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Put him in coach, he’s ready to play

Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Sep 25, 2008 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Have the Yankees given up on Melky Cabrera?

He was recalled from the minors on Sept. 5 and has had a grand total of three at-bats since. He’s been used as pinch runner or defensive replacement a few times but that has been it. He has been a ghost.

Center field is an interesting position to evaluate as the Yankees move into the offseason. The organization’s best position prospect, Austin Jackson, is a center fielder but has yet to play AAA ball. He has a chance to be a difference maker but probably not until 2010. It would be surprising to see him on the roster in April.

So …

* Do you plug Johnny Damon out there for one more season?

* Give Brett Gardner a chance?

* Obtain a CF via free agency or trade?

* Try Melky again?

* None of the above?

I get the sense they’re going to give Gardner every chance. The coaches work a lot with him and Joe Girardi clearly loves the speed he brings to the game, both in the field and on the bases. Gardner has been thrown out trying to stretch in each of the last two days. He’s learning that his speed won’t force players into mistakes at this level like it did in the minors.

“I need to pick my spots,” he said. “Stay on first and steal second. That’s better.”

Ideally, the Yankees want Gardner and Jackson to have roles moving forward. That would give the roster a much-needed infusion of athleticism. That is something that has been lacking for a few years now. You watch the Rays, Angels or some other teams and the Yankees look like they’re standing still by comparison.

As you consider possibilities for the 2009 roster, don’t focus entirely on what a player can do at the plate. How many runs a player can prevent in the field is a factor. Gardner is going to roam deep into the gaps and take away bloop singles in front of him. Jackson was voted the best defensive outfielder in the Eastern League.

One of the reasons Tampa is going to win the division is that they made moves to improve their defense, trading for Jason Bartlett and moving Akinori Iwamura to second base. The Yankees have to think that way, too.

 
 

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394 Responses to “Put him in coach, he’s ready to play”

  1. Deep to Left September 25th, 2008 at 11:25 am

    I like Gardner a lot and hope he’s given a fair shot. Speed kills, and he has plenty. He seems to be adjusting at the plate as well.

    Trade Melky for a bag of balls. I know you’re not supposed to “trade low”, but I don’t see a “trade high” opportunity on the horizon. That horse has left the barn. I always thought he was the most overrated Yankee. With the numbers he’s put up over the past two years, he has no business being the starting center fielder for the Yankees.

  2. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 11:25 am

    I can see the Yankees using a combination of Damon and Gardner in center field for the start of next year.

    Where you run into a problem is if something happens to hamper Austin Jackson’s development.

    Altough it’s likely he’s our CF for the forseeable future, we don’t know if he’ll lose next season to some unforseen injury or if he’s struggle at the AAA level.

    It’s a risk to consistently put Damon in center or Gardner at bat, and if something happens to AJ, they’re a little stuck, but I think for one more yeear it’s the best option.

  3. Braintrust September 25th, 2008 at 11:29 am

    I like Gardner in CF, with Damon spotting him from time to time. Melky is done with the Yanks. He had three seasons to prove himself, and backslid. He’s young, but the team has better options than him. In 2010 Damon is gone, Gardner can move to LF, and Jackson can take over CF. I can see Nady being with the team for awhile in RF.

  4. Knicks September 25th, 2008 at 11:33 am

    Omar is actually a top tier GM. Since he took control, he has turned the franchise from a dormant afterthought into a powerhouse. He’s signed guys like

    - Beltran
    - Wagner (excellent when healthy)
    - Pedro (did well for 3 years, was more of a symbolic move)

    And has been even better at trades -

    - Church/Schiender
    - Santana
    - Castillo
    - Delgado
    - Perez

    And he has developed some great young talent -

    - Wright
    - Reyes
    - Pelfrey
    - Nick Evans
    - Daniel Murphy
    - Heilman

    etc.

  5. vin September 25th, 2008 at 11:34 am

    “Stay on first and steal second. That’s better.”

    Man, I love that attitude.

    Something tells me we haven’t heard the last of Melky. My guess is he starts the year in AAA and tears it up – forcing the Yanks to bring him up – what he does from there is anyone’s guess.

  6. mel September 25th, 2008 at 11:35 am

    A healthy Hideki would make this a no-brainer.

    Damon LF
    Gardner CF
    Nady RF
    Hideki part time LF/DH

    If Gardner can’t do anything at the plate, then Damon would play CF until Jackson’s ready and Hideki would play LF. If he’s healthy.

    I liked what Melky brought the last two years, but I’d like to give Gardner a chance.

    Melky got the job by default, Gardner may get the job by default. If Jackson comes up and Gardner hits, they take 2 of the 3 positions. If Gardner can’t hit, he becomes a pinch hitter/4th OF.

    There’s a story here somewhere. I think it had to do with attitude or sense of entitlement. Melky’s not in the dog house, he’s in the dawg pound. If they’re not going to use him, he’s a throw in any trade we do. Kid deserves to play and would be a starter on many NL teams.

    Youth, speed, athleticism, and good defense. It’s been a while, huh? (No offense to Alex, but he’s an old-timer).

  7. trisha - but what do I know September 25th, 2008 at 11:36 am

    I’m down with whatever they do kids. I like watching the organization figure it out and sitting and hoping there’s a good outcome.

  8. Wilson September 25th, 2008 at 11:37 am

    Keep Gardner and trade Damon or Nady.

    Younger, better defense, faster.

    Watch the players play instead of looking at the stats. When you throw Damon-Jeter-Arod-Posada-Matsui-Cano-Nady etc. into a blender, of course the offense will look pretty good and the individuals will put up good numbers. But that is a mirage. We must get yoiunger.

  9. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 11:38 am

    Nobody’s bothered by the fact that Gardner can’t hit at this level???

  10. Bronx Jeers September 25th, 2008 at 11:38 am

    i was lucky enough to be at the game for Garder’s catch last Friday. Was there a better defensice play in the outfield this year? He also showed some arm that game.

    This is when I really miss Donnie on the team. Is there another player alive who could teach Brett to be a lefty hitter in Yankee Stadium?

  11. rodg12 September 25th, 2008 at 11:40 am

    Move Jeter to CF? Sign a SS that can pick it and hit 9th? Jeter moves to LF in 2010 when Damon is gone and AJax is ready? Just throwing it out there.

  12. Wave Your Hat September 25th, 2008 at 11:40 am

    If Gardner doesn’t improve, I don’t see how he can hold down even a part-time job.

  13. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 11:42 am

    Knicks: The cost of the Santana trade to the Mets may be prohibitive in the future. They’ve got Santana for seven years–an eternity for a pitcher–and they depleted their farm system of their best prospects to do it.

    Granted the prospects aren’t ones that many think are going to be future all stars, but it’s left the Mets farm system in a bit of lurch.

  14. vin September 25th, 2008 at 11:43 am

    Fredo,

    I think we’re all bothered by it… but if Melky hits .030 points higher and hits 10 more homers than Gardner, is that more valuable than Brett’s speed? I think the speed brings a sorely needed dimension to the lineup – even if the stats aren’t there.

  15. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 11:43 am

    “Nobody’s bothered by the fact that Gardner can’t hit at this level???”

    Hasn’t isn’t the same as can’t.

    He has had adjustment issues at each level (more than most apparently, I haven’t studied it) – but once he gets it he is effective.

    Plus – he’s cheap :)

  16. RalphieD September 25th, 2008 at 11:43 am

    “Nobody’s bothered by the fact that Gardner can’t hit at this level???”

    I’m bothered by the fact that you don’t watch the games because if you did you would realize he is adapting to ml pitching…his avg is rising slowly and he’s having better abs

  17. Jeremy September 25th, 2008 at 11:43 am

    Improving defense would be great, but I don’t think our shortstop is going to change positions any time soon ;-)

    The team will give every Gardner every chance to succeed in CF, as it did with Melky. If Gardner can get on base at all, he will be an adequate player. If not, the Yankees will have to go with Damon, assuming he isn’t needed in left.

    Melky is relegated to backup status.

    It’s very unlikely the Yankees make a move because CFs are so expensive and we could see Jackson as early as 2010.

  18. Patrick September 25th, 2008 at 11:44 am

    According to several metrics the Yankees were the worst defensive team in the American League this year. That has to improve if the Yankees want to contend next year.

  19. dave September 25th, 2008 at 11:44 am

    “I can see the Yankees using a combination of Damon”

    Yes, great idea. In fact give damon the job outright. The three stooges all wrapped into one.

    Great idea!

  20. jimmy1138 September 25th, 2008 at 11:44 am

    CF free agent class (as of mlbtraderumors)
    Rocco Baldelli (27)
    Willie Bloomquist (31)
    Mike Cameron (36) – $10MM club option for ’09 with a $750K buyout
    Jim Edmonds (39)
    Jerry Hairston Jr. (33)
    Gabe Kapler (33)
    Mark Kotsay (33)
    Corey Patterson (29)
    Scott Podsednik (33)

    Wow now that’s really poor if Kotsay is the best one in there.
    Trades? The Dodgers might want to get rid of Andruw Jones but even Melky is way better. To make some other trade happen the Yankees would have to give up at least Ian Kennedy.

  21. mel September 25th, 2008 at 11:44 am

    Fredo,

    Normally, yes, that would be a death knell. But Gardner has proved level after level that it takes him some time to adjust.

    He’d still have a role as pinch runner and defensive player.

    Runs that are saved end up on our side of the balance sheet. You know, if we were keeping two sets of books. :)

  22. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 11:44 am

    Fredo: I am a little bit worried, but he seems to be making adjustments.

    I’m willing to give him a shot.

  23. Bronx Jeers September 25th, 2008 at 11:45 am

    Fredo,

    I’m revising your post for the sake of positive thoughts.

    “Nobody’s bothered by the fact that Gardner….” hasn’t hit consistently at this level.

    He’s shown improvement though!

  24. jedi September 25th, 2008 at 11:45 am

    Just for the record. Nady is a VERY underrated player. Let’s not make the same mistake the Mets did and trade him for nothing.

  25. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 11:46 am

    Fredo -

    Apparently not. :lol:

  26. Miggs (All in for Moose's quest for 20) September 25th, 2008 at 11:46 am

    Gardner/Damon in center seems to make the most sense for 2009. If something happens to AJ in AAA (injury or bad play) the team can simply trade for a CF next offseason or sign a FA. But signing one this offseason with AJ so close and Damon still under contract makes no sense.

    Unless you trade Damon.

  27. Jeremy September 25th, 2008 at 11:47 am

    The upside to jimmy’s list of crappy CF FAs is that maybe someone will accept a one-year deal.

    If the Yankees took on Andruw Jones, randy l’s Cape Cod Sox fan neighbors would throw a huge clambake in celebration.

  28. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 11:48 am

    jedi: the Yanks have Nady cost controlled for one more year. If they were to trade him it likely wouldn’t be till 2010, and I just don’t see them doing that.

  29. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 11:48 am

    TK:

    He strikes out too much at every level. He has zero pop. No evidence of even gap power.

    On his greatest day, he’s Dave Roberts-lite IMO.

  30. Miggs (All in for Moose's quest for 20) September 25th, 2008 at 11:48 am

    Unfortunately Melky’s value was at its peak last offseason. I doubt you could get much for him now.

  31. V September 25th, 2008 at 11:49 am

    Melky is a future all star. We can’t give up on him.

  32. mel September 25th, 2008 at 11:49 am

    vin’s got a point, BG is very disruptive on the basepath.

    And Omar can’t build a bullpen to save his life. He should dip into the farm system. What is that? The farm is barren? Oh, my. Add that to the list of Omar’s achievements.

  33. Yankee Fan in Boston September 25th, 2008 at 11:49 am

    I do agree that the Yankees need more athleticism, but not to prevent runs in the field. A players value at preventing runs in the field, even the best defensive player in the game, is still far, far shorter than the runs a player can make at the plate. The biggest mistake is to overvalue defense. It’s certainly valuable, but in-his-prime Derek Jeter is still worth a lot more to a team than ihp Ozzie Smith.

    The team needs athleticism for things like going from first to third, actually scoring from second, etc. Giambi and Posada and now Molina totally anchored this team on the basepaths, and I’d like to see some of that change.

    As for CF, who knows! It’s just too bad Melky isn’t worth nearly as much as he used to be.

    The real question is will they be able to get actual production from 1B for the first time in years…

  34. sammy September 25th, 2008 at 11:49 am

    I agree with pete, it’s time to move jeter to second and get rid of Cano once and for all

  35. Miggs (All in for Moose's quest for 20) September 25th, 2008 at 11:49 am

    Rebecca yiu can’t trade Nady in 2010 unless you resign him.

    He’s a FA after 2009.

  36. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 11:50 am

    Fredo: And Dave Roberts won the Sox a World Series.

    I’ll take that on my team, thank you very much.

  37. Jeremy September 25th, 2008 at 11:50 am

    Melky’s trade value, to my knowledge, was never terribly high. Remember the debate over whether Melky should be traded straight up for Mike Gonzalez? That was what Melky could have gotten us at his peak: a good (until he got injured) lefty reliever. Now he could get us nothing unless thrown into a deal as filler.

  38. Bam Bam Balboni September 25th, 2008 at 11:50 am

    Reaaaaalll small sample, but the last 6 games he’s at:
    .313 .353 .500

    Could be getting used to ML pitching.

  39. mel September 25th, 2008 at 11:50 am

    *defensive replacement

  40. Patrick September 25th, 2008 at 11:51 am

    “And he has developed some great young talent -

    - Wright drafted in 2001, in the majors in 2004
    - Reyes signed in 1999, in the majors in 2003
    - Pelfrey drafted 2005
    - Nick Evans drafted in 2004
    - Daniel Murphy drafted 2006
    - Heilman drafted 2001, debut 2003

    So of those players Omar “developed” only two, Pelfrey and Murphy. Omar is okay at signing and trading for talent but he’s awful at drafting. In fact the Mets minor league system is among the worst in the majors because he refuses to sign over slot or spend much money in the international market.

  41. Bam Bam Balboni September 25th, 2008 at 11:51 am

    Gardner that is

  42. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 11:51 am

    “He strikes out too much at every level. He has zero pop. No evidence of even gap power. ”

    Good points Fredo – but I see him as the lead-off man after Damon if he progresses (although w/o Damon’s unusual power for a lead off guy)

    In the endless search for gamers and dirty uniform guys – I want to see some more of Gardner. Maybe you’re right that he is limited, but I’d like to see more of him and see if he can at least be an effective caddy/fourth OF

  43. EDUB September 25th, 2008 at 11:51 am

    Funny mets articles from the onion from other thread:

    http://www.theonion.com/conten.....ers_in_one

    http://www.theonion.com/conten....._rss_daily

  44. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 11:51 am

    Miggs: Right. Sorry, my bad!

  45. StandingO'Neill September 25th, 2008 at 11:52 am

    That post by Knicks came out of the blue and provided a nice laugh.

    First ask Met fans if Wagner’s career in NY was excellent, I’m sure they’ll use another word which isn’t so uplifting. Pedro was good for 1 year, maybe a year and a half if you stretch it. Definitely not 3. Although it was an important signing for them because at the time they were a doormat team, and that signing showed all potential free agents that Omar was willing to pay.

    Delgado trade was a salary dump, Perez was a lucky throw in as was Maine, but I’ll give him credit for that. Castillo was a decent trade, but that 4 year contract is a nightmare. Let’s wait before we declare the Schneider/Church trade for Milledge a success. Especially now that the Mets could use a right handed bat in the outfield.

    And as for the talent he’s developed, well number 1 a GM doesn’t develop talent, thats the job of a coaching staff. Wright and Reyes were already blooming before Omar arrived, Heilman has fallen apart and while I do like Murphy I don’t see much coming from Evans. Pelfry how has been great this year, but again how does Omar get credit for that?

    Omar has done a good job with the Mets, no question about it. But he also has his black marks as well. And at 87-71, I wouldn’t exactly call them a powerhouse.

  46. Patrick September 25th, 2008 at 11:52 am

    Oh and as a final note on my last post, Omar began as the Mets GM after the 2004 season.

  47. Wave Your Hat September 25th, 2008 at 11:54 am

    The Yanks need to look outside the organization for a CF’er for 2009. Neither Cabrera nor Gardner is the answer.

    We don’t need a great center fielder, and we don’t need more than one year. Jackson will come up in 2010 (probably).

    Nady will disappoint as a full time player. He’s great for a more limited role, just the kind of bench player the Yanks need and have not had for years.

  48. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 11:55 am

    Wave Your Hat: 20+ home runs and .300+ average does not a bench player make.

  49. rodg12 September 25th, 2008 at 11:55 am

    ‘The real question is will they be able to get actual production from 1B for the first time in years…’

    Asinine statement. Giambi is 10th in the AL in Adjusted OPS+, 4th among 1B. I’ll call that pretty dang good production from 1B.

  50. Jeremy September 25th, 2008 at 11:55 am

    We shouldn’t ask whether Gardner is the CF of the future. That could be Jackson. He only needs to be a passable CF for one year. Then we can put him on the bench or trade him.

    If he really is a consistently great defender, and can get on base with singles and walks, he will be fine for a season in center. It’s not like we’re sticking him at first base.

  51. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 11:56 am

    “he has turned the franchise from a dormant afterthought into a powerhouse”

    Powerhouse, noun. – A team that gets to the NLCS once, totally misses the playoffs, and subsequently has the most epic choke-job collapse two years running.

  52. StandingO'Neill September 25th, 2008 at 11:57 am

    Nady is limited, but its tough to call him a bench player. He has good power which help him to succeed by hitting homeruns and getting RBI’s which everyone seems to love, but his low OBP will hurt him. If he can improve that or at least keep it at a respectable level .340, then I can see him playing everyday for sure.

