Damon to be honored at Munson Dinner
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Dec 15, 2008 
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This release arrived this afternoon:
Star New York outfielders from yesterday and today, great catches and great plays will be the focal point of the award recipients cited at the 29th Annual Thurman Munson Awards Dinner set for Tuesday night, February 3, at the Grand Hyatt in New York City.
New York Mets Gold Glove center fielder Carlos Beltran, New York Yankees standout Johnny Damon, former Mets right fielder Ron Swoboda, Giants Super Bowl hero David Tyree, former Knicks All Star guard Allan Houston and Olympic gold medalist Dara Torres will all receive the Thurman Awards from the AHRC-NYC Foundation, it was announced today.
Diana Munson, Thurman’s widow, has been involved in the benefit since its inception, raising nearly $9 million to assist children and adults who have intellectual and developmental disabilities. Len Berman of NBC Sports will once again serve as the master of ceremonies. For tickets and information on the Munson Awards Dinner contact (212) 249-6188. The honorees will be cited for their accomplishments on the field of play and philanthropic efforts.
The AHRC New York City Foundation is a not-for-profit organization that supports programs enabling children and adults with intellectual and developmental disabilities to lead richer, more productive lives, including programs of AHRC New York City. AHRC New York City is one of the largest organizations of its kind, serving 11,000 children and adults who have intellectual and developmental disabilities, including autism, cerebral palsy, traumatic brain injuries and other disabilities.
Dont have a comment but just surprised to be in the top 5 to post. Yes!!
Someone ask Diana if there was great chemistry in the clubhouse when her husband played.
My nephew goes to an AHRC school. Great organization. Congrats to Damon and the other honorees.
Can I be a guest blogger? My topic will be how the Yankees should sign both Texeira and Manny.
Randy l is correct that Livan protected all those young Minnesota pitchers. He was their designated food taster.
AHRC does great work. Congrats to Damon, Beltran, Swoboda, et al.
Damon has been doing a lot of good things lately.
Red Sox supposedly offered 8 years/200M. Report not confirmed yet but it is posted on MLBtraderumors.
Johnny Do Good, Johnny Be Good.
Jennifer,
From the last thread, if Andy accepted a 3/$36M offer I don’t think that would taint his legacy. He should by all means take it. If he accepted a 1 year deal with another team that might taint his legacy, but it depends on the difference in the money. If he can get $16M, I wouldn’t begrudge him. Not many people would leave $6M on the table.
Andy said he wanted to come back and play for the Yankees for a year. What he didn’t say was, “I want to come back and play for the Yankees for $6M less”.
He’s getting Torred and I won’t hold it against him if he chooses not to come back.
Tim Clougher,
Brandon’s harsh on Andy, because he’s not…you know…
Here’s the link:
http://fromthedugout.freedombl.....lion/7632/
Why did Boston offer $200 million when the highest offer so far was $160 (atleast publicly)?
Are they using the same strategy that we did with CC? Blow everyone away to try and discourage the field?
I still think the City of NY should name a street after Tyree. Hey, they did it for Joey Ramone!
25 million a year?
Perhaps, but Tyree plays in Jersey…
Andy is getting desperate… his people are floating all these ridiculous rumors about these non-exsistant offer.
The funniest one was how he tried to use Torre as leverage, but Torre came out and denied it and said Andy will go back to the Yankees lol
Tyree… ahh the memories.
Could have had something real special brewing here again in NY if Plax didn’t screw up.
“25 million a year?”
To paraphrase Kristy Swanson from Ferris Bueller’s Day Off”
My best friend’s sister’s boyfriend’s brother’s girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who’s going with the girl who said the Red Sox offered Teixeira $200M last night.
mel:
To me Andy is the last piece to a great pitching staff…
Like I said about Andy in the previous thread, I think the bigger issue for him in the negotiations is ego rather than loyalty. He probably feels like if the Yanks can drop all this bank on CC and AJ, then why are they being so tightfisted with me?
And speaking of ego coming into play. CM Wang is one of the most humble players in baseball, he never complains even when the Yankees lowballed him last season and went to arbitration over $600K. But now I am wondering if he is gonna start feeling overlooked by the team soon too. The Record on the wkd. had the Yanks’ projected ’09 rotation with AJ listed as the no. 2 and Wang as the no. 3. The caption under Wang’s name said “went from ace to no. 3 in less than a week.”
I don’t know whether the Yanks really see Wang as the no. 3 or if that’s just the Record making stuff up as they go along, but Wang is better than Burnett and is still the no. 2 as far as I’m concerned! I’m worried he is starting to become underappreciated…my friend pointed out that these 2 deals to CC and AJ almost certainly indicate the Yanks will let CMW walk in free agency. Maybe that will be the right move at the time, but Wanger has kept this pitching staff afloat as long as he’s been here (well, every year except last) and needs to be appreciated as such! Number 3 starter, lol.
I don’t know that I believe that BOS would pay Tex $25mil a year. It’s possible; with Manny gone, the money is there. I just never bought into the hype that they wanted him so badly. When you think about it, they don’t really need him. That hick Pukelis mans 1B pretty well. And they made due without Lowell w/o a problem. It will be interesting to see if Tex really is their dream man.
Tom: I am a Jersey Girl myself, didn’t mean to neglect our great state! I think both states should get in on it. Like Strahan said at the victory parade, the Giants are for NY and NJ. I never really liked the sound of Paterson Plank Rd. anyway….how about Tyree Catch Dr. instead?!
3/$36 really isin’t that outrageous
Derek Lowe who is the same age, is going to get 4 years and $16 million per. He also accumulated his numbers in the NL West and was awful in his last year in the AL.
Andy brings everything Lowe does — 200 innings, big game pitcher, winner, durable, etc. and can be had at a much cheaper cost.
I’m honestly shocked he has not received more offers, but it probably is because he has not made himself open to offers and not been shopped around. If he was, every team who needs pitching would be interested in him (Mets, Tigers, Rangers, Chi Sox, Indians, Mariners, Orioles, Dodgers, Astros, Phillies etc.)
fn Plax man. It hurts my head just to think about it.
I guess at the very least we can say that our Giants pretty much defended their title admirably, no matter what happens in the next two weeks and playoffs.
