Three deals to be done
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Jan 16, 2009 
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Yesterday was the day for arbitration-eligible players to file. The two sides will exchange figures on Tuesday.
There were 111 players who filed including Brian Bruney, Melky Cabrera and Xavier Nady. There were 110 filers last season and only eight ended up in hearings.
It’s easy to see how Nady and the Yankees could have something to talk about. Maybe even Bruney. But what could the possible holdup be with Melky? He should be happy to get a free appetizer at the new Hard Rock Cafe after how he played last season.
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Policeman of the year Brian McNamee is reportedly in Washington today to testify before the grand jury trying to figure out whether Roger Clemens lied to Congress.
Boy, this is quite a puzzler. Golly, I wonder if he did? Roger wasn’t quite Frank Pentangeli when he was sworn in, but he came close.
So what are they going to do, throw him in the clink? Of course not. But it’s good that government prosecutors are spending time and money on such important matters like whether retired ballplayers took steroids. It’s not like banks swindled unknowing people into taking mortgages they could never afford and helped send the country into economic chaos.
Clemens has done a pretty complete job of ruining his life. The government doesn’t need to help.
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Not sure how much blogging I’ll get to today as I have a bunch of things to do. I leave for Tampa on Feb. 9 and won’t be back in New York until April 1. So all the things that need doing (taxes, getting the car inspected, dentist, etc.) need doing in the next few weeks.
I also want to spend time researching some stories that will run during spring training. But I’ll check back if something comes up.
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Tyler Kepner of the Times paid tribute to Todd Drew on his blog yesterday.
So did Curt Schilling. Good job by both of those guys.
They’ll settle with Bruney and Melky… not so certain about Nady. He had a great first half with the Pirates and then kind of fell off the statistical ledge the second half with the Yankees.
“The Braves seek a right-handed hitter but aren’t dead set on it. They were unwilling to meet the Yankees’ demands for Xavier Nady.” – MLBTR
What the hell are we looking for? He is a one year Boras client loan, are we expecting to great potential studs?
Bullpen arm, #5SP type, or utility infielder that can make contact with the ball. I’m not familiar with Braves roster, but they have to have someone.
Damnit!
Just read the Curt Schilling tribute to Todd. Very beautiful. I think I gained some respect for the guy.
It’ll pass tomorrow.
JoeyA,
Assuming you’re right, maybe the Braves don’t want to give up a bullpen arm or #5 starting pitcher for a one-year rental.
Curt for a spot in the guest blogger series?
I think not.
Can we sign Glavine to a one-game contract for whenever we play Boston and Smoltz is pitching.
Than sign Franco to close the game
“It’s not like banks swindled unknowing people into taking mortgages they could never afford and helped send the country into economic chaos.”
Maybe if people knew how to use a friggin’ calculator they wouldn’t take out loans they couldn’t afford. It’s not just the banks that are responsible for this mess.
westy: But that ignores rule #1 of the human condition:
People, on the whole, are stupid.
Pete, of course there are more important things for the government to be focusing on than retired athletes and steroids. The cops in my neighborhood have better things to be focusing on than an underage kid stealing a 6-pack from the local deli, but that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t do something about it.
Nobody forced Clemens to say the Mitchell Report was wrong, hold a press conference blaming everyone for his situation but himself, file a defamation lawsuit, go on 60 Minutes and play an irate victim, and then testify in front of the government while the country was watching and lie repeatedly in a manner that was both arrogant and delusional.
His reputation was already destroyed by the time he was called to congress. He could’ve taken the McGwire route and stayed within the law for the most part, or better yet, show some decency (and intelligence) by coming clean, apologizing for his mistakes, discouraging kids from doing the same, and likely end up in the Hall of Fame and certainly out of prison. He chose not to do any of that and now he has to face the consequences.
Our government should not tolerate this kind of behavior and people need to see that even the rich and famous must be accountable. It’s doing the right thing during tough times that shows the character of a person or society. Whether it’s an individual saying “thank you” and “please” on the day they lost your job, or a government punishing someone for blatantly lying under oath during an economic crisis – it’s not always easy, but it’s the right thing to do!
Rebecca, sarcasm is always appreciated!
im with danny, prosecute him and if he’s found guilty, fine him heavily, more than what it cost to prosecute him.
if he’s found guilty of lying to congress about taking steroids, that could lead to a lifetime ban from baseball and the HOF
“It’s not like banks swindled unknowing people into taking mortgages they could never afford and helped send the country into economic chaos.”
Yes, those poor people were dragged kicking and screaming into 5000 sq ft luxury homes against their will and had no idea at all that there was ever going to be a payment.
I sold houses during the boom and these people who bought homes were greedy as hell – looking to flip houses they could never afford in their wildest dreams and stick the next guy – but when the music stopped? They cry that they were swindled. So the fact that they lied on their loan applications becomes the nations problem. It is a MESS
Yeah what happened to _personal responsibility_? Banks might’ve been
greedy, so were the fiscally irresponsible leeches that fantasize about their “american
dream” and take out loans they know they couldn’t afford.
So after Joe wannabe homeowner took out second mortgages to buy field
box seats, get his wife a new coat, take the family out on vacation…
oops can’t afford the mortgage anymore. So they file bk, portray themselves
as “victims” who were “swindled”…shake themselves of responsibility
while media make them out as “CNN Heroes”
Meanwhile, folks like myself who never missed a mortgage payment foots the bill.
Swindled my ***!
if he’s found guilty of lying to congress about taking steroids, that could lead to a lifetime ban from baseball and the HOF
———-
Perhaps. All of them that went to congress that day should be in trouble. Palmeiro definitely lied (and it was proven). Sosa claimed not to know English, McGwire didnt want to talk about the past, and so on.
Clemens was in a no win situation, other than confessing. He was the only one on that half -assed report that anyone cared about besides Bonds.
The Melk man needs to be delivered to a funny farm if he thinks he is getting a big deal from arbitration – what is up w/ that?
Pete, your right good job by both those guys writing about Todd. I can’t believe im going to say this, but I did gain some respect for Curt Shilling with that piece he did in his blog, great job by him. As for Melky, yeah he should be happy to get anything from the Yankees, im sure they will settle though. I have said this before and I will say it again, the Yankees don’t need to rush to trade anyone, they are at a position of strength now and can wait to a great deal comes if it does.
Danny B: come on, give me a break with the sanctimony. What is the harm here to society? So you prosecute someone with a “perjury trap” to get him on some steroid charge? Who really cares? The government should stop grandstanding with this sort of crap and get serious about serious issues.
Not the D: right on, brother. The people who got screwed are by and large the “Flip This Home” crowd. Why should the taxpayers bail them out?
Maybe Curt wants to join us as our number 5 starter to stick it to the Sawx?
Not the D: right on, brother. The people who got screwed are by and large the “Flip This Home” crowd. Why should the taxpayers bail them out?
___________________
Its not a black and white issue…that’s why it will take a long time to fix…
If you allow enough forceclosures in a neighborhood…and they are sold at a deep discount…the other home values in the neighborhood will fall too
The government sounds so hypocritical going after clemens.