  53. Miggs (All in for Moose's quest for 20) September 25th, 2008 at 11:57 am

    I’m a little confused why some people think Nady is only a role player. Nady starts on basically any major league team. Role player? Really?

  54. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 11:58 am

    “Fredo: And Dave Roberts won the Sox a World Series.”

    Actually, he HELPED win an ALCS….as a pinch runner/defensive replacement…Brett’s most likely role.

    He’s never played in a World Series game.

  55. Wave Your Hat September 25th, 2008 at 12:04 pm

    Let me clarify on Nady. I really like Nady.

    By role player, I mean I think that’s his greatest use for a team of World Series quality. Although this year he was quite good against righties as well as lefties, career-wise that hasn’t been the case. I think it would be better to let Girardi pick Nady’s spots.

    I think Nady will play a lot no matter what. Damon and Matsui can’t play every day. They will both need substantial time off.

  56. SoCalYankeeFan September 25th, 2008 at 12:05 pm

    Realistically, I see Gardener in CF in 2009, Damon in LF for his final year as a Yankee and Nady in RF, his natural position and A-Jax into the OF mix in 2010. Another interesting option might be to sign Rocco Baldelli for CF to a 1 year plus option incentive laden contract assuming he is healthy.

    NY lets the following walk: Abreu (2 picks), Petitte, Pavano, Ponson and I-Rod. I would re-sign Giambi only as a DH for about $5 mil plus his $5 mil buyout. Big G had a good year offensively but was brutal at 1B and the Yankees cannot afford his defense. That means trading Matsui for salary relief or having him on the bench. Instead of signing Tex at 1B, have Cano spend the winter learning 1B, his range is too limited at 2B going to his left. Assuming Cano has a better 2009 offensively, it will also increase his value in case NY wants to trade him down the road. Sign FA Orlando Hudson for 2B. Backup plan: Miranda at 1B, Bernie Castro at 2B.

    The Yankees have to go after CC Sabathia, large contract notwithstanding. Reward Mussina with 1 year plus option offer (assuming he wants to come back).That would give them a starting rotation of Sabathia, Wang, Chamberlain (if he starts), Mussina, Aceves with Hughes ready to come up. Secondary FA pitching target Oliver Perez.

    The BP should be set with Rivera, Marte, Coke, Sanchez, Melancon, Bruney and Giese (and Joba if he goes back to the pen).

    SoCalYankeeFan 8)

  57. SMS47 September 25th, 2008 at 12:05 pm

    I’m on the bandwagon of platooning Gardner and Damon in CF for ’09. AJax has done nothing but prosper with a move to each new level, so I can’t wait to see his ’09 in SWB. Keep Nady in LF and resign Abreau for 2yrs in RF.

    I’d love to see a Matt Holliday pickup, but that makes ’09 pretty messy. Especially w Matsui still on the books.

    Melky is almost irrelevant until 2010, but he’d still need a huge year to challenge Gardner for a 4th OF spot. 2010 OF of Holliday in LF, AJax in CF and Nady in RF would be huge.

  58. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 12:06 pm

    From the NYTimes:

    “Hank Steinbrenner was active last winter in retaining Alex Rodriguez, Jorge Posada and Mariano Rivera with expensive long-term deals. But he attended no more than three games at Yankee Stadium all season.”

    Does anybody else find this ridiculous? If Hank isn’t going to bother showing up for games, when will the main stream sports media start tuning the clown out?

  59. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 12:06 pm

    Wouldn’t guess Nady will ever see .300 again. Truth about him is probably a lot closer to the .265 he’s posted for the Yankees than the .330 he posted for the Pirates. Still, given a full season, he’d probably be a .275, 20-25 homer, 80-85 RBI guy, who will play a decent outfield.

  60. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 12:06 pm

    Fredo: Close enough! Ask any Boston fan what they remember about 2004 and it’s ‘we beat the Yankees’ ;-)

    TKinDC: LMAO! So would the Dallas Cowboys fit that definition of a Powerhouse?

  61. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 12:08 pm

    TK: We don’t know why Hank didn’t come to New York. It’s suspicious, sure, but unless I know *why* he didn’t come to New York that often, I’m not going to get upset by it.

  62. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 12:10 pm

    Pete-

    The Yankees could essentially have the same team next year that failed them this season, and not get much younger in the process. Look at this scenario:

    RF: Abreu offered arbitration, and ends up signing a two year contract with a club option for a third year.

    LF: Nady in last year of contract

    CF: Gardner-Yankees so enamored with his speed and defense, but he hasn’t proven yet he can hit. Damon-no arm, and won’t be traded unless another lead-off hitter obtained[not sure if Gardner can consistently hit to lead off]

    3B: A-Rod- carries too much baggage that’s affecting his offensive skills in pressure situations. Interesting article in Fox Sports, why A-Rod will not last all nine years with Yankees.

    SS: Jeter there until he says he’s willing to move to another position.

    2B: Cano probably won’t and shouldn’t be traded, to sign recently hurt Orlando Hudson.

    1B: Is it Posada part of the time? Damon? Will the Yankees take back Giambi for one more year? My bet is Teixeira is not even offered a contract by the Yankees.

    DH: Matsui-has to prove he can still hit after surgery if trade bait. Damon? Abreu?

    C: Molina back, will Posada be ready?

    Therefore for positional spots the team is slightly younger Gardner over Melky, with the same defensive shortcomings and potential for extended absence due to injury.

    Therefore IMHO, once Cashman decides if he’s coming back next week, the first order of business should not jump at resigning Pettitte, like he wishes, before he goes home to Houston. He’s either retiring or playing for the Yankees only. Tell him to go home, stay in shape and maybe he’ll get a June/July prorated contract based on games pitched, if he wants to pitch in new Yankee Stadium. The team needs to first shore up their starting pitching, getting younger, thru FA and currently there are better options to explore than bringing back a sore armed Pettitte.

    Thoughts?

  63. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 12:10 pm

    “Fredo: Close enough! Ask any Boston fan what they remember about 2004 and it’s ‘we beat the Yankees’”

    Always wondered about that. We need Ray to comment. Was the ’04 World Series anti-climatic to Boston fans, having already stunned the Yankees? Still think there had to be some juice to winning a title for the 1st time in awhile.

  64. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 12:12 pm

    Fredo: From the friends I’ve talked to–and I have a bunch in Boston–the parties and the riots were way more wild after ALCS Game 7.

    My one friend and I agree–when the Yankees failed to clinch in Boston, they had no shot, because Boston had ALL of the momentum.

    What I’d do to get back that one stolen base!

  65. Mr. Ed September 25th, 2008 at 12:13 pm

    I’d give a gardner a shot next year. That game where he made the great catch and also stole bases and scored shows his potential. Even if he’s a singles hitter, he can do more with that then melky. But you only find out if he can hit enough by giving him a shot.

  66. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 12:13 pm

    Rebecca –

    The Cowboys are a perfect fit too!

    - – On Hank, he is apparently a managing partner of a billion dollar enterprise. If nothing else an owner has a responsibility to review the fan experience by being on-site.

    There is no excuse I can imagine – if he can’t devote the effort, then he hasn’t earned the right to have his opinion given any weight.

  67. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 12:14 pm

    “RF: Abreu offered arbitration, and ends up signing a two year contract with a club option for a third year.”

    Doubt the club option will fly. Some fairly easily achieved incentives (say, # of plate appearances) that would trigger the 3rd year would likely be necessary.

  68. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 12:16 pm

    Arbitration is by definition a one-year deal, no?

  69. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 12:16 pm

    “What I’d do to get back that one stolen base!”

    Hate to say it, but walking Millar to lead off the 9th was the most egregious thing that went down that night.

  70. TurnTwo September 25th, 2008 at 12:18 pm

    “It’s suspicious, sure, but unless I know *why* he didn’t come to New York that often, I’m not going to get upset by it.”

    and given the media that surrounds the team, the resources the team has to communicate amongst themselves, etc, why does he HAVE to be at the stadium to run “the business”?

    there arent companies that have a home base in one state, and operating regional locations away from the main campus?

    people need to get over this hank nonsense.

  71. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 12:18 pm

    Arbitration is a one year deal, but I don’t think it precludes the club from negotiating a long term deal before the arbitration hearing is set.

  72. Mr. Exceptional September 25th, 2008 at 12:19 pm

    I’m not really sure why everyone thinks they shouldn’t resign Pettitte.

    I think you absolutely resign Pettitte and Mussina.

    Pettitte is a proven commodity, knows New York and still has something left in the tank as a #4 or #5.

    Come on…is Pettitte better then Rasner, Ponson and Pavano…absolutely. If you don’t resign him those are the type of alternatives you’ll be facing again.

    A rotation with Pettitte, Mussina, Wang is a good start. You’ve basically got your #2, #3 or #4, and a #5 starter.

    I’d go to battle with those 3 any day.

    Pettitte will rest this winter, heal and come back strong a la Mussina…you just watch.

  73. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 12:22 pm

    “there arent companies that have a home base in one state, and operating regional locations away from the main campus?”

    That’s an interesting point which has nothing to do with the Yankees. :)

    The Yankees aren’t Kinko’s or Burger King – there is one basket with all the eggs in it.

  74. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 12:25 pm

    “Arbitration is a one year deal, but I don’t think it precludes the club from negotiating a long term deal before the arbitration hearing is set.”

    I agree – you just wouldn’t get the picks if you struck a deal before going to the arbitration hearing. You get them if a player declines the offer of arbitration (if I recall correctly)

  75. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 12:25 pm

    I don’t think you jump at resigning Pettitte unti you explore your chances of getting the FA starting pitcher/pitchers you want. Pettitte will still be available. If my memory serves me right, one of the reasons negotiations broke off with Santana/Twins is that Pettitte said I’ll come back. I still believe Santana could have been had minus Hughes in the deal.

  76. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 12:27 pm

    I think what they do in CF depends on a number of factors.

    Do they sign one FA pitcher or two?

    Do they sign Tex?

    Do they decide to bring back Abreu and move Nady to first base?

    Do they just blow it up (unlikely) and give all the kids first crack at making the roster?

    I think all of those questions determine what they do in CF.

    Perhaps they decide to load up on pitching, keep Abreu, and move Nady to first.

    If they do, I could see them giving Gardner first crack at the job. They will hope he can hit .250-.260, steal some bases, make the plays in CF, and bat 9th.

    With the work they are putting in with him, its not like they are treating him as if he won’t be on the team next year.

    He has to hit better though. Right now, its not enough.

    Doesn’t mean he won’t ever hit at the major league level. Just means he has to do so in order to stick.

  77. Mike R September 25th, 2008 at 12:31 pm

    “A players value at preventing runs in the field, even the best defensive player in the game, is still far, far shorter than the runs a player can make at the plate. The biggest mistake is to overvalue defense.”

    I would have to disagree and say that the biggest mistake is to undervalue defense. Offense may help you coast through the regular season, but as it has been said time and time again:

    Championships are built with [b]pitching[/b] and [b]defense[/b].

  78. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 12:34 pm

    Can anyone answer me how Paul O’Neill changed from a .262 hitter with CIN to a .305 (avg over 9 yrs) hitter with the Yankees?

    (This may appear off-topic, but I was actually wondering, when someone put up the numbers that might be expected of Nady, that weren’t they about where O’Neill was career-wise. They’re close, but if you separate CIN from NYY, it’s a world of difference.)

  79. Bronx Jeers September 25th, 2008 at 12:34 pm

    I really couldn’t care less if Hank is at the games or if he’s watching them from his little racing car bunk bed but don’t you think that if he really cared about the team that he would make more than 2 appearances at the Stadium?

    And if anyone messed up that Santana deal it was him with his Gary Cooper act.

  80. Jeremy September 25th, 2008 at 12:35 pm

    I like position-by-position breakdowns.

    “RF: Abreu offered arbitration, and ends up signing a two year contract with a club option for a third year.”

    Yeah, like TKinDC said, arbitration is a one-year deal. If they offer Abreu arb, he will decline and leave and the Yankees will get picks. I see him gone next season.

    “LF: Nady in last year of contract”

    Nady in RF to replace Abreu.

    “CF: Gardner-Yankees so enamored with his speed and defense, but he hasn’t proven yet he can hit. Damon-no arm, and won’t be traded unless another lead-off hitter obtained[not sure if Gardner can consistently hit to lead off]”

    No one is sure, sadly. Damon is needed in LF. Gardner will go in CF and we will all keep our fingers crossed that he can get on base. He just needs to get some hits and walks, and his speed and defense will make him a sufficient stopgap for a year. Bear in mind that I am not high on Gardner at all, I just think he’s the best option at the moment (assuming he isn’t a total liability at the plate, which is possible).

    “3B: A-Rod- carries too much baggage that’s affecting his offensive skills in pressure situations. Interesting article in Fox Sports, why A-Rod will not last all nine years with Yankees.”

    I haven’t read the article but I’ll pass on another attempt to get inside ARod’s mind. Last year, ARod was an absolute monster in pressure situations. This year he was hardly the disaster with RISP that many people say he is. I feel silly having to say I’m happy to have ARod at third next season, but I’ll say it anyway.

    “SS: Jeter there until he says he’s willing to move to another position.”

    Not for years.

    “2B: Cano probably won’t and shouldn’t be traded, to sign recently hurt Orlando Hudson.”

    He will be back and put up fine numbers. He’s had 2 seasons as one of the best players in the league and one season as one of the worst. He will come out somewhere between, on the above-average side.

    “1B: Is it Posada part of the time? Damon? Will the Yankees take back Giambi for one more year? My bet is Teixeira is not even offered a contract by the Yankees.”

    100% chance the Yankees will offer Teixeira a contract. Whether he takes it is the question. The Yankees would love to have Teixeira considering their hole at first, but some team (Angels) could throw such a huge contract at him that the Yankees decide not to beat it.

    First base remains a mystery. I don’t see Giambi back, but at the same time I don’t see anyone else there to replace him.

    “DH: Matsui-has to prove he can still hit after surgery if trade bait. Damon? Abreu?”

    Yes to Matsui as DH. I don’t think he will be trade bait unless he has an unbelievable season, in which case we won’t trade him anyway. Why trade for a broken down player?

    “C: Molina back, will Posada be ready?”

    I sure hope so.

  81. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 12:36 pm

    Yes you would get the picks if the player declines arbitration, and signs elsewhere. You also get the picks if the player, not offered arbitration signs elsewhere before 12/02/08.

  82. mel September 25th, 2008 at 12:36 pm

    SJ & Doreen,

    Many thanks for the great posts in the last thread.

  83. Y26 September 25th, 2008 at 12:39 pm

    The only way you can carry Gardner in the OF is if you sign Teixeria to replace Abreu/Giambi’s production.

    We are on pace to score 250 less runs than last year. Posada is 38 coming off shoulder injury will undoubtedly will affect his bat. Matsui hasn’t been healthy in 3 years and is very streaky.

    You can’t just let good players walk and replace them with average players. What if Gardner can’t hit at the ML level?

  84. t-rock September 25th, 2008 at 12:41 pm

    I’m shocked how open Girardi has been these past couple of weeks about next year and free agents and how different the team will be next year etc, You can tell he is hoping for a HUGE off-season and wants this thing shaken up. Normally, he would just re-direct the media to Cahsman and be non-committal about such things. But lately he has been very open and has given a lot of hints.

  85. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 12:41 pm

    The factor that nobody seems to want to talk about (by “nobody”, I mean the sports media) is, how will the economy affect baseball in 2009?

    I think its a very legitimate on a number of fronts.

    First off, many teams have suiteholders and season ticketholders from the banking and investment industries. As these various firms crash and burn, how will that affect teams’ bottom lines?

    Regular fans, who use their disposable income to buy tickets, memorabilia, etc, how will that affect teams’ bottom lines, if that money dries up?

    How many teams will want long term, big money contracts on its books given the unknown short term and long term effects of a down economy? Can these teams even afford to take on new deals?

    How will that affect offers perspective free agents get this off-season?

    Its going to be fascinating to me to see how all of these factors play into every team, especially the Yankees, off-season plans.

  86. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 12:41 pm

    Jeremy-

    Abreu declares for FA 15 days after the end of the WS. You offer him arbitration, he declines. What I’ve read is that does not preclude the Yankees from still negotiating and signing him as a FA to a deal. And thanks for your well thought out replies.

  87. X-man September 25th, 2008 at 12:42 pm

    Nady is good but he is not Abreu,I feel Nady is having a fluke year , he will come down to
    earth next year,if they let Abreu go they should make sure they have a Teixeira type 1st baseman .

    Johnny Damon also has a career year this season I don’t think he will copy it next year,and he has a track record of not being healthy in a full season.So they’d better find a solid CF next year.

    Gardner is good but don’t people think Melky did has some bad luck this season?Melky is not fast in the field,but he did make some amazing play,I remember in his minor league
    scouting report,he has a good first-jump judgement which make up his average speed.If he can hit 0.270 again with like 15 home runs,which I think is his upside,I think he can be yankees’ center fielder for some years.

  88. no.27 September 25th, 2008 at 12:45 pm

    I think the Yankees should go with Damon and Gardner sharing time in centerfield. Nady plays everyday in right. Posada catches, but DH’s about 60 games. When Posada DH’s, Matsui plays LF and Damon plays CF. When Posada catches, Matsui DH’s and Gardner plays CF and Damon plays LF. Melky is the 4th OF. This gives the Yankees a chance to see what they’ve got in Gardner and allows them to completely rebuild the OF for 2010 when Damon, Matsui, and Nady are free agents when Jackson should be ready and guys like Carl Crawford, Matt Holliday, and Jason Bay are free agents.

  89. Impalin-Palin September 25th, 2008 at 12:45 pm

    .204AVG .263OBP .278SLG

    Sox fans all over the US are hoping he’s playing CF next season.

