Wrapping it up from Yankee Stadium
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- June
- 14
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Not much point in over-analyzing this game. So here are a few assorted facts and figures:
• It was the largest shutout for the Yankees since a 15-0 victory at Toronto on Sept. 25, 1977. It was the largest shutout at home since a 15-0 victory against Detroit on Aug. 4, 1953.
• Yankees have won 14 of 19 at home.
• It was A.J. Burnett’s longest scoreless outing since last June 28 when he threw seven shutout innings against the Braves.
• Matsui has hit 10 of his 16 homers against lefties.
• The 15 runs were the largest margin ever in a Subway Series game.
• The nine earned runs were the most ever allowed by Johan Santana.
As for the Bruney/K-Rod thing, Bruney apologized for his actions after the game, saying he should have never criticized Rodriguez in the first place. Rodriguez took a pass on commenting other than to say that he considered the matter closed.
Bruney was hoping to apologize in person but before he could, K-Rod started to come at him and was intercepted by Mike Pelfrey and Jose Veras. Bruney never budged. There was a lot of yelling but no actual scrapping.
“I wasn’t trying to pick a fight,” Bruney said. “If anything I was hoping we could cross paths and bury the axe. For me it’s over with and hopefully for him it’s over with. It’s in the past.”
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on Sunday, June 14th, 2009 at 5:53 pm by Peter Abraham.
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Chad Jennings
Sam Borden
Josh Thomson
Aww why did Bruney back down?
He has nothing to apologize for, he is right.
Pete, sometimes you surprise me. You lose faith in the team and the players quicker than I expected.
if you’re going to back away like a wimp, why even start it up in the first place?
Just got back from seeing Taking Pelham 123-good shots of NY and a mention of the Yankees in the end.
Saw the game until we led 13-0, and was pretty impressed with Burnett, especially getting out of a bases loaded jam. Just when I was starting to think we should have gotten Derrick Lowe instead of Burnett, I see where he was clobbered by the Orioles today, and realize he wouldn’t have fared as well in the AL East.
Of the next six games-
Sabathia vs. Mathis
Wang vs. Lannan
Joba vs. Stammen
Pettitte vs. Josh Johnson
Burnett vs. West
Sabathia vs. Volsted
It looks like Wang has pulled the toughest pitcher in John Lannan. Hope the Yankees score early!
Anyone still unhappy we didn’t get Santana instead of Sabathia, for our 24+Million/year?
Looks like Josh Johnson is no slouch either.
Bruney is a wimp.
“if you’re going to back away like a wimp, why even start it up in the first place?”
Agree. Looks pretty weak on Bruney’s part.
Stand by your statement.
Matsui doesn’t have 16 homers this year. He has 10.
“Aww why did Bruney back down?”
Yankees probably told him to!
Wait till they come to OUR house
June 14th, 2009 at 5:56 pm
GreenBeret7, you said he pitched better because he had a large lead right?
That means nothing. He had a large lead in Boston and blew it. Thus flawed logic.
——————————————————————————————
Well, you’re wrong for the second time, and it’s still not flawed.
I didn’t say about him pitching better with a big lead. Read it again and comprehend it. I said the early, big lead gave him a chance to work on other pitches like his change-up. He broke it out in the 5th inning.
“GreenBeret7
June 14th, 2009 at 5:17 pm
That was the advantage that Burnett had that he usually doesn’t have. He got a huge lead, early in the game and he was able to work on his other pitches in a game situation. That’s much better than working on them in side sessions, because he can see the results.”
Just watching post game again. AJ had the belt in his locker. I guess it was too heavy to wear.
Bruney apologizing – aka yankees management told him to so this doesn’t become an even bigger deal to the media.
GB7, I responded to you in the previous post. You’re right. No issues. I get it.
Trader,
Despite being NL teams… those are some pretty tough matchups. Florida just swept Toronto on the road too.
Lannen vs. Wang is a tough matchup. Who knows about Joba? The Nats have some patient power lefties in the lineup.
Johnson vs. Pettitte is a complete mismatch.
But the most concerning part is… I don’t think we’ve seen any of of the next 6 pitchers we face.
Pete- That’s 6 of 10 homers for Matsui against lefties.
http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/p.....009/384542
Yankee Trader, I’m glad we kept Hughes. Melky too, who is a fine backup (that’s how I think he’ll end up), but especially Hughes.
From Jon Heyman’s twitter -
yanks pr person just broke up brian (krod killer) bruney interview. next step, a muzzle
about 1 hour ago from mobile web
“Matsui doesn’t have 16 homers this year. He has 10.”
GB – Birthday and Sunday homers count double.
Heh. I always miss the best games.
But I guess I was a little wrong this morning, huh?
Couldn’t be happier to be wrong.
DT – OPPC member (it’s in our blood)
June 14th, 2009 at 6:10 pm
“Matsui doesn’t have 16 homers this year. He has 10.”
GB – Birthday and Sunday homers count double.
Maybe those are dog year homers?
“Not much point in over-analyzing this game.”
I actually would love to read more analysis on this game. After the way they’ve played over the past week and all the negatives, it would be refreshing to read about a positive game.
Or how about this topic. How does a team barely get a hit off a guy who hasn’t made a major league start in years, then pummel a guy who is arguably the best pitcher in the game?
Alex
June 14th, 2009 at 6:10 pm
From Jon Heyman’s twitter –
yanks pr person just broke up brian (krod killer) bruney interview. next step, a muzzle
about 1 hour ago from mobile web
————————————————————
They be better off to muzzle the real idiot, Heyman.
Good for Bruney. K-rod said it’s over with. When yesterday he said it’s not ovah!
Anyway, thanks K-rod for revving up the Yankees today.
And is it true that K-rod didn’t gesticulate in his normal fashion yesterday? If so, that’s nice. For a day, the masses were spared.
“Pete, sometimes you surprise me. You lose faith in the team and the players quicker than I expected”
this board loses faith in yankee players, faster then Pete does.
this board is a trip.
Pete has done an excellent/phenomonal job of covering the yankees this year, yet people are fast to criticize
“Or how about this topic. How does a team barely get a hit off a guy who hasn’t made a major league start in years, then pummel a guy who is arguably the best pitcher in the game?”
You must be new to watching the Yankees…
The Yankees “should” have an easy time with Washington, right?
Do keep this in mind, they meet again in a few weeks at Shea, or whatever they call it for this year….Bruney will be greeted warmly when he comes in……K-Rod is a puke and he’s not well liked…I watched his bs since 2002 when he was in Anaheim…Bruney took the high road, and K-Chump did exactly what he’s known for, being a punk……I mentioned this last night, he wasn’t really cared for in the Angels clubhouse…..
“Maybe those are dog year homers?”
Don’t confuse your dog year homers with dog eared homers.
vinny-b, hold it. Pete has done a great job. And the board does lose faith faster. But I’m allowed to say tht there have been some comments he made I disagree with, am I not. Stuff like comparing Burnett’s pitching, when he threw 7 shutout innings, to waterboarding? Despite no runs actually being scored yet?
Pete has done a great job but come on, at least wait until a run is given up.
Lots of typos in my previous post, but you know what I mean.
Pat M,
What do you think? Do they get it done?
Pat M.
Maybe K-Rod wasn’t liked that much in the Angels clubhouse, but he was a big part of bringing them a World Championship, which is more than I can say about the other Rod!
There are no easy games. That’s the problem some of you have.
You look at pitching matchups and decide how the game is going to go.
The other team has major league players just like the Yankees.
Sometimes, guys get hot for a day, a series or a week. Other times, you catch a team that’s cold and can take advantage of it.
How many of you had Johan Santana giving up 9 runs today?
Or, Vincente Padilla beating the Red Sox in Fenway last weekend?
That’s baseball. You can’t predict the outcome of games based on the pitching matchup. Its a useless exercise.
Pat M.
June 14th, 2009 at 6:17 pm
Do keep this in mind, they meet again in a few weeks at Shea, or whatever they call it for this year….Bruney will be greeted warmly when he comes in……K-Rod is a puke and he’s not well liked…I watched his bs since 2002 when he was in Anaheim…Bruney took the high road, and K-Chump did exactly what he’s known for, being a punk……I mentioned this last night, he wasn’t really cared for in the Angels clubhouse…..
