Winter Meetings video blog No. 1
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- December
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In the interest of embracing technology, I did a video blog after arriving in Las Vegas.
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Chad Jennings
Sam Borden
You are the best Pete! Looking forward to you breaking all the news. Live it up a little you are out there.
I’ll take a couple of packs of cashews…..thanks for the coverage Pete!
Pittsburgh has apparently made four players available in what looks like a salary perge. Catcher Ronny Paulina, 2nd baseman Freddie Sanchez, LRP John Grabow and 1st baseman Adam LaRoche.
Paulina would make a fine replacement backup for Posada. He’s a much better hitter than Molina and a good defensive catcher.
Grabow would be a really good replacement for Coke, who could then return to a starter’s role.
Sanchez, at 5 mil a year for one year, is still a good hitter and is versitile. He plays 3rd, ss and second base. He could also be moved for other things to teams like San Francisco, LA Dodgers, Cubs and Colorado, all needing second basemen and all have some good young players.
Most importantly is LaRoche. If NYY strikes out on Teixeira, that should be the target.
Pittsburgh needs everything, especially money and pitching. NYY has a lot of money, good young not quite ready for NY pitchers and a lot of relief pitchers, both minor and major league.
They’re beginning to collect a lot of catchers, not all of which will play in NY. Jose Gil, PJ Pilittere, Kyle Anson, Cervelli are among them.
Middle infield at near the top is what NY is short of, but, players like Marcos Vechionacci, Bernie Castro, Reegie Corona and Ramiro Pena are it. They do have Damon Sublett, Chris Malek, Justin Snyder, and Mitch Hilligoss are just behind them.
Relief pitchers like Britton, Veras, Cox, Jackson, White, Robertson, Albaladejo, Geise, Edwar Ramirez, Whelen, Kroenke, Claggett, Jonathan Ortiz, Humberto Sanchez, Jonathan Hovis and Wordkemper could or should be made available to be moved with out any damage to the big team.
Startes like Kennedy, Wright, Dunn, Jason Jones, Hacker, Chris Garcia, Ryan Pope, Ryan Zink, Ivan Nova, Lance Pendleton
NYY is thin on outfielders, but there are some with promise/hope. Edwar Gonzales, Christian, Colin Curtis, Tim Battle, Abraham Almonte, Seth Fortenberry, Dave Williams and Austin Krum are pretty much what’s available.
Add cash to each deal…making each player coming to NYY a seperate deal. Sanchez is one player they want to unload because of the salary (5 mil +). Obviously NNY doesn’t need all of them, but all four would be of huge value for NYY.
Nady and if Sanchez were acquired could be used for a very good starting pitcher or a collection of very good young players to replenish the farm.
Curious….Can’t seem to get a post to take. Wonde if I’ve been banned.
Guess not.
Part I
Pittsburgh has apparently made four players available in what looks like a salary perge. Catcher Ronny Paulina, 2nd baseman Freddie Sanchez, LRP John Grabow and 1st baseman Adam LaRoche.
Paulina would make a fine replacement backup for Posada. He’s a much better hitter than Molina and a good defensive catcher.
Grabow would be a really good replacement for Coke, who could then return to a starter’s role.
Sanchez, at 5 mil a year for one year, is still a good hitter and is versitile. He plays 3rd, ss and second base. He could also be moved for other things to teams like San Francisco, LA Dodgers, Cubs and Colorado, all needing second basemen and all have some good young players.
Most importantly is LaRoche. If NYY strikes out on Teixeira, that should be the target.
Pittsburgh needs everything, especially money and pitching. NYY has a lot of money, good young not quite ready for NY pitchers and a lot of relief pitchers, both minor and major league.
They’re beginning to collect a lot of catchers, not all of which will play in NY. Jose Gil, PJ Pilittere, Kyle Anson, Cervelli are among them.
Part II
Middle infield at near the top is what NY is short of, but, players like Marcos Vechionacci, Bernie Castro, Reegie Corona and Ramiro Pena are it. They do have Damon Sublett, Chris Malek, Justin Snyder, and Mitch Hilligoss are just behind them.
Relief pitchers like Britton, Veras, Cox, Jackson, White, Robertson, Albaladejo, Geise, Edwar Ramirez, Whelen, Kroenke, Claggett, Jonathan Ortiz, Humberto Sanchez, Jonathan Hovis and Wordkemper could or should be made available to be moved with out any damage to the big team.
Starters like Kennedy, Wright, Dunn, Jason Jones, Hacker, Chris Garcia, Ryan Pope, Ryan Zink, Ivan Nova, Lance Pendleton
Part II
Middle infield at near the top is what NY is short of, but, players like Marcos Vechionacci, Bernie Castro, Reegie Corona and Ramiro Pena are it. They do have Damon Sublett, Chris Malek, Justin Snyder, and Mitch Hilligoss are just behind them.
Part IV
Relief pitchers like Britton, Veras, Cox, Jackson, White, Robertson, Albaladejo, Geise, Edwar Ramirez, Whelen, Kroenke, Claggett, Jonathan Ortiz, Humberto Sanchez, Jonathan Hovis and Wordkemper could or should be made available to be moved with out any damage to the big team.
Part V
Starters like Kennedy, Wright, Dunn, Jason Jones, Hacker, Chris Garcia, Ryan Pope, Ryan Zink, Ivan Nova, Lance Pendleton
Great update. it is difficult to pull off an extemporaneous report; you did a good job.
Pete -
Here’s to an eventful week! Thanks for the video blog. Don’t go getting any paper cuts – sounds like it could be an expensive proposition at the Bellagio. Is it legal to charge $9 for a bandaid????
Good morning, GB7.
Was anyone else hoping at least a little bit that Cash was going to have some good news to start the week?
I’m starting to become my “Nervous Nellie” self with regard to CC et al. and Teixeira. I know Teixeira isn’t their main target, but as much as I know it’s not a good idea to play “keep away,” I really don’t want him to be playing for Boston for the next 8 or so years.
Morning Doreen. Just trying to post this thing, but, it won’t take soming in the completed post. Trying to figure out what part of it is unacceptable. How are you this fine winter morning?
Part VI
NYY are thin on outfielders, but there are some with promise/hope. Edwar Gonzales, Christian, Colin Curtis, Tim Battle, Abraham Almonte, Seth Fortenberry, Dave Williams and Austin Krum are pretty much what’s available.
Part VI
Add cash to each deal…making each player coming to NYY a seperate deal. Sanchez is one player they want to unload because of the salary (5 mil +). Obviously NNY doesn’t need all of them, but all four would be of huge value for NYY.
Nady and if Sanchez were acquired could be used for a very good starting pitcher or a collection of very good young players to replenish the farm.
Part VII
NYY are thin on outfielders, but there are some with promise/hope. Edwar Gonzales, Christian, Colin Curtis, Tim Battle, A.Almonte, Seth Fortenberry, Dave Williams and Austin Krum are pretty much what’s available.
Finally figured out why the complete post wouldn’t take. amazingly, somebody or the filters are paranoid because you can’t type out A-B-R-A-H-A-M without the hyphens.
GB7
I am awake, and chilly, on this fine winter morning. It’s 19 degrees here! I’m beginning to understand why so many people fly south for the winter. Alas, we’re not going to be ready to retire to warmer climes for a long time. Where is that global warming they’ve been talking about??????
I just went over the Ty Kepner’s blog while it was interesting enough, it was the entry beneath his latest that caught my attention. It was about the name for the Mets new stadium. Frankly, I haven’t given the Mets or their stadium any thought at all lately. But it is a conundrum – how do you name a stadium after a now defunct institution? Again, the Yankees get it right.
Are the Yankees afraid CC goes elsewhere or is CC’s agent afraid the Yankees will?
“(Genske) has to be concerned about them pulling the offer and moving on to the other (free agent) pitchers,” the source said. “If he blows this deal, he’s dead as an agent. For one thing, who’s going to approach that $140 million if the Yankees are out of it? Sabathia winds up with a deal $20 million less than Barry Zito?”
http://www.nydailynews.com/spo.....o_yan.html
GB7 -
They must get a lot of impersonators. Can’t blame them. I do remember that for a while, people were posting using Pete’s name and it got really confusing. Pete used to post in the comments section a lot more a couple of years ago, didn’t he?
pat -
I have to think at some point the Yankees are going to have to tell CC’s agent to fish or cut bait. It’s getting ridiculous. But I would imagine that if the WC teams have plans to make offers to CC, this is the week to do it. The Yankees cannot take the chance that they’ve waited so long for Sabathia to decide that they lose all their other possibilities.
Doreen, a hint on how to beat the cold…at least until you have to go shopping or to work….build a large dome over the entire house, using clear vinyl sheeting (but it in rolls). Using 12″ slats 8 feet long. Put them in the shape of triangles and staple the plastic to them. Keep building them and connecting them, raising them in sections until the house is completely covered. Grass will grow and stay green, you can swim in the pool. It’s like a solarium. We used to do that with homes in upper state NY during the winter to build homes.
Or, if you don’t want to do that, turn the heat up very high.
Doreen
December 8th, 2008 at 6:43 am
GB7 –
They must get a lot of impersonators. Can’t blame them. I do remember that for a while, people were posting using Pete’s name and it got really confusing. Pete used to post in the comments section a lot more a couple of years ago, didn’t he?
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Not sure how this was run before, Doreen. I started coming here about the middle part of 2007 season. There will be problems if the Yanks get any more players by that last name. They have two in the system already.
They are used as first names…sorry for the confusion.
GB7 -
Think I’ll forego the dome. I usually walk around the house draped in a blanket. My husband thinks I should wear slippers instead of going around barefoot. He might have something there. Last Christmas he got be a NY Yankees blanket (my “Yankee Blankie” as I call it.) It’s a mainstay, even in the summer months. One of the best (useful) gifts I ever got!
As for the players with the “A” name, perhaps we could go the biblical route: “Abram” or just plain ole “Abe.”
