Today in The Journal News
-
- August
- 11
The Angels used an 18-hopper to beat the Yankees and sweep the series. We’re still waiting for somebody to dive.
Ian Kennedy is headed back to the minors with some specific instructions. This notebook also has updates on Johnny Damon, Xavier Nady and Hideki Matsui.
Flight leaves in 45 minutes from LAX. The plan is to catch some sleep in Minnesota and blog at you from the Metrodome this afternoon. So check back later.
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on Monday, August 11th, 2008 at 2:36 am by Peter Abraham.
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Peter Abraham
ponson will revert to normal soon enough…
Pete,
Have a SAFE trip back…Regards, Bob Merc-The Shift
Didn’t realize a new thread started….
Perhaps the Yanks should consider moving Cano to the Dodgers in a deal that would get Matt Kemp in return.
It would take more than just Cano to get Kemp since his value has plummeted this season, but the Dodgers need a second baseman next season with the retiring Jeff Kent and they already have two outfielders too many.
Now it is true that Matt Kemp does strike out more than his share, but so does Grady Sizemore and there’s no Yankee fan who wouldn’t want him on this team.
Cano would have a change of scenery and be united with Torre and his mentor Larry Bowa.
Kemp could move to CF and let Nady play RF while letting Abreu walk. He could then move to RF when Austin Jackson is ready to take over in CF.
Seems like a deal that would make a lot of sense for both teams. I sure hope Cashman reads this blog.
Then who plays 2nd base for us? Betemit?
Maybe Andy Pettitte can teach his little brother Ian Kennedy how to pitch in a MLB game.
TBA = Aceves ???
I do not think they will call up Aceves but that would be great. Aceves is who I want pitching that game but is seems more likely that it will be Darell “Disaster” Rasner.
It won’t be Aceves.
He’s only pitched a handful of games above AAA and he’s been knocked around a bit.
He’s also not on the 40-man roster and I doubt the Yanks will want to go that route for one or two turns in the rotation until Hughes comes back.
“Aceves is who I want pitching that game but is seems more likely that it will be Darell “Disaster†Rasner.”
Your “disaster” has five more wins at the major league level than Aceves this year, but don’t let hyperbole get in the way of common sense or anything.
I say you go with Rasner starting the game. He’s, for the most part, hung in there this year. If the bats show up, you can handle having Rasner in there a few more times.
“Perhaps the Yanks should consider moving Cano to the Dodgers in a deal that would get Matt Kemp in return.
It would take more than just Cano to get Kemp since his value has plummeted this season, but the Dodgers need a second baseman next season with the retiring Jeff Kent and they already have two outfielders too many.”
I understand your thinking, and think the Yankees are going to have to get creative as well in order to remake the team, but I don’t think Cano’s value has dropped as much as you have. I think folks see the whole picture with him and not what he did for several months this year.
If anything, I think the Dodgers give us more for Cano.
I also don’t think Cano’s the piece you trade away. This is where you start looking at the potential pitching surplus in the minors and how many slots we realistically have to fill in the next few years, how quickly we can stick to our plan and replenish, etc.
Sounds like they are telling Kennedy his stuff just isn’t good enough, and not his 90ish 4 seamer like so many think. It’s pretty much everything else.
He’s entering Kei Igawa land, where you can get AAA hitters out but not MLB hitters. Like Igawa, I’d be surprised if we ever see him pitch another game for the Yankees. Sad, because I was a big Kennedy fan. But they told him to stop nibbling at the corners so much, he did what they told him and got clobbered.
I can’t see the Yanks justifying bringing him up again. Its not like he’ll learn another pitch, he already has 4 of them that don’t work.
Make or break time. we’ll see how this team responds (as if they didn’t have 100+ games already to do so).
Let’s just say I’m concerned.
Steve
So it is the Yankees fault that Kennedy’s marginal talent is not good enough for the majors? If only he would nibble at the corners all would be well.
I don’t think so.
“Perhaps the Yanks should consider moving Cano to the Dodgers in a deal that would get Matt Kemp in return.”
that is something i was advocating when the dodgers were reportedly interested in acquiring Cano at the deadline.
i would still agree that Cano options should be adressed in the offseason.
Kennedy is like a lot of young pitchers who gets to the bigs and falls into that brainless trap of “don’t let your third pitch beat you”. So he abandons his curve/slider and two seam fastball and relies on his four seamer and change. Well, he’s not good enough for that.
It might be helpful that he was sent back with instructions to work on his # 3 (two-seam) and # 4 (curve/slider) pitches before coming back. That and a lobotomy and he’ll be all set.
The Cano/Kemp idea is an interesting one. Plenty of risk, plenty of reward on both sides. Might need to add Chase Wright to make it happen. Problem is, there’s no 2B ready to step in so oyu have to go the FA route where you hope Mark Ellis or Orlando Hudson might be available.
The more I read and watch these games, the more I’m coming to realize that this team just is not good as currently constructed. There are too many flaws – too many older players having down years (maybe downside of career?), too many holes in the rotation, relying on too many rooks or inexperienced pitchers in the pen, too many lackluster starts, and too many managerial mistakes. If this were another year, the Yanks would have taken 3/4 from Tex, and 2/3 from the Angels – maybe swept as they were leading in all three games. The fact that they can’t score runs, can’t close out a game, can’t stay in a tied game past the 9th, Mr. Clutch has turned into Mr. GIDP, the sandman can’t keep a game tied, and injuries out the wazoo… and inconsistency at the plate all freakin’ year…
“Every game is a playoff game now”… well, playing like crap for the past 100 games didn’t help… how is the date going to change that? Posada out for year, Wang out for year, Joba on DL, Matsui has no knees, offense is horrible with RISP, arod stressing by trying to carry the offense and is now up to 10 therapists, 2 strippers, and one older ex-song bird a day, Melky and Cano forgot what bats are for… if this were any other team, they’d be keeping the O’s company in the cellar. No Wang, No Joba, IPK doesn’t know how to pitch, and Hughes two starts away from a return… If the Yanks can make the playoffs and pass Boston in the next month and a half, it will a small miracle considering what this team has gone through and done or not done…
Any chance the spot goes to Hughes on a pitch count?
weekly state of the union…
63-55, with 44 games remaining. 4 GB of Boston for the WC, 2.5 behind the Twins.
figuring it will take 92 wins to take the WC, they need to win 29 more games, which means they have to play .659 baseball the rest of the way (or win 2 out of every 3 games).
they need Pettitte, Moose, and Sidney to continue to be solid, and they need Hughes back and pitching well this week.
6 weeks to go; time to stop screwing around and play a little baseball.
“Any chance the spot goes to Hughes on a pitch count?”
Girardi said yesterday that has not been part of the discussion yet. Sounds like they are leaning toward Rasner unless they need him for long relief in the next 2 days.
After 118 games, you’d think they’d have at least started, but maybe it’s time we all realized that this team is what it is… a lucky .500 club. Too much crap going on to keep this team afloat and winning. Wang and Joba to the DL were a big hit… Hughes’ and IPK’s ineffectiveness were even worse.
Transition year indeed.
“6 weeks to go; time to stop screwing around and play a little baseball.”
It helps that we only have to see the Angels 3 more times. Not worried about them if we make the playoffs b/c hopefully our rotation will be full again. We have to dominate.
Geez, I’ve been advocating trading Cano for two years and I have had every stalker, troll and 10 year old on this site up my butt for it.
Now, you guys have him going for Matt Kemp.
Glad to see I could take the bullets for you guys to decide to trade Cano! lol
Seriously though, and I’ve been consistent with this, dealing him (in the right deal of course) has to be something on the table in the off-season.
He is a very talented kid. His numbers have also declined dramatically since 2006.
You really only have two choices with him now. Either give him more responsibility within the team and hope that gets him to grow up or you trade him.
By trading him, it doesn’t necessarily mean you get older. You can acquire younger players in return for him. He still has value on the open market. The Yankees almost traded him at the deadline. He’s not a lost cause in terms of trade value.
They can’t go into another season with him just drifting. It hurts this team.
A dive yesterday keeps that ball in the infield. He doesn’t dive for balls. That ain’t good.
His defense the last three weeks has been deplorable. His defense was the only that has kept him afloat as a player for most of the season. Now, its as bad as his offense.
Its a tough spot for the Yankees. They are an old team and they know they have to get younger and more athletic in the off-season.
Their two young position players (Cano and Cabrera) have been awful this season. Its a bad spot to be in.
However, if they can spin off Cano for Kemp and another player (I vote for Kuo), its a deal you have to do.
You can find second basemen to plug into your team. Hell, maybe someone who can actually show up and play hard everyday, handle the bat, run a little, etc.
The entire offense has to be re-tooled in the off-season. This has to be the last year where you have a poor situational hitting team that can’t run, is too old, and can’t hit with RISP.
We will have to take it for another 40 or so games this year. Can’t take it for another 162 next year.
Just IMO, but I think Boston will win more than 92 games this year… I hope not, but knowing the Yankees’ luck this year, it’s probably likely.
btw, i personally expect to see Hughes get the call-up for the game on Wednesday, and have him throw him 85-90 pitches from the mlb mound.
i know he’s sched to throw Tuesday in Scranton, but i dont imagine theyd have a problem holding him back one day to give the big league rotation a kick in the arse.
A Kemp for Cano scenario sounds right and send his buddy Melky along also.
Sign free agent Orlando Hudson as the 2nd baseman to replace Cano.
Both Cano and Melky have been given every chance to succeed in New York and still haven’t grasped the situation.
These could be among the major moves the Yankees need to do in the offseason.
“Geez, I’ve been advocating trading Cano for two years and I have had every stalker, troll and 10 year old on this site up my butt for it.
Now, you guys have him going for Matt Kemp.”
now, dont think you were alone SJ. I proposed sending him to Minnesota for Johan last offseason, to save from having to send Hughes in the deal.
I expected this to be a year with growing pains. It’s not a surprise to me. They’ve performed well at times, but injuries have bitten them hard.
In the few times I’ve had to talk to IPK, he wasn’t anything like his interview. He’s lost complete confidence and it’s getting harder to believe that he isn’t a AAAA ball player in the American League.
He might perform well in the National League, but I honestly do not believe he will be anything more than 4th or 5th starter at best in the AL.
The pressure of New York didn’t get him last fall, yet somehow, this year it’s had an effect. Tough, but for those who read this blog, that isn’t the type of IPK that I saw in Scranton. Aceves isn’t going to go up by the way, there are much better options before him in Scranton.
From what I can reel off the top of my head only Abreu and Giambi are free agents…
Do you try to trade Damon (who’s been solid this year) and Matsui (who is this team’s apparently best clutch hitter)?
Cano has some trade value
Melky has none
arod 3b
jeter ss
? 2b (cano traded?)
posada/pudge c
posada 1b?
nady lf
? cf (Austin Jackson?)
? rf (Matt Kemp?)
curious…
Hughes isn’t pitching for the Yankees this week. He’s pitching in Scranton tomorrow.
They want to give him that 85 pitch start in AAA and I can’t say I blame them.
If he comes through that start ok, we may see him Sunday at the Stadium against the Royals. We aren’t seeing him against the Twins.
Orlando Hudson underwent season ending wrist surgery yesterday. Its the same wrist he had surgery on a couple of years ago. IMO, that takes him out of the FA mix for second base.
You can’t sign a guy coming off two wrist surgeries.
Its a shame because he REALLY wants to play in NY.
If they deal Cano, and they need a stop gap at second, I’d sign Mark Ellis. He’s a good, fundamentally sound player.
Not a superstar and knows his role with a team.
I know folks who like big names will HATE that choice. However, this team won 4 World Series with a few players on those teams like Ellis.
They need a few more guys like that on this team.
how odd would it be for Cano and Melky to go to the Dodgers and Torre would have half his team back? All they need to do now is trade Jeter and Posada to the Dodgers for Kershaw and Torre would be happy.
Kennedy was always projected to be a 4th or 5th starter by the Yankees. If he pitched like one this year, the Yankees would have been very happy campers.
The problem is, he’s not even that right now. I wish he was because it would solve a big problem.
They have to find a way to fix him. If for no other reason, he has no trade value if he can’t win a single game at the major league level in a season.
“how odd would it be for Cano and Melky to go to the Dodgers and Torre would have half his team back?”
and its even more odd, because that owner in LA did the same thing when he brought in Grady Little to manage, right?
he signed Nomar and Derek Lowe… it was like Boston West.
Seriously Turn Two, it’s like the Dodgers are the Westcoast ALeftovers.
sunny615
Westcoast leftovers, who can win their division.
The Dodgers under Frank McCourt are in a major market but run their franchise like a small market team. They are cheap.
They only took on Manny because it didn’t cost them any money. The Red Sox are picking up the entire tab.
That’s going to have to change this off-season.
The Angels, at least to me, look like the odds on favorite to win the World Series. They are a very, very good team.
They have excellent pitching and defense. They play hard everyday, and they have a nice, balanced lineup. Guys know their roles and play to them. They also play the game the right way. Very aggressively. That forces the opponents into making mistakes. One only has to look at the way they beat the Yankees to see how that plays out.
They also have a LOT of money and Arte Moreno isn’t afraid to spend it. I think they will sign Tex. I don’t believe they traded a good, young, cost controlled first baseman in Kotchman to rent Tex. They will ante up for him.
They will let Garrett Anderson and KRod go after this season, and re-up Vlad for a few years. That puts HUGE pressure on the Dodgers. The two teams are competing for the advertising and TV dollars in the second biggest market in the country.
If the Dodgers are forced to sign Manny, it limits what they can do in other areas because McCourt won’t go free agent crazy. If he signs Manny, that’s his big free agent move.
That’s where Cano comes in. He has a friendly contract, they will have a need for a second baseman, and Torre and Bowa can work their “magic” with him. I say that sarcastically because he played the same way under Torre than he has under Girardi. His results just aren’t there this year.
Its why signing CC is priority #1 for the Yankees. If they can, they can package a young arm with Cano and get Kemp and perhaps Kuo.
If they can, that’s a win win trade for both teams.
Kemp is the Dodgers Cano. Tremendously talented kid who drifts from game to game. Perhaps a change of scenario helps both players.
The Yankees have been playing Austin Jackson more in LF in recent days. Tells me that if they were to acquire Kemp, they would have no problems moving Jackson to LF and he becomes the 2010 LF when Damon and Matsui’s contracts expire.
Its certainly food for thought and the two teams did have discussions about such a deal this year. Hopefully, both sides re-visit it in the off-season.
Vrsce – considering their division, that’s not saying a lot. Toronto would almost be leading their division right now.
The need to get younger and more athletic should seal the fates of Abreu, Giambi, Sexson and Pudge. Of the four, only Abreu has some value, but it’ll take $ 12.8 Mill just to offer arbitration.
Can’t see them moving Damon or Matsui, but both contracts run out after 2009. I suspect it’ll be another awkward season in ‘09 trying to remain competitive while getting younger and more athletic.
Whatever they do I hope they maintain one core philosophy… no big money FA over age 30… NEVER.
This season has been pretty bad. I don’t think we can catch the Sux. Even with Wakefield out, they’re still a better team. You know why? Because even without Papi hitting and Manny gone, the rest of the lineup supports them. Heck, Lowrie has been performing better than Jeter lately. And Pedroia (aka short fat bald guy), unlike Cano, plays his heart out at 2B – you know he would’ve gotten to that groundball in the 9th.
I’m rooting for the Sux to get to the WS and then have the Brewers crush them in a four-game sweep.
Let’s compute this…
Cano and some young arm for Kemp in the offseason…
Abreu and Giambi are not resigned…
Knowns:
Jeter – SS
Arod – 3B
Kemp – RF
Nady – LF
Damon – CF with Melk as defensive replacement/4th OF? or Justin Christian? or Gardner?
Posada/Molina – C
Matsui – DH
2b – ?
1b – ?
“Can’t see them moving Damon or Matsui, but both contracts run out after 2009. I suspect it’ll be another awkward season in ‘09 trying to remain competitive while getting younger and more athletic.”
ive thought that they would move one or the other myself, but ther more i think about it, the more i think they’ll just bite the bullet on both of those contracts, let them run their course, and then let them go after the 2009 season.
i dont think you’ll see Giambi or Abreu back, even if they both want to come back on team-friendly deals.
I see that the Red Sox are about to break Cleveland’s record for consecutive sellouts. What do those teams have in common? Manny Ramirez. You gotta admit he’s fun to watch.
Here are the 2009 Free Agent 1b and 2bman:
First basemen
Sean Casey (34)
Tony Clark (37)
Carlos Delgado (37) – $16MM mutual option for ‘09 with a $4MM buyout
Nomar Garciaparra (35)
Jason Giambi (38) – $22MM club option for ‘09 with a $5MM buyout
Eric Hinske (31)
Doug Mientkiewicz (35)
Kevin Millar (37)
Richie Sexson (34)
Mark Teixeira (29)
Second basemen
Ray Durham (37)
Mark Ellis (32)
Mark Grudzielanek (39)
Orlando Hudson (31)
Tadahito Iguchi (34)
Jeff Kent (41)
Felipe Lopez (29)
Mark Loretta (37)
Aaron Miles (32)
Jose Valentin (39)
Who on there is worth getting? No one sticks out in my mind.
Who would have thought in spring training when Tampa ran over the Yankees’ young catcher in a meaningless game that they were sending a message that they were going to be a team to be reckoned with? They spit in the Yankees eye and got away with it. This Yankee team needs to find the hunger again.
If they get Kemp, he will play CF. Nady would be in RF.
Damon? I don’t know. He’s having a great year. He’s also hurt all the time. Do you trade him now and get something for him, or do you let him play it out in his final year in NY?
I don’t think they can have both Damon and Matsui on the team next year. The DH spot can’t be clogged because you don’t know about Posada’s health. If he can’t throw, and can’t play first base, he will have to be the DH.
Its a big question mark as to Posada’s ability to come back from this surgery. He will work his butt off. That’s not the question. However, that’s not a guarantee of anything.
38 year old catchers coming off major shoulder surgery just can’t be plugged in as “ready” for next season behind the plate.
Its why Pudge returning can’t be discounted.
sunny, i think Kemp would patrol CF, Damon would stay in LF and Nady would move to RF.
Matsui is your full-time DH.
Cashman can’t be faulted for deals he should have made or didn’t make.
Most fans wanted no part of dealing Cano, Melky, Kennedy or Hughes. They were looked at as strong parts of Yankee future. Too many people wanted Santana for chump change last winter.
Cashman went by reports and could never foresee that Hughes would get hurt, Kennedy would come unglued, and see Cano and Melky’s upside turn to downside. They were all expected to be big contributors in 2008.
Unless Hughes shows his potential sometime before the end of this season, none of the 4 will be spared in a deal this winter. Cashman won’t make the same mistake twice at the insistence of the Steinbrenners brothers.
Especially in the case of Cano, it’s better to deal a player a year too soon than a year too late before his stock falls any further. Another team may figure that Cano simply had an off year but the element of chance is almost always there with most players.
“He still has value on the open market. The Yankees almost traded him at the deadline.”
SJ44 can you give us any more info on this? Cano was almost traded to what team? For what players?
Thanks.