————————————————————
One can only imagine having a guy on the team like Gibson, Koufax or Drysdale, who wouldn’t have put up with that crap after the first time.
We have a good chance of beating the Nats. But SJ is right. In baseball there are no gurantees. You never have more than a good chance.
DT – OPPC member (it’s in our blood)
June 14th, 2009 at 6:18 pm
“Maybe those are dog year homers?”
Don’t confuse your dog year homers with dog eared homers.
————————————————————
That has to be somebody impersonating me.
There’s no typos.
Earlier this week, Philadelphia’s Shane Victorino made it clear he also doesn’t like Rodriguez’s over-exuberance on the mound and, especially, after saves, when he thumps his chest and points to the sky.
“You play the game,” Victorino said. “It’s not about showboating. You play the game hard, you play the game the right way.
“If I hit game-winning home run [off him], would he want me to get to home plate and do that?”
I wouldn’t be surprised to see a brawl the next time these two teams meet.
Should be fun baseball.
Funny how espn always buries the boston headline when the red sox gets thrashed.
So who is going down when Bruney comes off the DL?
Watching the Astros-D’Backs game – the Arizona announcers said Pudge Rodriguez needs one more game catching to tie Fisk.
They both felt he would go into HOF first ballot.
That’s a dumb comment by Victorino.
You DO celebrate when you hit a game winning HR, at least when you’re the home team.
Let’s not get too crazy about Burnett today. If he can’t pitch with a 13-15 run lead, then he’s got REAL problems.
He had the good fortune of having a 9 run 4th inning laid on his lap. That helps everybody’s control.
Before that time, he was having all of his usual problems and was forutnate enough to get a good call on the Cora checked swing and a line drive by Beltran hit right to Jeter.
Hopefully, he finds something in this outing that will make him pitch better than he has been pitching for the last month.
Let’s see how he does when he doesn’t have a 13 run lead in the 4th inning. That will give us a better idea if he is starting to get it together.
SJ44-
Meant to congratulate you on your nephews signing with the Pirates. Get’s to hopefully catch some ex Yankees like Karstens and Ohlendorf, who pitched well again today.
DT – OPPC member (it’s in our blood)
June 14th, 2009 at 6:25 pm
So who is going down when Bruney comes off the DL?
Watching the Astros-D’Backs game – the Arizona announcers said Pudge Rodriguez needs one more game catching to tie Fisk.
They both felt he would go into HOF first ballot.
————————————————————
With the heavy steroid speculation about him, it might be a test case.
No way Pudge should get in. Some players, even w/o steroids, are HOF’ers anyway, like Barry Bonds for example. I don’t think Pudge would be a hall of famer without the ‘roids.
Okay, Victorino said it first? Was there a lot of attention to it? Did K-rod blast Victorino back?
I think K-rod would’ve been best served by taking the Joba route.
“I’m not going to change what I do out there. I’m sorry if I offend anyone, but I’m not going to change.”
A goood start is a good start.
Perhaps the big fourth helped him. But he looked great the first couple of innings anyway.
Goood is good.
“They both felt he would go into HOF first ballot.
——————————————————————————————
With the heavy steroid speculation about him, it might be a test case.”
My thoughts exactly. I seriously doubt first ballot.
I’m still waiting for someone to get in – and then show up on the list of 103 names. (or some other list)
We should come up with some Yankees day off discussion topics for tomorrow:
Cervelli’s eyes
Jorge’s wonderful teeth
Bruney vs. KRod: Fists of Fury
John Henry’s twitter addiction
Way won’t aliens abduct Jose Veras
Were in the world is Hank Steinbrenner?
Wanger/Jobber/Youuuse
Does AJ like apple or cherry pie more?
What will Wang and Mrs. Wang name the baby?
F-Rod is a dumb punk. If you’re going to dance around like Milli Vanilli after every third out you get, you’re going to catch some flak, and it’s well deserved. This is baseball, not the NFL or NBA. Get used to it, punk. People are getting tired of your classless act.
SJ44
June 14th, 2009 at 6:26 pm
Let’s not get too crazy about Burnett today. If he can’t pitch with a 13-15 run lead, then he’s got REAL problems.
He had the good fortune of having a 9 run 4th inning laid on his lap. That helps everybody’s control.
Before that time, he was having all of his usual problems and was forutnate enough to get a good call on the Cora checked swing and a line drive by Beltran hit right to Jeter.
Hopefully, he finds something in this outing that will make him pitch better than he has been pitching for the last month.
Let’s see how he does when he doesn’t have a 13 run lead in the 4th inning. That will give us a better idea if he is starting to get it together.
————————————————————
That’s one of the reasons I brought up being a great time to break out his other pitches. The only thing bad that could happen was his ERA going up. He finally did break out the changeup in the 5th inning. It’s one of the few times he’s been able to do that in game situations.
SJ: Good point re: Burnett
DT, it’s going to be Mike Piazza in my opinion. He will get in, they’ll find out he juiced, and then the flodgates will open for all juicers to get in.
Way=Why
Has Pudge been accused by anyone?
I’ve always suspected him. Look at his stats. All of a sudden he starts hitting 35 homers right in the middle of all that? I ain’t buyin’ it…
Just like you can’t get too excited about any of these good outings, you can’t get too upset with bad outings.
They all have them, CC, Joba, Wang, Andy, Phil, and yes, AJ.
People want to view things through a microscope and look for tiny microbes when we should be looking at the big picture. Did we win the game? Did we take the series? Are we playing clean and crisp defense?
People should wait until there’s a larger body of work before deciding if someone is a rubbish pitcher.
Hugo, Canseco says he injected him.
“DT, it’s going to be Mike Piazza in my opinion. He will get in, they’ll find out he juiced, and then the flodgates will open for all juicers to get in.”
that would be a MLB PR disaster. If it ever did happen, I wouldn’t be surprised to see a CTownGate or a BudGate. Something to keep everything quiet.
Once someone goes in – I don’t see them being removed.
Thanks Trader, I appreciate it.
Ross came up to him and introduced himself when Tony and I were touring the clubhouse. He was really nice to the kid.
He told him that he hoped he was still around so he could throw to him in a couple of years.
He and Andrew McCutcheon spent time with him and told him what to expect in the minors. They then exchanged cell numbers and told him to call if he had any questions or needed anything.
I thought it was really classy of those guys to do that.
Nice to see Ross get win #6 today.
As my wife said the other day, Tony getting drafted by the Pirates is perfect for a number of reasons.
1. Its not Boston!
2. Its not Boston, in case you forgot the #1 reason! lol
3. Its a team that gives him a chance to move quickly through the system if he plays well.
3. Its a great sports town. We were there when the Penquins won the Cup the other night and it was a blast.
4. Its a beautiful ballpark. One of the best ballparks in the game.
5. Its a great restaurant town. Always a must for us! lol
6. Its on the East Coast, making travel plans to see him much easier.
All in all, it couldn’t have worked out better for everybody.
Now, the real work starts. He reports to extended ST tomorrow and will be in Charleston on Friday to start his pro career.
Hopefully all the trolls will stay off of here tomorrow.
Is there any word about the move that will be made to bring Brian back. I don’t see them sending Hughes out, after all they might need him to back up Wang. Especially if Wang doesn’t do well and they slot Hughes back in.
SEND DOWN VERAS!!!!
Or Tomko I guess.
My guess would be Tomko.
SJ, I think it also works out because Pittsburgh is an improving team this year so by the time your nephew makes it on they could be a real contender.
Jennifer,
I would think Veras or Tomko would be person losing their spot for Bruney.
I don’t think Hughes is going anywhere. Especially with the way he has been pitching lately.
m, I think the Yankees fatten up over the next few weeks as they are fed a buffet of NL East teams….Although all teams get up when playing the NY Yankees, but they’ll just steam roll their way through this segment of the schedule…..The Wang-Man coming back is an important issue…Having a good outing will go along way in his return to form…Much of his problems are upstairs…..
