ESPN: Burnett to Yankees
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Dec 12, 2008 
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ESPN is reporting a five-year, $82.5 million deal has been agreed to.
More to come on this.
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CC
WANG
AJ
ANDY
JOBA
WOO!
A comment from MLBTR says it all..
“Dear God…”
this should end well
Should we keep him wrapped up in protective bubble wrap starting immediately?
I bet you that Andy comes forward today or tomorrow and accepts a Yankee offer. That will settle our rotation. Ya got to hand it to $money and the Steinbrenners. The team is investing in winning.
Yippie!
Matt (Yardley, PA): Burnett to me is Pavano ver2.0.
Keith Law: Not even close. Pavano in the NL in his only two healthy years, right before signing with the Yanks: 423 IP, 272 K’s, 35 HR allowed. That’s in a big ballpark, facing opposing pitchers to boost his K total. Burnett, in the AL East, in a slight hitters’ park, last two years: 387 IP, 407 Ks, 42 HR. You can’t make a performance argument that he’s like Pavano. You can’t make a health argument that he’s like Pavano (who was hurt in some part of every year until his sixth season). You definitely can’t make a stuff argument that he’s like Pavano. That’s a completely unfair tag to place on Burnett.
Welcome back, Carl – oops – Welcome to New York, AJ.
YES! Not Lowe!!!
Alright A.J. Now we resign Pettitte and we’ll have the best rotation in baseball. Pic it
Sabathia
Burnett
Wang
Pettitte
Chamberlain
That’s one heck of a rotation. Good job Cashman.
At the start of the winter, I was not really in favor of signing Burnett, but I kind of like the deal now. If he can manage to stay healthy he’ll be an excellent no.3 pitcher for the next two or three seasons. He’ll be a decent no.4 once he starts to decline in the final two years of contracts. I would not be shocked if he missed a season somewhere along the lines though. Either way, the Yankees have quite a pitching staff now.
SACC: No, little children will want to poke the bubbles with a pin and he’ll get hurt! Think Rubber room!
i love the cc signing. i kind of wish they’d gone after lowe instead of burnett, but i guess they were willing to roll the dice given his success last season. you’d think they’d have learned their lesson with pavano, and understood that burnett has only made 30 starts in contract years, and that two of his whopping three 200+ inning seasons also came in contract years. but, maybe he figured something out last year. give cashman this, he has been aggressive in upgrading the rotation, and no one could argue that the yankees haven’t already vastly improved their ballclub. i’m wary of trusting damon, matsui and posada to supply offense this year and would have loved to see them make a more serious run at teixeira, but the pitching needed to be the focus and it has been. tough to argue with what cashman’s done so far this offseason. they’ll definitely look like a championship team on paper. unfortunately, that’s not where championships are won.
“Should we keep him wrapped up in protective bubble wrap starting immediately?”
Yes.
Pete probably sent that from the Black Jack table.
i like the signing…i don’t like 5 years. i hope they give him an opt-out clause too.
i really like the options we have to replace the first guy to head to the DL.
Tom December 12th, 2008 at 5:18 pm
SACC: No, little children will want to poke the bubbles with a pin and he’ll get hurt! Think Rubber room!
———————————————-
Oh! Good point!
HUGE MISTAKE!!!!!!
Cashman will be regretting this deal within two years guaranteed – I am regretting the move the minute it goes through. AND CASHMAN HAD BEEN DOING SO WELL so far this off season. And of course, he blows it with an idiotic move like this.
I’m back from Yankee Purgatory to destroy your hopes and dreams.
Sweet!
CC
Wang
Burnett
Joba
I guess Andy, although I’m pissed at his behavior. Who backed him up after he lied? Who backed him up when he admitted to one use of HGH? Who still backed him up after he said well yeah I did it twice? When the season was ending he said “It’s not about the money” BS Andy! If you don’t accept and SOON good writtens!!!
Bienvenido Ben Sheets!
money involved aside, cashman is doing a great job this off season. wow. cc and aj. the red sox must be shaking in their boots right now.
two predictions: tex 8/200. beckett’s agents ask for a huge extension.
Yes!!! This is great!
CC
AJ
Wang
Joba
Pettitte / Hughes / Aceves
Now just pass on Cameron and get Manny or Tex and it will be the perfect offseason!
This is a huge risk, without question.
But if he flourishes, this could have a huge payout for the Yankees. CC, Wang, Burnett, and Joba could be absolutely dominant.
Who the hell knows, honestly. I hated this move at first, but now I am warming up to him a bit. Perhaps his AL East numbers are proof that he excels in high intensity situations (i.e. playoffs). Also, with regards to his health, I was hesitant at first, but I don’t think the Yanks would risk a 5 year deal on something they were not positive about.
CC
Wang
AJ
(fill in the blank)
Joba
best 5 in baseball?
dave –
Hold on. We still didn’t hear about Andy. Sheets could still be in the mix.
——————-
matt
December 12th, 2008 at 5:15 pm
Bdog: we didnt get Burnett, he is a Yankee not a member of the LoHud Blog.
matt – I agree with you, but gave up that fight as one that you can’t win a long time ago!
omg I expect hell to freeze over any day now since kasey has a positive outlook on the Yankees.
I guess cash never came onto petes blog to look at the poll before he made this decision – THERE IS NO WAY THIS WONT END UP BEING A DISASTER. The only question is when and not if….
Come June, the Disabled List should be the most entertaining part of the Sports page, I think.
Nice job Cashman! I’d still rather see Sheets than Andy. I know Andy is a genuine Yankee and has laurels with the team, but Sheets could be a great addition if he stays healthy..
Coming soon to a television near you: Fear and Loathing in Peter Gammons’ Brain
Adam Dunn has not made it on mlbtraderumors in a legitimate post since his arbitration was declined except in an article that talked about how “earily quiet” the market is for him. Im going to go out on a limb here and say the yanks should make him an offer as soon as we sign the fourth starter which i hope is sheets over pettitte but i doubt.
