Today in The Journal News
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Aug 25, 2008 
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Robinson Cano delivered a big shot for the Yankees as they swept the Orioles.
It was a rough start for Darrell Rasner. This notebook also has updates on A-Rod, Joba Chamberlain, Derek Jeter and Carl Pavano.
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If you know a Mets fan, have them check out the LoHud Mets Blog. The blog has been revamped in recent days and there’s plenty of good info. Thanks.
Hey look the throwin prospect in the Arod deal
Arias
Arias in MLB
Pete,
Thanks for the links after the long trip back.
I’m not a sensitive Sally like others, but there’s some strong language there. The “denied” is fine because well Girardi and Marte contradicted each other.
But to say “Girardi claimed the Yankees…” is getting into that war of words territory. I know it’s semantics, but it sounds like you’re calling Joe a liar. Sounds like they want to take it slow with Joba, which they should.
Just a casual observation from an interested reader. Don’t want to get into a war of words with a writer.
Me: Do you really think the Yankees are planning out Joba’s rehab 24 hours at a time? The Yankees planned spring training in November. There’s obviously some sort of plan. You don’t just rehab your top prospect by the seat of your pants. There are protocols for these sorts of things depending on the injury.
“Claimed” is a word being used by a lot of New York papers in Yankee stories these days, unfortunately.
“I feel terrible,” Rasner said after the Yankees came away with an 8-7 win. “The bullpen did a great job to pick me up. I just wish I could have been better. I’m disgusted with how I threw.”
Paging Ian Kennedy……Are you listening
““Claimed†is a word being used by a lot of New York papers in Yankee stories these days, unfortunately.”"
-Let’s make this bet. If the yanks make the playoffs Pete has to change his Blog picture to him wearing a #27 jersey.
Pete,
I almost posted an addendum to say that of course they have a plan, they just don’t want to share it. You know how secretive they were about the Joba rules. IIRC you were justifiably upset then, too.
If you connect the dots, they’re going at a snail’s pace. Much slower than protocol calls for. That means they value Joba’s health more than his contribution at this point of the season. Even as the Yankees gain momentum.
If there were any setbacks he wouldn’t even be pitching. He’d be shut down. Joba claims he’s pain free, but I can understand the Yankees putting on the brakes because they know that Joba wants to get out there and help the team. But just like parents often have to do, they’re taking charge and making the tough choices.
I don’t want to get into it because I don’t want to be insulting or ungrateful. I love your humor and insight. I just don’t know enough about the New York sportswriting scene to make a qualified statement.
But just because the other kids are doing it, doesn’t make it right in my eyes. The writers and Joe got off to a rough start and it seems like no one’s going to forgive him for it.
You know that he knows that you know that he knows he has a plan and doesn’t want to share it with you. You know what they say about the best-laid plans. Everything’s subject to change. Joba’s a human, not a finely tuned machine that will be ready to go in 7 days because that’s what the doctor says. You guys basically called Joe a liar because it took 10 days before Joba started baseball activity.
Anyway, just seems that it *seems* that this little something you have with Joe is carrying over to your writing. Maybe I am a sensitive Sally after all.
Jumping off soapbox now.
Hmm .I’m pretty sure my brother would appreciate the Mets blog. thanks Pete
Sensitive Sally — enough! Why should the sportswriters “forgive” Joe as you suggest they should when his behavior hasn’t changed at all since he last apologized for it?
Expect to see the same ‘ol, same ol until Joe figures it out. It certainly ain’t gonna be the other way around.
And don’t accuse Pete of being the hypersensitive person you yourself are in his own newspaper writing. Geez, you’re really reading into things. Go look up “claim” if you need to review the definition of the word in your mind. What Girardi told the press hasn’t been proven to be true, therefore, he is “claiming” something.
The Jeter error certainly didn’t help Rasner,it was directly responsible for at one run and prolonged the inning.
Regarding Cabrera and his lack of control, I don’t 100% buy it that he has no idea where the ball is going. While he is all over the place, why is it that only certain batters have the target on them?
When the Yankees hit him I knew either Jeter or A-Rod was going to get HBP. I wouldn’t be surprised that all those near misses were more the product of his lack of control, in that he was really trying to hit batters. I think thats part of his game, to hit a batter hard, make the batters uncomfortable at the plate.
Funny, Joba got a suspension for NOT hitting Youkilis and being told that you have to have better control up in the bigs, yet Cabrera hits batters all the time and doesn’t get the same treatment. And most of the time that he goes after batters its in the upper body area. Why isn’t he being suspended? Because he is consistently dangerous on mound?
For $13
The double standard has me confused, it’s not like Cabrera is a rookie. And I guess the throw at Ivan’s head was ok because it didn’t sail over the top of his head.
if you guys know a mets fan… go have them get their head checked out.
Hey Pete
I’m just curious here, but what was your relationship like with Torre…? Did you ever have any of these writing “issues” with Torre? Was Torre more forthcoming with information than Girardi? For some reason, I don’t recall Torre being very forthcoming with Yankee plans either – he was usually smart enough to defer questions like those to Cashman.
I guess what I’m asking is… between Torre and Girardi, do you think the same amount of information is being passed but Torre was better and dealing with questions like those or did Torre actually tell you things that Girardi isn’t or do you feel Girardi is misleading you guys when Torre did not? I’m getting the feeling it’s the last one…
As a media person I can tell you it’s much more acceptable to receive “no comment” or “we’re not going into detaisl on that” as an answer rather than an outright falsehood. It is ALWAYS a bad idea to lie about something. Just don’t answer the question.
It was good to hear Rasner take the blame for an awful outing, but I sure look forward to the day when the Yankees are an excellent defensive team that takes away hits instead of an awful defensive team that gives extra outs on a near daily basis.
“As a media person I can tell you it’s much more acceptable to receive “no comment†or “we’re not going into detaisl on that†as an answer rather than an outright falsehood.”
Even a simple “I don’t know” or “we’re not sure on that yet” would suffice.
I can see where the writers would get annoyed at seeming to be used for propaganda for the team. If Girardi tells mis-leading things to the media and it gets refuted by the players, then Girardi is using them.
I think for him to say that there is no comment at this time, or something along those lines would come off better than what he is doing.
It isn’t helping his media relations, and the causes the writers to suspect everything he says. What purpose does that serve?
He would be wise to lay things out but stop with trying to spread untruths through the media.
Planning spring training, a relatively predictable setting, in November is a lot different than planning the timetable for a pitcher’s rehab from an unexpected injury, especially one that occurs toward the end of a season when by the time he’s ready to pitch in a rehab game more than likely the minor league season will either be over, or the minor league team will be involved in its own playoffs.
It is not far-fetched in this particular incidence for the Yankees to not know for sure how the rehab is going to progress. There are more than likely a few contingencies based upon how the last rehab session went and whether or not the pitcher experiences any setbacks.
how about the media types just realize Girardi is going to be coy, and sometimes simply downright deceitful, with information like that and just stop asking him the question? or at least dont get so upset when he gives you an answer that doesnt turn out to be accurate.
if the well is continually dry, why would go back to the same bucket everyday? learn from it and figure out where else you can get the water and try something else.
but then i guess thats why they were communications majors.
Pete is trying to get some hits for his buddy on the Mets side. Poor guy doesn’t get comments.
Pete,
I was listening to Boomer & Carton this morning and they said Girardi not being forthcoming with injury info is no big deal. They said Torre gave out pretty much all info and that Girardi just isn’t like Torre.
