The LoHud Yankees Blog

A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Hey, hey, over here. Look at me!

Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Nov 19, 2008 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Phil Hughes in his final start in the Arizona Fall League tonight:

5 innings, 2 hits, 0 runs, 0 walks, 10 strikeouts. 76 pitches/53 strikes. Both of the hits he allowed were singles. He also struck out four of the last five batters he faced, all swinging.

The Yankees would be flat crazy to trade Hughes. His injuries have all been freak things and he obviously has great ability. Signing big-time guys is fine and it makes sense when there is a need. But the key to putting together a consistent championship contender is developing your own pitching. You need to pay for what a guy will do, not for what he has done for somebody else.

 
 

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108 Responses to “Hey, hey, over here. Look at me!”

  1. KJ November 19th, 2008 at 11:09 pm

    They are going to need Hughes even more when the Yanks dont get CC.

  2. Al from BK( Its time to weigh our options beyond CC.) November 19th, 2008 at 11:10 pm

    “The Yankees would be flat crazy to trade Hughes. His injuries have all been freak things and he obviously has great ability.”

    Oh, boy. Did anybody else take economics class? Its called selling high and right now trading Hughes could fill a very important need going into next year. I can’t believe people want this guy made untouchable.

  3. EdWhitson November 19th, 2008 at 11:14 pm

    Sigh. How is it selling high when this guy has been effectively hurt for the better part of 2 seasons ? That’s selling high ? What do you think you are realistically going to get for him. You sell high when somebody overachieves and overperforms. Has Phil done that ?

  4. Frontier November 19th, 2008 at 11:15 pm

    Agree 100%, Al.

  5. Joe I November 19th, 2008 at 11:16 pm

    CC to decide after Thanksgiving…

    http://www.newsday.com/sports/.....2155.story

  6. HillBilllShakespeare November 19th, 2008 at 11:16 pm

    Hughes is a pimp. The Kid is young and his stuff is ferocious when its on. Give him a a chance to develop, baseball is a contrary beast. Gosh.

  7. Chompers November 19th, 2008 at 11:17 pm

    So…. if the AFL is a good place judge how good Hughes is….

    Lets talk about Austin Jackson batting:

    .252AVG .300OBP .387SLG 2SB 6BB 28K

    6BB 28K

    Ouch.

  8. Mad Man November 19th, 2008 at 11:17 pm

    I only trade Hughes if we sign 2 FA pitchers.

    If we don’t sign 2 FAs then unfortunately, we will need him and have to hang onto him.

  9. Al from BK( Its time to weigh our options beyond CC.) November 19th, 2008 at 11:18 pm

    “Sigh. How is it selling high when this guy has been effectively hurt for the better part of 2 seasons ? That’s selling high ? What do you think you are realistically going to get for him. You sell high when somebody overachieves and overperforms. Has Phil done that ?”

    This is as high as its been for a year now. A dominant AFL is a big selling point to teams looking to trade for this guy. Believe me there were a few scouts there checking out Hughes. I’m not saying we must trade him but his value is as high as its been since the Santana non-trade if they want to make a move it should be now.

  10. gayle November 19th, 2008 at 11:19 pm

    don’t tell francesa that I’m not joking he wants to trade Hughes AND cano for Nate mcclouth. He trule is clueless.

  11. ATL Yanks November 19th, 2008 at 11:20 pm

    Chompers,

    Don’t you know? When someone dominates the AFL, its because they are destined for stardom. When someone struggles, it’s because they are “working on things”.

  12. t-rock November 19th, 2008 at 11:21 pm

    LOL

    That Newsday article just refuted everything that Grazziano said today about the Dodgers/Giants making serious offers.

    I tend to side with Newsday much more than other area papers, but I don’t know. It could be just more BS.

  13. Al from BK( Its time to weigh our options beyond CC.) November 19th, 2008 at 11:22 pm

    Okay. So CC wants his turkey day before he makes up his mind, fair enough. However this is more time that the Angels will be able to stick their necks into the bidding :(

  14. RayMagnetic November 19th, 2008 at 11:23 pm

    “I’m not saying we must trade him but his value is as high as its been since the Santana non-trade if they want to make a move it should be now.”

    That’s the thing, “they” do not want to trade Hughes at all.

  15. KJ November 19th, 2008 at 11:23 pm

    I want CC just as bad as anyone. The Yanks really really need him but with that said Im not one of those Yankee fans who thinks he is as good as ours. I really believe that he will sign with the Dodgers for 6 and 130.

  16. Al from BK( Its time to weigh our options beyond CC.) November 19th, 2008 at 11:24 pm

    “don’t tell francesa that I’m not joking he wants to trade Hughes AND cano for Nate mcclouth. He trule is clueless.”

    I seriously chucked my remote when he said that. I wouldn’t put those 2 in the same deal unless I was getting Albert Pujols or Roy Halladay.