  90. Tony September 25th, 2008 at 12:45 pm

    You have to let Gardner be your centerfield next year. He is exactly what this team needs, brings great work ethic, plays hard, he’s a team guy and he brings a whole new dimension to the Yankees lineup. He stays out of double plays because of his speed which allows him to get into scoring position off a steal. I think you have let him be your starting CF next year……with Damon in LF and Nady in RF. Thats a nice offense. I would keep Melky as a bench player for the big club, he can be a late inning defensive replacement or a nice switch hitting bat off the bench. Maybe that hinders his development, then let him play in Triple A and let Christian be that off teh bench. He gives the team nice speed as well. They have options and I hope they let Gardner have CF.

  91. Tony September 25th, 2008 at 12:46 pm

    Impalin-Palin,
    Just remember both Giambi and Cano hit under .200 for over a month at the beginning of this season. Give the kid a chance.

  92. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 12:48 pm

    Dont know if anyone has mentioned this name.

    Bubba Crosby all over again. What the hell is the difference between Gardner and Bubba? We are not going to play a center fielder that has a pitchers batting average.
    What was that line Cash used a few years back? Ahh yes. Bubba is our center fielder.

  93. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 12:49 pm

    “According to several metrics the Yankees were the worst defensive team in the American League this year. That has to improve if the Yankees want to contend next year.”

    That’s odd. During last night’s game, they said that the Yankees had the best fielding pct.

  94. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 12:50 pm

    As I stated on my blog http://gardnerformvp.mlblogs.com, the Yankee’s best option is to move Damon to 1st base. 1st base doesn’t require as much skill as many of you may think. Whether or not you guys want to believe me, Damon is a terrible outfielder. He has absolutely no arm, which is a very big part of being an outfield. Speed is 50% of being an outfielder. So I would rank Damon as a 50-60 out of 100 as an outfielder. However, Damon is a great offensive presence. He should alternate at the 1st base/DH spot. Gardner is faster than Damon and has a pretty good arm.

    This is what I think the outfield should be next year. Nady, Abreu, Matsui, Gardner. Gardner should alternate with the other three for days that they DH. Melky isn’t on the list because I think he should be traded. He will probably be on the Nationals or the Giants next year.

  95. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 12:50 pm

    “Bubba Crosby all over again. What the hell is the difference between Gardner and Bubba?”

    Brett’s faster than Bubba.

  96. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 12:51 pm

    SJ44-

    What a great point. If banks can’t or won’t lend money, then companies or businesses would not be able to meet payroll, therefore job layoffs. It already steams the public that CEO’s walk away with millions[golden parachute] when their ship sinks-how does it look to spend close to a million a year for a premium number of seats in a suite at Yankee Stadium?

    I agree that a CEO willing to take his golden parachute from a failed company should be given a gold parachute and be made to jump out of a plane at 18,0000 feet!!

    Question? What relief do the Yankees get in the coming years from revenue sharing based on the new stadium costs?

  97. E-Man September 25th, 2008 at 12:51 pm

    I think Melky is done. It’s time to try Gardner-part time. I would leave the OF alone. Nady, Damon and Abreu. Not the greatest D line up in the world but all three of those guys were consistent at the plate this year. Gardner would be great to have on the bench for speed, late innings, tight games etc.

  98. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 12:51 pm

    The only difference is, the Yankees have spent more time working with Gardner in a week than they did with Bubba his entire time in NY.

    At minimum, absent a trade for a CF in the off-season (unlikely, IMO), Gardner will be competing for a job.

    They obviously aren’t going to hand him the job but, you have to think he will be in the mix.

  99. mel September 25th, 2008 at 12:52 pm

    t-rock,

    Interesting observation. I don’t know why people thought that it would be a seamless transistion, it never is. I mean people predicted it, but when all the stuff hit the fan they just lose perspective.

    Your shakeup theory might have some merit, much in the way that a new football coach works better with the guys he brings in than with the roster he inherits.

    Just human nature.

    It’s kind of strange to see Girardi coaching his old ‘mates. They’re not the problem, though. They’re professionals and they kept their eye on the prize. Like they did for the last 13 years.

    Still not liking the anonymous quotes, but there’s a 50%chance that person will be gone next season. And a 100%chance they’ll be gone the season after that.

    Maybe your theory helps explain some, but not all, of Melky’s playing status. Still think there’s more to the story.

    I think the Yankees knew they were going to get young, so they went with Girardi, knowing that the first year would be rough whether they won or lost.

  100. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 12:54 pm

    SJ44 -

    It’s certainly going to be quite interesting to see how it all plays out. All entertainment venues are going to suffer some setbacks, as the people who “put up the money” either no longer have it to give or need to be more conservative.

  101. CB September 25th, 2008 at 12:54 pm

    The idea that Brett Gardner’s defense is going to make the yankees a better team next year is a fantasy.

    Melky couldn’t hit a lick this year but he was outstanding in the field.

    He had the second highest zone rating and seventh highest relative zone rating for any centerfielder in baseball this year. That is outstanding.

    Melky got to more balls hit to the centerfield area than any other player besides Carlos Gomez.

    What are the chances Brett Gardner becomes the single best defensive centerfielder in baseball next year? And even if he does the difference between that optimal Gardner performance and Melky’s defense this year will be marginal at best. It will not make any substanstial difference.

    The only way Gardner is going to make this team better is with his bat. That was the enormous problem they had in CF this year. There’s no room to go up on centerfield defense from Melky. There’s just not.

    Gardner would help stealing bases. But he hasn’t shown he can hit. And the improvements in his offense people are talking about arent’ very large. Sure he’s been better than his first 50 at bats but that improvement is largely due to how bad he was when he first came up.

    The yankees offense got killed this year for two reasons 1. They didn’t hit with men on base. 2. They had the equivalent of three replacement level players in their line up night in and out – Melky, Cano and Molina.

    Having one replacement level bat in a line up kills a team. Kills them. Many teams have missed the playoffs just by having one replacement level performance. The yankees had three.

    That must change. They have to have a CF how can be at least league average with the bat.

    Can Gardner do that? Not so sure. But we’ll see next spring.

  102. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 12:55 pm

    SJ –

    Your point about the economy is a really interesting factor – I guess we have a new opening in the Bear Stearns and Lehman Bros. luxury suite slots.

    It is a good thing the Yankees have the building built now for all intents and purposes. If Yankee management had to go out and get financing in the current market it would be an absolute non-starter.

    Plus a lot of owners are real estate magnates – or at least they were before the bubble burst.

  103. PUDGE, THE 08 CURSE September 25th, 2008 at 12:55 pm

    M’s are gonna have to trade Ichrio…the players on that team cant stand him

    trade damon and something for Ichrio

  104. PUDGE, THE 08 CURSE September 25th, 2008 at 12:56 pm

    Ichiro, not Ichrio

  105. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 12:56 pm

    Why are a lot of you not mentioning Matsui in outfield talks? He is an above average fielder, although nothing spectacular. He is one of our best offensive players.

  106. Mr. Exceptional September 25th, 2008 at 12:56 pm

    What about trading Damon to some place like San Fran for Matt Cain? Sell high on Damon I say.

  107. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 12:57 pm

    If they put Damon at first. He will need to walk the ball to the pitcher after every pick off play. Iv seen enough of first basemans with no arms. Time to get a natural first baseman that can turn two.

    Will Posada be ready to catch next spring? If not. DH? 1B? Will we have to trade Matsui to open up a dh spot for Jorge?

  108. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 12:58 pm

    There is no way the Yankees could ever get Ichiro for Damon in a straight up trade. Ichiro is one of the best outfielders in baseball. Also, Damon is a good personality in the clubhouse. That trade would be detrimental to the team.

  109. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 12:59 pm

    “Why are a lot of you not mentioning Matsui in outfield talks? He is an above average fielder, although nothing spectacular. He is one of our best offensive players.”

    Two reasons:

    1) His right knee
    2) His left knee

  110. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 1:00 pm

    Damon and what else for Cain? Hughes? Jackson? Cano? Damon won’t waive his no trade to play for SF. No deal happening there.

  111. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:00 pm

    Yankee Trader,

    I’ve seen you ask several times about Pettitte accepting a Roger deal.

    Did no one answer? People are pretty adamant about him not returning because of his second half.

    I don’t like the Roger deal and Andy won’t either. Because Roger’s the only guy to pull that stuff and he doesn’t want to be linked to Roger right now.

    I’m on record of saying I want Andy back for one last hurrah. It’s partly sentimental, but it makes a lot of sense as we’ve only got Wang and a part-time Joba locked in right now.

    I prefer Andy for 1 year over Garland or someone comparable for 5 years. Cheaper, shorter, and more flexible. And quite possibly, better.

  112. vin September 25th, 2008 at 1:00 pm

    “He had the second highest zone rating and seventh highest relative zone rating for any centerfielder in baseball this year. That is outstanding.

    Melky got to more balls hit to the centerfield area than any other player besides Carlos Gomez.”

    I enjoy looking at stats as much as anyone, but by watching the games there is no way one gets the impression that Melky is a premiere CF in terms of tracking down balls – no way. Great arm – yes… good range – yes… but not great.

  113. E-Man September 25th, 2008 at 1:00 pm

    You can’t trade Matsui. He has a no trade clause in his contract.

  114. Mr. Exceptional September 25th, 2008 at 1:00 pm

    You can definitely count on having to DH Posada some of the time next year I agree.

    You also can’t count on Matsui to stay healthy for the whole season. I also don’t think he should ever be in the outfield again.

  115. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 1:00 pm

    “Why are a lot of you not mentioning Matsui in outfield talks? He is an above average fielder, although nothing spectacular. He is one of our best offensive players.”

    Because Girardi has already said that he sees Matsui as the permanent DH.

  116. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:01 pm

    Damon has a bad arm, but you are exaggerating how bad it is SOS. I’m sure he can make a good throw to 2nd base if he needed to. He’s at least an upgrade from Giambi. Jorge should continue to alternate with Molina at catcher.

  117. PUDGE, THE 08 CURSE September 25th, 2008 at 1:01 pm

    I said Damon and something else…Ichiro is available since the clubhouse is a mess with him in it

  118. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 1:01 pm

    “You can’t trade Matsui. He has a no trade clause in his contract.”

    Matsui has already said that if the Yankees want to move him, he’d waive his no trade clause. He’s honorable that way.

  119. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 1:03 pm

    I just checked Wikipedia and sadly, it seems Arte Moreno’s money comes from marketing and advertising. I was kind of hoping he was a real estate guy and Tex could come more cheaply :(

  120. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:03 pm

    Yankee Trader,

    And second half hopes don’t always work out. Injuries to both Roger and Joba put kinks in the plan.

    If anything, Andy starts the year. If things go awry, then Aceves, Hughes, or Coke can take the slot.

  121. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 1:04 pm

    “You can’t trade Matsui. He has a no trade clause in his contract.”

    What i got from last years rumors were that he would not block a trade.

  122. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:04 pm

    So if that’s the case, then Gardner, Nady, Abreu in the outfield. Damon at 1st. Cano at 2nd. Jeter SS. 3B A-rod. Catcher Posada/Molina. Problem solved. Maybe bring in a back up just in case of injuries.

    As for pitching, I think the Yanks should pursue Kyle Lohse. Read my blog if you want my reasons.

  123. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 1:04 pm

    “M’s are gonna have to trade Ichrio…the players on that team cant stand him”

    Ichiro is probably pissed that he’s playing for a God awful team. That’s enough to ruin anyone’s mood. I bet he’d be thrilled to be in pinstripes and wouldn’t be a clubhouse problem at all.

    That being said, Ichiro is starting to get up there in age. I might want to stick with a Damon/Gardner platoon than go with Ichiro.

  124. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 1:05 pm

    The financial market hit has affected the Yankees.

    Goldman Sachs, a co-owner of the YES Network (who has been trying to sell their share of the network for a year) just recieved a 5 billion dollar cash investment from Warren Buffet.

    They also announced a stock offering in an attempt to raise another 5 billion dollars. With this infusion of capital, they were on the verge of going under.

    Does that mean they will hold onto their stake in the network? Unclear at this time.

    Goldman Sachs is a great partner to the Yankees. John Mallory, their LA head, is the guy who brokered the Arod back to the Yankees talks.

    Ironically, it was Warren Buffet (a huge baseball fan) who told Arod to call John Mallory at Goldman Sachs and look to go back to the Yankees.

    Its fascinating to me how all of this stuff intersects.

    JMO but, the current state of the economy is going to affect free agency in a way neither teams, players nor agents ever thought back in spring training.

    It may end up being the biggest story of the off-season.

  125. Mr. Exceptional September 25th, 2008 at 1:05 pm

    I think if Damon would waive his no trade you could get Cain for Damon and a couple prospects. Just trying to come up with ideas.

    Obviously not Hughes, Jackson or Cano…but San Fran needs offensive help.

    Damon, Kennedy and Colin Curtis? Thoughts?

    People love playing in San Fran.

  126. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:05 pm

    The Mariners would not give up Ichiro unless we gave them Damon and some pitching prospects.

  127. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 1:06 pm

    If memory serves me correctly. Ichiro and Matsui dont get along. So if you want Ichiro. Youd probably have to unload Matsui.

  128. Mike R September 25th, 2008 at 1:07 pm

    “I haven’t read the article but I’ll pass on another attempt to get inside ARod’s mind. Last year, ARod was an absolute monster in pressure situations. This year he was hardly the disaster with RISP that many people say he is. I feel silly having to say I’m happy to have ARod at third next season, but I’ll say it anyway.”

    I hate to look at it like this, but it really seems logical. Last year A-Rod was in a contract year, he knew he would be able to cash in big if he performed. Since he put up HUGE numbers last year he was able to GUARANTEE himself that he would make 270 MILLION DOLLARS over the course of the next 10 GUARANTEED years.

    It seems that A-Rod may be the type of player that feels that he has ALREADY earned that 270 million, he is not in the process of earning it.

    If any of your 270 million dollars, I hardly think you would take your jobs quite as seriously as you did previously. It’s just such a big and long contract, he no longer has as much to play for. He will retire when the contract is over and all that will be left is his numbers. He’ll hit his home runs and go home happy regardless of the outcome. The only thing he seems to get upset about is when he has to respond to difficult questions.

    The closing ceremony for the stadium made it apparent to me, he just doesn’t seem like he fits in with the Yankees…

  129. YankCrank20 September 25th, 2008 at 1:07 pm

    This is the same move that got us in trouble with Melky. Melky was young and had one game-changing talent…his arm, so we threw him out there and ignored how he couldn’t hit at this level. Now Gardner has one game-changing weapon, his speed, and he’ll be thrown out there. I hope it works this time

  130. E-Man September 25th, 2008 at 1:07 pm

    lol yeah I’m sure he’d do that. Why put a no trade clause in your contract?

  131. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:08 pm

    People like San Fran. But nobody enjoys playing there. Or at least nobody who is serious about Baseball enjoys it. It is basically a retirement check if you get traded there. You can kiss your career goodbye.

    If Goldman is selling their Yes Network shares, I will gladly buy some.

  132. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 1:08 pm

    “People love playing in San Fran.”

    True, but I think they’d love playing for a team that has a shot at winning more. SF is years away from being a contender.

  133. Mike R September 25th, 2008 at 1:08 pm

    **if any of you were given 270 million…

  134. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:08 pm

    Buffett needs to call LeBron and convince him to strongarm CC into come to the Yankees.

  135. victor September 25th, 2008 at 1:09 pm

    but cano in right field I like the way he goes back on flyballs, great arm, and let face hit “he needs more time to react on batted balls hit to him” (try to get brian roberts) nady in left, damon/gardner in cf

  136. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:09 pm

    Except Gardner has the potential to hit. He has yet to prove it in the Major League regular season, but we can only hope.

  137. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 1:10 pm

    Mel-

    Thanks for being the first to offer a counter-point to not offering Pettitte a “Roger” deal.

    I too don’t want Garland for 5 years,or any years, but I do want the Yankees to explore their starting pitching options thru FA, before being too quick to sign Pettitte, and having Pettitte come in later, might extend his ability to pitch effectively down the stretch, as he probably can’t be counted on for 200 innings anymore. Also waiting on Pettitte until you have a clearer idea what your roster is makes sense as he is going nowhere else.

  138. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:10 pm

    Screw CC, he’s old and is worn out from all the complete games he is pitching. Get Kyle Lohse. He’s still young and managed to shut down the Red Sox and Rays in interleague play this year.

  139. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 1:11 pm

    “What i got from last years rumors were that he would not block a trade.”

    Sadly, this years realities probably preclude one from happening.

  140. Clint September 25th, 2008 at 1:11 pm

    Gardner can’t steal 1st. He is a .204 hitter.

    Justin Christian has comparable speed AND is a better hitter than Gardner, he also makes much more contact.

    BTW – Nady is a .265 hitter. Easy to put up good numbers in the NL Central. Tons of strikeouts, low OBP. He is nothing special, certainly not worth the contract that Boras will get for him. Sell him high, or pay him a Torii Hunter/Rowand contract.

  141. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:12 pm

    -Bedard is the problem, not Ichiro
    -Ichiro and Matsui would get along just fine
    -Matsui’s not getting traded. Why would anyone want to trade for a player who’s had 3 knee surgeries in the last year?
    -Ichiro will be worth the $20M for his Confucian-like quotes alone.

  142. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 1:12 pm

    SJ-

    Yep – Goldman is forced to raise cash as it converts away from being an investment bank.

    Steve Schwarzman of Blackstone is apparently in the wings with buckets full of cash – I remember when there were rumors about the Steinbrenners selling the team a couple years ago that Schwarzman was identified as a potential buyer.

    All that talk of selling the team has obviously died down to nothing as Hank and Hal have elevated their profile.

  143. Mr. Exceptional September 25th, 2008 at 1:12 pm

    Damon could go to San Fran, put up another career year, and sucker someone into his next contract.

