The LoHud Yankees Blog

A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Game 158: Yankees at Blue Jays

Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc, Podcast on Sep 24, 2008 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

YANKEES (86-71)
Gardner CF
Cano 2B
Abreu RF
Nady LF
Giambi DH
Betemit 3B
Ransom SS
Miranda 1B
Moeller C
Hughes RHP

BLUE JAYS (83-74)
Inglett 2B
Scutaro SS
Rios RF
Wells CF
Lind DH
Overbay 1B
Rolen 3B
Snider LF
Zaun C
Burnett RHP

Phil Hughes (0-4, 7.96) vs. the Toronto hitters.

A.J. Burnett (18-10, 4.18) vs. the New York hitters.

Notes: That’s a lineup you usually see in Dunedin around March 15. … The too-little, too-late Yankees have won six straight and nine of their last 10. They are now 8-8 against the Jays with two games left. … The Yankees have scored two or fewer runs 49 times and three or fewer runs 68 times. With five games to play, they have scored 753 runs. They scored 968 last season.

DOA AGAINST AJ: A.J.Burnett is 3-1, 1.78 against the Yankees this season (30.1 innings, 23 hits, 6 earned runs, 4 walks, 32 strikeouts).

But before you get all “they need to sign him!” consider that Burnett is 15-9, 4.57 against everybody else. In 183 innings against other teams teams, he has allowed 181 hits and walked 80. That’s still pretty good. But three years and $55 million or whatever? Not so much.

TIME FLIES: Phil Hughes last won a major league game on Sept. 27, 2007.

OBLIGATORY PHIL COKE NOTE: Lefties are 3 for 22 against Coke, fanning eight times. But he has been death on right-handed hitters, too. They are 1 for 16. Small sample sizes, obviously. But it suggests they should still develop him as a starter.

I DON’T WANNA FADE AWAY: The numbers for Alex Rodriguez over the last 16 games ain’t that pretty at all. He is 10 for 56 (.179) with 7 runs scored, 4 extra-base hits, 10 RBI and 15 strikeouts. His numbers have gone from ..315/.404/.602 to .300/.391/.575.

DON’T YOU KNOW: Robinson Cano is 9 for 20 with four RBI in the last six games. He actually had a hustle double last night. Next time he needs that kick in the pants in May.

HERE’S THE PITCH: The Yankees have allowed only nine runs in the last six games.

Since I’m out of notes …

vamp1.jpgLAST FIVE SONGS ON THE iPOD: A-Punk (Vampire Weekend), Highway Patrolman (Springsteen), Roadhouse Blues (Doors), New Year’s Day (U2), Hate and War (The Clash).

Wait, one more. It’s Long Black Veil by the great Johnny Cash. If you don’t have the Cash American sessions, you don’t know what you’re missing.

OK, back later with updates.

UPDATE, 4:14 p.m.: Mike Mussina said his right elbow felt better as he was on his way to get treatment. He’s going to try to play catch today and he intends to start on Sunday. … Andy Pettitte is likely to be scratched for Saturday with Sidney Ponson starting instead.

UPDATE, 5:47 p.m.: Andy Pettitte has been shut down for the rest of the season. So the rotation the rest of the way is Pavano, Aceves, Ponson and Mussina. … Girardi expects Jeter to play again this season but he did not take BP today.

Here is Girardi’s pre-game interview session:

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UPDATE, 7:02 p.m.: Here is what Joe Torre told reporters about the demise of the Yankees:

Torre said he took no satisfaction in seeing his former team miss the playoffs.

“The satisfaction I have, going someplace after 12 years, and you leave wondering if managing can be fun again, because the last few years back there weren’t fun,” he said. “I don’t take satisfaction in the Yankees being eliminated. But it’s satisfying that we win three games here and we’re in, especially with all the ups and downs we’ve had.”

Don Mattingly’s take was very candid:

“I’m sure it’s tough for the Yankees — something different, for sure. Jeter, Pettitte, Mariano. They haven’t missed in a long time. It’s one of those years in a tough division to play catch-up. But this year is a transition year for them without Joe. I interviewed for the manager’s job and I knew going in that it was sort of a no-win situation. You listen to them talk, and I don’t think they realized what Joe did for them for so long, how special he is at what he does.

“I think they sort of took him for granted, didn’t realize all the things he brings to the table as a manager. You’ve seen it here with the Dodgers this year. How he keeps the ship going the right way, keeps things on track when it looks like things are getting ugly.”

UPDATE, 8:08 p.m.: That’s the first big-league hit for Juan Miranda. He would have had an RBI except Wilson Betemit stood like a statue watching the line drive sail over his head then ran to third like Orson Welles.

UPDATE, 8:26 p.m.: See, Phil Hughes can pitch. Do not give up on this guy. He has a chance to be a top-tier starter in the AL once he stays healthy all year. He has command and poise and he’s 22.

UPDATE, 9:07 p.m.: Hughes made a mistake there with the pitch to Rolen and it could cost him a victory. But you would take 7 5 2 2 0 5 all the time. He really had command of his secondary pitches.

UPDATE, 9:13 p.m.: No matter what happens, I’m all for Hughes staying in the game. He needs innings and innings in tight spots. This is good for him. He’s at 92 pitches.

UPDATE, 9:20 p.m.: Excellent work by Hughes. Meanwhile Burnett just left the game to an ovation and took a curtain call. He is hugging all his teammates. Think maybe he’s going to opt out of his contract? Yeah, just maybe.

UPDATE, 9:27 p.m.: Well, a heck of a job by The Franchise, as he went pitch for pitch with Burnett. He’ll take a tough no-decision.

Now we need somebody to score to avoid the horror of extra innings of meaningless baseball. Jose Veras on to pitch. This might be over soon.

UPDATE, 9:52 p.m.: God Bless the great Bobby Abreu, who now has 99 RBI and has saved us from the calamity of an 11th inning. This will be seven straight and 10 of 11 for the Yankees. Maybe Bud Selig will take Hank’s advice and just put them in the playoffs.

 
 

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806 Responses to “Game 158: Yankees at Blue Jays”

  1. R-Tek September 24th, 2008 at 3:49 pm

    If we miss out CC we probably have no choice but to sign Sabathia or trade for somebody.

    I don’t want Sheets or Perez.

  2. Bill from NJ September 24th, 2008 at 3:51 pm

    the entire ‘vampire weekend’ album is perfect.

  3. mel September 24th, 2008 at 3:52 pm

    Thanks, Pete. Good stuff, especially the Doors, U2, and the Clash.

    Phil needs 2 wins to even his career record. Go, Phil! Stay healthy, A.J.!

  4. Jorge Tabata September 24th, 2008 at 3:53 pm

    Before Coke was converted into a reliever, he had 3 double digit strikeout games in Trenton.

    They need to atleast give him an opportunity to start. Not sure what to do with Sanchez though.

  5. Forntoso September 24th, 2008 at 3:54 pm

    I am more interested in watching Burnett tonight than I am Hughes.

    I want to see what our consolation prize for CC looks like.

  6. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 3:55 pm

    Awesome that A. Punk was in your last 5…

  7. aron September 24th, 2008 at 3:55 pm

    best song ever kid rock all summer long

  8. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 3:56 pm

    Considering…

  9. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 3:56 pm

    i like coke as a reliever for now
    maybe in the future he can be a starter but right now our bullpen is death, and i love it

  10. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 3:57 pm

    Cash and Springsteen?

    Interesting taste.

  11. Braintrust September 24th, 2008 at 3:57 pm

    Pete, all good choices. I’ve only heard the one song from Vampire weekend (A-Punk), which is pretty good. I have to check out their album. A must have Johnny Cash album is “Live from Folsom Prison”, I have a few Cash albums, with some American session songs. His latest stuff was very sad, because of his declining health, and I personally have a tough time listening to.

  12. mel September 24th, 2008 at 3:57 pm

    That Todd Jones is pretty funny. Leaking his retirement in his column:

    “So this is it,” Jones wrote in this week’s magazine. “If you’re a Tigers fan, I’ll never stress you out again. If you’re not a Tigers fan, you’ll never have me as your ace in the hole, convinced I’ll blow a lead against your team.”

  13. saucY September 24th, 2008 at 3:57 pm

    vampire weekend album seems catchy, for the most part. still haven’t listened to the whole thing (just whatever random songs my ipod plays for me)

  14. COL 88 September 24th, 2008 at 3:58 pm

    Pettitte to be shut down?

    Ponson is scheduled to pitch Saturday and will throw an inning tonight.

    per Ed Price.

  15. mel September 24th, 2008 at 3:59 pm

    NO!!!! I like Sidney, but not @ Fenway. NOOOOO!!!!!!

  16. Braintrust September 24th, 2008 at 3:59 pm

    It would not surprise me in the least that Pettitte has been pitching hurt until the Yanks were officially eliminated.

  17. jax gmen September 24th, 2008 at 4:00 pm

    Hughes better pitch well tonight or
    i will boo him louder than I booed Arod when he grounded into that DP against delcarmen!!!

  18. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 4:00 pm

    You’re right Pete concerning Burnett. It’s typical fan reaction to player who dominates their team and then starts clamoring for the same player to be on their team.
    As dominated as Burnett has been against the Yankees he has not been as dominate against everyone else.
    I like his stuff but this has the makings of another Pavano contract if he is indeed signed by the Yankees.
    I’ll put my eggs in another basket thank you very much.

  19. sw September 24th, 2008 at 4:00 pm

    “Ponson is scheduled to pitch Saturday and will throw an inning tonight.”
    FOX will be even more thrilled they decided to telecast the Saturday Red Sox/Yankees game.

  20. saucY September 24th, 2008 at 4:01 pm

    i thought Todd Jones was pretty funny dressing up as Ordonez during that one rain delay.

  21. jennifer September 24th, 2008 at 4:01 pm

    Any word on how Mussina is? Is his elbow okay?

  22. Doreen September 24th, 2008 at 4:02 pm

    Yankees complete 6-year agreement with Trenton.

    http://www.trentonthunder.com/.....D=20080924

  23. Adam September 24th, 2008 at 4:03 pm

    Once again: Cano’s good stretch lately has nothing to do with him sitting. It has to do with the way he and Long altered his swing so that he’s not out in front of pitches like he previously was. He’s said this himself, too.

  24. hank hal September 24th, 2008 at 4:04 pm

    Cubs manager Lou Piniella is only one victory shy of his 1,700th career triumph as manager, but he seems to be weary of the long grind that accompanies the season. “It has been a tough year,” Piniella told the New York Daily News. “And sometimes it can really take a toll on you. I don’t know how much longer I want to do this.” Piniella is signed through 2009 with an option for 2010, though some believe he will retire if the Cubs win it all this year. New York Yankees co-chairman Hank Steinbrenner reportedly is ready to offer Piniella a job as a consultant as soon as he retires from managing.

    Chicago Tribune

    http://www.fannation.com/truth.....view/70670

  25. stuart September 24th, 2008 at 4:05 pm

    If the Yanks sign Burnett they will regret it..

    No to Burnett or Sheets, soft losers, then again they have many guys like that on the yanks already.

  26. mark September 24th, 2008 at 4:05 pm

    Go Moose!!!

  27. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 4:06 pm

    Rebecca,

    There’s no doubt Johnny Cash influenced Springsteen. Neither one will ever have been accused of not taking chances or standing up for what they believed in.

    I’m old enough to remember the Johnny Cash Show on tv in the late 60′s. He had guests like Bob Dylan, Joni Mitchell, Neil Young, Derek & the Dominoes and a whole lot of other artists that were far from the mainstream country charts.

  28. dan 771 September 24th, 2008 at 4:13 pm

    no excuses for hughes tonight. he cannot use the ‘amped up’ excuse, he is on the road so he won’t get booed, and he is facing a pretty weak toronto lineup. want to see good fastball command, no nibbling, and the curve.

    time to see if he is an ace or a #3 like most expect

  29. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 4:15 pm

    come to think of it the only reason burneet is near 20 is bc of us

    if we beat him 3 out of the 4 times would we be begging to have him now?

    im all for getting a pitcher, in fact we desperatly need one but finding who is the best fit is a job im glad i dont have lol

  30. Save Us September 24th, 2008 at 4:16 pm

    Is Girardi an idiot? Ponson? Why cant we see one of the young guns. How about Aceves? Did they forget about him? I’d rather see a guy with a future, than a guy at the end, now that we are out, and even if we werent, i trust Aceves more than Ponson.

  31. Betsy September 24th, 2008 at 4:16 pm

    I think Pete’s jumping the gun on Phil Coke as a starter. He’s barely had a cup of coffee and now he’s all the rage? I’ve read that he wasn’t even that good as a starter anyway. Let’s see how people react when he starts to get hit hard, as happens to everyone.

    I’m bringing this over from the previous thread:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09.....ref=slogin

    I love this cutter for Phil……..and of course, I love his attitude. As disappointed as I am for the team that he wasn’t able to contribute, I’m equally as disappointed for Phil. He’s a hard worker and a very good kid – and as we saw in the ALDS against the Indians, he’s got the right stuff to succeed big time in NY, which not everyone has.

    I agree with you completely, Mel. The Yankees love Phil and that’s why they are sending him to the AFL and that’s why they aren’t guaranteeing him anything. They know he will earn his pinstripes one day, but he’s got things to work on that he should have been doing last year in AAA. He was a victim of the horrendous injuries to the Yankees’ starting rotation last year. SJ, I don’t know if Phil needs the whole year in AAA, but you’re right – he’s not a finished product, and how could he be? Phil dominated every single level he was ever at – he never even faced a bases loaded situation in the minors. LOL that’s unbelievable. He’s 22 – he’s 22 – he’s 22. I have to keep repeating that for people want think he’s a has-been/never was. Seriously, if this is how Yankee fans treat their young guys, booing them off the field and trashing them for being imperfect…..it’s scary.

  32. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 4:17 pm

    I don’t know Stuart, I don’t think Burnett is soft.

    He’s not the brightest bulb in the lamp store but, he’s not soft.

    He’s pitched hurt. He’s thrown big pitch count games when needed (Not just this year. He did it in Florida), and he brings a nastiness to the mound. Something that, aside from Joba, is SORELY missing on this team.

    Sheets? I agree. I wouldn’t touch Sheets. That’s Pavano wanting to happen more than Burnett, IMO.

    Burnett is interesting. Especially with a good bullpen behind him to keep his pitch counts more manageable.

    Would I sign him? As they say, the devil is in the details. I wouldn’t give him a 6 year deal but, I’d think seriously about signing him if I could fill other needs on the team prior to doing it.

  33. Save Us September 24th, 2008 at 4:17 pm

    I actually like the Lineup.

    We have seen what our stars do against AJ, so why not try the rookies and see if they can do any better, cause they cant really do worse.

  34. Sea Net September 24th, 2008 at 4:18 pm

    Nice lineup by Joe… finally playing the kids.

    Sadly, Burnett is going to have a field day with that lineup all night. Hughes will most certainly get the loss to make his record 0-5 as well.

  35. Miggs (All in for Moose's quest for 20) September 24th, 2008 at 4:18 pm

    If Cashman comes back I think there is ZERO chance Teixiera is in pinstripes next year. Zero.

    10 years/200 million for THAT guy? He’s good not great. He’s certainly not the answer. And if he’s not the answer now, what is he going to look like in 2016, when he has 3 years left on his deal?

    Ughh.

    So many things wrong with that idea.

  36. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 4:19 pm

    I thought Scranton’s season ended last week :)

  37. Save Us September 24th, 2008 at 4:19 pm

    One more thing to the Yankees. There are still 5 games and we can still put up a fight. It would be nice not to phone in the season and not end in 4th place behind Toronto.

  38. Wave Your Hat September 24th, 2008 at 4:19 pm

    Burnett will cost a boatload to sign, and I’m worried about his durability. I’d like to see the Yanks go in another direction.

  39. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 4:20 pm

    Isn’t Aceves pitching Friday night in Boston?

  40. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 4:21 pm

    if we could actually win with that lineup, I would be surpised.

  41. gayle September 24th, 2008 at 4:21 pm

    Anyone else hear that Derek Jeter took/got the Joe DiMaggio sign from the clubhouse walkway. Totally appropriate. Also question about Mussina wanting the flagpole does that come with the Lou Gehrig bat n top or is that a seperate purchase lol.

  42. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 4:21 pm

    oh yeah, why Cervelli isn’t in the lineup? He has caught Hughes before in the minors.

  43. mel September 24th, 2008 at 4:21 pm

    LOL. Girardi’s really trying to make A.J. look good.

    Let’s see if Gaston returns the favor. :?

    The only pinstriped Sheets you’ll see are in the bedroom.

    Burnett will cost you about half of what CC will.

  44. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 4:22 pm

    Miggs,

    If he doesn’t get a 10 year deal from the Angels, I don’t see who will give it to him.

    I know that’s what Scott is floating. However, floating it and doing the deal are two different things.

  45. Save Us September 24th, 2008 at 4:22 pm

    Perhaps he is. In which case, Ponson still isn’t the answer. Put Sanchez in, even pitch Kennedy. Something!!!

  46. Oddessy September 24th, 2008 at 4:22 pm

    How is Burnett soft? If we don’t get CC, where would you like to turn for pitching?

  47. saucY September 24th, 2008 at 4:22 pm

    what kind of a deal would it take to bring in AJ? i didn’t think it would approach $18+ M/Yr (as Pete’s 3yr/55M suggestion indicates). But if that’s where the market currently is, do you do it?

    I don’t think so. I think it may be closer to 3/45-50 tops… and i’m not sure I go beyond 3 years either.

  48. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 4:23 pm

    Pettitte’s been pitching hurt since August I think.

  49. Chris September 24th, 2008 at 4:23 pm

    “Is Girardi an idiot? Ponson? Why cant we see one of the young guns. How about Aceves? Did they forget about him? I’d rather see a guy with a future, than a guy at the end, now that we are out, and even if we werent, i trust Aceves more than Ponson.”

    Aceves is starting Friday night. Calm down.

  50. hank hal September 24th, 2008 at 4:23 pm

    Just like A-Rod was going to get 12 years/$450 and ownership of the team?

    Tex will be had for 8 years.

  51. sw September 24th, 2008 at 4:24 pm

    Wow that’s a terrible lineup. Like a split squad B team. So AJ, have you looked at houses in New York yet? :D

  52. Save Us September 24th, 2008 at 4:24 pm

    As my buddy the godfather says, “you have to make him an offer he can’t refuse”. (For CC Sabathia).

  53. NITRO September 24th, 2008 at 4:25 pm

    Man Kennedy has really fallen off the deep end in the organization. He hasn’t even been called up as a reward like Clippard/Wright were last year.

    I think it’s almost a lock he gets traded. Not like he’ll bring back much anyway.

  54. Mike S. September 24th, 2008 at 4:26 pm

    If it is official that Andy will be scratched, it means a mark he held with Babe Ruth is now by the boards. Going into this year, Pettitte and Ruth were the only pitchers to pitch in ten or more seasons and have a winning record in EVERY season that they pitched in. The only ones. At 14-14, Andy would lose that special distinction he shared with the Babe.

  55. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 4:26 pm

    Burnett might strike out 20 tonight. I’ll tune in to see how Hughes pitches, outside of that not looking forward to Burnett against the Spring Training lineup.

  56. Cobra 272 September 24th, 2008 at 4:26 pm

    I want to see tons of strikeouts and missed bats from Hughes tonight. If he is ever going to be the #2-3 starter he is expected to be, he has to be able to put hitters away. Middle rotation starters have value in the fact that they pitch 200 innings and go 7-8 each start. Hughes has to show he can do that.

    Strikeouts and no 10 pitch ABs tonight

  57. mel September 24th, 2008 at 4:28 pm

    I want to see Phil get back to being the groundball pitcher he was since…forever.

  58. AJ YANKS September 24th, 2008 at 4:28 pm

    Cobra, they taught him the cutter so he would NOT be the strikeout pitcher he was in Trenton, they taught it to him so he could be more economical. That was his problem at the ML level, and thats why Chavez worked with him to get him to get quick outs.

  59. Dave D September 24th, 2008 at 4:30 pm

    Hughes’ ace potential came from the fact he was a groundball AND strikeout machine. Now, he is neither. Since they changed his mechanics, he has no longer gotten the GB tendencies he had in 2006.

  60. stuart September 24th, 2008 at 4:30 pm

    http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/ne.....;type=lgns check out what they’re saying about us!

  61. Joe from Long Island September 24th, 2008 at 4:31 pm

    I agree with SJ and others – I’d go for AJ and see what it would take. CC, AJ, and Wang in a series – that would be something. Not to mention any combo of them and Moose and Joba (assuming Joba starts, but that’s another discussion).

    I’d like Tex, but not for 7-10 years. We made that longterm, inflexible mistake with Jason. I think Tex will get that kind of offer from Angelos in Baltimore, and maybe from the Angels (they didn’t trade Kotchman for a two month rental).

    If they don’t sign Tex, then look for a FA OF. The only way Abreu comes back is if they like a deal involving Matsui, and Bobby then DHs; at least, that’s my thought.

  62. steve September 24th, 2008 at 4:34 pm

    wait, the cutter was supposed to make him more economical?

    the chi sox hitters kept fouling it off, pitch after pitch, thats why he was gone after 4. that isn’t going to make him more economical.

    thats what happened to rasner too earlier. chavez taught him the cutter as well.

  63. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 4:34 pm

    If Andy was pitching hurt he shouldn’t have been. He ended up hurting the team, not to mention the fact that he took away opportunities from a lot of the kids. I call it selfish, not being a gamer. It isn’t like we were 10 games up in the division and his weak pitching wasn’t making a difference! If he wasn’t pitching hurt then I still don’t want him back.

    In any event, I will be extremely disappointed if he ends up coming back and taking up a spot in the rotation. Enough is enough. As far as I’m concerned, his pitching days for the Yankees should be in the past.

  64. pat September 24th, 2008 at 4:35 pm

    Poor Melky. With that line-up, he still can’t get a start? Talk about a stock dropping.

  65. mel September 24th, 2008 at 4:35 pm

    AJ has pitched to a 2.6 ERA vs. Boston and a 3.15 ERA vs. Tampa this season. The O’s, however, seem to have his number. :)

  66. jennifer September 24th, 2008 at 4:36 pm

    Now watch our b line up beat up AJ. :lol:

  67. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 4:36 pm

    I absoutely still think that Hughes is the real deal. I look forward to having him worked into the rotation. I just feel that he is going to end up being a solid #2 starter, if not a #1.

  68. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 4:36 pm

    Tonights start has nothing to do with charting Hughes’ future.

    I think some folks almost enjoy setting themselves up to blast a player by placing ridiculous expectations on him.

    Its just another start for him with a AAA (for the most part) lineup tonight in a meaningless game.

    Don’t make more out of it than it is.

    If he pitches great, awful or in between, it tells us nothing about next year or his future.

  69. S.o.S.27 September 24th, 2008 at 4:36 pm

    Miggs,
    I hope if Cash isnt the gm its still a no to tex for that ridiculous amount. OVER-HYPED. As iv said before. Use our strengths to fix our weeknesses. Our minor league pitchers can get us a young stud at first and a center fielder. We paid Giambi coming off of mvp like years a boat load. What did that get us? NO NEED FOR AN ALL STAR AT EVERY POSITION TO WIN!! Time to mix youth and experience to = hunger. Its worked for us before.

  70. Save Us September 24th, 2008 at 4:37 pm

    Why bother having Giambi in?

    Move Abreu to DH, Gardner to RF and Melky to CF.

    We’ve had all we can stomach of Giambi.

  71. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 4:37 pm

    Words cannot describe how overbearing, classless and obnoxious Red Sox fans are today in Massachusetts. I pray to God these dolts get swept in the playoffs.

    I have one guy who seriously argues about how much better Jed Lowrie is than Derek Jeter, which leads to the standard Jeter sucks rant from 2 other. For the next week I’m trading in my pinstripes for a pair of thundersticks!

  72. 86w183 September 24th, 2008 at 4:40 pm

    Exactly SJ…

    We tend to overreact to numbers being floated out there as if they are absolute minimums. Teixiera once said he wanted to go somewhere he could be happy for the next ten years and it was taken that he would insist on a ten year contract.

    I think you get Tex for numbers slightly higher than Giambi’s 7 year, $ 119 M deal… and he’s a much better buy than Giambi was back then because he’s younger, a switch hitter and a terrific defensive player.

    Burnett has had injury issues, but in the last four years he’s made 112 starts counting tonight. I wouldn’t go beyond three years for him, but I’d give CC whatever it takes.

    Here’s an AJ stat breakdown. He’s had five poor starts where he gave up 6 or more runs, plus one relief outing where he got hit. In this six outings his record is 1-and-4 with a 12.33 ERA.

    In his other 28 starts he’s 17-and-6 with a 2.99 ERA. He’s certainly high rish/high reward is he’s out there on the FA market.

  73. sw September 24th, 2008 at 4:40 pm

    Hughes is probably looking at the lineup behind him going, “Huh? I thought I was pitching in the big leagues.” Toronto’s hitting is awful so even if he beats them it’s not that meaningful. Kennedy beat Toronto and Kansas City, two anemic offenses, last September and that proved completely meaningless.

  74. Save Us September 24th, 2008 at 4:41 pm

    Drive 4-5 it is like when they argue (and some yankee fans argue too) that Cashman should watch Epstein to see how to put a team together. Last time i checked, Cashman has more championships than Epstein. And shockingly enough, The Sox missed the playoffs in 2006. So i dont see where they are so much better.

  75. Jorge Tabata September 24th, 2008 at 4:41 pm

    Regardless of how Hughes pitches tonight or in the AFL, he needs to spend next year in the minors.

    If Cashman doesn’t get CC/Burnett etc. then he still has to kind some kind of backup plan that doesn’t include Hughes.

  76. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 4:42 pm

    Trisha,

    The kids aren’t any good. Andy pitched because that’s what veteran players do. They play hurt.

    Derek Jeter played for 2 monhths with a broken hand.

    They didn’t have anybody better to replace Jeter or Pettitte in the lineup. At times, it happens and you just have to play the hand you are dealt.

    Its not only not selfish, its selfless. There were games he gutted out innings because the team needed him to do so. They didn’t have any “kids” or anybody else, to use in these situations.

    Its not like they wanted to continue to use Ponson and Rasner. They had no choice.

    It took a lot of guts for him to grind it out. Sometimes, it doesn’t work out. However, its pretty tough to rip Pettitte for grinding it out when other guys would just put themselves on the DL, collect the check, and called it a year.

    We can’t have it both ways. We can’t bang on guys for grinding it out just because the results weren’t favorable.

  77. S.o.S.27 September 24th, 2008 at 4:42 pm

    Trish,
    I partially agree. If Moose comes back. We dont need a 16 mil 4.5 era pitcher. But if he doesnt. We need to bring him back to fill out the backend of the rotation. I do think we need to stop milking these cows for every last drop and move on to some cows with fresh milk and plenty to spare. Aging isnt making any of these guys better.

  78. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, now a fan of who ever plays the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 4:43 pm

    I have to work tonight so I’m gonna miss Phil’s start :(

  79. mark007 September 24th, 2008 at 4:43 pm

    sw,

    exactly. today’s game is meaningless. yet most fans will go ga ga when he strikes out jason inglett and greg zaun on 89 MPH fastballs and loopy curves.

    this is a meaningless game for everyone involved.

