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Wait a second, that’s all there is?

Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Dec 13, 2007 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Senator Mitchell is lucky that Kirk Radomski was facing prison and was willing to rats guys out to get some time taken off his sentence. Otherwise the Mitchell Report would have been the size of a comic book.

Roger Clemens takes the biggest hit today. Turns out that that his vaunted work ethic came out of syringe. He’ll deny, I suspect.

Then what? If he wasn’t retired before, this clinches it. In five years voters will have to decide whether he belongs in the Hall of Fame.

I don’t know how much that report costs but I hope Bud Selig kept the receipt. He should get some money back.

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81 Responses to “Wait a second, that’s all there is?”

  1. RangerRob December 13th, 2007 at 3:25 pm

    Peter, if Clemens wanted to come back there would be dozens of teams that would listen.

  2. EricVA December 13th, 2007 at 3:25 pm

    Biggest waste of time, money and hype ever.

  3. SAndMan December 13th, 2007 at 3:26 pm

    What a major let down.To bad we got the wrong Left Hander in Pettitte…nice guy my @$$.Go get the LEGEND Santana.

    Why is there is no Red Sox.

  4. Chris December 13th, 2007 at 3:27 pm

    What a waste of money. He basically googled everything and threw in some info from a canary facing jail time.

    Baseball got owned.

  5. x23 December 13th, 2007 at 3:28 pm

    The no red sox tells u what kind of person Mitchell is.

  6. wood is good December 13th, 2007 at 3:28 pm

    This report is a HUGE disappointment. That’s all there is to this fire? It’s actually kind of shameful how full of holes it is.

    It’s eff’d up Clemens is getting fried already for this–and, maybe, justly so. But Pettitte — the facts as presented seem to not make him look that bad about all this….

  7. RJPinstripes December 13th, 2007 at 3:28 pm

    It seems like the Mitchell Report was just a report about what two trainers had to say!

  8. Mike R. December 13th, 2007 at 3:28 pm

    If the Yankees traded for Santana, there would be an ammendment issued by Mitchell to include him.

  9. Andrea December 13th, 2007 at 3:29 pm

    ok, is there a place I can just see the list without going through the entire report?

  10. Blargh December 13th, 2007 at 3:29 pm

    Mmm, you can bite in and taste the politics (and by that, I also include the monetary waste)

    So, anybody want to throw out odds of the Selig successfully diverting attention with this and miraculously avoid some kind of blame?

  11. NYY December 13th, 2007 at 3:29 pm

    Roger Clemens takes the biggest hit today. Turns out that that his vaunted work ethic came out of syringe.

    I think Pettite took the biggest hit today bcoz he is still playing. Clemens is pretty much retired. It may cost him in the in getting to HOF though.

  12. Joshua December 13th, 2007 at 3:30 pm

    Pete, everybody seems to be judging this report solely based upon the number of big name players it mentions. Can you comment on the recommendations Mitchell makes regarding the curtailing of PED use in the future. To me, that seems to be the most important issue here, despite the fact that the media and fans like to focus on the hoopla about Bonds and Clemens and who did what. Why would anyone expect a report with no subpoena power to produce a lot of results? This isn’t Mitchell’s fault, it’s baseball’s (all members). Let’s focus on curing the problem. What does he have to say about that?

  13. NYY December 13th, 2007 at 3:30 pm

    Andrea December 13th, 2007 at 3:29 pm

    ok, is there a place I can just see the list without going through the entire report?

    Exactly what I am looking for. Can’t find it anywhere though.

  14. rodg12 December 13th, 2007 at 3:31 pm

    How in the world can a person like Mitchell who sits on the Red Sox board realease a report listing quite a few Yankees but hardly any Sox? Isn’t he smarter than that? Doesn’t he know that puts the entire report’s legitimacy into question by a lot of people? Just ridiculous!

  15. Jbomb December 13th, 2007 at 3:32 pm

    So I guess it was mostly yankees taking steriods? a couple red sox from the 80’s and a few from baltimore. Give me a break. mitchell’s a joke and so is this report. Go back to your seat on the board of the red sox and shut up.