So now the question becomes DH. The Yanks have three candidates… Matsui for sure, Posada if his arm falls off, and Damon if his body starts to fall apart. Whom out of the three do you try to trade? And for what? Damon has had a decent year. Matsui is the most “clutch” hitter on the team, and Posada can hit. Now what?
very good news about matsui. he’s our only clutch hitter and should replace astats (nice steal there, big guy!) as the cleanup hitter.
How many homers has Millar hit against the Yankees this season? And how many against other teams? Seems he rises to the occasion.
Tell you what, I was as big a Cano apologist as they come. After the last two weeks I’m done. I can live with struggles at the plate but there is no defense for the effort in the field.
SJ – I completely agree. If you can get that kind of deal from LA, pull the trigger. Mark Ellis types are suitable.
I think that Posada will be at 1B, DH, and C next year, with Pudge and Molina. I think the person to move is Damon. He’s having a good year with the bat. There are a bunch of teams that will be looking for outfield help and they won’t find it from FA. That’s how you get more youthful.
trade value…
kind of hard to assess. who’d have thought a non-contending team would trade for randy wolf in july? i’m sure there will be takers for melky (who HAS to go), and cano.
however, i only want to see cano going if we get back a stud pitcher (highly unlikely, i mean, who’s on the market?), or matt holliday. the guy is a real stud, bats in the .300s, power, steals, the works. yeah, after 2009 he’s going to cost, so arrange a window to negotiate an extension (wouldn’t trade cano for a rental), and if boras kills it then whatever, let it go.
i believe that cano + melky + kennedy will equal holliday.
as for a 2b, there are always options to hold the fort until a gem comes along or someone develops in the minors.
Millar has hit 6 HR’s against the Yankees this season.
The Yankees and Dodgers talked about a deal earlier this year. Guys like Cano, Lowe, Kemp and other names were discussed. In the end, both teams pulled back from it.
Depending on what both teams decide their priorities are in the off-season, it wouldn’t shock me if those discussions were re-visited.
I still don’t think they will trade Hughes. Hughes, Brackman, Montero, Jackson and Melancon are the guys that are the true untouchables among the younger players/prospects.
Everybody else is on the table. As they should be.
“Damon? I don’t know. He’s having a great year. He’s also hurt all the time. Do you trade him now and get something for him, or do you let him play it out in his final year in NY?”
Damon gets hurt playing hard and isn’t afraid to play hurt. That’s different than saying he’s “hurt all the time”. A guy who’s playing up to his level this year in a non-contract year can play for my team.
maybe they should demote melky.send him dowm to aaa.he is the most replaceable player in baseball,then maybe cano could focus on baseball.split this tandem up it doesn’t bring energy anymore.
SJ, what do you know about Justin Snyder? I know he played well last year in the NY/Penn League, and has had a nice year in Charleston. is he a legit 2B option down the road?
internally, i know apparently the Yankees are high on Ramiro Pena. any other IF candidates who they yankees might look at as long(er) term options, should Cano be moved?
If the Yankees feel that Cano has been tapped out in pinstripes, he can be made an attractive option for a team that thinks they can tap his full potential and have him under team control for 5 years.
Robinson Cano 2b
4 years/$30M (2008-11), plus 2012-13 club options
signed extension 2/08 (avoided arbitration, $4.55M-$3.2M)
08:$3M, 09:$6M, 10:$9M, 11:$10M, 12:$14M club option ($2M buyout), 13:$15M club option ($2M buyout)
1 year/$490,800 (2007), re-signed 3/07
1 year/$0.381M (2006)
signed 1/01 as amateur free agent from the Dominican Republic
ML service: 2.153
what about kevin russo. from long island.having good year at trenton.
Damon is a great player. He was a great player in Boston. But his body will betray him sooner rather than later given his all-out approach to the game. Sure, he’s having a good year. But how many more can he have in him?
At the end of his career, he’ll be remembered for the “Idiots” and the grand slam in game 7 of the 2004 ALCS.
Nonetheless, that Yankee money spends just as well as a WS share.
why didnt we trade ipk and melky to the twins for johan?! we need arms bad.. Can we get washburn now? all the washed up pitchers tend to thrive in Yankees uniforms.. look at Ponson… someone get Hank or hal on the phone or put the real BOSS back in charge (George)..
Snyder’s future is more as a utility player IMO. I like him. He’s a real grinder type of player.
Still a few years away though.
No question Damon plays hard all the time. Bottom line is, he’s hurt an awful lot during the season and that’s happening more frequently every year. How it happens isn’t as important as the frequency in which it happens.
He’s already severely limited throwing the ball because of numerous shoulder injuries over the years.
Like Giambi, he’s a great guy in the clubhouse. But, how much is that worth at this point? That’s the question.
To me, its a 50-50 call. He can still play but, is this his last, great year? I don’t know.
I just know that the Yankees always seem hang onto guys one year too long and that doesn’t help them. Its a habit I’d like to see them begin to break.
trading for washburn now makes no sense. we have hughes, joba and pavano all about to come back in the next 2 weeks.
August 11th, 2008 at 10:01 am
why didnt we trade ipk and melky to the twins for johan?! we need arms bad.. Can we get washburn now? all the washed up pitchers tend to thrive in Yankees uniforms.. look at Ponson… someone get Hank or hal on the phone or put the real BOSS back in charge (George)..
Why do we have a moron ask this everday? It wasnt just those two. They wanted Hughes, Kennedy, Melky and Jackson. TOO MUCH!
Robinson Cano is certainly an attractive chip.I wonder if they would actually trade him. Maybe they can pull off a Roberto Kelly/Paul O’Neill type deal.
Except they lucked out hanging on to Mussina. I always thought the guy was overrated, and last year it looked like he was done. But he’s the only thing keeping the Yankees within sniffing distance. How is he doing it? I don’t know. But maybe it’s time to give Mr. Almost his due, even if the team around him stinks.
One thing to remember about good young ballplayers, when their head is not there or they aren’t doing well it is usually an emotional issue. Older players for the most part have physical issues.
We’ll find out at some point what is going on. Now if this is a permanent thing then yea dump him. But I’ll put my money there is another issue.
EX: Terdell Sands on the Raiders was an awesome DT in 2006. 2007 he ballooned to literally 400 pounds and was still getting blowned up by offensive lineman. THe reason his mom died – and he basically couldn’t deal with it for a good year. THis year he is swelt and recovered a fumble 30 yards down field.
Unfortunately, these players are like us at times – they have their issues.
Hang in there on Cano – but relentless to trade him if his first half next year is not good. Same with Melky he has improved every year including the first part then hit a wall. THese aren’t the guys that were suppposed to lead us –
it was the Jeter’s, Arod’s Matsui’s, Giambi’s, Posada’s, Abreu – they either didn’t produce or were injured.
Beacuse it was WANG, kennedy and melky. If it was just Kennedy and melky, I think Cash does it.
Excuse me – I believe it was Hughes/Melky or WANG, Kennedy, Jackson.
“If they deal Cano, and they need a stop gap at second, I’d sign Mark Ellis. He’s a good, fundamentally sound player.
Not a superstar and knows his role with a team.
I know folks who like big names will HATE that choice. However, this team won 4 World Series with a few players on those teams like Ellis.
They need a few more guys like that on this team.”
Wait a minute…
Mark Ellis, he of the .230 batting average? .231/.317/.361 Mark Ellis?
And people here absolutely despise the 23 year old .245/.299/.341 Melky Cabrera, right?
Could you imagine this place with Mark Ellis batting?
D00d has an amazing glove, but I don’t think I’d want him at 2B.
It will be interesting to see if there’s a trade market for Damon or Matsui at $ 13 mill. With their injury histories the last two years it’s hard to imagine a National League team having much interest.
A Millar/Miranda platoon might do a decent job at 1B if there’s no Tex and no Giambi. Don’t know about Miranda’s glove…. maybe Millar/Mientkiewicz?
Don’t really want to go that route. Heck, if the Angels keep Teixiera maybe they’ll deal Matthew Brown (.326 / .377 / .594 21 HR, 69 RBI in 93 g in AAA)or Mark Trumbo (.287 / .326 / .565, 31 HR, 79 RBI in A,AA), two excellent 1B prospects.
sunny you are correct. I am getting so sick and tired about reading about why we didnt’ get johan. I don’t know why poeple think it was Kennedy and Melky. Cash would have done it in a NY minute if it was just those two.
I can’t wait till he falls off, so we don’t have to read about it anymore.
“I can’t wait till he falls off, so we don’t have to read about it anymore.”
unless he doesnt.
and it doesnt look like he will, at least for the near future.
I may not know much, but one thing I do know is that they will NOT trade Cano this offseason. Don’t get me wrong, it would be foolish for them not to listen to offers but they are NOT going to be actively trying to trade him. The guy is a great talent and is young, he’ll be in pinstripes at least another year
“Excuse me – I believe it was Hughes/Melky or WANG, Kennedy, Jackson.”
from what i recall, it was Hughes, Kennedy, Melky or Wang and Kennedy.
i dont actually ever recall Austin Jackson in the conversation, reported by either Minnesota or NY reporters. i could have missed it though.
gotta give something to get something – I’d think they’d want Hughes or Melancon for one of those two.
it still wouldnt surprise me to see Prince Fielder playing 1B next year, either.
Santana won’t fall off for another year or two. It will be the last three or so years that Mets fans will complain about – more than likely.
I believe Jackson was in the mix – at the time Tabata was the hotter prospect – I believe when the Twins went from Hughes to Kennedy…
tho i could be wrong as well… so long ago… old age – they say memory is the first to go…
The Yankee success was with B level deals. Knoblauch and Brosius, Tino, Bernie, ONeill. Good players but certainly not 30 Million Dollar men. Cone, Wells, El Duque. Take the 1998 formula.
I live in LA.. Be aware that Kemp makes a lot of mistakes.. He is always making base running errors he in some ways is a OF Cano with the lack of discipline etc..
Cano being traded must be discussed but is not a must to happen.. They should hit the knucklehead 3rd and just see what the mental midget can do.. He tries to be the HERO on every AB and that is one of his problems…
He will never be he next Rod Carew, never not even close…This is his 4th year and this year has been a nightmare.. 300 OBP, that is Jason Varitek like……
Kevin Millar sucks just because he hits against the Yanks, look at his #’s he is atrocious…The Angels have thee issues like everyone else they are not the 27 Yanks…
Ironically, even if they had Santana this year, it wouldn’t change too much of what’s happening with this team.
Unless he can hit w/RISP, he would be on his fair share of losing games.
The guy has 9 wins in the NL, facing weaker lineups.
Not getting Santana isn’t why the team isn’t going to the playoffs. Their offense falling off the map, especially in situational hitting and RISP situations, is why they aren’t going anywhere.
Nobody could have anticipated such a dropoff in offensive production this season. But, its happened, and that’s why you will see a lot of new faces in 2009.
Mark Ellis isn’t a star. Yet, he’s a better defensive second baseman than Cano. Frankly, its not even close.
What he lacks in offense, which is much less than what Cano has given them for most of the season, you make up for by improving the team in other areas.
If you have a guy like Kemp in CF, you don’t need huge offensive production out of your second baseman.
Hitting wins regular season and pitching wins playoffs. Right now, even if the yankees pull it out, i dont see them getting past LA in the wildcard round.
To kick start the offense I’d shy away from guys with high OBPs who hit far below .300, like Giambi.
I would also shy away from guys whose OBP percentages wouldn’t be competing for the batting title if they were their batting averages, like Cano and Cabrera.
Right now we have A-Rod hitting in the .320 range but those are most of the guys hitting behind him. Lots of times A-Rod gets on, Giambi walks or hits into the shift, and Cano makes an out. If Cano gets on, Cabrera makes an out.
Having a good eye and the patience to take a walk is important. But if you bat .250 and often just move your team’s best hitter over one base, then one of the following batters has a .302 OBP, what’s the use?
The offense seemed a lot more potent with Matsui & Posada somewhere behind A-Rod, swinging their bats effectively. They have good hitter’s eye and can work pitchers for walks, but they often hit the ball with about a combined .300 average between the two of them. Take out Cano & Giambi, add Nady and another .300-capable bat, THEN you have some firepower behind A-Rod.
Cabrera and Cano seem to be buddies but they’re not exactly over achievers, and that may partly be something they rub off on each other. If they don’t want to be replaced, they need to hustle and play better. Their approach to the game is what needs to be replaced. Their choice to make if they want to stay.
Boston and Tampa having some adversity to deal with should be an opportunity to go for post season position. Right now, this team’s not able to take advantage. I’m giving it a 50/50 for the wild card. Boston needs to help us like they used to.
The Yanks showed they can beat LA – they just can’t finish them off. If they can pull of a playoff spot, Melancon should help in that area. It’s the RISP that gets them and getting to the playoffs is a bigger question to me than them beating LA.
I think the Yanks will write off this year for Cano as an aberration. They can use a couple of legitimate excuses; he was pressing too hard at the start of the year to live up to his contract, he always starts slow, etc. They will expect him to rebound next year. If he doesn’t improve, then I think they trade him.
(Robbie Cano)
“He is a very talented kid. His numbers have also declined dramatically since 2006.”
Gee, that’s a real fair statement about Cano, SJ! Using a sample size of 1 and 3/4 Seasons for Cano is a good analysis, huh? You failed to mention that Cano’s power numbers have actually increased and his fielding has actually improved.
I guess by those standards applied to Cano you could then say that “Matt Kemp’s numbers have declined dramatically since 2007″.
Robbie Cano, is arguably the most talented young position player in the NY Yankees Organization, and you people want to trade him away. Outfielders with Kemp’s credentials are much easier to come by than a second baseman with Cano’s talent.
giambi. abreu, oavano, sexson, for sure will not be back .\\giambi and abreu just continue the infatuation with older expensive declining players..
Moose and pettitte are another story I only bring back 1 if they want back.. If 5 of these 6 guys are gone that frees up about $60 mill right there.. 2b is much easier to fill then almost any position and league avg. $’s are much easier to attain.. Mark Ellis is agreat fileder who is having a bad year at the bat, but he plays like the old yanks, takes pitchers and is a tough player..
IF they trade Cano(we will see) then they can get a Kemp(supposively) and then the OF is set.. Kemp can play CF… then they get way younger more athletic then when AJAx is ready they can move Kemp to RF or LF..
Sure they will need to fill 1b and 2b but again Ellis can be a stopgap signing and the only decent option for 1B i Tex and he is a very good player but he is NOT worth what he will get paid and not as good as he thinks he is..He is a very good not great player, I love his plate discipline….
“Ironically, even if they had Santana this year, it wouldn’t change too much of what’s happening with this team.
Unless he can hit w/RISP, he would be on his fair share of losing games.
The guy has 9 wins in the NL, facing weaker lineups.”
except that what they need now more than anything is a starting pitcher. Ponspn has been as good as can be expected, and maybe even a little better than most of us ever thought he’d be, but you need an upgrade from the IPK’s and Rasners and Gieses of the world to make a real run.
and lets not get into the wins argument. if you follow baseball, as i know you do, we all know that if not for the Mets bullpen, Johan could easily have 13, 14, or more wins right now.
i’m not going to say it was a bad move not to get him, bc we’ve been down that road countless numbers of times already… but to say he wouldnt help right now is crazy talk.
The New York Times today compared Jason Lezak’s stunning 4×100m freestyle anchor leg to “the great closer Mariano Rivera”. That made me really proud as a Yankee fan and a Mo fan, but also a little bit sad given our current state of affair. I hope the Yankees can pull off a late season miracle surge just as the USA swim team did last night.
Welcome back people!
I am starting to thing that we need to change something dramatic in our team. What we have is not clicking. I propose that we should sign a guy like Barry Bonds!! Yes Barry Bonds.
Before you start ripping me for that let me tell you why. Barry still hase some baseball left in him ,and altough he brings some negative stuff with him , the yanks always did a great job to make sure that there off the field problems dont matter when they play the field (ex. Doc gooden, Darrel strawberry, Gary Sheffield, A-rod, Pettite)
So now he will come in and cashman could say to him any peeps that you make that we dont like we will fire you , he will behave because he wants to play baseball and maybe maybe this will spark this sleeping team!
A change of scenery could help!!
The other irony to me is when people bring up Brosius name.
Go back and look at the year he had in Oakland prior to his trade to the Yankees. He was barely over the Mendoza Line.
If the internet existed back then, folks would have gone nuts over that trade.
“The Yankees traded for THIS GUY to replace Wade Boggs”?
“What are Cashman and Stick thinking? Morons”!
That would have been the tame stuff.
Looking for “B level” type of deals is precisely the way they need to go in some areas.
We have played out the “names” and “all stars at every position” deal. Its one of the problems on the team right now. Too many guys can’t do the little things that help teams win.
You gotta have those guys on a team that can bunt, run a little, hit the other way, etc. The Yankees don’t have those guys. That’s why they are so poor in situational hitting spots.
Guys like Mark Ellis (just using him as an example) are more valuable to good teams regardless of their stats. They are just good players. That superstars or all stars. Just good players.
The Yankees have too few of those guys on the team. They have great players and awful players and nobody in between.
That has to change in the off-season and I think it will.
I have 2 questions regarding:
Can Kemp play D … can he throw the ball?
Would a Melky – Torre or a Cano – Torre reunion be something all those guys would like to see?
Barry at this point is not an option. He hasn’t played all year and IF the Yanks signed him, by the time he was ready to play, the season would be over.
“Outfielders with Kemp’s credentials are much easier to come by than a second baseman with Cano’s talent.”
that why the Yankees are so stock piled with Kemp-like players in the system?
or how about we go down the list of Kemp-like prospects who could be available… they’re a dime a dozen, right?
noone is saying Cano stinks, or you have to get rid of him. but you find out what his value is worth, and you make a move if it makes sense.
Those 2 questions were regarding trade ideas posted here so far (sorry for cutting it off)
sunny615
well barry said sat. that he works out every day and is ready to play now!! and he looks in great shape too.
“The guy has 9 wins in the NL, facing weaker lineups.”
Seriously? You are using wins as your basis? Maybe you should actually use stats that show how good a pitcher is, as opposed to how bad the bullpen of the team a guy plays for is.
Like his 3rd-best ERA, 9th-best Ks, 3rd-best quality starts, or 7th-best WHIP?
Inattention symptoms include:
* Not paying attention to detail
* Making careless mistakes
* Failing to pay attention and keep on task
* Not listening
* Being unable to follow or understand instructions
* Avoiding tasks that involve effort
* Being distracted or forgetful
* Losing things that are needed to complete tasks
These are some of the listed symptoms for ADHD. While I’m certainly not a doctor and I don’t think this would be such a simple solution as in Major League, when they realize that Wild Thing just needs glasses, but do you think the Yankees have ever considered sending Cano to a psychologist? Certainly seems like sometimes when I watch him he comes across as the poster child for ADHD.
“The New York Times today compared Jason Lezak’s stunning 4×100m freestyle anchor leg to “the great closer Mariano Riveraâ€.”
which, by the way, not sure who actually saw the event… but the race was amazing. too bad its all over the press now, and everyone knows we took the gold.
but watching that race, and that finish, live was among the greatest in sports theater that ive seen.
Latham Joe,
How has his defense been the last 3 weeks? Its been awful.