    That’s got to factor in some. He’s got to be thinking beyond his contract with the Yankees. I think if he feels his playing time will be limited, or he’ll be shuffled around position-wise, he might consider a move.

    Again, just thinking of ideas.

  144. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 1:13 pm

    “The closing ceremony for the stadium made it apparent to me, he just doesn’t seem like he fits in with the Yankees…”

    I disagree. Alex would fit in fine if the fans would allow him to. I saw that he didn’t tip his hat and I don’t blame him. The guy gets booed as if he were a BOS player. It’s shameful and uncalled for. There are few who work harder than Alex does. Ask his teammates. They don’t seem to have a problem with him. Anytime Derek has warmed up to him, you know that Alex has gotten his act together.

    Next year, we will see the same Alex we got last year. He’ll be happy, single and rich. I have a feeling that his numbers for next year are going to be off the charts.

  145. Wilson September 25th, 2008 at 1:13 pm

    I do think guys like Loshe and Lowe will be a better investment than CC.

  146. rconn23 September 25th, 2008 at 1:13 pm

    I’d love to see the team give Gardner a chance to start in CF. If Gardner could muster a .350 OBP to go along with his speed and defense, he could be a difference maker at the bottom of the lineup.

    To say he “can’t” hit in the majors is jumping the gun. It’s a small sample size. He is a young player who is adjusting. His performance in the minors has shown that he has initially struggled, and then made the adjustments to be successful.

    As I’ve said all along, Gardner brings more weapons to the table than Cabrera, who brings little, if anything.

    The team must get younger and better defensively. It’s why I believe the team should make a strong run after Mark Teixeira.

    Using the various excuses of “Posada can play first” or Matsui’s knees are so bad, he can move to first” is unacceptable. That’s all there is to it. Tex is a gold-glove caliber 1B, who brings patience to the plate that could more than replace Giambi. Tex has 120 RBIs this year and a much higher .OPS than Justin Morneau, whose name is being tossed around as an MVP candidate.

    More importantly, he feels a legitimate need. Dumping players in the mid and upper 30s, who have bad wheels (Matsui) or a bad shoulder (Posada) at 1st base would only serve to hurt the team.

    And if the team doesn’t make a run at Tex, what are other options. Shelly Duncan? Juan Miranda? Wilson Betemit? Expecting the Yankees to compete with those players manning a position where offensive production a must-have for most teams is really absurd.

    If Boras demands a 8 or 9 year deal and some other team is willing to pony up the cash, then so be it.
    However, the Yankees should at least stick their collective toe in the water and see what it would take to bring him here.

  147. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 1:15 pm

    If we go back to minor league numbers. Melky is a better hitter than Gardner. With what CB mentioned. Melky is also a better fielder. Better arm. That leaves one thing Gardner is better at. Speed. That doesnt help if you cant get on base.
    Call K.C. and ask if they would take minor leaguers for Dejesus.

  148. Mike R September 25th, 2008 at 1:16 pm

    SJ

    If you want to incorporate Economics into baseball, then look at how the income effect relates.

    As someone’s pay increases, they are generally willing to work harder. Until a certain point…when eventually someone has gotten and is getting paid so much, effort starts to diminish.

  149. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 1:16 pm

    “-Matsui’s not getting traded. Why would anyone want to trade for a player who’s had 3 knee surgeries in the last year?”

    mel, good point. However, Matsui is a consistent 100+ RBI guy (when healthy). I’d take a chance on him. I bet a team like SF, OAK or TOR would as well.

  150. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:16 pm

    Jeff,

    LOL. Secretly, I hope they don’t get CC. Either way it’s a win-win.

    YT,

    Sorry to disappoint you, but Pettitte’s status will be one of the first things to be decided. Earlier rather than later. And it really helps clear up the picture. They can’t sign 3 FA pitchers off the market. But if Pettitte comes back, the only unknown is where he pitches in the rotation. If all goes well, he’s pitching in the 4/5 rather than the 2/3 or 3/4.

  151. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 1:17 pm

    “Screw CC, he’s old”

    How young do you want him? Hes under 30.

  152. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:18 pm

    Laura,

    If the potential’s there, we could use those RBIs. Unless you were thinking of selling damaged goods? Shame on you!

  153. gayle September 25th, 2008 at 1:18 pm

    SJ–

    Great point as always a really good site that discusses the business aspect of baseball is biz of baseball which Ibelieve Pete links to on the right. It has been one of my bookmarks for a while now. I would say that some of these issues are already starting to hit although they broke a revenue record this year. MLB fell below their projections.

    http://www.bizofbaseball.com/i.....;Itemid=42

  154. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:18 pm

    I don’t like Lowe.Lowe is 35 years old and only does alright because he is in the NL West (worst division in baseball).

    Lohse is only 30 Years old and pitched in the AL for 5 years before going to the Reds, Phillies, then Cardinals.

  155. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 1:19 pm

    “I’d take a chance on him. I bet a team like SF, OAK or TOR would as well.”

    SF won’t anymore. Can’t use him in the OF. Further, he’s damaged goods and you don’t get good return for 1 year of Matsui no matter how well he hits when he’s healthy…if he’s healthy.

  156. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 1:19 pm

    Can someone tell me why C.C. was pitching with only 3 days rest?

  157. Mike R September 25th, 2008 at 1:20 pm

    “I saw that he didn’t tip his hat and I don’t blame him. The guy gets booed as if he were a BOS player. It’s shameful and uncalled for.”

    Part of being a professional athlete is having the ability to keep the fans from affecting your game. A-Rod has gotten booed plenty in his career, and I would hope that he wasn’t so fragile that he lets it govern his play.

  158. R-Tek September 25th, 2008 at 1:20 pm

    I don’t want CC… he doesn’t want to be here, he is only coming here for money. He is a West Coast groupie, he will hate it here like Randy did. I’m not in love with giving him 8 years and $170 million.

    Give me Burnett for 4 years instead. He is an East Coast guy and needs a change of scenery. 1\2 the contract of CC and if you listen to Waldman, he is practically begging to come here.

    Burnett and Teixeria > CC

  159. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 1:20 pm

    “If the potential’s there, we could use those RBIs. Unless you were thinking of selling damaged goods? Shame on you!”

    No way, mel. I’m a huge Matsui supporter and I want him on the team next year as the permanent DH. I was just saying that I do think that there are teams out there that would take him in a heartbeat.

  160. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:21 pm

    Ok, I didn’t realize that CC is 28 right now. But you realize that he is going to cost a lot and he is deteriorating faster than other pitchers because of the innings he has pitched. He will want a long term contract, so that would not be good for the yankee cause.

    Also, he is hitting really well. So I’d expect the Dodgers or one of the other big market NL teams to make an offer to beat the Yankees.

  161. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:21 pm

    Laura,

    Doreen & I have talked about this.

    It’s not fair and it’s not right, but Alex really should start a very subtle, almost invisible PR campaign.

    If he embraces New York, it will embrace him.

    He’ll reach his milestone, but it’ll be easier and better if the fans push him. Towards the goal, not out the door

  162. gayle September 25th, 2008 at 1:22 pm

    Alex was out beofre the game inter-mingling with fans who were waiting in line on the field siging autographs. He was there after the game signing autographs . That celebration at the end when he took a step aside I think was really more about letting long timers like Jeter, Mo, Posada and Pettite have their day in the sun. he was not part of that. If he had tried to assert himself everyone would have said he was trying to get in the spotlight.

    I think he did the right thing.

  163. gayle September 25th, 2008 at 1:23 pm

    Alex did tip his cap not sure what you all were watching

  164. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 1:23 pm

    “SF won’t anymore. Can’t use him in the OF. Further, he’s damaged goods and you don’t get good return for 1 year of Matsui no matter how well he hits when he’s healthy…if he’s healthy.”

    Perhaps, Fredo. It may not make good business sense since he’s got 1 year left, but as someone who has witnessed most, if not all of his clutch hits, I’d take the guy on my team regardless of how long it was for. As for his knees, he’s had both of them worked on now. Shouldn’t they hold up for at least one more season?

  165. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 1:23 pm

    “Can someone tell me why C.C. was pitching with only 3 days rest?”

    Because the Brewers are desperate to make the playoffs. Last night was his 2nd consecutive start on 3 days and a 3rd one could be coming up on Sunday.

  166. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:23 pm

    Burnett is not worth it either. He has yet to prove anything to me. At least CC has numbers. Burnett has nasty stuff, but is not quite consistent enough for my liking. And Teixeira will be on the Angels next year.

    Lohse is the answer.

  167. Knicks September 25th, 2008 at 1:24 pm

    We had a chance to get Jonathan Sanchez for Matsui, we blew it

  168. PAT M September 25th, 2008 at 1:24 pm

    CB called the CF situation perfectly…The Yanks need an offensive CF,,,Gardner & Melky are 4th OF type guys..Nothing wrong with that at all..Lokk at the Angels, their paying big $$$ for the same type of player ( Matthews )…If Gardner could at least bunt his way on ( let’s say 20 times ) then his value is increased….You just can’t steal first base, however bunting is about as close as it comes…..The Beltran failure will haunt this team for years …..

  169. RalphieD September 25th, 2008 at 1:24 pm

    some of these people here really use stats the wrong way…just because gardner is hitting 204 right now does not mean he is a 204 hitter and never will be anything more..he is slowly adjusting to mlb and should improve with time…it seems like there are too many people who hate gardner for some odd reason…they like seeing him do bad and take joy in the fact hes batting 204 right now..kinda sad and pathetic

  170. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 1:25 pm

    “Alex did tip his cap not sure what you all were watching”

    I have to rewatch the tape, but the photo that has been circulating on the net has him clapping with his hat on. Again, whether he did or not tip his cap doesn’t bother me one bit. Some of the fans treat one of our own like dirt. And frankly, it’s embarrassing.

  171. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:25 pm

    SoS,

    His last two outings were on short rest. The first was a loss, this was a win.

    He’s doing what they got him to do. Get them into the post-season. Last night’s got them the WC tie.

    Supposedly CC gave his agent “the riot act” for interfering.

  172. Dennis-Costanza(Sox fan) September 25th, 2008 at 1:26 pm

    Fredo.

    Re: Your question on the 2004 WS.

    IMO, the 2004 WS was anti-climatic. I am not sure many Sox fans would admit it but the WS was a a tad of let down after an emotional ALCS. Going to opening day in 2005 was better than WS. I know that sounds starnge but that is the way I felt.

    Respectfully. -dennis

  173. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:26 pm

    I agree Ralphie. The intelligent people here who watch the games instead of taking the stats as a representation of the truth can testify to the fact that Garner is nervous at the plate. Why else do you think he is always throwing his bat?

  174. Impalin-Palin September 25th, 2008 at 1:27 pm

    “If we go back to minor league numbers. Melky is a better hitter than Gardner.”

    Um…. when has Gardner EVER been a better hitter than Melky?

    Gardner is the NEW Melky. All hype, no substance.

  175. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 1:27 pm

    You can sign Teixeira, have Matsui and Posada in the lineup the entire year, but in our division, the Rays are not going away next year with their pitching and all players chipping in when Crawford and Longoria were out-without a .300 hitter in the lineup!

    Boston is set except for catcher and a few tweaks in the bullpen.

    Toronto is renegotiating with Burnett already[his wife loves Toronto] and with Halladay makes them competititive.

    If you want us to compete the money 1st needs to be spent on finding two young quality FA starting pitchers. Yes they’ll listen to Boras’ demands for Teixeira, and yes maybe Teixeira doesn’t care to play for Baltimore, his home town team he rooted for growing up, but I seriously don’t believe he’ll be a Yankee priority.

  176. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 1:28 pm

    Kyle Lohse is the classic case of Dave Duncan influence. Duncan takes guys like that and makes them pitchers.

    Hell, he made Jeff Weaver a post-season hero.

    Away from Duncan, those guys fail bigtime. Lohse was hideous in the AL.

    He isn’t even in AJ Burnett’s class as a pitcher.

    Just as they did in the off-season, I suspect they will pass on Lohse. His year is a total mirage. It will never be repeated if he leaves St. Louis.

  177. hank hal September 25th, 2008 at 1:28 pm

    CC for 8 yrs/$175 or Burnett for 4 yrs/$72?

  178. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 1:28 pm

    “Perhaps, Fredo. It may not make good business sense since he’s got 1 year left, but as someone who has witnessed most, if not all of his clutch hits, I’d take the guy on my team regardless of how long it was for. As for his knees, he’s had both of them worked on now. Shouldn’t they hold up for at least one more season?”

    Laura, a couple thoughts

    1) Knees with no surgery > surgically repaired knees
    2) He wasn’t all that good an outfielder when healthy. He’s a DH now
    3) He does San Francisco no good. They are still a ways away from contending and adding him for a year does nothing toward that end. In today’s baseball youth is more valuable than ever. Giants won’t part with A-list prospect(s) for Matsui. Nobody will. He’s worth more to the Yankees DH’ing for them than what he’d bring in trade.

  179. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:28 pm

    The picture showed Bobby didn’t tip his cap either. Just a snapshot in time. Looks like that was right after Jeter finished speaking, so maybe Alex was still zoning out. :)

  180. AJ YANKS September 25th, 2008 at 1:30 pm

    If CC doens’t want to come here and Toronto extends Burnett… then where do we go for pitching?

  181. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 1:30 pm

    Thanks for the info. I know C.C. is a work horse. But this is ridiculous. Players union or his agent should be stepping in. By the start of next year. He migh be damaged goods. Too bad. I wanted a fat lefty that can eat up innings. David Wells like.

  182. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 1:31 pm

    We never had a chance to get Sanchez for Matsui. It was
    Noah Lowrie and/or Kevin Correia.

  183. Mr. Exceptional September 25th, 2008 at 1:31 pm

    Forget getting rid of Matsui. Damon in the Yankees best chip right now, remember sell high.

    Again, I like Damon, he plays hard and gives it his all. But his defensive is horrendous and the Yankees need to get better on that end of the ball.

    He’s their best chance to get a decent return. He’ll be in his contract year, giving him extra incentive.

  184. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:31 pm

    I’m not saying Lohse is the next Nolan Ryan, but he is a solid young player with a good selection of pitches. He will also cost a lot less in prospects and money than Burnett and CC. And at least you can bank on the fact that he will enjoy NY, since money wouldn’t be the underlying factor of his arrival.

  185. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:31 pm

    SJ44,

    LOL. Duncan’s probably responsible for Jeff Suppan’s WS performance, too. Suppan was magical that week. Not so much now.

  186. Jeff September 25th, 2008 at 1:33 pm

    What you are saying about duncan is like saying that Kevin Long is the reason why Damon is so good this year.

  187. pat September 25th, 2008 at 1:34 pm

    If Warren Buffett is investing billions in Goldman-Sachs, their long term prognosis is better than anyone elses is the business. He’s the epitome of a returns oriented investor.

  188. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 1:35 pm

    Fredo,
    There is one team that loves to trade for players with a history of leg problems and past their prime. Ozzie and the white sox would love to have him. Not sure if Crede is a free agent or not. But maybe go after Crede for first base and a tbd.

  189. patrick max September 25th, 2008 at 1:35 pm

    why are they only playing well now when the pressure is off?

    why didn’t they do this when it mattered?

  190. raymagnetic September 25th, 2008 at 1:36 pm

    Gardner may be young but he’s older than Melky Cabrera.

    When Gardner runs he looks like an artist, when he hits he looks like an artist as well, a strikeout artist.

    If it were me I’d only let Melky hit against right handers and find a right hand hitting CF to play against lefties. I think that would solve the CF problem for 1 year.

    Mike R.,

    I dont think having more money makes a person work less if they’re doing something they love. In fact since we’re speaking of Warren Buffet, when he buys private companies he keeps the CEO’s of the companies he buys. He said they work just as hard not because of what they are paid, but because they love running the companies they’ve always ran.

  191. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:36 pm

    AJ Yanks,

    Read some of Burnett’s quotes from the Toronto recap. It’s over. He was so moved by the curtain call, “It was storybook,” Burnett said of the fans’ response. “It gave me goosebumps and tears almost at the same time. It’s great, man.”

    On the rocky relationship in Toronto, “I’ve grown up here a lot and they’ve grown up with me,” Burnett said. “So we’ve kind of moved on as a fan-player relationship. … I think they realize that I’ve taken a big step from who I was when I first came here.”

    It’s over. Leave on a high note. Did I say it’s over? :)

  192. bebop September 25th, 2008 at 1:36 pm

    I am totally unconvinced that Brett will ever hit well enough to be more then Homer Bush 2009. So far from what I’ve seen he makes Melky look like Manny.

  193. Redding September 25th, 2008 at 1:37 pm

    Adam Dunn for 1B

    Burrell for RF

  194. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 1:37 pm

    There were parts of the post-game when players were tipping their caps, and other parts where they were wearing them. Bobby Abreu, as one that I particular noticed, switched between the two, and others, who I couldn’t recognize, did the same.

    Sometimes I wonder what people are looking at. I watch the same tv picture as everyone else, and even when ARod isn’t in the picture, there are “reports” that he did or didn’t do something that “should” or “shouldn’t have” been done (i.e. joining in team brawl, congratulating a teammate, etc.). I seriously wonder….

    Not everyone has to like the guy. He is somewhat awkward. His talent has forced him into the spotlight, and I think he accepts that, but he’s not very good at it. He tries — too hard.

    I’m willing to bet when the camera is off and the media nowhere to be seen, he’s fine. Not Mr. Wonderful, mind you, but fine.

    And if we were all to be perfectly honest – Mr. Derek Jeter is not Mr. Warmth most of the time. But he handles the spotlight a lot better than ARod does.

    And before you say, when you make that much money you have to accept the booing, I would counter that it is not his “fault” he makes all that money. Someone has to be willing to pay it. And none of us, NONE of us, would turn down an opportunity to make that kind of money.

