Today in The Journal News
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Feb 16, 2009 
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A.J. Burnett dominated the Yankees last season. But he swears it wasn’t an audition. Joe Girardi sure was paying attention.
Alex Rodriguez apologized to Selena Roberts for saying she broke into his house. This notebook also has updates on Chien-Ming Wang, Alfredo Aceves, Jorge Posada and Andrew Brackman.
o god, here it comes pete, you must have added the arod apology thing because of your anti yankees bias. even mentioning the apology is a criticism of arod and it shows that you are just a red sox fan who has been sent here by the RSN to poison the minds of the true believers who come here for new on true yankee.
news on true yankees. s stopped working there apparently.
am fairly certain people will defend Arod, for making up the lie about Selena Roberts breaking into his home. Arod could blow up a bus of school children, and people on this site would still rationalize/defend him.
Makes sense to have Kennedy and Hughes and probably Coke heading up the rotation in Scranton with Aceves and Giese and perhaps Tomko being considered for the long relief role. I wonder if that role makes sense for Igawa? Nah!
To me AJ is in many ways the key to the season. If he pitches like he did in Toronto last season the Yanks are the team to beat. The added benefit he and CC bring is the ability to register strikeouts which is a great plus when you have a mediocre defensive team.
hey, hey now…it wasnt THAT many kids and the sleazebag helocopter pilot who filmed it was a deserter from the gulf war who hates arod.
LOL
He probably added the A-Rod apology thing since..you know..it happened.
He’s also been reporting on every tidbit of the A-Rod scandal, good and bad. Stop trying to turn everything into a “pro/anti-Yankee bias”.
Or, better yet, if you don’t like a pretty balanced atmosphere, then don’t read the blog anymore.
Jeesh, I sometimes wonder why people get so frustrated at the sign of an apologetic atmosphere..it’s a YANKEE BLOG, for christ’s take.
End Rant. Begin studying for test.
Although A-Rod is a tremendous hitter, he now falls under the same cloud that Bonds has over him. He has lied so much, that you can’t believe anything that he says. If he passes Ruth, Aaron and Bonds now, it means little. I will alway root for my team to win, but A-Rod is simply a cheat and a liar and his “excuses” mimic my 14 year old, when I catch her in a lie. If they could get even “average” value back for him, I say trade him. You know that his teammates will tell Pete and the rest of the media what is “proper”…but behind closed doors, they likely all feel like Jaime Moyer….and I don’t blame them one bit.
even with the smiley some people just cant pick up the sacrasm.
The new york post just never gives up. Today when they reported that Al Aceves decided to skip the WBC in order to try to win a spot on the team they wrote, Aceves is in the run for a long relief spot OR the 5th starter spot if Joba heads to the pen. Will they ever give up? Does he need to win 20 games to prove it or even that won’t be enough? (added by Mobile using Mippin)
vinny-b
February 16th, 2009 at 7:49 am
am fairly certain people will defend Arod, for making up the lie about Selena Roberts breaking into his home. Arod could blow up a bus of school children, and people on this site would still rationalize/defend him.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
LOL…No kidding. For all the people who suddenly have no problem with ARod’s steroid use, I’d be curious to know what they were saying when Bonds was breaking the HR record. Outraged, probably.
Or better yet, do they feel that ARod and Bonds are equal in terms of cheating? Do they suddenly have warm fuzzy feelings for Bonds?
Curious.
The Joba subject will not die until two things happen. He throws 200 quality innings in a season AND a suitable successor to Mariano is identified and developed.
Joba to the bullpen is for some like the never ending ARod scandal/situation. Grin and bear it on the subjects you’re tired of and jump right in on the ones that interest you… you’ll be happier for it.
I’m not a psychologist, but I did stay… oh never mind!
Pete -
I loved your story on AJ Burnett. It really ends up being great for both guys that it was almost a tandem signing – no one guy has the burden of being the savior of the Yankee pitching staff. I, personally, loved that dual press conference. AJ sounds like a perfect guy for the Yankees. Actually I like what I’ve heard or read from both guys – they certainly seem to be up to the challenge. Gotta like guys who choose to say in the AL and the AL East specifically.
