Dodgers offer Manny and Lowe
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- December
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The Los Angeles Dodgers offered arbitration to Manny Ramirez and Derek Lowe. Manny made $20 million last year. If he ever got in front of a panel, he’d get some sort of raise. While it’s hard to imagine Scott Boras accepting arbitration, he did it with Greg Maddux in 2003.
I bet a few name players will accept in this market. For some guys, it might make sense.
See MLB Trade Rumors for all your arbitration deadline needs at this point. I think I’m calling it a night.
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on Monday, December 1st, 2008 at 9:35 pm by Peter Abraham.
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Peter Abraham
Who’s gonna pay 3-strike Manny more than $20 mill in this depression?
Sleep tight Pete. Between the stock market crashing again and trying to figure out Brian Cashman’s logic & deceit I’ve had enough too.
You sleep, Pete. That’s creepy like when you see your teacher in the supermarket.
It is interesting looking through the list of players offered and not offered arbitration.
It seems as though the only players offered are the ones, the teams are sure they will not be able to keep Krod, AJ, Lowe etc.
The ones that they declined; Thomas, Embree etc are ones they aren’t sure other teams will sign, or that the current team doesn’t want to sign at the going rate.
it’s pathetic to see the Yankees acting like the Mets used to act in their cheapskate period.
Cashman’s comments are pathetic. he said “We wanted to be able to control the cost that we would allocate for every position on the club.”
the Brewers need to be that particular; not the Yanks. These comments are so small that it makes me wonder whether Cashman had anything to do w/the big decisions that made the Yankees great when George was running the team.
Methinks that Hal is not his father when it comes to the pocketbook. Strange days indeed.
Dunn doesn’t require a loss of draft picks…I’m in for signing him, and try to move either Damon or Nady.
People who keep calling the Yankees both ‘rich’ and ‘cheap’ realize they just built a 1.5 billion dollar stadium, right? My guess is that’s at least $100m/yr in payments.
GM and all of Detroit is going down. Our country is in the toilet. Do you really think it’s impossible for the Yankees to have financial problems?
From what I hear, they say if Obama pulls a miracle, the recession with ‘only’ be 2 years, although most pundits think it will last at least 4 years. Baseball will be seriously impacted. $20m in 2008 dollars might be $12m in 2010.
**or try to**
Dodgers will give Man-Ram 25 per.
I rather sign Dunn than Manny despite his 100+ Ks. The short porch in RF will do good for Dunn.:)
“I rather sign Dunn than Manny despite his 100+ Ks. The short porch in RF will do good for Dunn.:)”
Oh Lord. Dunn can’t play a lick of defense. However he WOULD hit 50+ HR’s in the stadium.
Al from BK( Where in the world is Carsten Charles Sabathia?)
December 1st, 2008 at 10:54 pm
Dodgers will give Man-Ram 25 per.
no way the dodgers give manny 25 million a year.
they pulled their offer away because they were affraid he would take it.
these players will not get the big contracts that they thought they were.
tex,cc,manny & all of them will get less years & less per year or they will be sitting by the phone waiting for a call.
this is why now you don’t see anybody at all being signed or getting offers.
the agents after a long time will say take a shorter deal ?& wait untill next year.
“However he WOULD hit 50+ HR’s in the stadium.”
that’s what i only care about. lol, he doesn’t require a loss of draft picks unlike 2 of Boras’ clients.
one of***
“Al from BK( Where in the world is Carsten Charles Sabathia?)
December 1st, 2008 at 10:54 pm
Dodgers will give Man-Ram 25 per.
no way the dodgers give manny 25 million a year.
they pulled their offer away because they were affraid he would take it.
these players will not get the big contracts that they thought they were.
tex,cc,manny & all of them will get less years & less per year or they will be sitting by the phone waiting for a call.
this is why now you don’t see anybody at all being signed or getting offers.
the agents after a long time will say take a shorter deal ?& wait untill next year.”
Well if CC takes our offer he won’t exactly be getting robbed. Manny and Tex will have to take less yrs+cash but CC will get whatever he wants from the Yanks.
