Today in The Journal News
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Aug 23, 2008 
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Bobby Abreu made it a memorable night for some kids who look up to him as the Yankees beat the Orioles.
Carl Pavano is back and says he’s ready to pitch. This notebook also has updates on Joba Chamberlain, Derek Jeter and Dan Giese.
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It’s no secret why Robinson Cano is having a poor season. He gets lazy unless somebody gets after him. Sure it’s wrong, but that is how he is. He’s a talented athlete who has not figured out the mental side of the game.
I’ve written on the blog several times how much the Yankees (and specifically Cano) miss the presence of Larry Bowa. Jack Curry of the Times was in Philadelphia to see the Dodgers and spoke to Bowa for the Bats blog. It’s required reading.
I don’t know who (Paul O’Neill? Willie Randolph? Dave Miley?) but the Yankees need to add a coach to the staff next season who would be willing to drop some tough love on Cano and others who dog it from time to time.
Whether Joe Girardi feels that way isn’t certain. But I can tell you that others in the clubhouse do.
paul oneil as a coach would be fantastic for this team
I hope that Cano’s not even here next year. I don’t care how much talent he has, since the baseball landscape is littered with lazy players who took their talent for granted and were huge disappontments.
I would rather that Cano is traded alone or in a package for a big hitter{Holliday?) or a top of the rotation starter, and then sign a top defensive, hustling player like Orlando Hudson who gets the bat on the ball. They need more players like that
Will they unretire #21 for Paulie?
Pete, I think you need to do a Springsteen v. McCartney blog poll.
So what are we going to do about that Ransom guy? Can he play 1B?
Good luck to Waipio in the US Championship game tomorrow on ABC!
Cano is 2 good 2 let go. U just have 2 hope he gets his head straight
If Randolph doesn’t get a manager’s job next season, I can see him either as the bench coach or 3rd base coach. The Yankee Brass will make changes both in player personnel and coaching staff whether Girardi likes it or not. Somebody is going to pay for this failed season.
Hopefully you’re right, this roster needs some shaking up.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again.
If it takes such special treatment or a personal trainer like Larry Bowa to keep Cano focused, the Yanks should solve that problem by trading him to the Dodgers in a package deal for Matt Kemp.
Kemp is younger, has far more power and speed, and overall more upside than Cano ever will.
Make the deal, Cash.
A Kemp/Damon/Nady outfield next season ain’t too shabby and Kemp could move over to LF/RF when Damon walks at the end of 2009.
They could have two very young five-tool kids with huge upside patrolling the outfield in 2010 when Austin Jackson is ready for prime time.
I absolutely love Bowa, he is the last guy left that has an absolute baseball mind. You could ask Bowa if he’s seen ‘The Dark Knight’ and he’d look at you like you had 6-heads, the guy only knows about baseball. I do miss him, but if Cano will only be motivated by somebody then what is Cano? We’d benefit from having a Larry Bowa like anyone else could, but I don’t see Larry Bowa working for Joe Girardi.
Go to wfan.com and listen to the Bowa interview with Joe and Evan from today about Kemp.
The Dodgers love Kemp. Mattingly has him working out on a new hitting program with him. Doesn’t sound like they would be willing to part with him that easy. Based on what Bowa said, if you’d like Andreu Jones, that sounds like it could be arranged
The Bowa interview on wfan.com also has stuff about Cano, instant replay, Manny and where the 2008 Yankees would be if Torre was still managing the team.
I know that ADD is diagnosed for people all the time that do not have it, but I really wonder if Cano suffers from it. If I were the Yankees I would check into it. It seems that there are times when he just spaces out a bit and lacks focus.
kinda like soriano, did?
“I do miss him, but if Cano will only be motivated by somebody then what is Cano?”
That’s a pretty simple question – he’s a talented guy who apparently needs a foot to the rear to perform at his best. It isn’t like this is unique in sports.
It isn’t like a 3B coach has things that he should be doing that are sacrificed by staying on Cano. If anything it would help team chemistry by demonstrating that Cano doesn’t get off easy if he doesn’t bust his tail.
I would have thought that Girardi had this ability to hold his players accountable, but he has not shown anything (at least publicly) that proves he can do what Joe Madden or Charlie Manual have done and discipline players – and in the Phllies case a STAR player – by publicly benching him but handling it in a professional way.
It looks to me like we would be bringing back Bowa to cover this hole in Girardi’s skills as much as Cano’s.
Hair Dresser, you’re a fool. Kemp has the same issues that you claim that cano has. The only 2 things that Kemp has on Cano is base stealing speed and the ability to strike out in huge numbers. That means that he doesn’t doesn’t put the bat on the ball. He also doesn’t walk, and as for power, in virtually the same number of at bats, Kemp has 32 homers and 130 RBI and Cano had 29 and 140 RBI. Batting average, Cano beats him to death. It’s a Hell of lot harder to find a defensive 2nd baseman with the batting skills like Cano than to find an outfielder like Kemp.
RalphRC, Hudson wants a multi-year contract in the neighborhood of 13-15 million a year, isn’t as good a hitter and is no better a fielder. He’s also almost 5 years older. He’s not worth it. He also has a season ending injury.
Right now, Kemp has 130 strikeouts and will reach 150 this year with about 40 walks. Yeah, just what NYY needs.
green beret: good to see you.
when the players stats, are compared, i don’t understand the love for kemp (over cano).
Lost in these posts is the classy Abreu. Nice job reporting on this Pete.
“Lost in these posts is the classy Abreu. Nice job reporting on this Pete.”
Good Job by Bobby – He’s really going to take the NL by storm next year when Nady is playing RF
C’mon Girardi. Here’s your chance to get that overpaid slug (Giambi) out of the lineup and put the X-Man in the No. 5 hole while getting Cody Ransom in at first base.
Oh, and while you’re at it, tell that useless Betemit to pack up and leave.
From mlbtraderumors.com
“With Ryan Howard looking at maybe a $14MM salary in his second year of arbitration, the Phillies could shop him this winter.”
This would be too great to actually happen. Can you imagine what it would take to get Ryan Howard?
The thinking was that when Girardi took over the team, there would be butt kicking and name taking and all spoiled free agents and no-trade contract holders would be pushed like Bowa pushed Cano and the team would be great. (That and the feeble hope that two young phenom pitchers would morph into Sandy Koufax and Don Drysdale). Out with kind, sweet, Sleepy Joe Torre. Well it didn’t work out that way because Sleepy Joe T wasn’t so sleepy after all.
