On Cashman, the roster and Manny
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Dec 12, 2008 
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A few things to ponder:
The new Cashman: When Brian Cashman decided to stay with the team in October, he spent his press conference railing against stories that criticized him and said his motivation was to prove those people wrong. It struck me at the time as a strange reason to keep a job.
But whatever is driving Cashman is driving him well. The trade for Nick Swisher was a good one and he has been smart in approaching the free agent market, targeting specific players, researching the process and moving at the right time. It remains to be seen whether CC Sabathia is a great pitcher in pinstripes. But how Cashman approached, recruited and signed the big lefty was brilliant. The Yankees were patient when they had to be and aggressive when they could be.
The roster: The Yankees have a full 40-man roster. So as players are added, players will have to be subtracted and designated for assignment.
The leading contenders would seem to be Chris Britton, Shelley Duncan, Cody Ransom, Justin Christian and Dan Giese. Maybe Steven Jackson. Because he is left-handed, I would think Chase Wright stays in the organization. But he’ll be 26 in February. I hope Britton gets a shot to go someplace else. He deserves a chance to show what he can do rather than ride the Scranton shuttle.
Manny Ramirez: Ken Davidoff had an interesting story in Newsday today about a frustrated Manny saying he will retire because of the lack of offers. It won’t happen, of course. Manny is all about the money. But it speaks to how unstable a person Ramirez is and why he would be a terrible addition for the Yankees.
Don’t forget, he said when he left the Red Sox that what he liked least about playing in Boston was the pressure to win every game. So how would that work in New York?
Some fans are holding out hope that Manny will be in pinstripes. Be careful what you wish for in this case. Manny in New York managed by a polar opposite personality in Joe Girardi could be a disaster.
The new Cashman album “Dope Money” drops on April 4th
No Manny
What about the possibility of getting Peavy after talks with the Cubs broke down?
I will not be convinced or swayed toward Lowe. Why block talented young pitchers down the line with a late 30′s sinker-baller with diminishing stuff. Lowe’s numbers since hes been in the NL west are not a strange coincidence the NL west is the junior hitting league in the game. Taking him out of that comfort zone in the NL west and thrusting him at age 36 into the best hitting division in baseball seems like a real good move. If I am gonna gamble on anybody it will be a guy with dominant stuff like AJ Burnett.
“But how Cashman approached, recruited and signed the big lefty was brilliant”
98% money ($60M more than the nearest competitor)
2% brilliance
Pete:
I respect your thoughts on Manny, but IMO he would be ok here..I doubt Cash goes for him unless there are just no other offers, we know Boston won’t anty up….Tex would be better, we’ll just wait and see….
If Atlanta loses out on AJ, they’ll probably revisit the Peavy trade. Peavy was excited about that possibility before it broke down. Houston’s too broke to do it.
People are saying Angels for Peavy, too.
Why aren’t people talking about Ollie Perez to the yankees?
Wiat, let me rephrase that what are your opinions of Ollie Perez? Do you want him in Pinstripes?
Boy Pete you really know how to take a day off!
Your observations about Manny are right on. He would be a disaster,especially now that he’s copping an attitude.
How many real home-run threats did we have on our championship teams? How bout players who hit for average and a good OBS?
“Manny in New York managed by a polar opposite personality in Joe Girardi could be a disaster.”
Even Terry Francona was relieved when Manny was traded away and he’s one of the most patient managers in the game.
Perhaps a team could tolerate his behvior when Manny was in his prime but now we would get same behavior but with a player in decline as an athlete.
Up until this offseason I’ve been a Cashman detractor. Honestly, I’ve hated him.
However, I can’t fault anything he’s done so far this offseason. He’s done a really great job. The 2009 Yankees look like they are going to be the stuff of legends again.
I wish he could have concentrated on pitching more in the past. However, tabula rasa… at this rate I might even become a big fan of Cashman.
“98% money ($60M more than the nearest competitor)
2% brilliance”
True. But a lot of times Cashman doesn’t even get credit for the 2%.
Compare that assessment to the way Theo is talked about.
He did the same thing with Dice K. Threw money at a problem and that was genius.
Just wait to see what happens with Tex. The sox will give him the largest contract this off season – and somehow it will be due to the brilliance of the boston front office which has tragested Tex since he was in high school as a must have player who once became available was secured by the rational, efficient methods of Theo Epstein rather than $200M of John Henry’s money.
Perez as a 6th starter? do we need him? his control scares me.
On Burnett:
1) Not sure I really want a guy who does not want to “be the man”. Seems to me that attitude doesn’t translate when it matters most.
2) I’m puzzled why this is really a contest. Seems that at worst, the Yankees have an offer as good as Atlanta’s. What decision is to made???
Dis-agree he’d be great, in NY
Burnett just wants to make it interesting.
CB:
Generally agreed. Little difference insomuch as Boston had/has actual competition for the services of those two players. Certainly no genius in the Matsuzaka matter as Boston had all the leverage on the contract.
He may have to do a little selling on Teixeira.
