Today in The Journal News
-
- August
- 5
The Yankees lost a game - and Joba Chamberlain - on the same night in Texas.
Dan Giese has replaced Darrell Rasner in the rotation. This notebook also has updates on Xavier Nady, Melky Cabrera, Phil Hughes, Jason Giambi, Mark Melancon and the American Idle, Carl Pavano.
Pudge Rodriguez is quickly getting acclimated to the Yankees.
————
Joba Chamberlain is flying back to New York this morning and will be at New York Presbyterian Hospital later today for an MRI.
The Yankees, if they follow their usual practice, will have the MRI read by some specialists around the country. In other words, we won’t learn much until later in the day.
Keep in mind, shoulder injuries of any sort demand cautious treatment. Chamberlain is arguably the most important player in the organization and the Yankees won’t let him pitch again until they are assured this injury won’t lead to something more serious.
The last thing you want is him altering his mechanics in some way to compensate. Jorge Posada believes that his minor lat strain in spring training is what led to his labrum issues.
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on Tuesday, August 5th, 2008 at 3:40 am by Peter Abraham.
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Take your time, Joba. We can get by for a bit. Hopefully just a muscle strain.
So what’s the rotation look like for the trip? I’m all confused.
Tuesday: Pettitte @ Harrison
Wednesday: Ponson (the good one!) @ Hunter
Thursday: Mussina @ Feldman
Friday: Giese @ Weaver
Saturday: TBA (IPK?) @ Lackey (yikes!)
Sunday: Pettitte @ ???
Then I guess Joba is pretty much done for the season.
Mel, I had this in the last subject thread, but, it appears that they are getting Mark Melancon ready for a callup. His next appearances will be in the middle of the innings. Also looks like Kennedy gets the call if Chamberlain misses any starts.
If Joba is done our season is over. You cant win without him and Wang. Especially when the teams you have to overcome have Kazmir and Beckett.
Give Igawa and Pavano a try; after all, Yankess are pretty much done for this season.
i’d rather see mealcon, hughes and kennedy but if they need a guy to eat innnings it’d be nice to see them stick pavano out there to throw 250 pitches one night when its 140 degrees in texas
hopefully only a minor infury for joba and hes back in 2-3 weeks …
I just…..I could not be more depressed. I don’t even know where to begin. I am glad there was a side story so not all of my attention was on girardi being an IDIOT. Maybe next time when a guy walks 3 men and has thrown basically a season high you can realize it is time to make a pitching change. Crist I saw him shaking his head during the hamilton AB!! He had his chance. As for joba, gos help me. It is just one injury after another, more heartbreak season after season. I am sick to my stomache.
Peace
You don’t mess with shoulders. Judging by all the stories today, he probably strained a deltoid muscle.
Not a serious injury if you don’t try to push through it. Posada had the same injury in ST, tried to push through it, and created a more serious injury.
Its why I always try to refrain when discussing how “tough” players are (see Carl Pavano) when it comes to injuries.
As fans, we often want players to, “show toughness” and “play hurt”. Players themselves do the same thing wtihin the confines of the locker room. Johnny Damon has a (justifiably) reputation as being “tough”. Yet, he will tell you that he has made minor injuries worse by playing through them. Its a very fine line between being “tough” and being “dumb” when it comes to playing hurt. If you aren’t careful, especially with pitchers, you can take a minor injury and turn it into something major.
Who knows if Pavano, while trying to show he was worthy of being a “good Yankee” tried to play through injuries that lead to a change in mechanics, causing his elbow injury?
Its something we will never know because all of the chatter (not just from fans, teammates as well) re: Pavano’s “toughness” have pretty much ruined all communication lines between Pavano, his teammates, and the Yankees.
We DO know Phil Hughes tried to play through what he thought was a “minor lat issue”, and it turned out to be a fractured rib.
I would be very surprised if we saw Joba anymore this season.
Even if its a minor injury (which I believe it is), the Yankees have Posada and Hughes as examples of guys trying to do too much and turning minor injuries into more serious injuries.
They aren’t going to go that route with Joba.
Girardi played it the only way he could play it last night. He was shorthanded and he stuck with Marte.
You don’t put a rookie (Robertson) in that situation. You just don’t.
Plus, you have to save some arms in case the game went extras. Given that the bullpen was shorthanded, Robertson would have had to pitch the 10th and beyond.
Its one of those powerless situations as a manager. He had no place else to turn.
He was down 3 arms (Veras, Giese and Rivera) last night. He already used Ramirez and Bruney. He was stuck. That’s why Marte took one for the team last night.
When you have a 3-0 lead against the worst pitching staff in baseball, you have to add on. The offense didn’t, stuff happened (like Joba’s injury) and the game got away from them.
And if Marte held Texas what would have been Girardi’s options for the next inning?
Most likely Robertson.
The point to question was not leaving Marte in too long but that, when you know you are short handed, you should have left Ramirez and Bruney for a longer period. The GM should have brought someone up for bullpen help and send Rasnar down.
Jeter needed to get that hit in the top of the inning. It would have put pressure on Texas hitters to swing away.
On the bright side, every one else in the division lost. This next week is important, if we can go 4-2, or 5-1 in the next 6 games we will be ok. I agree with SJ on Joba, I would be stunned to see again, unless it’s post season..
I believe next week you will see IPK, Hughs, maybe Pavano called up.
It’s not over till it’s over, from one of our HOFer’s.
Girardi had one other option, but, I’m not sure it was the right pitcher to do it with. I think it was Mussina’s throw day. I think if it had been Pettitte’s throw day, he would be the perfect pitcher to come in a get 1 to 4 outs. He’s stated that he’d prefer to pitch under game conditions than in the bullpen. Not sure if Mussina could do that, but, it’s an option that needs to be explored.
texas….the site of the hughes and joba injury…and the home state of one george w bush…ugh
Thomas:
Jeter had a good at bat and was robbed of a base hit…..
“The point to question was not leaving Marte in too long but that, when you know you are short handed, you should have left Ramirez and Bruney for a longer period. The GM should have brought someone up for bullpen help and send Rasnar down.”
Ramirez pitched long on Sunday, Bruney just returning from injury himself, he pitched the day before and you’re lucky you got out of him what you did.
You’re being too picky. hindsite is 20-20.
He only had one guy left in the bullpen after the 9th inning. Robertson. That’s it.
One reason why the Yankees bullpen has been effective is that they haven’t overused guys. Sometimes, that means a guy (last night it was Marte) has to take one for the team rather than just using everybody every night (the Joe Torre bullpen philosophy) to try and win every game.
Personally, if the offense did its job, adding more runs against the worst pitching staff in the game, the 9th inning becomes irrelevent.
Its never just “one” guy that blows a game. Last night, the offense had as much to do with the loss as Marte.
They have been working shorthanded in the ‘pen because the starters haven’t been going deep into games for the last 8-9 games. When that happens, your pitching is a mess.
From the Orioles series to now, only Ponson and Moose gave them any innings. That puts a big load on the ‘pen (coupled with Edwar’s one pitch outing when he got tossed the other day) and guys are gassed and dinged up out there. It happens to all teams at certain points in the season.
Unfortunately, its happening to the Yankees right now.
They can’t send Rasner down. He is out of options. They can only DFA him.
Its not Cashman’s fault they lost last night. Learn the rules of transactions before posting such nonsense.
Brian Bruney is coming off a serious foot injury. They aren’t extending him two innings right now.
Edwar? Why extend him when you don’t have to. Unfortunately, Girardi doesn’t have a crystal ball to see how the game is going to play out.