Maybe Torre didn’t personally do all the in-your-facing because he had Bowa to do it. Do you see Rob Thompson or Kevin “I’m-here-to-help” Long getting in anyone’s face? How about Pena? Yeah, sure. (I don’t know Pena personally, but common sense tells me that after Tony didn’t get the skipper job, he’s not going to be the first one to go out of his way for Joe Girardi). And clearly the players who were afraid of/respected Bowa don’t feel that way about Pena.
A-Rod can miss a few weeks, be distracted and still mash when his mind is elsewhere. His lack of timely hitting, and his defense, however, are embarrassing. Let’s not forget that Bowa’s old school, no b.s. manner got through to A-Rod too. Then there’s Abreu. If Bobby’s doing anything wrong There was a “Bowa effect” on at least three key players, cano, Abreu and A-Rod. Does Girardi’s inexperience show? Hmmmm. But that’s what happens when there is regime change. Should that, however, cause a team to forget how to win? No way.
So, the Yankees paid the price for having Girardi manage the last year of the Traveling Yankee Softball Team All Stars. Fair enough. But, the ’08 season is squarely on the players who didn’t do their jobs in the last year of a poorly constructed, old, less than athletic team. Yankee ownership’s commitment to rebuilding started when they signed Joe G and continued when they chose not to trade for Santana. I cannot see them changing course for next season.
Thus, IMO Yankee ownership will ruthlessly clean house of the players who are done, or who didn’t play up to legit expectations this year. No. 1 on the “to do for ’09″ list should be trading Cano.
IMO, if the Yankees are serious about rebuilding, then they must trade Cano as a warning to everyone on the Yankee 40 man roster and throughout the minor league system – and as a signal to any player in the league that might come here in a trade, or as a FA – that the Country Club is officially closed. (The best cure I can think of for Cano’s ADD is trading him for good prospects).
One last point: Jeter’s been hurt, whether it was a broken bone in his hand or a bum foot or leg. Still, as the season is winding up, his season average and OBP are edging back near his career numbers (almost .300 and .360 respectively as of last night). Plus, even the biggest Jeter haters have to admit his defense seems better this year than last. And Jetes is one of the few players hitting with RISP this year. He got to 2500 hits last night and has just passed Bill Dickey on the all time Yankee HR list. Consistent, productive, quiet, focused, professional, self-managing, HOFer Derek Jeter, what a “winner” looks like.
(Good to see you GB7)
murph dog’
your post was right on.i do think if cano was traded we should get major league position player and do think we should let giradi go.maybe buck,valentine or bowa.
I’m not ready to call for Girardi’s head yet, but I have been very disappointed. During the search, I wanted Mattingly with my heart, but Girardi with my head. I thought we’d be getting a no-nonsense taskmaster and instead we get a pollyanna, rah-rah guy. Maybe it’s because he’s too close in age and experience to the veterans. Whatever the reason, he’s been a disappointment. I would consider him on probation next year, and I too would look to get Buck back into the organization, even if A-Rod hates him. I also owe Torre an apology. The grass is always greener.
There are very effective drugs to counter act ADD. Trading Cano is not a good move. Getting him right, if possible, is far more important.
I forget which pitcher it was on one of the clubs that the Yankees faced, but he had ADD. They were ready to throw in the towel with him as he would lose focus during the games he was throwing. They found he had ADD, got him meds and his game was much better.
The Yankees have spent tons of money on developing these players. They have a lot of training staff, but I really wonder if the quality of their staff is up to the salaries they are getting. A lot of the injuries they had this year alone should be screaming about the lack of quality. Many of these injuries are of the type that would be reduced if they had better stretching.
They need to get kinesiologists to evaluate the plays that cause these injuries. The trainers they have do not have the background and understanding of muscles and movement that is needed. They might be fine with building strength and endurance, but not so hot with how they condition to prevent injuries.
While some will always happen, the Yankees have far too many to pass off as bad luck.
I was never for Girardi. I don’t think he has enough experience for the job, and while he might be better suited to a young team, he doesn’t know how to handle veterans. He is a .500 manager at this point with nearly 2 years of experience.
The loss of Bowa at third is felt during the game, but even more, IMO, during the off times. Meachem, Pena, Thompson, Long, none of them come off as the type to get in your face when needed. They are too much the coddling type of coach, not the hard nosed type that is needed.
Is handsome ransom starting tonught in place of giambi
I don’t know if Cano has ADD, but, the truth is that more than one game has been lost because of his ‘casual’ manner of playing. And that is hardly excusable in a professional player with a $40M contract. I believe that he needs to feel that his job is in jeopardy. Too bad Cashman traded Alberto Gonzalez, since he would have been a good replacement, at least to sit Cano for a while.
On another topic, I am really puzzled by the negativity towards Abreu in this forum. He is the Yankee leader in RBI’s, has a strong arm that has helped win games, wears out opposition’s pitchers and has a good influence on the team. I think Cashman should offer him a 2-year deal (maybe at a reduced price: I believe he would accept the discount). Even with Nady on board, we really don’t have a full outfield. Matsui cannot be counted to play on the field anymore, and Damon is fragile in center. I’d rather trade Matsui in the offseason than let Abreu walk to another team.
Concerned about Cano and ADD and spacing out? You would love Manny. I have said for years that except for when he is at the plate Manny has ADD.
When Santana wins the NL CY Young or is at least runnerup for it, in a new league, can we all finally admit we should have traded 3 underachieving players for him?
“C’mon Girardi. Here’s your chance to get that overpaid slug (Giambi) out of the lineup and put the X-Man in the No. 5 hole while getting Cody Ransom in at first base.”
dude i totally agree…giambi is horrible
DB, what’s Jeter’s and Damon’s excuse for their “casual play” at 189 million and 52 million dollars, repectfully? Grfeat to know that so many doctors and psychiatrists populate this board. Amazing how such a complex issue such as ADD can be diagnosed just by watching TV.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Manny has ADD either. Its something that has been diagnosed for a lot of people, too much, IMO, but there are some who do have this and its not always found.