  17. Chompers November 19th, 2008 at 11:24 pm

    OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    That’s how it works…..

    Pete doesn’t explain that on his blog.

  18. Soul November 19th, 2008 at 11:25 pm

    So CC will give us a YES or NO answer after Thanksgiving?

    What if he says no because the Dodgers/Angels/SF make him a comparable offer… will he give us an opportunity to raise our dollar amount? Or will he give us an answer about his desire to play in NY period?

  19. Al from BK( Its time to weigh our options beyond CC.) November 19th, 2008 at 11:26 pm

    “I really believe that he will sign with the Dodgers for 6 and 130.”

    I disagree. I see a nightmare situation coming together. Tex to the Sox and CC to the Angels.

  20. AP November 19th, 2008 at 11:27 pm

    Which are more meaningless?

    Winter League numbers

    Spring Training numbers

    September numbers

    I’d say Winter League numbers. Atleast the other 2 are against MLB competition. All 3 are meaningless though.

  21. KJ November 19th, 2008 at 11:31 pm

    Al I cant see the Sox doing that. Its going to be hard for them to trade Lowell plus they have Anderson coming up fast why would you block him? But on the other hand I dont see them just siiting around this off season doing nothing.

  22. Wilson November 19th, 2008 at 11:31 pm

    That was a confusing article.

    First off, he was quoting Gammons from where? There is nothing on ESPN.com and his most recent SportsCenter talked about how the Dodgers have moved front and center, yet the article downplays the Dodgers interest.

    Next, it says he will decide on his next team after Thanksgiving. So does that mean all final offers must be in by then? Or does this mean he will evaluate the current bids and narrow the field from there and continue to negotiate with everyone? Considering this is just our initial offer ($140), does that mean we will increase it soon even based upon the bids between now and then?

    That article created more questions than answers

  23. dave November 19th, 2008 at 11:32 pm

    I couldnt agree more. Trading hughes now would be horrendous. one, it would be admitting that not trading him for johan was a huge blunder. Two, you would not get back a Johan like player for him. Three, you dont trade players coming off a down yr with hughes talent. Four, put hughes in AAA for a couple of months and the first injury (and there will be multiple,) bring him up and let him start – he will be lights out by august. This isnt all hype for three yrs – this kid has the talent, the poise, the numbers against AAAA like competition. He is on the brink of breaking through. I can see it. One yr without injury and he will be just as untouchable as joba. We have to atleast give him another yr – the fans who have been following him since he was drafted are owed that much!!!

  24. mel November 19th, 2008 at 11:32 pm

    Phil is not untouchable, but the GM’s know the deal. You’re not getting Joba or Phil.

    Even Towers has backed off of Phil for Cy Young winner Jake Peavy.

    If it came down to Phil or Austin, hit the road Jackson. People are dubbing him the CF of the future before he’s even hit AAA. He hasn’t shown me anything and I’ve seen what Hughes can do.

    I’d give him up for Halladay. But that’s about it.

  25. R+ November 19th, 2008 at 11:35 pm

    mel,

    Joba is on a different level than Hughes.

    We won’t even listen to offers for Joba.

  26. Al from BK( Its time to weigh our options beyond CC.) November 19th, 2008 at 11:36 pm

    “Al I cant see the Sox doing that. Its going to be hard for them to trade Lowell plus they have Anderson coming up fast why would you block him? But on the other hand I dont see them just siiting around this off season doing nothing.”

    I just fear that they will enter a very competitive bid and since they are on the East coast Tex will oblige. This will in turn be followed by Moreno being mad at Boras so he then convinces CC to head west. This is why Tex going back to the Halos is pretty important.

  27. Arliss November 19th, 2008 at 11:37 pm

    Agree Pete – trading him is senseless….but that has nothing to do with his AFL performance as some here would like to pretend is what you are insinuating.

  28. Carl79 November 19th, 2008 at 11:37 pm

    I’m not even turning on the computer on Thanksgiving day. I don’t want my day to be ruined when CC rejects us. I’ll get the bad news on Friday instead.

  29. We need the big guy!! November 19th, 2008 at 11:38 pm

    I think CC is going to wait longer then that. The Angels will not have an idea about Tex until the winter meetings at the earliest. So I don’t see CC signing before he finds out if they are interested or not. If Boston signs Tex then the Angels will go after CC and I can see them offering just enough to get him. Boston can mess with the Yanks more then people think. It seems like if he really wants to stay in Calif. he would be leaving as much as $30m on the table…which seems crazy.

  30. Trevor November 19th, 2008 at 11:40 pm

    If none of these FA pitchers come here. The organization just has to do what they have been doing the last couple of years which is develop your own pitching talent.
    We’ll be seeing a lot of kids next and after if there is no Sabathia. Even if there is Burnett we will still be seeing kids because Pettitte won’t pitch forever. He’ll just be leaving the seat warm until another youngster (McAllister/Betances perhaps?) is ready.

