The need-a-job All-Star team
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Jan 10, 2009 
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Could this team of free agents win a division title?
First base: Kevin Millar
Second base: Orlando Hudson
Shortstop: Orlando Cabrera
Third base: Ty Wigginton
Left field: Adam Dunn
Center field: Ken Griffey Jr.
Right field: Bobby Abreu
Catcher: Jason Varitek
DH: Manny Ramirez
No. 1 starter: Ben Sheets
No. 2 starter: Derek Lowe
No. 3 starter: Andy Pettitte
No. 4 starter: Jon Garland
No. 5 starter: Oliver Perez
Closer: Brandon Lyon
Set-up man: Will Ohman
Set-up man: Juan Cruz
I left out Garret Anderson, Randy Wolf, Joe Crede and Pudge Rodriguez. Buster Olney has one of these all-unemployed lineups on his blog, too. It’s pretty amazing so many name players are still looking.
They could win a division title….but only in the NL West
I have a question about free agent compensation.
For the ones who were offered arbitiration and declined, until what point in time does the signing team have to give up a pick?
For example, lets say Varitek doesn’t sign with anyone until June. Would Boston still receive compensation picks?
I can’t seem to find an answer to this.
I wonder if the Yankees are eyeing any of them besides Pettitte of course.
Its amazing that those guys don’t have jobs yet. I wonder if any of them will end up jobless by the time the season starts.
It’s the economy, stupid!
[Sorry Pete, you walked right into that one]
For anyone who doesn’t believe that all facets of life are being affected be our horrific economy, just take a look at free agents yet to be signed.
Well Rebecca, looks like we were thinking the same thing at the same time.
My state was the first in the US to officially be declared to be in a recession, and that was early last year. When I went to have my taxes done, my tax accountant told me that what we were seeing was the tip of the iceberg and people definitely weren’t prepared for just how bad things were going to get.
trisha: http://www.nbclosangeles.com/s.....Homes.html
It’s awesome.
I cant believe Ben Sheets doesn’t have a job or any offers, he started the All-Star Game for the NL. The Yankees still have an opening in their rotation and I think Sheets should be the guy.
Sure that group could win a division.
Anyone want to offer some calculated guesses on what a payroll of that group will ultimately total?
Pel -
We should go after Juan Cruz this guy is filthy.
Trisha: My Dad was warning me about this since before Bear Sterns went under.
Given his job, he knew about the rise of food prices before most people, and coupled with his interest in the economy/finance, he pretty much sat me down at dinner one day and told me that $h1t was going down.
The funny thing is, I was watching a program on the Dust Bowl last night…and EVERYTHING that happened in the 1930s is happening now.
Which has me a little worried that we’re not far off from the next great European Genocide…
Kevin– Great minds! I thought that same exact thing.
Bob– I’ve read the rules and don’t think that situation is addressed. My guess is that the silence would mean the compensation rules would continue to be required for the entire season.
Man, the Sox signed Saito now! I have to give Theo credit. He takes low-risk high-reward signings and turns them into major contributors for his team. I wish Ca$hman would take all of the funny money we have sitting around and sign a few Penny/Smoltz/Baldelli/Saito type of signings.
I’d still be interested in Nomar Garciaparra as a bench player. I’m sure he’ll either be a Philly or more likely the Dodgers but I still think he’d be a great backup to bring in for us.
However, Juan Cruz should be a guy Ca$hman should seriously think about. We dont really need to be in the market hardcore for pen help but Cruz is a type A we could have for ONLY A 4 RD PICK because we already signed CC, AJ and Teix. Cruz has devistating stuff and would push our pen over the edge to pretty elite status. IMO he’d be a monster signing for the Yankees.
Off topic….
I just got through last weeks SI. The story of the adoption of Vick’s dogs by Jim Gorant is tremendous. Whether you are a dog lover or a fan of karma I highly recommend the read. I was unable to attach the link but the story is now on the SI website.
Have a good weekend.
-dennis
Rebecca, I used to be able to shut out reality by focusing on the great game of baseball but now there is no longer anywhere to run.
I’m worried too, worried about what is happening between Israel and the Hammas, worried because the entire world economy has been hit hard, worried because Bernard Madoff singlehandedly has ruined so many people and instituitions (and plissed that the loser is still able to walk the streets when a “nobody” who bilked people the same way would never be out on bail) – and thinking that we are headed for what we always heard about and never thought we’d ever see again, the Great Depression.
Sorry to be a come down. I think the harsh reality is really starting to sink in. When I read that 11 Macy’s were closing, I think I started to really see more of the iceberg straight ahead. Yeow.
Oops- didn’t see new post.
Has Boston given all these “bargains” major league deals? Current roster is at 39 and Saito brings it to 40.
They either need to do a 3+ player trade for a catcher to free up sapce to add Smoltz,Kotsay and a catcher, another major league contract trade for prospects or they are going to need to start just kicking people loose.
After guesstimating the salary for each player and adding it together, I got a payroll of $150 million, but who knows how much these players will get in this economy. It’s definitely veteran-heavy, but it would be a contender, I think. Good power, and I like the rotation.
Hey Trisha,
And don’t forget that the unemployment rate is the worst since 1945. It is a really scarey situation.
I think that a lot of these unsigned players will take one year contracts and then try free agency again next year and hope that things are better.
Mike
January 10th, 2009 at 1:03 pm
I cant believe Ben Sheets doesn’t have a job or any offers, he started the All-Star Game for the NL. The Yankees still have an opening in their rotation and I think Sheets should be the guy.
————-
Absolutely! Thank you! Sheets has ace stuff and he’s still on the market. I realize he’s an injury risk but lets say we only get 100 innings out of him thats still 100 more innings we filled and we can still fill the others with the young guys. We’re talking about a #4 or #5 spot. CC, AJ, Wang and Joba all have ace stuff potentially. If you add Sheets to that rotation we’d have one of if not the nastiest rotations in all of baseball! His back, his elbow, his shoulder…before 2005-2007 Sheets was one of the most productive (innings wise) in baseball. He did it again this last year and like you said STARTED THE ALL-STAR GAME!!! This guy has the stuff. We should sign him to a 1 or 2 year deal with an option for an additional year. I honestly think its ridiculous he’s still on the market regardless of his injury risks. SIGN BEN SHEETS!!!
pat: I thought the Sox had already added Kotsay?
Mike – good work.
Fran, not surprisingly the women here are worrying about the big picture in life and the men are making trades with other teams’ money!
It is very scary. And I don’t know about you but having my dad around always instilled a sense of security in me no matter the situation. I feel like there is no real safe place right now. (Something makes me think I’m right.)
Damn!
They should expand into Brooklyn with that group. They could compete over the next few years and then disband the team after that. They don’t need a minor league organization and they could play their home games at the old Yankee stadium.
Let them play in the NL east and maybe they would come in first or at least be a wild card.
Rebecca
Probably pending physical. Kotsay, Smoltz and Saito are not on their roster on mlb.com.
Hey Fran, what is your snow watch? Is it there yet, do you have any predictions of what is to come? I hear our storm isn’t supposed to start until around 6 tonight. Prediction is 6-9″, something like that.
I remember my dad quoting the saying “red skies at morning, a sailor’s warning, red skies at night, a sailor’s delight.” Well this morning when I looked outside I saw a red sky. Though it is possible that I have seen many before, I swear this is the first time I ever remember seeing a red sky in the morning!
How low is stock suppose to fall ? my god make an offer to Sheets already.
Maybe now is the time to take a shot at pedro or prior…
Cheap, easy solution for Back of the rotation guys… no big deal if the dont work out… well have P. Hugh and IPK waiting in the wings
Wait, who signed Bonds? I thought he was still a free agent!!
I’ve been out of the country since the new year so I haven’t had the opportunity to check out the MLB network so WHAT IS GOING ON with all the Red Sox shows?!
Fran: slight correction: the 2008 single year job loss was the worst since 1945 (but much smaller as a percentage of the total labor force), but the overall unemployment rate itself was 7.2% in December, according to today’s paper. That’s painfully high, but that rate has been reached or surpassed several times in recent decades.
Hopefully Andy Pettitte will get s job soon or retire, and that will be one less unemployed person. Ditto the rest of Pete’s list above.
“Maybe now is the time to take a shot at pedro or prior…”
helllllll nooooo to Pedro. He wants to stay with the Mets and be in the NL, so let him be.
Yea Trisha we’re headed to bad times and any “Change!!!11!” whether real or just fancy words is going to be too little too late. I always heard my grandma talk about the Depression and how hard things were, I just never thought I’d know first hand. Here’s hoping I can graduate school and move out of a major city before the expletive really hits the fan.
Maybe that’s why AP won’t sign for “only” $10,000,000.00 !
Chad – I heard that the Folsom Follies have been asking about Bonds and they didn’t even care about him passing a physical!
We should go after Juan Cruz. Nobody wants to give up a pick for a guy like that but we`d only lose a 4th rounder. The guy could be a great fit.
That’s a pretty darn good team, its crazy none of them have been signed. The only problem I see is that its an awful defensive outfield. That team could definitely contend for a playoff spot.
“Maybe that’s why AP won’t sign for “only” $10,000,000.00 !”
Not for nothin but that truly makes me want to vomit. I’m sure the McCourts fully understand his “dilemma”.
Pat: I see.
Brandon: I almost agree with you. I mean, there’s a reason and a good one the Yankees haven’t signed Sheets, but hell, if you can get him at a major discount–which seems likely–why not?
But like I said, I only almost agree with you.
I’m worrying about what to have for dinner tonight, not making any trades. Just kiddin’
It’s a great time to refinance, I just bought my 1st home 2 months ago with a great interest rate & now we are going to go for a better rate, close to 4%.
About Kotsay – yes he has been re-signed.
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/articl.....;fext=.jsp
Trisha,
It has started snowing here but right now it is only sticking to the cars and grass. They have downgraded our expected total accumulation to 2-4 inches from 5-7. It is supposed to get heavier later in the day.
Thank you Buddy McCourt!
Rob- I’m keeping my fingers crossed for you. You might just make it in under the wire!
Got my grades back finally, lots of A’s make me a happy boy!
Nick,
Thanks for the clarification. I am currently a member of that unemployed work force now and so the numbers seem even worse. And there aren’t very many jobs out there to apply for.
Anyone remember the show Queen for a Day? When some hard on their luck woman got to tell their story, get crowned and sent on their way?
It’d be fun to see these guys form their own team.
Maybe play in New Orleans or something.
Hmmm. Maybe we’ve been downgraded too! I have this “snowstorm” mentality that says you are supposed to go to the market and buy all kinds of things that you wouldn’t ordinarily buy and don’t even necessarily like but you really should have them around during a snowstorm.
So I did that last night, but I still have a few things I need to add to that “unnecessary” list so I probably should get to the market before things start up. The “milk and bread” thing defifnitely isn’t a myth because last night just about all of the bread was gone in the market I go to!
Rob,
you just recieving your grades now? I got mines before X-Mas. what school you in?
Rebecca -
We’re likely to see cameramen at ballparks not showing the empty seats in upper stands wherever possible for fear that fans will think the economy has affected baseball when in fact it has and will continue to do so.
With this economy, the sports dollar can be spread around just so far.
Oh Fran, I am so sorry. I hope you can find whatever you need to tide you over.
Ed: I just got my grades a couple of days ago. I passed, though, so that’s what matters.
Brad: Dude, I’m a Devils and Nets fans. Trust me, I’m already familiar with this tactic!
I go to Suffolk Law School. For some reason Law Professors take their grading responsibilities less seriously and it takes for-ev-er (Think Squints telling his story in Sandlot) to get grades out despite the fact that they were due last week. Maybe that means they take grading more seriously? But it just grinds my gears that if my Memo is 10 minutes late I lose a letter grade on the assignment but if they take a month to grade my final it’s fine !
Fran: Sorry to hear that. Ronald Reagan used to say “A recession is when your neighbor loses his job. A depression is when you lose yours.” I hope your depression turns into a recovery soon.
Fran:
I am so sorry to hear that
. I know it can sound trite, but if you need someone to talk to, I’m here, and I mean it.
Rebecca and Rob,
I guess each schools have different systems. Congrats to both of you passing.
What is Saito’s first name?
Brad– to your point almost every Giant game this year (home games) was full of empty pockets of seats. I commented to the guy and his wife who sit next to me every game how I was shocked that the World Champs didn’t fill all the seats. It’s obviously been worse since it got cold but even in September you saw lots and lots of empty seats. I fear that the people in charge of putting out “the numbers” are being nice in what they’re giving us. It feels like it’s worse than we’re being led to believe, in general and in sports.
Trisha, Thanks. Hopefully something comes up but it is rough going. And you wrote about your father and you know I also lost my dad last year. It’s so hard not to be able to run to him for advice.
AD
January 10th, 2009 at 1:42 pm
Maybe now is the ***time to take a shot at pedro or prior***
————————————————————
It’s probably the most humane thing to do. They’ve shot horses in better physical condition.
Rob – empty seats don’t necessarily mean no sale of tickets. Don’t the Giants sell out all of their games?
Rebecca and Nick,
Thanks. I figure that it has got to get better.
Able– Yes they do. The thing is it costs money to park ($20), and money to get to the games (gas or whatever). A whole lot of the seats are sold by the “real owners” to others and I don’t think that happened as much this year. Plus, a lot of owners don’t live in the area anymore. I go with my dad but I drive down from Boston for home weekend games.
Rob – those law school professors can be MFrs. I remember quite a few who were. One of my worst moments was when we were given a deadline to get a paper in (it was our “final” in that course) and were told that for every minute we were late we would lose points. I hit traffic on the way to turn it in and also got stopped for speeding when I tried to make up time and ended up with a very costly ticket. I ended up getting there past deadline by about 7 minutes and figured that when I showed the little loser professor my ticket he would relent and mark the paper in “on time”. He had about as much sympathy for me as I did for him when I learned he had been canned from his job there.
Grr!
I can’t believe the self proclaimed Tom Brady of baseball is a free agent right now. You would think a talent like that would be recession proof.
“It’s just like Tom Brady,” Millar said last night. ”If you had a fantasy football draft, he’d be your eighth, ninth, 10th quarterback picked. You’d want to take [Daunte] Culpepper, and you’ll finish in third place. You want to take [Michael] Vick and Peyton Manning and all these guys.
“I may not hit a home run the rest of this year and we might win the World Series. And I’m a part of this team. Somehow, somewhere, I bring something.”
Rob – I see what you are saying. Let’s look at the tailgaters tomorrow when they show them on t.v. Will they be eating filet mignon or blood loaf and head cheese?
“What is Saito’s first name?”
Takashi.
Fran, I remembered about your dad and I know how much he meant in your life. That loss can really make you feel like a ship without a rudder.
I’m going to keep you in my thoughts and prayers and hope that something opens up for you on the employment front but that in the meantime you have enough to keep you safe, healthy, and warm. And I echo Rebecca’s offer. We’re all in this together, and we share one of the most awesome bonds of all, our love for the Yankees. We will NOT let you sink!
able 21
January 10th, 2009 at 2:06 pm
Rob – I see what you are saying. Let’s look at the tailgaters tomorrow when they show them on t.v. Will they be eating filet mignon or blood loaf and head cheese?
————————————————————
Obviously, they’ll be eating ostrich burgers.
Able– lol I for one will be eating a cheeseburger and a cheesesteak.
Trisha– Yeah that’s the type of garbage I’m talking about. After you handed that paper in 7 minutes late on say December 17th I bet he didn’t post your grade until January 23rd !!
To be fair to Millar, he seems to be more underestimating Brady than overestimating himself. I`m not sure when the quote was made but he may have been one of the top ten first baseman in baseball when he said that.
Something got caught in the filter so i’ll rephrase:
Able– I’ll be eating cheeseburgers, the Filet’s went the way of the .com bubble here!
Trisha– I bet the same guy who penalized you for being 7 minutes late didn’t get that paper you handed in at 5:07 on December 17 back to you until January 23rd !
Pete, that team wouldn’t do very well at all. Each fielder you listed has limited range at best, and the rotation is loaded with pitcher who pitch to contact. Yeah, they mash, but that’s a poorly constructed team.
Empty seats at Giants games? Now that makes my head turn.
Trisha– I bet the same guy who penalized you for being 7 minutes late didn’t get that paper you handed in at 5:07 on December 17 back to you until January 23rd !
able 21
January 10th, 2009 at 2:06 pm
Rob – I see what you are saying. Let’s look at the tailgaters tomorrow when they show them on t.v. Will they be eating filet mignon or blood loaf and head cheese?
————————————————————
Obviously, they’ll be eating ostrich burgers
Thanks Trisha. I have Rebecca’s email address but I don’t have yours. Email it to me when you get a chance at Fran0322@aol.com
I doubt there will be empty seats at
Giant Stadium tomorrow. It should be a great game.
With all of those pitchers left on the free agent market and probably not getting nearly their asking price, the yanks have to consider filling up that that empty rotation spot with those 4 starters outside of pettitte – ie. sheets, perez, garland or lowe or of course, via trade.
Jaun Cruz would also be an excellent pickup and teams are shying away from him more because he is a type A free agent and less because of his asking price which is probably around 3 – 4 mil next season or maybe 2 years and 6 mil. He would stabilize our bullpen at a relatively cheap cost while only forcing the yanks to give up a fourth round pick … Who exactly are we going to get in the fourth round when everyone keeps saying this draft only has high cieling players and then, a huge drop-off in talent. Therefore, we will probably only get decent guys back from the firtst and second pick we have remaining from the two unsigned players.