I have the feeling the Yanks will end up with another bat before spring is here (even if the Cameron deal is completed). You get the feeling right now that come late January, a lot of #3-4 type hitters—Manny, Abreu, Dunn, Burrell, Giambi, Anderson to name a few—may still be available at a discount. Maybe it’s not Manny, but I won’t be surprised if Cashman slips in the back door for one of those guys.
I wouldn’t be concerned about Manny’s attitude with the Yanks because it seems that when Manny is happy, he causes no problems. I only see us getting him on a 1 or a 2 year deal so I don’t think he’d be a headache because, presumably, he’d be happy here. The bigger question if we sign Manny (or one of those other guys) is whether Girardi is able to rotate 6 guys between 1B, DH and the 3 OF spots. After last year, I’m not so sure he can do that without getting someone upset.
Cashman has a thankless job. If he signs a bunch of guys and the Yanks win, it’s because he had Steinbrenner’s money. If the players he brings in don’t perform, it’s his fault for signing them. And I’d wish people would stop comparing every Yankee team to the 96-2000 Yanks. We’re never going to duplicate those teams the same way the Mets will never have a team like ’86.
No, no, no to Ramirez. He’s a cancer. T.O. with a bat. Does anyone really think he’ll be a model citizen just because he’s on the Yanks?? I hope he has to settle for a one year deal with Pittsburg.
“about a frustrated Manny saying he will retire because of the lack of offers……. But it speaks to how unstable a person Ramirez is and why he would be a terrible addition for the Yankees.”
I don’t care if Manny is a Yankee or not but to declare someone unstable because they were allegedly frustrated is taking a leap. I say allegedly because Manny has since come out and said he would like to play until he hits 700 HRs. Immature, childlike, pampered, privilege all apply before I would use the unstable tag.
Say whatever about Manny, and we all have. The teams he is on WIN.
Cleveland late 90s
Boston 2001-2008
LA – 2008
I think some of that has to be attributed to his bat.
For starters, nobody knows that the difference was 60 mil. It was however going to be significant to keep Sabathia out of California.
“Some fans are holding out hope that Manny will be in pinstripes. Be careful what you wish for in this case. Manny in New York managed by a polar opposite personality in Joe Girardi could be a disaster.”
You mean like Reggie Jackson and Billy Martin?
CC made it more about location.
Andy is making it about money, which is why the troubled economy argument should be more talked about now.
“Little difference insomuch as Boston had/has actual competition for the services of those two players.”
Perhaps. But I think you could argue that going into this the yankees also would have had competition from additional teams if they didn’t play things the way they did.
If they had come in with say an offer of $110-120 to just top Milwaukee I think a more robust market for CC would have evolved and then the yankees would have gotten into a progressive bidding war with CC.
I think their strategy helped shape the market in ways favorable to them.
I think that’s what boston is trying to do – less successfully – with tex. How many leaked stories do we need to hear about how much the Sox are “lusting” after tex, how they won’t be outbid, how they will go up to $250M for him…
Why be so vocal in your desire for a player – especially a boras player?
Only reason I can think of is to send a message to any would be tom hicks and to arte moreno get out of the bidding as you are going to be outspent.
And it hasn’t worked nearly as well as it did with CC.
Now i think that’s mostly due to position – teams aren’t excited about taking long term risks on pitchers.
But ultimately it hasn’t worked as well for the Sox because people see the threat as somewhat hollow.
So no it looks like Tom Lerner may be setting himself up to be the next Tom Hicks. Moreno hasn’t backed off.
If the sox get him it will only be because of money.
But that won’t be the perception at all. All of the attention will be placed on the marginal difference strategy made – that is to Theo’s genius.
The yankees are given credit for the marginal difference their strategy may make far less often.
Mr. Pettitte’s best friend
December 12th, 2008 at 3:30 pm
Say whatever about Manny, and we all have. The teams he is on WIN.
Cleveland late 90s
Boston 2001-2008
LA – 2008
I think some of that has to be attributed to his bat.
————————————————————
How much better could he have been or could he have made those teams if he had given full effort?
The new Cashman is a better GM than the Cashman we’ve been privy to the past few seasons.
It’s either one of two things; The Steinbrothers have opened the checkbook after keeping it closed for the past couple of years OR Cashman realized the value established players have in this league vs. young kids and Quad A retreads.
The past couple of seasons it was all about Cashman finding someone else’s trash (Ponson, Rasner, Chacon, etc.) and turning it into something passable for the Yankees to get by with.
Now, it seems, he’s building a team instead of plugging leaks.
Last off season he was a terrible GM. I’m not going to revisit Johan, but there were so many minor leaguers who were so highly overrated he refused to deal and they all lost value this year.
He’s not making the same mistake this year and it appears he’s seeing Hughes/Kennedy as insurance for the established parts of his rotation.
They’re also excellent trading chips for a team devoid of positional prospects.
My biggest problem with Cashman has been his “shame of the payroll” routine. How he seemed to rather be crafty and cheap and build a winner instead of using the team’s resources to get their guy.
This offseason it’s a different story. With the rotation and pen he’s built, he can start to focus on how to fix the offense.
The other thing he’s done is gotten the guys off the island a lot of the low IQ players who may have talent, but aren’t good players.
