Today in The Journal News
-
- September
- 6
Brandon Morrow missed a no-hitter by four outs as the Mariners beat the Yankees. Wilson Betemit broke it up in the eighth inning.
Melky Cabrera returned to the Yankees with his career at a bit of a crossroads.
——————
Tonight was the first time I got a real sense from the players that they knew the season would end on Sept. 28 and not in the playoffs. Even guys like Derek Jeter and Johnny Damon were forced to admit that the Yankees have dug a hole there is no getting out of.
Let’s be honest, finishing in third place might be a stretch at this point. Toronto is only a half-game behind the Yankees and has much better pitching.
Tonight was the 43rd time in 141 games that the Yankees were held to two or fewer runs. It almost doesn’t seem possible. The Yankees have a run differential of +41. They finished last season at +191.
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on Saturday, September 6th, 2008 at 3:07 am by Peter Abraham.
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Peter Abraham
Can’t win em all. The playoff streak was bound to end. Its just unfortunate it had to happen the final season of YS. Here’s hoping a new streak starts with the opening of the new stadium. Look on the bright side guys, atleast now we’ll have cupholders and a jumbotron visible from any seat in the park. Whooo
Pete,
What causes Yankee’s season of loss, in your opinion?
Injury? Injury?
I can’t believe you’re calling Toronto at this point.
I also refuse to believe that the Yankees will just roll over at this point.
If you hate to lose, you’ll keep playing hard.
We’re missing a guy who had 38 wins in 2 seasons. We don’t have our veteran catcher who by the way has a pretty good bat. We don’t have our young, budding ace. And I don’t care what the other teams are doing in spite of their injuries.
There’s a lot of good things to appreciate about the Yankees. Yes, even in its current incarnation.
There’s so much hate towards these guys who are essentially the same players with the same flaws as last year. Talk about fair-weather fans. If this team hurts you so much that you have to continually trash it (not you, Pete. I know you’re just doing your job), then maybe you’d be happier following football. Please?
Reasons to the poor run output
1. Jeters playing under his career low. He has been much better of late, so that wrist injury hurt.
2. A-Rod homerun total is way down from last year. At this point he has 40 RBI’s less than last year at this time of the year. His batting avg is still high, but his hitting with risp is a huge problem
3. Posada has been out all year. His substitute, Molina,is a great defensive catcher, but it is almost not fair to compare their offensive numbers.
4. Matsui has been injured most of the year. He is a very good RBI man, and eas the teams best hitter in April/may
5. Cano has been brutal at the plate until the all star break
6. Melky has not matured. You could have lived with that if he was the only problem
Congratulations to Kei Igawa for being named Scranton/Wilkes-Barre Yankees Pitcher of the Year. He also went 7 strong innings to get the win tonight.
How is this guy not on the 40-man roster? Are they hoping someone takes him in the Rule V Draft?
I think the problem with the Yankees offense inconsistency is due to the Posada and Matsui injuries and Giambi being too streaky. This hurt Arod as he swung at some bad pitches because pitchers didn’t respect what was batting behind him enough. Nady has helped some, but it was too late with their pitching problems. Cano is a problem too, it would of been great if this season he put it all together from beginning to end, but that didn’t happen.
What is Cashman going to do to fix the offense?
the igawalbatross situation is truly puzzling. i can’t see him even being in the org in 2009. whether he is traded for anyone of value is the real question, though 14 wins in AAA should attract some NL bottom feeders – hi san diego!
The team could have overperformed a bit last year, with a career year from Jorge Posada and A-Rod having a huge MVP year. Also, Hideki Matsui had that fluke-like July, hitting 13 bombs and driving in 28 on the month. However, that obviously doesn’t account for the total loss of offensive consistency that we’ve seen this year (I guess inconsistency has been the only consistent thing).
Injuries and pitching (starting pitching and the lack of stability) really hurt the team, that’s pretty clear. The Yankees lost their “ace” and a team leader in Jorge Posada. They lost Jeter, A-Rod, Damon, Matsui and others for long stretches of time. Pettitte seems to be pitching through an injury, right now, even. He won 11 games for us in the second half of last year and we’re not getting anything close to that now.
While injuries and pitching have been our main problem, the Yankees inability to hit with RISP has haunted them. Giambi and A-Rod have shown glimpses of what they can do and have done in the past, but this year, when you’re 4 and 5 hitters are hitting under .270 with RISP, you’re bound to have rough stretches and the pitching hasn’t been able to make up for it.
good night, Irene.
mel –
Good post.
I’m feeling a bit melancholy this morning. It isn’t even so much that they lost last night – heck they could still take the next two from Seattle (Ponson nothwithstanding), and win more than they lose from here on out. But that the Red Sox keep rolling along. You don’t get a sense of anything picking up any time soon for the Pinstripes.