  80. S.o.S.27 September 24th, 2008 at 4:44 pm

    “For the next week I’m trading in my pinstripes for a pair of thundersticks!”

    Dont forget your monkey.

  81. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 4:44 pm

    Drive, you have my sympathies. I am home from work today but other than a little friendly jabbing, I can’t imagine my coworkers being overbearing. On the other hand, a Yankee fan living in Massachusetts has to be pure hell today. It’s okay, we will just keep channeling losses to them and soon enough you will be able to get the pests off your case. I an always equipped with some quick quips – this year it will be “whoopeedoo, when your team goes to the postseason 13 straight years, maybe we’ll talk. In the meantime enjoy the wild card.” And if I get back the expected “yeah but at least we got the wild card, your team didn’t get anything” all I will do is rewind the tape to – when your team goes to the postseason… :)

    That usually does the trick. But while I am within the perimiter of RSN, I am not in the heart of it like you are.

    Condolences.

  82. mel September 24th, 2008 at 4:44 pm

    Save Us,

    The Red Sox are better because the Oracle has proclaimed it so.

  83. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 4:45 pm

    Miranda but where the hell is Cisco ? :evil:

    Anyway I agree Coke needs to be given a chance but remember most of his effectiveness has to do w. the league not knowing him, same thing happened w/ Kennedy last yr. I think Coke can be a SP but they need to develope a good change up for him and I’d pair him w/ Edwar to try to teach him his change up.

  84. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, now a fan of who ever plays the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 4:46 pm

    “Regardless of how Hughes pitches tonight or in the AFL, he needs to spend next year in the minors.

    If Cashman doesn’t get CC/Burnett etc. then he still has to kind some kind of backup plan that doesn’t include Hughes.”

    Yeah lets stall his development another year or 2. This kid isn’t Ian Kennedy he can pitch and should pitch at some point next season.

  85. 86w183 September 24th, 2008 at 4:46 pm

    Trisha– there were no young pitchers worth replacing Pettite with an he knew it. That’s why he toughed it out. when you already have Ponson and Rasner in the rotation, Andy staying did not hurt the team.

    Mike S.— That Babe/Pettite stats is just silly. Babe pitched in five games in his last four seasons. Yes, he was 1-0, 2-0, 1-0, 1-0 in those seasons, but that’s pretty goofy to compare it to what Pettite has done.

    I do believe Andy Pettite is the first pitcher in baseball history to pitch more than a dozen seasons without having a losing record. To me, that means something.

  86. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 4:46 pm

    Oh for an OT talk next week on 90210 Micheal Lee guest stars :lol:

  87. Weather Man September 24th, 2008 at 4:46 pm

    Just because Hughes isin’t going to be the ace-phenom he was in Trenton, doesn’t mean he can’t be a good MLB pitcher. The guy in Trenton was looking like he could be a Mark Prior pitcher with an unlimited ceiling.

    He is not the same guy he was in Trenton… 2 years, 2 injuries, new mechanics, new pitches etc. he is a different pitcher. But thats ok. A #2-3 starter is very valuable in this league. Nobody should give up on him just because he isn’t going to be the Mark Prior-ace he looked like he was turning into.

  88. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 4:46 pm

    NITRO,

    “Man Kennedy has really fallen off the deep end in the organization.”

    Melky too. They wont even give the kid an at bat.

    Like Kennedy, it’s not Melky’s fault that they placed too much trust in him. Kennedy and Melky are auxillary players misguidedly placed in key roles. One can argue that both are the victims of an organization that forgot how to develop players.

    Both Kennedy and Melky came up on Brian Cashman’s watch. Unlike the earlier thread that blamed George Steinbrenner, these 2 are on Cashman.

  89. Phelps Phan September 24th, 2008 at 4:48 pm

    Vampire Weekend is the shiznit !!

  90. pat September 24th, 2008 at 4:49 pm

    “The Red Sox are better because the Oracle has proclaimed it so.”

    2006 was just part of the plan. wink…wink.

  91. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 4:49 pm

    SJ you and I will just agree to disagree on this one because there is no way I can get to the selfless perspective. To me Chuck Knoblauch was one of the greatest Yankee heroes because he actually went up to Torre and asked out of a game because he knew his throwing yips were getting worse and worse. His statement to Torre: take me out because I’m hurting the team.

    A team is there to win, not to field heroes. It’s one thing when one out of nine grits it out and plays hurt – not that you want to see anyone playi hurt. It’s quite another when it’s the starting pitcher and the quality of his outing is going to dictate whether you win or lose games – and very precious games I might add since the Yankees were chasing someone the entire season. Did they others they could have started? Absolutely they would have found someone. If someone went down, they would have had to find someone. I would anyday take chances on a minor league revolving door than trot out a veteran who is losing you game after game after game – and not just any veteran, one of your prime horses. He didn’t do us any favors SJ.

  92. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 4:49 pm

    If the Red Sox fans are annoying you, just mention that the Dolphins beat the Patriots.

    It worked for me.

  93. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 4:50 pm

    Trisha,

    Thanks for the condolences and tips.

    But like my wife says,when it’s 15 of them against 1 of me, it’s a fair fight. I can hold my own with the best of them :)

  94. Mike S. September 24th, 2008 at 4:50 pm

    Q: Why bother having Giambi in?

    A: Because he has 95 RBI. That’s basically it, to try and get him 5 more.

    They look at the numbers now. 100 RBI, .300 batting average, etc. Which is one reason Abreu (.299, 95 RBI) is in.

  95. TurnTables September 24th, 2008 at 4:50 pm

    Andy will have a bounce back year next year. I would certainly brig him back. We are in it to win it next year, Pettitte gives us a much better chance than any kid.

    Truthfully, he should have been shut down weeks ago but we needed him. That is more an indictment on the kids than it is on Pettitte being “selfish”.

  96. #9 September 24th, 2008 at 4:51 pm

    The last 5 songs on my iPod:

    This Is Not America – David Bowie
    Here I Am (Come & Take Me) – Al Green
    The Way Young Lovers Do – Van Morrison
    On Hit (To The Body) – The Rolling Stones
    Queen Of Hearts – Dave Edmunds

    Yeah – I know – they’re all old dudes.

  97. sw September 24th, 2008 at 4:51 pm

    Why not Phil Coke for Saturday’s start? That would make the game interesting at least. Ponson, not so much.

  98. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 4:52 pm

    By the way, Ponson and Rasner were not gotten to be Andy Pettittelike. They were obtained for a song. Andy was paid a handsome salary.

    Hey all season long all I kept hearing was bring up this one, bring up that one, why not Chase Wright, we want to see Aceves. Now those were all said in respect to Ponson and Rasner. Well Andy wasn’t getting the job done either. Were posters reticent to make those same suggestions because it was Andy Pettitte?

  99. Mike S. September 24th, 2008 at 4:53 pm

    Mike S.— That Babe/Pettite stats is just silly. Babe pitched in five games in his last four seasons. Yes, he was 1-0, 2-0, 1-0, 1-0 in those seasons, but that’s pretty goofy to compare it to what Pettite has done.

    It may be silly, but it’s a stat. And what if Babe would have lost? Granted he only pitched in one game, but he WON it. And it’s exactly why Pedro, (0-1, 2.25 in 1992) is NOT listed.

    I don’t make the stats. I just report on them.

    The stat is the truth. Period.

  100. pat September 24th, 2008 at 4:54 pm

    Brandon

    At the risk of showing my age, who is Micheal Lee?

  101. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 4:55 pm

    “But like my wife says,when it’s 15 of them against 1 of me, it’s a fair fight. I can hold my own with the best of them”

    Drive, that’s what I like to hear! You must admit, we do have a lot of good material to throw out there as response.

    :)

  102. Dr. J September 24th, 2008 at 4:56 pm

    Keep Coke where he is, we have more than enough guys battling for spots next year in the rotation. It’s not like Coke has ace potential anyway, he’d be a nice middle guy.

    I suppose you can see what he is as a starter in ST, but his future is still probably in the pen.

    Sanchez is an interesting case as well… should he stay in the pen or get a chance at starting? A lot depends on what we do this off-season. Ideally, you would like to keep both Coke and Sanchez to make our bullpen that much better and shut down and have the rotation with proven workhorses who can pitch deep into games, with the exception of Joba.

  103. #9 September 24th, 2008 at 4:56 pm

    “If he (Hughes)pitches great, awful or in between, it tells us nothing about next year or his future.”

    Especially if he’s pitching against Toronto’s own version of a “B” lineup – they’re both out now so Toronto will also be giving their youngsters a chance.

  104. saucY September 24th, 2008 at 4:56 pm

    #9, you should get Al Green’s new album :)

  105. Save Us September 24th, 2008 at 4:56 pm

    Andy Pettitte was still more reliable than Ponson and Rasner. He would go 6 innings. He had a few bad starts, but nothing like Sid’s last 2 months. The difference is when Andy came out, the Yankees still believed they could win, and when Sid was out, everyone cringed.

  106. mel September 24th, 2008 at 4:57 pm

    90210 alum sighting on L&O. Luke Perry was a very bad guy.

  107. saucY September 24th, 2008 at 4:58 pm

    “You must admit, we do have a lot of good material to throw out there as response.”

    meanwhile, most of what i get in return is explanations of when a century actually starts :roll:

  108. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, now a fan of who ever plays the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 4:58 pm

    A-Rod 09 MVP. You heard it here first.

  109. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 4:58 pm

    Brandon

    At the risk of showing my age, who is Micheal Lee?

    You ever saw Tristan Wilds as Micheal Lee on “The Wire” ?

  110. Tank September 24th, 2008 at 4:58 pm

    Rivera
    Marte
    Melancon
    Sanchez
    Bruney
    Coke
    Edwar/Veras/Robertson/Aceves

    Lock Down.

  111. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 4:58 pm

    “The difference is when Andy came out, the Yankees still believed they could win, and when Sid was out, everyone cringed.”

    I think that might be a bit of a stretch. It’s really tough to attribute thoughts to “the Yankees” and “everyone”. I was at the game Sunday and I can tell you that I was far from “the only one” who felt nervous with Pettitte on the mound. And he didn’t disappoint…

  112. #9 September 24th, 2008 at 4:58 pm

    “#9, you should get Al Green’s new album”

    Already have Rev. Al’s “Lay It Down” on the ol’ ipoddy, saucY ;-) It’s a good one!

  113. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 4:59 pm

    Keep Coke where he is, we have more than enough guys battling for spots next year in the rotation. It’s not like Coke has ace potential anyway, he’d be a nice middle guy.

    I suppose you can see what he is as a starter in ST, but his future is still probably in the pen.

    They have Micheal Dunn who will also be a fast mover based on his stuff alone.

  114. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 4:59 pm

    Andy Pettitte, even hurt, is better than Ponson, Rasner and anybody else they could have put out there.

    Its not about wanting to “see the young guys”. Its about trying to win games.

    Even when he was hurting, he was giving them a chance to win games. If they hit a little more, especially earlier in a couple of those starts, he could have won those games.

    The Knoblauch and Pettitte situations are apples and oranges. The Yankees had a replacement for Chuck.

    They had nobody to replace Pettitte this year in the rotation, given Wang and Joba’s injuries, and the ineffectiveness of the rest of the starters.

    At some point, you run out of bodies.

    I have no problems with Andy trying to gut it out. That’s what being a gamer is about.

    Just because the results didn’t pan out, doesn’t mean it wasn’t the right thing to do.

    If he is to come back, he knows its not going to be for 16 million dollars. At this point, its more about him deciding whether or not he wants to play rather than taking the last buck on the table.

    At this time last year, EVERYBODY wrote Mike Mussina’s career obituary. Now, everybody wants him back.

    If all Andy has is a sore shoulder, there is no reason why he can’t get healthy in the off-season and be effective.

    If folks recall, he was having an excellent first half of the season before the shoulder gave out.

  115. AJ YANKS September 24th, 2008 at 5:00 pm

    Is it healthy to drink as many Diet Cokes as Francessa does in a day?

  116. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 5:00 pm

    well i know we arent in it any more but this lineup against burnett?

    im just a tad bit scared to watch lol

  117. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 5:00 pm

    …And Dunn’s slider is more filthy than Coke’s and he can dial it 95 + for lefty.

  118. Greg Cohen September 24th, 2008 at 5:01 pm

    Some new pics of the new stadium – - – http://tinyurl.com/4w63k8

  119. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 5:02 pm

    “meanwhile, most of what i get in return is explanations of when a century actually starts”

    :lol:

    I’ve gotten that one too! You just have to be able to talk faster and louder and manage to get in that 2 rings in the first 7 years is hardly enough to wash away the 13 year postseaon dynasty (and 4 rings) that began a scant 10 years ago or wash away the century previous to 2000 that saw 26 rings to their 4!

    I am furiously fast on my feet when it comes to responding to Sux silliness and I think it is just a product of my extreme disdain for their organization!

  120. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 5:03 pm

    To me, I see Coke more as another lefty in the ‘pen than a starter.

    He now has a plus fastball and a plus slider. His curve and change aren’t very good.

    There is no crime about having two lefties in the ‘pen.

    I think if you have Marte and Coke in the ‘pen next year, it gives Girardi a lot of flexibility in how he uses certain guys.

    You can go easy on the innings with the starters if you have guys like Coke and Melancon for example, able to pitch the middle innings. Both guys have shown the ability to go multiple innings without too much of a problem.

    In the AL, that’s a weapon.

    You would have Joba (at least at the start of the season), Marte, Bruney and Mo at the back end of the ‘pen.

    That’s a helluva bullpen. Could be a real weapon for the Yankees in ’09.

  121. 86w183 September 24th, 2008 at 5:03 pm

    Mike S—

    You’re right. A fact is a fact is a fact.

    As a Yankee Babe was 5-0 with a 5.52 ERA. Yes, he had a winning record all four seasons. However, drawing the parallel to that and what a full-time starter accomplished is, and I quote myself “silly”.

    As for Coke, it would be foolish to start him now.. his last 20 or so outings have been out of the pen with none of them lasting more than two innings.

  122. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, now a fan of who ever plays the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 5:05 pm

    Great pics thanks Greg.

  123. 86w183 September 24th, 2008 at 5:05 pm

    SJ— Don’t you think a bulplen like that is a pretty good welling point for CC, AJ or any other starter?

  124. 86w183 September 24th, 2008 at 5:05 pm

    SELLING point… damn I need typing lessons!

  125. E-Man September 24th, 2008 at 5:06 pm

    LOL what’s Joe’s obsession with Giambi batting 5th?

    Man, I hope this is Jason’s last year. I hope Joe doesn’t influence a decision to bring him back.

  126. #9 September 24th, 2008 at 5:07 pm

    “Is it healthy to drink as many Diet Cokes as Francessa does in a day?”

    A Doctor told me that whatever crap they use in Diet Coke makes you insides glow.

    And Benzene can’t be the healthiest thing to ingest.

    Good article here:

    http://www.theecologist.org/pa.....ent_id=636

  127. saucY September 24th, 2008 at 5:07 pm

    Greg, you’ve done a great job keeping up with those photos.

    The amount of foul territory is less than I imagined. I think baserunners will need to think twice about running on past balls…

  128. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 5:08 pm

    One last point on the bullpen for next year.

    One of the selling points the Yankees can give guys like CC, Lowe, Burnett, etc, is the quality and depth of the bullpen.

    Veterans already love the fact they have Mo to close out games.

    However, when you can roll out the quality arms out of the ‘pen the Yankees can possibly roll out next year, that takes a lot of heat off the starters. They won’t get abused and overused, which keeps them fresh throughout the season.

    It also lengthens their careers, which starting pitchers look at when examining free agent destinations.

    That’s why I see a guy like Coke having a more crucial role on the Yankees in the ‘pen rather than trying him again in the rotation.

  129. rconn23 September 24th, 2008 at 5:09 pm

    SJ44,

    I agree with your sentiments about Burnett. I think he’s a risk, but certainly not as large of one as some are making him out to be. He makes a very nice-backup plan if the team fails to land C.C. I think Lowe would be another nice option. Burnett’s stuff is nasty, with so much movement, that the only downside is sometimes an overabundance of walks.

    Pete, agree with the Johnny Cash comments. I am a big fan of Rick Rubin’s work with him.

    Rubin also did a great job producing the new Metallica album, which is great. Yes, I still listen to Metallica and love ‘em.

  130. mel September 24th, 2008 at 5:09 pm

    I read that only the foul territory behind home plate will be changed. Same down the lines, right?

    Also heard that there’s an order for down-filled padding for RF on hold. :)

  131. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 5:10 pm

    If Saturday’s game means ensuring Boston wins the Wild Card and not the Division title, I say tell Roger Clemens it was a big mistake that he wasnt mentioned Sunday night and bring him back to pitch the one game.

    I know Ponson has pitched well at times,but let’s not mess around here!

  132. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 5:11 pm

    “LOL what’s Joe’s obsession with Giambi batting 5th?”

    I don’t but that experiment is on it’s last legs.
    Patiently counting the days until Giambi career in pinstripes are over…

  133. Mike S. September 24th, 2008 at 5:11 pm

    I didn’t pitch for the Babe, nor should I have to apologize for the ERA. I know what his stats were. Not that impressive, but still the 5-0.

    But it’s a stat, and the point really is that anytime there is a stat where, in all of baseball history, it’s just you (Pettitte) and the Babe, no matter how obscure that stat, (and it’s a positive stat) it’s saying something. Enough said.

  134. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, now a fan of who ever plays the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 5:12 pm

    CC will only come to the Yanks if he is not afraid of the AL. Chances are he’ll stay where he can dominate with ease and there is no division weaker than the NL West.

  135. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 5:15 pm

    CC’s destination has nothing to do with fear.

    Its all about the Benjamins.

  136. mel September 24th, 2008 at 5:18 pm

    Speaking of CC, he’s going on short rest for the second start in a row. :shock:

  137. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 5:18 pm

    SJ44,

    You beat me to the punch. I think $20mil a year will buy a whole lotta shots of courage.

  138. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 5:19 pm

    Gammons on 1050 now going on and on about how great Mariano is.

    I have a bunch of Mariano stories I will share in the off-season.

    Of all the guys I have been around in sports, he is one of the three best players and people I have ever met or had the pleasure of being around.

    He’s truly one of a kind.

  139. Betsy September 24th, 2008 at 5:19 pm

    Cobra, maybe you expect Phil to be a #2 or #3 based on the very few times we have seen him over the past year (and based especially on April’s performance), but the Yankees think of him very much as a front-end starter.

    IMO, Phil’s real problem is Joba being on the team. Phil can K people for sure, but he is not a flame-thrower like Joba is. Now, it appears that he can only satisfy fans by striking out people left and right. Anything less than that is a complete failure by an overhyped mediocrity. This really shows me that Yankee fans (I’m not directing this to anyone in particular) don’t know more about baseball than anyone else and they aren’t particularly knowledgable period.

  140. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 5:19 pm

    it is just me or does the field in the new stadium looks way smaller than present stadium

    maybe i cant really picture it yet until its grass

  141. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, now a fan of who ever plays the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 5:19 pm

    “CC’s destination has nothing to do with fear.

    Its all about the Benjamins.”

    Ok. Then I think his choice should be clear :)

  142. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 5:19 pm

    Andy has gone down with injuries more than Carter has pills. He missed a hell of a lot of time with Houston because of his elbow problems. Mussina has been relatively much more durable. Andy is a walking problem.

    You’re not a gamer when you hurt your team.

    Actually I don’t care whether people see Andy as a hero or as a goat. It doesn’t matter to my life. I just don’t want to see him back at Yankee Stadium.

    http://www2.sportsnet.ca/baseb....._Pettitte/

    http://www2.sportsnet.ca/baseb.....e_Mussina/

    (And I don’t count Mussina’s hamstring downtime in 2007 since everyone came down with hamstring injuries due to the outstanding coaching job by the guy no longer there!)

  143. S.o.S.27 September 24th, 2008 at 5:20 pm

    Greg,
    Looks great!! I really appreciate the monthly pictures that youv been showing us. From a guy in Cali. Thank you and once again great stuff.

  144. TKinDC September 24th, 2008 at 5:21 pm

    Wow –

    It is hard to determine which team is trying to panic their way out of the playoffs more – the Mets or the Brew Crew.

    Leave a little of CC left for us Milwaukee – we’ll take good care of him :)

  145. Bill from NJ September 24th, 2008 at 5:22 pm

    When is this “great” curveball from Hughes going to show up? That’s the real concern here. Right now, he has a 91 mph fastball and a hanging breaking ball – this isn’t #1 or #2 starter stuff to whomever mentioned he was going to be ealier in the post.

  146. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 5:22 pm

    Mel,

    That (CC working on short rest again) speaks to two things:

    1. His competitiveness. Which is a good thing.
    2. The lack of power his agents have, which is a bad thing.

    If I was his agent, I would be going crazy right now.

    Its one thing to be competitive. Its another to risk 150+ million dollars.

  147. mel September 24th, 2008 at 5:23 pm

    One thing I will say about CC, is that if he comes it’ll really loosen up the clubhouse.

    Don’t know much about him personally, but he seems to be of the “hip-hop” generation?

    And imagine how stylish that Yankees cap would look with all his outfits, on and off the field. ;)

  148. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 5:23 pm

    SJ44,

    Where do you think Humberto Sanchez fits into their plans? For some reason I was thinking about him today and I can see the Yanks using him as part of a trade. I’ve never seen him pitch in person, but I liked what I saw the inning he threw last week. He’ll need to build his arm back up, but will he ever start again?

  149. #9 September 24th, 2008 at 5:23 pm

    “Its all about the Benjamins.”

    Translation: Its all about the Big Mamoo.

  150. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 5:24 pm

    Bill,

    Did you see his last start? He showed off the 12 to 6 curveball. He actually threw several great ones against the White Sox.

    He’s 22 years old and has been hurt all year. Its way too early to decide what he isn’t.

  151. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 5:26 pm

    Drive,

    If he stays with the Yankees, I think Humberto’s future is in the bullpen.

    I love his arm. I think its better suited for work in the bullpen.

    If he’s not traded, which I don’t believe he will be, he will be in the mix for a spot in the bullpen next year.

  152. Bill from NJ September 24th, 2008 at 5:26 pm

    SJ44,

    Must have missed it. Will be watching closely tonight though.

  153. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 5:27 pm

    Greg, great site! Love the links to MLB trades and MLB rumors.

  154. Betsy September 24th, 2008 at 5:28 pm

    SJ, care to summarize what Pete said? Mo is my favorite Yankee and I can never hear enough about him. I don’t think I’m wrong in saying that many pitchers in the majors are in awe of him and probably the younger guys idolize him. It’s been a real pleasure getting to watch him do his thing for so long – it’s incomprehensible to me that he’s 38/39 and he’s getting guys out with the same pitch as when he was 28/29. Remember when Tom Kelly said that (in 1996) Mo was in a different league then everyone else? IMO, that still holds true – as a pitcher and a person. Might he be unanimously elected to the HOF?

    Weather Man, I think it’s still way too early to conclude that Phil isn’t going to be an ace-type pitcher. What are you judging him on? The few April starts? Phil pitched great in the post-season last year- I don’t care if it was out of the pen. 21 year old rookies don’t just walk into a packed Yankee Stadium and completely shut down a very good lineup. We really need to withhold labeling Phil as anything right now. Let him pitch consistently first and just stay healthy.

    Also, it doesn’t matter to me that this game is meaningless. I’m still very interested to see how Phil does tonight and how he looks.

  155. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, now a fan of who ever plays the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 5:29 pm

    “Bill,

    Did you see his last start? He showed off the 12 to 6 curveball. He actually threw several great ones against the White Sox.

    He’s 22 years old and has been hurt all year. Its way too early to decide what he isn’t.”

    If Phil could stay healthy for more than a 2 months he would eventually get comfortable and start to dominate.

  156. mel September 24th, 2008 at 5:29 pm

    Interesting read:

    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/.....id=3606171

  157. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 5:30 pm

    I don’t think Hughes’ curveball is going to be a concern. I’m far more concerned with how flat his fastball seems to be. He’s never going to be Nolan Ryan, but I’d take a Mike Mussina.

  158. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, now a fan of who ever plays the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 5:31 pm

    New Yankee stadium looks amazing. I am so there for the opener.

  159. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 5:31 pm

    Andy Pettitte is likely to be scratched for Saturday with Sidney Ponson starting instead.

    so going to get bombed with Ponson on the mound on Saturday. seriously, no more September call ups?

  160. kd September 24th, 2008 at 5:32 pm

    SJ,

    Can’t wait for the Mariano stories. He’s always so predictable with what he says to the media, it’ll be interesting to see another side of him. Much like Derek Jeter, he seems to have a premeditated answer to most questions. Did the Yankees have a media guru in the mid-90′s? We need that guy to talk to ARod

  161. stuart September 24th, 2008 at 5:34 pm

    Sj,

    Burnett is a huge risk.. He is over 30, and been injured numerous times.

    he is almost a 500 career pitcher having his best year ever by far in his walk year.

    I get CC and leave it at that. Also for the Johan groupies, CC costs them draft picks not players… CC is younger and sturdier also…

  162. gayle September 24th, 2008 at 5:36 pm

    I mentioned this earlier when I had seen the new photos last week it looks like the foul zones on both the 1st and 3rd base side are smaller than at the current stadium. Already know that there is 20 feet less fould space behind home plate but had not seen anyone say anything aboutthe 1st and 3rd base lines

  163. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 5:37 pm

    Thnaks for the link to the new pics of the Stadium.

    One thing I’m wondering about with the new ballpark. It looks like the roof and friese covers a lot of the upper deck. I hope it doesnt block the view of balls in the air the way the Loge seats did in the real Stadium.

  164. mel September 24th, 2008 at 5:39 pm

    I would love for Sanchez to find success in the Bronx. Besides the obvious hometown connection, I’d like to see something come out of the Shef transaction besides a salary dump.

    Shef’s a horse’s behind, but you can’t question his heart. I think it’s great that he has his uncle staying with him since his release from prison. He also wants Doc to see #500 live.

  165. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 5:39 pm

    Betsy,

    I have to run but, I will give you what he said and one Mo story from my experience with him.

    Gammons was talking about how Mo decided he was the one who was going to escort Cora Rizzuto out to SS Sunday night and was going to stay with her throughout the ceremony.

    He told Gammons that it was going to be a long ceremony and that he “wanted to be there for her” if things got emotional. He stayed with her the entire ceremony (almost an hour and a half).

    My experience with Mo. Game 7 of the ’03 ALCS. Yankees win and things are crazy.

    A good friend of mine is a reporter for an out of state television network. He tried to get Mo (Mo said he would do a one on one with him) but, he had no shot. The networks basically shoved him aside and in the locker room, it was a madhouse.

    I’m with him and he is getting ready to give up and call it a night. Mo (whom I’ve met a few times prior to this evening but, I certainly don’t know him well) gets my attention and motions me to tap my friend (who was still trying to get him) on the shoulder.

    Mo, WALKS AWAY FROM ESPN, goes up to my friend and says, “give me 15 minutes and I’m all yours.

    Sure enough, 15 minutes later out walks Mariano Rivera, the hero (along with Aaron Boone) of the night, takes my friend, a television reporter from a small NE station, to the dugout (he says, “so nobody will bother us”), and gives him a one on one interview.

    Are you kidding me? Guys of Mo’s stature just don’t do that. Certainly not for small town reporters.