Ideally, you don’t want to have to keep pitching your bullpen guys two innings per outing.
Its why starters going longer than 4-5 innings is a must if you want to have a good bullpen.
Let’s not take anything away from Texas, they are a good hitting ball club. They threw there best pitcher (their Ace) at us last night. Padilla is their best 13 game winner the next highest is a 6 game winner.
We will be ok, let’s hope Joba injury isn’t serious.
Losing Joba potentially for the rest of the season is a huge blow to our playoff chances. That said I agree you just cannot rush this kid back (which probably means out for a month). He is our future. Can the Yanks make it interesting down the strech? Sure, but without Wang and now Joba I just don’t see how we win the division much less a championship this year. Even if we sneak in on the wild card, I’m not looking forward to gettting bounced out of the first round again. I’m just not.
Oh well, baseball can break your heart sometimes, and I am disappointed with this latest injury. Who knows, maybe everyone just plays loose and enjoys the rest of the season now. I’m looking forward to the September call ups to see some of our prospects perform on the big stage which will offer hope for the future. Mr. Cashman the ball is now in your court, what’s the next move?
Hey Freddie Garcia could be an option.
Why not Chase Wright?
I gotta say, that Josh Hamilton is one seriously good fielder to go along with his hitting…he takes some odd routes to balls but he gets there. I’d definitely like to see him in pinstripes one day.
Joba…too many offspeed pitches last night. A lot of the Ranger hitters are free swingers and Joba shouldn’t have had as much trouble as he did second time around the lineup. Anyone catch the replay of the Kinsler “foul ball” when Pudge threw down to second? Joba had to hit the deck posterior first to avoid the throw, it looked really awkward, and he landed on his right side–Joba’s a big guy so that had to hurt.
Freakin’ tough loss last night for real.
That sums up this season in a nutshell. Injuries on top of injuries. I know that players get hurt, but the Yankees seriously need to look at their conditioning program. Too many players are getting hurt, and in some cases aren’t telling the manager until it’s too late.
Last night was pretty brutal,,,Marte to me is a one inning guy, can’t walk 3 in an inning and expect to escape that
Starting to get tired of AROD, guy’s head just doesnt look like he’s in it, I know what his numbers are but damm, we are locked into this guy for 12 years 12 YEARS
And the guy in the hole next to him is looking a little rundown as well
Tough times fellow Yankee fans, signs are there that this just is not the year, hope Im wrong, catching these teams without Wang and Joba now? Oy Vey
Yeah, I also would be surprised if the Yankees let Joba pitch again this year. They won’t take any chances with him and it’s the right move w/such a young player who is so important to the team’s future.
But god damn. This really sucks. Without Joba there is basically no hope of the Yankees doing anything this season. Our bad luck in losing both him and Wang is just insurmountable.
The other teams in the division are extremely f’n lucky. Not better for a second. Just lucky. All the problems and injuries the Yankees have had (and in a “transition year” no less) and they can still only manage a slim few game lead. Imagine if our players were healthy??
Kinda makes this all the more frustrating
The rest of this season is really gonna suck, especially if Moose doesn’t win 20. At least there are some quality young players who are fun to watch, so it won’t be a total loss. But still. This hurts.
And on top of everything else it only happened because of an incorrect call from an umpire. @#@$$^#*!!!
I’ve been a Yankee fan for 40yrs, maybe to some the play-offs look bleak right now that’s because your spoiled making it for 13yrs straight. Not trying to offend anyone making a point.
In 1978 it really looked bleak, mid-August and 12 games out of 1st, there was no WC, win division or nothing.
If we can just get a starter or the kids to get 6 inning starts, our bull-pen can do the rest.
We will be Ok.
We sre 5 games out of the division, and 3 back in the WC.
Plenty of baseball left, aginst the teams in front of us.
On the bright side (I guess) at least Cash didn’t make any trades that compromise our position for next year just to help out this year. In the meantime, just gotta suck it up and think about how hard next year will pwn with Wang, Joba and hopefully Sabathia at the front of the rotation.
In all the Yankees years of consecutive playoff appearances, I think we all knew in the back of our mind that at some point, in some year, whether it was from injuries or a slow start or both, that too many things would go wrong for the team to overcome. It looks like this is that year. Really it was bound to happen sometime. but it just sucks that it has to happen in the Stadium’s final season. And it sucks even worse that it had to happen to Joba. It was so much fun to watch him pitch, I’ll really miss it.
I’m always pretty optimistic about every season, but not this one. Comes a time where you just have to be realistic and look at things the way they are, not the way you hope for them to pan out. Yes, we are still deeply involved in the races and yes, there is still always a possbility that we can make this happen. However, when both of your aces go down and are probably shut down for the season (Be shocked if Joba comes back… Its one thing to have stiffness, its another to have stiffness and hear/feel a pop in your shoulder) you really have to question the state of the staff. Its not like we’ve had bad pitching and the offense has been picking it up all season. Fact of the matter is, this team is just consistently inconsistent (as the Cap’n would say) and for 100+ games now, they still has no idea how to put it together. TB has a solid 1-2-3, as does Boston. Our staff is now a 2-2-5-5-5 (AP,Moose, Ras, Ponson, ?? (IPK)) As optimistic as I would like to be about this season, you have to put it in perspective and not sit here and lie to yourself. You are only going to give yourself false confidence in a team that probably doesn’t even have much of it themselves right now.
Just have to look at the bigger picture. Get our guys healthy and back on track. Continue to develop our young guys and hope to see some glimmer of success in the majors.
I would LOVE for the Yankees to prove me wrong. I am still going to sit here and watch every game, for better or worse and love my team. But don’t think for a second that we still have a great, or even good shot at the PS in 2008.
Hope Hughes and Kennedy pick up the slack. Wouldn’t it be something if these two redeemed themselves after such a disappointing start to the season both had?
as a fan for 50+ years, i totally agree with timothy! of course, winning the #!#!#!# games is necessary also
besides, you can always enjoy counting down the days until your personal favorite whipping boy is gone - pavano or betemit or sexson or giambi or abreu or etc. etc. and your best new toy is delivered - sabathia or texeira or ???.
what a disappointment last night.. This team is killing me this year. Giving me so much hope and then just BAM..taking it all away! I know there is still plenty of time but these injuries are getting out of control.
I would rather be optomistic, we still have a good shot at the play-offs. I will miss Joba to, but we can still over come this.
I refuse to believe we are done, until the number’s (for you stats guys) say so, and right now we are not done!!
Christ…before you people start a rope shortage, at least wait until the medical reports come in today or tomorrow. You can dance from the bridge railings or rafters if it’s bad news.
Fans should stay positive, but this team is in a one step forward two steps back groove. Marte is a lefty specialist, he should be used to get out one big lefty, and then out. If he keeps pitching this bad, the Yanks should flush that option. In fairness to the Rangers, they can kill the ball. Nady looks great, and we’re lucky to have gotten him in that trade. I don’t like NL pitchers coming over to the AL, they get rocked most of the time because they’re not used to facing the AL lineups. It’s just the makeups of the leagues. The NL is more pitching & defense, the AL is just mash the ball.
This Joba injury is a huge deal. It practically forces Cashman to make a deal. You’re left with Pettitte & Mussina at the top…then Ponson, Rasner who got booted out of the rotation for Giese? Who was booted out for Rasner! In the minors we have Kennedy, who was stoned out of the majors, and lucky to have caught an injury when he did. Hughes, who hasn’t pitched all year, this guy Aceves(?) who we keep hearing about, and on the desperate end Igawa & Pavano. But the way things are going would it surprise anyone if Pavano made a start in the next two weeks?