  195. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 1:37 pm

    We need an ace, not a solid starter. We need someone who gives the bullpen the night off and shuts the other team down.

    Moving Wang to the #2 role would make the front 3 for the Yanks devastating in the post-season, just like the Brewers would have been if Sheets hadn’t broken down.

    Don’t settle for an inexpensive #2 or #3. Get an ace.

  196. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 1:37 pm

    Neither CC or AJ will cost anything in prospects. They, like Lohse, are free agents.

    The Yankees don’t need to save money and settle for a guy who isn’t as good as either Pettitte or Mussina in their attempts to upgrade the rotation.

    They need to get horses. AJ and/or CC are horses. Lohse is not.

    He’s a back end of the rotation pitcher in the AL. They have guys like that already. They don’t need another one.

    Jeff,

    Money is at the forefront of almost every players decision. You think Derek Jeter wouldn’t leave the Yankees if he got a 27 million dollar a year offer from somebody as a free agent?

    That’s the business side of the game. Its the NY Yankees and they have the biggest payroll in baseball, and have for many years.

    You can’t expect players to go WalMart shopping when it comes to doing deals with the Yankees.

    Sidney Ponson loves playing in NY. That’s fine and all but, I don’t want him pitching for my team. Same goes for a guy like Lohse.

    He would LOVE to pitch in NY because he knows he will make a ton of dough. Especially with Scott Boras as his agent.

    Doesn’t mean you do the deal. He’s the kind of arm you pass on because its not special.

    At this point, if they are going to venture into the FA market for pitching, its going to be for special arms and nothing less.

  197. Wave Your Hat September 25th, 2008 at 1:40 pm

    I find the posts on the changing financial climate very interesting.

    As someone who has been going through the Yanks “Relocation Plan” process, I have been wondering how the financial market turmoil would affect the Yanks next season.

    The ticket price increases at the new Stadium seem pretty steep to me(when you compare on an equivalent seat basis) and most partial season ticket plan holders are not going to be offered seats comparable to the ones they had in the old Stadium unless they upgrade.

    Plus, a lot of the companies you would have assumed would be in the market for the full season, top-of-the-line seats, you have to think will be cutting back.

    I think the Yanks may have been cursed with some unfortunate timing. The carrying costs of the new Stadium must be a lot higher than the old one, so they’ll need the revenue bump.

    That’s why I don’t think the Yanks can afford to go the rebuilding route. They need to win to keep 4,000,000 fannies in the seats. I see them making fairly dramatic moves in the off season to do that.

  198. mel September 25th, 2008 at 1:41 pm

    TK,

    So, what you’re saying is that Lohse in not a #1?

    K-Law’s killing the Mets for announcing Omar’s extension in the middle of their collapse. Called it a big middle finger to the fans. :lol:

  199. pat September 25th, 2008 at 1:41 pm

    “The closing ceremony for the stadium made it apparent to me, he just doesn’t seem like he fits in with the Yankees…”

    He fits in fine with the Yankees, he didn’t fit in fine with the ceremony. Let’s be honest. The Stadium ceremony was a tribute to the 1996-2000 teams and the members of Monument Park. Anyone not a member of that group was on the outside looking in.

  200. saucY September 25th, 2008 at 1:41 pm

    why do i bother? :roll:

    http://tinyurl.com/4x7uvy

  201. gayle September 25th, 2008 at 1:44 pm

    Gardner doesnt have to be a great hitter he needs to be a good hitter and up his on base percentage. It is what he does when he is on base that makes the difference and even when he doesnt steal he makes the pitcher and catcher think about it an often will effect how they work.

    If we keep Damon which I think we will Gardner is the #9 hitter you dont need a whole lot from that position.

  202. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 1:44 pm

    I thought the luxury boxes were already sold. Am I wrong?

  203. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 1:45 pm

    I realize this post refers to a post a while back, but I just showered.

    ANYWAY.

    About SJ’s post and the economy:

    I think SJ makes an excellent point.

    What’s going on with the economy right now is not something that is just going to blow over in a couple of weeks. We’re on the verge of the crisis of a depression–and my father says in his lifetime (he was born in 1950) the outlook has never been this bad.

    So what this means for baseball, we don’t knnow for sure, but already I’ve seen articles about overall attendance being down, and if you saw any of the last games of the homestand before the Final Game there were a number of seats empty by home plate.

    I’ve got no idea if the two are in any way connected but I think they probably are.

    The economy doesn’t affect the Yankees, it affects everyone, but teams like Tampa and Minnesota, with small payrolls, will likely find it easier to adjust.

    I’m very curious to see what the Yankees do going forward, if they do anything, but it’s a topic that will need to be addressed

  204. Wave Your Hat September 25th, 2008 at 1:46 pm

    Doreen, I don’t see how they could be. The Yanks haven’t asked for any money yet.

  205. patrick max September 25th, 2008 at 1:48 pm

    Girardi needs to allow facial hair AND Candy.

    enough with the stupid rules, this is a baseball team, not a corporation.

  206. no.27 September 25th, 2008 at 1:50 pm

    The way the season is going, Sabathia could end up pitching close to 280 innings if the Brewers make the playoffs. The rule is that pitchers are able to safely add 40 innings onto their highest inning total. That means Sabathia could through 320 innings for us next year and take up 2 spots in the rotation, right?

    Sabathia
    Wang
    Joba
    Sabathia
    Mussina

    $22mil a year for a guy taking 2 spots in our rotation isn’t really that much, is it?

  207. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 1:50 pm

    WYH -

    I don’t know why I had it in my head that the suites were sold. Too much information rattling around up there, I guess. Or too much mis-information. :)

  208. dan 771 September 25th, 2008 at 1:51 pm

    sanchez, veras, and britton for daniel murphy?

  209. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 1:51 pm

    “So, what you’re saying is that Lohse in not a #1?”

    mel -

    I left my heart in Milwaukee – CC or bust!

  210. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 1:52 pm

    SJ44-
    Totally agree that Burnett and Sabathia should be their first choices. Burnett pitching 96-96mph after 100 pitches last night, and Sabathia going on 3 days rest and pitching great for a key win, would be terrific pickups, assuming their total body MRI’s are clean!!!!!!

    However, in the glass half empty scenario, what FA starters are your next options? What starters could we realistically trade for and at what cost?

  211. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 1:52 pm

    “Girardi needs to allow facial hair AND Candy.

    enough with the stupid rules, this is a baseball team, not a corporation.”

    I agree patrick. They should also have a chuck e cheese(kids play room with games and toys)room for all the players kids. I think that would attrack more free agents. With a paid baby sitter of coarse.

  212. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 1:54 pm

    “I don’t know why I had it in my head that the suites were sold. Too much information rattling around up there, I guess. Or too much mis-information.”

    I suspect that deposits have been collected, but they aren’t picking up the mail any more at Lehman Brothers :(

  213. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 1:54 pm

    mel,
    I think the season premiere of the office starts today!!

  214. Noreaster September 25th, 2008 at 1:55 pm

    Not sure about this, but in reading and listening seems like Cano and Melky were party buddies. Cano has bad stats for day games and they both had down years. I wonder if the Yankees just want to get Melky away from Cano or this is some form of punishment for the both of them. It would be interesting to see if Pete had any intel on this…

  215. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 1:55 pm

    For a few million dollars, I’d be willing to give up facial hair.

    If, you know, I was an XY instead of XX!

  216. Andy September 25th, 2008 at 1:55 pm

    Gardner will be successful if he can put up numbers comparable to these…

    .270 BA, .330 OBP, .700 OPS, 50 SB

    Yep, those are Jacoby Ellsbury’s numbers. No reason Gardner can’t match that.

  217. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 1:55 pm

    I do have one worry about CC. Too many starts with 3 days rest.

    I know his agent called the Brewers and went postal on them. CC then called his agent and told him to chill out, that he has no problem doing it.

    This is one example where the players needs to listen to his agent. Its great that CC is that competitive and wants to win. Commendable, really.

    But, he is putting over 130 million dollars at risk with these starts.

    Sorry but, NO TEAM is worth that.

    If they make the playoffs, he may pitch FOUR starts in a row on 3 days rest. I can’t remember if that’s ever been done by a starter in the last 25 years of MLB.

    If that happens, and given his already heavy workload, that begins to give me pause about committing money and years to him.

    That is way too much pitching for one guy, IMO.

  218. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 1:58 pm

    “Yep, those are Jacoby Ellsbury’s numbers. No reason Gardner can’t match that.”

    There’s one. He’s probably not good enough.

  219. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:00 pm

    SJ: Given CC’s numbers in Cleveland last October, I think there’s a chronic problem of overuse with him.

    I would hope that if the Yankees sign him they exhibit much better judgement and not let him pitch complete games every time out!

  220. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 2:00 pm

    Honestly, Gardner is not as good a player as Ellsbury. Ellsbury makes better contact, has more gap power, and is just a better player than Gardner.

    Believe me, if Gardner could hit .250, he could help the Yankees win. That’s his ceiling, IMO.

    That’s Ellsbury’s floor. Big difference.

  221. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 2:01 pm

    Agree SJ:

    500+ innings on one left arm over the past 2 years is a lot by today’s standards. I believe whoever signs him regrets the 2nd half of the deal no matter what, but if this keeps up in Beertown, it may be more than that.

  222. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 2:01 pm

    “There’s one. He’s probably not good enough.”

    That is Melky, vintage 2006-7 plus Gardner’s speed – doesn’t seem that improbable to me.

  223. mel September 25th, 2008 at 2:01 pm

    SoS,

    Open house. :( Will catch it on the NBC website later.

    Did catch Heroes and Law & Order though. Got to pay attention to the shows from the beginning, since I won’t be watching Yankee baseball in October. :waaaahhhh:

  224. Andy September 25th, 2008 at 2:01 pm

    SJ44,

    Although I agree that Sabathia’s workload is utterly insane, he’s a big dude who has thrown over 240 innings this year and last, but in eight big league seasons has only thrown less than 190 IP once.

    He’s only 28 and is a stud, there’s no doubt about it. You can look at it two ways, he has a good track record with work load and will be an ‘iron horse’ per se for his next team or that he is bound to fall apart.

    Personally, I take my chances on him. At least we know if he gets hurt, he was more competitive will than let’s say, oh I don’t know…Carl Pavno.

  225. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 2:02 pm

    “Gardner will be successful if he can put up numbers comparable to these…

    .270 BA, .330 OBP, .700 OPS, 50 SB

    Yep, those are Jacoby Ellsbury’s numbers. No reason Gardner can’t match that.”

    Andy,
    Gardner barely batted .280 in the minors?(majors)Better pitching/fielding/scouting. Its easier said than done.

  226. 86w183 September 25th, 2008 at 2:03 pm

    The first thing Garner needs to do is put the bat on the ball. Punch and Judy singles hitters must be great contact hitters. His 28 K in 108 At Bats is at least three times what it ought to be.

    I’d be fine if they took a shot at a Gardnerin CF as long as they go get Tex and either CC or AJ is not both. Adding Tex and having a CF platoon would improve the Yanks defense a ton, and its not like Teixiera is a step down from Giambi offensively. and the Yanks got almost nothing offensively from CF this year. A fourth OF who bats RH would also be an important addition.

    I agree Damon is the one guy the Yanks could probably get good value in a trade, but then you have no leadoff guy. I don’t see any replacement and you don’t want to put that kind of pressure on Gardner.

  227. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:04 pm

    Andy–The problem is we don’t know what the overuse is doing to his arm. He’s setting himself up for a massive injury setback.

  228. melky gardner and cash September 25th, 2008 at 2:04 pm

    Melky I think was made a scapegoat. My opinion is that Joe doesnt like him. I think its totally wrong that when both Gardner and Melky are in the game together Joe keeps Gardner in CF. So, Melky was good enough to be the starting CF for the last two years but is not considered better than a guy who just got here, and so far cannot hit?
    Is this also the same Melky that they would not trade last winter to upgrade the pitching?
    Alot of guys had off years like Melky, a lot of guys with much more talent had awful at bats like Melky.
    Cash didnt even look at Tori Hunter last year because he already had a Cf right?

  229. gayle September 25th, 2008 at 2:05 pm

    Doreen and WYH-

    They have asked for money from full season ticket holders as well as suite holders. They asked for the inintial deposit I believe last week saying that if the deposite was not received the seats would then become available.

    I know this as someone in my office was holding seats (he is a full season ticket holder) but has now decided not to renew in the location where he was his seats went from 250 to 800

  230. Andy September 25th, 2008 at 2:05 pm

    Does anyone really not think Gardner can hit at least .250 and get on base 33% of the time? If he can do that, he can still swipe 40-50 bases, which would be beneficial to this team.

  231. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 2:06 pm

    Rebecca,

    One selling point to CC for the Yankees will be that he will have a very good bullpen behind him.

    That said, If I’m the Yankees, I have everybody who is anybody in the medical business pore over his medicals because that’s an awful lot of pitching in a two year time frame for anybody.

    I have felt for awhile (just a gut feeling) the Yankees would sign both CC and AJ, and work out their offensive issues from within.

    However, I have to think CC’s use is giving some in the organization concern about making this kind of investment in him. It would me if I was in a decisionmaking capacity with the Yankees.

    We just haven’t seen a pitcher pitch this much in the last 10 years or so of MLB. Frankly, its tough to watch, coming from the perspective of what’s best for the player.

    AJ Burnett, for example, said yesterday that even if he won last night, he wouldn’t pitch on 3 days rest to try and win #20 on Sunday.

    Fans may rip him for that but I say, “good for you”.

    Its a business. You have to watch out for yourself. If not, you run the risk of getting abused.

  232. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 2:06 pm

    You are willing to miss the office for an open house? You need to get your priorities strait. Besides i never knew people actually showed up to these.lol

    Watched Heroes. Never seen Law & Order. Not big on court shows.

    Heroes
    Prison Break
    24
    Terminator
    The Office
    Yankees
    ESPN
    Movies
    Colts
    Spurs
    red wings

    Is there actually anything else on tv worth watching?

  233. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:07 pm

    Andy: I don’t know. He probably can but I don’t like the idea of him facing Doc Halladay and while he’s showing some more power, it still isn’t a lot. He hasn’t come close to a home run.

  234. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 2:08 pm

    “You can look at it two ways, he has a good track record with work load and will be an ‘iron horse’ per se for his next team”

    So far as a track record goes, keep in mind that before last season, CC averaged less than 200 IP per season for 6 years. This 500 over ’07-’08 is a pretty big step up.

  235. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:10 pm

    SJ: Agreed, on all points. Sabathia doesn’t have Burnett’s injury history, but right now, if I’m the Yankees and I’m seriously interested in him, I’m very concerned about the potential damage he’s doing to his arm.

    The Yankees need a starter, but they don’t need a pyrrhic signing.

    S.o.S.: House. Is the most amazing show, ever. SVU is also worth it.

  236. Andy September 25th, 2008 at 2:10 pm

    Rebecca – I agree with your points. I mean obviously Gardner is not my ideal pick to play center, but Melky looks like a deer in headlights. For the time being I like Gardner’s speed, something we haven’t had in a while, which could shake things up and make things happen. He doesn’t need to hit home runs. We don’t need All-Stars at every position just guys who can make some kind of impact, even if it’s stealing a big base here and there (see Dave Roberts).

  237. Wave Your Hat September 25th, 2008 at 2:11 pm

    To my mind, Burnett is too much of a risk to give a big contract. By my count, he has been on the disabled list around eleven times, including at least twice on the 60 day list.

    He may be just fine going forward, but how much do you want risk on it?

    On the other hand, Sabathia, in approximately the same amount of time, has been on the DL twice. I know he’s been worked hard, but the difference is hard to ignore.

    Any course of action can go wrong, but I’d go with Sabathia.

  238. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 2:12 pm

    from mlbtr.

    “Olney feels C.C. Sabathia could draw a $140MM offer from the Yankees, but something more in the $90-100MM range from the Angels or Dodgers. So he may have to decide whether playing close to home is worth $30-50MM.”

    and

    “Olney is convinced the Yankees will offer Bobby Abreu arbitration but nothing more. Abreu is comfortably set to earn Type A status. If the Yanks offer arbitration, they’ll either get Abreu for one year and $16MM or so or they’ll get two draft picks. In contrast, Joel Sherman and Jon Heyman have said they expect the Yankees to let Abreu leave.”

  239. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:12 pm

    bailout plan reached

  240. raymagnetic September 25th, 2008 at 2:13 pm

    SJ,

    Is there any difference in Sabathia’s workload this yeat and Randy Johnson’s workloads in the late 90′s and 00′s? i dont have the exact numbers but I do know that Randy pitched over 220 innings multiple times in that time span.

  241. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 2:13 pm

    My bad.
    I do watch House occationally. Smarta$$ dr. house gets on my nerves after awhile. How come a patient hasnt unloaded a can of whipa$$ on him?

  242. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:14 pm

    Andy: I’m fine with Gardner if the rest of the line up performs like it’s supposed to and doesn’t pull a Giambi with RISP!

  243. Yankee Trader September 25th, 2008 at 2:14 pm

    Will White,in 1879 for Cinci, pitched 680 innings, with a record of 43-31 and ERA of 1.99.

    Next year he could only manage 517.1 innings with an 18-42 record and an ERA 2.14.

    Wonder how much he earned in his 10 year career pitching 3542 innings with a record of 229-166? Probably not enough to buy 2 Yankee season tickets in the bleachers!!

    I’m Ok with CC on 3 days rest, if he’s honest with the team on how he’s feeling.

  244. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 2:15 pm

    He was also out of gas by the ALCS last year because of that workload. Its worse this year.

    I love CC. The dude is bigtime competitive, takes the ball, and is a great young pitcher. All the traits I like in a pitcher he possesses.

    That said, the workload scares the daylights out of me.

    As fans, we think about the next year or two. Teams however, have to think about the life of the contract.

