 11:08 am

    hey wait, i thought all the players were going to leave when they got rid of Torre?

    4 for 4.

  192. Mike NYY- Save the Big Three December 3rd, 2007 at 11:08 am

    Apparently Melky is a fat, slow, 4th OF’er who will never get any better

  193. erikp December 3rd, 2007 at 11:09 am

    hmmm…

    so true. All Torre was able to poach was a few coaches.

  194. Mike R. December 3rd, 2007 at 11:09 am

    Phillips also believes the Mets are brilliant and that Ryan Church is “very underrated”

  195. Mike NYY- Save the Big Three December 3rd, 2007 at 11:10 am

    But Milledge is still better than Melky

  196. Mike NYY- Save the Big Three December 3rd, 2007 at 11:10 am

    If the Twins don’t like Melky why are we offering him?

  197. hmmm December 3rd, 2007 at 11:12 am

    “You don’t rescind your offer with the return of one of your better starters. If anything this means we should do our best to get Santana as our rotation will be even better upon his arrival.”

    i still think they will get Santana.

    i was just saying that with Pettitte, i don’t think they HAVE to anymore.

    Boston will probably still be ahead on paper to start the season, but just remember that the team you start the season with is not necessarily the team you end up with.

    if the Yankees did NOTHING else but sign someone like Riske, i would be comfortable starting the season. they have the chips to make a move at the deadline if they need to.

    we don’t know what will happen. maybe someone like Sanchex or Melancon emerges as a bullpen ace down the stretch. it’s not like Joba was on anyone’s radar at this time last year. maybe a pitcher no one considered gets put on the trade block.

    i think this team is VERY close right now.

  198. CB December 3rd, 2007 at 11:15 am

    Adam,

    First off – let’s put this Joba was hurt in college stuff to rest. He had a triceps tendinitis – that is not a big deal in anyway. Teams were very worried about how Joba had once been fat.

    When Joba was drafted I remember someone compared him to Sidney Ponson.

    Those people were absolutely wrong.

    Second – Since when do pitchers in the bull pen get “nurtured?”

    They don’t – they get abused because they can’t get regular rest. This is not a Joe Torre issue. Relievers burn out left and right all the time. That’s one of the reason’s Mo is so amazing.

    They cannot have Joba protected by the Joba rules for an entire year. He will get used as a regular reliever – back to back days, warming up without coming in, etc.

    That is not nurturing. Santana came up this way starting in the pen becasue he was picked up in the rule V draft not to nurture him.

    What PK said before is exactly right. You stick Joba in the pen this year you are damaging his development significantly in two ways.

    First – he threw 146 innings this year. In the pen next year he won’t throw more than 70. You won’t be developing his arm strenght. It’ll go backwards. So two years from now if you want to put him in the rotation how many innings can he throw if he only throws 70 in 2008?

    Second – joba needs to work on his 3rd and 4th pitches. They are both decent right now but have the potential to be very good. Coming out of the pen he only needs two pitches – fastball slider. He just won’t get better.

    Putting a guy with this kind of talent in the pen may make it more likely for him to get hurt, blocks him from developing arm strength and prevents him from developing his complementary pitches.

  199. winfield killed my seagull December 3rd, 2007 at 11:15 am

    Excellent…(said with devilish grin while palms and fingertips touch together)

    now don’t overpay for santana!!!keep hughes!!

  200. sunny615 December 3rd, 2007 at 11:16 am

    hmmm – that I agree with. This is a solid team with all the pieces in place, but the acquisition of Santana – without a doubt – puts this team on a more level playing field with Boston IMO.

  201. franklyn December 3rd, 2007 at 11:16 am

    wonderful news pete!

  202. Martini6196 December 3rd, 2007 at 11:16 am

    Sweeny Murti is on WFAN right now saying that the Twins could hold onto Santana and trade him at the deadline. Doesn’t he know Santana said he’s not getting traded midseason?

  203. Irabu's Son December 3rd, 2007 at 11:17 am

    YOWZA!!

    Now cooler heads will prevail and we can rebuild the rotation with Hughes, Joba, and Kennedy instead of overpaying for Santana, hopefully.

  204. Mister Delaware December 3rd, 2007 at 11:17 am

    If the Twins are out of contention, what are the odds that Santana would refuse a July trade to NYY/Boston?

  205. raymagnetic December 3rd, 2007 at 11:18 am

    First – he threw 146 innings this year. In the pen next year he won’t throw more than 70. You won’t be developing his arm strenght. It’ll go backwards. So two years from now if you want to put him in the rotation how many innings can he throw if he only throws 70 in 2008?