The music is about to stop…Is Pettitte in or out?!
The guy through 220 innings without incident this year. At least this is a worth-while gamble he is dominant and he pitches well within the division. Pavano was overrated from the start and he was never worth that contract.
I guess cash never came onto petes blog to look at the poll before he made this decision – THERE IS NO WAY THIS WONT END UP BEING A DISASTER. The only question is when and not if….
————————————————————
you scared him away with one of your essays
Yahoo!!!
AWESOME!!!! JUST STAY HEALTHY AJ!!!
So let’s see:
CC > Beckett
Wang > Matzusaka
AJ > Lester
Pettitte > Wakefield
Joba > Whomever
Let’s get it!
LETS GO SHEETS LETS GO SHEETS! Please brian make the right move for the next pitcher…
Now its time to lobby Bud Selig to start Interteam games. Burnett will never lose.
Pete-
Please clarify if you can. With Burnett, raises and expected raises for the arbitration players, what does the payroll approximately figure to be now??
so I’m guessing CC and Aj will have the press conference together sometime next week.
Gammons is going on ESPN and Quote the Bible:
“And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is becoming the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.”–REVELATION 18
YEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSS
. . . i know its “intra”, just playing off interleague
In the words of Jerry Seinfeld: “The fact that you (all) are so opposed to this makes me think i’m on to something.”
I would go with Phil Hughes instead of Pettitte.
1. If the other four can’t carry the rotation, Andy isn’t the one to pull us out of the hole.
2. Hughes will have little pressure on him, and his upside is greater than Andy’s.
3. It saves $10 million to be used towards offense.
3a. It’s 10 million closer to Tex.
If you picked the 10 pitchers with the best stuff in baseball right now I think you can make a legitimate argument that 3 of them are now in the yankee rotation.
And that does not include Wang.
This just does not sit well with me at all. Has Cash not learned a thing from Carla Pavano and Jaret Wright?
this is just wonderful news!
i think its good he only pitched well against the Yankees–he was saving himself for when he could play games that mattered instead of just going for stats.
Risky signing, but I think it’ll pay off for at least a few years. Now if they could just drop the Andy Pettitte nonsense and find a big bat I’ll be happy.
CC
AJ
Joba
Wang
Hughes
That’s what the rotation should be heading into the season.
I think AJ’s just bursting with joy…because he doesn’t have to wear those awful Jays alternate uni’s anymore.
Guys, chill with the Pavano/Burnett comparisons. Theyre not fair or accurate. It is like comparing Ben Sheets to Mike Hampton. Sure theyre both oft injured but one is still way better than the other.
Even though I’m not exactly thrilled about this signing, not like I was about CC anyway, AJ Burnett is a Yankee so he now has a fan in me.
Also, CB made a very good and fair point in the last thread. He did choose to come here over what would have been the easier assignment (easier league and div.) in Atlanta. So if we’re going to dog him for things he’s said or done in the past that make him appear lazy or greedy, then it’s only right to also tip our caps to him for electing to face the superior competition, and facing up to his former GM’s smack talk rather than turning tail and running to the AAAA league.
So happy about this one.
I like what I saw out of AJ last season. He brings an edge (not a Ford) to the rotation. The swagger from AJ, Joba and CC should nicely complement the cool calm assassin of Wang.
Just think about this for a second…most teams 3rd starter are going to face either Wang or AJ. Their 5th starter is going up against Joba who outdueled Beckett.
I know the economy sucks and we’re all going to Hell in a handbasket, but next season is going to be fun people. This is shaping up to be a rotation for the ages Yankee wise and I hope Andy gets to be a part of it because I love the guy and I also want to be able to say to Boston fans that 3/5 of our rotation is homegrown.
They only have one homegrown in their rotation in Lester.
I want:
CC
AJ
Wang
Joba
Sheets
One word for that –> Dominating
When they made Carl Pavano, they broke the mold.
GrouchoNYY,
The Yankees would still need another pitcher as insurance if they let Phil Yoouze be the #5 in the rotation. Can’t have two pitchers who can only give you 150 IP’s in the rotation at the same time.
“This just does not sit well with me at all. Has Cash not learned a thing from Carla Pavano and Jaret Wright?”
1. Pavano and Wright were not good pitchers. They did not have good stats (K/9, BB/9, etc.) and basically were signed after 1 fluke season.
2. They both had serious injury risks, which is really not the case here. Burnett had TJ surgery 5 years ago and hasn’t had a significant arm injury since. He misses time most seasons because he doesn’t pitch if his arm does not feel perfect.
3. According to Keith Law, Burnett has arguably the best raw stuff in baseball.
mel– He is probably crying because he doesn’t have the fun Retro Friday uniforms though. Those are my absolute favorite uniforms.
We’ve done it! When they said it couldn’t be done! We’ve replaced Rasner and Ponson!
oh thats another thing, it will be lolz to see him pitching in a split squad Spring Training game.
When they made Carl Pavano, they broke the mold. The only thing is, he was still in it.
Rob, those are the awful blue unis I’m talking about. They’re much to close the Carolina Blue for my tastes.
So potentially CC, AJ and Cameron locked up all in the same week? Seems like a pretty productive stretch to me.
CC > Beckett
No, plain and simple. I love the Yankees, hate the Sox, and Beckett. But no, you cannot make that comparison, at all. It is not even a debate.
Chris Russo is having an absolute meltdown right now.
Oy Nick, I got those lollipops! Thank you!
Now that they’ve lost AJ, TOR should go into rebuilding mode. They should start by sending us Halliday. Now that would be one hell of a rotation!