    He did it for one reason. Because he told my friend he would do it and didn’t want to renege on a promise.

    The guy is just an amazing person and VERY rare among today’s athletes.

  166. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 5:39 pm

    gayle,

    I thought the same thing about the foul ball area. If true, it could make it more of a hitter’s park than Yankee Stadium was.

  167. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 5:41 pm

    I too don’t understand why Ponson is being given a start this weekend. Is there no one the team wants to look at? Seems like a waste of an opportunity. Much as pitching Pavano again will be.

  168. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 5:42 pm

    I too don’t understand why Ponson is being giving the start. I would think a gamer would insist on taking the ball at fenway. After all we’re playing for pride aren’t we?

  169. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 5:44 pm

    Ponson can insist all he wants. It’s not his call to make. The team should give the start to someone who might play a role next year.

  170. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 5:44 pm

    trisha,

    I think you and I understand the severity of the situation more than most. Play your best and play your hardest to beat those damn Red Sux!!

  171. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 5:46 pm

    great article mel!

    what do you think, should moose and and come back?

  172. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 5:46 pm

    and andy*

  173. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 5:47 pm

    “I think you and I understand the severity of the situation more than most. Play your best and play your hardest to beat those damn Red Sux!!”

    Severity? Are you kidding?? It’s evaluation time. Besides, Ponson is arguably not even the best option to start.

  174. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 5:48 pm

    There is nobody else left. Everybody else went home.

    They aren’t going to call a guy back to the Yankees who hasn’t pitched in two weeks to pitch.

    Humberto Sanchez is not stretched out to start. Ponson is the last guy standing for that start.

  175. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 5:48 pm

    Drive you and I understand it, it seems, better than more of the distance challenged posters here :) but geeze you know the Yankee organization should understand it! I’m not so much down on Ponson as I am aware that his record against the Sux is abysmal!

    And I’m just stunned that Andy the gamer isn’t insisting on taking the ball. What, no glory left in it for him? He was okay to play all of the last games but not this one?

    Okay.

  176. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 5:50 pm

    ZMAN,

    Its not evaluation time. Nobody with any baseball chops evaluates players in September. That’s when you get false reads on players.

    You are just playing out the string. That’s all it is.

    Nobody is taking September performances and overdoing it on the evaluation side of things.

  177. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 5:50 pm

    Can’t Giese throw 4 or 5 innings?

  178. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 5:51 pm

    SJ — I’ll agree with you on games that have no meaning. However, if a guy is playing against a team that is still fighting for a playoff spot, his performance has meaning.

  179. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 5:52 pm

    trisha,
    maybe andy doesnt want to do more damage to his body that has been done, he even said his body is tired

    why kill himself for a game that means practically nothing, dont worry hes resting and getting himself back together for next season

    that is if he comes back of course lol

  180. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 5:53 pm

    but i agree that just because andy isn’t going to start doesn’t mean you throw ponson into the wolves

  181. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 5:54 pm

    trisha,

    As much as I want to win every game this weekend,I don’t hold it against Andy for not starting. He’s obviously pitched in a lot more pain than he’s let on. He’s a better pitcher than he showed in the 2nd half this year.

    As far as pitching last Sunday, he and Derek were both hurting. But nothing was going to stop them from playing in the last game at Yankee Stadium. I give them credit for that.

    My concern would be that it’s to nobody’s benefit if either of them worsened their injury by playing from here on out. We at least owe them them the benefit of the doubt.They’ve earned it.

  182. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 5:54 pm

    The new stadium field does look smaller then the current one. but they did say the dimensions are same. There will be less foul territory behind home plate.

  183. #9 September 24th, 2008 at 5:55 pm

    “…going to get bombed with Ponson…”

    Hey dude! Which bars you guys hitting – maybe I’ll meet up with yous!

  184. Betsy September 24th, 2008 at 5:55 pm

    SJ, wow – those are tremendous stories.

    Mo is a rare individual indeed and I suspect that when he retires, we are going to hear everyone in every aspect of the game (players, coaches, GMs, etc..) sing his praises. It seems that at every All-Star Game, pitchers want to soak up his knowledge and he’s all to willing to pass that on. I think he was showing Roy Halladay the grip on his cutter at this past game….as if Roy needs any more help, lol. Seriously, though, Mo is going to leave quite a legacy that it will be impossible to top.

    I imagine that the old-time Yankees would have been thrilled to have a guy like Mo on their teams – not just for his greatness on the mound, but because he represents the Yankees so well and honors them every day just by his proud, quiet nature. I’m sure Cora Rizzuto appreciated his support on Sunday and, as to your friend, that’s really fantastic. Mo kept his word and I’m sure your friend will never forget it. I could go on and on about Mo.

  185. MichiganYankee September 24th, 2008 at 5:55 pm

    200-run drop-off from 2008:

    Injury to Posada (and Molina’s regression) accounts for 75.
    Cano’s regression accounts for 35. Melky’s regression is another 20. A-Rod’s regression is another 32 (that’s how good he was last year), and Jeter’s is 14. That’s 176 runs (derived from VORP differentials). The futility of the bench (at least Shelly Duncan was producing last year) contributes a few more, though improvements by Giambi, Damon and Abreu provide an offset. It would seem then that a drop-off of about 30 runs is just due to a lack of “clutchness.”

  186. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 5:56 pm

    trevor
    thats what got me confused, how can the field look smaller if the dimensions are the same

    i blame it on the concrete looking stuff instead of grass
    in the end im sure its going to be a beauty

  187. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 5:57 pm

    The Rays finish out their series with the Tigers and the Angels finish out with the Rangers. I somehow don’t see either team losing all their remaining games. That’s what it would take for the Angels to lose HFA, and the Sux would have to win all the rest of theirs. At this point the Rays are 3 games ahead of the Sux in the loss column. So the Rays would have to lose at least three of their remaining games and the Sux would have to win the same three for there to be a tie. I also don’t see the Rays losing three games to the Tigers.

    But the Yankees still have a responsibility to try to win its remaining games so as to finish no lower than third place and also to help take away any potential HFA for the Sux.

    That said, whyever pitch Sidney against the Sux? Girardi may be feeling that it would be a slap in the face not to do it, but hopefully he will be willing to have a fast hook and will be willing to cobble together innings out of people like Giese and Robertson.

    What a disappointment that Pettitte isn’t willing to be enough of a gamer to take the ball for the start in Boston.

  188. bru September 24th, 2008 at 5:58 pm

    the yankees in the 90′s were always good with a bunch of 4.00 era pitchers,maybe 1 or 2 under that.
    they do not need sabathia.they should develope coke as a starter.aceves,coke get a shot.if they stink scrap them.

    sign mussina for one year,sign dempster,take a look at perez,trade cano and prospect(s) to the dodgers for billingsley,trade hughes for mclouth or votto.the rest is easy.
    they might not get votto,billingsley or mclouth but should target similar young players in a certain order from a specific wan’t list.
    rumors say that we can get mclouth for hughes,maybe a tad more.
    if we can get billingsley or someone similar it will allow us to use hughes to get a center fielder or first baseman without being hurt whatsoever and probably come out much better.billingsley replaces hughes.
    the reason cano should be traded is because it will take a potential star to bring in a great young pitcher that is more established and less of a risk than hughes.
    it might be tough to trade hughes for billingsley because they will be compared pitcher to pitcher,with cano it is a little harder comparing a second baseman to a pitcher.that is why cano should be used to get a pitcher and hughes to get a center fielder or first baseman.
    if abraeu is kept he should dh.he is a hard bat to replace.if abraeu leaves dh matsui.

    cc and tex should absolutely be considered but if they wan’t anything over 5 years i would pass.they could end up being terrible contracts.5 years or bye bye.

    imo the yankees should pass alltogether because of all the huge contracts they already have.

    they can build a very nice team but a strong young pitching staff is the key.with aceves,coke pitching well they have plenty of prospects to get it done.ajax,montero,betances also should be in play as long as the right young players are brought in.

  189. Joe Monte September 24th, 2008 at 5:58 pm

    SJ44 – Great story to hear about Mo, and I don’t think anybody is surprised by his actions.

    Mo is the greatest and I hope he pitches for 10 more years! (ha!)

  190. 27 this year September 24th, 2008 at 5:59 pm

    MichiganYankee,

    I like your analysis but I think maybe some other runs could just come from morale. Think about it, the whole season was just a bunch of downhill, bad thing after bad thing happening. That has to account for the pressure adn other things on the team. For example, if Hughes and Kennedy started off decently, the offense wouldn’t be pressured and the Yankees would have been winning more games which would make the players just play better.

  191. Duke Sims September 24th, 2008 at 5:59 pm

    Why is A-Rod sitting? He can win the home run title. Is Girardi trying to alienate another veteran besides Damon?

  192. 27 this year September 24th, 2008 at 6:01 pm

    Bru,

    Dempster is probably going to sign with the Cubs and this season was a career year for him adn his first season in a few being a full time starter. I doubt he will be nearly as good next year adn relying on him is a mistake. Perez, I just don’t think will help because he has been pretty decent in the NL for the Mets and only pitched good against good teams. He was pathetic against under .500 teams adn I just don’t think you are going to get him for less than maybe 15 mil a year over a few years. He is better than Silva and Boras is his agent.

  193. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:02 pm

    Drive, you can bet Jeter will be there in the last game.

    About Andy – I guess I have just grown tired of him and see him as an injury prone pitcher who should just retire. Did you see the injury history I posted? God Lord if we were looking to bring any other pitcher to the Stadium with that injury list, people would be screaming bloody murder – and well they should be.

  194. 27 this year September 24th, 2008 at 6:03 pm

    Joe Monte,

    I am surprised that Mo is considering retirement after this contract. After all, he never had major arm issues because his delivery is good and he only throws a fastball that goes everywhere. That is why he rarely struggles, one pitch is all he needs. I love him!!!!!!!

  195. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 6:03 pm

    trisha

    i don’t know what you expect from andy, the guy is hurting and is tired, and you want him to start WHY? seriously FOR WHAT?

    he is a gamer hence he eats up innings even though hes not at his best and is aching

    do you seriously think he walked up to girardi and said i dont want to pitch on saturday because we are out of it

    i highly doubt that, i know your nervous to see ponson start because well lets face it, its going to be red sox batting practise, but its no need to blame on andy

  196. Fran September 24th, 2008 at 6:03 pm

    Mariano’s sons went to my uncle’s summer day camp in New Rochelle for 5 summers. Mariano would always come one day during the summer and spend time at the camp playing ball with the kids and giving every kid in the camp an autograph. He was always gracious and friendly.

  197. 27 this year September 24th, 2008 at 6:04 pm

    Trisha,

    I disagree with the injury history of Pettite. He has had issues but I think the past 5 or 6 seasons he pitched over 200 innings. I personally would rather have him than like Livan as my innings eater. He isn’t much more than that, a 4.50 ERA with 200 innings. Pretty valuable.

  198. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 6:06 pm

    Trisha,

    What in the world are you talking about? He’s hurt. What part of that don’t you understand?

    They are out of the race now and there is no reason to pitch an injured pitcher.

    Geez, I’m surprised you aren’t calling for Chien Ming Wang to start on Saturday since it seems so important to you.

    Those Red Sox games may be important to you but, they aren’t important to anybody else.

    Tampa Bay holds the tiebreaker (head to head record) against the Red Sox. That means, they have a 4 game lead with 5 to play.

    They win one more game, they win the division.

    I realize Andy Pettitte is your whipping boy today.

    Funny since “warriors” like Ponson, Farnsworth, Ranser and Pavano, all 4 of whom you defend to the death, have pitched worse during their time as Yankees than Pettitte has.

    Why is that? Do you not think he didn’t try?

    It makes no sense to bang on Pettitte except in your world.

    What’s even more ironic is, those games may not even be played since its supposed rain all weekend in Boston.

  199. Doreen September 24th, 2008 at 6:08 pm

    SJ44-

    Thanks for relating what Gammons said and sharing one of your personal Mo stories. Just confirmation of what most of us felt – Mo is one of a kind in so many ways.

    Regarding Ponson pitching in Boston. You know, it’s not an ideal situation, last time he got bombed. But even though the desired results weren’t always there, Ponson worked it for the Yankees. And stood up after games for questions, win or lose, good game or poor game, making no excuses. We might have wanted it to be anyone but Ponson, but it WAS Ponson, and he gave it whatever he had. I’m gonna root for him on Saturday to turn in the best performance he’s had all year.

    Would I want him to be part of the staff next season – no. The Yankees need more. But I won’t trash a guy who worked hard and was a man.

  200. sw September 24th, 2008 at 6:08 pm

    Since Andy debuted in the majors in 1995, only Maddux, Glavine and Mussina have logged more starts, that’s pretty durable for an “injury prone” pitcher.

  201. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 6:08 pm

    “What’s even more ironic is, those games may not even be played since its supposed rain all weekend in Boston.”

    NOOOOOOO, poor moose everytime he gets close to 20 something always ruins it :(

  202. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 6:12 pm

    Injury history? The guy had elbow surgery when he was with the Astros.

    He pitched all year last year and pitched very well.

    How did he pitch in Game 2 of the ALDS last year? How was that for an “injury prone” pitcher?

    This year, he had a solid first half and got hurt in the second half of the season. Even being hurt, the guy still had some good outings in the second half but had little run support.

    He’s not injury prone. Carl Pavano is injury prone. Care to produce his sterling injury history?

    Andy Pettitte takes the ball 28-32 times a year and has for most of his career. You can count on one hand the number of guys who do that over a 12 year period.

    He’s also won a LOT of big games for this franchise. More than a lot of the wounded warriors you defend over the course of the season.

    When I see people bang on the Jeter’s, Pettitte’s, Posada’s, and Rivera’s of the world, it makes me see why people hate Yankee fans.

    If there are 4 players who should be beyond getting the beatdown treatment from a fan base, its those 4 guys.

    On and off the field, they have carried themselves as well as anybody could ask, with 4 rings to boot.

    Pretty tough to ask for more than that.

  203. bru September 24th, 2008 at 6:13 pm

    why on earth is ponson starting? there is no chance of him being in the rotation in 2009.

    the kids should play.cervelli should be catching,miranda the last few games,kennedy over ponson,ajax in center or right field.
    NOTHING TO LOSE.it would be good for the kids to get a taste.

  204. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:14 pm

    “i know your nervous to see ponson start because well lets face it, its going to be red sox batting practise, but its no need to blame on andy”

    Uh no that’s not it at all. I am not “nervous” rather I am cognizant of the fact that everyone is calling Andy a gamer since he was willing to take the ball every 5 days obviously injured – OR INEFFECTIVE – but now the last game against our biggest rival he wimps out because there is nothing else to play for? What about the pride that everyone is talking about. If the Yankees were still in it, would he be to hurt to play? Doubtful. The shine started to come off the apple for me when I realized that his goody goody image wasn’t all that it was cracked up to be and he had not admitted to using HGH until he was really confronted with someone turning him in. So I don’t think he’s all he’s cracked up to be anymore. Plus I think he’s ineffective.

    I have no difficulty with Ponson starting if that’s what the Yankees want to do. My difficulty is with Andy not taking the ball. That’s what a gamer does.

    That’s how I see it. I don’t care who agrees with me and who doesn’t. You’re entitled to see it differently.

    The Yankees need to have effective pitching in their rotation next year. After being dumped out of the postseason for the first time in thirteen years it’s even more crucial that the Yankees do a top-notch job with their rotation. That means not bringing back ineffective injury-prone pitchers because they want to come back. I can see taking a chance on Mussina. You’d be blind not to see that. So we will have Wang back, Joba according to the Yankees, and that leaves three spots (unless I’m forgetting someone.) I am hoping that Moose gets one of them. That leaves two. Everyone is yammering about getting younger. Well we’ve seen that we have a lot of potential from which to choose. Did Aceves look bad to you? Does he deserve a shot to try out in spring training? And what about Phil Hughes?

    To save rotation spots for two aging pitchers “just because” is ludicrous unless you have no other options. And everyone is also yammering to go and get a free agent or two. Well there are only 5 places.

    I’m suggesting that it is not necessarily unintelligent to think that Pettitte hasn’t earned one of them and that if we want to get younger you don’t do it by bringing back two aging starters! Two of five spots are taken. That leaves three. Everyone wants a FA – that leaves two. Phil Hughes is slotted as a possibility. That leaves one. If you think Moose deserves the right to come back – as I do – that leaves none.

  205. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 6:17 pm

    “When I see people bang on the Jeter’s, Pettitte’s, Posada’s, and Rivera’s of the world, it makes me see why people hate Yankee fans.”

    exactly my thoughts,thats what i like to call a yankee fan stereotype, but not everyone is like that, for example all those people at the stadium on the last day, we were practically out of it but you wouldnt have thunk it if you listened to the crowd that night

  206. mel September 24th, 2008 at 6:17 pm

    Andy has given his all to this club. It would sicken me to the nth degree if they threw money at someone else without asking him to come back for a year.

    Andy is not rubbish. He hasn’t even pitched like rubbish. It was just sub-par for the high standard that Andy has set for himself. With a probable injury.

    And please stop bringing up the $16M. This year’s option was to sweeten the pot so Andy would come back. Remember? Came back and saved our butts?

    Not going to be a problem anyway. As long as there’s no structural damage, Andy will be back if he wants.

    Trisha, this is not even remotely directed at you. There have been lots of people who share your opinion. Not as strongly, but your passion is immeasurable. Time to move on? :)

  207. Sea Net September 24th, 2008 at 6:18 pm

    CC won’t loosen the clubhouse. The Yankees are where personalities go to die. CC will become a Giambi-like Robot.

    Infact, that is one of the reasons he probably won’t come here— too many rules and too corporate for a laid-back, fun loving guy like CC. No facial hair, no candy, pressure to win, uptight manager, demanding fans, demeaning media etc.

    The only thing that was attractive to FAs about NY was the fact we could always offer the best chance to win of every team. We were locks for the playoffs and always did everything to win. Now, we are jut another team. We have no farm system and have the 3rd best team in the division. We have been one and done each of the last 3 years and now are not even in the playoffs. We have the toughest road to the playoffs of any team.

    All we have is money, but do we really want somebody who is only coming here because we give him $60 million more than the Dodgers?

  208. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:19 pm

    SJ – Andy is not injury prone?

    :lol:

    Guess you missed the link to his injuries. You might want to look at it and make that statement again!

    :D

    http://www2.sportsnet.ca/baseb....._Pettitte/

  209. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 6:20 pm

    Wow, when you really get down on a player, you dom’t go halfway, lol.

  210. COL 88 September 24th, 2008 at 6:20 pm

    http://www.newsday.com/sports/.....009.column

    More Sabathia Speculation

    Here’s what a friend of CC Sabathia told Midweek Insider this past week about the impending free-agent left-hander: “CC likes to be happy.”

    Sabathia, in other words, wants to be in a cheery atmosphere.

    He’s not afraid of pressure or adversity, but he’ll put himself in a place where the environment is supportive.

    Do the Yankees qualify as such a setting? Players from other teams used to want to play for Torre; will Girardi carry any of the same cache? Will the Yankees’ offer surpass the others by such a considerable margin that Sabathia won’t even worry about happiness?

    These questions will be answered shortly enough. But before Sabathia’s free agency even starts, it is proving to be one of the more dramatic cases.

    Sabathia has told people that he was building a home in California’s Orange County. But that is apparently on hold until Sabathia decides on his next employer.

  211. mel September 24th, 2008 at 6:21 pm

    Well, looks like Cito is in “win at all costs” mode.

  212. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 6:23 pm

    Trisha,

    Injuried pitchers don’t pitch in meaningless games.

    What part of that don’t you understand/

    Put aside your hatred of the Red Sox for a minute and think like an adult.

    The MANAGER is not going to use an injured pitcher in a meaningless game. HE is the guy who shut him down.

    That’s how it works. If Girardi asked Pettitte to pitch, he would pitch. He SMARTLY refrained.

    Pitchers get hurt. Its a fact of life.

    Wang has missed more starts due to injury in his 4 year career than Andy Pettitte has missed his ENTIRE career.

    Joba even missed 5 weeks with an injury.

    When Andy Pettitte is healthy, as he was last year and the first half of this year, he is one of the best pitchers in the league. That’s indisputable.

    If you don’t want him on the team, fine. Fortunately, you aren’t Brian Cashman.

    As far as HGH, please, let’s not go down that road. Over 70% of the guys in the game were using something to keep them going over the course of a year. That’s how the game rolled for 20 years.

    The world isn’t Alice in Wonderland. Professional athletes aren’t all angels. It also doesn’t make them bad guys either.

    Andy Pettitte is one of the good guys in the game. Its a shame your fandom can’t allow you to see that.

    Ironically, you defend Sidney Ponson, a convicted FELON. Amazing.

  213. vtred September 24th, 2008 at 6:23 pm

    Passing on Santana sent a bad message to the team and to other FAs— the Yankees are no longer the team that will do whatever it takes to win it all. Considering parity is at its height and we are in 3rd place, that isin’t exactly a comforting thought for FAs or for guys on the team.

    Santana wanted to come here badly. We were his first choice. We are CC’s last choice.

  214. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:25 pm

    “As long as there’s no structural damage, Andy will be back if he wants.”

    If the Steinbrenners want to win, this may not be the case Mel. After all, we’re talking about one rotation spot in a rotation that we want to be highly competitive and for which there will be more able bodies than Andy’s hopefully available to do the job. I’ve already listed the two spots already taken. If Moose and Andy are to take two of the remaining three, I don’t see that we’ve made improvements to our rotation, or at least the improvements that we need to be making. Face it, we have guys down below that will be competing for those positions. I definitely think Hughes is part of our future. So you’re talking about either not getting a FA at all – something I don’t care about one way or the other but something I know posters here are passionate about – or leaving one of Moose or Andy out.

    If Moose wants to come back, I think it would harder to make a case against it based on his season.

    Not as easy as I think some posters are thinking.

  215. nyyfaninlaaland September 24th, 2008 at 6:25 pm

    Why do we see Burnett as less risky than Sheets? Just because he’s healthier today? Or because Sheets has openly worried about his elbow ligament? It’s not like these guys won’t be given medical exams before signing.

    Every season Burnett has pitched 200+ innings, he’s missed significant time for the next 2. That can be coincidence, but he’s hit his career high this season – is there trouble ahead? Sheets was quite durable early on, but has had issues in the last 4 seasons.

    But this aside, Sheets will be 2 years younger on Opening Day 2009, may well be cheaper given the immediate health concerns, and has frankly pitched better than Burnett this season. Don’t give me the NL / AL thing – league ERA’s are very comparable this year, but Sheets’ is over a run better than AJ’s. Burnett K’s more at this career stage, but Sheets’ WHIP is better because of better control.

    If the docs say he’s okay, Sheets is as good a bet as Burnett, is largely unknown to AL hitters, and should be cheaper based on perception more than performance. It all comes down to the medical evaluation.

  216. mel September 24th, 2008 at 6:25 pm

    I don’t even care what players think about the Yankees. Ask Jose Molina what he thought about the Yankees before he was traded here. He’ll tell you that his preconceptions were wrong, wrong, wrong.

    You want to be a Yankee or not? If we have to bribe people to come here or if they don’t want to be a team player by doing something as simple as being well-groomed, then in the words of the infamous Michael Kay, “C-ya!”

  217. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 6:26 pm

    hmmm CC is more of a toss up then any of the other free agent pitchers out there

    yes we can offer him money but will that be enough? only time will tell

    if CC wants to stay in the NL then fine, but i see it as the yanks job to make sure that if he wants to try the AL that we get him

  218. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:26 pm

    “Wow, when you really get down on a player, you dom’t go halfway, lol.”

    You noticed? :D

    That’s probably because unlike the majority of posters here, it is so seldom that I get down on a player that when I do I feel that I probably have really good reason to back it up.

  219. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 6:28 pm

    Trisha,

    Since 1995, only Mussina, Maddox, Glavine have logged more starts than Andy Pettitte.

    Injury prone pitchers don’t post a record like that over 13 years.

    Really, I get the fact that Pettitte is on your bad side. Meaning, any objective analysis or explanation to you falls on deaf ears.

    If he does come back next year, do me one favor. Don’t post how much you love him if he pitches well.

    Hold that love for convicted felons like Ponson. It seems like they elict your “sensitive” side more than a guy who has given his guts to this franchise all these years.

    And you call yourself a Yankee fan? Wow.

  220. Meaningless Stats September 24th, 2008 at 6:29 pm

    Vtred,

    I do think not getting Santana did not sit well in the clubhouse– for a veteran laden team that wants to win. You think Jeter wanted to rebuild? Think we wanted to spend the last years of Mariano rebuilding? The last year of Mussina/Giambi rebuilding? Andy on the brink of retirement aftr the Mitchell report came back to rebuild? Cashman did the veterans a disservice and it showed.

    Posada himself lobbied for Santana. He was right, we did need a #1. I would hate to be Cashman in the likely scenario we miss out on CC…

  221. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 6:29 pm

    I didn’t think it was so much the veteran pitching that did them in this year though, but ineffective rookie pitching and offense that to date has scored almost 200 runs less than they did last year. Thats a huge drop off, and especially hard to overcomew with ineffective rookie pitching.

  222. mel September 24th, 2008 at 6:29 pm

    vtred,

    I don’t think that’s the message that was sent at all.

    And Johan knew that the Yankees would go all out to get Johan at any price he named if he hit FA.

    Apparently he didn’t mind going to the Mets because he signed off on it. He could’ve told the team privately that he would only agree to a trade with the Yankees, get the best deal you can from them.

    FA only care about one me$$age.

  223. PAT M September 24th, 2008 at 6:29 pm

    Such passion from the usually stoic SJ…Andy Pettite is a what indusrty insiders call a ballplayers ballplayer….I’m not one for cliche’s, but it truly applies to him….

  224. R-Tek September 24th, 2008 at 6:31 pm

    If my choices are Hughes/Kennedy or Pettitte coming off a 5 ERA season with a bad elbow, I take Pettitte everyday of the week.

    It shouldn’t come down to that, but if it does, the answer is petty clear.

  225. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:31 pm

    “If you don’t want him on the team, fine. Fortunately, you aren’t Brian Cashman.”

    You know that’s one statement that I think many of us can make about some of the “suggestions” made here by many others. I know I’ve thought the same about you when you were on a tear about certain players you didn’t think belonged.

    By the way, you were the one ready to shanghai Andy Pettitte earlier in the season when I was making a case for him and you gave every reason in the world he should be gone! I should just hunt down that post and use the reasons you used. Maybe you’d buy them!

    :lol:

  226. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 6:32 pm

    Not at all just observing that you are equally passionate no matter which position you take.

  227. Peter Abraham September 24th, 2008 at 6:33 pm

    I can confirm what SJ44 is saying about Mo. I’ve been doing this job all of my adult life and Mariano is one of the top 2 or 3 guys I’ve ever dealt with. A true professional and a classy guy.

    As for Andy, his shoulder is bothering him and has been bothering him for 2 months. Why is that so complicated to understand? Now that the games are meaningless, you don’t pitch him.

    I should be immune to it by now. But the lack of common sense among some people still astounds me.

  228. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 6:33 pm

    Actually, you don’t have a good reason to back it up.

    Its because he won’t pitch the last game of the year against your hated Red Sox that you lose all objectivity.

