Tonight in the World Series
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- October
- 26
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Game 4: Tampa Bay (Andy Sonnanstine) at Philadelphia (Joe Blanton), 8 p.m. on Fox. The Phillies lead the series 2-1.
In case you were inexplicably sleeping at 1:30 a.m. earlier today, the Phillies won Game 3 with a walk-off infield single when that nutty Joe Maddon walked the bases loaded to get to Carlos Ruiz and then used five infielders. Ruiz hit a 40-footer that Evan Longoria had no play on. He tried to flip it to the catcher while diving and it went over everything.
What happened to the Rays? Team Excitement in the AL playoffs has scored 10 runs in three World Series games. Sonnanstine will be facing the Phillies for the first time. Joe Blanton has a 6.05 ERA against the Rays in eight career starts.
If the Rays don’t win tonight, my “Tampa Bay in six” prediction isn’t going to look too good. But look at it this way, the sooner the Series ends, the sooner CC Sabathia can file for free agency.
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Chad Jennings
Sam Borden
Josh Thomson
CC Sabbathia’s arm is a ticking time bomb at this point. And ANYONE who gives him the absurd deal that he is looking for will regret it sooner rather than later.
The Phillies are (were) getting no respect.
Good for Jamie Moyer for giving his team what they needed. Hopefully Moose was watching.
Except for the balk gift in GM 1, the officiating has been awful towards the Phillies.
thank you MR. Anderson!..or should i say Dr. Anderson
Evan L should have let the ball go FOUL!
In case you missed the end of the game, here’s an excellent recap:
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/.....d=tab1pos1
They cover it all, even the Longoria decision and the blown call at first.
i’m not interested enough in the tampa /philly world series to bother to watch except for a little channel surfing. i suspect this is a national phenomenon considering the low ratings. fans don’t watch just because they are rooting for a team. they also watch to root against a team.
i don’t like or dislike either team enough to care one way or the other. i tuned in to every game to see tampa wipe out the red sox because i hate the red sox. you don’t tend to hate random teams that get there by the new parity advantages of revenue sharing and the luxury tax.
one of the downsides of baseball parity is there are no dominate teams to hate like the red sox and yankees. there are always more yankee haters than yankee fans so the whole country would watch to see the yankees lose. it may be a great story for ray fans ,but taking all that yankee money and giving it to the rays doesn’t make people turn on the tv to watch the rays.
with parity, mlb baseball needs to be careful what it wishes for. good luck selling the world series the next time contracts are up.
How is CC arm any worse than any of the other free agents out there? Atleast cc has proven he can pitch over 200 innings and not go down the following season. Sheets seems like he is constantly injurred and AJ Burnett has a long injury history with less talent than the other two. Lowe is just a plain waste of money as is the majority of the other free agents out there. CC is the safest bet of any of them – not saying he wont get injured but he is the most likely to stay healthy of those out there. Peavy doesnt even seem like an option any more unless the yanks want to extend his contract witih CC like numbers and give up hughes and more.
Here is what I think may be really interesting. It is a safe bet that pettitte is coming back – how effective he will be, who knows? Then, Mike Mussina seems to be written about daily. Some writers say he wont leave, others like pete say he is prolly not coming back. But what if he tells the yanks by the end of the week that he wants to return? Where does that leave us in the free agent hunt? I feel like it was a mistake last yr that when we re-signed pettitte we stopped going after any other starters. If we re-sign Moose this yr, will cashman feel less of a need to find two starters? Because neither of those guys are guaranteed t op of the rotation starters any more. And Hughes and Chamberlain wont be able to pitch all that many innings. Wang is coming off a major injury. I think that Mike’s decision should have little impact on the yanks in the free agent market. Whether he comes back or not, I feel we still need two free agent starters – cc and someone else. And Teixera should NOT be given priority over pitching. I do want teixera but I’d rather have five capable and effective starters and all points next season than an all star first baseman. No doubt the offense was flukey last season and the defense was shameful and teixera could help on both counts but once again, the reason we failed to make the playoffs in the end was ponson and rasner were in the rotation as permanent stay rather than stop gaps. Re-signing the vets, keeping the young guys, a comeback yr from wang and signing on two solid starters will assure us that major injuries to the pitching staff which im sure there will be atleast one of will not completely destroy our playoff hopes.
How bout an Ian Kennedy for Mike Jacobs trade? Is that enough to get it done??? I would love to see the lefty Jacobs hitting bombs over the new right field porch next season.
There’s no reason why we can’t pick up a Premium arm AND a Grade A first baseman.
“CC Sabbathia’s arm is a ticking time bomb at this point. And ANYONE who gives him the absurd deal that he is looking for will regret it sooner rather than later”
Here’s an article that talks about CC and the likely-hood of injury.
http://www.hardballtimes.com/m.....lling-off/
What are the chances that the Yankees bring back Abreu? If he goes, last year’s spastic offense gets even more shady. Inserting Teixera in the middle of the lineup sound pretty good – especially if we loose Giambi and Abreu.
randy l,
Game 3 was really, really good. Bad News Bears written all over it.
Go ahead homerun by Longoria pushed back to the warning track by the wind.
Mad Scientist packs the box with defenders and Ruiz hits the ball to the one place they couldn’t get to. Wacky.
Sorry, Pete; your Tampa Bay in six prediction didn’t look that good to began with.
Southron
Tom,
I got lost in the article.
The only historical data that I care about is the beginning of the ‘08 season where CC performed quite poorly. However he did bounce back and even did well down the stretch (though it WAS the NL).
