Waiting for a move that was never made
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Oct 17, 2008 
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Just sitting here now looking over my scoresheet from last night’s game. One of the things I’ve always done is to cross players off the roster when they enter the game, just to have a sense what moves the managers can make.
Two names are jumping out: Tampa Bay LHPs Trever Miller and David Price.
If you are going to keep a pitcher like Price on the postseason roster, why not use him against David Ortiz in the seventh inning?
If you don’t want to use the rookie in that spot, use Miller. What is the point of having a LHP in the bullpen if not to use against a hitter like Ortiz? The Rays also had LHP J.P. Howell. Maybe manager Joe Maddon was saving him to close. But he still had two other lefties at his disposal.
Instead Maddon let RHP Grant Balfour face him and Ortiz awoke from his slumber and slugged a three-run homer that changed the tenor of the game. Next thing you know Gabe Gross is playing right field like Bobby Abreu and the series is going to Tampa.
“We’ve been doing that all year. Grant has been very good in that situation, actually,” Maddon said. “He just got him tonight.
If you had been watching us all season, that’s the situation where Grant has really done well. He’s been kind of like that middle closer guy, and I felt pretty good about it. Papi just got him.”
Ortiz hit .221 with five homers against LHPs this season. He is 1 for 11 against Miller in his career.
It was a very Joe Torre moment in that Maddon stuck with a guy in the circle of trust instead of going with the matchup that made sense.
Maybe it won’t matter. Maybe the Rays will score a bunch of runs off the ghost of Josh Beckett tomorrow and they’ll celebrate on the plastic grass of Tropicana Field. But if the Red Sox somehow figure out a way to win that game, Jon Lester will look very imposing in Game 7. And if you remember how the Yankees fared against Matt Garza this season, hitters can learn to sit on that fastball, read that late movement it has and have success.
As I was leaving Fenway, the Rays were trudging to their bus and I caught the eye of Cliff Floyd.
“Can you believe that stuff?” he said, only he didn’t say “stuff.”
I just nodded. Sometimes it’s better not to start a conversation at 1:15 a.m. after a game like that.
Which is why I say there is no magic that was aplain hiccup and Tampa ends it tomorrow.
I can’t believe this series is still going on, its seriously infuriating. If the Sox win again this year the ESPN drones will be able to spew their “WORLD CHAMPION BOSTON RED SOX” nonsense for another 18 months.
days like this are when you would much rather listen to michael kay than of francessa.
francessa always overdoes these things and makes it more than it really is. same with the torre thing.
Floyd has been here before, he knows how damaging a loss like this can be.
Pete,
I understand why Maddon stuck with Balfour against Ortiz since Ortiz has been so bad throughout the playoffs. I don’t get why he didn’t bring in a lefty to face JD Drew.
I can understand Maddon believing that Balfour could get Ortiz out. Sometimes, decisions don’t work out. That’s baseball.
However, if you’re going with Balfour in that situation, then why bother having two lefties, Price and Miller, on the roster in the first place? Logically, you put players on the roster because you think they can help you win. If you don’t have faith in them to pitch in a clutch spot – and, after all, the playoffs are a series of clutch spots – then why waster roster spots on them in the first place? They’re professionals, after all; this is what they’re paid to do.
Very poor logic and decision making, in my opinion. (As was taking out Kazmir in the first place. What was Maddon saving him for?)
We have already had a ton of comments suggesting Maddon should have gone to Miller or Price in the other threads.
That being said, it is truely astonishing to believe the Rays had the Sox down and out and all they had to do was step on their necks and put them out for good.
As a Yankee fan I know that when yyou give a team like the Red Sox/Angels/etc even a little bit of breathing room, a lot of times they can come back stronger.
The last thing they needed was for Ortiz to wake up, Drew to get back to June-like form, and both Beckett and Lester to have another shot at redemption.
Hopefully, the Rays can finish up the knockout punch come Saturday evening.
Pete no doubt. Garza is not imposing at all and Lester isin’t going to have 2 bad outings in a row.
Game 6 is the Rays game 7. They lose that, they are done. They are facing a Beckett that is seriously hurt and pitching on heart rather than stuff. Their ace is on the mound. They need to win.
Ciff Floyd might be the hero in game 6 since he knows how to handle the locker room w/ Maddon and Navarro, I keep telling you guys that the Rays are more hungry than the Sox, that BP knows they owe the organization one, Saturday they will end it.
Repost from last thread…
I may be optimistic, but I have to think the Yankees have the best shot at signing CC. Other teams may be reluctant to give out a long-term contract for big bucks with the current economic situation. The Yankees have a ton of money coming off their payroll and will be printing money with the new stadium next year. They can offer CC an absolutely absurd contract, and as long as he does not get hurt, he will be worth it. Sure he may not want to go just for the money, but I think one thing a lot of people are forgetting is that he is the premier free agent this offseason and the players’ union will place a lot of pressure on him to accept the biggest offer. If the Yankees offer 6/150 and the next best offer is 6/120, I think the union would strongly urge him to consider playing for the Yankees.
sign CC (CC, Wang, Joba, Pettite, Mussina/Hughes/Acves)
sign Blalock (1st base)
sign Loretta (bench)
trade for a RF bat (preferably young)
Francessa did bring up a good point— Papelbon’s heroics woke up the crowd and the team and rallied the team.
*repost*
Eric,
I think money tightens up to a certain degree and the Yankees can leverage their money even better than usual.
I’d rather see them lock up AJ at a reasonable contract (meaning not Santana/CC money) and offer a nice above-market contract to CC.
I don’t think we should have to pay such a big premium. If he doesn’t want to come, then pass.
Benefits Yankees can offer:
*Better than average contract
*Good rotation
*Good bullpen
*HOF Mariano Rivera closing out your games
*New stadium
*Owners that will always spend to field a competitive team
*Power, Pride, Pinstripes
*Where else do you run into Yogi all the time?
===================================
If the Rays lose, Game 5 will be Maddon’s Waterloo.
“steve
October 17th, 2008 at 1:33 pm
days like this are when you would much rather listen to michael kay than of francessa”
yes. And actually, most any day.
Kay have grown on me. He have excellent guests, and seems like a decent person.
Papelbon gave up 2 runs he pitched good not great, it was Big Papi’s HR that shook that place, they were dead until he hit that ball. Anyone else hits it I don’t think they win but when he hit it it was like they found thier lost supper.
if the yankees couldn’t stop the bleeding against the sox, the little tampa bay rays can’t.
if torre, jeter, posada, sheffield, mariano etc. couldn’t calm the rest of the team down, then either can navarro and upton.
experience is going to rear its head in the final 2 games. the rays have no idea what they are in for
If you hate the RedSox (and I assume most here do), last night was deja vu. This feels just like 2004. I don’t think the Rays stand a chance now. You could honestly see from the first AB that Balfour did not have it. And I think Howell is their 3rd best lefty. Like Girardi did in Moose’s 20th win when he pulled Joba quick, you can’t let relievers snowball. When they are off you give them a quick hook.