Regarding the lineup, I am glad that Girardi is sticking to a set lineup over the musical chairs one, but a little tweaking is in order. If he insists on keeping Giambi in, move him back in the order and move Nady behind A-Rod or Matsui behind A-Rod. Giambi isn’t offering protection for A-Rod.
Sitting Giambi isn’t a bad idea either, but while Ransom has two dingers, can he hit otherwise? Maybe its time to find out and play him more.
GB7, its purely speculation, but it should be checked with Cano as he spaces out at times. I have no idea if Cano has ADD, but it should be looked into as he has shown some of the classic signs for it.
Larry Bowa is likely to stay with Joe Torre in L.A. but some good moves would see Rob Thomson reassigned to the scouting department with Paul O’Neill as Girardi’s bench coach and Tino replacing Meacham as the 3rd base coach.
Tino’s head is always in the game and Paulie would add some definite fire on the bench.
murphydog
If the Yankees clean house, and remain committed to finding either internal young players to replace them or trade for a young player, and not sign players to long term contracts of 5 years or more, it’s time to speculate who’s not coming back, and who might be available. The 2009 FA class is weak in position players, unless you want older players on 1 year deals until your minor leaguers develop.
The other problem is that because of albatross long term deals, and position players whose best position is DH, we really have only two players who are tradeable-Nady and Cano-and add Molina to that list.
CF is another problem. If you look at the rosters of other teams, there are few if any, ideal CF’ers to trade for. Many are older with hefty contracts-Wells, Hunter, Beltran, and Boras’ most overrated client-Andruw Jones.
Who goes and who stays? Are we willing to give a 7 year contract to Sabathia and will he be willing to take less to stay on West coast?
Any of you hear the interview Bowa did on Kay’s show on ESPN recently? I thought it was interesting that Bowa wanted to return to the Yankees — even without Torre — but Cashman told him he wasn’t wanted. Obviously, Cashman’s not a great judge of coaches, along with being less than stellar at juding players.
I’d like to get rid of Girari after this year, but it ain’t gonna happen.
Ransom is a career .236 major league hitter and a career .242 minor league hitter. He strikes out about one every three at bats. I’m not against him getting a few games against certain pitchers, but, this isn’t Babe Ruth we’re talking about.
murphydog-
i’m guessing that a third base coach like bowa makes about a hundred thousand dolllars a year tops. players who have the potential to swing the bat like cano are rare.
why not hire a coach for a hundred grand to keep the reins tight on multiple players in addition to cano. as you said arod needs someone his his face too.
i would keep cano and get a coach like bowa to stay on him. i disagree with most on this blog who say coaches in general such as the hitting coach have little to do with what players do on the field. i think they have a lot to do with the success of the team.
this is a soft team partly because there are no tough guy coaches on the team. the staff is mostly made of journeyman coaches who have survived by not rocking the boat.
not rocking the boat isn’t what we’re looking for on the yankees where almost all players will be set for life at some point . these players need a kick in the butt from time to time. as you said ,torre behind the easy going manner, was a tough guy.
the problem with girardi as a tough guy is that he’s kind of boy scout. i don’t get that with bowa. i’m not sure boy scouts are really what the yankees are looking for in coaches.
Is it not the job of the manager to get the most out of his players? Good managers find a way to motivate, even if its through a well-chosen coach. GI Joe does not impress.
cash and giradi should go.stick and buck take over.
I totally disagree with those who feel Nady should be batting fifth. He should bat cleanup!!!I definitely agree that Giambi should sit, since he clearly looks to pad his stats with homers for a contract next year.
Would love to have Tino and Paulie — their fire would be fab. But Paulie, for one, is not interested in working too much these days and being away from his family. They can barely book him to do broadcasting for more than a couple of series a year. I think Tino might bite at the oppportunity, though.
If Cashman didn’t want Bowa back, which is what I had heard as well, then its probably because Bowa wasn’t shy about telling Cashman what he thought and Cashman didn’t like that.
It would be an improvement to see at the very least Meachem gone. Thompson doesn’t inspire me much either, but either Tino or O’Neill could be good replacements. If they brought Paul back then he could re-take his old number and we wouldn’t have to hear him on TV any more. Two pluses there.
How bad does Giambi need to get before he’s moved out of the five spot?
GreenBeret7: Jeter is having a bad season. I don’t think anybody would question Jeter’s dedication and level after so many seasons and so many great moments. As for Damon: he’s helped the team over the years. His skills as a CF are severely diminished and he probably should be a DH with limited playing. But, things are what they are, and Damon is the CF for now (Melky was another underachiever and without Cano’s skills to boot). The thing that makes Cano’s case almost unbearable is that he is young and immensely talented. He, however, seems to think that ‘he has arrived’ and has nothing to prove to anybody. Time for a wake-up call.
The leader takes the hit when the boat goes down. Thats the way it is
Replacing coaches with people the players are friends with? I’ll pass on that.
Bowa will stay with Torre in LA. If you want to offer him the managing job, he may come back but he’s not coming back for a lateral move.
Yankee Trader, maybe A-Rod’s problem this year at the plate is because he is pressing to get more done knowing that Giambi isn’t going to do it. Plus he gets far less pitches to hit. Putting Nady behind him may show improvement to A-Rod’s production.
Agreed beefeater – time for Cash and his hand-picked manager to go.
The slogan for our new third base coach should just be: Anyone BUT Meachem.
Even Luis Sojo wasn’t this bad, and he was awful (love Luis, but that wasn’t his finest performance when he was the 3rd base coach.)
Jeter is getting close to being back at .300, that doesn’t seem so terrible to me. I am positive that Cabrera’s pitch on his hand did damage to him and he is finally healed enough now to produce more again.
Those who mentioned Torre, check out the article on him in the Daily News (NYC writers were in Philly). Funny stuff referring to JT and Jeter texting back and forth jokingly about whether Jeter is going to grow some dreads…
The reporters asked him to comment on NYY’s problems, probably hoping for vengeful quotes, but this is what he said:
(Torre) knows he’s closer to the playoffs right now than the Yankees, but he will not revel in the Yanks’ troubles in their first season without him.
“We struggled the last couple years I was there and we could come back and get someplace,” Torre said. “We got healthy and got better. They’ve never really gotten healthy. I could never sit here and gloat, knowing all these players I got close to were having to struggle.
“Even if I was angry at certain things, I would have a tough time not being able to root for those players individually.”
Torre noted that the Yankees’ record (68-60) is “a lot better than ours” despite a “ton of injuries.”