Im tired of explaining all the reasons I think sheets is worth the risk or trying to figure out how we can trade for aaron harang or why pettitte should just take the ten million. At this point, i dont care who we sign out of those five starers above or who we trade for as long as we actually get another starter.
My wish list in the beginning of the off season looked like this:
CC- check
High end starter like AJ or sheets – check
Teixeira – check
Another starter that is an innings eater/ re-sign pettitte –
A setup guy that could bring us flawlessly to Mo –
Competition for the backup outfield job – check (rodriguez)
Competition for the backup infield job – check (berroa)
So cash has filled five of the seven items on my wish list. Only a reliever and back end of the rotation starter remain. Cruz fills the eighth inning spot perfectly. A number of guys still on the market have fourth starter potential – this is my list in order: Pettitte, Sheets, trade for a guy like Harang, Garland, Perez. I would take Lowe but not for 3 years and 36 mil and he wants even more than that – i think harang who has a very similar contract to to that is far better/younger and shouldnt cost us too much in talent coming off a bad season.
Agreed Able. That game is going to be a war. I just hope it gets above freezing so I don’t have to dress like an eskimo. Cold days are made worse because the seats are small and you get the opportunity to know the people who sit directly next to you very well. lol Maybe my half of the seating license can buy me some elbow room in the new stadium !
Fran – done.
You’re a lucky man to be going Rob. Wish I was. Have fun and Go Giants.
Rob: Have a fun time at the game!
I’m going to watch in the comfort of a friend’s house!
Hardly any place you can go where the econony doesn’t come up in conversation.
Any player not signed by late March will realize how their stock has dropped and will need to work for cheap, accept a minor league deal, or call it a career.
Consession lines at ballparks will be shorter in 2009 and team owners are aware of it.
Selig warned of the economy at the winter meetings. Other pro sports are doing the same.
A real indicator may be how much those high priced 30-second commercials will be selling for with the Super Bowl.
I didnt put swisher on the list above because i made it after we had already acquired him.
Neil – no the real indicator will be how many of those face value $1000 a pop Super Bowl tickets will cost.
typo – how many of those tickets will “sell”
Neil, a very interesting thing to watch will be how many games are sell outs in the 2009 season. Maybe there are whole hosts of people who won’t be affected by the economy and have the money to pay for tickets and maybe there will be corporations who can still afford those fancy seats and will give the tickets away and thus help to show bodies in those seats, but then there are the people who were always in the nosebleed seats and the bleachers. At least some of those people will have to be affected by the economic conditions. And then we’ll see if ticket prices go down accordingly.
Bad times all around.
The trickle down theory of economics will clearly be at work in 2009. All those people who can only afford nosebleeds will return to the days of our youth when we trickled down to the high price seats after a couple of innings
Well those skies that were red this morning are looking quite grey right now. I think it’s time for the final hike to the market.
Later y’all.
OK — So no Pedro or Prior — just a shot at competing — who can be the inning eater at the back of the rotation. I don;t think You want Joba and P. Hugh going back to back every 5th day this year. Both are on inning counts, I’m giving up on Andy.. who’s are 5th starter?
“The trickle down theory of economics will clearly be at work in 2009. All those people who can only afford nosebleeds will return to the days of our youth when we trickled down to the high price seats after a couple of innings”
LMAO.
Truth is, you can see it at work everywhere…
And for all the ppl who say the yanks should get more high risk/high reward type players like the sox are doing – what do you think sheets is? What do you think burnett is for that matter? I didnt like the sox signing of smoltz or baldelli b/c smoltz is 42 and coming off major injury and baldelli is just a mess and will probably never be healthy enough to start in the rest of his career.
I dont care about being misdiagnosed or whatever that bs they were trying to spread in the off season was – fact remains baldelli is one of the most likely players to get injured in baseball.However, I do like the saito signing. If it doesnt work out they only owe him 1.5 – 2.5 million which is chump change to them and incentives force him to try to stay healthy and make the 7 mil he could make.
There is hardly any risk in this signing as the sox will either really get their moneys worth out of saito if he stays healthy as he is dominant or they pay him almost nothing and he goes on his way. On the other hand, they are giving smoltz 5.5 mil guaranteed and he isnt very likely to be all that healthy and/or effective. Probably less likely than saito. I kind of wish the yanks made the saito deal – just look at his numbers before injury last season – they were outstanding as usual and he still pitched for 45 innings. How he is only being payed 1.5 mil and not even really that much of a risk exemplifies how bad the current market is.
Further, i think if sheets continues to hover in pergatory, one really has to start thinking about a deal similar to that of saito’s. i dont mean similar in terms of money as giving him only 1.5 mil after a 200 inning season in which he was one of the best pitchers in the NL is preposterous but maybe as low as 6 mil guaranteed with incentives taking him all the way up to 15 mil in the first year. The second year could be a team or vesting option based on performance that also is 6 mil guaranteed with incentives taking him to 15. So if he is injured we only owe him 6 mil guaranteed and becomes a free agent against next off season and if he is healthy, he signs a 2 year and 30 million dollar deal which would appear to be his asking price at the start of the off season. Is 6 million not worth the risk of sheets after giving a risky pitcher like burnett 82 million guaranteed? I know and everyone knows sheets is risky but everyone is worth the risk at some price. i THINK if sheets spends long enough on the market, his price will drop so low he becomes worth the risk for the yanks. Worst comes to worst, we give sheets six mil and starts aceves/hughes/kennedy/joba in the fourth and fifth spot which we are going to end up doing if we dont sign anybody anyway.
That team is terrible. Bobby Abreu is one of the worst RFers in baseball, and Adam Dunn is one of the worst LFers. Griffey is a below average CF (being generous here) these days too. The outfield would be net -50 runs on defense, or 5 wins.
Jason Varitek is cooked and terrible. He’s barely above replacement level these days, if he is at all anymore.
UZR/150 for that team:
LF: -13.5
CF: -33.8 (!!! From 2007 his last full time CF job)
RF: -14.8
SS: 13.4
2B: -9.1
1B: -2.2 (a big improvement over 07)
3B: -3.2 (a big improvement over 07(
The team is worth -6 wins just on *defense* and that’s presuming Millar and Wiggington don’t revert back to ’07 levels.
Don’t worry, Justin, they haven’t actually banded together to form that team. You don’t need to have a heart attack!
That is actually an impressive team. If these guys aren’t signed by now when will they be signed?
Heres my projected stats for each one of those guys.
“First base: Kevin Millar- .240/20 HR’s/70 RBI
Second base: Orlando Hudson- .290/15 HR’s/75 RBI
Shortstop: Orlando Cabrera- .280/15 HR’s/75 RBI
Third base: Ty Wigginton- .280/20 HR’s/80 RBI
Left field: Adam Dunn- .240/40 HR’s/100 RBI
Center field: Ken Griffey Jr.- .250/20 HR’s/80
Right field: Bobby Abreu- .300/20 HR’s/100 RBI
Catcher: Jason Varitek- .240/15 HR’s/80 RBI
DH: Manny Ramirez- .300/35 HR/120 RBI
No. 1 starter: Ben Sheets(if healthy)-12-15 wins/ 3.50 ERA/
No. 2 starter: Derek Lowe- 12-15 wins/3.50-4 ERA
No. 3 starter: Andy Pettitte- 10-15 wins/4.00 ERA
No. 4 starter: Jon Garland- 10-15 wins/4.50 ERA
No. 5 starter: Oliver Perez-12-15 wins/4.00 ERA
Closer: Brandon Lyon- 30+ svs/3.00 ERA
Set-up man: Will Ohman-20+ HLDS/3.50 ERA
Set-up man: Juan Cruz-20+ HLDS/4.00 ERA”
Thats just my round about predictions but that is a lot of useful production sitting on the un-employment line.
I am actually concerned with the Sox signing 4 or is it 5 huge upside tiny downside guys, and us signing 3 huge stars at over market rates.
If we do as well as expected we still are not guaranteed a series win, and in any case we get ragged on for ” buying” playoff spots blah blah, if the Sox do well, Theo gets hailed as a brilliant GM, who was innovative, visionary, and prophetic.
Bob: That’s the risk you take every year.
If you succeed, you’re smart, you’re a genius and you’re visionary.
No one ever considers how much luck plays into the entire thing!
I am actually concerned with the Sox signing 4 or is it 5 huge upside tiny downside guys, and us signing 3 huge stars at over market rates.
If we do as well as expected we still are not guaranteed a series win, and in any case we get ragged on for ” buying” playoff spots blah blah, if the Sox do well, Theo gets hailed as a brilliant GM, who was innovative, visionary, and prophetic.
———————————————————–
I wouldn’t worry about any of them.
There’s a reason they all were gotten so cheap.
How did Wade Miller and Bartolo Colon work out for them?
Nick in SF……Cal Berkley Bears plus 6 is the lock of the day…..Pettite re-signs once the Brothers Steinbrenner’s are finished with their form of punishment….
Al from BK none of those numbers mean anything.
Batting average, RBIs, and Wins mean nothing.
There is some talent out there. Sheets will be good for any innings he contributes, Hudson and Dunn were positive values last year. Abreu managed to offset his terrible defense to be worth about 1 win.
It’s not a very good team though.
What old, low price, high upside guy has Theo or anyone else in the AL East signed in the past that has worked out?
Many more misses than hits.
PAT M: I think and hope you’re right about the Bears. I just hope they haven’t been reading their press clippings the past couple of days. A win today would get them a ranking. I took ‘em straight and parlayed with Arsenal FC this morning and the G-Men tomorrow.
Guys, what Red Sox “low risk” move worked out ? Bartolo Colon ? No. Wade Miller ? No. I’m not sure Ortiz fits the definition of a low risk signing b/c he was never a guy on the rebound like Smoltz, Baldelli, Colon b/c Ortiz was never good before he went to the Sox. o
Even Gammons says Varitek may receive a $2M offer to return to Boston.
Given a choice, I’d take the Yankees Frankie Cervelli over Varitek.
Even Gammons says Varitek may receive a $2M offer to return to Boston.
——————————————-
But does he get still get to wear that super cool “C” on his uniform?
I would be surprised if the Sox did not resign Varitek. I thought that is handling of the pitching staff was something that was very valuable to them.
The reds are in the hunt for a righty bat with power to sandwich between joey votto and jay bruce according to mark sheldon of mlb.com. The yanks have four outfielder starters including a right fielder with righty power named xavier nady. The reds have some interest in nady but would prefer to give up arroyo rather than aaron harang. The yanks rightly so want nothing to do with arroyo and everything to do with aaron harang. However, as reds bloggers and im sure the organization have insisted -a trade of harang for nady straight up is inequitable and the yanks need to add more to their side of the deal.
Therefore, i WILL go back to a comment I made two days ago or so. The yanks have a lot of young and unproven pitching talent and the reds only have a couple of pitchers that they are relying on to start outside of harang so they could use some young, cheaper back of the rotation starters. Also, harang’s contract is pretty large compared to the reds total salary without griffey or dunn and they would want to get that contract off their hands which totals another 2 years and a third year option.
So as I proposed, how about the yanks sign jaun cruz? And then, take some of the least effective major league bullpen talent like jose veras and couple him with Xavier Nady and a prospect like chase wright or steven jackson or possible major league starter like Dan Geise or Alfredo Aceves.
We are trading positions of surplus for our major deficit which is an innings eater and effective fourth starter who has the talent to be even better. So the first thing would be the yanks adding jaun cruz to the pen for the eighth inning. Then, they would trade Veras, Nady and a capable major league starter like an Aceves or a jackson or a or a wright or a Geise type player for Aaron Harang – the yanks would take Harang’s three year contract coming in at 11 million next season and the reds would take nady’s one year and five plus million dollar contract so the yanks would only add 6 million to their current salary total next season plus whatever they payed Cruz (about 3 million) for a total of about 9 to 10 million added to the current total.
Nady is expendable and too overpriced to just platoon or backup swishier. Swisher is the better hitter, better defensive player, a switch hitter, more patient and far more versatile. If we want a fourth outfielder for insurance we can use melky or sign a lower priced outfielder from the FA market.
How does this make sense? For only nine million dollars we are upgrading our bullpen by adding one of the better eighth inning setup men with ridiculous raw stuff and only taking out jose veras who was only marginally effective most of last year and is similar to many other pitchers the yankees already have in their club and farm system and adding a fourth starter capable of pitching more than 200 innings and being an ace at times (exactly what we need).
What about blocking Phil Hughes and the others from entering the rotation when ready? This is simple – at the end of the season, Harang will be owed 2 years and something like 25 million. If next years market picks up, that should be easy trade bait. Particularly, if harang is very effective next season which i think he should be. In most markets, 2 years for a pitcher of Harang’s caliber is a bargain and we could get back something very useful for him like a catcher or center fielder. Or we can do other moves but this seems like the best one to allow hughes to come up. Next year, Hughes can easily take over for joba when he is nearing his limit or fill in for injuries. Personally, i WOULD like to trade Geise, Jackson or Wright much more than aceves but whatever would get the deal done. If aceves is still around, hughes filled in for joba giving him plenty of time to work in the minors and aceves fills in for injuries.
WHAT DO YOU GUYS THINK?
Pat M: You mean Syracuse is not a lock?
I think that’s a wall of text that boils down to “keep piling on crap players until they give us something good.”
Where are these guys, playing AL? FantasyLand Park? 210 homers and 710 RBI for their 9 starting batters?
Rebecca,,,Are the Orangemen still a Division 1 school ????
PAT M
January 10th, 2009 at 3:25 pm
Rebecca,,,Are the Orangemen still a Division 1 school ????
———–
Zing !
dave, I tried to get through that post, but my attention span wavered and I had to turn to “The Brothers Karamazov” for some lighter fare.
Pat: Basketball, we’re ranked #9 ESPN/#11 AP
Football, uh, let’s not go there
“Bill Ladson of MLB.com says the Nationals are calling the Yankees about Xavier Nady and Nick Swisher. Nationals GM Jim Bowden’s alleged interest in these reportedly available outfielders should not surprise anyone.”
Milledge ? and who else…
I originally thought when cashman traded for and drafted boatloads of minor league pitching talent almost all of whom were right-handed that he was building in order to land a free agent with some of the talent. Since then, we have primarily just horded a good chunk of these players or outright released some of them. Yes, we did use Jeff Marquez to trade for Swisher and Ross Ohlendrof and Daniel mcCutchen to trade for Nady and Marte
But if Harang is such an ideal fit and the reds want more than just Nady this is our list of minor league starters still around and most of whom will never make the major leagues because we have Sabathia, Wang, AJ, Joba/Hughes/Kennedy and if we make this trade, Harang all lined up to start. And only so many pitchers can help in the major league bullpen. Here is the list: Anthony Claggett, Steven Jackson, Phil Coke (possibly), Ian kennedy, Dave Robertson (possibly but not for long), Dan Geise (possibly), Humberto Sanchez, Mark Melancon, Eric Milton, Sergio Mitre, Kei Igawa, JB Cox, Jason Johnson, Wilkin De la Rosa, Andrew Brackman, Chase Wright, Christian Garcia, Jose Valdez, Kevin Whelan, Wilkins Arias, Michael Gardner and George Kontos.
I did not even mention some of the pitchers in A ball or the lesser known names in the organization and all of these players are assuming a full rotation and full bullpen in the major leagues using the forty man roster with Mo, Marte, Bruney, Veras, Ramirez, Albadejo and Aceves. Therefore, a lot of those pitchers mentioned in the first list are expendable considering most of them will never be useful to the major league club just because so many spots are already filled for many years. im not saying it isnt good to have depth – i love that we do in fact but why not use some of this depth to acquire something that we need like a fourth starter capable of throwing over 200 innings of quality ball? Doesnt this make sense? Use the surplus in the outfield and minor league pitching talent to fill the deficit in the rotation for next year. Moreover, giving up nady right now would be selling him at his highest value yet and trading for Harang would be getting him at his lowest value yet. How many trades havent worked out when the team sold a player very high and got a player who was very low in his career? How many havent?
Let’s see: Raven vs. Titans. I’m leaning Titans..but still think the Ravens can pull it off. Decisions Decisions
If we can sign either Ben Sheets or Juan Cruz for a 4th RDer we NEED to do it. Sometimes you’ve just got to take advantage of the market. Because we already signed CC, AJ & Teix we already lost 1st, 2nd & 3rd RD picks. I really want to bring in Sheets. I wanted him over Burnett. If we can have them both in addition to CC we’ll have one of the elite rotations in baseball, on paper. However, Cruz has electric stuff and he could push our pen to elite status IMO, on paper. Either could prove to be one of the best signings of ours this off-season for us because the market is settling so they’ll be less expensive than previously thought and a 4th RD compensation pick is a lot less than a 1st RDer. IMO Ca$hman needs to try and sign one of these two. I’m partial to Sheets but considering Hughes, Aceves and others are either ready or nearly-ready to play on the MLB level that Cruz might be a better long term signing. I’d still love to have a rotation of CC, AJ, Wang, Sheets & Joba though! Ca$hman, take advantage of the market!!!
Brandon: from what I’ve heard of Millege, DO NOT WANT!
Maybe we’ll get Wil Nieves back…
They really should turn this blog into a money maker and sell stock. They charge a word fee. Anything over 25 words in 1 hour is a dollar a word. Ol’ Dave could build every stockholder quite a retirement fund. ***After one day***
Sheets medicals must be children of the corn scary. Crazy how he is still available. Though it might not be for too long..I guess the Rangers are showing him some interest?