Doreen
December 8th, 2008 at 7:00 am
GB7 –
Think I’ll forego the dome. I usually walk around the house draped in a blanket. My husband thinks I should wear slippers instead of going around barefoot. He might have something there. Last Christmas he got be a NY Yankees blanket (my “Yankee Blankie” as I call it.) It’s a mainstay, even in the summer months. One of the best (useful) gifts I ever got!
As for the players with the “A” name, perhaps we could go the biblical route: “Abram” or just plain ole “Abe.”
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You could order a couple of “Snuggies” that come with reading lites from TV at $19.95 plus handling. A blanket with sleeves. Comes in blue and red. Sounds like a commercial, huh?
I guess “ABE” could be used. ABRAM could be used, I suppose, but it makes me think of a tank. Maybe the yanks can trade them and we won’t have to worry about it.
I’m crushed that you didn’t think much of my dome idea. I guess I’ll just have keep my secrets for my own use.
GB7 -
Maybe “Ab(raham)” ?
The problem with the dome idea is that by the time we got it finished, it would be summer – of 2012.
Doreen
December 8th, 2008 at 7:12 am
GB7 –
Maybe “Ab(raham)” ?
The problem with the dome idea is that by the time we got it finished, it would be summer – of 2012.
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Well, yeah, it may take some time, but, I didn’t say the idea was perfected, yet.
I suppose they could be nicknamed “Raham”. If Ramirez can be “ManRam” why not? DEJE, MATEX, ROCA, JODA, BGAR…..
Nah….maybe not.
too bad for the yankees veritek didnt accept arbitration and probably wont be back with the sox. he really blew this past year and i was hoping they’d get roped into another season with him.
the cards are rumored to be interested in andy pettitte now. wonder if his ppl will be talking to the cards ppl during the meetings. i cant believe the cards are looking to pay him $16M either, but maybe hoping andy will be feeling unloved like the last time he left.
GB7
You have outline a strategy which could return the Yankees to dominance.
No need to overpay anymore because the other teams will not be able to afford to keep their stars.
I think the yankees should pursue the poaching route. Also tell CC to take it or leave it. They are being abused by this process with him waiting for anyone but the Yankees.
No idea if this has any substantive merit – its from Bill Madden – so take it as you will.
Madden is reporting that the Yankees are now willing to go to a 5th year for AJ Burnett now that Atlanta has set the market in that direction and were also getting ready to make an offer to Sheets:
“With the meetings scheduled to get underway today, Cashman was preparing to move aggressively on other pitcher fronts. Now that the Atlanta Braves have established the A.J. Burnett market at four years, $15 million per with an easily attainable vesting fifth-year option, it is believed the Yankees now were willing to go a fifth year for the oft-injured righty. Similarly, they were prepared to make a multiyear offer to Ben Sheets, who has a far worse injury history than Burnett.”
I’m skeptical on them going to a 5th year for AJ. Just a guess – but I get the sense that the yankees may be leaking this to plant the seed in CC and Genske’s mind that they have other options and a decision needs to be made.
CC and his agent have a lot of leverage here. But if this deal somehow falls apart and the yankees do decide to just go AJ, Lowe and Tex then CC may regret it for a long time and I can’t see his agent ever getting hired again by any major player.
“the cards are rumored to be interested in andy pettitte now. wonder if his ppl will be talking to the cards ppl during the meetings. i cant believe the cards are looking to pay him $16M either, but maybe hoping andy will be feeling unloved like the last time he left.”
I forgot who said it, but whoever it was, I agreed with them when they said if Pettitte decides to go to a different team over a couple million dollars the Yankees should say good riddance to him.
1) They have overpaid for his services the last 2 years (Pettitte wouldn’t have gotten 16 million from any other team)
2) They showed how highly they thought of him by calling off Santana trade talks once he decided to sign (the past two seasons he has done the ‘I don’t know if I want to play anymore’ thing)
3) After the Mitchell Report came out, the Yankees unequivocally supported him, and had the two biggest faces of the franchise (Jeter and Mo) accompany him to his press conference.
4) Nothing is confirmed, but I’m pretty sure the Yankees offered him a contract for less than the 16 million he received last year..unless it’s some arbitrary number, or a minor-league deal like the offered Bernie, why does Pettitte have such a problem with it?
I’m a big proponent that whatever happens during negotiations are null and void after the player signs (e.g. it’s fine that Posada had lunch with Omar Minaya before signing his deal…he was only trying to get more cash from cashman)…
If that’s what Pettitte is doing by talking to the Dodgers/Cardinals, that’s completely fine. But if at the end of the day, the Yankees offer 1 year 11 million and the Dodgers offer 1 year 13 million..Pettitte should accept the Yankees’ offer without hesitation. Doing anything but would ruin his place in Yankee history (IMHO)..
What do you guys think?
Wow Pete, $9 for the first aid kit! Don’t get any paper cuts, they could be expensive! Do you need to swipe a credit card if someone needs a defibrilator in the casino!?
CB,
Good point. Seeing as though the Yankees’ have seemingly changed their mind on 5 years for Burnett and 2-3 for Sheets, I think it’s an extremely clever marketing plot to get CC shaking in his boots (or at least to come to the realization that the Yankees have SOME pull in the negotiations).
I would still rather give Lowe 2-3 years at 15-18 million (overpay 1-2 million to get the deal done, but at fewer years than Burnett would require)
I think Cash will send CC a sign that he is not afraid to move on. Maybe a meeting with San later is in order.
Greg Grenske works on commission and stands to lose at least 200 large if he disses the Yankees deal. That ain’t chump change in a bad economy. He needs to tell Sabathia that this is no funny game to play. Take the deal before Cashman says he’s tired of playing games and moves on to other pitchers and Teixeira.
GALLO says the yanks may go 5 yrs on burnett. i wont believe it till someone with credibility says it.
it was joel sherman who said the yanks should say good riddance to pettitte if he signs elsewhere.
Brent,
Apparently the Yankees have offered Pettitte 10mm and the big baby is offended. He is truly a phony, as sated by one of the NY writers last week.
If the Yankees are really interested in Sheets, then that’s proof that Cashman hasn’t learned from his mistakes. You would think that the 40mil wasted on Pavano would have left a bad taste in his mouth. I guess not. We must be really desperate for pitching if Sheets is near the top on our list of pitchers to get. The fact that Sheets didn’t accept arbitration leads me to think that he’s heard that the Yankees are interested in him.
I’ve got a very bad feeling about this.
regarding pettitte, its a negotiation and i try not to get upset about negotiating ploys. but if andy doesnt want, say $12-13M of the yankees money, there are other less expensive pithcers available who are likely to be as good or better than pettitte.
regarding genske/sabatthia, why does everybody assume its cc who’s holding out and not genske? everybody just assumes that boras works pretty much on his own and tells the client to keep quiet, why wouldnt genske work in the same way. remember, this is likely genske’s biggest contract as well as cc’s.
to make his rep with other players, he has to up the yankee’s bid over the $140M unsolicited bid the yankees threw on the table. any idiot could’ve signed that contract, the point of hiring a high profile agent is to take whats offered and significantly improve upon it.
Brent
December 8th, 2008 at 8:17 am
Pettitte should accept the Yankees’ offer without hesitation. Doing anything but would ruin his place in Yankee history (IMHO)..
What do you guys think?
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Not much.
He doesn’t owe the Yankees anything, except his best effort with every start. That’s what he’s always given. The best he had on that day.
If the Yanks had an extra starter last year, for Pettitte to sit out 2 weeks to rest his shoulder, the rest of his season would have been close to what his first 4 months were.
“but at fewer years than Burnett would require”
how do you know Lowe wont get 5 years? He should get at least 4 in this market.
if/when CC is in the fold, id rather offer Sheets a contract for 3 seasons, then 4 years plus for Lowe or Burnett at 5 years.
and id prob rather trade for Peavy than pay for any of those 3 after Sabathia.
but thats just me.
definitely looking forward to some wheeling and dealing though. Pete’s coverage at the Winter Meetings a couple seasons ago was what hooked me on here at LoHud, and its only gotten better since. thanks for the hard work, Pete.
“regarding genske/sabatthia, why does everybody assume its cc who’s holding out and not genske?”
Ultimately the agent works for the player and if CC wanted to, he could tell his agent to accept. After all the Yanks have made an outstanding offer and no one has come close to it.
fran, tell that to arod.
GreenBeret7
Not a very wise comment on Pettitte, unless you actually think he is worth 16mm.
In the insular world of Major League Baseball, obviously all is very well if the GMs get to stay at the Bellagio. Same for the newspaper business. Of all the hotels in Vegas, man alive the Bellagio is the creme de la creme (to me anyway). I haven’t seen the Steve Wynn hotel nor been to it, but the pictures didn’t impress me very much.
There’s no crying in baseball? It seems there’s no recession in baseball!
“Not much.
He doesn’t owe the Yankees anything, except his best effort with every start. That’s what he’s always given. The best he had on that day.
If the Yanks had an extra starter last year, for Pettitte to sit out 2 weeks to rest his shoulder, the rest of his season would have been close to what his first 4 months were.”
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Pettitte has always been a gamer for NY, and that is what has endeared him to the fans. I remember people on this blog having the same conversation as to whether or not Giambi “owed” the Yankees anything, or if he would take a reduced salary because of this.
I don’t think Pettitte “owes” the Yankees anything, but I also don’t think the Yankees “owe” it to pay Pettitte 16mil when he doesn’t deserve it. All he’s been saying the past year or so is that if he continues to play baseball, he wants to do it as a Yankee. If that’s the truth, and he really has a man-crush for the Yankees, going to a different team for 1-2 million more seems a bit perplexing, no?
it would be classic if they all piled in to the motel 6 and were negotiating contracts in the breakfast buffet nook.