6 errors (2 per week), and 6 other plays that he didn’t make that led to runs.
He’s not the most talented young player in the organization. Austin Jackson is. In fact, its not close.
Take a look at what Cano was at 21 and what Jackson is now.
Robbie Cano has never been thought of as a 5 tool player. Jackson is.
Cano isn’t a kid anymore. This is his 4th season in the majors and his numbers have dropped each of the last 3 years.
I mean, geez, the kid was hitting .220-.230 for most of the year.
Power? Where are the doubles he used to hit? Non-existent.
His K’s are up. His DP’s are up and his defense has fallen off the map the last 3 weeks.
He has had a terrible season. There is no other way to spin it.
Put it another way. When the Yankees signed him to that deal in the off-season, do you think they envisioned this year out of him? Of course not.
They will listen to offers for him in the off-season. Doesn’t mean they will deal him. However, if something comes up they like, he’s gone.
did any one read this on ESPN??
Manny in Pinstripes?
Maybe Al, but he hasn’t seen live pitching in over a year. I think that counts for something…
Methinks the Yanks have 2 too many DH’s already… Manny has no place to play in NY.
I’m using 9 wins as an example of Santana not being able to cure all ills, regardless of how well he has pitched this year.
What he could have is irrelevent. If the Yankees could hit with RISP, they would be in first place. Unfortunately, what is, isn’t what things should be. Santana hasn’t made the Mets any better than last year and the Yankees don’t hit with RISP. That’s what we know for this season to date.
When you don’t hit, I don’t care who is pitching, you lose.
The Yankees have actually pitched pretty well for most of the season. They haven’t hit. Especially in key spots.
That’s my point re: Santana.
As good as he is, you still have to score runs and do it in spots in the game in which you can give your pitchers a chance to win games. If you don’t, even if Koufax were to take the mound, you lose.
“Robbie Cano, is arguably the most talented young position player in the NY Yankees Organization, and you people want to trade him away. Outfielders with Kemp’s credentials are much easier to come by than a second baseman with Cano’s talent.”
Which is what the Yankee ownership/mgmt think and which is why Cano is not being traded. I have to laugh when I see people proposing trades that include Cano. Clearly, those fans don’t know this organization. You don’t trade a talent like Cano just because he has one bad season.
The Manny rumors is leaked by his agent’s request. He also would make no sense for the Yankees, this is what we’ve been trying to end, unneeded spending and start more rebuilding from within. See you add him when he’s a final piece not when the piece just makes your offense stronger this is the type of crap we’ve been doing since 02′ and it needs to stop.
well barry said sat. that he works out every day and is ready to play now!! and he looks in great shape too.
It’s easy to look like that when your not taking shots in your prosterior.
What is all this “talent” Cano possesses.
Can he run? No.
Does he hit for power? No.
Is he an excellent defensive player? No. Better this year until the last 3 weeks. Has been awful the past 3 weeks.
Does he come to play and play hard everyday? No.
Does he grind AB’s? No.
He’s not the most talented player in the organization. Frankly, its not even close.
He doesn’t possess Arod’s talent. He doesn’t have the upside of Austin Jackson.
The Yankees “love” him so much, they almost traded him to the Dodgers last month.
He’s a talented kid. He’s also as inconsistent a player as you will see in the league. That’s not good.
Next season will be his 5th year in the majors. At that time, Derek Jeter had 4 rings and put up numbers that Robbie Cano hasn’t come close to approaching.
Cano is like every other player you evaluate in the off-season. If you decide that trading him improves your team, you trade him.
He may be off limits in trade talks to some bloggers. But, he’s not off limits in trade talks to the Yankees.
Manny isn’t coming to the Yanks. When he first got to LA a few weeks ago he said he loved it and was staying there. Now it’s the Yankees. Manny’s agent is Scott Boras. Unless Manny leaves him and negotiates his own deal like Alex did, Manny will follow the money.
Methinks the Yanks have 2 too many DH’s already… Manny has no place to play in NY.
Until Nady, this is what this regime has been striking out on. Getting the 4 or 5 tool bat. Getting Manny would be another unneeded attempt to say see we’re all in, we’re stronger this year, watchout Boston Manny is coming for you !, while TB, Tex and Minny start getting stronger infront of our eyes.
So then Manny can’t field his position, well stick him in the DH GLUT that we have w/ Posada,Giambi,Betemit,Damon,Matsui….etc. They need to get away from doing this.
Of course Manny won’t come here.That be said don’t say he has no place on this team.I don’t know another hitter that you could put behind A-Rod.
Thats the problem since 2004.There’s no one to put behind A-Rod to back him up.Everybody you put there only gets better behind A-Rod but aren’t good enough to be a threat.
Manny in pistripes would make this line-up great in the regular and post-season.But sadly we will never fill that spot.
“but watching that race, and that finish, live was among the greatest in sports theater that ive seen.”
TurnTwo, I couldn’t believe my eyes! I thought there was NO WAY Lezak would catch Bernard. Lezak was behind by half a body length at the last turn and Bernard was supposed to be the WR holder, it was just insane! And that Michael Phelps, he sure can scream!
Another good sample size, SJ! I’ve seen ARod, Jeter, your buddy – Scott Brosius, go through tough stretches for 2-3 week periods of time. It happens! Cano has improved his fielding since his initial season and will be right there at .981 – .983 this season, too.
TurnTwo:
Austin Jackson and Jose Tabata (before being traded )supposedly had talent equal to Matt Kemp. Now you name me one SECOND BASEMEN in the Yankee Organization with Cano’s talent.
My point is that infielders with Cano’s offensive and defensive potential are much harder to find than Outfielders like Kemp.
You can disagree all you want, but check the MLB rosters for second basemen that you can list with Cano’s talent. There are many more talented outfielders on MLB rosters than second basemen with Cano’s offensive and defensive talent.
The only way they can even entertain thoughts of getting Manny is to trade Matsui and Damon and not re-sign Giambi and Abreu.
That would mean they would still have to find a CF and live with 140 games of Manny in LF next season. He’s going to be 38 next year. I don’t know if I want a 38 LF next year.
That’s before even getting into the behavioral stuff. That’s a whole other issue.
Can’t see the Yankees committing the money Manny wants to secure him. If Manny wants to reasonable, cuts the dreads, and would agree to a contract containing behavioral incentives, you listen.
However, the chances of that happening are slim…….very, very slim.
“You don’t trade a talent like Cano just because he has one bad season.”
In Alfonso Soriano’s case, all it took was one really bad postseason. Granted, he was traded for the best player in baseball. But, Soriano had done more offensively with the Yankees for 2 years than Cano has, and had as much promise at the time he was dealt.
I think if the right deal came along and they were getting back what they considered was a more valuable, polished, and consistent all-around player, Cano would be gone. The Yankees have done potential trade partners a favor in signing him to the 4-year deal, because a new (potentially lower-budget) team won’t have to deal with arbitration haggling if Cano rakes like he did in 2006/the second half of 2007.
I think the names that Cano might be moved for haven’t emerged yet, and I think Matt Kemp is an extremely premature guess. I don’t even know if he’s the type of guy they would target (he strikes out a lot, he goes through stretches that are Cano-esque in terms of slumps, he doesn’t hit for a ton of power yet). Still, though, no way can you close the book on dealing Robbie.
SJ,
Agreed that Cano’s power numbers are down, but his K rate the last three years is:
‘06 – 11.2%
‘07 – 13.8%
‘08 – 8.5 %
i dont kill a-stats nearly as much as sj kills cano. but he loves to blast me for stating my opinions. when will the trade cano campaign end?
Nady was an important pick-up. I still believe that moving cano to the number 3 spot will help. I agree though, there is no excuse for him not getting that ball yesterday. I think he deserves to be benched for that. Send a message that girardi will put his bench players on the field if the a-team cashes it in. That being said, no way you trade him. He does make good plays and he can hit. This year has been a down year for everyone on that team.
which killed the yankees more yesterday, cano not getting to that ball, or a-stats making the 3rd out at 3rd with our clutchest hitter at the plate (at 2-0 no less!)?
i’d call it a tie.
I rather have Ryan Braun instead of Kemp. but it’s likely not to happen.
How many sample sizes do you want? This kid is in his 4th year in the majors and has taken not one but, two steps back.
He’s not going to have 10 years worth of sample sizes to determine his value.
His sample is one that is in decline since 2006. That’s over 1500 AB’s. That’s a pretty large sample size if you ask me.
How large was his sample size when he signed his new contract?
You don’t have to have a great player at second base to win.
Name me a team that wins that doesn’t have a great CF. Whether that player is great offensively, defensively, or both ways?
Cano’s “potential” is what is it right now. He’s not going to get any faster. He’s not going to get much smarter. If he was, ‘ya think we would have seen it by now?
He is what he is. He’s a player whose numbers have declined since 2006. That’s an undeniable fact.
He’s not just having an “off year”. He’s having a terrible season in every way. Ironically, after he got big money. To me, that’s a bad sign.
This team won titles with second basemen who aren’t 1/10 the player Cano is. Why? Because they re-distributed their assets in better ways. Namely, they had a player like Bernie in CF and better pitching.
Give me a kid like Kemp, who has Bernie Williams type potential and MUCH more upside than Cano, and re-distribute money to improve the pitching, and I’ll take my chances to find a second baseman.
Especially one that can hit .260 with a .290 OBP. Those guys are a dime a dozen and don’t cost 7 million dollars a year.
“Which is what the Yankee ownership/mgmt think and which is why Cano is not being traded. I have to laugh when I see people proposing trades that include Cano. Clearly, those fans don’t know this organization. You don’t trade a talent like Cano just because he has one bad season.”
I tend to agree with you, however, you must admit that Cano at times seems very lazy and undisciplined.
The only way Manny ends up here is if Hank takes the bull by the horns and negotiates a deal by himself. He doesn’t fit what Cashman is trying to instill here. I’m sure they will go hard after Sabathia and Texiera but will do their due diligence and take a look at Manny. In the end I think Texiera will resign with the Angels, especially if they win the World Series. Not sure about Sabathia but he is not a NY guy. Only way we get him is to overpay. Manny would be the 2nd option if they don’t get Texirera, but again, I just don’t see it happening. Just a case of Scott Boras using the Yankees as a bargaining chip.
“which killed the yankees more yesterday, cano not getting to that ball, or a-stats making the 3rd out at 3rd with our clutchest hitter at the plate (at 2-0 no less!)?
i’d call it a tie.”
I might be in the minority, but I have no problem with ARod’s attempted steal of 3rd.
manny’s a quitter, no pinstripes for him!
I’m sure they will go hard after Sabathia and Texiera but will do their due diligence and take a look at Manny.
Tex is not a final piece or a big need why would we go longterm for him ? CC I can see, if they get Tex that’s just continue to spend the money carelessly.
“which killed the yankees more yesterday, cano not getting to that ball, or a-stats making the 3rd out at 3rd with our clutchest hitter at the plate”
Alex was being aggressive and trying to make something happen. Cano was just being lazy in not diving after the ball. And what about Betemit on that play going to cover 1st. He needs to get the ball – Mo was going to cover 1st.
That 9th inning play plus the inability to hit with RISP killed the Yanks yesterday, not Alex’s attempted steal.
its not the attempt to steal 3rd thats the problem its the situation he chose to do it in. just like when he tries to hit a homer (and whiffs) when a single or even a grounder would get the job done, that is very bad situational awareness to go in that situation.
Alex was safe on replays BTW. Also just missed a go ahead homerun. Say what you want, but Alex plays hard. Sometimes he probably takes it too seriously. He would have never dogged that play like Cano did.
SJ, was the trade on the table centered around Cano for Kemp at the deadline or some other players? It’s hard to disagree with your postings today, the team needs much help for next year. It’s getting late early around here.
which killed the yankees more yesterday, cano not getting to that ball, or a-stats making the 3rd out at 3rd with our clutchest hitter at the plate
You can make the arguement that if Cano were more awake we sweep LAA or take 2 out of 3. Alex did the right thing he just missed a HR in the 8th inning and knew they weren’t going to pitch to Nady. The next 2 batters weren’t going to drive him from 2B to home, they just weren’t. So to answer your question Robinson Cano has hurt us big time, this season and this whole road trip.
I’d kill to see Cano play as hard as Arod does for one week.
If his effort equaled Arod’s on a daily basis, he wouldn’t be having such an awful season.
Which was the worse play? Easy. The play that decided the game. At least make an attempt to get the ball.
Geez, even guys on the opposing team didn’t believe he didn’t dive for the ball.
Stylin’ is one thing. Not playing hard is another. Robbie’s game has drifted into the latter more than the former this year.
Alex was safe on replays BTW. Also just missed a go ahead homerun. Say what you want, but Alex plays hard. Sometimes he probably takes it too seriously. He would have never dogged that play like Cano did.
Also, he was being agressive. The way the yankees have been unable to score with RISP, he wanted to be in position to score on a sac fly, ground ball, past ball, etc.
Other questions, why the hell didnt abreu slide on the play at home in the 1st (i think)?
One note, if you are looking for a 2B so you can trade cano, how bout Jeter? Move Jeter to second, A-Rod to short, and find a 3rd baseman. Or…. they can go for any of the IF from Florida. Uggla? They are having a good year meaning they will be looking to firesale.
“That 9th inning play plus the inability to hit with RISP killed the Yanks yesterday, not Alex’s attempted steal.”
The inability to hit with RISP is probably WHY Alex tried to steal.
I am in complete agreement with SJ44… Cano needs to be dealt more for his attitude than anything else. He’s seems completely careless at the plate and in the field.
kemp caution! just like the rest of the league cant figure why the yankees would want to part with cano, there must be a reason that the dodgers keep floating kemp in trade talks when the rest of the league seems to salivate thinking about him. theres something going on there that isnt apparent to ppl who dont see him play every day.
im not saying dont trade for him but some very in-depth investigation is in order before the yankees think about aquiring him.
I don’t think they’d consider Manny. They’ll already have a carnival of outfielders next year. I think they’ll either do plan A or plan B:
Plan A: Resign Giambi, Have Matsui be the regular DH.
Plan B: Resign Pudge, Have Posada be first base.
As far as pitching goes, it looks like the rotation next year will be the same as this year’s starting one was, unless they persue one of the potential free agents (Sabathia, Sheets, Burnett, Lackey, or even B list starters)
I’d kill to see Cano play as hard as Arod does for one week.
If his effort equaled Arod’s on a daily basis, he wouldn’t be having such an awful season.
Which was the worse play? Easy. The play that decided the game. At least make an attempt to get the ball.
Geez, even guys on the opposing team didn’t believe he didn’t dive for the ball.
Stylin’ is one thing. Not playing hard is another. Robbie’s game has drifted into the latter more than the former this year.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but wasn’t it Betemit who missed the last play of the game at 2nd? Not cano?
Cano, Kemp and Derek Lowe were the guys who names became public re: the talks. A few other names (mostly minor league guys) were kicked around. Both teams eventually walked away from it. It wasn’t one team having less or more of a desire to not do it. It ended up being a mutual, “let’s move on” type of thing.
“He’s going to be 38 next year”
manny ramirez was born may 30, 1972 so he will be 37 next year so get your facts right righteous one.
if you think cano has holes in his game, wait till you see uggla everyday!
big stick, no glove, no arm, no game-head.
Hey,
I think Pavano has had a really bad influence on this team. I heard from a lot of guys who know the Yankees players who say that most of them really admire what he’s been able to do, by getting paid and basically telling his bosses to shove it. They think it is awesome.
Yea, Kenedy doesn’t “feel too bad about it” because he caught the Pavano taint. Money for nothing and your chicks for free.
I saw Jeter the other week in NYC on a hot balmy early morning jaunt with folks at B Bar in the Bowery and he had the DJ play Jimmy Buffett’s “Margaritaville.” He was singing along karaoke style. He knew all the words! How does he know all the words? Well, obviously, he’s not practicing and is just learning words to songs by relaxed burnt out guys, like Buffett, James Taylor, Morrissey and Huey Lewis. He was wearing a Hawaiian shirt and flip flops! He was unshaven!
I asked him how it was going and he said, “no worries, man…it is what it is.” WHAT?!?!? IT IS WHAT IT IS?!!?!? He sounds like the turtle from Finding Nemo. He then said he hope the New Yankee Stadium will be more like Sandals in Ocho Rios.
Anyway, last night when Betemit didn’t dive, I am sure he was thinking the same thing…”ah dude, bogus hit…whatever man….MARGARITAVILLE HERE I COME!!!
CARL!!! TABLE FOR 25!!!!!
turntwo, my co-worker showed me the race this morning. Truely amazing. and what made it sweeter was beating the French after his statements.
“its not the attempt to steal 3rd thats the problem its the situation he chose to do it in. just like when he tries to hit a homer (and whiffs) when a single or even a grounder would get the job done, that is very bad situational awareness to go in that situation.”
I have to disagree. Having a runner on 3rd with only one out would have been huge.
Cano for Kemp, I’d do that. Both players underachieving and allows us to shake up this losing core.
Let’s hope Cashman is considering something like that.
“Geez, even guys on the opposing team didn’t believe he didn’t dive for the ball.
Stylin’ is one thing. Not playing hard is another. Robbie’s game has drifted into the latter more than the former this year.”
Just wondering… any potential to Cano getting sent down to Scranton for a wake up call? I guess that would indicate the Yanks calling it a season, which they would never do, as well as potentially hurt his trade value, but would be interesting nonetheless.
SJ I agree with much of what you said but as another poster stated Cano is actually striking out less. That is the amazing thing his avg. is down but K’s are down also.
Kemp BTW has 27 SB’s and Cano has no SB ability, none..
Cano’s range to me has been great , I do not know what his range factor etc are but he to me has great range and that is why the plays hehas been making lately are so hard to understand..
If they simply put Kemp nady and Damon in the OF and had Ellis and all things stay the same I like the new team better. Kemp has a 340 something OBP not a 302 OBP like Cano..
The papers today in LA are all over the hit to win the game and the Yankees(cano and Betemit0 having NO CLUE..
IN ESSENCE TEAMS ARE LAUGHING AT THE YANKEES Stupididty and lack of clutch hitting, the Yanks are now a JOKE…
THe low obp and low pitches seen is what really bothers me about this offense, the whole bottom of the order jsut hack and do that vvery innefectively and throw in the lack of clutch hitting and you have the Yanks a train wreck..
But remember Kemp has numerous brain locks but appears to play hard and want to learn.. I assume Torre and gang will think they can fix Cano so it is logical the DOdgers can trade for him and Kent is 40 and gone…….
A STATS playeed decent yesterday he did not cost us the game it is leaving 3 runners at 3rd with 1 out and the walk to the 9th hitter and the brain lock by the right side of the infield that lost the masterpiece yesterday.. every day there are new participants in the Yankee demise the only constant is there great clutch hitting…..
Yankees are going to have a LOT of outfield options next year. (Matsui, Nady, Damon, Abreu if resigned, Cabrera, Gardner/Christian, etc)
For all you SABR fans:
In addition to watching the Yankees this weekend, I also did some research.
SJ44 has a 102 WPAP (words per average post). That figure is by far the highest of all posters here at The Yankees Lohud Blog!
No to Cano,Melky and Manny being on the Yanks in 2009.Two quiters and one questionable talent.