If Joba heard/felt a pop that means he has a muscle tear. Thats the same as a “muscle strain” but “strain” sounds so much better than “tear”. As long as there isn’t cartilage or tendon damage he should be okay. I think SJ is right though, Joba could be shut down for the rest of the season.
GB
Even if it comes back as positive news, I doubt Joba comes back. He is the most valuable piece of our Franchise right now and we can’t risk throwing him out there. Minor injuries build up (minor pain in my shoulder, played through it… 2 months later, torn labrum). For the future of this organization and staff, I think you have to shut him down. You can’t risk 1 year for a ring for what could be 10 successful years of possibly more.
I’m not sure if anyone has brought this up but Joba has only thrown 89 innings this season. He was supposed to throw ~140-150. If he is done for the season then he’ll be on the same innings cap next year. That could mean time in the minors, back to the bullpen or he could be severely limited as a starter. Lets hope he can return somewhat soon and throw more innings.
I just loathe the words “I felt a pop” because those are the exact words Hughes said last year in Texas. So they now strike terror into my heart!
Can`t fault Joe or the team last night. Bad break with Joba, and horrible call by the umpire on the double play at home plate.
I usually over react in these situations, but I think stuff like this happens. Losing Joba will be tough but they will come out of it.
Be alright Joba. Please.
Joba and Hughes will probably be playing some serious winter ball to work on their innings, Patrick. That’s my guess anyway.
If Joba is done for the year (IMO he is unless maybe post season), it equate’s to 9 starts. Like I said before, we can over come this. Pudge is getting settled in, I believe the offense is going to be real tough down the stretch. A-rod is really due to break out.
Injury issues aside, the Yankees squandered yet another opportunity to gain on rivals with Tampa Bay, Boston, and Minnesota losing their games.
There’s only so many of these chances left in the rest of the season and there’s no telling when they’ll come back to bite.
The old adage applies: A win in April is as good as a win in September.
It can’t help but be felt that Wang’s injury will be the one that hurt the most.
I’m not putting the offensive load on A-rod, just saying by the numbers he is really due for a serious hot streak…
I can honestly say that some of the optimistic people on this blog make me feel better about a tough L.
Truth is though, only the play of the Yankees can make me feel optimistic about the rest of the season. If IPK shows us something special this weekend (I am assuming we see him), I’ll feel a lot better. I am hoping he can really give this team a jump start.
We have the Twins in a 3 game series soon, we have Tampa and Boston for a couple of more series as well.
We are in striking distance, yes we didn’t gain ground, but we didn’t lose any either.
Who would have thought that Carl Pavano would be under consideration as a piece of the starting rotation this year ?
I think the current situation highlights the intelligence in Cashman’s approach to building the organization.
Imagine where we would be if our two aces had gone down and we did not have the organizational depth in pitching talent that Cashmoney has put into the system (with the help of the scouting staff and a lot of Steinbrenner bucks making it possible)
So now we have Hughes and IPK - not to mention Aceves - who are all viable fallback positions given the tough spot we find the team in.
Last point - our ace who went down last night is making well under a million bucks - what if that is a $20/year pitcher? Pretty scary when you think about CC and Johan.
Wang’s injury is by far the one that hurt the most.
Imagine throwing out Wang, Joba, AP, and Moose every 4 days? It can be a slugfest for the 5th spot for all I care at that point. Every 4 days we would be throwing out a starter who usually always gives us a chance to win… Oh well. We all just gotta suck it up and hope for the best.
I actually don’t expect the MRI news to be bad, in the grand scheme of injury severity. But I do think the Yankees will shelve Joba for at least twice as long as would normally be required. Girardi said he’ll miss 1 start for sure…well he’s cryptic and you can never be sure what he means by that, but if, say, Rasner would miss 1 start were he to sustain the same injury, then you can be sure Joba will miss at least 2 or 3. IMHO.
Patrick -
That’s a really smart point about the innings cap - I hadn’t even thought about it.
Arod is leading the league in hitting and in the top 5 in HR despite missing almost a month. I just can’t see knocking that.
I agree it’s very likely Chamberlain is shut down. I just don’t see risking his/their future with a shoulder issue, but I don’t want to be premature, he could wake up today feel great and the tests show nothing.
I refuse to rule out PS. This team has kept in the mix through injuries to 4/5 of it’s starters, an MVP, and the catcher. I know this muddies the water, but I’m going to continue to have faith.
Lastly, I don’t know if anyone heard this, but Poppi heard a “pop” in his wrist again, so that could be a major loss for them.
I usually am very down after games and injuries like that. However you cannot blame Marte or Joe, and even the at bats late in the game which were pretty good. I think if Jobas lost, then they got to pick it up. They have great character guys on this team, and Boston is not exactly running away with the Wild card. Its not over, maybe this is Hughes chance to step up. Who knows. They may be down but not out.
my guess is freddy garcia is signed by next week
freddy garcia, victor zambrano, carl pavano and eric milton?
guess I’d better stock up the liquor cabinet for a bumpy ride.
This team needs a new approach to strength and conditioning. Wang, Huges, Joba, IPK, Bruney, Matsui, and Posada are out with injuries. Who knows what the deal is with Mo. This is beyond bad luck. It is mis-management and an embarrassment. Cashman has to take the hit for this.
jk-
you are jk’ing right?
Take a look at the injuries and PLEASE tell me what Cashman could have done.
You guys know in my previous posts, I’ve been slammed for some of my thoughts, on (Bonds/and others).
I will say TK you hit the nail on the head, imagine if this was a 20mil/ a year ace…there would be no flexibility…
Cashman has done a great job for the situation the team is in.
SJ/CB/ you guys we right, youth is were the Yanks have gotten smart.
Cash money if your listening, I owe you an apology for slamming you earlier this year.
JK
You last post is the dumbest one that I have ever seen on this blog.
Congratulations.
TKinDC;
LOL………….
Good to see Dr. SJ44 is up early and on the case today. He’d be surprised if we see Joba again this season. Why am I not surprised you feel that way? I choose to be optimistic and believe that Joba will be out for two to three weeks and be back by Sept 1st, either one of us could be right.
People are upset enough this morning, as the most respected poster on the board, it’s a real downer when you say things like that and not necessary imo.
Look at it this way, Marte took one for the team.
Don’t tell me you wouldn’t have been peeking through your finger’s if Kyle was in there last night.
“my guess is freddy garcia is signed by next week”
it owuldnt be the worst thing in the world to commit to the rest of this year and 2009 to Garcia.
Optimism is one thing but realism says the X factor with these Yankees is lack of clutch or timely hitting. Pitching injuries have hurt but too many well pitched games went for naught with every starting pitcher because of no run support.
still waiting for the “best player in baseball” to pick up his team. i aint seein it…
Sj I agree with everything you have posted. Injuries have finally caught up to the team this year and the offense cannot compensate for the voids.. edwar pitched 29 pitches the night before also.
I feel the season may be over.. they have lost there ace, there starting catcher and ther left fielder/DH for at least 1/2 the season each. there 2 young pitcher s gave them less then nothing and now ther young mega ace goes down.. this season has been terrible all the way around..They almost never get the big hit when they need it and that really hurts.
arod was invisible last night, his #’s are great but his big hits are non existent. his giveaway AB last night just is the tip of the iceberg and Cano gave away a huge AB like he always does with 2 on and no outs in like the 5th or 6th. Cano always tries to hit his way on, does he know a walk is as good as a hit.. Melky does the same but is less capable so really cannot get away with it..