I didn’t say anything about 16 mil for Pettitte. I said he didn’t owe the Yanks anything but, his best effort. Pettitte also realizes he won’t get 16 mil. All he’s looking at is getting the best deal available. The 10 mil was alow offer, because lesser pitchers are getting more than that.
Nice video Pete, I lived in Vegas for 12 years, beware the “rodeo dudes” after a few beers. Fights are like breathing to them. Wouldn’t want to hear you pulled an Armando Benitez
Tell Andy #12.5M . . . take it or leave it. In this economy, he’ll take it. That ain’t chump change.
“how do you know Lowe wont get 5 years? He should get at least 4 in this market.”
Yeah, you’re right. He probably will. Whatever Burnett gets, I think Lowe will get 1-2 million less and 1 year less..at least that’s what I’ve gathered from general reports.. It doesn’t seem like Lowe has been as vocal as Burnett regarding minimum # of years on their contract..If that’s the case, I can see Lowe settling on 3-4 years for the same or similar money to whatever Burnett ends up getting.
Ham fighters – on his contract last year I believe that ARod did tell that to Boras which is why he went to the Steinbrenners on his own without Boras to get the negotiations back on after the opt out.
lowe is 35 and burnett is 31. thats a huge difference when considering a 4th or 5th year on a contract. i think burnett will get his 4 plus and easy to attain 5th year, and lowe will end up with 3.
btw, once burnett’s 5th year vests, prepare the training room!
Gary
December 8th, 2008 at 8:50 am
Tell Andy #12.5M . . . take it or leave it. In this economy, he’ll take it. That ain’t chump change.
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He was paid 16 mil last year and they supposedly offered 10 mil this year. That season didn’t rate a cut of almost 40%. A compromise at 13 mil for one year is a fair deal all around. NYY needs Pettitte more than he needs them. It’s only his history with the club that makes him want to stay.
If you worked under contract on your job, a place that you enjoyed, and the contract was up, would you stay for a 40% cut?
fran, i know that i was referring to boras announcement of the opt-out during the sox WS win. also boras’s pissing off both the mets and dodgers with ridiculous demands when he left seattle. fortunatly for boras, he had tom hicks in his pocket which is probably why he asked for the world from the others.
“it would be classic if they all piled in to the motel 6 and were negotiating contracts in the breakfast buffet nook.”
Yeah I guess it would be a little contrary to their mission also, which isn’t to sit in front of Congress and beg for money but rather sit in front of agents and beg to give away money! What’s wrong with this picture???
“and lowe will end up with 3.”
there are way too many teams in on Lowe for him to just get 3 years.
and while he’s older than Burnett, he’s a much more reliable pitcher. he’ll get at least 4.
There is really no need to continue discussing Andy.
I think almost EVERYONE agrees he’s not worth $16m.
I think MOST agree he’s worth more then $10m… especially if you buy he was hurt most of the 2nd half.
I think the MAJORITY here would be happy to have Andy at $12m-$13m, which I believe would make the Yankees happy also.
So we will just have to wait and see. I believe Andy stays with the Yanks.
the yankees inital offer to pedtitte was just that, an opening offer. just like andy is free to flirt with the dodgers or cards or anyone, the yankees can offer what they feel they want to spend. if andy wants to come back home, all he has to do is have his agent call cash and it will be taken care of, and he’ll get $12M – $13M. he couldnt handle the negotiation process when he left, he felt unloved and signed with houston without letting the yankees counteroffer. lets hope he’s learned his lesson and will come home to finish his career
“He was paid 16 mil last year and they supposedly offered 10 mil this year. That season didn’t rate a cut of almost 40%.”
Obviously it didn’t. That’s why he said the two sides should compromise on 12.5. You said 13.
ham fighters
True, the issue was probably always going to be steeled as you suggest. It just got cloudy when Andy started to cry again.
Here is a pretty extensive analysis on Ben Sheets via THT.
http://www.hardballtimes.com/m.....en-sheets/
Vrsce
December 8th, 2008 at 9:07 am
ham fighters
True, the issue was probably always going to be steeled as you suggest. It just got cloudy when Andy started to cry again.
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Well, I guess every player that NYY has to deal with is crying, then?
“If you worked under contract on your job, a place that you enjoyed, and the contract was up, would you stay for a 40% cut?”
Also, I don’t mean to attack you..At least we’re all having a discussion instead of an Anti-Abraham flame war..
But I think you also have to look at whether or not Pettitte was worth the 16 million he received..I don’t think he is/was worth 16 two years ago, last year, or this year..so if you admit he was overpaid, going to 12-14 million would bring him down to what he really deserved during the past two years..
Then consider his off year in 2008, and 10-13 million is a good range for Pettitte..whether or not it’s a 40% decrease in salary.
“If you worked under contract on your job, a place that you enjoyed, and the contract was up, would you stay for a 40% cut?”
Also, I don’t mean to attack you..At least we’re all having a discussion instead of an Anti-Abe flame war..
But I think you also have to look at whether or not Pettitte was worth the 16 million he received..I don’t think he is/was worth 16 two years ago, last year, or this year..so if you admit he was overpaid, going to 12-14 million would bring him down to what he really deserved during the past two years..
Then consider his off year in 2008, and 10-13 million is a good range for Pettitte..whether or not it’s a 40% decrease in salary.
Brent
December 8th, 2008 at 9:06 am
“He was paid 16 mil last year and they supposedly offered 10 mil this year. That season didn’t rate a cut of almost 40%.”
Obviously it didn’t. That’s why he said the two sides should compromise on 12.5. You said 13.
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It’ss fair as it gets. Split 50/50.
i think u might see lowe take less yrs and a higher aav from the yanks or sox. just a guess. i think he’s hot to get back into the AL East, and it would be in both the sox and yanks interest to sign a shorter contract.
side note: my last post had “anti-@braham flame war” with the @ being an A, and it was filtered out.
Pete really doesn’t want anybody talking about him.
Last year when he came back Andy could have easily gotten a 2 year deal from the yankees.
He decided he only wanted a one year deal instead. He didn’t want the burden of the commitment that a two year deal entailed given his recurrent thoughts of retiring.
I’d guess he regrets not pushing through with a two year deal last winter.
He’d still be signed to pitch in the new stadium for a year and would be making $15-16M.
Last year Andy had leverage. Now he has far less.
Watch what’s happened to Pettite – the night and day difference between this winter and last.
That’s why players always want the most guaranteed money they can get when they have leverage. The most guaranteed money generally means the most years on the contract. At the salaries they are getting, clubs can only change the AAV’s by so much for shorter term deals to make any sense.
And as it is players don’t want shorter deals at higher AAV’s. It’s the total guaranteed money that really matters. Later on they will not be in as good a bargaining position.
Let’s see CC turn down an extra $40m guaranteed. He should talk to Pettite about that.
“i think u might see lowe take less yrs and a higher aav from the yanks or sox. just a guess. i think he’s hot to get back into the AL East, and it would be in both the sox and yanks interest to sign a shorter contract.”
That’s probably true for the Red Sox..He’s made no bones about wanting to go back. I wonder if that would hurt the Yankees chances? Say Boston has no intention whatsoever of signing him..Does he still consider the Yankees an option, given the rivalry? Usually yes..players don’t get as involved with the NY/Boston rivalry as fans do..but it would be ironic in a sense for him to wish/pray to be on the Red Sox again, only to sign with their hated rivals.
OldYanksFan
Thanks for the link,the health report suggests that Sheets is a very big risk.
GB7
You are missing/avoiding the point about Pettitte. It is not about the negotiations and potential saw-off at 13mm. rather, he whined and left for Houston,, he took HGH, lied and was caught. Then he cried and all was forgiven. He retires, he comes back, he only wants to be a Yankee, unless he get 16mm, then he may be a Dodger.
There is nothing wrong with tough negoatiating, but no one (except maybe you) likes a 2 faced cry baby.
“If you worked under contract on your job, a place that you enjoyed, and the contract was up, would you stay for a 40% cut?”
comparing baseball players salaries to normal salaries is a joke.
anybody here get a 1500% increase in aav, like robbie cano did last season? any arbitrator ever decide against your case and award you $5M?
Brent
December 8th, 2008 at 9:11 am
“If you worked under contract on your job, a place that you enjoyed, and the contract was up, would you stay for a 40% cut?”
Also, I don’t mean to attack you..At least we’re all having a discussion instead of an Anti-Abe flame war..
But I think you also have to look at whether or not Pettitte was worth the 16 million he received..I don’t think he is/was worth 16 two years ago, last year, or this year..so if you admit he was overpaid, going to 12-14 million would bring him down to what he really deserved during the past two years..
Then consider his off year in 2008, and 10-13 million is a good range for Pettitte..whether or not it’s a 40% decrease in salary.
———————————————————–
40% decrease is a huge cut, regardless of the amount. As a matter of fact, the most the team could have leagally cut his pay was 20% had they asked for arbitration.
NYY needed Pettitte two years ago and had no problem agreeing to the request. Had NYY been unhappy with his 2007 numbers, they had every chance to decline the option. The team is also the one to take his time needed to make his decision to return. His off year was because of a late season injury. He still tried pitching through it, because the team didn’t have any options. Pettitte risked further injury by pitching since he didn’t know the seriousness of it.
“There is nothing wrong with tough negoatiating, but no one likes a 2 faced cry baby.”
unless he comes back and wins 12-15-17 games… then id like him, too.
Yes, so would I. but right now he is a snivelling phony.
Vrsce
December 8th, 2008 at 9:19 am
GB7
You are missing/avoiding the point about Pettitte. It is not about the negotiations and potential saw-off at 13mm. rather, he whined and left for Houston,, he took HGH, lied and was caught. Then he cried and all was forgiven. He retires, he comes back, he only wants to be a Yankee, unless he get 16mm, then he may be a Dodger.
There is nothing wrong with tough negoatiating, but no one (except maybe you) likes a 2 faced cry baby.