Ham
Arod was wrong, Selena is slime, And Pete has an anti Arod bias. If you question any of that, you have not been paying attention.
Because I feel that Ms. Roberts has no Journalistic integrity, does not mean Arod is absolved of anything he did. Pete’s anti Arodness has been an issue way before this scandal.
Gordon Edes has an interview with Moyer with a different feel then the one posted yesterday.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/ne.....;type=lgns
“LOL…No kidding. For all the people who suddenly have no problem with ARod’s steroid use, I’d be curious to know what they were saying when Bonds was breaking the HR record. Outraged, probably.
Or better yet, do they feel that ARod and Bonds are equal in terms of cheating? Do they suddenly have warm fuzzy feelings for Bonds?
Curious.”
I am speaking for myself here but I bet I am also speaking for many many others. Perhaps the question you should be asking is this: Are people who are hating Bonds now calling Clemens a hero? Then at least you’d be comparing apples to apples and not making fruit salad.
I have been outspoken to the point of being oppressive about any player who has been caught using – until that player owns up to the act. Therein may lie the difference here.
I think Bonds is scum and I think Clemens is scum. I think Palmeiro is scum and I think any of the players who were caught and played the moral outrage card as opposed to owning up to it are scum. Once a player apologizes or acknowledges the truth, then my moral outrage tends to become great disappointment that the player cheated; recognition that there are likely going to be some consequences in terms of that player’s place in the history of the game; and the ability to actually move on.
Let’s not pretend that Arod choosing to retract his statement is anything other than him choosing to stop talking about this instead of taking that scumbag to court.
When you have a low life like Selina who has nothing to lose going after you the options presented are to ignore her and minimize damage or go with a mutually assured destruction which hurts you more than the loser who came after you.
Sad but true.
“Or better yet, do they feel that ARod and Bonds are equal in terms of cheating? Do they suddenly have warm fuzzy feelings for Bonds?”
I think it brings things into perspective. Pete asked the same question yesterday, I believe that when it happens to one of yours you can see both sides. Of course if this would have happened to a red sox player we would have reacted differently, but it didn’t.
And it is a crime to rethink a position when it hits closer to home?
“I have been outspoken to the point of being oppressive about any player who has been caught using – until that player owns up to the act. Therein may lie the difference here. ”
++++++
Trisha, Didn’t Bonds, Sheffield, and ARod all use the same excuse? “I didn’t know what I took.” Whether it’s “the clear” or “flaxseed oil” or whatever ARod claims he thinks he was taking.
I don’t see much difference between Bonds and Arod. Both got caught cheating, and lied to varying degrees about it.
If ARod had to testify in front of Congress a year or two ago, I’ll bet he would have denied using steroids (the only other choice would have been to plead the 5th), in which case he’d be in the same hot water as Bonds is today.
its funny how arod hired like 4 agents to get and keep his name in the paper both in and out of baseball. then he went out with the biggest media whore of all time, then he cries when a reporter shows up legally near his home.
who’s the sleazebag?
arod interview about selena roberts
http://snaeze.myminicity.com
I also hate how everybody counts Wang as the/a #3 starter. All Wang ever did was pitch decently, going 19 two years in a row is not a number 3 starter it’s as good as any ace. The thing is that if Wang were to hit free agency now he’d probably (only) get money like a #3 starter because he doesn’t strike out enough. Tough Luck. How much money and years do you think he would get? (added by Mobile using Mippin)
one other thing, arod has not confessed to knowingly use steroids and lied on every occasion in the interview that would have indicated he knowingly used.
he is standing on the same exact ground as bonds and sheffield, that he didnt knowingly use and you will see that continue tomorrow.
Allow me to solve your “curiousity”. At least from my end.
I could care less about steroids and HGH. It is the most overblown, nonsensical scandal in sports history. Its amazing to me how many good, sharp minds in the media have bought into this nonsense.