Joey’s Poodle — saw those articles in the papers today reporting on Torre in Philly. I thought he was very gracious indeed.
That’s brilliant. Send Cano a wakeup call by trading him….and no replacement for 2nd base. Smart move. Mantle had issues when things didn’t go right, either. Stengel trashed him to his face and team mates, but, praised him in the papers. NYY should have traded Mantle in 1957. There are a lot of players that need help from father-figures to kick them in the azs from time to time. Mantle and Mays were two prime examples of this.
It’s not immaturity…it’s insecurity. Read the interviews that Tony Castro had when writing his book on Mantle. It’s a must read for understanding why many extremely talented atheletes/people are also highly insecure.
Hair Dresser, you’re a fool. Kemp has the same issues that you claim that cano has. The only 2 things that Kemp has on Cano is base stealing speed and the ability to strike out in huge numbers. That means that he doesn’t doesn’t put the bat on the ball. He also doesn’t walk, and as for power, in virtually the same number of at bats, Kemp has 32 homers and 130 RBI and Cano had 29 and 140 RBI. Batting average, Cano beats him to death. It’s a Hell of lot harder to find a defensive 2nd baseman with the batting skills like Cano than to find an outfielder like Kemp.
Hey, GB.
Go eff yourself. I’m gonna argue or exchange insults with a little punk kid.
Grow up and be a man.
If you don’t like what I have to say, ignore me. It’s not that hard.
the comment that giradi is a boy scout tough guy is true.he is to nice to be a bowa or a lou pinela
Hair Dresser, it’s not my fault that you are wrong about a Kemp/Cano trade. Kemp is a fine player, but, finding one like him is easier than finding a available 2nd baseman as good as Cano. Deal with it and “grow up”.
green beret.
u really think cano upside is higher than kemps.cano doesn’t even show up for the first half of the season. he forgot to show up the 2nd half this year.he never takes pitches and can’t run.he has alot of terrible atbats.could he be a little overrated?
Sorry if this is a double post but it appears to have gotten stuck in the filter.
murphydog
Easy to find a reason that the 3 players you chose could have “Bowa effect”.
Abreu and A-Rod had history with Bowa. Bobby from when he managed in Philly and Alex from when he was 3rd base coach in Seattle. It was probably easier for Bowa to be more in their face because he knew them when and they viewed him as someone in authority that they respected when they were younger players.
Both Bobby and Alex seem to have a good relationship with Robbie and maybe he recognized that if Bowa could get in their face for their own good, no reason he wouldn’t get in his.
Wonder if Melky could be included in your “Bowa effect” group as well?
GB,
You’ve got some severe self-esteem issues where you have to insult others for merely have a different opinion than you and that’s really pathetic and sad for a 19 yr old kid.
But you go right ahead and keep doing so and ignore me in the future. Perhaps a little respect towards others on this board might go a long way for you some day.
I’m well aware of Kemp’s strikeout totals. There are a lot of outfielders who strikeout their fair share like Sizemore and there’s no Yankee fan on this board who wouldn’t want him on this team.
The Yankees need to find a way to toughen up their coaching staff, if it means figuring out how to drag Bowa back or someone of his ilk,, it needs to happen.
Meachem needs to go. He is a clown and doesn’t seem like his head is in the game, not the example you need from a 3B coach.
I have no problem with getting coaches specifically to help wandering pros stay focused. If that is what it takes to get guys talents like Cano to keep his head in the game and help guys like Arod keep from total insecurity, I say spend the 3K it takes.
I agree with giussepe Franco. There’s no need to call somebody a fool. Show some class GreenBeret7. This is supposed to be a friendly board. I hate anonymous name calling. Very weak.
abreu has 90 strikeouts.but he is productive.at bat that is
Not sure what part of my post the filter doesn’t like so I’ll try it a different way.
murphy cites Abreu, A-Rod and Cano as being affected by a lack of Bowa effect.
Abreu and A-Rod had a history with Bowa in Philly and Seattle respectively. Cano seems to respect and has a relationship with both of those players so the carry over of respect and willingness to listen to him get in his face would be expected.
Wonder if Melky also suffered from lack of Bowa effect this year?
Cody Ransom has an OPS+ of 1150 right now. The best 2 at bats of his career.
there are many issues facing nyy. Joe Girardi isn’t one of them.
regarding Cashman/Bowa. Cashman probably wanted the next manager (Girardi) to have input, on who his coaches would be. Understandable.
I like SJ44′s idea, of bringing in Buck, as a consultant. If only, to p*ss off arod.
Randolph will be the third base coach next year, and will work with Cano.
Re: Tough love, I had a similar post from a few days back. Check it out.
http://claybuchholzloveslaptop.....-work.html
It does amaze me. When Girardi was putting together his coaching staff, many fans commented that a Larry Bowa-type coach was needed. Didn’t the Yankees realize that?
Been having filter problems too. One last try:
IMO the Cano situation is one of several litmus tests for this organization. Some questions for those who don’t want to trade Cano:
1) How do the Yankees go forward with rebuilding and yet tell all the youngsters in the minors and any who would come to this team in a trade or as a FA that if you have potential like Cano, that it’s OK not to have the highest motivation and dedication and professionalism?
2) And by the way, what is Cano’s track record that we are so convinced that this year is the aberration and that last year’s numbers were not a career year? What exactly is the case for giving Cano the benefit of the doubt such that you tolerate his unprofessionalism and make MLB level coaching decisions based on the need to externally provide what he should bring to the park internally every day?
3) The fans are against spoiled superstars on long term contracts who do not produce in the clutch or who seem to be playing for the dollars instead of for the team. Tell me, how is that not Cano?
4) Why would I suppose that the more money he makes, and the more concessions that the Yankees make to his laziness and lack of professionalism, the better Cano will focus and produce? That does not work in any other setting, why would it work in baseball?
Everybody is entitled to their opinion on Robbie, obviously. He’s a difficult case because he may have awesome talent. But, IMO, you don’t make concessions to a guy like Cano. You make a trade and send a good, healthy message, replacing him with player(s) with better attitudes if not quite the same potential. Making coaching changes just to suit him? That’s going backward for this organization, IMO.
“Randolph will be the third base coach next year, and will work with Cano.”
Randolph possesses none of Bowa’s motivational skills.