I don’t care how much of a horse a pitcher is, I don’t want my (future) pitcher going over 120 pitches on a semi-regular basis.
If he becomes a Yankee, that won’t be a problem. Until Girardi pulls him to protect a lead that’s slipping away. Oh, boy.
Herm Edwards trying to out-coach Eric Mangini.
not a difficult task.
Mel, Sorry about that. It’s a little heavy for a sunday.
Here’s the only part that really matters:
“If I am a GM trying to woo Sabathia in the of season, these large pitch counts would not bother me much. Sabathia has had no arm injuries and it appears that if used reasonably he can be a horse who carries a team on the days he pitches.”
Only if CC wants to come here, should we seriously pursue him.
I have no problem being the highest bidder, we actually should be. But this 30%-40% more than the 2nd highest bidder is lunacy.
Don’t you mean Eva?
Even though I am rooting for the Rays, I said before the series started that my gut prediction is that the Phils will pull it out.
My gut prediction was that the Rays would beat the Sux, and I stayed with that all the way through.
Hey, if the Phils win, will y’all trust my next gut prediction – that the Yanks will win it all again next year?
I doubt Philly is going to lose 2 in a row at home.
Looks like this is going 7.
That’s what Maddon gets for trying to reinvent the wheel in that spot. Chances were good he’d lose there anyway, but he didn’t give himself any better shot at surviving that inning in that situation.
Tom,
That’s fine. As long as he can continue the trend through the bulk of the contract.
His conditioning would be a concern for me. I’ve heard CC say his whole family’s built like him and he’s not concerned about it. Wha? Why wouldn’t you want to be in the best possible shape?
If I’m shelling out $150M for an athlete, I want an athlete. Not saying CC’s not an athlete. But I like to see guys take really good care of their investment.
Just because he’s done it all these years doesn’t guarantee similar results in the future. Age does funny things to the body, recovery is slow. You have to work in order to win the battle against father time.
I know that guys like CC, David Wells, and yes, even John Daly (not just a golfer) are phenominal athletes.
But, I like that guys like Bruney and Ryan Howard are taking their own careers seriously by proactively getting into better shape (yes, I’m aware that Howard may be doing it for the Subway endorsement).
I’m prepared for the flaming, but let me say that I do like CC and would love to have him on the Yankees.
But yes, the conditioning and heavy pitchload would be a concern for me.
If the Jets manage to lose to KC I will have to seriously considering renouncing my fandom.
I mean. I know they’re the Jets and all…but come on, really now…
Rebecca,
It’s a tough pill to swallow because of the Favre factor, but there’s so much parity in football and the cliche about “Any Given Sunday” is true.
And the game’s not over yet.
I still can’t believe the Bills are where they are.
My Giants lost to the Browns (got embarrassed actually)
And the Chiefs actually beat the Broncos too.
Any given Sunday.
And what has gotten into the Rams? Thank god the Giants played them when they still sucked.
I actually like the parity though. It makes it fun.
Mel, I understand. I too am concerned about CC’s body type.
Once again I’ll quote the Hard Ball times. (I’m bored today):
“fat pitchers generally perform better than any other group and are the most likely to stick in the major leagues for a long time”
They did an entire series of studies on pitchers and their body types. They found that Fat pitchers have longer healthier careers.
Tom,
Yeah, the durability factor.
Mussina’s quite the blimp, too!
“No doubt the offense was flukey last season”
Flukey? It was the worst offensive Yankee season in 14 years.
“but once again, the reason we failed to make the playoffs in the end was ponson and rasner were in the rotation as permanent stay rather than stop gaps”
Not quite, the Yankees allowed 50 runs LESS than they did in ‘07. In fact the 2008 pitching staff had the lowest ERA of any Yankee team since 2003. Not only that, but of our “Dyansty” championship teams only the 1998 team allowed fewer runs than the 2008 Yankee staff.
The under performing offense buried this season not the pitching staff.
“Tom
October 26th, 2008 at 3:21 pm
“fat pitchers generally perform better than any other group and are the most likely to stick in the major leagues for a long timeâ€
They did an entire series of studies on pitchers and their body types. They found that Fat pitchers have longer healthier careers”
Tom: that’s amazing. Seriously.
sign him up.
…You can get a penalty for taunting?
This would be cool if it actually happened. Especially if Jeter did it for the US and they met in the finals.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c.....index.html
Rebecca,
It’s a big penalty in the college game.
I think I actually heard Joe Benigno scream “Oh The Pain”.
biggest underachievers: 2008 Dallas Cowboys or 2008 NY Jets?
vinny-b
October 26th, 2008 at 3:26 pm
“Tom
October 26th, 2008 at 3:21 pm
“fat pitchers generally perform better than any other group and are the most likely to stick in the major leagues for a long timeâ€
They did an entire series of studies on pitchers and their body types. They found that Fat pitchers have longer healthier careersâ€
Tom: that’s amazing. Seriously.
sign him up.
______________________________________________________
It’s hard to pull fat.
way to go Spencer.
The Cowboys are beat up playing without many starters the Jets aren’t.
For those of you who actually care about the Jets, what’s the NY press doing about this Favre/Lions thing?
It continues to be a story for some reason and Deanna is responding on a blog. I feel sorry for Brett.
Is the NY press killing Favre about it?
Yeah if the Jets lose today, I renounce my Jet’s fanclub card. I will burn all my jerseys and t-shirts as well. Now really, can they lose to the lowly Chiefs, that is pathetic.
As a die-hard Jet fan, I am used to the “same old Jets.” It seems that Favre has caught on! I actually am missing Pennington right about now.
Leon Washington: you are the man !!!!!!!!