Whether its Bonds, Arod, Ortiz, the man in the moon, it doesn’t matter to me.
You want baseball to go back to a “pure” time? Ok, tell me when that was? The “Red Juice” times of the 30′s and 40′s? The “Diet Pill” scandals of the 50′s? The Greenies Era of the 60′s through today? Cocaine Era of the 80′s?
You know what the hot “drug” of choice now is? Viva Viagra! That’s right, Viagra is now the drug of choice to keep guys going through the season.
Does that mean we are currently in the Viagra Era?
I’m just curious to know when there was a “clean” era in baseball because I can’t find any.
Nobody is promoting steroid use. I just don’t like the moralizing and misinformation that goes with it. Mainly because its inconsistent.
Guys that are liked by the media and other players and got nailed are covered differently than guys who aren’t. Its human nature but, a tad frustrating just the same.
Plenty of guys took steroids, some in much larger doses than the players who have been caught, and still couldn’t play. Its not the magic elixir promoted by so many people who misreport this story on a daily basis.
Its an era in baseball that EVERYBODY, players, owners, front office executives and yes, the media, did nothing about it when it was in full bloom.
There is cheating in professional sports. It goes on in baseball, football and everyplace else. Its a fact of life. Doesn’t make it right but, it happens. Life ain’t fair that way.
The only way you are going to cheating is with effective rules and controls and quality leadership. Baseball fails on all of those counts, hence problem is not solved.
My question is, where’s the end game with this stuff? Are we left with people asking players if they flunked a 6 year old drug test in their zeal for “answers”. Is that even logical?
At some point, somebody has to be the adult here and move on.
Still waiting to see candidates and sadly, none are emerging.
The only problem here is the media. They love a good story as long as it sells and are happy to destroy whatever they report on as long as it sells papers.
There is a reason the evening news is dying and it’s because they have turned the news into a police blotter tabloid.
Baseball has encouraged the media to turn the sport into another police blotter of drug use and they have been all to happy to take the ball and grind it into our faces. It is no longer possible to pick up a sports section without hearing people complain about drugs used several years ago.
The odd part is that most drug use in the sport doesn’t matter – as if speed doesn’t help you perform better over a long season –
It would be a hoot if the game just destroyed itself and cost all of the leeches their jobs.
No doubt there is a place for steroids talk. The question is why it has to be used as a seasoning on every single piece of baseball news on every site.
I think it is being misunderstood how people are reacting to ARod.
I don’t think there’s a person here who actually SUPPORTS the fact that ARod did steroids. I think people run the gamut from just accepting the fact – because, really, what else can ya do? – to villifying the guy.
As to your question about Bonds vs. ARod, I can only answer for myself. I always thought it was stupid for Bonds to take steroids and I think it was stupid for ARod to take steroids. I thought it was unfair that the entire steroids scandal focused on a single person – Bonds – and I think it is unfair that the entire steroids scandal is again focusing on a single person – ARod. I think the “powers that be in baseball” think we’re stupid; I think they want to deflect blame from themselves by pointing at particular stars in the game. I think if someone had stepped in from the get-go, it is likely neither Bonds nor ARod would have done what they did,
I don’t know if anyone heard John Kruk on ESPN last evening, but he was very adamant about placing the blame EVERYWHERE.
The thing is, piling on ARod does nothing to really solve the problem. But, the fact that he is widely considered the best player in baseball makes his use a lot more newsworthy than anyone else’s. We as Yankees fans may not like all the negative attention and negative commentary, but, frankly, it is a very negative situation.
I think ARod was stupid to inject anything about Selena Roberts into his apology last week (was it only a week ago???). I figured he was exaggerating at the time. But it was plain old stupid because he risked loosing whatever little credibility he had. And to put himself of the position of having to apologize to a woman who is publishing a book that is going to be very problematic for him (to say the least) was also stupid. Stupid, stupid, stupid.
i see the chief apologist has arrived
To your point, SJ44 – Kruk also said that guys will ALWAYS look for a way to be better than the next guy.