    That’s not a “good” reason. Its a silly one. Actually, its a sad one, given who you have gone to the mat to defend on this team over the course of the year.

    Turning on Andy Pettitte because Girardi won’t pitch him while injured in a meaningless game against the Red Sox is beyond foolish. Its sad.

    Girardi wants Pettitte back next year. He has already told him so. It will be interesting to see what happens.

    Its certainly an option because I doubt the Yankees are going to fill 40% of their rotation with kids in 2009.

    That’s a mistakes they won’t make again anytime soon.

  229. Jorge Tabata September 24th, 2008 at 6:34 pm

    Didn’t Girardi already ask for Pettitte to come back without even checking with Cahsman? That was a message by Girardi to Cashman… I want to win next year, enough with the overhyped kids.

  230. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:35 pm

    “Injury prone pitchers don’t post a record like that over 13 years.”

    I linked to his numerous injury record. If you want to try to throw in red herrings rather than deal with it, feel free. I will now look to compare the other pitchers you mentioned to see if their days out of the rotation have been as numerous as Andy’s.

  231. Doreen September 24th, 2008 at 6:35 pm

    vtred -

    Santana didn’t want to come here badly enough to force the trade with the Yankees, did he? And he didn’t turn down the trade to the Mets and instead hold off for free agency. I’m not saying he didn’t want to come here. I’m just saying at the end of the day, it apparently wasn’t something he insisted on.

  232. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 6:36 pm

    trisha – BRING BOBBY BACK!
    September 24th, 2008 at 6:19 pm
    SJ – Andy is not injury prone?

    Guess you missed the link to his injuries. You might want to look at it and make that statement again!

    http://www2.sportsnet.ca/baseb....._Pettitte/

    __________________________________________________

    If you look at that list a little closer, you’ll see that 9 of them had nothing to do with injuries. The entries in 2004 were all the same injury. He hurt the elbow checking a swing early in the season while pitching in Houston. Almost everything listed were double entries for the same injury. He had some groin injuries in spring training that carried over into the start of the season. The same injuries that wang had in those two years. Basically, he’s had two major injuries…2002 and 2004. In 14 years, he’s pitched over 200 innings in 10 of them…one in his rookie year when he was called up in late April.

  233. bru September 24th, 2008 at 6:36 pm

    mel :

    Burnett will cost you about half of what CC will.

    and he will pitch half the innings.

    sabathia will get between 20-23 million a year,burnett,13-17 million,much more than half.

    i hate to say it but they both are bad decisions.
    sign mussina and maybe pettitte,sign one fa pitcher and trade for another good young one is the way to go.

  234. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:37 pm

    “As for Andy, his shoulder is bothering him and has been bothering him for 2 months. Why is that so complicated to understand? Now that the games are meaningless, you don’t pitch him.”

    If his shoulder was bothering him for two months he had no business in the rotation blowing games for the Yankees. Why is THAT so complicated to understand?

  235. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 6:37 pm

    I don’t really get down on Yankee players, anyway. The last one I really did was Kevin Brown, the minute he put his had through the wall, lol.

  236. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 6:37 pm

    *hand

  237. mel September 24th, 2008 at 6:39 pm

    Trisha,

    I don’t want to go round and round in circles with you on the topic. We all like Phil, but 9 fans out of 10 would take Pettitte over Phil next season if they were battling for that last spot.

    I am not advocating keeping Andy for the next 5 years. Sometimes it comes down to making human decisions over baseball decisions. Giving the extra year to Mo, not knowing that he would be lights out. Giving the extra year to Jorge knowing there’s very little chance he’ll need his gear by then. Keeping Jeter at SS a year or two longer than he should.

    These are the Yankees.

  238. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 6:42 pm

    Trisha,

    You can pull all the posts you want about what I say. I will tell you this much, I don’t bang on injured guys.

    If a guy isn’t trying, like Cano at stages during the year, I will bang on him because effort shouldn’t be something that is optional among major league players.

    If I bang on a guy, and I find out later he was really hurt, as was the case with Jeter earlier in the year, I have ZERO problems admitting I am wrong.

    What I won’t do is bang on guys who have been damn good to this franchise and treat them as if they are garbage simply because they aren’t playing in a meaningless game against the Red Sox.

    In fact, if I was Girardi, the only game I would play the A Lineup the rest of the way is Moose’s final startt. He deserves that.

    Aside from that game, the season is done. There is no reason to play guys who are hurt.

    Pat M,

    If this team had 25 Andy Pettitte’s on it, they would be going to the playoffs.

    The problem is, they don’t and that’s why they are going home.

    As you can tell, I am old school when it comes to assembling a team. What a player has (in terms of guts) is as important to me as his skillset.

    The Yankees have a lot of guys who put up pretty numbers on the team. Great for fantasy baseball, not so great for winning baseball.

    Andy Pettitte is one of those guys who brings his guts to every start. He has been hurt for two months yet, still took the ball.

    He could have just shut himself down, still would have collected his check and nobody would have faulted him yet, he didn’t do that.

    Same with Jeter and his smashed hand. Matsui, rehabbing his knee to give it one last try this year.

    Just because the results didn’t go as desired doesn’t diminish what those guys tried to do.

    Sorry but, you can’t bang on guys like that. You hope you can have a team full of them.

    If you do, you usually get fitted for rings at the end of the year.

  239. Doreen September 24th, 2008 at 6:42 pm

    As “ineffective” as Andy Pettitte has been the last 6 weeks of the season, some run support would have won at least 2 or 3 of the 5 games he lost. He stayed in games longer than he had the energy for to save the bullpen, which had been overworked because of ineffective starts by Rasner and Ponson, and Andy is extremely good at grinding out innings. He never used his tired or sore arm as an excuse for his less than stellar outings, though I believe the Yankees were “in” all but one of them. He stood patiently and answered question after question, never talking about not feeling strong enough.

    Andy’s what you want from your team. There is no way if he is hurt he should pitch in a game that means nothing at all for his own team. Yes, you want the team to play for pride at this point, but not foolish pride.

    The Andy Pettitte’s are few and far between.

  240. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:43 pm

    mel, I always love it when people say things like “everybody would”, “9 out of 10 people would”. I mean come on. You have no idea any more than I do about how many people are feeling what way. I can only tell you that I know for sure about 10 people who don’t want to see Andy back again because that was about the number of people I heard talking about it either on the ramps waiting to go to the Monuments or in the bleachers when he made his way to the mound.

    Although I would assume there are more than those 10 I can’t give you numbers or percentages.

    SJ, about me rooting for someone who comes back and does well, I guess I have as much right to do it as you do to trash Pettitte earlier in the season and want him back now!

    Let the person without sin here cast the first stone…

  241. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 6:45 pm

    “If his shoulder was bothering him for two months he had no business in the rotation blowing games for the Yankees. Why is THAT so complicated to understand?”

    i would like to know who in the world would you have replaced him with at the time? rasner? ponson?

    he was being a “GAMER”, sucking it up for the team and trying the best he could, i would rather an injured andy any day then rasner or ponson

    why is THAT so complicated to understand?

    how about we just agree to disagree :)

  242. You Know Who September 24th, 2008 at 6:46 pm

    Here’s hoping the Yanks won’t suck today.

    Let’s go Indians!

    ( Hi Trisha :) )

  243. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 6:46 pm

    SJ44,

    “Those Red Sox games may be important to you but, they aren’t important to anybody else.”

    I say WHOA!! I draw the line there, big fella. We’re out for blood against Boston if it’s this Saturday or a pickup tidleywinks charity event in December.

    If Andy cant pitch, what’s so wrong about him having his buddy Rog spell him? lol

  244. Joey's Poodle September 24th, 2008 at 6:47 pm

    SJ,

    Thanks for the stories, looking forward to more when you have the time and inclination.

    Amazing the patience you have dealing with the irrational nonsense that gets posted here sometimes, but I appreciate having someone with the actual current contact reminding people that players like Pettite, Jeter, Mariano and Posado are or should be beyond such childish lashing out.

  245. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 6:47 pm

    Doreen
    September 24th, 2008 at 6:42 pm
    As “ineffective” as Andy Pettitte has been the last 6 weeks of the season, some run support would have won at least 2 or 3 of the 5 games he lost. He stayed in games longer than he had the energy for to save the bullpen, which had been overworked because of ineffective starts by Rasner and Ponson, and Andy is extremely good at grinding out innings. He never used his tired or sore arm as an excuse for his less than stellar outings, though I believe the Yankees were “in” all but one of them. He stood patiently and answered question after question, never talking about not feeling strong enough.

    Andy’s what you want from your team. There is no way if he is hurt he should pitch in a game that means nothing at all for his own team. Yes, you want the team to play for pride at this point, but not foolish pride.

    The Andy Pettitte’s are few and far between.

    ____________________________________________________

    He had 3 of his final 10 starts before Sunday that were 7 innings each, 3 runs in each and one no decision, 2 losses. Not all losses were on him.

  246. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:47 pm

    GB – I know that not all of them had to do with injuries. I looked at that list closely. He had a ton of days out of the game because of injuries. Or let me say he certainly isn’t as durable a pitcher as Mike Mussina who has been pitching a lot longer and had a lot fewer days missed.

    So I am saying that if I choose between Moose and Pettitte I choose Moose. And I am also saying that I definitely don’t choose to bring both back because I think we need a different look somehow to our rotation. A younger look. A healthier look. Moose in my book has earned the right to come back if he wants to.

    If we had a kick butt rotation already on the books and a number 5 starter left to fill, MAYBE I’d give Pettitte a chance. But we don’t.

  247. mark007 September 24th, 2008 at 6:48 pm

    would you guys trade Hughes for Adam Dunn this offseason?

  248. mel September 24th, 2008 at 6:48 pm

    Drive,

    Well, for one thing. Our stripes run one way, and his run another. :P

  249. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 6:48 pm

    “I say WHOA!! I draw the line there, big fella. We’re out for blood against Boston if it’s this Saturday or a pickup tidleywinks charity event in December.”

    LMAO.

  250. vin September 24th, 2008 at 6:48 pm

    mark… no.

  251. Peter Abraham September 24th, 2008 at 6:49 pm

    Every player, especially veteran ones, have injuries they play through. Abreu’s wrist, Johnny’s foot, Derek’s hand, etc. Andy has had a bad shoulder for a while. He was able to pitch (not very effectively) but he pitched. You play through pain when it matters.

    Now that the games are meaningless, you’re going to see far less of Johnny, Derek and obviously Andy. Why have an injured player on the field for no reason? Half the guys aren’t playing today.

    I’m really not sure why this is somehow a question. But that’s as simply as I can explain it. Besides, Trish, now you get to see he great Sidney Ponson. Maybe they’ll get Kyle back too!

  252. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 6:50 pm

    would you guys trade Hughes for Adam Dunn this offseason?

    Adam Dunn is a free agent to be. AND HELL NO TO DUNN! we already got Giambi’s bat and Betemit’s plate disclinpe combined, which that equals to a Adam Dunn.

  253. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 6:50 pm

    “Those Red Sox games may be important to you but, they aren’t important to anybody else.”

    I say WHOA!! I draw the line there, big fella. We’re out for blood against Boston if it’s this Saturday or a pickup tidleywinks charity event in December.

    I don’t feel that way about it at all, then I again I don’t live surrounded by Red Sox fans. Thankfully.

  254. Knicks September 24th, 2008 at 6:50 pm

    mark, Not straight up. However if we could get back Arroyo and Dunn for Hughes I would do it

  255. stuart September 24th, 2008 at 6:51 pm

    what afraud, abreu, and the other softies arent winners? You telling me 25 Afrauds with his frosted hair, and BS answers, and smallness when it counts would not make the Yanks a winning team!!! Cano and his baseball smarts, ability to work the count, and his all out play is not winning baseball???

    No way… They need less Pettitte’s and more afrauds, cano’s, gimabi’s and other losers…Arod, giambi, abreu, have won nothing ever and that is the bottom line………

    Jeter has more guts and class the nafraud in his sore left wrist then afraud has in his whole body…This team is made up of many losers that need to be eliminated. Bruney is a winner, he could have given up and gotten surgery but no he rehabbed back and tried his hardest for the team, that is a winning attitude and he should be rewarded and brought back for next year, and Hughes better learn quick about winning and being a tougher player…..

  256. Doreen September 24th, 2008 at 6:51 pm

    Thanks GB7 -

    I don’t always have all the details and don’t always want to look them up. I do know they had a chance to win almost all the games Andy pitched. I put “ineffective” in quotes, because I didn’t think he was all that ineffective.

    And as has been discussed ad nauseum

  257. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 6:51 pm

    mark007:

    nope nope nope nope NOPE

    if we trade hughes it better be for someomne better than DUNN

  258. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:51 pm

    Hey this reminds me of when I first came here and didn’t carry out the party line on Wang and had every outraged “GM” here in the book on my case calling me every name in the book! Why not round out the season the same way?

    I wasn’t terribly thrown then by having a perspective that might not have agreed with the majority’s and I am not thrown by feeling that way now. I have always said that everyone here has nothing more than a fan opinion, despite some being much more continually vocal than others. So I am willing to stay with my opinion and wait and watch to see what the organization does.

    No need to pop a blood vessel gang because I don’t see things the way you do. I’m not popping any in return because you don’t agree with my perspective!

    :D

  259. Doreen September 24th, 2008 at 6:51 pm

    wow – don’t know why that got cut off, but as has been discussed here many times, most of this team’s losses can be traced to a lack of offense, or timely offense, than pitching.

  260. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 6:52 pm

    Hughes, Rasner, and Ramirez for Votto and Bruce. you got yourself a deal.

  261. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 6:57 pm

    “Besides, Trish, now you get to see he great Sidney Ponson. Maybe they’ll get Kyle back too!”

    Hey Pete don’t play the dozens with me! :D You’ll force me to hunt down your blogs where you say that the Yankees made a mistake trading Kyle for Pudge. Oh yes you have said that.

    And by the way, who was better adjusted about Kyle being traded than I? Once a deed is done, I go with the flow because I am always sure that the Yankee organization knows more than I do. And you do. And the rest of the posters on this forum do. That’s why I don’t spend my entire life complaining about every Yankee thing here and have my stomach in knots 99% of the time over things over which I don’t have control.

    Last I looked I had as much right to make a case for something in which I believe as anyone else here. People have the right to disagree. That is cool. It doesn’t mean that anyone with a different opinion has the corner on the truth, despite the sense I get that certain posters have that feeling.

    I gave my opinion and I gave my reasons. That’s good enough for me. I’m not looking to change minds here. I sleep well whether or not I am in the majority of thinking on any given day.

  262. vin September 24th, 2008 at 6:57 pm

    “Hughes, Rasner, and Ramirez for Votto and Bruce. you got yourself a deal.”

    I’m sure you’re being sarcastic, but the last thing we need is to open the door to “the garbage for all-stars rumor mill.”

  263. stuart September 24th, 2008 at 7:00 pm

    Az got Dunn for nothing so the yanks need to trade Hughes for Him!!!!

    WHere do people come up with this garbage. and yea the yanks need another un-athletic DH, like the Knicks need another selfish point guard

  264. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:02 pm

    “i would like to know who in the world would you have replaced him with at the time? rasner? ponson?”

    Now be sensible here. You couldn’t replace him with Rasner or Ponson since they were already in the rotation. Geesh! How about one of the kids that people here talked about ENDLESSLY wanting to bring up but have suddenly had total memory lapses about?

    “how about we just agree to disagree”

    :D

    I said that a long time ago! But that’s obviously not allowed around here with some people.

    Okay time to win a game.

    GO YANKEES!!!

    GO TRIBE!!!

  265. Chas September 24th, 2008 at 7:02 pm

    Who was that singing the Canadian National Anthem? I’m sure Simon Cowell would have harsh words for her…

  266. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 7:02 pm

    I’m sure you’re being sarcastic, but the last thing we need is to open the door to “the garbage for all-stars rumor mill.”

    YES, i was being sarcastic.

  267. mel September 24th, 2008 at 7:03 pm

    Hey, did they photoshop Gardner’s BA? When did it go above the mendoza line?

  268. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:06 pm

    trisha

    lol you got me there
    forgot that sadly during the past 2 months we were still pushing ponson and razz back out there

    i get the hibbie gibbies just thinking about it :)

  269. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 7:07 pm

    Over Under (20) the amount of times Kay and Leiter says Hughes has a straight FB.

  270. Chas September 24th, 2008 at 7:08 pm

    Jasmine Richards… how could a person who sings for Disney sound so bad…

  271. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 7:09 pm

    Doreen
    September 24th, 2008 at 6:51 pm
    Thanks GB7 -

    I don’t always have all the details and don’t always want to look them up. I do know they had a chance to win almost all the games Andy pitched. I put “ineffective” in quotes, because I didn’t think he was all that ineffective.

    And as has been discussed ad nauseum

    ____________________________________________________

    Pettitte has abot 6-7 real stinkers a year that tends to jack up his ERA, but, this year, he had a lot of games where, for whatever reason, he had trouble in the 4th or 5th inning. I have no answer for it, any more than why it usually takes Mussina and Wang an inning or two to settle in. Pettitte has already said (as late as this past week) that he’d like to return and plans to have a talk with his family and then with the Yanks well before the FA season opens, and, I suppose Mussina will also. Unless NYY signs 2 or 3 FA pitchers, they’ll still need a 6th starter to help fill innings, and Pettitte or Mussina would be the perfect fit…Pettitte possibly is a better fit for #6. He had said that last year, with all of the issues over the winter that he didn’t have the time to prepare himself physically like he wanted. I’d say that he’s as much a creature of habit as Mussina.

    People harp on not bringing up pitchers from the minors instead of pitching Ponson and Rasner, but, Horne, Marquez and others were hurt and Aceves and Coke weren’t ready. It’s hard to win with the #9 pitcher and a discarded pitcher in the rotation, isn’t it?

  272. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:09 pm

    Hey faith, I love your thinking. Yes there is always next year, and yes I would vote for Moose for President!

    And yes, in my heart of hearts I know that Andy is a gamer. I just believe he is no longer effective and that’s why I don’t want him back.

    :)

  273. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 7:10 pm

    AHHH….Gardner, got a bit too greedy!!

  274. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:10 pm

    Wow, something we will hardly ever see. Gardner out at a base – though we did see it recently didn’t we.

    :)

  275. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 7:11 pm

    Gardner looks (facially) like Pedroia.

  276. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:11 pm

    Now, GB, if you are talking about a number 6, maybe I can see it. Just not a 1-5.

  277. Laura - Will sell first born for tickets to the new Yankee Stadium! September 24th, 2008 at 7:11 pm

    Donnie Baseball is dreaming if he thinks that Torre could have gotten these guys to the playoffs this year. It’s real easy to be in a AAAA division and make the playoffs. If LAD was in the East, they’d be behind BAL.

  278. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 7:12 pm

    Mel, I was wondering since when did Gardener hitting over 200? wow!!

  279. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:12 pm

    and you have your opinions just like every other poster on this blog

    and moose would be a great president! lol hey anyones better then the choices we have now, right? haha

  280. MoBoy(aka McLovin) September 24th, 2008 at 7:13 pm

    Pettitte started the season in the DL and also last year and he’s going to end the season.

    People actuaslly want him back.Yeah sure bring him back.That is as much of a dumb idea as Kennedy ,Joba and Hughes in the rotation this year.

  281. vin September 24th, 2008 at 7:13 pm

    Am I being greedy for wanting CC and Garland, as well as both Pettitte and Mussina for next year?

    1. CC
    2. Wang
    3. Pettitte
    4. Mussina
    5. Garland

    6. Aceves
    7. Hughes
    8. Kennedy

    Thow Joba into the mix sometime in June, and that’s a top-tier rotation – this plus the promise of a very effective bullpen.

    The lesson we all learned this year is the importance of “inventory” (as Cash calls it). You can have a great rotation at the beginning of a season, but if two guys get injured, and one guy isn’t as effective as planned, then you’ll see your #8 starter way more than you’d ever want. This not only killed the Yanks’ rotation, but also their lineup… replacing Posada with Molina, Jeter and ARod with Betemit, and Matsui with nobody until Nady exposed one of the team’s biggest weaknesses – a poor bench.

  282. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:13 pm

    Hey I’m still steaming about Cliff Lee’s ineffectiveness last night. Games can always surprise you though. I mean weren’t we sure that was the one game that was going to be the Sux loss?

    There is also a part of me that thinks it was kinder for us to be eliminated earlier in the week rather than later.

  283. RalphieD September 24th, 2008 at 7:14 pm

    gardner seems like hes trying too hard to impress people now..but its a big positive that hes getting hits…gardner should come to realize he doesnt have to be that agressive in taking the extra base simply because he can usually steal it anyway…

  284. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:14 pm

    So now there’s 11 who agree about Andy.

    :)

    Thanks McLovin.

  285. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:15 pm

    brett we all know your fast no need to prove it, just get on base thats what we all wanted!

  286. You Know Who September 24th, 2008 at 7:16 pm

    So how many RBI, doubles, and homeruns will Jason Bay have tonight?

    Does Manny have more RBI for LA or Bay for Baaston?

  287. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 7:16 pm

    trisha – BRING BOBBY BACK!
    September 24th, 2008 at 7:11 pm
    Now, GB, if you are talking about a number 6, maybe I can see it. Just not a 1-5.

    ______________________________________________

    Sorry, but, if Pettitte is healthy, he can pitch on my team if he wants…there’s no reason he can’t he a left handed version of Mussina with better stuff.

  288. Laura - Will sell first born for tickets to the new Yankee Stadium! September 24th, 2008 at 7:18 pm

    We lead the league in fielding pct? That’s a shocker.

  289. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:18 pm

    Well GB, in my book he’s had too many health issues to believe that he will ever have a healthy season. Back spasms this, shoulder aching that, elbow hurting this. Enough. You can have him for your team though. Then I’ll pcik someone else for mine! Like Red Rover.

  290. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:18 pm

    hey, at least we lead in something lol

  291. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 7:21 pm

    Hughes and his 90mph fastaball…

  292. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:21 pm

    Geeze though we have a lot of potential in our bullpen. Heck I wouldn’t want Bruney going anywhere. Obviously Coke either. Marte isn’t bad. Mo’s a keeper too!

    Not bad to go into another season with your pen pretty well in place. That doesn’t often happen to teams.

  293. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 7:22 pm

    trisha – BRING BOBBY BACK!
    September 24th, 2008 at 7:14 pm
    So now there’s 11 who agree about Andy.

    Thanks McLovin.

    _____________________________________________________

    Him and about 4 others that agree with you aren’t exactly ringing endorsements. This one in particular is a troll with the baseball IQ of an ice cube. Not knocking your preferences, Trisha, but, you need better backup than this one.

  294. vin September 24th, 2008 at 7:22 pm

    “We lead the league in fielding pct? That’s a shocker.”

    That’s because they only get to the easiest to reach balls.

  295. Wangawa September 24th, 2008 at 7:22 pm

    i never thought that hughes and mussina would have the same fastball velocity…

  296. Bronx Jeers September 24th, 2008 at 7:22 pm

    Oh snap. Trisha got taken down hard by Pete! I’ve said it before, Andy’s got a lifetime pass in my estimation. I had a feeling he was hurt. He had to be.

    “I just believe he is no longer effective and that’s why I don’t want him back.”

    If he’s healthy, he is effective though!

  297. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 7:23 pm

    scouts say hughes throws 94mph where is it?

  298. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 7:24 pm

    Let’s go Yanks! Get some runs

  299. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 7:24 pm

    Pettitte is a gamer, but I hope he’s pitched his last game in pinstripes. If it weren’t for his excellent season, I would have said the same about Mussina. One year and one year only for him please. I’m sick and tired of sentimentality getting in the way of sound decisions when it concerns the Yanks.

  300. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 7:25 pm

    Nady is batting .267 His swing is too big

  301. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:25 pm

    CASHBUM

    do u see joba pushing 98 in the first inning?
    absolutely not, becasue its the first inning and unles your in trouble you shouldnt be using your best stuff

  302. mel September 24th, 2008 at 7:25 pm

    Nice of Donnie to take the high road there.

  303. yankeefan91 September 24th, 2008 at 7:26 pm

    burnett is just nasty

  304. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:26 pm

    Puh-lease with the Torre/Mattingly tandem talk.

    1. If the New York Yankees played in the NL West, they would have clinched first place already. Two months ago at least. :) Because that’s the qualilty of the teams that are in the NL West.

    2. Mattingly is right in saying that Torre knows how to right a ship, (though he couldn’t figure out how to get the ship back to port without getting a tow for quite a few seasons.) Torre SHOULD know how to right a ship seeing he has had so much damned experience. Maybe when Girardi is in his 70s and has managed the number of years Joe has, he’ll be righting ships with his eyes closed.

  305. RalphieD September 24th, 2008 at 7:26 pm

    “i never thought that hughes and mussina would have the same fastball velocity…”

    they dont…hughe’s cutter is roughly mussina fb tho

  306. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 7:27 pm

    Giambi Cant hit HEAT

  307. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:27 pm

    nady is actually batting .305, but with the yanks alone .267

    nady vs abreau?
    who wins the battle?

  308. sw September 24th, 2008 at 7:27 pm

    The Yankees starters probably have the worst collective BABIP because of the fielders not getting to the baseball, and nobody’s been hurt by that more than Andy because he’s a groundball pitcher. His defense independent ERA is 3.69.

  309. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 7:27 pm

    It didn’t take the AL pitchers to realize that Nady is an easy out on fastballs up and breaking balls low and off the plate. He may be more tradeable back to an NL team.

  310. Doreen September 24th, 2008 at 7:28 pm

    When weighing whether or not to offer Mussina and Pettitte one more year each, you have to take into consideration who their replacements would be. I’m not sure that right now there are better #4 and #5 replacements for them out there right now. It’s not all sentiment. They would not bring them back if they were obviously done.

  311. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:28 pm

    “Pettitte is a gamer, but I hope he’s pitched his last game in pinstripes. If it weren’t for his excellent season, I would have said the same about Mussina. One year and one year only for him please. I’m sick and tired of sentimentality getting in the way of sound decisions when it concerns the Yanks.”

    Bingo.

    GB, I suppose you have no respect for ZMANN either?

  312. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:29 pm

    Bronx Jeers – uh, that was getting taken down hard?????

    Please tell me when I’ve been taken down softly. I didn’t think I had been taken down at all, thanks.

    :D

  313. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 7:29 pm

    ***It didn’t take the AL pitchers long to realize that Nady is an easy***

  314. mel September 24th, 2008 at 7:31 pm

    Nady’s easy? :)

  315. bru September 24th, 2008 at 7:31 pm

    usually pitchers like hughes that sit at 93 are not number one starters.

    why do people post and say the only way cc comes here is if this happens or that happens?
    it is all about the money.is he willing to leave money on the table and how much.

  316. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 7:32 pm

    Trisha — I will disagree with you on Abreu though. An earlier poster put it best: he delivers his numbers, but he’s lacking an intangible, “winning” quality. Add to that the fact that he’s 35, is a below average fielder, wants way too many years and $’s, and I say it’s time to move on.

  317. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:33 pm

    lets go miranda :)

  318. nyyfaninlaaland September 24th, 2008 at 7:33 pm

    Trisha -

    Your passionate fandom is much appreciated, but your inflexibility regarding your baseball opinions can be offputting. We all have the right to have an opinion, but we also have the responsibility to check that it corresponds to reality and the openmindness to be willing to change it if not.