This is the same government who allowed that gay bathroom enthuiast senator try to take back a confession, who allowed a senator who admitted to prostitution while he wore dipers to continue sitting, hitting on pages, extorion, yadda yadda. Oh and allowing a drug dealing former cop who stored blood for 8 years when he could have done anything to it, to be a star witness?
give me a break.
Pete, Feb 9th is like 3 weeks away. Wow poor you going to the nice warm sunshine of Tampa. That is a great time of year,spring training and Im sure you are excited to get to see CC,AJ and Tex the new guys and see if Girardi is any better with you guys. Good luck and keep up the good work.
“Clemens has done a pretty complete job of ruining his life. The government doesn’t need to help.”
Misses the point. The government doesn’t NEED to help; the government is obliged to help. A functioning criminal justice system doesn’t overlook SOME instances of federal perjury. An oath under penalty of prosecution is an oath under penalty of prosecution — to assign them relative values defeats the purpose.
Also this whole notion that the government is too important or too busy or whatever to deal with a lowly sports/entertainment issue is just totally misguided and kinda played out. The government is HUGE. (Some people say too huge, but that’s beside the point.) People who are upset that Arlan Specter is investigating the NFL or whatever “even while we are fighting two wars!” don’t understand how congress works. Arlan Specter probably has a staff of forty people, working on legislation with dozens if not hundreds of others on a wide range of issues — much of it stuff that would strike the average baseball fan as even sillier than steroids in baseball.
I think at least 2 of these 3 arbitration cases will be pretty interesting, as arb cases go. Obviously Nady is due a nice raise based on last year, but I assume he and his agent will hold up his Pittsburgh numbers as the basis for his salary, while the Yankees will point to his NY numbers and argue that his salary should be formulated based on those? I wonder which side will carry more weight.
Melky will be interesting too, b/c I remember many people here saying that players almost never get pay cuts in arbitration, back when we were debating the pros and cons of not offering it to Abreu. But how on earth could anyone look at Melky’s numbers from last year and then award him a raise in good conscience?
anyone have any guesses on which way either of these 2 cases will go? Also, who argues on behalf of the Yankees in arbitration? Is it Levine?
from another webpage:
Doesn’t it seem a little odd that when you have a ball player (Roger Clemens) who lies to Congress about steroid use in baseball, the U.S. Attorney for DC convenes a grand jury to consider a perjury indictment, but when an official of the Justice Department (Bradley Schlozman) lies to Congress about trying to politicize the civil service within DOJ, the U.S. Attorney fo DC passes on further investigation or prosecution? Which really seems like the more significant problem for the country?
“JoeyA
January 16th, 2009 at 11:26 am
“The Braves seek a right-handed hitter but aren’t dead set on it. They were unwilling to meet the Yankees’ demands for Xavier Nady.” – MLBTR
What the hell are we looking for? He is a one year Boras client loan, are we expecting to great potential studs?
Bullpen arm, #5SP type, or utility infielder that can make contact with the ball. I’m not familiar with Braves roster, but they have to have someone.”
This is why I’m not in favor of trading Nady…we are not going to get something back that matches what we gave up for him. Nady will probably be a Type A FA, so if a team w/o a protected 1st rounder (Mets & Braves will likely both fall in that category) signs him, we get 2 picks. Those 2 picks are the only way we’re gonna get back talent with the ceiling of Tabata and McCutcheon, so thats the way to make the Nady trade worthwhile.
I think that’s what the Yanks are weighing in any negotiations for him – can we get back something better than we would if we took the 2 draft picks? IMO, the answer is no, so they shouldnt trade him.
“It’s not like banks swindled unknowing people into taking mortgages they could never afford and helped send the country into economic chaos.”
More like the government forced the banks to give out loans to people who could not afford them. Subprime mortgages Pete, subprime mortgages.
“Tantron Willoughby
January 16th, 2009 at 12:39 pm
Maybe Curt wants to join us as our number 5 starter to stick it to the Sawx?”
Or better yet, maybe Pedro does…. since he was one of the many victims of a Sawx FO PR smear campaign when they decided they wanted to cut ties with him.
nice posts by curt and ty.
Pedro of 5 years ago maybe, not Pedro of today.
BBB, Nady’s will probably double, and I think that Cabrera’s may stay the same (or, a slight Cost Of living increase). I doubt the Yanks would win if they try to cut it, but, it’s doubtful that an arbitrator will increase it.
Boras probably wants Nady traded too, since he will likely be on the bench this year.
I still don’t buy into Melky or Gardner starting in center every day. I think we will see Damon starting in center more than half of the games this season, with a defensive substitution at some point in the game that moves Damon to left and puts Melky or Gardner into center then.
I think most of the at-bats in the outfield this season will go to Damon, Swisher, and Nady. Plus, as soon as someone tweaks something or needs a rest, whether it’s any of those 3 guys, or Melky/Gardner, or Matsui, or even Tex (Swisher moves to 1st), the bench is fully prepared to supplement that loss in the lineup.
Kurt extended an olive leaf to Yankee fans. Maybe he does have a couple hundred innings left in the old engine!
Agree with BBB on Nady.
Underselling Nady after a career year is silly. If the market’s not right to trade him pre-season, I’m sure there will be ways to find at-bats for everybody, then re-evaluate as the deadline approaches.
Or do we expect a healthy roster all year?
I feel the need to wade in on the McNamee issue. If it was just McNamee’s evidence, and Roger had kept his mouth shut, there would be too much doubt about a rat selling out to save his own skin from prosecution. And when you pile on Mcnamee’s other criminal problems, then I personally would discount his evidence. As they say in Roger’s home state: That dog won’t hunt.
But, once Roger decided to blab off, it didnt take long for him to sink himself. And, you have to wonder why you would lead with your chin when you know that somewhere out there is an underage country and western singer who you did the posteurpedic polka with while you were married, who would be sought out to find some way to discredit your credibility.
Sorry, but when you are not squeaky clean, and you start proclaiming your virtues, you are bound for a big fall (see also Elliot Spitzer for example).
Anyway, I just look and Andy Pettite’s appraoch and the fact that all of us Yankees fans want him back and I feel a bit sorry that Clemens was that dumb. He deserves what he gets if he lied….
We could see a situation in the beginning of the season where we carry 3 catchers on the roster again, if Jorge isn’t 100%. Melky or Gardner could start in AAA, freeing room to make the move possible.
With the pitchers not completely conditioned, I don’t feel they would carry less in the bullpen to carry an extra position player. They could just send down an outfielder.
Its not like Melky is looking for $10 million out of arbitration. I would imagine he is out for a raise. I don’t know his salary last year, but I know it was closer to league minimum than it was to Arod’s. So he will probably win a raise, just because the numbers are so low (in baseball world).
Mike talking about “Jober” again, give it up.
Espresso
the only raise Melky should get is 6 inches off the ground from a good swift kick.
Next year, if he has a comeback season, he can have a raise.
