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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Yankees trim Britton and Christian

Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Dec 12, 2008 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

RHP Chris Britton and OF Justin Christian were non-tendered according to the Yankees. That makes them free agents.

The 40-man roster is now at 38 pending the addition of CC Sabathia and A.J Burnett.

 
 

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207 Responses to “Yankees trim Britton and Christian”

  1. sabernar December 12th, 2008 at 6:41 pm

    They’ll be snatched up. Any way the Yanks can swing a trade? Both of those guys have at least some value.

  2. harwood December 12th, 2008 at 6:43 pm

    No.

  3. Vader December 12th, 2008 at 6:47 pm

    First, Christmas has come early…what a week.

    Second, with the Owner’s pending divorce and the Padre’s seemingly in a salary dump mode, would they move Adrian Gonzalaz and what would it take?

  4. j2 December 12th, 2008 at 6:49 pm

    with the new signings, they need offense so much more than the number four sp or a replacement/platoon cf. wish they’d redirect those funds to a big hitter.

  5. S.A.- CC you soon Mr. Sabathia December 12th, 2008 at 6:49 pm

    Bye bye

  6. Dan December 12th, 2008 at 6:49 pm

    Hopefully Britton gets a chance somewhere. He didn’t deserve what they did to him the last few years.

  7. Jeremy December 12th, 2008 at 6:51 pm

    Maybe Britton should have trimmed himself?

    Talk about a guy who never got a shot. At least we gave up basically nothing (Jaret Wright) for him.

  8. dave December 12th, 2008 at 6:52 pm

    britton would have been good. If they trade away a couple of prospects for some of cameron’s salary — they can still afford adam dunn IMO.

  9. Todd December 12th, 2008 at 6:52 pm

    Is that where they got the term ‘trim the fat’???? (for Britton)

  10. chris December 12th, 2008 at 6:53 pm

    damn I liked Christian…he was a good hustle guy.

  11. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 6:56 pm

    JC was fun to watch, hope he makes the most of whatever opportunity he gets next.

  12. Trevor December 12th, 2008 at 6:57 pm

    Sabathia
    Wang
    Burnett
    Hughes
    Chamberlain

    Mo
    Marte
    Coke
    Bruney
    Robertson
    Melancon
    Aceves

    :D

  13. Rob NY -- 2009 The Road to Redemption December 12th, 2008 at 6:57 pm

    I will remember Christian as the guy who won us a game because he was fast. Fell down at third got up and won the thing. Good job and hope you do well. Britton will finally get a shot somewhere. He’s not a bad option in the 6th inning for somebody.

  14. Michelle B. (X is the new black) December 12th, 2008 at 6:58 pm

    was justin christian the guy who thought he hit a double a few yrs back while playing the SF giants, but the ball was caught and he didnt realize it. So he stood on 2nd base till someone told him he was out, and he didnt believe them so he didnt move…the crowd was hysterical.

  15. S.A.- CC you soon Mr. Sabathia December 12th, 2008 at 6:59 pm

    Where is Wang? Is he back home resting up?

  16. BBFan December 12th, 2008 at 7:01 pm

    I would not be surprised if they sign JC for a minor league contract.

    I do not understand the love for Britton. For a very big guy, he is a soft thrower and hardly hits 89/90 mph.

  17. Phil December 12th, 2008 at 7:02 pm

    I thought we would non-tender a few more.

  18. BBFan December 12th, 2008 at 7:03 pm

    “was justin christian the guy who thought he hit a double a few yrs back while playing the SF giants, but the ball was caught and he didnt realize it. So he stood on 2nd base till someone told him he was out, and he didnt believe them so he didnt move…the crowd was hysterical.”

    Are you sure it was JC with SF.
    It happened with Basak with Yanks a couple of years back.

  19. Christina December 12th, 2008 at 7:04 pm

    my power finally comes back and i have to read we have signed Burnett… argghhh!!! I know he has a sick curveball but has anyone followed him and seen how horrible he is when he doesnt have it. I hope im wrong.

  20. Vader December 12th, 2008 at 7:05 pm

    Marchand with Kenny on ESPN, just said that he thought Texeria could still be on the Yankees.

  21. gunna happen, ya'll December 12th, 2008 at 7:05 pm

    ” Cameron or no Cameron, there’s no dough left for Mark Teixeira or Manny Ramirez. ” It is going to SO FUNNY when Pete has to eat those words with Tex in a NYY uniform on opening day….SO FUNNY !!!

  22. Michelle B. (X is the new black) December 12th, 2008 at 7:06 pm

    chris basak…thats who i was thinking of…thank you

  23. Phil December 12th, 2008 at 7:07 pm

    http://njmg.typepad.com/yankeesblog/ Some insider told Caldera that the Yanks were still in play for Manny and Tex.

  24. Jeff NJ December 12th, 2008 at 7:08 pm

    Good riddance Britton, but you had to love JC’s hustle. I guess he is eminently replacable though. By the way, for those of us wanting an offensive upgrade, I think a full year of Swisher, Nady and Cameron will help generate plenty of runs. Plus getting back Jorge and Matsui. Bounce back years from Cano (and to a small degree A Rod), an the offense will be just fine.

    Send me my invoice for 2009 already Yankees, you had me at CC.

  25. BBFan December 12th, 2008 at 7:08 pm

    “Marchand with Kenny on ESPN, just said that he thought Texeria could still be on the Yankees.”

    So, Marchand is a Boras mole too :)

  26. Mr. Faded Glory December 12th, 2008 at 7:11 pm

    Gardner can do everything Christian can, and more.

    As for Britton – this is asinine. The guy kept producing and was jerked around constantly. I’d rather have him on the roster than Burnett, anyway.

  27. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 7:11 pm

    Chris Britton was just signed to be the spokeman for the Greyhound Bus Lines.

  28. EDUB December 12th, 2008 at 7:12 pm

    Pete is obviously right. There’s little to no chance we get Teixeira at this point. All these rumors flying around are either:

    a) Boras and his moles spreading the word to up his salary
    b) Yankees getting involved to drive up the price for the red sox

    Don’t read too much into these nonsense rumors about Tex

  29. Pokey December 12th, 2008 at 7:12 pm

    You guys do realize that the Yankees will still act like they are looking at those guys just to drive the prices up right?

  30. RayVTNC December 12th, 2008 at 7:12 pm

    That is funny Nick in SF!!

  31. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 7:14 pm

    Oh, John Heyman…

    ” On Friday, the day after the meetings ended, they further upgraded their rotation by agreeing to a five-year contract with A.J. Burnett, and they remain in serious negotiations with Derek Lowe and have Ben Sheets and old Yankee Andy Pettitte in their sights. They are also considering big-time first baseman Mark Teixeira or slugging savant Manny Ramirez, meaning they could wind up signing as many as four of the five big players on this year’s market (Sabathia, Teixeira, Ramirez, Burnett and Lowe are the big five).”

  32. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 7:14 pm

    In other news, Peter Gammons just found out about the AJ signing:

    http://tinyurl.com/5r79vx

  33. JUSTIN December 12th, 2008 at 7:14 pm

    SEE YAA MAYBEE JUSTIN HAD SOME TRADE VALUE BRITTON SHOULD OF DID WHAT BRUNEY DID GET IN SHAPE AND PITCHH …..NOT LOOK BRUNEY HAS A SPOT IN THE PEN

    BY THE WAY I WILL MISS U FARNWORTH LOL

  34. CB December 12th, 2008 at 7:16 pm

    Nick,

    That was far too easy. Sort of disappointed in you.

    Besides, Gammons wears his pain mostly inside of his soul.

    It’s the eyes that betray him more than a curdled mouth.

  35. RayVTNC December 12th, 2008 at 7:16 pm

    Everyone realizes the Yankees are hated for spending money right? They are hated when they don’t as well, right? So spend a few more $$$ and sign Tex from our beloved friends who are trying to copy the Yankee’s uniform colors.

    Pete,
    If the Red Sox weren’t the team involved I’d say Tex wouldn’t be a Yankee. So today at 7:15 PM, I predict Tex signs with the Yankees for 10 years $210M. $15M paid next year. LOL!

  36. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 7:17 pm

    Nick, Edvard Munch? You out did yourself.

  37. EdWhitson December 12th, 2008 at 7:17 pm

    Did Heyman really say that ? Wow, people are right….he is in Boras’s pocket.

  38. Aaron December 12th, 2008 at 7:19 pm

    Britton never was given a real chance with us. But i hope Christian resigns on a minor league deal. Him and Nady made my last trip to the stadium one to remember.