  31. Dave D November 19th, 2008 at 11:41 pm

    The room is about to get more crowded in the auction for free agent left-hander CC Sabathia, if it hasn’t already.
    An agent familiar with the situation said Wednesday he expected the San Francisco Giants to make an offer to Sabathia’s agents in an effort to coax him into playing for what in essence is his hometown team.

    Another agent keeping tabs on Sabathia said he expected the Los Angeles Angels also to enter the fray at some point. Because Sabathia’s representatives are keeping all offers private, it wasn’t known if either the Giants or Angels had submitted formal bids or merely were testing the waters.
    Reports that the Los Angeles Dodgers were preparing to make an offer apparently were not true, according to those familiar with that club’s plans.

    http://www.jsonline.com/sports.....84059.html

  32. Frontier November 19th, 2008 at 11:42 pm

    If the Yankees are serious about getting CC then its about time for them to increase the offer.

  33. mel November 19th, 2008 at 11:43 pm

    CB,

    Saw your question on Tex. Still mulling over it. Gotta pay attention to the lumpia or they’ll burn.

  34. Nick in SF November 19th, 2008 at 11:44 pm

    I’ve heard that USC is mulling an offer to CC too. He could be in California plus play for the most respected professional franchise in Los Angeles.

  35. We need the big guy!! November 19th, 2008 at 11:45 pm

    I think all the article means is do not expect him to sign BEFORE Thanksgiving…he wants more time. Thats all. That it could be right after or a couple more weeks from now. The article really says nothing. I do believe Newsday’s sources more then other newspapers. The source that said that the Giants and Dodgers were in were a NY newspaper what would they know about what is happening in Calif.??! The beat writer in Calif. said they don’t think either team has the money and he doesn’t believe it.

  36. CB November 19th, 2008 at 11:46 pm

    Mel,

    CC is a man with a healthy appetite. Do you think he likes phillipino cuisine?

    Maybe you could help out in the negotiations?

  37. Patrick Bateman November 19th, 2008 at 11:49 pm

    Who needs Sabathia or Santana? Lets go with 5 inning Phil.

  38. KJ November 19th, 2008 at 11:51 pm

    CC will most likely be inked at the winter meetings Dec 8-11.

  39. Y's Guy November 19th, 2008 at 11:51 pm

    trade hughes? u guys are crazy. he’s been throwing 95 since his last injury, which he was not doing when he was last in the majors. he’s what 23? who cares what the afl does to his trade value, no way you trade him.

  40. pat November 19th, 2008 at 11:51 pm

    “If the Yankees are serious about getting CC then its about time for them to increase the offer.”

    Why? Other than the Brewers, has anyone else even made an offer or have people just speculated that they are going to?

  41. GreenBeret7 November 19th, 2008 at 11:51 pm

    It seems that most of Toronto’s big ticket players except for Wells could be moved. Apparently, not only Halladay possibly available, but, Ryan and Overbay also. Sadly, I doubt that they’ll make them available to the AL East. It appears that economy hit’s Toronto first. The majority of their income is in Canadian dollars and their contracts are in US funds for a loss of 20 cents on the dollar.

  42. chris November 19th, 2008 at 11:51 pm

    I really think CC is staying west like he originally wanted.

    If that’s the case we end up with lowe Burnett and Texiera. Poor us right?

  43. EricNS November 19th, 2008 at 11:52 pm

    then lets get Tex, Lowe, and AJ instead -

  44. alvaro espinoza's hipster frames November 19th, 2008 at 11:53 pm

    53 out of 76? what happened on those 23 pitches? suspectttt…..

  45. KJ November 19th, 2008 at 11:54 pm

    If we dont get CC then I can Def see AJ and Tex but I really doubt they will get Lowe.

  46. Al from BK( Its time to weigh our options beyond CC.) November 19th, 2008 at 11:54 pm

    “I really think CC is staying west like he originally wanted.

    If that’s the case we end up with lowe Burnett and Texiera. Poor us right?”

    I doubt it Tex and AJ. Boston can have Lowe.

  47. Squints November 19th, 2008 at 11:54 pm

    “Oh, boy. Did anybody else take economics class? Its called selling high and right now trading Hughes could fill a very important need going into next year. I can’t believe people want this guy made untouchable.”

    Because he has fantastic stuff. Freak injuries in youth are no reason to “sell high” on one of the top three pitchers to come out of this system in the last five years. Getting rid of young players for pricey veterans is a short sighted, ill fated plan that has gotten the Yankees to the position they are in now.

    As for someone bringing up AJAX’s relatively poor performance in the AFL: I think it shows us one thing; Austin Jackson is incredibly raw. I’m excited to see what he can do at AAA, but I think a lot of us are counting our chickens before they hatch with AJAX.

  48. S.A.-Looking forward to 2009. Show CC the money and stay away from Peavy! November 19th, 2008 at 11:54 pm

    “CC will most likely be inked at the winter meetings Dec 8-11.”