Ever wonder what would Peavy looks like in Pinstripes?
(please excuse my poor photoshopping.)
Kay is so much better than Francessa. And now that they are each solo, it’s not even close. Francessa can’t carry a show alone and it shows, Mike and Dog needed eachother to succede.
Kay’s show is much more lively than Mike’d up too. Better callers, better guests. Kay is more courteous to callers and doesn’t have the arrogant holier than thou persona that Francessa has. La Greca is better than any of these scrubs that Mike has brought in.
“Eric
October 17th, 2008 at 1:38 pm
I may be optimistic, but I have to think the Yankees have the best shot at signing CC. Other teams may be reluctant to give out a long-term contract for big bucks with the current economic situation. The Yankees have a ton of money coming off their payroll and will be printing money with the new stadium next year. They can offer CC an absolutely absurd contract, and as long as he does not get hurt, he will be worth it. Sure he may not want to go just for the money, but I think one thing a lot of people are forgetting is that he is the premier free agent this offseason and the players’ union will place a lot of pressure on him to accept the biggest offer. If the Yankees offer 6/150 and the next best offer is 6/120, I think the union would strongly urge him to consider playing for the Yankees”
word. I believe the economy will favor NYY, as well.
showing CC $$$, to bring him to the bronx doesn’t bother me too much. Number one, the yankees don’t really have a choice, they need him. Number two, CC Sabathia have already proved he is a GAMER. To say he was pitching for a contract in Milwaukee, i don’t buy it. He went way above the call-of-duty. He is a competitor.
The difference between Francessa and Kay is that Kay talks sports and is level headed. Francessa is an instigator and exacerbates even the smallest of situations.
Kay is annoying on the air but his show is much better than Francessa’s is.
I asked this morning and no one answered, should Francona consider moving Lester to Game 6 to put more pressure on the Rays?
pat: put it this way – I hope they don’t
Ed,
He doesn’t look so good.
TurnTables,
I think we’ve seen Kay soften up around the edges as usual. When I first started watching Yes broadcasts, he was arrogant, abrasive, self-centered actually.
Then Kenny, Paulie, Flash to a lesser degree, and mostly Leiter really changed the tenor of the booth. Kay’s a different guy in the booth now. Much more humble and self-deprecating. I like it.
Ed
Everyone looks good in vertical stripes. They are slimming. Someone get the word to CC.
Next season the best rotation would be:
CC, Wang, Lowe/Burnett, Pettitte, Joba.
Where’s my post ?
Dammit it’s caught in filter, well excuse the 3 DPs people.
boston is playing with absolute house money and they have the momentum, history, and pedigree on their side.
nobody in the world (and this blog either) expects beckett to do anything tomorrow. they expect his injury to hinder him and expect him to get shelled. the bar is already set low and the excuses have already been made. boston winning this game would be a major upset. all the pressure in the world is on tampa and they know it.
pat,
What do you think? CC tells the kids, “Hey mock up some pix of me so I can decide where to play.”
Kind of like the program that shows what you’d look like with different hairstyles.
vinny b
Me too but it makes sense. The only bad part is it sends the message that the Sox don’t have faith in Beckett getting it done so I’m guessing Francona wouldn’t do it.
mel: Kay is the same way on his radio show, as well. Often remarks, how know one really likes him. I actually think, he is bein honest.
Pat –
I’m working on CC to have ‘stripes on. lol, if CC does sign with the Yanks then he will save me the hassle of doing it.
“Papelbon gave up 2 runs he pitched good not great”
Those runs were actually Delcarmen’s as he walked the guys who scored to start the 7th. I believe Papelbon retired 6 of 7 he faced, but he really needed to keep at least one of Delcarmen’s runs off the board. I agree that “great” is not a fair assessment of his work last night.
Pat – no chance. Lester vs. Garza is a better matchup for Boston.
vinny-b,
As long as he doesn’t have his personal vendetta/agendas and actually knows what he’s talking about it’s all good. Once upon a time, he didn’t know who Joba was.
Mel -
I thought so too. I find it really odd of seeing Pudge in stripes when he was traded.
thought you guys would like to read this..i did
From BA:
NEW YORK—The Yankees knew that Mike Dunn’s left arm was live when they converted him from a light-hitting outfielder to a pitcher. What they didn’t know was that in less than three full minor league seasons they would have a hurler with big league stuff.
“He got better every step of the way and at the end he was throwing 95 miles an hour,” general manager Brian Cashman said of the 23-year-old Dunn. “He was pretty impressive. He throws strikes from the left side. He is in the same breath as Phil Coke. He showed enough stuff that it’s hard not to pay attention to him.”
Coke, a 26-year-old lefty, made it to the big leagues this year after being converted from starter to reliever. He pitched 14 2â„3 innings for New York, giving up one run and striking out 14 against just two walks.
Dunn, who was moved to the mound in 2006, went 4-7, 4.55 in 30 games (22 starts) for high Class A Tampa and appeared in one game for Double-A Trenton. But it was in the eight relief stints that Dunn impressed—he struck out 26 and walked six in 16 innings coming out of the bullpen. It was a happy accident: The Yankees shifted Dunn there because he was approaching his innings limit. He finished with 126.
“As a starter he had a good year, but when he went to the pen he took off,” farm director Mark Newman said of the 33rd-round pick from Community College of Southern Nevada in 2004. “He was throwing 96 (mph) with a slider consistently at 86 to 87 with outstanding depth to it. He’s got Coke-type stuff.
“(Tampa pitching coach) Greg Pavlik always thought he had the mentality and stuff to be a reliever.”
The Yankees face a tough choice this winter in whether to add Dunn to their 40-man roster in order to protect him from the Rule 5 draft. Because the organization perceives its converted pitchers to be ripe for injury, they are pleased that Dunn appears to have made it through the “high-risk period” unscathed.
YANKEE DOODLES
• Righthander Andrew Brackman, the 30th overall pick in 2007 who missed the entire 2008 season after having Tommy John surgery, was pitching in Hawaii Winter Baseball. The 22-year-old was throwing in the mid-90s in his early starts.
• Wilkins de la Rosa, a 23-year-old lefty who also is a converted position player, will be added to the 40-man roster this winter. The Dominican Republic native went 9-4, 2.11 in 32 games (11 starts) this season for low Class A Charleston and Tampa. He struck out 125 and walked 44 in 107 innings
“mel
October 17th, 2008 at 1:57 pm
As long as he doesn’t have his personal vendetta/agendas and actually knows what he’s talking about it’s all good. Once upon a time, he didn’t know who Joba was”
true
mel
Money being equal, slimming pinstripes could be the difference maker. There’s nothing worse than a uniform that makes your butt look big.