I see you still don’t understand the word you often use on here.
I’m not Arod’s “apologist”. Far from it. An “apologist” accepts and condones what one does. I’ve not done that. If you can find a post where I say its “ok” he did steroids, have at it. You can’t because none exists.
I’m a supporter of the guy because I don’t bail on people when they go through tough times. Even if those tough times are self inflicted.
Its a shame you are unable to expand your limited vocabulary and actually understand the meaning of the words you write.
Perhaps that will improve when you get to 5th grade.
Doreen,
You bring up a point that is amazing in this whole thing. Whether its ego, insecurity or both, its amazing to me that guys like Bonds and Arod used. The other guys were using to catch up to them as players.
They didn’t need to use to catch up to anybody. It just shows you the pull in this stuff.
If nothing else, its a fascinating character study.
John, here’s the difference to me. Arod said that he let his ego get in the way, that he felt that he had to do something to justify the huge contract he had gotten from Texas, etc. In other words, he owned up to doing something wrong.
My problem with Bonds is that he is a stone cold liar. All of the records show that he had conversations with the Balco peddlers, his trainer, etc., and was on a continual program of steroid use. There were also recorded conversations where he was told that the things he was taking could not be detected in tests so he didn’t have to worry. The smoking gun is really there with that guy and it is obvious that he continued to totally lie about it. Arod acknolwedged using between 2001 and 2003. That’s an acknowledgement of a lot of use.
I cannot compare Bonds and Arod in this one. If Arod had come out and denied using anything and then tried to play the “gee maybe some of the supplements were tainted?” card, that would be different. He sat down and had a nation-wide face-to-face confrontation in which he admitted he was embarrassed, that he had done wrong, that he owed an apology to other players, the fans, etc.
Bonds continues to this day to give the finger to everybody.
Scott Van Pelt from ESPN got suspended by the network last week for saying Bud Selig has as big a role as anybody in this scandal.
I wonder if Kruk is going to get also going to get suspended for, gasp, having the nerve to tell the truth on an ESPN broadcast.
Telling the truth is getting tougher and tougher to do at ESPN because it gets in the way of business. The suits in Bristol don’t like that to be the case so Scott had to take a bullet for it.
ESPN (unfortunately) is where the majority of sports fans get their “information” these days. If you can’t rely on them being truthful, you can’t be suprised there is so much misinformation out there on this issue.
“Let’s not pretend that Arod choosing to retract his statement is anything other than him choosing to stop talking about this instead of taking that scumbag to court.
When you have a low life like Selina who has nothing to lose going after you the options presented are to ignore her and minimize damage or go with a mutually assured destruction which hurts you more than the loser who came after you.
Sad but true.”
emac I totally agree with you. As soon as I read it the first thing that went through my mind was that his handlers told him he should do it.
silent on the roberts apology, sj, you have been out there smearing her and trying to support arod’s account of the incedent from hours after it happened until at least friday. thats why i asked if you were on arod’s payroll.
suddenly you have nothing to say about her?
suddenly you have nothing to say about your boy lying through his teeth just last week?
arod is a media whore and cannot complain just because the media he courts says things he doesnt like.
SJ44 –
In ARod’s interview with Gammons last week, he started to talk about the climate in Texas – how hot it was there and how difficult it was to workout there. What I’ve read about Primobolan is that it allows you to maintain muscle/strength even if you’re working out less. I have to wonder if he was worried about not being able to work out in the manner he had become accustomed to, and if that was the case, that he would not be able to perform to the level that he was being paid to do. It was a tiny sound byte – nothing I’ve read picked up on that mini-statement.
I’m not looking for excuses for ARod, believe me, but I am fascinated by what makes people tick – why do they do things, especially why they would do uncharacteristic things. ARod is know to be fanatical about the food he puts into his body, so it makes very little sense to anyone that he would be less fanatical about drugs.
cc no evil,
your perception of ARod as a media whore does not take away his freedom of speech.
no but he has no freedom to lie like he did about roberts.