Burnett is definitely worth 16 mil a year…(remember pettitte made that much last year).
perhaps not 5 years, but we now have the best 1-4 rotation in the game.
How do you not like those uniforms? My only hope is that AJ brings the stirrups with him.
AJ Burnett’s “stuff” is so electric … you can feel how uneasy hitters are facing him when the step in the box … 98mph at the knees, then dropping that nasty slider or change up of his … it is downright filthy.
Anybody who thinks he is another Carl Pavano – circa 2004(just in terms of talent) hasnt been watching him pitch.
He can flat out dominate … now that he is locked up I love knowing that he is ours and that the Yankees dont have to face him anymore.
Big “if” regarding his health … but provided that he does stay relatively healthy and continue to answer the bell like last year, what a weapon he could be.
I can’t see how Pettite doesn’t come back.
Once he does – it’s not simply an issue of the 5 man rotation that’s so impressive.
The depth chart is very impressive:
CC
Wang
AJ
Pettite
Joba
In reserve:
Aceves
Hughes
Kennedy
+/- Coke as a starter
How many teams could go down to their #8 or #9 starter like that?
To add to Adam’s 5:32 post, Jaret Wright also FAILED his Yankee physical. Now I don’t know who was responsible for permitting the team to sign him anyway (I would bet heavily against it being Cashman) but i think we’re pretty much assured they wouldnt repeat the same mistake w/AJ.
To say nothing of the fact that AJ is a far better pitcher than Wright or Pavano.
Also, many of you are forgetting one thing. We now have a stable of arms in the minors to protect the risk we’re taking on AJ. With Pavano/Wright, we didn’t have that, and their stuff was not worth the risk anyway.
I still think AJ is gonna be a disaster towards the end of his deal, but right now I’m just choosing to think about the more immediate future.
I don’t think the Yankees are considering Sheets anymore. It seems like the plan was to take a gamble on either AJ or Sheets, and then to go after Lowe or Pettitte.
Pettitte seems to be Cashman’s first choice, and Lowe will be the fall back.
It’s hard to argue with a rotation when 4 out of the 5 starters feature 95+ MPH fastballs. Teams will absolutely hate facing us
Wanna know how Aj Burnett **look like** in **pinstripes**?
Go here: http://www.brandyrich.com/Bran.....urnett.jpg
As a Dukey, I’m allergic to Carolina Blue.
(Before you guys get all bandwagon on me, remember I have close family in the area.)
I think Andy is the far better bet for 2009 than Hughes. 180-210 innings from your #4? Do it!
CC
Wang
AJ
Andy
Joba + Aceves + etc
Woo hoo!
“Chris Russo is having an absolute meltdown right now.”
aw i actually kinda miss them.
“CC > Beckett
No, plain and simple. I love the Yankees, hate the Sox, and Beckett. But no, you cannot make that comparison, at all. It is not even a debate.”
What? CC ERA+ past 3 years 140, 143, 162.
Beckett ERA+ past 3 years 95, 145, 115
“In reserve:
Aceves
Hughes
Kennedy
+/- Coke as a starter
How many teams could go down to their #8 or #9 starter like that?”
Considering only Hughes is actually any good, I bet most teams can do that.
Pete,
We need a photo shopped picture of Cashman as Santa stat!
How Do , Cashman has done the Job this Off-Season . People can’t knock him now . He’s always put the best interests of the YANKEES First .
Very Nice !!!!
To carry over convo from the last thread though, I think the lineup/bench still needs a high OBP lefty. To CB and the rest of you who are good number crunchers: a) can we afford to sign Dunn still? and b) any chance the Yanks might actually do it?
If not, what do you think it would take to pry Nick the Stick from the Nats? Even if they don’t get Teix they still have Young and Willingham; you’d think with Nick only having a year left and them being, yanno, the Nationals, they’d have to take the opportunity to get something of value for him if it were presented, right?
You guys are missing another point of making this move too.
Not only does it add wins from his pitching performance on the team, but adds wins by subtracting losses incurred facing him.
We faced him 5 times last year and he went 3-1 against us, and we were 2-3 in games he pitched. So suppose the replacement Toronto pitcher wins 1 or 2 less games than Burnett would have in his place against us. Add that to the 3 or 4 game improvement by having him take starts from the likes of Kennedy/Rasner/Ponson and Burnett alone puts us close to the Wild Card last year.
Add in CC replacing Moose but himself adding an extra win or two by eating the innings and saving the pen, and Wang and Joba healthy for the 30 starts they missed combined last year, and it’s very easy to see this team winning 100 games if healthy.
Who needs to sign Tex if you have the most dominant pitching staff in major league baseball? Their offense right now is good, not great, but if you have a team ERA in the mid-3’s, which this team very well could, you don’t have to have a 900 run offense to win games!
“Not only does it add wins from his pitching performance on the team, but adds wins by subtracting losses incurred facing him.”
I stopped reading after this because it’s basically the dumbest thing I’ve ever read. Please jump off a bridge.
FOX Sports and the AP have reported it too.
First heard it on WFAN at 4:57 p.m.
So who’s next? Pettitte or Sheets?
As for CF, i’d rather go after Ankiel of STL than Cameron of MIL even though Cameron is CC’s buddy. He’s a big boy, he can take care of himself!
Raymagnetic– better you than me making that argument. I was here in ‘07 when CC won the Cy Young over Beckett and there were riots in the streets. Beckett has been great in the post season (outside of getting completely smashed this year) but his regular seasons have been above average, not amazing. Sort of like Wang. People would laugh at you for comparing Wang and Beckett in the regular season but that’s a fair comp. IMO. Only Wang is more consistent.
People complain about Pavano, but check out Nick Johnson’s history. It’s scary. He may not be a malingerer, but he keeps getting horrendous injuries.
Sheesh. I was really hoping we wouldn’t get him… Remind me again, when was the last time a roster stacked with overpaid players won us a championship?