    I don’t think some fans will be able to last that long if that does happen. lol

  49. Squints November 19th, 2008 at 11:57 pm

    Oh and it also doesnt’ make sense to trade Hughes for pitching when there are equally (if not more so) valuable pieces available on the free agent market like there are this year. Yes that means giving up draft picks but those picks most likely won’t sniff the majors for at least 2-3 years at best.

  50. GreenBeret7 November 19th, 2008 at 11:59 pm

    S.A.-Looking forward to 2009. Show CC the money and stay away from Peavy!
    November 19th, 2008 at 11:54 pm
    “CC will most likely be inked at the winter meetings Dec 8-11.”

    I don’t think some fans will be able to last that long if that does happen. lol

    ————————————————————

    Yep, and I mentioned something like that earlier. With teams wanting to save 40 man roster space for their best players and kids, it makes no sense to sign them before the Rule 5 Draft. I don’t think it made a dent, though.

  51. Ed - patience isn't a virtue to some people November 20th, 2008 at 12:00 am

    “it makes no sense to sign them before the Rule 5 Draft.”

    ..and Cashman will find ways to trade some dump for a player or 2.

  52. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 12:02 am

    Say Chamberlain has a shoulder tweak this year (hoping not). That will be, like Hughes, two injuries early on in his career. Will you want to “sell high” on him as well?

  53. Don November 20th, 2008 at 12:02 am

    So let’s recap the day

    Gammons – Dodgers are becoming a major player for CC and he wants to go there.

    Davidoff – Dodgers/Giants are not serious players

    Graziano – Dodgers/Giants are about to make significant offers.

    Olney – Dodgers about to make an offer for CC.

    Journal Sentinal (Milwaukee paper) – Giants and Angels about to or already have made big offers, Dodgers are not.

    Inside SoCal (LA Paper) – Dodgers do not plan to make an offer anytime soon.

    So who to believe?

  54. no.27 November 20th, 2008 at 12:03 am

    Phil Hughes is going to prove people wrong next year. He’s finally going to have a healthy year and he’s so much more experienced and developed than when he was called up 2 years ago. Please stay away from Burnett and Lowe!

    CC
    Wang
    Pettitte
    Hughes (with 15 starts from Aceves, Coke, Kennedy, or Igawa)
    Joba

  55. 4 x 4 November 20th, 2008 at 12:03 am

    No because Chamberlain has proved he is a dominant reliever. If he gets injured, its likely due to his body not being able to hold up as a starter, like Papelbon.

  56. Nick in SF November 20th, 2008 at 12:04 am

    Dec. 8 is too long to wait.

    If CC really loved us he would have already signed and flown down to help fix Cano’s swing.

    Bad sign.

  57. GreenBeret7 November 20th, 2008 at 12:05 am

    Squints
    November 19th, 2008 at 11:54 pm
    “Oh, boy. Did anybody else take economics class? Its called selling high and right now trading Hughes could fill a very important need going into next year. I can’t believe people want this guy made untouchable.”

    Because he has fantastic stuff. Freak injuries in youth are no reason to “sell high” on one of the top three pitchers to come out of this system in the last five years. Getting rid of young players for pricey veterans is a short sighted, ill fated plan that has gotten the Yankees to the position they are in now.

    As for someone bringing up AJAX’s relatively poor performance in the AFL: I think it shows us one thing; Austin Jackson is incredibly raw. I’m excited to see what he can do at AAA, but I think a lot of us are counting our chickens before they hatch with AJAX.

    ———————————————————-

    There’s no doubt that Jackson is the real thing. From watching him in Charleston and Tampa, it was obvious that he is a special athlete, and, he was still, basically a basketball player playing baseball. The was then and to a certain extent, relying in strictly ability and hasn’t learned all of the subtle points of playing baseball.

  58. dave November 20th, 2008 at 12:05 am

    Mel,

    In total agreement – phil has proven he can do it. All we are waiting for now is some consistency and an injury free yr, Lets see what he can do with a full season of health

  59. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 12:06 am

    “Phil Hughes is going to prove people wrong next year. He’s finally going to have a healthy year and he’s so much more experienced and developed than when he was called up 2 years ago. Please stay away from Burnett and Lowe!”

    I’d much rather have Burnett than Pettitte.

  60. DJete November 20th, 2008 at 12:08 am

    Hughes has god to get a shot. I don’t want to hear anything about trading him. If BCash was gonna do it, the time was last off season when his stock was high. 08 didn’t work out but I strongly believe he’s got a nice career ahead of him.

  61. GreenBeret7 November 20th, 2008 at 12:09 am

    Squints
    November 20th, 2008 at 12:02 am
    Say Chamberlain has a shoulder tweak this year (hoping not). That will be, like Hughes, two injuries early on in his career. Will you want to “sell high” on him as well?