“I’m worried he is starting to become underappreciated…my friend pointed out that these 2 deals to CC and AJ almost certainly indicate the Yanks will let CMW walk in free agency.”
Oh, I don’t worry about this at all. I think that the Yankees see how good Wang is. I know that the players love playing behind him. And I’m not convinced that he moves to #3. I think he’s #2 and AJ is #3.
BBB-
Tyree himself is a Jersey boy, right? I’m very protective of New Jerseyites (New Jerseyans?).
This is from a Boston site, interesting says the Yanks are in on Tex.
http://www.projo.com/redsox/co.....af3e6.html
this organization is a disgrace
first bernie
then torre
now pettitte
wouldn’t shock me if they try and low ball jeter (like 3 yrs and $7 million per or something) when his contract is up too.
we had out money like drunken sailors to guys who don’t want to come here or we have no track record, yet we low ball our own.
BBB,
No doubt. It’s painful to think that could have been if we had Burress, but we did our best considering the circumstances.
The bigger question is what happens this off-season if we collapse and can’t score points here down the stretch? Will they go out and trade for a big time WR? Will they bring back Burress if he is found not guilty?
“we had out money like drunken sailors to guys who don’t want to come here or we have no track record, yet we low ball our own.”
Not quite how I would have put it, but I agree with the point you are trying to make. Andy is a true Yankee and deserves to be treated as so.
Giants need to trade for Chad Ocho Cinco next year.
He is a guy that will thrive in a winning situation.
btw, I think the Yankees should wait out Pettitte. Don’t go after Lowe (too long) or Sheets (medical red flags). If Andy doesn’t come back, you go with CC/AJ/Wang/Joba/Aceves/Hughes. The ball is definitely in Andy’s court.
MLBTR has now retracted that rumored offer of $200M to tex from the sox.
They said that the report was from a radio show and that the people on air were talking about a hypothetical offer that would be in the range of $200M.
No offer was made.
“btw, I think the Yankees should wait out Pettitte. Don’t go after Lowe (too long) or Sheets (medical red flags). If Andy doesn’t come back, you go with CC/AJ/Wang/Joba/Aceves/Hughes. The ball is definitely in Andy’s court.”
I agree, mel. Andy deserves some time to think this through. Plus, I want no part of Sheets or Lowe.
“we had out money like drunken sailors”
I’ve never seen a drunken sailor outbid himself for the services of a “companion” for the evening.
That said, sentimentality has no place in this business. You want to be sentimental, do it on Old Timers Day.
Why should the Yankees overpay for Pettitte? And why should Pettitte accept a lowball offer? I’ve seen both arguments put forth here. Pettitte is a true Yankee so Cashman should overpay to keep him. On the other hand some people have said that Pettitte owes the Yankees for some reason so he should accept less money to stay in NY. Both arguments are silly, business is business.
“He is a guy that will thrive in a winning situation.”
How do we know that? He’s never been in one.
“No offer was made.”
Which begs the question, what is BOS waiting for? The Nats have their offer out there. So does LAA. What’s the delay from BOS? Are they balancing their checkbooks? They have the money; with Manny coming off the books, it shouldn’t be a problem. Maybe this supposed interest from them has been nothing but conjecture the whole time.
Damon’s a good guy
Laura,
I think an offer was made, just not the ridiculous one that someone ran with. LOL. The Red Sox outbidding the “poor” Yankees.
“Why should the Yankees overpay for Pettitte?”
IMO, 12mil is not overpaying him. Andy still has the goods.
“And why should Pettitte accept a lowball offer?”
He shouldn’t. 10mil is insulting. Here is where people post that it isn’t. That’s your opinion. You don’t offer a true Yankee 10mil after shelling out 40mil the week before for unproven (in Yankeeland) commodities.
Well consider me a druken sailor, were’s the check book, so I can sign a big bat.
10 million Andy ! Take it or Leave it !
“I think an offer was made, just not the ridiculous one that someone ran with. LOL. The Red Sox outbidding the “poor” Yankees.”
Oh, okay. Well, someone needs to get the details of the offer out there because inquiring minds (namely Yankee fans who want Tex in pinstripes) want to know!!!
sorry “drunken”
CB:
I just rechecked MLBtraderumors and now see that the rumor has been debunked. Thanks for the heads up.
It’s been a mystery to many why veteran left-hander Andy Pettitte hasn’t taken the Yankees’ $10-million offer. But here could be a clue as to why he hasn’t: Pettitte’s people apparently are telling folks he has a $36-million, three-year offer from another, unnamed team
I can’t say yet whether 10 million is insulting. I don’t know what the market is for Pettitte yet. If he truly does have a 3 yr 36 mil offer then it is certainly an insult/lowball. I don’t believe he actually has that offer though. If 10 million is the best offer Andy can get, is it still an insult?
$10M is an insult, $12M a lot less so. Although Horatio Ramirez and Chan Ho Park both signed for about $2.5. Shudder.
Pettitte is getting paid $10m to be their #5 starter. Not a 2 or 3. He was over paid plenty the last 2 years. Name 1 team that will pay him even $10m next season..?! No one will. He needs to get over himself. He was awful last season. The offer is fair and he doesn’t deserve any more. Just because the Yanks choose to give CC and AJ big contracts doesn’t mean that Pettitte should get whatever he wants.
How sad is it that cool red sox fans get trolled here? That airplane comment by “ray” was pathetic.
can we please stop calling people true yankees?
I think we definitely could take a flier on this guy maybe even for our 5th spot in the rotation if all else falls through. He’s got a live arm and a ton of guts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OM3Z_Kskl_U
“If 10 million is the best offer Andy can get, is it still an insult?”
Patrick, the drop from 16 to 10 is a steep one. Going down to 12 would seem to me to leave Andy’s ego last damaged.
It’s also about perception. How does it look that we are prepared to throw gobs and gobs of $$ at the new guys while trying to nickle and dime one of our own? It doesn’t feel right to me. And if it doesn’t feel right, it ain’t right. I hope that’s not just a woman’s perspective. There have got to be some guys out there who think that we should be showing Andy more love than this. I know, Fredo – business is business. That is probably how Cash and the Steins see this. If so, they are being very shortsighted.