I have absolutely ZERO sympathy for anyone involved in the Clemens/McNamee mess. While I disagree with the holier than thou frauds who want to castrate everyone implicated in the Mitchell Report, these guys clearly deserved each other.
Nady has more value to the Yankees than he would likely bring in a trade. Ninja Burglar has outlined the “plan” I’ve advocated for weeks. Keep in mind it would be a mistake to plus Matsui in for 162 games, so there are some AB for the taking at DH as well. Six guys for four jobs keeps everyone fresh, especially when three of the six are 30 or more.
The fact that the New York Yankees would like to win the World Series in the small, 3-4 year window that they have is evident by the unheard of amount of spending on three free agents this offseason.
They appear to be making a play to ensure a World Series win in the first year of the New Yankee Stadium, hopefully making up for the lack of a playoff appearance in the last year of the old one.
With so much money spent already, why not extend a $12-$14 million offer toward Andy Pettitte? If there is even the reasonable expectation that it would give us the victory in the World Series to have a for-sure innings eater, then why has he not been signed?
To me, it seems like the Yanks have set themselves up for Win or Bust.
“With so much money spent already, why not extend a $12-$14 million offer toward Andy Pettitte?”
I think they will after they try to move Nady. Nationals have 3 center fielders and I would take any of them: Milledge, Maxwell, Dukes. In that order of preference. Make the trade! Throw in some prospects if you have to!
“Nady has more value to the Yankees than he would likely bring in a trade.”
In terms of production, yes. But I think this argument becomes a bit more brittle when you factor in how many years of control under contract you would get out of the person you trade for.
Nady will be a FA after this season and will command big money that he isn’t worth.
From Pinstripes earlier post:
“Teams have won with far worse “seeds”, namely Reggie Jackson, Rickey Henderson, Manny Ramirez, Roger Clemens and Randy Johnson, just to name a few.”
These “seeds” all have one thing in common which ARod has yet to match – they ALL came up big time in Post Season!
the thing that bothers me most about the clemens thing is that he isn’t the only one to deny it after the mitchell report came out.
sure he denied it in more ways than others did. but a lot of people denied it and said the report was just plain wrong…
You have an excellent point, Russell. Any of the three Center Fielders would be a great get for Nady, even if we had to give up a B prospect to free up the payroll for Pettitte.
I guess it just depends on how much Nady gets from abritration. The less, the better on all fronts. He’s more trade worthy with less and if he stays, he costs less. Higher the salary, the less we get in a trade for him and the more we’re paying him if he stays.
Crossing my fingers
Small Window? I don’t get that concept. Even when the holdovers from the dynasty years get older we can fill in with free agents and the newly revived farm system.
Milwaukee had a small window – ours is just about unlimited.
With the amount the Yanks’ revenue should go up in 2009 between the new Stadium and the break they will get on their revenue sharing payments, you wouldn’t think they’d have to move Nady to do anything.
“Nady will be a FA after this season and will command big money that he isn’t worth.”
…which is exactly why…
“Nady has more value to the Yankees than he would likely bring in a trade.”
The corner outfield market being what it is, maybe Nady’s trade value isn’t much to begin with.
oh, and i won big league stew create a caption from yesterday. i didn’t read the others, but i guess they were bad, cause mine wasn’t all that great…
http://tinyurl.com/create-a-caption
I agree with several others on here, no bank I ever heard of walked into a home with a gun and said either ur brains or ur signature will be on this mortgage application for a new home. People who are too dumb to understand their own personal financial situation shouldn’t be following the advice of salesmen to begin with. Everybody wanted to be a real estate maven and live beyond their rational means without minding the risks. The banks didn’t make them do that, they allowed them to. Big difference between reality and the media painted picture that was predictable from the start and is now quickly being painted, that of the banks being the bad guy. The failure to get out of ones own way is the problem of many americans and yet again, it has reared it head. And yet again, the american media looks for a scapegoat. I really hope the average person reading garbage like this isn’t fooled by what really took place. When someone defaults on a credit card payment, is Visa the bad guy for offering them a low APY? Haven’t read that story much and the concept is identical. People know what they can afford and that there is risk in that their personal financial situation could change.they are the ones to blame.
Yes Ninja, but Nady doesn’t have much value to the Yankees because they are only going to get 1 good year out of him. A trade for a #5 pitcher with 1 year left (or unproved CF youngster) could be a match for Nady that would make sense for both teams.
“Nationals have 3 center fielders and I would take any of them: Milledge, Maxwell, Dukes. In that order of preference. Make the trade! Throw in some prospects if you have to!”
Millege isn’t as good as the guys we have. Only in a fan’s fantasy would the Nats trade us Dukes for a Nady package. Maxwell’s not a major leaguer yet.
Don’t see it.
I wonder if Cashman takes a chance on Andruw Jones for cheap one-year deal? Obviously “he’s a shell of his former self” (to quote the controversial sportscaster Howaaad Cosell) but maybe enough to provide good centerfield coverage and hit as well as Gardner/Melky.
Free apps for Melky!!! Amazing Pete, that just made my day!
I bet W. pardons Clemens before leaving office in the next couple of days. Texas boys take care of each other. Just a hunch.
As for trading Nady for Milledge, I’d do it. He’d be the most athletic player on the team with a nice upside and he’s got swagger something that, I think, this team can use a little of.
Doubt the Nats would do that trade though. I gotta think a young athletic CF with speed and power on his way up is exactly what they are building around, not a 1 year Boras rental player who is turning 30.
Well done saucY!
Millege hits better than Melky, but defensively he’s much worse than either Cabrera or Gardner. Don’t think he’s a fit for us.
Can’t see the Nats taking Nady’s salary, either.
Moving to a different team, Nady wouldn’t get him, but what about Cody Ross?
If anybody is watching CNN, they’re getting ready to show bird strikes on planes…..some amazing damage done to planes.
OK, I’ve officially decided. If Melky gets a raise in arbitration, I’m asking my boss for a raise too. I just wish she followed baseball so I could actually use the Melkman as a case study.
“Yes Ninja, but Nady doesn’t have much value to the Yankees because they are only going to get 1 good year out of him.”
granted about it only being 1 year, but that doesn’t account for the 2 draft picks the Yanks will receive should they keep Nady and he be given Type A status. If the Yankees use those picks wisely, then they along with 1.5 good seasons from Nady, should approximate the same value of what they gave up to get him in the first place.
But if they trade him for Milledge, (whose below-avg OPS+ means his bat won’t play well at a corner OF position, but his defense wont play well in center) that plus half a season of Nady is far less value than they gave up in the original trade with PIT.
Cody Ross is a free-swinger who should be a fourth outfielder–he would not be an answer for CF.
“So what are they going to do, throw him in the clink? Of course not. But it’s good that government prosecutors are spending time and money on such important matters like whether retired ballplayers took steroids. It’s not like banks swindled unknowing people into taking mortgages they could never afford and helped send the country into economic chaos.
Clemens has done a pretty complete job of ruining his life. The government doesn’t need to help.”