  39. James December 12th, 2008 at 7:20 pm

    Don’t forget to add claggett to the list of relievers, Melancon, Claggett, and Coke, gonna show how damn good the yankees farm system is… #1.

  40. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 7:22 pm

    OUCH. I really hated to see them cut Christian loose. I would have cut Duncan loose before even Britton.

  41. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 7:23 pm

    Hmmm, either CB expects too much or Tom expects too little?

    It’s been a long week. Don’t forget to tip your waitress. Try the veal.

  42. Vader December 12th, 2008 at 7:23 pm

    For the Yankees to truely have a top five farm system, they need to develope some real position players.

    I’d say give it two-three more years to see if the Sally players can make an impact in the Majors or if they are at least knocking on the door.

  43. Vader December 12th, 2008 at 7:26 pm

    CB, or his yellow teeth

  44. PittsburghYankeeFan December 12th, 2008 at 7:26 pm

    Notice how the Yankees are in play for all of Boras clients? How lame–it kind of helps me out, since it exposes all of the Boras trolls out there.

    Sign Pettitte or Sheets, then Mike Cameron for one year with the Brewers taking Igawa and a bit of salary (with Melky, of course). See what you have in Jackson.

    The time to make a big offseason move for hitting is next year, when Matsui and Damon’s contracts are up.

  45. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 7:26 pm

    I have no standards or expectations.

  46. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 7:26 pm

    Nick: I don’t know if you got my other post or not but I finally got those lollipops =D

  47. Aaron December 12th, 2008 at 7:28 pm

    Yea i really dont see how Duncan has more value to us than christian. Id take Ransom over Duncan at first and Take christian over duncan in the outfield if we had to cut loose one it wouldve been Duncan.

  48. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 7:28 pm

    Mr. Faded Glory
    December 12th, 2008 at 7:11 pm
    Gardner can do everything Christian can, and more.

    As for Britton – this is asinine. The guy kept producing and was jerked around constantly. I’d rather have him on the roster than Burnett, anyway.

    ————————————————————

    All he does is run faster. Gardner was faster and a better fielder, but, Christian is the better hitter and can actually hit the walls and gaps. He’s also a very good base runner. In a third less at bats, he had nearly as many steals and doesn’t strike out nearly as much. He would have been the perfect platoon with Gardner had they chosen to go in that direction.

  49. Todd December 12th, 2008 at 7:28 pm

    Gammon’s is moving to Oregon so he can get a doctor assisted suicide……….

  50. DaSaint007 December 12th, 2008 at 7:29 pm

    Britton needed to lose weight. Don’t understand the infatuation with him. He was barely good in Baltimore. JC will be missed. Good hustle in the OF, excellent speed, maybe even faster than Gardner. Like GreenBeret, I would have cut Duncan first. He could always land a job w/the Reds.

  51. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 7:30 pm

    Rebecca: no, I didn’t see the other post. I’m glad you and UPS could finally work things out!

    Sorry for the delay, but I was hoping another shoe would drop and Maryland would forfeit the game (just kidding, I’m just slow).

    Cal vs. Miami in the Emerald Bowl, who wants a piece of that???

  52. CB December 12th, 2008 at 7:31 pm

    I think they’ll try to bring Christian back on a minor league deal.

    I think they like him a lot.

    Don’t know if he’ll want to come back. Probably better for him to go to another organization.

    Having to DFA a guy like Christian is why they didn’t place Horne, Cox or Whelan on the 40 man for the rule 5.

    Better to take the risk on them not getting selected than to risk having to DFA them to make room on the 40 man later as you sign free agents, trades, etc.

  53. jake December 12th, 2008 at 7:32 pm

    Cashman’s been doing a great job. Burnett. Sabathia.Wang. Pettitte. Joba. That could be a flat-out dominating rotation the likes of which we haven’t seen in a long, long time. And you’ve got to give Cash credit that he’s held onto Hughes, Kennedy, A-Jax, etc., just like he’d always planned. So, 2008 was a washout. But now the Yanks have a great LH ace at the top of their rotation (like Santana would have been), but still have great pitching in their farm system.
    And for all the folks who have been bashing the yanks’ farm system. . .which team lost more players than any other in the Rule 5 draft? And what does that say about that team’s farm system?

  54. will fl December 12th, 2008 at 7:33 pm

    id rather have sheets than pettite

  55. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 7:35 pm

    AJ *and* Sheets?

    Cashman might as well just stay in Vegas…

  56. pat December 12th, 2008 at 7:39 pm

    “The Bombers made a four-year, $64 million offer to Derek Lowe, though they may reconsider it now that Burnett is in the fold.

    Pettitte has been offered a one-year deal worth $10 million, while the Yankees are preparing a two-year offer for Sheets in the $26 million range.”

    http://www.nydailynews.com/spo.....rnett.html

  57. Ed - CC and AJ are now Yanks!! Aj better stays healthy!!! December 12th, 2008 at 7:40 pm

    I’m sure Christian will be back, we need another pinch runner just in case Gardner is in the game already.

  58. Brad December 12th, 2008 at 7:41 pm

    Gammon’s is moving to Oregon so he can get a doctor assisted suicide……….

    ………………………………………….

    He’s most likely in his suite at the Green Sardine Can making love to his bottle of Bailey’s.

  59. Erik A. December 12th, 2008 at 7:41 pm

    I hope Christian comes back… as for Britton, good riddance.

  60. E-Man December 12th, 2008 at 7:42 pm

    The signing of AJ pretty much dooms Ian “Tom Glavine” Kennedy. Unless he becomes a reliever or somehow becomes better than Hughes.

  61. pat December 12th, 2008 at 7:45 pm

    Andy needs to come back. If the Yanks sign Sheets instead of Andy, barring injury, the rotation is pretty set until 2011 and I was hoping to see Phil by 2010.

  62. /b/ December 12th, 2008 at 7:46 pm

    LOL at The Scream being Gammons….so true.

  63. j2 December 12th, 2008 at 7:46 pm

    GB7- Yeah, I would’ve thought Duncan was of lesser value than either JC or Britton. What explains that move?

  64. will fl December 12th, 2008 at 7:52 pm

    The yankees may surprise us and leave that 5th hole open. Everyone needs to remember joba has yet to be dominating as a starter. Reliever? Yes, but not as a starter. If he can’t get it done, they may just need another starter.. thus comes in hughes or kennedy.So they very well may have to pickup sheets or pettitte

  65. C-Smoov December 12th, 2008 at 7:54 pm

    Amazing how Britton is chopped liver to some people when he never got into a game cuz Torre and Girardi didn’t have the sense to stop overusing Veras/Edwar/Marte/Robertson/Bruney

    I’ll miss Britton and Christian … best of luck to them

  66. ReleaseTheHounds December 12th, 2008 at 7:56 pm

    assuming the yanks now sign sheets or andy, would you be willing to trade melky and an okay prospect for cameron, OR would you be willing to trade melky and kennedy (or maybe a mlb reliever) for rick ankiel.

    Ankiel (29 years old) can hit in the 3-4-5-6 hole, even in the 2 hole at times. He has the power to hit 30 homers, and can probably do so hitting anywhere from 265-275. He also has a strong arm and apparently is solid defensively.

    He is a free agent after this season and that is why he is being offered. I think his bat potential for our 3 or 5 spot in the order, makes him a better fit for next season.

  67. RayVTNC December 12th, 2008 at 8:00 pm

    I like Ankiel more than Cameron! Yes!

  68. harwood December 12th, 2008 at 8:01 pm

    overusing 5 different relievers? non of which is even the closer. what did they play 5,000 games last year?

  69. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 8:06 pm

    There were rumors of an Ankiel trade back in October. Have they been creeping up again?

  70. Joe from Long Island December 12th, 2008 at 8:06 pm

    Rick Ankiel is a Scott Boras free agent. Which means he should be expected to file for free agency. Which means we would have given up players for a one-year rental.

  71. Ed - CC and AJ are now Yanks!! Aj better stays healthy!!! December 12th, 2008 at 8:10 pm

    LOL, the Mets are trying to be like the Yanks. How? they have their own Robertson in the bullpen. Minya traded Schoeneweis for Connor Robertson, Dave’s older brother.

  72. Joe from Long Island December 12th, 2008 at 8:10 pm

    Hi Rebecca – It’s been a long time. How’s grad school going?