Pete keeps saying that Hal and Cash havent been looking at the last few years as a blueprint for the next few years. Could’ve fooled me.
“a) can we afford to sign Dunn still? and b) any chance the Yanks might actually do it?”
Can they afford it? Sure. Is it in their budget for 2008 I doubt it.
I think any significant additions they would make would basically require an organizational decision to throw the budget out the window.
They would basically have to say – we may lose CC after 3 years so the opportunity cost of the next three seasons to our organization are huge. As such, we are going to go all in – no matter the cost – and try to win these next three years.
They could for example say we’ll have money coming off the books next year so lets spend more now.
I don’t see them doing that. In fact, it’s very unlikely.
But that’s what would be required unless they are able to move salary e.g. Matsui or damon.
One burning question remains!!! What happens to my favorite Yankee, Kei Igawa???? (Just kidding)
CB: My one worry is that we’ll have to go that deep before the All Star break…
Though it’s kind of funny–when you think you have plenty of depth, you don’t (2008 Yankees), and when you think you have no depth, you have a surprising amount (2008-2009 Devils)
As long as Burnett doesn’t hurt something signing the contract he should be healthy for spring training.
“People complain about Pavano, but check out Nick Johnson’s history. It’s scary. He may not be a malingerer, but he keeps getting horrendous injuries.”
first, it was the Met’s fault for injuring Johnson. second, Pavano’s medical is **worse** then Johnson’s FYI.
I don’t like giving Burnett 5 years, and definitely not 82.5 million. Not with his injury history back in Toronto. Chances are he’ll be a good pitcher for us when he’s healthy, but I wonder how often we’ll see him on the DL over the next 5 years. It kind of feels like the front office is trying to win it all the next couple of years, and hoping A-Rod’s chase of the record will be enough to keep fans happy when the bulk of our players are too old/injured to really make a run at the WS.
How about no to Andy and Mike get Paul Bird and Tex?
I hope he can last 5 months let alone 5 years. Maybe Andy will have a comeback season like moose did.
A million dollars a start. What a great deal. And people thought CC’s deal was absurd.
Rob NY,
Beckett and Wang have basically been the same pitchers throughout their careers. Beckett is considered an Ace while everyone dogs Wang for his past couple of playoff stinkers.
Wow Adam, that’s a pretty ridiculous thing to say. How is that not reasonable?
If Burnett is on Boston or Toronto, we have to face him most likely 4 or 5 times in a season. Since he tends to dominate us, that means we are taking at least 2, most likely 3 losses in those 4-5 games. So instead of a sure loss facing him, we have a fighting chance against a lesser replacement pitcher, who maybe wins fewer of those 4-5 games. By weakening the competition, we strengthen our own record.
I thought it was pretty obvious, maybe not so much to someone who’s out there looking for an easy flame war.
I love Andy, but saving $10 mil on Andy plus $10 mil by not getting Cameron and we can pay for Tex this year. Next year, we unload more salary. Tex at $20 mil may be steal.
Beckett Postseason Stats
7-1
2.90 ERA
3 complete games
87 innings pitched
Nuff’ said.
Groucho: Yeah, but he’d be only a backup 1b/part time DH for us. And if/when he got hurt, Miranda could come up from AAA to replace him.
I really want him because theres a hole in the 3rd spot in the order IMO and I cant think of a single player in baseball who’d fill it more economically and adequately than him. On the days he sat, Matsui or Swisher could bat 3rd, but he would be a really good weapon to have in the 3 hole against plus pitching who we’re trying to run up their PC and knock out of the game as quickly as possible.
CAN WE GIVE THE GUY A CHANCE 1ST GEE WIZZZZ….
Toronto Blue Jays get their man….signed Matt Clement to a minor league contract. Could Carl Pavano be next?
“Beckett Postseason Stats
7-1
2.90 ERA
3 complete games
87 innings pitched
Nuff’ said.”
does that make him a better pitcher??
Is El Duque a better pitcher than Greg Maddux? No you say? But his playoff record is better….
I don’t understand why Yankees wants A.J. so bad and pay so much. A.J.’s ERA is not particularly outstanding plus his history of injuries. It really puzzled me.
There’s no way in hell that either C.C. or A.J. will be allowed 100+ pitch counts as seen in their previous years.
With the bullpen they’ll have behind them, “workhorse” will no longer apply.
It’s now up to Girardi to be strategic in keeping runners moving around the bases.
Adam I hope you are kidding…AJ was hurt in 2006 and 2007…do you people not do your homework?
Just because a guy pitches well verse the yanks and red sox doesnt mean you should sign him to a ridiculous, stupid contract at the age of 32.
He has been on the DL 10 times. Has only thrown 200 innings 3 times. You might as well have signed Sheets, who is better than AJ, to a 2 year deal. It is much safer and cheaper.
You can worry about every pitchers health, but there are better chances with others, and then you dont top that off with huge contracts. It looks good on paper, but doesnt make too much sense long term.
Beckett certainly has been dominant in the Postseason, but let’s not anoint him “the best pitcher in baseball” based on 87 innings. Beckett has hardly been the best pitcher in the regular season, which matters equally as much because you need to make it there first!
Beckett has had many years in which he has not started 30 games as well. He’s just as injury prone throughout his career as Burnett, yet Boston traded Hanley Ramirez, an MVP caliber shortstop, for him, and look how that worked. Sure, he wasn’t his best last year, but when he was healthy, he won for them. Burnett could do the same for us.
Let’s not forget how badly Beckett got clobbered for most of the last Postseason. He’s not invincible, and in fact other than the 2003 World Series, his record against the Yankees is pretty mediocre.
“raymagnetic
December 12th, 2008 at 5:47 pm
Rob NY,
Beckett and Wang have basically been the same pitchers throughout their careers. Beckett is considered an Ace while everyone dogs Wang for his past couple of playoff stinkers.”