OldYansFan, if they financially overextended themselves w/the new Stadium, then it’s terrible, greedy management. just like GM – if GM were well-run, the downturn wouldn’t have threatened it’s existence.
no one’s gonna go to the new Stadium if the Yanks devolve into a mediocre team. tix are a ton, and they got rid of a lot of cheap seats.
The Red Sox offered arbitration to Jason Varitek (Type A) and Paul Byrd (Type B). They were both borderline cases, and it seems that either player could go either way on deciding whether to accept. Yet, the Yanks don’t do anything with 2 players like Abreu and IRod who were less likely to accept then the 2 Sox players.
maybe with that explanation all the babies screaming bloody murder about Abreu not being offered and crying about losing potential draft picks will zip it.
Abreu very likely could have accepted since he loves being here and the money won’t necessarily be there for the 2nd tier free agents.
Cashman appears to be shoring up his resume — showing he has what it takes to manage payroll like small-market teams have to. Remember, the rub last fall was, “he’ll never get another GM job, all he’s had to do was write checks in New York.”
Abreu accepting is fine by me. then there’d be a good patient hitter in right instead of Nady, who has no patience.
i could live w/Nady if Teixeira were coming along. but…well, if Cashman thinks the way to improve the 2008 Yanks pathetic offense is to replace Giambi & Abreu w/Nady and Swisher, Cashman’s inept. hopefully there’s more to the plan – but his comments were so small-town that it’s hard to respect that possibility.
“The Red Sox offered arbitration to Jason Varitek (Type A) and Paul Byrd (Type B).”
here is the difference, since everything is not about the Yankees:
the Red Sox WANT Varitek to accept. they currently don’t have a catcher and are ok with Varitek on a one year contract.
Byrd only made $7M last year. he will likely be signed somewhere else for close to that.
Pudge made $13M. he will NOT get close to $13M on the open market.
every case is different.
“Remember, the rub last fall was, “he’ll never get another GM job, all he’s had to do was write checks in New York.”
”
where was that “the rub”? in your head?
find me one source for that.
“hopefully there’s more to the plan – but his comments were so small-town that it’s hard to respect that possibility.”
I hope so to. However as long as he gets CC and another pitcher I can deal with the offense being average.
Patience people. The time to judge this decision will come later.
The only things we know are the public facts concerning the decisions to-date. The rest is reading the tea leaves from press statements from management. Did everyone expect Cashman to come out and lay out his entire strategy for the off-season? We know nothing of management’s true plans — nor should we. If we did, every other team would know too.
I am willing to give Cashman the benefit of the doubt that they had a good reason to believe there was a likelihood that Abreu would accept. And perhaps they have good reason to feel they will re-sign Andy anyway. Or perhaps Cashman has other ideas that will make these moves make more sense.
It’s like watching a poker game and commenting on the player’s moves based only on chip counts and position without knowing the cards held.
Give it some time.
Let’s see how it all shakes out
The surprisingly limited number of arbitration offers clearly shows that the recession has impacted the baseball world much to the disappointment of many. (“The many” being the second tier of free agents). Cashman’s actions mirror those of his counterparts and demonstrate that the Yankees are not necessarily above it all.
On the other hand, and IMO, the Yankees are still prepared to add the Big Bat and are simply avoiding the largesse of recent years but possibly covering the downside if they fail in that pursuit… Most likely, they would not have cared about the potential waste in more prosperous times but the landscape has been altered.
It would be shocking if Abreu were to receive a handsome 3 year package given his declining skills particularly on the defensive side. I cannot foresee an NL team even contemplating a multi-year signing if that club were doing any level of due diligence. I sense from the somewhat rude manner in which Abreu has been treated (the absence of any contact) that his defensive play this past year was an absolute turn-off. Though nothing was stated during the season (or in the post-season other than Girardi’s cryptic comment that they must “get more athletic”—i.e., “lets get some guys who can play defense”), it would seem that both Cashman and Girardi had concluded that they could no longer tolerate his defensive play.
Only as a last resort (and assuming he is available) would a contract be proffered. That assumes no FA Big Bat is added. Were I to speculate, however, I would say Manny will be slotted in as the DH, but I’m usually wrong.
We shall see; it is absolutely intriguing.