So we should throw away the law because you think that the government has enough to do? Lying to Congress is perjury sometimes but not others? If there are other problems going on it shouldn’t be prosecuted by when times are stable in the country unleash the dogs?
Clemens insisted on the Congressional hearings. In doing he so he helped write his own obituary. The law was made for everyone. Since Clemens was the clown in one of the most public circuses televised in a long time, it would certainly send out the wrong message to any others who are called to appear in front of a Congressional committee if Clemens, after that frightfully embarrassing, hubris-filled performance – where his lying was so painfully obvious that you were forced to come face-to-face with a man whose ego was totally out of control – were to walk away without any legal ramifications since he’s “done a pretty complete job of ruining his life.”
Hey I was caught red-handed taking money from a cash resigter when a clerk turned around. (Unfortunately there were eyewitnesses and my DNA is on the bills. Who knew?) But I have a receipt saying that I was somewhere else that day. I don’t care how much it looked like me and I don’t care how many eye witnesses there were. I didn’t do it. What is really plissing me off though is that the entire community believes I did it and thinks it looks just like me. I lost my damn job in the process. Nobody will hire me, even though I didn’t do it. Why should the government waste its time prosecuting me? My life is already ruined! The economy is in ruins. I’m sure prosecutors have a lot of better things to do with their time. Hey go take care of real crime like murder and things like that!
Yeah, that’s how the law should work!
Russel,
I believe Nady does have value to the Yankees, which I outlined earlier. I also believe that, the corner outfield market being what it is, he doesn’t have much trade value either.
Could the Yankees really get a #5 starter that you’d rather have over Hughes, Aceves, Coke, in exchange for Nady when there are other outfielders to choose from in the FA when pries are dropping? Who is gonna do a deal where they give up a back end starter for Nady?
Do we need yet another young unproven outfielder to add to the pot of other unproven outfielders we already have?
Are any of those spare parts more valuable than Nady who will not only provide quality at bats, but help as insurance that we don’t have to plug in some “unproven young” infielder our outfielder into our lineup when someone needs a few weeks off?
You may think so, but I don’t.
There is no urgency to get rid of him before his deal expires. He’s replaceable after the end of the season, when he walks. In a season where the offense probably loses more pieces than it adds, the next best thing is depth. No reason to get rid of it, IMO.
(By the way I was using a hypothetical just in case there is anyone who didn’t get that. I didn’t really steal money from a cash register.)
“Cody Ross is a free-swinger who should be a fourth outfielder—he would not be an answer for CF.”
Don’t see where you’re coming from on that. He doesn’t have a high OBP, true, but he has pretty decent power and the numbers all seem to indicate he’d be about average defensively in CF.
He’s clearly better than a fourth outfielder, and the numbers say he’s better than Melky or Gardner.
Plus he’s cheap, and maybe he could be gotten from Florida.
“Bullpen arm, #5SP type, or utility infielder that can make contact with the ball. I’m not familiar with Braves roster, but they have to have someone.”
why on earth would the Yankees trade Nady for a utility infielder?
makes no sense. at all.
“But if they trade him for Milledge, (whose below-avg OPS+ means his bat won’t play well at a corner OF position, but his defense wont play well in center) that plus half a season of Nady is far less value than they gave up in the original trade with PIT.”
no it isn’t.
Milledge for Tabata is a trade that favors the Yankees.
the rest of the crap the Yankees gave up was fair for Marte.
“Millege isn’t as good as the guys we have. ”
if you are talking about Gardner and Melky, i disagree.
duh, once you factor in CF defense, I respectfully think you’re wrong.
Well, one good thing the cruddy Giants are eliminated. Did Melky or A Rod hit better w/RISP last year? Onto pitching, Smoltz, Dice K, Beckett, Lester, Wake vs CC, AJ, Wang, Joba and Hughes..No brainer. Boston has the better pitching. Hughes is the next Pavano, he’s injured more than he plays. AJ will last about half the season. Then the Yanks will be down to three quality starters by the All Star break. Kennedy, Coke, Acavado, please, I mean please. Along with the Yanks aging offense, I fear this season will be worse than last.
The Yankees offense is actually getting younger, believe it or not.
“Did Melky or A Rod hit better w/RISP last year?”
Better than Varitek? Both.
What did Clemens do ? I didn’t think anyone had any proof against him. Did they ? I’m not kidding, I really have not followed it at all.
I mean, I know Clemens was accused of using HGH / steroids, but I just thought it was an accusation, I did not think there was any proof. Again, I’m not kidding or living in a cave, the whole thing turns me off.
Replacing Abreu who will be 35 at the start of next season, with Swisher who is 28 through all of next season is a difference of 7 years.
Replacing Giambi who is 38, with Teixeira who will be 29 at the start of next season is a difference of 9 years.
Pretty clear the offense is getting younger.
No way would any court of law accept the personal souvenirs of Brian McNamee as valid proof….not the least of which would be the problem with tainted “evidence” and chain of custody.
“The economy is in ruins. I’m sure prosecutors have a lot of better things to do with their time. Hey go take care of real crime like murder and things like that!”
a newscaster on cnbc the other day blasted the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform for even spending time last winter on steroids and clemens when every minute they were doing that, they weren’t spending time uncovering the ticking financial time bomb that was developing .
seeing that committee undress greenspan the way it did shows the power it wields. greenspan’s contribution to the financial mess by his endorsement of financial paper that almost no one understands including him means he likely has caused much human suffering than clemens caused.
maybe he didn’t break any laws, but greenspan’s career is as tarnished as clemen’s because of this.
for those who think average people should know better when going into financial deals with banks with mortages, loans, or credit cards, how is anyone going to know totally what they are getting into when the federal reserve chairman has set up a financial system that even he doesn’t understand? everyone who was hurt wasn’t irresponsible and a deadbeat.
personal responsibility is great. i’m all for it, but that goes for those that create the financial system in the first place .
i wonder how many bank or financial company boards george mitchell is on? maybe he had a few more important things to be looking at than peds in baseball.
GreenBeret7, so how is Congress investigating Clemens for purjury. I really have not followed this episode at all, obviously.
francessa is saying the nfl is thinking of moving the super bowl to president’s day weekend. that would bring it right up to pitchers and catchers report date.
Ed Whitson, it’s hard to bring you up to date on Clemens when we don’t know how behind you are.
Have you gotten to the American Revolution yet?
I think we should keep Nady, unless Cashman is blown away with an offer.
Having said that- I think the FA “corner outfield” glut is overplayed. Beside Manny (who is really a DH) there is no FA-RH outfielder close to Nady. Plus the draft pick for letting him walk next year, has value as well. I think Cashman could swing a decent deal if so inclined.
president’s day weekend makes a ton of sense. they should’ve thought of that sooner.
Cashman is obviously going to add another starter to the mix here.
I remember when Alex opted out. A reporter asked him who was going to play 3rd base. “Hello Wilson Betemit” he replied. Same with Swisher being the 1st baseman before Tex was signed, and Bubba being the CF when Damon was ultimately signed.
