It’s bad and it could get worse
-
- August
- 20
This is one of those stats that you have to check three times because it doesn’t seem possible. But it’s true. The Yankees have been held to two or fewer runs 40 times this season.
That’s 32 percent of the games they’ve played.
The Yankees have had a lot of injuries. But that goes beyond injuries. The Washington Nationals, who barely have a pulse, have been held to two or fewer runs 47 times.
It’s easy to say, “Fire Kevin Long.” But that’s reactionary and silly. He was the hitting coach last season when the Yankees scored 968 runs, the most in baseball. Long didn’t spend the winter taking stupid pills.
The Yankees gave Long a three-year contract last winter because Joe Torre was begging him to come to Los Angeles. Even the most virulent of Torre haters would have to admit he knows a bit about selecting coaches.
If there were some easy answer, it would be a good story to write. But there’s not. Mix in a few underachievers (Cano, Cabrera, Jeter), the fact that nobody is having a career year (like A-Rod and Posada last season), the injuries and vastly different personality as manager and you have a bad mix.
Unfortunately, it’s only going to get worse. The Yankees are largely a team of well-paid, under-contract players. Once it becomes obvious to even the true believers that they’re not going to the postseason – and that could be by the end of the week – it could get ugly.
Keep in mind that 21 of the remaining 37 games are on the road and 19 are against teams that would be in the playoffs if the season ended today.
Hold on tight.
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on Wednesday, August 20th, 2008 at 12:53 am by Peter Abraham.
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Peter Abraham
stop cheering us up Pete
What a depressing post. Thanks, Pete.
I’m still holding out hope that they go on a bit of a run and play some meaningful games in September. Doesn’t look promising, though.
Blah, blah, blah. I’d rather wake up each day, knowing that my favorite baseball team has a chance to win because anything can happen. The day might end with another painful, avoidable loss but there’s still hope for the next day.
Even if (when) we don’t make the postseason, it’s not the end of the world. The Yankees need to get that monkey off their back.
And, please, please, Pete. Stop being a fatalist. Just stick to the facts, painful as they are!
Uglier than this?
So they’ve used up all their 2-runs-or-less games and will now score at least 3 per game. Good to know.
Of course it can get worse. Joe Girardi is managing this team.
And Joe Torre is involved in a pennant race. Shocking.
Who plays CF next season? Heck, who plays CF this season? And don’t say Bernie!
Mel:
Please explain how making the playoffs every season is a monkey a team needs to get off its back. As far as I know, that’s a good thing.
I’m all for being positive, but be realistic.
“And Joe Torre is involved in a pennant race. Shocking.”
In the weakest division in baseball, and with a team with a worse record than the Yankees. Joe G is not the problem with this team.
E-man,
Please. Leave it at the door. Unfortunately, someone has to win that division. Don’t even. I can’t believe that you…
FIRE KEVIN LONG!!!
lol
Just joking…pete is right..it doesn’t look good!!!
I keep hearing people including pete say that Kevin Long was the hitting coach last year when the team scored 968 runs..but the bottom line was/is that Joe Torre was the manager last year…Joe Girardi is the manager this year!
Timmy Lupus thank you… the sooner you brain dead fans who come on here relize its time to stop blaming Girardi we will all be better…. Why does Arod not get knocked by the media for? Here is a great Major Leaguer who cant carry a team let alone drive in a runner from 3B with less then 2 outs. Who else thinks that money should of been spent elsewhere? Remember in the offseason when Cashman said they didnt think they would be able to score enough without Alex…. hmmmmmm think again…
Um, the Dodgers are one game behind the Yankees in terms of record depending on how they do tonight.
And please don’t tell me you all wouldn’t take 82-80 if that got you into the playoffs.
It’s pretty amusing that people chased Torre out of town and now they’re ripping him for not having a good enough record while his team is tied for first.
I don’t even know what to say. I suppose that drowning myself in Brooklyn Lager is a legitimate option.
FIRE KEVIN LONG !
(not joking)
“In the weakest division in baseball, and with a team with a worse record than the Yankees. Joe G is not the problem with this team.”
He is still involved in a pennant race. The division or record is meaningless.
I thought anyone could take these Yankee teams to the postseason?
Obviously not.
Joe G is not the sole problem but he is apart of the problem with this team.
I’m afraid the Yanks are probably two years away from being a powrehouse again. Next year, I have faith the pitching will pull through and a rotation of Wang, Hughes, Joba, Mussina, (fill in the blank) will be lights out. But this offense of aging stars has to be revamped.
Is it realistic to think Jorge will be a viable option behind the plate again? If not, where do they put him? First base? Matsui will be the DH. Damon in left. Those two contracts have a year left and I would doubt anyone would want to pick up Matsui knowing he is needing knee surgery. If Damon is gone, who leads off?