    As a former graduate student, I can say – “You volunteered for this!” (lol)

  73. ReleaseTheHounds December 12th, 2008 at 8:13 pm

    were gunna give up melky and a prospect for 1 yr of cameron…i figure ankiel is the best bet to solve our lineup…meaning he can hit third or fifth and play good defense.

    and with the pitching staff set (assuming we sign andy or sheets) where does kennedy, who has soured and failed with the big league club fit in?

    he may be a solid pitcher for the cards, and we may not have to trade him, i was just saying we would have to trade a solid prospect along with melky for ankiel.

    i think it makes more sense than dealing for cameron.

    ankiel can be our 3rd or 5th hitter in the lineup (or 2nd, 4th, or 6th.)

  74. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 8:14 pm

    Joe: A short comparison study–

    If the Yankees don’t win, those in charge “lose their heads”.

    If, in my area of study, you don’t do as your asked, you lose your head if you’re lucky.

    Otherwise we’ve got hanging, burning, quartering, flaying, strangulation, starvation, suffocation, drowning…

    But mostly I spend my time looking at things connected to medieval Nottingham. It’s a long story. And it’s slowly killing me.

  75. riyankeefan777 December 12th, 2008 at 8:15 pm

    Sabathia
    Wang
    Burnett
    Hughes
    Chamberlain

    Mo
    Marte
    Coke
    Bruney
    Robertson
    Melancon
    Aceves

    hey trevor dont forget sanchez!

  76. EdWhitson December 12th, 2008 at 8:16 pm

    As a starter, Joba had a 2.76 ERA in the A.L. East, 65 innings and 70 plus strikeouts. A short body of work, but a dominating body of work. He could be better than CC or AJ next season, IMO.

  77. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 8:17 pm

    I’m about to start Churchill’s “A History of the English Speaking People — Volume One: The Birth of Britain” — I hope there’s lots of juicy violence and mayhem.

  78. riyankeefan777 December 12th, 2008 at 8:17 pm

    has anyone heard anything about the brewers wanting to move fielder for young pitching? a friend of mine swears by this but i cant find anything about it!

  79. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 8:20 pm

    Nick: That won’t give you the juicy bits, it’s straight up political history without the juice and he mentions as much.

    If you want juicy and a good introduction, go with Robert Lacey, Great Tales from English History.

  80. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 8:20 pm

    I’m reading Shelby Foote’s Civil War.

  81. BBB December 12th, 2008 at 8:20 pm

    “OR would you be willing to trade melky and kennedy (or maybe a mlb reliever) for rick ankiel.”

    I would, but the Cardinals apparently wouldn’t. According to a post on here yesterday, they’re asking for Gardner, Kennedy AND Melancon for Ankiel. Pass…

  82. Steve Balboni December 12th, 2008 at 8:21 pm

    I would much rather Rick Ankiel over Cameron. I think i read where his salary is less than 1 mil (possibly 900K) and the fact he is a one year rental, the players you’d have to give up aren’t top tier because of that issue.

  83. ShamWow December 12th, 2008 at 8:23 pm

    Pic of Yanks opening day team.

  84. ReleaseTheHounds December 12th, 2008 at 8:24 pm

    Haven’t heard anything about that. Melancon would clearly hold up the deal and I wouldnt do that. Then I would just settle for cameron.

    I think I may do gardner and kennedy for ankiel though.

  85. ShamWow December 12th, 2008 at 8:26 pm

    Maybe this works
    http://dondep.tripod.com/Yanks_team.jpg

  86. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 8:27 pm

    Oh well, I have to read it anyway. Hopefully the straight-up political history will be entertaining enough.

  87. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 8:27 pm

    Rebbeca, what’s part of the medieval age is your focus?

  88. Mark Carlson December 12th, 2008 at 8:27 pm

    Don’t forget about Jose Veras

    Trevor December 12th, 2008 at 6:57 pm

    Sabathia
    Wang
    Burnett
    Hughes
    Chamberlain

    Mo
    Marte
    Coke
    Bruney
    Robertson
    Melancon
    Aceves

    :D

  89. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 8:29 pm

    CB
    December 12th, 2008 at 7:31 pm
    I think they’ll try to bring Christian back on a minor league deal.

    I think they like him a lot.

    Don’t know if he’ll want to come back. Probably better for him to go to another organization.

    Having to DFA a guy like Christian is why they didn’t place Horne, Cox or Whelan on the 40 man for the rule 5.

    Better to take the risk on them not getting selected than to risk having to DFA them to make room on the 40 man later as you sign free agents, trades, etc.

    ————————————————————

    All I can think of is that NYY has a deal that includes sending Duncan somewhere. He really has no value above AAA.

  90. Wave Your Hat December 12th, 2008 at 8:30 pm

    If the Yankees are willing to trade for Cameron, as a fan you would be crazy to want Ankiel instead.

    Cameron would be a lot more valuable to the Yanks than Ankiel. Ankiel is not a defensive center fielder. His offense + defense would give you less than Cameron.

    The Yanks are going to sign one more free agent pitcher. So getting Ankiel would not let the Yanks get Teixeira or Manny. The payroll would with Ankiel + Tex or Manny would be around $210MM.

    So, don’t fool yourself. Root for getting Cameron.

  91. Ed - CC is a Yankee! December 12th, 2008 at 8:30 pm

    ShamWow,

    it doesn’t work. Tripod doesn’t allow hotlinking.

  92. BBB December 12th, 2008 at 8:31 pm

    Gardner and Kennedy is a lot for one year of Ankiel, too much IMO. Especially considering how well pitchers do in StL under Dave Duncan, Kennedy has even more value to them than he would to us.

    I might do Kennedy and Veras, but only because of Ankiel’s favorable salary. I would have considered throwing a guy like Christian in but he’s gone now, which I dont get unless another pickup is iminent, you’d have to think he could help some team somewhere.

  93. j2 December 12th, 2008 at 8:32 pm

    Rebecca, Sorry to hear grad school is taking you in an untoward direction. Not a history person, but as a prof., hence former grad. student, and long-time reader of this blog, you have my sympathies.

  94. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 8:33 pm

    Tom: Late medieval and early Tudor England. Basically, Black Death (1347ish) to the death of Henry VIII (1547).

    Henry VIII isn’t considered a medieval monarch, but I got into history because of the Tudors.

    Henry VII, the first Tudor is my favorite…and I also love the Wars of the Roses.

    Fifteenth and early Sixteenth century Florence and Papal history isn’t half bad either. I love me some Borgias and Medicis…

  95. pat December 12th, 2008 at 8:33 pm

    Jays give Matt Clement a minor league deal and spring training invite.

    http://www.nationalpost.com/sp.....id=1069778

  96. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 8:34 pm

    j2: Might I ask what subject?

  97. Bret the Hitman December 12th, 2008 at 8:39 pm

    Pettitte is not yet signed.

    Cameron not yet acquired.

    That’s 20 million dollars hanging in the balance.

    Stick with Hughes and Melky/Gardner and do something more with that money!

    Hughes + Melky/Gardner + another bat is more valuable than Pettitte + Cameron.

  98. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 8:39 pm

    “Basically, Black Death (1347ish) to the death of Henry VIII (1547).”

    Way to spoil the ending for me. I thought Henry VIII made it!

  99. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 8:41 pm

    Tom
    December 12th, 2008 at 8:20 pm
    I’m reading Shelby Foote’s Civil War.

    ————————————————————

    Anything by Shelby Foote is a must read.

  100. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 8:41 pm

    Nick: HAha I even wrote a paper about the death of Henry VIII.

    Cushing’s is a nasty bugger.

  101. j2 December 12th, 2008 at 8:43 pm

    Rebecca, Contemporary stuff that falls interdisciplinarily among Sociology, Religion, and Philosophy; namely, Social and Professional Ethics. I came up through Sociology of Religion, so not without the conventional graduate b.s.

  102. ReleaseTheHounds December 12th, 2008 at 8:43 pm

    we arent getting tex or manny or dunn.

    the reason i brought up ankiel is because the cards are looking to deal him and i thought it is possible to get him and would be an upgrade over a 35 year old cameron who has lost a step in centerfield.

    plus, ankiel can be our number 3 or 5 hitter.

    he also has a plus arm and is apparently solid on defense.

    i think if you are willing to deal melky and a prospect for 1 yr of cameron, you should be willing to do a similiar deal for ankiel.

  103. Joe from Long Island December 12th, 2008 at 8:44 pm

    Rebecca – I studied genetics, specifically bacterial and bacterial virus (bacteriophage) genetics. But, I think this pertains to any grad student – The first semester is the roughest, don’t give up. And if you can find like-minded friends in the field, so much the better. Try to remember why you’re studying in the first place – presumably, your love of the subject matter.