  16. Dee December 13th, 2007 at 3:32 pm

    On ESPN, this reporter from the Houston Chronicles said he knows Andy and thinks he must be humiliated and he wouldn’t be surprised if Andy walks away from the game now…

    Is that possible even though he has already signed on for 2008?? I’m really worried…

  17. NYY December 13th, 2007 at 3:32 pm

    Barry Bonds was killed for his steroid use. Roger Clemens is let away lightly by the media and fans.

    Racism????

  18. Andrea December 13th, 2007 at 3:32 pm

    Mike (of M and the Mad Dog) makes a good point. There’s no actual proof, no paper evidence against Clemens. All they have this this guy saying this happened. Clemens could just deny it.

  19. will December 13th, 2007 at 3:33 pm

    andrea, rebecca posted it in the previous thread

  20. Andrea December 13th, 2007 at 3:33 pm

    NYY: give it time. It’s only been an hour and a half since Clemens was accused.

  21. jennifer- Hip Hip Jorge December 13th, 2007 at 3:33 pm

    How did Pettitte take a hit? WHen he supposedly took it, it was to get back from an injury? He wasn’t always on it.

    Mike and Mad dog pointed out that there is NO paper trail for Roger, it is all hearsay. This all froma person who is trying to avoid jail time.

  22. Jbomb December 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pm

    This report only proves one of two things that Mitchell is a fraud or that steriods were never that big a deal in the first place.

  23. Andrea December 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pm

    will: thanks!

  24. Mike R. December 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pm

    Andrea and NYY –
    The closest thing is this:
    http://yankees.lhblogs.com/200.....ent-227292

  25. rodg12 December 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pm

    Joshua – I agree with your post that that is the heart of the manner, but why release the names then?? Wouldn’t that take the focus off your goal?? What legitimate reason is there to releasing the names which it so obviously detracts from the “true purpose” of the report?

  26. Ed December 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pm

    If people can even consider Bonds for the Hall of Fame, which a lot of people seem to be doing, then Clemens is a lock.

    If this report is true, he had already won 4 Cy Young awards before taking steroids.

    As for Pettitte, well, he was in the same situation Pavano was in at the start of this season. (Remember all the stories with Pettitte trying to advise Pavano on it?) Apparently Pettitte took a few HGH shots and recovered ok, whereas Pavano took surgery and a 2 year recovery time (we all know Pavano won’t recover in less time). If those are the options, you can at least understand why someone would choose that. Doesn’t make it right to do it the way he did though. At least Paul Byrd has the “I have a doctor’s prescription” claim of semi-validity.

  27. The Dude December 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pm

    What about the guys who paid cash?

  28. Phil December 13th, 2007 at 3:34 pm

    limited and as a result, slanted report. What a disgrace!

  29. Joshua December 13th, 2007 at 3:35 pm

    Andrea December 13th, 2007 at 3:29 pm

    ok, is there a place I can just see the list without going through the entire report?
    ——–

    This type of response is part of the problem. Everyone is so focused on the names of players from the past that no one actually wants to read the report (hundreds of pages) that details recommendations for cleaning up the sport in the future. I’m just as interested as anyone about who took roids and HGH but can’t we at least have some journalistic integrity and read the report to aware of the context?

  30. will December 13th, 2007 at 3:35 pm

    NYY,
    you think maybe the difference in reaction to bonds and clemens might just possibly be because one guy is a nice guy, and the other is, well, not?

  31. mel December 13th, 2007 at 3:35 pm

    Has Andy already signed the contract?

  32. jennifer- Hip Hip Jorge December 13th, 2007 at 3:35 pm

    Andy will NOT walk away.

  33. Phil December 13th, 2007 at 3:35 pm

    NYY

    Bonds lied to a grand jury. Did Clemens?

  34. Joshua December 13th, 2007 at 3:35 pm

    Or at least read parts of it (I know a few hundred pages is too much to read straight through)

  35. gayle December 13th, 2007 at 3:35 pm

    FYI Andy and Roger BOTH knew that this was coming as it said in the report that the contacted players when they got information and asked them to come in for interviews.