———————————————————–
I’m not avoiding or missing a thing. The HGH incident occured back in 2002, by all accounts consisted of two shots. That’s hardly enough to have helped any injury.
As was mentioned by CB, both teams were more than happy with Pettitte’s last contract. Pettitte even gave the Yanks an out.
What ever you say…I like two faced cry babies.
ham fighters
December 8th, 2008 at 9:19 am
“If you worked under contract on your job, a place that you enjoyed, and the contract was up, would you stay for a 40% cut?”
comparing baseball players salaries to normal salaries is a joke.
anybody here get a 1500% increase in aav, like robbie cano did last season? any arbitrator ever decide against your case and award you $5M?
———————————————————–
The amount of money has less to do with it than the percentage of the cut.
You must love Clemens then (Andy ratted on him, and cried about it.
Andy is a good guy, very likeable and always wants to do the right thing. He also has a phony side and takes advantage of his clean cut image to push the envelope (not just about money)
Vrsce
December 8th, 2008 at 9:32 am
You must love Clemens then (Andy ratted on him, and cried about it.
Andy is a good guy, very likeable and always wants to do the right thing. He also has a phony side and takes advantage of his clean cut image to push the envelope (not just about money)
———————————————————–
Have it your way. I explained my part with rationality.
You go right ahead with your hissy fit. I’m through.
“He also has a phony side and takes advantage of his clean cut image to push the envelope”
who really cares?
can he help the team win games?
Ben Sheets, over the last 4 years:
1) Has averaged 150 IP, last year being his best season
2) Has ERA+’s of 128, 119, 117 and 139. This is basically 2 years of an Ace and 2 years of Wang.
3) His WHIP over that time is very respectable, at under 1.15.
He is now 30 years old. He gets paid close to $13m, which is very cheap and he is an excellent pitcher…. when he’s healthy.
So…. here is a radical thought for debate. NOT a suggestion, just throwing it out there (so nix on the German Shepard comments).
We are talking about giving him 2-3 years at near his current salary. This is ‘less risk’ or the lesser of 2 evils compared to AJ, who will get 4-5 years.
Here’s my thought.
The problem with Sheets is that he could be a TJ surgery/Elbow surgery caniddate? If so, that basically kills his value in a 2-3 year deal.
So… what if you offer him 5/$50m…..
and have him have TJ surgery/Elbow surgery (and anything else he might need) and then look at his contract being 3.5 years of a post TJ surgery Ben Sheets?
The truth is, 3 good Ben Sheets years are well worth about $50m on todays market ($17m-ish AAV). Give him 2009 off for surgery and rehabilitation. In 2010, he should be 90%, and then maybe an Ace from 2011 on?
He has 1428 IP on his arm (not a lot)… compare to CC, who has 1659 at 2 years younger. If Sheets is off a year, and is healthy, he could easily be good for 3-4 more years.
The Yankees have done this stategy with a LOT of their kids, including Sanchez. They get a ‘hurt’ pitcher for under-market, assume 1.5 years off for surgery/rehabilitation, and hope they have an above average pitcher after that.
This would assumes we get Andy back for 2009, and Sheets basically replaces Andy for 2010 and beyond.
Would Sheets fit that mold?
What’s better? Would 3/$39 and HOPE he doesn’t need surgery, or 5/$50, cut him up, and try to get 3.5 years of a ‘healed’ pitcher?
Unfortunately, I don’t know enough about his exact medical issues to know if this stategy is prudent.
Just a crazy THOUGHT in a Bru/Brandon kinda framework.
Feedback?
Old Yank Fan that’s a decent idea.
But he probably doesn’t need the surgery, its all speculation.
i was probably pedtitte’s most vocal critic on this blog last offseason. ( i was right when he first said he only used hgh once and i said i didnt believe him).
but at the same time, i like the guy. he’s not perfect, his ‘oh shucks, golly gee” act has really taken a hit and his leaving for houston was just stupid, but he is one of our guys. he’s won and lost big with us, he’s family.
and the yankees could do alot worse for the back end of the rotation, even if he costs a litte more. Lets hope they can get this settled this week.
“40% decrease is a huge cut, regardless of the amount. As a matter of fact, the most the team could have leagally cut his pay was 20% had they asked for arbitration.
NYY needed Pettitte two years ago and had no problem agreeing to the request. Had NYY been unhappy with his 2007 numbers, they had every chance to decline the option. The team is also the one to take his time needed to make his decision to return. His off year was because of a late season injury. He still tried pitching through it, because the team didn’t have any options. Pettitte risked further injury by pitching since he didn’t know the seriousness of it.”
—————————————————————
I think the points you’re using work more in my favor than your own. The Yankees had no problem overpaying for his services in 2006 and 2007..that much I’ll give you. They also gave him all the time in the world to decide if he wanted to come back.
You’re also right that his numbers were down because of injury, but that doesn’t change anything. Injuries affect all players, and if they get injured in a FA year, it’s going to lower their worth. Why should Andy be any different?
I still don’t see a problem with the paycut if he was being overpaid in the previous 2 years. The Yankees were OK with it then, but should the be expected to be OK with it now?
He was overpaid the last 2 years. His actual worth (already below 16m/year) is decreased due to his injury. Open and shut case.
It must be tough to be perfect like some of the posters here…
Please get me Pettitte for a year. I don’t want the Livan talk to start up!
oyf
good thing you said its a crazy idea…
if shets need surgery then his value is not anywhere near what you propose.
if sheets signed with someone else then needs the surgery, the yankees could then get him for say $2.5M with incentives after the surgery instead of paying him $20M while he’s on the dl.
OldYanksFan
December 8th, 2008 at 9:40 am
Ben Sheets, over the last 4 years:
1) Has averaged 150 IP, last year being his best season
2) Has ERA+’s of 128, 119, 117 and 139. This is basically 2 years of an Ace and 2 years of Wang.
3) His WHIP over that time is very respectable, at under 1.15.
He is now 30 years old. He gets paid close to $13m, which is very cheap and he is an excellent pitcher…. when he’s healthy.
So…. here is a radical thought for debate. NOT a suggestion, just throwing it out there (so nix on the German Shepard comments).
We are talking about giving him 2-3 years at near his current salary. This is ‘less risk’ or the lesser of 2 evils compared to AJ, who will get 4-5 years.
Here’s my thought.
The problem with Sheets is that he could be a TJ surgery/Elbow surgery caniddate? If so, that basically kills his value in a 2-3 year deal.
———————————————————-
I doubt that NYY or any team is going to willingly pay 10 mil a year for two years and then hope he can come back to be worth 10 mil for each of the next 3 years. Not only that, but, it does nothing to help the 2009 season. You also have to figure the extra 40% he’d cost over the tax threshhold.
Andy Pettitte’s responsibility is to himself and his family, not to the Yankees or the Hendrick’s brothers, or whoever. he doesnt owe anyone anything.
if he really wants to come back to play in NY, he’ll take the paycut and come back.
if the money is more important, and he can get more somewhere else, then he goes.
i dont see the haggling over a million or two being a huge barrier to Pettitte coming back to NY if he wants to for either side.
“Please get me Pettitte for a year. I don’t want the Livan talk to start up!”
How about the “KENNEDY AND HUGHES WILL BE OUR SAVIORS!” talk from last year? I miss that
Pettitte was not overpaid the last two years.
Pettitte was paid exactly what the market price for him bore.
That’s it. No more or less. He was a free agent on the open market the past two years. The Yankee’s determined that on the open market his services were worth $16M for each season. That’s the end of story.
Now this season Pettitte is back on the open market. We’ll see what the market for him turns out to be based on his past track record and his performance last season and how it coordinates with his preferences.
Those are the factors that will determine how much he’s paid. No different than the past two seasons.
People here don’t want to pay Andy good money for a year, but are willing to spend $140M-150M for CC?
“People here don’t want to pay Andy good money for a year, but are willing to spend $140M-150M for CC?”
I think people just differ on what good money is for a pitcher of his caliber.
I wouldn’t go higher than 14 for him. 10 was lowball, 12-13 is adequate, and 16 is too high.
“Pettitte was not overpaid the last two years.
Pettitte was paid exactly what the market price for him bore.
That’s it. No more or less. He was a free agent on the open market the past two years. The Yankee’s determined that on the open market his services were worth $16M for each season. That’s the end of story.
Now this season Pettitte is back on the open market. We’ll see what the market for him turns out to be based on his past track record and his performance last season and how it coordinates with his preferences.
Those are the factors that will determine how much he’s paid. No different than the past two seasons.”
I don’t know if he would have gotten 16 from any other team either of the last two years, so does this accurately reflect his market value?
strange how we talk about where pettitte will finish his career, while at the same time we speculate about a possible 5 yr deal for derrick lowe.
lowe is 1 year younger than pettitte!
Brent,
I understand the difference. But Andy’s a Yankee. He wants to come back. Your AAV on a 1-yr. contract is going to be higher than a multi-year contract because it gives you flexibility.
I can understand people saying they don’t want him back, but we really do need him. Otherwise we’re blocking 3 slots for years to come.
Andy for 1? Or Lowe for 4?
Beningo is bringing it right now !
Buster’s blog said CC’s friends said over the summer that CC didn’t want to play in NY (Minky?)
But you can’t tell me that CC would shun NY for the Brewers. That’s weak.
http://www.nypost.com/seven/12.....143147.htm
“I don’t know if he would have gotten 16 from any other team either of the last two years, so does this accurately reflect his market value?”
Yes. He was on the open market. One the high offer was $16M and that’s what he accepted.
Doesn’t matter what he could or could not have gotten from any other team. What matters is what he got from the team he signed for.
No team was giving ARod anywhere close to $250M before Tom Hicks stepped in. Off ARod went to Texas.
Who else was going to give Barry Zito $126M? But that’s what the market for him bore.
It only takes one team.