A center fielder would be nice, preferably one not in their 30s who can hit.
Does Abreu come back?
Two years from now where is Jeter?
This team looks like it is turning into the East Coast version of the Giants.
Mel,
If they don’t make the playoffs this year, the pressure is only greater for next year, isn’t it?
I’m watching Yankee replay. I just saw Damon’s 8th inning fielding mistake. Painful to see again.
Pete,
How do you think the Jets will do this year?
The lack of offense is somewhat of a blessing in disguise. It illustrates that the offense needs a major overhaul.
That starts with letting Abreu and Giambi walk.
I’d trade Cano in a package deal that involves Matt Kemp. He could be a great young player for this team for years to come.
If they do sign Sabathia, they can use some of the young arms on the farm to find another bat.
Missing the postseason wouldn’t be the worst thing in the world. Teams have to take a step back once in awhile and take a breather.
The Yanks haven’t done that since 1993 because their own success has become their worst enemy the last few years.
A demanding fan base has forced this team to patch holes with spackle rather than tear down the entire wall and replace it.
The Yanks need to get a young threat in their line-up. I still think Cano will be that soon, but they need another. Now I’m not one of these people who say WELL VERAS FOR BRAUN SEEMS RIGHT…. here is something I would look into if im the Yankees…..
2 players I think would fit the Yankees nicely are Matt Holliday and Coner Jackson…
I’m sure Phil Hughes would have to be dealt to get Holliday and honestly I would pull that trigger IF AND ONLY IF THE YANKEES LAND CC SABATHIA…
I THINK ITS A MUST and I THINK IT WILL happen this off-season. Watch the yankees will get a MLB PROVEN YOUNG BAT
Forget to get to my point-
the point being, the pitching will improve, however this anemic offense won’t. There are two positions that may see improvement next year- center field (if they can pull off a trade and find someone to play center) and catcher (if Posada is healthy). I don’t see any options out there that point to huge improvements offensively in left field and at first base- but I could be wrong, wouldn’t be the first time.
LMAO can we stop with the Kemp for Cano deals lol its really stupid… I’m not doubting that Kemp is good, but really I’d take Cano’s future over Kemps any day and NO im not a palm reader…
Pete,
I’m glad you asked. Now I’m just an amateur psychologist, but I think this team is under a lot of pressure to win. From the Boss being near the end of his fantastic journey, from themselves, from the fans. And it really ratcheted up after 2004.
I think if they miss the postseason and heads don’t roll, then they can relax again and not worry about the postseason streak.
The RISP thing is evidence of the team pressuring out. How difficult is it to get a productive out? And even the worst teams run into a hit with RISP once in while. It’s really bad this season, but it’s nothing new. They’ve struggled with it for a while now. It’s just compounded this year by all the things you mention in your post.
I really wanted the fairy tale ending at the Yankee Stadium because it would be just perfect.
But I’m all for new beginnings as well. And, yes, as counterintuitive as it may seem, it might be a good thing. Even spoiled millionaires need to be reminded that wanting something and getting it are two different things.
-
Unfortunately, it’s only going to get worse. The Yankees are largely a team of well-paid, under-contract players. Once it becomes obvious to even the true believers that they’re not going to the postseasonand that could be by the end of the week – it could get ugly.—Are you trying to say that once it’s plainly obvious they’re not going to the postseason, some of the players will pack it in and give a half-effort?
If so, I don’t think that’s the case. Some of these players are at the end of their careers and playing for a contract. Even the ones that are signed are smart enough to know that they will still be playing in the spotlight. The Yankees missing the postseason, in the final season at the stadium no less, will put this team under greater scrutiny than ever before. They’ll want to save face.
Girardi has most of a season behind him and he is coming close to succeeding in disproving the saying that ‘any manager can win with a two hundred million dollar team’. It looks to me like he needs to improve in a number of areas, like for example:
1. Who plays. he has too often rested hot players to play cold ones, even in situations where there were off days coming up and no particular signs of fatigue. He seems to decide on a stat-head basis (like, ‘he’s played X number of games in a row so he has to take off now no matter how good he feels and how hot he’s playing’), instead of realizing that real people have high and low energy periods that are not so predictable on a mathematical basis. A good statistical manager will rest people on a schedule he has in his head. A good people manager will rest them when they need it and let them play out their hot streaks when they’re feeling good.
2. Batting order. he seems to take into consideration practically nothing more than the simple alternation of lefties and righties.