Not to mention that nobody EVER discussed Wang’s playoff performance until he threw a poor game there. I’m not even sure most of the know nothings who dog him are even aware that he pitched very well @ LAA as a rookie in the ALDS, or that he recorded the Yankees’ lone playoff win in 06.
Like with Mariano nowadays, the general public only wants to talk about his struggles. Guess when he does well it isnt “news”.
Ray– I completely agree with you. The thing of it is Wang has a steady 120 ERA+ for the two full years he pitched. Beckett has been all over the place including his first year in Boston where he was below league average. But he’s an ace? He’s better than CC? I thinks not. He has been Bob Gibson in the post season but he hasn’t quite been CMW in the regular season. We will have the best rotation in baseball if health is not an issue.
Career ERA+ : CMW 117 Beckett 116 CC 121
Non-tenders will complete the bench, Cameron will complete the outfield….wonder what Cash has up his sleeve next?
“Beckett Postseason Stats
7-1
2.90 ERA
3 complete games
87 innings pitched
Nuff’ said.”
Are you aware of the fact that you have to pitch well enough to make it to the playoffs.
In ‘06 Beckett was a below league average pitcher and the Sox didn’t make the playoffs that year…….
Well, when AJ is healthy…that is a hell of a rotation. Red Sox fans are probably feeling a bit stressed right now.
Who has their press conference first? CC or AJ?
Do we lose wins by not having to face CC?
I kid, I kid!
Wow – reading down the comments this blog is completely bipolar right now. One comment – amazing move and the next – what a disaster. Its actually pretty funny.
I dont mind getting burnett at all. What i mind is the five years we are giving him – when has burnett even been healthy for two years straight? Never. We may not regret the five years this year but we will, we definitely will. Just a warning this will probably begin GREAT but it wont end well.
As for the pavano comparisons, I dont like the deal but its unfair to say pavano part 2. AJ hasnt pitches less than 100 innings since 2003. When was the last time pavano pitched more than 100 innings? He has been able to stay healthy for three full years – a task pavano accomplished did twice while missing significant time every other year. Can this deal turn out to be pavano version 2? Yes of course. Will it? Probably not. AJ is just far better in terms of stuff. He just needs to learn to get the ball over the plate. The one concern I have is he does sit out due to pain when nothing is actually wrong with him. Hopefully, on a contending team with a boat load of all stars he wont be able to get away with it very long. This most certainly will end as a bad signing but the real questions are how will it start and how long do we have?
*begins repeatedly bashing his head onto this desk*
What does the Yankees staff need? Stability! So sign Burnett! Dammit, dammit, dammit.
^ Does El Duque have career stats even close to Maddux? No you say?
Beckett and Sabathia both have pitched for 8 years, and have very similar numbers. But guess what? Becket completely destroys Sabathia with regards to the post season. And as a Yankee fan, I sorta feel as though the postseason is very important.
Make sense?
We gain wins just by not having Igawa, Ponson & Rasner in the rotation….
dave
December 12th, 2008 at 5:19 pm
HUGE MISTAKE!!!!!!
Cashman will be regretting this deal within two years guaranteed – I am regretting the move the minute it goes through. AND CASHMAN HAD BEEN DOING SO WELL so far this off season. And of course, he blows it with an idiotic move like this.
———————————————————–
This must be a great move for two reasons.
1. Youv’e never been right, yet.
2. It has to be good if it makes you feel bad.
SHEETS SHEETS SHEETS SHEETS OHH SHEETS
I like the signings and all of you who say we shouldnt of signed them or one of them, who did you want? Last year we tried the young guys and we all see how that worked for us, these are moves that had to be made. However, We need some offense right now AROD is the only big-time HR threat, we have alot of questions with Jorge,Matsui,and who knows what every1 else will do. I think Robbie bounces back but not a 3 hitter. Nady to me isnt a 3 hitter, We need to get TEX or Manny and somehow shed Matsui’s contract or use Swisher as a platoon @ 1b,OF,DH. Matsui is gone so use that $$ NOW and get TEX
I know this is like speaking a foreign language here, but can we worry about making the playoffs before worrying about what happens once we’re there?
Okay folks, you are all making valid points. But when it all comes down to it, the season is played to win a World Series.
If I had to pick between Sabathia and Beckett to pitch game 7, both healthy, I would take Beckett in a heartbeat. And therefore, I consider him the better pitcher.
I’m not gonna get in an argument here, because I want Sabathia to do great.
Lets go Yanks!
Why do people keep clamoring for us to sign more marquee players to hit the ball? I was for signing a bat before Cashman’s strategy unfolded, but at this point it makes no sense to add a bat.
Consider these FA’s and why we cannot sign then:
Tex: Once we get Cameron, that will officially end any chance of getting Tex. Where would we put Swisher? The outfield is full w/ Damon, Cameron, and Nady. We have Gardner.
The other DH types (Manny, Dunn, etc.): We have a DH already. I would rather have Matsui than either of them. I think Matsui’s injury risk is heavily overstated. He had surgery on one knee, then needed it on the other. This is not uncommon because athletes commonly over compensate when injured and injure something else. With two “new knees” I think he should be ready to rock and roll as DH. Remember, before the broken wrist and knee injuries he had his own little iron man streak going. Also, he actually hits well as DH (many do not), and is a very clutch hitter.
The lineup is not Murder’s Row plus Cano, but with the way the pitching is shaping up it does not have to be. It is still a top 5ish lineup in the AL. Now we have a top 5ish rotation in the AL, and maybe a top 3 bullpen the it has been coming together.
One final thought, how can anybody want to see Manny in pinstripes. I mean, aside from all he does to disgrace the game, he was the enemy for so long. I absolutely hate signing Bostons garbage. I hate signing any AL East recycle (yes, including Burnett but I understand why we need to).