The point is this – free agency is a form of a modified auction. The top bidder generally sets the bidder outside of those very rare instances when players take less to go to places for non-monetary reasons.
Still a market and that’s how these guys get paid.
George King says the Brew’s offered CC an opt-out after 3 years.
Hey , the Yanks can do that no problem.
How about an opt-out after years 1, 2 AND 3.
ham
Insane isn’t it!
Mel,
I agree that the Yankees need Pettitte for 2008, because as well as Hughes has pitched lately, you can barely pencil him into the 5th spot, whereas you can draw pettitte in with permanent marker.
I guess I’m just arguing over 1-2 million. My main question was just how people would see him if he ended up going somewhere else. I still feel like (slash hope) the two sides will come together by the end of the week,
OldYanksFan thanks for the info on Sheets I remember that HBT article, even more reason why they need to buy him low, if that guy becomes Josh Beckett in the AL East you can’t pass that up.
if andy just said, “if lowe can do it, i can do it” and signed a 4 yr/ $45M contract with the dodgers or dbacks, he could average 12 W’s a year in the n.l. and that would put him right up around moose’s total of 270 wins. moose could open the door for him. i dont see it but he’s lefty and the n.l. west is soft.
Brent,
I’d feel a little wounded, but I can’t hate Andy unless something nasty comes out of his mouth. Players go to other teams all the time.
My guess is that he really wants to pitch at NYS. So I can’t see him quibbling over $2M.
sorry andy would need to avg 13.7 wins/yr to catch moose in 4 yrs. pardon my exaggeration.
Let CC walk. Sign Tex, AJ and Andy now.
Too much money for CC and it is better spent on two other starters and we need Tex.
Pull the offer, screw the agent and let everyone know that we won’t be played anymore.
*The Giants could look to deal for Cardinals receiver Anquan Boldin if Plaxico Burress is done in New York.*
I think it moved
I’m going to make a prediction and say that by the end of the meetings the Yanks will have pulled their offer for Sabathia, and put a big offers on the table for Texiera & Lowe.
Even if Pettitte got to the 270 mark win before retiring, he has only a slight chance of making the HOF. His numbers would be about Dennis Martinez/Jack Morris range.
el presidente! gets a mention! one of my faves!
16 million is and has been too much for pettitte.
how come becket is signed for about 10 million,schilling for 11 or 13 when he was pitching great in a better economy,pedroia for chump change,lowell took less.
the list is endless.the red sox stand firm & players go to the yankees for the most money.
this has to change.pettitte is giving the yankees no breaks here.i wan’t players who wan’t to be here because of the tradition,stadium,etc… not because we offered the most money.
how about players who at least don’t mind playing in ny?
ham fighters
December 8th, 2008 at 10:27 am
el presidente! gets a mention! one of my faves!
————————————————————
Martinez, Morris and Pettitte have been or were damned fine pitchers…just not HOF fine.
Brandon,
I think the Giants will need a big receiver now that Burress is gone. They are deep, but after yesterday you can see how reliable Hixon & Smith are on a week by week basis. Hixon had that pass, and I think that’s one Burress would have come up with. The receiver’s played well in the past several games with Burress out, but they knew that he would be back, so they only had to fill in. That all has changed. Now Hixon is the man, but can he handle it? I think Toomer’s at the end of the line though. They have too many young receiver’s that aren’t playing, that are capable of filling his shoes.
They are NEVER letting an acknowledged or convicted HGH/Steroid user in the HOF.
Mickey Lolich was another outstanding pitcher who never got the credit. His biggest problem was being stuck on a lot of bad Detroit teams.
Braintrust, real quick OT because I don’t want to change the topic from Hot Stove, I think Hixon can handle it, Jerry Reese eversince he got him off waivers frm Denver knew there was something special in this kid, I think this week was a natural let down that he will learn from. I also expect Manningham to get in the future game plans, I attribute the loss to bad timing, distractions and fatigue catching up. Put it this way the Giants thought they could prove people wrong at every step now they know they have to come out harder, practice harder and really stay in the game mode. Gilbride had a horrible Sunday I think people forgot it effects everybody and you could w/ the game calling it just was very odd.
“I’m going to make a prediction and say that by the end of the meetings the Yanks will have pulled their offer for Sabathia, and put a big offers on the table for Texiera & Lowe.”
Why are the Brewers meeting with CC’s agents? They can’t come anywhere close to our offer. And there’s no way he’s leaving 40mil on the table to play in MIL.
Andy inks a deal for 12.5 million….
Laura,
They may restructure the deal with an opt-out after 3 years (like AJ had with the Jays). If I was CC, no way I sign anything with the Brewers that doesn’t have such a clause. 3 years from now $20M might be a pittance.
CC probably asking Cashman questions about New York, etc. Feeling out process (that should’ve happened weeks ago). Not a pretty picture, but CC probably wants to tango.
That, or he’s asking Cash to take the offer off the table, it’s killing his market.
PAT M.
December 8th, 2008 at 10:36 am
Andy inks a deal for 12.5 million….
————————————————————
Morning, PAT M. Was that your prediction or inside info?
Did you ever get to see Lolich and McLain pitch, back in the day? what a deadly combination to go up against for about 5 years.
“Andy inks a deal for 12.5 million….”
Please tell me this is not true
“Why are the Breweres meeting with CC’s agents?”
Because it’s become quite obvious Sabathia doesn’t want to play in New York. Other teams know they can offer him a low ball offer and he’ll likely accept it.
At this point I wouldn’t put it past him that he’ll actually leave 40 million on the table.
Per Olney, The CC-Cashman meeting went “great”.
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn.....=blogEntry
GB7,
The Yankees don’t do deals in 1/2 million increments.
Buster Olney says to take it for what it’s worth, but his source says the meeting between Sabathia and the Yankees went “great.”
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/.....a-rum.html
…and Bronx Jeers beat me to it.
Great? I take it that means great for CC and his family. His kids, grandkids and great grandkids will never have to work for a living.
“That, or he’s asking Cash to take the offer off the table, it’s killing his market.”
LOL! Perhaps. I’m so over this whole CC thing that it’s gotten to the point where I’m not sure that I care whether he comes or not.
mel
December 8th, 2008 at 10:43 am
GB7,
The Yankees don’t do deals in 1/2 million increments.
————————————————————
Not usually, no, they don’t. Didn’t they sign somebody over the last few years that had cents added in to match his uniform number?
“Per Olney, The CC-Cashman meeting went “great”.”
Great for whom? CC or Cash? This week is going to be torturous with all of the rumors and non stories filling the airwaves. This has got to be the strangest off season yet. And that’s saying something considering the A-Rod fiasco last year.
Laura,
Great for Olney!
The meeting went “great” ?
The source could have been a Yankee official, and if it was, what else are they supposed to say?
How did the meeting go?
ANS: “It was terrible. We made zero headway, and see no reason to continue our pursuit of Sabathia”
It’d be great if he signed something.
Happy Birthday to Moose. Gone but not forgotten.
Just curious, if the Cubs do in fact land Peavy, should the Yanks go after Rich Harden since the Cubs would have to do some salary dump in order to land Peavy?
GB7,,,I just think they’ll split the differnece between last year and this years offer…..As for 1968 Tigers, I watched on WPIX, Denny groving one for Mantle….Tigers came back from being down 3-1 to Gibson’s Cardinals to win the WS….The donut man was the hero that October……Four years later I got a March hit off of him….
Laura – The Hot Stove is Stone cold!
December 8th, 2008 at 10:48 am
“Per Olney, The CC-Cashman meeting went “great”.”
Great for whom? CC or Cash? This week is going to be torturous with all of the rumors and non stories filling the airwaves. This has got to be the strangest off season yet. And that’s saying something considering the A-Rod fiasco last year.
———————————————————–
It’s only odd because of the number of quality players and pitchers and the number of teams needing them. They have time to wait to get their price and they’ll get it. It’s the lower tier players that may get squeezed by signing too early. If they wait, they could get their money when teams start bargaining scared.
“It’s only odd because of the number of quality players and pitchers and the number of teams needing them. ”
It’s also odd that a player gets the best offer ever made in the history of the game for his position and he’s waiting for a *worse* offer to materialize. That seems odd to me.
“Just curious, if the Cubs do in fact land Peavy, should the Yanks go after Rich Harden since the Cubs would have to do some salary dump in order to land Peavy?”
no… they want to move Jason Marquis before trading for Peavy, so that opens up the rotation spot.
now, with the Tribune Company going bankrupt, who knows what kind of players they will really be this postseason.
and Lou Pinella has made it pretty clear he doesnt want Peavy, while the GM says they are still in the market for him, tentatively, but apparently they also need to find a 3rd party to make it happen.
lot of moving parts to this one…
“How did the meeting go?
ANS: “It was terrible. We made zero headway, and see no reason to continue our pursuit of Sabathia” ”
At least you could respect that for it’s honesty. They say it went great and then CC turns around and signs with a CA team.
PAT M.
December 8th, 2008 at 10:53 am
GB7,,,I just think they’ll split the differnece between last year and this years offer…..As for 1968 Tigers, I watched on WPIX, Denny groving one for Mantle….Tigers came back from being down 3-1 to Gibson’s Cardinals to win the WS….The donut man was the hero that October……Four years later I got a March hit off of him….
———————————————————–
I remember reading about the McLain groove pitch to Mantle for #535 to pass Foxx. Mantle was his idol. He told Freehan to tell Mantle to call his pitch and he’d get it. He still took a couple of pitches before figuring out that McLain wasn’t kidding. The funny part was that Pepitone batted behind Mantle, figuring McLain was in a generous mood and called for his pitch. McLain decked him.
I’ve watched replays of the ‘68 series (I was in Vietnam during that time) and Lolich was absolutely amazing. Gibson was right there, until game 7.
“and Lou Pinella has made it pretty clear he doesnt want Peavy, while the GM says they are still in the market for him, tentatively, but apparently they also need to find a 3rd party to make it happen.”