We just don’t know who it’s going to be yet, or what the cost is. But the extra arm will come.
Wave Your Hat – funny. I think I’m caught up to the Great Depression now! I guess my question is, was their anything conclusive against him. Everything sounded like a he said / she said, so I deemed it a witch hunt and stop following it.
president’s day weekend makes a ton of sense. they should’ve thought of that sooner.
____________
They should move presidents weekend, not the other way around…
Are they extending the current playoff format? Or will teams have 6 weeks to prepare for the SB? I dont get it…
“What the hell are we looking for? He is a one year Boras client loan, are we expecting to great potential studs?”
Having Nady this year is a good thing, not a bad thing. The Yankees have invested HEAVILY in this team with a win-now attitude. If they can’t get something worthwhile, it doesn’t make sense to move Nady. The Yankees can certainly use the depth.
Too many fans seem to be casting Nady away as if he is a useless part. He is a dependable MLB regular. He should also bring a draft pick if he leaves next offseason.
I suggest the Yankees wait til the AllStar break. Dunn and Abreu will be signed so supply will be down. The Yankees can decide if they still need Nady (if Swisher is playing well, are there any injuries?) and then trade him to a team who is fighting to make the playoffs.
Unless someone bowls them over with a great deal, why not wait til the ASB?
Corner outfielders still available:
Abreu, Griffey Jr., Hinske, Brad Wilkerson, Alou, Garret Anderson, Dunn, Luis Gonzalez, Jaque Jones, Jay Payton, Manny.
Obviously some of these guys are better than others, but that’s a lot of names for mid January.
IMO, it’s all related. steroids are being used by mlb to deal with their labor issues and to sell drugs to the fans. i also wonder if maybe it’s a way to preempt lawsuits on the part of the players, considering how dangerous these drugs are and considering the role mlb played in their distribution.
Ninja – a lot of those guys are really old and asking for an exorbitant amount of money and have good risks.
It makes me smile seeing all of these guys go past their prime, asking for increases in salary for less production, and be sitting there without jobs.
francessa said they are thinking about expanding the regular season to 18 games in 19 weeks, with only 2 exhibition games.
personally i think 18 games is crazy long. teams already have a really hard time maintaining thier intensity over the course of the season as it is now.
Also, the Braves have spent some money this offseason. They don’t appear to be in rebuilding mode, though their offense appears to be lacking.
What are their options?
Sign Abreu or Dunn to a 3yr deal and spend way more money than they want to on defensive liability corner OF?
Sign Andruw Jones and pray he can magically turn his career around?
Give up a top notch prospect for a dependable OF who will help boost them to a legit contender in the NL East AND get them a draft pick next offseason?
Do nothing and have a good team that is just a tad short offensively to compete with the Mets and Phillies?
The Yankees are in the driver’s seat in these negotiations. No need to cave.
Pete cut Melkey so slack you and i know that alot of stars started off slow hes onley 22 and i remember a former yankee having trouble when he was younger he became a star let me see Bernie Williams sound fumillier and also Sammy sosa started off slow nd where are they noe future hall of famers
Boston Dave – Nady came off a record season for him. You run the risk of him having significant decline in production. Just saying that is one reason why you could consider trading him now. Strike while the iron’s hot.
giambi was smart to jump on that $4.5M. at least he has a job.
Heard on ESPN Radio that the Yankees are disscousing Nady for Pelfry and Nady for Glavin Floyd i think that Nady Floyd trade rumor is true thats the best the yankees are going to get or i would love to see Swisher and Nady for Fransisco Liriano
I think the upshot is that Clemens injected someone at the Country Music Awards? I’m a little mixed up on it all too.
who is going to trade for Nady when there are so many free agent corner outfielders?
Jay how many RH corner outfielders are there?
Francessa likes to make stuff up to rile up listeners. I wouldn’t worry about it.
can we please sign manny?
“MYGIRLS
January 16th, 2009 at 2:49 pm
Well, one good thing the cruddy Giants are eliminated.”
GTFO
(unless youre referring to the baseball team…then kindly disregard this statement)
“Heard on ESPN Radio that the Yankees are disscousing Nady for Pelfry and Nady for Glavin Floyd i think that Nady Floyd trade rumor is true”
I must have cut class that day. I can’t even imagine why the Mets or the White Sox would do those deals.
Nady for Floyd?! Wut?? That can’t be true, sounds like highway robbery for Chicago…I wish it was though.
AROD fan
January 16th, 2009 at 4:04 pm
Francessa likes to make stuff up to rile up listeners. I wouldn’t worry about it.
can we please sign manny?
—–
Really?
“Don’t see where you’re coming from on that. He doesn’t have a high OBP, true, but he has pretty decent power and the numbers all seem to indicate he’d be about average defensively in CF.”
Average to above average defensively in CF, but I don’t believe that he’ll maintain his 2008 performance at the plate. 28 years old, couldn’t put it together for 3-4 years before ’08, terrible at getting on base, and if you watch him play he swings as hard as he possibly can at every pitch he offers at. No guarantee that his power will hold up and considering he never walks, I greatly doubt a reprise of 2008.
“He’s clearly better than a fourth outfielder, and the numbers say he’s better than Melky or Gardner.”
No, the numbers say that he was better than Melky and Gardner last year, but the numbers don’t dictate that he’ll be better going forward.
“Plus he’s cheap, and maybe he could be gotten from Florida.”
Marlins already moved Willingham, Gregg and Jacobs in order to balance their books, doubtful that they’re just giving away someone like Ross who is useful to them as someone who can keep the seat in CF warm until Cameron Maybin is ready to take over full-time. They have seemed more willing to move Hermida, but the Yankees already have a glut of corner OFers. Ross may sound nice as an option for CF for ’09, but trading anything valuable for him could be pointless because it will be buying you another good CFer but not good enough to clearly be a starter.
MR YANKEES OFFSEASON MISSION COMPLETE START SAVING FOR PUJOLS 2011 GET SHEETS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
January 16th, 2009 at 3:59 pm
“Heard on ESPN Radio that the Yankees are disscousing Nady for Pelfry and Nady for Glavin Floyd i think that Nady Floyd trade rumor is true thats the best the yankees are going to get or i would love to see Swisher and Nady for Fransisco Liriano”
Personally would want Gavin Floyd, but it’ll cost us more than Nady to get a young 16 game winner with a 3.91 ERA and .242 BA against.
EdWhitson, the proof against Clemens is overwhelming. No, there isn’t a photograph with a needle in his behind but there is one of him at Jose Canseco’s house when he said he had never been there (under oath). There are reportedly receipts for HGH shipments to Clemens that will be confirmed after the indictment. There is the admission that McNamee was telling the truth about injecting Clemens’ wife with HGH and then Clemens claiming he had no knowledge of it. There is Andy Pettite’s testimony about conversations he and Clemens had about using performing enhancers to which Clemens claimed Andy “misremembered”.