That play was pretty funny, he carried the kicker on his back.
Leon Washington is almost singlehandedly willing the Jets to victory despite the best efforts of Favre-Mangini to lose.
What is the probablity of the Yankees bringing back Pavano the last year of contract at 13 mil.
If we get CC, then Moose and Andy return, why risk a long contract on A.J. @15 mil. per when we could have Pavano for just one.
As far as I’m concerned the risks for injury to either is about the same. Burnett has been in the league nine years and on the DL ten times, twice in 2008 with shoulder issues.
CC, Wang, Moose, Andy, Joba, Pavano.
win or lose, not able to hate Favre.
By the way
GO RAMS!!!!!
Ichiro as a player manager?
At least he’ll understand his players while they plot to beat him up!
I love fat pitchers. Seriously.
Favre-Coles may have just salvaged the Jets season.
Have I ever mentioned how I hate that cocky Philip Rivers and his plastic, trash-talking face?
Okay, can’t use that word, I guess.
Did I ever mention how I hate that *arrogant* trash-talking Phillip Rivers and his ugly, plastic face?
timmy,
You make valid points. I didnt realize how well our pitching did. Actually watching the games – i did not fall like our pitching this yr was all that remarkable considering how poor Hughes and kennedy did in their short stints and how pettitte had a bad season and the two stop gaps didn’t really excel either. I am actually extremely surprised to hear that our pitching was better than most other years. but even given those facts, I still can’t legitimately say that the major problem this team will have next yr is offense. We have absolutely no starting pitching depth currently and our defense was one of the worst in the game last yr. With a team comprised of arod, jeter, damon, matsui, nady and posada with a big bat most likely tp be added this off season, I still think offense is not much of a concern. Cano will prolly have a comeback season and posada will prolly play for most of the season if not all of it. Pitching is still priority number one for this team in my eyes as it usually is. We can add tex and cc by all means but the big free agent pitcher should come first and take priority. i feel like cc can have a far greater impact on our season next yr anyway. We have signed big bats every season in a row from giambi to matsui to sheff to arod to abreu to damon to nady and none of them have helped us win the world series.
“mel from Taco Bell
October 26th, 2008 at 4:02 pm
Did I ever mention how I hate that *arrogant* trash-talking Phillip Rivers and his ugly, plastic face?”
co-signed
Belichick is an ugly gross nasty little troll. Patriots karma started at the most amazing time possible – most important game of their BFD season, with what 2 seconds left and they lost? I don’t even care about football but I was psyched on the spectrum – nowhere near the level – of the Aaron FN Boone homer when the Giants won that game.
Patriots spygate karma continued when their little “Giselle is my new midweek practice toy” quarterback got offed for the season since he had practiced so hard in the offseason – NOT – and was probably out of shape when he got injured anyway. And so they continue on their way to mediocrity.
I just love to hate craptown-oriented teams!
About football – some of those players make CC look svelte. It isn’t that they are big. They are fat gross slobs with these disgusting flabby bellies hanging over their uniforms. What’s up with that!
UGH.
It was pretty ugly, but I’ll take the Jet win.
Trisha,
Little known fact, but CC had signed a letter of intent to play football at the University of Hawaii. He and Shane Victorino would’ve been teammates had Victorino not been drafted.
The only reason CC’s belly doesn’t hang out is because he’s not wearing a spandex jersey.
Some national writer made a comment that mlb should make Charlie Manuel wear a pullover when he waddles to the mound. I think it’s endearing.
mel,
The NY media is actually very favorable towards Favre. They are more interested in the Glazer/ESPN/Peter King drama than they are the actual story.
mel, CC is a big boy no question. I am not saying he has a good excuse, but he sure has a better excuse than those fat slob football players who supposedly run up and down the field all the time! Dis-GUSTING! I’m stunned they don’t arrest of the field. Talk about taxing your heart.
Can someone answer this for me,
I keep reading about players like Hughes and others who the Yankees having playing winter ball. I think thats a great idea but I wonder if Gardner is playing? If not I think he should be, does anyone know?
He needs to work on his hitting
Y26,
Do they think there’s a conspiracy? Glazer’s pretty solid.
Whether it’s true or not, the story’s getting way too much attention. But I guess anything related to Favre’s a story nowadays.
Guys within the game don’t think that Favre would initate the call and give any info. Which would be old news because they put in a lot of new stuff since Favre left.
And here’s another question! Why are football players’ necks bigger than their heads?
trisha,
Combination of weight-lifting and steroids.
And where did you want the Rams to go? Home with a loss?
gabel,
The only guys playing winterball (in addition to AFL & Hawaii) are Christian and Oneli Perez in the Caribbean League.
But I’d put money that he’d hook up with Kevin Long over the winter. He seemed to be turning the corner near the end and I know that Girardi likes Brett.
Leon Washington and Laverneus Coles are amazing.
But the Cowboys have got to be the bigger disappointment. They’re a team that’s actually supposed to win games.
the Jets….are the Jets.
““No doubt the offense was flukey last seasonâ€
Flukey? It was the worst offensive Yankee season in 14 years.
“but once again, the reason we failed to make the playoffs in the end was ponson and rasner were in the rotation as permanent stay rather than stop gapsâ€
Not quite, the Yankees allowed 50 runs LESS than they did in ‘07. In fact the 2008 pitching staff had the lowest ERA of any Yankee team since 2003. Not only that, but of our “Dyansty†championship teams only the 1998 team allowed fewer runs than the 2008 Yankee staff.
The under performing offense buried this season not the pitching staff.”