3. No clear idea about when to bunt and when not to bunt.
4. Afraid (or doesn’t know how) to use the hit-and-run.
5. Won’t sit regulars for bad play or lack of hustle (like Cabrera and Cano, who might have picked up their play if he’d sat them down early on for slacking—see Cano’s improvement after an example was finally made of Cabrera).
6. In an area of relative strength, he still misused certain pitchers even when he had a rich bullpen—examples are Albaladejo, Ohlendorf and Marte (who he pitched for two innings twice in one week, with other relievers available, when the guy hadn’t pitched more than one inning for two years, then couldn’t seem to figure out why he was ‘disappointing’).
7. Seems not to know how to ‘gather up’ a bunch of giant egos into one big joint effort—a key leadership skill.
I was in favor of hiring Girardi as Torre’s replacement and I still think he’s smart, hardworking and ambitious. The question is whether he can be flexible enough to recognize and learn from his mistakes.
If he can, then even if this season is lost NYY may be back in the playoffs next year. If not, the ‘Girardi era’ may be a short one. I’m hoping for the best.
We need a Roberto Kelly for Paul O’Neill type trade.
A good solid player in his prime, who’s patient at the plate.
Pete, I’m ready to jump but before I go can you do me a favor?
I’m tying a rope around my waist. Can you fasten the other end to Brian Cashman’s ankle?
If I’m going to take the plunge, I’d like him to join me.
It will be interesting to see how this team plays when the lead gets insurmountable (i.e 13 back in the division, 11 in the WC) or when we get officially eliminated.
Will they play even more lifeless than they are now? Will Girardi just rest the stars and let guys like Gardner, Christian, Ransom, etc. play? Will they just have that somber mood in the clubhouse and every game will be like a funeral? This is new territory for these guys.
The worst part is that in a couple of weeks we have that makeup game against Detroit then have to travel to Tampa-Seattle and LA. For an aging team that is basically eliminated, that is going to be brutal.
I’m not ripping Torre, Pete. Simply pointing out that he’s not doing a whole lot better in LA. E-Man wants to rip Girardi for the Yankee troubles. If you put this season on Girardi, Torre is just as accountable for the Dodger mediocrity. The fact that “80 or 82 wins” gets you into the play offs in that division says it all. The NL west is an absolute joke.
Only thing I will knock Girardi on is he doesnt stand up to the Veterans enough.. He should bench a player if they dont do something right… I know its New York and the media would be all over him, but the hell with it…
...Consume my heart away; sick with desire
And fastened to a dying animal
It knows not what it is; and gather me
Into the artifice of eternity…
For all the Girardi bashing, let’s face it, he’s a fairly inexperienced manager. Young players improve, maybe he learns and improves.
hughes has lost all his value. we’ll be lucky to get huston street for him.
though i do think he should be shopped this offseason.
Lets not be realistic here peeps..it ain’t looking good this year!
But
We all know that the yankees and baby george are going to be ready to offer 6yr 140mil to CC..as soon as the last pitch of the world series is made at the trop in tampa(lol i guess)
So IMO the yankees look good to make a run next year..but you have to look at this season with a grain of salt because of the injuires and lack of production..also people seem to forget that this is only Joe Girardi’s 2nd season as a big league manager!
Hey, if they’re two years away from being a powerhouse, I’m all for them stinking it up this year and next. As long as the talent develops and we have another team that is even half as good as late-90’s, I’ll be satisfied. I guess I don’t sound like a normal Yankees fan, but I really don’t mind trading two awful years for a couple of great ones. The past five or so years have been weird. They have had success, but it never felt like a so-called “powerhouse.” It was almost like watching a team who either didn’t have fantastic potential reach the cusp and drop off OR be on the side of it: having a team with huge talent and watching them underperform.
If I have learned anything in my short time of Yankees fandom (since ‘04, a great year to get into it… oMg! bandwagon!1!!11), it has been different from what someone may have known if they were fans for a lot longer. You have to be patient. I have never seen the Yankees play in the WS as a die-hard fan. I have never known what it is like to have that huge load lifted off your shoulders and just be able to celebrate success. All I have known is pressure and criticism. And it has made me realize that we have what fans of other teams dream of. Yet it is never enough. So you just have to sit back, relax, and enjoy the ride, no matter where it takes you and no matter what kind of bumps you have along the way. Deal with it, kids.
Nady, Marte, and Pudge must feel right at home with all thestroisanet@yahoo.com losing.
And why did the Bengals re-sign Chris Henry?
LMAO can we stop with the Kemp for Cano deals lol its really stupid… I’m not doubting that Kemp is good, but really I’d take Cano’s future over Kemps any day and NO im not a palm reader…
You can’t be serious. Kemp’s upside is far greater than Cano’s upside. In fact, it’s not even close. Kemp is five-tool guy who is a month away from his 24th birthday.