    The Roger stuff seems much more harsh to me if valid as it took place over a number of years I actually forgot that he and Canseco were teamates. The Pettite thing looks to me like a one time thing and not a common occurrence.

  36. yanklifer December 13th, 2007 at 3:37 pm

    http://bats.blogs.nytimes.com/.....ells-list/

    list

  37. Clay Bellinger December 13th, 2007 at 3:37 pm

    fat man on M& the MD just made a good point. There is no concrete evidence against Roger and Andy. Just the one trainer’s account of what happened, no papper trail, no cancelled checks, so that leaves me to believe one thing…. They still did it!!!!

  38. migames December 13th, 2007 at 3:38 pm

    “Barry Bonds was killed for his steroid use. Roger Clemens is let away lightly by the media and fans.

    Racism????”

    Look up McGwire, Mark

    One other thing…this whole thing about Roger Clemens and him throwing the bat towards piazza makes senses now.

  39. Dee December 13th, 2007 at 3:38 pm

    In our country, one should be innocent until proven guilty. How can George Mitchell named names and tarnished someone’s legency without giving them a chance to defend themselves first?

    And how can Mitchell get away with the responsibility of having to comprehensive evidence and witnesses that fairly represent the entire league and every team?

    The report is based on so-called evidence that is one-sided and self-selecting. There is major flaw is this so called investigation that costed millions of tax-payers’ money.

  40. james December 13th, 2007 at 3:38 pm

    I can’t wait for Mike Lupica’s unique take on all this, he so unpredictable.

  41. The Dude December 13th, 2007 at 3:39 pm

    You Yankees fans need to get a grip. This report PROVES BEYOND DOUBT that the Red Sox and their players NEVER did anything shady to potentially enhance performance or recover quicker from injury – well, at least their IMPORTANT players. The Yankees, on the other hand, are guilty beyond doubt of being a collection of roided out mercenaries. The Red Sox are good and the Yankees are bad. Finally, thanks to the objective work of Sen. Mitchell, we know all of this for a fact.

  42. migames December 13th, 2007 at 3:40 pm

    “without giving them a chance to defend themselves first? ”

    Everyone he mentioned he asked to come in and speak to them, they declined

  43. KB December 13th, 2007 at 3:40 pm

    I’m a huge Yanks and Pettitte fan but if you read the report- I think the most damning thing for each of them is their allegiance to a trainer who is obviously very comfortable with using PEDs as part of the regime. Their is no actual proof and I see no grounds for punishment, etc. but they have stood by, and trained with, a guy for many years who clearly uses these things in the program. That stigma is not good.

  44. Joshua December 13th, 2007 at 3:40 pm

    rodg12: I think there is some validity in releasing the names so that more investigations can take place. Perhaps now that some names are out in the public it will encourage baseball to conduct a more powerful investigation (one with actually authority). With everything staying behind closed doors there is no initiative to solve anything.

    That said, I think you’re right that releasing the names is somewhat counterproductive. What I think should have happened is that the names should have been separated from the part of the document that deals with recommendations for the future. Perhaps the names could have been released once the other parts had been digested.

    Just a thought…

  45. EricVA December 13th, 2007 at 3:41 pm

    Forget politics or anything else…
    This was blown way out of proportion for the information that was delivered. This is in no way complete or informative.

  46. Ice Age December 13th, 2007 at 3:41 pm

    It’s over, the Yankees need to suspend all participation at every level with baseball. This is a biased disgrace.

  47. Mean Mr. Mustard December 13th, 2007 at 3:41 pm

    I said it before nd I’ll say it again: if you can listen to Sgt. Pepper’s Lonely Hearts Club Band and not care that it was created under the influence of LSD and regard it as a musical masterpiece, then you can regard Roger Clemens, McGwire, et al as great baseball players who do belong in the Hall of Fame.

  48. Clay Bellinger December 13th, 2007 at 3:41 pm

    My feeling is that half of players use, regardless of this report.