EMac:
Do you think anybody in the media wants to write about this? The vast, vast majority of us got into this because we like sports and the process of writing and reporting, not the courts, pharmacology and government agents. We want to talk to prospects about trying to make it, veterans trying to hang on and topics like that.
People like you blame the media. But the second the subject comes up, the comments section overflows with opinions, pro and con. This story drives itself.
Nobody in the media called Alex and said “hey, use steroids” and then told him to lie about it. Nobody called Victor Conte and told him to start Balco.
What do you think I’d rather do tomorrow, sit there and jot down what A-Rod says or go watch Hughes throw his bullpen?
You know what really makes me mad? I like reading about the history of sports. I would love to say that I covered such great players as Clemens, Bonds and A-Rod and saw them at their peak. Instead I get to say that I covered the steroids era and I’m not really sure who the heroes were.
That’s nice that you call me a leech and wish that I lose my job. You seem like a fine human being. But all I want to do is write about baseball and give people a way to find out about their team, the same way I did when I was a kid and I read every paper I could get my hands on.
If I could go back in time, I’d smack the syringe out of his hands and tell him not to do it This is not what I signed up for.
Doreen:
Alex literally weighs how much tuna he puts on a sandwich. The idea that he had no idea what he was taking is beyond ridiculous. He knew exactly what he was taking and picked that particular PED for a reason.
what has happened here is that in everybody’s rush to have arod’s back, they have basically just rejected the idea of freedom of the press, which is one of the founding principles of american democracy.
roberts as far as we know, broke no laws whatsoever. arod broke federal laws and the rules of the game. but to read this blog, you would think it was the other way around
SJ, VanPelt got suspended for calling Bud a “pimp”. I agree with you sentiment, but I think he was suspended more for his choice in words.
I think Keith Law put it well the other day when he compared PED’s with AirBorne Cold Meds. They don’t help you as a baseball player anymore then anything can keep you from getting a cold. But pro athletes look for an edge, and they believed steriods would provide that.
Pete -
I absolutely agree with you on that point.
Doreen
I think intelligent people have already moved on from the fact that he used steroids. The “why” is the most interesting part for me.
While the media seems intent on playing a game of gotcha and is screaming to know when he did it and what he took, I’m much more interested in the why he did it so the next guy who feels the same way has a road map to look at different options.
IMO, that’s when you move forward.
“what has happened here is that in everybody’s rush to have arod’s back, they have basically just rejected the idea of freedom of the press, which is one of the founding principles of american democracy.”
cc, exactly what part of freedom of the press are you talking about? A public figure is a public figure. Public is distinguished from private. What that means is that while you might want to ambush a public figure when they are out and about, a person’s home is his castle. Roberts did something no respectable journalist would do – found a way to use her press credentials onto gated property, even when she acknowledged Arod was not expecting her. If you say you wouldn’t be furious with someone who was writing a down-and-dirty book about you showing up at your front door, you’re a liar. That’s not about freedom of the press.
If you’re talking about the fact that she leaked court-protected information, you’re on equally shaky ground.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. Few people defend Arod’s steroid use. There probably isn’t a bigger black mark in the game. Even fewer defend Roberts’ guerilla tactics.
Pete,
Why do you think baseball writers follow the PED problem more closely then NFL writers? It’s definitely as big a problem in football.
trisha, i know you’re a lawyer, but i also know that have repeatedly accused roberts of breaking laws that there is no proof she broke in the past weeek.
please explain what gated property she was on and why that was illegal.
My feeling about his apology is twofold:
1. It was the right thing to do. Especially since it was clear he went “off message” with his comment about her.
Instead of saying she was “breaking into my house”, he could have said, “there is no reason for her to come to my house”.
You can have all the handlers you want. When clients go off message in mid-interview, you are helpless.
2. It doesn’t excuse her for looking to have a “gotcha” moment. That’s the game and she plays it well. He was dumb to put himself into that situation.
This not a “Freedom of the Press” issue. Its an issue of how you conduct yourself. Both parties are not A students in that regard.