Sigh. Once again, Andy was not “awful” last year. Moose ’07 was “awful”. There’s value in giving Andy $12M because he’s capable of pitching actually capable of pitching as a #2 or #3. And it’s only for a year so it’ll cost way less than a Derek Lowe or a Jon Garland. And he’s an innings eater (see Livan Hernandez).
*Sacramento Kings Fire Coach Reggie Theus*
And Lawrence Frank is still employed
“Just because the Yanks choose to give CC and AJ big contracts doesn’t mean that Pettitte should get whatever he wants.”
Well, considering that Andy wants another $16mil, we at least agree on that point.
migames,
Only after they refuse a lowball offer or a spring invite.
“can we please stop calling people true yankees?”
No, we can’t.
Pettitte doesn’t have a 3 year offer on the table and if he does, its in Houston. If he goes anywhere else for that long, his comments about Yankees or retirement are nothing. He might change his mind and that’s cool, but if he wants to win, NY is his best shot…he knows that. His agents are idiots. Is he going to squabble over the $2 million difference to play for a better team as a 4th starter? If so, I hate to say it, take care pal.
Pettitte should just agree. He could have told the Yanks about the Mitchell Report last year…
I guess we’re insulting Andy w/ 10 million
“I guess we’re insulting Andy w/ 10 million”
I think so, although I didn’t think we were insulting Torre with his offer.
EDUB-
“In their latest bid to beef up their pitching rotation for the 2009 season, the New York Yankees today signed Iraqi journalist Muntadar al-Zeidi to a three-year deal worth $32 million.
The right-handed al-Zeidi, 28, impressed the Yankee scouts with his performance in Baghdad yesterday when he threw both of his shoes at President George W. Bush.
While neither of the shoes hit their target, both throws “had great velocity and good movement,” said Yankee owner Hank Steinbrenner.
“The first shoe was high and outside but the second one was right down the middle,” Mr. Steinbrenner said.
The Yankee boss said that he was also impressed with Mr. al-Zeidi’s fighting spirit when Secret Service agents tackled him.
“That could come in handy when we have a series with Boston,” he said”
http://www.borowitzreport.com/article.aspx?ID=6969
I just don’t agree that the Yankees should overpay Pettitte. He has pitched well for the Yankees in the past but they have also paid him very well in the past. They don’t owe each other anything. To be honest, I doubt Pettitte could get more than $10 mil on the open market. If he can then maybe the Yankees should up the offer a bit. However, it really does sound like Cashman doesn’t want to spend more than $10 mil on the fourth rotation spot.
When was the last time a player took a discount to play for the Yanks? Players do whats best for them and their families. The Yankees should act the same way.
It was pretty insulting how he pitched in the 2nd half, but I’m just saying.
gee a # 5 SP asking for 36/3 yrs. ? Go West Andy.
Laura – Welcome, CC!
December 15th, 2008 at 3:36 pm
“I’m worried he is starting to become underappreciated…my friend pointed out that these 2 deals to CC and AJ almost certainly indicate the Yanks will let CMW walk in free agency.”
—-
This is an interesting scenario that I brought up the other day as well.
If when CMW is eligible for FA the following is happening then you have to wonder:
1- CC is jamming and doesn’t opt out
2- AJ is jamming and has no injuries
3- Joba is jamming and Melancon is doing fine in bullpen
4- Hughes is jamming and is still cheap
5- Brackman, McCallister, Aceves and others are all ready
What do you do then? If CMW is still jamming he will be looking for 20mm or more. Do we trade him in his walk year to cut payroll and pick up prospects? Or do we pay him that amount when we are not so pitching desperate? If we pay him then we will have to trade the young guys who we say we are trying to develop.
Imagine us trading a pitcher to cut payroll for a stud prospect?
Interesting scenario that only plays out if all of the above happen. If any of the above doesn’t happen then no way we would move him.
But what if???
Show Sheets the money and forget Andy.
He has 24 hours to accept.
How many years does Wang have before he becomes a free agent?
Reposting from last thread:
“somehow his strike outs wouldn’t seem so bad if he had a high number of walks created by taking the chance of taking the 3-2 pitch. he walked 43 times on a 3-2 count and struck out 37 times.”
randy,
You are exactly right on the mark here. You’re basically seeing what most other people who complain about guys like Swisher, Dunn and Cameron don’t.
People look at a guy like Siwsher or Dunn and just equate him with Dave Kingman. It’s nothing at all alike.
Swisher strikes out simply because he works the count very deep. In order to be selective at the plate and draw walks you must take a lot of pitches.
If you see a lot of pitches and go deep into counts then you are increasing your chance of walking.
But of course you are inevitably also increasing your chance of striking out.
Look at how dramatic the stats you posted above are. Swisher saw 90 3-2 counts. So he was willing to take the risk of taking pitches so that he got into a lot of 3-2 counts – he had 588 plate appearances so 15% of those resulted in a 3-2 count.
Swisher lead the league in pitches per at bat at around 4.4 per at bat.
Now was that risk worth it? Let’s take a look. Of the 90 3-2 counts he was in he walked 48% of the time.
That’s fantastic. Swisher put himself into a position to draw a walk with a probability of nearly 50%. And then on top of that he must have also gotten some hits on 3-2 counts. His OBP in 3-2 counts could have been close 60%.
But of course that lead to additional strikeouts.
On your point about contact. Swisher made contact with 86% of all pitches thrown to him in the strike zone. That’s fine. League average is 88%.
And part of what you also have to enter into the equation for Swisher – he hits for some power. Last year he hit 21 HR so he’s swinging to drive the ball as well.
Swisher may strike out but he does not have a problem making contact. That may sound paradoxical – but it’s true.
The only players who are able to generate high OBP while hitting for power and not striking out a ridiculous number of times are the truly, elite gifted players like ARod and Manny. Guys who have explosive hips and unbelievably quick wrists and can thus afford to see a lot of pitches but stil have the ability to get hits when they are behind in the count.
Given that guys like Swisher or Dunn – guys that just don’t have that kind of ARod physical ability – try to do instead is to get on base by taking a risk on striking out. That’s a very good strategy as the trade off are well worth it.
The Mitchell Report is erroneous right now. This is business.
For any of you expecting Pettitte to give the Yankees a discount because of HGH use, don’t fool yourself. They are offering him a contract based on his value.