    The last 3 years of Jason Giambi’s contract hamstrung the Yankees pretty good. It prevented them from being able to do certain things to improve the team. It definitely killed them at first base, as Giambi’s skilled declined. Do we want to repeat that again?

    Its a tough call, given the way the Brewers are (IMO) abusing him.

    Perhaps, this is when the economic conditions of the country help the Yankees.

    At this point, anybody giving him more than 4 years has to have their heads examined. The state of the economy may make teams leery of committing big dollars for long periods of time toward ANYBODY right now.

    Obviously, I’m saying this without any medical data from him in front of me but, I wouldn’t offer more than 4 years for him right now.

    Hope I get two great years and I’ll live with the results of the other two years.

  245. no.27 September 25th, 2008 at 2:15 pm

    Gardner’s last year in AAA is pretty comparable to Ellsbury’s.

    .296/.414 76Ks
    .298/.360 47Ks

    I think Gardner needs a little time to adjust to Major League pitching, but he could turn into one of those pesky hitters that seem to give the Yankees trouble every year.

  246. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 2:16 pm

    gayle -

    $250 to $800?! We generally go to individual games; we’ve never had any sort of season plan, so I wasn’t really paying close attention. I know people have been upset about the raise prices, but that kind of a hike really takes it out of the range of affordability for a lot of people, I’d guess.

    Even if the economy wasn’t in trouble, who exactly are the Yankees thinking are going to be able to come up with this kind of money?

    I understand why they prefer full season holders to partial and either of those to single-game attendees – you want the guaranteed, steady income. But they may be being foolish here. There’s a huge part of their fan base who’ll be deciding to finally buy that large flat screen and refinish their basements to watch the games in HD on YES and end up saving money. Who’s going to take their place?

  247. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 2:16 pm

    SOS:

    House and Criminal Minds are two I’ll make a point of watching. Other than that. Not a whole lot.

  248. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 2:16 pm

    “Will White,in 1879 for Cinci, pitched 680 innings, with a record of 43-31 and ERA of 1.99.”

    lol –

    He was juicing! (old school)

  249. Wave Your Hat September 25th, 2008 at 2:17 pm

    The fact is, this year will be only the third time CC has gone over 200 innings. Nolan Ryan threw more than 200 innings routinely, as did Roger in his prime. My guess if you look at pitchers like CC, you’ll see a lot were able to sustain that workload.

    I’m concerned about it, but not that much given the Yanks’ alternatives.

  250. mel September 25th, 2008 at 2:18 pm

    SoS,

    School open house, not real estate.

    Good parents show up to those.

  251. Mike R September 25th, 2008 at 2:19 pm

    raymagnetic,

    I’m just trying to say that he really does have a lot less to play for now that he has a contract that will take him to retirement. Players ABSOLUTELY play harder in contract years, and A-Rod isn’t an exception to that.

    In the cases of CEO’s, I think a lot of their passion toward their companies come from the fact that it is THEIR company and they are the top dog. That’s where A-Rod differs, it will never be HIS team.

    Jeter will always have that benefit, and I think having that certainly helps to create the passion that the fans love him for having.

  252. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 2:19 pm

    Ray,

    The difference between RJ and CC is, CC has come from an era where pitch count was prevelent from high school to the majors. RJ didn’t.

    Also, that workload by RJ led to 3 back surgeries. So far, CC has avoided the knife.

    If you are the winning bidder for his services, his physical condition becomes a big issue. Just something to think about as this thing goes forward.

    I’m in the camp of Buster re: Abreu. I think they offer arbitration, he rejects it, and they get 2 picks for him.

    I can’t see Bobby leaving 2 years and over 30 million on the table.

  253. 86w183 September 25th, 2008 at 2:19 pm

    What’s troubling to me about CC’s workload is the needless innings both Cleveland and Milwaukee put him through. Getting complete games in 9-1 wins, for example is wasteful. He started slowly last year and I bet he does next year to, but proper;y handled he’s an old school stud who I think is well worth the risk.

    One interesting thing about the upcoming offseason is the order in which things happen. The Yanks have to decide on arbitration offers to their FA before anything else unless the sign them. My guess is Arbeu gets offered and both Mussina and Pettite get one year deals. The others are sent packing.

    Then you sign CC or AJ and go to work on Tex/1B.

    I think CF will be the last thing settled.

  254. pat September 25th, 2008 at 2:19 pm

    “I’m fine with Gardner if the rest of the line up performs like it’s supposed to and doesn’t pull a Giambi with RISP!”

    With their payroll capabilities, it’s time for the Yankees to have players who can hold their own on both sides of the ball rather expect other players to compensate for them.

    Not everyone is going to hit .300 every year but hitting .200 isn’t going to cut it.

  255. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 2:19 pm

    “Did catch Heroes and Law & Order though. Got to pay attention to the shows from the beginning, since I won’t be watching Yankee baseball in October. :waaaahhhh:”

    mel, did you like those Heroes episodes? I thought it was much better than last season, but I did see some people on the Internet complaining. Some fans are never happy.

  256. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 2:20 pm

    “The last 3 years of Jason Giambi’s contract hamstrung the Yankees pretty good. It prevented them from being able to do certain things to improve the team. It definitely killed them at first base, as Giambi’s skilled declined. Do we want to repeat that again?”

    sj,
    Exactly the reason i wouldnt give Tex a long term deal. Get a first baseman by trade.

  257. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:21 pm

    SJ: I’d argue against giving a long term contract to anyone regardless of the state of the economy!

    I’m still not a fan of Alex’s contract. It’s good for the next couple years, but by the end of that contract? He’s likely going to be a huge liability and the Yankees won’t be able to do anything about it!

    Doreen: It’s crazy. I have o idea how people are going to be able to pay for that.

    If I could ask the Steinbrothers one thing, it’d be, what do you say to the base of young Yankee fans that can only afford bleacher seats? How do you keep them supporting your team?

  258. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 2:21 pm

    Rebecca -

    That was faster than I expected. And I hope it’s effective.

    It also makes me wonder why there has to be an actual crisis for Congress to work together, instead of, as one legislator put it, “kicking the can down the road” for someone else to work out at another time. :(

  259. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 2:23 pm

    “I can’t see Bobby leaving 2 years and over 30 million on the table.”

    I see this posted all the time. We don’t know what is in Bobby’s heart. Maybe playing for the Yankees means enough to him that he’s willing to take a hit in salary and years. Maybe CC wants to be a Yankee. We just don’t know and won’t for a few months now. The waiting will be brutal especially since we won’t be watching Yankees baseball after Sunday.

  260. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 2:23 pm

    “SoS,

    School open house, not real estate.

    Good parents show up to those.”

    lol. Yeah i know you were talking about a school open house. Im a good parent. I have the baby sitter go to them with a tape recorder.

  261. Forntoso September 25th, 2008 at 2:24 pm

    I would be thrilled if we could get CC for $140.

    I am expecting more along the lines of $175 mil (for him to forgo the West Coast and come here)

  262. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 2:24 pm

    “I’m still not a fan of Alex’s contract. It’s good for the next couple years, but by the end of that contract? He’s likely going to be a huge liability and the Yankees won’t be able to do anything about it!”

    Not necessarily. Alex takes good care of himself. He may be as productive in year 9 as he is in year 5. We’ll have to wait and see.

  263. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 2:25 pm

    Laura,
    Heroes season premier was the best yet of the 3 seasons. My prediction is the lab guy that injected that stuff will turn bad.

  264. Mike R September 25th, 2008 at 2:25 pm

    The thought of a 40 year old A-Rod making 28 million dollars and still having 3 years left is terrifying to me…

  265. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 2:25 pm

    “Maybe playing for the Yankees means enough to him that he’s willing to take a hit in salary and years”

    You’ve got to be kidding.

  266. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 2:27 pm

    “Not necessarily. Alex takes good care of himself. He may be as productive in year 9 as he is in year 5. We’ll have to wait and see.”

    We’ll just need to bring in the LF fence 5 feet every year in the last few years of the contract :)

  267. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 2:27 pm

    Rebecca -

    If you want young people to connect with the game, they need to, every once in a while, get to sit where the action is, where you can see the faces of the people you’re rooting for, and actually hear the sounds of the game, not just look down on silent “ants” on the field.

    There is nothing like being able to sit close to the field at least once in your life at a major league baseball game.

    At some point, I would think those ticket prices are going to have to have a “correction.”

  268. pat September 25th, 2008 at 2:28 pm

    “I’m just trying to say that he really does have a lot less to play for now that he has a contract that will take him to retirement.”

    I think A-Rod is the person least focused on the money he makes. He strikes me as someone more legacy focused than money focused.

    He doesn’t want to be known as the richest baseball player, he wants to be known as the best baseball player.

    He will continue to play hard for the legacy not because of the money.

  269. vin September 25th, 2008 at 2:28 pm

    “We’ll just need to bring in the LF fence 5 feet every year in the last few years of the contract ”

    As long as it’s gradual, no one will notice… kind of like how LA and San Francisco will be neighbors in a million years.

  270. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 2:28 pm

    Continuation –

    That will only happen if people stop going to the games and stop buying season ticket plans. Because wouldn’t you rather sell 100 seats for $10 each than 0 seats for $50?

  271. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 2:28 pm

    Laura,

    Heart, head and agents all affect thinking.

    Bobby Abreu is 35 years old. This is his last chance to cash in and the year he had is going to allow him to do so.

    While he may love playing with the Yankees (which he does), he’s not leaving 30 million bucks on the table.

    As fans, we all want to think players will do things for the “love of the game”. Many of them do. That’s why they get involved with charities.

    When it comes to their contracts, its all business.

    Mike Lowell left one year and about 15 million on the table to go to Boston. If they Phillies offered 5 years instead of 4, he would have gone to Philadelphia, regardless of how much he loves playing in Boston.

    Posada would have taken the Mets 4 year offer had the Yankees not added a 4th year to his offer.

    Nobody loves playing for the Yankees more than Posada. However, its a business and guys, especially guys cashing in at the end of their careers (like Abreu) are less likely to leave significant dollars/years on the table.

  272. vin September 25th, 2008 at 2:29 pm

    “He will continue to play hard for the legacy not because of the money.”

    Exactly… at the end of the day, Alex is the least of our worries.

  273. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 2:29 pm

    vin -

    I like that idea! :lol:

  274. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 2:30 pm

    “We’ll just need to bring in the LF fence 5 feet every year in the last few years of the contract”

    THE HOUSE THAT AROD BUILT.

  275. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 2:31 pm

    “He doesn’t want to be known as the richest baseball player, he wants to be known as the best baseball player. ”

    Wow – I’m not an A-Rod hater, but he has broken the bank twice. You can blame the agent if you want (or really, Tom Hicks, the owner of the Rangers) – but money is clearly a huge driver.

    I don’t really object to that – it isn’t my money after all.

    The only downside is if the pressure hampers his performance – which it only seems to in even numbered years :lol:

  276. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:32 pm

    Doreen: Completley agreed.

    When people ask me what to do I tell them the best thing is to go to a road game-Toronto, Baltimore…cheaper tickets and in some respects more fun.

    But I have a feeling the Steinbrothers are very out of touch with Yankee fans of my generation.

    We’re a generation too young to remember anything before Derek Jeter (okay, some of us might remember an old Mattingly, but not me), and we’re not used to sitting on our bums in October.

    It might do them some good to figure out what it’s like for us–considering we’ll be the ones buying season tickets in a few years!

  277. Russell NY September 25th, 2008 at 2:33 pm

    I’m buying bleacher seats from day 1. Going to be tough getting tickets.

  278. Mike R September 25th, 2008 at 2:33 pm

    “I think A-Rod is the person least focused on the money he makes. He strikes me as someone more legacy focused than money focused.”

    You’re right. His future personal accolades are what he plays for now since his contract is already locked in.

    Money is no concern of his anymore, he took care of that last year.

  279. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 2:35 pm

    Rebecca -

    Cleveland is close enough, too, if you like to drive.

    But you shouldn’t have to travel out of state to see your team play.

    The other option is to go to more minor league games. We’re lucky enough to live close to Trenton, so we take in a couple of Thunder games every year. The best seats in the house cost $10. There is no better bargain.

    But it’s not major league baseball. And it’s not “the” Yankees.

  280. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 2:37 pm

    Rebecca,

    Honest suggestion. I would write a letter to Hal Steinbrenner and talk openly and honestly about your concerns.

    I think its a very legitimate issue and I think its something he should hear about from younger Yankee fans.

    I’ve had season tickets for over 20 years. I’ve been going to the stadium a LOT longer than that.

    I’ve seen the place change a lot over the years and I agree that younger fans are getting squeezed out too much.

    I think its in your best interests to write Hal and communicate your concerns. They are very legitimate.

  281. chambliss September 25th, 2008 at 2:39 pm

    To follow SJ’s theme about the economny, if I were running the Yankees I would be very nervous about the impact of the economy on the finances of the organization. As with all new ballparks, corporate dollars are counted on in a major way for revenue. NYC is (or was) the financial capital of the World. There will be a lot of corporate budget restructuring going on in the next few months and years, and entertainment and marketing budgets are likely to be slashed.

  282. Oddessy September 25th, 2008 at 2:39 pm

    To be honest, I would give Cc a blank check, literately.

    If he wants $25 mil for 7 years, give it to him. Let hm name his price as long as it isin’t over $200 million or 8 years.

  283. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 2:41 pm

    “Nobody loves playing for the Yankees more than Posada. However, its a business and guys, especially guys cashing in at the end of their careers (like Abreu) are less likely to leave significant dollars/years on the table.”

    Like I said, we’ll see. One thing is clear; this is going to be one of the most interesting off seasons in years.

  284. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:41 pm

    SJ: Tell me where to send it and I’ll handwrite it.

    I’m 100% dead serious. My email is rebecca@puristbleedspinstripes.com

    It really does matter to me–the one thing I’ve always wanted to do is to buy season tickets, and while techinically I can afford them, I won’t buy anything more than a partial package for bleacher or tier seats that I can split with someone because otherwise it’s not cost effective.

    When you consider how much it costs to just get to the Stadium, and to buy concessions, it’s not a good recipe for maintaining the fan base when you haven’t had a ring in eight years to back it up.

  285. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 2:42 pm

    Kazmir = 8 homers allowed over his last 14 innings

    Wonder if he’s gassed?

  286. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 2:42 pm

    “Heroes season premier was the best yet of the 3 seasons. My prediction is the lab guy that injected that stuff will turn bad.”

    This is one of the few complaints that I have. Mohinder injecting himself with the serum was straight out of the Fly. Just a little too cliche.

  287. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 2:42 pm

    “Money is no concern of his anymore, he took care of that last year.”

    You mean she took care of it last year and this year. Maybe he knew he would have to give up half someday and went for the jugular contract.

  288. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:43 pm

    chambliss: London is now, and the scary thing is they lag behind New York, so the financial crisis will hit them, and it will be worse than it is here.

    Doreen: Best deal is Syracuse. $8 for first row seats. If you go on a rainy, cold night you can wander through the park, take a seat by the bullpen and even interact with the pitchers.

    Seriously, one of the best memories I have from my time at Syracuse is going to an AAA game on such a night.

  289. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 25th, 2008 at 2:44 pm

    Rebecca-

    I agreed every word you said. As for me, I started to follow the Yanks since mid ’95 season, which it was Mattingly’s final season as a Yankee. It does feel weird now that the Yanks isn’t playing in October now. However, I’m a Nets fan, I should be use to the fact that my favorite team isn’t playing in the playoffs. The Yanks not playing in October does make me feel a bit “weezy”.

  290. Cobra 272 September 25th, 2008 at 2:46 pm

    It sucks that the hot stove only starts to get active after Thanksgiving… too long to wait. So much intrigue this year.

    Though the Cashman situation and the rumors will start to fly soon after the regular season ends, so atleast there will be some interesting things to watch early on.

  291. Noreaster September 25th, 2008 at 2:46 pm

    Rebecca,
    I’m not an expert, but to my untrained eye Gardner does not look strong enough to hit the ball hard with any consistency. I worry that he is overmatched. But I really like the guy and hope the best.

  292. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:47 pm

    Ed: At least we have the Devils–who’s current playoff run is exceeded only by the Red Wings.

  293. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 2:47 pm

    Laura,
    Very interesting. Never watched the fly so i wasnt aware of that. And here i thought it was something original. Gotta admit it was still good.

  294. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 2:48 pm

    Rebecca,

    I just sent you the address.

  295. yanksrule September 25th, 2008 at 2:49 pm

    Gardner out of hitting in the nine spot would be a great thing because if he doesn’t get on base, so what? cuz the top of the order is coming up and if he does get on i’ll take the chances that damon, jeter, or a-rod will drive him in.

  296. 86w183 September 25th, 2008 at 2:50 pm

    Minor League Ball is the best deal there is, especially if you can follow your favorite team’s prospects. I drove down to Lakelaand years go to see a stud LHP the Yankees had who had star written all over him.

    He was dominant that evening and I remember telling everyone who would listen to be that he was a future All Star for sure.

    Whatever happened to Brien Taylor?

  297. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:51 pm

    SJ: Recieved.

    Ooh, this is fun, I feel like an activist!

    But on a more serious note, it means too much to me not to do it.

  298. dan 771 September 25th, 2008 at 2:51 pm

    gardner will never hit enough at the ML level.

    at best, he will be betemit without the power but with speed. tons of strikeouts, not much contact, that type of hitter.

    he is just too small and weak, the bat always flies out of his hands. the only way he has a chance is if he perfects the bunt single.

  299. Mike R September 25th, 2008 at 2:52 pm

    “You mean she took care of it last year and this year. Maybe he knew he would have to give up half someday and went for the jugular contract.”

    Never thought of it in terms of the wife before, good point.