    ———————————————————–

    Can I play “What Ifs”, too?

  62. mel November 20th, 2008 at 12:09 am

    CB,

    lol. Does he like laulau? Kalua pig? Man doo? Sushi? After all, he did sign a letter of intent to play football at UH.

    Back to Tex. At first blush, I don’t believe that Nats would ever pay a position player $19M per.

    Pre-Swisher, Tex was a must. I would’ve topped whatever the Angels offered. Which would probably be 7/$140M. Money being equal, I think he’d choose the Yankees over the Angels.

    Post-Swisher? I still want them to get in the mix, but I won’t be as devestated if we miss out. Either way, it’d be 7 years max.

    And 7 years max either way.

  63. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 12:10 am

    “There’s no doubt that Jackson is the real thing. From watching him in Charleston and Tampa, it was obvious that he is a special athlete, and, he was still, basically a basketball player playing baseball. The was then and to a certain extent, relying in strictly ability and hasn’t learned all of the subtle points of playing baseball.”

    I just want to see what he can do for a full season at AAA. I’d also like to see a littttle more power out of him, but I do have confidence that he will be great.

  64. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 12:11 am

    “Can I play “What Ifs”, too?”

    I’m just trying to say that the “trade Hughes” crowd is jumping the gun entirely.

  65. We need the big guy!! November 20th, 2008 at 12:12 am

    I will believe Davidoff. Like anyone would ever believe Gammons….Let me guess if Boston was interested in CC, he would be saying CC never wanted to come to the east coast but Boston is such a great organization that now he wants to…Right??!

    Dodgers could make a low blow offer say $100m, Giants I cant see them paying CC and Zito $40 combined and not go out and get a hitter and there best hitter is Molina. Thats crazy. The Angels can not even think about making an offer until Tex makes his decision. Which won’t be for a while.

  66. Al from BK( Its time to weigh our options beyond CC.) November 20th, 2008 at 12:14 am

    “CC
    Wang
    Pettitte
    Hughes (with 15 starts from Aceves, Coke, Kennedy, or Igawa)
    Joba”

    15 starts from Kennedy/Igawa. Please revise that maybe Aceves deserves those starts but IPK/sunglasses should never don pinstripes again.

  67. trisha - Mike Mussina just dropped out of my 2009 starting rotation. CC will opt to be a Yankee. November 20th, 2008 at 12:16 am

    Hey Nick you know it’s all schtick with us, tautology, and smooches! Can’t imagine that you’d take my schtick anymore seriously than you think I should take yours! Sheesh!

    I will say this however. I was having a little fun with billy that night and didn’t seriously think you were the same person.

    I guess you were really serious about an apology since you mentioned it various times, including again tonight. The fact of the matter is that I haven’t been on when you have so wasn’t going to waste words that you might not see.

    I do think it’s a riot that someone who has so much schtick (that would be you) would bother asking for an apology about anything. I would think a real schtickster would be able to take a little schtick in return! To me that’s the equivalent of Don Rickles getting upset when someone insults him! Too funny!!! In any event, if I were to ask for an apology every time I was maligned here, this place would be flooded with apologies!!! I guess I don’t really take it quite as seriously. Most of the time the whacked out and totally gratuitous shots pretty much amuse me.

    Anyway, smooches to you.

  68. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 12:16 am

    “15 starts from Kennedy/Igawa. Please revise that maybe Aceves deserves those starts but IPK/sunglasses should never don pinstripes again.”

    I agree with you on Igawa but not on Kennedy. Come on. He’s a young guy. He had a bad hiccup last year. That happens to young guys. That doesnt’ mean he’s a complete and total bust. I don’t think Kennedy will be in the Yankees incredibly long term plans anymore, but I don’t see him being as useless as Igawa.

  69. CB November 20th, 2008 at 12:17 am

    mel,

    do you do buffets? I could see that being the real topper to land us some CC. I’d say all you can eat… but given CC’s stature I don’t know if industrial sized pots would qualify as home cooking anymore…

    no idea the big man was signed to play football on the islands. how about that? Quarterback or Left tackle? I’m actually serious about that. CC is the only guy i could see doing either.

    You’ve been a real proponent of signing tex. I don’t know if 7 years / 140 is going to do it. My gut says it’s going to be a lot more than that on tex.

    Soriano somehow convinced Hendry to give him an 8 yr deal. Cabrera 8 year deal.

    I think tex is going to come in around 8 yrs 165-175. Around there.

    If the yankees do sign him, Tex and ARod will be getting to know each other real well.

    What a bizarre thing it would be if Jeter’s gone after 2010 and arod and tex are manning the fort.