YankeeRay,
I’ve thought of the same scenario, however I highly doubt the Yankees will have 5 really good and injury free starters. However if they do, I’m sure they will let Wang hit FA.
Sabathia, Burnett, Chamberlain, Hughes, Brackman ? It’s possible..
If Andy takes the 3/36 from anonymous we get 2 draft picks.
GO !
“Randy l is correct that Livan protected all those young Minnesota pitchers. He was their designated food taster.”
nick in sf-
and as a result, you see how thin and in shape those young twins pitchers were. matter of fact, the whole twins team was losing weight which was the real reason they reluctantly had to release him .
“It was pretty insulting how he pitched in the 2nd half, but I’m just saying.”
Brandon, I think it’s pretty clear that Andy pitched the second half injured. Why? Because his team needed him. Our pitching staff was in shambles and could not handle yet another pitcher going down with injury. So he pitched. He didn’t pitch well, but he did the best that he could and gave it all he had. Why? Because that’s what true Yankees do. That’s what good players do. They take one for the team.
And if people don’t think that kind of selfless effort is worth another 2mil from two mega rich brothers, there isn’t anything I can do about that.
Thanks for that breakdown, CB. I don’t know the particulars, but that kind of sounds like Giambi.
I don’t mind strikeouts if they were good at bats. What I can’t stand is things like Cano swinging at the shoestrings. His strikeouts in winterball went from 1 to 3, but I think Melky’s at 8!
No draft picks Brandon, we didn’t offer him arbitration.
From last thread:
Hey I wonder of Manny would agree to a ‘wanker clause’ in his contract. I can see it now:
“But Manny, it says here on page 3, paragraph 2, line 4 of the contract you signed – ‘if team determines player is too much of a wanker to deal with, team can opt out of said contract with said player at any time at no cost.’ and we consider making a cell phone call on the way to first base after posing to watch what you thought was an upper deck HR (to the bleachers) fall short of the warning track, and then being thrown out at first base while you’re at it, to be under the umbrella of that clause.”
Swisher had 135 plate appearances with a full count last year.
Laura the 2 picks will make it worthwhile he got hurt meaning he can get hurt again. 10 million if he takes it as an insult I ain’t crying, right now Mr. Gosh gee, jolly geee gosh…. is holding us up. There needs to be a deadline on his a..
“No draft picks Brandon, we didn’t offer him arbitration.”
WHAT ! Argghh…. screw it let him go if he doesn’t take the 10.
” … and no, Manny, we don’t believe that near-miss of a HR was stopped by a sudden gust of wind. The game was being played at Minnesota.”
“WHAT ! Argghh…. screw it let him go if he doesn’t take the 10.”
I give up.
If Andy doesn’t sign here, sign Tiexiera. I haven’t hear which team the rumored team is. If its Boston I’ll keel over on my keyboard. Actually, Andy probably doesn’t have three effective years left in him.
Um, this looks old but I don’t think I’ve heard this as part of our chatter – though I don’t get to hang in for all of the different thread changes. It’s from Yankees.com
I read the headline and just a little of the beginning – but I do hope it’s nothing but news hype…
http://newyork.yankees.mlb.com.....8;c_id=nyy
If it’s old news, sorry about that.
“Eleven Teams Interested In Daniel Cabrera”
WTF ?
“Eleven Teams Interested In Daniel Cabrera”
Yeah, they heard how good he was at plunking Yankee players.
The thing that concerns me about Swisher is the very low number of hits relative to strikeouts. His ’08 ratio of 135 SO’s to 109 H’s was extremely bad. I doubt you can find more than a few players in the league with significant AB’s with worse ratios. Walks are nice but, unless the bases are loaded, don’t drive anyone in.
“Eleven Teams Interested In Daniel Cabrera”
who in the right mind would take a shot with him? :X
how about 11 mil for andy, meet him in the middle
im not too happy of the idea of:
CC
Wang
Aj
Hughs and friends
Joba
helllooooo, did we not learn anything from this year? sign andy and let hughs start in AAA
Thoughtful musings about the prospect of Manny in pinstripes:
http://tinyurl.com/6k5kma
“how about 11 mil for andy, meet him in the middle”
how about 10 take it or leave it.
“Thanks for that breakdown, CB. I don’t know the particulars, but that kind of sounds like Giambi.”
mel,
Giambi is the prototype of this kind of player. People tend to get on the Swishers of the world more however as he just doesn’t hit for Giambi’s power.
The approach however is similar.
I think the first player of this type to ever play the game was Dick Allen.
Allen should be in the hall of fame, IMO. There’s a lot of reasons why he hasn’t been elected in but part of it is that people keep talking about his K’s without putting them into the context of his OBP.
“how about 10 take it or leave it.”
eh, i guess that can work also lol
Someone please INSULT me and offer me 10 million a year.
“Swisher may strike out but he does not have a problem making contact. That may sound paradoxical – but it’s true.”
cb-
thanks, that’s what i was looking for. swisher appears to be a very smart hitter. i also notice that he hits more of his home runs on a 3-2 counts than in any other count over the past three years. 15 hrs in 263 3-2 count at bats.
pitchers have to be especially careful because of this home run ability on these 3-2 counts which is going to lead to a lot of walks. it’s going to be very interesting watching him hit in different situations.
“# jennifer December 15th, 2008 at 4:50 pm
Someone please INSULT me and offer me 10 million a year.
”
Id take half that and you can throw all the shoes at me you want.
sudenly, i am high on Swisher.
thank you for the reports.
Good Article on Dick Allen. It’s called “The Best Player Eligible for the Hall of Fame”
http://online.wsj.com/article/.....al_journal
Nick Johnson: 1st base
Swisher: RF
Nady: trade him for a needed player or prospect
I fully expect, depending on Wang’s performance during the first half of the season, that the Yankees will offer him a contract extension like they did with Cano to ensure that they can retain him relatively cheaply. Wang doesn’t want to leave the Yankees and he is a very modest man. I can’t see him walking away into free agency and I can’t see the Yanks letting a guy like CMW leave.
“Swisher had 135 plate appearances with a full count last year.”
Ok. Just looked this up myself. Swisher had 135 plate appearances and 90 at bats with a 3-2 count. That’s remarkable. He had 588 total plate appearances. So 24% of all of his plate appearances went to a 3-2 count. What a pain for pitchers.