    Second – joba needs to work on his 3rd and 4th pitches. They are both decent right now but have the potential to be very good. Coming out of the pen he only needs two pitches – fastball slider. He just won’t get better.

    Putting a guy with this kind of talent in the pen may make it more likely for him to get hurt, blocks him from developing arm strength and prevents him from developing his complementary pitches.

    Please run this argument across Earl Weaver and explain to him how horrible a pitcher Jim Palmer amongst others were because they started their careers in the bullpen.

  206. whozat December 3rd, 2007 at 11:18 am

    “If somebody offered you $75 dollars or a scratch off and the scratch off COULD be worth $100 $50 or $20 what would you take. You take the sure bet $75.”

    To me, it’s more like a sure $75, and a scratch off that could be worth as much as $100, but no less than $50. Because of his control and the fact that he’ll have his legs underneath him all year (like we saw in Sept and Oct), I think Hughes is extremely unlikely to bust, barring freak injuries. A guy like Horne, on the other hand, with “great stuff but spotty control” is one of those guys that is very likely to struggle, at least early on, and may never get it together.

  207. jennifer- Hip Hip Jorge December 3rd, 2007 at 11:18 am

    Oh come onSantana would agree to be traded if his team was in last place and they wanted to trade him to a first place team. Is he just saying that so they move quicker.

  208. Shamus December 3rd, 2007 at 11:19 am

    WOw– what a way to wake up…

    A foot of snow and Andy Pettitte is coming back…

    If I’m Cashman (and this upcoming opinion is probably why I don’t have Cashman’s job), I pull Hughes, say new offer is IPK, Horne, Melky and Gardner/or Gonzalez…

    And I say, “Let me know by the time the Daily Show with Jon Stewart starts tonight…or we’re out.”

    With Andy back one more year, and Moose, I think Wang and the Lethal Weapon III could contend, especially with that lineup bahind them, right now, as a team, minus an-under-the radar arm or two for the bullpen.

    Am I crazy?

  209. Martini6196 December 3rd, 2007 at 11:20 am

    “jennifer- Hip Hip Jorge
    December 3rd, 2007 at 11:18 am
    Oh come onSantana would agree to be traded if his team was in last place and they wanted to trade him to a first place team. Is he just saying that so they move quicker.”

    Ok that may be true but he probably won’t sign an extension at that point meaning the Twins will get much less for him at the deadline. If he starts the season as a Twin he is going to free agency.

  210. sunny615 December 3rd, 2007 at 11:20 am

    Hughes and Melky I don’t believe is overpaying. Hughes, Melky and Horne/Tabata/AJax/Kennedy/or Betances is overpaying. If the Twins stand pay on that demand, the Yankees should walk away.

  211. On D Ball December 3rd, 2007 at 11:20 am

    Pete,

    It was nice of you to give credit to the Houston Chronicle.

    Shows you are a class act.

  212. keith December 3rd, 2007 at 11:21 am

    I can’t believe people on this blog are still clamoring for Joba to be put into the pen. It’s unreal.

    Let’s trade for Johan and then put him in the bullpen with Joba and Mariano and then we can make it a FOUR INNING GAME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Igawa for 4, Joba for 2, Johan for 2 and then teh bridge to mo is complete!!11!1

  213. Kyle From CT December 3rd, 2007 at 11:23 am

    I think its brilliant that Hank put a deadline on this thing. its getting ridiculous, and with the Red Sox offers it will only get more ridiculous. I say if the Twins don’t take our offer we move forward with what we have: Wang, Pettitte, Moose, Hughes, Chamberlain and Kennedy as the 6th. Next year, assuming Pettitte and Moose walk, we can try our hand at picking up Santana when hes a free agent, cause I doubt he’ll get traded mid-season this year.

  214. whozat December 3rd, 2007 at 11:23 am

    “Please run this argument across Earl Weaver and explain to him how horrible a pitcher Jim Palmer amongst others were because they started their careers in the bullpen.”

    But how long did it take them to develop? Would having Joba shelve his changeup for ANOTHER year be a good idea for getting him to be a dominant starter ASAP?

  215. Chicago Dave December 3rd, 2007 at 11:25 am

    I agree with those that say pull Hughes from the deal NOW. With Pettitte back in the fold, it’s time to play hardball with the Twinkies. I honestly don’t care if Boston gets Santana at this point.