Hair Dresser has posted the same crap on a daily basis. That’s what he does….post the same thing for about a week. Usually, it’s to jump on the rant of the week, such as getting rid of Cano, “Rodriguez is a bum”, and last year, it was dump Torre. actually, he’s quite hilarious, if not rather pathetic.
When Kemp produces the numbers that Abreu has throughout his career, then, maybe, some of those strikeout totals can be somewhat overlooked. Until that happens, I’ll stay with the more difficult position to fill…2nd base.
“Whether Joe Girardi feels that way isn’t certain. But I can tell you that others in the clubhouse do.”
Who are these people? What did they say? Or are you going to leave us with unsupported innuendo?
I don’t buy the idea that Bowa’s absence has a significant effect on any player. Cano laughed and smiled and looked happy in 2006 and 2007, much like he does this year. He made the same kind of mental errors and occasionally didn’t run hard. Only he put up tremendous numbers. So now he’s having a bad season and we want to get into his head and call him lazy. If you don’t back it up, it’s just speculation.
Does Cano loaf in practice? Does he not train as hard as he did in past seasons? Is he disrespectful to his coaches and manager? Where is the actual evidence that he’s lazy?
And why is Bowa is the only person with the magical ability to “motivate” Cano?
http://theblogofchampions.com/.....son-plans/
“Who are these people? What did they say? Or are you going to leave us with unsupported innuendo”
beat writers, will not reveal this type info, to the public. It breaks ‘the code’. They probably wouldn’t even tell us, each players nickname.
when Pete says “others in the clubhouse” feel Cano needs Bowa-type monitoring, it means nothing without knowing who “others” are.
my suspicion is that this comes from Giambi, who always seems to be saying stupid things to reporters – 2006 SI interview! – and who loves to mouth off. if it’s him, he has no credibility for me on this type of thing. Giambi always plays with his head up his butt – never has learned how to throw to 2B or take advantage of the shift, etc.
If Derek Jeter or A-rod or Jorge Posada or Abreu – guys who work hard and are gamers – say it, then i’d take it seriously.
i liked Bowa, but for 1/2 or so of 2007, Cano played like crap. which makes me skeptical of the degree of Bowa’s influence.
No expert here, but maybe you give arod some mental relief by batting him third. His personality mental make up etc may not be conducive to cleaning up. Also from time to time may give hin an extra at bat.
Abreu certainly without the power of arod, does make more consistent contact might just flourish at cleanup.
I am a fan of the G man, but clearly he is not a the number 5 this year. X,Matsui, even Cano I believe would be more consistent producer at 5 then Giambi. Giambi goes to 8 or 9 but then you run into two snails with him and Molina.
Moving Cano to 5 might signal to him he is needed to perform up to his potential, then maybe not.
Point is to many good realistic options and far to little production to continue batting Giambi in the 5 hole. Don’t know about his skills diminishing but his consistency has this year anyway. I can only wonder what drug Girardi has to take to make him oblivious to moving Jason down.
Come on Pete, Bowa’s absence has little to do with Cano’s poor season.
“Come on Pete, Bowa’s absence has little to do with Cano’s poor season.”
You could have at least offered ‘because I said so’ as evidence. Nice work.
“i liked Bowa, but for 1/2 or so of 2007, Cano played like crap. which makes me skeptical of the degree of Bowa’s influence.”
Case clsoed
Get off this Bowa needed crap. If Cano needs to be motivated or threatended by a tough coach, it is time to trade him.
“Whether Joe Girardi feels that way isn’t certain. But I can tell you that others in the clubhouse do.”
As someone wrote earlier, get off this ananymous BS. Name your soruces. If some veteran players said that, they should be showing some guts or leadership and go after Cano rather than whining to you.
And, you can not stop taking a dig at Girardi in every thing you write. We know that is your worst weakness.
Exactly how much motivation does Cano require in order to play to the top of his skills ?
Here’s a 26 year old (man ?) playing baseball for the most storied franchise in all of sports and drawing $30M worth of salaries at least until 2011 with opportunities to make even more and for just 8 months of enjoyable work in a city loaded with excitement like nowhere else.
He should be pushing his own buttons for the kind of life he lives.
As much as you Cano haters like to ignore, a large reason why Cano is having a bad season at the plate is simply bad luck.
His BABIP is only .270 right now which is a LOT lower than his career numbers. In the last three years his BABIP was .318, .359, .329. And he’s hitting the ball just as hard, his line drive % is up from last year and about equal with his 2006 and 2005 LD%. Even if you only watch the games and ignore the stats its pretty obvious how many hard hit balls have been caught. He’s been robbed of a lot of hits and he isn’t getting many lucky hits.
Obviously Cano makes some really dumb mistakes in the field and thats not luck thats a lack of focus and hustle. I can’t defend him for those plays. Its a shame his struggles at the plate have been carried into the field. I think Bowa could have helped him there but I really doubt Cano would be having a better season at the plate if Bowa was here.
Trading Cano would be a huge mistake in my opinion. He’s exactly what this team needs; young, very good hitter, very good fielder.
Murph —
In answer to your last post, the reason why some of the fans in here get outraged when you mention trading Cano is the “homegrown boy” effect.
They think they’ve developed him, birthed him, raised him, etc.
They have no idea how much of a me player this guy is and how he could care less about the laundry he wears and just wants his money.
The guy plays with the passion of walrus. His defense, which all the Cano apologists were touting when he couldn’t hit a softball has slipped a ton.
Comparing him to Soriano is not fair. Soriano had power, speed and played with some fire. Cano just hits.
I love how the Cano apologists say, “he’s not lazy, he’s smooth”. Yeah. Sure. Tell me that when the ball goes under his barely outstretched glove as it often does. Balls that he should knock down, but he’s too smooth to knock a ball down. He can only make circus catches.
The mere idea that we have to hire a coach to get Cano to focus is the reason you trade him if he still has high value.
You do not build teams around these guys. You build them around Jeter and Posada. Guys who play with more heart and fire than Cano ever will.
I don’t think Cano will ever “get it” until he’s playing for his next contract/option years.
A long list of fireable offenses exist now for Cashman. Chief among them was showing Cano the money this year. It took away the players motivation not to mention the GM didn’t know that the guy he was giving 30 million to needed Larry Bowa in his ear instead of Bobby “I was a lousy player” Meachem?