24% is remarkable. For comparison abreu got to 3-2 only 13% of his plate appearances. Giambi 18% of his at bats went 3-2. So Swisher is way ahead of Giambi and Abreu in working the count full. (For a floor comparison Cano got to 3-2 6% of his plate appearances.)
Of those 135 PAs he drew walks 43 times – 32%. In addition he got 19 hits with a 32 count. 43 walks + 19 hits over 135 PA = a 46% on base percentage which is terrific.
Swisher K’d 37 times which is a 27% K rate. Which actually isn’t very bad given the count.
A 46% OBP makes a 27% K rate well worth it.
Working the count full as often as he does costs Swisher some K’s but turn him into an on base machine.
And that was in a year when he only hit .219 overall.
Swisher is like Betemit… amazing power from the left side, patient at the plate with a good eye, and strikeouts.
One out of every 4 at bats, Swisher had a full count. That’s about 1 per game, unreal.
1. I’ve been high on Swisher from day one (when we got him)
2. About Daniel Cabrera – if you can’t understand teams being high on him then you haven’t watched the guy pitch.
People don’t seem to have the ability to note the possibilities when they watch various players, they only hone in on the problems. Cabrera has absolutely filthy stuff, but he has had a problem with control. Apparently 11 teams are bright enough to observe what some of you have obviously missed.
I have always thought Cabrera was an extremely talented and lethal pitcher. I also recognize that he has had difficulty reigning it in. If someone can work with him, he has the stuff to be a number one starter.
You don’t have to agree, and I respect that. But at least 11 teams recognize he has a lot going for him.
Man
Boras is really spinning it tonight? Does that bozo ever learn?
Or you haven’t watched him often enough.
nick johnson has averaged only 97 games per year for the past 5 years. that is a remarkable injury record for a first baseman isnt it? i always liked the guy, but he just cannot stay on the field.
“Swisher is like Betemit”
um no. for our sanity i very well hope that swisher is nothing like betemit
“Someone please INSULT me and offer me 10 million a year.”
Jen, that’s easy for you to say; you weren’t making 16mil last year. This kind of money is a lot to us regular working stiffs. We know that 10mil will feed our families and their families and their families…..
But everything is relative. Think of your own job and salary. I make a decent amount of money. If I were to be offered the same job I have now making 10K less, I’d be insulted. That’s how Andy probably sees this 10mil offer. It’s easy to think that he’s being a jerk by turning his nose up at 10mil….until you put yourself in his place and change the figure to match your life, your job and your salary. I see where he’s coming from and from that perspective, 10mil is an insult.
Swisher isin’t really the problem… it’s the Cameron/Gardner-Nady combo that is concerning.
Cannot have all 3 in the lineup… too many strikeouts, low averages, and no contact.
“Swisher is like Betemit”
Since we are discussing insults, this is an insult to Swisher. LOL!
Laura,
How many games before we should boo Swisher?
johnny damon is still deciding whether to attend, seeing as how he has been nominated for 3 awards at some other awards ceremony..
“How many games before we should boo Swisher?”
None. I don’t believe in booing players from your team, not even Betemit.
Wait… Betemit has “amazing power”? He has 42 HRs in 8 seasons.
MLBTR says the Angels are interested in Manny, and that Scioscia talked to Francona about him.
Boston had money coming off their books for Manny but they see it quickly gone with a new contract for Pedroia and what they’ll lose in arbitration cases with Youkilis and Papelbon. They gained some by trading Crisp but that goes to Varitek soon.
They hold a team option with Beckett for 2010 but how happy will he be seeing what Sabathia and Burnett are earning ?
They may sign Teixeira but it’s bound to upset the applecart. Bay is a FA after 2009.
It won’t be easy for them to deal Lugo and Lowell unless they eat some salary.
I’m with Laura. The Yankee offer– if there is no flexibility– is an insult. Truth is Pettite pitched very well while he was healthy. Then he pitched hurt, which a lot of guys wouldn’t do. It’s true we over paid him last couple of years. But we needed him. I think Yanks should at least offer 12 m.
Right now our bench is Molina, Ransom, Gardner, and ????
i wouldnt be too happy if i was a white sox fan right now
swisher for betemit………….. really? lol
they apparently offered lowe $15M/year, that pretty much makes andy’s case that he deserves alot more than $10M.
Beckett will take a discount to stay with Boston, so will Youkallis and Lester.
Papelbon may not, but the rest will.
“i wouldnt be too happy if i was a white sox fan right now
swisher for betemit………….. really? lol”
I’ve got a lot of friends who are WS fans and they didn’t know that Betemit stunk until I told them. Now, they feel that they gave away Swisher for nothing. It was a salary dump; plain and simple.
Cb-
It’s nice to know that the Yankees were doing their due diligence/homework when discussing the trade for Swisher.
Pettitte was overpaid last year, and as nice as it would be to have another lefty in the starting rotation, let him retire if he can’t live with 10M.
Boston will have some problems if they fork out big bucks to Tex. Word in that clubhouse — where many have played for peanuts for years — is that guys want to be made whole. Just think of guys like Beckett, Ortiz and Wakefield (and I’m invoking them only as examples) — what they’ve been paid by the Red Sox and what they would have been worth on the open market. This Boston management has been very shrewd in locking up their own players at below market cost. But I don’t think that advantage is going to hold for long.
Just give Andy $13 million and get it over with.
Convince them to meet in the middle. We want 10, they want $16.. we add 3, they subtract 3… $13 million.
“Nick Johnson: 1st base
Swisher: RF
Nady: trade him for a needed player or prospect”
Of course you realize this weakens are offense, right?
alvaro espinoza’s hipster frames December 15th, 2008 at 5:13 pm
“johnny damon is still deciding whether to attend, seeing as how he has been nominated for 3 awards at some other awards ceremony..”
———-
Super smart and super funny. Thanks Alvaro! LOL! LOL! LOL!
you’ve gotta wonder what lowe is going to end up getting now that the yankees are out of that market. cash laid out the offers and cc and aj grabbed, lowe may not end up getting what the yankees offered from anybody else.
If the Red Sox miss out on Tex… they will make another big splash.