    This isn’t directed at you personally – I have no doubt of your passionate feelings for the Yanks. But we could all use a dose of humility regarding our opinions.

  319. FrankDiscussion September 24th, 2008 at 7:34 pm

    Last year Mussina was in the doghouse, but look what he come back and accomplished this season, after most of us (myself included) wrote him off. Is Pettitte capable of doing the same ? Only time will tell, but IMO it is a little too early to write him off yet.

  320. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 7:34 pm

    Miranda pulled a Carmen on that one.

  321. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 7:35 pm

    trisha – BRING BOBBY BACK!
    September 24th, 2008 at 7:28 pm
    “Pettitte is a gamer, but I hope he’s pitched his last game in pinstripes. If it weren’t for his excellent season, I would have said the same about Mussina. One year and one year only for him please. I’m sick and tired of sentimentality getting in the way of sound decisions when it concerns the Yanks.”

    Bingo.

    GB, I suppose you have no respect for ZMANN either?

    _________________________________________________

    I’m sure he nor anyone else gives a damned whether I have respect for him or not.

  322. Bronx Jeers September 24th, 2008 at 7:36 pm

    “Besides, Trish, now you get to see he great Sidney Ponson. Maybe they’ll get Kyle back too!”

    alright maybe it was an exageration but still… It’s pretty cold when Pete starts referencing your past taglines.

  323. vin September 24th, 2008 at 7:36 pm

    “nady vs abreau?
    who wins the battle?”

    is the battle held near the outfield wall?

  324. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:37 pm

    well even if cliff lee was on point yesterday we probably would have been eliminated today, the sux are starting to beat up on the tribe

    i guess it was silly to think they would have been swept but hey people can hope and dream lol

  325. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 7:37 pm

    “It’s pretty cold when Pete starts referencing your past taglines.”

    It’s a little creepy too. Does Pete print out and study each day’s posts??

  326. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:38 pm

    “is the battle held near the outfield wall?”

    HAHA! only if the outfield wall is cover with plush :)

  327. RalphieD September 24th, 2008 at 7:41 pm

    very nice inning for hughes

  328. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 7:41 pm

    Word to Kay Hughes has been throwing since June.

  329. Laura - Will sell first born for tickets to the new Yankee Stadium! September 24th, 2008 at 7:42 pm

    “How he keeps the ship going the right way, keeps things on track when it looks like things are getting ugly.”

    Why didn’t he “right the ship” when BOS was on their way of coming back from being down 3 games in 2004?

    Torre’s talents are overrated. The Dodgers are in the playoffs because of late season acquisitions (namely Manny). The Yankees won 4 WS in 5 years because of awesome pitching, clutch hitting and good defense (none of which they’ve had this year).

  330. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 7:42 pm

    Nice inning for Hughes. Great knuckle curve.

  331. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:43 pm

    “alright maybe it was an exageration but still… It’s pretty cold when Pete starts referencing your past taglines.”

    It’s a guy thing. When they can’t get you to come around to their way of thinking they decide to go with a frontal attack. No big deal. I’ve dealt with guys all my life!

    :)

    Besides, I had to remind Pete that he himself talked about the trade for Kyle not being a good one, so it’s silly to shoot yourself in the foot when trying to shoot someone else!

  332. stuart September 24th, 2008 at 7:43 pm

    clowns this guy is 22, and throws like that.

    YOU DO NOT GIVE UP ON 22 YR OLD POTENTIAL STUDS EVER……

    if healthy and that is a big if, he can be a very good pitcher, and do not tell me about the speed gun…

  333. Mike R September 24th, 2008 at 7:44 pm

    It looked more like the old Hughes in that inning

  334. jason September 24th, 2008 at 7:44 pm

    A couple great curves from Phil that inning. If he can locate the fastball, with that curve, a good slider and good changeup he will be a very good pitcher. His fastball does seem a bit straight compared to Burnett which moves quite a bit.

  335. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 7:44 pm

    Hughes had a nice inning, get the child some runs

  336. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 7:45 pm

    You know, this may sound bleak — hell, it is bleak — but Cano is the only position player with significant upside on the major league roster. And not just because he’s had a down year. I hate that this is the case, but isn’t it true?

  337. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:46 pm

    “Your passionate fandom is much appreciated, but your inflexibility regarding your baseball opinions can be offputting. We all have the right to have an opinion, but we also have the responsibility to check that it corresponds to reality and the openmindness to be willing to change it if not.”

    Which is exactly why I was willing to understand the Yankees needs to trade Kyle when they did despite why ardent support of him and also why I acknowledged that it was time for Sidney to be sat down despite my ardent support for him.

    And I also freely acknowledged I was wrong about Igawa.

    But I don’t think I owe it to anyone to change every opinion just because they don’t comport with someone else’s view of reality. You can see that I am far from the only one who feels Andy shouldn’t be brought back!

  338. LYPD September 24th, 2008 at 7:47 pm

    How’s Cliff Lee’s fastball compared to Hughes’?

  339. jason September 24th, 2008 at 7:49 pm

    Didn’t Cano get the memo from Hank that they want to sign this guy? Careful of our goods!

  340. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:49 pm

    “clowns this guy is 22, and throws like that.

    YOU DO NOT GIVE UP ON 22 YR OLD POTENTIAL STUDS EVER……”

    Stuart I agree with you once again. I actually see Hughes making the rotation next year. I think he is talented enough and mature and hard-working enough that he will do what needs to be done to get his stuff in order.

  341. sw September 24th, 2008 at 7:49 pm

    Cano revenges the Moose by putting the hit on Burnett.

  342. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 7:50 pm

    Screw it, we might as well give Gardner every opportunity to be the centerfielder next season. If he can somehow hit .250, he could steal 50 bases.

  343. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:51 pm

    where did the ball hit aj?

    im watching on gameday

  344. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:51 pm

    Rays down 5-0 in Baltimore. This is why those of us who are less than fond of the Sux want the games against the Yankees to have meaning…

  345. sw September 24th, 2008 at 7:51 pm

    *avenges* :P

  346. You Know Who September 24th, 2008 at 7:52 pm

    Is this the first time that Phil Hughes went 2 innings with less than 50 pitches ?

  347. Yankeefanfoev13 September 24th, 2008 at 7:53 pm

    Phil Hughes will be a stud.
    But as much as I would love him to on the Yankees staff, he needs to start the year in AAA and get some innings in, and as we know, injuries do happen, so he might end up being the Yankees staff.

    Did I mention that the Yankees need AJ?

  348. Jim S September 24th, 2008 at 7:54 pm

    For arguments sake, if the Yankees had made the playoffs what would have been the 4 man rotation and with Matsui out, who would have been the DH?

  349. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 7:54 pm

    Hey, that was nice!

  350. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:54 pm

    I didn’t notice where he got hit, faith.

  351. sw September 24th, 2008 at 7:54 pm

    Woo X!

  352. bru September 24th, 2008 at 7:54 pm

    there is a 50/50 chance that both hughes and cano will be traded in the offseason but only if the yankees get the right players in return from what i’ve been hearing.

  353. Wangawa September 24th, 2008 at 7:54 pm

    still think that Nady’s swing is too big?

    the guy has done everything asked of him since he got here.

  354. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:54 pm

    i guess nady wins the battle lol

  355. RalphieD September 24th, 2008 at 7:54 pm

    nice hit nady

  356. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:55 pm

    Jim S, something tells me that if the Yanks made the playoffs Sui would have waited to have his surgery.

  357. sw September 24th, 2008 at 7:55 pm

    Burnett got hit in the back left hamstring.

  358. Laura - Will sell first born for tickets to the new Yankee Stadium! September 24th, 2008 at 7:55 pm

    Giambi is having a great year? These TOR announcers don’t know much.

  359. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:56 pm

    thanks sw

  360. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 7:56 pm

    2 runs, 5 hits against Burnett. This might equal our previous damage against him this season.

  361. Jim S September 24th, 2008 at 7:57 pm

    Thanks Trish, I thought that too, but who would they have ser Pettite started after Mussina and Pettite. Just curious.

  362. Jim S September 24th, 2008 at 7:58 pm

    ser Pettite wow what a typo

  363. Doreen September 24th, 2008 at 7:58 pm

    That’s a GREAT way to watch a game!!! A little food, a little drink.

  364. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 7:58 pm

    by good year they mean the 32 homers and the 95 rbi
    as much as i hate to admit it as much as the big g hindered us this year, he also helped us

  365. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 7:58 pm

    Holy crap, I switched the station to get the score of the Sux game and they were showing clips of their wildcard clinching celebration. You would have thought they won the world series. Mike Lowell shooting champagne all over the fans.

    Yankee celebrations, save for world series celebrations, are always so subdued.

    Just sayin.

  366. Bronx Jeers September 24th, 2008 at 7:59 pm

    Hey! Stuart’s here!

    Stu allow me to revise your comments in your usual style.

    “YOU DO NOT GIVE UP ON 22 YR OLD POTENTIAL STUDS EVER……” you morons!

    “if healthy and that is a big if, he can be a very good pitcher, and do not tell me about the speed gun…” you bunch of idiots!

    Hey I see you started off with calling everybody a clown though. Not too shabby but sort of Stu-lite IMO.

  367. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 8:01 pm

    Good good question Jim. I would be willing to bet that Girardi would have gone with Ponson and Pavano just for the experience factor. I’m trying to think like he does now, not necessarily thinking what would make sense to a fan.

  368. mel September 24th, 2008 at 8:01 pm

    Doreen,

    Are you talking about the restaurant or hotel in CF?

    Was it last season where there was a naked woman behind one of the windows?

  369. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 8:02 pm

    bru
    September 24th, 2008 at 7:54 pm
    there is a 50/50 chance that both hughes and cano will be traded in the offseason but only if the yankees get the right players in return from what i’ve been hearing.

    ____________________________________________________

    They have psychiatrists and medication for those that hear voices in their head.

  370. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 8:02 pm

    another good inning for hughes!

  371. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 8:02 pm

    Hughes will be good he just needs time to develop. Gameday has him throwing a lot of sliders.

  372. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 8:03 pm

    Toronto has a strong pitching staff. If they can add some offense, they could threaten next year. Just saying that the Yanks making the playoffs next year is hardly a given.

  373. Doreen September 24th, 2008 at 8:05 pm

    mel -

    The CF hotel restaurant, but there were also some really nice restaurants within walking distance of the hotel/ballpark.

    Yes, it is the same hotel where people were otherwise “busy” during the game with their drapes opened. I don’t know how long ago that was, though. :lol:

  374. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 8:05 pm

    Trisha – I wish the Yanks celebrate more like the Sux. They seem to actually enjoy themselves. Our guys just treat it like a business and that only a WS win deserves a celebration. Getting into the postseason is a huge achievement. I didn’t mind them celebrating.

  375. jason September 24th, 2008 at 8:06 pm

    He is throwing his sliders and is showing off a really good (at least in my ver novice opinion) curveball. I don’t know id has shown the changeup yet.
    I am certainly not crowning him anything, but to me he is showing progress.
    I also very much enjoy watching the kids. Hughes, Gardner and Miranda and maybe Ransom will ahve roles on this team next year at some point. It is fun to see rather than just read AAA boxscores.
    As I said earlier I think this offseason has the potential to be one of the most exciting in years. Not just for some big names that might be signed, but also to see the remaking of a franchise.

  376. mel September 24th, 2008 at 8:06 pm

    Z,

    They will probably lose the 2 out of their 1-2 punch. One of the young guys (Marcum?) had surgery?

  377. bru September 24th, 2008 at 8:07 pm

    gb i just wanted to see if you were still with us.i knew it,lol.
    you actually have no clue .there is a real chance of it happening.

  378. Kevin Garnett September 24th, 2008 at 8:07 pm

    anybody watching the game on yes and hear what mike kay just said about cc? i missed it but heard him talking about contracts and agents and figure the yanks have to be involved

  379. vin September 24th, 2008 at 8:08 pm

    “Screw it, we might as well give Gardner every opportunity to be the centerfielder next season. If he can somehow hit .250, he could steal 50 bases.”

    I couldn’t agree more… unlike Melky, Gardner brings at least 1 positive thing to the table, offensively – base running. Melky is one of those guys you would think is fast, but isn’t… like Cano. With Melky vs. Gardner it comes down to what you value more – speed or a dozen homers – everything else is a wash IMHO.

  380. Bronx Jeers September 24th, 2008 at 8:08 pm

    the Yanks were goin nuts last year when they clinched. Everybody does. It doesn’t get old and you never know if it will be your last.

  381. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 8:08 pm

    Can Ransom not bunt? (that’s an honest question).

  382. jason September 24th, 2008 at 8:08 pm

    nice hit by Miranda. Going the other way.

  383. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 8:08 pm

    some idiot name Ian O’Connor thinks A-Rod will leave the yanks in 4-5 years.

    Alex Rodriguez will be a member of the Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim by the start of the 2011 season. OK, maybe not the Angels, and maybe not 2011. But the point is, he won’t be a Yankee for the duration of his 10-year, $275 million contract, not even close.

    http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/s.....038;ATT=49

  384. pat September 24th, 2008 at 8:08 pm

    Congrats to Miranda on his first hit!!

  385. mel September 24th, 2008 at 8:09 pm

    Congrats, Miranda!

  386. sw September 24th, 2008 at 8:09 pm

    Marcum and McGowan are both having surgery. If Burnett walks it’ll be just Halladay and Litsch left.

  387. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 8:09 pm

    Vin — I believe Gardner is also the better fielder.

  388. Bronx Jeers September 24th, 2008 at 8:09 pm

    I think Mc Gowen had surgery too. Neither are expected back until mid next season.

  389. Tom Gaffney September 24th, 2008 at 8:09 pm

    Hughes looks awesome. That knuckle-curve is sick. I really think he’s going to put it all together next year and have a break through season. 15+ wins and an ERA in the threes type break through. I know it’s ambitious but his stuff is there, now. The cutter really adds another dimension and he’s adjusted his curve to a swing and miss pitch for major leaguers.

    Did anyones see Nady’s at-bat? That’s what I love about this guy. He went down and got a really tough, nasty breaking ball and lined it to center to drive in two. What a difference between several other guys on this team who are really only mistake hitters. Cash has to take that quality into evaluating players much more than he has before. No more mistake hitters, Brian, Nady is a good start.

  390. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 8:11 pm

    come on gardner, show them you want that job at cf!

  391. bru September 24th, 2008 at 8:12 pm

    gb,i am not forming my own oppinion.i heard mike on the fan ask heyman if it might happen and that is what he said.

    he also said that the yankees are not affraid to pull the trigger if tey get what they wan’t in return.
    this is a guy who knows a lot more than you and i.

    gene michael and hal wanted to trade hughes for santanna but cash and hank didn’t.

  392. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 8:12 pm

    “Our guys just treat it like a business and that only a WS win deserves a celebration. Getting into the postseason is a huge achievement. I didn’t mind them celebrating.”

    Something about shooting champagne all over the fans just somehow doesn’t seem dignified enough to me. They clinched for the wild card, they didn’t win the world series.

    I know what you mean about having more fun, but the Yankee way just isn’t that way. And maybe when you make it into the postseason 13 straight times acting like you’ve just been out of the looney bin doesn’t seem like the way to go. Their celebrations are always dignified. The only one I remember being raucous – raucous for them – (a relief as it were) was the last year when they had to work their tails off and in spite of all of their injuries made it in. And they celebrated in the clubhouse not on the field.

  393. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 8:14 pm

    Burnett is at 70 pitches already

  394. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 8:15 pm

    Actually it was Hal and Cashman didn’t want to trade him. Hank and Micheal did.
    Hughes has mixed in a few change ups.

  395. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 8:15 pm

    Cleveland making a comeback, 4-3 not Tribe.

  396. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 8:17 pm

    Leiter says that was a cutter Gameday says slider.

  397. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 8:17 pm

    Are we actually going to debate the proper way to celebrate? If so, there is another way — the way Madonna and A-Rod do it. She sings her “Celebrate” song, while he dresses up as a ball girl and absorbs multiple spankings from the 50-year-old hardbody.

  398. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 8:18 pm

    bru
    September 24th, 2008 at 8:12 pm
    gb,i am not forming my own oppinion.i heard mike on the fan ask heyman if it might happen and that is what he said.

    ___________________________________________________

    That’s all you need to know about the validity of the rumor. Two of the more clueless idiots in NY along with Sherman and Lupica.

  399. Vince Black (Yanks fan in Chitown) September 24th, 2008 at 8:18 pm

    Nady or Abreu?

    I keep both, but if forced to choose.

    Abreu.

  400. crying yankees fan September 24th, 2008 at 8:19 pm

    hughes back to 89-90 mph fastball. wow, this guy is frail!

  401. nyyfaninlaaland September 24th, 2008 at 8:20 pm

    Trisha – more than a bit late here in responding, but my quibble with your opinion wasn’t about bringing Andy back,it was about his injury proneness. That isn’t actually an opinion issue, but a measurable fact. And the measure is relative to other pitchers. On that basis he can’t be considered such.

    On whether he should be brought back, that is an opinion based thing, and you’re more than entitled to yours about that.

  402. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 8:21 pm

    CC just got out of a bases loaded jam

    the brew cew is killing us with their use of him

  403. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 8:22 pm

    As far as them saying that it might happen, it’s also possible, theoretically, that an elephant can wrap his tail around a dandelion and hang over a cliff, but, I wouldn’t count on it.

  404. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 8:22 pm

    Trisha – All I know is that I would’ve loved for the players come out and greet us fans after some big victory (ie clinching a postseason spot, winning ALDS, etc). I was watching some of the video. Varitek went around the entire field and shook fans hands in the stands. Some of the BP sprinted out and celebrated with their cop (who protects them during the game).

    As much as I hate to admit it, Boston had a lot of obstacles in their way. Several of the players mentioned how hard the season had been and how thankful they were to reach October.

    I hate the Sox, but that’s the way they celebrate in their park. If I was a fan, I would’ve loved to be there.

  405. RalphieD September 24th, 2008 at 8:23 pm

    hughes is locating that curve well

  406. nyyfaninlaaland September 24th, 2008 at 8:23 pm

    I keep hearing about Hughes’ straight fastball and the movement on Burnett’s. Yet on Gameday each’s fastball typically have 5″ of break. Hmmm…

    Now, Burnett is clocking 94, with Hughes at 90, so that’s significant.

  407. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 8:24 pm

    It’s too bad Leiter isn’t recognizing the slider. He has a pretty good one tonight.

  408. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 8:26 pm

    Two more outstanding innings for Hughes, including pitching around the leadoff double. The fastball will come around, but, as long as he mixes the knuckle curve and off-speeds in, he’ll be just fine.

  409. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 8:26 pm

    the Z-Pac is getting killed ever since the no-hitter. kind of like David Cone, after his perfect game.

  410. ZMAN7777 September 24th, 2008 at 8:28 pm

    Is it me, or have the Orioles lost every game since mid-August the past few years?

  411. Bronx Jeers September 24th, 2008 at 8:29 pm

    Sox were celebrating on the field? I thinks that’s great having the fans involved. I.m telling you if the Yanks ever did that, everybody would be saying how they’re so in touch with the common fan and all that garbage.

    Everybody thinks because the yanks dont let players grow beards and they have to wear ties when travelling, that they’re this super classy organization.

    A classy club wouldn’t have ignored the manager that led them to the postseason for the last 12 years when they had that thoughtless “celebration” the other night.

  412. jason September 24th, 2008 at 8:30 pm

    Can someone please explain the loss of velocity for Phil. His first couple starts back he was 92-94 now he is 90. Is he taking something off it to locate it. Problem is a mistake pitch and Rios hammers it to right field. at 94 a mistake and you can sometimes get away with it.
    Other than that he has shown great pace ont he mound. Is mixing and locating his pitches well.

  413. YankeeJosh September 24th, 2008 at 8:31 pm

    Andy Pettitte almost singlehandedly kept us in the ALDS last year vs the Tribe and if it werten’t for he bugs, we win that game and maybe the series.

    IMO, he’s been pitching hurt this year and gutting through it because we had no better options.

    Last year at this time everybody wanted to get rid of Mussina, and look at the rebound year he had. Pettite is younger than Mussina and has pitched consistently well over the years. Mussina himself said the difference between this year and last for him was that he was feeling healthy. There’s no reason to think that Pettitte won’t return to being a better pitcher than he was this year if healthy next year. Because of his age, I think he’s more likely to have a better 2009 than Mussina, and if the Yanks only bring back one, I’d bring back Pettitte. Though, since you can never have too much pitching, I’d try and bring both back.

    Pettitte is not what is wrong with this team. He’s one of the few who lives and breathes winning and he can pitch for my team any day.

  414. you gotta have faith (well, theres always next year...)(MOOSE FOR PRESIDENT!) September 24th, 2008 at 8:32 pm

    the rays are making a comeback its 6-5 now

  415. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 8:32 pm

    Andy Pettitte almost singlehandedly kept us in the ALDS last year vs the Tribe and if it werten’t for he bugs, we win that game and maybe the series.

    did you forgot Hughes? he was the only pitcher with the W.

  416. Patrick â„¢ September 24th, 2008 at 8:32 pm

    “Yankee celebrations, save for world series celebrations, are always so subdued.”

    Come on now thats just not true. Don’t you remember how crazy they were when they clinched the wild card last year? It was pretty absurd.

    Now on to Hughes.. so far he looks good. His command is a lot better tonight and his curve is sick. Its a bit troubling that his fastball is down to 90-91 but there could be a good reason for that. I wouldn’t be surprised if Eiland told him to concentrate on command rather than velocity. A well placed 91 mph fastball is a lot better than a 94 mph fastball over the middle.

    For some reason I haven’t been able to post at work, maybe my job blocked it? Weird..

  417. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 8:33 pm

    You have to remember that for Hughes, this is the tail end of spring training or the first couple of weeks of his season.

  418. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 8:33 pm

    Hughes looks good

  419. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 8:34 pm

    “Yankee celebrations, save for world series celebrations, are always so subdued.”

    Come on now thats just not true. Don’t you remember how crazy they were when they clinched the wild card last year? It was pretty absurd.

    Now on to Hughes.. so far he looks good. His command is a lot better tonight and his curve is sick. Its a bit troubling that his fastball is down to 90-91 but there could be a good reason for that. I wouldn’t be surprised if Eiland told him to concentrate on command rather than velocity. A well placed 91 mph fastball is a lot better than a 94 mph fastball over the middle.

    For some reason I haven’t been able to post with the â„¢ after my name. Pete, were those symbols blocked for some reason?

  420. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 8:34 pm

    “Yankee celebrations, save for world series celebrations, are always so subdued.”

    Come on now thats just not true. Don’t you remember how crazy they were when they clinched the wild card last year? It was pretty absurd.

    Now on to Hughes.. so far he looks good. His command is a lot better tonight and his curve is sick. Its a bit troubling that his fastball is down to 90-91 but there could be a good reason for that. I wouldn’t be surprised if Eiland told him to concentrate on command rather than velocity. A well placed 91 mph fastball is a lot better than a 94 mph fastball over the middle.

  421. PAT M September 24th, 2008 at 8:34 pm

    Frail no, changing speeds yes….That’s what pitching is all about Crying Yankee fan…..

  422. Dee September 24th, 2008 at 8:36 pm

    Just turned on the game…how’s the AJ audition going??

    Wow Phil Hughes, welcome back.

  423. bru September 24th, 2008 at 8:36 pm

    GreenBeret7
    September 24th, 2008 at 8:22 pm
    As far as them saying that it might happen, it’s also possible, theoretically, that an elephant can wrap his tail around a dandelion and hang over a cliff, but, I wouldn’t count on it.

    i would do a cano + ajax for billingsley and hughes + a low to mid level prospect for mclouth or votto in a second.
    you replace hughes,replace cano’s production and create a hole that is easier to fill.
    you are too close minded.

    what is you’re plan?,to keep putting the same old tired team out there every year.

    waiting for everyone of the prospects to return the yankees to glory is like gambling.

    the red sox did it with almost all free agents and trades and the yankees dynasty did it the same way,they just got lucky with mo,posada,jeter,pettitte but by no means did they wait for them to pan out.

  424. Jones September 24th, 2008 at 8:36 pm

    You listen to them talk, and I don’t think they realized what Joe did for them for so long, how special he is at what he does.
    “I think they sort of took him for granted, didn’t realize all the things he brings to the table as a manager. You’ve seen it here with the Dodgers this year. How he keeps the ship going the right way, keeps things on track when it looks like things are getting ugly.”

    DAMN STRAIGHT!!! THAT’S WHAT THOSE IDIOTS GET FOR LETTING JOE GO! NO JOE, NO PLAYOFFS! COINCIDENCE? I THINK NOT!

  425. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 8:37 pm

    His fastball is 89 90 because he’s mostly throwing cutters. As oppose to his 4 seam FB which is usually 92,93 sometimes 94.

  426. E-Man September 24th, 2008 at 8:38 pm

    Hughes has nice stuff tonight.

    But it is september and these games mean nothing.

    Ian Kennedy was awesome last september too.

  427. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 8:39 pm

    Nice comeback from 3-0 count to get Inglett, who’s been a pain for NYY all year.

  428. YankeeJosh September 24th, 2008 at 8:39 pm

    Ed,

    Hughes had a great game against the Trbe, but he only pitched 3.2 innings and he did it at the Stadium. Andy gutted out a great game when the Yankees really needed it after Wang bombed in game 1 going 6.1 scoreless innings. Hughes helped get us a game, but if we win that game for Andy, Pettitte helps us win the series. That was a series changing game, once the Yanks got down 0-2, the task to win the series became incredibly difficult.

  429. stuart September 24th, 2008 at 8:40 pm

    yeah e man Hughes game against the Indians in the playoffs was a mirage also. his game against the rangers in Texas also did not happen.

    Man your more of a sour puss then me….

  430. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 8:41 pm

    “But it is september and these games mean nothing.”

    This is the first September since 1993 when they haven’t. Even up until yesterday they actually meant something.

  431. Cliff Lee September 24th, 2008 at 8:41 pm

    Is Phil Hughes the next Cliff Lee?

  432. yankeefan91 September 24th, 2008 at 8:41 pm

    this is great pitching by burnett and hughes

  433. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 8:42 pm

    These are still major league hitters and they are still trying to get hits….

    Hughes has shown flashes…you have to give this guy the benefit of the doubt…he was good in the playoffs last year and this year he was learning how to pitch in the major leagues….with cracked ribs.

    You hope that injuries don’t hamper his development but I think this is what we can expect from Hughes as he continues to learn how to pitch in the Major Leagues.

  434. Joe from Long Island September 24th, 2008 at 8:43 pm

    Phil is in a no-win situation with some people.

    If he pitches poorly tonight, he stinks.

    If he pitches well, well, it’s September against the Blue Jays, he’s supposed to do well, and it doesn’t mean anything.

    Well, his pitches either move or don’t move, and he either has control or he doesn’t. Yeah, he shouldn’t be handed a starting pitcher’s job in ST, but this is encouraging, something to build on when he goes to Arizona in a few weeks.

    Some guys need a period to develop and grow. Unlike some of the wizards who post here, who were great successes first time out in anything they ever attempted.