  104. Joe from Long Island December 12th, 2008 at 8:45 pm

    GB7 – Shelby Foote is (was?) an excellent writer of Civil War history. I wish I had more time to read.

  105. ShamWow December 12th, 2008 at 8:49 pm

    Yanks opening day picture.

    http://dondep.home.comcast.net.....s_team.jpg

  106. dave December 12th, 2008 at 8:50 pm

    Everyone who thinks the AJ signing was a brilliant move and cash can do no wrong should check out this post:

    http://www.bronxbanterblog.com/

    Apparently pavano and AJ are more similar than one would originally think. Im not saying AJ will turn out like pavano. Im just saying the five years wasnt a good idea. And remember pavano was coming off 2 consecutive seasons of 200 plus innings. AJ has NEVER had two consecutive 200 innings seasons. Pavano was signed from 29 to 32 and AJ signed from 32 to 36. Pavano put up a stellar era plus of 137 with an era of 3 with the marlins in 222 innings the year before we signed him. AJ has never broken an era plus of 122 in his career and never had lower than a 3.3 era in his career. Pavano made 30 starts twice in his career- AJ made 30 starts twice in his career. Finally AJ has never had less than 79 walks in 200 IP – Pavano never had more than 39 walks in 200 IP and the year before pavano came to the yanks and his best year he had a whip of 1.17 in 200 innings. AJ’s best whip on the marlins in 200 innings was 1.18. Eerily similar! I will root for AJ and I will embrace him and Im not saying that AJ is pavano version 2, Im just saying he is really risky for 5 years – one more year than pavano’s 4.

  107. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 8:51 pm

    Joe from Long Island
    December 12th, 2008 at 8:45 pm
    GB7 – Shelby Foote is (was?) an excellent writer of Civil War history. I wish I had more time to read.

    ———————————————————–

    Are you going to read all 3 Civil War narratives? You’d enjoy Shiloh, too.

    Foote was great in the work and interviews he did with Ken Burns on his Civil War Series on PBS.

  108. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 8:51 pm

    Yeah, I’m on Volume 3 of Foote’s work. He was such a great story teller.

    He’s been criticized for being “pro south”; however, I would argue that his southern sympathies make the story much more enjoyable.

  109. Todd December 12th, 2008 at 8:52 pm

    That picture looks NOTHING like Gammons………..(That screaming guy has no yellow teeth)

  110. trisha - CC and AJ and Sheets - OH MY! December 12th, 2008 at 8:52 pm

    OH MY GAWD!!! AJ IS IN STEINBRENNER’S BOX!!!!!

    *YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!*

    If Cashman is Santa, I would say that Brandon and I are his right-hand elves!!!!!

    I am so psyched I could scream. This is one of the times I hate the silence of posting on the internet because there is no way to emote to/with your brethren when you feel so much excitement!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I started hoping we’d get AJ last season, when I knew he would finally be a free agent!

    Please forgive then if I just say it again –

    *YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!*

    The signing of AJ probably has me as excited as signing CC. I will be happy with Cameron if it happens.

    THANK YOU BRIAN CASHMAN.

    *YAHOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!*

  111. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 8:54 pm

    j2: Do you teach at Fordham or in the city at all? I want to take that course!

    Joe: That’s the advice EVERYONE has given me. I plan to get my Masters at the end of this year and then take a year or two off before thinking about a PhD. I’m more interested in teaching than I am in research.

  112. Wave Your Hat December 12th, 2008 at 8:54 pm

    Bret the Hitman-

    Like you, I thought for a long time that cobbling together a fifth starter out of Hughes, Aceves, Kennedy or someone else cheap, and signing Teixeira, would be the best way to go.

    I was worried that the Yanks offense was not deep enough to survive Posada not being able to catch full time, or Cano or Swisher not bouncing back.

    I also thought that a top fifth starter wasn’t all that valuable, because of the fewer starts he gets and the fact that he wouldn’t be in the playoff rotation.

    However, it’s clear that Cashman has decided that he wants five first class starters.

    Also, you have to consider that if it was your money, and you were already laying out a $160MM commitment and an $85MM commitment, you might be reluctant to commit to another $170MM or whatever it is going to take to sign Teixeira. You have to respect that reluctance.

    The fact is, you cannot say that Pettitte or Lowe or Sheets, plus Cameron, is going to be worse than Hughes or Aceves or Coke, plus Teixeira.

    The Yanks are laying out enormous sums of money.

    I’m beginning to think we should enjoy the ride.

  113. Todd December 12th, 2008 at 8:56 pm

    I like that mental picture of Gammons in Fenway drinking Bailey’s. I imagine he’s listening to Billy Joel’s Captain Jack….

  114. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 8:59 pm

    Tom
    December 12th, 2008 at 8:51 pm
    Yeah, I’m on Volume 3 of Foote’s work. He was such a great story teller.

    He’s been criticized for being “pro south”; however, I would argue that his southern sympathies make the story much more enjoyable.

    ————————————————————

    LMAO. Only damned Yankees thought he was too pro-south. The south thought he was too kind to the Yankees.

    Down here, it’s referred to as “The War Of Northern Agression”. A few of the elementary schools down here will have pictures of the presidents hanging on the walls….right on down the line to Buchanan and then Andrew Johnson. Seems as though one is missing. The real old timers refuse to carry pennies in their pockets and $5 bills in their wallets.

  115. BBB December 12th, 2008 at 9:00 pm

    “OH MY GAWD!!! AJ IS IN STEINBRENNER’S BOX!!!!!”

    lol

    OH MY GOODNESS GRACIOUS!!!

  116. harwood December 12th, 2008 at 9:03 pm

    the hanging socks have signed Billy Traber to a minor league contract

  117. dave December 12th, 2008 at 9:03 pm

    oh and the 16.5 million we guaranteed to Burnett next year makes it extremely unlikely that we will sign another big bat – looks like cameron trade and that may be it. I still think it would be worth it to give up more than melky for cameron to have the brewers take some salary depending on who the prospects are. We have plenty of pitching that is expendable in the minor leagues. Further, i still think we can afford dunn if he costs no more than 12 million next season. I hate the idea of having some strange combination of matsui, cano and nady in the three hole depending on who is doing well at the time. Adding Dunn would make the lineup far deeper and more intimidating. Arod is the only real power threat at this point and cameron and nady in the lineup take off a ton of obp points from the team average last year. We replaced abreu and giambi who are 7th and 10th among active players in obp essentially with swisher, cameron and nady. iF Swisher has a full recovery from last years self destruction, he is well above league avg in obp. Nady and cameron on the other hand are both well below league avg in obp which essentially takes away a lot of what the yanks are known for and thrive at which is taking pitches and wearing pitchers down. Dunn would be a perfect compliment to arod batting left and be a very acceptable replacement to the obp taken away – He was first in walks in the NL last season. He is also a shoe-in for 40 homers – giving us a power threat from the right and left side back to back. I cant imagine why cash wouldnt look into this.

  118. trisha - CC and AJ and Sheets - OH MY! December 12th, 2008 at 9:06 pm

    “OH MY GOODNESS GRACIOUS!!!”

    :D

    BBB, I just got home from doing some shopping so had no idea the signing had happened. I seriously don’t remember the last time I was so psyched about a Yankee signing. And what better than to have a pitcher who has been so jonesing to be a Yank!

    I was given a tremendous birthday present (a day early)

    :)

  119. Phil December 12th, 2008 at 9:06 pm

    dave,

    so the Yanks are gonna open a new stadium and let their O struggle? They’re gonna get another bat.

  120. Joe from Long Island December 12th, 2008 at 9:07 pm

    GB7 – ah, yes, nothing like historical revisionism.

    At one point, I was going to study Civil War history, as part of a larger interest in military history. But that was in a former life.

  121. linkin ballpark December 12th, 2008 at 9:07 pm

    “Down here, it’s referred to as “The War Of Northern Agression”.

    thats why the losers don’t get to name the wars.

  122. Wave Your Hat December 12th, 2008 at 9:08 pm

    Dave,

    Getting Dunn would require trading Matsui.

    That’s not so easy. Matsui has a no trade clause.

    At $13MM, he would not have all that many takers. Remember, at this point Matsui is limited to DH.

    Dunn may be an upgrade over Matsui, but not an enormous one.

    Last, I think Matsui is valuable to the Yanks from an international brand standpoint.

    I just don’t think Dunn is in the cards.