That program saved me from the “Rachel” haircut everyone was sporting. If they only had it 35 years ago I could have avoided the Dorothy Hamill coif too.
“if the yankees couldn’t stop the bleeding against the sox, the little tampa bay rays can’t.”
Tampa has better pitching going (Shields, Garza) this weekend than the Yankees did (Lieber and Brown)in 2004.
Just wondering what you guys think… would you trade Austin Jackson and Phil Hughes in a package for Peavy?
pat,
Too funny! I hope you didn’t have the Farrah Fawcett. I will lose my respect for you!
David Cone’s Labrum
Agreed but if the Rays beat Beckett on Saturday, there is no chance of a Lester/Garza match-up until 2009.
I’d rate Dunn’s stuff better than Coke, he’s going to be a quick mover, he can be in the pen or as a LH SP that kid throws smoke I told you guys about Coke this season watch out for Micheal Dunn and Wilkins De La Rosa next season.
TurnTables,
You are 100% correct on the better caller part. WFAN callers are some of the lowest of the low. ESPN 1050 never gets idiots saying things like “I hope Torre wins in George’s backyard in Tampa” or “I’m a Yankee fan rooting for the Red Sox because I want to see Torre against Boston”. FAN callers are the worst… sometimes you even wonder if they follow sports.
Russell NY,
Good question.
No.
Rusell,
I’m not as high on Jackson as others, so I think I would. I was MUCH higher on Tabata. He had the advanced understanding of the K-zone, low K rates, .300 hitter at every level, and the same speed.
Just wondering what you guys think… would you trade Austin Jackson and Phil Hughes in a package for Peavy?
No
Whats De La Rosa’s upside? Middle rotation guy? Power arm out of the pen?
“Righthander Andrew Brackman, the 30th overall pick in 2007 who missed the entire 2008 season after having Tommy John surgery, was pitching in Hawaii Winter Baseball. The 22-year-old was throwing in the mid-90s in his early starts.
• Wilkins de la Rosa, a 23-year-old lefty who also is a converted position player, will be added to the 40-man roster this winter. The Dominican Republic native went 9-4, 2.11 in 32 games (11 starts) this season for low Class A Charleston and Tampa. He struck out 125 and walked 44 in 107 innings”
Brackman sounds great but hes still a year off likely and De La Rosa could be a fast mover a dominant lefty doesn’t stay down for long.
“Just wondering what you guys think… would you trade Austin Jackson and Phil Hughes in a package for Peavy?”
Hughes? In a heartbeat. However, if you do, I don’t think Jackson needs to be part of the deal. Hughes and a couple lesser guys (Gardner and IPK or maybe Marquez) should put them in the ballpark.
Maddon got greedy with trusting his bullpen wouldn’t blow a huge lead…terrible.
So on Sunday, you could have
Game 7 in Sox/ Tampa on Sunday Night
and
Seattle Seahawks at Tampa Bay Buccanners on Sunday Night at the same time.
Tampa has always been a FB town and the Bucs are good this year. That will be a crazy night in Tampa. Even though it’s game 7, the FB ratings in Tampa will probably be higher than the Rays.
Those who want to package Jackson in a deal for Peavy, why?
We have no major league ready position players but you want deal Jackson.
That deal makes little to no sense.
It’ll take a lot of stripes to “slim” CC!!
I see no reason for the Yankees to be over the top here. Mel pointed out some of the advantages to playing for the Yankees, plus there are marketing opportunities for him in NYC that would dwarf anywhere else. And if he pitches the Yankees to # 27… cha-ching, cha-ching.
Santana money should just about do it. That’s $ 23 M/per. Why should/would the Yanks overpay?
I like the idea of Loretta for the bench. Guys like Jason Michaels, Frank Catalanotto would be great gets as well. It’s an underrated part of what they must get done this winter… improve the bench!
mel
The Dorothy and the Farrah were popular at the same time. I was in junior high at the time and way too much of a tom-boy to go with the Farrah. At the risk of appearing ancient here, Streets of San Francisco and Starsky and Hutch were more must see TV than Charlies Angels. Both had cute boys on them.
I hope De La Rosa and Brackman are not as injury prone as Hughes.
De La Rosa could be in the majors next year considering he will be on the 40 man and a fast mover.
Whats De La Rosa’s upside? Middle rotation guy? Power arm out of the pen?
Power closer out the pen anywhere from a #3 – 5 SP who can top out at 96 and he’s a LHP w/ a nasty change up that he just learned to go w/ a filthy slider. When he doesn’t walk you he strikes you out.
Joba really opened the door for a lot of the pitchers coming up. Of course we didn’t have the arms back then, but even we did, would they have been given a chance? We really suffered through some miserable bullpens. Was anyone as shocked as I to find that Flash is still with the Phillies?
Interesting comment from Pete today….
“Next thing you know Gabe Gross is playing right field like Bobby Abreu and the series is going to Tampa.”
It’s good to see that Abreu’s defensive follies have become the standard of inadequacy. Hopefully, the Yankees finally come to gripes with that which hastened his departure from Philly and not do anything more than offer him arb. Were the team not be so contractually larded down, he would be an excellent DH and worthy of a deal…but certainly not if he is to put his glove on and waddle out to right field.
De La Rosa = Odalis Perez
“Just wondering what you guys think… would you trade Austin Jackson and Phil Hughes in a package for Peavy?”
No chance..
If it was Hughes and a bunch of B prospects I’d consider it but the Padres wouldn’t go for that.
“Hughes? In a heartbeat. However, if you do, I don’t think Jackson needs to be part of the deal. Hughes and a couple lesser guys (Gardner and IPK or maybe Marquez) should put them in the ballpark.”
I would do that in a heartbeat as well. In all honesty, I like Gardner so I wouldn’t mind them dangling Jackson.
De La Rosa could be in the majors next year considering he will be on the 40 man and a fast mover.
He’s not Rule 5 next year is he ?
“It was a very Joe Torre moment in that Maddon stuck with a guy in the circle of trust instead of going with the matchup that made sense.”
Well written, and pleasantly surprising to read on this blog.
Even if they were bad decisions, I can understand not going with Price because of his youth, even if it begs the question why he’s on the roster at all. I can understand leaving in Balfour to face the seemingly harmless Ortiz.
What I can’t understand (besides Gross’s and Upton’s positioning) was Maddon’s patience with Wheeler. After he walked Bay on four pitches, it should have been obvious that Wheeler was ineffective and leaving him in would give the Sox just the opportunity they needed.
TBS kept cutting to Howell warming up, but Maddon didn’t bring him in. Why warm him up with no outs in the eighth if you’re waiting to use him in the ninth? Ludicrous.
I have never seen such a bad job of managing in the playoffs.
Don’t the Rays have a defensive replacement for Gross?
I’d rather have Cliff Floyd out there.