What this says to me is that Girardi and his players are not on the same page. If Girardi said Marte was fine, and spoke with Marte, why would Marte contradict his manager. There’s a bigger issue at stake here than Girardi’s skirting the media. Maybe He’s just trying to protect his players? But this has been going on all season, and it’s making Girardi look like a fool to the fans. Imagine what they’re saying in the clubhouse.
TurnTwo, errr… the job of being a writer or tv reporter is to ask those questions. Misuse the media at risk, which is what Girardi is doing.
Torre didn’t give out every bit of information, but he did try using the media to spread dis-information either. There is a big difference there.
“But this has been going on all season, and it’s making Girardi look like a fool to the fans.”
i wouldnt say that as a blanket statement. if you havent learned to take what Girardi says with a grain of salt by this point, then who’s the fool here?
I’ve known a few professional media spokesperson types in prior employment. Always, rule #1 was don’t lie. It was very strongly ingrained in me that lying and spinning are not the same thing and that lying to the media is not only not acceptable, it’s not smart. Writers aren’t stupid and the ones who aren’t lazy (99% of them are not lazy) talk to other people about the same things they ask you about, either before or after they talk with you. Whether it’s on or off the record, the truth will out.
Girardi’s been caught fibbing a few times, and there were even a couple of air-clearing sessions. Still, he thinks he’s giving out troop movements in a time of war if he says that Marte is day to day with some soreness. If the only lefty in the bullpen hasn’t thrown in 10 days pretty much everybody else has already figured out he’s not well.
It’s not even so much that Girardi see things differently from the media. They have reached out to him and tried to set things straight because he’s basically a good guy and he was a broadcaster and it would be better for everyone if he got the point. To stubbornly refuese to get this right is, well, stubborn.
“the job of being a writer or tv reporter is to ask those questions. Misuse the media at risk, which is what Girardi is doing.”
and thats fine, i get that. ask the question because thats what you need to do and quote him, and then go to the next guy…. but dont get so angry at the man when his info is inaccurate or misleading.
raymagnetic
You should say that it is Chris Carlin and Kim Jones doing the show today.
That said Joe is making Kim’s job just as difficult as Pete’s. Also I think she said that Joe said fromt he very begining that he wasn’t going to say who was and wasn’t available and he has stuck with that.
Turn Two, no need to throw insults here…
If you actually read my post, the point was not that Girardi looked foolish for trying deceiving the media, that’s par for the course. I could care less about that that. What is an issue is that Marte contradicted what Girardi said. Shouldn’t the manager & his players be on the same page?
Checked out the Mets blog. There’s basically nobody adding comments. I hope it catches on.
A lot of posters are critical of Pete for knocking Girardi but if they just read around a bit, they’d realize that the whole beat corps is scratching their collective head with many of Joe’s less is more type statements. Even Tyler Kepner from the Times is on board and that guys got to have the tightest leash of the bunch. In Girardi’s world everybody has tendinitis but no one is hurt. I guess he figures he needs to keep this “I’m such a fierce competitor I even keep injuries a secret like I’m in the NFL.” image alive as his rookie manager mistakes provide a fitting backdrop for the poor play of his team.
If Pete wasn’t critical of Girardi, he would be a total lackey. Then again, it would make him a good candidate for a job on YES.
TurnTwo,
The media’s job is to GET information. That’s why they are there.
They aren’t an extension, nor should they be, of the Yankees PR Department. They also aren’t the enemy.
Folks Pete is “bad” or “out to get Girardi”? Please.
Go back and read about guys like Henry Hecht and Dick Young. Those guys were VICIOUS.
They make Pete Abraham look like Jason Zillo, compared to the way those guys (and others during their eras) did their jobs.
The current Yankee beat is filled with guys who aren’t “killers”. They just want accurate information.
They are well aware of what they can or can’t print. What they don’t want is to be lied to their face on the minor stuff. Once that happens, a reporters natural instinct is going to go up (as it should) and that makes keeping the big stuff quiet much more difficult.
It also isn’t a “privilege” for the media to be there. Its their job. Just like its Girardi’s job to manage the team.
Whether some fans like it or not, part of the job (a BIG part of it in NY) is dealing with the media on a daily basis. Its also not without its rewards for Girardi and the other athletes and coaches in town.
Joe Girardi makes over 1 million dollars a year in off-field endorsements ranging from hawking Mercedes to his TV Show on YES.
You know why? Because its a media driven town that loves sports and he is seen (as Torre was) as an honest, standup guy. A guy companies would want to hawk their products.
Its not like that in other markets. So, you can’t rip the media on one side and take advantage of the media and endorsement opportunities on the other side.
In other words, Girardi makes money because of how he is viewed in the media.
Girardi isn’t a virgin here. He was IN the media for God’s Sake. He knows how the beat works.
None of the beat guys are asking him to give them info that will change the course of a pennant race.
However, when you see a guy hasn’t pitched much, its a logical question to ask if he is ok.
There are so many ways to answer that question other than doing it the way Girardi has done it this year.
Its not the media’s job NOT to ask him the question. Its Girardi’s job to handle the question better.
This isn’t exactly Watergate. Yet, like too many control freak type of guys, Girardi continues to handle this the wrong way.
I really hope somebody with the Yankees pulls him aside and offers some assistance in dealing with this in a better way.
He’s taking a minor thing and turning it into a bigger problem (vis a vie, his creditibility) and its completely unnecessary.
“Turn Two, no need to throw insults here…”
sorry if you perceive that to be a personal insult… i meant to throw that out there as more of a rhetorical question.
“What is an issue is that Marte contradicted what Girardi said. Shouldn’t the manager & his players be on the same page?”
im just not reading more into it than Girardi saying he was ok, and Marte saying he wasnt right, but feels better.
i dont think there is any dissention amongst the ranks here or anything like that, where Marte feels he needs to be honest, and shows up his manager or anything like that.
Here’s the problem with Pete’s line of reasoning – I as a fan don’t really think that Girardi is a fool if he tells Pete that they don’t have a plan for Joba or that Damaso Marte is fine.
I only think he’s a fool if he makes mistakes that hurt the teams performance on the field. (Like leaving Moose in to face Manny). The comparisons with Art Howe miss the mark for the same reason – Art Howe lost credibility with the fans because the Mets fell apart, not because he handled PR incorrectly.
That said I really didn’t think that Pete ‘took a shot’ at Girardi in the article. The negative attitude toward Girardi’s press relations is usually confined to the blog and the fact that there is a point of view to the blog is what makes it fun imo.
The Yankees don’t exactly look to be a shining example of a rock steady team though… just saying.
Girardi can be J. Edgar Hoover with the media, and it won’t mean squat if he wins. IIRC, Girardi was the only player that wouldn’t talk to Buster Olney for his book, “The Last Night of the Yankee Dynsaty.” (A night on which I’m sure Buster was overjoyed.)
After all, the Patriots head coach was caught illegally videotaping other teams, didn’t exactly come clean, and is still heralded as a genius and mentioned in the same breath as Lombardi.
“Joe Girardi was the only player that wouldn’t talk to Buster Olney for his book,”
That surprises me b/c backup catchers seem to be a beat reporters best friend – smart guys with little to do on game days. Maybe there was some beef between them? Who knows?