  123. BBB December 12th, 2008 at 9:09 pm

    Speaking of money and payroll… Bob Klapisch (I know, he’s a tool, but he might have good sources) wrote pretty definitively the morning after the Yanks signed CC that they would (I quote as directly as I can from memory) “eclipse $200MM in spending in the next couple of weeks without the slightest hint of guilt or shame”

    …Just curious on the general consensus, do people tend to think that will be the case, that kind of spending spree, or did Cashman mean what he said about staying around $180-190?

  124. j2 December 12th, 2008 at 9:10 pm

    Rebecca, I’m over in Western NY, Rochester area. Do I recall correctly that you spent time at SU? If so, you know the area. Colder and snowier than Manhattan, which is a great place for grad school. (I loved it.)Not that you need more advice, but I also loved teaching before getting in the mix of an M.A./Ph.D., too. You can’t say that you prioritize teaching over research on applications or to your mentor profs., but that’s where the job opportunities are–with teaching, rather than research/publication. Anyone who loves baseball as you do (and did you also used to write that snappy blog?) would do well with undergraduates. Okay, off soapbox, back to baseball. (Am so psyched about our starting rotation. Spring Break in Tampa?!)

  125. wide recievers hate safties! December 12th, 2008 at 9:10 pm

    the #3 hitter is arod

  126. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 9:10 pm

    GB, HA! Next time I’m south of the Mason Dixon I’m paying with nothing but $5 bills.

    To be fair to Foote, he did avoid the “Lost Cause” mythology of the South, and up until July 4 1863 the south was winning.

  127. Joe from Long Island December 12th, 2008 at 9:11 pm

    I think that Cash will try to minimize the budget, but, in the end, he will do what he has to do to put a winner on the field. The rewards for winning it all are too great not to.

  128. trisha - CC and AJ and Sheets - OH MY! December 12th, 2008 at 9:13 pm

    phil and dave – you both might be going in the right direction and maybe the Yankees will sign another bat (in addition to Cameron if he comes.)

    phil, you said the following: “so the Yanks are gonna open a new stadium and let their O struggle? They’re gonna get another bat.” But here is another way to look at it maybe? Is it possible that the Yankees believe that their offense is quite fine as it is, and that with the addition of superior pitching they are not worried? Half playing devil’s advocate and half really believing it, I can tell you that I think they have a formidible offense as it stands, with the addition of Jorge and Matsui back in the lineup.

    Just my thoughts on it.

  129. Bret the Hitman December 12th, 2008 at 9:14 pm

    Wave your Hat,

    I hear you but I wasn’t thinking of coughing up another 200 million for Teixeira. I was thinking more about a shorter term deal for Manny that coincides with our 3 year window for the offense. I think the upgrade over Matsui is enough to warrant the contract because we have only one more year of Matsui. It’s a 3 year upgrade and makes the team so scary it’s difficult to fathom.

    That being said. I know the Yankees don’t want to disturb the egg cart by bringing in someone so unpredictable as Manny Ramirez in the clubhouse and with the fans/media. The last thing we want to do is scare off CC Sabathia or other free agents that play now and will be asked to sign when our vets retire.

    There must be a split over Manny in the Yankees organization I would imagine.

    But it could be fun to sit back, relax and enjoy the ride with Manny.

  130. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 9:14 pm

    BBB- I think Kaplish ment 200 million spent this winter on contracts to CC and AJ.

  131. dave December 12th, 2008 at 9:14 pm

    I dont see a thing about the yanks and sheets right now. I dunno exactly whats going on with pettitte but it seems we are closer to re-signing him than doing anything further with sheets. I would still sign sheets over pettitte if it costs about 3 million more or so. Despite having two big injury risks in the rotation, you have two dominant starters when healthy and sheets has been an ace for most of his career. Plus, he may have incentive to come here now that we are signing CC and in the process of signing cameron. I heard 26 mil for 2 years is in the table for sheets and not much else in terms of offers for him. That would be a solid play for the yanks costing only 3 mil more than pettitte and one extra year for someone that has 10 times the talent and is only 30. He also pitched to the tune of 9 and 2 before the all star break last year and had an era below 3. He started the all star game and before the break was probably the best pitcher in the NL for the majority of the season. We risked giving burnett five years so why not risk giving sheets 2? Seems to me like five years of burnett is far more of a gamble than 2 years of sheets. Esp since sheets is 2 years younger.

  132. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 9:18 pm

    GEORGE: I’d love to be a Civil War buff. What do you have to do to be a buff?

    JERRY: Well sleeping less than 18 hours a day would be a start.

  133. Wave Your Hat December 12th, 2008 at 9:19 pm

    “and up until July 4 1863 the south was winning.”

    Well, actually, at that point most of Tennessee was gone, the largest Confederate port at New Orleans had fallen, the main Confederate rail line west had long been severed at Corinth, the trans-Mississippi states had effectively been severed from the eastern Confederate states, a Confederate army of 28,000 was hopelessly bottled up and about to surrender at Vicksburg, and the Tullahoma campaign was kicking off which would result in the fall of Chattanooga.

    Other than that, the South was doing fine.

  134. HITMAN in the hof December 12th, 2008 at 9:20 pm

    If the Yanks dont sign Tex or Manny, I think they will somehow make a push at Holliday or Crawford in the future

  135. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 9:21 pm

    j2: What to you mean “used to write”? :-P I still write it!

    And yeah, I just finished at Syracuse last May.

    My interest really is teaching, as opposed to the research…I think I’d be happier teaching at a small school..pity none of them are hiring at the moment.

  136. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 9:21 pm

    Nick, the first step is growing old time facial hair.

  137. Wave Your Hat December 12th, 2008 at 9:22 pm

    Bret the Hitman-

    I can’t help it, I know I shouldn’t, but I like Manny too. I’d love to see him coming to the plate for us. But I have to be realistic, I just don’t think it’s going to happen.

  138. BBB December 12th, 2008 at 9:23 pm

    Tom: That makes some sense that he might have been referring just to CC & AJ’s contracts rather than total payroll, I hadn’t even thought of that. But, wouldn’t it kind of be stating the obvious? I mean everyone knew the Yanks had 3 spots to fill and that if they were gonna sign 3 guys their total salaries would almost definitely be over $200MM.

    It just seems like it’d be more newsworthy if he meant total 2009 payroll, since that would be a direct contradiction to something Cash said before. But, never put stating the obvious past Klapisch!

  139. dave December 12th, 2008 at 9:26 pm

    Wave your hat,

    Dunn is only 29 years old. He is not limited to DH duties. He can play first base or left field. Swisher is so cheap he can come off the bench or platoon with nady. Swisher can also be a defensive replacement at first or pinch hit. Swisher will also back up dunn, the entire outfield and the dh spot in the event of an injury (VERY LIKELY) giving us a superb bat off the bench. I know dunn is a downgrade on the field but swisher can replace him by the seventh inning most days. Also, dunn can play left, swisher can move to first and damon can dh in the event of an injury to matsui (very likely.) it gives us a deeper bench, a deeper lineup and a formidable bat in the fourth spot. It gives us far more versatility as well. Dunn would also greatly improve the obp of the team which goes way down with the trade of cameron and nady.

    Trisha,

    This is the problem – exactly what you just said. Except we cant bank on an injury free season from matsui and posada while relying on a comeback season from both cano and swisher. I believe the comebacks are likely but injury free for both of them? There is no way this team goes the whole year without an injury. And we have absolutely no bench at the moment. Acquiring Dunn and making swisher the backup for the most injury prone players (other than posada) gives us a strength we usually lack. An injury occurs and we are fine because swisher is capable of being a great hitter. Further, if nady struggles, swisher can take right field. If damon struggles in left, dunn can move to left and swisher can take first with damon dhing. It gives us waaay more options and the problem with the lineup as it stands is one or two major injuries and the lineup looks incredibly weak. Matsui bats in the four hole and he gets injured and we have 3 or 4 guys in the lineup who have career obps under 350. As long as everyone stays healthy – YES the lineup looks ok other than the fact that there is no solid third hitter in the lineup but one or two injuries or cano and swisher continue to regress and the lineup will start looking mighty weak.

  140. BBB December 12th, 2008 at 9:28 pm

    i’d actually prefer Dunn over Manny, but unfortunately I agree with whoever wrote before that it aint happening without trading Matsui, or Damon or Nady. I’ve gone over and over it in my head and I just don’t see a way to fit those 3 guys plus Dunn all into the lineup on a regular basis, especially if Cameron is now in the mix.

    It’s a shame, whoever ends up with Dunn is lucky as hell and is going to be getting a bargain imo. But I’m not willing to dump consistent and known commodities like Matsui and Damon.

    I still think this team needs 1 more bat though. I’ll mention Nick Johnson again….anyone have any ideas on what it would take to get him? Couldnt be much.