Was anyone as shocked as I to find that Flash is still with the Phillies?
Nope, but his time is going to expire really soon.
Brandon -
from what I heard, he is.
“Those who want to package Jackson in a deal for Peavy, why?
We have no major league ready position players but you want deal Jackson.
That deal makes little to no sense.”
Because it is easier to find outfielders than ace pitchers that are cost-controlled?
“Hopefully, the Yankees finally come to gripes with that which hastened his departure from Philly and not do anything more than offer him arb.”
Abreu was a much better offensive and defensive player with the Phillies. They got rid of him because of payroll and because the idiotic Philadelphia fans hated him for no reason.
John,
What? He has extra digits?
Anyone who thinks that the Padres would give us Peavy for Hughes and B prospects is dreaming. That is insane.
“Joba really opened the door for a lot of the pitchers coming up. Of course we didn’t have the arms back then, but even we did, would they have been given a chance”
That’s what Melancon said in ST. Other prospects are taking note that the Yankees are willing to give them a chance and not easily going to just trade them like they did in the past.
Ed,
Swear to god, haven’t heard his name come up in years. I know he was injured, but wow, it’s been a long time since I’ve heard antying about him.
Brandon -
De La Rosa is a 6 yr FA, not a rule 5 guy.
Remember, he came up as a OF’er in 2002.
Brandon -
from what I heard, he is.
Then him and Micheal Dunn,will be on the 40 man roster meaning Garcia is going to be a tough one to decide .
Brandon -
source:
Thanks Clint I knew he wasn’t. Thanks for clearing that up.
Gordon spent most of the season on the DL.
We got Joba with his supplemental pick
I sense that if Austin Jackson were a farm hand of a team with an abundance of minor league prospects, such as the Brewers, the Rays, the Twins, he would viewed as just another decent prospect with a shot at being in the bigs. But with the Yankees and the paucity of position prospects, the trumpets play loud and long.
With the state of bullpens around the league, those arms would be snatched up quickly.
Don’t know much about Garcia. Would he be snatched up and would it bother the Yankees?
Nevermind it’s obvious you have to protect Dunn and WDR there should be no further discussion on who to protect, you protect both of them.
“That will be a crazy night in Tampa. Even though it’s game 7, the FB ratings in Tampa will probably be higher than the Rays.”
Is there any such thing as a crazy night in Tampa? The core of the city’s population is asleep by 8:30. Maybe if they played Game 7 simultaneous to the early-bird special at the local buffets, the Rays would pull in some ratings.
“They got rid of him because of payroll and because the idiotic Philadelphia fans hated him for no reason.”
The fans felt he had no soul and could never get anything done when it matters. For whatever reason, the Phillies were a much better team after he was gone in ’06 (and since), but the Yankees fortunes improved quite a bit in ’06 when they got him.
Mel -
Flash simply doesn’t have it anymore. when Lidge was injuried toward the end of spring training, he couldn’t keep the closers role for more than a week when the season began. it could be possible that he might retire this season. who knows…
“Because it is easier to find outfielders than ace pitchers that are cost-controlled”
Not currently in baseball. There aren’t any good young outfielders available in FA. Unless you’re trading young arms no one is trading you their productive and very good outfielders.
The system is thin already with position prospects and Tabata was already traded now you want to trade Jackson.
Still doesn’t make sense.
86: I like Frank Cat, too. He always hit the yankees.
Loretta is my first choice. And he’s a FA
This is next years pen:
Mariano(Closer)
Melancon(set-up/7th)
Bruney(set-up/7th)
Coke(Lefty.6th/7th)
Aceves(long-man)
Dave Robertson(situational righty)
Edwar Ramirez(change-up, possible lefty match-up)
I would protect Garcia over Horne, IMO.
Horne is a 26 yr old guy who has been so injury prone with arm trouble, and had one good year. His control has always been bad too. He’s probably destined for the pen. He really has no future here anymore with all the arms that have come up.
Garcia is only 22 and has ace upside. Pitching-wise, he is advanced. I remember Nardi said a few months ago that he uses Garcia’s repeatable, clean mechanics as a model for other guys. He is a guy who can move quickly too. His injuries should be in the past now that he has finally gotten the TJS.
wow. i knew pinstripes had the slimming effect, but this is amazing
CC in Pinstripes
Patrick, as to Abreu’s departure from Philly, I would suggest that you read some of the blogs and columns at that time. The reason he did not warm the cockles of the fans was for the same reasons…the stats look great, which by his own admission is “what he plays for”, his generally tentative play in the outfield and his wall-phobic ventures which gave Mike Mussina heartburn on every ball hit to rightfield were Abreu trademarks in Philly.
When is the last day the 40 man roster can be decided before the Rule 5 draft ?
trying again…
CC in Pinstripes
“I would do that in a heartbeat as well. In all honesty, I like Gardner so I wouldn’t mind them dangling Jackson.”
i dont disagree.
it wouldnt be easy.
but i cant help but continue to see Sabathia, Wang, Peavy, Joba… over and over again in my head.
and i said in the last thread, as much as Girardi seemingly likes Brett Gardner, it wouldnt surprise me to see him put his fingerprint on this team.
mel,
They would absolutely snatch up Garcia. He is essentially an AA pitcher and is advanced pitching wise. He has ace potential or even closer potential. They could do side sessions with him or something and he could pitch out of some team’s pen this year.
A bad team will put him on the 25 man.
CC in pinstripes
Al,
Not so high on D-Rob and Edwar. Where’s Veras? Not a personal fave, but he’d be preferable to those two. Geise did well, too.
Yeh I’d let Horne go Rule 5 it’s going to suck but I’d rather protect Dunn/Delarosa and Garcia over him.
“The fans felt he had no soul and could never get anything done when it matters. For whatever reason, the Phillies were a much better team after he was gone in ‘06 (and since), but the Yankees fortunes improved quite a bit in ‘06 when they got him.”
Philly fans are goofy like that
I’d say the Phillies got better since Abreu left because of Cole Hamels, a better bullpen, etc
Abreu was a steal for the Yanks no matter how you slice it. His offense has declined a bit over the past 2 seasons but its only been this year that his defense has gotten so bad.
Brandon– Dec 5th is the date I think. Early December.
here’s the 40man roster. http://newyork.yankees.mlb.com.....p?c_id=nyy
lol saucY-too skinny though!
saucY,
Thanks! You made my day. I’m still laughing.
Can I have some of those diet pills?
Caller -
“I hope Cano, A-Rod, and Abreu are not on vacation now and are instead watching how Pedroia and Youkallis play compared to them”.
Two interesting snippets from rotoworld:
According to the New York Post, “the Yankees are hearing whispers” that impending free agent Andy Pettitte may want a two-year contract.
The newspaper speculates that the Yankees “may balk” if that’s indeed Pettitte’s asking price. He went 14-14 with a 4.54 ERA this season on a one-year, $16 million deal.