  216. Mister Delaware December 3rd, 2007 at 11:26 am

    As someone else alluded to, Palmer came up in the pen a full decade before free agency. That does (or probably should) change the way you utilize your high-end starting prospects.

  217. roundabout December 3rd, 2007 at 11:27 am

    It’s great Pettitte is coming back – gives the Yanks a year’s grace to learn if Hughes, Kennedy and Chamberlain can be successful starters (Putting potential aside, we don’t know the answers YET).
    Why do people think Billy Beane will not demand Hughes for Haren? Haren is not Santana, but is not that far off.

  218. ND Yank December 3rd, 2007 at 11:27 am

    What was that stat that SJ44 was reciting over and over about Santana not giving up more than X amount of earned runs last year in X amount of his starts?

  219. Phil December 3rd, 2007 at 11:28 am

    Palmer also had to overvcome a ton of injuries from early career misuse to make it to the Hall of Fame. He was a very rare pitcher. They thought his career was over two or three different times when he was starting out.

  220. ~Adam. December 3rd, 2007 at 11:28 am

    CB-

    You’re right on all your points. But I still don’t think it’s a terrible idea for one season. You’re right he needs his arm strength built, but come August we don’t want to have to shut him down.

    And triceps tendonitis is a big deal considering its a symptom of an impigment in the elbow combined with a repitive motion. And someone as young as Joba is not fully grown no matter how big he is, especially at his joints. No, Triceps tendonitis is not a symptom of TJ, but it’s not a good sign either, the way biceps tendonitis is not good sign for a shoulder. It was plenty to scare every team in baseball.

    I can think of a starter who was ‘nurtured in the pen’. Johan Santana.

    It raises a question though, how will the Yanks maximize Joba’s innings, so by the end of the year, he’s maxing out innings and maxing effectiveness.

  221. rodg12 December 3rd, 2007 at 11:28 am

    It was….Santana only gave up more than 4 runs in 4 starts last year.

  222. keith December 3rd, 2007 at 11:28 am

    I think it was he gave up 4ER or more 4 times in 30 something starts.

  223. raymagnetic December 3rd, 2007 at 11:29 am

    But how long did it take them to develop? Would having Joba shelve his changeup for ANOTHER year be a good idea for getting him to be a dominant starter ASAP?

    Who’s to say putting Joba in the pen makes him shelve any of his pitches.

    Question, when the Dodgers put Chad Billingsley into the bullpen did it make him a worse or better pitcher?

    Truth is Joba has 30 ML innings. 30! He’s only going to pitch about 150IP’s in the rotation anyway.

    100IP’s in the bullpen or 150IP’s in the rotation. Which one is greater?

  224. Annie Savoy December 3rd, 2007 at 11:30 am

    OK – now that Andy is back, let’s close the trading door, keep Hughes and Melky and let Joe Girardi start making his plans.

    Someone else can trade for Santana the next time around.

    Oh, and don’t forget that Hank says that Joba is a Starting Pitcher. And, that’s final.

  225. VTyankee fan December 3rd, 2007 at 11:30 am

    This has been a great 0ff-season for all things Yankee.

    I can’t wait to see Joba as a starter. A great chance to see him make a guy look silly 2 or 3 times not just once.

    Glad that Andy is back(along with Mo and Jorge), but will be sad to see Hughes and Cabrerra go if we get Santana.

    I think every one will secretly miss Serling’s call of”the Melkman delivers” after a big hit or defensive gem if he goes. But that the way baseball goes

    At least we’ll still have “A-bombs from A-rod”!!

  226. Mister Delaware December 3rd, 2007 at 11:30 am

    And he gave up atleast 4 in 5 of his last 7 starts. All depends on how you cut the numbers.

  227. mary ellen December 3rd, 2007 at 11:31 am

    This is an amazing early Christmas present – THANK YOU ANDY!!!

  228. The Bronx Stop December 3rd, 2007 at 11:32 am

    I think I love you, so what am I so afraid of…I’m afraid of what I’m not sure of…..your fastball there is no cure for…….Johan Santana that song is dedicated to you from me.

  229. erikp December 3rd, 2007 at 11:34 am

    I don’t think we can resaonably assume we’d be in as good a position next year as we are right now, now that Pettitte signs. You have to assume that at least one of the Hughes/Joba/Kennedy either has a weak year or gets injured, and is consequently worth less and puts the Yanks in a worse bargaining postion than they are now. At this moment, those 3 guys are all relatively untarnished and at their highest potential value. Sure, they could all have great years and fulfill all the expectations we have, in which case we probably have no need to do anything after 2008, but history/probability says otherwise. I say you still make the Santana trade if Hughes/Melky/one prospect gets in done.