I haven’t been following this story so I’m somewhat out of the loop. Why doesn’t Lou want Peavy?
“I haven’t been following this story so I’m somewhat out of the loop. Why doesn’t Lou want Peavy?”
i really dont know… he’s said publically though that the Cubs are done in the pitching market, while Hendry has come out afterwards and said they are still shopping, etc.
i think it comes down to Lou wanting a LH OF impact bat more than another pitcher.
“At least you could respect that for it’s honesty. They say it went great and then CC turns around and signs with a CA team”
If the Yankees admitted it went terrible, they would lose whatever leverage they still had, and it would lower the cost of Sabathia significantly.
The Angels would offer at least 115 million knowing it would beat the Brewers’ offer, and they would become the front runners.
This way, there’s still an element of mystery of who’s in front.
It’s really doubtful that Sabathia will pass on 40 million, but, to play near home for 10-15 mil total, yes, I could see that happening.
Isn’t it possible that the feelings were mutual?
“It’s really doubtful that Sabathia will pass on 40 million, but, to play near home for 10-15 mil total, yes, I could see that happening.”
I could too although, again, I think this “I want to play near my home” is a lot of bull. He’s probably using it as leverage to get more $$ out of us.
**CC’s Agent wants more time with Yanks!**
The $140 million game of chicken began in earnest Sunday night when Brian Cashman met with CC Sabathia and his agent, Greg Genske, on the eve of the winter meetings at the Bellagio hotel.
According to industry sources, it was Genske and not Cashman who asked for the meeting, although the Yankee GM is just as anxious to find out Sabathia’s intentions now that the big lefty has had a couple of weeks to mull the six-year, $140 million offer that would make him the highest-paid pitcher in history. The reason Genske wanted the meeting, said one source, is that the agent is trying to buy more time for another team more to Sabathia’s liking to approach the Yankee bid.
With each passing day, the likelihood of that lessens considerably. “(Genske) has to be concerned about them pulling the offer and moving on to the other (free agent) pitchers,” the source said. “If he blows this deal, he’s dead as an agent. For one thing, who’s going to approach that $140 million if the Yankees are out of it? Sabathia winds up with a deal $20 million less than Barry Zito? Like I said, (Genske’s) dead.”
Although they have boldly made Sabathia their No.1 priority, it is unclear how long the Yankees will keep their offer out there, especially with other pitchers they covet now fielding big offers. Hal Steinbrenner has said the offer won’t be out there indefinitely and it would seem that Genske, with nothing else even close to the Yankee bid, is going to need to provide Cashman with a satisfactory reason for why it hasn’t been accepted. Only the Milwaukee Brewers and San Francisco Giants are believed to have made offers to Sabathia, both of them $40 million lower than the Yankees’.
http://www.nydailynews.com/spo.....o_yan.html
“i think it comes down to Lou wanting a LH OF impact bat more than another pitcher.”
Well, they most certainly need another bat. But to turn your nose up at a talent like Peavy is a bit puzzling, especially since I think the year they got out of Dempster will prove to be a fluke.
I wonder if the Yanks are considering giving an opt out clause to CC, this way if he really misses Cali, he can leave.
“But to turn your nose up at a talent like Peavy is a bit puzzling”
totally agree.
Ugh. All of these players who were supposed to accept arbitration in fear of the faltering economy and crap all pretty much declined it. Good thing we didn’t offer to Abreu, though.
Buddy Biancalana
December 8th, 2008 at 11:11 am
I wonder if the Yanks are considering giving an opt out clause to CC, this way if he really misses Cali, he can leave.
————————————————————
I’d consider a mutual OPT-OUT after 4 years. It allows NYY to control whether he leaves if NYY has pitching issues down the road.
“I wonder if the Yanks are considering giving an opt out clause to CC, this way if he really misses Cali, he can leave.”
I suggested they do that a few threads ago, but the problem with an Opt Out clause is what if you don’t want him to leave? What if they give him an Opt Out after 2 years, he pitches lights out for both years and then wants to head West? The Yankees aren’t going to want him to leave.
I don’t have a problem with Opt Outs. I think it gives the players the same power to leave as the Owners have to get rid of them. I just don’t think the Yankees will want to do that.
“I wonder if the Yanks are considering giving an opt out clause to CC, this way if he really misses Cali, he can leave.”
Yankees really shouldn’t have to. Were they to consider it, I’d think they’d have to get 4 years out of him before the opt out.
Okay, opt out after 4 years, could be better than a 6 year deal anyway.
Although it might be difficult for some to fathom, CC enjoyed his stay in Milwaukee. He developed friendships, enjoyed the camaraderie, and respected the legitimate Brewtown appreciation of his efforts. Were Milwaukee to be located on the “West Coast” there would be no issue..
I recognize full well that many, in this day and age, are wedded to the notion that the pot of gold carries the day and CC should have hopped on a plane to the City of Cities many weeks ago and shouted “where do I sign”!! It didn’t happen, no response, not even an acknowledgement, until now.
Contrary to some views expressed, it is quite likely that CC and his family, not his agents, are calling the shots. Were money to be the prime consideration, any agent who is doing his job would not have allowed this much time to pass with nary a contact with the Yankees, given their situation.
It could well be that the rumored Milwaukee three year “opt-out”´may just carry the day. As a Yankee fan, I certainly hope not, but that possibility cannot be ignored. If CC does not offer any indication that he is “seriously considering” the Yankee proposal, and not simply using it as leverage, Cashman should move on with his other options lest they be lost.
After two plus months, the Winter meetings are underway…..Now the fun begins, and cabin fever is over….
no opt outs.
“no opt outs.”
Agreed, we have plenty of Mama’s Fried Chicken in NYC CC, plus anyone who disses you we got your back.
“no opt outs.”
Why not, TurnTwo? A team can decided after a certain amount of time that they no longer want a player. Why can’t a player decided that he no longer wants to be on a team?
Calling racist on that Brandon. Always classy.
Thank you Yikes.
Well then Laura what’s the point of signing a full contract then?
Sign a 4 year deal instead of a 6 year deal with an opt out after 4.
Why should he have the security of a 6 year deal and the Yankees only have him secured for 4? Come on.
They’re making him the highest paid pitcher in the game. That should be enough.
Do you think Andy will be in for 14m with a team option for 1 year? Might get cc in/out very quickly.
if you look at the yankees 140/6 contract is 23 million & change a year. the brewers offer of 5/100 is 20 million a year.
any chance cc & family say it is only losing 3 million or so a year instead of looking at the total package??
Also Laura when a team decides they no longer want a player, he still gets paid as long as he’s under contract. So I don’t really see your point.
“A team can decided after a certain amount of time that they no longer want a player.”
i dont know how this above applies to baseball’s guaranteed contracts, as opposed to say NFL’s non-guaranteed contracts.
its seems like you’re talking about no-trade clauses?
“Why can’t a player decided that he no longer wants to be on a team?”
unfortunately, a player can really force his hand if he wants to… but its called a contract; you’re getting guaranteed money to perform at your highest level, and you need to live up to that commitment.
As usual, Dan Graziano has the most sensible take on the current status. http://www.nj.com/yankees/inde.....pdate.html
Okay am I the only one who thinks this offer should be pulled and Tex should be a Yankee? Enough is enough at this point the best way for us to save face is to kill the deal and force CC to take considerably less from a Cali team. Genske will never live it down and CC will get what he wants but take a BIG pay-cut. Tex actually wants to play for us for the right price CC doesn’t wanna play hear at all costs it seems.
CC’s agent is doing what any agent would do. Make the team that really wants you panic into offering up more green. The longer the Yanks don’t hear from him the more eager they are to land him, hence the more likely they are to throw bigger dollar signs. Enough of this CC wants to play close to home nonsense. This is not sleepaway camp,there is no need to give him opt out clauses so he can run back “home”. This is a professional baseball player who will play for the team that gives him the highest paycheck.There is no loyality in baseball and our own Mr. Johnny Damon proved that a few years back. Mark my words CC will play where him,his agent and his family can cash in the most. I am a native New Yorker who loves this city but if a job was paying me 40 million more than my current one they can ship me wherever they want in the world.
LMAO. Michael Silverman of the Boston Herald says the Yanks may have interest in Varitek. Not sure where he’d fit in other than batting practice target for pitchers. They’re certainly not paying him and giving up a draft pick to the Red Sox for the “privilege”.
courtesy of MLB Rumors.com
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/
“I dont know how this above applies to baseball’s guaranteed contracts, as opposed to say NFL’s non-guaranteed contracts. Its seems like you’re talking about no-trade clauses?”
If a team decides that they no longer have use for a player, unless he has a no trade clause, they can trade him to another team and the player has (for the most part) no say in the deal. If a player like CC signs with the Yankees and finds that after two years, he’s not really happy in NY (for whatever reason), why can’t he have the option of leaving and signing with another team?
“Agreed, we have plenty of Mama’s Fried Chicken in NYC CC, ”
Ahem, just to let you know, this is actually blatant bigotry.
“They’re certainly not paying him and giving up a draft pick to the Red Sox for the “privilege”.”
LOL HAHAHAS. the Sox wishes they could gain the Yanks’ draft pics. once is enough.
Ariel,
Thanks for that.
If the Yankees’ offseason plans were dependent on what CC was going to do, then the offer should’ve been an expiring one. A deadline will force some sort of decision. Now it “appears” that we’re being played? Of course he should. Why wouldn’t CC? Now we look like the groom standing at the altar, staring at the back of the church wondering if the bride’s even going to show up.
Cameron? Again with the Cameron talk?
“I am a native New Yorker who loves this city but if a job was paying me 40 million more than my current one they can ship me wherever they want in the world.”
Even if they were shipping you to Siberia?
“Tex actually wants to play for us for the right price”
The right price??? You mean HIS right price, right?