Kemp is the Dodgers Cano. Extremely talented, but prone to vapor locks.
However, from a pure talent standpoint, he’s more talented than Cano. He’s also younger and plays a more premium position.
It is kind of like a Roberto Kelly for Paul O’Neill type of trade. Its all about gauging the upside.
Matt Kemp is a five tool player. Robbie Cano is not.
What’s tougher to find…..five tool CF or second basemen?
Its one of those deals that could help both teams.
In Kemp, the Yankees get a guy who will probably make 600K next season. If you figure Nady will make about 7 million, they would have 2/3 of their OF locked up for about half of what it will cost just to re-sign Abreu.
They can look elsewhere to find a solid second baseman. A guy who can make the plays, hit enough at the bottom of the order and is just a good, solid player. They don’t need a superstar to play second base. They do need a guy who can play the position with some measure of day to day consistency.
Every trade has risks. Obviously, you weigh the risks before doing anything.
However, a Cano-Kemp swap has the potential of being a deal that helps both teams. The ideal type of trade.
yeah, i agree, its all pavano’s fault!
and which injury did pavano fake when he told the yankees to shove it?
Clay,
LOL. You have too much time on your hands!
“Yankees are going to have a LOT of outfield options next year. (Matsui, Nady, Damon, Abreu if resigned, Cabrera, Gardner/Christian, etc)”
Only problem is, Matsui and Damon can’t play in the OF every day, Abreu is terrible in RF and will get a longer and richer contract elsewhere (probably?), and Cabrera, Gardner and Christian are all extra outfielders. Besides that, though, I guess it’s true that they’ll have a lot of options…it’s just that none of them are very good.
sj, i think his stats would indicate the you’re the one with too much time on your hands!
I agree with most of the poster’s here, this team really needs a shaked up. I can’t believe I’m saying this but A-rod is the only player playing with a sense of urgency.
The Halo’s maybe the best team is Baseball right now, but we should have capitalize and won 2 of the 3. All this status qou, playing. We still are only 4 games back…Non of it matters unless we win…I’m at a loss with this team..
“LOL. You have too much time on your hands!”
SJ,
Yeah. My wife says the same thing.
I do not profess to know too much about Kemp, other then some stats and hype. I don’t believe I have seen him play once.
But, judging from some comments here and elsewhere a Kemp/Jackson cf/lf combo has the potential to be dynamic. Young, cost controlled, 5 tool, athletic etc. They can be cornerstones for years to come. Then a guy in rf like Nady for a few years after this contract (to soon to talk about that) and you have a fantastic and cost effective outfield.
Pitching is here and coming.
We would then need to work on the right side of the infield.
how crazy is it that melky is still playing.he is an automatic out.it’s like having a pitcher bat.do not resign abreu,giambi,pudge,.choose 1 of petite or moose. no tex or sabathia.go after sheets, he’ll get less years.good bye superstars hello good young players.
My only concern with all the Kemp-for-Cano talk, is why would the Dodgers give up on a cheaper, younger player with more upside in exchange for a 2B with less potential? Wouldn’t they want to part with Ethier first, who gets bandied about in trade talks more liberally than Kemp. I thought Kemp’s name usually elicited a Phil Hughes-like “untouchable” response from the Dodgers. That would make me believe that they’d have to give up even more than Cano to get him (one of the many pitching prospects), and I don’t know if that’s as easy to swallow. I also don’t need to be reminded that all good trades aren’t easy to swallow, but I guess what I want to know is where does the line get drawn if you want to hypothetically pursue a Kemp-for-Cano swap?
russ, a little warning about going young:
young guys on the team this year: joba, hughes, kennedy, cano, melky, gardner, christian.
1 good one out of 7.
Yeah, the Yankees have plenty of Of options… not a whole lot of ATTRACTIVE options, but options nevertheless.
I think trade speculation is about the best thing we do here. There’s a lot of merit to the Kemp/Cano idea, which makes it intriguing and also validity to the argument that you don’t deal away the only quality position player you’ve developedf in a decade.
Just please, no Pudge talk… the Yanks don’t need to spend $ 30 mill on three catchers in their mid thirties. the three keys to how they put the ‘09 team together are Sabathia, Pettite and Mussina. After that you make decisions on Pudge, Sexson, Giambi and Abreu. then you look for the other pieces. My vote would be to sign CC and Pettite but not Mussina… but I admit Mussina is making it tougher and tougher to think that way.
Another key is Joba’s shoulder. Is he full go as a 180+ inning starter? If so you definitely don’t bring back BOTH Pettite and Mussina.
Another interesting tidbit about Matt Kemp: Kemp, Joba Chamberlain, and Bruce Springsteen all share the same birthday!
it may have been mentioned already (long thread).
how is Kemp’s fielding (in center-field) ??
Correct me if I’m wrong, but wasn’t it Betemit who missed the last play of the game at 2nd? Not cano?
I had to answer this. Betemit did what he had to do, come out cover the hole and retreat back to 1B when Robi stops it. Cano didn’t even dive, he looked at Betemit like it was his ball to catch, Pudge had a dead stare at Cano, Mo did the same thing. If there is one thing I hated about Alfonso Soriano it was how he dogged play after play and Robi Cano is going the same route. It’s unbelieveable how sometimes I ask myself is he giving 100 % on that play ?……
“Another interesting tidbit about Matt Kemp: Kemp, Joba Chamberlain, and Bruce Springsteen all share the same birthday!”
Hah…the feeling on this thread at least is that a lot of Yankees fans are hoping that Joba and Kemp can celebrate their birthdays together next year during the 2009 pennant race.
andrew: the talk before, was: kemp/lowe for cano. Maybe nyy would not have to part with an additonal player.
Although this is a trying season, one, of a few, positive outcomes is that Arod is becoming the Yankee’s leader. It is evident that he is growing into this role; that is a good thing.
skeptic,
agreed. but u can’t keep clogging every position with bad contracts.cano will turn it around here or someplace else.yesterday was disgraceful.i think melky should be moved or demoted break up that tandem.christian a 27 yr old rookie.hughes could turn it around if he stays healthly.these players don’t have time in ny to blossom or not in melky’s case
“If they simply put Kemp nady and Damon in the OF and had Ellis and all things stay the same I like the new team better. Kemp has a 340 something OBP not a 302 OBP like Cano..”
Sounds nice…. in theory.
In reality, it’d probably suck.
Vrsce not saying your wrong but what makes you say that ?
“They can look elsewhere to find a solid second baseman. A guy who can make the plays, hit enough at the bottom of the order and is just a good, solid player. They don’t need a superstar to play second base. They do need a guy who can play the position with some measure of day to day consistency.”
Who?
Last I heard, the As and Ellis are talking extension. He’s willing to give a hometown discount, and really wants to stay in Oakland.
Assuming he signs there, Orlando Hudson’s wrist is scary, who do you go after?
There’s a reason it’s difficult to find middle infielders – they ain’t a dime a dozen.
SJ44: appreciate the posts, today.
you have been in favor of a cano trade. Does Cano’s personality, play a part in this? He looks to be on cruise-control. As does, jeter. As does, arod. To my disappointment, jeter and arod are immovable. Is a cano trade (in a fair deal) serving the purpose of moving out a ‘laid-back’ player, and bringing in a candidate for 2nd base, who is a pedoria/eckstein type?
I feel the need to defend Melky here. He isnt an automatic out, in fact his OBP is over .300, which is where half the freakin team is, minus A-Rod and Giambi. He is an above average CF also. I think there has to be something to the Cano/Cabrera dynamic though that should be addressed. Both are good players, but Cano in particular cannot write it in like Cano does. and the double play on the first pitch of his Ab in the first was atrocious. All in all, they are both staying, so they need to find a way to fix them.
Season over. Now can everyone join my cause. Yankees in 09! Rehab Joba the right way don’t rush our future ace. Let Phil Franchise finish the year in SWB working on his command and developing a high quality third pitch. Keep Melancon down, don’t September call up the kid let him continue getting his work in down at SWB dominating hitters. When his innings limit is met shut him down and let him compete for a bullpen job next March. This is the price of being a transition team. Any team who wants to infuse several young pitchers into the pen and rotation respectively must have a down year, this is the Yankees down year. The sooner we except that as fans the better everyone will feel. Do we really want Joba blowing out his rotator cuff just to give us a few innings in September when we are 5 out of the card and 9 out in the division(probably more by the time he returns). Do we want Phil Hughes a future 2 or 3 guy to rush back from a serious injury just to provide a few mediocre innings, when next year he can come back at full strength and with a deeper arsenal. Do you want Mark Melancon a future bullpen stud called up just a few months after he started pitching coming off of Tommy John surgery? Use common sense Yankees in 09 its time to let Tampa have their fun in October it is our turn to sit this dance out.
Laura – X marks the spot!
August 11th, 2008 at 11:10 am
“Robbie Cano, is arguably the most talented young position player in the NY Yankees Organization, and you people want to trade him away. Outfielders with Kemp’s credentials are much easier to come by than a second baseman with Cano’s talent.â€
– - – - – - -
Tell ya what Laura, the Yankee farm system right now is void of position players that can make an impact within the next 2 years with the possible exception of A-Jax.
If the Yankees can get a Matt Kemp for Robby Cano, the deal has to be seriously considered. Center field has been a challenge ever since the heydays of Bernie and it’s a critical position. Melky has not been the answer. If there’s a position that can be carried by the rest of a team it’s 2nd base. Cashman would have a plan in place for 2nd base before ever dealing Cano.
When thought about, the worse thing that could have happened to Robby Cano was when the media started comparing him to Rod Carew and unfair or not, it caused him to regress and take his talent for granted.
First of all, the Yankees aren’t going to give up on Cano. And secondly, who would play 2nd? Everyone who thinks that Orlando Hudson would come to the Yankees just assume that if we throw money at someone, they’ll be willing to play in New York. Some guys just don’t want to play here. Not to mention he’s having major surgery on his wrist, which will be an important factor to how he performs next season. So sure, trade cano, get Kemp and sign Hudson, who may not be 100% next year, so everyone can say how Cashman screwed that up and needs to be fired. There’s no level ground here, it’s lose-lose either way.
alright, enough of this ‘next year’ talk. this year isnt over and im not giving up!
bench cano for a few days and move on.
i’ve been harping on moving astats in the order, but even if he stays in the 4 hole, joe really needs to shake up the order. not sure its time to pull a billy an draw names, but move jeter down to 6th and put nady in there (personally id put arod 2nd, nady 4th).
if cano gets his head out of his butt, how about batting him 3rd and putting abreu behind arod.
i know everyone will have some reason why you cant do that but what he have been doing isnt working and there’s still time to pull this season out of the crapper, so try something different!
enough of the pity party, lets get hitting!
“If there is one thing I hated about Alfonso Soriano it was how he dogged play after play and Robi Cano is going the same route.”
It is unbelievable that the Yankees lately can only find 2B prospects that show tons of promise right off the bat in the bigs, then wear out their welcomes after around 3 seasons due to issues with inconsistency, approach and effort. Let’s hope whoever might replace Cano at 2nd in 2009 is a little better than Enrique Wilson/Miguel Cairo in 2004 and Tony Womack in 2005.
The thing about Cano…everyone says he’s a great second half player. That came from what – two seasons? Maybe it led both us and the Yankee organization on a bit. Personally, I don’t see why any team would want him in a trade. Has a bit of potential, but plays with no heart.
It is unbelievable that the Yankees lately can only find 2B prospects that show tons of promise right off the bat in the bigs, then wear out their welcomes after around 3 seasons due to issues with inconsistency, approach and effort. Let’s hope whoever might replace Cano at 2nd in 2009 is a little better than Enrique Wilson/Miguel Cairo in 2004 and Tony Womack in 2005.
That’s probaly why they drafted David Adams and Corban Joseph…but it’s amazing our 2B for the last 10 years has been lazy.
Why would the Dodgers trade kemp? Easy it is ego.. Torre and there crew wil lthink the ycan fix Cano. Cano excelled for Torre and therefore Torre and crew will think they can fix him because like most human beings Torre thinks he is smarter and better at managing then Girardi.
The DOdgers also have a glut(Kinda) in the OF and need middle infield help badly.. Ethier while not great should be a every day OF for the Dodgers…
Cano on the whole has been the biggest dissapointment for the Yanks he is only 25 and his #”s this year are way down over last year which really was his 3rd year in the game….
Send them Cano and Melky(insurance for the Dodger OF) and get back Kemp and something else.. Torre has Andruw jones for 1 more year and Peieere for 2 so Melky could help them especially if Jones is DONE>.
Al,
Did you actually go back to the other thread and copy & paste that 12:25 p.m. repost? Or do you have it saved on your desktop?
No one wants to join your doomsday cult.
jobatime,
melky gives away more games with his bat then he saves with his arm and glove.360 obp in 06′ 338 in 07′ and we all know about 08′.he swings for the fences.he can’t run that great either.
You’re the man!
I’m not for giving up Robbie, unless I hear of a solution that doesn’t create a bigger hole for the Yanks. We need a quality 1st baseman and another OF.
Pitching, Pitching, Pitching…this is the answer…..
“Al from BK
August 11th, 2008 at 12:25 pm
Season over.”
good thing you werent the phillies or rockies manager last season!
AL from BK:
I have yo back.
soriano was an OF moved to 2b because knobby forgot how to throw.
how is Kemp’s fielding? (in center-field)
Why are the Yankee’s the only team that takes it so slow with the youth…
The A’s, Twin’s, Halo’s……….bring the talent up and let them play…..
There are times when Max Kellerman sounds like an idiot sport analyzer today is one of those times.
I do not think Arod becoming the Yankee leader is a good thing.. Arod is a good player but leader!!!
Yeah a leader leaves the all star game in the 4th inning to go to his party. A leader never comes up big when it counts. A leader is tough and comes up big on occasion when it matters.
As I stated if Arod becomes the Yankee leader they are in HUGE trouble.. A rod should stay what he is a enigma, a stat man, and loner, with limited interpersonal skills.. Arod should do what he is good at , worrying about Arod….
Sorry left out the Ray’s………….
The youth is the jolt the yanks need………….
I say bring Jackson up, give him a taste, same goes for the pen…
Why are the Yankee’s the only team that takes it so slow with the youth…
The A’s, Twin’s, Halo’s……….bring the talent up and let them play…..
kinda how nyy did it, with Kennedy and Hughes, this year?
they tried. Players have to co-operate, tho. 2 way street.
As I stated if Arod becomes the Yankee leader they are in HUGE trouble.. A rod should stay what he is a enigma, a stat man, and loner, with limited interpersonal skills.. Arod should do what he is good at , worrying about Arod….
stuart this is a moment when I say WTF ?
“soriano was an OF moved to 2b because knobby forgot how to throw.”
You are wrong, he was drafted as a SS. They tried him at 3B, SS and eventually he landed at 2B. He didn’t play OF till he left the Bronx, unless he was out there in spring training at some point, but certainly never in the minors or during the regular season.
tim, if we can move to a really weak division and get used to making the playoffs like 1 out of every 3 years, we can be just like the twins and a’s too!
Stats are fun.
Anyone who wants to start an argument can take certain stats (or sets of stats) and make one of the game’s best hitters look like an incompetent buffoon at the plate. They can then switch a stat or two and make any .230-260 hitter look like an MVP candidate or at least a prospective one. All they have to do is leave off certain other stats that support an argument against them, throw in some naive opinions on salary, contracts & baseball economics and you have a blowhard blog GM.
Call it data beautification or selective ignorance … it’s an common tactic to use in blog posts, but it’s certainly no way to run a team. At least a championship contender.
You want to get max out of sharting next year, here you go.
Starters:
Wang
Joba
Sabathia (or Sheets or trade for Peavy (kennedy and gardner and prospect)
Mussina
Pettitte
Start Hughes in the Minors and Bring him up in May. This takes away some of the pressure and hopefully he can make it through the summer without getting hurt. I think starting him down allows him to build up confidence, and i think if they do this, he puts on a show in 09′. Kennedy is different. I dont know what to think here. Also hopefully sometime in late 09′, we bring up Brackman (if ready) and get a taste of what he may do.
Melancon deserves the call up others I am not sure of.. Melancon statistically has dominated the minors to crazy levels…
andrew, i stand corrected, soriano was a hitter with no position moved to 2b because knobby forgot how to throw.
skeptic:
What about Ray’s……
“if cano gets his head out of his butt, how about batting him 3rd and putting abreu behind arod.”
I like where you’re going with this… but I’d write Cano off… and simply switch ARod and Abreu. Alex gets better protection, and Abreu will not expand the zone trying to get a hit – he has no problem taking a walk. This reminds me of the Ortiz Manny scenario when Francona tried hitting Ortiz 4th… he realized Manny is the perfect 4th hitter because he’s not going to force the issue and swing at a pitcher’s pitch (unless its Mike Mussina’s) just because he’s hitting cleanup.
“The thing about Cano…everyone says he’s a great second half player. That came from what – two seasons? Maybe it led both us and the Yankee organization on a bit. Personally, I don’t see why any team would want him in a trade. Has a bit of potential, but plays with no heart.”
Well, he had a nice 2nd half going… then he hurt his wrist.
But it’s a lot easier to just say “He sucks and is lazy and I hate him”
Brandon Arod is not a leader he is simply a very very good player.. I was just responding toa poster who was happy Arod is becoming the team leader.
Ricky Henderson also was not a team leader or barry bonds or many very very good players..
Arod should do what he is good at; pile up stats often meaningless and worry about his vanity..
JobaTIME,
Kennedy + Gardner + a prospect for Peavy? Why would SD do that deal? That prospect would have to be Joba.
Like I’ve said before but got slammed on here, we should have went full bore after Tex.
“for Peavy (kennedy and gardner and prospect)”
Is that prospect Joba Chamberlain? If not, forget it. Also, unless Hughes comes back and pitches like he did in April, if he’s healthy through March 2009 he isn’t going to AAA. He’s got nothing to gain from dominating in the minors. They haven’t reached the point of having to tell him to go re-learn how to pitch yet this year, because it hasn’t been proven that he’s forgotten how (unlike IPK). Granted, that might change in 2 weeks or so depending on how he performs, but I am thinking he will look different than he did in April.
“Why are the Yankee’s the only team that takes it so slow with the youth…
The A’s, Twin’s, Halo’s……….bring the talent up and let them play…..”
It’s called having pressure to be competitive every single year. I hate to say it, but the Marlins have had the best strategy… build an army of great young talent, acquire a couple of key free agents, win it all, dump everyone off for more young talent. Brilliant really… but pretty lame.
funny hobs
“trade for Peavy (kennedy and gardner and prospect)”
You’re joking, right? That crap package ain’t gonna get Peavy to the Yankees.
Oh so now it is a hurt wrist for Mr. Cano!!
BS, it is a hurt brain not wrist.. enough with the excuses these guys are not related to you, they make a lot of money, and almost all of them have no clue about the real world.
Cano is just not a smart player, his approach at the plate is usually impatient and undisciplined… He lunges at balls all the time and tries to pull them and grounds out to 2nd or 1st. WHen he is patient and goes where the ball is pitched he is affective but has a hero complex and would rather swing a3 and 1 on a bad pitch then take a measly(his term) walk.