  49. The Dude December 13th, 2007 at 3:42 pm

    Where’s Sammy Sosa on the list? Good thing the Senator did a thorough job investigating performance-enhancing drug use in MLB.

  50. Andrea December 13th, 2007 at 3:43 pm

    Joshua: I’m interested in reading parts of the report at some point. But I am curious because I missed the announcement that was made on the radio and I just want to know real quick. I have every intention of reading some parts–if I can handle it.

    However, I don’t really know if Mitchell’s methods for “cleaning up the sport in the future” are the way that I could go about it. I’m also not really into this entire report based on hearsay. But it’s worth a read. But for now, I just felt left out having not heard the announcement.

  51. vince December 13th, 2007 at 3:43 pm

    Breaking news:
    Rasner will return.
    But Rasner will still be invited to the Yankees Spring Training with a chance to make the 2008 Major League roster. Rasner’s father said his son will be given the chance to make the Big League club as a spot starter and long reliever.

  52. Ice Age December 13th, 2007 at 3:43 pm

    Oh no The Dude thats fine. The Yankees are bad, the Red Sox are good. Luckily for MLB I don’t own the Yankees cuz if I was I’d take my ball and go home. No more All Star game at Yankee Stadium, find someplace else.

  53. Clay Bellinger December 13th, 2007 at 3:43 pm

    Sosa was not on the list, never failed a test, now does he get into the HOF?

  54. Ice Age December 13th, 2007 at 3:45 pm

    Sosa never played in New York, so no he is not on the list.

  55. TTERB December 13th, 2007 at 3:45 pm

    THE WHOLE THING COST 60 MILLION DOLLARS !!

  56. Joshua December 13th, 2007 at 3:47 pm

    Mean Mr. Mustard:

    While I agree with you in theory, in practice there is a huge difference between the Beatles taking drugs and athletes taking drugs.

    Both cases deal with illegal substances, but there is no proof (only subjective opinion) that drugs enhance musical performance. Some people like the Beatles albums that were made “under the influence” and others don’t. You can charge the Beatles with a crime for possessing LSD or whatever but it doesn’t really translate into objective judgments of their albums.

    On the other hand, the strength and healing abilities that are enhanced by PEDs are not subjective. While it is uncertain how much steroids help any given player, we can scientifically document how steroids OBJECTIVELY help you hit a baseball further (assuming you are good enough to put the bat on the ball in the first place). They also are objectively known to quicken the healing process which objectively means a player can perform for more time on the field.

    You’re right, the Beatles albums MIGHT be better because of the drugs. But it’s not the same thing as baseball players DEFINITELY gaining certain advantages from performance enhancing drugs.

  57. Today December 13th, 2007 at 3:47 pm

    Manny Alexander
    Chad Allen
    Rick Ankiel
    David Bell
    Mike Bell
    Marvin Benard
    Gary Bennett, Jr.
    Larry Bigbie
    Barry Bonds
    Ricky Bones
    Kevin Brown
    Paul Byrd
    Alex Cabrera
    Ken Caminiti
    Jose Canseco
    Mark Carreon
    Jason Christiansen
    Howie Clark
    Roger Clemens
    Paxton Crawford
    Jack Cust
    Brendan Donnelly
    Chris Donnels
    Lenny Dykstra
    Bobby Estalella
    Matt Franco
    Ryan Franklin
    Eric Gagné
    Jason Giambi
    Jeremy Giambi
    Jay Gibbons
    Troy Glaus
    Juan Gonzalez
    Jason Grimsley
    Jose Guillen
    Jerry Hairston, Jr.
    Matt Herges
    Phil Hiatt
    Glenallen Hill
    Darren Holmes
    Todd Hundley
    Mike Judd
    David Justice
    Matt Karchner
    Chuck Knoblauch
    Tim Laker
    Mike Lansing
    Paul Lo Duca
    Xavier “Nook” Logan
    Josias Manzanillo
    Gary Matthews, Jr.
    Cody McKay
    Kent Mercker
    Bart Miadich
    Hal Morris
    Daniel Naulty
    Denny Neagle
    Rafael Palmeiro
    Jim Parque
    Andy Pettitte
    Adam Piatt
    Todd Pratt
    Stephen Randolph
    Adam Riggs
    Armando Rios
    Brian Roberts
    John Rocker
    F.P. Santangelo
    Benito Santiago
    Scott Schoeneweis
    David Segui
    Gary Sheffield
    Mike Stanton
    Ricky Stone
    Miguel Tejada
    Ismael Valdez
    Mo Vaughn
    Randy Velarde
    Ron Villone
    Fernando Vina
    Rondell White
    Jeff Williams
    Matt Williams
    Todd Williams
    Steve Woodard
    Kevin Young
    Gregg Zaun