Cano needs a personal trainer to stay focused every day and you think he is going to be a better player than Kemp?
Puh-leez.
Innocent until proven guilty! , Dr.J
Sometimes it has to get real ugly before it gets better. I guess we’ll find out if that’s the case.
I had some worries about the offense before the season, but never in a million years did I think it would be this bad.
I’m at the point I just want it to be over with this season. It’s become unbearable to watch.
RayBlay,
It could be worse. Sherrill is on the DL. Wagner out indefinitely. But get this one. Cardinal save leader Isringhausen left the team. He told a writer, “It’s over”. Career threating injury in his arm.
We have most of our guys intact. Some will be leaving, whether they want to or not. We have an improved farm system and lots of money to spend. If people can’t accept that this year and next are transition years, they’ll be sorely disappointed.
Injuries and Tampa being so good are a large part of why the seasons over in August (think about that) but they shouldn’t have been this lousy and Ineffectual. Someone has to answer for that and every time the past few season looked like it was about to fall apart it didn’t. We all know why. Torre. Cashman lost confidence In Torre because he wouldn’t play Melkey the great over Bernie. Joe Torre is going to make the Playoffs again. Cashman didn’t like that Farnsworth like all other lousy relievers Cashman got stunk. This Year with all those talented arms in the minors it was wise to block a spot on the team with an all time stiff like Hawkins because he hoped to get a supplemental pick for him in the off season (a move fully endorsed by those morons at No Maas). Melkey and Ian K. for Santana and he said no. Time o say good bye to Cashman and Good Luck in the Play Offs Mr. Torre.
That post is like yelling fire in a crowded theater. It serves no purpose other than to incite the panicked among us.
Maybe I have an unfounded faith in the players on this team, but I don’t believe they will mail in the balance of the season if they are eliminated because of guaranteed contracts.
If you feel they are just going through the motions, I hope you would ask the players and Girardi and Cashman about it rather than just speculating here about it. Speculation is for those without access, you have the ability to ask the questions of the people who can give the answers.
Um, for the genius bashing Torre and the state of the NL West: Did you take it when Torre won a division at 87-74 in 2000 with the Yankees, 4 games worse than the AL wild card team, 7 games worse than any NL playoff team? That is such BS, it’s a weak division. Guess you will give back the 2000 world title because the Yankees only won 87 games.
Torre would have this team at least closer than Girardi, a guy who couldn’t last more than one year with Florida.
2 things:
1. Call me crazy if you want or get mad at me(i completely understand) but it makes NO since to me how a true fan can say it has become “unbearable to watch”..i don’t care how bad it seems to be or is…there is no way that i could stop watching my team just because they aren’t any good!
2. This Matt Kemp stuff has got to stop…he is a right handed Robinson Cano, hitting wise! The same people that dislike Cano because of his work ethic are going to dislike Kemp for the exact same reason!
lmao Girardi also wouldnt of brought in Jeff Weaver in a World Series game. HE also would of stole againts Tim Wakefield in the 2004 playoff’s. He also would of layed down a bunt agiants Schilling. He probly wouldnt of batted Arod 8th in an elimination game lol.. He probly wouldnt of pitched Kevin Brown agiants the Sox either when Orlando Hernandez dominated them… hmmmm is their more?
How is being HONEST about the job Torre is doing “bashing” him? Did I say Torre is a terrible manager, and that he is a joke? I simply stated the fact that he is not doing any better in LA than Girardi is doing in NY. You do not know for a fact that Torre would have this team any closer this year. I have nothing but respect, and love for Joe Torre, and what he did in NY. Buy trying to make him seem infallible to put down Girardi is pointless.
Joey’s Poodle.
Great post. Does anyone think that a 4th place finish, or worse, could force the FO’s hand to let Giradi walk?
I too was excited about him coming in to manage the team, but some very savy analysts (now more so in retrospect) said he was not the right manager for a veteran team. Since as Pete pointed out, many of the key players on this team aren’t going anywhere, where does that leave Girardi?
THE Yankees are absolutely unbearable to watch. The stupid errors/mistakes that only losing teams make, the fact that even fundamental baseball comes across as a challenge. The idea that winning one game will make absolutely no difference, yet people suddenly think it will help. I can’t help but change the channel when I’m watching them. I am never shocked when all kinds of disaster strike, but my subsconscience is always one step ahead and my finger’s always on that button. It’s at the point where yes, I do enjoy watching baseball. But only if the Yankees are doing well or doing badly because they are not able to measure up to a higher-quality team. If they play like absolute losers, I just don’t have the patience. As much as I love them, and as much as they take up hours and hours of my day.