“the Red Sox WANT Varitek to accept. they currently don’t have a catcher”
Pettitte leaving the Yankees would harm the Yankees far more IMO than Veritek leaving would harm the Red Sox.
Pettitte’s impossible to replace – durable, a lefty, plus his intangibles. the last time the Yanks got cheap w/him, Cashman’s brilliant plan was to “replace” him w/Vasquez and Kevin Brown. why risk losing him?
I am sure Cashman has a plan. Relax people! I bet he has already worked something out with Pettitte. Abreu was on the way anyway.
July 1st-
Is your handle a reference to A Jax?
The Cubs did not offer arbitration to either Kerry Woods or Bobby Howry.
Both were type A free agents.
The Cubs passed on 4 first round/ supplemental first round picks.
The cubs are not a small market team nor have they been afraid to spend money (see Soriano and Zambrano’s contracts).
Teams are clearly worried about what’s going on in the economy.
Woods said he would have come back on a one year deal – and the Cubs made sure he had no opportunity to do so, even passing on the picks to ensure their cost structure.
That would have never happened a year ago. Woods was terrific this year.
CB-
Any thoughts on Burrell? No word yet on whether he was offered arbitration.
Burell is the really interesting guy, IMO.
If he’s not offered arbitration then teams really think the entire free agent market may collapse.
He’s a terrible defender but he had a terrific season at the plate – much better than Abreu. And the idea that he’d accept arbitration at age 32 – young enough to still expect a multiyear deal (perhaps his last) is very striking.
Manny and Lo(we)? Ouch.
How sson before the Fehr cries collusion……The players middle class has expanded in the past few hours…..I applaud Cashman and the decision regarding Abreu…..I still think The Yanks will reach out to Texeria along with Sabathia…..Suddenly that offer to CC is looking somewhat larger…..
Thanks CB.
Burell wasn’t offered arbitration via mlbtraderumors.com
“How sson before the Fehr cries collusion……The players middle class has expanded in the past few hours….”
Pat,
What we’re watching in front of our eyes is a market potentially deflating.
Its fascinating.
Take the Kerry Woods situation. He’s not offered arbitration when in the past he would have. KRod and Fuentes are.
Kerry Woods now becomes less expensive to sign relative to KRod and Fuentes.
Woods also adds more supply to the market.
Does Woods create downward price pressure on KRod and Fuentes?
I’d guess he does. Watch to see if Omar gives Woods a call now.
But this is how deflation works – prices keep falling, which makes demand decrease (why spend now when spending later may buy more), supply floods the market, etc.
It’ll be interesting to see what happens. Given how few major league players there are and the fixed number of roster spots things can only fall so much.
But right now you get the sense that teams aren’t confident they can properly price the value of many players.
I find a lot of this laughable. Bobby Abreu and Andy Pettitte appear upset because the Yankees aren’t going to pay them $16 million dollars each next year…please.
A friend of mine just lost his job today. Get some perspective people.
These players act as if they can’t get by on $10 to $12 million.
Someone better sit some of these guys down and explain to them what’s really going on in this country. Major league baseball needs to start worrying about how it’s perceived by the general public or people might find something else to turn to to escape…rant over.
“Burell wasn’t offered arbitration via mlbtraderumors.com”
That is something else. Never would have guessed that.
Just remarkable. Burrell hit 33 HR and had an .875 OPS.
There were 11 type A/B free agent outfielders on the market.
Only 4 were offered arbitration. And one of those was Manny. Another was Milton Bradely who is arguably not even an OF anymore.
Burrell, Dunn and Abreu all not offered arbitration.
Abreu’s market price just plummeted. What team is going to sign him at the age of 35 when Burrell and Dunn are available without compensation and are much younger.
Just as it’s true in today’s Real Estate and on Wall Street, it’s a buyer’s market…..Unless of course your looking to buy in Beverly Hills or the Upper East Side…..Next week in Vegas is going to be extremely interesting on many fronts….
i recall Burrell having a bad rep – didn’t he have issues w/Bowa?
Dunn – jeez, he’s Dave Kingman. a .240 hitter who walks and had some pop but an iron glove. no thanks.