  435. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 8:44 pm

    Josh,

    The Yanks clinched their playoff spot in
    Toronto last year. The year before that they clinched in Boston. I can’t remember when they last clinched a spot at home. Also,the celebration in Yankee Stadium was quite wild on the night they beat Boston in the ’03 ALCS. They’ve had nothing to celebrate since.

  436. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 8:44 pm

    You can’t win with some people. If Hughes pitches well it’s a meaningless September game. If he was getting bomb tonight it’s he can’t even get the lousy Blue Jays out and he’s a bust. SMH

  437. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 8:45 pm

    YankeeJosh,

    Clemens was pitching hurt and put himself onto an ugly jam early in the games. Hughes came in and cleaned Clemen’s mess and pitched a great game to get the win.

  438. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 8:46 pm

    E-Man September 24th, 2008 at 8:38 pm

    Hughes has nice stuff tonight.

    But it is september and these games mean nothing.

    and if he was struggling, I assume you would probably be complaining about that and coming up with trade ideas on what player we can get for Hughes(you are probably doing that now anyway).

    He’s pitching well today. Let’s just watch, enjoy and see if he can continue.

  439. PAT M September 24th, 2008 at 8:46 pm

    I wish there was a way of saving all the Hughes doubters, put there remarks in a folder & then display them in about 2 years…..There has been a few of us who have been rather blatant about how good this kid is going to be….Take note, he’s going to be real good……Maybe when he starts to shave….

  440. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 8:46 pm

    wow, the Tribe couldn’t tied the last game night with bases loaded twice, and they came through with a clutch today.

  441. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 8:47 pm

    METS BULLPEN STRIKES AGAIN 5-5!

  442. YankeeJosh September 24th, 2008 at 8:48 pm

    I’d hope that Hughes gets a chance to compete for the 5th starters role next spring. He shouldn’t hav it handed to him like this year, nor should he have no shot at it, as that would be demoralizing. Even if he struggles a bit, if the team can have a solid 1-4 in the rotation (CC, Wang, Joba, Moose or Pettitte), you can live with Hughes struggling at times and learning. And if he really bombs again, there’s always AAA.

  443. Yankeefanfoev13 September 24th, 2008 at 8:48 pm

    Mets blew a 5-1 lead haha
    Now 5-5

  444. Cliff Lee September 24th, 2008 at 8:48 pm

    “….has command and poise and he’s 22.”
    ________________________________________

    Pete, the words “Hughes” and “poise” together have been way overused. Unless you can say them with the words “win again,” don’t say them at all.

  445. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 8:49 pm

    “Is Phil Hughes the next Cliff Lee?”

    I don’t really see any similarities between the two.

    Another completely off topic thought. Some people around here have been talking about trading for Nate McClouth this offseason. I don’t really see the allure in getting him. He was the worst fielding CF in the NL this year. The Yankees were the worst fielding team in the AL this year, its not a good idea to make it even worse with McClouth.

  446. You know nada September 24th, 2008 at 8:49 pm

    can one of you know it all, winter GMs, tell me why Pettitte is shut down?

    Boston will not be sitting their players. They are trying to avoid a playoff series with the Angels by winning the east, and will be trying hard to beat the Yankees.

    Why is Pettitte not starting? Because of his “shoulder” injury?

  447. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 8:50 pm

    Cliff Lee September 24th, 2008 at 8:48 pm

    “….has command and poise and he’s 22.”
    ________________________________________

    Pete, the words “Hughes” and “poise” together have been way overused. Unless you can say them with the words “win again,” don’t say them at all.

    If only Cliff Lee was able to win a game yesterday. If only…

  448. Drive 4-5 September 24th, 2008 at 8:50 pm

    Josh,

    Not to pick on you but “As much as I hate to admit it, Boston had a lot of obstacles in their way.”

    Other than the Yankees, Boston is the only team that could afford to pay $7mil for Manny to play elsewhere when he became a distraction. They are also one of the few teams that doesnt blink and eye to pick up salary dumps like Kotsay, Bay and Byrd. They used their financial clout to their advantage to make the playoffs. They aint Tampa Bay.

  449. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 8:51 pm

    phlilies getting blowen out

  450. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 8:51 pm

    Most importantly he hasn’t walked anyone.

  451. zellyanks91 September 24th, 2008 at 8:51 pm

    Joe from Long Island- Couldn’t have said it better myself. Nice post there. Hughes has been impressive tonight.

    Kevin

  452. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 8:53 pm

    If only Cliff Lee was able to win a game yesterday. If only…

    I concur.

  453. YankeeJosh September 24th, 2008 at 8:53 pm

    Ed, I remember. I’m as big a Hughes fan as anyone here, and think he has a great future with the team. I’m not at all downplaying what Hughes did. I just think what Pettitte did was more impresive. 6.1 scoreless innings in Cleveland against Carmona who the Yankees couldn’t touch was a masterful performance by Pettitte. Hughes 3.1 innings were impressive, but the length and hostile environment weren’t there. Hughes kept us in the series. Pettitte would have won us the series imo if Joba doesn’t blow the save there because of the bugs.

  454. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 8:53 pm

    What a difference a ride makes!

    I had to go out and listened to Waldman and Sterling announce that Tampa Bay had closed the score to within a run, and now I read that they are leadingt. :D

    Good on ya Rays.

    Then I hear that Cleveland has tied the score in craptown.

    Good on ya Tribe.

    Now I hear that the score of the Mets game is tied.

    Yeow.

  455. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 8:53 pm

    He throwing all his pitches for strikes, economical innings…this really is something to build on for him.

    It’d be great for him to get 1 win under his belt before the season ends and head off to the AFL with some confidence.

  456. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 8:54 pm

    Pat M – I definitely believe Hughes makes the rotation next year. You kind of can’t watch the guy pitch and not realize he can really pitch!!!

    :D

  457. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 8:55 pm

    Boston had a lot of obstacles in their way????

    :lol:

  458. You know nada September 24th, 2008 at 8:55 pm

    can one of you know it all, winter GMs, tell me why Pettitte is shut down?

    Boston will not be sitting their players. They are trying to avoid a playoff series with the Angels by winning the east, and will be trying hard to beat the Yankees.

    Why is Pettitte not starting? Because of his “shoulder” injury?

  459. You Know Who September 24th, 2008 at 8:55 pm

    Oh boy, Hughes can get to the 7th inning!!!!!!!!

  460. NJ in Tampa September 24th, 2008 at 8:57 pm

    “The Yanks clinched their playoff spot in
    Toronto last year. The year before that they clinched in Boston. I can’t remember when they last clinched a spot at home. Also,the celebration in Yankee Stadium was quite wild on the night they beat Boston in the ‘03 ALCS. They’ve had nothing to celebrate since.”

    They celebrated at Yankee Stadium when we clinched the East thanks to Bernie Williams walk off in 2004.

  461. pat September 24th, 2008 at 8:57 pm

    A little kid with a ball and an ice cream cone. Does life get any better than that?

  462. PAT M September 24th, 2008 at 8:57 pm

    Tricia, you’ve joined approx 10 % of the people on this board…Welcome

  463. ray (sox fan) September 24th, 2008 at 8:57 pm

    You know nada
    September 24th, 2008 at 8:49 pm
    can one of you know it all, winter GMs, tell me why Pettitte is shut down?

    “Boston will not be sitting their players. They are trying to avoid a playoff series with the Angels by winning the east, and will be trying hard to beat the Yankees.”

    The Sox just put Timlin into the game which is tied right now in the sixth inning. That pretty kills the argument that the Sox won’t be resting some of their guys.

    Even a Sox fan recognizes that Pettitte has given a ton to the Yankee organization. Give him a break!

  464. You know nada September 24th, 2008 at 8:57 pm

    I know you’re all baseball “experts” *rollseyes* as you sit here every night and argue about a team you all like, while hitting the refresh button on your screen, instead of, you know, actually WATCHING the games….but can one of you know it all, winter GMs, tell me why Pettitte is shut down?

    Boston will not be sitting their players. They are trying to avoid a playoff series with the Angels by winning the east, and will be trying hard to beat the Yankees.

    Why is Pettitte not starting? Because of his “shoulder” injury?

  465. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 8:58 pm

    Actuually, last year we clinched in Tampa.

  466. Yankee Trader September 24th, 2008 at 8:59 pm

    As far as Pettitte is concerned, he’s not pitching for any other team than the Yankees. There’s no reason to be quick to sign him. They could try and sign two quality FA pitchers first, send Pettitte home, tell him to stay in shape and if needed he’ll be called up in June/July to a prorated contract. Had Pettitte not agreed to come back when he did, there was a chance the Yankees would have been able to get Santana without sacrificing Hughes.

  467. Joe September 24th, 2008 at 9:00 pm

    Does anyone else think that we might be watching 2/5ths of next years pitching taff at work tonight?

  468. You know nada September 24th, 2008 at 9:00 pm

    Ray –

    I agree. Pettitte has given more to the Yankees, than any of you’re hired guns: Schilling, Dice-K, Beckett. (I didn’t mention Wakefield).

    I agree with you.

    I’m just asking, is Pettitte getting the well deserved break, or has he really been pitching hurt all month?

    The Sox just pout Timlin in?

    So they DO realize they won’t win the east, even though they’re 3 games back.

    sweet.

  469. E-Man September 24th, 2008 at 9:01 pm

    “and if he was struggling, I assume you would probably be complaining about that and coming up with trade ideas on what player we can get for Hughes(you are probably doing that now anyway).”

    lol no. I didn’t last start. I’m just saying, some people (probably a few here) put Kennedy on throne last year based on 3 starts in september.

    Hughes is still unproven.

  470. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 9:02 pm

    You know nada: Probably because he’s likely been pitching hurt since August.

  471. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 9:02 pm

    “can one of you know it all, winter GMs, tell me why Pettitte is shut down?

    Boston will not be sitting their players. They are trying to avoid a playoff series with the Angels by winning the east, and will be trying hard to beat the Yankees.

    Why is Pettitte not starting? Because of his “shoulder” injury?”

    Uh yeah and if you try to pursue this any further you will be told you lack common sense by Pettitte apologists. Not worth the effort.

  472. Christina September 24th, 2008 at 9:02 pm

    Almost time for the blue jay song.

  473. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 9:03 pm

    Drive – Feel free to pick on me haha. I don’t mind and I welcome any thoughts. Actually, I believe the Sox are number five on baseball payrolls this year, so a few other teams could’ve afford to dump Manny. When I said “obstacles,” one I was referring to was all of the distractions Manny had caused. From pushing down the traveling secretary to mysterious injuries, his situation created tons of drama. And when they traded him, there were some questions of how his run production would be replaced. However, since that trade they have been playing better baseball.

    Other obstacles: Ortiz out for two months, Beckett and Lowell on the DL a few times each, cutting spring training short and starting the season in Japan, Drew out for a month, their starting SS out for a month+, Tek’s horrible offensive slump, and Dice-K out for a month.

    Btw, I live in Sox territoy so I am very aware of them.

  474. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 9:03 pm

    Christ, where was this guy all year?

  475. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 9:04 pm

    I take full responsibility for that home run.

  476. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 9:04 pm

    YIKES!

  477. RalphieD September 24th, 2008 at 9:04 pm

    damn..

  478. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 9:05 pm

    Dang thats a tough one, Rolen was definitely sitting curveball on that pitch.

  479. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 9:05 pm

    :(

  480. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 9:05 pm

    Oh Damn

  481. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 9:05 pm

    You know nada – yea I think Boston has given up on the division. Again, since I live in Sox territory, I get NESN and have been watching the game. They have a couple of rookies in lineup along with Timlin pitching. By no means are they trying to win this game.

  482. You know nada September 24th, 2008 at 9:05 pm

    Rebecca, Thanks. And Same old Hughes. He’ll fail to win tonight. He has no lineup batting for him.

    Trisha…lol thanks.

  483. Yankee Trader September 24th, 2008 at 9:06 pm

    That’s too bad- Hughes pitched well against their A-team while we trotted out 4 regulars against Toronto.

  484. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 9:06 pm

    Well…he bounced right back…c’mon Yanks…get him some runs

  485. mel September 24th, 2008 at 9:06 pm

    Still a good outing for Hughes. Get it back, guys.

  486. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 9:06 pm

    guess he wont win a game all year :(

  487. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 9:06 pm

    Hughes just threw a change on his second pitch to Snider, it looked really good IMO. He should throw that pitch more, I’m kind of shocked he’s been throwing so many cutters. His cutter is easily his worst pitch and that change is a lot improved since we last saw him in the majors.

  488. You know nada September 24th, 2008 at 9:07 pm

    Josh,

    That’s a shame. I think they could still win the East if they wanted.

    But, whatever “Tito” wants to do is fone with Theo, as long as Theo has another gig to play I guess.

  489. RalphieD September 24th, 2008 at 9:07 pm

    nonetheless…a great 7 innings for hughes

  490. yankeefan91 September 24th, 2008 at 9:07 pm

    but da bench is deep 2day if we get a couple of baserunners well bring a big bat off the bench

  491. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 9:07 pm

    And a very late “Ugh” on that HR. Oh well, he’s still doing a nice job tonight.

  492. Doreen September 24th, 2008 at 9:07 pm

    An oops, for sure, but good comeback with the K.

    Hope the Yanks can muster up another run or two.

  493. sw September 24th, 2008 at 9:07 pm

    Burnett is probably out, maybe they can score of the Jay’s pen.

  494. Wangawa September 24th, 2008 at 9:07 pm

    That wasn’t that terrible of a curveball. I’d give some credit to Rolen for hitting that one out.

    Either way, very solid outing by Hughes, finally.

  495. mel September 24th, 2008 at 9:09 pm

    Hey! Stop abusing AJ!

  496. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 9:09 pm

    You know nada – I don’t know if I would call it a shame haha. I’m perfectly fine with them not winning the East. Except they are probably doing the smart thing by resting their guys in preparation for the Angles. It looks like another face-off between LA and Boston this year.

  497. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 9:09 pm

    Get some runs!!

  498. Michael September 24th, 2008 at 9:09 pm

    Here’s the good thing and the better thing about that half-inning. The good thing is that two runs on five hits over seven innings is very solid; you’d take that from your number-one starter 80% or 90% of the time.

    The better thing? He screws up, hangs a curveball, allows a home run. Then he immediately buckles down and strikes out the next guy on three pitches. No fear, no avoiding the strike zone, no loss of focus. That’s a very good sign. When you’re 22, how you react to your mishaps is often more important than the mishaps themselves.

  499. Andrew September 24th, 2008 at 9:10 pm

    Can someone who knows more about pitching help me out here. The RSN announcers said the curve to Rolen was a hanger. But as I saw on MLBTV, the ball clearly broke down, and plenty. You could say it was up in the zone too much, but I wonder whether it was really a “hanging curve”. Did Rolen just time it?

  500. Knicks September 24th, 2008 at 9:10 pm

    FIRE GIRARDI!

    why didn’t he pull hughes and bring in the lefty to face Rolen? now he deprived him of a win.

    he is a terrible manager, now his confident is ruined

  501. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 9:10 pm

    I don’t believe for a minute the Sux have given up on the East. That’s a ridiculous statement to believe for even a mninute. Three behind in the loss column with 5 to play. Boy you talk about cotton for brains. They want the AL East so bad they can taste it. You know, HFA.

    Geesh.

  502. Mark (Brett is back) September 24th, 2008 at 9:10 pm

    Reminds me of that game when Rasner was cruising, and gave up the homer.

  503. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 9:10 pm

    Hughes could definitely get through an 8th inning. Hopefully he will get that chance if the Yankees can come up with a run.

  504. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 9:11 pm

    Bush on tv re: economic crisis

    CNN, MSNBC, et al.

  505. mel September 24th, 2008 at 9:12 pm

    For those of you who care about such things, that’s 11 strikeouts.

  506. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 9:13 pm

    Andrew, my take on that pitch was that Rolen was sitting on the curve and he got it. Hughes was obviously trying to throw the curve for a strike on the outside corner which is where he put it. Unfortunately Rolen was expecting it and since it was in the strike zone he hit it a long way. If that was a 2-strike pitch I’d say it was hanging but I think Hughes was trying to get a called strike there.

  507. AZ Four September 24th, 2008 at 9:13 pm

    These games are meaningless… Hughes SHOULD pitch the 8th. If he wants to be an ace, he has to be able to throw 100+ pitches. If he gives up runs, who cares? Nobody cares about the result of this game, this game is all about Hughes.

    Put him in for the 8th.

  508. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 9:14 pm

    “why didn’t he pull hughes and bring in the lefty to face Rolen?”

    Because Rolen is a righty? In other news, you are a moron.

  509. Oddessy September 24th, 2008 at 9:14 pm

    Man AJ looks NASTY.

    I think all this guy needs is a winning situation.

    I want him AND Tex over CC. Thats the best way to get bang for your buck.

  510. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 9:14 pm

    Trisha – “Given up” may be the wrong words, but they are not gonna play their brains out for it. They have Kotsay at first, all rookies in the outfield (though one is Ellsbury), Cora at SS, and Timlin pitching in a tied game.

  511. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 9:15 pm

    Back out for another inning!!!! Go Hughes

  512. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 9:15 pm

    We aren’t Pettitte “apologists”. You were given a logical reason why he isn’t pitching Saturday and you rejected it.

    Then again, you defend a convicted felon on the team yet, trash a guy who helped the team you profess to love to 4 rings.

    Logic isn’t really a staple in your world when discussing the Yankees.

  513. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 9:15 pm

    Probably pull him at 100 pitches

  514. ray (sox fan) September 24th, 2008 at 9:16 pm

    trisha – BRING BOBBY BACK!
    September 24th, 2008 at 9:10 pm
    “I don’t believe for a minute the Sux have given up on the East. That’s a ridiculous statement to believe for even a mninute. Three behind in the loss column with 5 to play. Boy you talk about cotton for brains. They want the AL East so bad they can taste it. You know, HFA.”

    Trisha, you can believe whatever you want, but clearly at this point it is not the top priority for the Sox to win the division. Why in the world would they be putting Timlin in right now?

    We are three behind in the loss column but you might as well make it four. Tampa Bay won the over all series against us so if we ended up tied with them they would still win the division.

    Plus Tampa Bay is refusing to lose these days.

  515. John in Ohio September 24th, 2008 at 9:17 pm

    I wrote this on an earlier post…..what are your thoughts?

    I cringe everytime Abreu goes back on a fly ball. The guy is deathly afraid of leaving his feet, hitting the wall, or colliding with the center fielder.

    I like it when he comes to the plate, but he kills ya in the field.

  516. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 9:18 pm

    Wow…right at 100 pitches…the only thing that make this tidier is if the Yanks can score a run…get Hughes the win and Mariano the save.

  517. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 9:18 pm

    good job hughes

  518. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 9:18 pm

    Hughes was awesome tonight. The offense has to step up and get him a W. I guess thats what we’ve been saying all year with respect to the offense :(

  519. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 9:18 pm

    All in all, an outstanding 8 inning performance from Hughes. Maybe two mistakes all game.

  520. mel September 24th, 2008 at 9:19 pm

    Dang, Phil. Way to hit 100 right on the nose.

    Stop it, Cito!!!! Burnett can get his 20 next season.

  521. sw September 24th, 2008 at 9:20 pm

    Tampa took the lead on Baltimore. Orioles pitching truly awful. If a team had the Jays pitching and the Orioles hitting they’d probably be pretty good.

  522. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 9:20 pm

    Pat M, proud to be part of that 10%. What really strikes me about Hughes is his maturity and the responsibility he takes for his game. He came up that way it seems. Then add to it his pitching ability that has to be obvious to all but those who spend more time posting than watching.

    I think you have two kinds of fans (maybe more but at least these two). One kind is basically bottom line and anything less than a win/great outing/relative perfect AB puts them into a tailspin. Then you have fans who pay close attention to the detail in a game and look at the game as more of a continuum than a discrete series of games. I tend to fall into the second category and that’s exactly why I was so slow to give up on Igawa (okay maybe too slow as it turns out.) I paid attention to the way he pitched and saw just how nasty his stuff was when he had it working. So I was always hoping that he would find a way to harnass it and be an effective pitcher.

    I am not saying that one way is right and one way is wrong but just explaining why the 10% may be sold on Hughes where a lot of others may not be. The 10% continue to watch him pitch on a continuum and see incremental improvement and also see his pitching ability. So we can project him into the Yankee future. People who are looking for results don’t have the time to pay attention to the nuances.

    Just a thought.

  523. Nick in SF September 24th, 2008 at 9:20 pm

    Yessssssss!!! I knew I was right about Phil, you stupid meanheads and mean stupidhead Phil haters.

    Sorry, had to get that off my chest.

  524. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 9:20 pm

    Forget Burnett. When is Roy Halladay a FA?

  525. Andrew September 24th, 2008 at 9:20 pm

    Thanks Patrick, good take.

    So, hitter guesses correctly + pitch gets too much of the plate + decent hitter = home run.

    I was just piqued by the description of the pitch as a hanger.

    Neat to see two pitchers en fuego.

  526. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 9:20 pm

    Well done Phil!
    Well done!

  527. Forntoso September 24th, 2008 at 9:21 pm

    This is a great game… 2 members of next year’s rotation going head to head. Both look very good.

  528. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 9:21 pm

    Patrick,

    Took the words out my mouth re: the moron.

    The Sox are really out 4 with 5 to play. The Rays own the tiebreaker with the Red Sox.

    If they tie, the Rays win the division. There won’t be a one game playoff.

  529. t-rock September 24th, 2008 at 9:23 pm

    God, I hope AJ doesn’t get an extension with the Jays. I want him if we miss out on CC.

  530. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 9:23 pm

    This guy is nasty…if the Blue Jays could somehow find a way to score runs they’d be a factor in the AL East too…

    But that is why it is the toughest division in baseball…there are 4 teams that would be legitimate contenders in 3 other divisions in baseball

  531. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 9:23 pm

    Trevor, what are you smoking where the Yankees getting Halladay is an actual possibility?

  532. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 9:24 pm

    Really nice outing by Hughes. I’m happy to see him pitching looking like he has the confidence in his stuff again.

  533. Jonathon September 24th, 2008 at 9:25 pm

    Oh fundamentals…

  534. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 9:25 pm

    “2 members of next year’s rotation going head to head.”

    Yep throw in Joba Wang Sabathia for the other 3 spots. See you in October 09.

  535. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 9:25 pm

    Rebecca: in his dreams, that the Yanks would be getting Halladay this offseason.

  536. EY September 24th, 2008 at 9:25 pm

    Wow stellar pitching by Hughes today. Come on offense. let’s get a WIN for Hughes.

  537. jd September 24th, 2008 at 9:26 pm

    gosh i hate bettimet

  538. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 9:26 pm

    ouch, that shot hitted Miranda right under his shoulder.

  539. sw September 24th, 2008 at 9:26 pm

    They should have sent a pitcher out to bunt, I bet Moose or Pettitte or even Rasner would get it down.

  540. Nick in SF September 24th, 2008 at 9:27 pm

    Joba + Hughes = Generation Just Us Two!

  541. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 9:27 pm

    SW your “logical reason” is someone else’s excuse in case you don’t get it. You have to accept that because you say it doesn’t make it so! It’s your opinion. Others of us, yes certainly more than I if you bother reading, are of a different opinion. That’s why faith and I can have such a nice time together here, because when faith suggested we agree to disagree, we did! When I suggested the same to you you took it as a challenge to keep trying to prove me wrong.

    Let it go. Your opinion is worth no more or less than mine or anyone else’s.

    “Logic isn’t really a staple in your world when discussing the Yankees.”

    This is really a condescending statement and one that shows you to be full of yourself as usual, but nothing more. In fact you seem to have some kind of problem with people questioning what you say to the point that you have to come out with bitter and subjective shots if you can’t get them to come around to your way of thinking.

    As I pointed out, you were hellbent on getting rid of Pettite and gave me a hard time and was as condescending in the opposite direction as you are being now. So I guess I could say that your inconsistency causes me to value your opinion less.

    So now let’s leave it. You and I have changed out positions. I can deal with it. I guess you can’t. You thought Pettitte was the scourge of the earth and deserved to be traded because he was hurting the Yankees. Now you’ve done a 180. Your right. I thought Pettitte deserved a chance to prove himself over the course of the season. Now I think he has overstayed his effectiveness welcome. My right.

    Leave it.

  542. jason September 24th, 2008 at 9:27 pm

    SJ – Since you are here, what are your thoughts on Hughes – with the mutliple caveats that his is Sept., the Jays hav been eliminated etc etc.
    I thought he should very nice command and poise. He had a nice tempo on the mound. None of that constant shaking off pitches and wondering around nonsense. Get on the mound, get ready, pitch, throw strikes.

  543. YankeeJosh September 24th, 2008 at 9:27 pm

    A Rays win tonight and a Sox losss and the Rays clinch the East. The Red Sox would be 4 back with 4 to play and Tampa owning the tiebreaker. Rays magic number as of now is 2.

    It’s very unlikely the Yanks-Sox games will have any meaning at all. Sox will be locked in to the wild card, so might rest most of heir starters Sunday. The only reason they wouldn’t is because there is now a longer layoff between the end of the season and start of the Division series. Sox might rest their players Saturday and give everyone some time Sunday against Moose to not lose the feel of live games.

  544. LLIME September 24th, 2008 at 9:28 pm

    See what happens when Hughes attacks hitters and doesn’t nibble? He looks like a stud.

    I know this wasn’t exactly the biggest test and Kennedy mowed down this same lineup this time last year, but it is encouraging.

    Velocity wasn’t great though…

  545. Christina September 24th, 2008 at 9:28 pm

    Their offense is half of the reason that Halladay is at 19 wins, as opposed to 22 or 23. This guy gets shafted so much. Last year, I cant even tell you how many games he lost or recieve da no decision on because their offense let them down.

    Half of it was because of Vernon Wells sucking it up. It is odd though becuase for the past few years the Jays offense was ranked pretty high up.

  546. Abraham September 24th, 2008 at 9:28 pm

    I really wished they had brought up Hughes sooner. Because of Kennedy not doing great after being called up. Hughes chance to back earlier was taken away.

    I wonder. If you take all of Burnett’s starts against the Yankees out of the equation. Would he have a 5.00 or 6.00 era?

  547. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 9:28 pm

    I asked WHEN is Halladay a FA. Didn’t say anything about that we was getting him.

  548. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 9:29 pm

    Joba + Hughes = Generation Just Us Two!

    LOL :P

  549. R-Tek September 24th, 2008 at 9:30 pm

    If we don’t score, send Hughes out there for the 9th anyway. If he gives up a walkoff HR, who cares? Get him to 110 pitches.

  550. sw September 24th, 2008 at 9:30 pm

    Halladay’s an FA after 2010. He’ll be 34 in 2011. I wonder if his arm will hold up after two more years of Cito abuse.

  551. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 9:30 pm

    Trevor; Yes, but the meaning is inherent ;)

  552. KING FELIX September 24th, 2008 at 9:32 pm

    veras in = bleu jays are salivating. walkoff win for them.

  553. stuart September 24th, 2008 at 9:32 pm

    trisha, what is wrong with you? is it because of last night that you sound like the female version of howard cosell! find a hobby.

  554. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 9:33 pm

    Halladay’s 32? Wow, didn’t realize he’s been around that long

  555. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 9:33 pm

    Thank You SW. If he’s that old then I’ll pass.