  141. trisha - CC and AJ and Sheets - OH MY! December 12th, 2008 at 9:29 pm

    GO HORNETS!

  142. Ed - CC is a Yankee! December 12th, 2008 at 9:29 pm

    “Swisher is so cheap he can come off the bench or platoon with nady.”

    the Yanks didn’t acquired Swisher to sit or have him platoon with someone.

  143. Wave Your Hat December 12th, 2008 at 9:29 pm

    Dave,

    Dunn in LF in Yankee Stadium? Please, be serious.

    Dunn is not a defensive first baseman. The Yanks have been clear that is the way they want to go, so I don’t see him there either.

    For the Yanks and Dunn, it’s DH or nowhere.

  144. dave December 12th, 2008 at 9:30 pm

    And swisher can play first while dunn dhes the days that wang pitches – forgot to mention that. Everyone else is a strikeout pitcher anyway

  145. Ed - CC is a Yankee! December 12th, 2008 at 9:31 pm

    “But I’m not willing to dump consistent and known commodities like Matsui and Damon. ”

    it’s a shame where some people fail to realize that. good point.

  146. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 9:32 pm

    Joe from Long Island
    December 12th, 2008 at 9:07 pm
    GB7 – ah, yes, nothing like historical revisionism.

    At one point, I was going to study Civil War history, as part of a larger interest in military history. But that was in a former life.

    ————————————————————

    While I was stationed at Ft Bragg, NC. I’d spend my weekends and holidays going to every Civil War site that I could locate. I ended up with ten VHS tapes full and more than 300 rools of film taken. Absolutely awe inspiring at some of them. Shiloh…Manassas, Yellow Tavern, Wilderness, Gettysburg, but, Antietam was unbelievable. Antietam was like being in a church with no roof.

  147. BBB December 12th, 2008 at 9:32 pm

    “I still think this team needs 1 more bat though.”

    *Preferably, a high OBP LH bat who could hit 3rd. Dunn and Johnson both fit those qualifications better than most, but it would be a hell of a juggling act to get Dunn in the lineup every day. Due to difference in salary, if Nick sat sometimes it wouldn’t be as big an issue. Also, Nick obviously doesnt strike out anywhere close to as much as Dunn.

    Nick could play 1st when Swisher is playing the OF, and even give Matsui some days off from DHing. Having a guy like him hitting 3rd to stretch the lineup and run up the pitch counts of guys like Halladay or Beckett could be a very valuable weapon.

  148. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 9:33 pm

    300 ****rolls*** of film

  149. trisha - CC and AJ and Sheets - OH MY! December 12th, 2008 at 9:33 pm

    “The Yankees and Brewers continue to talk about a Mike Cameron for Melky Cabrera deal of center fielders. Money and *agreeing on a second player going from the Yankees* to the Brewers is the hangup to a trade that many expect to get done.”

    Hmmm. Anyone else hear anything about this second player thing?

  150. Laura - With this pitching staff, how can we lose? December 12th, 2008 at 9:33 pm

    “But I’m not willing to dump consistent and known commodities like Matsui and Damon. ”

    Here’s hoping the Yankees feel the same way.

  151. j2 December 12th, 2008 at 9:34 pm

    Rebecca,

    My apologies. You are the woman who writes that snappy fun Purist Blog! You could publish if you wanted to, no doubt. (I’m thinking Barbara Tuchman of the Middle Ages for contemporary American readers.) No one is hiring now with the down economy. (I doubt Fordham, even.) Get the Ph.D. if you are still motivated by the subject matter and you will be golden for a college post.

  152. Laura - With this pitching staff, how can we lose? December 12th, 2008 at 9:34 pm

    “Hmmm. Anyone else hear anything about this second player thing?”

    Cash is probably trying to get them to take Igawa and MIL wants no part of that bum.

  153. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 9:35 pm

    One of the big problems with the 2008 offense was the lack of Matsuifor most of the season. So now we dump Matsui (after losing the left-handed bats of Giambi and Abreu) to make room for another bat? I don’t think so.

  154. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 9:36 pm

    Anyone catching the Devils Rangers game?

    I didn’t realize you could play baseball on ice…judging by the score, anyway, that’s what they’re doing…

  155. Wave Your Hat December 12th, 2008 at 9:36 pm

    “Antietam was like being in a church with no roof.”

    You are so right about that. The fields are still being farmed, nothings changed. It’s like the battle was yesterday.

    I was at a re-enactment there with my six year old son when an artillery caisson pulled by four horses came careening down the road and into the field right beside us. It was awe-inspiring, and my son remembers it to this day.

  156. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 9:37 pm

    j2: Funny you should mention Tuchman, I just finished reading A Distant Mirror and I thought it was marvelous.

    Fordham’s just announced a hiring freeze, three years I think.

  157. Ed - CC is a Yankee! December 12th, 2008 at 9:37 pm

    Scott Proctor has now **left** the Dodgers. they nontendered him. at least now, Proctor can’t be abused by Torre anymore.

  158. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 9:38 pm

    You all civil war buffs need to get yourselves to Gettysburg…

  159. dave December 12th, 2008 at 9:38 pm

    dUNN has a 984 fielding percentage at first base. And wang is the only pitcher who needs an excellent infield defense and swisher can play first those days. if the yanks signed Lowe and pettitte with wang already there – i agree we need a better first baseman but CC, AJ and Joba are strikeout machines and dont have a very high gb to fb ratio. I dont know dunn’s defensive metrics and i am sure swisher is much better but he is 29 – he cant be so bad he has to be relegated to dh duties already. This is not manny ramirez we are talking about. it is not essential to trade matsui to get dunn. And if it is we should do it. Dunn is far less of an injury risk and will hit 40 homers without a problem and probably more in yankee stadium – matsui is a constant injury risk and wont even come close to 40. i think dunn would be fine at first with a defensive substitution in the seventh and swisher starting when wang pitches.

  160. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 9:39 pm

    ooooh, “The Guns of August” was so great, one of these days I’m going to re-read it.

  161. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 9:39 pm

    Tom
    December 12th, 2008 at 9:10 pm
    GB, HA! Next time I’m south of the Mason Dixon I’m paying with nothing but $5 bills.

    To be fair to Foote, he did avoid the “Lost Cause” mythology of the South, and up until July 4 1863 the south was winning.

    ————————————————————

    You start paying with $5 bills and they’ll sic them dogs on you. If you want to read some great humor from the south, read Lewis Grizzard. Absolutely hilarious. He was a big Elvis and Georgia Bulldogs fan.

  162. ANSKY December 12th, 2008 at 9:40 pm

    Copied & amended from the last thread:

    Actually, E-Man, I think Pete’s point (last thread) was Joba is so good that putting him in the pen is ridiculous too.

    OK … you’re right. Let’s put CC, Burnett AND Joba in the bullpen. Bring ‘em all in for the 5th, 6th & 7th innings, every day, before Melancon comes in to set up Mo for the close.

    And Coke, Hughes, Kennedy, Aceves & Ponson can start. Better yet, let’s trade for Papelbon, Putz & K-Rod so we can convert them to starters. After all Hughes & Kennedy can’t pitch and Ponson would be drunk on his third chance with the team. Then convert Jeter to a CF, Posada to a 1B, move A-Rod to SS, trade Cano & Damon for Ken Griffey Jr in LF, sign Manny to DH & convert Matsui to a bullpen catcher. Don’t worry if the outfield’s a little weak … Swisher can be converted from a good 1B & bad OF to a bad 1B & good OF. And if Gardner can’t make the next step, Bernie could come to the Boss’s luxury suite (Clemens-style) to announce he’s been given a proactive mid-season contract to make a comeback and save the day.

    Sorry E-Man … that rant was actually directed at some members of the general audience and not you. Still, maybe another way to put it would be like this: Joba in the ‘pen is a little like hunting three sheep per game with an AK-47 and a 120-bullet (120-pitch) clip. Sure it’s fun, but is it really the best use of your weapon and all that ammunition?

  163. trisha - CC and AJ and Sheets - OH MY! December 12th, 2008 at 9:41 pm

    “at least now, Proctor can’t be abused by Torre anymore.”

    Real good point. It probably also shows how little sway Torre has in LA since Proctor has been his pet forever and we know how he goes with his “veterans” – whether they stink or not.

  164. Ed - CC is a Yankee! December 12th, 2008 at 9:42 pm

    “matsui is a constant injury risk”

    that’s a fib. Matsui only went on the DL 2 times in his career during his tenure with the Yanks for the past 5 years. Both times were major injuried. the first time was a freak accident when making a diving catch, and the 2nd time was his knees.