Abreu’s fielding was lousy this year, but i’d much rather have him than either of these guys. Abreu’s versatile in that he has power, walks, hits for average, hustles, steals bases – a nice ballplayer.
the comments here are laughable.
the yanks a small market mentality…yeah there payroll will be $170 mill this season.
WHy can’t they just overpay Pettitte about $8 mill more then he is worth this year… These are the same clowns that in 5 months will complain about the bad contracts and no roster flexibility because the yanks have no more money to spend..
yeah get adam dunn, he fits the profile of a winning player. he cannot field, run, and strikes out over 170 tiems a year, hell let’s sign his twin also.He sounds like a little younger and bigger giambi…WOW that signing worked out well. I forgot the fans liked him because he was fun loving and a good interview, forget that he stole about $50 mill, nah he was a good guy and wore the thong resign him also.
“Next week in Vegas is going to be extremely interesting on many fronts….”
Absolutely. Players must be staring at all this in disbelief.
I don’t know if baseball has seen anything quiet like this in the free agent era.
Watch – the next thing that may happen is that players rush to sign.
They’re not going to want to get locked out – teams will have some available money they’ve budgeted to spend. When that money dries up players will be out of luck.
Given that there’s going to be a rush to sign by many players. Get the money when it’s offered.
Right now Cashman’s decision to not offer Abreu arbitration looks much, much better than it did even a few hours ago.
To be paying Abreu $18M next year when Pat Burrell may be making $10M would be crazy. An awful value.
The LA times is reporting another surprise – John Garland is going to accept arbitration.
Who would have thought Garland would accept arbitration.
That’s an indicator that the players also aren’t feeling all that confident of testing the market.
Garland’s not very good – but in ordinary circumstances he’d have expected a contract at least as good as Carlos Silva’s last year.
Now he’s willing to go on a one year deal? I’d guess he’s trying to rebuild some value given how poor his year went – but for a durable pitcher his age to not think he could get a multi-year deal is something.
Maybe Sheets will decline arbitration, he is so much better than Garland.
Off-season pitching moves:
CC Sabathia/6 years 140 million
Andy Pettitte/1 year 12 million
Ben Sheets/2 years 14 per incentive laden deal w/3rd team option
“Maybe Sheets will decline arbitration, he is so much better than Garland.”
Just a guess – I think there’s a very good chance Sheets accepts arbitration unless he’s truly worried his elbow might blow out.
He’ll get $15-16M in arbitration. What will he be offered on the open market given his elbow?
We’ll see how risk averse he is. We’ll see that of all players who are free agents now.
CB-
Didn’t Peter say CC will get his deal done before the winter meetings?
Clock is ticking.
“CB-
Didn’t Peter say CC will get his deal done before the winter meetings?
Clock is ticking.”
The further this CC thing goes without a resolution the more I think Genske wants to shop around 140 mil at the winter meetings. In this economy it will be a tough sell and if the Angels get Tex we will be the only team in the running.
If the market is this bad for middle tier talent, it would serve the yankees well to go after someone outside of signing the big names. They can get them at a discount it would seem and spend more on somebody else. especially considering that their major targets were all offered arbitration while soo many others were not – they could pay less and not lose the draft picks they will not get back from their own free agent.
CB,
sheets may not be offered 15 milion but he will get a multiyear deal. There is always the risk if accepting arbitration and getting injured next year for even more of the season. At this time, he is coming off a season in which he started the all star game and had an era close to 3 in almost 200 innings. Could he really replicate that next season? He could potentially sign a 2 year 30 million dollar deal and hope that when he becomes a free agent in 2010 the market has picked up and he has stayed healthy for two seasons. Just a thought but you are probably right – he could very well accept arbitration
*******************BREAKING NEWS***********************
The LoHud Yankee Blog has announced that it will not offer arbitration to adult nightclubs Lace and Stiletto. Said blog spokesman P. Abe:
“The determination we made today was to make sure that we control what amount we’d be spending at least in the event that we’re fortunate enough to purchase lapdances at these clubs again. We did not want to put ourselves in a position of having that determined by a third party without knowing what that [dancer's] figure would be. The arbitration time period falls in early February, so obviously as we attempt to make New Years plans, in Lace’s case and Stiletto’s case, they made a lot from us last year. It’s been tough in the past to try and deviate from previous years tips in an arbitration setting. We wanted to be able to control the cost that we would allocate for every position [in] the club[s].