Thats about the worst OF defense one could ever have. The bargains are definitely tempting though. Dunn at 1/10 or 2/18 is an absolute steal even with his defense. Abreu too if he doesnt get the 3 year deal he wants.
Brandon-
“Bill Ladson of MLB.com says the Nationals are calling the Yankees about Xavier Nady and Nick Swisher. Nationals GM Jim Bowden’s alleged interest in these reportedly available outfielders should not surprise anyone.”
“Milledge ? and who else…”
Milledge and lefty pitcher John Lannon would do nicely, but a big price to pay!
GreenBeret7
January 10th, 2009 at 3:35 pm
They really should turn this blog into a money maker and sell stock. They charge a word fee. Anything over 25 words in 1 hour is a dollar a word. Ol’ Dave could build every stockholder quite a retirement fund. After one day
—————
That’s about 35 words
Brandon, the Nats are more interested in left handed bats than left handed. If the Nats were dealing anybody, I’d be asking for Milledge or Willie Harris.
Nick,
What is the Brother’s Karamazov? It only takes a minute or less to read the post. i would really like some feedback to see if any of this is really feasibly – according to riveraveblue who originally brought it up the yanks would have to give away more than nady to get harang but it is possible.
CORRECTION: left handed bats than ***right*** handed.
Brandon-I’d take a Milledge package for either one of them. He’s a bit of a prima-donna but he’s extremely talented. He could step right into CF for us and move to either corner OF position when AJax comes up. Honestly, if we can get him and a prospect for Nady (or Swisher) we should. Thats a pretty good return that fits our current roster IMO.
I wouldn’t worry about any of them.
There’s a reason they all were gotten so cheap.
How did Wade Miller and Bartolo Colon work out for them?
They sucked but Big Papi did Ok, and Bill Muellar won a batting title, Okajima was a trash pickup he did well, Some of these guys pan out, and they have NO downside, they are trash. I just wish the Yanks were more creative in the fashion instead of jst whipping out the ole checkbook
GB – i think i would have to force myself to stop coming to the blog. But if you think about the time it takes to read the posts – it is really not that long at all. I usually can reread a long post i make in a minute or less.
could someone please tell me why the Nats **want more** OFers while they have a **surplus of OFers** ?
…makes no sense!
Rebecca, It was meant to be a joke……They have a good basketball program…..As a UCLA basketball fan it’s much like being a Yankee fan…Very condesending attitude….
Rob NY
January 10th, 2009 at 3:39 pm
GreenBeret7
January 10th, 2009 at 3:35 pm
They really should turn this blog into a money maker and sell stock. They charge a word fee. Anything over 25 words in 1 hour is a dollar a word. Ol’ Dave could build every stockholder quite a retirement fund. After one day
———————-
That’s about 35 words
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To get the word out, it was worth every dollar.
Giant — You dont want milledge in CF for any amount of time. He is absolutely brutal going back. There was a game last year against us where he was playing literally 10 feet from the wall IN Washington (which has a huge outfield) and we had 2 or 3 bloop hits in a row that nearly any other CF would have gotten to. As a corner hes not bad, and he has very good bat speed.
dave
January 10th, 2009 at 3:42 pm
GB – i think i would have to force myself to stop coming to the blog. But if you think about the time it takes to read the posts – it is really not that long at all. I usually can reread a long post i make in a minute or less.
————————————————————
Sorry, but, that’s more time than I care to waste. You repeat the same thing 5 times a day. Not worth the effort.
Ed – American League, prepare to be scared! CC, Aj, and MT!!
January 10th, 2009 at 3:42 pm
“could someone please tell me why the Nats want more OFers while they have a surplus of OFers ?
…makes no sense!”
Swisher can play 1st, and so can Nady, although his best position is corner outfielder.
Rangers need pitching and have Nelson Cruz and Marlon Byrd and of course, probably untouchable Josh Hamilton, who would be an instant fan favorite. Any realistic interest in Byrd for CF and Cruz for RF?
“Brandon, the Nats are more interested in left handed bats than left handed. If the Nats were dealing anybody, I’d be asking for Milledge or Willie Harris.”
They are calling Cashman about Nady and Swisher GB. So it seems they are interested in a RHB too.
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/articl.....;fext=.jsp
I’d ask for Milledge + Bernadina
“Giant—You dont want milledge in CF for any amount of time. He is absolutely brutal going back. There was a game last year against us where he was playing literally 10 feet from the wall IN Washington (which has a huge outfield) and we had 2 or 3 bloop hits in a row that nearly any other CF would have gotten to. As a corner hes not bad, and he has very good bat speed.”
So he plays RF what’s the problem. If he pans out keep him if not we deal him.
SA- Brian,
I find it hard to believe his reports are horrifying. One, not just the rangers are looking to sign him. Multiple reports in the last week have said the brewers are in the running to re-sign him as well. Honestly, if the brewers who know him better than any one else in the MLB still want him back, how bad can his health really be? Two, he rejected his 14 mil arbitration offer.
So either Casey Close thought some team was dumb enough to sign him without looking at his med reports or that the reports werent bad enough to keep ben sheets from netting a contract over 14 mil annually for multiple years. otherwise, Casey would have told ben to accept arbitration. Three, Ben went on the DL in late september with a minor forearm injury.
Only this week did olney and others starts writing bogus reports that it wasnt his forearm but his shoulder or his back that were injured. Pleease – im sure no media knew about these injuries until early january even though they would have had to happen in august or september. All of the articles after sheets originally exit in sept. talked about no other injury except that of his forearm – dont you think if it was his back or his shoulder that one of the media outlets in mil would have mentioned something at that time?
Brandon- How about Milledge and Cordero?
Brandon-
IMO Milledge would be a good pickup for Nady, and would give us another younger speedy outfielder.
Tell us about Bernadina.
not a great team here..most washed up…
“Brandon- How about Milledge and Cordero?”
They’re trading pitching. Bernadina + Milledge gives us trade pieces w/ position OF. Plus I’d think our BP is better off w/ what we have.
GB –
That is true but people also ask me the same questions five times a day referring to a post and i AM forced to answer the same question but i try to address it to different people if i am repeating something ive already said a couple of times. Not to mention, every one in this blog including pete repeat themselves multiple times. With a team that is doing almost nothing at the moment, it is difficult to find new things to talk about every single day. There is only so much to say when the team isnt even playing.
Rebecca, On the surface the Orangeman giving 8 looks good, but they haven’t played anyone really….Rutgers has played in losses to topped rank teams quite well…..I’m staying away…..Milledge would be a sweet pickup….
Brandon (CC & AJ now Marky Mark (they stilled over paid him) are Yankees)
January 10th, 2009 at 3:50 pm
“Brandon, the Nats are more interested in left handed bats than left handed. If the Nats were dealing anybody, I’d be asking for Milledge or Willie Harris.”
They are calling Cashman about Nady and Swisher GB. So it seems they are interested in a RHB too.
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/articl.....;fext=.jsp
I’d ask for Milledge + Bernadina
————————————————————
I just read that they wanted Nady or swisher to play first base, because they’re tired of Johnson.
Is Gammons going to report that Dice-K and Saito don’t get along? Just wondering.
If Sheets is so healthy, his agent should be willing to showcase him in front of interested suitors.
By the way the Red Sox signings were all big gambles:
Saito- no surgery, experimental platelet products injected into his elbow.
Smoltz-Shoulder labrum surgery and prior bad elbow, who if only 80% by May or June, will likely retire.
Kotsay-bad back
Baldelli-mitochondrial disorder
Penny- best signing if truly getting himself back in shape.
I wish cash would start showing some sort of sign that the last starting pitching spot will be remedied by opening day.
Milledge is a nice player and nady for milledge is a good trade but does he still have that attittude that the mets didnt like and the major reason they traded him like partying all the time etc.
Al,
Chad Cordero is a FA. they non-tendered him.
“Tell us about Bernadina.”
LHB, good fielding CF, he’s a speedster, leadoff bat type. He hit .211…he’s like a Willy Taveras a bit better upside.
I think the Yankees will regret it if they trade Nady or Swisher for anything less than a quality 3rd starter. I don’t trust Matsui to stay healthy, much less play the OF regularly. Damon needs rest sometimes too. Mark my words, an unexpected injury will happen and if we trade one of these guys we will regret it.
Pat M: Wait, do you mean I’m condescending (:-X) or that UCLA fans are condescending?!
GB: You know, I don’t like to post anything about other commenters, but…
Brandon: Milledge’s rumored attitude problems don’t concern you? Or am I not thinking of the right player?
http://minors.baseball-referen.....i?pid=1226
Im a Met Fan-
I understand that. I go to a lot of Mets games because one of my best friends is a huge Mets fan. I’ve seen Milledge play plenty. He’s a much more natural corner OF but for 1 season until AJax is up we can deal with Milledge in CF. Having Milledge around to play next to Ajax in the OF in the future would be a good look for the Yankees.
Funny thing about Milledge that I’m sure most will dismiss or call B.S. but here it goes. My friend who I’m talking about is named Shawn. Shawn went to VTech and so did his younger brother. His brother Matt is still down there. Matt roomed with for a while and is still good friends of David Wright’s little brother who also goes to VTech. Man, I know that sounds long winded and B.S. but its true. I’m a Yankees fan I have no reason to make up a Wright story… Anyway, Wright would always tell us inside info on the Mets that you wouldn’t hear elsewhere. We hear about signings just before they happen pretty often and we got the inside scoop on their club house. I wish I heard about the Yanks instead but whatever. During the time where Milledge seemed to be getting on the veterans nerves, but Manya would completely deny it, we heard the truth. They hated him. He’s immature and full of himself. He does have great skill though and is said to have grown up through the experience of being traded and playing for the horrible Nats. IMO he’s too talented of a young, contract-controlled OF with multiple tools to not trade for if we can get him for a dump of our extra OF. I’d prefer to trade Nady because of his impending free agency but even if it cost Swisher I’d be for it. But we have to get something in addition. He starts the package but isn’t the entire thing. If we can get Milledge and a pitcher or infielder (2B/SS) we should take the deal. I wont deny Milledge was an absolute jerk on the Mets though. They were smart to trade him even though it didn’t look that great with Church getting hurt and Schneider not living up to the hype behind the plate. Hopefully Church will bounce back for you and Schneider will maintain his level at least. But I’d take Milledge if we could get him.
http://washington.nationals.ml.....9053423563
Rebecca no not really because the Mets are a clown college.
Chad Cordero is a free agent and coming off shoulder surgery, July 8th that could require 9-12 months or more to rehab
Yankeetrader,
I think saito was the best signing because he only costs 1.5mil and has the highest upside of any of them with the numbers his has put up the last three seasons.
What do you mean showcare Sheets? They are showing every single team he want to look all his medical records? What free agent risky or not pitches in front of teams? Thats kind of ridiculous. Why didnt pavano have to showcase himself in front of the indians? He is certainly more risky than sheets. Why didnt smoltz showcase himself to the sox? He is more risky than sheets too. Or baldelli for that matter? He is probably the most injury prone player in baseball. What about prior why isnt he showcasing himself? he certainly holds a lot of risk. Why should sheets have to do something that none of these other players who have far more risk have to do?
Rebecca– You’re exactly right about Milledge. That’s the guy who was high fiving the fans down the 3rd base line when he hit a homer with the mets. He is a good prospect though.
Brandon– Bernadina’s minor league stats look nice, real good OPS. Why would they give up on him? He’s only 24-25.
Brandon,
forget about Milledge, I would want Ross Detwiler instead.
Rebecca- The milledge situation was overblown. They didnt like him high-fiving fans on his way out to the field. Hed be a very good pickup for Nady, but not for swisher. To others it may differ but i value swisher much higher than nady
“forget about Milledge, I would want Ross Detwiler instead.”
LOL fat chance.
Well Garland is terrible so he’d have to be the 5 instead of Perez,and that’s if he even made the team. I’d much prefer Randy Wolf. The OF defense of that team would probably be the worst OF defense of all time. Jim Edmonds would be a better choice for CF over Griffey, but not a great one either.
Brandon,
LOL, wanna what else is a fat chance? Jeseus Flores. LOL
Cordero’s a free agent. I’d love to bring him in too but it wont happen. If the Mets were smart they’d bring him in to truly push they’re new pen to the next level. I think they have one spot in their pen they could shift people around and Cordero would be a great signing for them IMO. But yeah, the Nats let him go because of his injury. He’s way ahead of where they thought he would be. The Nats are going to check him out for sure to see if he’s ready to come back. You never know about arms off of injury though.
Brandon, Rob and I’m a Met Fan: Thank you, a lot.
From what I understand, Milledge and someone else had major attitude problems, but the other person’s was worse, only I can’t remember who that was.
Anyway, the way Cashman works, I expect him to turn around and do something like Swisher for Pujols.
(yes, I know that you could never, in fact, trade Swisher for Pujols).
Is Emilio Bonifacio still on the Nats ?
Jeff,
Damon is coming off an excellent and healthy season. The yanks are not expecting matsui to play the field at all. i AGREE – a third starter will be solid for nady that is why i like harang. Swisher and nady are both getting a lot of money next season – if they really need a backup outfielder because damon is a risk they can sign one for a million or 2. Five is a lot for a backup and nady cant even play center. fURTHERMORE, melky can backup and gardner can start or the yanks can trade for a center fielder and gardner can backup the outfield. Point is, if we can get something of value that we need, nady should be expendable.
“Is Emilio Bonifacio still on the Nats ?”
he was traded to the Marlins for Willingham and Olsen.
Not a bad team at all. I put Gabe Kapler on my roster to play center rather than Griffey, because Griffey isn’t a center fielder anymore.
“From what I understand, Milledge and someone else had major attitude problems, but the other person’s was worse, only I can’t remember who that was.”
Our buddy sand-pit Billy Waggles
Dave
If you want a job, a good job, you’ll have to showcase yourself. If there was recent film, since his injury, and accurate footage of Sheets throwing off a mound at 90 feet, like was seen of Smoltz, by the Red Sox, then maybe he’d have more interest.
Brandon-
Thanks for the link to Bernadina.
Roger Bernadina is a great suggestion. I’d take him in a second.
Rebecca — Do you mean with the mets? The wilpon’s are very strict about attitude stuff (to a fault eg. Manny) and i cant really remember anything since the Bonilla Henderson poker game that was truly a detriment to the team. Milledge was a young guy and he was kinda flashy but again the reports were overblown. You may be thinking of Dukes who is also on washington now
“he was traded to the Marlins for Willingham and Olsen.”
Damn.
Rebecca,
When did cashman work in that way? I must have slept through that off season. Cashman will end up signing perez and him and Burnett he wont play a game through the entire length of their contract. That sounds more like cashmans hand work over the past five years. But i have no complains so far this off season outside of burnett and five years. Burnett barely deserves 3 but tex and cc were solid and i loved the swisher trade. All we need is another starter and maybe juan cruz and that is that.
Rebecca–Optimist Prime–Staying to write the story
January 10th, 2009 at 4:13 pm
Brandon, Rob and I’m a Met Fan: Thank you, a lot.
From what I understand, Milledge and someone else had major attitude problems, but the other person’s was worse, only I can’t remember who that was.
————————————————————
The other would be Elijah Dukes.
Rebecca, What I was attempting to say, that teams that have had great success , seem to have a superiority attitude as do their fans…..I as a Yankee fan as well as a UCLA b-ball fan, I look at other teams with a less that shinning resume as the half-not…..Jock-strap menality I guess….
Dave — I agree with everything you said. CC and Tex were overpaid, but all premium players are besides Pujols i would say. Swisher was a great pickup. But I dont think anybody understands the AJ signing.
yankeetrader,
I dunno what sheets has done to try to secure a job. But if the brewers are still interested in him that is a VERY big sign – it means they still feel he is worth another contract. And if the brewers think that, then I am going to believe them because medical records dont tell you as much as what the team he has been on his entire career knows.
http://washington.nationals.ml.....7023050354
Can someone get me rankings on Bernadina’s fielding ability. Uzr and w/e else you can get, fielding bible if you must.
yea -cashman has done a good job this off season but a move like swisher for pujols is very far from a cashman like move in the recent past.
GB, Rob, et al: Elijah Dukes is, in fact the other player I was looking at.
Pat M: Thanks.
Dave: I only mean that Cashman tends to operate by stealth. Not many people thought the Yankees had a realistic shot at Teixiera until it was a done deal. No one saw the Nady/Marte deal, and even less the Pudge/Farnsworth deal.
If we can get Milledge for Nady, you gotta do that in a heartbeat. Milledge can play CF for us next year then transition to LF after that if AJax is ready. It will probably take a young arm to get him as well. Maybe a Nady/Horne package??
Brandon:
http://www.baseball-reference......ro01.shtml
one error in 20 games…I’m not sure how to read the other fielding stats.
Hmmm, do I have to pick this game without S.A.’s advice??? Ok, go Titans. I have too many Yankee-hating Baltimore relatives to root for the Ravens unless I had some other sporting interest in them.
Milledge, Alberto Gonzalez, and lefty Scott Olsen for Nady, Ramirez[Edwar], Albaladejo, and Kennedy, or some facsimile of a like deal.
Rodg — I mentioned it earlier, but you really dont want milledge in CF unless the division is already clinced. His runs created cant balance out his futility in CF. As i mentioned earlier hes average for a corner position. And his bat is bound to improve so a nady for milledge steal would be a trade. In swishers worst year his OBP was only 4 pts below nadys career. Def trade nady now while he has value
“one error in 20 games…I’m not sure how to read the other fielding stats.”