Did I use “we” in this post? The “we” police were out earlier.
We knew the Yanks had no competition to sign Sabathia, so getting AJ is maybe even bigger. The rotation now looks better as any the Yankees has had in the past 10 years. And that is not counting the arms we have in the wings in case of an injury, Hughes, Aceves and Kennedy.
You can’t win in the post season if you don’t make it first. You need Sabathia to get there in the first place, especially considering they DIDN’T make it last year. Why don’t we worry about that before we worry about what he does in it? These are exactly the right types of pitchers to sign.
Who would you rather have starting a game 3 in a postseason series? 88 mph sinker baller Derek Lowe who last got clobbered in the AL East or high 90’s fire baller AJ Burnett? Sure, he could get hurt, but he’s not Pavano, and even if he only starts 25 games, he’s still a huge upgrade over what they’ve had, and when he’s on he’s nearly unstoppable. If he gets hurt, then Hughes can fill in for a few starts and even put up similar numbers.
They have the depth to take a chance on this move. If it works, it’s huge. If it doesn’t, then they’ll get something out of him and fill in when necessary. At the very least, this keeps him off of teams that are major division contenders, which you all laugh at but if a pitcher of his caliber is on those teams and healthy, you certainly wouldn’t.
“My one worry is that we’ll have to go that deep before the All Star break…”
rebecca,
Welcome back. Hope grad school isn’t too bad.
Look there’s no doubt this is a huge risk. I wouldn’t have given AJ a 5 year deal. I just wouldn’t have. But it is what it is and I’m hoping as much as I can that I’m completely wrong.
This is one of the biggest risks the franchise has taken on a player perhaps since signing Dave Winfield to the leagues biggest deal and assuming he’d be the next Reggie Jackson.
This is a much, much bigger risk than giving Alex $275M or giving CC $161M.
AJ just doesn’t have nearly the track record of either of those players and he’s a pitcher who is a high effort guy who only throws 2 pitches.
He’s been a thrower more than a pitcher his whole career. He never made the transition. His stuff is so good he’s one of the few that could get away with it.
That kind of pitcher even loses even a few miles on his fastball, without becoming more of a pitcher, and he’s in trouble.
The yankees are basically saying we are making a commitment to being a pitching first franchise, we have a huge need, our young pitchers aren’t ready and we have the financial resources to absorb the body blow if this deal doesn’t work out.
They are basically betting that AJ becomes the next Curt Schilling. A guy with extreme talent who puts it together later on his career.
That’s a low probability high upside gamble.
But there’s also very few players in the game with his physical talent.
Oh, good. The Yankees really need an unexceptional injury-prone starter. And to lock him up for five years, too!
“Also, CB made a very good and fair point in the last thread. He did choose to come here over what would have been the easier assignment (easier league and div.) in Atlanta. So if we’re going to dog him for things he’s said or done in the past that make him appear lazy or greedy, then it’s only right to also tip our caps to him for electing to face the superior competition, and facing up to his former GM’s smack talk rather than turning tail and running to the AAAA league.”
First off, he came here because he didn’t want the pressure of being the ace in Atlanta, so let’s not give him too many accolades. It’s a high risk/high reward signing for sure.
I say bring back Pettitte and let Hughes pitch in Scranton and dominate down there to get his confidence and consistency back because he’ll be getting plenty of starts when Burnett breaks down.
Yay!!!
GreenBeret,
Your a funny guy. I guess the CC signing was a huge mistake because i wanted that. Also, the mussina signing must have been a disaster because i wanted that as well. And all the groaning I did when cash signed pavano and wright just because they were there and everyone wanted them must have been way off base because look at how well those two deals turned out. And i did not want to re-sign posada to a long-term deal and look at how well that deal has begun. Im right more than you think and this burnett deal rubs me the wrong way. He may be good this year and he may be good next year but at some point, we will regret giving burnett five years – this thing doesnt end until he is 36 years old. Sheets is 2 years younger and looking for a deal that is at least 2 years shorter – he may not work out either but hmm, bad 2 year deal or bad five year deal let me think about it for a while because thats a tough one.
Vince what if you wanted a guy to win the Cy Young and pitch 32 starts. Then, pitch four of his last three starts to catapult you into the playoffs rather than die an Octoberless baseball death? It’s obviously not a slam dunk either way.
Beckett 2008 ALDS: ERA: 7.20 5 ip 4BB. Dominant?
2 games ALCS: ERA: 9.64 9 ip 10 er Dominant?
He is erratic at best IMO. When he’s on he’s great, when he isn’t, yuck. Sound familiar?
The whole thing is the 5 years dave. If you sign AJ for 3, then great, but that isnt realistic. At that price, we should have tried to sign Lowe for 3 (not happening) or just sign Sheets for 2 plus an option and bring back Andy.
It just makes more sense than going down a road we have all been down before. There is no way I would have given AJ 5 years if I were a gm.
I would have tried Lowe for 3 years at 50 mill and Sheets for 2 years plus an option. And then Andy depending on room and flexibility obviously.
Also, can we start the rick ankiel for CF talk…if you are going to trade melky and a prospect for cameron, and you have all this starting pitching now, you might as well think about trading melky, a prospect, and someone like britton for ankiel. The prospect would have to be at least a B prospect, and may have to be kennedy. However, Ankiel can play good cf defense and hit in the third, fourth, or fifth spot of the order. Only thing is, he has 1 year left till free agency, which is why the cards wanna deal him.
Jerry Crasnick is the unseen ESPN baseball guy.
I don’t think there is much doubt about it – they signed Burnett because he strikes people out. Lowe doesn’t.
We all know this is not a defense-oriented team. At least not yet – it’s going to take awhile if they want to make this team good defensively. So, what do you do? You go after pitchers who can get a lot of outs by making hitters not put the ball in play.