  556. Betemit stinks September 24th, 2008 at 9:33 pm

    Have to love Girardi’s managing. Doesn’t have Arod pinch hit, for $28m he cant get an at bat?! Well he probably would of hit into a DP anyway. Betemit is just another player that Girardi has asked to bunt this season that clearly doesn’t know how to. Funny how the Steins don’t put any of this on Girardi but non of his players can do anything fundamentally. I mean bottom of the 8th, tied game and decent at best hitting Betemit can’t bunt….That makes sense..

  557. jd September 24th, 2008 at 9:34 pm

    does anyone else hateeee mlb.com coverage of everything??
    they cut innings short,,start late,,,and make u log in everytime u make a change,,,also iphone sucks for mlb coverage…
    just venting…time to get satellite for YES..and new phone?

  558. sw September 24th, 2008 at 9:35 pm

    Halladay’s 31, but he’ll be 34 in 2011.

  559. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 9:36 pm

    stuart, you are getting on my nerves. Other people here call you an idiot and I tell them not to insult you. I agree with some of your opinions. I have been nothing but respectful to you. I don’t need you critiquing me or my posts.

    And whatever you mean about the female version of Howard Cosell has gone over my head. So you can have that thought to keep you warm.

    Okay?

  560. Wangawa September 24th, 2008 at 9:36 pm

    Generation Deux

  561. On the road September 24th, 2008 at 9:37 pm

    Phil didnt deserve this fate.

  562. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 9:37 pm

    Trisha,

    It’s not my opinion he is hurt. He IS Hirt.

    Girardi said it. Pete and just about every beat writer on the beat have confirmed it. Only you seem to be rejecting it.

    I thought Hughes was dynamite tonight. Loved the use of the cutter and I think Moeller did a nice job settling him down after the first inning and worked featured the curveball the rest of the game.

    Definitely something he can build on for the AFL season.

  563. yankeefan91 September 24th, 2008 at 9:37 pm

    wat a hidious slide by miranda but good hit

  564. Bronx Jeers September 24th, 2008 at 9:38 pm

    Nice Miranda!

  565. Betemit stinks September 24th, 2008 at 9:38 pm

    Let me guess Miranda will never leave 2nd base…With this great fundamental team.

  566. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 9:38 pm

    Miranda really wants that 1B gig next season.

  567. jd September 24th, 2008 at 9:38 pm

    “”Betemit stinks
    September 24th, 2008 at 9:33 pm
    Have to love Girardi’s managing. Doesn’t have Arod pinch hit, for $28m he cant get an at bat?! Well he probably would of hit into a DP anyway. Betemit is just another player that Girardi has asked to bunt this season that clearly doesn’t know how to. Funny how the Steins don’t put any of this on Girardi but non of his players can do anything fundamentally. I mean bottom of the 8th, tied game and decent at best hitting Betemit can’t bunt….That makes sense”"

    I AGREE!…they lost at least 4 games this year cause NO ONE can bunt on this team!

  568. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 9:39 pm

    Why can’t our guys bunt? It’s very frustrating to watch.

  569. Abraham September 24th, 2008 at 9:39 pm

    My posts are not going through. Why is that? Let me say this again. I thought they should’ve brought Hughes back up sooner. Kennedy failure in his second go round this season had something to do with that. And if you took Burnett’s starts against the Yankees out of the equation would he have a 5.00 era?

  570. yankeefan91 September 24th, 2008 at 9:40 pm

    can anybody bunt in this team

  571. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 9:40 pm

    “A Rays win tonight and a Sox losss and the Rays clinch the East. The Red Sox would be 4 back with 4 to play and Tampa owning the tiebreaker. Rays magic number as of now is 2.”

    What would happen with a Rays loss and a Sux win? Are you saying there is no way whatsoever the Sux could win the east? If they are three behind in the loss column with more than three games to play then it is absolutely possible. At one point this evening the Rays were down 6-0 and the Sux were up 4-0. That’s why they play the games!

    HOWEVER – if it should happen that the Rays clinch the east – and there is no way for the Sux to tie the Angels – then I would absolutely agree that these games with the Sux are meaningless and the one I would really care about would be Mooses on Sunday when he goes for win #20.

  572. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 9:40 pm

    The Yankees could take a lesson from the Angels–make EVERYONE bunt in the minors.

  573. KING FELIX September 24th, 2008 at 9:41 pm

    sadly, betemit has a better chance of getting a clutch hit in that spot than a-rod

  574. joe September 24th, 2008 at 9:41 pm

    gardner can bunt. That’s bout it I think.

  575. You know nada September 24th, 2008 at 9:42 pm

    Josh,

    sorry I got you mixed up with Ray (Red Sox fan)

    As Yankee fans…yeah I hope the Red Sox lose their remaining games.

    but if I was a sox fan..i’d be pissed they’re not trying to win the east, and just about assuring themselves a 1st rd loss. lol

  576. jd September 24th, 2008 at 9:42 pm

    cant hit AND cant bunt?! INEXCUSABLE!!

  577. Betemit stinks September 24th, 2008 at 9:42 pm

    Moeller who is lucky he is playing on this team can’t bunt either…How pathetic…But it is not Girardi’s fault ofcourse

  578. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 9:42 pm

    memo to the members of the 2009 Yankees. For the love of God, please learn how to bunt.

    No excuse for bench guys to be this inept trying to bunt.

  579. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 9:42 pm

    SJ – Jeter plays hurt. Why shouldn’t Andy. You can bet that Jeter wouldn’t shut himself down for the rest of the season, hurt or not. That’s my point.

    But we see it differently and that’s fine.

    And if it should happen that the Sux cannot win the east I would agree with josh that letting the kids play is not a bad way to go. Except for Moose’s 20th.

  580. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 9:42 pm

    Can all the Hughes bashers please stand up?

  581. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 9:42 pm

    Trisha – The Ray’s magic number is 2. That means any one of the following would clinch the division: two Ray wins, two Sox losses, one Ray win and one Sox loss.

  582. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 9:42 pm

    Melky could bunt too.

    now, Gardner HAS to bunt.

  583. sw September 24th, 2008 at 9:43 pm

    I said it before, the pitchers on this team can probably bunt better than any of the hitters. Seriously, what do they teach in the Yankees minor leagues?

  584. Oddessy September 24th, 2008 at 9:43 pm

    Hughes looked great tonight.

    I still don’t think his stuff is conducive to being a top-flight pitcher, but he will be a very good ML pitcher if he can master that FB command.

  585. Nick in SF September 24th, 2008 at 9:43 pm

    Nick in SF
    September 24th, 2008 at 2:55 am
    Goal for tonight: get Phil’s ERA below 7.00!

    ______________________________________________________

    That was my early-morning goal for this game. Mission accomplished! I must be among the savvy 10% of baseball fans.

  586. joe September 24th, 2008 at 9:43 pm

    if gardner can’t lay down a bunt, fire all the coaches in the minors. Disgrace.

  587. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 9:43 pm

    Brett getting it done.

  588. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 9:44 pm

    Jeter getting ready to come in for defense.

  589. David Cone's Labrum September 24th, 2008 at 9:44 pm

    Cone and Wells plopped down in the row in front of me at Sunday’s Stadium-closing game and I had a chance to ask them a few questions. None of this is news-breaking, just thought I’d share it with you all.

    Q: Compare Hughes and Coke

    Cone: The difference is mentality. Coke gets after it – no looking back, no fear – he attacks, plain and simple. Hughes has the “deer in headlights” look to him. He needs confidence and time.

    Q: How’s Leyritz doing?

    Wells: I haven’t talked to him in a long time. I’m not sure many guys have. It’s sad.

    Q: Is Gardner destined for more than Pinch running/4th outfielder duties in 2009?

    Cone: Surprisingly, the organization is really high on the guy, if he could just hit a “litle bit” (emphasizing with a pinch of the fingers). Just a little bit more, and he’s a starting CF in the major leagues. Could be an impact guy.

  590. jd September 24th, 2008 at 9:44 pm

    BRAVO gardner!

  591. AJ YANKS September 24th, 2008 at 9:44 pm

    Why are people blaming Girardi?

    This is an organizational problem, not even the minor league guys can bunt. Cashman has to change that philosophy this off-season and make sure he instates a rule which requires they learn how to bunt.

  592. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 9:45 pm

    I cannot wait to watch the encore, I hate missing the only starter I care about all week!

  593. Betemit stinks September 24th, 2008 at 9:45 pm

    Look at that someone can bunt…Now can Abreu actually get a sac fly??!?!

  594. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 9:45 pm

    About learning how to bunt. Absolutely agree. When we say there was enough fault to go around, that’s where Girardi comes in for me. How many times did we see cases where players needed to find a way to sacrifice someone over and failed to do it. So many that if you add them up we definitely would have been in the postseason if the guys had sacd each other over!

  595. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 9:45 pm

    You know nada – oh god, do I sound like a Sox fan? Haha no big deal, don’t worry.

  596. YankeeJosh September 24th, 2008 at 9:45 pm

    Trisha, yes the Sox can win the East, but it’s very improbable. Rays are up 3 games entering today, so the Sox need to gain 4 games (because of the tiebreakers) in the standing with 5 games to go. That’s very hard. According to ESPN’s stats, the Sox have a 1.6% chance of winning the division.

  597. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 9:45 pm

    GRAND SLAM FOR BOBBY!!!!!

  598. jd September 24th, 2008 at 9:46 pm

    intentional hit batter? DP in play then…

  599. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 9:46 pm

    Still don’t want Bobby back?

  600. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 9:46 pm

    BRING BOBBY BACK!

    BRING BOBBY BACK!

    BRING BOBBY BACK!

    I just love the guy.

  601. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 9:46 pm

    If we were still in contention that would have been way more significant.

  602. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 9:46 pm

    Sweet as Hell swing by Abreu.

  603. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 9:46 pm

    eww, Veras is going to be the W and not Hughes.

  604. joe September 24th, 2008 at 9:46 pm

    YA BOBBY

  605. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 9:47 pm

    Abreu definitely a type A FA. That will give us 2 extra picks.

  606. Only umps on the take hate instant replay. September 24th, 2008 at 9:47 pm

    That was sweet.

  607. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 9:47 pm

    Bobby!

  608. Betemit stinks September 24th, 2008 at 9:47 pm

    Go Abreu!! That is better then a sac fly. Now Girardi better pitch Bruney and not garbage Ramirez.

  609. Yankee Trader September 24th, 2008 at 9:47 pm

    Wow, Abreu coming thru-will make out like a bandit if offered arbitration-now will want Manny money!!

  610. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 9:48 pm

    Yankeejosh while I hear what you’re saying, I also heard that there was 0 % that the Sux would be able to come back and win four games when they were three down in a 7 game series.

    I take nothing for granted anymore.

  611. sw September 24th, 2008 at 9:48 pm

    Good for Bobby. One guy who’s been hitting with RISP all year, at least.

    Cubs up on the Mets 6-5 now.

  612. Newark Bears September 24th, 2008 at 9:48 pm

    Yeah, let’s replace Bobby with Jackson and Gardner LOL

    Great suggestion by the arm chair GMs.

  613. thunderfangabe September 24th, 2008 at 9:48 pm

    haha i had just text my friend a few seconds before that slam to say “bobby’s goin’ yard”

  614. Wangawa September 24th, 2008 at 9:48 pm

    Dump Giambi, bring back Bobby.

  615. Joe from Long Island September 24th, 2008 at 9:48 pm

    I know this sounds cynical, but I think Bobby’s price/years for a new contract just went up.

  616. ray (sox fan) September 24th, 2008 at 9:49 pm

    A miracle….Varitek intentionally walked.

  617. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 9:49 pm

    “Still don’t want Bobby back?”

    Push comes to shove Manny is still a way better hitter and if it comes down to signing Abreu to a 5 year or Manny to a 3 year deal I choose the latter.

  618. Johnny D. September 24th, 2008 at 9:49 pm

    Why do you call this meaningless baseball? Because they’re playing for the game and not for some higher goal? Isn’t this more meaningful baseball?

  619. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 9:49 pm

    Bring back Bobby!!!

  620. Oddessy September 24th, 2008 at 9:49 pm

    Watching this game makes me even more sad that we are out of it.

    It sucks that they start playing well when the pressure is off. Where was this in August?

  621. EY September 24th, 2008 at 9:50 pm

    This isn’t even save situation. Maybe they should run Edwar out there so he can give up a bomb for Mo to save the game.

  622. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 9:50 pm

    “Cone and Wells plopped down in the row in front of me at Sunday’s Stadium-closing game and I had a chance to ask them a few questions”

    Geeze I didn’t even have to get any further than that to be impressed! Wow. It doesn’t even matter what their answers were.

    :D

  623. bob September 24th, 2008 at 9:50 pm

    kotsay just doubled in the go ahead run in the bottom of the eighth. 5-4

  624. Only umps on the take hate instant replay. September 24th, 2008 at 9:50 pm

    All we need to do with Bobby is help him get over his fear of playing better defense.

  625. R-Tek September 24th, 2008 at 9:50 pm

    Al, absolutley if it’s between Manny and Bobby, I’d take Manny hands down.

    However, I really don’t think Cashman is gutsy enough to sign him.

    If my options are Gardner/Edmonds or some hasbeen vs. Bobby, I take Bobby hands down and trade Damon or Matsui to free up the DH.

  626. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 9:51 pm

    “eww, Veras is going to be the W and not Hughes.”

    If I would have taken a pool of all the LoHud posters how many of you would have said Phil would go winless?

  627. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 9:52 pm

    WTF????

  628. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 9:52 pm

    WTF, Ponson? where’s Sanchez?

  629. NITRO September 24th, 2008 at 9:52 pm

    Kevin Hart? Pinella brings in a kid with a 7 ERA in a 1 run game?

    Where is Marmol, Sardmijza, Howery etc?

  630. SJ44 September 24th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    Trisha,

    I’m going to explain this to you one final time.

    A pitcher pitching with a sore shoulder in a meaningless game does nobody any good.

    These games don’t matter anymore. They are not going to further risk a pitchers health by having him pitch in a game that has no consequences.

    You don’t that with pitchers.

    There isn’t a team in baseball that would abuse a pitcher like that.

    You want to see FA pitchers run from signing with the Yankees! Use an injured pitcher in a meaningless game.

  631. sw September 24th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    Ponson in. 8O

  632. YankeeJosh September 24th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    Yankeejosh while I hear what you’re saying, I also heard that there was 0 % that the Sux would be able to come back and win four games when they were three down in a 7 game series.

    I take nothing for granted anymore.

    Trisha, but in a one on one series, the team has control over their destiny, meaning comebacks would be much more probable. I was never comfortable in 2004 with the Yankees up 3-0, given how the Yanks pitching was set up in that series. Here Boston doesn’t have control because they aren’t playing Tampa.

  633. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    Nice to see Bobby get 20 HR and almost 100 RBI.

    I don’t get why Ponson is pitching right now. He is starting on saturday and this is essentially garbage time. Isn’t this the perfect opportunity to give Sanchez another shot?

  634. Betemit stinks September 24th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    Ponson please tell me you can get 3 outs before giving up 4 runs…

  635. Mike R September 24th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    I really hope that Hughes can reproduce some of the results he had tonight next year.

  636. Tank September 24th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    Ponson? ROFL

    This is TOO funny.

  637. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    “Al, absolutley if it’s between Manny and Bobby, I’d take Manny hands down.

    However, I really don’t think Cashman is gutsy enough to sign him.

    If my options are Gardner/Edmonds or some hasbeen vs. Bobby, I take Bobby hands down and trade Damon or Matsui to free up the DH.”

    Thats ok. But who says Cashman is still making the decisions this offseason :)

  638. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    If I would have taken a pool of all the LoHud posters how many of you would have said Phil would go winless?

    AL, I would say he would get at least 2-3 wins with the optioning down to AAA if wasn’t injuried.

  639. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    Johnny D. September 24th, 2008 at 9:49 pm

    Why do you call this meaningless baseball? Because they’re playing for the game and not for some higher goal? Isn’t this more meaningful baseball?

    Perhaps the best post I’ve ever seen on LoHud.

  640. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 9:54 pm

    Ponson? o-kaaay..

  641. You know nada September 24th, 2008 at 9:54 pm

    good stuff cone’s labrum.

    thanks.

  642. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 9:54 pm

    so tell me how come the elimination number can’t be based on a Yankee loss?

  643. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 9:54 pm

    Ha I think that was more luck than skill, but whatever gets the job done…

  644. george September 24th, 2008 at 9:55 pm

    Abreu’s really a tough choice. he’s been trending downwards the last couple of years, and so you have to expect it to continue. Still, he seems like he’ll be a productive hitter for a few years.

    his D is so bad, but i’d have to bring him back. then use Nady as trade bait for another part or some youth.

  645. David Cone's Labrum September 24th, 2008 at 9:55 pm

    You all should read Olney’s column on the Yanks demise for some insight on the repercussions of FA spending sprees.

    Even signing Abreu would have an impact on our draft for next year. As difficult as it might seem, I think we need to let the guy go, move Nady to right and platoon Damon, Gardner, Melky or other (trade) in CF and Left for 2009.

    Bobby might command 3 years – want to make that move? DH looks awfully crowded in 2-3 years already.

  646. EY September 24th, 2008 at 9:56 pm

    Shouldn’t they be giving the youngsters in the pen some innings instead of Ponson?

  647. Patrick September 24th, 2008 at 9:56 pm

    Another point about Pettitte. He clearly has an injured shoulder, why risk a meaningless start and possibly make hte injury even worse? Hopefully this is the kind of injury that will improve with rest over the offseason. No point in really injuring it just to beat the red sox in an meaningless game.

  648. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 9:56 pm

    Well look at that, we won again!

  649. Joe from Long Island September 24th, 2008 at 9:56 pm

    You know, I bet Sir Sidney and Rasner would be fairly decent in the NL. I was just thinking, Omar and the Mets should look at those guys in the winter.

  650. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 9:57 pm

    Love Bobby but he can’t come back next year. This all needs to change.

  651. Nick in SF September 24th, 2008 at 9:57 pm

    Abreu always giggles when he’s interviewed by Kim after the game.

  652. pat September 24th, 2008 at 9:57 pm

    A 10 inning Yankee game in uder 3 hours. Un-heard of.

  653. R-Tek September 24th, 2008 at 9:57 pm

    lol Al, I HOPE Cashman is gonem lets hope he is :)

  654. PBL September 24th, 2008 at 9:58 pm

    does anyone think jeter or jorge would be this happy if they hit a gw homer today?

  655. jennifer September 24th, 2008 at 9:58 pm

    I think Bobby likes Kim.

  656. Thomas September 24th, 2008 at 9:58 pm

    Ponson?? What the F????
    We have a 4 run lead, try one of the new kids!!!!
    How about the kid we got for Sheff????

  657. stuart September 24th, 2008 at 9:59 pm

    anybody out there have beckett’s post season numbers?

  658. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 9:59 pm

    Now its time for Phil (and Joba too hopefully) to head off to the Fall league for another 40-50 innings.

  659. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 9:59 pm

    PBL if they value winning yes. Nothing changes on that field bad season yes, but they react the same if they win.

  660. AZ Four September 24th, 2008 at 9:59 pm

    What we saw tonight from Hughes was our #3 starter for years to come.

    He isin’t going anywhere.

  661. jennifer September 24th, 2008 at 9:59 pm

    How strange is this. The Mets game started the same time as ours and is only in the 8th. We played 10 before they played 8.

  662. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 10:00 pm

    And further proof that the Sox are not “trying” for the division – one run lead in the 9th and no Papelbon.

    Any way, great day for Hughes. I hope it only improves his confidence.

  663. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 10:01 pm

    Okay now that the game is over, NYYankinlalaland (I think that’s your whole title!) why don’t you tell me the pitchers you are comparing Pettitte to in terms of injuries. You made the statement that he isn’t injury prone compared to other pitchers, and I say that I don’t want someone who has to be shut down 15 days with back spasms that you don’t know whether or not they will show up. He has had a ton of down time. He’s been on the DL too many times.

    So I will look at the injuries to the pitchers someone else used as comparison, pitchers who have comparable innings I guess.

  664. Doreen September 24th, 2008 at 10:01 pm

    There’s nothing wrong with being happy after hitting a grand slam and winning a game. Sheesh.

  665. Betsy September 24th, 2008 at 10:01 pm

    Hey guys – I was out at dinner and missed Phil tonight (taped the game, though). It sounds like (from the other boards I’ve visted) that Phil was downright nasty tonight, and that his curve was filthy. True? Also heard that he threw a great change up – in the 7th, I think? If so, I am so happy for Phil; he’s had an unfortunate year thus far, but it looks like he’s ended on a great note. Plus, he’s going to the AFL on positive note and with plenty of good feelings. This kid is 22 and he’s going to be an outstanding pitcher.

  666. pat September 24th, 2008 at 10:01 pm

    PBL
    Is your point that you want everyone moping because they aren’t going to the postseason?

  667. Quilvio Imposter September 24th, 2008 at 10:02 pm

    2009 lineup

    Damon LF
    Jeter SS
    Cano 3B
    A-Rod 3B
    Posada C
    Matsui DH
    Nady LF
    Casey Blake 1B
    Gardner LF

  668. george September 24th, 2008 at 10:02 pm

    “God Bless the great Bobby Abreu, who now has 99 RBI and has saved us from the calamity of an 11th inning.”

    yes, we really have it tough, watching a spectator sport while enjoying broadband internet connections. It’s especially tough on sports writers; it’s almost as bad as toiling in mosquito-infested fields for a dollar a day.

  669. David Cone's Labrum September 24th, 2008 at 10:02 pm

    Mets and BrewCrew to be tied for the WC after tonight.

    Great stuff!

    Eiher team would make for great theatre in a 3-game series.
    Santana or Sabathia with the potential to pitch games 1 and 5 – sign me up..

  670. Abraham September 24th, 2008 at 10:03 pm

    My posts are not going through. Why is that? Let me say this again. I thought they should’ve brought Hughes back up sooner. Kennedy failure in his second go round this season had something to do with that. And if you took Burnett’s starts against the Yankees out of the equation would he have a 5.00 era? Go Hughes.

  671. Dave D September 24th, 2008 at 10:03 pm

    G.I. Joe will never be able to command the clubhouse and mold this team if we keep bringing in paychecks/vets.

  672. PBL September 24th, 2008 at 10:03 pm

    Brandon, I disagree, I don’t think you’d see any of those guys, Jeter, Jorge, Mo, or Pettite, celebrate winning a game that’s meaningless.

  673. Josh September 24th, 2008 at 10:04 pm

    Stuart – you can find it here: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/.....yerId=4242

    But basically, Beckett in October is gold. I still remember that awful Game 6 of the 2003 series.

  674. Don Draper September 24th, 2008 at 10:05 pm

    The Yankees have taken on ARod’s personality and now perform best in meaningless situations, padding team stats after the “game” has been settled.

  675. Sea Net September 24th, 2008 at 10:05 pm

    Joba the phenom fireballer Ace
    Wang the #2 where he should be
    Hughes the #3 starter where his ceiling is

    sounds good. Though CC will be ahead of all of them :)

  676. PBL September 24th, 2008 at 10:05 pm

    pat…yep, sort of. my point is i think the guys have been the heart of our championship teams would be.

  677. You Know Who September 24th, 2008 at 10:06 pm

    Mr. Clutch—Mark Kotsay—does it again!

  678. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 10:06 pm

    Mamol pitching 8th?

  679. PAT M September 24th, 2008 at 10:06 pm

    I learned a long time ago ( during the Nixon Admin ) while scratching my way through the farm leagues, that you play with pain, you do not play hurt…..That well known fact is highlighted in Capital letters when it pertains to a pitcher…Especially with a shoulder/ elbow issue…..Man, that’s rather basic, isn’t it ?????? Nick from SF, You may be the most clever person here, love your stuff…..

  680. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 10:06 pm

    Maybe Bud Selig will take Hank’s advice and just put them in the playoffs.

    got to get Selig drunk, and have him write on paper (of record his statement) that he has agreed to put the Yanks into the playoffs because of Hank’s advice.

  681. Abraham September 24th, 2008 at 10:06 pm

    “Quilvio Imposter
    September 24th, 2008 at 10:02 pm
    2009 lineup

    Damon LF
    Jeter SS
    Cano 3B
    A-Rod 3B
    Posada C
    Matsui DH
    Nady LF
    Casey Blake 1B
    Gardner LF”

    That opens up the whole right field for the other team.

  682. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 10:07 pm

    Phil pitched great today. Would have been nice to see him finally get a W for this season, but whatever.

    Hopefully he continues to do well while playing in the AFL

  683. Sigmund September 24th, 2008 at 10:08 pm

    If the Mets lose tonight, there will only be five teams in baseball with a better record than the Yankees. All five will be going to the playoffs, as will three teams with the same record or worse. Just trying to take the sting off the season.

  684. FrankDiscussion September 24th, 2008 at 10:08 pm

    Betsy,

    Phil indeed looked sharp tonight. Made one mistake with a hanging curve but rebounded nicely. Curve was biting well all night long. Good stuff.

  685. Jose September 24th, 2008 at 10:08 pm

    Torre is all class and I appreciate what he did for us… I really wish I could root for him in the playoffs.

    But the media is making me despise him and the Dodgers. The Diet Coke Bandit (Francessa) leads the Torre slurp parade.

  686. AJ YANKS September 24th, 2008 at 10:10 pm

    Sabathia tonight

    7 IP, 4 H, 1 ER, 11 K

    Pitching his 2nd consecutive game on 3 days rest.

  687. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 10:10 pm

    “2009 lineup

    Damon LF
    Jeter SS
    Cano 3B
    A-Rod 3B
    Posada C
    Matsui DH
    Nady LF
    Casey Blake 1B
    Gardner LF”

    WOw 3 LF Nice

  688. pat September 24th, 2008 at 10:10 pm

    “my point is i think the guys have been the heart of our championship teams would be.”

    Jeter and Andy were laughing in the dugout in the 10th inning. Do they lose “True Yankee” points for that?

  689. Nick in SF September 24th, 2008 at 10:11 pm

    Thanks, PAT M, but I need to try harder to use my superpowers only for good and never for evil.

    One correction: I’m *in* SF from I’m *from* New York.

  690. Clint September 24th, 2008 at 10:11 pm

    Samardjzia lights out all year now choking when it matters the most.

    Great job. Where the hell is Marmol?

  691. Buddy Biancalana September 24th, 2008 at 10:15 pm

    Nick-

    Just curious, are you a writer?

  692. Head Trauma Harry September 24th, 2008 at 10:16 pm

    Hey the Yanks are playing AWESOME right now. Postseason here we come !!!!

    What month are we in again?

  693. dennis September 24th, 2008 at 10:16 pm

    i think the mets 3rd base coach came up through the same system as the yanks 3rd base coach!

  694. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 10:17 pm

    Brandon, I disagree, I don’t think you’d see any of those guys, Jeter, Jorge, Mo, or Pettite, celebrate winning a game that’s meaningless.

    That was Mo smiling last night right ? and Jetes w/ the fist pump com’on man stop w/ the BS.

  695. JWagg September 24th, 2008 at 10:18 pm

    “2009 lineup

    Damon LF
    Jeter SS
    Cano 3B
    A-Rod 3B
    Posada C
    Matsui DH
    Nady LF
    Casey Blake 1B
    Gardner LF”

    … Maybe if we were facing a team composed soley of right handed Jason Giambi’s…

  696. PAT M September 24th, 2008 at 10:18 pm

    Sincere apologies Nick in SF……I knew that…..