    Get. Your. Facts. Straight!

  165. DanKirby December 12th, 2008 at 9:42 pm

    “Hmmm. Anyone else hear anything about this second player thing?”

    It was reported here yesterday. The Brewers want another prospect in exchange for the cash to pay off part of Cameron’s contract.

  166. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 9:43 pm

    Proctor got a restraining order, so they had to let him go.

  167. The Hitman (HOFamer) December 12th, 2008 at 9:44 pm

    Yanks need some pop like this kid Aaron Bouchey who hit .625 for his high school a few years back and nows @ a JUCO. good luck to him

  168. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 9:44 pm

    Is there any player in professional or amateur sports who isn’t a constant injury risk?

  169. dave December 12th, 2008 at 9:45 pm

    Im not advocating dumping anyone – sign dunn to play first. Let swisher play first when need be. Swisher is a solid bat off the bench if anyone gets injured and otherwise, can platoon with nady. Dunn is not a horrible first baseman and considerably better than giambi. One injury and gardner, ransom or molina is in a lineup that looks weak to begin with. i THINK people forget that we have significant injuries every year and NEED to have a quality guy off the bench – swisher has enough versatility to fit the bill.

  170. Ed - CC is a Yankee! December 12th, 2008 at 9:47 pm

    Trisha,

    the Dodgers’ rookie pitcher, Cory Wade has already begun the transaction of being abused by Torre. whenever I tune in the Dodger’s game, Torre always brought him in. I feel bad for him. :(

  171. dave December 12th, 2008 at 9:47 pm

    With matsui’s knees and age, i think it is safe to say he is an injury risk. As is posada. We desperately need a quality bat off the bench.

  172. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 9:47 pm

    Wave Your Hat
    December 12th, 2008 at 9:36 pm
    “Antietam was like being in a church with no roof.”

    You are so right about that. The fields are still being farmed, nothings changed. It’s like the battle was yesterday.

    I was at a re-enactment there with my six year old son when an artillery caisson pulled by four horses came careening down the road and into the field right beside us. It was awe-inspiring, and my son remembers it to this day.

    ————————————————————

    Burnside’s Bridge, where it crosses over Antietam Creek had to have been the bluest water for a stream that I have ever seen. The cemetary, up by the park ranger’s shed…brought tears to your eyes…when you stop and think that it was only a small portion of the 4000 soldiers that died that day.

  173. Miggs December 12th, 2008 at 9:47 pm

    I think Matsui is poised for a big year. Whenever he’s healthy he hits and produces. He’s a smart player and I remmeber numerous clutch hits he’s gotten over the years. Having him in the lineup is huge.

    I think a lot of people forget how good he is and just want to dump him on the scrap heap because he’s been hurt. The bottom line is he’s a character guy, he alwaya gives 100%, and he can flat out hit. He’s .300/30/110 guaranteed if healthy. I know its a big if.

    But the potential upside to keeping him is way greater than the compensation we could get in a trade. And he’s only got one more year at 13 million.

    Besides the 2 knee injuries he’s been relatively healthy for the 8 years he’s been here. I know he broke his wrist, but that was a freak injury.

    This is a guy who apologized to the fans and the team when he hurt his wrist. Who does that? He’s the type of player you want, not one to usher out the door.

  174. BBB December 12th, 2008 at 9:50 pm

    I remember hearing Kay say not so long ago that Matsui and Damon led the team in getting the runner in from 3rd with less than 2 outs.

    As beastly as Dunn can be, imagine asking him to pick up the slack in that department? Not very likely.

    Damon and Matsui (the latter in particular) are really underrated hitters, imo. Both bring a lot to the table and Damon is a damn good left fielder too.

    It really is a crying shame cause I would love to see Dunn on this team. But I just don’t see how it could be done (no pun) without throwing away something that means more to this team than we may realize.

  175. Nick in SF December 12th, 2008 at 9:50 pm

    I’m with you, Miggs. I want Matsui in the lineup as much as possible.

  176. dave December 12th, 2008 at 9:50 pm

    Consider it this way – compare our current lineup with the redsox lineup if they get teixera. It is incomparable. Getting Dunn solves the problem with the fourth blackhole in the lineup and drastically improves the bench. Probably our two biggest problems after we sign pettitte or sheets.

  177. Brian (Red Sox Fan) December 12th, 2008 at 9:50 pm

    GB7 – I spent 1 1/2 years at Camp Lejeuene, but never visited any Civil War sites. Later, as a civilian, I did get to Gettysburg (3 times), Bull Run, Fredericksburg and Antietam. I totally agree with you on Antietam — what a gorgeous setting —- hard to believe how much carnage took place there (in one day).

    P.S. I’m from RI, and RI’s own General Burnside managed to solidify his reputation as an incompetent at Antietam ….. kept marching his people across a narrow bridge (under sniper fire) when thay could have waded through the stream en masse.

    But he did let them have candy and ice cream in the locker room …..

  178. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 9:50 pm

    Rebecca–Optimist Prime–Staying to write the story
    December 12th, 2008 at 9:38 pm
    You all civil war buffs need to get yourselves to Gettysburg…

    ———————————————————–

    I’ve been there 4 times, and spend at least three days there each time. There is just so much to see, there. Unreal.

  179. Miggs December 12th, 2008 at 9:52 pm

    Laura hopefully the 2nd player is a bullpen guy. I doubt they’ll take Igawa.

    If the Brewers will eat some of Cameron’s salary, I think including Veras or Edwar is not out of the question.

    Deal from your depth. We have a ton of bullpen arms. I’d rather give up one of those guys than a minor league starter, even if he doesn’t project to be a top end guy.

    Just my 2 cents. Your thought?

  180. Jeff NJ December 12th, 2008 at 9:52 pm

    Dan I’m concerned about the possible 2nd player to go with Melky. Imagine it was Igawa or Duncan? Might be someone as high as Horne or Cox. Will be interesting.

  181. Donnie Baseball 23 December 12th, 2008 at 9:52 pm

    Cash is giving Girardi every chance to win and if he doesnt win say bye-bye to him, I doubt Hank/Hal will wait or be calm with Girardi. Getting these players this off-season does put alot of pressure on Girardi for the upcoming year.

  182. Ed - CC is a Yankee! December 12th, 2008 at 9:52 pm

    Miggs,

    I’m with you too..Matsui is definitely in for a big year. He will be a newly transformed Godzilla.

  183. BBB December 12th, 2008 at 9:52 pm

    sorry if this has been mentioned and I missed it, but MLBTR reports the saux signed Billy Traber to a minor league deal. LOL!!!

  184. dave December 12th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

    I really dont understand why you guys think it is nessecary to trade matsui to get dunn. It is not. Dunn can play first base and is decent at it. He is no giambi on the field but he is giambi at bat if giambi was healthy season round. Swisher can fulfill so many roles it is a waste to put him at first every day. Swisher could get playing time every single day whether we sign dunn or not. He instantly and dramatically improves the bench. Matsui can still dh almost every day if he stays healthy. Damon can still play left.

  185. Ed - CC is a Yankee! December 12th, 2008 at 9:54 pm

    Johnny Gomes also have been nontendered.

    I guess the Rays doesn’t need him to start a fight anymore.

  186. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 9:54 pm

    Brian (Red Sox Fan)
    December 12th, 2008 at 9:50 pm
    GB7 – I spent 1 1/2 years at Camp Lejeuene, but never visited any Civil War sites. Later, as a civilian, I did get to Gettysburg (3 times), Bull Run, Fredericksburg and Antietam. I totally agree with you on Antietam—- what a gorgeous setting ——hard to believe how much carnage took place there (in one day).

    P.S. I’m from RI, and RI’s own General Burnside managed to solidify his reputation as an incompetent at Antietam ….. kept marching his people across a narrow bridge (under sniper fire) when thay could have waded through the stream en masse.

    But he did let them have candy and ice cream in the locker room …

    ————————————————————

    It was pretty close as to who was the most incompetent Union Generl, but, Burnside and McClellan were tied for first. Union forces out numbered then 2-1 and could have come close to ending it all there, but, it just lead to the worst butchery in US history for one day.

  187. ANSKY December 12th, 2008 at 9:55 pm

    Ed (same Ed as Ed 209 for last month?)

    Matsui’s wrist, as everyone knows, was a freak thing that happened on a hustle play. You give a guy a mulligan for an injury like that.