SJ,
How exciting!
Will Tony be one of the first amongst all the draftees to report?
It really goes to show that his work ethic is larger than his ego.
What is up w/this team’s fascination w/Veras and Berroa?
After his pro debut, I would imagine young Mr. Sanchez’ next big day will be going to major league camp on an invite next spring to help catch the big league staff. That should be an exciting time for him, and a lot of Sanchez family dollars pumped into the Bradenton economy.
Canseco may be flaky, but his allegations have all pretty much been proven true, far as i know.
Pudge’s stats:
92: 16 doubles, 8 HR
93: 28 doubles, 10 HR
94: 19 doubles, 16 HR (in only 99 games)
95: 32 doubles, 12 HR
96: 47 doubles, 19 HR
97: 34 doubles, 20 HR
98: 40 soubles, 21 HR
99: 29 doubles, 35 HR
last year: 20 doubles, 7 HR
Pat M,
Errr…Thanks…I was thinking more along the lines of roundball…
But, I think the Yankees get it done.
No way the WC comes out of the Central.
And bad things keep happening to the Angels. Shields to have season-ending knee surgery. Are Seattle and Oakland strong enough to beat out an AL East team? Doubtful.
I am afraid Jose’s one good outing in 24 will buy him a reprieve.
But Tomko has one bad outing and he’ll probably be sent down (hopefully not).
Veras has one good one, but he’ll probably (hopefully not) stay.
Weird.
I’d like to see both sent down and have Melancon and Bruney in the pen.
With questions about the rotation and the lack of length in general, I think Berroa will (should) go down.
SJ: As a life-long NJ/NYer, Pittsburgh is not on the east coast. It’s in the east, sure, but it’s not on the coast!
Neal Huntington, their GM is a very sharp guy. He worked with Mark Shapiro in Cleveland and they found a lot of talent over the years.
He has a young, sharp staff dedicated to building from within.
He got a lot of heat over the McClouth trade but, that was a steal for the Pirates.
They got Jeff Locke, 21 years old and one of the best LH starting pitching prospects in the game.
Charlie Morton, a servicable back of the rotation starter.
Gorkys Hernandez, one of the best OF prospects in the game.
If Gorkys hits, with Morgan and McCutheon already there, the Pirates could have the best defensive OF in baseball by mid-season next year. Three guys, all under 25, who can fly and cover a lot of ground.
In that ballpark, that’s what you need.
Add to it, Pedro Alvarez, Brad Lincoln, my nephew and a few others, they are starting to put the pieces together.
They just need a little more time.
Pat M,
anything can happen in a short series. one of the reasons I hate the expanded playoffs. All you have to do is be best of 4 or 5 teams, and you get your shot. Some people may think it “adds excitement.” I thought the idea was to figure out who the best team is.
Question SJ: Yanks-Pirates WS, who do you root for if your nephew is already starting for them?
m, I was so focused on the Yanks…I think we’ll know by the end of the first 1/4…..I have the Lakers plus 3….These game 5 elimination games on the road are always tough to call….Do the Lakers in the back of their mind want to win on their home court with the Staple fans going wild…I think Kobe wants this so much that they’ll put forth the needed effort…..Really, this series could have been over by now…….Bottom line The LA Lakers are the 2009 NBA Champions….
What a Stanley Cup Final! Still can’t get over my Devils getting bounced in a seven game heartbreaker.
I hate the media, that Devils-’Canes series was one of the best of all time, I say THE best, but nobody noticed because they were two small market teams.
Rebecca,
East Coast travel is what I meant! lol
A lot easier than Pasco, WA or some other far western venues that were on tap if another team selected him.
GB,
You are right, the ST invite will be fun and the family will definitely be helping the Bradenton economy!
M,
Tony, the Nationals second first round pick, and the Brewers first round pick all signed. A lot of the second rounders and below have also signed. That’s what happens in baseball.
With the exception of some of the first rounders and some of the guys in other rounds looking for well above slot money, signings take place quickly.
The teams then hold a mini camp at their ST home for the draftees before sending them off to their assigned teams for the rest of the summer.
If its Yankees-Pirates? It depends? If he promises me the ring, then I root for the Pirates!
If not, I root for him to have a big series and the Yankees win1 lol
Figured as much SJ.
Melancon isn’t ready. he’s been getting hammered often in the last 3-4 weeks, since he was sent back to Scranton. NYY has been making a few mistakes with pushing these young pitchers through so fast. They’ve screwed up pushing De La Rosa up to AA Trenton with less than two years as a pitcher. Now, he’s starting to get racked up.
SJ, given the way the starting pitching has been and given the Hughes is sort of tied up to Wang’s starts or the odd inning on his throw day, any cahnce that no pitcher is sent down for Bruney and they get rid of Berroa instead?
“I thought it was really classy of those guys to do that.
Nice to see Ross get win #6 today.
As my wife said the other day, Tony getting drafted by the Pirates is perfect for a number of reasons.
1. Its not Boston!
2. Its not Boston, in case you forgot the #1 reason! lol
3. Its a team that gives him a chance to move quickly through the system if he plays well.
3. Its a great sports town. We were there when the Penquins won the Cup the other night and it was a blast.
4. Its a beautiful ballpark. One of the best ballparks in the game.
5. Its a great restaurant town. Always a must for us! lol
6. Its on the East Coast, making travel plans to see him much easier.
All in all, it couldn’t have worked out better for everybody”
SJ: very happy for you/your family. And i like the way your wife thinks. : )
Out of all the arms in the system, the only guy who has a shot to help them this year is Michael Dunn.
Mainly because, he’s LH, throws 95, and can be a specialty arm in the pen.
Melancon has not pitched well so far this year. Certainly not up to his capabilities.
That’s why I believe they will go outside the organization to get bullpen help.
Its one thing to throw strikes in a 15-0 game. Its another to do it with a 2 run lead late in Fenway. Something this bullpen has failed at doing 3 times already this year.
You can’t just have all rookies in the pen. They need another, dependable veteran arm besides Bruney out there. Hopefully, one arrives by the trade deadline.
SJ, One of the things scouts and the club’s player devopment people look at is a players progress…If you chart where Tony was just last summer, as he was playing in The Cape and fighting for some pt….I think he’ll move along quite quiuly and mark my words, he’ll be in PNC in September 2011 as a call up……
It was gentlemanly of Bruney to apologize, but he was 100% correct in what he said. There have been times before when I felt Bruney talked too much and/or was out of line, but this time, he was literally speaking for probably millions of baseball fans (of various teams) who feel exactly that way about krod. No one should have to apologize for verbalizing something so many people were thinking,imo.
Anyway, Bruney did his part to squash it, which is the stand up thing to do, that Krod wouldnt even comment on it only makes him even more so look like the punk he is. Funny how butthurt he is getting over the words of someone whose existence he claimed to be completely unaware of!
SJ,
Did you and your nephew get to sample at sandwich at Primanti’s yet?
Damn, now I’m hungry.
“I hate the media, that Devils-’Canes series was one of the best of all time, I say THE best, but nobody noticed because they were two small market teams.”
That was a great series except for the ending. It shattered my heart in a thousand pieces!
SJ: Makes much more sense!
I agree, Pittsburgh seems like a great place to go. Reason one for me would be the chance to get promoted quickly. I understand Pitt is a beautiful city, not what you would think that from it’s steel city reputation. Thanks for letting us follow along with Tony during the draft process, it felt like we were following a local kid. Good stuff.
We really didn’t want Boston for a number of reasons.
One, my wife hates it up there! She’s up there now on business and is miserable.
Two, I can’t stand the Red Sox. Like Theo and some of their scouts a lot. Really, really good guys.
I’ve had business dealings with Larry Lucchino over the years and, let’s just say he’s not one of my favorite people.
Also not a big John Henry fan.
That’s another team that is light on catching in the system.
But, the other factors would have made our lives miserable! lol
Glad it worked out the way it did.
Nick,
That’s a possibility. Perhaps spending 9 straight games in NL parks, they would rather have an extra arm instead of an extra bat.
I’d do the opposite. That said, I admit to being stumped all year about the roster construction of the team.