I think the major reason why I am not upset about this move is because I expected he was going to be a Yankee the day he opted out of his contract – no doubts in my mind that he would be a big-time target.
The reward can potentially be very big – he’s not a great starting pitcher. But he can be very, very good. Yes, even when healthy, he can be erratic as well. You are not going to get consistent greatness from the guy; but you don’t need him to always be great.
mel
December 12th, 2008 at 5:32 pm
When they made Carl Pavano, they broke the mold.
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Well, that cliche is certainly appropriate and explains his injury history.
“Adam I hope you are kidding…AJ was hurt in 2006 and 2007…do you people not do your homework?”
They weren’t major injuries (they didn’t require surgery). 2006 was an issue with scar tissue from his TJ surgery and 2007 he had two separate DL stints for shoulder soreness. He was fine in 2008, so I don’t expect these to be issues.
I love the people that think everything cashman does is the right move because he has all the info – just think about the past for a little while.
CB, I agree it’s a huge gamble over the life of the contract, but maybe not as much for the first couple years (absent his health history), which goes more to your “all-in” theory. Build the farm as planned but give the current team the best rotation possible while you still have Mo, Posada, productive-Jeter, etc.
CB:
Grad school is slowly killing me…and would you believe none of the medievalists are baseball fans (!?!)
It’s a huge risk. I hope it pays off, I really do, I’m just really really cautious and to me this smacks of a giant red flag overkill type moment.
It’s a thin market and the Yankees are doing what they can. It’s a moment like this I almost wish the Yankees were a small(er) market team, a team that could perhaps wait a year and invest in a better market without having to worry about fans calling for the heads of the manager, general manager and entire front office…
Oh well, c’est la vie.
At least fired Yankee officials get to keep their heads. In the things I study, this is usually not the case…
GB,
my preaching for Gaudin is now gone, Cubs tendered him.
However, the Braves nontendered Chuck James, you opinion?
Why Burnett, He is the next Carl Pavano. I hate this signing, too much money, too many years and he guy is overrated. I am not a fan. I think sheets was the better risk reward guy for sure.
I know the yankees have a lot of money, but putting a lot of money into a guy who is injury prone is not a wise business decision. In addition i dont think this is a wise baseball decision as well.
He has had not one year in his career where is era was under 3.5, walks way too many hitters and if you have read about him he is a nut case. Tats all over his body. Way to screw this one up cashman. I would have loved sheets is in pinstripes.
Matt-
“Who needs to sign Tex if you have the most dominant pitching staff in major league baseball? Their offense right now is good, not great, but if you have a team ERA in the mid-3’s, which this team very well could, you don’t have to have a 900 run offense to win games!”
That’s probably true, but you need your offense to work counts, get into the other teams bullpen by the 5th or 6th innings. Our offense scored something like 3 or fewer runs in 60’some games and were shut down by pitchers that are lucky to be in the majors like Scott Feldman of the Rangers.
Really, IMO, it would help to have a consistent bat, with power, hitting behing A-Rod, rather than Matsui, or Posada, or whomever gets placed there.
OMG I would rather had gone after sheets but we will never know untill the end of 2009 but thats a relly good rotation
Sabathia
Wang
BURNETT
JOBA
TBD
NOW WE NEED A POWER HITTER ADAM DUNN OR TEXERIA ANYONE?
THIS DEAL IS GREAT. EVEN IF AJ ONLY PERFORMS for TWO YEARS. WHY? BECAUSE in two-years Zack M, Betances, Or De La Rosa will be waiting in the wings for their shot in the big leagues.
Better said: when they made the mold, it broke Pavano.
four of his last starts on three days rest* is what i meant to type.
So who gets the Yankees’ first round and supplemental? The Brewers (CC) or the Jays (Burnett)??
ps – there’s a new post up.
Best rotation in baseball right now. All of you hating on Burnett, give me a reason why this isn’t the best rotation in baseball (assuming Pettitte signs)
Worried about the 5 years for AJ, but gonna hope for the best.
Welcome to the family AJ.
If everyone stays healthy, happy and well fed..we do have one pretty good rotation.
yanks will still end up adding a .900 ops guy.
Ed – CC and AJ are now Yanks!! Aj better stays healthy!!!
December 12th, 2008 at 6:07 pm
GB,
my preaching for Gaudin is now gone, Cubs tendered him. However, the Braves nontendered Chuck James, you opinion?
————————————————————
Gaudin is ok, but, not in NY. He’d be perfect in San Diego or Seattle….big parks. As far as James…no place for him.
Priority one – get someone on him about his supposed bad mechanics, and keep that arm healthy.
Maybe Cashman needs to delegate a special team of people to watch & protect his arm. Kinda like back in ‘98 with the 5 ANSKY guys in one of their TV commercials, hovering around David Cone like special agents after the dog bit Cone’s finger. Man, I would NOT want to be the “N” guy on that team.
I wasn’t a huge fan of signing Burnett and think 5 years is way too much, but it’s a better pick-up than Lowe. AJ is younger and in his prime. Enough with older pitchers.
I’d still like Teixeira though, and I think it’s worth not signing Pettitte ($10 million) and not trading for Cameron (another $10 million) and putting that $20 million towards signing Teixeira. Let Melky and Gardner compete for Center and if they can’t put up decent numbers, Damon or Swisher could move there. Let Hughes/Aceves/Kennedy compete for the 4th starter spot.
CC
Wang
AJ
Hughes
Joba
Damon
Jeter
Teixeira
A-Rod
Matsui
Posada
Nady
Cano
Melky/Gardner/Swisher
That’s a really good solid team with both starters and relievers.
oh, and saying “Burnett will get hurt in the first week of the season” is not a good reason
Rebbeca, should have gone to Grad school for literature. All of my dissertation chair was a huge Red Sox fan and the other two Profs were Giants and Cubs fans respectivly.