That’s good but we need more detailed. His bat was horrible, he has upside but it was near putrid in yr.1..in the minors he was high OBP the last 2 yrs. and a decent slugging last season. Him and Milledge could be nice if this is the best deal which I doubt it is.
just throwing this one out there;
how about a trade of Nady to the Reds for Jeff Keppinger and a minor leager? he’d be a good utility infielder off the bench.
Nick in SF….I’m playing the Titans and Carolina …
“just throwing this one out there;
how about a trade of Nady to the Reds for Jeff Keppinger and a minor leager? he’d be a good utility infielder off the bench.”
Not enough. Keppinger is a good hitter, but a bad fulltime fielder.
You don’t trade Nady, a guy coming off a career year, for a utility player.
Good to know, PAT M. Looking good so far. I got hit by St. Mary’s last night, the Titans can make it up.
I’m losing patience for a yes or no with Andy Pettitte.
Is Randy Wolf an option ?
http://houston.astros.mlb.com/....._id=150116
Met Fan –
Didn’t realize Milledge struggled so much in CF. Complicates the deal if he can’t play CF. I’d still prefer Milledge to Nady though. Even if they both play corners.
“I’m losing patience for a yes or no with Andy Pettitte.”
didn’t you know Pettitee rejected the offer?
Lefty: Wolf didn’t pitch well last year at the Stadium…his numbers last year may have been inflated by the time he spent pitching in San Diego.
Look at his road stats before anything else.
Nady for Keppinger
you dont trade a position player for a bench guy
unless your getting a top prospect…keppinger would just be a throw in
Wolf is an option; a bad option.
PAT M: Cal is now at -5.5, I think your call moved the market.
Rebecca — I beg to differ. Were i cashman he traded for swisher at the right time, and now would be the time to trade nady. His numbers dropped dramatically when he went to you guys and his career year is held up by his time with the pirates. Trade him while his value is high.
Nick in SF January 10th, 2009 at 4:33 pm
Hmmm, do I have to pick this game without S.A.’s advice??? Ok, go Titans. I have too many Yankee-hating Baltimore relatives to root for the Ravens unless I had some other sporting interest in them.
============================================
Uh Oh. I finally decided on the Titans too.
I say the panthers later today will be purring in delight.
SA,
Remember few weeks ago, I told you that Pacman would disappear like the video game? LOL, and I was right.
Check point for me. lol.
Rebecca,
Yea I gotcha. I am just saying while no one knows moves before he makes them he doesnt always make the best moves. The farnsy – pudge deal was worthless and the nady/marte deal was a salary dump by the pirates as usual. But the swisher deal was solid and the nady marte deal certainly worked out and the yanks got the deal and not the sox or someone else which is a positive as anyone could have taken on their salaries.
Fact is we need a fifth starter – i dont care how cashman does it and i dont even care who he ends up getting as long as they are a major league fourth starter and as long as he actually makes the deal rather then going into the season relying on aceves/joba/hughes/kennedy to fill the fourth and fifth spot which is far too reminiscent of last off season. While Wang Moose and pettitte were not nearly as good a top three as CC, Wang and AJ we cannot rely on all three to stay healthy as we couldnt last season. iF even on of those three goes down with injury (and im looking at burnett) we will be forced to move Joba up to the third slot, put aceves in the fourth and hughes in the fifth. That is NOT good considering none of them can pitch even close to 200 innings this season. Thus, we need another starter like pettitte or harang that can pitch 200 innings of quality ball over the course of the season. Pettitte isnt looking very likely right now so time to start looking at sheets, garland, perez or trading nady for harang or someone else using minor league pitching talent.
S.A.: I’m not worried by your picks; sometimes you’re right!
Ha Nick!
Ed did you see that idiot Pacman on the CBS pregame show. He seemed like he was high. He said he thinks he will be back with the cowboys next season.
Holy TD Ravens
The whole Pettite negotiation issue has been played out in the media, so to get him signed both sides are going to need to come to an agreement that saves face for both parties….Andy signs for 12 million plus a durability incentitve clause……As for Cal, it’s the best pick of the day…..That number will drop as the morning and afternoon games are completed……Damn, Ravens score….
time for a new expansion team?
SA,
Yes. in his dreams he would be back with Dallas.
Hmmmm, Ravens score just after S.A. goes public…
What is with all the we need to trade nady for a position player talk. We dont really need a position player – we need another starter. Starters are just as crucial to the season as position players in case no one has noticed. And our lineup is already stacked – gardner in the ninth spot isnt horrible. And mets fan is right. Nady’s value has NEVER been higher. Trading him now is the best way to go and trading him for a guy whos value has never been lower like harang is even better.
Ed – American League, prepare to be scared! CC, Aj, and MT!! January 10th, 2009 at 5:10 pm
SA,
Yes. in his dreams he would be back with Dallas.
=============================================
lol
Well remember: I did say it seemed like he was high. So it could have been due to that
Pat,
If the yanks sign pettitte for 12 mil plus incentives then pettitte is certainly saving more face than the yanks. The yanks want to give him 10 mil and pettitte’s current market value is around 8 mil. When pettitte sees that he can eitehr get less money from another team, 10 mil from the yanks or retire, he will either take the yanks offer or retire. The yanks wont and shouldnt up there offer because NO one in the league is offering him 10 mil nevermind more.
Met Fan: I’m not sure what you mean, but my point is that you don’t trade Nady for Keppinger because you can get a lot better than Keppinger for Nady right now.
Jeff Keppinger is the perfect UT player but we’d better get more than that. You want to throw Phillips or Arroyo or Harang in with Keppinger for Nady or Swisher and a prospect I’m down.
Yankee Trader
lannan would be nice.
would they do a nady os swish straight up???
“Fact is we need a fifth starter – i dont care how cashman does it and i dont even care who he ends up getting as long as they are a major league fourth starter and as long as he actually makes the deal rather then going into the season relying on aceves/joba/hughes/kennedy to fill the fourth and fifth spot which is far too reminiscent of last off season.”
Is Dave reading my mind?
OMG did you just see that Ray Lewis hit on Hall just now? WOW!!!
Man, I thought Chris Johnson was gonna just be another Combine fluke but he can really run.
Giantthinker,
You and I have been on the same page for days now. So many people on this blog think that sheets is too risky at any price and that Harang’s three year deal will block Hughes and that pettitte’s negotiations are finished but the point is to try and figure out how we CAN get another start not to try and figure out why each of these acquisitions wouldnt work. And after the criticism about why these things wouldnt work, there is no explanations of who is better or how else we can get a starter just why we cant. Its amazing sometimes how some refuse to think outside the box a bit.
Hey, you guys think we could get Milledge and Nick Johnson for Nady? They want Nady to play 1B. Johnson is always hurt and thats why they want someone else in the first place. However, the Yanks have wanted Johnson back since he left. He’d be a hell of a bat and backup 1B off the bench for us and his stock is so low I’m sure he’d be a throw in. If we could get a package like that I’d sign off on it right now!
dave, deep breaths. I don’t think Cashman is waiting for a consensus to form on LoHud before he fills that last slot in the rotation. We have even less of an idea what Cashman thinks/knows about Sheets than we do about other things. It’s fine to debate it ad nauseum, but you know that convincing folks on here isn’t going to help get Sheets, right?
Dave-Sheets has ace stuff. He started 31 games last season! Its crazy he’s still out there. If we’re talking a #2 spot I understand being wary of his injuries but we’re talking a #4-#5 rotation spot. If you plug Sheets into our rotation that would give us all 5 guys who have ace potential. I wanted Sheets over Burnett but if we can have both I think we have to. Plus it will only cost us a 4th RD pick? IMO you have to do it. We can sign him to a 1 year deal if he wants to prove he’s healthy. I’d rather sign him to a 2 or 3 year deal but I’d just be happy to have him. I hope Ca$hman comes around to it. I think Juan Cruz would be a great signing also but I’d rather have Sheets. Sheets was a very big innings eater before the 2005-2007 stretch where he was injured a lot. Besides that the guy takes he mound for you and gives you quality. He’s got a 3.72 career ERA and averages 178.5 innings a year. Lets be dramatic and say Sheets only gives you 100 innings thats still 100 innings less we had to use our young guys like Hughes and Aceves who will be needed at one point or another anyway. Why not keep those guys fresh? Sheets market consist of the Rangers and thats it right now. Why not scoop him up and have an elite rotation that can carry us to the post-season? SIGN BEN SHEETS!!!
http://www.baseball-reference......be01.shtml
Teams were hot for Sheets, then they saw his medicals and there have been no offers. Could it be, that there is something there that no one likes?
gianthinker: Why on the earth would the Yankees need Johnson when they’ve got Swisher to back of Teixiera?
As for Sheets,
read this article: http://www.hardballtimes.com/m.....en-sheets/
I did a blog post on it, but the HT article explains it much better than I ever could.
If the Yankees could get Sheets for free, that’d be one thing. But he’s a former #1 starter. It’s not worth the money it’d cost.
Rebecca — Oh i agree, i wasnt commenting on kepp. I just think now is the time to trade nady. Because i firmly believe his stock will drop this year. Does this game remind anyone of the Titans Ravens playoff game in 2000? Titans destroy the ravens statistically but somehow baltimore stays in the game. Im rooting for baltimore so hopefully this game ends up the same as the 2000 game
Forget Sheets.
They need someone who is capable of taking the mound every five days.
There’s not a chance in hell Cashman rolls the dice on him when they’ve already got a high risk/ high reward guy in the rotation in Burnett.
I still say Pettitte will eventually resign. It just might take a little while longer.
Nick,
I really should start reminding myself of that fact daily. It just gets a tad frustrating when the consistent posts are why this person or that person is bad for the club. I hope cash is smarter than some on this blog and realizes that no matter who, we need another signing. It would be ridiculous to leave the last spot open – it is like building a multimillion dollar massion with 60 inch tv screens in every room and stain glass murals and marble floors but forgetting to put in a back wall. Ehh not the best metaphor but you get the idea.
Giantthink,
I agree with almost everything you said. Except that the brewers are also still in the market for sheets as of three days ago via mlbtraderumors and others. Also, signing him for three or even two guaranteed years may end up being a mistake. Unless its a deal breaker, i would give him one year with a team or vesting option based on performance. The entire contract should be incentive based – maybe 6 to 8 million guaraneed with incentives going all the way up to 15 mil for both years. i ALSO wanted sheets more than burnett as did MANY, MANY people on this blog. In pete’s original vote sheets had double the number of votes as burnett i believe. And that was when he was asking for three years. If the brewers still want him, i cant imagine his health is as bad as some would have us believe and they know him pretty well.
I’m with the astute Mr. Franco…..Pettite will re-sign, it makes too much sense for both parties…..It just has to appear good ( PR wisw ) for both sides…..12 million is the number….
Ed- Cordero is a FA, the Yanks should take a flier on an extra lefty. Also when healthy his ERA is 3 and under! Yanks could catch lightning in a bottle the guy had 47 saves at age 23!
I’d ask for Milledge + Bernadina
===================================
why ask for 2 cf or a cf & a corner outfielder,makes no sense at all.
Bernadina though a small sample has terrible numbers & is not proven,Milledge is not that good.
i could see Justin Maxwell & Lannan.maxwell has speed,good glove but a lot of upside.
he was injured last year & i don’t know his status but if we can get him & lannan for nady or swish & if we have to throw kennedy in i would.
we get a cf & lefty pitcher.these are the kinds of trades the yankees are bad at.
As previously stated, I am also in the Pettitte-will-come-home crowd. The final piece, makes too much sense.
Then again, it would make a lot of sense for the Titans to be up a couple scores right now, yet they’re not.
I want to hear Shannon Sharpe read Finnegans Wake out loud.
Al. Cordero is a right handed pitcher
Cashman isn’t going to sign Sheets because he’s a health-wise clone of A.J. and that would be a foolish risk. Most likely scenario is still to resign Pettitte, which I would say is 50:50 right now.
Loving this BAL-TEN dogfight, traditional defensive/physical smashmouth football in terrible weather on a dodgy playing field. Beautiful. TEN wins 16-13 in overtime. CAR to win 27-17 tonight, NYG makes up for the egg they layed against PHI 6 weeks ago, 24-20, and SDG shocks PIT 20-17.
Cordero had the same surgury Smoltz had (labrum).
The argument that the yanks shouldnt sign ben sheets because no other team seems to wants him or that he shouldnt be acquired because he is still on the market and if he was THAT healthy, he wouldnt still be on the market is a straw man argument. Every other team wanted Carl Pavano and how did that work out? I heard any one would have traded for Randy Johnson and how did that work out for NY? Just because every team or no team wants to do something doesnt mean it is the right thing to do. And not every team is not interested in sheets because the brewers and rangers are.
Al-
Cordero is right-handed.
“As previously stated, I am also in the Pettitte-will-come-home crowd. The final piece, makes too much sense.
Then again, it would make a lot of sense for the Titans to be up a couple scores right now, yet they’re not.”
Well said.
Yeah Nick in SF,,,What going on ???? White never fumbled when he ran at USC….Chargers shock the world tomorrow….
People are not “interested” because of the economy and the way it is right now, also teams want to wait for the price tag to go down. If Sheets can out and I said Id take a deal say 2 years $15 million id be shocked if 15 teams didnt call in the first hour of that statement. Sheets is very good option for #5 for the YANKS if they go that route. LETS GO GMEN
nady/swisher & kennedy for lannan & justin maxwell would be sweet.
we get a young,cheap,fast cf with a good glove and a ton of upside & a young lefty who eats innings & we lower payroll.
bombshell,
So your argument is that because the yanks were stupid enough to give someone as risky as AJ five years and 82 mil guaranteed that they shouldnt go out on a limb and give sheets a one year incentive based deal. Doesnt make a whole lot of sense. If anything if the yanks felt AJ deserved a contract like THAT, they should be wise enough to realize sheets with similar risk would cerainly deserve a contract at an eighth of the cost and a fifth of the years.
If pettite comes to the yanks with a one year 10 mil deal in hand, I would be shocked if the yanks didnt go up to 12 mil. Until that point, why should the yanks bid against themselves and where is pettite going to go for less money than the yanks are willing to give him except into retirement? Most people believe that if you want only one job in one area that you dont have the leverage to get more money than in another area. Pettitte somehow thinks that because he only wants to play for the yanks, they should pay him more money than any other team is will to give him when it is quite the opposite. iF pettitte only wants to play in NY then the yanks have the ability to offer him the same as another team and still get him to play with the yanks.
Dave I defended the A.J. move, I think it was just about worth the risk. Two risks? Not sure about that. I would only do it if we only gave him a one year deal with an option and the contract is something like 5-6 mil with possible 9 mil if he starts enough games. Maybe you already argued something like this but I don’t have the time to go back and look through the thread. I still think Cashman won’t do it. Pettitte is the frontrunner for me.
dave -
The argument is if you’ve already decided to go with one guy who was a health risk, you really should NOT be going for a second one. No one argues that Sheets isn’t one of the most talented pitchers around IF HEALTHY. Sheets’ problem is that going forward, the chances of him staying healthy enough are slim. Since the Yankees need a guy in their rotation to eat innings, Sheets is not their guy. It’s a shame, but that’s what it is.
Bombshell,
You thought five years and 82 mil is worth the risk for AJ? but sheet’s risk isnt worth any more than 5 mil guaranteed for one year with incentives. While i agree with your second point – i think 6 mil guaranteed with incentives going all the way up to 15 mil is fair for one year of sheets, i never in any frame of mind would think aj DESERVED the contract the yanks gave him despite the market value. Even in aj’s so called career year his total numbers were only mediocre or decent. And he has only managed to stay healthy for three of his nine years. Five years for a guy that has only been healthy for three years of nine is NOT worth the risk IMO. It is similar to pavano in the fact that he was also coming off a career year and had only been healthy for two years in his six or seven year career. No one should ever get more guaranteed years than they have had healthy years in MLB service.
So..I think I’m gonna keep my NFL picks for tomorrow to myself.
Titans leaving a whole lotta points on the field
Rebecca
Yogi was Right makes me homesick. I miss the Food.
Nick
Have you started crime and punishment yet?
dave: I’m not sure how many times and in how many different ways we can say this, but Sheets’ concerns are different than AJ’s and bigger, as well.
For one thing, Burnett was _healthy_ all of last season; Sheets wasn’t.
Never mind that Sheets’ issues are rotator-cuff bassed, which can be extremely difficult, if not impossible to come back from–remember Jorge Posada last year? This is what you’re looking at, only worse, because Sheets throws more and with more force than Posada does.
Never mind also that Sheets has only pitched in the NL, has a .500 record in interleague play and would have to adjust to AL line ups.
Between Sheets and Burnett, it’s not even close.
Sheets is a number one type; Burnett was a #2 behind Halladay.
If Sheets hasn’t gotten an offer it’s not because all the other teams don’t know he’s available…
Doreen,
That makes sense but sheets will be slated to be our fourth starter. With joba, hughes and aceves all perfectly capable of pitching 100 innings of quality ball even 120 innings for sheets would be fine – he wouldnt reach most of the incentives meaning he would still remain pretty cheap and he would give us about the number of innings we need in order for hughes to take over. Further, joba can pitch 150 innings or so and aceves can take over for him. iD RATHER have 120 innings with sheets (which is his career low) then try to get 400 innings out of joba, aceves and hughes. I understand that pettitte or someone else would be more beneficial and more likely to stay healthy and pitch 200 innings filling an even greater need but if pettitte is a no go and there isnt much else out there, i would take a flier on sheets.
TarheelYank: thank you very much
It’s amazing how much you can pick up just by walking down the streets by yourself…
Tarheelyank, you’re not asking the right question. Let me help:
“Have you –started– finished crime and punishment yet?”