Can I still get an answer here… Who here wish the Yanks didnt sign Arod?
also that question does not have any meaning to it. So dont say DONT BLAME IT ON AROD… I’m not i’m only asking…
That LA team has ALOT LESS talent on it than this NY team. The fact that he’s above .500 is amazing.
Just think what he could do with a team like ours?
oh yeah…
Torre touched the Dodgers with his Mojo that’s why they are within one game of the division. Forget about the fact that the team that is leading the division is only 5 games above .500. lol.. What will be the excuse then if he doesn’t make the playoffs this year torre supporters?
It was a joke how the Yankees handled Torre.
It’s scary how much better the Jays would be than the Yankees if they could add 100m to their payroll.
everybody root for the d’backs.
A joke do people not know that the Yankees made JOE TORRE? Who was he before the Yankees… One of the worst managers in Baseball…
Italiano,
Will not answer that because Alex is a Yankee, but there were a lot of people who weren’t sad that A-rod opted out.
It was dismaying to see Alex re-signed, not because I don’t want him or appreciate him. But nobody was bidding for his services. We got played.
Cashman had it right when he said that ship has sailed. He was sticking to his word that if Alex opted out, that was it.
But whatever, they had to pay him at least $27M. It’s just the years. Think the first 4 years were tough? Let’s tack on another 10.
I guess I didn’t care either way, but I do appreciate what he does on the field.
Our lineup seems to have gotten old overnight. Cashman was worried about the offense before the season even started. How is that on the manager? The Dodgers won 82 games last year. That was with the Diamond backs, and Rockies both winning over 90 games. This year they’ll probably finish with around 82 wins. That will be with no one in that division winning 90 games unless a miracle happens. Yep the manager makes all the difference. Stop blaming the manager, and start pointing the finger where it belongs at the guys on the field.
mel,
I’m glad you went back and saw my comment about the Lewis article. I just assumed you wouldn’t see it, and I don’t know how to just copy a post into another thread (can you do that?). I guess I’m not the only one who likes to go back and peruse the comments (esp. to read the “good poster” comments). Anyway, I do look forward to your posts. I think we’re both close in age, married with kids, and long-time die-hard fans, who just happen to live on opposite sides of the country! I get what you’re trying to say about the “monkey on your back” as far as the Yanks making the playoffs every year. Maybe Pete doesn’t get it because he’s not a true Yankee fan (I mean that in a good way Pete). I don’t know how much more frustrating it can get this year, but I know I’ll be back at it tomorrow, like I am every other day of the year following this team!
Timmy Lupus
Your right again….
Look at the numbers folks, The 2008 Yankee Offense doesn’t come close to the traditional offenses we had in terms of production that can be due to injuries but we will see.
I thought getting bounced in the first round 3 years in a row was the monkey on our back. Little did I realize it was making the postseason. This is going to be a relief, then.
Let’s see
Billingsly, Kershaw, Lowe, Kudora, Maddux >>>> Mussina, Pettitte, Ponson, Rasner, Pavano/Hughes
Looney > Giambi
Kent > Cano
Frucal (when healthy) > Jeter
Blake Pudge/Posada/Molina
Kemp > Any of our OF’ers
Manny > Any of our OF’ers
Ethier = Nady
Broxton, Wade, Beilmel, Tronsoco, Park, Kuo > MO, Veras, Marte, Edwar, Robertson, Bruney
Where did anyone get the idea that we have better talent than the Dodgers? It’s all names, folks. Guys living off their reputations. Dodgers have REAL young talent not the overhyped variety that we have. Torre inherited a great young team.
*Arod > Blake and Martin better than any of our caychers
I reaspect your opinion, RayBlay…but..i disagree with you 100%
I feel like that is one thing that seprates true fans from regular fans, if someone is just watching a team when they are doing good and can’t stay with that team when they are doing bad(or horrible in the 2008 yankees case) that is called a “fairweather” fan. If the yankees are getting killed by 20 runs i can still watch it, that doesn’t mean that i’m happy about it or pleased or content! But i can still watch it because of my love for the team and the game!
That’s what being a true fan is all about!
today is my birthday and i cant believe these yankees
every other birthday of my 19 years always was a success
i prayed and wished for a birth into the playoffs but i guess it aint happening
love ya yankees but all empires come to an end
say good bye to the empire
If you swapped places, the Yankees roster would probably win a few more games than the Dodgers in the NL west. The Dodgers roster would probably lose a few more games if they played in the AL.
Regardless of talent and regardless of who’s managing. That’s because the NL is an inferior league.
If you swapped rosters, the LA Yankees would do even worse.