He has not figured this out in almost 4 seasons in the Bronx so he is either stupid or in his own world, you make the choice…
Jeremy Shockey obviously has no use for his New Jersey home, just across the Hudson River from Manhattan, now that he’s been dealt to New Orleans. And so he has loaned it to Joba Chamberlain.
That was nice of Jeremy
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/peter_king/08/10/ufl/1.html
my thinking about putting cano in the 3 hole is that after he serves his pennance (ride the pines for a couple of days) it might drive home the point of how much this team needs him to contribute NOW! lets face it, he may not be a real go-getter out there but now he’s gotta be embarrased and looking to redeeem himself.
also, i thought all along that if abreau were let go after this season that cano would be the heir apparnt for the 3 hole. before we vote him off the pinstriped island, why not give him that shot to show what he can do in that spot.
in any case, giambi behind arod (just like the rest of the battting order) isnt working, sj said the other day that he thinks arod is trying to do too much b/c he has no support behind him in the order. moving abreu, a much better rbi and contact guy behind arod may help arod psyche (now THERE’s a scary place!) and let him calm down in RISP situations.
in any case, this batting order isnt working.
In this series yeah Cano/Betemit made a mistake, but our so called strength cost us this series. The PEN…….the manager why leave Veras out there after 2 home-runs?
The Halo’s play each game as if it’s the last game. Any one is available to win the game at hand.
We need to do the same thing. This season is not lost just yet..bring up the young arms and Jackson…and at least try it. Put the young arms in the PEN…………..
“Like I’ve said before but got slammed on here, we should have went full bore after Tex.”
They had nobody to trade–Casey Kotchman was the best player Atlanta could have gotten, because they wanted to try and replace Tex’s production at first with a young cost-controlled alternative. The Yankees packaging Tabata and better pitching prospects than they gave up for Nady+Marte might not have bested what the Angels offered. The Braves still think they’re close to contention again in 2009, and so why are you taking a prospect package (the best the Yankees had to offer) instead of a major league first baseman who is young and could be a part of a winning team relatively soon?
my guess for the rotation next season would be Wang, Pettitte, Joba, Moose and Freddy Garcia.
Hughes starts in Scranton. Sabathia signs a 7 year deal in Texas for $148 million.
“Sabathia (or Sheets or trade for Peavy (kennedy and gardner and prospect)”
LOL!
Brandon Arod is not a leader he is simply a very very good player.. I was just responding toa poster who was happy Arod is becoming the team leader.
See I’m sorry I can’t agree here, I’ll use my NY Giants as an example Micheal Strahan and Antonio Pierce led that team, and they were pains in the butt off the field. Arod is at the stage that he needs to step up. See the perception of Arod is never going to change it is what it is but in order to get to that locker room and show that there is a difference he needs to step up. Girardi knows that, management knows that, hey it won’t be pretty but if it happens it can only be a plus.
“Then who plays 2nd base for us? Betemit?”
Sure, he has been getting better as an every-day player.
The problem is, + defense and + hitting middle infielders are much harder to find than corner outfielders. I would ask for a bit more for Cano, and I think they would consider.
Calling A-Rod “A-Stats” is one of the dumbest things I have seen in a while.
Some of you need to join the real world. A-Rod is one of the only things the Yankees currently have going for them. All of the blame and hate that goes towards A-Rod here is ludicrous. The Yankees problems stem from injuries and the fact that Cano, Melky, Jeter and the entire bench have under performed.
There should be a shakeup in the off-season though. The main thing that needs to happen is getting a CF that can actaully play. If that means giving up Cano, so be it.
And whoever floated the idea of Jeter to 2nd and A-Rod to short…that is a very intruiging idea that I would like to see happen. I don’t think there is a chance in hell it will happen, but it makes a lot of sense to me.
Brandon,
in the past Arod seemed to be all about Arod, this year he seems to have team suuccess as a priority. I think that is why he presses too much with men on base. He has the team at heart, it is a good sign, IMO he will become an even better ballplayer.
“Oh so now it is a hurt wrist for Mr. Cano!!
BS, it is a hurt brain not wrist.. enough with the excuses these guys are not related to you, they make a lot of money, and almost all of them have no clue about the real world.
Cano is just not a smart player, his approach at the plate is usually impatient and undisciplined… He lunges at balls all the time and tries to pull them and grounds out to 2nd or 1st. WHen he is patient and goes where the ball is pitched he is affective but has a hero complex and would rather swing a3 and 1 on a bad pitch then take a measly(his term) walk.
He has not figured this out in almost 4 seasons in the Bronx so he is either stupid or in his own world, you make the choice…”
Could you give me a link where Cano used the term ‘measly’ when talking about walks?
Because you just come across as an idiot.
I don’t know if you were paying attention, but Cano sat out a couple games a couple of weeks back – with a hurt wrist.
It’s no coincidence he went from mashing the ball to stinking overnight. Ditto Jeter and his HBP in the hand – mashing, gets hit, stinks.
Sometimes, you have to read between the lines on this stuff.
Of course, it’s a lot easier to just say he ‘has no heart’, ‘is lazy’, and ’stinks’.
Brandon,
Love ya kid, but if you think that A-rod is going to replace Jeter as the clubhouse leader you’ve got it painfully wrong. Even after Jeter is long gone, Alex will not be a leader for the Yankees. Think of Jeter as Yogi Berra.
Alex is the greatest in the game right now. But he’s no leader. You can’t go to school to be a leader or order leadership online or get it through religion. It’s something you’re born with and very rare.
I’m not going to get into the specifics of why Alex doesn’t have what it takes because it’s painful to rehash and it would stir up a whole Alex love/hate thing here. But he’s no leader. Except in meaningless HR.
extremly critical road trip and astats has 3 rbi and totally screwed up getting thown out at 3rd yesterday.
he swings for the fences when a single or even a groundout will do.
i dont know if he puts himself above the team or what it is, but he is just unclutch. seems like his head isnt in the game or he’s just not very smart.
either way, his stats way outstrip his actual value. he’s been called the best player in the game for about 6 years now and the teams he’s played for have NOTHING to show for it.
We all know baseball is a streaky game, everyone here is bashing Melky.
Sat: he’s 3 for 4, switch hitter, yet Sun he’s on the bench.
Everyone’s complaining about his production, he gets hot..Joe G puts him on the bench????
mel I love your opinion but Jeter is no clubhouse leader.
You know me, I’d pack Cano’s bags and carry him piggyback to the next team if he were traded.
He’s my least favorite Yankee since Mell Hall.
What is sad is that the guy is the straw that stirs the drink here. If he hits like he’s capable of, we win.
But he’s so inconsistent, so unfocused. I don’t care if he’s young, you cannot build a team around this guy and expect him to perform.
You can build a losing inconsistent team around him.
I don’t know if Kemp is the right trade, although it seems to make sense.
I don’t know if we can’t get a young top starter for him.
Maybe if Ricciardi gets the axe in Toronto, the new GM might be interested in Cano and prospects for Hallyday.
The point is, you don’t what happens in the off season. Players become available and Cano is a great piece to dangle.
I don’t worry about who replaces him at 2b. We won with Mike Gallego, Mariano Duncan, etc. at 2b. The key here is to find a sound player — you don’t have to find a guy who will hit .330. Just someone who plays the game right.
You want to tell me Cano plays the game right? Go ahead. I won’t believe you.
Cano is one of those players where his apologists sit there and tell you what you see isn’t who he is. When he looks lazy, they tell you he’s not lazy, he’s smooth!
When he looks unfocused they tell you, “no, that’s his style, you don’t understand!”
I know what I see and I see an immensely talented young man who does not have the fire to be the best. He’s regressed this year at a point in his career where you want to see him get better.
He didn’t just get the call up from Scranton. He’s not a “kid” anymore.
I hope he gets traded for some serious talent. I think other GM’s will be seduced by the same things his apologists are seduced by and he’ll wear out his welcome in the next town just like he is doing here.
Al the quitter
Melancon’s 17 innings short of 100. I know the common response to that is “no sweat, they were easy innings”. That all real nice, but those innings also include 30-35 times where he’s getting up to throw in preparation for being in a game. Also true that history tends to be unkind to relievers who’ve been used for 100+ IP’s the year before.
I wonder just how much help he can be the next month in a half or so.
And all this “leader” stuff is foolish. If the Yankees were currently in first with the exact same team, would anyone be talking about “leadership”?
These guys are professionals, just like the rest of us. We are paid to do a job. There is no “leader” at my job, just a boss who expects us to perform. And if we don’t perform up to expectations, eventually we will be working somewhere else.
No matter what Cano’s reason is for under performing, lack of leadership is cop out excuse.
There are alot more quitters on this board than Al. I’m sure there isn’t even room to list them all.
Melky is also God-awful from the right side this year, though, Timothy. He has ripped left handed pitching to the tune of .221/.289/.311. Honestly, Girardi is liking what he’s seen from Christian against lefties and at this point considering how little Melky has done since April, he and Christian platooning is the least of the team’s worries.
Vinny-B- Thanks for getting my back on this one I’m kind of sick of copy and pasting that edict so I’ll stop. Was Ken Rosenthal just blowing colossal amounts of smoke or was there any shade of truth to those Zach Greinke rumors? If we could get Greinke and somehow rid ourselves of the melky/robby cancer that would be nice.
Timothy,
Who knows? Maybe there was some kind of issue. Melky was supposed to sit 2 games in Texas and back for the third. Didn’t he sit out the whole series? At any rate, his “rest” was much longer than anticipate.
Girardi might not have patience for attitude. Unfortunately, he was forced to use IPK. And he can’t bench Cano for screwing up like Maddon did to Upton because Wilson’s his backup and he screwed up, too!
I wouldn’t call myself a quitter just realistic. This team doesn’t deserve to make the playoffs and isn’t prepared to compete even if they were to somehow make it.
“extremly critical road trip and astats has 3 rbi and totally screwed up getting thown out at 3rd yesterday.
he swings for the fences when a single or even a groundout will do.
i dont know if he puts himself above the team or what it is, but he is just unclutch. seems like his head isnt in the game or he’s just not very smart.
either way, his stats way outstrip his actual value. he’s been called the best player in the game for about 6 years now and the teams he’s played for have NOTHING to show for it.”
You can repeat yourself 100 times, but you’re stupid every single time.
Fact: ARod with runners on hits a lot more singles than HRs. Makes you think he’s, oh, I don’t know – not swinging for the fences.
I think he’s trying to make solid, hard contact – it’s great when it’s hit where they ain’t (1st inning yesterday), it stinks when it’s right to the 3rd baseman for an easy double play.
The whiners here, who obviously don’t understand real baseball, will never get that. The difference between an RBI double and a hard hit double play really isn’t all that much.
Brandon,
I wouldn’t know because I’m not in the clubhouse, but Jeter does get a lot of respect inside the clubhouse and out, which is the #1 requirement for a leader. Charisma’s #2.
I think that injuries are more of an issue than Jeter’s leadership.
If you guys think that Jeter’s soft and doesn’t want to win based on what he WANTS you to see, I think you’ve got it wrong.
Jeter’s cut from the same cloth as Tiger, Jordan, and any other champion. He just happens to play a sport in which you’re more likely to fail than not.
Some of you guys really make me laugh! Cano has “no heart”, Cano “has regressed”, Cano this.. Cano that.
Its nice that you know Robbie Cano so well.
Has “no heart”, huh? Why? Because on yesterday’s grounder he thought Betemit was to field it (which he should’ve) and he was shading more towards second, plus the runner partly blocked his vision?
He has “no heart’? Why? Because he’s made it to MLB at 23 and already has become an All Star?
Every MLB player who plays the game doesn’t play “blood and guts” like Derek Jeter. Many players have different mental approachs to baseball, it doesn’t mean that they don’t care or aren’t trying.
Yeah trade Cano because we lost yesterday. While your at it: trade ARod for getting thrown out at third..or trade Pettitte for coming out and giving up a 2-0 lead…or trade Abreu for grounding out with a runner at third and less than two out…or how about Mo for throwing a cutter right down the middle so Figgins could hit a seeing eye grounder??
Funny, funny armchair GMs, make me chuckle!
You guys are f@#$king ridiculous.
You don’t trade Cano unless someone comes in and knocks your socks off with an offer.
Stop being so reactionary. I know this season has been frustrating at times but jeeze.
Cano did not play because of a bad thumb not wrist.. again Cano’s deeds not words leads me to believe he thinks walks are meaningless. again when all you clowns go to dinner with Cano tell me all about his feelings and thoughts.
Now on Arod as a leader and comparing him to Peirce and Strahan. Pierce and Strahan were vocal long before they became the so called leaders. Also Arod is a loner and into his GLOBAL BRAND.. WHy would he worry about something so insignificant in his world like team and camraderie!!!!
And now we are signing 86 MPH Freddy Garcia for next yr.. Shrewd move a older guy coming back from serious injury with his velocity down, maybe we can sign him to like a 5 yr. deal!!!!!!
Ever think he may swing for the fences because they are incapable of bringing runners in. And i like him trying to take 3rd so he can score on an out. He was safe according to the replay.
mel:
Maybe so, just to or IMO after you get production finally from someone you have been waiting for all year, you stick with him.
I don’t know, I’m grabbing at straw’s, something has got to give.
Al,
There’s no “cut and paste edict”. Pete doesn’t mind small excerpts, as long as you give credit or link the source.
Of course, if that was a dig at me, I was just joking and thought you knew blogging etiquette of putting *Re-post*. Unless I’m totally wrong, I recall seeing your “It’s all over, join me” post yesterday.
“Fact: ARod with runners on hits a lot more singles than HRs. Makes you think he’s, oh, I don’t know – not swinging for the fences.
well, i cant even begin to describe how weak an argument point this is.
what % of hitters doesnt hit more singles than homeruns, whether trying to or not, in any situation?
I may be a serious minority here, but i think you sign Pavano to a one year deal with benchmarks if he doesnt get much from other teams. If he is hurt, you dont lose much, if he isnt he may be worth something.
Mel- You are correct that doomsday post was a repost. Probably because I am tired of defending or restating the same opinions on this team.
“well, i cant even begin to describe how weak an argument point this is.
what % of hitters doesnt hit more singles than homeruns, whether trying to or not, in any situation?”
Yeah that was pretty stupid whoever said it, but why don’t you back up your claim. What % of his hits are singles with no one on base compared to with runners on?
I would bet its fairly similar, Troll.
What is truly amazing is that this badly flawed team is only 4 games out of a wild card spot. A hot streak at the right time, and we could all remember this season very fondly. Hard to believe when you see how they’ve been playing recently.
Though their problems recently have related to fielding and hitting with runners in scoring position, I think the key to any sort of comeback has to be strengthening the starting rotation. There are just too many journeymen there now.
If Joba, Hughes, and/or Pavano are able to pitch again soon, this team has a chance. Otherwise, it doesn’t much matter; even if they reach the playoffs, a quick exit is almost certain.
I’ve never liked the idea of trading Cano. It seems to me that players with his talent aren’t easy to come by. We are talking about a guy with reasonable power, and a .300+ average is his first 3 years in the majors. I find myself waivering somewhat on this given his performance this year, but I think they need to get quite a bit back to really consider trading him.
“I may be a serious minority here, but i think you sign Pavano to a one year deal with benchmarks if he doesnt get much from other teams. If he is hurt, you dont lose much, if he isnt he may be worth something.”
Huh? You were just trying to get laughs right?
“You don’t trade Cano unless someone comes in and knocks your socks off with an offer.
Stop being so reactionary.”
i dont think anyone here is advocating sending him off for less than what he’s worth, or maybe even ask for a little extra.
i think its logical and reasonable to discuss the possibilities, and actually reactionary to dismiss not trading him at all because we all know he can be really, really good sometimes.
trading cano now is not reactionary move after yesterday..
he is finishing his 4th yr. he has a OBP of basically 300(atrocious) and just seems not to get it.. Kemp is a stud if you cannot get a stud young player you do not do the move but he is a guy that takes bad ab’s has really bad #’s with RISP, and is not a work the count guy who I think the Yanks need and have done well with.
Cano has bee nteh biggest bomb this year for the yanks even bigger then jeter, giambi, and others…
SJ AND TO ALL THE BLOG READERS TELL ME YOUR FEEDBACK ON MY VIEW AND IF YOU THINK THIS IS REALISTIC:
IF I WAS Cashman at the end of the season i will look in dealing cano. I will look explore a trade with Toronto. Blue Jays Execs must have been impressed with how kennedy threw one of his most impressive games last year at the Rogers Centre. Cano + kennedy (or an additional/different prospect) for Halladay.
Here is the reason why the Blue Jays might budge. Blue Jays are known for trading ace-caliber pitchers (i.e roger clemens). If we acquire Halladay then it would make our rotation infinite times stronger and we’ll address a big concern in the rotation. It would make also make us less incline of signing CC, which who knows how many years he will be asking.
Jeter’s cut from the same cloth as Tiger, Jordan, and any other champion. He just happens to play a sport in which you’re more likely to fail than not.
Mel I’m just going to disagree here, Jordan and Jeter are nowhere near the same type of mold, that is just not true. I’ll leave it at that. Jesus sometimes I do believe he is overrated but to compare him to Micheal Jordan ? Jesus Christ …
“i dont think anyone here is advocating sending him off for less than what he’s worth, or maybe even ask for a little extra.
i think its logical and reasonable to discuss the possibilities, and actually reactionary to dismiss not trading him at all because we all know he can be really, really good sometimes.”
Are you reading the same board I am. I’m seeing general agreements to statements such as “He has completely worn out his welcome” and “I’ll carry his bags to his new team for him”
recently the problem has been hitting with RISP!!!!!
What the f are you talking about? The hitting with RISP is not a road trip issue it is a the WHOLE SEASON
LOOK AT THE #’s the YANKS ARE 3RD OR 4TH WORSE IN BASEBALL WITH RISP…THAT IS NOT A 1 WEEEK ISSUE..
“I may be a serious minority here, but i think you sign Pavano to a one year deal with benchmarks if he doesnt get much from other teams. If he is hurt, you dont lose much, if he isnt he may be worth something.â€
This is good stuff. Rewarding a guy who got 40 mil for pitching under 20 games with a contract extension. Come on now.
Trading Cano is not the answer, we will be week then at 2nd base.
Ok you trade him say for a descent OF, now you have a horrible right side of the infield???
Pavano yes is laughable, but we have 12mil reasons he should be pitching right now out of the PEN. Who cares about a rehab start for him..he gets 1 inning, then 2 and so on.
the Blue Jays are never going to trade Halladay to the Yankees. i think we can all forget that idea right now.
http://mvn.com/mlb-mariners/2008/08/09/washburn-cleared-waivers-and-other-tidbits/
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” Washburn Cleared Waivers and Other Tidbits ”
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Too Funny !
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Gotta win these next 6. We play Minnesota well, hopefully A-Rod is getting on one of his rolls where he can carry the offense for the next 10-15 games. With our next 12 games against Minnesota, KC, Toronto and Baltimore we need to win 10 of these games to make any kind of run. Hopefully Joaba and an improved Hughes can be in the rotation by the time we play Boston.
stuart:
RISP is and has been a problem this whole year, I agree.
However our SO called strength cost us this series as well. THE PEN.