But the most damning evidence of all is basic common sense. There is no compelling reason for McNamee to lie to prosecutors about Clemens when he told the truth about everyone else (all other parties mentioned have admitted to his accuracy). The Lidocane and B12 injection excuse (the only injections he claimed to get from McNamee) makes no sense medically and can’t be corroborated by any teammates or staff members.
Not to mention, the extremely compelling circumstantial evidence of his performance as they correspond to his alleged use of the drugs. Those of us who grew up in the 70s and 80s remember what great baseball players could and couldn’t do (Clemens and Bonds probably being the best of them), what happened when you hit your mid 30s, how many home runs you could expect from a player like Brady Anderson.
All that changed in the 90s and anyone that fits the profile must at least be suspected. Add the kind of evidence we already know about Clemens and it’s truly a slam dunk. Too bad the guy was just too full of himself to see it himself. Could’ve saved himself and the government a lot of time and money and us fans a lot of grief!
Twins don’t need OFer’s or 1st baseman, so Liriano would cost us Hughes to start with plus others.
Red Sox Owner John Henry To Meet With Varitek
By Tim Dierkes [January 16 at 3:17pm CST]
According to WEEI’s Alex Speier, Red Sox owner John Henry said in a Comcast Sportsnet interview that he is flying tonight to meet Jason Varitek one-on-one. You have to think a meeting without Scott Boras might speed up talks.
————————————————————
That should be a fun meeting. If I were Henry, I wouldn’t worry about whether Boras was there or not….I’d be making sure that Luccino wasn’t there.
“No, the numbers say that he was better than Melky and Gardner last year, but the numbers don’t dictate that he’ll be better going forward.”
Andrew, you are entitled to your opinions of course but the CHONE and Marcel projections both disagree with you. You might also want to take a look here (see comment 29):
http://www.replacementlevel.co.....ng_invites
I agree with you that the Marlins might not want to trade him but on the other hand they might be. You can never tell with Florida.
“Misses the point. The government doesn’t NEED to help; the government is obliged to help. A functioning criminal justice system doesn’t overlook SOME instances of federal perjury. An oath under penalty of prosecution is an oath under penalty of prosecution — to assign them relative values defeats the purpose.”
Hey, nobody pursued Clinton!
“Boston Dave – Nady came off a record season for him. You run the risk of him having significant decline in production. Just saying that is one reason why you could consider trading him now. Strike while the iron’s hot.”
True, but only if you get good value for him. The big advantage that Nady has is that he is cheap for 1 season. Teams are clearly cautious to sign the available OF to big money, multiple year deals. Especially with smaller market teams, there is a big premium on getting a cheap, 1yr rental, who is dependable, who should get you a draft pick. That is not available via free agency.
Consider how many free agents are out there unsigned. That should tell us something. Teams don’t want to give big $$ over multiple years for any of these guys. They want short term deals for dependable, above avg guys. That is Nady.
I’m not saying don’t trade Nady. I’m just saying the Yankees don’t NEED to trade him unless they get a very good deal. The Yankees can certainly use depth and the Nady/Swisher combo provides that.
I don’t agree with the idea that the Yanks now have an expendable part and should go out and get whatever they can for him. Nady can be a valuable part of the 2009 Yankees if thats what it comes down to.
Are they taking the private Jet?
“Andrew, you are entitled to your opinions of course but the CHONE and Marcel projections both disagree with you. You might also want to take a look here (see comment 29):”
WYH: Good link, I just took a gander myself. I say forget about Cody Ross, if anything the Yanks should trade for Jody Gerut. He would cost less than Ross because he’s older and more injury prone, and it’s not like the Padres are trying to compete this year, whereas the Marlins may be. Plus, Cashman and Towers are buddies and may have similar views on what a good return might be. I don’t think we would have to give up Nady to get him.
Normally I might be lukewarm on the idea because I wouldn’t think Gerut would repeat his success of last year, but those projections seem to and I’m going to assume theyre smarter than me, haha, so maybe it is worth a shot.
Danny, thanks for the catch up, much appreciated.
Danny Baseball
January 16th, 2009 at 4:22 pm
Not to mention, the extremely compelling circumstantial evidence of his performance as they correspond to his alleged use of the drugs. Those of us who grew up in the 70s and 80s remember what great baseball players could and couldn’t do (Clemens and Bonds probably being the best of them), what happened when you hit your mid 30s, how many home runs you could expect from a player like Brady Anderson.
————————————————————
Of course, the fact that this supposedly took place from ’99-’01, coming off of 2 straight Cy Young seasons, why would he start taking anything, then? He then had 2 of the worst years of his career. Sounds like it really helped, doesn’t it?
Looking at the CHONE projections, does anyone favor a straight swap of Nady for righty Marlon Byrd, both free agents after this season, and using Byrd in CF, plattoning at times with lefty hitting Gardner?
“GreenBeret7
January 16th, 2009 at 4:24 pm
Red Sox Owner John Henry To Meet With Varitek
By Tim Dierkes [January 16 at 3:17pm CST]
According to WEEI’s Alex Speier, Red Sox owner John Henry said in a Comcast Sportsnet interview that he is flying tonight to meet Jason Varitek one-on-one. You have to think a meeting without Scott Boras might speed up talks.
——————————————————————————————
That should be a fun meeting.”
C’mon, 4/$40!!
Hey, I can dream, lol
why ya are all getting at me for am just saying floyd for nady is a good trade dont you agree thts a steal for the yankees becuase floyd is under team control through 2013
John Henry’s going to be pissed when he finds out he doesn’t get frequent flier miles on the private jet.
“if anything the Yanks should trade for Jody Gerut.”
I like Gerut too. I agree he’d be worth a shot. I couldn’t figure out how we could get him from SD. Of course, I didn’t figure out how to get Ross, either, but don’t ask me to be consistent.
The thing that really surprised me about those CF rankings was how low they rated Mike Cameron. If those ratings are right he’s not that much of an upgrade over Melky or Gardner (kind of makes me question those rankings a little bit, I have to say).
Boras really helped Varitek by convincing him to not accept arbitration!! Now a one year 5M contract, with incentives would look good to him. Like paying your broker commission while he astutely runs your portfolio into the ground.
Yankee Trader: Byrd for Nady is a really interesting idea. I’d definitely do that. I was actually just thinking yesterday that the Yanks should sign Byrd when he hits free agency, because of his ability to play all over the OF. But I bet Texas would want young pitching in return in any trade. Still, definitely worth looking into on Cash’s end.
Floyd for Nady would be a steal for the Yankees, that’s why I’m not convinced, without us throwing in a top relief or starting pitcher prospect, that it would get done.
BBB
January 16th, 2009 at 4:37 pm
“GreenBeret7
January 16th, 2009 at 4:24 pm
Red Sox Owner John Henry To Meet With Varitek
By Tim Dierkes [January 16 at 3:17pm CST]
According to WEEI’s Alex Speier, Red Sox owner John Henry said in a Comcast Sportsnet interview that he is flying tonight to meet Jason Varitek one-on-one. You have to think a meeting without Scott Boras might speed up talks.
——————————————————————————————
That should be a fun meeting.”