  300. Bruce September 25th, 2008 at 2:52 pm

    I think I am leaning towards the best move for the organization being to let Gardner play center field next year. Its not a great free agent crop, so why sign a mediocre guy who is just going to block Jackson once he is ready? We didn’t not make the playoffs this season because of lack of production in center (although Melky’s lack of production did not help).

    I think the key offensively is to add one all around hitter type to the lineup (Texeira?). If you do that, you lengthen the lineup and you can hide Gardner in the 9-hole, and he might just steal you a few games with his legs. After next season, the old men in left come off the books, there are more free agent outfield types, Jackson may be ready, and perhaps we can put a younger, more athletic and versatile outfield on the field.

  301. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 2:52 pm

    SJ:

    This from Keith Law. Your thoughts? Where’s the Yankees?

    Niel (Dallas): What team has the most pitching in their minor league system?

    Keith Law: (1:08 PM ET ) Texas. Tampa, Boston, San Francisco too.

  302. Meaningless Stats September 25th, 2008 at 2:53 pm

    Forget Gardner, why not just get Ichiro? He is available, his teammates almost beat him up.

  303. BB September 25th, 2008 at 2:54 pm

    Rays is formidable team,and Redsox is too. Both of them have great lineup and sharp starters,and always can struggle to the very end for victory in every game. It will be difficult for Yankees to surpass them in 2009. Garnder’s positive attitude is benefit to the team,but I really worry about his hitting. Besides,I don’t think the Yankees lineup of this season will be able to surpass Rays and Redsox in 2009. Although Yankees got a lot of wins recently,but it’s still too late. We really need a more active and younger team and get the best pitchers and better outfield players.

    Get A.J.Bernett(he pitch well in AL East)
    Get Mammy (his WPA is 7.06)(top)
    Get Mark Teixeira (his WPA is 5.98)

  304. jk September 25th, 2008 at 2:54 pm

    It will be a tough sale for premium seats in the new Stadium. I spoke to the ticket office a few weeks ago and they said premium seats in the main level and field level were available. Theses seats are $350 and up per seat per game, some are north of $1,000.

    No one from Lehman, Bear Stearns, AIG, or Merrill will be buying these. The Yankees had to be assuming large sales to Wall Street. They can forget about it now.

    When the bleacher creatures yell “box seats suck” in the new Stadium, they might be yelling at a bunch of empty seats.

  305. S.o.S.27 September 25th, 2008 at 2:55 pm

    What exact injury did Brien Taylor have that surgury and rehab couldnt get him back out there?

  306. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 25th, 2008 at 2:55 pm

    Want to see something cool and creative?

    Rebuilding the “House that Ruth built” with Legos!

  307. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 2:56 pm

    Ed: I saw that! It’s amazing!

  308. Fredo Corleone September 25th, 2008 at 2:57 pm

    “What exact injury did Brien Taylor have that surgury and rehab couldnt get him back out there?”

    I thought it was a shoulder injury sustained when he was trying to get his brother out of a barfight or something like that.

  309. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 2:57 pm

    Fredo,

    Next level after those teams. Although, I think he overvalued Boston’s arms. I like Law. Yes, he can be snarky but, he’s got a good eye for talent. In this instance, I think his evaluation of Boston’s arms is a bit overdone. I don’t think their high level arms are as good as the Yankees at the present time.

    The Yankees pitching development is going to depend on guys like Brackman, McAllister, Betances and Humberto Sanchez.

    Brackman alone could take the Yankees to a Top 3 level because his ceiling is very high.

    If those guys project, as I believe Melancon and Hughes will, I put the Yankees right in there among the best in the game right now.

    That would be 6 pretty high level pitching prospects. That’s about as good as one can ask for, IMO.

  310. Weak Knees Willy September 25th, 2008 at 2:57 pm

    Why not trade Robinson Cano to the Dodgers for Matt Kemp?

  311. eric September 25th, 2008 at 2:58 pm

    Melkey is a 4th OF, at best. not even a question.

  312. TeKNetick September 25th, 2008 at 2:59 pm

    Texas is loaded… they took the Braves to the cleaners.

    Tampa has Price, Mcgee, Davis, Niemenn, Hellickson… no doubt they will spin a lot of thoe guys into position help and probably Houston Street or a good closer, they will be even tougher next yr.

    San Fran has Madison Buddinger, a power lefty who completely annihilated the SAL this year. They also have Sosa. Both those guys have Brackman/Betances talent with a much higher chance of reaching it.

    Boston, well what can you say, they are the model organization in baseball right now.

  313. Russell NY September 25th, 2008 at 2:59 pm

    “When the bleacher creatures yell “box seats suck” in the new Stadium, they might be yelling at a bunch of empty seats.”

    Haha, very funny :)

  314. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 2:59 pm

    You know, you have to really, REALLY like the Yankees to buy those seats!!! Or have 80 friends to split the bill and even THEN you’d have to really like the Yankees.

    Imagine the choice – a 4-day getaway vacation, or one night at Yankee Stadium? (Assuming 4 seats costing $350 each)

  315. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 25th, 2008 at 3:00 pm

    Rebecca: I would want to do too but I don’t think I have the time and patience doing it. school is stressful already. LOL.

  316. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 3:00 pm

    “Forget Gardner, why not just get Ichiro? He is available, his teammates almost beat him up.”

    I just scanned that Deadspin article – I think Ichiro is a pure stud – but if we can’t pry away freaking Washburn I doubt they can bargain in good faith for their coverboy.

  317. vtred September 25th, 2008 at 3:01 pm

    As Bill Madden said on SNY yesterday, we have nothing in our farm system. Thats why things will get worse before it gets better, especially in the likely scenario we don’t get CC.

  318. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 25th, 2008 at 3:02 pm

    Texas is loaded… they took the Braves to the cleaners.

    correction, Texas is loaded with catchers. so I don’t know what you thinking about Texas being loaded. Expect the Yanks doing alot of talking with Texas this offseason.

  319. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 3:04 pm

    “Why not trade Robinson Cano to the Dodgers for Matt Kemp?”

    Why trade one head case for another? Plus, LAD loves the guy. Now if you want to take Juan Pierre or Andruw Jones off of their hands, LAD may listen. But thinking that they are going to deal Kemp is just a fantasy.

  320. bdog375 September 25th, 2008 at 3:04 pm

    Yes, centerfield is an interesting position. The upside of Gardner is huge. I still do think that Melky should be written off. His offseason this year is huge. He has obvious talent, and he is younger than Gardner. It will be interesting to see how he shows up next spring. If he works hard this offseason he should be right back into the mix. He could be a good right fielder down the road.

  321. Meaningless Stats September 25th, 2008 at 3:05 pm

    I’d give up Kennedy for Ichiro. They can also have Igawa, Karstens, and Rasner if they want.

    If they want a position payer, give them Melky, Duncan, Miranda etc.

  322. Trevor September 25th, 2008 at 3:06 pm

    Jon Heyman on with Francesa now.

  323. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 25th, 2008 at 3:06 pm

    I just scanned that Deadspin article – I think Ichiro is a pure stud – but if we can’t pry away freaking Washburn I doubt they can bargain in good faith for their coverboy.

    Ichiro could be a good replacement for Abreu in the #3 hole and is better defensively. Just shift Nady to 1B. Sorry, Ichiro isn’t getting #51.

    no i’m not purposing a trade for Ichiro.

  324. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 3:07 pm

    “I’d give up Kennedy for Ichiro. They can also have Igawa, Karstens, and Rasner if they want. ”

    Well, since we have already traded Karstens, this would be difficult.

  325. TurnTwo September 25th, 2008 at 3:10 pm

    “Brackman alone could take the Yankees to a Top 3 level because his ceiling is very high.”

    i dont think KLaw has ever been a Brackman guy, which is why the yankees would fall off his radar.

    id take Ichiro for IPK and some spare parts if the Mariners want to get rid of his salary, but i wouldnt give up much more than that.

    Id be open to deals that would bring over Matt Kemp or Colby Rasmus, who both have huge ceilings as young players.

    id also look into David Dejesus in KC, not a big player, but just like the way he plays the game.

    id have no problem giving CF to Gardner if thats what they want to do, but i have a hard time believing they’ll give him the keys to start spring training without a backup.

    i wouldnt let Damon play CF full time. i prob actually would try and move him, too, if i could get something useful for him.

  326. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 3:10 pm

    “Well, since we have already traded Karstens, this would be difficult.”

    Like anyone would notice! lol. Just give IPK a Karstens jersey.

  327. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 3:10 pm

    Getting your farm system info from Bill Madden is your first mistake.

    Bill Madden couldn’t name 3 people in the Yankees farm system.

    They have arms, and some of those arms helped the team this year. They are light on position players above A Ball.

    That’s not news.

    That said, if you want a stocked farm system, don’t sign Type A free agents. I don’t think Bill wants the Yankees to go down that road or he would have nothing to complain about.

    Its about striking a balance. To that end, the Yankees are still a work in progress.

  328. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 3:11 pm

    We’ve got quite a bit at our farm system at the A and AA levels. We’re a couple years behind other teams, but we’re on the right track.

  329. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 3:13 pm

    “Like anyone would notice! lol. Just give IPK a Karstens jersey.”

    LOL!

  330. SJ44 September 25th, 2008 at 3:13 pm

    Sure, anybody would give up Kennedy for Ichiro.

    Problem is, the Mariners wouldn’t take it.

    Start with Montero, Hughes and Jackson. Then you get their attention. BTW, that would be nuts to do.

    You aren’t going to pry Ichiro away from Seattle (especially since he has a no trade clause) for underperforming minor league prospects.

    The Mariners wanted Austin Jackson for Jarrod Washburn. What do you think they will want for Ichiro?

  331. G. Love September 25th, 2008 at 3:14 pm

    I’m almost setting my mind that we won’t get CC. I think there is always another team that goes nuts for the big fish every off season. Whether it be Zito, Hampton, Brown, Chan Ho Park, etc. There is always some owner that blows everyone, including the Yanks, out of the water and that’s where the player goes.

    My gut feeling, for some odd reason, is SF goes nuts for CC. I know, you would think after Zito they wouldn’t do it, but I think they will and I think they’ll trade Cain for a top hitter and start building that club to be a power again.

    If we lose CC, as I expect we will, I think a rotation with AJ, Wang, Joba, Moose and Pettitte with Hughes/Aceves waiting in the wings is fine to start the season. We’d have power K arms in Joba and AJ. We’d have an off speed master in Moose. We’d have the sinker baller in Wang and finally we’d have the durable lefty in Andy.

    When one of them goes down, Hughes/Aceves and maybe even Coke gets their shot.

    If we do get CC though, I think that leaves Andy or Moose home next season.

    As for Mr. Melky, he played himself out of the teams plans and it’s going to take a lot more than a hot spring to get this organization to ever give him the kind of rope they gave him this season.

    It’s in his best interests and the clubs interest to trade him so we can break up the Cano/Melky situation which

  332. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 3:16 pm

    “Bill Madden couldn’t name 3 people in the Yankees farm system.”

    I just have an intuition that if David Robertson, Phil Coke, and Mark Melancon walked into a room with Madden – he couldn’t pin name tags on the correct guys. :)

  333. TurnTwo September 25th, 2008 at 3:16 pm

    “The Mariners wanted Austin Jackson for Jarrod Washburn. What do you think they will want for Ichiro?”

    i think everyone realizes that. the point of the ichiro conversation, at least for me, is that you are offering to take his entire contract and let them rebuild.

    now that you’re going to have a stable, new GM who’s going to come in, make a lot of changes, reevaluate players and personnel, its not out of the question to think that if they move to tear it all down, you can pick him off the mariner tree.

    but of course, noone is trading Hughes, Montero, and whatever else for him.

  334. G. Love September 25th, 2008 at 3:17 pm

    I’m okay going into the spring with Gardner plan A, Damon plan B in CF as long we improve the 1b situation.

    I like Gardner. He hit that triple the other night in Toronto and for all of you saying he can’t drive the ball to the gap, you should check that hit out.

    He seems to be making strides at the plate and with his speed, his ATTITUDE and the fact that he knows he’s one step away from losing his job to someone every day, I think he’ll be very motivated.

    We haven’t had a speed threat like that on this team in a very long time.

    It’s long overdue.

    Less 3 run homers and more running 1st to 3rd on a base hit is what this team needs.

  335. TurnTwo September 25th, 2008 at 3:19 pm

    “Less 3 run homers and more running 1st to 3rd on a base hit is what this team needs.”

    agreed.

  336. ray (sox fan) September 25th, 2008 at 3:19 pm

    Speaking of Ichiro, I heard a brief report on a Fox Sports radio station.

    They said there was a report out of Seattle that earlier in the year some Mariner players were so upset at Ichiro, that they “wanted to beat him up”. I am quoting their exact words.

    SJ or anyone else know what in the world that is all about?

    Thanks.

  337. Fran September 25th, 2008 at 3:20 pm

    I think that the Yanks have a real good shot at Burnett since according to the announcers and some sports writers, he has indicated that he want to play here.

  338. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 25th, 2008 at 3:20 pm

    i think everyone realizes that. the point of the ichiro conversation, at least for me, is that you are offering to take his entire contract and let them rebuild.

    Ichiro did wanted to come here before he resigned with the Mariners last season.

  339. MAtt September 25th, 2008 at 3:21 pm

    My Shooping List

    1- Sign CC at any Cost! the guy is going through hell just to get a chance to win with the Brewers Imagaine what he’d do for the Yanks.

    2- Trade Cano. I really dont think that it would be selling low on him because everyone knows the kid’s potential. I especially like the idea of sending him to the Dodgers
    (ie Larry Bowa) in return for Kemp who can play the entire outfield and a pitching prospect.

    3-Sign Manny! Hell hath no fury like a Manny scorned!

    4- trade some of our pitching to land a 1b like Prince Fielder or Ryan Howard who are both trade candidates this offseason.

    Imagine that team!

  340. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 3:21 pm

    ray -

    check out

    http://deadspin.com/5054756/we.....-on-ichiro

  341. G. Love September 25th, 2008 at 3:21 pm

    Turn Two — I meant less “waiting” for 3 run homers. Obviously if the team hits 2 3 run homers a night most nights we win.

    I just think we have to build that offense where guys have roles and everyone isn’t a 3-4 hitter out of place in the order.

  342. TurnTwo September 25th, 2008 at 3:23 pm

    “I meant less “waiting” for 3 run homers. Obviously if the team hits 2 3 run homers a night most nights we win.”

    yeah, i got what you meant, still agree.

  343. ray (sox fan) September 25th, 2008 at 3:25 pm

    Thank you TK. Interesting story that really surprised me.

  344. vin September 25th, 2008 at 3:26 pm

    Ichiro is way too important to that franchise for them to just give him up. Everyone knows Ichiro in Seattle… even non-baseball fans. Without him, they’re the Royals – without the 80′s.

  345. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 25th, 2008 at 3:27 pm

    trade some of our pitching to land a 1b like Prince Fielder or Ryan Howard who are both trade candidates this offseason.

    Fielder and Howard would make Giambi look like a gold glover. if that’s the case, I rather keep Giambi.

  346. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 3:29 pm

    Funny note from the Mariner blog – (we think we have it bad!)

    “THE OFFICIAL 100/100 CLUB OF MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL

    Established: Sept. 24, 2008

    Founder: Seattle Mariners

    Chairman: Seattle Mariners

    President: Seattle Mariners

    Members: Seattle Mariners

    2008 Membership dues: $117.6 million”

  347. pat September 25th, 2008 at 3:29 pm

    “I think that the Yanks have a real good shot at Burnett since according to the announcers and some sports writers, he has indicated that he want to play here.”

    Rumor has it that he professed his love for Boston when they were in town too. His mama raised no fool.

  348. TurnTwo September 25th, 2008 at 3:29 pm

    “Fielder and Howard would make Giambi look like a gold glover.”

    except Fielder is still young enough to hit you 40 HRs a season for the next 10 years.

  349. Paulie September 25th, 2008 at 3:29 pm

    1- Sign CC at any Cost! the guy is going through hell just to get a chance to win with the Brewers Imagaine what he’d do for the Yanks.

    Umm..yeah, he’s not pitching for 180 million dollars or anything, thus putting enormous wear and tear on his arm in the process. But, you’re probably right – he really, really wants to win with the Brewers. He’s totally not thinking about that huge NY paycheck (or LA paycheck), and he really does care what happens in year two of that deal. He’s probably different than ALL other players.

  350. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 3:30 pm

    Matt, your shopping list needs adjusting.

    1- Sign CC at any Cost!
    By the time MIL is done with him, CC will spend most of next season on the DL. Plus, he wants to play in LA. I don’t want a guy who only came here for the money.

    2- Trade Cano.
    No, it’s not selling low; it’s selling stupid. Cano has too much potential to give away. Plus, as I mentioned before, LAD is not parting with Kemp.

    3-Sign Manny!
    The day this idiot becomes a Yankee is the day I walk away from the team.

    4- trade some of our pitching to land a 1b like Prince Fielder or Ryan Howard who are both trade candidates this offseason.
    Boras is going to try and get Texeira 7 yrs so I’m prepared to pass at him. I’d take Fielder before I’d take Howard.

  351. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 3:32 pm

    My letter to Hal Steinbrenner is already three pages long! Whee!

  352. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 25th, 2008 at 3:32 pm

    except Fielder is still young enough to hit you 40 HRs a season for the next 10 years.

    true that but as a DH. lol

  353. Braintrust September 25th, 2008 at 3:33 pm

    The Yanks should look into dealing for Matt Kemp for the outfield next year. I know they are going to go after CC, but they need a plan B, and it’s not Burnett.