Imagine a loss season.. Other teams such as the Dodgers and tigers have had similar injuries to the yanks and also are treading water or doing worse then the Yanks.. The Yankees offensive studs have not carried the team.. The cashman moves were great but I think especially if Joba is out they have no chance..I think if they Send Rasner down and lose him in the waivers who cares, is he a long term part of the solution.. AAAA pitches area dime a dozen and find lightning in the ottle once in a blue moon. Rasner has been given every opptty. by the Yanks but is just not very good…
Freddy Garcia is scheduled to work out this Thursday in front of several teams.
Jeff-
SJ is just telling the truth. Joba is this franchise’s most prized possession. It is not worth bringing him back early and jeopardizing the man’s career for the sake of a ring. Its one thing to be optimistic about it, but you have to look at the bigger picture and the future.
You are right though, he could be back in 2-3 weeks, but most of us doubt it. We are just trying to be realistic about a terrible situation.
Jeff NJ:
I don’t know, Joba would really only get 9 more starts this year. IMO I see the Yanks being extremely careful with him. In 1 or 2 weeks, we will probably have at 3 least 3 call ups, or 2 and maybe 1 signing.
I believe if Joba is ok, he would only make a PS appearance.
IMO
I was as big of a ‘cheerleader’ a couple of months ago, when everyone was whining about the Yankees’ slow start.
I think, if Joba’s out for a significant amount of time, I will give up pretty much any hope for the playoffs this year.
I’m surprised at some of the Girardi defenders on the bullpen use. It was a mistake to commit to getting five outs from Marte. Bruney should have stayed in with the bullpen being short. He only threw 20 pitches.
I also disagree with the notion that you “just don’t” put a rookie in with the bases loaded. If that’s true, then you “just don’t” bring your only other reliever in the eighth inning. Marte was really struggling to locate vs RH hitters and should have been out of there having thrown 41 pitches.
All you keyboard physicians need to relax a minute. It could be as minor as a cramp that could lead to missing just one start. If it’s a miuscle strain, that’s a DL stint, but with 50 games to go there’s still time for Joba to come back.
If Joba goes on the DL may guess is Giese and Rasner both start this weekend with Melancon or another reliever coming up. Makes more sense than turning Rasner into a reliever on short notice.
the 140 innings cap meant that joba would have had to slow down his innings anyway. if he averaged 6 innings per start, he was going to run out of innings before the regular season was over. so if this is minor and he misses say 3 starts, he will still be able to make it to 140 this season.
stuart:
They still have a very legit shot at making the PS. IMO
I refuse to give up on them. They are due, to get real hot offensively..
Patrick Joba will never go back to the minors for pitch count issues.. Have you seen him pitch?? He has top 10 stuff now, his ERA is 2.50 ish.. They will deal with his innings limit in the majors enough with the hysteria.
others are now realizing this is why signing a huge pitching FA is risky!!!!
DUH, DUH, SUH.
Signing pitching FA for long term huge deals is a total crap shoot, is this news to you all????????
Hughes+Chamberlain=Prior+Wood
TK, it looks like you picked a bad time to stop sniffing glue.
.
.
.
.
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Airplane (quote - Lloyd Bridges)
I agree the Yanks are in a for a tough fight, but “History” show’s stranger things have happened. We are not that far behind in any race for the pennant or WC.
Who know’s thge medical situation with or without Joba, we can get a PS berth.
Manny Ramirez may be a goof but but he puts up superior numbers compared to A-Rod in the area of clutch hitting.
For the most part, Alex is a straight numbers guy.
With the game on the line there’s several hitters better seen with a bat in their hands than Alex.
He has never understood how to contain his power when a game situation calls for just making contact.
The sad part is, the closer he gets to Bond’s record the more swinging for the fences we’ll see.
Stuart - If the Cano at bat that you are referring to was the one where he smoked a line drive to left field that was caught, that was not a giveaway. That was an extremely well hit ball right at a fielder. Similar to Jeter’s hit in the 9th, good line drive, good catch by Hamilton.
It is quite frankly amazing where the Yankees are this season despite injuries to arguably their two most consistent hitters (Posada and Matsui). Their most consistent pitcher (Wang). And Rodriguez for a month, Hughes and Kennedy for two months, Damon for time etc.
What other team can lose their best hitters and ace pitcher and be just two games back in the loss column from a playoff spot.
We will need to see how long Joba is out. But Kennedy likely gets a turn soon and then Hughes a bit behind him.
I was as frustrated as anyone last night but the larger concern is Joba’s health.
timothy I hope you are right on the offensive explosion I have no faith in; jeter, arod, abreu, giambi, irod, etc. carrying this team offensively.. NONE..
the yanks just do not consistently get big hits…
they scored 5 runs last night on the surface looks good but the rangers have the worst pitching in baseball..no excuse but the yanks have had more then there fair share of unfortunate issues this season.. the millionaires just could not do there jobs or pick up the slack..the best player in baseball only played like a top ten player, ALBERT PUJOLS carries a team Arod does not.. Jeter had a bad year, abreu is very up and down, giambi is terrible with RISP, Cano is a head case, melky not very good, Matsui hurt to much, Damon( a really good player) but not a superstar, etc…
This is the bleakest it has looked in quite a while…
stuart:
Any huge signing of a contract is a risk, god forbid A-rod blew out a knee.
Missing your actual point……..
Heard Rasner has a blister on his throwing hand. If that’s so he wont be DFA’d, but put on DH.
Guess is Joba, even if MRI negative, will not return for this road trip.
Unlikely now that Yankees can pick up Washburn thru waivers, because Seattle will want to much. No to Livian Hernandez.
Marte should have been pulled as soon as he couldn’t locate the plate. It’s 100 degrees and he wasn’t right. Whichever starter whose turn it was to pitch on the sidelines that day should be an option for Girardi.
If Joba and Rasner are out the Yankees should bring up 3 pitchers to replace him.
As our bullpen is our strength, this is now 3 days in a row that they have failed. Sometimes teams make the playoffs on luck, but that’s not going to happen unless we win almost all the series games we have left.
“Hughes+Chamberlain=Prior+Wood”
Okay, you are stretching here. Those guys were injured every frackin’ season. Joba and Hughes haven’t even played as long as them. Plus, we don’t even know how bad Joba is. People here are already saying he’s done for the season. Are you serious? He hasn’t even seen a doctor yet and already, people are expecting the worst. I’ll agree that if Joba is toast, so are the Yankees playoff chances. But I’m waiting for a doctor’s report before I jump over the ledge.
stuart:
I just have to believe this offense is so over due to get hot and stay hot.
Any news on Hideki
more arod out of the 4 hole. he’s killing our rallies! put nady or someone else who is at least occasionally clutch in there. let arod work on his HOF #’s from the 2 hole or batting 6th or something. (i said let him work on his #’s in another uniform, but nobody listened and now we’re stuck for 10 yrs!)
Bleach Creach…ramirez so-called clutch numbers this year are about a .250 BA. Close and late, he’s hitting .184. Anything else, you can look up.
***.194***
I hope Joba is just fine, however 1 guy doesn’t make a team.
They still have a very good shot..at the PS.
washburn wont clear waivers. he does have a huge contract that nobody wants but since the m’s already turned down a player for washburn, its obvious they wont let him go for no compensation, so the red sox and rays have a free shot to claim him knowing the m’s will pull him off waivers and then cant work out a new trade with the yankees.
that ship has sailed…
“the 140 innings cap meant that joba would have had to slow down his innings anyway. if he averaged 6 innings per start, he was going to run out of innings before the regular season was over. so if this is minor and he misses say 3 starts, he will still be able to make it to 140 this season.”