    His knees, as best I can recall, were already in not-so-good shape at the same time. He tried to rehab them in order to avoid getting them scoped, but he eventually had to have one of them done. He probably could have & should have had them both done at the same time rather than trying the rehab route on the second one. I kind of see it as one instance of bad knees whose repair unfortunately got stretched out over time. Maybe they could have been done & rehabbed while he rehabbed his wrist. At least that’s what I understood … could be wrong on that end of the timing.

    He won’t be able to beat Brett Gardner in a sprint but he’ll be able to get around better than people expect. We’ll have to see his times from base to base are in spring training. He should be able to beat Posada in a sprint but how much more giddyup he’ll than that have remains to be seen.

  188. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 9:55 pm

    “Is there any player in professional or amateur sports who isn’t a constant injury risk?”

    stephon marbury

  189. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 9:57 pm

    I’m much more of a Revolutionary War person myself…

  190. BBB December 12th, 2008 at 9:58 pm

    Isn’t the 2nd player in the Cameron deal contingent upon how much money the Yanks want Milwaukee to throw in? My impression was that Milwaukee was willing to do Melky for Cam straight up, but NYY wanted cash as well so offered an additional player. I think Cash is trying to get MIL to take on Igawa and his salary as well, then the financial commitment becomes less for us subtracting the money owed Kei from Cameron’s salary.

    But I bet if it came down to either surrendering a prospect Cash sees as part of our future or paying more money, Cash would easily choose to pay more.

  191. Ed - CC is a Yankee! December 12th, 2008 at 9:59 pm

    ANKSY –

    Yep its me. :D I was at that game vs Boston when Matsui made that freak dive. I felt his plain. ouch,,,

    update >>>>>>>>>>

  192. Brian (Red Sox Fan) December 12th, 2008 at 9:59 pm

    GB – but McClellan did look good in his uniform (later ran for President).
    I don’t feel like talking baseball today – it’s going badly for The Nation right now.

  193. BBB December 12th, 2008 at 10:00 pm

    I’d be happy if the 2nd player was Veras and Milwaukee paid a chunk of Cameron’s salary as a result. I’m still convinced Veras is going to start sucking hard any time now, and would LOVE to send him packing before it happened. Brewers need RP’s too, so it’s not like they’d be in a position to turn that down.

  194. Rebecca--Optimist Prime--Staying to write the story December 12th, 2008 at 10:01 pm

    GB: When I went I stayed with a friend who lives about an hour away. She lives in a house that dates from that time and one of the officers stayed there during the war.

    PRetty cool, no?

  195. Ty December 12th, 2008 at 10:01 pm

    There is a reason that despite not being offered arb, Dunn has gotten virtually zero interest from teams. Phils signed a 36 yo Ibanez and gave up a pick. Cubs are looking at Abreu and even at the malcontent Bradley. Isn’t strange that these teams who had the pleasure of watching Dunn play all the time haven’t given him the time of day? Perhaps their respective organizations don’t employ smart individuals who can decipher things like OBP/OPS. More likely, they have come to the conclusion that despite his 40hr potential and .400OBP he really brings very little to the table despite costing just money.

  196. Miggs December 12th, 2008 at 10:02 pm

    Dave the problem is that you can’t structure your team or make moves just because another team does something.

    You think the Sox are scrambling to get Sheets, Lowe, or other starters because we signed Burnett and CC? No way.

    You go in with a gameplan and you try to stick to it. IMO the gameplan was simple. Spend whatever it takes to upgrade the rotation. The bullpen is fine after signing Marte. Then bank on the fact that your offense, which was a juggernaut in 2007, comes back to normal production (for their talent). They upgrade the defense. They get younger.

    Think about it. A Rod had a down year (for him). Posada out for the year. Matsui injured for a large portion of the season. Cano was painful to watch at times. These 4 guys should have much better years than last year. Also, Jeter won’t be playing half the year with a broken wrist. They added Swisher, that was good. Their defense is much improved.

    They don’t need Dunn. They don’t need Burrell. Sure they could use Manny or Tex but they aren’t getting either one.

    Bottom line is we won almost 90 games last year with all the crap that happened. I didn’t even mention the injuries to 60% of the starting rotation.

    We are much improved with just the CC. AJ, and Swisher acquisitions. A few more minor moves and I think its going to be a great 2009.

  197. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 10:02 pm

    dave
    December 12th, 2008 at 9:38 pm
    dUNN has a 984 fielding percentage at first base. And wang is the only pitcher who needs an excellent infield defense and swisher can play first those days. if the yanks signed Lowe and pettitte with wang already there – i agree we need a better first baseman but CC, AJ and Joba are strikeout machines and dont have a very high gb to fb ratio. I dont know dunn’s defensive metrics and i am sure swisher is much better but he is 29 – he cant be so bad he has to be relegated to dh duties already. This is not manny ramirez we are talking about. it is not essential to trade matsui to get dunn. And if it is we should do it. Dunn is far less of an injury risk and will hit 40 homers without a problem and probably more in yankee stadium – matsui is a constant injury risk and wont even come close to 40. i think dunn would be fine at first with a defensive substitution in the seventh and swisher starting when wang pitches.

    ————————————————————

    Please don’t tell me that you honestly think that a .984 Fielding Percentage for a first baseman is good? That’s beyond butchery.

  198. ANSKY December 12th, 2008 at 10:02 pm

    Matsui will probably do a lot better than people expect he will.

    MVP? No.
    All-star? Maybe not.
    Comeback player of the year? Maybe a chance.
    World Series champ? Hope so.

  199. GreenBeret7 December 12th, 2008 at 10:06 pm

    Rebecca–Optimist Prime–Staying to write the story
    December 12th, 2008 at 10:01 pm
    GB: When I went I stayed with a friend who lives about an hour away. She lives in a house that dates from that time and one of the officers stayed there during the war.

    PRetty cool, no?

    ————————————————————

    Gettysburg is like a living museum. The monuments start about 10 miles from town….out in the fields, in yards….and this is where people are living…unreal. I love that stuff.

  200. ANSKY December 12th, 2008 at 10:07 pm

    Ed (may I call you 209?)

    ” Johnny Gomes also have been nontendered. I guess the Rays doesn’t need him to start a fight anymore. ”

    Maybe the Sox sign him, and put him in the on-deck circle when Youkilis faces Joba.

    Would have been a riot to see Gomes charge Farnsworth last spring but I guess we’ll never see that now, will we?

  201. Tom December 12th, 2008 at 10:10 pm

    GB, Looking out over that field that Pickett’s men charged over even gives a Yankee like me the chills.

    Also, being a Jersey boy, we take pride in the fact that we voted for George Mcclellan in 1864.

  202. Laura - With this pitching staff, how can we lose? December 12th, 2008 at 10:14 pm

    “If the Brewers will eat some of Cameron’s salary, I think including Veras or Edwar is not out of the question.”

    I’m not expecting MIL to take Igawa, but it was on my Christmas wish list. :)

    If I had to pick, I’d give them Edwar. Both of them started to stink towards the end of the season, but Veras stunk a little less. When Edwar goes bad, he *REALLY* goes bad. He’s too susceptible to the long ball.

  203. Laura - With this pitching staff, how can we lose? December 12th, 2008 at 10:17 pm

    A friend of mine (a lowly White Sox fan) had heard that the MIL deal was stalling and he asked me why. I told him that the Yankees wanted MIL to eat some of Cameron’s salary. He burst out laughing. He said “How can you ask MIL to eat salary after you just signed a guy for $160mil? You Yankees have got a lot of nerve.”

    It was at this point that I took out my gun and shot him.

    Well, not really, but the evil part of me was thinking about it. :P

  204. Wave Your Hat December 12th, 2008 at 10:19 pm

    “It was pretty close as to who was the most incompetent Union Generl, but, Burnside and McClellan were tied for first. Union forces out numbered then 2-1 and could have come close to ending it all there, but, it just lead to the worst butchery in US history for one day.”

    My vote has to go to “Fighting” Joe Hooker. For sheer incompetence, nothing can beat his performance at Chancellorsville.

  205. Tarheelyank December 12th, 2008 at 10:22 pm

    Wigginton non-tendered

  206. hobbie December 12th, 2008 at 10:45 pm

    we can’t have CC and Fielder on the Yankees. I can just see them colliding on a close play at first base or becoming trapped in each others gravitational field forming a miniature black hole.

  207. Taino December 16th, 2008 at 9:39 am

    We really need a Manny in our team to shake things up! He protects Alex, And when 2 Latinos get together on a team They tend to make things happen and really Compete with one another. Ex: Manny and Ortiz, Cano and Melky, Posada and Bernie, Abreu and Gonzalez, The history is pretty good! Think on that!


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