  354. Paulie September 25th, 2008 at 3:34 pm

    You wanna get CC, Fielder/Howard, Kemp, and Manny whilst giving up a streaky second baseman who can’t keep his head on straight, and pitching prospects that failed terribly this year when give the chance to shine?
    Is there anything else you want? Maybe Tex? Maybe trade away Melky for Longoria and Pena? Maybe we can move Bruney for Webb?
    People don’t want failing players for ones that already perform. They don’t want the hype of what could be, they want the numbers, and at a cheaper price – which Cano is not.
    And, I’m pretty sure Burnett is going to the highest bidder, no matter the uniform they’re asking him to don.

  355. Paulie September 25th, 2008 at 3:35 pm

    If NY offered Cano for Kemp, LA would hang up the phone while laughing their arses off.

  356. Braintrust September 25th, 2008 at 3:35 pm

    Fielder is too damn fat. Any long term deal for him will be futile on the backend. You’re looking at a FT DH by the time he’s 30.

  357. Doreen September 25th, 2008 at 3:35 pm

    Rebecca –

    Whoa! That’s a novel!

  358. Prince Fielder's Knees September 25th, 2008 at 3:36 pm

    Please help us, we’re buckling!@!

  359. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 3:37 pm

    “You wanna get CC, Fielder/Howard, Kemp, and Manny whilst giving up a streaky second baseman who can’t keep his head on straight, and pitching prospects that failed terribly this year when give the chance to shine?
    Is there anything else you want? ”

    Probably to hit Lotto.

  360. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Can I get a Moose Bar? September 25th, 2008 at 3:37 pm

    Doreen: Not compared to my 350 page fantasy manuscript it isn’t :-P

    But yes, it’s long and handwritten. I’m putting a lot of effort into it!

  361. gayle September 25th, 2008 at 3:38 pm

    You know what I am looking forward to most for next year. Not having to hear about Joe Torre. I loved him while he was here and wish him nothing but the best of luck with The Dodgers but I think everyone needs to get over it. He is not with the Yankees and people need to moe on.

    Heyman and Francesa just said that Yankee fans are up in arms and it irks them to no end that Torre made the playoffs and Yankees didnt. You know what it doesnt bother me in the least and in fact i think it is the best thing that could have happened.

  362. TurnTwo September 25th, 2008 at 3:38 pm

    “Fielder is too damn fat. Any long term deal for him will be futile on the backend. You’re looking at a FT DH by the time he’s 30.”

    thats fine, he’s only 24 now. he can play 1B for me for the next 5 years, and then be my DH.

  363. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 3:38 pm

    “If NY offered Cano for Kemp, LA would hang up the phone while laughing their arses off.”

    Not before saying no to Kemp, but offering Andruw Jones instead.

  364. Ed - it's been a wild ride this past week, looking foward to 2009 now September 25th, 2008 at 3:38 pm

    Rebecca -

    if you do recieve a response from Hal, please post it up. I would love to see it. =)

  365. Burnett's Law September 25th, 2008 at 3:39 pm

    Anybody want to bet that AJ winds up on the DL at least once next year, maybe twice!

  366. randy l September 25th, 2008 at 3:39 pm

    g. love-

    for whatever it’s worth, my eyes don’t like gardner as a hitter at all. he’s really an awful looking hitter. no fluidity . very little bat speed. i’m fifty nine and i know i can hit a ball farther off a tee than he can. i really don’t like seeing that in yankee center fielders.

    if he couldn’t run as well as he does, he doesn’t seem to be much of an upgrade over bubba crosby.

    i think if he’s part of the discussion in any role but 4th outfielder the yankees are in trouble.

  367. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 3:40 pm

    “My letter to Hal Steinbrenner is already three pages long! Whee!”

    3 pages? Are you cutting the letters out of magazines? j/k

    :lol:

  368. Laura September 25th, 2008 at 3:40 pm

    “Heyman and Francesa just said that Yankee fans are up in arms and it irks them to no end that Torre made the playoffs and Yankees didnt. You know what it doesnt bother me in the least and in fact i think it is the best thing that could have happened.”

    I’m listening to this too. What annoys me about this conversation is that they are totally ignoring the fact that the Yankees are in the hardest division in the ML while Torre’s Dodgers are in the worst. I’m sorry, but you have to factor that in. You also have to factor in the arrival of Manny. No way LAD is in the playoffs if they don’t pick up MopHead.

  369. First Round Exit September 25th, 2008 at 3:40 pm

    I predict that the Dodgers will be playing golf on October 5th.

  370. vin September 25th, 2008 at 3:42 pm

    “3 pages? Are you cutting the letters out of magazines? j/k”

    Haha – too funny.

  371. PAT M September 25th, 2008 at 3:42 pm

    There must be a CF out there ( Kemp ) who will grow into the position…..Remember Micky Rivers, or better yet Elliot Maddox, who was a give away by Baltimore if I recall correctlt…..There will be many a trade to be made this offseason, that’s where the next CF is coming from…Melky & Gardner I just do not see hitting their way into a everyday player..I truly wish that would be the case….

  372. trisha - but what do I know September 25th, 2008 at 3:45 pm

    “I know you like to fall into your snippy stage when you get caught talking about things you know nothing about but, think for a minute.”

    SJ just let me say this. You’ve talked out of your butt and been wrong here more times than I can shake a stick at. You had Andy traded and were all over him like a cheap suit earlier in the season. You had Giambi going before the trade deadline and Ian Kennedy was your loving pet.

    I don’t think I’ve ever felt the need to make statements like the one you did above. Other people here may think you’re God and worship at your throne, and that’s fine. I don’t. I think though that your are obviously from what you said an older Italian male and growing up Italian I know how the older generation of men like to shake their fists when women defy them. I don’t play that game so it isn’t going to work with me.

    To me you are no more in the know than anyone else posting here. I think some of your posts make sense and others don’t, just like everyone else’s here from time to time. You call me out on something, I find the stats that deal with whatever you’ve mentioned, and you switch your argument when what you’ve said falls apart. I’ve seen you refer to people here as morons. I’ve seen you be extremely personally cutting. It seems to happen only when someone doesn’t fall all over your opinion on life.

    Since you’ve shown yourself to be wrong about things, I take your opinion the way I do everyone else’s here. If it makes sense then fine. If it appears to me that you’re coming from total negativity then that’s fine too. I don’t feel the need to debate everything with which I disagree, which would be a ton of stuff here – and I am sure that other posters would be debating with me constantly about some of the stuff I post with which they disagree. But not everyone feels the need to upstage every idea that differs from theirs. I know I don’t. And I have constantly said I know enough to know that I don’t know everything and that all I have is my opinion. Hard as it is for your to swallow, you are in the same boat.

    You have ardent fans here and that’s a nice thing. They can’t wait to hold onto every word that comes from your keyboard and there’s nothing wrong with that if it works for them. I on the other hand am a more critical thinker and don’t take any one person’s word for anything. I actually like to think about alternative ideas and see if they fit. If they don’t and I’m in agreement then that’s okay too.

    Last night Pat M. told me that I was in about 10% of the posters here about a certain idea that he had put out. That means 90% don’t agree. I can deal with the fact that I am in the minority way of thinking. Pat M on the other hand is someone whose ideas typically make sense to me. So I feel that maybe there is something to be said for the 10%. But I am not putting down the 90% who feel differently.

    Unless someone is in your percentage category on any give topic, it appears that you KNOW they are morons for not drinking your kool aid. If you can’t see there is something wrong with that then there is something dramatically wrong. I profer my opinions, I believe in them strongly, they make sense to me, but I never say they are the unequivocal way truth and light. I don’t lose sleep when others don’t see it the same way.

    I almost have to laugh about how much comfort if seems you have been able to give to other posters who are so protective of Andy Pettitte. You have been thanked so many times for being his vanguard that I lost count. Geeze are we all that insecure here that we feel personally violated if our favorite player is attacked. If that were the case, I’d be locked up in Bellevue right now since the kamikaze attack here started when I didn’t buy the party line on Wang, continued because I had the audacity to say that I thought Farnsworth was pitching well, and continued when I had the nerve to say I thought Ponson was doing the job for which he had been gotten. And now it continues because I point out that Andy Pettitte has been injury prone (289 days out of work with injuries in 7 years including 2 months “hurt” that weren’t counted as down days here.)

    I guess my question to you is have you been officially annointed the forum guru where you have infinite wisdom and anyone who disagrees is a moron, or is it possible that you could ever be wrong? I have my own thoughts on that but would like to know yours.

  373. Matt September 25th, 2008 at 3:48 pm

    I really don’t like the Idea of Gardner in center. I think He’d be a nice 4th OF but not a starter and the only way damon could play center is if we gave him a moped and a pitching machine to throw for him. Does anyone have any other Ideas about CF you guys scoffed at the Idea of acquiring Kemp so I’d like to hear some Ideas. I agree Prince isn’t the best option @ 1b but i do think Ryan Howard would be. The guy is going to hit at-least 40 homers and play adequate defense. We need a 1b, CF, and probably 2 Sps….any ideas? and please save me the build from within stuff Cashman always talks about. The teams of the 90′s that he had nothing to do with had a base core of home grown talent and the rest was built with FAs and trades. We also had younger position players and a veteran staff. sadly i think we can all say the reverse does not work as is evident this year. So lets hear it. who is playing 1b, CF, and SP’s next year?

  374. Wave Your Hat September 25th, 2008 at 3:49 pm

    I seriously doubt Gardner is the Yankee CF next year. He looked overpowered at the plate this year to me. He’s going to need to improve a lot, and I don’t see that happening.

    I still think the Yanks will make a trade to bring in a serviceable CF to bridge the gap until Austin Jackson is ready.

    Rebecca, I applaud your civic spirit, but you are tilting at windmills. Unfortunately, nothing is going to stop the revenue maximization drive. Watching YES is still pretty inexpensive, though.

  375. saucY September 25th, 2008 at 3:49 pm

    rebecca, i’d be hesitant on making it too long. like a resume, he may take a look at a ton of ink and discard it.

    good luck though. and keep us ‘posted’ :)

  376. MUDDYWATERS September 25th, 2008 at 3:59 pm

    Rebecca, I agree with Saucy. While you should get things off your chest so to speak, when you write the first draft, keep the letter you plan to send to two paragraphs.

    Busy people don’t bother to read long missives. When people write novels to them its going to be filed in the round filing cabinet (the waste can).

  377. Yanks in 09' September 25th, 2008 at 4:06 pm

    Please….just say NO to trading for Howard! yes, he hits homers in bunches, but he makes Giambi look like a gold glover…can’t run and strikes out at an epic pace…in the NATIONAL LEAGUE. In the AL Beast, he make K 220 times. NO THANKS!

    I LOVE Gardner! Plays the game the right way…great speed…hustles…covers ground in the field and has a good arm….BUT, can’t hit. (yet?) Question is, if Jackson is also quick, is a great outfielder and is the guy of the future…why not just put him out there next year?? Are we really worried he won’t at least hit the .210 that Gardner is hitting? If they’re gonna hit the same, give A Jax the experience.

  378. randy l September 25th, 2008 at 4:10 pm

    pat m-
    from seeing lots of good pro hitters , your eyes must cringe, as mine do ,when you watch gardner swing.

    if it was golf and we were playing with him, i’m sure we’d be looking down the fairway when he swung. his swing is that bad. he could put the on deck hitter in a slump just from watching him.

  379. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 4:13 pm

    If Gardner could simply become a proficient bunter he would become significantly more valuable.

    Does anyone around him realize this? It would seem to be patently obvious.

  380. PAT M September 25th, 2008 at 4:17 pm

    He’s just not a big league hitter…He’s made it this far due to other outstanding skills…I do believe it’s due to his ecellent speed, defense that he made it to AAA ball…Listen guys, if he can’t hit a lick by now, it’s not going to suddenly happen…Bunting and slapping the ball to the opposite fileld will help..That being said, he’s no Major Leaguer ……Tricia, I admire your convictions…Pick and choose your battles though…The one’s you can win….The Pettite issue is not one of them….Your intelligent, now be wise….

  381. trisha - but what do I know September 25th, 2008 at 4:24 pm

    Pat M then let me have this conversation with you. Pretend this isn’t about Andy. How can you not call someone who has been down 279 days in 7 years injury prone? I trust your judgement so I want to hear what you have to say. To me it is counterintuitive to say otherwise (about being injury prone).

  382. PAT M September 25th, 2008 at 4:33 pm

    The term injury prone at the Pro level, has as much to do with being hurt as it does with being unrelaible..It’s almost a label of being damamged goods….It’s the kiss of death when using that term with ballplayers..So much of the reaction / flack your getting has much to do with the term itself…Besides in my opinion, Andy Pettite can be counted on to take the hill just about every turn…I do see your point, however you may be off on your assesment of his lack of durability……Now, there are reservations about the future as his shoulder has become a chronic concern, but he’s a horse in book……Listen, we all take our lumps here, whether it be Hughes, or Kennedy I’ve taken many hits….Let it slide, and rise above it….

  383. Weak Knees Willy September 25th, 2008 at 4:41 pm

    To “Laura” and whoever else thinks the Cano for Kemp trade is crazy. Joe Torre and Larry Bowa have ALWAYS had a hard on for Robinson Cano. 2005 – batting .297 w/ 14 HR’s, 2006 – batting .342 w/ 15 HR’s, 2007 – batting .306 w/ 19 HR’s, 2008 – batting .264 w/ 14 HR’s.

    Here are the second basemen for the Dodgers, Jeff Kent, Blake Dewitt, Chin Lung Hu and Pablo Ozuna. That’s embarassing. Cano is better than all four and has a ton of potential as he has shown over the years. He is still a young and only getting better. Torre and Bowa bring out the best in him.

    Here at Matt Kemp’s numbers in 3 seasons. 2006 (52 games) – batting .289 w/ 7 HR’s. 2007 (98 games) – batting .342 w/ 10 HR’s. 2008 (1st full season) – batting .290 w/ 17 HR’s.

    His #’s are not above and beyond Cano’s. Even if you have to throw in another player like Melky, Veras or a minor league pitcher. Who cares to be honest. LAD outfield would be Manny, Jones, Pierre, and Melky.

  384. Weak Knees Willy September 25th, 2008 at 4:45 pm

    Cano has had 1 disappointing season (2008) since joining the Yanks. He is a very good player so don’t say he is worthless or has no trade value. Yanks need an outfielder and the Dodgers need a second baseman.

  385. Weak Knees Willy September 25th, 2008 at 4:47 pm

    And in case anyone else thinks otherwise, Gardner is terrible. His only talent is speed and he doesnt even know how to run the bases.

  386. TKinDC September 25th, 2008 at 4:48 pm

    “He’s just not a big league hitter…He’s made it this far due to other outstanding skills”

    Juan Pierre
    David Eckstein
    Corey Patterson
    Michael Bourn
    Chone Figgins

    Why not Gardner? I just sorted for high SB guys with mediocre averages. They all have their place on good teams.

  387. trisha - but what do I know September 25th, 2008 at 4:58 pm

    Pat M I’m good with it. I just have great difficulty with posters who have any air of condescension or feel the need to personally put down other posters and call them names just because they are not in agreement. SW in my opinion does that often. I don’t care who agrees and doesn’t agree about Andy. It won’t change my life any!

  388. Weak Knees Willy September 25th, 2008 at 5:04 pm

    Laura, Im new to this blog so I’m not too familiar with you or your posts but from what i can tell, you love to oppose everyone’s opinion. You act as if you should be the GM of the Yankees and your opinion is the right opinion.

    But i have another suggestion for 1st base. Trade for Morneau with the exception of Joba, Hughes and Jackson. Texiera is overrated. Imagine this lineup

    1. Damon DH
    2. Jeter SS
    3. Abreu RF
    4. A-Rod 3B
    5. Morneau 1B
    6. Nady LF
    7. Kemp CF
    8. Posada C
    9. Anyone including “Laura” 2B

    Let me guess Laura… you dont think a trade for Morneau is possible and the Yanks would be crazy to deal top prospects for him.

  389. PAT M September 25th, 2008 at 5:12 pm

    Tricia, Much of this forum is still about the good old boys
    mentality…So there are credibility issues at times I suspect…Let me further expand on this…..There are some that need to won over maybe…However there are some very good baseball people here….Sj, CB, Randy I, and several others are real sharp baseball guys, anlike myself are from the days before batting gloves, just pine tar…..Diplomacy may get lost in the translation sometimes, roll with it and do not take it personnally…….It comes off weak and will be precieved as whining or even crying…..Remmeber in A League of their own, Tom Hanks….There’s no crying in baseball….Not that you cry, it can be seen as such…..Look at this a hard ball…Dig in and swing hard….As I stated, you’re smart, now be wise….

  390. trisha - but what do I know September 25th, 2008 at 5:21 pm

    Pat M – good advice. I still think however there is a bit of hypocricy when someone says they are unequivocally right and then posts something that is unequivocally wrong – and still trashes everyone who doesn’t agree with his opinion.

    But I will do my best to rise above it.

  391. PAT M September 25th, 2008 at 5:24 pm

    Not worth the BS & aggrevation….This should be fun and insightful….

  392. bodhisattva September 25th, 2008 at 6:37 pm

    CB,

    Nice to see you posting again. Your voice is always worth listening to, and unlike some others, isn’t in love with its own sound.

    On Cabrera, I couldn’t agree more that he is an outstanding defender.

    Vin: Cabrera is in a select group of defenders. I won’t call him elite, because that’s an even smaller, rarer group. But he is excellent.

  393. No. 4 train straphanger September 25th, 2008 at 9:22 pm

    And so the illustrious Yankee career of Carl Pavano has come to a screeching halt.
    Will the violin section please step forward for a sad symphony minus an encore.

  394. No September 26th, 2008 at 3:08 am

    Re Brett Gardner: Love this bobblehead’s hustle in the field and on the basepaths. And if this were football, or if there were such a thing as a “designated fielder-runner,” I’d say, stick him in center. As it stands, however, he is just plain terrible at the plate. I don’t care if he’s gotten lucky the last few games. He’s quadruple-A at best.


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