As far as the Yanks not looking rock-steady – they seem like a pretty professional, buttoned up outfit to me. Even A-Rod hasn’t said anything back-page worthy this year and the biggest on-field problem is Robbie Cano’s immaturity and inconsistency – which will work itself out imo.
The filter keeps eating my eloquent response –
With the team now needing to scratch and claw for every win, they’re better off right now to send Rasner to the pen as long relief, send down Britton, and bring up Chase Wright to cover Rasner’s next start vs. the Jays. No 40- man roster changes needed, Wright is on the 40-man already.
I think Peter has a legitimate gripe when it comes to Girardi lying about injuries. He has been caught lying too many times to count and it’s only been one season. It doesn’t serve any purpose either. Its not like the team is getting a competitive edge when he lies about an injury. I think Pete has become a little anti-Girardi in all things because of his Joe’s lying. Thats a bit unfair but its totally fine with me that Pete takes everything Girardi says about injuries with a grain of salt.
Its pretty obvious Joe is learning on the job. How many months did it take him to realize that going with a consistent lineup is a good idea?
I like the way Joe has handled the bullpen and for the most part he does a good job making in-game decisions. However he has definitely made some mistakes in his first year and handling the media is one of them. Hopefully he can improve on that next year.
“Here’s the problem with Pete’s line of reasoning – I as a fan don’t really think that Girardi is a fool if he tells Pete that they don’t have a plan for Joba or that Damaso Marte is fine.”
i couldn’t agree more.
i once had an email go round with bob ryan of the globe. he was bashing nomar when he left the red sox. i sent him an email saying that he should show some respect to a player like nomar. i basically said that the game belongs to players like nomar and that writers and fans are along for the ride.
we got into a heated back and forth on who owned the game. i said it’s the player’s game. he said it’s the writers and fans because they love it more. he said the writers were the “keepers” of the game.
i respectively still disagree. it’s the players game. reporters who have a false sense of their place in the game can come up with all kinds of crazy attitudes towards players, managers, and coaches.
but really who cares? i’d rather read a box score any day than any reporter’s description of a game .
i figure reporters are reporters because they write well, not because they understand what they are writing about.
“It is not far-fetched in this particular incidence for the Yankees to not know for sure how the rehab is going to progress. There are more than likely a few contingencies based upon how the last rehab session went and whether or not the pitcher experiences any setbacks.”
doreen -
this is called “the haze of war” when the crap hits the fan and things are going too fast to go by the original plan. i actually think cashman is at his best when he wings it. he’s pretty good at scrambling.
of course he has to be because his plans usually stink.
I mind about JoeG’s lying to the media only because it is an indicator of either stupidity or poor judgment on his part.
JoeT’s saying “We’ll know more about that next week” gave out no more information but it kept the info close to the vest without disrespecting the writer or his readers. And JoeT gave the beat guys something else to write about with his endless anecdotes and quotes. So they got what they needed to do their job and he got the space he needed to do his. And the press did less digging around among the players because they were mostly satisfied with what they got from the manager.
Not saying JoeG needs to tell all. Just saying there’s ways and ways to do things, and JoeG’s way antagonizes all of the press and some of the fans. Does he really need the agita? Does the team?
you know what was great? when people used to actually discuss baseball here instead of constantly debating Pete’s little crusade against Girardi’s injury reports.
did you ever notice that this is the ONLY major yankee blog that spends this much time on this “issue”?
why is that?
b/c no one really cares until Pete TELLS you to care about it.
here is a quote from the Larry Bowa, the guy that everyone wishes was still here, and a guy that still works for Joe Torre:
gododgers8: Coach, do you have any aspirations to manage again?
Bowa: You know what? Not really. I like working for Joe. And when you’re coaching, you teach more. When you’re managing, there are too many other things that you have to take care of that don’t have anything to do with the game — dealing with the media, keeping things hush-hush if a guy’s hurt. It’s much easier teaching kids about being better players
wait, keeping things “hush-hush if a guy’s hurt”???? the great Larry Bowa just admitted that others engage in the same type of cheap media chicanery that the evil Joe Girardi does??
impossible.
seriously, who gives a crap?
you guys spend WAAAAAAY too much energy legitimizing such a stupid issue.
the red sox would be in bad shape for starters if they didn’t have byrd going in the series.
why is that again why cashman didn’t pick him up to help the yankees and hurt the red sox?
“seriously, who gives a crap?”
not me.
i’m sending all my brain neurons to figuring out how the yankees can sweep this next series with the red sox.
why is that again why cashman didn’t pick him up to help the yankees and hurt the red sox?
Byrd with the Red Sox:
13.3 IP, 16 Hits, 8 ERs, 4(!) HRs, 5.40 ERA
seems to me like Byrd is doing just fine hurting the Red Sox on his own.
yes, Rasner is also not very good. but it’s basically a “pick your poison” scenario here.
hmmm,
I totally agree. That’s why I have a problem with Peter’s agendas – such as against Girardi, ARod, and Edwar – because way too many people echo them.
Those other blogs are just a click away.
Wonder why they’re relatively deserted in comparison with this one?
I just find it somewhat funny that before the season the media loved the idea of making Girardi look to be Billy Martin part 2, and now that it seems as if Girardi’s personality is somewhat mirroring Martin in regards to handling the media, they don’t like him all that much.
Girardi will just have to do what Martin did to get the media off his back, grab a drink and win a world series, lol
For those who say Pete has an agenda, what is his agenda, exactly? Does he want Girardi to get fired?
“Byrd with the Red Sox:
13.3 IP, 16 Hits, 8 ERs, 4(!) HRs, 5.40 ERA
seems to me like Byrd is doing just fine hurting the Red Sox on his own.”
see, this is where one of my pet theories of baseball comes in. the 13.3 innings is for two games. he went 7 innings and 6 innings. that’s innings eating.
it saves the bullpen. and if someone else were in there( in the bad shape the sox rotation is in) that pitcher would likely be even worse.
what if buccholz were forced to start? or some other rookie from triple a without experience in big games. byrd won’t choke against the yankees( he might stink but not because he’s nervous). a rookie might.
i think the byrd pick up by the red sox may end up being a difference maker for them.
i hope not, but i’m concerned about it.
(thanks for the on field baseball talk)
“i figure reporters are reporters because they write well, not because they understand what they are writing about.”
Very well said Randy.
I guess there’s not much to talk about on an off-day huh ?
For those who say Pete has an agenda, what is his agenda, exactly? Does he want Girardi to get fired?
his agenda is to increase the hits on his blog.
and there is nothing wrong with that.
but he simply throws out the red meat, and then all you guys spend hours debating it. over and over.
it’s kindof hilarious that Yankee fans actually think Girardi should announce that the only left hander in his bullpen may be unavailable.
just like it was hilarious to think that Girardi should have been more forthcoming about the seriousness of Posada’s injury in the days leading up to the trade deadline. yes, it was BS that Posada was ever going to consider rehabbing his shoulder and return this season. that was likely NEVER going to happen. but why announce that when you are trying to trade for a RH bat?
use a little critical thinking instead of just swallowing everything Pete feeds you.
Eh this same garbage would be discussed even if we were in the middle of a playoff series Phelps, lol People like to argue.
haha,
Touche O’Neil.
Do you folks know what Pete does for a living? He’s not a crazed stalker fan. He’s a beat writer assigned to the New York Yankees. Do you suppose he has a slightly more informed opinion of how a major league baseball manager is supposed to deal with the media than the rest of the brain surgeons who post on this blog?