AND
The Newark Star Ledger reports that the Yankees and Padres “have had preliminary discussions” about a Jake Peavy trade.
Peavy has said that he’d prefer to remain in the NL, but his agent indicated that he’d accept a league change to certain AL teams. Expect to hear just about every mid- and high-payroll team in baseball linked to Peavy once the offseason gets underway.
I’d take Pettitte on a two year deal @ 9-10 mil per year.
“Yeh I’d let Horne go Rule 5 it’s going to suck but I’d rather protect Dunn/Delarosa and Garcia over him.”
I wouldn’t let Horne go. I’d definitely protect him, Dunn and De La Rosa. If Garcia is exposed to rule 5 theres no way someone picks him. He has a lot of potential but hes still very far from being major league ready.
AZ: I agree, Garcia over Horne, at this point.
that said, when Garcia is no longer getting hurt, then i’ll believe it.
Sorry Pete I’ll make sure not to.
Buter Olney is saying it would take Hughes and Cabrera for Peavy?
That is highway robbery. Even though Buster thinks it’s “highly unlikely” to happen. But with Towers and Cashman being best friends it could happen.
Nice knowing you Phil Hughes.
Trevor, this is MELKY Cabrera we’re talking about?
I think it’s more likely the Yankees trade for and then send the Padres Miguel Cabrera.
“I’d say the Phillies got better since Abreu left because of Cole Hamels, a better bullpen, etc”
That explains ’07 and ’08. I was speaking of the balance of ’06 when it was the same team he left. They played .625 after he was gone after playing 6 games under .500 with him.
It was a great deal for the Yankees.
I wouldn’t let Horne go. I’d definitely protect him, Dunn and De La Rosa. If Garcia is exposed to rule 5 theres no way someone picks him. He has a lot of potential but hes still very far from being major league ready.
Patrick I’d put Horne on the same level as Horne and Horne is 26, Garcia is 23. That’s why I would choose him over Horne.
Buter Olney is saying it would take Hughes and Cabrera for Peavy?
When did he say that?
Horne is done. It’s too bad they didn’t trade him when his value was high last year.
“This is next years pen:
Mariano(Closer)
Melancon(set-up/7th)
Bruney(set-up/7th)
Coke(Lefty.6th/7th)
Aceves(long-man)
Dave Robertson(situational righty)
Edwar Ramirez(change-up, possible lefty match-up)
”
I disagree..
The Yanks should pick up Marte’s option. Edwar doesn’t automatically deserve a spot over Veras. Robertson isn’t ready for the majors. Giese and Rasner deserve a shot at the long relief spot.
The Yankees have a lot of quality relievers and too few spots for them all. They should consider trading some of them (Veras, Bruney, Edwar since they are established and could get more in return).
(I’d put Garcia on the same level as Horne)
Trevor: very true (Re: Horne)
Wouldn’t an extension be involved? You don’t give up Hughes with extending a player. So you give up Phil and money? You’re tempting me with Melky. Just kidding. Melky needs to realize that he’s not winning back the job and accept his role. Whenever he hears footsteps he goes in the tank offensively. I think he chirped about something and that put him in the doghouse.
Buter Olney is saying it would take Hughes and Cabrera for Peavy? That is highway robbery. Even though Buster thinks it’s “highly unlikely†to happen. But with Towers and Cashman being best friends it could happen.
Nice knowing you Phil Hughes.
Cashman would offer up Kennedy first. its true about Cashman and Towers being friends, if Kennedy would be traded, then SEE_YA!!!
I’m sorry it was an old article. But it can still happen given the circumstances
“Patrick I’d put Horne on the same level as Horne and Horne is 26, Garcia is 23. That’s why I would choose him over Horne.”
I’m guessing you mean you’d put Horne on the same level as Garcia. I disagree, Garcia doesn’t have the track record or experience of Horne. No team is going to pick up Garcia and leave him on the 25-man for an entire season. He’s simply not ready for that. Horne on the other hand could definitely step in to a bullpen or starter spot.
Hughes and Cabrera for Peavy?
Where do I sign….I’ll drive them both to the airport.
SA -
read my blog, i bolded some key words.
Some intriguing names that need protection in the rule 5 this year—
Wilkins De La Rosa (not due to rule 5, Milb free agent)
Mike Dunn
Chris Garcia
Anthony Claggett
Alan Horne
Steven Jackson
Kevin Wheelen
JB Cox
Johnny Nunez (kid from Wash)
Most of the other guys are filler arms (Jason Jones, Brett Smith, Wordekemper etc.)
From the position players, only Corona, Pena, and Carson are guys of note. Guys like Eric Duncan, Battle, Piliterri etc. too.
“They played .625 after he was gone after playing 6 games under .500 with him.”
Oh okay I didn’t realize that. Maybe the rest of the team didn’t like him? My guess is it was incidental but who knows.
I’m sorry it was an old article. But it can still happen given the circumstances
The Padres would want a whole lot more than just Melky and Hughes
Hey Ed-Nice Blog!
SA -
thanks.
From July 31 through the playoffs, the Dodgers earned an additional $12 million in revenue that is being crediited to the Manny factor. Not bad for a guy who cost them Andy LaRoche and Bryan Morris.
Patrick,
Horne is a 26 yr old pitcher in AAA who has had injury after injury. He has had one good year in his career. This year, he looked like Dontrelle Willis, his mechanics were all out of whack and they sent him to Low A to work on it. His injuries have been of the arm variety.
His ceiling is a #4-5 starter or a good BP arm. We have plenty of those. Horne is not a big part of our future. He doesn’t have that much upside, he had one good year at age 25 in AA.
Garcia on the otherhand, has ace potential and is 3 years younger. Pitching wise, he is very advanced. Doesn’t have the mechanic/control problems that Horne does. His upside is much higher and he will be in AA next year.
This isin’t even close, it’s not like Horne is a safer bet either.
Alan Horne is always hurt. He’s 26 and has already had surgery to fix his rotator cuff and labrum. take him off the 40man. No team will pick him up.
Alan Horne, Ian Kennedy, Melky Cabrera, Kei Igawa (the Padres wanted him last season) and Tim Battle for Jake Peavy?
too much for one?
Did you guys see Horne this year?
He has completely regressed and his shoulder is fried. He is 26 years old and has pitched like 5 games in AA. He couldn’t find the plate this year, he was getting shelled in A-Ball
darnit, i keep forgetting Horne is out til 2010.
pat,
The full time Red Sox players also voted 2/3 share to Manny. (1/3 to Bay).
The same guys who voted him off the island.
Horne had shoulder surgery this year, FYI.
His ceiling is a middle rotation guy as it is. And we don’t need him in the bullpen.
A 23 yr old AA pitcher with ace/closer potential > A 26 yr old AAA pitcher with #3 starter/middle reliever potential.