Almost, probably one more post away.
Rebecca,
You can say it until you turn blue in the face but it doesnt mean it is true. Sheets injuries are not rotator cuff based – they WERE rotator cuff based back in 2006 but his latest and current injury was to the forearm NOT THE SHOULDER. And despite some strange articles to the contrary, nothing i mean no single article until january discussed anything about sheets shoulder or back which were injuries he had back in 2006 and 2007. in 2008, he was healthy the entire season until september when he came out with a torn forearm muscle. Not a back injury and not a rotator cuff injury. AJ was healthy all of last year but no year prior since 2005 so while he is not injured currently, he is a big injury risk overall. Finally, we gave burnett five guaranteed years and sheets will probably cost one year with a possible option. Total risk is irrelevant – the point is whether or not AJ’s risk warrant a five year deal and whether or not sheets current risk warrants a one year deal. iT IS not an argument over who has more injury risk next year, the argument is whether the contract is worth the risk in years to come. Fact is, giving burnett a five year deal when he has NEVER had two consecutive injury free seasons is probably MORE risky than giving sheets a one year deal when he has had three consecutive injury free seasons and never pitched less than 120 innings and never made less than 17 starts in any given season.
Dave, Regarding Sheets, you may want to start thinking inside the box….His med chart must look rather grim…..
The reason why Sheets doesn’t have a job yet is not because of the economy. It’s because of his health.
Burnett didn’t have any problems finding a job. If the Yanks hadn’t signed him, the Braves would have done it.
Talents like Sheets aren’t jobless this long without a legitimate reason. And the reason is that his medicals have teams running scared.
Pete said the other day that he personally heard officials from three organizations tell him that Sheets’ medicals were not good at all.
What the Yanks need now is a guy who is capable of throwing 200 IP next season.
The odds are better that Megan Fox shows up on my doorstep than Ben Sheets throwing 200 IP in 2009.
dave -
Basically what you’re proposing is, if the Yankees get Sheets and he can’t give you those the needed innings, that you have 5th starter (without regard to actual order in the rotation) by committee. That Yankees, frankly, have “been there, done that” and more than once.
Now, nothing that major league teams do or don’t do surprises me; and who knows, maybe as the season gets closer, they do take a flyer on Sheets. But I don’t think that’s the way they really want to do it this season. I think they want their rotation fairly set. And I don’t think they want to go to the prospects one second before they’re ready, unless they absolutely have no other choice.
The Yankees can’t go into the season with 3/5ths of the rotation as risks. Joba has an innings limit, A.J. may not pitch 200 innings and Sheets has a bad back, a bad shoulder, and an elbow that may explode.
Also, for those who like Russian Literature read The Master and Margarita.
And the idea that sheets has zero interest is simply not true. Both the brewers and the rangers have expressed significant interest in signing sheets next year. The reason sheets is STILL on the market is more likely that he hasnt receieved an offer that he has liked rather than the idea that he has no interest at all. The brewers thought it worth the risk to offer him 14 mil in arbitration in order to recieve a first round draft pick and sheets thought he would get more interest despite his medical records and get offered more than 14 mil per season – other wise, close would have accepted the arbitration offer. Although most media outlets would have us believe that signing sheets even for one year is the equivalent to giving Baldelli a 5 year contract, facts it seems have pointed to the fact that sheets is not nearly that risky at least in the minds of the brewers and in the mind of Casey Close (Ben’s agent).
Also, from what I’ve read, heard, and what I understand, some of Sheets’ injuries people don’t really understand what the origin is – notably the injury to the back shoulder area (forget the name). He comes up with really weird injuries.
Unfortunately, the Yankees are really not in the position to take this chance. I’ll bet they think it stinks, too.
The Yankees can’t afford to wait for a decision from Pettitte. If he decides to retire or sign elsewhere, Cashman must have an opportunity to pursue alternatives. The Braves are making a big push for Lowe, and the Mets have shifted their focus to Perez. That’s a big window of opportunity closing right there. Once those two are signed, the leftover teams will make a scramble for the next tier of starters.
It might be time for Andy to be given a deadline. This staredown has gone on long enough.
Nick
I hear War and Peace is easy reading.
Comparatively speaking of course.
dave:
The MRIs that went around _this_ offseason were obviously worrying enough.
Rotator cuff damage isn’t something that goes away over night, and it gets worse with time.
Why do you think everyone was all like ZOMG JORGE HAVE THE SURGERY ALREADY last year?
It’s because eventually with that type of injury, if you keep doing strenuous things, like, I don’t know, _pitching_, you will likely aggravate it and you will eventually need surgery.
Maybe you’re willing to live with that risk, but the Yankees’ front office is not.
Sheets vs. AJ? Sheets is hurt, right now. AJ is healthy. Sheets is chronically injured, in a myriad of ways over his career. AJ had an elbow surgery, complications from that, and is now over it. The two aren’t comparable IMHO.
dave-
History of shoulder and back and elbow injuries trumps history of elbow injuries every single time. Please stop saying that Sheets represents the same amount of risk as Burnett as this point. It’s simply not the case.
“Both the brewers and the rangers have expressed significant interest in signing sheets next year.”
I wouldn’t make much of Texas’ interest. That’s not a front office known for making sensible decisions, especially with pitching.
dave,
have you seen Sheets’s latest medicals?
dave,
Still in agony over our rotation?
There’s no crisis. We are already the best team in baseball.
I like Andy, but Hughes, Aceves and Kennedy could fill out the rotation just fine.
“Although most media outlets would have us believe that signing sheets even for one year is the equivalent to giving Baldelli a 5 year contract”
dave, please don’t sensationalize. It only makes your arguments weaker.
dave are you related to Sheets by any chance?
dave -
Girardi spoke glowingly of Sheets – he no doubt wanted him. If the medicals were the least bit encouraging, he’d be a Yankee by now, especially with Pettitte doing his usual off-season procrastination dance.
Doreen,
I REALLY hope you are right because currently, the yanks are in the exact same shape they would be in if we sign sheets and he gets injured being that we have no definite starter for one spot and joba is guaranteed not to start every start the entire season. I like sheets but i dont think he is essential. What i do think is essentia is exactly what you said above – we need to sign another arm so that we dont have to rely on young guys and a starter by committe situation as we had last season. i DONT mind signing sheet but i also dont mind giving pettitte 12 million (even though it is ridiculous) nor do i mind trading nady for harang or any other starter of that caliber for that matter. We need innings and quality ones and right now, we have no one to fill that role.
Cuiseppe,
I understand what you are saying. He did pitch 200 innings last season however. Also, the brewers felt it worth the risk to offer him 14 mil in arbitration and sheets felt he would get more and knew EXACTLY what his medical records and doctors had said regarding his health. Also, the brewers have not only offered him arbitration but later, got back into the discussion of whether or not they should re-sign him for next season. And while i know the yankees and other MLB teams have alot of info at their disposal, no team knows sheet’s health better than the brewers. If the brewers feel as if sheets can stay healthy next year, why shouldnt we?
I didn’t see it, but I heard Joba looked fat and WAY out of shape on a recent CNBC interview….anyone concerned about this? It’s only a month and a half until pitchers and catchers – these guys should be mostly in fighting trim by now.
Maybe Sheets screwed up by turning down arbitration. Maybe he misjudged the market. Maybe he was thinking too far outside the box. People, even people attempting to act in their own best interests, do err. This should be obvious, dave, as you seem to think that Cashman is erring.
Wow 1st & Goal Ravens and another Titans player with an injury
Suddenly I’m getting a uneasy feeling about this game and my investment….
Doreen: I think you put it much better than I ever could have!
“Hughes, Aceves and Kennedy could fill out the rotation just fine.”
You have nothing to back this up. You’re talking about three guys who have combined for, what, 5 or 6 decent major league starts?
If the brewers feel as if sheets can stay healthy next year, why shouldnt we?
———-
Because there’s no need for the Yanks to roll the dice on him. What they need is stability at the back end of that rotation.
Sheets provides anything but that right now.
You cannot have that many risks in the same rotation, especially when you’ve spent $420M+ to get this team back to the World Series in 2009.
Confucious,
By golly you’re right. Let’s get Sheets, and sign Lowe too in case Sheets gets hurt. 120 wins or bust.
Betsy-here is a link to that cnbc interview. It was Joba and David Ortiz.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/1584023.....038;play=1
Joba does seem a little out of shape but he was a bit hefty to begin with. Maybe the beard and shirt was not helping either..
I’m not sure what the interest in Lastings Milledge is about, never mind bernadina (who is awful… he’s brett gardner but not as fast and not as good a hitter which says something…).
Trading for a CF who is not really a CF is not a good value proposition. You wind up getting a bad bat – one that would be OK in CF but terrible in LF/RF and poor up the middle defense. If later on you decide that that player can’t play CF then you are stuck as his bat won’t play in a corner spot.
And Milledge is not a CF. He’s just not a good fielder. On top of that I have trouble seeing how his attitude problems would play in the yankees straight laced, veteran club house. Could you imagine how Jeter, Alex and Posada would react to him high fiving a fan? Cano might lose concentration but he’s not a problem. Cano is a stretch as it is given how focused so many on the team were. I can’t see Milledge fitting in.
The yankees in 2007 had the 4th highest walk rate in baseball. In 2008 they were 21st. They need to get back to being a patient team. Milledge does not fit into that style of play either in the short term or long term.
Washington just doesn’t have much talent at all. I have trouble seeing how a trade would be worked out for Nady there.
One team that I could see possibly being interested in Nady that might be a trade partner would be the Braves. If they sign Lowe then they’ll have a shot at the playoffs. I could see them wanting to take a shot while Chipper is still on the team. I think they like Nady also.
Rebecca =
Thanks!
I think if they don’t come to terms with Pettitte this week, this situation will not be settled until after pitchers and catchers report. That’s my guess, anyway.
I personally hope they just offer Pettitte 12, see what he does and if it’s a no – go from there.
rog,
The brewers have sheets medical and some of his doctors work for the organization and the team remains interested. And I am not sensationalizing – the media is! i AM just pointing out how much the media has seemed to skewed the situation in favor of AJ and against sheets merely because sheets was injured at the tail end of last season and AJ was not.
Wave your hate,
Relying on those three to fill two spots and any injuries is the equivalent of what we did last season. And that didnt work out well for us. I just feel if the yanks dont sign another arm it appears they havent learned their lesson and history may repeat itself as it usually does.
Guys,
You are implying that i think burnett is more of a risk than sheets currently. He is not. I am simply saying that his five year contract is very risky considering that he has only been healthy for one season and never two consecutive seasons at a time. And if burnett is over his injuries, thats great but he had that surgery quite a few years back and he has been injured many, many times since.
SA,
Im not related to sheets but i wish i was – i could use some money.
When it the next “Wave Your Hate” typo coming?
Guiseppe, what other handle were you using recently?
dave -
The Brewers interest in Sheets doesn’t mean a ton in my book. They are not needing the same thing as us and are in a different position than us. They can more easily roll the dice on Sheets and hope he stays injury free than we can. Their starting pitching is really hurting right now…what other alternatives are there for them?? I do agree with you that we need to sign/trade for another veteran starter for our rotation. I would hate to go into next year counting on 2 youngsters to have spots in the rotation after all we’ve done this offseason. I ultimately hope we can work out something with Pettitte. Makes too much sense for both sides to not come to a deal.
ooops, the hate beat me to it!
Im not related to sheets but i wish i was – i could use some money.
===============================================
Haha
That reminds me, must call mom and say hello
Hey Nick, should I change my name? Is there such a thing as a Freudian typo?
Guiseppe, what other handle were you using recently?
————
Not sure what you mean.
CB-
What are you thinking the Yanks should look for from ATL in a Nady trade?
Maria Bartiromo has an annoying voice.
Pitching is the most valued commodity in the game of baseball as we all know…Most teams are in need of front line starters ( except Anaheim )…Atlanta , St. Louis , Texas are desperate for starters…Only the Rangers have shown interset in Sheets, hell the Red Sox elected to take a flyer on Smoltz & Penny rather than Sheets……Ben Sheets when right is one of the best pitchers in the game…So with that in mind, the lack of offers lead to one conclusion, there must be some real health and durability issues….If things with Pettite do indeed fall apart, maybe Cashman throws an incentive laced deal at his doorsteps and see if he responds…It is a last resort type scenerio for the Yanks I think…..Man if he could throw 185 innings and make 28 starts, Yanks are looking great come October….But Sheets couldn’t make it to October for the Cinderella Brewers last season…..
“By golly you’re right. Let’s get Sheets, and sign Lowe too in case Sheets gets hurt. 120 wins or bust.”
Well, you can get snarky and accomplish nothing, or you could actually make an effort to argue your point.
The theory going into last season was that the Yankees were the best team in baseball (maybe second to the Red Sox, but certainly a playoff contender) and that they would be ‘just fine’ with Hughes and Kennedy in the rotation. If 110 wins would have been disappointing, we missed even that mark by quite a lot.
You don’t compete in the AL East by giving rotation spots to guys you can’t rely on for quality innings.
It’s pretty crazy to think that so many people had the same idea at roughly the same time. About a week or so ago, I was thinking that you could field an entire 25 man roster from the players left out there, and, if it was at all possible, how I’d kill to start a team right now (in Brooklyn!), and compete in the AL or NL East. I thought about writing something like this on my own blog, but it’s redundant now. Had I done it a week ago, however, I would’ve put Giambi in there at 1st, had Trever Hoffman closing, and maybe switched out Varitek for Pudge. I love these veteran teams, good job, Peter!
Guiseppe: someone else has been using that “Megan Fox” line with a different handle, thought it might be you.
Wave Your Hat: keep the name, I enjoy the ‘typo’ too much.
PAT M: The Titans just don’t want to win. Unbelievable.
Nick,
I dunno if cashman is erring or not. I have no idea who he is or isnt interested in. We could sign sheets tomorrow for all i know. It seems as though the only clear and obvious fact is that we need another starter – out of pettitte, sheets, perez, garland, others or trade. i personally would probably prefer trading harang to any of these options – he is 30, making 11 million next season and will probably be better next year than any of these pitchers. He will have two years left after next and net us a solid return if traded to make room for the younger guys. Relying on joba, hughes, aceves and kennedy to fill the fourth spot, fifth spot and any and all injuries would be a HUGE mistake and one that we already made last season. The yanks would be downright foolish to have not learned their lesson from last years mess which i thought was a mistake before we even started the season. Especially, while i listened to cashman talk about how pavano turned a corner but even taking out pavano we were relying on Pettitte, Moose, wang, hughes, joba and kennedy. This year we are relying on CC, wang, AJ, Hughes, joba and aceves – if someone cant see the similarities between these two situations they dont know baseball.
Tennessee coughs it up again. Unbelievable.
TURNOVER!!! Holy smokes this is a hell of a game.
Wow. Did that really just happen in the Ravens/Titans game?
CB: So my first inclinations about Milledge were right, then…
Doreen: Honestly, I think we’re at that point where the Yankees tell Andy that they’re moving on…it’s already the middle of January, but then there are people that will think I’m a hater for it.
Dave: Other teams don’t want what the Brewers’ doctors have to say because those doctors and Sheets’ agent are going to make Sheets look as attractive as possible-correct me if I’m wrong but a team signing Sheets means the Brew Crew gets a draft pick.
If the guy Posada saw, Andrews (? I’m bad with names), said that Sheets was A-OK, then that’s one thing.
But as I’ve said time and again, right now, Sheets is not worth the risk.
CB-
Braves like Swish too. Who would you like from the Braves for Nady?
Confusius, you make some good points and I would much prefer Pettitte or another durable starter to rolling the dice with the kids again. But I disagree with your premise that snarkiness can accomplish nothing on this board, as you know.
lol what’s half the distance to the goal when you’re on the goal line?
Guiseppe: someone else has been using that “Megan Fox” line with a different handle, thought it might be you.
—————
Nope, wasn’t me. I always use the same moniker.
She has admirers everywhere, though.
I just turned the football game on.
Apparently I’ve been missing something.
BaBaBooey
Snarky my new favorite word
“But I disagree with your premise that snarkiness can accomplish nothing on this board, as you know.”
I don’t, actually. Enlighten me.
I want every Titans receiver to take a knee after catching the ball!
Rebecca -
I’m a huge proponent of signing Pettitte and upping the offer; however, that being said, enough is freakin’ enough already.
The pitching staff is too important to be playing footsie with.
I’m also hoping the Yankees have a bit more positive karma going on this season. The last 2 season have started off rather poorly, pitching-wise. It’s time for the winds to change, no?
TarheelYank: You should check out Livejournal sometime.
Sal -
Switch that to the AL/NL WEST and you might have something. I think that team struggles in either of the bEast’s. The defensive deficiencies alone would be tough to overcome in either of those divisions.
Doreen– from your fingers to Joe Pesci’s (George Carlin reference) ears. We need some good mojo to start the season. I hate starting off like 8-11.
FG time for the titans.
This is some game
Sorry, Confusius, I thought we had tangled before and that you knew I was pro-snark.
The braves have a very deep system. I think it really depends on how much they want to try to win this season if they are able to add Lowe. If they add Lowe then they have a pretty good NL team but they need more offense.
I’d try to get a young outfielder from them back for Nady. That’s an area they are very deep in.
I’m not real inclined on trading Nady but if they do I’d like to see them expand the deal to try to get back a player of value rather than marginal prospects.
The value of marginal prospects to the yanks is very low. The roster spots are too valuable at the major league level.
Tarheelyank -
I LOVE the word “snarky.”