Theo is not watching the Yankees add 2 premier starters while they do nothing.
Whether it’s Peavy, James Loney, Prince Fielder, Matt Cain, Russell Martin, Chad Billingsly, Oswalt, Lance Berkman, Joey Votto, Todd Helton, Adrian Gonzalez etc.
Boston will add a premier player or players this off-season.
For those of you who think it’s the honorable thing to meet in the middle on Pettitte’s demand for 16M, or that it’s an insult, he grabbed the chance to take the 16M when he knew that he would be named in the Mitchell report and when he realized the Yankees might retract the offer if they traded for Santana.
If Andy doesn’t come back… the rotation doesn’t look so hot all of a sudden.
You have the big 3 on top, then Joba/Hughes, both injury prone and both with innings limits as your #4-5, with very little depth behind them.
Now, if we allocate Pettitte’s money to Teixeria, then you can live with it, but if not, then neither the offense NOR the pitching staff is that intimidating.
“For those of you who think it’s the honorable thing to meet in the middle on Pettitte’s demand for 16M, or that it’s an insult, he grabbed the chance to take the 16M when he knew that he would be named in the Mitchell report and when he realized the Yankees might retract the offer if they traded for Santana.”
Perhaps I’m missing the point of your post. So when the Yankees offered him 16mil, he was supposed to say “No, I might be mentioned in the Mitchell report so give me 10mil”?
You know what I would do?
Call Mussina and see if he wants to reconsider. Now that he sees that the silly rebuilding project is over and we are trying to win now by adding CC and Burnett… ask him if he would like to be apart of what could be the best pitching staff in baseball to try and win a ring.
I think part of Mussina’s reason to retire was that he was unsure if we would seriously contend (meaning a WS calibur) or just continue the downhill slide. After all, at the beginning of the off-season it looked like we would miss out on CC.
Now that we’ve gotten him and Burnett, our outlook has changed dramatically and Mussina may want to give it one last go.
bring andy back, its too late now to sign Sheets because then you have too many injury prone pitchers (aj, sheets, maybe even CC), Lowe is good but how about spend that little extra money on offense?
bring andy back!!
joey votto is a premier player? dont get me wrong, hes good. but i think he needs a few more years playing at a consistent level before hes considered premier imo
Aardvark December 15th, 2008 at 5:31 pm
“If the Red Sox miss out on Tex… they will make another big splash.
Theo is not watching the Yankees add 2 premier starters while they do nothing.
Whether it’s Peavy, James Loney, Prince Fielder, Matt Cain, Russell Martin, Chad Billingsly, Oswalt, Lance Berkman, Joey Votto, Todd Helton, Adrian Gonzalez etc.
Boston will add a premier player or players this off-season.”
——
Agreed. It’s just the type of deal Theo would make out of nowhere, pulling off a deal to bring an Oswalt, Peavy or Berkman to Boston for prospects, etc. Watch for a frustratingly creative deal or deals to come in the next 6 weeks.
God I hope Boston trades for Todd Helton. I would laugh for a month.
“If Andy doesn’t come back… the rotation doesn’t look so hot all of a sudden.”
We won 89 games last year with the likes of Rasner, Pavano,Ponson. The rotation this year is dynamite, with or without Pettitte.
Next years FA starting pitching is weak, with only John Lackey a Type A FA, IMO,that would be available.
If the Yankees don’t get Pettitte, they’ll find someone else in the FA market or make a trade with their abundance of relief pitching or minor league pitching.
Redding December 15th, 2008 at 5:40 pm
“You know what I would do?
Call Mussina and see if he wants to reconsider. Now that he sees that the silly rebuilding project is over and we are trying to win now by adding CC and Burnett… ask him if he would like to be apart of what could be the best pitching staff in baseball to try and win a ring.
I think part of Mussina’s reason to retire was that he was unsure if we would seriously contend (meaning a WS calibur) or just continue the downhill slide. After all, at the beginning of the off-season it looked like we would miss out on CC.
Now that we’ve gotten him and Burnett, our outlook has changed dramatically and Mussina may want to give it one last go.”
——-
OOOOHhhhh. Like Yoda, this advice sounds. I like it! Bill James even projects 14 wins and an era under 4.00 for the MooseMan next year, if he were to play. One more year on top of that and he is so close to 300, he could get it without getting Carltonitis.
“Now that we’ve gotten him and Burnett, our outlook has changed dramatically and Mussina may want to give it one last go.”
Considering that he had decided to retire before the season started and then held firm to that decision after winning 20 games, I doubt he’d reconsider. At the end, he sounded like a man at peace with his decision. Best of luck to him!
I could see Boston pulling off a combo blockbuster with Oswalt and Berkman.
Something like Buchholz, Bowden, Lars Anderson, or something. They give up a lot but get back 2 studs who are fairly young and under control for a while.
Ask the Royals again about Dave DeJesus for the CF spot and 3rd in the lineup. He would be a nice addition. BTW, The Big G would be great as a pinch-hitter next year. I don’t think Adam Dunn is that much better-especially because he played in Cincy.
Redding-
“You know what I would do?
Call Mussina and see if he wants to reconsider.”
Would like that!!!
“We won 89 games last year with the likes of Rasner, Pavano,Ponson. The rotation this year is dynamite, with or without Pettitte.”
Yes, barring injuries, etc. I’m not ready to sign us up for 100 wins just yet. AJ needs to show me that last year wasn’t a fluke and that he can pitch while healthy for an extended period of time.
alright people forget mike cameron if it came down to it:
manny for 2 years at $40-45 mil
yay or nay?
I haven’t read any of the above posts so I apologize if this has been repeated…
Does anyone know if there is there any truth to the rumor that Pettitte has a standing 3 year $36 mil offer??
That idea about Mussina is very intriguing.
Certainly worth a shot.
Hmmm… A disgruntled Manny on this team who feels no teams are giving him any “respect” (money) and will fake knee injuries to get out of playing to put pressure on the Yanks to renegotiate his deal in the middle of a pennant race… Sounds great… let’s sign him up… at least he’d take the heat off of Arod… (end sarcasm).
I like the idea of reaching out to him again. He;ll probably refuse, but whats there to lose?