  58. Mo December 13th, 2007 at 3:48 pm

    Andy will not retire. He knew he would be in the report when he signed. Mitchell approached all of the implicated players to give them a chance to defend themselves.

  59. S.o.S.27 December 13th, 2007 at 3:48 pm

    So he caught the ones who wrote out checks. How about the next 50 million of Mitchells research go to finding out who paid by credit card,money order,cash,food stamps etc.

    What a complete waste of time. I think we can all agree that Selig has to go down as one of the dumbest and worst commisioners in all of sports. Having a Sox employee do the investigation was totally foolish. I hope congress steps in and does something about Selig and the players union. Like suspend Fehr and Selig for knowing what was going on for years now. For using this fake investigation to make us think they are getting to the bottom of this. When in reality it was a smoke screen.

    Way to waste 50 mil and the time for info that could have been gathered in a week. Just be reading the papers.

  60. The Dude December 13th, 2007 at 3:48 pm

    Congratulations, Sammy Sosa! This report clears you of any wrongdoing. You are now the true home run king with your pure, clean 66 home runs in 1998. Viva Sosa, and viva Sen. Mitchell!

  61. Joshua December 13th, 2007 at 3:49 pm

    Andrea:
    That’s fair enough.

    I’m not saying I agree with Mitchell’s recommendations for the future, just that the names are distracting people for some really important decisions about the future of baseball.

  62. james December 13th, 2007 at 3:50 pm

    Lupica’s begins about a bellman in a NYC hotel, just a regular Joe kind a guy. The regular guy sets the theme for the story (and Lupica never does this) about big names.

  63. Andrea December 13th, 2007 at 3:51 pm

    Joshua: true, but if there were no names, chances are people wouldn’t even care about the report.

  64. Anthony December 13th, 2007 at 3:52 pm

    Just a question- why didn’t Mitchell talk to the Red Sox trainers? He’s a Director there, don’t tell me he didn’t have the power.

  65. Joshua December 13th, 2007 at 3:54 pm

    Andrea:

    It’s sad, but I think you’re probably right that no one would be that interested. But that’s not only true with baseball, society in general places more emphasis on name value than real substance.

  66. Tek is a Phony December 13th, 2007 at 3:55 pm

    the fact that Sosa is not mentioned takes all credibility away from this report.

  67. pat December 13th, 2007 at 3:57 pm

    Work is getting in the way of fun today. How is McGwire not on the list?

  68. Kyle From CT December 13th, 2007 at 4:01 pm

    Mitchell used two New York area informants. One of which is facing jailtime, which is just convenient for Mitchell. I am very curious why, for spending 60 million dollars or whatever, he didn’t at least look into other sources. There is not a single current Red Sox player on that list, which just doesn’t make much sense. Whether I’m beating a dead horse or not, I think there is at least a few current Red Sox that have been involved with steroids.

  69. The Mick December 13th, 2007 at 4:09 pm

    where is mcgwire on this list?

  70. steve December 13th, 2007 at 4:09 pm

    Tek: Mark McGwire isn’t on the list either.

  71. Ray December 13th, 2007 at 4:11 pm

    LOL! This is strange. Didn’t I just read a few days ago where Ortiz said that he wasn’t sure if he took steroids or not because of what might have been in the supplements he took while in the DR? LOL! This report, while possibly a good start, is so biased from a credible side because it is only slanted from NYM clubhouse & NYY clubhouse & Grimsley. Albeit, I probably would not have included Canseco because of his book deals, there must have been ways to bring each Teams clubhouse personel & address them in more detail.