But if he misses the rest of the season (which is a distinct possibility) he will have thrown less innings this year than he did last year which means he will be back on a 140 innings cap next year.
“Patrick Joba will never go back to the minors for pitch count issues.. Have you seen him pitch?? He has top 10 stuff now, his ERA is 2.50 ish.. They will deal with his innings limit in the majors enough with the hysteria.”
Of course I’ve seen him pitch. Think about this for a second before you take shots at me.
If Joba is out for the rest of the season he will be back on the same innings cap which forced him to the bullpen for the first part of this season. Now that he’s stretched out as a starter I don’t see Cashman putting him back in the bullpen and transitioning him YET AGAIN to a starter. That was a mess in the media and it can’t be easy for Joba.
Assuming this is true then basically Joba has to be a starter for the whole season with a 140 innings cap. Most starters have 30 starts or more in a season. 140/30 = 4.66 innings per start. So are you telling me you’d limit one of the pitchers in your rotation to less than 5 innings per start? That would basically be like giving every fifth game away.
You can’t sacrifice games in the majors in favor of developing Joba so the best option I see is putting him in the minors to get his innings up.
The final option would be to make him a reliever for the rest of his career which is the worst possible course IMO.
Jason I was in the car listening to the rangers broadcaster on XM, they did not mention line drive so if I am wrong I apologize the 2 and 0 thing bothers me with Cano it is a endless theme with him
Again teams usually do not win games but teams lose games.. 2 examples are the yankee game last night and the angels game…the walks etc. at the end killed the yanks and O’s..
the good news is if the Joba is out a while , at least the Yanks will finally get a high draft pick, and can look at some younger guys more then usual..
The 2 huge injuries are the Wang and Hughes ones.. Call me a fool I expected and expect big things from Hughes regardless if he throws 93 or 96(who gives a crap) and Wang running the bases is huge..
matsui and posada the yanks should be able to overcome with there 9 other all star lineup.. the lineup had not come thru all year..the tino yr. when he carried the team for 2 weeks is a n example, they had huge pitching issues but there offense just pummeled teams.. that team is not as well balanced as this team on paper..
Trader…no way are the Yanks going to make Rasner the DH. he can’t hit for squat. With blisters, the may DL him, though.
we all know that the Steinbrenner’s wanna win more than anything else. So what happens if we dont win??? Does Cashman go bye-bye?? Does Girardi keep his job???(Personally Id like to see Showalter back) What type of splash do the Yanks make? Does Jorge,Matsui,Abreu,Giambi, maybe even Mosse,Andy, come back next year??? for that fact does even Damon make it next year??? I truly believe that if we dont make it to the ALCS it is going to be an off-season to remember. New Stadium there is no way the Steinbrenner’s dont make HUGE changes..
Y’s guy on washbum he will clear waivers and the Yanks since they are lower in the standings then the sux and rays would get him if they wanted or the mariners could pull him back.
the team lower in the standings gets the first bid…
In spite of all this, injuries to key players, poor pitching from the young guy’s earlier this year, no real clutch hitting, tons of talent that is over do to produce.
We are only 5 games from the division, 3 in the WC…
I know we will win the WC at the very least. Ok I said it.
coach jay I will bet you any amount of money you want Girardi does not lose his job it is not even a possibility.
why don’t we discuss if the sun will come up tommorrow??
“Does Jorge,Matsui,Abreu,Giambi, maybe even Mosse,Andy, come back next year??? for that fact does even Damon make it next year???”
ughh… we just signed Jorge to a 4 year deal, Matsui is still under contract, as is Damon…
My only guess is that you meant they might be traded
Did i say he was getting fired???? Nope asked the questions, remember the old Yankees that fired managers after 1 year and Hank is said to be like the OLD GEORGE?? please dont put words in my mouth thanks
Well right they would have to be traded, Guys i know what im talking bout.Thats why I asked what will happen in your opinions?? I know it wont be all of them gone but thats why i throw out the names.
Why would Girardi lose his job ? He’s playing the cards that he’s been dealt. He can’t control the injuries that have plagued the team this year and he can’t force the offense to perform up to it’s potential.
stuart, the m’s have already turned down a b prospect for wasbhurn, they are not going to let him be claimed on waivers. the yanks want wash to clear waivers so they can restart trade talks, they know that if they claim him, he wont clear and they cant trade for him. the M’s will put him up for waivers but if anybody claims him including the yankees, they will pull him off and wont be able to trade him.
knowing that the m’s wont let him go without recieving a prospect, the other teams are free to claim him knowing that the m’s will revoke the waivers and then they cant trade him to the yankees.
Agree with comment on Arod. the best player in the game needs to get some big hitsI knew he probably did nothing last night because it was a close game.
Joe G, isn’t going anywhere he has done a great job with what has happened this year.
Cash money he isn’t going anywhere either.
After our PS trip this year, next year will be even more exciting…
Stuart - It was acutally a very good good at bat by Cano. He got ahead in the count, got his pitch and drilled it the other way. Just happened to be right at a guy. Honestly, he could not have hit it much better.
The fearless prediction is that in about three starts Hughes comes up really helps to fill the void left by Joba. The reports so far on Hughes’ rehab have been outstanding.
I met a guy whose son played in college with Ian Kennedy. He has followed him throughout his college career and brief professional career. He seems to think that Kennedy is a very good pitcher and will work himself out. He too will help (sooner than Hughes).
Does anyone remember the initial injury Alan Horne went down with this year?
Another factor to consider is that the 3 closest minor league pitchers to start the season have all gone backwards this year: Horne, White and Marquez. Makes it even more remarkable how the Yankees are still in this thing.
who was calling the pitches last night? The bench or Pudge? Is it possible that Pudge called for too much breaking stuff and put undo stress on Joba’s shoulder? Seems that we weren’t having all these pitching problems with Molina as the backstop.
People still bashing Arod, I thought that went out last year. He’s our best player, get over it. Way bigger problems than Arod.
Random thought…
If we lose out on the bidding for CC (wouldn’t be too disappointed, hate shelling out big contracts), does anybody think we make a run for Yu Darvish? I mean, he has to be under consideration right now.
I know, a lot of Japanese pitchers don’t translate in the US. However, they said he is probably better than Dice-K and he is younger. And as much as we’d hate to admit, Dice-K is a very good pitcher when he isn’t walking the world. Just a thought… Don’t need to get bashed for it.
Ive seen it all on here now, We are blaming Pudge for Joba’s inury..
I think Girardi is def safe for next year, but after that I am not sure of, Cash I think saved his job for those trades he made at the deadline and not giving up any top prospects. Sorry to say but I think Abreu is gone as well as Giambi and I think the Yanks will look hard to trade Matsui or Damon at least 1 of them. The one thing is maybe this off-season we dont have to overhaul the ‘pen.
Agree with Scooter.
Media and everybody else bashes A-Rod. His own fans don’t need to jump in the mix, let it go.
we have bigger problems then our offense failing miserably led by our cleanup hitter?
i sure dont think so…
so i ask again, when is the supposed “best player in baseball” going to rise up and take his team somewhere? he is useless when he’s most needed.
why shouldnt we bash him when he’s doing nothing while the offense cant score? is arod above criticism?