C’mon, 4/$40!!
Hey, I can dream, lol
————————————————————
The picture of Luccino standing at the window of the airport, tears rolling down his cheeks, sobbing, “But, I wanna go, too. I promise to be good and you don’t even have to buy me nuffin’.” just flashed in my mind.
Actually GreenBeret7, it was 1998 to 2001 that McNamee claimed to inject Clemens himself, but there was also information not involving McNamee directly for Clemens using between 2002 and 2006.
Byrd would probably be available at a discount when Texas decides it’s out of the race in June!!
Danny Baseball
January 16th, 2009 at 4:48 pm
Actually GreenBeret7, it was 1998 to 2001 that McNamee claimed to inject Clemens himself, but there was also information not involving McNamee directly for Clemens using between 2002 and 2006.
————————————————————
More of that secret informtion from Mr. Unnamed Source?
“Byrd would probably be available at a discount when Texas decides it’s out of the race in June!!”
I don’t know about a discount but I can’t see Texas trading him before then. Probably not until the trade deadline.
Braves apparently balking at the Yankees asking price for Nady-most likely looking to get Jordan Shafer or Gorkys Hernandez.
Anyone interested in lefty Kelly Johnson, versatile OF’er/ 2nd baseman for Nady, as Braves have Martin Prado to take over 2nd.
“More of that secret informtion from Mr. Unnamed Source?”
It’s been a while since this was the hot topic and I honestly don’t remember, but it was better than an anonymous tip. Everything should come out once the grand jury hands down the indictment and we’ll have plenty of concrete stuff to work with. My point is, this has already been elevated beyond a reasonable doubt for a reasonable person and the government is doing the right thing for holding him accountable.
“John Henry’s going to be pissed when he finds out he doesn’t get frequent flier miles on the private jet.”
john henry doesn’t have just one private jet anymore: he traded his good one in in for 5 fixer uppers that have a high upside if they don’t crash.
oh, randy l ! That’s awful!
doreen-
it’s nick in sf’s fault. he gave me the idea.
looks like people that want to trade for Milledge havent seen him play CF
he is horrible in CF and has an arm like Damon…and he’s a dickhead
randy likes those kinds of planes, crash or not. They’re gritty jet-fuel eaters.
search:
Ex-SF Linden Signs With Yanks
Linden, Berroa, Bernier, Leone signing and stats
Ex-Yank Christian Signs
Native New Yorker John Rodriguez signs with Yanks
This guy follows the Yankees fringe and minor league players!
Here’s an intersting look at the Yankees to 5 prospects:
http://www.baseball-intellect......prospects/
Danny Baseball – your iteration of the evidence against Clemens was an accurate depiction of what happened at the hearings. There were so many inconsistencies in Clemens testimony and then things that were outright lies (the photograph you mentioned that had him at Canseco’s party when he provided a receipt from a golf course as proof that he wasn’t being just one of the things.) And then there was the Pettitte testimony that Andy must have been “misremembering.”
None of it is secret evidence. Those of us who are attorneys and were rivetted to the hearings both for the legal aspects and because it involved the sport we love have no difficulty remembering the testimony nor the inconsistencies.
Finally, as long as major league baseball is the only sport afforded the antitrust exemption by Congress, baseball will Congress’ handmaiden. If it wants it otherwise, it can give up the antitrust exemption.
randy l -
I shoulda figured Nick in SF had something to do with it!
Jon Gruden & GM both axed in Tampa Bay.
Tom,
thanks for the link. I hadn’t seen that site before but it looks really good.
Nick in SF -
I just saw your jet-fuel eater post. Priceless!
i remember seeing alan dershowitz on espn the morning of his testimony saying that he was sure clemens attorneys had made it clear to him the very serious consequences that could result if he lied in his testimony.
whether you think congress should have been holding the hearings or not, there is alot of evidence that clemens lied, very publicly and after being warned of the concequences, in his testimony to congress.
for alot of people in the U.S., its the only congressional testimony they watched last winter. for prosecutors to look the other way would be unacceptable imo.
he knew what he was doing, he was given chances to back off and he went ahead and lied to the committee, he has nobody to blame but himself and maybe his lawyer.
the glazers finally gonna land the tuna?
“john henry doesn’t have just one private jet anymore: he traded his good one in in for 5 fixer uppers that have a high upside if they don’t crash.”
Well played.
So do you pick up Andruw Jones for the minimum salary when he’s released and try to whip his sorry butt into shape in the minors, almost entirely at the Dodgers expense, just to see if he’s able to contribute down the stretch or next year?
If he’s done then he’s done, you just let him go. If he’s working and showing improvement, maybe one could convince another team he has a greater upside even if they know he’ll never be like Andruw in his 20′s. Trade him to that team for the trading deadline before they can see that come July 31 he’ll probably have gotten as much of his skills back as he may ever get. Prospects, a bullpen arm or two, or whatever. And if nobody takes the bait, you still let him go.
I know if the Dodgers let him go it means they don’t think he’s ever coming back. They6′re probably right. As long as the financial obligation is no more than the minimum, is it worth the chance maybe you could get someone better in return after 4 months of putting Andruw through boot camp?
I feel like such a used car salesman right down to the plaid jacket, mismatched polyester slacks, comb-over ‘doo and birth control glasses.
the baseball-intellect guy didn’t seem to know who hard Montero’s outs were in Charleston and how that park suppresses homers.
Ham Fighters
January 16th, 2009 at 6:35 pm
the glazers finally gonna land the tuna?
—–
Good call Ham as Tuna hasn’t spoken yet and still has plenty of time to opt out and collect 9mm as he passes go.
Phil
January 16th, 2009 at 6:45 pm
the baseball-intellect guy didn’t seem to know who hard Montero’s outs were in Charleston and how that park suppresses homers.
————————————————————
The wind blowing in off of the river and in from left field killed a lot of Montero’s and Laird’s shots. Grayson Stadium in Savannah killed a lot of shots when they played here.
seems like there’s been a tuna-to-tampa rumor everytime bill’s been unemployed or about to be. id still be surpised to see him leave miami, i think thats a pretty cushy job for a jersey guy, but tampa i could see him leaving for. especially since he can keep the 9 mil while doing it.
“Heard on ESPN Radio that the Yankees are disscousing Nady for Pelfry and Nady for Glavin Floyd i think that Nady Floyd trade rumor is true thats the best the yankees are going to get or i would love to see Swisher and Nady for Fransisco Liriano”
if cash was able to pull this off and get floyd it would amazing and our rotation would be unstopable loli highly doubt this will happen but man would that be a good deal.
I think the point is that Congress didn’t need to call Clemens in to discuss what HGH he may have taken in the first place…it was a baseball matter and it should have stayed there.
NOT that Congress should ignore perjury…they should have never spent the time with all those Congressmen trying to get special TV time in the first place. IMO, It was none of there business.
We all know Football players are doing tons of things to improve there performance including killing themselves from the amount of weight and pressure they put on there hearts…I think making baseball had a policy in place was more than enough…Congress did have better things to work on….obviously.