From the day Joba went down, I felt like the team took a punch in the gut. Rasner and Ponson have worked hard, but haven’t gotten good results – either they’ve pitched poorly and lost, or they’ve pitched well, gotten no run support and lost. They are who they are. They could not replace Joba and Wang. You can’t go on a winning streak if you have – well, I was going to say only 2 pitchers you can count on, but really, they have one. Pettitte has not been Pettitte, even though he settled in last night and ended up pitching very well. You may laugh at me, but I actually think this team has shown more heart than anyone gives them any credit for. Lack of positive results does not mean lack of heart.
Now they play for pride. Third place? Okay, well, fine. But they have 20 to win for Mussina. Jeter needs a couple fo hits at the Stadium for a record that will never be broken. Still accumulate as many wins as they can. Winning the last game at the Stadium.
No, they’re not mathematically eliminated, but they just don’t have the horses (starting pitching) to carry them through. It would surely be a miracle at this point. And Boston’s playing at friendly Fenway so it looks very, very bleak.
But being a fan means sticking with the team through the lean year(s) as well as the fat ones. So, Let’s Go, Yankees!
RISP productivity in the middle of the lineup is a big factor, but let’s make sure we’re on the right culprit.
ARod is hitting .270 with RSIP, Giambi .215
ARod has a .409 OBP, .447 SLG and .856 OPS with RISP, Giambi is .339, .346, .685.
That’s a big difference and between that and the absence of Matsui and Posada led to Alex pressing most of the year. It’s no coincidence that he has been much better since Matsui returned. A healthy Matsui and Nady all year would be a very capable # 5, # 6 combo in the lineup.
The keys for ‘09 offensively…
1. Get healthy
2. Replace Giambi with Teixiera
3. Package assets for a high quality CF
It comes down to just two questions. How soon until the Yankees are mathematically eliminated ? Will Toronto overtake the Yankees to finish in 3rd place or will the team manage to muster up enough pride not to allow it to happen ?
“Tonight was the 43rd time in 141 games that the Yankees were held to two or fewer runs.”——————————————————————————————86w183 above has the biggest reason. Terrible RISP by Giambi and poor RISP (.150 pts below OPS) for ARod. While that is the biggest reason, other factors have contributed.
Jeter with a below average year.
Cano with a way below average year.
Melky with a way below average year.
And missing Po’s and Matsui’s bats.
A good club can overcome a few hurdles, whether they be injuries or down years by a few players. But we have had mulitple injuries and very poor years (if you consider RISP) from 5 players. And our bench, which looked good to start the year, was a total flop.
Consider if Wang and Joba were healthy. I’d say we would be at least +4 wins.
Consider if Posada and Matsui were healthy. I’d say we would be at least +4 wins.
Consider if ARod and Giambi had RISPs close to their OPS (they have had tons of opportunities) healthy. I’d say we would be at least +4 wins.
So if all those things happened, we would be 87-54, 1st place.
If 2 of those 3 things happened, we would be 83-58, 1/2 game behind Boston.
If 1 of those 3 things happened, we would be 79-62, 4 1/2 game behind Boston, which with 3 games left against Boston, would have us still in the hunt.
It was just one of those years where almost everything went wrong. Out of 25 guys, Moose, JD and to some extent Abreu have been the only healthy and above (their) average players.
I will say that EVEB with all our injuries, scoring 2 runs or less in 43 games seems almost impossible. The team as a whole simply suck*d the root.
By the way, Giambi’s AVERAGE OPS from 2007-2007 (3 years) was .932. His average RISP for that same time was 1.027 (+.095). In his horrible 2004 year where his OPS was .721, his RISP was .862 (+.141). In 2003, .939 OPS and 1.008 RISP (+.069).
So Jason has always been VERY clutch. This was just an unusual year for him.
When I think of the Red Sox, I think of guys who live in caves and eat what they hunt. When i think of the Yankees, I think of guys who shave their backs and blow gum when they strike out with RISP. Those are the images.
Everyone’s looking for an answer. It’s in the intangibles, I guess. Where is the leadership on this team? El Capitano…
Would it at least help if they took the gum out of their mouths? Or, instead of popping it in girlie defiance at the pitcher who just aced them, they swallowed it in humility?
Igawa will do ok next year on a National league team.
Pete:
Didn’t Pavano clear waivers? Could we at least salvage something by trading him to a contender?
...Just a follow up: Can you think of one player on the Yankees you’d want leading a platoon or a company? Seriously – who would you entrust that to in a NYY uniform? Maybe, Moose, Jorge, right? Scan the infield. Scan the outfield.
I can think of a half dozen Red Sox. Why is that? And dudes, I am Yankees fan sayin’ this.