  697. LLIME September 24th, 2008 at 10:19 pm

    I like the Nate Robertson glasses.

  698. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 10:19 pm

    Oh my god was that Jetes jumping after Abreu’s GS ? Does he lose true yankee points for that too ?

  699. Betsy September 24th, 2008 at 10:20 pm

    I love Coney, but he can not be comparing Phil Hughes to Phil Coke. Phil # 1 has already shown the metal that is very rare among youngsters by doing what he did against the Indians. That confidence is natural to him – he doesn’t wear it on his sleeve like Joba, but that night, I saw a kid who truly belonged out there. The fact is, Phil has suffered several bad injuries and it’s natural that he would experience a lack of confidence, a “deer in the headlights” look when he’s getting knocked around for the first time in his life. Once Phil is able to pitch consistently, and pitch well, that confidence of his will be back.

    Phil Coke has pitched in very few games up here, albeit very well, and he hasn’t had a bad outing yet. Let’s see what he does when confronted with adversity. Plus, he’s also a few years older than Phil.

  700. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 10:20 pm

    With Hughes pitching in the the Arizona League, it’s going to get his innings up, but, it’s going to be tricky to evaluate him, I would think. If he’s great, is it because they’re minor leaguers or if he gets hit, is it because that big curve and cutter didn’t break in the thin, dry air. It will be interesting to watch. Good results are good, but the innings are better. The innings for Chamberlain are just as important for him, also. I dread the yammering and whining on this board if they get hit, though.

  701. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 10:20 pm

    PBL help me here these guys look happy after they win, they should be cursing and crying off that field shouldn’t they ?

  702. LLIME September 24th, 2008 at 10:21 pm

    Qulvio

    That lineup is awful. Arod will get walked everytime up (ecept in clutch situations, of course)

  703. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 10:21 pm

    The Irishman just choked

  704. Nick in SF September 24th, 2008 at 10:22 pm

    Hey Buddy,

    No, I am not a writer, professionally. I did submit an album review to an alternative weekly once and it was published. They paid me $10!

  705. mel September 24th, 2008 at 10:22 pm

    And that’s why you don’t IBB someone to load the bases….

  706. Betsy September 24th, 2008 at 10:22 pm

    Ah, I see. Even after a terrific game by Phil, we’re getting the “he’s no more than a #3″. I love it. I really hope that these folks do not pop out of the woodwork to say that they knewe it all along when Phil becomes a top notch starter.

  707. Dr. J September 24th, 2008 at 10:23 pm

    AFL results are meaningless. He is essentially facing good AA hitters, though it is in a bandbox.

    Can’t draw any conclusions form it, it is primarily for innings.

  708. Betsy September 24th, 2008 at 10:24 pm

    Thanks, Frank Discussion! I saw the curve on YES highlights and boy, was that thing nasty. Whew!

  709. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:24 pm

    Nick: That’s awesome!

    I’ve been writing for ages and still haven’t published anything. Guess I’m not very good.

  710. patrick max September 24th, 2008 at 10:25 pm

    The players are allowed to celeberat… they have had a great year. Jeter is the captin and MO is a legand

    both can celebreat when they want

  711. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 10:25 pm

    Mets BP just needs 3 outs and they can get the W in the 9th.

  712. arial September 24th, 2008 at 10:25 pm

    The Dodgers will go far in the post season, much to the chagrin of the Steinbrenners, especially if Torre rides Manny all the way. Out of spite, the Yankees, and against the advise of Cashman, will sign Manny to a multi-year deal, not as rich as he would like but far better than the competition. The Dodgers will not bid as McCourt will be too busy counting the merchandising proceeds from the dredlock sales. In response to the outraged press pointing out the potential pitfalls of Manny in the clubhouse, the Steinees will say, “if Torre can deal with him, we certainly can, and we expect Girardi, if he indeed is a true Yankee manager, to do likewise”. Don’t be surprised if it indeed happens.

  713. dennis September 24th, 2008 at 10:26 pm

    let me guess nick… a steely dan album?

  714. pat September 24th, 2008 at 10:26 pm

    Girardi postgame

    On Bobby: You can have an awful day and in the last inning of the night you hit a GS….Hughes curveball was good, his change was good. The important part is getting into a count you can throw it…I hope he isn’t kicking himself for the curve to Rolen because he was good tonight….we’ll take that performance from Phil everytime….He pretty much did everything right tonight, the mistake to Rolen will happen but he was right tonight….This is a hard game and it doesn’t take much for your mechanics to not be right. If this was an easy game, everyone could do it. Even those people on the Lohud blog!

    Okay he didn’t say the thing about the Lohud Blog but he was thinking it. :smile:

  715. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 10:26 pm

    That name Quilvio is giving me badddd deja vu. *shudders*

  716. Tank September 24th, 2008 at 10:26 pm

    Clock will strike midnight on the Cubbies soon. It has already started.

    Ayala will give up a couple hits but get out cleanly.

    Wright or Delgado will hit a walkoff HR off Chad Gaudin, Bob Howery, or whoever is left in the pen.

  717. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:28 pm

    Come on Cubs.

  718. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 10:28 pm

    Pat M I love your point about playing in pain by not playing hurt. All the more reason Pettitte should have either shut it down earlier or pitched Saturday’s game in Boston. I find it hard to believe that he got an injury in Sunday’s game.

  719. NITRO September 24th, 2008 at 10:28 pm

    I really like Moller, hard worker, blue collar player, good clubhouse guy.

    I wouldn’t mind him playing 1st base for us next year.

  720. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 10:29 pm

    Come on Cubs.

    Rebeccaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa :?

  721. Bronx Jeers September 24th, 2008 at 10:29 pm

    I was just looking thru today’s paper. Isn’t Hank just the epitome of the classy owner? He’s hated the division set up in the 70′s and he hates it now? So I guess he’s pretty much hated them since he’s started following baseball then.

    Hank the Hater.

    Personally I like him as Mad Dogs replacement on WFAN nxt year.

  722. mel September 24th, 2008 at 10:30 pm

    JFC

  723. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:30 pm

    Trisha, Andy wasn’t hurt in Sunday’s game.

    He was hut mucch before that, sometime in July/August.

  724. NITRO September 24th, 2008 at 10:30 pm

    If Hughes becomes a #3, I’ll be thrilled.

    #3 starters are very valuable.

  725. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 10:30 pm

    haha Pat. Thanks,, as always, for the recap.

  726. Nick in SF September 24th, 2008 at 10:31 pm

    Rebecca: the experience was actually pretty mortifying. The editor changed the properly-spelled ‘Joao Gilberto’ to ‘Joan Gilberto’ and changed a sentence around so that it meant the exact opposite of what I had written. The end result was too embarrassing for me to show to anyone. And my review was highly unobjective, it was for an album by one of my favorite bands. I was totally in the tank for them.

  727. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 10:32 pm

    Francesa should have Hank be his sidekick on his WFAN show. Can you imagine that train wreck?
    :shock:

  728. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:32 pm

    Brandon–Y que? Tengo una cosa para los cubs. Son mi equipo del leagua nacional.

    (Y, en serio, como estoy vivir en NYC con los Mets es el mejor equipo de beisbol en NY?)

  729. pat September 24th, 2008 at 10:33 pm

    Moeller
    He was able to get ahead the whole night….Good fastball command and just being aggressive…..He looked great out there and he did a nice job for us…..His curve was a big pitch for us, got alot of Ks on it….2 runs 8 innings, we’ll take it everytime….This gives him alot to grow from and good for everyone here to see it

    Hughes
    I was throwing the ball well and a little pissed for throwing the one pitch and not get the win….I thought for the count it was executed but he got a good swing on it….The last few starts in the minors the curve has been good….mechanically I just threw strikes….I was pissed off once I threw it I knew he hit it out but being able to settle down and get thru 8 was big for me….The season for me was disappointing and one good outing doesn’t erase that but it’s good to end on a positive note.

  730. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:33 pm

    Nick: Ah. I shy away from reviews. Write fiction instead. Been working on a baseball novel, actually. Tons of fun.

  731. trisha- BRING PETTITTE BACK September 24th, 2008 at 10:33 pm

    Be patient with me. I’m a little slow.

  732. Trevor September 24th, 2008 at 10:33 pm

    “Damon LF
    Jeter SS
    Cano 3B
    Arod 3B
    Posada C
    Matsui DH
    Nady LF
    Casey Blake 1B
    Gardner LF”

    Where is the change at? This is pretty much the same team now. You 4 guys playing the same position.
    Sorry you’re not ready to be a Gm.

  733. Nick in SF September 24th, 2008 at 10:34 pm

    dennis: steely dan? Um, no. Yo La Tengo.

    Rebecca: one more thing, you haven’t been alive long enough to have done anything “for ages”, so keep at it.

  734. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 10:35 pm

    Brandon–Y que? Tengo una cosa para los cubs. Son mi equipo del leagua nacional.

    (Y, en serio, como estoy vivir en NYC con los Mets es el mejor equipo de beisbol en NY?)

    Fue de relajo :lol:

  735. Yankee Trader September 24th, 2008 at 10:35 pm

    Question-Which Yankee players are going to the AFL?
    Do the Yankees send coaches Eiland and Long?

  736. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:36 pm

    Nick, says you. Phil Hughes is younger than me.

    Okay, so it’s two months, but my point is still valid.

  737. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 10:36 pm

    I think Eiland is a given, also expect Aldred and Chaves

  738. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:38 pm

    Brandon: What the heck does relajo mean? You telling me my spanish is a complete mess? :-P

  739. mel September 24th, 2008 at 10:38 pm

    pat,

    Did Phil really use the “p” word? Jason Zillo’s going to have to coach Phil a little there. :)

    Although that’s a lot milder than what I read on the mound.

  740. Buddy Biancalana September 24th, 2008 at 10:38 pm

    Nick-

    Was it SF Weekly or the Guradian? I got a buddy who works for the Big Takeover, maybe I can get you another shot.

  741. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 10:39 pm

    Dan Murphy just won the game.

  742. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 10:39 pm

    lou is not playing to win bring in Triple a pitchers

  743. Nick in SF September 24th, 2008 at 10:40 pm

    Hmmm, well, if you’re older than Phil Hughes, you’re pretty old, given that he’s already been a phenom, a failure, a has-been, and a prospective comeback success story.

  744. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 10:41 pm

    Rebecca joking :)

  745. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 10:41 pm

    “Joba the phenom fireballer Ace
    Wang the #2 where he should be
    Hughes the #3 starter where his ceiling is

    sounds good. Though CC will be ahead of all of them”

    I’d say you’re right. Of course Phil looked good tonight hes a good pitcher. However if this rotation has CC, Joba and Wang in it obviously he could be no better than a 3-4. Who ever said that a number 3 starter couldn’t be good? Lester is Boston’s number 3 starter and I’d say hes pretty good.

  746. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:42 pm

    Nick: What the hell does that make me?! o-o

    Continuing in adult education?

  747. pat September 24th, 2008 at 10:42 pm

    mel

    I wouldn’t make that up. He used the “p” word not once but twice. :smile:

  748. CASHBUM September 24th, 2008 at 10:42 pm

    if im a philies fan or brewers fan im pissed

  749. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:42 pm

    Brandon: Ahh, muy bien :-D

    Y entonces no siento mal de mi español!

  750. Nick in SF September 24th, 2008 at 10:44 pm

    Buddy, it was the Sacramento News & Review.

  751. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 10:49 pm

    NYfaninlalaland – this is for you. You told me that it was an objective fact that Pettitte was not injury prone. This may or may not be true I guess depending upon your perspective. Earlier SW told me the only pitchers with more innings in than Pettite were Glavine, Maddux and Moose.

    Here are the comparisons. It certainly looks to me like Pettitte is much more injury prone than those three guys! I have no idea what other comparison pitchers you could or should use!

    glavine years in the majors – 21

    IP – 4413.1

    days out due to injuries – 148

    days out as a percentage of innings pitched – 3.3

    maddux – years in the majors – 22

    IP – 5002

    days out due to injuries – 35

    days out as a percentage of innings pitched – .7

    moose – years in the majors – 17

    IP – 3556.2

    days out due to injuries – 116

    days out as a percentage of innings pitched – 3.2

    pettitte – years in the majors – 13

    IP – 2731.2

    days out due to injuries – 289>

    days out as a percentage of innings pitched – 10.6

  752. YankeeJosh September 24th, 2008 at 10:50 pm

    Brandon (We’ll miss you Yankees Stadium !)…”Keep Manny away !”
    September 24th, 2008 at 10:39 pm
    Dan Murphy just won the game.

    Brandon, you were saying? ;-)

  753. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 10:50 pm

    Brandon (We’ll miss you Yankees Stadium !)…”Keep Manny away !”
    September 24th, 2008 at 10:39 pm
    Dan Murphy just won the game.

    ____________________________________________________

    A little premature speculation, there, Brandon.

  754. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:50 pm

    Holy.

    Moly.

    Watching the Mets is like watching the universe explode.

    How are these guys going to October and we’re not!?

  755. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 10:50 pm

    Epic choke job in the 9th by the Mets for anyone who missed it it was the most painful thing I’ve ever seen.

  756. Yankeefanfoev13 September 24th, 2008 at 10:51 pm

    hahaha mets don’t score with a leadoff triple
    remind me why they don’t boo wright, yet yankees fans boo a-rod?

    Doesn’t make sense

  757. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 10:52 pm

    The Mets. Whoa
    Hello extras

  758. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 10:52 pm

    how did that happen ?

  759. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 10:52 pm

    “Holy.

    Moly.

    Watching the Mets is like watching the universe explode.

    How are these guys going to October and we’re not!?”

    Easy Becca, its the NL!

  760. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 10:53 pm

    “How are these guys going to October and we’re not!?”

    They’re in the NL and we’re not?

    Rebecca, if they end up being successful it will just emphasize that point. How in hell do you make it to the postseason with no bullpen to speak of and no closer!

  761. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 10:53 pm

    Al from BK – :)

  762. OMG September 24th, 2008 at 10:54 pm

    trisha,

    Should we get rid of Mo? He sat out for elbow surgery, too.

    Should we get rid of Joba & Hughes? Their percentages must be astronomical.

  763. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:54 pm

    And my list of reasons to hate the NL goes ever longer.

  764. Joe from Long Island September 24th, 2008 at 10:56 pm

    Rebecca – In case you haven’t noticed – Baseball, like life, is not fair.

    But, it is a game of redemption – there’s always another inning/AB/game/season.

    Further philosophical discourse upon request.

  765. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 10:56 pm

    Poor Orioles, I almost wish that there could be a trade off of GMS for a portion of a season to help other teams. They really have been terible. I just heard the stat that they have not won a series since some earlier series with the Tigers and have been swept 11 straight times. You just don’t want to see that happen to any team but the Sux. They need to feel validated as a team too.

    :)

  766. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 10:56 pm

    I’m fairly confident that 25 of us posters with Pete as the skipper could win 70-80 games in the NL.

  767. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 10:57 pm

    Joe: I just had three hours of philosophical discussion on the distinction between the terms prudhomme and chivalry.

    I think I’ll pass :-D

  768. Nick in SF September 24th, 2008 at 10:58 pm

    I didn’t write this, but I think it’s funny. Are the Mets too big to fail? Time for federal intervention?

    “The New York Mets are suffering a stunning late season collapse once again. Leading by three games just a week ago, they are now a game-and-a half behind the first place Phillies and without a drastic change, the Mets could be shut out of the playoffs altogether.

    This historic collapse is seen by some as warranting a government bailout of the Mets…before things get worse.

    The collapse brings to mind the epic catastrophe last year where the Mets were seven games up with just two weeks left in the season and then went on to lose game after game and finally falling out of the playoffs with a loss on the last game of the year.

    But now the Mets are petitioning the federal government for funds to hire relief pitchers. “If we collapse and don’t make the playoffs again, thousands of hearts will be broken. Think of the children” said one Mets front office executive. “Think of the seniors who’ve been waiting over twenty years for us to win the World Series.”

    Other sources say the team not making the playoffs would effect local vendors as well. “When there’s no game I don’t make any money,” said a man who identified himself as Tony and runs a parking lot near the stadium. Local sandwich makers said that perhaps a ton of pastrami would rot in area delicatessens without playoff games to boost sales.”

  769. Phil's Dad September 24th, 2008 at 10:58 pm

    “The season for me was disappointing and one good outing doesn’t erase that but it’s good to end on a positive note.”

    At least he has the right attitude about things. I really haven’t been too dazzled by Hughes in many of his major league starts (tonight and @Texas being exceptions), but if he can improve his change I can see him growing into a pretty solid pitcher. His stuff really isn’t dazzling enough to say he’s an ace, that will all depend on how his command progresses.

  770. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 10:58 pm

    The-Riot stole base.

  771. Joe from Long Island September 24th, 2008 at 10:59 pm

    Rebecca – Boy, you lead a wild life.

  772. dennis September 24th, 2008 at 11:00 pm

    rebecca, is this the first time the yanks have missed the playoffs since you have been following them?

  773. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 11:00 pm

    Cubs with the lead.

  774. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 24th, 2008 at 11:00 pm

    about time, the Cubs score a run!!

  775. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 11:00 pm

    “trisha,

    Should we get rid of Mo? He sat out for elbow surgery, too.

    Should we get rid of Joba & Hughes? Their percentages must be astronomical.”

    Actually what we should do is stop changing the rules to make a point. I responded to someone mentioning Andy being not injury-prone compared to pitchers who have innings comparable to or more than his. I have shown that
    Andy’s days out have been a lot more than those players with more years in. I don’t think it’s my responsibility to respond to every “creative” permutation.

    To get rid of pitchers who are just starting their careers is not any kind of apt comparison to a pitcher who should be ending his and his been injury-prone and ineffective. If you want answers on Joba and Hughes, ask me when they’ve pitched in the majors more than 13 years.

  776. Al from BK( Yankees in 09, supporter of who ever beats the Sux.) September 24th, 2008 at 11:00 pm

    Cubs take the lead! whoa brutal for the Mets.

  777. sw September 24th, 2008 at 11:01 pm

    7-6 Cubs.

  778. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 11:03 pm

    Rebecca–Optimist Prime–Can I get a Moose Bar?
    September 24th, 2008 at 10:57 pm
    Joe: I just had three hours of philosophical discussion on the distinction between the terms prudhomme and chivalry.

    I think I’ll pass

    _________________________________________________

    Wasn’t Don Prudhomme a top dragster? I don’t mean that he dressed in drag and raced people.n

  779. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 11:04 pm

    ….

    Wow.

    I mean, just, wow.

  780. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and hopefully the offense won't be so offensive. September 24th, 2008 at 11:04 pm

    2 run HR
    Cubbies now lead 9-6
    :shock:

  781. Brandon (We'll miss you Yankees Stadium !)..."Keep Manny away !" September 24th, 2008 at 11:04 pm

    Manny’s primo just ended the game. The Mets BVP :(

  782. Josiah from NC September 24th, 2008 at 11:04 pm

    Trisha,

    Why do you not support Andy coming back as a #4 or #5 starter, yet you were so committed to having a below average starter at best instead, ie. Ponson, Rasner, or Pavano.

    I just don’t understand.

    And wow, the Mets are garbage. haha

  783. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 11:05 pm

    “Trisha, Andy wasn’t hurt in Sunday’s game.

    He was hut mucch before that, sometime in July/August.”

    Then you missed Pat M’s point which says that you play in pain but you don’t play hurt. He hurt the team and potentially himself by playing hurt.

  784. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 11:05 pm

    Does anyone feel bad for the Mets?

  785. Timmy Lupus September 24th, 2008 at 11:05 pm

    Maybe we can trade some bullpen arms to the Mets for Johan? ;)

  786. pat September 24th, 2008 at 11:05 pm

    Red Sox tragic number is at one. A Rays win/ Sox loss tomorrow makes the weekend meaningless to them. Just gotta hope the forecast of rain in Boston all weekend doesn’t affect Moose’s start for Sunday.

  787. dennis September 24th, 2008 at 11:08 pm

    god i love the mets… you can count on them.

  788. Bronx Jeers September 24th, 2008 at 11:08 pm

    Wow. As it stands right now, The Mets and Brewers would face each other in a 1 game playoff for the wild card. CC vs Perez?

  789. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 11:08 pm

    Then you missed Pat M’s point which says that you play in pain but you don’t play hurt. He hurt the team and potentially himself by playing hurt.

    Are you going to apply the same playing in pain but not playing hurt standard to Derek Jeter, who played most of the year hurt, and according to various perspective expressed on this blog, hurt the team immensely by doing so?

  790. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 11:08 pm

    “Why do you not support Andy coming back as a #4 or #5 starter, yet you were so committed to having a below average starter at best instead, ie. Ponson, Rasner, or Pavano.

    I just don’t understand.”

    Josiah, listen very carefully and you’ll understand.

    I supported staying with the starters we had this season at the point I supported staying with them because we didn’t have any better options below at that point and while they weren’t knocking out the opposition, they were still having periods of effectiveness. You may have noticed that I did not support getting rid of Pettitte this season, no matter how badly he was pitching.

    I am not supporting bringing back Rasner for next season, nor Ponson. I am supporting getting top-notch pitching 1-5. Andy Pettitte does not fit into that paradigm as far as I am concerned.

  791. YankeeJosh September 24th, 2008 at 11:09 pm

    trisha – BRING BOBBY BACK!
    September 24th, 2008 at 11:05 pm
    Does anyone feel bad for the Mets?

    Not me. The Mets are on an equally hated level as the Red Sox for me.

  792. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 24th, 2008 at 11:09 pm

    Joe: Being a medieval history student fun. I actually have a sword collection–two broadswords, a light sword, a civil war sword and a wooden practice sword–and I have a ren gown, too.

    Dennis: Yes.

    I’ve been following the Yankees since 1996–I’m too young to remember any year before that even if I wanted to.

    So Yankee-less baseball in October is uncharted territory, but of the other teams I follow (Nets, Jets, Devils and Syracuse), I’m quite used to failure

  793. For $13 I'll be a Macadamia Nut September 24th, 2008 at 11:10 pm

    If the Mets lose tonight they will be tied for the WC with the Brewers. They are still behind Philly.

    That means they just might not make it to the post season.

  794. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 11:10 pm

    “Are you going to apply the same playing in pain but not playing hurt standard to Derek Jeter, who played most of the year hurt, and according to various perspective expressed on this blog, hurt the team immensely by doing so?”

    Is this a set up where I am going to get killed for the answer if you don’t agree with it, or do you want a sincere response because you are genuinely curious about the response.

  795. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 11:12 pm

    Yankeejosh do you hate them enough that it would bug you if Mets posters were here making nice conversation with Yankee posters and trading off congratulations?

  796. YankeeJosh September 24th, 2008 at 11:13 pm

    Trisha, think of it as cost-benefit for Pettitte. Is it worth pitching in pain to try and help your team get into the post-season? I think that’s a safe yes. Is it worth pitching in pain when your team has been eliminated and you could further injure yourself for next year (assuming you’re coming back). I think it’s a safe no. The risk of pitching through the pain/injury whatever and injuring yourself worse is simply not worth it.

  797. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 11:14 pm

    Angel I personally don’t care whether you were trying to set me up or just wanted an answer.

    I absoutely apply the same standard and think Jeter should have shut it down if he was hurt.

  798. Abraham September 24th, 2008 at 11:16 pm

    Why does everyone forget Hughes’ game against the Indians in his second start back from the dl last year? Him and Joba combined for a shutout.

  799. GreenBeret7 September 24th, 2008 at 11:17 pm

    trisha – BRING BOBBY BACK!
    September 24th, 2008 at 11:05 pm
    “Trisha, Andy wasn’t hurt in Sunday’s game.

    He was hut mucch before that, sometime in July/August.”

    Then you missed Pat M’s point which says that you play in pain but you don’t play hurt. He hurt the team and potentially himself by playing hurt.

    ____________________________________________________

    Some players will play hurt when they’re at the end of their careers because they feel like they owe something to the team, especially if they know that at an advanced age (for ball players) that surgery will probably end their career. Nolan Ryan pitched his last year, knowing that he needed Tommy John surgery, but, also knew that at age 46 he’d never pitch again. Pettitte felt he owed the team everything he had, since there were no better choices available in the system. I’m sure that if he feels that he can’t be affective any more, he won’t sign another contract. That was one reason that NYY signed him to the option year in 2006. They trusted him to be honest, and, in athletes, where mney is concerned, that’s usually rare. Look at what Schilling did in Boston. He knew that he needed surgery and Boston took him at his word and screwed them out of a contract.

  800. YankeeJosh September 24th, 2008 at 11:17 pm

    Trisha, I have no problem with anyone posting anything here as long as they are cordial and not trolls. The only time I will root for the Mets is when they play the Red Sox (or maybe even the Rays) next year in interleague play where Mets wins benefit the Yanks.

  801. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 11:23 pm

    “They trusted him to be honest, and, in athletes, where mney is concerned, that’s usually rare. Look at what Schilling did in Boston. He knew that he needed surgery and Boston took him at his word and screwed them out of a contract.”

    :D

    I remember saying the Sux organization had every right to take umbrage at Curt the mouth holding the team hostage with his last-minute decision to come back after announcing retirement and expecting the Sux organization to roll over and bark, and taking a ration of crap from Sux fans who basically told me to mind my own business and that the mouth had earned the right to do that.

    Well I laughed my butt off when Curt was shut down before he even got started!

    Boy you are right about not being able to trust players to be honest when it comes to $$$$$!

  802. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 24th, 2008 at 11:23 pm

    I did actually want an answer.

    Setting you up? For what? I disagree with you, that’s all. But if you’re going to put something out there as an opinion, people are entitled to ask you questions to clarify if they understand your position completely. Which I think I do now.

    But I’ve learned the hard way that engaging you in anything beyond something we agree on will only ever get me accused of impersonating people – something I’ve never done once on this blog.

    I’m not in a hurry to experience that again. Trust me.

  803. dennis September 24th, 2008 at 11:26 pm

    http://www.nydailynews.com/spo.....layof.html comments anyone?

  804. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 11:28 pm

    I don’t think I’ve ever accused you of impersonating anyone nor do I think you would do that since there are certainly no strings on your tongue so I don’t feel you would need to pretend you were someone else to speak your mind.

    If I ever did accuse you of impersonating someone, I certainly do not remember doing so. And I apologize if I jumped to thinking you were setting me up. I guess I was just tired for tonight of having people come at me from all directions.

    I sincerely do think players who are hurt should shut themselves down. Selfishly I want them to do it for the good of the team. I’m not quite as worried about what they are doing to themselves.

  805. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 11:34 pm

    dennis, I hate to say it but I was reading the article and was immediately riveted by the following:

    Big Apple astrologers: New Yankee Stadium aligned for greatness

    YAHOO!!!

    Now I’ll go back and read the rest.

    :)

  806. trisha - BRING BOBBY BACK! September 24th, 2008 at 11:40 pm

    dennis it’s tough to know what to say about it. I understand his points though about Joe looking like a hero out there when the Yankees have more wins and won’t be in the postseason.

    I also absolutely agree with his point about the team that wins the world series oftentimes being nothing more than the team of the group that got hot at the right time.
    But I guess I have to stop at his saying that no team in the NL west should be in the playoffs because teams in the NL west is a weak division.


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