I like what I’m seeing. Getting anything for Betemit was a master stroke and rebuilding the rotation the way he seems to be is exactly what this team needs.
One thing to remember is.. Girardi’s “Talent” is replaceable.. Manny’s talent isn’t.
“I only see us getting him on a 1 or a 2 year deal so I don’t think he’d be a headache because, presumably, he’d be happy here.”
If Manny wasnt happy making $20mil on a franchise that let him show up when he wanted,made excuses for him when he quit in August of 2006,fake injuries in 2007 and get away with avoiding the media till he chose to speak in Sring of 2008, why in the world would anyone think he’d be happy in New York?
It’s a mute point. The slug isnt coming. Hopefully no other team rewards him for failing to give his best effort to the Red Sox in 2008.
Manny Ramirez must be bi-polar. He can’t figure out if he wants to play in the North Pole or the South Pole.
Drive 4-5
December 12th, 2008 at 3:40 pm
“I only see us getting him on a 1 or a 2 year deal so I don’t think he’d be a headache because, presumably, he’d be happy here.”
If Manny wasnt happy making $20mil on a franchise that let him show up when he wanted,made excuses for him when he quit in August of 2006,fake injuries in 2007 and get away with avoiding the media till he chose to speak in Sring of 2008, why in the world would anyone think he’d be happy in New York?
It’s a mute point. The slug isnt coming. Hopefully no other team rewards him for failing to give his best effort to the Red Sox in 2008.
————————————————————
Please….don’t sugar-coat it. LMAO.
Afternoon, Drive
the term is “moot point” not “mute point”
Brilliant my @$$, he had to outbid the Brewers by $61 million and give him a opt out clause. He doesn’t deserves credit for that. That’s just throwing away money at players.
Is easy to overpay for players, any GM could do it.
Are we gonna give Cashman credit too when he signs Burnett for 90 million?
With Manny the numbers are mesmerizing. I can only imagine what he and Arod could do hitting third and fourth. But he is an unstable head case, who would rub alot of the Yankee players, coaches, fans, and manager the wrong way. With that said, he’ll probably go back to the Dodgers.
jay destro
December 12th, 2008 at 3:47 pm
the term is “moot point” not “mute point”
————————————————————
Careful, Jay. They’re going to “Moot” you.
“Are we gonna give Cashman credit too when he signs Burnett for 90 million?”
Yes
It is not 90 mil. It is 80 mil.
“It’s either one of two things; The Steinbrothers have opened the checkbook after keeping it closed for the past couple of years OR Cashman realized the value established players have in this league vs. young kids and Quad A retreads.”
Or there’s simply much more high quality talent available on the free agent market this year and as such he’s decided to deploy his resources in the open market aggressively as that the area where they can be used most effectively this off season.
The yankees biggest advantage over other teams is money.
Cashman doesn’t want to make the yankees better by paying with player talent in trades.
He would rather use the resources he has in larger supply of.
That’s why they didn’t trade for Santana last off season and went head over heels this off season for CC and also for AJ.
If they had to give up young talent to get AJ – they wouldn’t. Only money – they’re all in.
This free agent off season has a lot of quality in it – so they are focusing on free agency.
Next year the market isn’t nearly as good so they may not spend as aggressively and could focus more on trades or the draft.
It’s not a new or different Cashman as much as it is a new and different market place due to the supply of talent available and the veteran contracts that are coming off the books this off season.
:0
The really under appreciated thing Cashman has done in recent times is how he has managed the 40man roster.
Looking back to the midseason moves last year and the Swisher trade this winter, he has done a great job of taking guys from the fringes of our roster, who were not going to be impact guys for us, and getting a good return for them – while at the same time freeing up some spots to protect more guys in the minors.
We lost 4 guys i the rule 5 draft (though odds are a couple will be back), but without Cash’s recent trades we could have lost twice that number – including guys with higher ceilings.
jay destro
December 12th, 2008 at 3:47 pm
the term is “moot point” not “mute point”
Thanks Jay. I knew that but was a lil excited before I hit “submit” lol
i know, but it was more fun to be a jerk about it
Pete you say that Manny left Boston because of the pressure to win every game and New York will be worse. I beg to differ
you seem to know Boston nothing can approach the fanaticism and the Red Sox mania the press has up there with the team.
Burnett signed 5/82.5
“For starters, nobody knows that the difference was 60 mil. It was however going to be significant to keep Sabathia out of California.”
Good point. The difference was $61 million.
Just say no to Manny.
I think many of you are overstating the issues with Manny. He’s hardly a clubhouse cancer. He generally keeps to himself – doesn’t open his mouth much to the media, and consistently puts up some monster numbers. He and A-Rod are easily the best hitting right handers of this generation. His second half last year does not paint a picture of a player that is slipping.
He has been the same his whole career. Every year there is some strange event (typically tied to wanting a few days off) that has people scratching their heads, but its worthwhile trade-off.
Keep in mind that apart from the fight with the aging clubhouse attendant, most of the stuff about Manny came from Red Sox management. Their playbook is to use propaganda for most of their stars as they head for the door (Clemens, Nomar, Pedro, and even Lowe).