Protect:
De La Rosa
Claggett – not sure he did pitch well this year
Whelan – don’t know. great stuff but don’t know where the ball is going
Dunn – yes
Garcia – yes
Horne – no
JB Cox – yes
Stephen Jackson – no
vtred you are completely missing the point.
If a player is picked in the rule 5 draft he has to stay on the 25 man roster or he is returned to the original team.
Horne is closer to being major league ready than Garcia. He could be valuable as a bullpen arm or starter as soon as April of this coming season. You can’t say that about Garcia. Therefore Horne is a safer/better pick in the rule 5 draft. Theres a VERY slim chance any team would take a chance with Garcia.
Also, you listed Horne’s issues but what about Garcia? He has tons of potential thats never been realized. He is coming off a very serious injury. He has been known to be extremely immature. Like you said, he’ll be in AA next year. Doesn’t sound like a kid ready for a full season in the majors to me. Theres no way he would be picked in the rule 5.
What about Igawa for Chase Headly? We can move him to 1st base for now and eventually to SS to replace Jeter.
Francessa should just give in, and defect to the RedSox.
It was actually Wang, Cano, and even Melky who opened the door for the prospects. If those three were terrible when they came up the prospect door what have been shuttered quickly in my opinion.
I can’t believe people actually said they would rather trade Jackson than Gardner. That is unbelievable to me that people actually thinks Gardner’s ceiling is higher than Austin’s. Gardner does one thing well, he can run. He is in the same class as Reggie Willits if he’s even that good.
Patrick – Garcia has TJS, his injury problems should be behind him, most of them were linked to that.
Horne’s shoulder is fried, he had another surgery on it. No team would take Horne at all after what he showed last year.
Garica on the other hand, could pitch out of the pen for a team right now. Stuff wise, thats how advanced he is. A team would take him and stash him like they did Santana.
What about Igawa for Chase Headly? We can move him to 1st base for now and eventually to SS to replace Jeter.
FAILED. Headly isn’t even a SS. He’s a 3B by trade.
Michael Kay is coming up soon. Guess I’ll listen to him
“if the yankees couldn’t stop the bleeding against the sox, the little tampa bay rays can’t.”
I needed a good laugh today. Thank you, whoever wrote this post.
Ya see, the little tampa bay rays outplayed the Sux during the season. They pretty much owned them in the postseason also, up to last night in the 7th inning. I’m willing to hedge my bets that they actually find a way within the next two games to put them away. Life happens, blind squirrels find acorns every once in a while, but it’s hard to ignore how the Rays have had handled the Sux. In fact, they pretty much owned them in the Trop.
I’m willing to vote Rays still.
vinny,
Francessa isin’t a die hard Yankee fan anymore. The way he slurps the Red Sox, he has become more neutral than anything else. He actually uses them to take shots at the Yankees. Today was all about linking them to the 9-0s Yankees. He can’t even say good things about the Sox without reminding us what the Yankees were.
“That is unbelievable to me that people actually thinks Gardner’s ceiling is higher than Austin’s.”
i dont think anyone thinks Gardner’s ceiling is higher than AJackson. perhaps you are assuming what people think because some people are open to trading Jackson in order to get Jake Peavy for the rotation.
“S.A.-Looking forward to 2009 and no Peavy to the Yankees!
October 17th, 2008 at 2:50 pm
Michael Kay is coming up soon. Guess I’ll listen to him”
waiting for 3pm, myself
Beckett in that spot scares me tomorrow when everyone has already written him off. The bar is already set so low that anything short of complete Tampa domination is going to be a disappointment. If he ever wins that game, you might as well not even watch game 7 or watch any sports related programming until Thanksgiving.
Very dangerous spot for the Rays tomorrow.
Actually the two people agreed that they liked what they saw from Gardner and wouldn’t mind giving up Jackson for Peavy.
I like Gardner, too, but I’d love to see how a raw talent could develop in our system. I’m especially intrigued by cross-over athletes like Jackson and Brackman. And pitchers who are converted position players. I love the teaching aspect of baseball, especially at the AAA & major league level. So much better than the jaded athletes we sometimes bear witness to.
mel
What share did the Dodgers vote him? He probably ended up with more than a full share between the 2 teams when all was said and done.
*raw talent being Austin Jackson
pat,
Don’t know. This is the article. Leaked info, of course. There’s a video of Boras talking Manny, but I don’t pay attention to that stuff.
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/.....id=3648384
“JINT
October 17th, 2008 at 2:51 pm
Francessa isin’t a die hard Yankee fan anymore. The way he slurps the Red Sox, he has become more neutral than anything else. He actually uses them to take shots at the Yankees. Today was all about linking them to the 9-0s Yankees. He can’t even say good things about the Sox without reminding us what the Yankees were”
JINT: Francessa being in NY, knows his audience doesn’t want to listen to him salivate over the RedSox for 5 hours today. The problem is, he doesn’t care. And he’s going to give it to his NY audience, whether they like it or not. Arrogant person.
I still don’t think Jackson has star potential, we may be wise to sell high on him.
We sold low on Tabata, that was a mistake. His upside was considerably higher than Jackson’s.
mel and SA, glad you liked it. best i could do in a short time at work…
Tabata’s upside is not better then Jackson. I’ve seen better power (HR’s and doubles) out of Jackson who is more raw then Tabata.
I believe Jackson also has better speed then Tabata. The only thing Tabata has on Jackson is a better arm but Jackson arm is pretty good too.
Austin Jackson is the better athlete.
“I believe Jackson also has better speed then Tabata. The only thing Tabata has on Jackson is a better arm but Jackson arm is pretty good too. Austin Jackson is the better athlete.”
Jackson is the much better athlete; Tabata was believed to be the better raw offensive player.
Trevor,
I was going to ask who was more athletic, but you answered that.
Who does Tabata compare to in the field? (besides Manny)
lol. If you go to espn’s baseball page, there’s a guy in the stands that looks like Cashman (with an extra 20 lbs.) He’s jumping for joy.
Turntwo it’s not that people want to trade Jackson for Peavy, a couple of posters said they would rather trade Jackson, than Gardner. That’s what I find unbelievable.
“a couple of posters said they would rather trade Jackson, than Gardner. That’s what I find unbelievable.”
ah, sorry… then i must have breezed over those posts.
yeah, if you are going to hold onto one of the two, then yeah Gardner cant hold Jackson’s jock right now in terms of potential ceiling.
No, ray.
They’re saying that they’re willing to give up Jackson because they think Gardner can play CF for the Yankees.
It’s not Jackson over Gardner in a trade. Gardner’s not even part of the Peavy equation.
It’s Gardner over Jackson in CF, if that gets you Jake Peavy.