  70. pat November 20th, 2008 at 12:17 am

    “Matsui is said to be ahead of schedule and running in place — head trainer Gene Monahan told Girardi that Matsui “looks great,” and Posada is working out with strength coach Dana Cavalea in preparation to begin a Dec. 1 throwing program.”

    http://newyork.yankees.mlb.com.....8;c_id=nyy

  71. GreenBeret7 November 20th, 2008 at 12:18 am

    Russo 1-4, 1 run scored, 1HR, 2 RBI, 1 flyout, 2 strikeout, 1 walk, playing 3rd base. Hitting .321, 3 HR, 8 doubles, 16 RBI

  72. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 12:19 am

    “What a bizarre thing it would be if Jeter’s gone after 2010 and arod and tex are manning the fort.”

    That’d be a strange sight, indeed. Realistically, what do we all think the chances are that the Yankees are Jeter-less in 2011?

  73. Clint November 20th, 2008 at 12:19 am

    It is up to Cashman to determine which offers are legit and which are smokescreens. He is the GM of a franchise, he has access to these things unlike fans.

    This whole SF thing could be smoke by CC’s agent to get us to increase our offer or it could be legit. Cashman must figure out which and act accordingly. If they did indeed bid, THEN it is time for us to increase the offer. But don’t just do it unnecessarily.

  74. Buddy Biancalana November 20th, 2008 at 12:20 am

    Trisha-

    Your post to Nick was mighty impressive.

    Cheers!

  75. AJ YANKS November 20th, 2008 at 12:20 am

    I’d rather have Burnett over Tex. Wouldn’t you, mel?

  76. PAT M November 20th, 2008 at 12:21 am

    I wonder how many band wagons this site will require in about two years when Phil Hughes starts to fulfill his promise as a outstanding MLB pitcher ????? Currently there’s only one and it’s filled with those who have been with him since he started his journey in the organization….And for a few of us, even before that…..

  77. trisha - Mike Mussina just dropped out of my 2009 starting rotation. CC will opt to be a Yankee. November 20th, 2008 at 12:23 am

    Buddy, of course I can only hope he’s around to read it. Otherwise if he should mention an apology again and you see it, you might tell him about the post!

  78. GreenBeret7 November 20th, 2008 at 12:23 am

    Squints
    November 20th, 2008 at 12:10 am
    “There’s no doubt that Jackson is the real thing. From watching him in Charleston and Tampa, it was obvious that he is a special athlete, and, he was still, basically a basketball player playing baseball. The was then and to a certain extent, relying in strictly ability and hasn’t learned all of the subtle points of playing baseball.”

    I just want to see what he can do for a full season at AAA. I’d also like to see a littttle more power out of him, but I do have confidence that he will be great.

    ———————————————————-

    Jackson is a line drive hitter, and speed guy. The home runs will come, but don’t expect 30 homers a year…18-22 probably. He should get to 25-30 steals a year. Don’t confuse him being very good with being great. You’ll be disappointed.

  79. pat November 20th, 2008 at 12:24 am

    “What a bizarre thing it would be if Jeter’s gone after 2010 and arod and tex are manning the fort.”

    People thought the same thing in 1995 when Mattingly retired. It seems to have worked out okay the last 13 years though.

    I’m guessing Jeter will be around post 2010 if he wants to be.

  80. Brandon (TEIX IS NOT WORTH IT, GET CC !)..."Don't trade Robi !" November 20th, 2008 at 12:25 am

    Blazers are toying w/ the Bulls.

  81. mel November 20th, 2008 at 12:26 am

    CB,

    The football story came out after Victorino hit the HR off Sabathia. Victorino (state track champ) had also committed to play football & baseball at UH. It was one of those cosmic intersections.

    Looking at Cabrera’s deal, then yes it appears that the 8th year is necessary.

    Let’s just put it this way, I’d rather pay $175M to Tex than $150M to CC.

    Burnett would be almost half the price and can be just as dominant. Wang is a producer. Joba’s coming into his own. Hughes is on the road to recovery. Pettitte holding down the fort. We have Aceves & Coke replacing Rasner, Igawa, & Ponson. I would definitely go to battle with those guys.

    Don’t get me wrong, I would love to have CC. But a Tex/AJ combo’s pretty enticing.

  82. Buddy Biancalana November 20th, 2008 at 12:27 am

    Trisha-

    Will do, he was just here before, I’m sure he will be back.

  83. Jeff November 20th, 2008 at 12:27 am

    What does CC need time to think about? He either wants to come to NY or not. Our ‘offer’ was a mere formality. If he is interested in coming here, a deal will be hammered out and we will outbid any team.

    So what is he waiting for? A WC team to come close to us? Well, then we will presumably raise our offer again and we are right back at square one.

    He has had months to think about this, especially from early October on. What more could he possibly try and process in the next week?

  84. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 12:27 am

    “Jackson is a line drive hitter, and speed guy. The home runs will come, but don’t expect 30 homers a year…18-22 probably. He should get to 25-30 steals a year. Don’t confuse him being very good with being great. You’ll be disappointed.”