My thesis defense was a three hour baseball argument that spilled over into a 8 hour beer drinking fest. Good times.
can we please hold off on the pavano references about aj?
avg # of starts last 4 years: 28
average IP last 4 years: 183
thats not pettitte like, but it nothing like pavano.
If everyone stays healthy on the pitching staff, it has a possibility of cranking out 13-1400 strikeouts and that will take much of the defensive issues out of play.
Id rather have TEX and Sheets and Andy or a combo of Tex and Sheets/Andy and another mid-level pitcher. Of course to go along with CC. Still think we need that #3 hitter
Yankee Trader,
That’s true that they might need to upgrade a little on offense, but most of the upgrades are very expensive. I think they’d have a pretty good chance of being at least an 800 run offense next year when you consider that they’re replacing Molina/Cabrera with hopefully healthy Posada/Cameron. I think it’s reasonable to expect Swisher and Matsui to at least emulate if not supplant Giambi’s production, and Abreu’s is easily covered if Posada/Cameron take all the extra AB’s.
Someone like Tex/Manny would be a huge boost to protect A-Rod, but is it really necessary to put the payroll that high to do so? I think they’ll score more runs than people think if they have fewer below replacement level hitters.
well merry Christmas
“I agree it’s a huge gamble over the life of the contract, but maybe not as much for the first couple years (absent his health history), which goes more to your “all-in” theory.”
Nick,
Unfortunately, part of what makes the gamble so big is that it’s both a enormous gamble over the life of the contract (as it would be with any pitcher though more so with AJ) but it’s also a large risk short term as well.
It’s got large risk on both ends of the time spectrum.
There just so much variance in the number of innings he’ll throw in any one season that it’s tough to have any idea what he’ll give them even next year.
One of the things that makes me feel better about his long term risk is that he’s already had TJ, had the complication of the recovery period and seems to have emerged.
In a weird way I’d feel even worse about this deal if AJ hadn’t had TJ. Very rare that any pitcher needs TJ twice. AJ does have a violent delivery however. Don’t know if this makes sense.
In 2009 will he be closer to the AJ of 2007 or 2008? Who knows.
The risk that links them both is more qualitative – it’s more about personality unfortunately. Basically the knock on AJ is that he’s just not willing to grind out a season in order to help his team.
That’s the knock. That he’ll head to the DL over very little. That he would never ever do for a team what CC would.
That’s really what it gets down for.
This contract is a bet that AJ has become a new person as a baseball player.
That was all the talk about AJ this season. He was mentored by Halladay and it finally sunk in.
Al Leiter who is a smart guy swears by AJ. Loves him. Al thinks it’s a new AJ. A more mature guy.
That’s the risk and that’s short term and long term.
They are betting on the guy more than the stuff.
update >>>>
Scott Boras has just about the whole stage to himself with his stable of clients.
He now will realize that other teams will not have Yankee kind of money.
“If everyone stays healthy on the pitching staff, it has a possibility of cranking out 13-1400 strikeouts and that will take much of the defensive issues out of play.”
This is and has been clearly part of the team’s long term strategy.
They are basically acknowledge that the left side of the infield is never going to be very good or more than average with Jeter and ARod there.
So the strategy is just to prevent any contact from being made.
This is why the yankees placed a particular value on AJ.
The team is being assembled in a very rational, carefully thought out way.
yeah, unless they decide to swoop in at the last minute for someone who’s undervalued, the yankees just took alot of air out of the FA balloon.
CC
wang
aj
sheets/pettitte/lowe in that order of preference
Hughes
i personally think we should have joba in the set up role. with him in there we would only need 6-7 innings tops. it would be like the rivera wetland days! plus im worried about his durability after last season
Great job Brian! Acquiring the top two free agent pitchers, who happen to be two of the best pitchers in baseball, is a good move. They paid what they had to to get what they wanted. Risky?, there is always a risk but you really can’t fault a team for getting great talent. Hey I was suspicious about AJ (injury history) but all those major league talent evaluators can’t be blind, can they? Now Andy should be as humble as he presents and accept the 10 or so million, hold down the spot for Hughes, and help lead the team back into serious contention for another ring. Oh, still some work to be done this winter: they need a center fielder (Cameron to hold down spot for Jackson is a good move) and utility infielder (too bad Punto signed elsewhere.)
I just don’t get how you spend $16.5 million to sign a guy in his 30’s who, best guess, will pitch 150 innings per year when for a few dollars more, you can get a guy like Tex who is in great shape and will play every day.
If Burnett is another Pavano, Cash should be fired. How many mulligans does he get (Pavano, Igawa)?
I just don’t get it.
Matthew Cohen . .
Pitching wins Championships !!!! . .
Two years too many on both contracts. I cannot stand how the Yankees get shaken down like that time and time again.
The rotation is finally improved and we’ve got an ace for the first time in the 10 years Cashman has been a GM.
Only worry now is who bats 3rd and protects A-Rod. I’ve got as much faith in Xavier Nady as I do in General Motors making good cars.
so is anyone know is cc will still be 52 and AJ 34?
The rotation is finally improved and we’ve got an ace for the first time in the 10 years Cashman has been a GM.
——————————————————
What are you talking about? As much as I didn’t like Clemens he was an ace.
BBB: “AJ Burnett is a Yankee so he now has a fan in me.”
That’s gross. What about the gerbil?
Does anyone know the specifics of how much sheets is asking for because I would love to have him on the team.Give him a 2 year contract or so.
In 2 years I have a feeling that the rotation will look like this
1)C.C
2)Joba
3)Wang
4)Burnett
5)Hughes
Thats looking very well.
this looks like a new carl pavano.
ok at least not derek lowe