Cashman blew it with Cano. If Cano had this season w/o the guaranteed dollars, the Yankees would have killed him arbitration and gotten him for a discount next year.
But I believe Cano wouldn’t have sucked this year if he hadn’t gotten the guaranteed money. If he were playing for his supper, like Jeter, Bernie, Jorge and every other Yankee young player were forced to, he would have shown up this year to make sure he got the raise in arb after the year.
Bad job by Cashman and if he gets canned, good. Take soft Girardi and Meachem with him too.
I’d rather start next year with a real tough manager, not a company man who only sees sunshine when it’s raining. I wonder if Girardi knows the future health complications he’s giving himself by lying about the state of the team and players. You can see it wearing on him in the dugout. He’s not being truthful and I think he’s being a version of himself that is not at all genuine.
G love: you’re right. Comparing soriano to cano is not fair. Cano is a better 2nd baseman, then soriano ever thought about being. Soriano was a terrible defensive player. Let’s not forget this.
“I love how the Cano apologists say, “he’s not lazy, he’s smoothâ€. Yeah. Sure. Tell me that when the ball goes under his barely outstretched glove as it often does. Balls that he should knock down, but he’s too smooth to knock a ball down. He can only make circus catches.”
Well said.
How many times he did not dive for the ball, it went under his glove and resulted in runs for the opposition. Does Bowa has to tell him to dive? He does not know that is the right way to play? He does dive some times, it is not like he does not know. It is laziness.
Slot Giambi in at leadoff where he can spray the ball to all fields and be a threat on the basepaths when Jeter comes to bat.
Bowa was a great 3B coach and we miss him this year. That said, I’m not buying this story. Bowa’s influence on Cano from all the reporting in previous years was primarily on his defense not his hitting. Even if he had some impact on his hitting, I can’t see it being that big. This is a huge dropoff from last year.
Pete also harps on the baserunning. You don’t look good when you are thrown out being “too” aggressive on the basepaths, but is it better than going station to station waiting for the home run when we watching time after time opposing pitchers getting out of innings after someone getting on is followed up weak pop-ups and double plays. I don’t have a problem with Giambi’s decision to go for the double. If Markasis’ throw was a little off line or he could have kept his hand on the bag, he’s safe. If you were paying attention, two batters later, someone hit a weak grounder to first that would have been a double play ball anyway. Abreu’s caught stealing was appeared to be a hit and run that didn’t work out because A-Rod didn’t make contact and struck out. I’m fine with trying to manufacture more runs by being a little more aggressive on the base paths. Its not going to work out all the time, but you have to try something after witnessing time after time, players getting on base and being stranded.
I’m not in love with the new coaches on Giradi’s staff and would support some upgrades in the offseason, but they aren’t the problem. The players are the problem.
“coach like bowa makes about a hundred thousand dolllars a year tops…”
really? I think he makes at least 200 grand per yr.
Beckett’s not pitching Tuesday
Josh Beckett (hand) has been pushed back again and will not start until Friday against the White Sox.
Beckett was supposed to throw a side session Saturday in preparation for a Tuesday start, but the organization decided to give his hand several days of extra rest. “This gives him another three days of more routine and we can bump his side back to Tuesday,” manager Terry Francona said. “We all feel a little bit better about being overly cautious.”
BAT GIAMBI 6th or 7th IF u WANT TO HAVE A LITTLE CHANCE OF MAKING THE PLAYOFF OR MAKE HIM TAKE ROIDS
“You could have at least offered ‘because I said so’ as evidence. Nice work.”
Cano’s career rates are .303/.336/.468
Can’s rates since May 1st are .296/.330/.444
So, he had one terrible month, and has been hitting close to his typical pace ever since.
Like I said, Larry Bowa has had very little to do with Cano’s performance this season.
CT – do we know who might be taking his spot?
Wakefield
http://www.beloblog.com/ProJo_.....s-b-3.html
beckett gives us fits, this is good news.
hopefully we see bartolo colon or clay buchholz loves laptops.
It looks like it could be Wakfield, Byrd, and Lester
My cheerleading helped build a softball dynasty 30 years ago. Can I apply? Actually, my biggest asset was a loud voice. We never had a collision on a pop up or fly ball!
ok – that should be managable…thanks CT
To people realize that Kemp has also hit .342 just like Cano did? He did last year.
Kemp has a potential to be a 30 HR/30 SB guy. He is also 2 years younger.
Trading Cano for him is outrageous at all, but I doubt LAD does it. They could use Kemp to get someone better.
I thought Beckett’s hand was getting better?
That doesn’t sound good. Did Kenny Rodgers and Shelly Duncan have similar symptons?
Can’t say I’ve like Josh in the past, but I’d never wish harm on anyone.
He’s been much more sedated and quiet this season. I thought it was because of his his struggles, but maybe something serious has humbled him.
Hope it’s nothing serious.
From NYT, quote of the day—–
“Even the brand name of the toilets in the main press center was covered in tape, lest anyone think American Standard had paid to be the official urinal of the Beijing Games.”
It seems Beckett may have some inflammation in his elbow too
http://www.boston.com/sports/b.....and_2.html
*symptoms
I don’t think it can be one guy who gets on Cano. Jeter was effeective with his tonguelashing, but it’s not in his personality to nag (really, that’s what it is) and it wouldn’t work for very long.
I thought A-rod was mentoring Cano? The main guys need to share the parenting duties I guess.
Meanwhile we’ll wait for the lightbulb to go on. They were seeing the ball pretty well last night, huh?
Bobbo. Wow. 5-fers are rare.
AJ, Kemp hit .342 in half a season last year. When he knocks in 97 runs in a season or has 41 doubles in a full season, let me know. Those 130 strikeouts are pretty, though, to go with his monsterous 40 walks.
loonylarry – Thank you for the information. It would be intresting to see his BABIP sine May. Using the stat of my own eyes, it seems he has been hitting the ball with much mroe authority the last couple of months. He started the season – first month or two hitting the ball very weakly on the ground or short pop-ups. But every since, even some of his outs are hit squarely.
This team will never respond to an abrasive force like a Showalter or Bowa full-time. A-Rod hated Buck in Texas. They will tune him out within a week and lose the clubhouse much faster than Girardi did. Bowa was great in his role as a guy who gave it to Cano and offered some tough love in doses, under Torre.