“Rasner is also not very good. but it’s basically a “pick your poison†scenario here.”
No question that Rasner struggled yesterday, but was anyone watching I-Rod call that game? I try and watch where the catcher sets up and if the pitcher is hitting his spots. The pitch Mora hit for the HR was exactly where I-Rod called for it – right in Mora’s sweet spot.
I-Rod, IMO, at this point in his career is a below average catcher with little ability to ‘read’ what the pitcher has on a given day and what the hitters are trying to do. Until Eiland came out and apparently said something, every pitch he called for was away. The batters were able to basically disregard 1/3 to 1/2 of the SZ. You can say all you want about how his hitting is a big improvement over Molina (really?) and that his ability to throw out runners is on par with Jose (really?), but this guy should in no way be seen as the NYY #1 catcher. He is a real liability at this point, especially since he is being used with the pitchers with the smallest margin for error.
Phelps,
Not much to talk about as far as the Yankees, at least until we get TMZ updates from various Starbucks locations around the country.
But I’m looking at today’s schedule and the only 2 teams of interest that are playing today are the White Sox and Minnesota.
Looks like the White Sox are visiting the O’s, but they’ve got to finish a suspended game. Ironically, George Sherrill was pitching in the bottom of the 11th. After they finish that game, 2 guys I’ve never heard of will start the regular game.
Minny goes to Seattle. No chance there. Liriano v. Batista. There’s a better chance Chicago loses 2 today than Seattle beats Liriano with Batista.
what’s Wang up to these days? Has he even started throwing?
Mel,
I just hope that if we don’t make the playoffs, 2 teams from the central make it. Hope the White Sox & Twins handle their business so the Res Sux can be left out.
I realllllyyyyy want the Red Sux not to make the playoffs.
I think thats cause i live in Massachusetts.
The Yankees rotation right now is: Mussina, Pettitte, Ponson, Pavano, Rasner. Before the season started many of us thought Mussina would be out of the rotation by July, now he’s our #1 starter. Even if the Yankees somehow scratch and claw their way into the playoffs theres no way that rotation does well. Maybe if Joba can come back they will have a shot.
The Yankees still control their own destiny. They have several games left against the white sox and red sox, if they can keep winning they still have a chance.
Rob L.
Pete did a Q&A with him about a week ago. He watches all the games on tv. I think he used to ride in with Melky (?) and watch the home games, too. He’s out of the boot, but no baseball activities.
It must be killing him to be out. I know it’s killing me. It’ll be a different scene when he comes back. If we land CC or Burnett (!) Wang would actually be our #3 IMO.
Do you folks know what Pete does for a living?
what is your point? what does Mike Lupica do for a living? Joel Sherman? Steve Phillips? George King? Mike Francessa?
don’t get me wrong, i am NOT putting Pete in the same category as those other guys. not at all.
but the fact that he is a paid reporter doesn’t really prove anything.
“No question that Rasner struggled yesterday, but was anyone watching I-Rod call that game? I try and watch where the catcher sets up and if the pitcher is hitting his spots. The pitch Mora hit for the HR was exactly where I-Rod called for it – right in Mora’s sweet spot.”
Tough to criticize a catcher for something we know absolutely nothing about. What if Irod wanted that pitch in the dirt? Should he start on his knees with his glove on the plate? You can criticize Pudge for his hitting (although its still a very small sample size) but catching is something we don’t know much about, he does.
the fact the yankees have to worry about the twins for the wild card is because the twins went 14 -9 with livan hernandez pitching for them.
that’s what innings eating does for you.
i guarantee if the twins make the playoffs, the players will vote a full share of all playoff money to livan.
the yankees absolutely have to get a few of these kinds of pitchers next year.
“Not much to talk about as far as the Yankees, at least until we get TMZ updates from various Starbucks locations around the country.”
Thanks for the laugh Mel.
My point is that he, apparently, knows that there is a difference between nuance and lying. Nuance is saying “we need more info” or “I don’t know” or esentially, no comment” (like Torre would do) and lying is, well, lying.
One is an acceptable way to keep one’s cards close to one’s vest. The other makes you lose credibility.
Randy I get your innings argument, but I think you need to let the Livan Hernandez go. Livan had an era+ with minnesota of 75. Compared to say Rasner with the yankees whose era+ is 85. Rasner is about 25 innings behind Livan now, which is probably made up in the difference of a month that Rasner spent in AAA.
Livan did give the twins innings, but how many of those innings were “quality”. His record is meaningless to me, and by looking at his numbers, his “production” was easily replaceable by someone else. Heck how many innings did they waste on Hernandez when they could have been going to Liriano?
randy l -
Maybe the Yankees need two GMs – Cashman for the “haze of war,” and someone else who’s a little better at longer-term planning.
If Pavano can progress in his next start so that he can be a 6/7 inning pitcher, perhaps that can be the Yankees’ answer to Byrd.
But if Beckett is injured more so than the Red Sox are letting on, I’d call the teams about even these days.
One is an acceptable way to keep one’s cards close to one’s vest. The other makes you lose credibility.
winning brings credibility.
it’s that simple.
all this other crap is white noise.
Rasner’s a good guy, but he’s just so hittable. The ball must look like a volleyball coming out of his hand. He jumped out of the gate and it’s been downhill since (he did well against Toronto, tho).
Anyone know if Chase Wright lines up with Daryl?
“Tough to criticize a catcher for something we know absolutely nothing about.”
Watched the game on MASN to get a perspective from other than the YES wizards. Jim Palmer does the analysis there. One would think he knows something about pitching and catching.
He was really critical of I-Rod’s calls, both with Ponson and Rasner, and in one particular instance yesterday where he called for a pitch that resulted in a line drive down the 3rd base line when the defense (Nady) was shaded to center, he said I-Rod really needed to get his head in the game.
Okay thats fine, Jim Palmer is definitely a more credible source (I have no way to access MASN though). If Palmer could tell me that Pudge has been bad since he’s come to NY, I’d listen. But I’m not going to call Pudge ‘below average” after one game. I’m sure its not easy catching Rasner since Pudge really isn’t catching many balls (okay bad joke, I was tryign to say Rasner is so hittable).
But I look at what Pudge did with nursing Pavano through his start, and he’s had a lot of success with Ponson (and Rasner on Tuesday), its tough for me to say the evidence is there that he’s terrible.
” His record is meaningless to me, and by looking at his numbers, his “production†was easily replaceable by someone else.”
you say that, but is it really true? players love playing behind a guy like livan. they’re on their toes( partially so they don’t get killed by baseballs accelerated at a high rate of speed) and they’re in the game. both on offense and defense.
the wins are not a surprise. it’s part of the hidden game of baseball.
the twins knew what they were doing and they rode livan right into liriano and now have a rotation way better than the yankees.
I think Wright has earned a spot start this year. Funny I’m not a big Wright fan myself, but for some reason people really don’t like him around here. I mean he’s 1-1 in his career in the majors. His first game he was okay, but did enough to get the win. His second start obviously was a nightmare with the 4 hrs in a row. And then after that, poof, he’s gone.
Granted if he ever does anything in the majors its a 5th starter at best, most likely a lefty specialist or long reliever. But with his AAA numbers, the Yankees could do worse. Give me a shot if the situation calls for it.
thanks mel…
randy l,
What would his share look like? Pizza Hut for a year? Subway?
The only thing that concerns me about Byrd is beating him this week.