None of our players can bunt and the pitchers break their feet when they run the bases.
Theresa,
Thanks, again!
If you want to copy the link of a LoHud post, right click on the date/time stamp. Choose ‘copy shortcut’ and paste into a new post.
You can also use the blockquote tag, but most of us are lazy and just cut and paste text along with quotation marks.
Hey ITALIANO!!!!!—- I’ll stand up and be counted on your a-rod question. At the time a-rod was a free agent, I wrote, in another Yankee blog, that I didn’t think it really mattered one way or the other if a-rod returned to the Yankees. I don’t like him, I don’t think he is a ‘winning’ ballplayer. He sure can compile stats, his talent is undeniable, but in truly crucial moments he has terrible at-bats. If he was the great ballplayer many say he is, right now he would be carrying this ballclub on his back to the playoffs. Reggie would. Thurman would. The Mick would. Donnie Baseball would. Bernie would. Paulie would, too. a-rod doesn’t, never has, and frankly I believe he can’t & never will. I refer to him as: “a-rod- that’s little ‘a’, little ‘b’- he doesn’t deserve caps in his name”. That said, he isn’t alone this year as the reason for why the Yankees are in the predicament they are in, but the others aren’t being paid to be the best ballplayer in the world. He is.
“Joey’s Poodle” made an excellent posting at 1:21am about Girardi. I agree with every point. Girardi needs more “seasoning” before we can call him an excellent manager. But I think he CAN be an excellent manager. That said, if his team hits the way it ought to, those problems are no problems at all.
—SteveB
man am I glad to be in vegas. You guys are nuts. I wrote this on my iPhone while using the facilities. Back to the tables!!!
Nick,
I don’t think you know the rules here. You’re not allowed to contradict what I say. You’ve done it twice in this post. You’ve been warned.
I really think HANK’S signing of Arod had more to do with the Yanks making money off of him on and off the field then actually bringing him back because they want to win a championship with him. If it wasn’t to make money off his home runs then it would of been a 6 or 7 year deal. A 10 year deal for a 33 year old doesn’t make any sense unless of course you want to guarantee if he breaks the home run record it is with this team and not after his deal ended…and he is on a new team.
I am not an Arod fan. I feel you can appreciate him better when you just read his numbers and do not have to watch him play everyday. I don’t think this team can win with him batting 4th, being the big dog and expecting him to ever carry the team to a championship..because it won’t happen.
I will not risk a third transgression.
“That LA team has ALOT LESS talent on it than this NY team. The fact that he’s above .500 is amazing.”
NL West Standings as of 8/20/07
ARI 71-55
SD 66-57
LAD 64-60
COL 63-61
SF 55-70
Standings as of 8/20/08
ARI 65-60
LAD 64-61
COL 58-69
SF 53-72
SD 48-77
I guess Grady Little was also a miracle worker since at this time last year the Dodgers actually had a slightly better record when everyone in there division was also playing much better baseball.
The next infraction will cost you a box of Moose Bars.
Bottom line – Yankees front office (with 90% of fans’ approval, probably 98% of people here) treated Torre like dirt, and they are getting what they deserve. I’d guess all the Jeter bashers on this blog couldn’t wait to shove Torre out the door, too. Jeter is trashed for not having stats. A-Rod, Abreu and Giambi all have stats, and they don’t win jack. Second-biggest mistake was re-signing A-Rod. Biggest – giving Torre an “offer” they knew he would turn down.
Go ahead, tell me how he burned out the bullpen. Oh, guys like Rivera, Wetteland, Stanton, Jeff Nelson, Graeme Lloyd etc.? Torre burned out non-talents like Sturtz.
not like it matters because he has no credibility, but i wonder when the next rant from hank is coming.
http://yankees.lhblogs.com/2008/08/20/its-bad-and-it-could-get-worse/#comment-504980
Testing one…two…
Celerino, all the people foaming at the mouth for Torre’s head all over value what a manager does for a team. The Tigers, Indians, and Arizona, and Mariners were all predicted to have great years. They all came into this season with the same managers, and 3 of those teams actually upgraded their rosters. They’ve all tanked. Managers are always a scape goat for when the team under performs.
Irabu, 39, became angered after his credit card was rejected.
AP
Ok I’m done.
As a fan I ask myself 2 questions(you should ask yourself these questions aswell)...the same questions that the Front Office had to ask themselves:
1.Do I/we think this team is better with Joe Girardi as the manager or Joe Torre?
2.Does having Alex Rodriguez on this Yankee team make us better?
If someone was a Yankee for 5 seconds then does something wrong the Media reports it “Former New York Yankee insert name and crime Today”
“I guess Grady Little was also a miracle worker since at this time last year the Dodgers actually had a slightly better record when everyone in there division was also playing much better baseball.”