He certainly has to have given thoughts to pitching in the new stadium in a rotation alongside CC, AJ, Wang, and Joba, right?
peavy absolutely does not want any part of the al east. its been noted before. oswalt, i cant see houston getting rid of. maybe berkman but not the other two. either way i wouldnt be surprised if they went after someone to keep pace in the offseason moves. its expected. if they dont get tex, we def did the better job imo
I’ll allow Manny to dog it on one condition— he hits in the playoffs and plays every game against the Sox/Angels.
If he wants to not run out a groundball against the Royals or misses a week with a fake injury against the Rangers and Mariners… who cares?
Think long term people. Manny will hit in the playoffs and in big games against our rivals. Thats all we need. We don’t need him for the full 162.
“alright people forget mike cameron if it came down to it:
manny for 2 years at $40-45 mil
yay or nay?”
Nay, because:
1. Manny will get that much or more to stay in LA.
2. 20M costs the Yankees 28M with the 40% luxury tax.
3. Manny didn’t like the scrutiny in Boston
4. He’s a quitter.
while i dont think the yankees will be in for real on tex or manny, i do think cash will scoop up a bat especially since everyone expects some of the mid tier guys to go pretty cheap.
“We don’t need him for the full 162.”
Fine. Then let’s structure his contract to say that he only gets paid on days when he plays like he gives a damn. I’m sure that will go over well with Boras.
I’m honestly scared of what Theo is going to pull off if he doesn’t get Teixeria. Investing $200 million and 8 years into Teixeria may be light compared to the other moves that Theo is capable of pulling off via trade.
Theo has the ability to erase the effects of CC/Burnett this winter. He has the farm system and the creativity to do it.
Newark,
You mean have a pre-existing agreement with Manny on when he dogs it and time his fraudulent injuries to coincide with softer opponents on the schedule?
Certainly not a bad idea if Boras would agree to it under the table.
“I’m honestly scared of what Theo is going to pull off if he doesn’t get Teixeria. Investing $200 million and 8 years into Teixeria may be light compared to the other moves that Theo is capable of pulling off via trade.
Theo has the ability to erase the effects of CC/Burnett this winter. He has the farm system and the creativity to do it.” who out there aside from tex is of the magnitude that would be a better grab based on talent AND team need that they could grab? its not gonna be peavy or oswalt? who else is out there that the sox need that would be a gigger grab for them than cc/burnett was for us?
Girardi handling Manny… I would pay to see that.
I would also pay to see Manny actually participating in Girardi’s boot camp ST and adhere to the no candy in the clubhouse rule.
“Theo has the ability to erase the effects of CC/Burnett this winter. He has the farm system and the creativity to do it”
To duplicate CC/AJ. he’ll have to erase his farm system. And more.
“Girardi handling Manny… I would pay to see that.”
that could be a pay per view event! lol
46 year old Jamie Moyer signed a 2-year deal with the Phillies.
Expect to see him at Times Square on New Years Eve playing the role of Father Time.
No to Manny, It is inconceivable that they will sign him.
Andy should take the 10mm or tell the Yankees no thanks. Either way is fine.
Cameron for Melky and Igawa is a great deal.
Then a bench guy and the team is set.
Baseball players have it made:
They get paid when they don’t play.
Paid when they’re sick or hurt.
Get 3 months paid vacation.
Meals, lodging, and transportation taken care of.
How many stars in the history of Baseball have actually deferred their money, so the team could add another player to enhance their chances at a pennant? Roy Oswalt offered, but his owner didn’t take him up on it.
NO, NO, and NO for man-child Manny!!!
manny as a yankee would kill me, but i have no fear whatsoever that cash would ever let that happen.
Yankee Trader,,,,,Ballplyers don not recieve any money after Oct 1, or when the final out is made….No paid vacations….However your point is very well received…..Nice gig…..
Is there a website that can sort stats to the point that it can spit-out data showing:
Side-by-Side numbers for the ML pitcher that is “MOST SIMILIAR” to Andy in 2008 & 2007 ???
lol okay so i guess thats a big old NAY for manny haha
it would be hilarious to see GI Joe and manny lmaoo and u have to admit A-rod batting infront of manny is a temptation too good to at least not look into, even just a little bit
I wouldnt be shocked if that 3y/36mill Andy rumor is real and its the Mets. He should take it. We can probably fill the slots with our depth and/or if we get Sheets on the cheap.
if berkman is available for trade why dont we go after him? im not sure about his defensive stats but he has played cf, lf, rf and 1b so thats alot of flexibility if there are injuries as well. his offensive stats trump camerons as well!
My guess is that Pettitte’s offer, if he has one which is quetsionable, is either from Texas or the Mets. Both are looking for a lefty starter. The Mets could one-up the Yankees and get a solid starter in teh process. Texas just desperately needs pitching and is relatively close to home. No way is it from Houston who has said that they don’t want anything to do with Andy and that they are trying to cut payroll (they are considering trading Oswalt).
Please stop calling people “True Yankees” unless you’re George Steinbrenner you just sound stupid. Check that, even if you’re George Steinbrenner you sound stupid.
$10 million dollars to ANYBODY is not an insult. Andy isn’t worth more than that now anyway. Look at his second half last year. He’s not a $16 million pitcher, 10 even seems high. If he were worth more than that, he’d be getting offers for more than that.
He doesn’t owe the Yankees anything and they don’t owe him anything. If he doesn’t like the offer, he can find one somewhere else or retire. The Yankees can find another 4th starter (Joba’s gonna be 5th so they can control his inning count) for a lot cheaper elsewhere, even in their own organization. Cash is doing a great job. You can only have so much loyalty to one player. Overpaying them by 6 million dollars seems a bit much, even for the Yankees.
harwood
December 15th, 2008 at 6:17 pm
I wouldnt be shocked if that 3y/36mill Andy rumor is real and its the Mets. He should take it. We can probably fill the slots with our depth and/or if we get Sheets on the cheap.
—-
Let him go to the Mets. I’d rather have Sheets or Perez though I’d prefer to put that money towards Tex.
If no Tex or Manny then definitely another starter.
This should be a big week as most teams will be winding down next week.
Wouldn’t it be hilarious if someone throws a shoe over CC’s head during his press conference on Wednesday?
still with that said we need a big bat, if not manny or teix, than who? does anyone here really think cameron is good enough? i cant say that i’ve seen many or even any of his games.