    And why list names of players if all there is on them is inuendo or a comment by someone.

    This kind of bias and possible notriety of a clubhouse person could lead to book deals & movies. How many others will want to do the same $$$. Like “My life in Boston Supplying the Juice”. This is just the beginning. Wow! How could MLB be so stupid!

  72. Vinny December 13th, 2007 at 4:17 pm

    Sixty million bucks could have been better spent with a real cleanup program not like the rinky-dink one that exists.
    Mitchell’s esteem went right down the toilet bowl for heavy reliance of information from 2 trainers ratting out and accepting a plea deal. The report was a flat out flop.

  73. Ice Age December 13th, 2007 at 4:17 pm

    Ortiz not being on this list is a disgrace, look at his numbers pre Red Sox, give me a break.

  74. Drive 4-5 December 13th, 2007 at 4:18 pm

    Jose Canseco, author of “Juiced,” played for the Red Sox in 1995 and ‘96. He said he hasn’t been contacted by Mitchell’s investigators.

    I don’t want to sound like sour grapes, but how could Mitchell have NOT questioned Canseco? Especially about his Red Sox years? In ’95 the Red Sox signed Canseco the largest free agent contract of any player that year and the largest contract of his career.

  75. Eddie Layton December 13th, 2007 at 4:37 pm

    The information against Clemens is very substantial and very damning. A disastrous day for the Rocket. If Bonds doesn’t get into the Hall of Fame due to steriods, then how can Clemens get in?

  76. SAndMan December 13th, 2007 at 4:38 pm

    So can we get rid of Andy Pettitte now?

  77. Ray December 13th, 2007 at 4:59 pm

    The ALL STEROID TEAM – Unidentified Suspected Players
    C – Piazza & Pudge & Varitek
    1B- McGwire & Sexson
    2B- Kent & Vidro
    SS- Garciapara
    3B- Pujols & Beltre
    OF- Sosa & S. Finley & S. Green
    OF- Albert Belle & Guerrero
    OF- Brady Anderson & M. Ramirez & L. Walker
    DH- D. Ortiz
    SP- Schilling
    SP- A. Burnett
    SP- Mulder
    SP- Hampton & B. Colon
    SP- Chuck Finley
    RP- Dotel
    CL- Foulke & Mantei & Nen

  78. lil' m December 13th, 2007 at 5:10 pm

    Pete: Any take on why coverage of Mitchell’s Red Sox board membership/paid advisor role conflict of interest issue has been virtually nonexistent? The mentions have been few and far between (e.g., Ken Davidoff of Newsday, Selena Roberts of the Times, and Howard Bryant of ESPN). One would think that the sports press would be all over this angle.

  79. Drive 4-5 December 13th, 2007 at 5:37 pm

    I hate seeing Pettitte and Clemens getting burned today as much as anybody. But I don’t think we should go overboard with Mitchell conflict of interest charges. He’s a former federal judge and has been involved with peace negotiations around the world.

    His biggest mistake was that he should have permanently broken ties with the Red Sox as soon as he took on the investigation. Absent of that disassociation,he should have at least done more investigation about the Red Sox than any other team. When he didn’t even interview Canseco about his Red sox playing days, he left himself open to criticism.

  80. Jo December 13th, 2007 at 5:57 pm

    It is a sad day for Yankee fans across the world. Clemens is not a surprise being on the list. But Dandy Andy broke our hearts and so did Chuck Knoblauch.

  81. Daniel Rosen December 13th, 2007 at 6:06 pm

    Senator joe McCarthy had lists too. The numbers changed on those lists depending on how drunk he was. Where is the proof? A couple of canaries? Whatever happened to due process? Also, how come there are no Red Sox? This charade is so compromised it should be being examined according to Pete’s headline–that’s all there is? Hopefully, saner folk will see the real story here is a witch hunt and botched investigation. This is a real smear job. Unless there are smoking guns, or guys fess up, we will never know the truth.

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