“the Blue Jays are never going to trade Halladay to the Yankees. i think we can all forget that idea right now.”
lol BUT BLUE JAY EXECS WERE IMPRESSED BY ONE GAME THEY SAY KENNEDY PITCH AGAINST THEM> PLUS EVERYONE KNOWS THEY DONT HAVE CABLE IN CANADA THEY HAVNT SEEN ANY OF HIS STARTS SINCE THEN THIS COULD REALLY WORKD!!!!!!1111
You want to say Mariano Rivera in the same mold as Jordan in baseball then I agree, but Jeter ? …So Paul O’neill had nothing to do w/ it, Bernie Williams had nothing to do w/ it ? Boggs ?… These are the type of blanket statements I can’t believe my ears or eyes recieve.
Don Vito he cleared waivers on Saturday, they also bought out Jose Vidro.
J’s dad,
Boston plays Chicago tonight and Yankees play Minny. The Central winner and WC will come from this group of teams.
If we win and Boston loses we’re 3 GB of Boston with 6 head to head games to play. Boston & TB have 6 games to play. TB & Minny have 4 to play. And on and on.
8/11 is too early to declare the season dead.
joba time, safe according to replays means nothing. and the throw clearly beat him. let me be the 10 millionth person to say that if you dont make it, it’s a huge mistake, no excuses (okay a few brownie points for trying to make something happen)
listen, i dont blame global warming on arod, i root for the guy EVERYTIME he comes up, and i take no joy whatsoever when he doesnt come through. I’m a yankees fan and we need him to lead us to titles, and im always hoping he will.
but…im critical of his situational hitting (and his situational stealing yesterday)
i also object to his admiring his doubles (which he has admitted is becoming a problem) but those 2 are minor but very annoying points….
my biggest objection though, is his contract, and the strategy behind it. i think it’s WAYYYYY to long , and i think the $30M/yr would have been much better spent improving 3 other positions on the club (over and over for 10 years.)
great player? absolutly no doubt about it?
best player currently in the game? im not there with you, (i weigh clutch alot heavier than alot of you guys do.)
now if he can go all carlos beltran on us through october this year, i will change my mind and joing you all at the altar, lets hope it happens….
but i am still skeptical.
“You want to say Mariano Rivera in the same mold as Jordan in baseball then I agree, but Jeter ? …So Paul O’neill had nothing to do w/ it, Bernie Williams had nothing to do w/ it ? Boggs ?… These are the type of blanket statements I can’t believe my ears or eyes recieve.”
I think you guy are misinterpreting what the original comparison was. They were talking about personality, leadership qualities, not about dominating on the field.
The is NO Michael Jordan of baseball….never has been never will be, it is too different of a game. Same goes for football.
Tino Martinez, Darryl Strawberry who was Jetes mentor. He took Jeter in, Darryl and Doc and Tino and Paul were the leaders in that room. The Subway series it O’neill, Clemens (as much as we hate him) and Williams who led that room. Ever since the veterans left I haven’t seen any or heard many leadership when considering Jetes. I’m sorry but I’ve seen more from Damon, Moose and Mo than him. I guarantee we’ll see some from Pudge too.
YANKEES TO DO LIST:
People are being too critical on Cano, he’s still one of the best second basemen in baseball. But at the same time, if you can get a trade for good young players, why not.
DONT BRING BACK JIAMBI. Play a platoon of Damon, Posada, and perhaps a young prospect at first.
GET RID OF CABRERA, Gardner will due until Jackson is ready.
FIND A # 2/3 Starter behind Joba & Moose as insurance incase Andy feels like retiring.
Find a 4/5 starter, haha incase Phil & Ian can’t hack it anymore.
Dont Sign CC for a ridiculous amount of money, try to make it reasonable.
KEEP NADY IN OUR OUTFIELD, hes the kind of low cost players that a winning team needs.
Brandon,
Please, I’m not saying that Jeter’s the best in baseball like Jordan is in basketball.
I’m talking intangibles. They’ve got “it”. They’re winners.
Jeter’s the Captain. His job is to be a leader, voice, and face of the team. He’s like a dignitary or a diplomat.
And of course there can be more than one leader in a clubhouse. Jorge is one. Mo is one. And yes, even Damon. It’s not a Jeter dictatorship.
Just because a bunch of fans think he’s not doing his job (you’re not alone in this opinion), doesn’t mean he’s not a leader.
Not trying to offend anyone, but who cares who the leader’s are of Multi-Millionare’s, that are on a sinking ship.
I think you guy are misinterpreting what the original comparison was. They were talking about personality, leadership qualities, not about dominating on the field.
And again it takes when people turn off the rose color glasses to notice that Jetes leadership has been very, very minimal then the guys that use to be here. Sheffield, O’neill, Boggs to a degree, Clemens(yes we still hate him), Tino, Williams.
Again stop giving me this crap about him doing it by example. Where is the example this season ? Where’s the leader ? why am I hearing Damon convince me more than he is ? where is his awareness of the season and where it’s going. This is a big reason why I miss Georgy he definitely not only leads by example but vocally too, he commands a room.
Joba showed more leadership, which I will call passion to play than anyone in the dugout.
Who is our 1st baseman next season?
Sexon/Miranda platoon? Matsui? Betemit?
Brandon,
If there was a problem with Jeter all these years, do you seriously think that Jorge would stand by and let it go? Do you think that Mo would let it go?
“the Blue Jays are never going to trade Halladay to the Yankees. i think we can all forget that idea right now.”
Sure they would. All the Yankees would have to do is send Joba to Toronto in return. No sweat. (:
Again who cares who’s leading everyone of the plank!!!
Some one not sure who out of all these player’s can instill fire in there gut to play hard…
mel
August 11th, 2008 at 1:41 pm
J’s dad,
Boston plays Chicago tonight and Yankees play Minny. The Central winner and WC will come from this group of teams.
If we win and Boston loses we’re 3 GB of Boston with 6 head to head games to play. Boston & TB have 6 games to play. TB & Minny have 4 to play. And on and on.
8/11 is too early to declare the season dead.
Do u also realize that Yanks have to play Boston 6 times and Rays 6 times. Yanks also have to play Angels again.
Ricciardi would rather hang himself from the Toronto space needle than trade Halladay within the division.
the other 3B in NY has 92 RBI’s.
How many does the best player in the game have this year? I forget…
The pen did stink this weekend but if we could hit with RISP then a 2 – 0 lead is actually 4 to 0 etc.
the RISP has been the Yankees biggest problem all year by far….
halliday IS the blue jays.
Timothy,
Only a true leader would have the equipment to decide who walks the plank first.
“KEEP NADY IN OUR OUTFIELD, hes the kind of low cost players that a winning team needs.”
we dont specifically need low cost players to win. we just need good players.
Joba showed more leadership, which I will call passion to play than anyone in the dugout.
And he’s 23 yrs. old that’s the sad part. So if or when we’re losing 6-2 or 7-4 tonight by the 8th inning and Jetes hits into his GIDPs is he leading by example ? should I blame him for the loss, since it’s the leader that usually takes the blame for a loss but I’ve never seen Jetes do that in his life. Usually if your the guy that the team looks to you make your self visible then. And actually look like you give a damn, every freaking Jetes quote I can rehearse it before he even saids it. “uhh … we just need to play better” really you think ?
gosh will this Pirates pitcher even get out of the first inning?
wait over 1/3 of Yankees’ remaining games are against TB, BOS, LAA
yeah, sure, they’ll be fine…
If only George was himself, he would be ripping these guy’s and rightfully so….
Playing and taking that business like approach, just isn’t getting it done…We need some fire, someone smashing cooler’s after a horrible performance with RISP…
Some one ripping the PEN for blowing leads…
Some one ripping A-rod for taking a chance, when there is 1 out, and 2 balls on Nady………
If there was a problem with Jeter all these years, do you seriously think that Jorge would stand by and let it go? Do you think that Mo would let it go?
What ?
NYY,
Yes, read my statement again. I mentioned the 6 Boston/Yankee games.
Glass half full? Chance to gain back those 3 or 4 games against Boston.
Glass half empty? Chance to fall further behind.
I’m a GHF kind of person.
A miracle. He did!
“Do u also realize that Yanks have to play Boston 6 times and Rays 6 times. Yanks also have to play Angels again.”
How is this relevant the Yankees don’t play like a playoff team. Just because they play TB and Boston several more times doesn’t mean they will flip the switch and all of a sudden play hard. This team hasn’t even shown that other gear that we are used to seeing them hit in the second half(especially recently) I don’t think this team as a whole has any heart.
It’s kinda hard to get RBI’s when no one is on base in front of you. Especially when Capt. Clutch GIDP’s everyone off two batter ahead of you.
Any updates on Freddy Garcia?
Some one ripping A-rod for taking a chance, when there is 1 out, and 2 balls on Nady………
No that was the right play Napoli can’t throw a runner out to save his life Sexson,Cano or Molina weren’t going to drive him from 2nd, that’s not letting yourself settle for just being on 2nd and actually trying to make something happen. Nevermind he was safe and the ump blindly missed it again but there should be no issue w/ that play.
Brandon,
If the players had any problem with Jeter not being a leader in the clubhouse, don’t you think that Jorge would be the first one to speak up? Since Jorge has this fire and Latin passion that everyone speaks of so fondly?
Don’t you think Jorege would do something about it? Sign with the Mets because Jeter’s f’in up the club? If we know Jorge, he’d never let something go if it bothered him.
btw, i think all the discussion about what we should do in the offseason is way too early.
what we do in the offseason is going to be very heavily influenced by:
what we get out of phil the last 6 weeks;
what we get out of joba the last 6 weeks;
what we get out of cano the last 6 weeks;
when and how this season ends.
you have to know the last one first before you can make any plans.
Every time Jete GIDP’ I want to take him for a nice drive in his nice blazing copper Ford edge and proceed to throw him out of the panoramic vista roof.
Heyman debunks the Manny rumor in his daily scoop.
Some one ripping the PEN for blowing leads…
Completely disagree here. Do you know that BP basically stood on thier heads for the whole season. If anything that bullpen should flash back the middle finger in this offense.
stuart/Brandon/Mel:
I agree with all your input’s, IMO this team has no real leader. Jeter is the Captain but he really never was the so called leader! He was just a kid that played hard every play, whether he made a great play or failed he played hard every inning, every at bat… This team has no real fire ball personalities, and they really need one…Jorge was the closest to ripping player’s and he’s out. Jeter never rips anybody at least out in the open. If Jeter is the leader, he needs to be ripping people out loud in front of everyone, making them angry.
Al,
I’ve never seen this Ford Edge commercial. What makes it so offensive?
Brandon:
If A-rod was doing that all year great, he picked a bad time to try it.
“Al,
I’ve never seen this Ford Edge commercial. What makes it so offensive?”
Your sarcasm is greatly appreciated. For those not familiar with this advertising nightmare turn on YES for more than 30 seconds and your guaranteed to see it.
Brandon,
If the players had any problem with Jeter not being a leader in the clubhouse, don’t you think that Jorge would be the first one to speak up? Since Jorge has this fire and Latin passion that everyone speaks of so fondly?
The perception has been that Jetes is a leader, the only one who debunked this perception are players that are traded away, like Gary Sheffield. You have to understand you cross Jeter in that locker room ex. Chad Curtis (your sent packing) not many players will risk an instant ripping through the media.
Don’t you think Jorege would do something about it? Sign with the Mets because Jeter’s f’in up the club?
He nearly did, he even admitted if not for the money he wouldn’t be here when he signed. Anyway one thing doesn’t have to do w/ the other mel, you do know this is also a business.
If we know Jorge, he’d never let something go if it bothered him.
Jorge admitted when he doesn’t play he can’t lead this this time like he could if he were healthy (teammates wouldn’t respect that)
There is so much wrong with this team its not funny!! It all starts in one place and that is with the joke manager we have!
1. Girardi has No idea how to use or does he have a feel for this bullpen.
a. Every time he has use Marte in consecutive innings he has imploded. Now tell me this if you are going to use Mariano then start the inning with him. What did he accomplish with starting Marte! He used Mariano anyhow. Girardi said he would have used Mo for four or five outs, but not six. That’s ridiculous. WE NEED TO WIN GAMES NOW!!!
b. Lets go back to the 2 games we beat the Angels in New York. Won the Saturday game by a large margin and again on Sunday. In both of these games he used Veras up by 4 runs. Then on Monday against Texas when he did not have Rivera he could not use Veras because in Girardi’s words he had a dead arm! Well if he is feeling tired why the hell are pitching him up 4. So he uses Marte for 2 innings and we lose on Homer. Sound familiar!
2. Starting rotation: Does anyone remember that Ian Kennedy got hammered all Spring long! This just didn’t happen once the season started. Yet we continued to run him out there and if we all remember after every start he said he thought he pitched better than his pitching line. DO YOU THINK THE MANAGER WOULD SIT DOWN WITH HIM AND TELL HIM RIGHT NOW YOU AAA MATERIAL AND UNTIL YOU REALIZE THAT YOU WILL GET NO BETTER. Obviously not, considering Kennedy’s quotes on Friday. So what do we do? We send Kennedy down Sunday and play the game a pitcher short.
3. Baserunning:- They say a team takes on the personality of its Manager. This has NOT happened here. Girardi always played hard!!! This team like Abreu’s non slide yesterday or everyday you watch Cano run the bases is inexcusable and they should be sat down until they hustle all the time. Abreu stuns me because if you watch him he runs out every ground ball very hard! His outfield play is suspect once he hits a warning track but he always sprints out of the box and will break up a double play. Though NO PASS! He did not hustle on that play and should have been pulled. Give Charlie Manuel credit. He pulled Jimmie Rollins TWICE. This would have never have happened on a regular basis like it does with this team under Torre!
4. Situational Hitting: We by far are the worst in Baseball. They all love Kevin Long because he must kiss their asses and tell tham how good they are. They all do what they want to do and never give themselves up to advance a runner or get a run in.
5. Cano needs Larry Bowa up his ass. Bobby Mecham and Kevin Thompson are not getting through to him. That primma donna MUST dive for that ball.
This team is filled with all-stars surrounded with a coaching staff that is scared to call anyone out and discipline any of them!
GIRARDI NEEDS TO START DOING HIS JOB AND STOP KISSING ASS!
Al,
No offense, but I’m not being sarcastic. I live about 6000 miles away from the nearest market served by YES.
I follow the games on mlb.tv so I’m blessed enough to watch Michael Kay and Co., but they block out the commercials.
I only see people complain about the Edge commercials so I was curious.
If someone who didn’t know much about baseball were to read this blog, they might think that A-Rod goes to the plate, looks at whether there are runners on base or in scoring position then decides how best to hit for himself.
“OK there are men on second and third. If I can hit it on the ground, it helps me because it doesn’t help the team.”
“OK there are no men on base now. Looks like perfect time to knock one out and look good without helping the team too much.”
“We’re up by 4 and there’s one man on, so its safe to hit a double or a HR.”
“Jeter was already on 2nd base, so if Abreu had just got on, I’d have had to hit a squibber to short and get out of the inning. Instead, just I’ll pop out behind the first baseman”
etc etc etc …
Of course he runs through all these possible scenarios in his head while he’s concentrating on how he looks standing in the on-deck circle.
Now if you think A-Rod really thinks this way, keep posting that he’s a selfish player who only pads his stats when it doesn’t matter.
Hey if Dennis Rodman ever once sat back under his team’s basket as the Bulls (or Pistons) offense ran up the court, then intentionally missed a couple layups after his teammates steal get the ball back so he could pad his rebound sats, then that must be what A-Rod’s thinking think when he hits a solo HR or knocks in a run when the Yanks are ahead.
Brandon,
Uncle! I give up! You win!
You know, I wonder what would have happened if Sweet Lou got the nod, instead of Joe G………….He would be so far up some of there *&^ it wouldn’t even be funny…….
Girardi has No idea how to use or does he have a feel for this bullpen.
Someone please post the record after we score first for this individual who says Girardi has no feel for the pen.
I’m new here but I’ve been reading since the first winter meetings
@stuart
Wright has 90 RBI not 92 RBI. He gets a RBI every 5.93 plate appearances. Arod has 70 RBI and he gets a RBI every 6 plate appearances. Arod also has a higher OBP, SLG, BA and has more home runs.
Arod has also scored 73 runs in his 420 plate appearances. It has taken Wright 534 plate appearances to score 77 runs. So let’s cut this who has the better 3B nonsense.
Hey Mel – Do you live in Hawaii or Japan?
I got it the reason why Astats has less RBI’S then Wright is because Jeter hits into those GIDP.. Yeah the 240 avg with RISP for astats has nothing to do with it..
for $27 mill can he at least get 100 RBI’s this year please…
the driving in 40% from 3rd with less then 2 outs also has no affect on Astats great production…
WOW a super arod groupie, do you also have memebership to his fan club? does he e mail you updates about his BRAND???
Retrocluch –
If you ask some of the posters here, A-Rod’s only doing it for his own benefit not the team’s.
For all the commitment and trust they have put into the youth movement they sure are getting a near zero return at least this season.
I don’t think the Steinbrenner boys are going to display the same patience next season. Hank wanted Johan and I’m sure he’s got a big I told you so to all that said nay if this team fails to make the post season.
even Hal is saying they’re going to make a splash in the off season and he’s supposed to be the sensible one.
They simply cannot build this grandiose stadium and start charging absolutely ridiculous prices to the elite fans and put out the same flawed product.
retroclutch I did not say Wright was better but at $7 -$10 mill he is a better value..
that is undeniable, arod makes about $20 mill more then Wright.. Arod is atrocious with RISP, what is your excuse on that 1? DO not give me the small sample size crap either…
stuart
well Stewie, the yankees are stuck with Arod for 9 more seasons after this one, so you can like it or you can whine and cry for the next decade or you can change the subject.
and Bronx jeers the steinny moves will be what?
freddy garcia, barry bonds, some other moronic move for old overpaid crap similar to what they have done for the last few years.
hell try to get some aging stars and recapture past glory it has worked great look at this years team. in yankeeland you never have enoguh of 34 yr old. multi yr contract, talent that is beaten up.. sounds like you should be a GM….
the Yanks move for younger and less expensive talent will not be reversed, fools…..
Actually stuart if you pull the data out and give Arod the same amount of plate appearances as Wright and if he scores RBIs at the same clip it is 89 to 90. Which is remarkable considering he isn’t hitting as well with RISP compared to Wright. Wright is hitting .250 with RISP and Arod is hitting .234 RISP. Additionally Arod is being walked more than Wright in these situations. Wright has walked 21 times in 144 RISP situations. Arod has walked 24 times in 107 RISP situations.
Look no one will say that Arod is doing the job with RISP but you can’t say Wright is any better because he isn’t.
The pen’s demise has coincided with the starters inability to go deep into games. The pen is now overexposed and overtaxed. Since the 8 game win streak ended -
Ponson – 4 IP at BOS
Mussina – 5 IP vs. BAL
Rasner – 6 IP vs. BAL
Joba – 6 IP vs. BAL
Pettitte – 5.1 IP vs. LAA
Ponson – 7 IP vs. LAA
Mussina – 7 IP vs. LAA
Rasner – 4 IP vs. LAA
Joba – 4.2 IP @ TEX
Pettitte – 5 IP @ TEX
Ponson – 6.2 IP @ TEX
Mussina – 7 IP @ TEX
Kennedy – 2 IP @ LAA
Giese – 6 IP @ LAA
Pettitte – 7 IP @ LAA
Only 4 times in the last 15 games has the starter pitched 7 innings. 7 times, they have complete 5 innings or less.