———
v. interesting. didn’t offense decline and pitching/defense improve throughout baseball this season? i think the yankees were something like 9th in offensive categories and like 10th in defensive categories. very similar.
Their heads don’t need to be big — brains are optional equipment for almost all football players.
Such a disappointing loss
Joey’s Poodle -
Sure sounds like it if you hear them grunt and slaughter the English language!!!
“And where did you want the Rams to go? Home with a loss?
”
mel, I don’t know much about them but the broadcasters said something about the Rams being “a much improved team”. So that makes me think that it wasn’t probably a surprise to football fans that the Rams didn’t win the game.
Can’t wait til the Patsies face a real team this season.
Hmph!
AROD fan,
It wasn’t just a decline, the Yankees scored 179 runs less this year than they did last year. That is a staggering drop off. Not only that, but to find a Yankee team that scored less runs you have to go all the way back to 1994/1995, and those were strike shortened seasons. The Yankees scored 789 runs in ‘08. The only other team to come close to that number during the Yankee play off run was the 2001 team that scored 804.
Rebecca
Cowboys are without Romo, most of these teams because of the cap and weak bench are one injury away from having the number one pick in next year’s college draft.
How would the Jets fare without Favre? look at New England without Brady, a different team.
And here is why New York sportswriters get the much-deserved criticism they do about being bullies and frauds. Check out this headline and then the come on by George King the turd, I mean the third:
BRONX BUMMER: BURNETT MAY NOT WANT TO BE A YANK
“…And now word is spreading that A.J. Burnett will shy away from The Bronx, too.”
But if you read a little further, this is what you find:
Burnett’s agent, Darek Braunecker, denied his client has ruled out the Yankees.
“That is 100-percent wrong,” Braunecker said. “If he does indeed opt out of the deal [with Toronto] he will see if the Yankees are interested.”
The media has indeed turned into a barf-time joke.
Trisha, the Rams were winless the first few weeks of the season and fired their coach. Since they brought in this new coach, they won 2 games and have been competitive. Unfortuntately, they could not pull it out today.
Rhapsody: Without Favre?
Probably the same as last year, a 4-12 team.
I’m just saying, the Jets didn’t have the expectations the Cowboys did going into the season, therefore they can’t be as disappointing.
It’s like asking which team was more disappointing, the Yankees or the Royals
“The only guys playing winterball (in addition to AFL & Hawaii) are Christian and Oneli Perez in the Caribbean League.
But I’d put money that he’d hook up with Kevin Long over the winter. He seemed to be turning the corner near the end and I know that Girardi likes Brett.”
ive read that montero and gardner are playing in some winter league..cant remember which one though
Looking at the seasons final #’s and saying the pitching was as good or better than 200X and that ultimate failure was the fault of the offense is as grand a case of stat-simplifying as there is.
When you compare these #’s to the rest of the league, a clearer picture begins to take shape.
And when you realize that the Yanks got 18 wins from all the other starters not named Mussina, Wang and Pettite, it is clear that it was the lack of bonafide starting pitching that led to their falling short of the playoffs.
I know the Cowboys are without Romo, Newman and safety Roy Williams and all were in the pro bowl last season.
And this kid they drafted running back Felix Jones looks like a great back and he’s been out for a 3 games. He actually has looked better than Barber when on the field, he’s averaging like 9 yards per carry.
At some point they’ll get these guys back, I think safety Roy Williams is done for the year. It might be tough for them to catch the Giants, Skins or Eagles for a play-off spot though.
Dave,
Also take a look at this.
1996: Team ERA 4.65, Runs allowed 787
1998: Team ERA 3.82, Runs allowed 656
1999: Team ERA 4.13, Runs allowed 731
2000: Team ERA 4.76, Runs allowed 814
2008: Team ERA 4.49, Runs allowed 727
1996: Runs Scored 871
1998: Runs Scored 965
1999: Runs Scored 900
2000: Runs Scored 871
2008: Runs Scored 789
CC is a priority, but when I see people who say getting a player like Tex isn’t a must or that we should just use Gardner in CF next season I cringe.
I don’t want CC. An expensive, long-term contract for a guy so morbidly obese is madness. Madness! For the love of God don’t do it, Cashman!!!
Ralphie D,
There are 4 Caribbean leagues. The Puerto Rican League hasn’t started play yet. That would be very good news to have more Yankees playing.
I’m wondering what the status of Pavano is? The yankees still have the one year option for 2009 at 13 mil.
Have they pulled the plug on Pavano or are they waiting for the Moose and Andy to make their decisions before doing so.
Seems to me I would risk an injury free year from Pavano about the same as I would the 2009 season from Burnett and of course the advantage to Pavano is it would be only be a year at 13 mil. not a three or four year at 15 mi., in the case of Burnett.
I might have missed a post by Pete on this one, just wondering if the door is still open for Mr. Bruised Buttocks.
CC reminds me of David Wells in that he appears to be very durable, as Wells was early in his career. A southpaw with a rubber arm is not such a bad thing in the AL East.
Signing CC is more about innings then anything else.
Burnett on the other hand has been in the league 9 years and on the DL 10 times, twice in 2008 for a sore shoulder.
Burnett age 32 had never surpassed 12 victories in a single season until this year (surprise) a contract year.
Quick look at the Venezuelan rosters and I found Francisco Cervelli (catcher) & Luis Sojo (manager) on one team.
Rhapsody,
I can see your point about Burnett, but you have no case if you’re advocating Pavano over Burnett.
Pavano is persona non grata in the organization. The players hate him. He’s not getting another penny from the Yankees.
Pete addressed this a while ago. He felt the chances of Pavano being with the Yankees next season are less than zero.