“who was calling the pitches last night? The bench or Pudge? Is it possible that Pudge called for too much breaking stuff and put undo stress on Joba’s shoulder? Seems that we weren’t having all these pitching problems with Molina as the backstop.”
Joba was calling them. If you -actually watched the game-, you’d notice he shook Pudge off a lot.
Of course, don’t let that keep you from irrationally blaming Pudge.
Maybe it was Melky’s fault?
Yu Darvish is a great call however it was said he likes Boston, and maybe even the west-coast. But $$$ talkes and the Yankees are moving into a new-stadium and look at the marketing opitions he could have
Coach Jay,
you start with an assumption, then base your whole post off it. your assumption is false. the brothers stein aren’t their dad. they’ve made many comments about how this is, in essence, a rebuilding year. they’re not going the same route they did before. to build a new core of youth, you’ll have struggles, and that’s what they’re running into. i don’t think you’ll see them get away from that philsophy because the teams having some difficulties. they expect that. now, if in a few years, this isn’t working, then you’ll see some dramatic changes, but not now.
as a side note, whenever people tell me they know what their talking about, i assume the opposite. if people actually know what their talking about, you can figure that out pretty quickly without being told.
SOMEONEELSE. You are so right, It was Melky’s fault Joba got hurt last night what were we thinking not blamming him from the start. Its melky fault 2 the Yanks didnt get another SP at the dead-line
Now if We lose both Joba and Wang, I think we are done. This season is absolutely over. Time to look forward to the new stadium. By the way, call Mattingly, our new manager.
Coach - I don’t think the bullpen gets remade. The one decision is on Marte - do you pick up the option.
As far as players go, some will depend on who will play for short contracts.
Mussina and Pettite - depends on CC, depends on Joba, depends on what Hughes and Kennedy show the rest of the way - but you have to keep at least one if not both.
Giambi - I am not averse to swapping Giambi for Miranda who is now at .300 and hitting lefties better of late.
Abreu - Can replace him with Nady if he doesn’t take a two year deal.
Matsui and Damon - I would look for trades. They will have one year left on the contracts and Damon is having a good season so he will be valuable. Matsui has been injury prone and is probably a DH at this point. For these two you also have to weigh the trafe value versus potential draft picks you would get the following year should they leave as free agents.
IRod - depends on Posada.
Overall, I would be worried about getting rid of so many veterans on the team (although that might be a good thing), getting rid of potentially three outfielders, and the lack of outfield prospects close to ready in the minors (Austin Jackson still being a year away).
WSR ur an idiot. I never said they were their DAD and actually I only said HANK and USA today actually did an article about how Hank is like his dad and even Hank said he was like hes dad in alot of ways. Last time I checked all the guys i mentioned are not young guys nor are they guys we brought up through are system, except for Andy and Jorge. Ive always said we should do what we did in 96 and win with are own guys and put pieces in that way, CC is younger than Moose, Tex is younger than Giambi, Matsui and Abreu.. Thanks for you comments though
Arod needs to get some hits when the game is postion to be won or lost. He needs to stop with the homers when they are down by 7 or up by 7
Someone Else-
Relax there. Blaming Melky like that… Don’t you know its always A-Rod’s fault around here? Jeez…
You guys are clueless, I said that WE DONT NEED TO get ‘pen help i never said to get any for the pen. I like are pen, and I never said to get rid of anyone I asked a “WHAT IF” questions.. my god
I’m glad we didn’t have this blog in 1978.
obviously I have no idea about Yu Darvish but I pas no matte what.. Japanese pitchers pitch every 6 days and it is just to big a gamble.. SUre CC is a gamble but his durability has been a positive so far..
Arod is overall the yanks best player he just is not as great as his groupies think…when you make $28 mill a yr. theoretically you should be the best player.
he is not very clutch….he has much company on this team with mr. giambi being even less clutch, cano and his brain cramps, and assorted other fellow come up small in big moments teammates… the yanks are 11th in runs scored… that is all I need to say, 11th…………
How many innings has Joba thrown? Hopefully plenty because having this injury could put him on a smaller innings limit next year like Hughes. It would suck to have to deal with inning limits on Joba next year to such an extent.
We all know we cant have Damon,Melky,Abreu,Nady and Matsui playing the OF doesnt work guys. So 2 of them have to go and with the lack of no one being able to play CF but Melky that leaves either Damon, ABreu, or Matsui so what do the Yanks do
If the umpires make the right call, the double play stands and Joba’s should is fine today.
Just asking?
Does anyone else think Joba was throwing more breaking balls than usual last night?
Maybe it was a function of the hitters he was facing. Also, the slow curve seemed to be working for him. Several times he dropped it in on the first pitch like Moose has been doing lately.
But it did seem like he threw fewer fastballs even though he seemed to have good velocity on the YES radar gun.
Stuart-
Fact of the matter is, nobody on offense is doing their job except for some guy named Nady. And that is a small sample size with the Yanks so I’m not even sure if that could be put into argument. The offense as a whole needs to step it up. Somebody needs to ignite it, whether that be A-Rod, Cano, Jeter, etc… When Cano is hot, you can see what he does to an offense. Came out mashing the second half and we went 8-0. Somebody needs to step up and be a lead-by-example leader for this club for the next 50 games.
i think its time to put that “best player in baseball” title away, he is not.
he’s also not work $28M/yr.
I read about Yu Darvish who is one of the biggest stars since Dice-K and Matsui. He has a good breaking ball and fastball and some secondary stuff and from what I read, great control to the strike zone. I don’t think it would be too bad to sign him and hope for the best.
Look at the posts last night, in the 2nd inning I posted he was only throwing curves and fastballs at that time.. this has no affect on his injury. I did point out this was good because he was saving his slider for later in the game….
Yanksrule57:
I noticed the fast ball drop off, who knows maybe he was a little dehydrated. Texas is a good offensive team, maybe good fast ball hitters, but I was surprised he didn’t go with more fast ball’s in bad spots.. not sure why?
joba couldnt locate his fastball all night, thus the walks…i think he was injured before he took the mound, it may have gotten worse as the game went on. he threw more curves b/c he didnt have command of his fb, even cone pointed that out a couple of times.
Wha? You mean it wasn’t a bad dream? Joba really did get hurt last night?
Wait. What’s that I see over there? Couldn’t be. Yeah, I think it’s hope.
Before everyone starts shoveling dirt on the Yankees season, lets see how the team responds. My guess is that they’ll rally.
LOL @ Yu Darvish. He would be absolutely perfect, but I don’t think it’s happening with the new look Yankees.
If Joba’s news is bad and Hughes is lights out in his next start, don’t be surprised to see him stretch out in the majors. Even before Joba got hurt, Phil was on the express bus.
Pitchers should be called up in this order:
Garcia (if he can be acquired)
IPK
Hughes
The kid that gave up 4 in a row
Igawa
Aceves
Pavano
Let me point something else out, the big win over the Angels on Sunday? Keep in mind if Figgins fields AROD routine DP ball with RISP they don`t win that game. So that was yet another failure with the game on the line, only this time he and the Yankees got lucky
He threw more breaking balls because Texas hitters are FANTASTIC fastball hitters. They are all very aggressive so throwing breaking balls to get them off-balance and to chase was the game plan for last night. That is all.
stuart:
I noticed the same thing, but it seemed to me that after the 2nd he kinda stop using the fast ball as much, not sure why…
27 this year. hoping for the best is not a strategy.
cashman has strategy is not real complicated so I will spell it out. develop pitching from within(cheaper and pitching injury wise is to risky to pay high price FA) and sign a occasional FA position player when it makes sense…
this is his strategy and it is sound, they need to keep to the plan….the plan is working look at the results thruout the minors and on the mound last night and more to come…….