    I’m definitely not expecting that at all. That’d be incredibly unreasonable; I mean, the guy’s not a Ryan Braun type hitter.

    I love a 9.2 unintentional walk rate, though–thank you, StatCorner–awesome site if you haven’t checked it out, do so. tRA is essentially an invention of theirs and despite its complexity, it’s really growing on me.

    tRA in a nutshell is basically like FIP/DIPS but to a higher level. It takes the expected runs/outs on different batted ball types and uses those in its calculation. Very, very cool.

  85. GreenBeret7 November 20th, 2008 at 12:27 am

    pat
    November 20th, 2008 at 12:24 am
    “What a bizarre thing it would be if Jeter’s gone after 2010 and arod and tex are manning the fort.”

    People thought the same thing in 1995 when Mattingly retired. It seems to have worked out okay the last 13 years though.

    I’m guessing Jeter will be around post 2010 if he wants to be.

    ———————————————————-

    I would guess that he becomes the DH and super utility player after that.

  86. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 12:30 am

    “What does CC need time to think about? He either wants to come to NY or not. Our ‘offer’ was a mere formality. If he is interested in coming here, a deal will be hammered out and we will outbid any team.

    So what is he waiting for? A WC team to come close to us? Well, then we will presumably raise our offer again and we are right back at square one.

    He has had months to think about this, especially from early October on. What more could he possibly try and process in the next week?”

    If five or six places of employment were set to offer you a contract, would you take the first one?

    If you were accepted at five or six colleges, would you go to the first one that accepted you?

  87. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 12:31 am

    “I would guess that he becomes the DH and super utility player after that.”

    I don’t think after 2010 (barring some advanced age surge in the next two years) Jeter’s offense will justify him being a DH. We’ll just have to wait and see.

  88. CB November 20th, 2008 at 12:34 am

    “Let’s just put it this way, I’d rather pay $175M to Tex than $150M to CC. ”

    Here’s the problem – no team truly has a choice between spending on Tex and spending on CC.

    This year there are really going to effectively be two free agent periods.

    The first is going to happen from now probably until the winter meetings. All of the top pitchers will likely sign then.

    At the meetings and after the Boras circus is going to prop up its main tent and then the hitters are going to sign.

    Teams really don’t have a choice of signing Sabbathi OR Tex because there’s going to be almost no overlap when both guys want to sign.

    CC wants it done early. Tex as boras always does – very late.

    So here’s the issue if you only have one $150+ contract to dole out. You can only sign Tex if you elect to pass on CC. If you pass on CC though you very well may come up empty, especially with Boras.

    But if you bid on CC and miss you could also then bid on Tex. Caveat there is of course – CC accepts then you are out on Tex.

    Choosing to allocate resources to tex rather than CC creates a much higher risk of getting neither than trying to bid on CC.

  89. Ocelot November 20th, 2008 at 12:34 am

    I think FA market will break down like this:

    Manny stays with Dodgers.

    Texeira to Boston.

    CC to Angels.

    AJ to Yankees.

    Lowe to Giants.

    Pettitte to Astros.

    KRod to Mets.

    Sheets to Brewers.

  90. GreenBeret7 November 20th, 2008 at 12:38 am

    Squints
    November 20th, 2008 at 12:31 am
    “I would guess that he becomes the DH and super utility player after that.”

    I don’t think after 2010 (barring some advanced age surge in the next two years) Jeter’s offense will justify him being a DH. We’ll just have to wait and see.

    ———————————————————

    Why not? Paul Molitor was a DH for more than 10 years. Seems like he was realitively successful and so were his teams.

  91. Ocelot November 20th, 2008 at 12:41 am

    If you were accepted at five or six colleges, would you go to the first one that accepted you?

    If it was Harvard? Yes.

  92. mel November 20th, 2008 at 12:42 am

    CB,

    Gotcha. Either way it’s a win-win. We get CC. Or we miss out on him and take a stab at Tex.

  93. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 12:44 am

    “Why not? Paul Molitor was a DH for more than 10 years. Seems like he was realitively successful and so were his teams.”

    That’s true but Molitor was hitting at a higher level when he became a full time DH in 1991. As much as I love DJ, I don’t see him putting up some of the seasons that Molitor put up in the last 7-8 years of his career. I think 2008 is what we’re going to see more of in the next few years, not 07/06.

    I don’t think he’s going to have as much of a power outage again in 2009, though. I hope.

  94. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 12:45 am

    “If it was Harvard? Yes.”

    Just because it’s the most prestigious place with the biggest endowment doesn’t mean it’s the right place, though. CC’s doing what any one of us would do in the same situation–sit back, review all your options, then decide.

  95. CB November 20th, 2008 at 12:48 am

    mel,

    I think this is really why the angels are in on CC. Making the commitment to Tex is the most high risk strategy possible. You can easily come up with nothing major to show for the winter.

    It’s ironic – I agree that a long term contract for Tex is much less risky given that he’s a hitter. That said, the act of trying to sign tex is much more risk in and of itself.