I guess so and that’s why they kept him.
What was our record this time last year?
or this time the past 12 years?
That’s all on the team, the manager has absolutely nothing to do with anything.
Batting orders mean nothing. putting a guy hitting .200 RISP in 5th and a guy hitting .300 6th is all the players fault.
Taking out all of the lefties against a LHP even when our lefties murder LHP is all our righties fault. They need to step it up. Especially Betemit.
Resting players when they start to get hot or are in the middle of a streak. That’s all the players fault. How dare they get hot when the manager planned to give them that day off.
that’s so right. why did people say torre burned out the pen, when clearly all he did was burn out marginal bullpen guys. sure, he may have relied a little too much on mo getting more than one inning saves, but that’s far from burning him out. burning out scott proctor? who cares, that’s what scott proctor was made for. sort of like britton was made for flying on regional jets and traber is made to be a a lefty specialist who can’t get lefties out.
OK Lupus I agree but also, saying the NL West is inferior or worthless (or maybe someone else said that, I forget) is why I brought up 2000 Yankees, or 2006 Cardinals or other examples. Maybe these Yankees with the same talent playing the NL west would be even worse than the Dodgers, or 20 games better. it is different pitching matchups against different players.
The bottom line to ME, is, even if he falls short, Torre has a team in the hunt. Maybe Girardi one day will be better. It took Torre til hs fourth team to win it all. LaRussa didn’t win anythign with the Chisox, etc.
It was just a shame the way Torre was treated for doing so much here, and all “fans” could point to was no bunting. The Rays don’t bunt, they swing 3-and-0, etc. It’s part of the game peopel got carried away bashing Torre.
“If he was the great ballplayer many say he is, right now he would be carrying this ballclub on his back to the playoffs. Reggie would. Thurman would. The Mick would. Donnie Baseball would. Bernie would. Paulie would, too”
Nice in theory but a little bit of revisionist history.
All of those players had years their teams didn’t make it to the postseason. While they were all great players, their effort alone wasn’t enough. It takes more than 1 guy to get it done.
So many Years the Yankees over performed in a hard to explain unquantifiable way and most people pointed at Jeter because that pretty much was the kind of player he was. This Year they’ve underperformed in a hard to qualify “held to two or fewer runs 40 times this season” kind of way. All the Torre haters don’t want to hear so be decent and at least keep you’re mouth shut. He made the Playoffs every year. He made the Playoffs every year. He made the Playoffs every year.
Oh Yeah he never took one of those horrendous teams that had no chance to win to the playoffs before coming to the Yankees. Thanks got it.
Joe Torre made the Playoffs EVERY YEAR!!!!
E-Man, Girardi has certainly made mistakes just as Torre did when he was here. Just like every other manager does in baseball. I was shocked when he benched Damon in Min. The mistakes he’s made simply do not account for 200+ runs less this team will score. Or the boneheaded plays made in the field. As I said Cashman was worried about this offense before the season started. They are not fundamentally sound. They choke with RISP, can’t bunt, have made some huge base running errors. Guess what, they did the same thing under Joe T in the play offs. Couldn’t hit the good pitching, and just flat out shut down.
Celerino Sanchez, I did say the NL west is weak because it is are weak. Look at the standings I posted, and check the records. Every team in that division has a worse record now than they did last year. The Dodgers record is also about where it was this time last year. Same team, different manager same result. Not a knock against Torre, as I said the Yankees problems or is it Joe’s fault that Dodgers won’t win 120 games.
brovo rayblay! im the same way… so much criticism from other fans of other teams but it feels good to be a fan of dem yanks…frankly no matter what happens basebal is a fascinating sport. i love it and i love new york so there u have it. One of theses days all of the stress of being a passionate Yankee fan will pay off… its just a matter of time
“Not a knock against Torre, as I said the Yankees problems or is it Joe’s fault that Dodgers won’t win 120 games.”
Sorry that should read. Not a knock against Torre, as I said the Yankees problems aren’t all on Girardi or is it Joe Torre’s fault that Dodgers won’t win 120 games.
I think I may need some sleep.
Totally agree with Joey’s Poodle post.
My worry about Girardi is that his mule/donkey personality will not allow him to correct his errors. Not sitting Cano and Cabrera long ago was just bad managing. They’re kids—how are they supposed to learn if you don’t discipline them?
Oh, and the lineup—I personally think Cashman told him last week to KNOCK IT OFF. Too little, too late. The GM should have stepped in long ago—Cashman’s the one who was pushing for “boy genius” Girardi in the first place.
Could Jeter be having a bad year because of the absence of Torre?