NoneoftheAbove –
I had to smile when you mentioned the gum chewing. I don’t agree with you, mind you, but it gives you pause: Can they hit and chew gum at the same time???? Seriously, though, we’re truly frustrated fans when we are noticing the gum popping!
Time to have Matsui get his surgery, and play gardner every day to see if he’s got a real chance or not
dump ponson too, give Kennedy his starts?
i have no clue why this is the case, but man, did that third game in boston really change the season or what? before that game, im pretty sure they were tied in the loss column. a bad loss, sure. but they havent had more than a 3 game winning streak since then.
The team just got old all at once, especially Jorgie and the Captain. Probably Matsui to a degree. That’s why the injuries, the natural age progression that happens to everyone. 36 year old catchers and 34 year old shortstops tend to lose a little something
Considering the Red Sox have had similar injuries and underperformances by stars as the Yankees this year, why are they going to the postseason and we’re not? “Intangibles” doesn’t cut it as an explanation for me . . .
the Boston hurt, but the eventual exposing of the frauds in the starting rotation hurt more. You cannot be a contender with Pavano, Ponson and Rasner in your rotation. One of them? maybe, two of them? highly doubtful, all three? No way in hell!
I wouldn’t want anyone in baseball leading a platoon or a company. Military analogies don’t work, period. This team probably does need a vocal leader (Jorge) and has too many laid back personalities. This is why so many would like to see Cano moved to get one of those scrappy “grinder” type guys in that spot.
The gum chewing is funny… I’ve seen those guys (Jeter and ARod) blow bubbles while going from first to third. I’ve seen them blow bubbles while fielder a ball. It looks odd, but it beats having them chew tobacco and spit disgusting brown goo all day long.
Untalented “scrappy ‘grinder types’” are overrated.
wood is good:
The Red Sox “underperformances” are not as “under” as ours. Thats fairly obvious, no?
GB 7——I beg to differ. You don’t want nine of them on the field. But A guy who consistently gives you tough at bats helps drive pitch counts. A guy who sells out physically on defense helps set the tone for others. Guys like Pedrioua, Echstein, Figgins and Mark Ellis are great assets to have. Pedroia may have gone beyond that role, but that’s the kind of guy I think every team can use.
Trade Pavano, what’s the point in keeping him?
We’ve seen Jeter blow a perfect bubble while catching and throwing the ball for a successful double play and leaping over the runner in the process. That was this year.
Whatever has ailed him this season, bubblegum wasn’t the culprit.
Maybe the problem is that he’s not Peter Pan, and neither are the rest of them.
I love this team, I really do, that’s why I am reading this on a Saturday afternoon. I even stayed up watching last nights game. Here is the reality. Cashman has to go. He did not build the dynasty teams but for some reason took all of Sticks credit. He allowed a 200+ million dollar team to start the season on the arms of two unproven kids (IPK and Hughes), two aging veterans (Mussina and Petite) and Wang. He’s toyed with Joba’s head. He was told he was starting, then he was in the pen, then he’s starting, now he’s back in the pen. WTF!! That’s why this team is what it is. In all honesty, Cashman was lucky the kids got hurt, then he could use that as an excuse with having to sign Ponson and give Rasner all these starts. All teams have injuries, Beckett has been out alot this year. Everyone points to Wang as a major problem. Folks, Moose has been everything that Wang was supposed to be and who thought, Cashman included, that he would be the teams #1. He was most likely slated for the pen. He replaced all Wangers starts and wins. There was no loss there. I like Cashman as a person, but let’s get real, he is not a great GM. He is a GM with alot of $$ that didn’t spend it wisely. This all started with the signing of Pavano. He was a .500 career picture off a year of 18-8 and we paid him $40 million for four years. Epstein, he goes and gets Beckett. He could have picked up Santana. Who doesn’t trade a guy like Hughes for him. This guy is a #1. Hughes had one great game!!! I like Hughes, but come on. Let’s get real. I hate to say it, we have been out GM’d and it’s time Hank and the boys make a change.
Boys, I don’t demand much. I rarely criticize you for failing to perform as expected. I forgive. I excuse. I apologize.
(Though PLEASE, some one tell me why A-Rod invariably swings at the first-pitch in pressure situations, whether against Justin Masterson with runners on 1st and 3rd in the 7th or last night against Putz in the 9th when the guy couldn’t find the strike zone with a magnifying glas. WHY WHY WHY!!!!!)
This one time I implore you not to go quietly into the night. Please, keep fighting. If at the end of the day you lose the battle, you lose, but you’ll retain your pride and your dignity if you battle unto the very last.
One more run. One more streak to furnish a little extra drama. One more flourish before i begin counting the days until pitchers and catchers report. Is that too much to ask?