By the way, I’m watching Baseball Tonight and they were reporting on the Bruney-KRod fiasco. Here was the beginning of their story. QUOTE: *Reporters asked Brian Bruney what he thought of…*
Did you get that? *Reporters asked Brian Bruney.* So I have to say, Pete, that you were wrong to get down on the poster who said she felt it was the media just trying to create a story, or something to that effect. I believe you said that Bruney offered it and that no reporter was going to ignore it.
If the staff of BBT got that right, I’m sorry but I feel that Bruney was set up.
i really think this whole idea that melancon is struggling is completely overblown..as a whole he has a 2.73 era and its somewhat bloated because he has given up multiple runs in a couple outings…vast majority of the time he goes in there and dominates
SJ44
June 14th, 2009 at 7:02 pm
Out of all the arms in the system, the only guy who has a shot to help them this year is Michael Dunn.
Mainly because, he’s LH, throws 95, and can be a specialty arm in the pen.
Melancon has not pitched well so far this year. Certainly not up to his capabilities.
That’s why I believe they will go outside the organization to get bullpen help.
Its one thing to throw strikes in a 15-0 game. Its another to do it with a 2 run lead late in Fenway. Something this bullpen has failed at doing 3 times already this year.
You can’t just have all rookies in the pen. They need another, dependable veteran arm besides Bruney out there. Hopefully, one arrives by the trade deadline.
————————————————————
NYY will want a quality arm in the pen…but, it all depends on how much they’re willing to pay for that quality. Colorado will want a ton of talent for Street, and the main competion for that will come from the Angels.
Not sure just how well Arizona will be willing to deal with NYY, given the long time rancor between the teams. I’d even take a shot with John Grabow for Pittsburgh. I’d think they’d just like to unload the contract.
Question to everybody about the need for a veteran/proven late inning bullpen arm (since I’m sure we all agree that we are in need of one) – who would you get if you could get anyone? Taking into consideration the talent we’d be giving up, of course.
I have heard Huston Street’s name bandied about, and he seems like a logical solution, but he makes me a little nervous. I never thought he was all that in Oakland. What about Juan Cruz? The Royals are likely out of it, would they trade him? Or maybe the White Sox would move Thornton?
I know there is no hard science to this but I am looking for opinions. Cliff Lee vs. Chris Carpenter. I have Lee. Do I sit him or play him?
I forgot about the NL parks, which seems to point more towards keeping the extra bat over the extra arm for pinch-hitting and pinch-running (even though losing the DH gives us an extra bat already).
It’ll be interesting to see what they do, but today’s result plus the off-day plus CC going on Tuesday theoretically means everyone will be reasonably re-charged in time for Wang’s start and beyond.
Didn’t get to Primanti’s this trip Zach.
I usually am in Pittsburgh once or twice a year to do Steeler games.
We go to Primanti’s for lunch and Lidia’s (great Italian restaurant) for dinner. Those are our usual stops.
Tony lost 35 pounds on the Subway Diet this summer and fall. He’s king of the tuna and turkey sub! lol
He wanted to go to Subway for lunch (the kid is beggin’ for an endorsement deal! lol) and we ended up having dinner in the GM’s suite Friday night. Didn’t get a chance to hit the usual spots.
Pat M,
No question, the kid blew up this summer. Going into the Cape, Robert Stock of USC was the #1 catching prospect in the league. He was also the #1 catching prospect in early 2009 draft reports. Tony was an afterthought.
By the end of the summer, Tony was the best catcher in the Cape, Stock became a pitcher, and his name was starting to get mentioned more by scouts.
The first month of this season, when the Pirates began scouting him in earnest, he got off to a very hot start. By April, most scouts had him as the #1 catcher in the draft, despite being from an East Coast school.
When you think about it, its a meteoric rise for a kid. Especially one from a Northeastern school. Its not how it usually goes in baseball.
I really want to see tomorrow’s Yankees classic again. Loved that game because I look at that game as the one where I thought, “If our pitching ever gets it done, we could be a GREAT team.”
That used to be my favorite win, but now it goes to the walk-off pop up. Can’t make that stuff up.
“We really didn’t want Boston for a number of reasons.
One, my wife hates it up there! …..
Two, I can’t stand the Red Sox.”
Scrolling quickly through the posts, you would almost think that this was a Mark Teixeira quote about why the Yankees were the best situation for he and his family! LOL I mean, those are all similar reasons to why they didnt want Boston!
Oh, and speaking of the NL parks,I cant wait to watch CC hit!
RalphieD (OPPC all day)
June 14th, 2009 at 7:08 pm
i really think this whole idea that melancon is struggling is completely overblown..as a whole he has a 2.73 era and its somewhat bloated because he has given up multiple runs in a couple outings…vast majority of the time he goes in there and dominates
————————————————————
5 muliple run games in his last 15 is not good, and that doesn’t include his inherited runners allowed to score.
5 ***multiple*** run
I’m as big a Melancon fan as anyone on this blog. He hasn’t pitched well in Scranton so far this year.
He has to be sharper with his command if he’s going to get a shot this year in the pen. He’s pitching in a lot of bad counts and his stuff isn’t as good as it was last year. Its not as crisp.
I still think he’s going to be a very good pitcher for the Yankees. It just may not be this year.
SJ- You need to look no further than John Henry twittering nonsense about the ‘curse of MT’
Both bullpens are spent. Ours is one of the best I’ve ever seen.
Hope I didn’t hurt Mark’s feelings!
How important are head-to-head games? If we had split the season series thus far, we’d be 6 games behind.
the MT curse?
Tomorrow night will be the 900th game at Fenway between the Sox & Yanks. Yanks have hit one of our batters in all 6 games this year
Wind seems to be blowing out today. Rays load the bases in NYC and, yes, 2 runs score. Good joba…
etc
Could you imagine of George was doing nonsense like this? The media would be up in arms.
BBB
June 14th, 2009 at 7:13 pm
“We really didn’t want Boston for a number of reasons.
One, my wife hates it up there! …..
Two, I can’t stand the Red Sox.”
Scrolling quickly through the posts, you would almost think that this was a Mark Teixeira quote about why the Yankees were the best situation for he and his family! LOL I mean, those are all similar reasons to why they didnt want Boston!
————————————————————
The shopping just isn’t as good.
“5 muliple run games in his last 15 is not good, and that doesn’t include his inherited runners allowed to score.”
according to milb.com he has only given up 8 earned runs all year so 5 multiple run games doesnt make sense
Boston is okay if you like real provincialism. Some people do. Talk about YAWN!!!!!
My nephew got transferred to Pittsburgh from NY and absolutely hates it. He and his wife just took the GMATs so they could find their way out of there.
Of course, Tony isn’t going to be spending 100% of his time there anyway, even if he loves it. And I’m sure it’s fine for a visit.
“F-Rod is a dumb punk. If you’re going to dance around like Milli Vanilli after every third out you get, you’re going to catch some flak, and it’s well deserved.”
Hey, I can’t stand K-Rod either, but I see no reason to insult Milli Vanilli.
if the Yankees do lose a game to Wash it will be the first game
Hey, speaking of New England, does anyone know much about Stamford, CT? There may be a move on the horizon.
Laura,
I’m originally from CT. Stamford is a nice area. Next to Greenwich, one of the wealthiest places in the country, good restaurants, close to NYC.
If you have to live in CT, Stamford and Westport are probably two of the better places to live in the state.
GB, Boston does have some great Italian Restaurants on the North side….I never thought Boston as a destination for shopping, unless you’re considering schools…..
with this bullpen setup the Yankees now have they will never hold a 1 run lead in the 7th or 8th innings
“If you have to live in CT, Stamford and Westport are probably two of the better places to live in the state.”
Thanks, SJ44. Big question: Is it Yankees country or Red Sox country? That makes a huge difference. My guess is since it’s so close to NYC, it’s Yankees country.
SJ44 June 14th, 2009 at 7:23 pm
Laura,
I’m originally from CT. Stamford is a nice area. Next to Greenwich, one of the wealthiest places in the country, good restaurants, close to NYC.