Exactly who is that home run conscious fraud at 3rd base ?
The ringless fool that always looks around the ballpark to see who is looking at him.
Jeter is having an off year for Jeter but still will finish at 300. Lets all get excited that this is the last year we have to watch Giambi swing late at high heat. No contact all year w/ runners on. He can grow his back hair and pull it across his face and it wont make a difference. It’s nice he gave himself a nickname, Big G. How about Big Stiff.
Interesting to note…Yanks are 5th in OBS….10th in runs.
Needless to say…we need clutch RBI guys.
Whose out there (Free agents) that could fill that role?
I don’t agree with everything that Joe G has done this season, but I surely don’t blame him for all of our issues. He should have been able to pull the lineup out of a hat before the game everyday and we should have scored more runs. Clearly, something else is going on Hopefully this years offensive collapse is just an anomaly that will right itself next year.
having the 21st century version of Dave Kingman batting 5th hasn’t helped.
I agree that Girardi needs to make examples out of his players who dont hustle, even the veterans. In Tampa, Joe Maddon sat BJ Upton for not running out a ball. There are a lot of instances on this team where players should be sat as punishment. It may hurt for one game, but will help in the long run. As hard as some of these guys work (a-rod), they look lousy on the field.
Baseball players are strange creatures, so “pulling the lineup order out of a hat” would be more than slightly disruptive to their routines.
It’s not that surprising that Girardi’s constant line up changes were on par with the hat method, BTW.
James
August 20th, 2008 at 2:34 am
2.Does having Alex Rodriguez on this Yankee team make us better?
=====================
We never would have made the playoffs this year without him.
What? Oops.
Wang, the hat comment was just a joke…perhaps it didn’t translate well through the PC…I was trying to illustrate that the lineup has not produced and i personally don’t feel its entirely Joe G’s fault.I do agree that players are creatures of habit, but for 200 million, someone needs to get it done 30% of the time, seriously.
I do agree that sometimes it did appear the Hat reared its ugly head in the dugout…
don’t blame it on girardi, no matter what order he puts these guys in they still can’t hit especially when on of their teamates is laying down on one of these white infield pillows.
the constant posts and reminders of how badly the yankees are doing right now is starting to become excessive Pete. we all have eyes to watch the games with, we see what’s happening ourselves. i don’t need you reminding me everyday, several times a day that they stink. i just don’t know why you feel the need to constantly focus on how bad things are, (although i have a very good theory.)
p.s. for the record, i love your blog, have been reading it for quite a while and I will continue to read it. don’t be so quick to shoo me away just because I, (god forbid) disagree with you.
Anybody could see before the season that there were major question marks with this team. Personally, I would’ve tried to trade Matsui before the season. I also hated the Posada resigning. In general, our offense is way too old. There’s no speed, no sparkplug. So what do we do?
1. Need to sign Sabathia and Moose. Pettite? I guess we resign him for a year if he wants to come back, but I believe he’ll retire. That gives us a C.C., Wang, Moose, Joba and hopefully Hughes rotation, with alot of good arms in the minors.
2. Plan as if Posada will not be catching most of the games. Try to get a young catcher that bunts and can possibly hit for avg. Plan on Posada, Matsui and Damon splitting all their time at DH and 1B, with games in the OF and C sprinkled in. No need to sign a 1B this year when we have 3 terrible fielders under contract for next year. Do not resign Giambi(duh).
3. Leave Cano alone for another year, see if he bounces back. Still young, it’s not like he’s Rickie Weeks. Leave Jeter and Arod where they are, but make sure to have a young utility IF who can friggin run and field dependably! At some point in the next couple of years, Jeter will need to be moved to 2B, OF or 1B(more likely OF), so plan on looking for a long-term solution at SS.
4. Sign a young veteran OF(or trade for one with minor leaguers) who can start in either RF or LF, leaving Nady with the other spot. Platoon Gardner and Cabrera, but give Gardner a chance to win the job in CF. Do not sign Abreau. Let’s hope Austin Jackson can play at some point in 2009.
5. I kind of like the way the bullpen is shaping up with some of their young pitchers, but jeez don’t leave your best arms in the minors even if they are starters. Use them as relievers in the big-time. Karstens should’ve been a long-reliever all year, if you ask me(and if you asked me in May, I said this).
6. Mo is fine.
7. Cashman knows his talent, resign. Girardi will need a veteran coach with him next year though.
In closing, this team, I think, is still a year away from contending again, but there are little things that can be done in the meantime. After 2009, you adjust some more with Damon and Matsui not taking up space. Then you sign a good 1B. If you can’t get good bats, by all means, at least look at the defense and running ability of your team.