“Even though we wanted lapdances, by offering arbitration we would lose out ability to determine a final cost. So by doing so, we chose to go a different direction, not offer arbitration and we’ll still stay engaged with the entire adult entertainment market including those two clubs.”
******************DEVELOPING STORY**********************
I have to say I have slightly changed my opinion towards the arb decisions considering Dunn and Burrell were both not offered. I guess it is in fact a sign of the terrible times – of course, the yankees to me stand in a different class in terms of money. They consistently have the highest payroll in sports, the most attendance and the highest prices but i guess even the yankees cannot overpay for players when salaries may be shrinking this off season. And the funny thing is that no one really knows by how much.
That is probably the reason for the delay in free agent signings as GMs are desparately trying to evaluate the price of talent. I think this is all the more reason to go after Sheets over Burnett this season barring the idea that Sheets does not accept arbitration. Unlike Burnett who may fall into the class of CC and Tex merely because he is overhyped, Sheets will not only fall under the radar but fall into the mid tier talent and could in fact, be in steal for us in the end.
Further, this could impact the players expectations. CC who has been sitting on 140 million for weeks may now realize why he hasnt received any offers to counter the yanks and could pounce on the offer sooner rather than later. i dont think players realized the dire straights and this arbitration process may have served as a wake up call. Especially for cc sabathia who is waiting to accept the highest contract in baseball in a country that is in a bad recession surrounded by players that are being forced to take pay cuts.
Nick,
LOL, Best.Breaking.News.Ever!
People that are defending Cashman’s decision to not offer arbitration to Abreu, Pudge, and Marte are not addressing the point that if they accept arbitration, the Yankees can cut them 16 days before the season starts and only pay them for 30 days. I’m not sure how many days an MLB contract is based on, but I figure it’s at least 180 days. That would mean the Yankees would have to pay less than 17% of what the arbitrator decides the player should get. The percentage could even be less.
That means that if Abreu was awarded a $17 million contract, the Yankees could tell him that if he accepted it, they would cut him. He would get less than $3 million from the Yankees. He’d be looking for a new team 16 days before the season starts when most teams would have their budgets set.
Pudge would be in the same boat. Let’s say he gets a raise and the arbitrator gives him a $14 million contract. He would get $2.3 million from the Yankees. He ends up losing money.
The Marte contract seems like a mistake too. I don’t think there’s any way he takes a 1 year arbitration deal based on what Affeldt got a few weeks ago. They definitely could have gotten 2 picks for him, and as valuable as a lefty reliever is, Coke looked pretty good last year and the bullpen is strong anyway.
And, what’s the reason to not offer arbitration to Mussina?
Here’s a link that makes the arbitration process pretty easy to understand: http://baseball.suite101.com/article.cfm/how_baseball_arbitration_works
I dont really like burrell or dunn unless they come real cheap and that means cheaper than one year and the 16 million we passed on for abreu. I dont see either one of them being significantly better although they are younger. We dont really need a left fielder or DH as much as right, center or first. Dunn can play first but not very well.
OPS+ Comparisonin 2008
Burrell – 125
Dunn – 127
Abreu – 120 and speed which isnt taken into account
I think people need to stop harping on the idea that the Yankees could offer arbitration and then cut the guy. What purpose does that serve and when was the last time you saw that happen with an all-star caliber player?
Firstly, said player would take up a roster spot on the 40 man. Secondly, is that really the kind of message you want to send to players? We’ll offer you arb…but we’ll cut you right before the season if you accept. I’m sure that would resonate well with players thinking of signing with the Yankees…come on.
Abreu is not a $16 million player anymore, it’s that simple. Neither is Pettitte. You’re going to see a much better constructed Yankee team next year. Better defense, more athletic, deeper pitching. Cashman is making tough, smart moves.
You’re going to see better years from Cano, Matsui, Posada. Too much panic on this blog.
The Yankees can hopefully get CC and maybe Sheets and they could be looking pretty good.