If you have to live in CT, Stamford and Westport are probably two of the better places to live in the state.
——————————————————–
way to much traffic down there,if you want a good part of the state check out Sin City East (Waterbury)
Laura,
Its about 70/30 Yankees vs. Mets. At least it was when I was up there. I think the %’s are probably still the same.
Pat M,
Ever hit Pagliuca’s in the North End? My favorite restaurant in Boston. Only redeeming feature of the city! lol
RalphieD (OPPC all day)
June 14th, 2009 at 7:20 pm
“5 muliple run games in his last 15 is not good, and that doesn’t include his inherited runners allowed to score.”
according to milb.com he has only given up 8 earned runs all year so 5 multiple run games doesnt make sense
————————————————————
Even at that, he’s had 3 multiple run innings in 3 of the last 10. If that makes you feel better, fine. He’s still not ready. The Yanks already have that….they need better…not the same.
“way to much traffic down there,if you want a good part of the state check out Sin City East (Waterbury)”
The job would be in Stamford. How close is Waterbury to Stamford? I don’t do long commutes.
would Street be a good fit for this team..Rockies say he’s on the market
Laura
Stamford area is great. I used to work there. Lots of good towns to live in within a 10 minute commute of downtown. Nice LI Sound beaches nearby too.
Where do you live now?
Pat M.
June 14th, 2009 at 7:24 pm
GB, Boston does have some great Italian Restaurants on the North side….I never thought Boston as a destination for shopping, unless you’re considering schools…..
————————————————————
I’m very susceptable to picking up accents….that would scare me to death. It wouldn’t fly real well in Georgia, either. My midwestern twang causes enough trouble.
“Even at that, he’s had 3 multiple run innings in 3 of the last 10. If that makes you feel better, fine. He’s still not ready. The Yanks already have that….they need better…not the same.”
sorry if i struck a nerve gb…im just saying people are making it sound like melancon is down there throwing volleyballs to the plate to the tune of a 10 era…while hes not doing great since being demoted…hes not stinking up the place either
“Where do you live now?”
Chicago, IL – but I’m NYC born and raised.
I like Jenks, I think the White Sox put him on the market.
well it’s(Waterbury) 90 miles from NYC, if your going to work in the city(Stamford) I guess you should live there,that part of the state is congested
“Hey, I can’t stand K-Rod either, but I see no reason to insult Milli Vanilli.”
Nice one, Laura!
“Nice one, Laura!”
I thought so too.
RalphieD (OPPC all day)
June 14th, 2009 at 7:32 pm
“Even at that, he’s had 3 multiple run innings in 3 of the last 10. If that makes you feel better, fine. He’s still not ready. The Yanks already have that….they need better…not the same.”
sorry if i struck a nerve gb…im just saying people are making it sound like melancon is down there throwing volleyballs to the plate to the tune of a 10 era…while hes not doing great since being demoted…hes not stinking up the place either
————————————————————
You didn’t strike a nerve. And, he has been throwing beach balls, lately. It’s the lately that’s the concern…and, it began after his demotion. That’s a bigger concerm.
Laura
The traffic around Stamford is nothing compared to what you’d find in a big city like Chicago or NY.
all this team needs is a 8th inning shut down guy,don’t think Bruney is the answer, he could be a nice 7th inning RP…
“I like Jenks, I think the White Sox put him on the market.”
Don’t get your hopes up on Jenks. Kenny Williams is using the trade rumor to try and force Jenks into signing a contract with the hometown discount attached. Jenks, so far, hasn’t been interested. However, Williams does have a way of getting these guys to come around to his way of thinking. We will see.
pat June 14th, 2009 at 7:38 pm
Laura
The traffic around Stamford is nothing compared to what you’d find in a big city like Chicago or NY.
——————————————
Tell that to the people who commute down there
With all the yapping he’s been doing, Bruney better be at least part of the answer.
Really, Laura? Because Jenks wasn’t the only name I heard. I think Dotel was mentioned. I know he diid bad his first stint here, but he’s having a terrific season.
“The traffic around Stamford is nothing compared to what you’d find in a big city like Chicago or NY.”
I’m sure it’s not. Nothing compares to NYC traffic. I laugh when Chicagoans complain about the traffic here. They don’t know what real traffic is.
“”Both bullpens are spent. Ours is one of the best I’ve ever seen.
Hope I didn’t hurt Mark’s feelings!
How important are head-to-head games? If we had split the season series thus far, we’d be 6 games behind.
the MT curse?
Tomorrow night will be the 900th game at Fenway between the Sox & Yanks. Yanks have hit one of our batters in all 6 games this year
Wind seems to be blowing out today. Rays load the bases in NYC and, yes, 2 runs score. Good joba…
etc
Could you imagine of George was doing nonsense like this? The media would be up in arms.”"
Their sh|t don’t stink…
“Really, Laura? Because Jenks wasn’t the only name I heard. I think Dotel was mentioned. I know he diid bad his first stint here, but he’s having a terrific season.”
I’m not saying that Williams isn’t going into sell mode. If the White Sox don’t start playing better and fast, he will start dismantling the team. But he really doesn’t want to get rid of Jenks. He wants Jenks to sign long term for his price. Jenks believes he can get big money elsewhere. And he’s right!
SJ not that you will be up that much but have to go to the Daily Catch in the NOrth End when I was in school up there it was the b est small only like 5 tables they bring the dishes in the pots they cook it in lol
Don’t anyone show this to trisha:
After the game, Burnett lauded the pitch-calling contributions of Cervelli, a 23-year-old from Venezuela who has been touted as a defensive standout but contributed surprising offense.
“I think it’s just a matter of that we used everything today,” Burnett said. “I don’t know if it’s the catcher, but we used curveballs and fastballs in good counts. They had no idea what was coming, and that’s huge. If I’d miss with a hook, he’d call another one. We didn’t stay in a pattern.”
God what is wrong with that loser Henry…classless.
I really hope we beat the Sox this year. I’d rather knock the Sox out of the playoffs than win a WS title, and I say that w/total honesty.
I know many will disagree. But that old windbag down in Boston is such an arrogant, pompous a$$ that I want to rub any victory we get in his face.
I’ve been amazed at the degree of hostility towards trisha and anyone on this forum daring to suggest that Posada being behind the plate hurts the team — despite evidence from nearly 40% of the season and the alleged wishes of the pitching staff substantiating it.
So let’s make this easy for those who don’t think Posada is a liability behind the plate. Please enlighten me. In the history of baseball, how many teams have won a World Series with a primary catcher who was 37 years old or older?
If there have been at least two or three, I’ll seriously reconsider my position — despite what my eyes, the evidence, and multiple Yankee pitchers (allegedly) believe. Surprise me…
jennifer
June 14th, 2009 at 7:18 pm
SJ- You need to look no further than John Henry twittering nonsense about the ‘curse of MT’
Both bullpens are spent. Ours is one of the best I’ve ever seen.
Hope I didn’t hurt Mark’s feelings!
How important are head-to-head games? If we had split the season series thus far, we’d be 6 games behind.
the MT curse?
Tomorrow night will be the 900th game at Fenway between the Sox & Yanks. Yanks have hit one of our batters in all 6 games this year
Wind seems to be blowing out today. Rays load the bases in NYC and, yes, 2 runs score. Good joba…
etc
Could you imagine of George was doing nonsense like this? The media would be up in arms.
————————————————————
Actually, george twittered a lot before there was “Twitter”. He was ahead of his time. You need to go back and look at some of his quotes and blurbs. He just sent his tweets straight through the media.
Maybe Laura. But still, Cash would be stupid not to check it out.
From Bryan Hoch’s Twitter
“Spoke to someone yesterday who pointed out A-Rod has been collapsing R hip during at-bats & is relying mostly on upper body and back leg.”
“Maybe Laura. But still, Cash would be stupid not to check it out.”
Oh, it doesn’t hurt to ask. I’m just saying that it could just be posturing from Williams to strengthen his position with Jenks at the negotiating table.
Arod has been absolutely horrible. Why is he still batting fourth? If I was him.. ego aside.. I would tell Joe to move me down the lineup instead of being an out 93% of the time.