I do find it ironic, though, that the Sox were the winning bidders.
Agent: Paul! How ya doing? Great news!
Paul: Oh yeah? The good Lord answered my prayers? Who is it? The White Sox? Minnesota?
Agent: No way, Paulie Boy. You hit the jackpot! Think ring.
Paul: The Angels? Thank you, Lord!
Agent: No, no, Paul. You’re going to Boston. The Red Sox think you can put them over the edge…Hello?…Paul?….Are you there?
I heard Wang said he might throw down in FL sometime next month but for the Yanks this season is out of the equation. Funny but I remember back in June it was a 6-8 week layoff. Injury fabrications once again!!!
kidding, kidding!!
Rasner always seems to know when he needs to make adjustments. The problem is that he can’t go more than 4 games without falling out of wack somehow. He’s been decent as a 5th but the last turn of the rotation really exposed it for what it is. It’s going to be a near impossible climb. Hopefully the bats will remain awake for the Sox series. Looks like they’ll be facing Burnett and Halladay next weekend. Yikes! Just how many extra wins do you think think the Yanks would have if they had Halladay? It seems like they would gain at least 4 just by him not pitching against them.
“the twins knew what they were doing and they rode livan right into liriano and now have a rotation way better than the yankees”
You may be right, but i think Nick Blackburn, Kevin Slowey & Glen Perkins have something to do with that also.
“the twins knew what they were doing and they rode livan right into liriano and now have a rotation way better than the yankees.”
Randy I’m sure the twins players prefer to win more than being on their toes. They have a better chance to win with Liriano, not Livan.
As for the Twins rotation being better, I think that’s debatable. They have a nice mix of young strike throwers, but nobody that you feel confident giving the ball to in a big game. They have a collection of “good” pitchers, aside from Liriano.
While the Yankee rotation currently is somewhat pasted together, there’s still a lot of upside there (short-term) I mean. If these two teams matched up in the playoffs, I’d take the Yankee rotation in a heartbeat.
And you also have to figure, this is the twins rotation, this is what they want out there. for the Yankees, this is a patchwork rotation, one that has been hit by injuries. When you throw in Wang, Joba and Hughes, the Yankee rotation is far better looking then what the twins have to offer.
“If these two teams matched up in the playoffs, I’d take the Yankee rotation in a heartbeat.”
Assuming all our guys are healthy right ?
Well yeah I should have phrased that better. I would obviously take a fully healthy Yankee rotation instead.
Now I think Randy is saying the rotations as they currently are. Still I think I’d take the Yankee rotation, especially in a 5 game series.
If I get to include Joba, then it makes it even sweeter, since Joba, Pettitte and Mussina looks better to me than Liriano, Blackburn & Slowey.
The twins have a nice rotation don’t get me wrong, but its slighly above average. They don’t walk anyone, but they don’t blow you away either.
“You may be right, but i think Nick Blackburn, Kevin Slowey & Glen Perkins have something to do with that also.”
this is how having livan on the team helped the twins young pitchers:
http://www.twincities.com/ci_9.....ost_viewed
“We thought getting Livan here would be a big plus because of the experience he brings,” Smith said Thursday. “He’s been through more on and off the field in his life, as a Cuban defector and all that; he’s been through the World Series; and in 10 years he’s never been on the disabled list.
“He goes out and pitches, and we thought he would be a good influence on our young staff. He has done that. Our young guys have responded.”
randy l,
Can you tell us more about your beach volleyball career? That’s much more interesting than Liriano.
As they are now, i’d take the Twins rotation. Liriano is better than Moose
& I would take all the Twins’ young guys over alot of underachieving & overachieving guys (Ponson) Give or take which Petitte shows up.
“Imagine what they’re saying in the clubhouse.”
I imagine they’re saying “let’s go out and get a win!”
People have differing opinions on this subject matter. I tend to stack up with Clare and hmmmm on this one (and anyone else who has echoed their comments.)
While I can understand why Pete and other reporters are looking for straightforward information, I can also understand that Girardi’s main job is not to meet with reporters so they can get information for their stories but to run a team and try to win games. So since I am not a reporter but a mere fan, I really don’t care what Girardi says and what his motivation for saying it is. I care that he does what he feels is right to win games. Period. But it doesn’t mean I don’t understand why Pete may be upset about it. It just means that I’m not particularly upset about it. I mean it isn’t like Girardi is lying to Congress about an issue of international import. If he has a reason to keep things close to the vest he does.
I might submit to you that if part of his reason is to keep information away from other teams, responses such as “no comment” and “we’re not sure” might be as much of a tip off as saying someone is not available to play.
I don’t see Girardi as an outright liar. Therefore I think he must have his reasons. That doesn’t help Pete and the other reporters, but it is what it is.
Okay Randy but now you’re getting into off the field influences. We were talking about his contributions on the field. THe Yankees don’t need to bring him in for his off the field leadership. We already have that with Pettitte and Mussina.
So for the Yankees, we are talking strictly on the field results. And going by the numbers he’s really not much of an upgrade over Rasner.
randy l ,
Are you campaigning for Livan next year or something ?
That’s fair Phelps, its close right now I’ll give you that.
Personally I’m including Joba because it sounds as if he’ll pitch again. I like Joba over Liriano, but thats really a toss up. And I’d take Mussina and Pettitte against Blackburn and Slowey.
O’Neill,
Yea it depends which Petitte shows up, & how well you think their young guns can handle pressure.
It’s really a toss up, but i see most people taking the Twins.
“Why should the sportswriters “forgive†Joe as you suggest they should when his behavior hasn’t changed at all since he last apologized for it?”
What is that Joe has to change?
He does not have to change any thing to please a very minority of the writers who are irrational. Also, who are the other writers day in and day out harping about Joe not sharing info? Name a few please, with specific evidence.
Yanks want to be careful with Joba and every thing Mel wrote about it is correct. If they share whatever plan they have and then it does not pan out, then these irrational writers can say Girardi lied about it. He can never win with these guys.
The bottom line is if the Yanks perfrom well, nobody gives a damn about this kind of whining. If the Yanks do not perform well over a long period, say next year as well, then Girardi will get fired.
If the two rotations are within a stone’s throw of each other, I give the edge to the Yankees in a playoff series. Because they’re the Yankees. That’s a lot of rookie pitching for the Twins to throw out there in a playoff series.
Standing O’neil, sounds like you’re thinking Wang would be available in the playoffs. I don’t think that’s an option at all.
O/T but has anyone mentioned that Shaq was issued a TRO for stalking a woman? I hate Shaq, but I hope that’s not true. It hasn’t really hit the mainstream news cycle yet. I guess there’s too much stuff going on right now.
Good god, Randy…give the Livan Hernadez crap a rest. The Twins won those games in spite of Hernandez, not because of him. Rasner and Ponson have pitched better than Hernandez did.
BBFan,
Can I ask if you’re a female?
“Even a simple “I don’t know†or “we’re not sure on that yet†would suffice.”
I wish it is that simple.
If Girardi says he does not know, these media vultures will kill him saying he does not even know what is going on with key players.
“It’s really a toss up, but i see most people taking the Twins.”
Yeah it all depends on how high your opinion is of the young guys. Like I said I like them, but I need to see more. The scouting reports on them are basically what we’ve seen so far, so I don’t see them getting all that better.
Humberto Sanchez has been promoted to Tampa A
“Can I ask if you’re a female?”