If you think they play tight now just wait until they have a hot-head managing them. These millionaires will only respond to level-headed guys who show them respect. They stars are too-weak minded to respond to yelling/berating… it will make them tighter and press more.
You can’t “toughen up” veterans, can’t teach an old dog new tricks. Most of these guys are on their last legs anyway, they are not going to change the way they play.
Mel, Jeter never says anything to any player, unless it’s to back them up, unless his name is Rodriguez.
If any of the coaches needs to talk with Cano, since Girardi seems to be above that, Tony Perez would be the logical choice to take on the “tough love” duties. As tam captain, though, it’s Jeter’s responsibility, only because he’s a position player. My choice of players though would be Rivera.
Cano OBP SLG AVG
Mar and April .211 .236 .151
May .333 .432 .295
June .302 .416 .287
July .322 .495 .327
Aug .333 .426 .265
Before All-Star .285 .358 .246
After All-Star .353 .504 .312
If you take out April Cano has had a very consistent year (relative to his past). I will definately take a .310 average and .500 slugging (since the all star break) from a second baseman any season. He just needs to start a bit faster, as do all of the Yankees. He also needs to give more effort in the field on every play.
GB7,
I think that some things get lost in translation between the leagues.
There are always exceptions, but it’s my opinion that the two leagues are not equal. Not even close.
So if two players are “similar” you have to give bonus points to the AL guy.
In recent history, Nady and Bay are the only guys who’ve made the transition seamlessly. Even J.D. Freaking Drew and the great Miguel Cabrera have struggled in the transition.
I guess what I’m saying is playing in the NL is a whole different ballgame and those stats can be discounted somewhat. So while Kemp looks great, what would he look like playing the AL East?
You got to do something if it vastly improves the position and the team, but the hot chick always looks better than the dependable (and yes, servicable) wife that’s been with you.
So I’m with you, Cano’s a pretty good young player and it’s worth sticking with him for now.
One thing I noticed is that Cano doesn’t strike out as much. Does Alex strikeout more?
“the great Miguel Cabrera have struggled in the transition.”
Near .300. Will get 30+ homers and 100+ Rbi. Everyone should have such struggles.
I don’t have a problem with Cano, With a more aggressive staff he can achieve more..
One thing’s for sure, Meachem must go.
Anyone but Meachem.
Fredo,
Thanks for that. I haven’t looked lately, but I do remember he struggled in the first half of the season. How’s his defense been?
hughes should be option to AA
Jason, I am not sure where to find Cano’s BABIP since May. Maybe someone else knows. I suspect that you are correct.
Also, to the guy that said the following about Matt Kemp:
“When he knocks in 97 runs in a season or has 41 doubles in a full season, let me know.”
You should know that he has been a leadoff hitter for a good chunk of this season. So measuring him by RBIs is pretty stupid.
What they need to do is bring Willie Randolph next year to work 3rd and and move Meacham to the bench.
GB7,
The first game after Melky was sent down, Jeter really gave it to Cano. He responded well. So Jeter has it, it’s just not in his nature to do it all the time. And really, why should he have to? No one should be told to hustle, pay attention to the play, and take care of the ball.
If he can hit more bombs like he did yesterday, I suspect that a lot of people would shut up about his “smooth moves” in the field.
Just when Lester looked untouchable. Single and a bomb. Nice, Vernon.
Not to mention the walk and hit batsman that followed.
“Jeter really gave it to Cano”
Is it speculation or there is evidence that Jeter did it? I just do not see Jeter doing it ohter than giving bland statemnets to the media like we need to start hitting.
Phil Franchise 8ER in 3 innings.
Why again should Hughes start ahead of Pavano?
Mel, agreed on the strikeout problems with Kemp. He strikes out 4 times more than Cano, doesn’t walk much more. Only his steals are much higher over the same sumber of games they played over the first two years of Cano and 2 and a half with Kemp. Everybody keeps harping on Cano’s season, but, since 1 May, he’s hitting close to .310. Just a bad start. Not as bad as Jeter’s 2004 start, though. I don’t recall anybody demanding a trade, then. Now, these same people are crying about Cano’s contract. Nevermind that Jeter held the Yanks up for 189 million after 4 years. Whether he deserved it or not, is beside the point. This isn’t meant to be a stereo type remark, but, a lot of the Latin players go through the same thing as Cano, and, above all else, that was one thing that Bowa understood.
I made a reference to a book written by Tony Castro about Mickey Mantle and Willie Mays. Castro talked to players, coaches and psychiatrists about them, and the conclusion was that they were extremely talented, they were also extremely insecure about themselves and went into funks like Cano has.
BBFan- there is an interview on yesnetwork.com of robbie, he talks about the jeter conversation
heres the link
http://web.yesnetwork.com/medi.....#038;_mp=1
ok the filter doesnt like my link…
BBFan, go to yesnetwork. com and go to the video section, there is an interview of cano. he talks about what jeter said to him. and he also said meacham has really helped him out this season.
It appears that the Lester facade may be crumbling today. Even if it just for today, I’ll gladly take it.
He shouldn’t.
Pavano gives us a better chance to win plain and simple. Hughes cant get out hitters from the worst team in AAA (who he faced last week BTW), its highly unlikely he will be able to get outs in Camden Yards of all places against a team that is filled with Yankee killers (Huff, Roberts, Markakis, Millar, Hernandez, Payton, Mora).
I am looking forward to tonight’s game. First to see if Pavano actually takes the mound. And if he does then to see what he does. Maybe if he pitches well Cashman can trade him to a team that is desperate for pitching.
whos injured in the boston game
if they trade Cano now, he still has some trade value, if they keep him another season and this same thing happens, his trade value diminishes…..so what do you do? go with a known producer, or with a question mark of a lot of talent? hmmmmm, I know what I choose
ESPN announced Beckett won’t pitch Tues nite against us
So far, the only injury in the Boston/Toronto game has been to Lester’s ERA.
oh and BTW, I’m going to the game tonite – I’ll try and blog during the game
what magical known producer will be taking cano’s place at 2b if the yankees trade him?
And, who would this “known producer” be, Jeter’s wanna be wife?
“what magical known producer will be taking cano’s place at 2b if the yankees trade him?”
You mean a guy who can hit .265 with 55 RBI????
Sorry, the delay in the game was to Toronto’s catcher getting hit with a ball that had been fouled off one of the Suxer’s foot. It took him quite a while to get up.