Going back to last night’s exchange about the difference in the articles about Pavano – it really is quite interesting that using the same quotes you can tell a completely different story. You can delete some quotes; you can set off quote with whatever prose you want. It really makes the argument for reading as many sources as you can get your hands on before making any judgments. And even then, unless you’ve spoken to the guy yourself, and actually heard him speak, the inflections, etc., you’ll never ever really have an accurate “story.”
Nick enlightening Confucius– What has this world come to?
Folks, please be reasonable about Nady.
We got both Nady and Marte for Karstens, Ohlendorf, McCutcheon and Tabata.
Nady had an OPS+ of 144 with Pittsburg, 105 for us.
We got him for a pennant race.
Now, seriously, exactly how much do you think he will fetch in a trade?
Confucius-
Was I being snarky? Personally, I like Andy, as most posters here probably know. But if you don’t think Hughes and Aceves have a good shot to hold down one spot, then I think snarkiness is the way to go.
But hey, that’s just me.
Rebecca –
I didnt say the brewers doctors were making sheets look attractive to other teams. i WAS saying the brewers have all the info because of the med reports and the docotrs all came from them and they still remain interested in re-signing him and they still offered him 14 million in arbitration which to me, says it was worthf a draft pick to risk the possibility of sheets being on their team next year at 14 million in cost. i GUESS to others it means they wanted a draft pick really badly and now, they are so bad that he is worth the risk of re-signing but that is not the way i see it. The brewers actions regarding ben sheets speak louder than those of any other team because they know him better than any other team.
Any one else think nady, veras and one of aceves/steven jackson or Dan Gaise would be worth it for Harang? I think outside of pettitte, harang could be a perfect fit for the yankees next season. Young, perfectly capable of pitching 200 innings and extremely good numbers in 2007. He will come at a cheap price only because he had an offer year last year but he is young enough to easily bounce back. If we can expect pettitte to bounce back we expect harang to as well. Still further, he will net us a nice CF or Catcher next off season if he pitches well next year and we trade him to make room for hughes in the off season. he is in all of baseball probably the most ideal return for nady.
Rob, I’d settle for .500 at this point, as long as everyone is healthy!
CB, my last post about Nady wasn’t aimed at you, just the folks that think that he and some random minor leaguer are going to fetch a starter we’d want or an everyday player.
This game reminds me of the Miami game last week…..Does anyone know when the Yanks broke out of the gate well…Semms like the past 3-4 years they’ve been very sluggish at best…..I see no reason for any roster changes except for signing Pettite….I would like another right handed stick of the pine though….
Doreen: It’s not too far from what Twain once said:
Lies, damned lies, and statistics.
Doreen,
yeah I found the difrence between the two articles amazing. I assumed Pete’s link was the same article that I had read. Then I read your post and I was confused. I went to Pete’s link and realized the diffrence.
You know, is there any pitcher out there available for just 1 year, in a trade situation? The Yankees don’t need, probably don’t want, to sign a guy for more than 1 year. You don’t make trades for one-year rentals. This is why I don’t really understand the hard-lining with Pettitte. Unless they use one of their pitching prospects (or 2) in a trade for a really “wow” pitcher. And they seem to be moving away from that way of doing things.
I would LOVE to hear what pettitte actually thinks will happen when the yanks refuse to up their offer … is he planning on playing for another team for less? Finally, slunking back to the yankees for 10 mil with his head down? Retirement? Begging the yankees privately to give him 11 mil so he can save face in the eye of the public? Begging another team to at least offer him 10 mil so he doesnt look like a fool? There is not many positive options for pettitte if he doesnt get his way in the end. And Im sure a lot of people including myself have lost a ton of respect for pettitte since the whole steroid thing.
Wave Your Hat: More than Keppinger, less than others.
ugh, how was that not a delay of game??? Are these refs honest??
Would be nice for he Yanks start the season fresh, alert, in charge and in control
What a throw! No delay of game? Oh please
“But if you don’t think Hughes and Aceves have a good shot to hold down one spot, then I think snarkiness is the way to go.”
Well, if you have nothing to back up that belief, yeah, I guess it would be.
Hughes hasn’t pitched an effective major league inning in over a year. Aceves had one good month, nothing better than Kenendy the year before, and no major league track record outside of that month. It’s pretty easy to think that they can’t give me 30 decent starts.
he=the
Rebecca -
I love that quote by Twain, but I suspect there are more than a few people here who would swear by statistics!
“And Im sure a lot of people including myself have lost a ton of respect for pettitte since the whole steroid thing.”
Pettitte didn’t use steroids. If you are going to lose respect for someone, at least get it right.
Wave,
I generally agree with you. Nady isn’t going to bring much back in a trade given he’s only a year from free agency and is a boras guy.
The only situation where it would make any sense is for an older team that wants to make a run at the playoffs and needs a right handed bat.
In general Nady’s utility value to the 2009 team will be higher than his trade value.
I don’t think they’ll make any serious effort to trade Swisher given how badly they’ll need OF next year.
I LOVE hdtv! It’s a great equalizer in terms of fine lines, zits and dark circles.
Doreen,
We dont need to trade for an ace just a good pitcher and hopefully young and capable of pitching a lot of innings. And we dont nessecarily need a pitcher that has only one year left on his contract either as we can trade him after the season if need be. Why make all of these parameters to try and find a pitcher? We should look for the best option that a team is willing to trade and then, try to fit him into our long term plan. We shouldnt narrow the players we want to a precious few best on the long term plan and then, hope the teams are willing to trade those select guys.
Long field goals for the win!
Rodg12, NL West would indeed be good, but I’d argue AL West as well. All those teams will have deficiencies this year. I think I’ll call my team the Sacramento Sluggers, cause that’s about all they’ll do!
Doreen -
What brought about that comment???
I said steroid thing – i meant HGH. Sorry about that. Wave – you take the comments about pettitte far too personally. Its not like i was talking about you. And pettitte is being an arrogant, selfish baby right now – no team even wants him for 10 and for some reason, he thinks the yanks should give him 16. The guy has made over 100 million dollars. I wont for a second feel bad that he doesnt feel he is being respected. He needs to get some perspective!
43 yard FG…and it is…Good!
oh dear
Sal -
Agree with you on the AL West. That’s why I put AL/NL WEST in my post
CB….Angels need an outfielder..They really don’t want to put Figgens out there…But I do agree with you, he has more value to the Yanks than in a trade…..
rodg12-
Must be a troll.
Like I said, long FGs for the win.
dave -
I know what you’re saying. I just think it complicates things when you add a guy with multiple years on his contract with an eye toward trading him. On the one hand, it’s insurance against the minor league guys not panning out; but it’s also a disincentive for those same guys – they’ll see a smaller opportunity for joining the big club.
I know they don’t need an ace, just a solid veteran who can give innings.
The things that’s really killing here is this shouldn’t even be an issue. Pettitte should have signed weeks ago. Shoulda, woulda, coulda, I guess.
Wow. Playoff football is something else man. I played this sport for 16 years and it really pulls at your insides like heartburn watching games like this. (and i’m not talking about the nachos!) Baseball is my favorite sport to watch but football is special among the major sports.
Unless Cashman’s plan is to net a starting pitcher for Nady or Swisher, they should keep them both. We haven’t a decent bench in years, and I would much rather have Nady come on to pinch hit than Melky Cabrera or Cody Ransom.
Holy…
oooooooof, that’s not a good way to start the football weekend. Boooooooooooo!
and the Baltimore Ravens will be going to the AFC Championship game.
CB,
Does it have to be someone in contention? Cant it be any team that needs a right fielder or first baseman? And i would think a lot or even most teams in the NL would think that at last have a chance of making the playoffs on any given year.
Ravens win….Ouch….
rodg12 -
We just got hdtv on Thursday. I was watching a commercial during this football game and there was a relatively young woman who had fine lines around her eyes; there was a relatively young man with dark circles under his eyes. The other night during a college football game, there was coach with lots of bumps on his face. I’m used to regular tv where at least the actors always look perfect. It’s just refreshing to see the imperfections, I guess.
Listen, when you’re a female in the US, you grown up knowing you can’t/don’t measure up to the people you see on tv and in the movies. Even when you realize magazines are airbrushed and there are techniques to blur lenses, it does a number on your self-esteem over the years. Even if you are an attractive person, you never, ever measure up.
HDTV is an equalizer.
“I love that quote by Twain, but I suspect there are more than a few people here who would swear by statistics!”
Statistics are like bikinis- they show a lot but not everything!
Nick: Honestly, I think you just shouldn’t bet against football teams from Maryland!
HDTV is a wonderful thing
Braintrust,
I imagine cash would be fielding offers for swisiher and nady for pitching at the very least. iT IS our biggest need and one of largely expendable. Why would he not?
dave, just so you know, mastering the spitball or learning how to cork a bat will help you be a better player a lot more than HGH will, because HGH won’t help you at all. So how many people are you willing to lose respect for?
“but it’s also a disincentive for those same guys – they’ll see a smaller opportunity for joining the big club.”
And regress because of it? If they do that, I don’t want them on my ballclub. I want to see guys who are going to raise their game even if there are no open spots, guys who are going to *make* the front office notice them and open those spots.
I think Phil Hughes is a better competitor than that. But if he decides he’s not going to work hard because he sees that there’s no room in the ML rotation, then he becomes the trade chip.
I’m picking the Panthers to win tonight-so that’s pretty much the kiss of death. Put money on the cardinals people
Ha, my bad, Rodg!
On the Nady/Swisher front…I, too, think a contending team, or one that thinks they will be, is more inclined to trade for one of these guys. Nady is a free agent next year, and Swisher costs too much. Both add up to formulas that would only go well with one of those win now types of teams.
Dorreen
very true on both counts – it may be a disincentive but it is also insurance. Pettitte should be in pinstripes by now. I dont think i have ever been so disappointed with a yankee in the off season in my life.
Confucius -
Not exactly what I meant. It would be discouraging, though, don’t you think? And yes, if they stop working hard because of that, then, no, chances are they weren’t the right guys to begin with.
Doreen -
Gotcha. Interesting observation that I had never thought about. I do know I LOVE HDTV now. Tough for me to watch games that aren’t in HD now.
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
The Devils got Shanahan.
By the way, Cardinals win, we trade Nady. Panthers win, we trade Swisher.
why not make it more interesting? haha.
“It would be discouraging, though, don’t you think?”
So is sustaining an injury. Or looking at the Red Sox lineup. Real competitors don’t get discouraged, though. They just do their jobs. :\
Tom
January 10th, 2009 at 6:10 pm
Cordero had the same surgury Smoltz had (labrum).
——-
So when we were discussing Bedard, the labrum thing made him a bad get along with the attitude but Smoltz will be fine at 42 after labrum surgery?
wave,
IT was more about his actions this off season than the hgh issue. using hgh was cheating and he only admitted to it when he was forced to and there were little repercusions. But he also lied and said he wanted to pitch in the new stadium no matter what his salary and that it woudnt be about the money. Now, he wants the yanks to overpay him by far when no other team wants him for even what the yanks are offering. I dont mind everything else but the lying part really pisses me off and that is when i lost a lot of respect for the guy. He said that and he has made over 100 million dollars in his career – he is making it all about the money when he doesnt need it and he shouldnt be doing that after he said he wouldnt. He is also showing no respect for the organization and fans that whole heartedly supported him throughout the entire hgh issue despite the fact that he said nothing to warn us or the organization of this matter before signing his contract last off season. He went from being a virtuous, honest guy to being an unloyal, disrespectful, cheating, liar. But i still want him back on the yankees next season and i thinkt he yanks should give him what he wants just because we need him and it would be nice to see him in the new stadium for the memories.
PAT M, you have the Cal game? Cal down 5 with about 2:50 left.
re: Nady
Teams will want to see his arbitration outcome before any deal is considered. The hearings are February 1-21 in Phoenix. Salary figures are exchanged January 19-20.
dave, so it’s not the HGH thing, it’s that he says he wants to pitch for us but won’t pitch for the Yanks’ price?
Uh, YankeeRay, I think most of us think that signing Smoltz on the part of the Red Sox is an incredibly high risk move unlikely to pay off.
Unless I’ve been misreading everything on here since New Year’s…
Maryland is my Waterloo.
At the Yanks are counting on Syracuse to decide their roster fate…
Good call rebecca, im rooting for the Cardinals.
YankeeRay-
No, I never said that. Nor do I believe that the Smoltz signing was a good one. Cordero is not worth the risk. Nobody comming of labrum surgery is worth the risk.
Oh, and is it just me or is that Jim Mora Coors Light commercial hilarious?
“Playoffs? Playoffs? You wanna talk to about playoffs?”
Dave watch the Andy comments. I will put on my Andy police hat and spank you.
Rebecca–Optimist Prime–Staying to write the story
January 10th, 2009 at 7:57 pm
Uh, YankeeRay, I think most of us think that signing Smoltz on the part of the Red Sox is an incredibly high risk move unlikely to pay off.
Unless I’ve been misreading everything on here since New Year’s
——
I know that. I was referring to Bostons perception based on Theo and Gammons remarks. If we had signed Smoltz or traded for Bedard it would have been condsidered bad moves but Bostons is a smart move.
We on this site consider it risky and hopefully that move is along the likes of Colon.
Nick: The Yankees are going to go off of a Syracuse/Rutgers game?
At least the Panthers/Cardinals are (theoretically) evenly matched!
*”I hope the Yanks aren’t counting on Syracuse to decide their roster fate…”* is how that should have read. Stupid multi-tasking.
Those not into football can watch the Mets lose another big game on mlv tv . They are replaying Gae 7 of the 2006 NLCS (the infamous Endy Chavez catch and Beltran K)
Have I said before I am addicted to the channel lol.
Bad economy? War? Global Warming? Political upheaval? This world has been through all of this for since the beginning. Just trust in Jesus and will see you though. That is His promise and he never breaks a promise. My he bless everyone of you who believe and trust in Him.
A few years back after Andy had left the Yankees for Houston I was watching a Brian Cashman interview on the YES Network one evening in which he said that during the negotiations to resign Andy that he had called the Hendrick Bros numerous times after the Yankees initial offer was made, to resume contract talks and was told that Andy wasn’t ready, that Cashman would be contacted when Andy was ready.
Then Cashman heard the news of Andy signing with Houston from a news report.
This version of the truth of course flies in the face of the information that was in public domain at the time, the NY media blaming the Yankees and Cashman for not aggressively pursing Andy and in doing so portraying Andy as a victim leaving for the Astros with no choice.
Andy has never given an honest version of those circumstances that I know of.
I believe Brian Cashman to be a man of high integrity and his version of what went down as being the truth.
I also believe when Roger retired to then un-retire and join Andy in Houston that the entire scheme had been cooked by the two the season before. The Hendrick Bros. who sit on the board of Minute Maid field, they too in my opinion were in the scheme up their eyeballs.
This brings us where we are today. I wonder if things would be better served if Andy like Arod did before him, should dump his agents and call Cashman direct, as there has to be some degree of distrust from the Yankee front office and Cashman toward the Hendricks Bros. for all that has happened in the past.
Smoltz isn’t exactly “fine” after having Labrum surgery. He isn’t expect to contribute anything to the sox until mid to late May. And even then, at 42, who knows if he’ll have the velocity he used to have, will have responded to rehabbing, or will be able to do anything to stay on the field? It’s a huge risk for the Sox, but one that they’re able to make. I don’t think it’ll work out for them however.
Come on Cal…
Evenly matched? Maybe, but the Panthers are 10-point favorites.
PAT M: Cal game going to OT. Good for the Bears’ chances to win, not as good for the spread…
Forget that drama queen Andy. he more suited to a broadway show….and sign Braden Looper to maybe 1yr 6.5mil with an option
Keep Both Nady and Swisher….if some areas need addressed at the trade deadline then we can make a move
The pitching would wear out during the dog days.
What those players have in common is an inflated sense of their AAV. Time to get real.
O Perez pitching game 7 on MLB right now. A good chance to see how he pitches in big game moment.
I like him a lot and think he would be a great get but don’t want to block that spot beyond this year. If we got him it would give us insurance for this year and open up Joba to the pen option beyond this year.
The mets should be on him big time since it looks like Atl is all over Lowe.
hiscross
January 10th, 2009 at 8:06 pm
Bad economy? War? Global Warming? Political upheaval? This world has been through all of this for since the beginning. Just trust in Jesus and will see you though. That is His promise and he never breaks a promise. My he bless everyone of you who believe and trust in Him.
————————————————————
Jesus is still 2 years way….just in time for Posada to teach him all of his learnin’
Good game, I was pulling for Kerry Collins though, he’s had some tough luck during the course of his career.
Today with the turn-overs more of the same.
why would the Yankees even be interested in a guy like Braden Looper? He’s been a starter for two years, lets up a ton of hits, hasn’t posted a winning record as a starter and doesn’t miss bats, even remotely. That’s screaming for a 9 – 15 record and a 5.00 era in the American League
Nick: Shush! I’m enjoying my delusion.
hiscross: I’m a practicing Jew. I’ve no intention to place my faith in Jesus.
Though I will place a reasonable expectation of hope in Jesus Montero.
Hiscross– Not to get into religion, because that’s not what this is about, but If god made me in his image, and Jesus is god, I think I’ll trust in myself. I’ll see myself through thank you very much.
Nick in SF…..I have Cal getting 5…They’ll win the game outright anyway…..
Pat M.
I agree on the angels being a fit. I still find it hard to believe that they won’t sign a free agent outfielder of some kind given how badly they need a bat and the supply on the market.