“Heard on ESPN Radio that the Yankees are disscousing Nady for Pelfry and Nady for Glavin Floyd i think that Nady Floyd trade rumor is true thats the best the yankees are going to get or i would love to see Swisher and Nady for Fransisco Liriano”
I call BS on that Floyd for Nady trade.
“f cash was able to pull this off and get floyd it would amazing and our rotation would be unstopable”
floyd is a good pitcher, maybe closer to the pitcher he was in the 2nd half of 08′, but I’d be careful throwing the word “unstopable” or even unstoppable around.
Ed – American League, prepare to be scared! CC, Aj, and MT!!
January 16th, 2009 at 7:27 pm
“Heard on ESPN Radio that the Yankees are disscousing Nady for Pelfry and Nady for Glavin Floyd i think that Nady Floyd trade rumor is true thats the best the yankees are going to get or i would love to see Swisher and Nady for Fransisco Liriano”
I call BS on that Floyd for Nady trade.
————————————————————
The whole thing was BS. It was his 1 minute of fame. Somebody actually read and responded to something he and is 12 year old friend thought up.
Hey guys, question here. I’ve always been a supporter of Joba as a starter, but recently I read somewhere (don’t remember where) that if he is a starter he could pitch 200 innings, and he would impact 34 games. While in the bullpen, he could impact 75-80 games. What do you guys think about this?
i think i want 200 innings of joba.
im thinking jason from levittown was the source of the nady for floyd rumor.
hey boston dave, don’t make fun of my spelling! lol
LGV, I think you should ask yourself if you want to put CC and AJ into the bullpen too so that they can impact more games. Then you will find your answer on Joba.
Chamberlain’s going to be held to 150 innings, max for 2009. That puts him on target to cut loose for close to 200 innings in 2010. Hughes should be completely ready at that time, too. That’s one reason that they need that 6th starter this year. He can take 9-10 starts of Chamberlain’s this coming season and a couple from Burnett and Pettitte, also. Basically you’d get 1 and a half starters for about 900,000 dollars.
The 8th inning role could very well be the most overrated role in the game.
We already know the 1-2 punch of Mo/Wetteland helped win this team and championship – but they won 3 more rings and 5 more pennants without such a dominant 1-2 punch in that pen.
In fact, outside of the Yanks in 1996 and the “Nasty Boys” in 1990 – I don’t recall another team in the past 20 years who won the World Series with such a dynamic duo in the pen.
It’s necessary to have a very solid pen. But it’s not necessary to take your best young pitcher in the organization and put him in such an overrated role when a dozen other teams have found ways to win rings without it.
I’ll just give Law’s take on the whole Joba thing. It’s from yesterday:
Jason (New York, NY): What do you think are the chances that the yankees put Joba back in the bullpen where i believe he belongs and is the best asset to the team and letting players like Aceves, Hughes, Kennedy and Kontros fight it out for the fourth and fifth spot in the rotation..
Keith Law: Joba does not belong in the bullpen, and he is NOT more of an asset there. Just stop it.
http://proxy.espn.go.com/chat/.....t_id=24565
Nick, you’re completely right. And I favor Joba as a starter. Just playing a little devil’s advocate here.
It’s just hard, when your a fan of this team, not too fall in love with a potential 8th/9th inning reliever, considering the impact Mo had in that role during our dynasty years.
It’s just hard, when your a fan of this team, not too fall in love with a potential 8th/9th inning reliever, considering the impact Mo had in that role during our dynasty years.
———–
That was Mo’s role for one season – 1996. They let Wetteland walk and gave Mo the closer’s job in 1997.
They did okay without that formula in 1998, 1999, and 2000.
It’s easier to find potential Nelsons and Stantons for the bullpen than it is to find someone with Joba’s potential for the rotation. In 2010 and 2011 we could have ace-quality starters 1-4 or 1-5… it’s a beautiful dream.
Joba-to-the-bullpen talk is hard to wipe out than Somali piracy. But it’s just as dangerous!
Guiseppe,
I’m just assuming that if Joba went to the bullpen (which he should not), he would eventually become our closer.
That’s why I made the reference to Mo and the dynasty years.
And just out of curiosity, is it Guiseppe or Giuseppe?
Joba-to-the-bullpen talk is hard to wipe out than Somali piracy.
———————————————————-
LOL, clever. I don’t think it will go away until Joba wins his first Cy Young, as a starter of course.
Yankees have hired Prudential Douglas Elliman, one of the largest NY real estate brokerages, to help them sell their remaining luxury boxes(7 of 59 are left) and the remaining premium seating (25% still available). Any takers?
For those interested, the memorial service for Todd Drew will be _Sunday 18th, 3 PM at Riverside Memorial Chapel, 76th and Amesterdam_
I’m going to make every effort to attend.
hahahahah..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....re=related
“I think the point is that Congress didn’t need to call Clemens in to discuss what HGH he may have taken in the first place…it was a baseball matter and it should have stayed there.”
Congress was involved long before that. The Mitchell Report was the by-product of an investigation that took place after the first wave of Congressinal hearings were held (as a result of Jose Canseco’s book.) High school athletes had died using steroids and Congress considered the used of dangerous and illegal substances filtering down to that level a matter of extreme importance. Baseball players were considered role models to youth, and Canseco’s book alleged rampant steroid use in major league baseball. His book also showed that baseball had been unwilling or unable to police itself, and Congress decided it needed to step in. (Always remember the baseball anti-trust exemption. Congress owns MLB as long as they want to continue to have that exemption.) It might have been able to remain inhouse if Clemens didn’t insist on becoming a one-man press show, calling press conferences and insisting on appearing on 60 Minutes. In doing that he publicly questioned the validity of the Mitchell Report, denying he had been asked to answer to allegations in the report. He also said he didn’t know about the contents of the report until the Friday before they were being published. All of those things were found to be untrue, based on phone records and the timing of Clemens sending his investigators to try to shake down Brian MacNamee. When you basically call former US Senator George Mitchell and his investigators liars, and you do it on 60 Minutes, you put Congress in a position of needing to get to the bottom of it since they are the ones who asked baseball to police itself and the result was the Mitchell Report. Before Clemens et al were called to testify, Fehr, Selig et al were called to testify as to the contents of the report.
Congress had stepped in long before the Mitchell Report was compiled and published.
I’m just assuming that if Joba went to the bullpen (which he should not), he would eventually become our closer.
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Worry about who the next closer is in two years when Mo retires. Then again, based on his dominant ’08 campaign, Mo could decide to pitch longer.
By then, the Yanks should have a replacement in mind to take over the closer’s role and Joba could very well be one of the best pitchers in the game.
Mark Melancon….in the wings for future closer.
Yes / No ???
I don’t think a reliever who hasn’t thrown a single inning in the majors is waiting in the wings.
Melancon could be on the list for sure but I don’t think the Yankees are even thinking about that right now given that Mo is signed for another several years. Who knows what things will look like in 2011…
Did you feel that way when he played on your red sux team?