I didn’t realize that the Sux hadn’t won a game at Rogers Centre since last year, before last night’s win. Looks like they may be starting a new streak today!
Another run just scored.
4-0 Jays.
Lester’s at 75 pitches in the 3rd inning, with only one out.
You know what that means. Pen burn on the way!!!
“appears that the Lester facade may be crumbling today.”
Facade??? Kid’s one of the 3-4 best lefties in the AL. You want crumbling facades, you needn’t look any further than Scranton, PA.
lester gonna reach 80 pitches by the 3rd inning
5-0
Jays are having some very nice AB’s.
Jeeze Louise – 5-0 Jays. Lester may not make it out of the 3rd!
Uh Fredo, getting that upset isn’t good for your blood pressure. I said it might just be for today.
Okey dokey? Lester’s a heck of a pitcher. Better?
6-0 Jays.
Not at all upset Trish. Just sayin’. We don’t want to be like the “Yankees Suck!” morons in Fenway.
First of all speak for yourself, paleface!
Secondly, the truth will set you free. Lester couldn’t suck more if he tried – today. If you reread my post I said it might just be for today. When I used the word facade, I was using it the way one would reference the front of a building. So I was saying he was falling apart. Is all.
Geeze this is like deja vu all over again. 7-0. That feels vaguely familiar, and very uncomfortable!
Freddie, you spend more time here trashing anything about the Yankees and puffing up about the Red Sox more than most Red Sox fans. Just admit that you’re a Red Sox whatever.
GreenBeret thanks for that info. I didn’t know that Fredo was a Sux suckup.
Don’t know if this was mentioned already but we won’t be seeing Beckett in the next series.
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/articl.....8;c_id=mlb
Didn’t some dorks announce that he had just slept wrong? Probably intentional misinformation. Anyway we’ll be seeing Wakefield instead.
“Secondly, the truth will set you free. Lester couldn’t suck more if he tried – today. If you reread my post I said it might just be for today.”
True enough. My bad.
GB:
Calling a spade a spade is all. Taking shots at another team’s young pitchers is a bit lame in light of some of the failures of the Yankees young pitchers. I compared to the Fenway morons and their “Yankees sucks!” chants (even when the Yankees were 10 games up on them). I re-read Trisha’s post and apologized.
Lighten the bleep up.
That’s the report Trisha. Looks like Girardi isn’t the only manager that lies to the poor, misinformed media. Somehow, I doubt that anybody complains about it on here, though. I don’t think the reporters are giving us fans that want to know everything, the whole truth. I feel cheated.
Boy it has to be such a luxury for a starting pitcher to be spotted a 7-run lead. You want to see s decent pitcher be able to pitch his game, spot him a nice lead. It bugs me when your guy has to be the equivlant of Cy every time he takes the mound in order to feel you might pull out a win.
That of course has been the fate of our starters more often than not. Then you wonder why they make mistakes and give up runs. Nobody should be forced to be “perfect” with every pitch!
Looks like a Freddie nerve was struck.
Wow there should be at least a few web gems coming out of the Toronto game.
GB, I have to say that I am someone who is not terribly bothered by misinformation on players. I know sometimes it is done as a measure of strategy, such as Girardi never announcing whether or not certain relievers will be available in a game since he doesn’t want to give an early advantage by giving away that info. I can also respect lack of information until a team is totally certain since it does no good for anyone to say things prematurely. If someone is giving an educated guess and it turns out to be wrong, so be it. Reporters push for info.
If it is not being done as a measure of strategy and is an outright lie, then yes that bothers me.
Wow Crisp just kind of bounced and slid around the Toronto outfield. This has the makings of an ugly lopsided game.
“If it is not being done as a measure of strategy and is an outright lie, then yes that bothers me.”
Don’t really see how such a strategy works in baseball. An opponent doesn’t really gather any sort of edge in baseball knowing a guy is playing or not playing or how injured he is. Unless the Yankees came to work on Tuesday thinking they are facing Beckett and learn at 5:00 they are facing Wakefield instead, there’s no edge.. It’s not like football when you may prepare for a player or players (and NFL coaches emply that strategy in a pretty big way).
GreenBeret and Fred,
the replacement may come in more than one player, I’m not exactly sure who else becomes free agents after this season, but the risk is what if Cano gets worse and the value isn’t there (what, b/c he doesn’t have Larry Bowa anymore? wa wa wa!) seriously, that is no excuse when you in the big leagues and wearing pinstripes. It can’t be good in the clubhouse either
Sure you can gather an edge. You just might want to reset your rotation based on knowing who the matchups are.
But in any event, I don’t particularly care when I learn information since it never changes the position I will be playing (couch cheerleader). So when I find stuff out, I find it out!
Trisha, as far as injuries to players, I can’t see a reason in the world how it’s anybody’s business besides the team and players. If they want to talk, that’s up to them. If it was me, I’d be mad as Hell about disclosures. During 36 years in the military, that’s one thing I refused to do, and that’s allow the military to release anything about me or injuries, and I refused to make any comments or grant interviews, which was part of my job. That was my alternative. It was nobody’s business.
I never trusted the media to be honest or objective. They either exaggerate, twist or just oput and out lie, because that’s what sells.
Teams that spill their guts about an injury really hamstrings that team if they need to make a trade to replace the injured player. It’s not smart business.
Jeter’s wanna be wife, what happens if the player they get bombs and Cano is just having a one time off season, and explodes to have career years for the next 10 years? Who in the world would you and others blame, then?
jeter’s wife person: cano had an awful april that has been pulling down his stats that show he’s been hitting around .300 since. if he didn’t have that april, nobody would be whining now. that production is harder to replace and many teams would be glad to take him for almost nothing.
“Trisha, as far as injuries to players, I can’t see a reason in the world how it’s anybody’s business besides the team and players.”
I’m thinking that’s an absolute BINGO GB.
“I never trusted the media to be honest or objective. They either exaggerate, twist or just oput and out lie, because that’s what sells.”
I’m with you there also. It’s all about readership and scooping the competition, so whatever they have to do for that to happen, they do it.
“Teams that spill their guts about an injury really hamstrings that team if they need to make a trade to replace the injured player. It’s not smart business.”
Now that makes sense. Of course with the trade deadline long gone and hard to find, it’s not really an issue.