Mel, I will not answer that question as I do not believe it is relevant for the discussion. Sorry about that.
“Standing O’neil, sounds like you’re thinking Wang would be available in the playoffs. I don’t think that’s an option at all.”
Nah no Wang Mel. I think he’s definitely done for the year. I’m thinking more along the lines of Pettitte, Mussina, Joba and a 4th guy (Hughes, Rasner, Ponson, Pavano).
And yeah true on Shaq, I like the guy, hope this is nothing serious.
“Can you tell us more about your beach volleyball career? That’s much more interesting than Liriano. ”
well, first of all i was a legend in my own mind. at least that’s what my friends said.
i was part of a very cool intense hotbed of beach volley ball at siesta key, fl from the early eighties to mid nineties. there was a core group of about 20-30 guys. we played everyday from early am to sunset. there was never not a winner’s game going on court one. and it took years to get good enough to play on court one.
players from the avp tour led by sinjin smith and randy stoklas started coming for a few weeks every winter stealing our girlfriends and drinking our beer, but it was an acceptable trade off because it raised the game to an even higher level.
many of the top players the women’s tour spent a month there getting in shape for the florida swing. gabriella reese , while in college,played in our tournaments and never won one. our best female always beat her.
ii was pure sport played for the fun and competition. i’ll throw up some photos of the scene back then some night and provide a link for you.
The thing that bothers me most about Girardi not telling the truth is that it shows contempt for us fans as well as the writers and other media folk. When you lie about insignificant things it comes under the assumption that you are stupid.
Take the issue with Marte. It was easy to prove that Girardi was lying. Why do that? I don’t think the writers are looking to get secret plans or give other teams an advantage. What purpose does it serve to say he is fine when he can’t be brought in the game? Baseball managers don’t spend a lot of time on worrying about one relief pitcher. They have the information on every one of these pitchers – how and what they throw – and one of the coaches goes through it with the players when they come in.
Liars always think they are smarter than you. They think they can pull a fast one on you.
Girardi is playing a stupid game with them for no real advantage. Torre didn’t give up every bit of information either, but giving SOME real information can defuse having to disclose all or being painted as dishonest. When a person has been caught in a lie repeatedly you lose respect and trust in them. You second guess EVERYTHING they say because they are so willing to lie about the little things.
Girardi is building a bad reputation here. Nothing good will come from that. He doesn’t have to open the door to the inner workings, just be honest enough rather than out right lie.
“Humberto Sanchez has been promoted to Tampa A”
Thanks for the update Brandon.
Lately we did not hear any thing about him and I was wondering if he was hurt again.
He will be a key member next year as a starter or bullpen arm.
BBFan,
No problem.
I have a theory that’s two-fold.
In general, the support for and the gripes about Girardi are split along gender lines.
Also, the guys seem to get really bent out shape about any perceived deception on Girardi’s part. The females seem to be okay with stretching the truth for the greater good.
Humberto is throwning 93-95 mph, Nardi has told him to can the change up this year. He is fastball/curveball they say he will finish this season on a playoff team whether it’s Trenton or Scranton is yet unknown but he is said to be 90 %, this could be a big push to AAA then NY.
randy l,
Cool! We’d much rather see pix of Gabby than hear about Livan’s appettite.
You sound old. Gabby and Laird are ancient in my book.
BBFan, the reason why the media wouldn’t buy the no comment or we’ll know better in a week comment now from Girardi is because of all the lies he has been caught in. He treated the media like fools, now its payback time.
i doubt we’ll see Humberto anywhere near NY this season, unless its a cameo appearance just to show him what the big league clubhouse is like for next season.
“The thing that bothers me most about Girardi not telling the truth is that it shows contempt for us fans as well as the writers and other media folk. When you lie about insignificant things it comes under the assumption that you are stupid.”
But on the flip side (although this is impossible to really prove) say Girardi comes out and tells the media Marte’s hurt and he won’t pitch. Then late in the game a manager is comfortable pinch hitting with his best lefty, knowing Marte can’t come in. The lefty gets a hit against the weaker righty and the team loses. The fans will roast Girardi for losing and for giving away a information.
Managers lie, the media and the fans (especially the fans) need to get over it. And btw I’m male.
“Take the issue with Marte. It was easy to prove that Girardi was lying. Why do that?”
You have the right to interpret the way you want, I have no qualms with that.
But the fact is the day after the question was asked to Girardi, Marte pitched 1.1 innings of excellent relief. That is good enough for me to believe what Girardi said.
Mel, what “greater good” is there in saying a player is fine when he isn’t being used due to day to day injury?
The end result is that the player isn’t used, the media was. It didn’t positively effect a games outcome from Marte’s injury being kept secret.
With Girardi unable to be trusted at his word, where is the greater good in that?
I can take it more if he understates things. To lie about it though is wrong. It give no advantage. None.
every manager has different ways of divulging information.
TurnTwo they wouldn’t tell a prospect not going to the majors to can thier 3rd pitch, his velocity is up and Humberto could make a big push to NY w/ the final month. Remember if he’s near 100 % this is a guy that can motor through the minors. The article saids he will finish the Tampa A season then move up to a playoff team AA or AAA, what he does there will determine if he comes up to NY.
Girardi lied by saying there was nothing wrong, period. That is different from saying “he felt a bit tired and we wanted to give him some rest”. Same outcome in terms of production, but huge difference in perception to the media and fans about Girardi.
With Girardi making the statement that Marte was fine, it then implied that he had no trust in the guy. Which does more harm?
I heard Girardi on the radio last night saying how Osi Umenyiora is fine and should be back in 2 weeks.
He said 50% of the NFL has torn knee cartilage.
Mac,
lol. I should’ve just left it at “have no problem with stretching the truth”.
I’m not going to get into any debates, but I will say that I’m not opposed to sports teams playing coy.
“BBFan, the reason why the media wouldn’t buy the no comment or we’ll know better in a week comment now from Girardi is because of all the lies he has been caught in. He treated the media like fools, now its payback time.”
See, Girardi has shown he is positive thinking guy, probalby goes overboard with it. I do not see that as lies.
Yes, he had an issue at one time and patched things up. After that no other writer has criticised Girardi that he is not telling the truth. Even Pete does not do it in his news paper article. I sincerely believe Pete does it on this blog to have this kind of provocative discussion, and I am ok with it.
When I think of this Girardi lying business, I think about last year when the Joba Rules were divulged. I forget if it was Torre or Cash who told the media about them, but whoever it was, the other was a bit miffed because now the opponent knew when Joba was available and when he wasn’t.
While Girardi could and should go about his “lying” in a better, more appropriate manner, I can sort of understand where he’s coming from. Pete made a comment yesterday, though, that he should just say “hey, this is off the record,” or “no comment on that.” He may be at the point now, though, that “off the record” won’t work.
Standing O’Neill, that doesn’t make any sense whatsoever. If the pitcher can’t come in, he can’t come in. That is with fore knowledge or not. The results aren’t going to change. Being that we only have one lefty relief pitcher it means even less. They have gotten by without a lefty for a half the season. Unless you think Traber is effective.
not to stir up this discussion (because I have been trying to ignore it since yesterday), but why do we as fans think we have the right/need to know a player’s injury status? Unless you are betting on the games or need to know for fantasy baseball, what actual difference does it make to you?
mel-
what i really like about beach volleyball was if you talked smack you had to go out and back it up or look like a fool.
players learned to be careful what they said because there was always someone who could beat you.