I think players can sign a grievance and it is determined why they are being cut by the comissioners office or something like that. I dont think teams can sign players pay them part of their current contract, cut them and then, rack up the draft picks. It would make arbitration a joke as teams would be paying to get draft picks back. There has to be some sort of rule that prevents that from happening or at least protects the player from having to sit out a season because the team wanted to screw them over.
i LIKE HOW sabathia, burnett, lowe, sheets, tex and manny were all offered arbitration. Every FA that the Yanks FO has talked about looking at for the most part. And jon garland being offered arbitration is surprising – 12 million last year with a 5 era. I guess it goes to show how much the angels value their draft picks. This action could draw comparisons to pettitte – both had down years. Both could have been signed for cheaper most likely. Garland was a B free agent but making less money and pettitte was an A free agent making 4 million more. Im sure Paul Byrd could also have been signed for less but im sure the sox did not want to risk losing the pick – he was also a type B.
mr exceptional – there isnt enough free agents and money available to do a complete makeover of the team. We need our kids to come through as well. I dont think people are anrgy because they wanted pettitte and abreu back for 16 million. It was the fact that not offering arb was completely giving up hope to get more first rounders that made the decision tough to bear. Everyone keeps saying that pettitte and abreu werent worth that much but was the risk that they may pay them that much worth getting two first rounders each? That is the real question. I think most people realize abreu wont make an annual salary that close to 16 million next season.
despite all of this discussion, i still find it highly unlikely that abreu would have accepted – he may get less than 16 million but he certainly will get more than one year and Im pretty positive thats what he wants.
“I think people need to stop harping on the idea that the Yankees could offer arbitration and then cut the guy. What purpose does that serve and when was the last time you saw that happen with an all-star caliber player?
Firstly, said player would take up a roster spot on the 40 man. Secondly, is that really the kind of message you want to send to players? We’ll offer you arb…but we’ll cut you right before the season if you accept. I’m sure that would resonate well with players thinking of signing with the Yankees…come on.”
I agree that the roster spot could be an issue, but I don’t see any player accepting arbitration, especially the way this free agent market is, if they know they are going to need to look for a new contract 16 days before the season. It’s not THAT big of a problem, but I do see your point.
Is that the message that I want to send players? I think the players signing with the Yankees are focused on getting paid, not whether or not the owners/managers are nice people. You see anyone coming to the Yankees because they think Cashman, or the Steinbrenners for that matter, are nice guys? No. The ONLY good character trait that Steinbrenner has had is that he wants to win, and approaching the arbitration process the way I suggested is showing that they want to win.
Also, I’m sure the reason I can’t think of an example of this happening to an all-star player is because whenever a team tells them they will be cut right before the season, they don’t accept arbitration. Why would a player put himself in that position, especially in this free agent market? And why would that rule be there if it wasn’t used?
Here’s the rule:
“If the player is cut within 16 days before the season begins, he is entitled only to 30 days’ termination pay. If the player is cut during spring training but after the 16th day before the season begins, he is entitled only to 45 days’ termination pay.”
I don’t think the Yankees would get picks if they cut the players, but it wouldn’t get that far. I definitely don’t think a player could file a grievance if the Yankees don’t do anything against the rules.
There are constraints on the ability of a team to release players on non-guaranteed contracts, such that union grievances could be filed and the Yanks could end up paying players that didn’t play before the grievance was heard – and MLB isn’t known for its speedy approach to such things.
There was never any consideration to offer arb to Pudge – he would definetly accept, as he’d likely make more in that 1 year than in 2+ on the open market. Pettitte would have accepted as well – the talk about the Dodgers and not wanting to take a pay cut was designed to push the Yanks to offer – his agent knows he won’t get that kind of payout in the open market, even without the draft pick cost.
The Garland and Byrd offers are interesting – let’s hope they both accept, and they could. Garland could be a stumbling block for the Angels – they’d have the same 5 starters from ‘08 signed, plus Escobar too who won’t be healthy to start the season. Of course, they’re gunning for 1 of CC or Tex – maybe they shift back to Tex at that point. Byrd accepting the Sox offer could be good – I’m betting they have a gentleman’s agreement he won’t. But seemingly it would be in his interest to accept – how many years does he have left – and accepting means a minimum of $6 MM in ‘08.
no. 27 –
that’s merely the rule on what must be paid if players with non-guaranteed contracts are terminated by those dates. Not sure how or if it applies, but there is a sufficient demonstrated skill provision in the uniform player contract that could lead to a grievance procedure.