  230. Yanksrule57 December 3rd, 2007 at 11:34 am

    While sifting thru the nearly 2000 plus posts regarding potential Santana news this weekend, how many of you read the article about Hank S. that said Tino Martinez was coming back to work for the Yankees?
    Good to hear, but the article only speculated on what the “Bamtino’s” new role would be.

  231. Jax December 3rd, 2007 at 11:34 am

    What’s wrong with going with Pettitte,Wang and the three pitchers? I rather give up 2 draft picks than give up Hughes,Melky+

  232. The Bronx Stop December 3rd, 2007 at 11:35 am

    Yanks Rule-
    Click my name and scroll down a few posts….

  233. CB December 3rd, 2007 at 11:35 am

    “Please run this argument across Earl Weaver and explain to him how horrible a pitcher Jim Palmer amongst others were because they started their careers in the bullpen.”

    People who keep bringing up this mantra of Earl Weaver and Jim Palmer coming up through the pen never check to see what Weaver actually did with palmer.

    Here’s Palmer’s workload

    1965 Age 20 IP – 92
    1966 IP – 208
    1967 IP – 84 (spent most of year in minors)
    1968 IP – 37 (most of year in minors)
    1969 IP – 181
    1970 IP – 305

    No manager or organization would ever do this now. They would be fired. Palmer got very, very lucky.

    Palmer’s workload jerked up and down terribly from age 20 to 25 when he finally settled in the rotation.

    From 1965 to 1966 his innings pitched increased 220%!! Between 1969 and 1970 his innings pitched increased 170%!!

    This is good development? This is awful. Now back then they didn’t know any better I supposed.

    But to hold baseball as it was in 1965 to 1970 as a model for baseball now is absurd. Modern medicine may have developed a bit from 1969 to now for instance.

    Right now with good young pitchers organizations try not to increase their innings pitched by more than 30% from one season to a next.

    That’s already what the yankees have said is their development model.

    If Joba throws 70 innings in 2008 he won’t be able to be a regular starter or even close in 2009 or 2010.

  234. Frank Discussion December 3rd, 2007 at 11:35 am

    Great news about Andy returning, nice way to start off the week. Perhaps the upcoming meetings will provide the opportunity for Cashman to go after Kazmir or Bedard, two viable alternatives to Santana that aren’t likely to be as costly.

    I’ll take Santana if the Twins toss Pat Neshek into the deal.

  235. rodg12 December 3rd, 2007 at 11:36 am

    New Pete post….

  236. gayle December 3rd, 2007 at 11:36 am

    Not to change the subject but can someone explain to me how Billy Martin only gets 3 votes from the veterans committee for the Hall of Fame (to go in as a manager) You ned 12 to get in and he got 3. Unreal.

  237. Derek Jeter for President December 3rd, 2007 at 11:37 am

    I agree with JAX there is no reason to give up any of the 3 we have, and with them throwing with Wang and Pettitte is gold. Why dont we put more focus on fixing our crappy bullpen. That were we really need some work to be done.

  238. The Bronx Stop December 3rd, 2007 at 11:37 am

    Gayle-
    I was very surprised at the HOF voting.

  239. Flam December 3rd, 2007 at 11:38 am

    I still am not thrilled with Moose. I think he has alot of work to do before he can gain my trust again. Im sorry, just my opinion.

  240. The Bronx Stop December 3rd, 2007 at 11:38 am

    Does anyone else here realize how important Joe Girardi has already been to the New York Yankees?????

  241. fred December 3rd, 2007 at 11:39 am

    could very well be that IPK is the gem, young mussina-like (i listen),and dangling him up front was a ploy to get him out of the deal. hughes is so reminiscent of milton it’s scary, and milton was an A player, but if santana is truly healthy, santana at the top of the rotation in yankee stadium, new york market, could be a better fit, mor than an upgrade. as for joba, the person who alluded to the innings count is on target. we should all have good years for pitchers who had third and fourth pitches that are “close”. we know he’s lights out as a setup guy and has the mettle to close. torre let him die on the hill in cleveland, f* bugs, anyone with an edge would have adrenalined-out. he’s your closer after mariano, and will be well-seasoned at that point. meantime you have a stud who can do the 100 innings and not fall apart, as per flash gordon, sturtze, and a surgically repaired cast of thousands… has letroy hawkins improved?? i remember him as buddy groom lite.