Andrea,
I believe Cashman was upset that the rules got out. I recall hearing him on the Michael Kay show, and he really wasn’t happy, rightfully so. A lot of sports is about desception. If a guy is on your roster and active, you can say whatever you want, since the other team has no knowledge.
Now taking it to the extreme would be someone like Bill Belichek, where a guy will be on the inactive list, and he won’t even tell you what is wrong with him. I think Girardi is just trying to find a line in between, which is fine.
The media may not like him, but as hmmm said, if the team starts winning, no one will care anymore.
Finishing the season with 3 at Fenway could be pivotal. Division win is unlikely and the team’s 5 out in the WC.
Sox are starting to fall apart with injuries, and the pitching matchups are pretty favorable for us this week.
With the exception of that hot streak after the all-star break, the Yanks are still a .500 team as some here have pointed out in the past.
Hopefully Boston will find a way to hand it to us again just like old times. I’d rather not go into that final 3 game series and be 2-3 games behind them .. being ahead by at least 3 is the line to shoot for. Win the three Sox games this week, then make up one game per week to be up by 3 going into the final series at Fenway.
I still think it doesn’t look good for us right now, being 5 out for the WC with about 5 weeks to go, but with help from Boston/Minny/ChiSox there’s a shot.
BBFan,
This is from Pete, ““Claimed†is a word being used by a lot of New York papers in Yankee stories these days, unfortunately.” That tells me they’re all frustrated.
I started this whole thing because I something jumped out at me on the newspaper side. Pete says a lot of outrageous stuff on the blog and it doesn’t bother me because he has a lot of leeway.
Girardi was forthright with all the major injuries— Hughes, Joba, Wang, Matsui, Arod, Posada, (when he explained why he wasn’t at C for a while), Rivera (when he wasn’t available) etc. almost immediately or when the results came back the next day.
If he holds back on releasing information on lesser players like Marte for strategic reasons, what does it matter?
Remember how ticked Cashman got when the Joba rules were made public last year?
“Also, the guys seem to get really bent out shape about any perceived deception on Girardi’s part. The females seem to be okay with stretching the truth for the greater good.”
Mel, stated another way, certain posters (since we already know that there are male and female on both sides, or so it seems) have an unrealistic sense of entitlement, while certain other posters understand Girardi has a job to do and also understand he may have reasons unknown to the unentitled for keeping things close to the vest.
Anyway, you might remember that this blog was up in arms and Pete incited a near riot when he suggested that Joba’s injury was much worse than it ended up being, suggesting that if it wasn’t something horrible, Joba wouldn’t be going to Andrews, yada yada yada. The blog drank the kool aid and it was doom, gloom, and pandemonium for two days – until we found out GIRARDI DID NOT LIE when he said he didn’t think the injury was going to be anything serious since Joba was not in pain and his velocity hadn’t gone down.
See, those are intelligent baseball observations but people here were looking for spies behind every rock. When you do that, I think you tend to find them!
As it turns out, Joba’s injury was not serious or injury ending, nor did it require surgery. The Yankees were merely being cautious, as they should be.
So there are two sides to every coin.
Girardi is just fine with me. Since I don’t manage the team or make decisions on who will be out on the field on any given day, I really don’t need the information.
In fact, I think it’s kind of cool that he keeps things close to the vest.
This is what I say to reporters: go and report on the game, and wait until a manager is damned good and ready to give you information on a player. You have enough to write about without worrying about injuries. That’s the manager’s job.
Something like that.
(By the way, have you ever been treated to an after-game interview where Girardi isn’t ready to give out information and the press vultures decide they want it anyway. Try being Girardi for a day.
“Standing O’Neill, that doesn’t make any sense whatsoever. If the pitcher can’t come in, he can’t come in. That is with fore knowledge or not. The results aren’t going to change. Being that we only have one lefty relief pitcher it means even less. They have gotten by without a lefty for a half the season. Unless you think Traber is effective.”
a) Traber is terrible.
b) I think you missed what I was shooting at. The opposing manager may have no idea if marte is healthy or not, but if he’s out in the that bullpen he’d have to believe he can pitch. So say in a big spot said manager needs to pinch hit, and he can go with his average righty hitter or above average lefty hitter (but who can’t hit lefties). If that manager knows marte can’t pitch, he’ll go with the lefty for sure.
$13, there’s nothing wrong with showing contempt for the media. They’ve been showing contempt for the truth since the first media maggot appeared. If they can’t find a story, they invent one. Sports media is the worst of the lot. Most have never played the game above sandlot…never mind Little League. The worst of the bunch are NY and Boston sports writers. Somebody earlier listed two of NY’s worst hacks…Dick Young and Henry Hecht. Perhaps the worst of the bunch was Jimmy Cannon. He’s the one most responsible for villifying Mantle earlier in his career and later, found a new target in Roger Maris. Maris’ crime…when Cannon posed questions to Maris, who was feeling down because of the flu and a slump, Maris said, “Not now, Jimmy. Maybe tomorrow.”
Cannon launched a three week attack on what a jerk Maris was and that he had no right to be playing right field for the Yankees. Cannon, Oscar Fraley and Ford Frick were all writers and drinking buddies of Babe Ruth (Frick was baseball commissioner, then and Fraley, who wrote “The Untouchables”, felt that it was their duty to protect Ruth’s legacy from Mantle and Maris).
The media isn’t some group of priviledge royals. Part of their job is to write the information and the truth….the real truth…not what they want the truth to be. The other part of that job is to increase revenue for the media outlets that hired them.
“they wouldn’t tell a prospect not going to the majors to can thier 3rd pitch, his velocity is up and Humberto could make a big push to NY w/ the final month. Remember if he’s near 100 % this is a guy that can motor through the minors. The article saids he will finish the Tampa A season then move up to a playoff team AA or AAA, what he does there will determine if he comes up to NY.”
just my opinion, Brandon, but i just dont see it.
if he saw MLB time and had success before his surgery, then id say maybe there is a chance, like Pavano.
but not a top prospect who was the jewel of the Sheffield trade, and who they are counting on for 2009 and the near future.
and he’s gotta be second in line behind at least Melancon, who is light year’s ahead of him in terms of their rehabs. at least Melancon has proven to get out AA and AAA hitters with consistency over the last couple months.
Sanchez has how many innings… like 11 or 12 this year? and you think they are going to promote him within weeks to the MLB club for the playoff stretch run?
anybody want to save Yankee Stadium????
See new thread
“You sound old. Gabby and Laird are ancient in my book. ”
i am old.
even in those days my nickname was” grandpa”.
when an opponent would use it, i’d say at least i’d never been beaten by someone older than me (especially effective comeback when my teammate and i were whooping them).
reese wasn’t really suited to the two person game. she was too slow to cover the whole court.
Concentrating on more important things
there is a very good chance we will sweep Sox. If it happens that is great. If not, and we win the series, still it is progress and we will be 4 down with a month of basball to go.
With all the injuries Sox are having lately, out formidable competition for WC will be ChiSox or Minny.
Trisha I wish your first paragraph could be pasted at the beginning of each comment section.
“I think you missed what I was shooting at. The opposing manager may have no idea if marte is healthy or not, but if he’s out in the that bullpen he’d have to believe he can pitch. So say in a big spot said manager needs to pinch hit, and he can go with his average righty hitter or above average lefty hitter (but who can’t hit lefties). If that manager knows marte can’t pitch, he’ll go with the lefty for sure.”