According the Associated Press Wang threw off the mound today whoo hoo and also this tidbut got it from si.com so for all those worrying why Girardi was not in them yesterday he was there today
Notes: The Yankees held a second day of organizational meetings on Friday. Among those taking part were general manager Brian Cashman and manager Joe Girardi. … Dallas Cowboys owner Jerry Jones stopped at the Yankees’ spring training complex Monday to see New York owner George Steinbrenner. Jones was in Florida for the NFL owners meetings.
Turntwo,
I’m on my phone and it’s not an I-phone so scrolling sucks on other but I found one of the posts I was referring to.
Russell NY said “he likes Gardner and wouldn’t mind dangling Jackson.” If the choice is between Gardner and Jackson I don’t see how you choose Gardner.
“Garica on the other hand, could pitch out of the pen for a team right now. Stuff wise, thats how advanced he is. A team would take him and stash him like they did Santana.”
Ahh no thats not really true. His stuff is good but he’s not advanced at all. Attitude and injury problems have really limited his development. Theres no way a team could carry him on the 25 man roster for an entire season. He would be basically useless for the whole year.
Live chat on River Ave. Blues right now.
According the Associated Press Wang threw off the mound today whoo hoo
Cool.
“Russell NY said “he likes Gardner and wouldn’t mind dangling Jackson.†If the choice is between Gardner and Jackson I don’t see how you choose Gardner.”
yeah, ray… that was in the context of if you need to include Jackson to get Peavy. thats what i got from him anyway.
sorry here is the link to the whole story
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c.....index.html
Mel, Turntwo,
I guess I took it the wrong way then.
AJax’ ceiling>Gardner’s ceiling
“Mel, Turntwo,
I guess I took it the wrong way then.”
its cool, but i think its a question thats worth considering.
Padres want a almost-ready MLB CF, and a couple of pitching prospects.
could you send Jackson and IPK, with like a McAllister and Betances-type package, if that means you get to keep Hughes?
is that something people would be open to doing?
or is Jackson completely off limits, no matter what? same as Hughes?
IF the Padres put Jake Peavy on the market, other teams will have more assets to deal than the Yanks. We won’t be the winner.
I like Jackson, but he’s not enough to get Peavy, and neither are our other guys. Look at what it took to get Harden or Haren – Peavy will take more. Our farm system isn’t up to the challenge.
There are good FA pitchers available, and the Yanks have money to spend. Trading for Peavy is just a fan fantasy.
ray,
Whew. Good to see you calm again.
O/T. But I noticed that the AFL players wear their MLB home whites (haven’t seen road grays yet) with the AFL team caps. How strange is that?
It’s neat for players to wear ML unis, but wouldn’t it look chaotic on the field?
For me Jackson should be completely off limits. I don’t mind doing Hughes in the right deal. In fact I would rather trade Hughes instead of Betances. Betances has better upside then Hughes.
“IF the Padres put Jake Peavy on the market, other teams will have more assets to deal than the Yanks. We won’t be the winner.”
not just the prospects, but the ability to carry his contract, and pick up that option at the end.
it might have been team-friendly, but i think its still like $17 million or so a season for a pitcher, and $23 million in the last year.
WYH,
B-but, Brian and Kevin are BBF!
If the Yankees were to offer Jackson, Hughes, a combination of Brackman/Betances or McAllister/Brackman or Melancon/Betances or Brackman/Melancon that certainly is enough to get Peavy.
Other teams would offer similar packages but some teams would not be able to afford him.
Right now the rumor is the Braves giving up 2 big prospects. Shaffer (sp) and a pitcher. Yankees could match that.
But Cashman isn’t going to trade his farm system when he could just give Sabathia a check.
Turntwo,
I wouldn’t want to see them trade both Hughes and Jackson for Peavy but if it’s one of them and lower level prospects I’d be okay with it.
The 40-man roster situation is always intriguing, but there’s one thing to keep in mind. The typical MLB team will protect talent first not worrying about who is more MLB ready.
I expect the Yanks to clear space on the 40-man by releasing Moeller, Rasner, Ponson and possibly Britton. I can’t rank the guys on raw talent, but based on what I’ve read De la Rosa, Garcia and Dunn would be the first three guys added.
I still say don’t trade Hughes for Peavy. Kennedy, Aceves and Cabrera plus a bullpen arm should be enough. If not, move on.
One year for Pettite or Mussina, just one.
“I wouldn’t want to see them trade both Hughes and Jackson for Peavy but if it’s one of them and lower level prospects I’d be okay with it.”
yeah, i tend to agree. i think thats reasonable.
“not just the prospects, but the ability to carry his contract, and pick up that option at the end.”
$9MM next year is an easy carry and a huge bargain.
His contract through 2012 is below or at market, going from $15MM to $16MM to $17MM. Lots of teams can afford that. The big back end is a team option with only a $4MM buyout, so not a big worry.
Sorry, don’t mean to be negative, but teams will be standing in line to bid for Peavy IF the Padres shop him. Personally, I don;t think the Padres will.
No, no, no to trading Jackson. And no again. Everyone wants the Yankees to develop their own players and then use their own players, their higher end players, and the first chance that comes up, we’re ready to dangle them like so much meat? No, no, no.
Gardner has not shown nearly enough to indicate he could be an everyday CF for the Yankees. Yes, the kid is fast. And, the kid is fast. Other than that, the kid is fast.
Seriously, though, he did show some moxie by being able to hit in run-scoring opportunities, and that’s good. But he doesn’t walk enough so far, and he strikes out too much, so far, and he’s not going to ever hit for a lot of power. Maybe doubles and triples that he gets through his speedy feet, but not necessarily deep in the gap, almost HR doubles. I like his demeanor; he seems gritty and willing to go all out. But I don’t think you trade one of your better position prospects and give the job to Gardner and then if he can’t do it everyday, then what?
I know Jackson is still a relatively unknown quantity, and I know that it’s at least a season before he’s going to make an appearance in NY, but the Yankees will never have depth on the farm if they give it away. Jackson is not excess. He is it right now. Pitching they may have some surplus that can be dangled. But not position players.
Of course I’ll root for whatever team the Yankees field, and whatever moves they make, I’ll end up hoping for the best if I can’t fully support it. But Johan Santana was a pitcher you trade good stuff for. Peavy, as far as I’m concerned, is too unknown a quantity because he’s an NL pitcher and the Yankees have not fared well with the likes of them. I’d tread carefully.
86,
Wow. Aceves would be a great addition for San Diego. He’s had years of pitching professionally, did well in the AL, and would be a good addition as far as demographics/region.
Doreen,
We need to understand that:
1. It typically takes awhile for Gardner to adjust to a new level.
2. He’s got a very good eye. Rated best in the Yankee system at the end of 2006.
3. I think he can do it. Look at Nady’s stats with NY and Gardner’s stats with NY. Not a big difference in the averages (except for SB & HR). This is with a bad Gardner start and a bad Nady finish.