    This is one of the reasons why Boras is so good at getting high dollar deals in the market.

    He keeps dragging out the process. As that process drags out teams on his hook start needing his client more and more because the alternative possiblities keep coming off the board.

    In a sense Boras keeps driving up the opportunity cost associated with no signing his client. You can’t not afford to sign this one guy because you spent all winter waiting for him and passing up other moves that you may have deemed important but not as important as signing the Boras client.

    The longer you wait in the market the more expensive not making a move becomes. You have fewer alternatives – supply keeps shrinking and that artificially increases your demand for what is left.

  96. Smarter Than You November 20th, 2008 at 12:49 am

    Oh, boy. Did anybody else take economics class? Its called selling high and right now trading Hughes could fill a very important need going into next year. I can’t believe people want this guy made untouchable.

    Did you sleep through the class?

    It’s more likely than not that trading Hughes now would be selling low rather than high.

    Stop being so fatuous.

  97. ralphrc November 20th, 2008 at 12:55 am

    CC was awful last year with Cleveland, he’s terrible in the playoffs, he’s fat and will probably blow up on the mound, and he doesn’t want to be here. Why waste the time and money and go sign Tex, Sheets, Burnett, and Pettitte, use Swisher in center, and consider signing Dunn as he is under the radar for RF(can’t be much worse than Abreu). I’d also trade Nady, since he would bring a nice return and it’s his last year on his deal with Boras as his agent.

  98. Ocelot November 20th, 2008 at 12:55 am

    November 20th, 2008 at 12:45 am

    Indeed I agree.

  99. feefoo November 20th, 2008 at 6:37 am

    AHAHAH WHAT A JOKE. YOU WANT DUNN AND SWISHER IN THE OF! GET A LIFE!

  100. Squints November 20th, 2008 at 7:27 am

    Dunn wouldn’t be a bad option at all, just not in the OF.

  101. Ron November 20th, 2008 at 9:27 am

    Its difficult to develop your own pitching when the team is consistenly drafting near the bottom. It is do-able, but more difficult than lets say Pirates, KC, etc.

  102. Jake November 20th, 2008 at 10:07 am

    I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again:

    If the Yankees plug Hughes into their rotation on Opening Day, it will be a terrible mistake.

    His A, AA, AAA, and AFL stats are fine and dandy but he is yet to do anything of consistent success in the majors. When I see that (out of the bullpen), then I can see him being discussed as a starter.

    But good strides Phil, I hope you pan out this time.

  103. bodhisattva November 20th, 2008 at 10:24 am

    Ron
    November 20th, 2008 at 9:27 am
    Its difficult to develop your own pitching when the team is consistenly drafting near the bottom. It is do-able, but more difficult than lets say Pirates, KC, etc.

    Well, we’re doing a pretty good job of it now: Wang, Joba, assorted bullpen arms, Hughes hopefully contributes in 2009 and we have a class of impressive young arms headed by Betances. We’ve also made two trades using our pitching depth to land Nady & Marter, and Swisher deal, and none of those pitchers are remotely our elite prospects (unfortunately gave up Tabata, an elite position prospect).

    We have enormous pitching depth now in this organization in, what, a matter of four years? It’s pretty impressive. McAllister is now starting to knock on the door of the top tier of guys, and Banuelos looks to have a bright future as a homegrown lefty.

    We may have help from Aceves and Garcia in 2009, certainly from the former and if the latter can stay healthy, he’s one of the organization’s most talented arms who would be ready to chip in.

    Cashman’s reload job appears to have happened virtually overnight.

  104. bodhisattva November 20th, 2008 at 10:25 am

    ^^Marte

  105. bodhisattva November 20th, 2008 at 10:29 am

    Jake
    November 20th, 2008 at 10:07 am
    I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again:
    If the Yankees plug Hughes into their rotation on Opening Day, it will be a terrible mistake.

    They’ve already said he’d have to earn the spot, and even if he does, they’re going to be careful with him and give him the best chance to be successful. “Terrible mistake” if he’s their best option to round out the rotation coming out of spring training? How so?

  106. gdamac November 20th, 2008 at 12:08 pm

    The Yanks are set to throw around money like sailors on fleet week after good starting pitching, lack of depth at starting pitching is one HUGE reason we missed the playoffs despite the pay roll.

    DO NOT TRADE HUGHES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  107. bodhisattva November 20th, 2008 at 12:36 pm

    ^^^Really can’t see it. He was mixing in the change last night to good effect. His velocity has enjoyed a bump-up. He’s 22.

  108. SullyLV November 20th, 2008 at 12:50 pm

    Let’s remember Hughes is still only 22 years old.He needs time to deveolope.Trading him now means Cashman was wrong in
    not doing the Santana trade.When it’s all said and done Yankee fan’s will be happy that Hughes is pitching for the Yanks.


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