SJ, Always my first stop when in Beantown….Cioppino and Calamari Fra Diavalo…..Stuffed eggplant is great….
Jay, you even said it. ALLEGEDLY. The reason teams haven’t won, as far as I know, w/a 37 year old catcher is not because said catcher apparently magically forgot how to call a game. It was about offense. And Posada is a terrific offensive player.
The stats point otherwise, but history points away from the stats. Posada has caught some great pitchng staffs…because pitchers happen to have bad starts when he catches them does not mean he can’t call a game.
I really like Cervelli, but there’s no problem w/Posada in my opinion.
“I’ve been amazed at the degree of hostility towards trisha and anyone on this forum daring to suggest that Posada being behind the plate hurts the team — despite evidence from nearly 40% of the season and the alleged wishes of the pitching staff substantiating it.”
Jay, I don’t have any hostility towards trisha. I posted that quote from AJ to fuel the fire because I think the Posada catching debate is a legitimate one, especially when it comes to AJ. I really do believe – and I’ve said this before – that AJ prefers to throw to Molina or Cervelli. What I’m not prepared to do is to say that all of the pitchers do, but I really think that AJ does.
Maybe the media needs to stop trying to start crap or keeping it going and just shut up. All it does is gets a bunch of parrot-like fans going. One group needs to report the news instead of trying to be the news and the other needs to read it and stop believing what they read (read the news for it’s entertainment value, not for real news) and then running to the blogs to spew their new-found “facts”.
GB7, what are you referring to?
“Spoke to someone yesterday who pointed out A-Rod has been collapsing R hip during at-bats & is relying mostly on upper body and back leg.”
A-Rod is doing what he has to do to try and help the team. Is his hip 100%? No. It may not even be 50%, but he’s going to try and tough it out in the best interest of the team. Their record proves that they win when he’s in the lineup. He deserves some credit for the sacrifice he’s making.
Laura,
I wasn’t referring to you at all. I hadn’t even noticed your post — which I thought was a great addition to the discussion, by the way.
I was primarily referring to Randy l. and CB — whose posts come across as bitter and juvenile for their name calling and generally nasty tone and their utter absence of facts.
Jennifer, I could see George doing the internet nowadays like Mark Cuban does, getting in all sorts of trouble.
i-know-nothing
June 14th, 2009 at 7:52 pm
Arod has been absolutely horrible. Why is he still batting fourth? If I was him.. ego aside.. I would tell Joe to move me down the lineup instead of being an out 93% of the time.
————————————————————
at least your name is based on fact.
Anyone-Will the Yankees call up Sergio Mitre or Casey Fossum before trying the trade market?
Omit “name calling”. It’s just the nasty tone and absence of facts and their seeming inability to disagree without being disagreeable that I find distasteful.
I get what you mean Jay. But randy l. is normally a very good contributor to discussions.
Casey Possum is just filler. I don’t think he doesn’t throw as hard as Tom Glavine does now. It’s doubtful that even Washington has a use for him. Mitre might help later, but, not sure I’d put him in the pen this soon after surgery. Maybe as a late August-September call-up.
Which player on the Yankees has the best OBP?
Would anyone be surprised- it’s Nick “the clown” Swisher?
Nothing wrong with Randy or SJ. They just don’t have any use for trolls or stupidity.
Yankee Trader, I’d be surprised if it WASN’T him.
Hey Yankee Trader, saw your post on Pelham 123 above — did you ever see the original?
Laura, Joba might prefer Cervelli as well.
Wait till they come to OUR house,
I have no way of knowing what Randy l. normally is or isn’t. But I see how he responds/behaves whenever anyone has the audacity to suggest that Posada being behind the plate is hurting the team or that Cervelli being behind the plate is better for the Yankees and their chances of winning.
I have nothing whatsoever against him. In fact, I’ve gone far out of my way to compliment him for his knowledge and experience and in an effort to find common ground. But enough is *&$^ enough! There’s no excuse for his rude and juvenile behavior on a discussion forum to others who dare to have an opinion different than his. And the same goes for CB. Grow up!
John Henry is a effete clown who dresses and behaves like Truman Capote. His day will come.
Bruney apparently doesn’t find Joba’s over the top histrionics to be as tiresome as K-Rod’s. Hm. Ok.
Maybe Jay. I don’t know. Somehow I never seem to be around when this depsite crops up, or I’m only around for part of it.
Yes, I agree with GB, Randy and others…don’t confuse an attitude with exasperation. They are correct on the manufactured Posada/Cervelli matter…and they know it.
“Laura, Joba might prefer Cervelli as well.”
After the nonsense between he and Jorge the other day, I wouldn’t be surprised.
I just saw Cervelli’s post game interview. I know we joke about his eyes, but they really are mesmerizing.
Anyone think that the Yankees were as sick as many of us hearing how they should have traded for Santana 2 years ago? Either way it was probably pretty sweet for a couple of guys like Hughes and Melky who were hung out for months floating in the trade talks to make big contributions to the win on Santana’s worst start of his career. For one day at least it shows everyone that the Yankees made the right decision
GreenBeret7,
“Nothing wrong with Randy or SJ. They just don’t have any use for trolls or stupidity.”
Neither trisha nor I were being trolls or being stupid. And if you think it’s OK to characterize somebody as stupid for expressing their opinion instead of saying that you disagree and saying why as part of a constructive discussion, then you’re part of the problem, too.
trisha has been a consistently very thoughtful poster in every single post of hers that I’ve read. And I’m certainly no troll. And I can tell you that my posts were not made without some research and thought either.
And neither trisha nor I started any name calling in any posts that I’m aware of.
Again, it’s time for Randy l. and CB to stop their juvenile behavior and grow up — period.
The Ghost, did Hughes pitch today?
Wait till they come to OUR house,
“Maybe Jay. I don’t know. Somehow I never seem to be around when this depsite crops up, or I’m only around for part of it.”
If you want to see what juvenile behavior is, do a search on posts from Randy l. and CB “responding” to — actually more like attacking — trisha and anyone else daring to suggest that Posada is a liability behind the plate in the thread right before this one.
By the way, their behavior has been sufficient juvenile that I wouldn’t be at all surprised if either or both wouldn’t resort to posting under multiple names to support their position.
It’s a shame, too — because Randy l.’s experience should allow him to be a thoughtful and constructive contributor who wouldn’t NEED to resort to nastiness to support his position. Maybe the fact that he and CB do exactly that says something about the lack of facts they have to support it.
I find it very short sighted to judge a cacther based on how a pitcher performs. You can’t judge it by his good performance and say it must be the catcher.
In many of AJ’s bad games his problem has been location not pitch calling. When a catcher calls for a pitch low and away and the pitch is up over the plate it is hardly the catchers fault.
You can’t judge a catchers performance based on the outcome of the game. Also you can’t judge a catchers relationship with a pitcher based on the media reports. It is obvious they have an agenda at times. We don’t know what goes on in the clubhouse.
I don’t know Jay. Having never had a problem with either I don’t want to get into something that I really have nothing to do with. It’s the problem of those “attacked” more than anybody else’s.
Hi Everyone!
I am home. Quite the weekend for Yankee baseball. I thank Fleetwood Mac
Nobody’s asking you to get involved, Wait til.
I’m just calling out nasty, juvenile behavior when I see it.
Jay, I can’t comment on the specifics of this topic, but you are way, way off base in your suggestions about randy and CB, among others.
There is a lot of context in this discussion that goes beyond today’s and yesterday’s discussions.
You got it Jay.
Nick in SF, I’m relatively new but I notice that you are generally an even keeled poster here…so I’ll go with the benefit of the doubt and say that I think you might be right.
We should trade fo Mark Derosa
S.A.–The sun will come out tomorrow; I’m down with the OPPC
June 14th, 2009 at 6:31 pm
We should come up with some Yankees day off discussion topics for tomorrow:
Cervelli’s eyes
Jorge’s wonderful teeth
Bruney vs. KRod: Fists of Fury
John Henry’s twitter addiction
Way won’t aliens abduct Jose Veras
Were in the world is Hank Steinbrenner?