“My question is, where’s the end game with this stuff? Are we left with people asking players if they flunked a 6 year old drug test in their zeal for “answers”. Is that even logical?
At some point, somebody has to be the adult here and move on.”
SJ44,
That is exactly correct. Nobody here is defending A Rod’s use of steroids. The vast majority of baseball fans acknowledge that there has been an era in baseball where performances were enhanced by drugs. Vigilance is required to prevent it from happening again.
Leaking and publishing the results of a 6 year old test that was done anonymously, the results of which were legally protected by a court of law, serves no purpose other than prolong the healing process.
Bud Selig and the player’s union had all the evidence they needed 10 years ago and did nothing. The fans, management and players now know it was a mistake. It’s been addressed. Personally, I dont want the other 103 names made public. Enough is enough.
cc, I guess it really depends on whose story you believe in terms of Roberts. I absolutely do not believe that she drove by his house and left when she didn’t see any cars (her story). I’m thinking that a property as large as Arod’s likely has garages and therefore cars could be parked inside. In any event, if she stepped one foot onto that property, even if it was to get out of her car and peer down the driveway, well then that’s trespass. But about getting to go to his house – if all she did was drive by, her tactics were still low rent.
I think probably the breaking of laws that people likely referred to had more to do with her allowing court-protected information to be published. She was a link in the chain that got information into the news that was never supposed to be there. So even though she wasn’t the first link in that chain (the people who gave up the information would be that), she was still involved in getting court-protected information to press. The most that could happen to her, if the government wanted to pursue this, is that she could go to jail if she refused to give up the sources that provided the information.
trisha, publishing leaked documents happens every single day in the u.s. and is not against the law.
Pete, for what it’s worth, I don’t have a problem with you’re doing your job. I know that I am in the minority, but what I really hate is the way people care about players for reasons other than what they do on the field. Why does it matter? I personally don’t care about the whole steroids issue, and I certainly don’t care about historical records, because there are ever-evolving factors that help or hurt their production. Babe Ruth, for example played before baseball had the best black, Latin, and Asian players to choose from, played in an era when pitchers who didn’t throw complete games (on about a day’s rest) were followed by the worst pitchers on the team in the bullpen, in an era where outfielders’ gloves were the size of their hands – meaning no coco crisp esque catches. Why are people obsessed with comparing players from different eras? Baseball is about winning, not deifying history.
again, you are supposing and suggesting crimes that there is no proof she ever committed
CC
Is Arod responsible for the steroid scandel?
What should be his punishment for admitting his use?
Is Bud Selig an innocent victim?
Whats your feelings about “greenies” and all the other assorted illegal ways players have used to get an edge?
Have you read Selena Roberts articles on the Duke lacrosse scandel?
pete, the guy has 4 agents to get his name into every corner of the media on and off the field!
HE is the one courting the off-field attention.
I know trisha is amoung a number of lawyers that post here. I’m confused about the legality of handling illegally obtained goods.
If my cousin Vinny stole tv’s, and I knew he stole tv’s, would I be guilty of possession of stolen property if Vinny gave me a tv as a birthday present?
Or, let’s say my cousin Vinny worked in the DA’s office.Violating a court order, Vinny gave me the results of a person’s drug test so that I could publish them in my next newspaper column. Am I not in posession of stolen property?
tarheel
arod is responsible for taking ped’s
i never said he should be punsihed.
i think selena roberts was the worst colunnist the times has ever employed.
“trisha, publishing leaked documents happens every single day in the u.s. and is not against the law.”
WHAT????? Is there something dramatically wrong with your thinking here??? We are talking about the courts making an order. Do you seriously think they think it’s just fine for some pissant flunky who calls herself a “journalist” to help to violate that order and that there are not ramifications when that happens?????
Do yourself a favor. Read up a little on Fainaru-Wada and Williams before you put your foot in your mouth any further.
drive 4-5 the answer is no. the only people to whom the courts seal applies is those with legal access to the information.
there are no laws against publishing them, as that would clearly be unconstitutional.