  242. Yanksrule57 December 3rd, 2007 at 11:39 am

    The Bronx Stop,

    You were all over it, and thanks for the link, I have already added you to my bookmarks.

  243. Andy Hawkins December 3rd, 2007 at 11:40 am

    I don’t think it’s ever a bad idea to let a starter get work in the big leagues for a season or two. But the Billingsley example doesn’t compare to Chamberlain. Billingsley was essentially a long man, and he’d pitch the fifth, sixth or seventh and the Dodgers would let him start innings and use all his pitches. Joba won’t be allowed to do that. He’s too good, too dominant with those two pitches, and there’s a difference between pitching the eighth in a tight game and pitching the sixth and seventh in a tight game.

    Believe me guys, it’s all a moot point. Wherever you put him, he’s going to dominate. The question is, do you want a dominant eighth-inning guy, or do you want a dominant starter. I saw Joba start a few times in the minors. He has a chance to be the next Clemens. We all saw Joba relieve in the majors. He has a chance to be the next Rivera. Wherever you put him, he’ll succeed. But personally, I’d rather have the next Clemens, since we still have the current Rivera.

  244. hmmm December 3rd, 2007 at 11:40 am

    “100IP’s in the bullpen or 150IP’s in the rotation. Which one is greater?”

    uhh, 150?

    you are missing the very basic point that he NEEDS to pitch 150 innings this year if you want him to pitch 200 innings in 2009.

    if he pitches 100 this year, he can’t really pitch more than 150 in 2009.

    he’s going to start.

  245. The Bronx Stop December 3rd, 2007 at 11:41 am

    Thanks Yanks Rule…

  246. hmmm December 3rd, 2007 at 11:41 am

    “Does anyone else here realize how important Joe Girardi has already been to the New York Yankees?????”

    seriously. how much angst about Torre leaving was tied up in the fear that the free agents would leave?

  247. Nick December 3rd, 2007 at 11:41 am

    Tino coming to camp gives him the role in working with the 1st baseman with Mattingly gone. His winning attitude will rub off on many.

  248. Yankee Jay December 3rd, 2007 at 11:42 am

    Isn’t CC a free agent after this season? He’s another front line lefty that will probably be available if we don’t get Santana. That would give us the ability to see what we have this year with the kids and still be able to get a big name without giving up Hughes.

  249. Ed FL December 3rd, 2007 at 11:43 am

    A-Point,
    Santana and Abreu are close friends. They played in the Venezuelan leagues.

  250. Jax December 3rd, 2007 at 11:43 am

    The reason why I’m in favor of having Joba in the rotation is because the Yankees have a number of guys on the farm that could fill that eighth inning role. If they didn’t I think I would rather have him in the pen.

  251. Mitchell's Eleven December 3rd, 2007 at 11:44 am

    Keith: three-inning game. we’d be trading Kennedy, Horne, Tabata, and Betances for Joe Nathan. don’t you remember?

    we’d be a shoo-in for the World Series then, RIGHT FOLKS? ;)

  252. frequent flyer December 3rd, 2007 at 11:45 am

    Joe Girardi has been everywhere since his hiring as manager, in the country and out. He may have been one of the more influencing voices in getting Andy and others back in the fold. Not a stay at home manager.

  253. ~Adam. December 3rd, 2007 at 11:47 am

    CB-

    The way I understand TJ is that the young pitchers are particularly susceptible because they don’t know their own strengths and weaknesses, especially when they’re fatigued. And that their joints aren’t quite done growing until they’re 25-27 yo. Pitching is a disastrous motion to make with one’s arm, especially 100 times on a hot day. A young tired pitcher is likely to put too much pressure on the structure of their elbow when their muscle is tired or weak. Or in Hughes case, his hamstring. Much the same way dancers or runners transfer too much of their weight to the structure of their knees. It only takes one over thrown fastball, or a one incorrectly thrown changeup, curveball, or slider and that ligament is damaged.

    But a pitcher can’t pitch in fear of TJ. Arm strength is important, but so is structural strength and growth. Probably most important is maturity of knowing one pitch is not worth a career. Again, as we saw with Hughes last year, he was lucky that wasn’t a knee. I’m sure the Yanks have some very expensive OrthoDocs to figure this stuff out though, and not you and me lol.