Wanger/Jobber/Youuuse
Does AJ like apple or cherry pie more?
What will Wang and Mrs. Wang name the baby
*****
May I add one to the list?
How many little leaguers could have caught the pop up Castillo dropped???
Here’s what Burnett said today about Cervelli on why he thinks he matches up so well with him.
“I just win with him, you know? He knows everything I want to throw and puts down everything I want to throw. I mean, I shook him once or twice all game and I thought my mind was free and I was free and just having fun out there.”
Carl DeRosa would be nice (I like how he’s very candid to the media)but a bullpen arm is a bigger need than a utility infielder at this point.
For anyone baseball fan not watching the Pen on MLB Network you are missing something really good and juist saw that the Ron Santo documentary is on at 9PM. WHo needs espn baseball when stuff like this is on.
Hey Sean, were you on the Yankees message boards?
“It’s just the nasty tone and absence of facts and their seeming inability to disagree without being disagreeable that I find distasteful.”
Absence of facts? If that isn’t the pot calling the kettle black.
Let me make it simple for you so even you can understand. You are questioning Jorge Posada’s game calling, saying his pitch calling is a liability.
Wasn’t he the starting catcher on two World Series winning teams? Answer, yes.
Haven’t the Yankees made the playoffs every year when he was the starting pitcher except one? Answer – Yes.
When was the only time the team didn’t make the playoffs. That would be 2008, when Jorge Posada was hurt for the majorty of the year.
To say Jorge Posada has lost his ability to call games is to say he has lost his mind. And that, well that, is just moronic.
A.J. Burnett has been an inconsistent pitcher for his entire career. What you’re seeing now is what he’s always been.
I guess all those other catchers that have played with him can’t call a game either.
Don’t like the “nasty tone”? Don’t say dumb things and don’t talk about the absence of facts, when you don’t have a leg to stand on.
Wait till they come: thanks, hahahha, but sometimes I am not so even-keeled. Part of what Jay said makes some sense from a limited perspective, but the part that suggests that two people who have been posting here for a long time and have earned a lot of respect would post as sock puppets has not basis and I can’t respect that type of accusation.
I have yet to see a post where trish has been condescending to Randy l. or CB. I’ve seen any number of posts where they’ve been condescending to her.
This is getting very nasty…like watching the Jerry Springer show.
I hate Jerry Springer but I think I may get popcorn and just keep hitting F5…F5…F5…
This should be a nicee arguement.
Yeah Nick, I’ve scrawled back andsee what he means, but I’m sure there’s more to it than that.
“I just win with him, you know? He knows everything I want to throw and puts down everything I want to throw. I mean, I shook him once or twice all game and I thought my mind was free and I was free and just having fun out there.”
==============
I think it’s time for Posada to give back and assume the same role Girardi played in his own development in the late nineties. Girardi earned a lot of good will with Yankee fans back then by selflessly grooming Posada to take his place. That non-contentious relationship was a hallmark of what the Yankees were about back then.
andsee is and I see, and nicee is nice.
rconn,
For you to seriously suggest that I haven’t provided supporting facts for my conclusions is beyond laughable. When a couple of posters astutely pointed out that the statistics for the season to date that show that when Posada has been behind the plate, Yankee pitchers give up WAY more runs was skewed by the number of lousy Wang starts Posada’s statistics included, I not only calculated them without Wang’s starts included, but provided the data so that any of you could check me.
Don’t go there….
I just got back – was out all day and missed the game. I guess AJ pitched pretty well, but I’m not happy about the 4 walks at all.
The Yankees bunted in the 2nd inning? Blech…..
Ok, they won and I’ll take it…… not overly excited about it, but it’s better than a loss.
Cervelli is definitely not the catcher of the future. He is not a good offensive player, and in my opinion he will be a backup at best.
Watch for Montero. Everything I heard about him is awesome. Supposed to be a beast.
We need Posada this year, his bat especially. Making Posada DH won’t work because we need Matsui.
Sean Serritella
June 14th, 2009 at 8:26 pm
Here’s what Burnett said today about Cervelli on why he thinks he matches up so well with him.
“I just win with him, you know? He knows everything I want to throw and puts down everything I want to throw. I mean, I shook him once or twice all game and I thought my mind was free and I was free and just having fun out there.”
****
Sounds like AJ Burnett is trying to recruit a personal catcher. Bear with me, I am a little out of the Yankee loop since I was away. Where is Molina in his rehab? I can’t imagine the Yanks will carry 3 catchers when Molina returns
First time Nick Johnson is back at Yankee Stadium since he was traded. You think he’ll get a nick reaction?
that should be nice.
Betsy
June 14th, 2009 at 8:36 pm
I just got back – was out all day and missed the game. I guess AJ pitched pretty well, but I’m not happy about the 4 walks at all.
****
Apparently when Burnett threw his no hitter with the Marlins he walked 9 batters in that game. I guess you take the good with the bad
jennifer
June 14th, 2009 at 8:37 pm
First time Nick Johnson is back at Yankee Stadium since he was traded. You think he’ll get a nick reaction?
***
I doubt it. Do people even remember he was supposed to be the prospect of the future?
And I’ve given Randy l. and CB and anyone else who disagrees with trisha and me (and the statistical evidence this year and the Yankee starters who allegedly don’t want to have Posada behind the plate when they pitch) a cream puff opportunity to provide facts that at least partially undermine our position:
What teams in the entire history of baseball has won a World Series with a catcher who was 37 years old or older?
Betsy,
Is that really you? You must have had a bad day. The won 15-0. What could there possibly be to be “bleh” about? No game is going to be perfect – well, except a perfect game.
Cheer up and enjoy the laugher. This one counts – they beat a premiere pitcher.
I think this discussion needs to go beyond stats. Just listen to what the pitchers say…and don’t say.
No one believes the pitching staff doesn’t like Posada. I know they appreciate his bat! They may just feel more comfortable with the two backups.
Again, it could be a coincidence or not. But anyone with ears and eyes can see there’s a difference.
And no one is saying Posada should be replaced.
Betsy, I noted that you were a pessimist the other day (and as I said you are a true fan and certainly not a troll)…but how could you not be happy with a 15-0 shutout, where A.J. went seven innings? What do you want a perfect game?
We have no idea if they called a bunt in the second orthey did it on their own, but however it happened it wasn’t a bad move because more often than not you expect Santana to be nasty, so you’re trying to squeeze runs out of him any way you can and and win w/pitching. I had no issues with it.
Yeah a BP arm should be first priority. Derosa is a fine player. He can play just about everywhere.
Jay, to be fair I did give a response to that question.
Hey Betsy, it was a good Win today. The walks always happen with a guy like Burnett on the mound, but he had 8 k’s and even though he got in jams he pitched himself out of them.
Watch Recaps, maybe that will cheer ya up more.
Erica- Probably not.
Sad really.
“Sounds like AJ Burnett is trying to recruit a personal catcher.”
He may be. The problem is that Cervelli will probably go down to the minors once Molina is ready to play. Whether AJ likes throwing to Cervelli is a moot point. He needs to be able to throw whoever is behind the plate. If he heads to the mound thinking that he’s not going to pitch well with Posada behind the plate, he won’t. It will be a self fulfilling prophecy.
Jay: just don’t accuse people of changing screen names when you have to reason or hint of a reason to think they would do that. It’s underhanded. Keep to the high road if you’re going to call people out for taking the low road.
That can’t be Betsy…because that is too ridiculous and she’s not that ridiculous.
Burnett said he liked Cervelli. That’s not good. That’s not good at all. Burnett better hope he doesn’t shake me off if I catch him again. I’ll make him look like a monkey.
I am Jorge’s inner demon, king of your worst nightmare! I slapped Orlando Hernandez around. I’ll break Burnett like a twig.
Well we all know Jorge will be catching CC on Tuesday since he’ll have two days off in a row.
Jorge and the pitchers have to learn to get on the same page.
“Don’t go there….”
Oh, but I will. Didn’t Jorge Posada catch Wang when he had two 19-win seasons? All of the sudden this year, he told Wang to throw pitches a foot out of the strike zone? You can’t seriously believe that.