I thought so. We are not far off at all.
trisha again you make youself look like the worst lawyer i have ever chatted about legal matters with.
there is no proof, no matter how many times you suggest it, that anybody bribed anybody in order to obtain the list.
can you plese cite just one case successfully prosecuted where a journalist or publisher was convicted of conspiracy to leak court-protected information?
“If my cousin Vinny stole tv’s, and I knew he stole tv’s, would I be guilty of possession of stolen property if Vinny gave me a tv as a birthday present?”
That would make you an accessory to a crime, just as Roberts was an accessory to a crime. What differs here is the crime and the penalties involved. If you can end up in jail, you have to realize that you’ve done something wrong in the eyes of the laws, no matter how you want to play semantics here. (Not you Drive. I’m talking still to cc)
this is the thing, i hate roberts. i couldnt believe she kept that gig.
but the principle of a free press trumps hating roberts as well as rooting for the yankees in my book. unfortunatly alot of poeple on this board gladly threw thier priciples into the harlem river just to back arod.
cc are you playing stupid? When journalists go to jail over leaked information, why don’t you educate us as to exactly why that happens.
trisha what crime is she guilty of? please you are a lawyer, stop embarrasing youself.
imitating my cousin vinny is a little unspecific as far as charging a person with a crime.
ok trisha lets try this one more time.
journalists sometimes get jailed for contempt of court for not revealing thier sources.
roberts, to your knowlege has never been called to testify in any court of law.
therefore she cannot be guilty of contempt of court.
can you argue against this premise or do you concede that i am right?
“but the principle of a free press trumps hating roberts as well as rooting for the yankees in my book.”
I don’t have a problem believing in the tenents of “free speech” and a dislike for a person abusing that freedom. As for rooting for the Yankees, well guilty as charged.
cc, when I spend time with people like you, I do my best to remain respectful because I think you are operating from a premise of understandable ignorance since you are obviously not a lawyer. But I don’t play bait and switch with anyone. So how about you answer the question I asked rather than changing the rules of the game because you don’t have an acceptable answer.
Why don’t you tell us why reporters end up going to jail when they leak information every day of the week, as you say they do – if they’ve done nothing wrong and are operating under the freedom of the press. Once you do that I might be willing to respond to your next lame premise – the fact that Roberts has not yet been called upon to answer for publishing what she did a scant week ago.
i answed you question. they go to jail for contempt of court for not revealing thier sources.
now answer my question.
Are you asking me to acknowledge that as of today Roberts has not been asked about her sources by a court of law?
As of today she has not been asked about her sources in a court of law. That of course has nothing to do with whether her act was legal and court-protected. It was not.
Do you know how long it took for the reporters in the Balco Case to be charged of contempt? Just about two years.
ok i give up. it is plain that she has committed no crime, but you, a lawyer, are constantly accusing her of committing crimes. it is a shame to your profession that you dont accept the rules of law in the u.s.
CC
You do bring up a good debate. I think of the Robert Novak case. I think it depends on her methods of obtainging the information. We will find out.
Tarheel it doesn’t depend on the method at all. Once information is leaked, the problem begins. It doesn’t matter whether someone offers a bribe to the person who holds the information or whether they holder calls a reporter. I’ve seen reporters go to jail, both nationally and locally, mor times than I can shake a stick at. If they refuse to give up names when court-protected information has been published, they can be held in contempt. It’s actually quite simple.
no, it doesnt depend on her method.
IF she were called to testify, and
IF she refused to reveal her sources
THEN and only then, could she be jailed for not revealing those sources. and then only if the judge decided to hold her in contempt (some judges refuse to jail journalists even in these cases)
the contempt is in not answering the question in court. until she is called and refuses, she has committed no crime and trisha should be ashamed that she wont admit that.
It appears that the majority of the posters on this forum “get it” regarding Roberts, and a small minority don’t. Keep trucking cc. You just keep telling everyone who’ll listen that freedom of the press trumps here when the reporter could eventually end up going to jail. Extremely impressive. I can’t be sure if you are truly dumb or are just playing dumb.