Then why even sign the contract laura. that’s the point in signing a contract. Its quite simple. You want the team to commit to pay you, the team wants you to commit to playing for them.
We aren’t solving the cure for cancer here. These opt-out clauses are rare, and not something that will ever become common. No way the Yankees give him an opt-out clase. NO WAY. Tell him to go play somewhere else.
Laura,
They could ship me to Kuwait for all I care.
Al,
Not at all. Some CC fans have lost their patience.
Ajay,
No way. At least they better not bid more. Especially if he’s hesitant to come here. NO RJ REDUX, please!!!
“Ahem, just to let you know, this is actually blatant bigotry.”
I deserve that. I’m still waiting for John to get online so I can apologize to him personally.
AL: we need CC. He may save our season next year. Tex will not. Offense in baseball is only the supporting cast. A frontline pitcher is the star.
BTW just to let people know I’m not a white Brandon
but that’s besides the point back to Hot Stove.
don’t know if its been posted: Buster Onley will be “shocked” if Rocco Baldelli doesn’t sign with Boston.
Boston gets all the good players (i want). I don’t like Theo
Brandon (TEIX IS NOT WORTH IT, GET CC !)…”Don’t trade Robi !”
December 8th, 2008 at 11:49 am
BTW just to let people know I’m not a white Brandon but that’s besides the point back to Hot Stove.
————————————————————
Ah….I’ll bet that you’re not even a Brandon.
I’m sick of the Yankees being used as a pawn in bargaining. Lets pull the deal and move on to other options. Get Tex and solidify the corner IF positions for the next 6-8 years. Then we can get AJ+Andy and let Hughes/Aceves/Coke compete for the 5th starters role. Its obvious that he is waiting for a Cali team to jump in and he will take whatever they give him. So if he will go there for much less than our offer is he really worth worrying about? If we pull the deal now he will have the Brewers at 100 and whatever the Cali teams decide to throw at him could be no more than 110 with the Yankees out of the bidding. Doing this would show FA’s that the Yankees don’t get BS’d and also leave a 40 million dollar asterisk on Genske’s resume.
when a player signs a 5 year deal the team owns him for those 5 years.he can’t just sign with another team under any circumstance unless he is traded & then the new team has to honor the exact terms of the contract.
if there is an opt out clause that the player exersizes the contract expires & the player is an unemployed free agent free to do whatever he want’s.
“BTW just to let people know I’m not a white Brandon
but that’s besides the point back to Hot Stove.”
So its okay for hispanic people to be racist towards blacks but not okay for white people?
I didn’t think your comment was racist or bigoted so I don’t really care, I am just curious.
“Ah….I’ll bet that you’re not even a Brandon.”
I bet your not GreenBeret
Al,
Have you lost your marbles? Have you given up hope?
“Michael Silverman of the Boston Herald says the Yanks may have interest in Varitek”
maybe to have him pinned down, while Arod beats the #!!@%!!! out of him.
Okay – Let’s stop comparing CC to Randy Johnson. Johnson was TRADED to NY; he did not come as a free agent. I do not know if he waived a NTC, however. In any event, if CC comes to NY, i will ultimately be his decision, not anyone else’s.
Not only that, but Johnson is an ornery guy. By all accounts, CC is certainly anything but.
“AL: we need CC. He may save our season next year. Tex will not. Offense in baseball is only the supporting cast. A frontline pitcher is the star.”
Its obvious he will only sign here if he gets no other offers and this is his last resort. Sorry but I think the Yankees deserve better than that let him and Genske leave Vegas with egg on their faces. I can deal with a year or two of losing if it means getting guys who actually want to play here.
“Laura, They could ship me to Kuwait for all I care.”
To you and me, 140mil is a lot of cash. CC apparently isn’t too impressed with the figure.
Baldelli may have more value to Boston than NYY. If he can only play 2-3 games a week in center field, he’s not that much help to NYY. You never know when he’s available or for how long.
“So its okay for hispanic people to be racist towards blacks but not okay for white people? ”
Just killing the thought. The mama’s fried chicken is more about CC eating in NY.
“I didn’t think your comment was racist or bigoted so I don’t really care, I am just curious.”
Well Ofcourse it’s not ok, it’s different lets not lie about that, but certainly not ok.
“don’t know if its been posted: Buster Onley will be “shocked” if Rocco Baldelli doesn’t sign with Boston.”
Problem with Baldelli is that he virtually compels you tp have a 5th OF because as a 4th OF, he cannot be relied upon to fill in for an injured regular on a daily basis. You get a Baldelli, you have to go get a Hairston or Bloomquist type to cover you’re arse.
mel,
The Yanks will bid more in a panic. There is no evidence that he doesn’t not want to come here other than the media who’s main goal is to sell papers. Those words never came from CC’s mouth. I am sure he loves where he grew up like most of us do but this is a job and pitching in Cleveland which is 2,000+ miles from home was never a problem. He is holding out for more money. He will pitch where the money is!
GB something about Rocco intrigues me IDK what it is
Whoa, Doreen! Just meant that we’d have to pay CC to want to be here. If there’s a better example then I’ll use that.
Poll question:
Which is more ridiculous?
A. Boston interested in CC
B. Yankees interested in Varitek
Brandon (TEIX IS NOT WORTH IT, GET CC !)…”Don’t trade Robi !”
December 8th, 2008 at 11:52 am
“Ah….I’ll bet that you’re not even a Brandon.”
I bet your not GreenBeret
————————————————————
Yes, I am. Just look here at my driver’s license. It says GreenBeret7 I. Toughguy.
B
“Al,
Have you lost your marbles? Have you given up hope?”
I’m down and out Mel. I am now officially a CC naysayer. It is officially the winter meetings and he is STILL giving us the run-around, its time to move on.
“if there is an opt out clause that the player exersizes the contract expires & the player is an unemployed free agent free to do whatever he want’s.”
bru, we got that. I was just explaining why I don’t have a problem with Opt Out clauses. Hey, I think the 140mil should be enough to entice CC to come here. Clearly, he’s got other plans. So be it. Again, I’m at the point where I don’t care anymore. I was really looking forward to this off season when the regular season ended. Now, not so much!
“Yes, I am. Just look here at my driver’s license. It says GreenBeret7 I. Toughguy.”
Nice
Ajay,
If CC really wants to come here and he actually wants more than what’s been offered, I lose respect for him.
I’m all for outbidding the next guy to get a guy we want. But we blew the closest (only) bidder out of the water by $40M.
Give me a break (not you, CC).
“The Yanks will bid more in a panic.”
And that will be a shame. No one else is going to be able to come close to the 140mil. If we go higher, we are simply bidding against ourselves. Where have I seen that happen before?
Brandon (TEIX IS NOT WORTH IT, GET CC !)…”Don’t trade Robi !”
December 8th, 2008 at 11:56 am
GB something about Rocco intrigues me IDK what it is
————————————————————
Baldelli was quite a talent until this medical issue hit. He reminds me of the sort of talent that Freddie Lynn was, only right handed.
“The mama’s fried chicken is more about CC eating in NY.”
Yeah I didn’t really find your comment to be racist. Maybe a bit stereotypical but not a big deal IMO.
Yeah Rocco Baldelli would be an interesting addition, I hope the Sox don’t get him. He’d be a great player to have on the bench. If he can stay healthy (big if) he has huge amounts of talent.
mel -
I’m responding to people who say they don’t want CC because if he doesn’t really want to come here, it will be like RJ. Which, RJ wasn’t all that bad (not great, mind you, but not bad) for a guy who hated it here. I don’t think the Yankees should have to bid against themselves, either, for CC. I wouldn’t object to whatever contract thingies they might do to sweeten the deal, though – opt out, whatever.
And the more ridiculous idea is the Yankees wanting Varitek. Absolutely.
FWIW I don’t think CC’s holding out for money. I think he’s holding out for location.
“I’m down and out Mel. I am now officially a CC naysayer. It is officially the winter meetings and he is STILL giving us the run-around, its time to move on”
and i take it the Jets are not helping matters
GreenBeret7
You are a knowledgeable fan, a little cranky, loke most old guys and maybe you used to be tough.Not now, and please do not have a hissy fit, as is your habit. Everyone get old.
“I’m down and out Mel. I am now officially a CC naysayer. It is officially the winter meetings and he is STILL giving us the run-around, its time to move on.”
Don’t give up man ! Now the Jets that’s a different story, but not on CC, we take this till he picks up a pen.
I’m sick of the Yankees being used as a pawn in bargaining. Lets pull the deal and move on to other options. Get Tex and solidify the corner IF positions for the next 6-8 years. Then we can get AJ+Andy and let Hughes/Aceves/Coke compete for the 5th starters role. Its obvious that he is waiting for a Cali team to jump in and he will take whatever they give him. So if he will go there for much less than our offer is he really worth worrying about? If we pull the deal now he will have the Brewers at 100 and whatever the Cali teams decide to throw at him could be no more than 110 with the Yankees out of the bidding. Doing this would show FA’s that the Yankees don’t get BS’d and also leave a 40 million dollar asterisk on Genske’s resume.
-
Al, I am all about this and have been for some time. Tex, AJ and Andy is the deal for many reasons.
I would still try and trade matsui and sign Manny. If you need to trade Nady or Swisher then fine. I could live with swisher in CF or Melky. I don’t want to trade Cano for kemp and I am tired of hearing about Posada having to play 1B or DH. If Jorge can’t catch then move on. Enough of paying the former winners for past performances.
Get younger and lock in the bats as well as pitchers.
AJ, Wang, Pettite, Joba, Hughes is solid with bats added.
““I’m down and out Mel. I am now officially a CC naysayer. It is officially the winter meetings and he is STILL giving us the run-around, its time to move on”
and i take it the Jets are not helping matters”
Jets, Knicks and Yanks. I have very little to be excited about atm
mel
December 8th, 2008 at 12:01 pm
FWIW I don’t think CC’s holding out for money. I think he’s holding out for location.