Rhapsody…. you’re kidding, right?
In the last four years Burnett has made 112 starts, pitched 742 innings and posted 50 wins.
In the last four years Pavano has made 26 starts, pitcher fewer than 150 innings and posted 9 wins.
Comparing the two is easy… there’s no comparison. No one on the planet would give Pavano $ 13 M next year. I doubt anyone gives him $ 3 M.
Mel,
“The players hate him. He’s not getting another penny from the Yankees.”
Unfortunately even without picking up the option on Pavano, they still have to pay him 1.95mil just to leave. Nice little severance package for basically doing nothing for four years isn’t it? Sure beats a watch.
Mel
That sort of answers my question, but until we hear it from the Yankees I sense it is a possibility.
The economics involved Pavano vs Burnett and the length of a contract Burnett seeks seems to me that the organization that told us Chad Curtis would be in centerfield and that Alex was history has done far stranger things.
Some of you guys keep forgetting that the Winter Meetings are in Vegas.
Some GM is gonna wake up with a hell of a hangover, down $500 and holding his copy of a contract with Carl Pavano
86w183
I would stay away from Burnett like the plague. 9 years in the league, 10 trips to the DL to me are not worth a multi-year at 15 mil. per investment.
My point was and is with the young pitching we do have in the developement stage, considering the dearth of FA pitching this season, the reality is I have not seen the Yankees publicly slam the door in Pavano’s face and wonder why.
Rhapsody,
I’d sign Pavano if he signed a Lee Iacocca type of deal. Are you old enough to remember him? He pledged to work for a buck for one year. Yes, he was an auto exec, but that’s what I’d want out of Pavano. It seems unfair how he’s treated, but he didn’t do himself any favors with hydroplaning his Porsche into a truck. And trying to cover it up! Teams look for ROI.
Timmy,
Those are surprising and interesting numbers. I wonder if it just the yanks that saw the huge dip in offense and better pitching or was it all around baseball? I agree we should sign tex, I would never say no to him. It just seems like on paper – we should have scored the most runs in baseball and it was due to the fact that jorge was out the entire season and cano took ten steps back in his performance that we had such bad offensive stats. I dont think both of those will happen next season. Cano has too much talent to be that awful and posada should atleast play more of the season than last yr. Tex certainly would help with offense and defense though. Im not saying at all that we shouldnt get him – just think pitching should be priority number one. Tex could help us for yrs to come- he is everything we are looking for in a first baseman – young, athletic, five tool player, all star, gold glover. Him along with nady, cano and the young pitchers could bring the team back in the right direction and ajax by the end of the season. Thats a start to a younger team at the very least. I dont have any faith that gardner can be the starting centerfielder for the yanks. Its the same pipedream that melky was. I was saying to everyone last yr that melky isnt the answer to centerfield and ppl starting throwing fits. Ill say it again this yr – GARDNER IS NOT THE ANSWER TO THE HOLE IN CENTERFIELD. I dunno who is but i know he is not. Gardner is a great player of the bench and another example of how the yankee organization over-values their prospects.
Rhapsody,
You’re really clinging to silk strands here.
It’s fine to hate Burnett, but there are a dozen better options than Pavano. Some of them are in-house.
Some of the players would puke if they heard Pavano’s back. They liked Ponson better. What does that tell you?
Mel, Ralphie D, et.al Brett Gardner
I read Gardner was on the Toros de Este of the Dominican League but has not yet played,
Plaxico Burress, although very talented, is working very hard to become one of the best jerks in the NFL.
He will become a cancer in the Giants clubhouse.
Mel
I’m not defending Pavano, on the contary, his contract slightly better than what we got from Don Gullett.
My point is, if we sign CC, and considering what little else is available in the FA market, 13 mil. for Pavano at no cost of young players vs signing Burnett to a multi-year at 15 mil per season might not look that bad to the Steinbrenners.
Don’t be surprised. I’m not advocating anything, I’m wondering why Carl has not sent on his way.
Cool, Rhapsody (love the tune, not the team)
But you’re talking to the wrong person. I like Burnett and I won’t be swayed.
I think it is a great idea for the Yankees to sign Pavano for 13 million! (wink, wink)
Mel
I don’t dislike Burnett at all, If he remains healthy and pitches against us 4 times next season chances are he wins all 4.
What I really dislike is signing him to a multi-year contract considering his injury history. I’ve had enough of the multi year contracts to guys like Pavano, Johnson, Brown and Wright to last a life time.
Yankees are really not in a good position here, if we lose CC, Andy and Moose retire how would you feel about Pavano for one year then?
ray,
Hallo! Saw article saying that the Sox only needed to sign Varitek and shore up the bullpen. Thoughts?
And your C’s have a tough opener, huh?
ray (sox fan)
Don’t laugh.
I guarantee if Pavano becomes a FA the Sox will be kicking the tires. No doubt.
Mel
I like Burnett too but dislike the risk involved, I hope the Yankees stay away.
RhapsodyInBlue
October 26th, 2008 at 5:15 pm
86w183
I would stay away from Burnett like the plague. 9 years in the league, 10 trips to the DL to me are not worth a multi-year at 15 mil. per investment.
My point was and is with the young pitching we do have in the developement stage, considering the dearth of FA pitching this season, the reality is I have not seen the Yankees publicly slam the door in Pavano’s face and wonder why.
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You’re wrong on 2 counts. Burnett was not on the DL at any time this year. He made 34 starts and one relief appearance.