The DBacks just completed a trade for Adam Dunn
vrsce another shrewd comment from you.. .the oint is KING Arod has not pulled his weight this year not real complicated.. The guy wanted and needed to be the highest paid player so I shed no tears for poor misunderstood Arod.. The King of Narcisism…
He has won absolutely no where and if you looked at cause and effect A stats may be a factor in those results..
But whine about Melky or Betemit or some other spare part nonsense… Give afraud, jeter, steroid boy, bobby wall, cano(MR. Walk ) all passes they have just run into bad luck this year delusion..
Mel- Sorry about that I wasn’t aware of your situation. Basically the commercial is so over-marketed that it has become numbing as a Yankee fan to have to watch the captain get pimped out in a car commercial. It is on between 50-100 times during YES broadcasts.
Giambi for his last 5 of 7 years …
Pavano for 4 years …
Kevin Brown for his last 2+ years …
That’s what you can call ‘being stuck with’ someone.
A-Rod for 9 years?
If you really want to complain, you could look at it as being stuck with him. But I’d take that guy on my team for 9 more years.
retroclutch very good points. again Arod is far from terrible but he has not elevated his game remotely to where it was last year.. Thanks for pointing out to me also that Wright’s #’s this year have been nice but nothing earth shattering..
good trade for the DBacks. they needed a veteran bat for that lineup, and he’ll hit some HRs for them down the stretch.
Play Betemit & Sexson and we sure start winning NOW as per Mr. Double-Play Captain. “I was shocked” – Rivera said. I’m shocked too anytime I see Betemit in the lineup, pinch hitter? HA HA HA, I’d say he’s a ‘pinch-striker”. I’m really anxious what Hank thinks about poor Yanks right now, any quotes from Tampa? Bye Girardi, you truly suck.
yeah Ansky when arod is 37 and you have 4 more years on tha tdeal I am sure you will be ecstatic with the contrract.. why wouldn’t you , you see now wrong with the great winning player Alex Emanuel Rodriguez.. After all each town he has left is just torn apart by his departure…
Poor misunderstood A rod… It is never his fault we are jealous of his riches….
We gotta go like 5-1 in the next six games. We do well against the twins and the royals are the royals.
Then again, these are the 2008 yankees. So we will probably go 2-4.
If the Yankees could trade Cano for Matt Kemp, I would dance in the streets. Never gonna happen, unless the Yankees throw in some extras.
There are few players in the game I covet more than Kemp. Nady-Jackson-Kemp would be a great outfield going forward.
Cano has talent, but he seems to be either going backwards or spinning his wheels. He seems unmotivated or aloof at the plate and in the field this season. Watch the replay of the Figgins dribbler yesterday – that’s the kind of play where an infielder has time to make a decision on whether or not to dive, as opposed to just diving as a reaction to a batted ball. He watched it roll into the outfield. Why? It may be more evidence that the guy is just unmotivated to play hard.
Kemp is prone to “vapor lock”, sure, but has more raw talent than Cano, and is actually improving.
If the Yankees could trade Cano for Matt Kemp, I would dance in the streets. Never gonna happen, unless the Yankees throw in some extras.
There are few players in the game I covet more than Kemp. Nady-Jackson-Kemp would be a great outfield going forward.
Cano has talent, but he seems to be either going backwards or spinning his wheels. He seems unmotivated or aloof at the plate and in the field this season. Watch the replay of the Figgins dribbler yesterday – that’s the kind of play where an infielder has time to make a decision on whether or not to dive, as opposed to just diving as a reaction to a batted ball. He watched it roll into the outfield. Why? It may be more evidence that the guy is just unmotivated to play hard.
Kemp is prone to “vapor lock”, sure, but has more raw talent than Cano, and is actually improving.
Play Betemit & Sexson and we sure start winning NOW as per Mr. Double-Play Captain. “I was shocked†– Rivera said. I’m shocked too anytime I see Betemit in the lineup, pinch hitter? HA HA HA, I’d say he’s a ‘pinch-strikerâ€. I’m really anxious what Hank thinks about poor Yanks right now, any quotes from Tampa? Bye Girardi, you truly suck.
When I read quotes like this it makes me wish for schools to be open yearly because you must be 12 or 13 yrs. old to post that and think people believe it.
building a new stadium does not make a team immune to going through the pains every other franchise goes through. If paying a higher price next year on a team trying to dig it’s way out of a decade’s worth of mismanagement offends someone, the solution is simple: don’t buy a ticket. Something tells me there’ll be folks at the staudiuk next season. Call me crazy.
OK lets see –
A-Rod doesn’t knock runs in when it counts, doesn’t score as many runs as he could, so the only possible reason is that he just sucks.
But when he gets on, the guys behind him don’t do much. So sometimes he doesn’t score unless he hits a HR. Yeah his average and production is down with RISP. With Mr Overshift hitting .250 coming to the plate right after him, how many good pitches is he really going to see? Maybe, just maybe, opponents don’t really like to pitch to him unless it doesn’t matter if he produces.
I think there’s a degree of it just being him, and ALSO a degree of how the opposing pitcher approaches him, or how they can approach him due to what’s coming up behind him. Given what’s been behind him in the lineup most of the year, I’d give him a little more benefit of the doubt than he’s getting.
everything sucks, let’s all give up, ok?
I absolutely love Matt Kemp from a talent standpoint. I’d seriously entertain a Kemp/Cano deal if I were the Yankees. From the Dodgers perspective, a run producing 2B is incredibly attractive as a national league team. AL teams have the benefit of supplementing run production through the DH, whereas NL teams do not. Replacing Kemp’s #’s is easier than finding a Cano. Cano is a terrific talent, who’s genuine problem is consistency. He’s hitting .333 since the allstar break, with a .915 OPS.
Given that Albert Pujols doesn’t play 3B, he isn’t going to become available to us (and he’s got hat elbow thing) I think we can ’suffer’ with A-Rod in the lineup.
Is Wright doing better in some ways this season? Sure, maybe. Problem with you, stuart, is that you expect everyone to be Pujols, Ty Cobb, Lou Gehrig etc in every freakin at bat.
You’d probably trade your wife in for a new one if she had a cold sore one night.
why hasnt anyone mentioned the fact that we sorely miss Doug M? He easily makes that play yesterday. Could he be worse offensively than betemit, sexson, and giambi? Also, is it coincidence that he is ont he teeam when mental case arod has his best year and is most relaxed? the guy was a buddy from high school. the curse of doug m.
by the way. to all you nitwits that want to ship all the prospects, you were the same people that wanted us to get rid of dionner navarro. guess we couldnt use him right now huh?
morons.
ok this cano/kemp thread, I’m still of the same opinion: you both don’t really look to unload Robbie, but you also don’t rule out anything that makes the organization better.
Name-dropping Mike Gallego and Mariano Duncan isn’t enough. You’re still losing what is right now a solid presence at second base for years to come. A Mark Ellis is a nice fix, but for how long is a player like that enough? What IS Tony Womack up to these days?
Good move for the D’Backs. Hopefully this will keep Torre out of the playoffs.
I miss doug menkeiwicz greatly….and he WANTS to be a Yankee. We should give him a lifetime services contract.
stuart I wouldn’t exactly call .250 with RISP nice. It’s pretty bad as well. Arod compared to the rest of the team is actually pretty startling as well. Compare him to Abreu who leads the team in RBIs. Arod has more total bases, more sac flies, and fewer double plays. Clearly Abreu is getting more RBIs. Arod has stolen more bases and at a much better percentage. 14/7 vs. 16/2. Arod is also walking more per plate appearance and has more extra base hits.
Also keep this in mind. Arod started slow, like everyone else. .366/.455/.693 in June and .337/.413/.621 in July. He has had 44 of his 70 RBIs in those two months. 16 of his 26 home runs in those two months. That tells me two things. First of all, he was getting nothing to hit early because Giambi behind him was killing him. When Giambi turned around so did Arod’s numbers. The second thing it tells me is that the further behind the team fell, the more he elevated his play. Perhaps the RISP numbers don’t show it but it isn’t like he is fading into obscurity when the team needs him the most. He had a horrible series in Texas, no one will deny that but every player goes through that.
Here’s an added statistic about Arod. At Tropicana Field, he has a ridiculous 1.400 OPS. At the Metrodome he has an equally ridiculous 1.374 OPS. At Yankee stadium he has a 1.132 OPS. I would argue that where games matter most, he is elevating himself beyond.
Stuart,
Hey we’re all frustrated here.
I,m just saying there is no way people are going to make the heavy investment that is needed to buy up all the seats that will run 800$ – 2500$ per game and 300,000$ per suite to see the same bad team.
I can’t say they will land everybody but they’ll sure be in the game for names like Teixeira, Sabathia, Burnett.
The money is there
the need is there
Nothing will cure the hitting ills of Arod Cano Jeter Etc except the individuals themselves. Money can’t fix that.
The RISP has been a horrible situation for them but so has the lack of starting pitching. What do they have like 10 wins out of the 4 and 5 spot? That was a mgmt decision to gamble on Hughes and Kennedy. I don’t see them making that mistake twice.
dioner navarro passed through two other franchises before landing with the rays. This is the first season he’s looked like anything special.
Real easy to pick them when looking in retrospect.
I hate posting from my phone!!!
Bronx jeers…..I sincerely doubt the organization is concerned as to not having stadium filled for the next ten years. Hate to break it to ya.
Ansky you are just wrong. I know arod is a very good player just guys like you think he is great and a immortal which he is not.
Yes Arod is the best position player on the Yanks that is not a shocker but he is not Pujols not even close.. Arod if he could do better late and with RISP then he has he may have it all but he does not.. This team needs arod to be the best player in the game which he has not been this year.
Now if your saying Jeter appears to be fading, giambi sucks with RISP, cano has had a terrible year, etc. I agree. But the Arod fan club never takes any criticism you think all criticism is unwarranted and all that stuff.
I applaud arods desire to be a great player and his effort, I have never questioned that I mostly question his propensity to over think and grip to hard when it matters most…
The Dianmond backs have decimated there system which was very very good . It probably is a good move because the NL sucks and the Diamondbacks if they get to the dance could win with there big 2 starters.
IMO the Yanks get rid of:
Giambi
Betemit
Pugde
Andy or Moose
Abreu
The only bat I would sign from free agent would be Tex (if the Halo’s don’t sign him) or Manny for 2 or 3 yrs at 20mil
a year
with
Damon CF or Damon LF
Jeter SS Jeter SS
A-rod 3rd Tex 1st
Manny DH/LF Arod 3rd
Hideki DH/LF Hideki DH
Posada C/1st Posada C
Nady RF Nady RF
Cano 2nd Cano 2nd
Rookie**FA Melky/ FA/ Rookie** CF
Has anyone come up with who is going to play 2B if we deal Cano for Kemp? And please don’t say Ellis; he’s not batting any better than Robbie is. Can’t say Hudson; he just had surgery and is injury prone.
For those ready to give up, will you stop watching the games, and posting on the blog?
Okay so lets not bring back our most consistant starter this year..
Bronx Jeers getting Sabathia is absolutely worth looking into. Tex I am less for if his deal is insane, he has great plate discipline, is a good fielder, and a swicth hitter but he is not a superstar. If he gets superstar money let’s spend the money elsewhere.
for arguements sake say the rotation is ; sabathia, joba, hughes, wang and either pettitte or moose, then I sya that is a rotation that can win it all.
The pen will be good next year with; mo, melancon(I am counting on him), veras, marte, edwar, robertson ,and others they need no outside arms for the pen.
they need to improve the offense and get younger and more athletic.. I say bye bye to abbreu, giambi for sure.. then I say get rid of 1 of the damon or matsui.. I say then maybe look into Kemp and something for Cano and something. I like Mark Ellis if they lose Cano(get him for 2 yrs at a very modest #) then a team of kemp, nady, damon(prefer him over matsui), jeter, arod, posada, and a new 1b and 2b can be a very very good team.. They need at the 2b and 1B to be grinder type players guys who take pitch’s and are contact hitters….
that is a well balanced very good team…Maybe weak in power but should be sufficient
jennifer:
Either keep Moose or Andy not both………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………..
“For those ready to give up, will you stop watching the games, and posting on the blog?”
The fact that they are still watching the games and are still posting on this blog tells me that deep down, they haven’t really given up. They are just so frustrated and disappointed with the team this year that they WANT to give up, but really can’t. I can’t either. I’ll give up when they are mathematically eliminated from both the division and the WC. Until then, I’ll suffer along with the rest of you.
so does nobody belive that bringing bonds will help this team?!
“I like Mark Ellis if they lose Cano(get him for 2 yrs at a very modest #)…..”
This I don’t get at all. How anyone can think that Cano and Ellis are in the same league is beyond me. I’d bet my entire year’s salary that Cashman would never do this trade.
Laura I just looked at Ellis’s #’s the lst few years they are actually much worse then I expected……
BUt again if they got Kemp then they can give up some batting avg. at 2B for wither speed or more plate discipline and they should be OK….
Either keep Moose or Andy not
It’s got to be Andy, no offense to Moose but I’m not giving up those draft picks for Moose.
Not again, but yes Bonds would help…sorry I said it.
Hey Pete, you’re on ESPN!
does anybody have any updates on our 1st round draft pick being signed..or any picks?
Brandon:
I agree on Andy if he doesn’t retire.
Pete, nice appearance on Outside the Lines
Laura I do not think Ellis is in Cano’s league I also do not think Melky is in Kemps league.. They strengthen themselves in CF and weaken themselves offensively at 2B even though this year Cano is not hard to replace.
WHy do you think you need a superstar at each position..
The angels catchers check them out? How about the Angels SS? How about Figgans at 3B?
The pieces need to fit, superstar not needed at each position…
saw you on OTL pete
I say trade Melky, Hughes, and Kenedy to Texas for Hamilton..
If joba was still in the rotation this angels series would’ve turn out in a different result than a sweep.
It just isn’t fair that we have suffer all these injuries in one year.
28) RHP Gerrit Cole = Unsigned
44) LHP Jeremy Bleich = Unsigned
75) RHP Joseph Bittle = Unsigned
106) 2B David Adams = Signed
140) SS Corbin Joseph = Signed
170) LF Christopher Smith = Signed
200) RHP Brett Marshall = Signed
230) C Kyle Higashioka = Signed
260) CF Daniel Brewer = Signed
290) RHP Michael O’Brien = Signed
320) RHP William Mitchell = Unsigned
350) CF Raymond Kruml = Signed
380) RHP Luke Greinke = Signed
410) RF Jack Rye = Signed
440) RHP David Phelps = Signed
470) RHP Matthew Richardson = Signed
500) 1B Luke Anders = Unsigned
530) SS Addison Maruszak = Signed
560) RHP Brandon Braboy = Signed
590) C Mitch Abeita = Signed
620) RHP Patrick Venditte = Signed
650) 1B Mitchell Delaney = Signed
680) RHP Cory Arbiso = Signed
710) SS Ryan Wilkes = Signed
740) 3B Michael Lyon = Signed
770) C Jeff Nutt = Signed
800) LHP Blake Monar = Unsigned
830) SS Garrison Lassiter = Unsigned
860) RF Chad Gross = Signed
890) OF Michael Jones = Signed but quit
920) C Benjamin McMahan = Unsigned
950) 2B Spencer Lucian = Signed
980) LHP Andrew Suiter = Unsigned
1010) RF Tom Baldridge = Signed
1040) RHP Brad Rulon = Signed
1070) RHP Andrew Shive = Signed
1100) LHP Christopher Dwyer = Unsigned
1130) RHP Justin Harper = Unsigned
1160) RHP Clay Caulfield = Unsigned
1190) 1B Erik Lovett = Signed
1220) SS Samuel Mende = Unsigned
1250) CF Mykal Strokes = Signed
1280) LHP Clint Preisendorfer = Signed
1310) RHP Matthew Summers = Unsigned
1339) RF Evan Ocheltree = Unsigned
1367) SS Creede Simpson = Unsigned (LOSER)
1394) RHP Matt Viltmann = Unsigned
1421) RHP Ryan Flannery = Signed
1448) RHP Rob Scahill = Unsigned
1475) RHP Johnathan Folino = Unsigned
1502) LHP Nikolas Turley = Signed
D-backs get Dunn from Reds for three prospects
I got it! Trade Cano and another prospect for Kemp. Sign Rafael Furcal to play 2B. Sign Pat Burrell or Milton Bradley to play 1B.
28) RHP Gerrit Cole = Unsigned
44) LHP Jeremy Bleich = Unsigned
75) RHP Joseph Bittle = Unsigned
Any word on the progress of these 3? I have heard nothing about them anywhere
In 2007 and 2008 Robinson Cano has had 1,050 at bats. He has struck out 122 times.
In 2008 alone, Matt Kemp has had 432 at bats. He has stuck out an incredible 117 times.Can you imagine the howling on this blog if Matt Kemp played for the Yankees and struck out once every 4 at bats??
Cano’s 162 game averages are: .303 BA,.333 OBP,.470 slugging %, 18 home runs, 89 rbi
Kemp’s 162 game averages are .030 BA, .345 OBP, .481 sluuing %,19 home runs, 78 rbi
There have been whispers about Cano being lazy. There have been whispers that Kemp has a bit of an attitude.
There’s less than 2 years difference in ages. Matt Kemp is no improvement over Robinson Cano.
Cano’s numbers this year are very close to Bernie Williams’ numbers at age 24, only Cano has already had 2 better seasons than Bernie did at the same age.
Give Cano a chance.Cano has shown he can be a dominant player at times. He’s only 25 years old. He is having a bad year.
I can’t believe that the 1st half of the day was dedicated to trading Robbie Cano (dontcha know?)
Sure – let’s trade the youngest positional player to have been an all-star on the team and is signed to a club-friendly contract. We need to cut down on those!
Not to mention the fact that Robbie gives you offense out of a position that is pretty barren in the AL.
But since DFA’ing Damon, Giambi, Moose et al didn’t work, it seems like a great way to spend the day. I’m just glad I wasn’t around to suffer through it.
I say trade Melky, Hughes, and Kenedy to Texas for Hamilton..
SP >> OF
and Texas would come to your house and slap you w/ that phone.
stuart, ARod clearly presses with RISP these days. I think a lot of fans are just tired of all the amateur psychiatry that goes into his at bats.
I don’t think ARod fans feel he can do wrong. I think they are tired of all the attention paid to ARod when his low average with RISP is not one of the team’s major problems.
For all his struggles he still has a .399 OBP with RISP. He is getting garbage to hit, and to his discredit he is swinging at that garbage. He needs to draw walks and the rest of the lineup needs to come through. It’s his fault that he’s pressing, but I have a feeling that if he kept walking with RISP many commenters on this site would accuse of him of “settling” for walks.