————————————————————
a suggestion was made a few weeks ago by somebody to move Vallejo to New Jersey, since the state of California wouldn’t fit.
daaaayum. Ohio State will get annihilated by Texas.
didn’t see the Fiesta match-up, till now
If’ there is an on the field brawl, and the dugouts clear 7 the pen comes running in, I want GB7, wearing the same uni as I…..Not all that certain about Brandon
Jets, Knicks and Yanks. I have very little to be excited about
it will get better. On the upside, at least you’re a New Yorker.
“Baldelli was quite a talent until this medical issue hit. He reminds me of the sort of talent that Freddie Lynn was, only right handed.”
if the Yanks are interested in Baldelli, then one could assume Melky will be traded.
mel,
That is what baseball has turned into. There agents are money hungry pigs and will try to milk teams for everything there worth. Look at this years free agent crop….you got a first baseman that wants $200 million, a pitcher who was healthy for 2 years of his career wants a 5 year deal,Varitek the heart and soul of the Sox organization looking to leave for more money. The days of players having loyalty to a team is long gone. That is why I don’t buy this CC not wanting to come here garbage. He would be the first player in a very long time to leave money on the table for another team.
PAT M.
December 8th, 2008 at 12:06 pm
If’ there is an on the field brawl, and the dugouts clear 7 the pen comes running in, I want GB7, wearing the same uni as I…..Not all that certain about Brandon
————————————————————
Brandon can buy the pizza and beer after we’re finished. That’s his part of the fight.
“Jets, Knicks and Yanks. I have very little to be excited about”
it will get better. On the upside, at least you’re a New Yorker
“Get younger and lock in the bats as well as pitchers.
AJ, Wang, Pettite, Joba, Hughes is solid with bats added.”
I agree man. This rejection from CC is totally unwarranted the Yankees aren’t the KC Royals or the Seattle Mariners we at least deserve a straight answer. You would think the Yankees were inviting this guy to a prison camp for 6 years. Its the NY Yankees moving into a brand new state of the art stadium, the best ballpark in the game. Also besides all that its the Yankees! The best team in the history of sports playing in the greatest city in the world if you can’t sell that the guy obviously has 0 interest.
“If’ there is an on the field brawl, and the dugouts clear 7 the pen comes running in, I want GB7, wearing the same uni as I…..Not all that certain about Brandon”
I’d clear the way and leave you on the field to do battle Pat M
Laura – The Hot Stove is Stone cold!
December 8th, 2008 at 11:58 am
“if there is an opt out clause that the player exersizes the contract expires & the player is an unemployed free agent free to do whatever he want’s.”
bru, we got that. I was just explaining why I don’t have a problem with Opt Out clauses. Hey, I think the 140mil should be enough to entice CC to come here. Clearly, he’s got other plans. So be it. Again, I’m at the point where I don’t care anymore. I was really looking forward to this off season when the regular season ended. Now, not so much!
———————————————————–
sorry.
update >>>>
Ed – patience isn’t a virtue to some people
December 8th, 2008 at 12:08 pm
“Baldelli was quite a talent until this medical issue hit. He reminds me of the sort of talent that Freddie Lynn was, only right handed.”
if the Yanks are interested in Baldelli, then one could assume Melky will be traded.
————————————————————
Most likely. NYY might end up with a three headed snake in center field though with Gardner, Baldelli and Christian. On certain days, that would be close to the fastest outfield in baseball. Move Nady for young infielders.
CC,
It’s been nice flirting with you…
Do you like me…
Circle Yes/No
Sincerely,
The Cashman
P.S. Please respond soon Mark Teixiera wants a long term relationship too
Gb, my respond on on the update >>>>
sweeny on the fan live from vegas saying that the brewers train & have spring training in arizona wich is 2 months closer to home for cc in addition to being in the nl.
he also is hearing rumblings that the brewers might up the offer a little.
The current situation again demonstrates, appallingly so, the differences between the Yankee and Boston management from top to bottom. Cashman, though he purports not to, lays it all so that his goals are an easy read. And if not, the sound bites from Tampa, fill in the gaps. CC has held Cashman hostage for the better part of 3-4 weeks. Cashman has made it clear that pitching is the number one priority and until CC is resolved, there will be no other significant (read..$$$) offers, certainly not to position players. Hal, the conservative one, says if it takes money to win championships, we will spend money. Hank the blustering one, tells the press, “I like Manny, he’s a clutch player”. Later when asked whether the Yankees will make Manny an offer, he replies, “not now, maybe later”. The proverbial “unnamed sources from within the Yankee organization” feed the spin more.
What are the Yankees, in a collective sense, saying? Obviously, pitching, starting with CC is the the number one priority. Unless and until we have visibility with CC, we cannot address, with any sense of finality our hitting needs which we do have. Scottie, don’t do any thing with Manny now (as if you could) we will be there if we don’t do a deal with you for Tex which we can’t do if we get CC, who, by the way, is holding us hostage.
On the other hand, Boston ownership says nothing. More importantly, Theo does likewise. Does Boston want Tex? Do we really know? We they be players? The press speculates with Tex having many in his corner, but those statements from Tony Mass and others are their own opinions…no “unnamed sources” from the Sawx here. Does Boston want Burnett or Lowe? Who knows. However, there is one guy we know they don’t want, and in that respect, nothing need be said.
One thing is apparent, however, there is definitely a front office/ownership disparity between the two perennial competitors, and we are on the short end..
Ariel
Good points. What would you do, given that CC has had the 140mm offer for a month?
Ariel :
if you were to tell me that because of the yankees approach we are losing players then i would agree.
i think it is because the red sox have produced more & better players from their system allowing them to lower payroll & not be as desperate with free agents.
they target pitching ,high obp players,defense wich is the safest,best way to do it.
the yankees tend to go after the flashier,big dollar guys.
the yankees seem to be stuck in the middle but getting better.
i like the way the farm system is going.we have a lot of pitching & an absolute great bullpen with tons of debth.
if we can just get a few solid pitchers & upgrade cf as far as obp i think we are fine.
my ideas of changing this team will be critisized heavily by most but i would trade cano & kennedy for kemp or another decent obp cf,sign furcal for 2nd base,trade damon,matsui,sign cc,tex & another pitcher.
we seriously upgrade defence,fb,obp,pitching,cf & have a payroll of 185 million or so.
right now signing cc & another pitcgher has payroll at 183 million.
we can have the same payroll with a lineup of
furcal(2nd base)
jeter(ss)
tex(1st base)
arod(3rd base)
nady(rf)
swisher(lf)
posada(catcher,dh)
kemp or another cf.(cf)
dh(miranda,posada)
rotation
cc
wang
sheets
joba
hughes,etc….
Bru…u have already traded Cano in your mind…
Haha
i love cano but i don’t like our cf situation.
if we can upgrade there i don’t care how we do it but i don’t see gardner/melky as a solution
on mlbtr.com the yankees resume talks for trading cano for kemp.
the best news i’ve heard yet.
getting kemp for cano makes sense because he is cheaper,2 yrs younger,it fixes cf & he is almost the exact same offensive player who could take off big time.
i guess my trade cano idea isn’t as crazy as many make it sound.
Dodgers, Yanks Resume Cano Discussions
By Tim Dierkes [December 8 at 12:02pm CST]
According to Ken Rosenthal, the Dodgers and Yankees have resumed their discussions about second baseman Robinson Cano at the Meetings. The Dodgers also like Melky Cabrera, while the Yankees hope to get Matt Kemp and pitching from L.A.
OK boy and girls (and Brandon)…
Here’s what I do to make something happen FAST…
1) I pull CC’s offer, and make another at $135m
2) I offer Tex 7/$143.5
3) I tell CC’s agent if Tex signs first, they pull CC’s offer
4) I tell Tex’s agent if CC signs first, they pull Tex’s offer
BOTH agents are aware of #3 and #4. Both Agents understand ONLY the first to accept gets Yankees money
When CC see’s this, he will understand he just lost $5m, and will probablty lose another $15m-$25m if he doesn’t act fast.
The truth is, while we NEED CC more, both players improve the team a similar amount.
This will probably speed un a decision by one of them, and then the Yankees can adjust, knowing they got 1 of the big 2, and then chase other players accordingly.
i think if the dodgers ok a move cano is gone & if we can get pitching and kemp for cano & melky it will be a great move.
furcal can easilly replace cano and having kemp with furcal upgrades the offense & cf big time.
i don’t understand why most people wouldn’t wan’t to trade cano for kemp.we lose absolutely nothing as far as numbers,obp,etc….
he is also younger,cheaper.
do not be suprised if cano is traded very soon & don’t give me any of that no way long goes to the dr if the yankees were going to trade cano.
this team needs a big change & i am glad cashman realizes this.
only a dummy doesn’t trade cano for kemp if an option is out there to sign furcal or get another 2nd baseman who comes close to cano’s production.
no way we go with gardner and or melky in cf.
i am not saying cano is needed to get a cf but it is an option.
if we can get a cf without using cano i am all for it but it would cost a few good prospects maybe hughes,ajax.
trading cano for kemp and maybe signing furcal allows us to keep all of our prospects including ajax,hughes,kennedy,etc…..
OldYanksFan:
excellent idea
i don’t know if i would lower the dollar amount though.
i think with a little pressure cc signs.
we need to put an end to cc playing us.
there are only a few offers for him & he clearly isn’t happy with the brewers or the others or he would have accepted one.
140 million will not be easy to turn down foir being close to home for 80 games or 3 months.
with milwaukee the only difference is the nl.he is not close to home.he might be closer in st that’s it.
i don’t see him playing in milwaukee for a chance to hit a few times a week and it costing him 40 million or so.
he is waiting for a team to come very close or match it.i am not sure how important it is for him to be the highest paid pitcher in history.i am sure he wouldn’t mind it.
This economy must really sucks.
I guess $140m isn’t worth what it use to be…