On the 2nd count, you said he made 10 trips to the DL in his career. Wrong again…he made 6 trips and in two of those trips, they were after 60 DL stints and he came back too soon and they put him out on rehab. You also counted the times that he was on the 15 DL when he was removed from that list to put him on the 60 DL the same day. He had Tommy John surgery in 2003 and then in 2005, he went on the list because of tearing the scar tissue.
Lets see I took awful advise and played Big Ben over Kurt Warner. Big Ben -3 points currently. Kurt 25 points. I think I am going to fire my adviser.
Dave,
No doubt Posada, and Matsui going down were huge blows. Getting them back for (hopefully) a full season should in theory be a big boost. The problem is what Matsui, and Posada are we getting back? How will Mats knees react next year? And no one knows how Jorge will recover from his surgery. Cano is very talented, and seemed be improving after Long alerted his stance in the box. Will that have a carry over? We hope so, but again that’s another question mark. Nady is a decent player, but it seemed like the AL figured him out rather quickly. Will he make the adjustment? His career line isn’t exactly fantastic. Add up all those question marks, and it could be another long season of “Cap tipping” to absolutely mediocre pitchers like we saw all year.
Oh an I am currently losing to a team two players down 34 to 67. :barf:
Rhapsody,
AJ is older, so I he won’t require a 7-yr. deal to sign.
If he wants to play for the best franchise, he’ll accept the terms.
We’re in the driver’s seat. We have money in a tight market. He who signs first won’t be left out in the cold.
If we don’t get CC and lose Moose, I go:
Wang
AJ
Andy
Joba
Hughes
Acevedo to fill in when IP limits are hit.
Not getting CC will make it challenging for sure, but it won’t be fatal. Not along the lines of trading away Babe Ruth as someone suggested the other night.
And Tex to replace Bobby’s production is a must.
And CC is not a lock. He won’t be an easy sign.
“jake
October 26th, 2008 at 5:20 pm
Plaxico Burress, although very talented, is working very hard to become one of the best jerks in the NFL.
He will become a cancer in the Giants clubhouse”
Coughlin would probably kill him, if he could. I mean, literally kill him.
Hi mel,
It would be very interesting who wrote that article about the Sox because that take on things is way too optimistic in my estimation.
True, the Sox need to decide what to do about catcher, but there are several other things that need to be addressed.
Do we sign Wakefield to another year?
Will Ortiz return to form or should we plan on bringing in another big bat?
What we can expect from Lowell? Should Youkilis play third and bring someone else to play first?
Are we going to have a rotating center field position with Coco and Ellsbury?
Do the Sox seriously enter into the bidding for CC, Tex, Burnett, and even Lowe or do they just attempt to push up the price for you guys?
Pedroia, Papelbon, Jason Bay and others only have one more year on their contracts. Do the Sox try to extend their contracts now?
I think there are lots of issues the Sox need to explore.
GreenBeret7
Scouting report
2008
Burnett has landed on the DL 10 times in nine seasons, including twice in 2007 with a right-shoulder issue. When healthy, Burnett’s fastball is between 94-98 mph and he has an effective curveball and changeup, leading to high strikeout totals. (Jordan Bastian/MLB.com)
Fantasy spin: Burnett has No. 2 starter stuff, but he’s a huge risk because of fragility. Don’t say we didn’t warn you.
http://fantasysource.sportingn.....index.html
Mel
Sorry don’t like your rotation, A.J. would just add another question mark because of his injury history.
RhapsodyInBlue
October 26th, 2008 at 5:39 pm
GreenBeret7
Scouting report
2008
Burnett has landed on the DL 10 times in nine seasons, including twice in 2007 with a right-shoulder issue. When healthy, Burnett’s fastball is between 94-98 mph and he has an effective curveball and changeup, leading to high strikeout totals. (Jordan Bastian/MLB.com)
Fantasy spin: Burnett has No. 2 starter stuff, but he’s a huge risk because of fragility. Don’t say we didn’t warn you.
http://fantasysource.sportingn.....index.html
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2007 is not 2008 as you stated. and whoever wrote that little bit of nothing was wrong, also. check out and count up the times from the trasaction lists in the below link. being moved from the 15 day Dl to the 60 day DL is not two times…it’s one.
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/.....yerId=4153
Scouting reports
2008
Burnett has landed on the DL 10 times in nine seasons, including twice in 2007 with a right-shoulder issue. When healthy, Burnett’s fastball is between 94-98 mph and he has an effective curveball and changeup, leading to high strikeout totals. (Jordan Bastian/MLB.com)
Fantasy spin: Burnett has No. 2 starter stuff, but he’s a huge risk because of fragility. Don’t say we didn’t warn you.
2007
Burnett’s elbow issues were back in 2006, when he spent more than two months on the DL. When healthy, his fastball can hit between 94-98 mph, and he has a very effective curveball. Early in his comeback, he focused more on blowing hitters away, but transitioned more into a pitching-to-contact approach later in the season. His strong September (2.84 ERA, 45 K’s in six starts) was encouraging. (Jordan Bastian/MLB.com)
Fantasy spin: A borderline No. 2 if you can stomach the risk.
2006
Based on pure stuff, few are better than Burnett. His fastball is clocked regularly from 97 to 100 mph, and he can be virtually unhittable when his changeup is working. But he has yet to match his physical talents with his mental makeup. During his seven-game winning streak, Burnett induced more weak contact and went deeper into games. When he went back to trying to overpower hitters, he struggled (0-6 in his final seven starts). (Joe Frisaro/MLB.com)
Fantasy spin: The change of scenery might help, but questions remain. Will he really pitch better in Toronto than he did in Florida’s pitcher-friendly park? Don’t view him as anything more than a No. 3 for now.