Coach Jay,
haha, this is not a world of what if? People jump all over others just for kicks. The argument gets kind of circular at some point. Best thing is to move on.
Re: Alex. All we want is a little contact. A little love. That’s all.
I didn’t have time to read all your comments but here is what I have to say. Girardi was absolutely BRUTAL lasty games. On Sunday he left Edwar in the game and he allowed HR, same thing happened with Marte yesterday. Damaso was off and walked Rangers, that was time to put Robertson or even Rivera in the game, just to get that friggin’ last out. Instead, The Great Joe lef him in the game struggling with his pitch control and he loaded bases and allowed crushing grand slam. So, I BLAME GIRARDI for these 2 grand slams completely. Bad coaching. BAD.
Looks like the Yanks are going to go heavy after Freddy Garcia or Jarrod Washburn now. They are in deep crap if Joba is out. He and Moose (!!!) were the only ones that have been reliable lately.
black Yankee:
I don’t know, maybe routine but A-rod was scorching the ball on Sunday…if the call stood last night on the DP, Texas doesn’t get the 3 run homer…it’s baseball…
The umpires have been flat out awful this year. I flipped to the Red Sox game last night for 5 minutes, and saw Sean Casey at bat. He took a curveball inside, hit it into play, got thrown out and all of a sudden it was called a foul off his foot. Casey was not even close to hitting it off his foot. The umpire didnt even call it until Casey turned around to tell him to. This crap has gone on all year, bad calls and umpires calling based on what the catcher and hitter tells him. That happened to Giambi a couple times this year too. MLB needs to review the umpires for real, not this stupid “grading” system crap.
O Mel I agree I was just throwing it out there. I personally like this team we have right now and think we can win. I do like everyone else think we need to get some back end help though. I like Giese starting over Rasner. Its early in the morning and just seeing what people think may happen next year if things go south the rest of the Year.
stf-
Marte gets pulled and the only reliever we have left in our pen is Robertson, and thats for the entire game. Rivera, Veras and Giese were all unavailable. Know that before you start asking for Girardi’s head. Marte had no choice but to bite the bullet for this club last night, NONE. Only argument you could make is for Bruney to stay in the game longer since he only had 20 pitches. Even that is a stretch since you kinda have to be cautious with him still.
freddy garcia has not pitched all yr., had a major injury, and we are moving him into the rotation because he use to be good.. sounds like the george steinny yanks.. we are big on reputations, if reputations could win games we would be in first.
I do not touch garcia with a 10 foot pole.. PASS>>>>>
If we do not have the answers within call it a season and move on.. Let’s call this offense the reputation offense because the reputations do not eual the results from the whole team except Damon and Nady(small sample size) the rest are underachievers…….
Sad but true on the underperforming….
Somewhere in Tampa, Carl Pavano is sitting in an easy chair in a dark room, stroking a black cat, and cackling, “Good! Good! All is going according to plan…”
Isn’t today supposed to be Freddy Garcia’s big pitching exhibition for all interested teams? Anyone know when or where that is taking place? I assume the Yankees will be sending someone to watch him…
The real awful umpire, especially last night, is Bull-spit Bob Davidson. Not only does he come in from 2nd base to override the call at the plate because, after all, he’s the crew chief and he has all the authority, he then proceeds to scream and curse at A-Rod, who has the gall to question his divine authority.
Kudos to the biggest punk, and most classless umpire working in the game today. I don’t know if anybody remembers the hatchet he took to the World Baseball Classic, but that mess, on top of his long history of making terrible calls and then pounding his chest to defend himself…he really adds a lot to the sport, a great mediator out there on the field.
so you are just figuring out the umps stink..
they always stink.. I still have not seen the ball hit Kinsler but they overruled the initial call.
I am clueless on the balks so I will not go there.. the umps think we come to see them!!!!
I can show you a missed call on the basepaths almost every game.. a few days ago a yankee was called out at home forget the play, he was safe…..
the yanks have not gotten or created many breaks this year…
I think if the Yankees see that Freddy Garcia can even lift the baseball, they should present him with a blank check.
this season is one disaster after the next. this sucks.
Andrew,
I saw Davidson talking to ARod on YES last night too, and thought it was utterly despicable. It was an example of an umpire playing-God and saying “Don’t you f-ing talk to me like that…”. Now, we dont know what ARod said, but knowing him, he probably only asked “How can you make that call all of the way from 2nd base and overturn the home ump’s call?” Obviously, Davidson doesn’t use reason.
ohhh…I am pessmistic about the team’s chances without Joba, but just remembered something that made me feel a little better - it is August now. August is Andy’s time. Don’t be surprised to see him step up big.
But just that alone will not be enough…Hughes will need to step up big too. No matter what happens though I bet Andy will at least make the stretch run interesting.
Also re: Freddy Garcia, he hasn’t pitched in 14 months, how is he supposed to be signed, work his way through the minors, and then be the guy to contribute to the pennant race in 2008? If they are going to sign him, it’s going to be insurance for next year. And, if they sign him, it would make me think that they weren’t all that interested in bringing back Moose and Andy for 2009. Personally, I say pass on Garcia and let’s tend to our own right-hander with a shoulder issue to insure that he doesn’t need the type of major operation that Freddy needed. Everyone needs to grin and bear a few more starts by IPK, as much as that disgusts the people that post on this board.
BBB…I am skeptical that Andy is the same Andy as before. He looked just plain awful last week. He’s been “one-good, one-bad” this year. I would like to see him put a string of great, quality starts together.
Also, don’t look now, but the Yanks bullpen has not been that great recently.
Speaking of… I wouldn’t touch Prince Fielder with a 100-ton crane. Did you guys see his punk move against last night’s starter, Parra?
Jason Smith said last night, winning teams don’t have fights like that. The Yankees, Angels, Red Sox (the Manny thing was on Manny), etc. He’s absolutely right. Why would you punch someone you respect? You wouldn’t.
At this point, I am not trying to be negative about the season, just realistic. My optimism will come back to me once I see some solid IPK at the MLB level. Its sad, but our season now comes down to the young guns on the farm.
In addition, here is to hoping that people in the lineup can feed off of X and learn how to see the pitch and hit it in a big spot.
re: Arod, with all the bashing of him in the clutch, I started looking at Pujols at bats since he seems to be the guy that everybody assumes always comes through. With a 2-1 deficit the other day, Pujols popped out with men on base in the 6th, and leading off the ninth, he grounded out on the FIRST pitch. Cano, Jeter et al are always killed for first pitch swinging, but here is the “best hitter” in baseball doing it down 2-1 in the 9th. We only see the highlights of these other guys when they do come through, we see our guys making 6 or 7 outs out of 10 even when they are on fire.
“I still have not seen the ball hit Kinsler but they overruled the initial call.”
Which I thought they were not allowed to do without evidence that the original call was wrong. Davidson should be suspended without pay. But of course he won’t because his union will protect him.
Not to go off on a tangent but even though I come from a family of union workers, this is the kind of thing that makes me hate unions. Their protection of their employees is such that there is no motivation for them to perform their job properly, because they won’t be rewarded if they do, nor will they be disciplined if they don’t.
Jeff,
Really, get a grip. They aren’t going to take ANY chances with Joba Chamberlain. N-O-N-E.
Its not a cramp. If it was a cramp, he wouldn’t be going for an MRI today.