This is why I don’t think ARod’s struggles with RISP are one of the team’s biggest problems. Ask yourself, if ARod comes up with a man on second or third and walks, do you feel confident that Giambi and the rest of the lineup can drive the runners in? I don’t.
“WHy do you think you need a superstar at each position..”
When did I say we need a superstar at each position? I didn’t. It’s not about Cano being a superstar. It’s about not trading away a better player for a weaker one.
First of all, this whole Kemp thing assumes that the Dodgers are willing to part with him. I don’t think that they are. They worked hard to keep him in the Manny deal and my guess is that they want him for the long haul.
Secondly, if we are making Kemp our everyday CF, what about Jackson, who is supposedly the CF of our future and close to being ready to come up? Are they Yankees just giving up on this kid too (like they did with Tabata)?
Lastly, as horrible as Cano has been this year, I don’t think that the Yankee brass has lost enough faith in him to trade him away and have Ellis playing 2B. When we played OAK, Ellis did nothing to impress me. I most certainly am not replacing Cano with him. I bet Cashman feels the same way.
“The fact that they are still watching the games and are still posting on this blog tells me that deep down, they haven’t really given up. They are just so frustrated and disappointed with the team this year that they WANT to give up, but really can’t. I can’t either. I’ll give up when they are mathematically eliminated from both the division and the WC. Until then, I’ll suffer along with the rest of you.
”
I actually haven’t watched a game since Joba’s injury I knew that was it. I do however follow on gamecast and with you guys and gals. Having to actually watch the dreck is another issue and those Ford Edge commercials, I actually feel less stressed since I stopped reading the paper and watching Girardi try to excuse it away in the post-game.
I meant that Kemp’s 162 game batting average is .303 Sorry
Kemp for Cano in offseason. Makes sense as Dodgers overstocked with Of’ers and need a replacement for Kent.
Orlando Hudson a FA just had wrist surgery and would have been a good option to replace Cano.
Mark Ellis was mentioned, but his offense is terrible.
Concerned about Matt Kemp’s SO ratio of about 1/4 AB’s. I thought we wanted young athletic “contact” hitters.
Expand this deal to include young Taiwanese lefty, Hong Chi-Kuo, and you have yourself a deal. Cano + AAA pitcher for Kemp and Kuo.
Should Yankees pick up the hefty 6M option on Marte? If they don’t I would expect him to want a multiyear contract at 4.5-5M/Year.
Don’t really want Abreu back although he’s our best with RISP.
Giambi gets 5M buyout. I’d say here’s your 5M, goodbye.
Pettitte and Mussina -depends how they perform the next 7 weeks.
If the Yankees still see themselves in the race Paul Byrd a FA, unlike Washburn, would be a better choice, as he has pitched well as of late.
Adam Dunn a good move by Reds. Would not have resigned him, and probably getting more major league ready signed players than draft picks would have gotten them.
Maybe we should do the same with Abreu and Mussina, once we feel we’re out of it.
Tony –
Bittle has a shoulder issue that the Yankees are concerned about (which Bittle’s people contend). So there is a strong chance that it either won’t get done at all or that there will be a much lower signing package.
I would guess that he returns to Ole Miss (SEC women are fine!)
28) RHP Gerrit Cole = Unsigned
44) LHP Jeremy Bleich = Unsigned
75) RHP Joseph Bittle = Unsigned
Any word on the progress of these 3? I have heard nothing about them anywhere
Cole will be to the last minute because MLB doesn’t want #28 picks getting over the slot money dictating what the top 10 picks get.
Jeremy word is soon.
Bittle needs shoulder surgery which the Yankees want a discount on him, but he saids he doesn’t need it thereforethe Yankees are telling him go to college.
“Give Cano a chance.Cano has shown he can be a dominant player at times. He’s only 25 years old. He is having a bad year.”
Ah, the voice of reason!
Jeremy,
You make some good points, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen a comment begrudging a walk by Alex or anyone else.
The Alex hate runs deep, but I think even his biggest detractors would cheer a walk over a strikeout.
What Joe G does is no different than what Joe T did. We forever heard from Joe T how that pitcher was so great etc etc. Only difference Joe G won’t throw Alex under the bus, if he thought that steal was a bad idea. Joe T on the other hand would have thrown Alex under saying it was a bad move.
per Kemp. Do not like the strikeouts.
personally, i don’t buy the, “strikeouts = harmeless” argument. Strikeouts are rally killers (unproductive outs).
Its not about replacing Cano (if they trade him) with a comparable second baseman.
Its about improving the TEAM. If you can do that by trading Cano to upgrade a position or two, you do it.
Its not going to be an all star at every position team next year.
If folks think they are just going to spend on every free agent on the market because they had a bad year, you are in for a rude awakening.
The business argument doesn’t wash. The suites are sold out for the next 10 years. The premium seating for 5 years. The prime advertising for 5-7 years, depending on contractual terms.
YES ratings are even UP this year. Meaning, ad rates will rise for next season.
Hank and Hal both worked for their dad when their dad was at his “best”. Blowing people out left and right at the drop of a hat. Making moves that hurt the team in the short term and long term, despite getting the short term press hit when the moves were made.
It got so bad, both guys left the organization for almost 20 years before coming back. They are not their dad.
The most ridiculous stuff written about Hank this year has been he’s, “like his dad”.
The only way he is like his deal (aside from resemblence) is the way he volleys back and forth with the media.
In terms of running the organization? He’s as much a believer in younger, more athletic players with a more flexible payroll, as Hal or Cashman.
They have waited for 3 years to get the amount of salary off the books in order to re-tool the team.
When they do re-tool it, its going to be younger, more athletic, with better balance than we see now.
If they trade Cano and got a 23 year old, 5 tool CF like Matt Kemp for example in return, that’s a huge upgrade. It allows them to replace him at second base with a guy who is more of a blender into a lineup than an all star.
Its all in how you build your team. If you take from one area, you have to add in another.
Nobody here is saying, “trade Cano no matter what”. What some of us are saying is, he’s not an untouchable, and if the team is upgraded more by trading him than by keeping him, its an option that has to be considered.
While we can go back and forth on this until the sun sets, its clear the Yankees feel the same way about the possibility of moving him.
If not, they wouldn’t have spent time investigating that possibility in June and July.
They have said “no” to every team that has inquired about Mark Melancon and Phil Hughes. They have not told teams “no” re: Cano.
That should tell you something.
Yankees need a huge CHANGE wisely.
The stadium has been gorged for a few years now but as late as 2003 there were about 10,000 less per game. I was watching a 1998 game on Yes and I saw an empty upper deck! Never see that now but if this weren’t the final season, tickets would be a lot easier to come by. But just because the stadium is filled now doesn’t guarantee it will be filled years down the road. Especially at the prices they’ll be asking. Highest priced ticket now is around 250$ next year that ticket costs 800 to 2500$. The Mets will also be in the picture because they too have a new stadium. More competition. Yanks need big names and a winning team to keep those premium seats sold. Cheap seats aren’t the issue and they’re all cheap seats right now if you compare them to the new Stadium prices.
Hate to break it to ya… but no one is going to be paying premium prices to see a non playoff team. Attendance fluctuates as a team fails or succeeds. The Yanks are not immune to that fact.
Laura — Your post about people still watching and posting here and not yet giving up is the smartest thing posted here today.
We’re all frustrated. We’re still watching the games and it’s painful to see the team you love play this poorly when on paper it should not be having the problems it’s having.
We’ve been decimated by injuries and we’ve still stayed in the hunt, but the frustrating thing is that if the guys who were healthy were just playing up to their potential, we’d be in first place.
I don’t know what the dynamic is that is causing this. I can’t imagine there is more pressure this season than there was last season when everyone was spouting how they were playing for Torre’s job and legacy and stuff, but this is the hardest Yankee team to watch play since the very early 90’s.
If you’re still watching, you haven’t quit on them even though you may post in here that they are done like I have.
I just don’t see how they are going to catch the Red Sox playing the brand of ball they have been playing for 2 weeks.
Maybe they’ll surprise us still, but I think a lot of us are just trying to get ourselves comfortable with the fact that this team may not come back.
It’s a hard pill to swallow when you’re a fan and you know the owners pay these guys handsomely and we have the highest payroll. I know a lot of that payroll is from mistakes from the past, but we’re still head and shoulders ahead of every other team money wise in what these guys get paid.
stuart…wow, your A-Rod hate is pretty thick. Did A-Rod have sex with your wife or something?
A-Rod does have some areas where he could improve, but again, A-Rod is about 99 on the list of the top 100 reasons the Yankees are having a poor season.
But keep spewing your vitriol just because you don’t like him for some reason.
Sometimes I think if A-Rod won the MVP, Division Series MVP, LCS MVP, and WS MVP some of you would still say he didn’t do enough because he didn’t pitch in any games.
It is going to be strange seeing how these guys play when we are officially out of it.
Does Girardi rest the veterans? Does he shut down Andy and MO? Do we bring up guys like Melancon and A-Jax to give them experience? Do we play spring training type games with the extended roster and let some of the young pitchers and BP arms pitch in games with no regard for results?
Dunn to D Backs
“This is why I don’t think ARod’s struggles with RISP are one of the team’s biggest problems. Ask yourself, if ARod comes up with a man on second or third and walks, do you feel confident that Giambi and the rest of the lineup can drive the runners in? I don’t.”
We’ve been watching this scenario play out all season long and those men are almost always left stranded on base. What week was it where in each game, we had left the bases loaded at least once? You’re not going to win games that way.
Kay is ripping the players who didn’t attend Murcer’s memorial on his show.
Meintkewitcz the Mets killer.. WOW, Freddy I understand Minky ?
Kay is ripping the players who didn’t attend Murcer’s memorial on his show.
How is this moron on radio. Who did he say
BP by committee at Shea
Hate to say it but the Yanks need C.C. && if they dont get C.C. then they need Tex.
They should also pick up Rocco Baldelli for CF with Gardner/Cabrera as his backup incase he gets hurt.
Obviously drop Giamibi, but also keep Abreu as DH.
Move Nady to RF and have Matsui & Baldelli as an outfield.
If you dont sign Tex, you can have a platoon of Posada & someone else (betemit) at 1B, which still gives you offence and defence with Molina or Pudge as catcher.
If you get C.C. & Pettite doesnt retire then have Hughes in the BP and incase of injury.
Try to get Ohman, and Fuentes, but dont brake the bank for either.
My Dreamm (REALISTICALLY!!)
P Sabathia
P Wang
P Chamberlain
P Moose
P Pettite / Hughes
1B Posada / Betemit
2B Cano
3B A-Rod
SS Jeter
LF Matsui
RF Nady
CF Baldelli
C Pudge / Molina (depending if yankees sign Pudge)
DH Abreu (we all saw how he raked as a DH)
Bench
OF Cabrera/ Garnder or both (Matsui & Baldelli are injury prone)
C Molina
IF Betemit
BP
Rivera
Bruney
Marte
Ramirez
Veras
Robertson
(Hughes, if Pettite comes back)
Ohman/Funetes (if the yankees choose to sign eithier)
“It’s a hard pill to swallow when you’re a fan and you know the owners pay these guys handsomely and we have the highest payroll. I know a lot of that payroll is from mistakes from the past, but we’re still head and shoulders ahead of every other team money wise in what these guys get paid.”
True, but the money aspect doesn’t bother me as much as the unfulfilment of talent does. These guys could be making $65K a year and if they possessed the talent that I think they do and underperformed like they have been all season, it would be just as bad.
Fans from other teams always like to throw the money in my face (mainly out of jealousy), but I always tell them that lousy play sucks regardless of how much you make. Would we be less upset if instead of $220mil, the payroll was $100mil? I wouldn’t.
Only Pettitte and Jeter attended Murcer’s memorial.
Dunn for 3 prospects
Not going to the playoffs this year (if that happens) won’t have any effect on attendance. None.
The place is already sold out for most of 2009. All of the premium seating is set for years.
In other words, the Yankees will have the money. If folks don’t want to show up, it won’t change a thing.
If they miss the playoffs this year, it doesn’t mean they are doomed for the future. It means they missed the playoffs this year. That’s it.
They are also 4-13 in their last 17 post-season games.
Its not exactly like they have lit it up in the post-season since Game 3 of the ‘04 ALCS.
I don’t care what team you follow, EVERY team has a point where they need to take a step back and re-tool before going forward.
The Yankees have the unevitable task of having to do this AND having to make the playoffs. That’s just about impossible to do.
Its why, despite the moves they made at the deadline, they didn’t make a single move that negativity impacts next season.
They can’t say it because the fans would go crazy. However, its a transitional year.
Look at their moves. Last off-season, the “big” move was Hawkins. This trade deadline, moves that helped the team as much for next year as this year.
Would they love to win? Sure. Do they wish they were healthier and guys who are healthy put together better years? Sure.
But, that not being the case, they aren’t doing anything to hurt their long range plans.
That makes is a transitional year.
They need CC not Tex.
Trevor I think Pettitte and Jeter were invited. Otherwise the players would have gone.
mel, I’m certain that if ARod finished the season with a .225 average and a .450 OBP with RISP, he would have plenty of detractors here. I mean, how many Yankee fans even know the guy has about a .400 OBP with RISP? Probably far fewer than the number who know he has about a .225 average.
Laura, you’re right, which is probably the biggest reason the team is so hard to watch. The Yankees are just a bad team with RISP.
“They should also pick up Rocco Baldelli for CF with Gardner/Cabrera as his backup incase he gets hurt.”
Okay, you do know that Baldelli has a debilitating illness that saps his energy, right? You think a weak Baldelli is better than a healthy Melky/Gardner?
These proposed 2009 lineups are pretty hysterical. Everyone, let’s wait for 2008 to officially end before we jump off the ledges, shall we?
SJ, what does the SJ stand for?
You can’t get younger more athletic players unless you have something to trade.
The under 30 FA position players consist of the following:
Mark Teixeira, Felipe Lopez, Cesar Izturis,Dallas McPherson, Adam Dunn, and Rocco Baldelli.
In my opinion our realistic trade chips are Cano,Nady, Cabrera,Joba, Hughes, and many of our talented minor leaguers. We’re not trading Joba. We shouldn’t trade Nady even though a FA at end of 2009. We probably won’t trade Hughes. Melky would be a throw in. Cano would be the logical choice unless you are willing to let go of the Melancons, Jacksons, etc., elites of the minor league system.
I really don’t see the Yankees seriously interested in a Boras type contract for a 1st baseman-Teixeira. Dunn is a DH-we have enough. Izturis and Lopez are utility players.
Rocco Baldelli would be worth a shot if given an incentive laden contract that he would accept.
SJ44: appreciate the posts, today.
you have been in favor of a cano trade. Does Cano’s personality, play a part in this? He looks to be on cruise-control. As does, jeter. As does, arod. To my disappointment, jeter and arod are immovable. Is a cano trade (in a fair deal) serving the purpose of moving out a ‘laid-back’ player, and bringing in a candidate for 2nd base, who is a pedoria/eckstein type?
Ill take just about anything over Melky.
SJ44,
I agree that the Yanks should listen to offers for Cano. But I want nothing to do with anyone who the Yanks are going to depend on that not only strikes out 1 out of every 4 at bats, he strikes out 4 times for each time he walks. One can already hear the howling that would go on with Yankee fans if their new centerfielder stuck out once a game and only walked twice a week.
Also, Kemp turns be 24, not 23 in October. Kemp is a terrific talent and should have a fine future. At the plate, he’s no improvement over Cano. Once he’s on base, he’s better than Cano. He’s better than Cano defensively as well. If the Yanks trade Cano they need to get a Kemp type player plus an established pitcher, not a prospect.
I think one reason the Yank’s listened to offers for Cano rather than Phil Hughes is that right now Cano’s trade value is far higher than it is for Hughes. At this point, Cashman is better off holding on to Hughes in hopes that he proves to live up to the hype.
Kemp in CF? I like it! It would be nice to have an actual major league hitter in CF. Cano has proven that his inconsistencies can indeed last an entire year as opposed to his typical first half stinker followed by a torrid 2nd half. Get him outta here while the value is still decent and if you can land an OF of Kemp’s caliber you should pull the trigger.
Who’s at 2nd if Cano Leaves ?
Rocco Baldelli could probably hurt himself getting out of bed he is a huge injury risk and as you can see injured players= no playoffs.
Haven’t read all the posts today, and SJ44, I enjoy your comments, but yesterday you were saying to talk about next season at a later time .
Today, with the comments I’ve read, it seems that this last series with the Angels has most of us Yankee fans already resigned to the 2009 season and what will make us better, while getting rid of the “dead wood”
I’m one of those, because if the Yankees pull it out this year, it will give me something to “shout about” like I did last night when the American swimmers took on the French challenge and beat them in the most exciting last lap comeback I’ve ever seen.
Vinny,
I am not bothered by his attitude. He’s not a bad kid. I just don’t think you win with guys like that on the team. I don’t.
I have always felt his greatest attribute to this team would be in trade.
I loved Jim Kaat as an analyst. I thought he was terrific. However, the worst thing he ever said was comparing Cano to Rod Carew. That not only placed unfair expectations on him, its given fans a belief he’s better than he actually is as a player.
You look at Dustin Pedroia. Robbie Cano has more talent in his little finger than Pedroia has in his entire body.
Guess what? Pedroia is a better baseball player than Robbie Cano. In fact, its not even close. That’s said to say for player with Cano’s ability.
I’m more inclined to like guys who are gamers than guys who aren’t. Guys like Arod and Jeter, while enormously talented, are gamers.
Andy Pettitte is a gamer. Posada, Mussina, Damon, all gamers.
Robbie Cano is not. He’s a kid getting by on his talent and that’s it. Now, its not enough. Especially since, his talent has leveled off.
Guys on the team talk to him about this. Yet, it doesn’t seem to penetrate.
If you are the Yankees, you only have two choices at this point. You either trade him, or put him in the #3 or #5 spot in the order next year, increase his responsibility within the team, and hope that does the trick.
I’m not against the latter option. I think though, the former option is a better option if the right deal is ever on the table.
My point with thinking twice as to trading Cano isn’t wanting to have an all-star at every position. It’s about Cano giving us the luxury of having a rock at that position for years to come. You trade him and, yes, you can absolutely make due with a Mark Ellis-type at second, especially with a hypothetical Matt Kemp roaming centerfield. You’re also losing a hell of a lot of security at that position.
Again, I’m up for whatever helps the organization, but I think there’s more to this.
Looking at the schedules for NYY, Red Sox , Rays, Twins and White Sox The Twins have an easy remaining schedule, and with Liriano back I wouldn’t be surprised that they win the Central.
The White Sox schedule is easier than our two opponents in the East. They could very well be the wild card, while the Beasts in the East are beating up on each other.
We have the worst schedule of all, in terms of road games and poor records against teams like Orioles, KC and Toronto. We have one remaining 3 game series at Seattle over Labor day that I’d bet we could sweep, depending on the pitching matchups.
“The place is already sold out for most of 2009. All of the premium seating is set for years.”
Actually, not really. They Yanks have sold out the $2,500 seats, Alex himself bought 4 of the 122 front row seats. But Lonn Trost’s people are still calling season ticket holders non-stop to try to unload many of the unsold $500-$1500 seats. The only other “premium” seats sold out are the $100-$135 ones on the “Terrace” level.