Flippin brilliant. Seriously baseball fans can’t figure that stuff out? You are exactly right. There is always strategy being employed in games. Why give the other team a chance to set things up far in advance? That’s just dumb.
Standing O, I think we’re definitey on the same wavelength.
Trisha,
The master at that was Billy Martin too. Not sure if this is definitely true, but I’ve read that when the Yankees played the Royals in the ’77 playoffs, Martin sat Reggie to start the game so he could use reggie in a pinch hitting matchup that he wanted later on. Now that would be risky as all hell, but he managed to get the scenario he wanted and it worked. And the Yankees went on to win the series.
Sanchez has how many innings… like 11 or 12 this year? and you think they are going to promote him within weeks to the MLB club for the playoff stretch run?
I know Turn2, I know but ask yourself why would they tell him to can the changeup, if he’s not coming up it would be better longterm for him to use the change up. Out of the PP report it saids his curveball is back to about 90 % and the control is almost as good as it was before the surgery. Turn2 my thinking here he is not canning the change up w/o another purpose, someone in this FO thinks he can move quickly this year.
“I know Turn2, I know but ask yourself why would they tell him to can the changeup, if he’s not coming up it would be better longterm for him to use the change up.”
it was my understanding at the beginning of the season that he was planned to rehab as a bullpen guy this year anyway, and that they might view him long term as a back of the bullpen option. that would explain scrapping the changeup.
i know where you’re coming from, but i just think you’re reading too much into it.
if billy were alive, i would pay money to see pete interview martin and then call him a liar on the blog.
Girardi lied by saying there was nothing wrong, period. That is different from saying “he felt a bit tired and we wanted to give him some restâ€. Same outcome in terms of production, but huge difference in perception to the media and fans about Girardi
wrong.
if Girardi said he was “a bit tired” and then Marte said his elbow had some inflammation, Pete would ABSOLUTELY hammer Girardi for the inconsistency in the stories.
i have no doubt about that.
Haha I’ll throw in on that randy.
Bottom line, the media needs to write something to get paid. The more readers they get the more money they make. Whats bound to get more attention:
1) The Yankees won today (story #20 on this topic)
or
2) Girardi is a liar.
Just look at this blog for the answer to that.
“Martin sat Reggie to start the game so he could use reggie in a pinch hitting matchup that he wanted later on.”
Billy benched Reggie because Reggie couldn’t hit Splittorff even if Splittorff told him what pitch was coming.
i know where you’re coming from, but i just think you’re reading too much into it.
I’m just also taking into account how quick they moved Bruney off his rehab and putting that times table w/ Humberto if he is lights out. That would be something if Humberto Sanchez were to move quickly this year to the Bronx. My guess is he’d be what Duaner Sanchez is for the Mets but w/ more velocity.
Well that would make more sense, thanks Fredo.
Again I was just going on what I heard. I missed the 70s but have tried to read as much as I can on it. So I’m at the mercy of word of mouth.
“it was my understanding at the beginning of the season that he was planned to rehab as a bullpen guy this year anyway, and that they might view him long term as a back of the bullpen option. that would explain scrapping the changeup.”
They’re sure using him as though he’s a pen guy. He’s thrown only 4 innings over the past 35 days. Doesn’t sound like the resume of a guy who will help the big club this year. Good to see him move up and out of the teenager league though.
Standing O:
Reggie was successfuly used as a PH in that game, but he was benched in favor of Cliff Johnson due to Splittorff’s nasty lefthandedness and Reggie’s inability to connect off it. Ole Cliffie did well that game, doubling and drawing a walk in 3 plate appearances.
“I’m just also taking into account how quick they moved Bruney off his rehab and putting that times table w/ Humberto if he is lights out.”
Bruney’s injury was a foot, no??? Plus Bruney has actually retired a major league batter in his career, right? Brandon, Sanchez has gotten such kid glove treatment in the GCL (11 IP in 2 months, 4 IP in the past 35 days) that it makes little sense to think they’d accelerate his progress to the point of being in the bigs.
Thanks again Fredo.
I incorrectly just added to the legend of Billy martin, lol.
Wasn’t Reggie in a terrible slump that series anyways. Splittorff pitching or not, benching Reggie for a game wouldn’t have been terrible. Then again that would be the equivalent of Girardi benching Arod in a playoff game vs. Boston, lol.
Fredo Corleone
August 25th, 2008 at 12:52 pm
“Martin sat Reggie to start the game so he could use reggie in a pinch hitting matchup that he wanted later on.â€
Billy benched Reggie because Reggie couldn’t hit Splittorff even if Splittorff told him what pitch was coming.
______________________________________________________
Actually, while this is accepted as the truth, there was more to it than that. Martin was trying to prove to Steinbrenner that he (Martin) could win without Steinbrenner’s Boy. Jackson was a career .274 hitter off of Splittorff, 26-05 and 3 homers, 6 doubles and 16 RBI, 20 strikeouts…not bad for somebody who couldn’t hit a pitcher even if he knew what was coming, considering Jackson hit left handed and Splittorff was a left handed pitcher.
I wonder if the Boston media is frying Terry as much as they are Joe (in NY). It seems like they keep pushing back when Josh will pitch, first it was against the Yankees, it is pushed back now, next we’ll find out he is going on the dl.
WHAT A LIAR that Terry F is.
Also the mets aren’t letting it be known how serious John Maine’s injury is. Now we hear he might be shut down for the year. LIARS THE WHOLE LOT OF THEM!
See now this is a much better discussion then whether or not Girardi is a liar, lol
***26-95 against Splittorff***
GB:
Reggie was 2 for 16 off Splittorff in 1977, including his Game 1 O’fer, and was 1 for 14 in the series before the benching. You are 100% correct about the Martin/Steinbrenner piece of it though. In the end, Billy didn’t prove what he had hoped to I guess. Good thing.
Have their ever been two bigger egos in the history of sports that have gone head to head other than George and Billy?
Jerry Jones and Jimmy Johnson? I don’t know I’m drawing a blank, it would be a good discussion.
Here’s another thought: if you want to prevaricate, make sure everyone is on the same page.
Girardi: Hey [player x], don’t let on that your arm is falling off, I just told the media that you’re weightlifting Subarus on your off day.
This would avoid Girardi looking like an idiot, when the media walks from his office to player x’s locker to watch him reattaching his arm with duct tape.
“Have their ever been two bigger egos in the history of sports that have gone head to head other than George and Billy?”
More of an “ego triangle” when you put Reggie in the picture.
Bruney’s injury was a foot, no??? Plus Bruney has actually retired a major league batter in his career, right? Brandon, Sanchez has gotten such kid glove treatment in the GCL (11 IP in 2 months, 4 IP in the past 35 days) that it makes little sense to think they’d accelerate his progress to the point of being in the bigs.
Fredo I know but I got that feeling especially hearing Nardi speak about him. I think he was close to be healthy they rushed him a bit and now he could be near 100 %, if that is true he can move up quickly.
Jenn. If you have a friend that is a Mets fan tell him/her John Maine is about to be done for the season. They can’t risk his longterm for this year.
“if you want to prevaricate…”
does it feel good ?
it’s not illegal is it?
Standing O, you could put Martin-Steinbrenner in that group, or Steinbrenner-anybody else with an ego.
randy: only if you do it under oath.