Cramps aren’t something that require MRI’s. Geez, you can’t be that naive, can you?
If its a strained deltoid (in other words, a tear. Which is what strains are), they aren’t going to risk using him unless he is 100%.
In other words, they aren’t going to risk his future for this season.
That’s not being a downer. That’s just telling the truth.
Perhaps you can’t handle the truth. That’s another issue.
The bottom line is, the Yankees have had TWO instances this year where important players (Posada and Hughes) tried to push themselves through “minor” injuries and they became major injuries.
Do you really think they are going to risk Joba Chamberlain the rest of the way? I’d say the odds of him coming back this year are 10%.
And please, don’t tell me how Girardi said its “not something significant”. He also said Bruney had “no structural damage” to his foot. He missed 3 and half months.
He said Posada was “fine”. We now know Posada was hurt in the first day of ST, and had been hurt ALL SEASON.
Girardi said he was “confident” Wang would be back in September for the past month. The other day, he said there was “no chance” he would be back.
Derek Jeter played SIX weeks with a broken hand. Yet, Jeter and the Yankees have insisted he has been “fine”.
The Yankees ALWAYS lie about injuries. Always. Doesn’t make them bad people. Its just the way they choose to handle discussing injuries publicly.
Choosing to be optimistic is one thing. Being realistic is another.
Sometimes, the two don’t always go together.
I hope he only misses one start. However, given the Yankees honesty when it comes to injuries, I would venture a guess to say the odds that he only misses one start is about nil.
“the yanks have not gotten or created many breaks this year…”
That is not new either. The umpires have been screwing the Yankees for the past few years now.
“Also, don’t look now, but the Yanks bullpen has not been that great recently.”
Thats because Girardi has no flexibility. Most of his guys are burnt because his starters can’t last more then 5. Our bullpen was great when our guys were going 6+. Our bullpen was fresh, ready and healthy. Now, starters are having a hard time through 5 and its killing our arms in there.
They aren’t just screwing the Yankees. The umpires have had a bad year throughout baseball this year.
The two balk calls against the Rangers were awful last night. Absolutely awful.
The Kinsler play wasn’t much better.
The Yankees aren’t in third place because of the umpires. They are in third place because of a combination of underperformance from many players on the roster for long periods of time and injuries.
That’s a much more deadly combination to a season than bad umpiring.
I’m glad Joe didn’t tax everybody last night.
We would have a tired/taxed out the whole pen and 9 more road games, with Tex, Halo’s amd Minn (maybe with or wothout Joba). We are still in this race. Marte was the only guy left last night…maybe Robertson…
The offense is gonna have to get hot, I believe they will, Texas is a good offense…
id trade arod for pujols every day and twice on sunday.
Well, regardless of whether Joba comes back or not, Yanks have to play the remaining 50 odd games and we are going to be following it.. So there’s no need for ’season is over’ ’sky is falling’ cries yet..
It is easy to speculate with injuries and some guys here try to take the injuries too lightly and some take it over cautiously… Being a regular blog reader, Pete is very conservative on his speculations about
returning back from injury and he has been proven right in two instances (hughes and wang) this year..
Best case scenario is Joba misses a couple of starts, comes back into the rotation and continues to do what he has been doing.. moose and andy go around their business.. Hughes comes back and pitches well.. Offense and bullpen do their job.. we make the playoffs..
Good Chance: Joba is shutdown for a month or so.. hughes comes back.. goes 3-3 or so.. Kennedy or ponson or whoever fills in decently enough and we end up fighting till the last game of the season..
Worst case scenario is Joba is shutdown for the season.. Hughes and kennedy come back and pitch like the earlier part of the season…
Dream scenario: Joba just misses a start.. Hughes comes back and pitches a no-no… goes 6-0 or 7-0…. Kennedy fills in great and goes 4-2 or 5-1…. Moose wins 20 games.. yanks take the division.. Wang comes back for the postseason.. Pavano wins the world series MVP…
BBB -
I am a teacher in Jersey, and obviously part of one of the stronger unions in NJ, but I understand where you are coming from with the umps, and unions. There is sometimes a blind defense for members, when sometimes it would behoove the union to cut its losses and get rid of waste. Granted, it provides me and others with a sense of protection…but I’ve always thought that if one did their job correctly, protection wasn’t needed. That view is a little naive, probably, as there are certain situations I’ve seen where the union is absolutely necessary to protect myself and other co-workers from preposterous things, but your point is valid.
Can I sue Joe Morgan? I broke my arm when I fell off my chair. Pretty sad when he likes our chances more than the fans do.
Seth (Hershey, PA): Hey Joe. Do the Yankees have any chance of making the playoffs if Joba is out a while? Thanks
Joe Morgan: (10:49 AM ET ) I think they would still have a chance because I think they would find another starter. Remember, the Yanklees still have a great lineup, and it would have to win games for them…which it can do. If I can put runs on the board, it will make my pitcher more comfortable, so I beleive in lineups. The Yankees have a very good lineup.
joba is probably done for the month, maybe he comes back in the next two weeks, maybe next year. his future is more important than the team’s present.
“He’s been “one-good, one-bad” this year. I would like to see him put a string of great, quality starts together.”
Well if he is going to put such a string together, now is the time to do it. He has been up and down this year, but it definitely wouldn’t surprise me to see him summon two months of greatness right now is all I’m saying.
The bullpen is a huge worry though. I’m very concerned about Mo. They acted like his back spasms were just a one day thing but then he wasn’t available yesterday. (Which is a perfect example of why i’m not optimistic about seeing Joba return, it’s ALWAYS worse than they say it is.) But anyway, if Mo is on the shelf for any length of time I think you can basically stick a fork in us. It’s improbable enough that we’ll get by without Joba…
Matt is exactly right. The bullpen is scuffling the past week because the starters haven’t given them innings.
Go back 8 days. Last Sunday in Boston, a short Ponson start.
Monday vs. the O’s. A short Moose start.
Tuesday vs. the O’s. Rasner gave them 6 but the ‘pen had to get used up because they struggled.
Wednesday, Joba gave them length.
Thursday vs. the Angels, a short Andy start and the ‘pen got used up.
Friday: 7 strong out of Ponson but, Mo came up with back spasms after the game necessitating everyone getting more work.
Saturday: Strong outing by Moose.
Sunday: Bad outing by Rasner, no Mo, guys had to get used up.
Last night: Short inning by Joba and guys had to get used up.
9 games, and 6 of them had the starters give them short outings. Couple that with Mo’s back spasms, needing Giese for the Rasner slot in the rotation this week, and some guys just being plain gassed, you are going to have a tired bullpen.
That’s why Girardi had Marte take one for the team last night. With Mo’s availability for tonight in question, the only fresh arm he has out there is Robertson.
You can’t kill’em all out there. If you do, you have a Joe Torre-type bullpen.
You may want to trade Arod for Pujols, I think I would too, but he would get killed by Yankee “fans” the minute they come to the realization that he does not hit a home run every at-bat and actually has bad at-bats from time to time even from the 6th inning on.
Ugh…the injuries this year have just been unbearable. Every team goes through it, yes, but to be in contention at this point, with what they have sustained, is quite amazing. I don’t know how much longer they can hold out though.
SJ44:
I totally agree with the Joba synopsis, but who know’s..
I really believe we are due for a real hot streak offensively, everyone…They are due….I agree with Stuart and you, we need to look from with in for the pitching help..the only guy out is Garcia but like Stuart said he hasn’t pitch at all this year..I would rather go with a kid…
The umps gave us two runs last night so I