September 6th, 2008 at 11:13 am
“GB 7—- I beg to differ. You don’t want nine of them on the field. But A guy who consistently gives you tough at bats helps drive pitch counts. A guy who sells out physically on defense helps set the tone for others. Guys like Pedrioua, Echstein, Figgins and Mark Ellis are great assets to have. Pedroia may have gone beyond that role, but that’s the kind of guy I think every team can use.”
GreenBeret is right. “Scrappy grinders” or gritty players, sorry, don’t remember which term you used – are useful on your 3rd line in ice hockey. They are not only “overrated” in baseball (I wholeheartedly agree) they are media inventions.
Further, you make a big mistake by collapsing this definition of player with guys who give you “tough” at bats. Bobby Abreu is “laid back” in demeanor, so according to your incredibly confining stereotype, he couldn’t possibly be a guy who has “tough” at bats and drives up pitch counts, but that is exactly what he does, and expertly so.
You write in cliches and think in cliches.
a potential no hitter off a pitcher who NEVER started before?!?!... Maybe this is rock bottom?!
GreenBeret7 September 6th, 2008 at 10:55 am
“Untalented “scrappy ‘grinder types’†are overrated.”
And they are overrated precisely because this definition of player, people congratulate themselves, is the practical little winner who gets it done, as opposed to the “talented” player who mocks his God-given skill and doesn’t “try.”
But the truth of it is, the notion of this grinder type is utterly romantic: and it has even evolved to the point where people actually believe that a LACK of skill is some moral virtue.
The fact is you can express “trying” in skillful ways. What people don’t see is that their definition of “effort” is limited to the effort that presents itself in one particular way. That’s just stupid.
Did DiMaggio not “try” because he never had to leave his feet to catch a fly ball?
Time for the high school manager to go. Bring a veteran in.
Bodhisattva—- You been inhaling a lot of incense today?
There’s no virtue in being less talented, but there is virtue in giving your best every day, every inning, every at bat. David Eckstein is probably less tlaented than just about every other player in the game, but look what he’s accomplished. Compare Pedroia and Cano in talent and productivity.
I have no problem with players who are easy going, smooth and productive. Nowhere did I write anything to even suggest that, but you manufactured it anyway.
I have a big problem for guys who coast on talent and produce a percentage of what they’re capable of. I don’t think Paul O’Neill was ever themost talented player in the Yankees outfield, but there’s no argument that his passion and fire was an asset. Why is that?
The point—since you can’t figure out on your own—is that ALL types of players can be successful. Guys who are obviously not as big, not as strong and not as fast but bust their butts and do all the little things to help a team win are extremely valuable. They excite fans and they can motivate teammates as well.
OldYanksFan – Stop blaming this season on injuries. Everyone has them. You’re saying that if we didn’t lose Wang, Joba, Posada, and Matsui, we would be in the hunt. But then you’re forced to argue where Boston would be w/o their injuries. I live with Sox fans and I’m very aware of all of their injuries.
Dice-K out for a month. Ortiz out for two months. Beckett and Lowell have been out for a few weeks. Schilling out for the year. Colon has been out for three months. Drew hasn’t played in forever. And Manny left. We can also factor in the under-performers like you did (for Arod and Giambi). Beckett is not having that 07 season. Ortiz couldn’t hit a thing for the first month. Ells is not the star everyone thought he would be. Lugo is still an awful player. And Clay was a disaster.
Every team has injuries and underperfomers. They are never an excuse.
i’ve never read or seen Jeter and Damon saying it’s time to just wait ‘til next year. Pete’s just projecting; there’s a difference between acknowledging how far behind you are and conceding.
you really have to play the games and see what happens. they have to keep themselves in position to take advantage in case Boston or Tampa collapses.
look at the 2000 Yankees. On Sept. 10, they were up by 8.5 games on Toronto & 9 on Boston. All but clinched. But then they go 5-16 the rest of the way. Fortunately Toronto and Boston played poorly too. if Boston had gone on a decent 15-7 run, or Toronto 13-6, they’d have won.
A major change in ownership has had effects on the team. In prior years the poor hitting would have cost the hitting coach his job or at least constant public humiliation. Some of Girardi’s decisions were questionable, but no one can guarantee they were all in fact his decisions. From day 1, there wasn’t the stated goal of winning the world series or even getting to the playoffs. The team and manager were publicly given a pass long ago by ownership. One is rarely able to stop being a fan of his or her team, but ownership and media should recognize the relationship to ticket sales and winning. Dating from 1990, the Yankees did not become #1 in AL attendance until 2003. It took a number of consecutive years in the playoffs to get there. The Yankees don’t sell just because they’re the Yankees. They have to win to sell.
From a Red Sox fan – the Yankees really stink and should be ashamed of taking all that money for this horrible performance. The Yankee fans can’t hold a candle to Sox fans either. Ha Ha That’s a shame