Sabathia+Sheets!!! Sabathia+Sheets!!! Ca$hman, sign Sabathia+Sheets!!!
Sabathia, Sheets, Wang, Joba, Hughes/Pettitte = WS
the yankees went into this winter looking to shift emphasis from scoring runs to preventing runs and they wanted to cut payroll significantly. not offering arbitration to pettitte and abreu fits this goal perfectly. Lets face it, either guy would have taken the arbitration, so the yankees would have been on the hook for 32-38 million for those two.
if pettitte had pitched for say the indians and finished the season the way he did, (especially considering that he’s always been a better 2nd half pitcher) then there’s no way you’d even think of offering him anywhere near $16M. he’s looking for a legacy payraise. only thing is he broke the chain a long time ago when he went to houston b/c the yankees didn’t come running after him with buckets of money quick enough.
abreu helped the offense a ton, but was a total defensive liability who’s skills are eroding before our eyes.
we didnt miss out on any draft picks, both these guys would’ve taken arbitration, so we only lost out the chance to way overpay two fading former all-stars.
Pete and others-
When you wake up, tell me what compensation the Yankees would have to give the Brewers if they signed both Sabathia and Sheets. Sabathia rated higher than Sheets, so does that mean the Brewers get the Yankees 1st round pick for Sabathia+ a sandwich pick and then the Brewers get the Yankees 2nd round pick for Sheets? Would they also get the Yankees 3rd round pick for Sheets, or another sandwich pick between 2nd and 3rd rounds?
“When you wake up, tell me what compensation the Yankees would have to give the Brewers if they signed both Sabathia and Sheets.”
YT:
In the scenario you describe, the Brewers would get the Yankees 1st and 2nd round picks plus two sandwich picks.
“Abreu’s fielding was lousy this year, but i’d much rather have him than either of these guys. Abreu’s versatile in that he has power, walks, hits for average, hustles, steals bases – a nice ballplayer.”
George – You are correct that Bobby is still an above average player and has some fine attributes. However, last year his defense was horrible, and rated at -28 runs.
You simply can’t ignor the effect his defense has on winning (or losing) games. So, based on last year’s salary, we have:
Player .OPS Defen Age Pay
ADunn: .898 .Poor 29 $13m
Abreu: .843 Worst 34 $16m
Now I’m not advocating getting Dunn… just saying for the money, there are better alternatives to Bobby. Plus, due to age and being in YS, Dunn has a better chance of outperforming his last year. If we did get Dunn, he could play 1st with Swisher in RF. Swisher, if he posts a .800ish OPS, considering defense, MAY be as valuable as Bobby for $10m less.
Thanks Fredo-
If we sign Burnett and Sabathia, does Toronto get the Yankees 1st pick, having had a worse record than the Brewers or do the Brewers get the 1st pick with Sabathia rated as a higher Type A than Burnett?
The worst that can happen if we sign three Type A free agents, who were offered but declined arbitration is our 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round picks. Correct?
“The worst that can happen if we sign three Type A free agents, who were offered but declined arbitration is our 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round picks. Correct?”
Yeah, I believe so. How those picks are dispersed is a matter of Elias rankings I think. Sabathia would be #1, followed by Burnett and Sheets if I remember the rankings correctly.
This will be the final year that many if nor all baseball owners will feel they are at the beckon call of a Scott Boras.
His clients will tell him under the conditions of the economy, they want a reasonable deal done sooner than later.
Playing waiting games will not be in the best intersts of the player.
Al from BK( Where in the world is Carsten Charles Sabathia?)
December 1st, 2008 at 11:17 pm
“I rather sign Dunn than Manny despite his 100+ Ks. The short porch in RF will do good for Dunn.:)”
Oh Lord. Dunn can’t play a lick of defense. However he WOULD hit 50+ HR’s in the stadium.
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So would Juan Miranda, if he ever gets the chance.