4. He can’t hit for power. Yet. Ellsbury wasn’t much of a power hitter either (although I think I could hit one out of Fenway
). But, he’s fast.
Did I mention Brett was fast? He’s fast.
i dont see Aceves having any real trade value.
could be a throw-in, but because what you see is what you get from him, a team is going to rather take a chance on a higher ceiling prospect than a mid-aged Aceves.
Tabata = Abreu
Jackson = Mike Cameron
TurnTwo,
Of course not, but he could be the sweetener.
Imagine Peavy going from Petco to the AL.
Okay, now imagine Aceves, who’s only had one bad start, going from the AL to Petco.
Petco’s a two-way street.
i kind of thought of Aceves as our own future Julian Tavarez type. spot starter, injury replacement type long reliever. and of course, not as ugly…
Patrick,
there is no way to rationalize how someone would take Horne instead of Garcia. Chances are, neither gets taken but if you are a GM, you don’t touch Horne at all. 26 yr old pitcher with a fried shoulder, messed up mechanics, and not much upside.
Garcia has serious upside, he is not raw. Read the interviews from Nardi. He said he uses his mechanics and repeatable delivery to tutor our other young pitchers.
“Okay, now imagine Aceves, who’s only had one bad start, going from the AL to Petco.”
sorry, i dont really see it. i know what you’re saying, but i just dont agree with it.
i never had much of an opinion on mike cameron. but looking at his numbers, if jackson turns out like him, you could’nt complain. i thought jackson was projected to be a better hitter (for avg) though…
Actually Aceves has value for San Diego, not only because of the Mexican connnection, but they are looking for two guys who can contend for their big league rotation if they move Peavy. Aceves and Kennedy qualify. Add in Melky for CF and an additional prospect I think it’s a nice package.
Is it the best they’ll get, probably not. But how many teams will Peavy agree to pitch for?
Okay, it doesn’t have to be Aceves. But take any pitcher who’s had some success in the AL (yes even Hughes and Kennedy) and put them in the NL at Petco and they’ll be productive.
Not saying he has to headline the deal, but you could do far worse than a ML ready pitcher.
mel -
I just don’t want Jackson to be expendable because of Brett Gardner. Not yet.
I do understand that he has needed time to adjust at each level. I didn’t see the plate discipline, but I didn’t know of his minor league stats in that area. He seems too small to hit for power, but he is young. And fast. Gotta give him fast.
In summary, I just don’t want them to trade Jackson. He’s not expendable yet. Not until they have more and better position players in the system. And hopefully, he will develop to the point where he is never expendable and is the Yankees everyday CF, and if Brett shows he can shine, perhaps they jockey for their most appropriate outfield positions between the two of them.
And you know what else? I don’t want him to hit for power – or rather, I don’t want him to try to hit for power. I think that had a lot to do with Melky Cabrera going off track. I realize many people don’t like Melky now and some never did, and I’ll admit he wasn’t perfect. But he was a darn sight better than he ended up being once he got bit by the HR bug back in April of this year. And I think part of why he did it was all the talk about, well, maybe he could develop into a guy who could hit homeruns. And then he hit a few in a short period of time, and I think he was smitten and never recovered. That’s my very, very humble opinion.
86,
4 or 5 teams, but no Yankees. But that’s not official and you never know how things shake out and perceptions change if teams start balking.
mel -
That would be I don’t want Brett Gardner to try to hit for power. It would be okay for Jackson, perhaps.
keeping jackson is a no brainer, imo. with tabata gone and whatnot…
Doreen,
LOL. I get it now. I don’t want to give up either one. I’d rather have those two together in the OF one day. Maybe add Victorino.
Seriously, the strikeouts got better in September. The hitting improve. It looked like everything was clicking. He had a pretty good series against Toronto (esp. Halladay).
Too bad he didn’t come up a little earlier, it looked like he was on the verge of putting it together.
And he’s small, but he looks strong. I thought he was wiry, but he’s actually pretty muscular.
I hope he has a good winter of working out and brings it in the spring, because he can offer a lot in the field and the basepaths. He’s a player you can get really excited about. And the nice thing is that he hasn’t been hyped, so no letdown!
That situation reminds me very much of 1995, when Buck Showalter left Cone in forever and wound up replacing him with (I think) Jack McDowell instead of giving Mariano a chance in a big spot. Managers hate giving a new guy like Price a high pressure spot even when it’s clearly the best move at the time. In tight moments, they’ll always go with the guy who got them there, often ignoring the fact he’s tired, worn out, or just doesn’t have good stuff that night.
I hope he has a good winter of working out and brings it in the spring, because he can offer a lot in the field and the basepaths. He’s a player you can get really excited about. And the nice thing is that he hasn’t been hyped, so no letdown!
____________________
Completely agree…if Jackson is not going to be called up until August…and you have 4 months of Gardner to see what he can do…we hope he does well…and then you have more leverage to trade A-Jax
But not yet…
I dont know if people sense this or not…Cashman is giving out the signals…this will be a rebuilding year
PATIENCE
Thus, there is no need to get CC and AJ…get CC and wait til 2010 to get another pitcher via free agency or trade
I get to hit and run most of the time so I don’t get to read all of the fine print. I don’t know when and where the Peavy interest started but there is obviously a lot of it.
You Peavy people. Please give me a list of the FA pitchers you would get if you hand the decision, and rank order them. But here’s the catch. You are only allowed two FA pitchers.
Just curious.
2010— What signals? Only signals I see are a franchise that hated missing the post-season and has no intention of doing it again.
Trisha– I don’t know what a Peavy person is but all I want for Christmas is CC Sabathia. If the store is out my second choicve is AJ Burnett. I’d kick the tired on Oliver Perez if Pettite doesn’t come back, but my preference would be to go into 2009 with CC, Wang, Mussina, Pettite and either Joba or Hughes. There’s a story out that Peavy told San Diego his 5 preferred teams (ALL NL) so trading for him may not be an option.
The Phil Hughes hate amongst Yankee fans is unbelievable. He is 22, and you say that he is extremely injury prone due to a hamstring and ribcage injury??
Trading Hughes would be a huge mistake for the Yankee organization. He will be a 15 game winner in his first full season as a starter.
Just horrible pitch selection in that inning- one of the morons who was providing color commentary said something to the effect of, “Balfour knows his job, he’s ahead in this game and just needs to pump fastballs in there.” No, he needs to throw strikes, throwing 12 fastballs in a row isn’t going to get the job done. I don’t know if I counted a single breaking pitch in some of those AB’s
I was thinking the same thing that Peter said about the bullpen decisions in the later innings. And could Maddon please put in a defensive replacement for Gross or not have him out there at all? That single by Dustin that scored Boston’s first run should have been caught and if it was there was no four-run seventh. I mean, he really pulled up on that play. But give kudos to the Red Sox they never say die, which was the Yankees calling card for years.
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