That said Scoscia’s got that particular brand of ball he likes to play and I suppose none of the free agents fit…
I like Scoscia but I have to say – he’s becoming way too rigid. Every year they talk about needing a hitter behind Vlad. But the main reason they don’t score is because they just don’t get guys on base. Scoscia loves guys who are fast and put the ball in play but if you don’t get on base you’re just going to make outs at a high rate and not score much.
Nady would fit in with the Angels. He’s not very patient at the plate.
CB: As long as Scioscia can keep beating the Yankees, I’m not sure he’ll have any inclination to change his style.
Going to 2OT, PAT M. I have 6 points at -120
This is going to be the total opposite of the last game.
CAR- 28 ARZ- 35
Yes, but they can’t beat the red sox.
Rhapsody – I have long wondered if the Hendricks’ were on the up-and-up. It seemed funny when Andy went to Houston the first time, since it made so much sense, in my eyes, for the Yanks to bring him back. Then Clemens (another Hendricks client) un-retiring to go to the Astros just seemed too weird.
This time ’round, they come up with a mystery 3 yr/36M offer, that doesn’t materialize. I think the Yanks sticking to their 10M offer, despite it making sense to bring him back, speaks to the Yankees’ determination to make a stand in light of Andy and his agents dealings in the past. Not to mention concealing the HGH stuff which came out in the Mitchell report.
As time goes on, I think more and more that Cash and the Yanks are gearing themselves up for an open competition in ST for that spot. That they are preparing for Aceves, say, who is already a finished product, to win it, which will allow Phil Hughes time in Scranton to perfect hi cutter and develop some more time. I think they ultimately want Phil to fill that starting slot, but want to give him the time to grow into it.
They originally planned on Andy to keep that spot open for Hughes, but are really tired of the games he and his agents are playing. That’s what I think.
“As long as Scioscia can keep beating the Yankees, I’m not sure he’ll have any inclination to change his style.”
As long as he keeps losing to Boston year after year in the playoffs he’s being myopic in not reevaluating the way they play baseball and whether it’s suited for the post season.
They’re goal is to win the world series. That division is a joke and making the playoffs is not why Moreno has spent so much money on that team.
Nick in sf….Cal is shooting 38 % and should have put the Huskies to sleep along time ago…Romar gas a good Huskie team but really Cal Berkley is a better deeper team….CB, Nady would be a perfect fit in Disneyland and their system is loaded….That being said, I like the Yanks the way their constructed right now…Of course that is on the premise that Andy returns to the fold, which I think happens in the next week or so…Maybe after Lowe signs….
I think that Abreu would be a really good choice for the Angels. His defense is no worse than what they got from Guerrero over the last two years. He hits, drives in runs, steals bases, still has a good, accurate arm in right field and he gets his walks.
“As long as he keeps losing to Boston year after year in the playoffs he’s being myopic in not reevaluating the way they play baseball and whether it’s suited for the post season.”
Agreed.
I like Moreno…but the Angels’ inability to beat Boston in the playoffs is perhaps the one thing worse than the Yankees inability to beat them in the regular season!
Both Abreu and Dunn would be good fits with the Angles.
Rebecca – I think the Angels ability to drive the Yankees crazy in the regular season is related to the Yankees inability to have good enough starting pitching. One would hope that that changes this coming season.
“Both Abreu and Dunn would be good fits with the Angles.”
You’d think but Sciocsia puts a lot of value on defense and very little value on players who get on base frequently.
Part of the reason why they’ve had no interest at all on Manny (which is just hard to get over…).
This is one of the reasons why they wanted Tex back so badly. He was good enough defensively to fit into what scoscia likes to do but still gave the team what they needed at the plate – high OBP and power.
Dunn should be a guy they sign. But they seem to have no interest at all.
The angels keep beating the yankees because they’ve had better pitching and the yankees have been a poor defensive team. Poor defense against a fast team is a not a good mix.
Boston has been a good defensive team and that’s a problem for the angels. Boston’s also had good pitching. The big difference between them in the playoffs is boston’s ability to stay patient at the plate and get men on base.
I haven’t seen somebody fly that high on the football field. That man is about 3 feet off the ground.
Joe from Long Island
I agree, I think you have it right.
“You’d think but Sciocsia puts a lot of value on defense and very little value on players who get on base frequently.
Part of the reason why they’ve had no interest at all on Manny (which is just hard to get over…).”
I can’t understand that either, CB. You’d think that that the Angles would sign either Manny or Dunn. I mean they don’t even have to play the field.
Would love to have Larry Fitzgerald on the Giants.
All tied up at 7
Joe: Indeed.
CB: Think the Yankees have done enough to improve their defense?
The Angels have made some decisions that have confused me lately.
They trade a young, solid, cost-controlled 1B for Tex. I would have thought they would have done whatever it took to sign Tex longterm. Afterall, it’s not like they didn’t have a clue as to what his contract demands would likely be. They then say they will make Tex their first priority; but if they can’t get him, they will go for CC. Problem is, CC wanted to sign early as possible, while Tex, as a Scott Boras client, was going to fully assess the marketplace. So that planning was screwy. Then they bow out the Tex dealings, saying they don’t want to spend that much money on any one player; why did they trade Kotchman for him in the first place?
Very strange thought processes, in my opinion. Almost seems like they have disjointed decision-making.
S.A.– I’d like to sign Chad Johnson for tomorrow lol
Are you watching this Cal game, PAT M???? Going to 3OT.
Rob NY January 10th, 2009 at 8:41 pm
S.A.—I’d like to sign Chad Johnson for tomorrow lol
=================================
lol Ocho Stinko.
Nick I’m watching it on the CBS game tracker…Man what a game……
hiscross
this is a yankee blog. you forgot to add “Yankees Not Making the Postseason?”
I find it hard to believe that the Angles are going to go with Gary Matthews, Jr and Kendry Morales at LF and 1B next season.
Randle just fouled out, oooops
Heh, all you Giants fans worrying about your RBs….
I don’t even know who my QB will be next year!
Wow. TD Cardinals.
Thanks, S.A……I’ll check that out later.
The Yankees have had the worst luck with injuries lately. I wouldn’t go searching out a deal for Nady or Swisher – I like having depth and flexibility.
Nick in SF,,,This game is my 5 star play…I loaded up for this game…
“Think the Yankees have done enough to improve their defense?”
rebecca,
I think the yankees defense this year will be much better – and by much better I mean that I hope it will be league average this year.
Last season they were one of the 3 worst defensive teams in the game. This year I’m hoping they can be middle of the pack.
I think it depends on two main things:
Can Jeter be ok at SS the way he was in 2008? Or will he revert to 2007 (which I think was related to his knee injury…)
Will Cano bounce back defensively and become an above average defensive 2nd baseman again?
If those two things happen the team will be ok defensively. And going from horrendous to OK is a major improvement.
But it depends on those two things IMO.
CB/Tom/Joe
I don’t get the Angels thinking on not signing Dunn/ManRam either. Both are perfect fits for them (well, in my eyes anyway…apparently not Sciocsia’s). Actually, as a Yanks fan, now that I think about it…I’m glad they’re not in on either and Sciocsia doesn’t like them. Means they won’t be as strong next year as they could be.
Tied again with a minute left, PAT M. Cal is doing it with smoke and mirrors without Randle. We can’t afford a 4th OT.
The Angels apparently pulled out of the Tex sweepstakes as they got the impression he wanted to be on the East Coast…..
Get this piece by a Milwaukee mediot:
http://www.jsonline.com/sports.....63469.html
Swisher for Cameron? Floated by the Yankees? I’m not sure if the above or Andy’s 3/36 offer is more unbelievable. That makes absolutely NO sense for the Yankees
CB: Indeed. Although I don’t think it’s possible for Canò to get much worse than he was last year without trying.
Wow, maybe I really am the NFL picks kiss of death.
Makes some sense Betsy. Swish is making like 7 million this year and is under control for 2 more after this. Cameron is making 10 and is a FA after this year. So the money is pretty even. Cameron can play CF and (as CB has pointed out) OPSed as one of the top 8 CFs in the game last year. We still have Nady to play RF. I’d probably be in favor of this deal. Would prefer it to be Nady instead of Swish on our side. However, I don’t see the Brew crew doing this. Where would Swish play? They already have Hart and Braun on the corners with Fielder at first. I guess Hart could play CF, but that’s really not an optimal position switch.
The angels seem to have decided very quickly that Manny was just not a guy who fit into their system and neither is Dunn.
That’s what I meant about them becoming a bit rigid. What they’re doing is simply not working in the playoffs. But they want players in the mold of Eric Aybar and Torii Hunter (or at least what Torii Hunter was 5 years ago…).
It’s a tough thing – i think it’s a very good idea for an organization to adopt one uniform way of playing and to institute it throughout – from low minors to majors.
The downside to that is that you can become slaves to the system and not evolve fast enough or respond to competition.
I think that’s happening to the Angels. They just aren’t willing to change or so it appears right now…
Betsy –
1. Tex wanting to be on the East coast – and this was news?
2. I agree, Swish for Cameron makes for a bad deal for the Yankees, in my opinion.
Nick in SF..You must be watching this live…..Rebecca how are the Orangemen doing vs. Rutgers…
PAT M, yes, live, Cal just won by 3 in 3OT, wow!
Sweet 16 team they are…..
Is the goal of the Angels to become the Atlanta Braves, circa mid 90s-early 2000′s, of the AL West?
Pat M: Syracuse is up by nine.
They should be up by more but I’m too busy watching football to know if anything’s happening.
Just as long as the Orange(men) keep winning, I’m down with it.
yanks should sign cruz or lyon. u can have too much bullpen help
The Angles should trade Weaver, Brandon Wood, and Morales to SD for Adrian Gonzalez.
Will Rutgers ever be good at sports?
I think the angels believe that given their resources and need to compete with boston and ny the best thing for them to do is to put in a system that will be consistent over time and find players who will fit that style of play.
That’s actually pretty similar to the red sox approach.
Unfortunately for the angels i thin the system they’ve chosen to implement is flawed. Can’t score if you don’t get on base, especially if you don’t hit for a lot of power.
I don’t believe those Swisher for Cameron trade rumors for a minute. Sounds like Melvin leaking rumors about him turning down the yankees in return for the yankees leaving him hanging on the first cameron trade.
Swisher is 27 and cameron 36. The yankees aren’t making that trade, especially when they need OF for next year.
Cameron for $10M on that brewer team makes no sense at all. He’s 12% of their pay roll. If they could move him they would.
“Cameron for $10M on that brewer team makes no sense at all. He’s 12% of their pay roll. If they could move him they would.”
Just make him team captain, then he’ll be worth it. And tell him no texting with CC in the dugout.
Tom: The Rutgers women are quite good.
Rebecca, maybe they were a lock today as well …..As for the Angels, unless they get a hitting outfielder, they’ll go with Figgins in left, Tori in center and Matthews in right…There was a piece today in the Orange County Register that was questioning Moreno and why he’s raised ticket prices and has not for the first time hasn’t improved the club…..They’re playing the market as prices are dropping….The loss of Texeria was a set back….Manny is still in play I think…They still may make a play for Peavy….
I know Rebecca. It’s just I feel I was cheated out of 4 years of the college experience.
Tom: So is Rutgers one of the 6 teams you root for?
Tom that trade proposal has been mentioned here locally….Padres are in love with Gonzo, but they’d be getting 3 starters in return…Then they move Peavy and suddenly they’ve rebuilt their team….
When did you graduate from Rutgers Tom?
I think they are still threatening to not give me my diploma due to unpaid parking tickets.
It’s amazing how the Padres went from near NL Wild Cards in 2007 to projected last place in 2009.
The argument that there’s no parity in baseball is fallacious.
“they’ll go with Figgins in left, Tori in center and Matthews in right…”
I thought they were going to play Juan Rivera in LF? If they play Woods at 3b not sure where figgins fits in.
Torii had a .344 OBP. Matthews .319. An outfield of matthews, hunter and figgins would be awful.
They had the 4th worst OBP in the AL last year – only the A’s, Mariners and Royals were worse and those were three lowest scoring teams in the AL.
And on top of that they are losing Tex. They had a team OBP of .330 last season and Tex had an OBP of .449 while he was on the team.
They better be waiting out the market because I can’t see how they are going to make that offense work.
Tom– you feel cheated out of the college experience? I played football at Wagner College because I wanted to be closer to home, when I could have gone to Rutgers or BC (and sat the bench probably lol but I could have gone!). I don’t think my school has won a meaningful game, ever.
Panthers turning it over
This game is shocking
This is off-the-hook crazy.
Pat M., What’s the Padre’s new ownership’s philosophy? Are they going to rebuild? Or, do they plan on keeping Peavy and Gonzo. If they did it right, they could get 6-7 starters for the both of them.
S.A. ’02. They withheld my diploma because they said I owed $400 in un-returned library books.
http://thesportshernia.typepad.....ngaged.jpg
lol I love Hideki Matsui!
Rob, at least you played and, presumably, got a free education out of it.
Tom: They nearly withheld my diploma because I had 8 books that were overdue by about a month.
I returned them, though.
Note to self….check in with S.A. before making picks next week and go opposite direction
Granted, the Panthers could still come back and win this, but covering that 10 pt spread is going to be almost impossible.
Yeah, I had that going for me Tom. It was always fun explaining to my dad why I didn’t have to work because ‘technically’ I was earning $35,000 a year. lol But something about playing in front of 1,500 people isn’t exactly the same as playing in front of 15,000+ at a BCS bowl.
S.A. ‘02. They withheld my diploma because they said I owed $400 in un-returned library books.
================================
Are you kidding me? Yikes.
I graduated in 2000. Oh the memories of the RU Screw.
I still remember how horrific the Rutgers football team was when I was there. Oh the pain.
rodg12 January 10th, 2009 at 9:35 pm
Note to self….check in with S.A. before making picks next week and go opposite direction
Granted, the Panthers could still come back and win this, but covering that 10 pt spread is going to be almost impossible.
========================================
LOL. Hey!
“15,000+ at a BCS bowl.”
Might want to up that number a bit there Rob
S.A.: um, how do I put this… Um… well, you should totally root for your favorite team tomorrow, but… well… you don’t *have* to make an actual prediction, do you?
Rebecca, I called them up and said that I’m not paying the fee because I never took the books out. They were books about genetics what not. I was an English major, i had little use for genetic texts.
To make a long story short, in October I got my diploma in the mail. I never paid the fee though.
CB, The front office ids committed to Brandon Wood, they need Figgins in the lineup as he’s their jump start to the offense…Rivera I’m not certain if he plays everyday at this point, same goes for the salary laden Matthews…They have to make some moves, and they will….Unless the move Brandon back to SS and bring Figgins back to 3rd….They are loaded with pitching especially with Escobar due to return…..
Since I’m lazy and there are over 470 posts on here, I’m going to ask this at the risk of repeating a question. There’s rumor out there that both the Reds and Nats are interested in Nady/Swisher – is there a good match up here? What’s the get?
Nick-no predictions from me tomorrow.
Just to be safe.
sunny -
Maybe a match. The primary names that have been thrown out from the Nats were Milledge and Lannon. I thought Milledge sounded pretty interesting but learned he’s mostly a hack defender in CF so he really isn’t a great fit. Lannon is semi-interesting. Names floated from Cincy were mainly Harang and Keppinger. Don’t really see Keppinger being a fit. Utility guy, sure, but not an especially good fielder. Downside with Harang is the multi-year contract. CB brought up Atlanta as a possible trade partner as well. Talked about getting a young OFer in return from them.
Tom: Yeah, but I actually owed the books. oops.
Sunny: Nothing with the Nats. With the Reds someone said Keppinger but most don’t like that. Another suggested Adam Dunn but I don’t think that’s what the Yankees want if they want to improve defensively.
Ooo, thundersnow!
Pat M.
They need to just admit Matthews is a sunk cost, bench him as a 4th of and move on. He’s horrible. Rivera in RF, Hunter CF, Figgins in LF. Wood at 3b.
They should sign manny but they won’t. They really should sacrifice some defense and sign Dunn to play 1b. Kendry Morales?
I think Beane smells blood in the water in anaheim. Terrific pitching for the Halos but that offense… and vlad is a year older. I also don’t know if I believe in Wood. I don’t trust the PCL and he seems like he may be one of those PCL products (and there have been a lot of them…).
They should trade a pitcher – move weaver. They can afford to. With the value young players have now its very hard to make big trades, however.
This game has all the makings of a Carolina comeback ala the Bills / Oilers game in 91….Wonder what the numbers are for the 2nd half…..For all those talking about trading Nady what do you expect to get in return ??? Who goes to RF, since it appears that the team is finished with buying contracts other than Pettite’s…..
Re: Figgins
It is true that Figgins seems like the odd man out in LA. They’ll go with a Rivera-Hunter-Matthews outfield with Vlad DH-ing and Wood playing 3b.
They could use Swisher at 1b but no way I would trade him for Figgins.
However, I’d love to find a way to get Figgins as I believe the Yankees are also slaves to a system.
We would be more balanced with a couple more Angels type players as they would be with a few more patient sluggers.
The best teams blend all aspects of offense and can score runs in a variety of ways.
I feel we’ve been too station to station, homer or nothing in our approach. It’s nice to have guys on base but if you can’t hit with RISP or score cheap runs with speed and contact, you could use at least one or two guys like Figgins.
People talk about how valuable Gardner would be if he could only get on base at a .350 clip?
That’s Chone Figgins.
thanks rodg12, but aren’t we trading an OF to get rid of surplus? Or is he talking prospect?