If we don’t sign Andy, we’ll just move on to Sheets/Lowe.
Nah, we’ll probably let Aceves, Kennedy and Hughes compete for it.
“I wouldnt be shocked if that 3y/36mill Andy rumor is real and its the Mets. He should take it. We can probably fill the slots with our depth and/or if we get Sheets on the cheap”
it’s not the Mets.
Andy not hispanic.
faith,
The offense as it stands right now, is not championship calibur. Too many holes, too much age, and the bottom of the order is putrid.
Banking on A-Rod, Posada, and Cano repeating their 2007 campaign, Swisher hitting like 06-07, and Matsui staying healthy is not a smart strategy for a $200 million dollar team with world series aspirations.
EVERYTHING has to go right for this offense to be GOOD, let alone great or top of the league. I would hope Cashman is smart enough to realize this.
Agree with Phil
If not Andy, then Hughes will be in the rotation, ready or not. Hughes will beat ANY of the other kids in an open competition anyway.
I think if we just deal with Gardner in CF we can sign Dunn for around the price of Cameron. Dunn 3 years 34 million.
vinny-b
what does that mean??????
No Andy, then that spot can be filled from within….The inning cap combined with Joba’s may prove to be problematic ….Not certain as to where Phil is in that regards…175 maybe ????
If they don’t sign Pettitte and stay within the organization with, say, Aceves to begin the year, then fine. But if they choose to fill that spot with a free agent outside the organization it’s going to cost them more than Andy in both money and years. If they’re lucky it would be a 2-year committment at at least $10 million per. So already it’s costing more than Pettitte would. Just give him the darn 12 mill or 13 mill for one more year and be done with it. It’s cheaper in the long run (unless you go with rookies) and it’s the right thing to do.
too much age, and the bottom of the order is putrid.
“”Banking on A-Rod, Posada, and Cano repeating their 2007 campaign, Swisher hitting like 06-07, and Matsui staying healthy is not a smart strategy for a $200 million dollar team with world series aspirations.
EVERYTHING has to go right for this offense to be GOOD, let alone great or top of the league. I would hope Cashman is smart enough to realize this.”"
A PERFECT SUMMATION OF OFFENSE PROBLEM!!
“Wouldn’t it be hilarious if someone throws a shoe over CC’s head during his press conference on Wednesday?”
Peter Gammons
I think if we just deal with Gardner in CF we can sign Dunn for around the price of Cameron. Dunn 3 years 34 million.
like other ppl have noted, he strikes out WAY too much. id settle for the headache that is manny before watching him k at the plate 100+ times! if were gonna trade, go after berkman before cameron.
X-mann,
i hope so too, or we will look like the blue jays of last season, good pitching, but no offense
In cash we trust. lmaoooooooo
phil yews went 135 innings this year, he should bel clear to go around 17 innings.
i dont want him handed anything but i think he’s gonna push his way into the rotation permanently this year.
170 innings that is
“go after berkman before cameron.”
Why would Houston ever trade Berkman? Last time I checked they were not doing a fire-sale. Berkman would defintely mean Hughes and Ajax.
Don
December 15th, 2008 at 6:24 pm
Wouldn’t it be hilarious if someone throws a shoe over CC’s head during his press conference on Wednesday?
…………………………………………
Wouldn’t it be funny if the Boston Socks signed that Iraqi reporter to a pitching contract ?
phil should start in AAA. bottom line, Andy get off ur texan butt and sign the dotted line!!!
while andy has lived in texas since high school, he is by birth a louisianan from baton rouge.
Can anyone tell me how many runs Manny cost the Sox over the last several years by standing at the plate to watch what he thought were HRs fall in play? Certainly it cost them 1 or 2 bases a shot and I’m guessing he did it more than a handful of times a season. Then there’s how the ensuing the scenarios would have changed the next play or the rest of that inning.
Also, can anyone compare the ’08 season run differential when comparing a full year at the numbers Manny put up for LA in the second half versus the 4 months of Manny dogging it and demanding a trade plus the 2 months Jason Bay playing in Manny’s place. C’mon pro-Manny stat heads … bring THAT one on.
Factor in the defensive shortcomings including runs & bases given up by not going all out to get to a ball, or sitting on the ball when he can’t find it after falling to look for it behind him ….
And this guy is worth ‘plus 4 wins over the average player’?!?!?!?
How can that possibly be worth the money, especially when Tiexiera’s out there?
I was trying to think about the current situation from Manny’s point of view. I think what would be best for him if he knows he’s not going to get the 5-year contract would be to sign a one year deal (1yr/25-28 mil)with a team and mash like he did in LA for the season, put himself in the AL MVP race, get to the WS with the Yankees, etc. Then next year he’ll be back on the market and teams will likely sign him to a 4-year deal. Right now he has a bad image because of the crap he pulled in Boston. He thought his big LA performance would cover for that, but apparently it’s not. One more year of LA-like performance would DEFINATELY make the world forget.
Meanwhile, the team that signs him gets a motivated Manny Ramirez on the shortest possible deal. Seems like a win-win situation for both parties.
Thoughts on this?
“Can anyone tell me how many runs Manny cost the Sox over the last several years by standing at the plate to watch what he thought were HRs fall in play?”
arod caught this disease this season, too!
Why would Houston ever trade Berkman? Last time I checked they were not doing a fire-sale. Berkman would defintely mean Hughes and Ajax
i was just going w what other posters said about the sox going after berk. i have no idea if they are looking to trade him or not ( i can def agree w you) i wasnt sure if this was knowledge i wasnt privy to. IF hes available, id rather see the yanks go after him.
Funny one, ham!
At worst A-Rod at least makes it halfway down the first base line before the ball lands.
Sometimes Manny doesn’t leave the batter’s box until it lands. If he makes it all the way across the dirt circle around home plate, it’s either because he doesn’t want to show up the pitcher or he just got chewed out for posing on his last warning track shot by Francona.
i dont see the astros going into fire sale mode. if they were, they would have listened to the offers they got for valverde at the winter meetings instead of declaring him off the table. if you’re going into rebuilding mode, you pretty much get whatever you can for your closer cause there wont be many games to save for a while.