2005
Burnett made an impressive recovery from Tommy John surgery, but he tired out late in the final weeks of the season, experiencing some inflammation in his right elbow. Still, he got better as the year progressed, setting a franchise record and personal best with 14 strikeouts against the Rockies in late August. (Joe Frisaro/MLB.com)
Fantasy spin: Now healthy, Burnett can dominate and is ace material.
2004
Expected to be the ace in 2003, Burnett spent most of the year on the DL after undergoing Tommy John surgery. He should be ready to rejoin the rotation in May. If he regains his form (98-mph fastball, sweeping curve), the Marlins and fantasy owners will have plenty to cheer about. (Joe Frisaro/MLB.com)
Fantasy spin: He’ll slip in the draft because of injury concerns, so don’t reach for him too early.
2003
Who wouldn?t want a guy who will pile up innings and strikeouts and win 15 games? If he mixes his spiked curveball with 98-mph fastballs, expect another solid season. But there are health concerns. He has played four years in bigs, spending significant time in each on the DL, including a one-month stint late in 2002 with a mysterious elbow ailment. (Joe Capozzi/TSN)
Fantasy spin: Burnett has pitched his way to the group of elite pitchers, but beware — injury issues could be on the horizon because of overuse.
2002
He has an excellent fastball (averaging 92-94 mph) and overhand curve but is wild and injury-prone. After opening 2001 on the disabled list (broken foot), he had a solid year despite falling apart at midseason. He flashed good control late with only 13 walks in his last 392.1 innings, but he must sustain that all year to be an impact starter. Otherwise, his WHIP reduces his value.
Fantasy spin: Marlins’ No. 3 or 4 starter. (Mark Bonavita/TSN)
2001
The scouting report on Burnett (based on Sept. 26 start using 20-80 scouts’ scale, 50 is average): “Burnett flashed a 70 four-seam fastball Wednesday — velocity’s great, but no life, and Andruw Jones just drove one out in Florida’s big ballpark. Burnett also has a 65 two-seam fastball, both fastballs usually have a 65 grade for life (they are very lively pitches). He has a 55 change of pace, his spiked curve was a 60-65 (with 60-plus life) and his cutter is a 50. Physically, he has the big trunk of a classic innings eater.”
Fantasy spin: Burnett’s fastball might be tepid because he’s tired after a long, long season. He’s done an awful good job considering the team he plays for, his long injury history, and the fact he had all of 124 major league innings coming into this season. He’s proven to me that he has the potential to develop into a No. 1 starter in fantasy baseball. (David Srinivasan/TSN)
2000
Burnett enters his second full season looking to prove himself. He was inconsistent after recovering from surgery to repair a ruptured ligament in his hand last March. When he has consistent command of his excellent spiked curveball and mid-90s fastball, he can be tough. (Joe Capozzi/TSN)
Fantasy spin: Burnett also has some maturity issues to deal with. If he grows up and works hard during the spring, he’ll develop into an ace-caliber starting pitcher.
http://fantasysource.sportingn.....pe=updates
Suggesting the signing of Paguano for any amount is preposterous. For $ 13 M is beyond clean language.
Teams do not “announce” cutting ties with a player until time to offer or not offer arbitration which is next month.
Buy the way AJ Burnett is a full year YOUNGER than Paguano and he’s made 86 more starts in the last four years. Sure he’s a risk, but signing Paguano isn’t risky… more like flushing money down the toilet. I’d give Burnett four years @ 15 M per before I’d give Paguano minimum wage.
Rhapsody,
So what does your rotation look like if you don’t get CC nor Moose?
I’ll still take Burnett over any other pitcher on the market after Sabathia, and hope that NYY also signs Pettitte and Mussina. Whether Hughes or Chamberlain pitches, makes no difference, they will still need a 6th starter to give Pettitte and Mussina a couple of starts off during the year and to keep Hughes/Chamberlain’s inning in check.
GB7,
No Bedard? I heard Seattle’s open to a trade. Just kidding.
Your whole post makes sense. In effect, we need 2 FA signings after Pettitte. Right now we have Wang and Joba. Dat’s it.
Mel
I don’t know.
Until Andy and Moose go public we won’t know.
Rhapsody,
Andy’s in play. I’ve always believed there’s a chance Moose comes back. Now the word is he wants a lot of money. I’ve always said that would be the case. He was underpaid in ‘08.
mel from Taco Bell
October 26th, 2008 at 5:55 pm
GB7,
No Bedard? I heard Seattle’s open to a trade. Just kidding.
Your whole post makes sense. In effect, we need 2 FA signings after Pettitte. Right now we have Wang and Joba. Dat’s it.
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Right now, I’m not sure that I’d take Bedard for Kennedy, even if Seattle picked up 80% of Bedard’s contract. I’d be willing to bet he’s on the 60 DL at the start of the season, with that bad hip.
who was the last 20 game winner to retire then and there and never attempt a return? i’ve heard the answer before, but forgot it
So it’s the same ole same ole – not that there’s anything wrong with that!
Posters A: GET CC!!! WE WANT CC!!!
Posters B: SAY NO TO CC!! HIS ARM IS BLOWN OUT! HE’S NOT WORTH IT!!!!!
Posters B: I WANT BURNETT!! GET BURNETT!!!
Posters A: BURNETT??? NEVER!!! HE’S A WALKING INJURY!!! SAY NO TO BURNETT!!!
Dat’s why I sit back and let the Yanks do the work. Then I cheer for the team they field.
Mel
I think Moose is returning, he just wants the pot sweetened.