PAT M -
Optimal return for Nady would be a CF or a SP (if Pettitte isn’t resigned). If Nady is traded, Swisher plays RF. After mulling over the possible trades that have been floated out there, seems to me our best option is to resign Pettitte and keep the team the way it is. Unless Cash finds a better match that no one has talked about, however. The benefit of trading Nady, IMO, is that we’d be selling high on him. I’m not confident he can match last years numbers he put us with Pittsburgh again.
Re: Trading Nady
Breaking News: You can’t sell high on a Boras client in his walk year. Impossible.
sunny -
If you meant CB, yeah he was talking an OF prospect. Upper levels guy, presumably.
Just got home from Mo’s restaurant- yummy. Prices were like 25% lower than last time we went so the economy is even impacting Mariano.
CB, I like Brandon Wood maybe not at SS, but he’s going to be a big time player…..But it is time for the Angels to start making trades for today rather than tomorrow which has been their philosphy fo rthe past 8 years or so….Stoneman hoarded these players and now it’s time to cash them in if they want to stay in the game with the big boys……Brandon was earmarked to play SS along side Howie Kendricks ….
Optimal return is trading Nady and Matsui in salary dumps and signing Manny to DH and play occasional OF giving Damon a rest. Swish in RF.
Sign Pettite and its game over.
Had to get may daily Manny post in.
Damon LF
Jeter SS
Tex 1B
Arod SS
Manny DH
Posada C
Cano 2B
Swisher RF
Melk/Gard CF
For anyone who’s sick of hearing that the Yankees buy their championships, take a look at this article:
http://riveravereview.blogspot.....r-way.html
The benefit of trady Nady is creating budget space for mid season moves.
There are a lot of teams going to dump salary if attendance and ad revenue get ugly.
Pat M.,
I don’t know. Woods has such a long swing. Generates a ton of power when he runs into one but I still don’t know if he can make enough contact in the bigs. Struck out a lot and didn’t get on base much even in the minors. We’ll see. He was a real blue chipper just a couple of seasons back but hasn’t progressed as much as hoped. Angels hitters up and down their system don’t control the strike zone very well. Don’t think that bodes well for big league success.
Wow, this game is unbelievable. Panthers finally get the turnover and they turn around and turn it over right back.
Re: Panthers
I live in Charlotte and am so happy right now. Most of the fans are hicks and I don’t like hicks.
Re: Hicks
Check that.
Willie Nelson.
I like Willie Nelson.
2H line was Panthers -10. I’m going down with the ship.
*He was a real blue chipper just a couple of seasons back but hasn’t progressed as much as hoped.*
to me, Brandon Wood is one of the best recent examples of waiting too long for a prospect to develop, and losing his trade value completely.
there is no doubt that he could still become a decent MLBer, but the way things have worked out, odds are the Angels overvalued him and they are going to wind up eating his value, like they do with a lot of their ‘stud’ prospects of recent memory.
there is something to be said or learned about trading prospects when they are at their peak value with the lesson of Brandon Wood… not all prospects have to grow, develop, and become MLB stars in the organization the were drafted in to best impact that organization.
Giants are ONLY 4 pt favorites.
I like the idea of Swish coming off the bench, we haven’t had a good bench player for so long. In 98 Strawberry hit 24 home runs off the bench. Gardner is also a great pinch runner
Damon LF
Jeter SS
Tex 1B
Alex 3B
Hideki DH
Posada C
Cano 2B
Nady RF
Melky CF
Bench:
Swish
Gardner
Molina
Ransom
With a line up that strong you can afford Melky, last year it was just really bad because Melky,Molina,and Betemit would all be playing the same game with Ponson or D-Raz on the mound
“to me, Brandon Wood is one of the best recent examples of waiting too long for a prospect to develop, and losing his trade value completely.”
Sure that’s easy to say now but that’s the whole importance of talent evaluation.
If you could explain why Alex Gordon is turning out to be Alex Gordon and Evan Longoria is turning out to be Evan Longoria you’d be a rich guy.
But it’s just not that easy. Brandon Wood was a consensus top prospect and was a SS to boot – how often do power bats come up at that position? It’s just not easy to give up on that.
There were yankee fans two season ago who were eager to trade Joba in a deal for Mark Teixeira before atlanta sent him to Texas.
It’s not easy to distinguish the Brandon Wood and Neftali Feliz.
CB, He does have a long swing and Hatcher has been working with him on having a more compact swing…But he’s has the tools to be an above average ballplayer…….His slg. #’s are sensational, granted he’s yet to dupilcate this during his brief time in Anaheim…He’s going to be good I think….
Since I was bored and Arizona is running away with this game, I decided to analyze the All-Free Agent teams proposed by Pete Abe, Olney and River Ave Blues.
The complete analysis is on my blog, but my conclusion is basically that they’d finish
1) River Ave Blues
2) Buster Olney
3) Pete Abe.
Wonderful plug for your site Rebecca. Since the game is so bad and they’ve moved on to pre-teen punt pass and kick winners i’ve decided to view your work.
Rebecca: that was probably more charitable than analyzing Pete’s football picks for today…
Rob: I’d say that I try, but I think the shameless self promotion is obvious enough.
*But it’s just not that easy. Brandon Wood was a consensus top prospect and was a SS to boot – how often do power bats come up at that position? It’s just not easy to give up on that.*
i never said it was easy, nor did i indict the angels necessarily on being too protective of their talent, tho that could be argued, or at least considered, about their organization.
of course hindsight is 20/20 on this, but from what i remember, while Wood played SS it was believed:
1) though he had great power, he struck out way too much, and
2) while he played SS at the minor league level, it was widely understood he would NOT be a SS if he did progress and develop into a MLBer.
but… my whole point was that Brandon Wood, as their top prospect, was said to have been mentioned in any number of deals that would have brought in players (such as Miguel Tejada to name one…)
and you wonder how an organization would have changed for the better if they were so over-protective of their “top talent” and traded them away for a more established, everyday player or pitcher.
INT #4.
yeesh, I hope the Panthers enjoyed their bye week at least.
Nick in SF, I’m taking the hit on the back end of this game as well….Bad NFL day, but I could several of these games and still be ahead thanks to the Bears….I’m committed to the G-men and the Chargers tomorrow…..I need a bailout from them or I’ll be out of football funds before the Superbowl at this rate….
Leave PA alone Nick his team is playing golf with Gessel Bunchen.
*INT #4.*
its funny… after the Panthers took the opening kickoff to the 50, and then scored in like 3 minutes and 5 plays, i thought this game would be the blowout we all expected and was ready to throw in ‘Gladiator’ into the DVD player…
and since then, its like the Panthers forgot there was still 55 minutes left to play.
Rob: LMAO, but it’s spelt Giselle
Nice post Rebecca. I agree with your breakdown. I like RAB’s team the best.
One thing I personally noticed was that the line-up would be better served in each instance playing Manny in LF and Dunn at DH. Manny (though still bad) was a much better LF than Dunn last year.
Yeah Google tricked me Rebecca, I think my joke plays anyway. Apparently Tom plays very good golf too because he’s Giselle is a pretty good looking lady.
Ha, I finally broke down and bought this shirt a couple days ago:
http://tinyurl.com/3uohxl
“and you wonder how an organization would have changed for the better if they were so over-protective of their “top talent” and traded them away for a more established, everyday player or pitcher.”
Nearly they’re entire team is built up through their farm system and they did win a world series.
If you are going to consider how they might have been better if they’d been more willing to trade prospects you’d also have to consider how they could have been significantly worse.
They didn’t trade Wood out of an organizational philosophy. That was controversial and Stoneman ultimately wound up leaving because of it.
If the organizational philosophy had been different they very well may have traded John Lackeye. It’s hard to say.
But it was that philosophy of building through young players that turned around a once moribund, afterthought of a team.
Many of those rumored trades the angels could have made would have wound up being bad trades anyway. They were very lucky to not have traded for Miguel Tejada in 2006 as it turned out. He’s awful and has an untradable contract.
If keeping Wood meant not acquiring Tejada that’s a huge net plus for them. Even if Wood turns into nothing they didn’t have to absorb the impact of Tejada’s contract. The opportunity cost of that contract would have been very significant.
What the heck Delhomme?!?!?!?!?!?! Took him in the ESPN gridiron challenge today. He’s going to freaking score negative points!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
5 ints. Holy crap
Is Delhomme upset that he didn’t win the Punk Pass and Kick competition for his age group??? Suck it up, geeeeeez!
Is Delhomme upset that he didn’t win the Punk Pass and Kick competition for his age group??? Suck it up, geeeeeez!
Sorry for the double double post.
Rodg12: Thanks man!
S.A.: Yeah, I’m thinking there’s another spygate coming on, or something. Because you’re obviously seeing film or something.
*If you are going to consider how they might have been better if they’d been more willing to trade prospects you’d also have to consider how they could have been significantly worse.
They didn’t trade Wood out of an organizational philosophy. That was controversial and Stoneman ultimately wound up leaving because of it.
If the organizational philosophy had been different they very well may have traded John Lackeye. It’s hard to say.*
of course.
im not trying to wax poetic here, or make some large point about the angels specifically.
all i was saying was:
(enter team name here) overvalues (enter prospect name here) and while (enter prospect name here) was rumored to be the centerpiece for a trade including (place MLB star or everyday player or pitcher here), the fact that they didnt deal him when his prospect value was highest, now (enter prospect) is past the developmental time frame to be an impact player for the (enter organization here).. now (enter organization here) need to reevaluate what (enter prospect name here) can really contribute to the everyday ballclub at the MLB leve, if anything.
http://www.centpoker.com/home.php
So all the teams that had homefield advantage lost today. That means all the teams with homefield will win tomorrow right?
TurnTwo– (Enter response to post here)
Rodg, I just don’t see that the Yankees would trade a guy who they really like, who’s under control for a few more years, for a 1 year stop gap. Buzz lateley has it that the Yankees would prefer to move Nady if they move either of the two. I don’t particularly see the need to do that, though.
Joe, I’m not sure if it was news to the Angels or not. Maybe they thought they could sway Tex and then just decided it was too much $$ to lay out for a guy who preferred to be elsewhere. I was surprised the Angels pulled out given their lack of options, but maybe that’s the difference between the Angels and the Yankees (or most other teams and the Yankees). If the Yankees want someone, they will pull out all of the stops to get him, even if his preference is to be elsewhere. Plenty of players have learned to love NY when they didn’t think they necessarily would….and Tex already did like CA. Plus, the Yankees weren’t involved by then. Who knows? If the Angels had been involved and the bidding increased beyond where the Yankees wanted to go, maybe Tex would have chosen CA, where he knows he liked it, over Boston……where he seemed to have some issues with.
Rodg, I just don’t see that the Yankees would trade a guy who they really like, who’s under control for a few more years, for a 1 year stop gap. Buzz lateley has it that the Yankees would prefer to move Nady if they move either of the two. I don’t particularly see the need to do that, though.
Joe, I’m not sure if it was news to the Angels or not. Maybe they thought they could sway Tex and then just decided it was too much $$ to lay out for a guy who preferred to be elsewhere. I was surprised the Angels pulled out given their lack of options, but maybe that’s the difference between the Angels and the Yankees (or most other teams and the Yankees). If the Yankees want someone, they will pull out all of the stops to get him, even if his preference is to be elsewhere. Plenty of players have learned to love NY when they didn’t think they necessarily would….and Tex already did like CA. Plus, the Yankees weren’t involved by then. Who knows? If the Angels had been involved and the bidding increased beyond where the Yankees wanted to go, maybe Tex would have chosen CA, where he knows he liked it, over Boston……where he seemed to have some issues with.
“(enter team name here) overvalues (enter prospect name here) and while (enter prospect name here) was rumored to be the centerpiece for a trade including (place MLB star or everyday player or pitcher here), the fact that they didnt deal him when his prospect value was highest, now (enter prospect) is past the developmental time frame to be an impact player for the (enter organization here).. now (enter organization here) need to reevaluate what (enter prospect name here) can really contribute to the everyday ballclub at the MLB leve, if anything.”
(US Democrats) overvalues (Barack Obama) and while (Obama) was rumored to be the centerpiece for a trade including (Respectability or Economic surplus), the fact that they didnt deal him when his prospect value was highest, now (Obama) is past the developmental time frame to be an impact player for the (World).. now (The World) need to reevaluate what (Obama) can really contribute to the everyday (government) at the (international level), if anything.
You walked straight into that.
(I’m a liberal, for the record…and the above is a joke so please take it as such!)
I agree with what Rebecca said. I’m a Libertarian for the record.
Let’s see if Delhomme will throw INT #6
Flagrant foul on Rebecca. Free throws and loss of possession.
*You walked straight into that.*
well played, Rebecca
Gave up on this game, I’m playing Peperdine over Loyola Maymount laying the 7 points…..While the Angels may over value and over protect there prospects, they seldom make foolish / bad trades….As Cb pointed out they build a solid foundation from within and add thru free agancy the parts they need….Moreno stated when he bought the team from Disney, that they will model the success of the Yankees in the 90′s….And they have…..
*I’m a Libertarian for the record.*
ah ha… tucker carlson for pres!
Nick: Yeah, but my team already won so it doesn’t matter
Is Delhomme going for a record?
Is Delhomme going for a record?
My basketball team already won too. My football team plays tomorrow, yay!
*You walked straight into that.*
and not for nothing… but my point was just to bring into the discussion the idea of organizations overvaluing prospects, and just wondering what paths the baseball gods would have led certain organizations if some of these prospects were traded in some of these proposals along the line, for better or worse.
and i have to say, i am jealous for all those people who will be down in DC for inauguration.
Go for 2!
TurnTwo: My cousins live in Annapolis, so they could go no problem. I’m jealous!
*My cousins live in Annapolis, so they could go no problem.*
someone at work told me that the best way to be a part of the whole inauguration process was to show up at one of the train stops they’ll take on their way on the amtrak from philly to DC…
word has it that they are staring their trek a couple days early to do kind of a victory lap north towards boston, with press stops along the way, before eventually heading south and winding up in DC.
Swisher > Nady
this team can win a division but that #1 starter belongs in the Yankees
GET SHEETS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
6 INTERCEPTIONS I mean really ?! really ?…thanks for giving me a queezy feeling about the Giants game Delhome
And yes get Sheets
Le sigh.
No matter how rational the argument for not getting Sheets…still, they argue on…
For anyone who’s sick of hearing that the Yankees buy their championships, take a look at this article:
http://riveravereview.blogspot.....r-way.html
“MR YANKEES OFFSEASON MISSION COMPLETE START SAVING FOR PUJOLS 2011″
LOL…That’s not gonna happen. Getting Teix killed that mission buddy.
Not to mention St. Louis will do what it can to keep Pujols.
Yup. I’m praying w/ my rosary beeds for tomorrow’s game. Seriously I didn’t expect the Panthers to fall flat, Kerry Collins I did but the Panthers ?…Thanks for giving me doubts.
Rebecca,
Your analysis on the free agent rosters were very good reads. Thanks for putting them all together!
However, I also read your Sheets argument, while very good as well, I, too, tend to stand on the “get Sheets” side of things, so I’d like to offer a counter point.
My reasons are this…comparing Sheets to to rest of the free agent crop of starters, in terms of ability, I don’t think anyone can say that he’s not at the top. His price tag isn’t something I worry about, since we’re talking the Yankees getting him, and not a small market team.
What Sheets provides is an ace at the number 4 position. It makes it so that we only have one slot for a kid, Joba. Don’t get me wrong, I want Hughes in there at some point, but after last year’s Hughes/Kennedy debacle, I don’t think it’s wise to have kids in both of the 4-5 spots. Remember, Joba is still unproven. Everyone assumes that he’s a lock to go out and be amazing and injury free. He’s not, and the Yankees can’t afford to go into another season with that looming over them.
Now, if Sheets can be the guy he’s meant to be, then we got ourselves a hell of a rotation. If he gets hurt somewhere down the line, then we can throw one of the kids in there. Meanwhile, the kids are getting more seasoning in Triple A or as the long man, and building their own arm strength.
As for Sheets’ arm angle and how it relates to his injuries, I think this is fixable, and with a change of scenery, a new pitching coach, and an organization with better facilities and capabilities, I think the guy has a good chance to turn it all around. This could be quite a coup.
I think the Red Sox are smart to take flyers in Penny and Smoltz. These guys are great, but should they succumb to injury again, they have back ups. If they’re healthy, though, the rest of the AL East is in trouble. Sheets can work in the same way. I really think the reward far out weighs the risk, and I also think the Yankees are getting another seasoned starter no matter what. I do believe in the young guys, though, and I don’t want to clutter the rotation with a Lowe or Perez, who will command at least three years. Don’t get me wrong, I like Perez as well, but this is why I want Sheets above all others. One or two years of possible ace like material at the number 4 slot, and we can get the kids in there at some point. I think a contract for him is a good maneuver.
I like Rebecca but SIGN BEN SHEETS!!!!!
2009—CC, Wang, AJ, Sheets, Joba
5 guys with ace stuff? Sign me up for that!
SIGN BEN SHEETS!!!
Jett,
Good red. Thanx
There’s something i really don’t understand. Since Andy Pettitte clearly isn’t willing to accept the $10 million dollar offer and he isn’t willing to take a pay cut, why not sign Derek Lowe? Let’s say we sign Lowe for 3 years worth $45 million. Annually we would be paying him for less than Andy and more of a reliable pitcher as well. Since he is a Class A free agent, the Yankees would only give up a 4th round pick. Finally, and this is my biggest point, if the Yankees sign Lowe, we can finally put Joba, our golden arm, back in the bullpen where he truly belongs.