  254. Yankee Jay December 3rd, 2007 at 11:47 am

    You won’t get Haren for Kennedy/Melky/B-list prospect. Billy Beane will ask for a TON for Haren, probably MORE than the Twinkies want for Santana. He is really attractive to small market/low payroll teams like Arizona since he is way cheaper than Santana. Those teams know that they can’t sign Santana, but they could have Haren for longer and cheaper, meaning they would be more willing to give up the farm. $16 mill for 3 years (though I think the last one is a player option the will certainly decline if his performance stays up). BB knows this and will be looking to take teams to the woodshed.

  255. E-ROC December 3rd, 2007 at 11:53 am

    I wonder what it would take for the Yankees to get Rich Harden as their setup man.

  256. the truth of the matter December 3rd, 2007 at 11:54 am

    Steve Phillips makes as much sense as Rush Limbaugh does and with an extra dose of jibberish.

  257. swo December 3rd, 2007 at 11:59 am

    “Let’s trade for Johan and then put him in the bullpen with Joba and Mariano and then we can make it a FOUR INNING GAME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Igawa for 4, Joba for 2, Johan for 2 and then teh bridge to mo is complete!!11!1″

    Keith, your comment would have been perfect if you included some more 1s, an “OMGZ” and a “ROFLMAO!” But as it stands it is quite good. :-P

  258. fred December 3rd, 2007 at 12:00 pm

    forget billy beane. i’ve had enough of him to last seven lifetimes. he’s full of himself, and should be off the list with angelos and that j* in tampa bay.

  259. ThatWasMe December 3rd, 2007 at 12:09 pm

    the truth of the matter, enough of the political commentary. You don’t need to hear mine, nor me yours.Thanks.

  260. YankeeBaseball December 3rd, 2007 at 12:18 pm

    “Mike NYY- Save the Big Three
    December 3rd, 2007 at 9:58 am
    1) Haren————1) Santana
    2) Wang————–2) Beckett
    3) Joba————–3) Matsuzaka
    4) Phil————–4) Schilling
    5) Andy————–5) Lester

    That`s at least pretty close.

    I think that their top 2 would be stronger, but our bottom three would take their’s. I agree it is close to say the least.”

    Who cares how we match up with them in the regular season??? Bottom line: in the PLAYOFFS, we wouldn’t stand a chance against Santana, Beckett & Buchholz!

  261. filthy slider December 3rd, 2007 at 12:21 pm

    GREAT NEWS, never saw a pitcher come off a year like Andy had and retire, unless he was hurt. One lefty in the fold one to go.

  262. YankeeBaseball December 3rd, 2007 at 12:22 pm

    …. and trade (for prospects or bullpen help)

    Mussina to Philly or St Lou

    plus Igawaa to San Diego

  263. ThatWasMe December 3rd, 2007 at 12:22 pm

    YankeeBaseball
    Buccholz with Beckett and Santana? Ridiculous comment. Google Bo Belinsky for a starter.

  264. YankeeBaseball December 3rd, 2007 at 12:50 pm

    ThatWasMe “Buccholz with Beckett and Santana? Ridiculous comment. Google Bo Belinsky for a starter.”

    What the feck are you talking about??? All I said was if the Red Sox get Santana and have Santana, Beckett and Clay Buchholz (or Matsuzaka) as their front three in the playoffs, no way we beat them (and how the 4th and 5th starters match up is irrelevant IN THE PLAYOFFS where rotations are shortened). This is perfectly reasonable and TRUE. That is why it is imperative to get Santana or at the least Boston not get him…

  265. Scud Missile December 3rd, 2007 at 1:09 pm

    Yayyyyyy Andy!

  266. TC December 3rd, 2007 at 1:31 pm

    Thrilled to have Andy back! And I’m with you…they can keep santana. I don’t want the yanks to give up too much

  267. ThatWasMe December 3rd, 2007 at 1:44 pm

    Yankee Baseball,
    We beat the Red Sox like a drum last season except for the first month of April when the Yankees used an MLB record 10 different starters and another MLB record 6 rookies. May was not much better. Don’t forget we had Wang, Pavano, Mussina, Hughes, Rasner and Karstens all on the DL at the same time. The notion any of the Sox starters are unbeatable by the Yankees is false, I believe the Yankees won 9 of the last 11 games between the Sox. Buchholz is unproven, Matsuzaka had a problem getting out of the 4th inning and winning on the road.

  268. Dee December 4th, 2007 at 4:16 am

    YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Welcome back Andy!
    I’m at the Lisbon airport and screamed so loudly when I just read this that I think people here thought I was having some sort of epileptic seisure. Go Yankees!

    And Pete, thanks for the continuous great coverage!


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