See ya now.
Trisha
I agree, but that was not the question. The question was
“can you plese cite just one case successfully prosecuted where a journalist or publisher was convicted of conspiracy to leak court-protected information?”
Robert Novak was not charged(that I am aware of). He published secret information that possibly endangered lives.
Here is a good article on that issue
http://www.allbusiness.com/pro.....969-1.html
“the contempt is in not answering the question in court. until she is called and refuses, she has committed no crime and trisha should be ashamed that she wont admit that.”
DUH. We actually had that discussion a very long time ago. You were so hell bent on saying that Roberts had freedom of the press on her side (WRONG!) that I guess you couldn’t see straight.
Pea brain. Freedom of the press isn’t a concept that bears discussion here. Whether or not the court pursues the leak of information IS.
Tarheel, cc is playing word games. He’s trying to pretend that Roberts did no wrong and is protected by the freedom of the press mantra. We all know that falls apart as soon as the government pursues the leak.
The fact that a repoter is forced to either give up sources or go to jail shows just how much power the courts do have over “journalists” who help to break the law.
Whether it is “conspiracy” in the legal sense or conspiracy in the practical sense is of no moment to me. It ends up in the same place, with the reporter on her or his knees.
They give up sources and are probably never trusted again or they end up in the pokey.
So the moral of that story is that reporters who follow the law and don’t help to leak information protected by courts usually end up being respected and trusted – and they can always legally protect their sources. Those who try to be the big cheese and act bigger than the law, well they usually end up losing one way or the other.
Trisha
It seems we debating two separate issues.
If the names “fell in her lap” she didn’t do anything wrong.
If she is called in to court to testify, and does not reveal her sources, she is in contempt. IMO
Tarheel, certainly if the names fell into her lap, she isn’t guilty of bribery! But they were names that were not supposed to fall into anyone’s lap and therefore were never supposed to see the light of day. Roberts knew that when she passed the information on. The minute she did that she put herself in jeopardy of dealing with further ramifications. But she did that with her eyes wide open because “journalists” always know that if they provide leaked information there is a potential penalty.
I question Selena Roberts integrity, not her intelligence. She knew exactly what she was getting in to.
Tarheel, totally agree.
I’m shocked that Arod called Selena Roberts. A phone call?
Does anyone do that anymore?
Wouldn’t it have been more affective to find out which hotel Selena is staying at in Tampa and then drive by to see if her car was there?
Maybe he could have meet her at the all you can eat breakfast buffet and done it in person.
He could have tracked her down on the gym treadmill as she was working off her breakfast.
A phone call? Pleeze. Next we’ll hear about people using email and that new fangled internet.
The reason steroids is treated as such a big deal in baseball is that baseball is, for many people, about 20% sport and about 80% an exercise in nostalgic sentimentality. A lot of journalists, novelists, and other public intellectuals have devoted their careers to mythologizing baseball, especially the era of the 1930s-1950s. These people all seem to imagine that baseball is imbued with some kind of mystical quality that sets it apart from any other athletic endeavor.
These high priests of the game are all about glorifiying baseball’s “golden age” and they hate any development that reminds them that baseball is a big-business sports enterprise and not a Frank Capra movie. They hate the salaries, the entourages, steroids, sabermetrics, luxury boxes, and stadium naming rights. They like to believe that the game used to be “pure” and that it’s their job, somehow, to extol that history.
Ultimately, I don’t think baseball’s ancestor-worship is good for the game. The NFL’s popularity is based on the here-and-now. Baseball is always holding up its PAST as the ideal and denigrating its present by comparison. There’s no future in that. Baseball needs to find a way to embrace its present, warts and all, if it wants to attract new generations of fans.
Nobody is suggesting MLB should condone steroid use. But how about some perspective? Steroids may have led to a lot more HRs being hit, but they haven’t exactly destroyed the game. Now that there’s a reasonable testing regime in place, just MOVE ON. There’s no reason for all the sobbing and hand-wringing.