How do you think Moose felt watching his inner Moyer pitch last evening in the World Series?
I’ll tell you how, inspired.
That said, it would make me happy to see Moosey back on the team.
BUT – I’m willing to wait and see what happens, absent stress, consternation, spinning out, and voicing an opinion that doesn’t matter anyway!
Rhapsody,
Exactly. Feel the same way.
And the pull of 300 is pretty strong. No matter what anyone, including Mike and his brother, say.
I’d front load a contract for Mussina (16 Mil and 11 Mil on the second year and possibly the third year option or buyout). If Mussina has a crash and burn year, I think he, like Pettitte, has too much pride to hang on for a second year.
October 26th, 2008 at 5:59 pm
who was the last 20 game winner to retire then and there and never attempt a return? i’ve heard the answer before, but forgot it
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Sandy Koufax in 1966 won the last ML Cy Young with 27 wins and ERA title and retired at age 30.
If Mussina was underpaid last year he sure was overpaid in 2007 so it’s even. If he and Pettite want to come back for $ 12 M or so I’m okay with that. Still would need to add one starter via FA or trade. That would let Joba/Hughes et al fight for the # 5 job with Joba the clear front runner is the shoulder is 100 %.
Sandy Koufax won 27 games in his final season before deciding his elbow hurt too much to continue.
Trisha -
I’m with you!
But, it’s still fun to wonder what’s actually going to happen.
Going back two posts about why football gets a pass for ‘roids when baseball doesn’t … the stats were too obvious. In football, there was never a blatant spike, like, for example, any guy off the street could rush for 2,000 yards. That never happened. Baseball you had it – guys off the street who were marginal prospects when signed were hitting 45, 50, 60 HRs regularly. Guys like Giambi who wouldn’t even be in the league were hitting .340 and winning the MVP. When he was off ‘roids, the Yanks wanted to demote him and void his contract.
In baseball, you can’t hide on the offensive or defensive line. Or even a running back who on roids/HGH gets the benefit of recovering faster from injury, but your stats don’t freak out overnight. Baseball, it was too obvious – guys over 38 years old, instead of careers ending, were kicking butt. Plain and simple, it became a joke to the naked eye. Football looks the same on TV, roids or no roids.
Celerino Sanchez
October 26th, 2008 at 6:46 pm
Going back two posts about why football gets a pass for ‘roids when baseball doesn’t … the stats were too obvious. In football, there was never a blatant spike, like, for example, any guy off the street could rush for 2,000 yards. That never happened. Baseball you had it – guys off the street who were marginal prospects when signed were hitting 45, 50, 60 HRs regularly. Guys like Giambi who wouldn’t even be in the league were hitting .340 and winning the MVP. When he was off ‘roids, the Yanks wanted to demote him and void his contract.
In baseball, you can’t hide on the offensive or defensive line. Or even a running back who on roids/HGH gets the benefit of recovering faster from injury, but your stats don’t freak out overnight. Baseball, it was too obvious – guys over 38 years old, instead of careers ending, were kicking butt. Plain and simple, it became a joke to the naked eye. Football looks the same on TV, roids or no roids.
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Giambi would have played without the steroids and if you think that every 290-300 pound person off the streets can run a 5.5 second 40 yard dash, you’re wrong. It’s just about as easy to pick them out in either sport.
Are there opinions that matter on this board?
Is it time for Pete to pull the plug?
Nick in SF
October 26th, 2008 at 7:14 pm
Are there opinions that matter on this board?
Is it time for Pete to pull the plug?
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It’s better than some days when there wasn’t enough brain matter on the board to equal an ice cube.
Solid defensive game and just enough offense for the Giants.
I wasn’t too excited with that ultra-conservative offensive series but I like how the defense isn’t going into prevent mode.
G-Men rule . . . . 21-14 over Steelers.
My heart is still racing after watching that Giants game.
Great win!
Nick in SF
October 26th, 2008 at 7:31 pm
I wasn’t too excited with that ultra-conservative offensive series but I like how the defense isn’t going into prevent mode.
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I haven’t seen that much Jersey grabbing since the English came over and started taking land from the Indians.
Now that baseball can pretty much sell any product it wants, I think the biggest roid scandal is not that they actually work–and turn marginal prospects into MVPs–but that they actually don’t work. Pitchers took roids too, so roids can’t really account for a spike in offensive production. There are so many other factors like expansion teams and hitters parks and the elimination of the strike zone. Plus, there really were some amazing hitters. The idea that mediocre and less than mediocre players suddenly become MVPs and record breakers just sold a lot of drugs to a lot of middle aged men, adolescent boys, and minor leaguers who will never become Barry Bonds no matter what kind of designer hormones they take. also, club use of steroids to solve their own labor issues in the majors and minors is just petty.
Whoa Mike Singletary. He just went off!
Brady Anderson.
Rays of Phillies tonight
or
Rays. Joe Blanton is a doughboy.
I like the Phillies in this game.
I like the Phillies.
I think that this game is going to be a slugfest.
Phillies
I wish people would start singing the National anthem the right way.
“I wish people would start singing the National anthem the right way.”
All they have to do is hit all the notes. Not difficult.
Giambi would have played without the steroids
a borderline major-leaguer at best without roids. Certainly no 7-year, 120-million contract sans juice/HGH/etc.
It is truly amazing how the Yankees and Phillies mirror each other. Bases juiced no outs, so far no runs.
Oops wasn’t bases loaded, was first and third, but they just got a run. Thankfully!
Give us CC please!
The yanks have no hope with you in the next few years.
people who rooted for the rays are not true-die hard yankees fan