Didn’t Posada catch the staffs on two World Series teams? He did.
Do you honestly think he forgot how to call pitches? That is just absurd.
You’re forgetting a whole career dating back 12 years, based on a sample size of not even a half season – that, by the way, is nothing more than sheer happenstance.
Listen, Jay, baseball is way over your head. Switch to curling.
jennifer -
I really do hope that Nick Johnson gets a nice welcome pre-game. Once the game starts, you know how that goes.
I do remember he was a hot prospect for the Yankees.
Was sorry he was traded.
Was always sorry to hear about his many injuries, because I always wished him success (well, except against the Yankees, that is).
Jay
June 14th, 2009 at 8:32 pm
I have yet to see a post where trish has been condescending to Randy l. or CB. I’ve seen any number of posts where they’ve been condescending to her.
—————————————————-
Jay, I’m not trying to bash Trish, but I have been on the opposite side of a discussion with her and she can get a bit snippy if you don’t agree with her. I think that her passion for the Yankees can hinder an open discussion at times.
I’m not trying to critize her just giving my impression.
“I think this discussion needs to go beyond stats. Just listen to what the pitchers say…and don’t say.”
Exactly. Look at AJ’s comments. All he had to say was that Cervelli did a good job today. He didn’t have to go into the amount of detail that he did. It looked to me like he’s trying to put it out there that he prefers Cervelli.
Laura, wow – I think AJ just criticized Jorge in a not-so subtle way with those comments. I don’t know if he meant to, but he did. The guy’s put his foot in his mouth recently – I wish he’d remove it.
Beating up on the weak sisters of the NL or whomever the Yankees are facing won’t impress me because – any good team can do that (and at this point, I’m not assuming anything). The Yankees just do not play the type of baseball conducive to winning in the post-season.
Laura – All we are saying is give Wang a chance!
June 14th, 2009 at 8:42 pm
“Sounds like AJ Burnett is trying to recruit a personal catcher.”
He may be. The problem is that Cervelli will probably go down to the minors once Molina is ready to play. Whether AJ likes throwing to Cervelli is a moot point. He needs to be able to throw whoever is behind the plate. If he heads to the mound thinking that he’s not going to pitch well with Posada behind the plate, he won’t. It will be a self fulfilling prophecy.
*****
I agree Laura. Liking Cervelli will become a moot point once Molina is back, unless the Yankees inexpicibly decide to carry 3 catchers. Hopefully, he can get it in his head that he likes pitching to whomever is behind the plate. I did enjoy his performance today though
“I have yet to see a post where trish has been condescending to Randy l. or CB. I’ve seen any number of posts where they’ve been condescending to her.”
jay-
show the posts.
put up or shut.
I can’t believe this is his 5th season away from the Yankees. In some respects it seems so long ago, in others it seems so recent.
rconn23 as an objective observer there ARE facts supporting his claims this year…it’s not a ridiculous arguement but I personally believe that Posada calls games just fine.
Anyway, I’ve got my popcorn. F5…F5…F5…
Laura,
Girardi has known what AJ’s preferences are for a while now. He’s forced the AJ/Posada battery because he didn’t want a personal catcher situation. And it was the correct thing to do. But, you also have to look at what works for each pitcher as well.
And before people get on AJ for being immature, etc. moose had a personal catcher as well.
Nick,
I didn’t accuse anybody of anything — other than nastiness and juvenile behavior. What I said —just in case you’re interested — is that if someone would resort to that kind of behavior that I wouldn’t be surprised if they wouldn’t also resort to other juvenile behavior.
If someone would stoop to one, why wouldn’t they be willing to stoop to the other. That’s not an accusation…
You know Cervelli just blows me away. I’m not going to go in on the Cervelli vs Posada thing. Cervelli is a kid that’s come out of A ball Tampa, got hurt, played a few games at Trenton and into the Majors. I expected him to fall apart after a few games, once the League had adjusted to him as happens with most other players. They come in, they’re successful, the League adjusts and see ya later. Instead the kid has thrived, maybe they haven’t paid attention to him yet. But Holy Cannoli, he’s fun to watch catching a game. And your top two starters love his game calling – “Houston we have a problem”.
“I did enjoy his performance today though”
I liked the first two innings. Wasn’t crazy about the 3rd, but liked the ones after that. LOL!
I think it’s okay if A.J. prefers Posada. That, to me, isn’t the issue here. The issue is that he is the one with the hang-up. It has nothing to do with JoPo’s ability to call a game.
Warriors with words…
An ace falls, prinstripes take two…
Subway’s setting sun…
“Girardi has known what AJ’s preferences are for a while now. He’s forced the AJ/Posada battery because he didn’t want a personal catcher situation. And it was the correct thing to do. But, you also have to look at what works for each pitcher as well.”
True. If it turns out that we can only get good performances out of AJ if Cervelli or Molina are behind the plate, they may just have to go that route. It doesn’t really speak well of AJ, but if we win, does that even matter?
Wow,
Do you really think AJ’s the only one that prefers Jose or Francisco?
Laura – All we are saying is give Wang a chance!
June 14th, 2009 at 8:47 pm
“I did enjoy his performance today though”
I liked the first two innings. Wasn’t crazy about the 3rd, but liked the ones after that. LOL!
***
Actually, I found the 3rd inning rather comforting. Nice to see another team that has massive trouble scoring with a RISP and less than 2 outs. I also knew once Burnett got out of that inning the game was in the bag. You could just feel the wind sucking out of the Mets with that 3rd out.
Betsy
June 14th, 2009 at 8:36 pm
I just got back – was out all day and missed the game. I guess AJ pitched pretty well, but I’m not happy about the 4 walks at all.
The Yankees bunted in the 2nd inning? Blech…..
Ok, they won and I’ll take it…… not overly excited about it, but it’s better than a loss.
————————————————————
Two of the walks and one single came in the 3rd inning. apparently, he had trouble with a release point. He started the inning with 2 walks and a single. H He then stuck out two batter with a check swing and a pitch on the corner. He kept them to three singles and 2 walks over the last 4 innings. Regardless of the team, he did well.
He perfers Cervelli because he doesn’t like my game calling. You don’t even have to read between the lines here.
THERE WILL BE HELL TO PAY
He has now released Jorge’s inner demon!
“Actually, I found the 3rd inning rather comforting.”
The ump giving us that check swing strike was comforting. That might have been the game right there.
DYNASTY IS DESTINY!
June 14th, 2009 at 8:47 pm
Warriors with words…
An ace falls, prinstripes take two…
Subway’s setting sun…
****
This is my favorite haiku yet!!!! I have an annual bet with a Mets fan friend. Loser of the 6 games buys dinner. If there is a split, we go dutch. I am making her take me someplace fancy when I win!
randy l.,
I said:
“I have yet to see a post where trish has been condescending to Randy l. or CB. I’ve seen any number of posts where they’ve been condescending to her.”
You said:
“jay-
show the posts.
put up or shut.”
Very happily. How about this beauty?:
“randy l.
June 14th, 2009 at 3:00 pm
” I wish we could dump Posada right now when Molina comes back. Let two defensive catchers work our pitchers. We have enough offense.”
sean-
do everything you can to preserve all your brain neurons.
you may be running a little low on them.”
Would you care to characterize this post as a sterling example of engaging in constructive discussion? I see nothing but insult and an utter absence of facts — something I’ve very sadly come to expect from you, despite all your very valuable real world experience.
m, I think CC and Andy are fine with him. I think Hughes needs him. I think Wang has his own issues and Jorge is the least of his worries. And I am 100% certain that they ALL appreciate his bat.
Steve Carlton had a favorite catcher.
Greg Maddux had a favorite catcher.
If a current Yankee pitcher has a favorite catcher, what is wrong with that?
Jay, I saw exactly what you did. It’s cheap and it’s not appropriate when you don’t know what or who you’re talking about.
Those guys both have a lot of history and credibility on this board. You want to go after what they have actually said, fine, but don’t insinuate something about their integrity. I’ve had it done to me with no basis and it’s not a move that garners respect from those who know better.
Laura – All we are saying is give Wang a chance!
June 14th, 2009 at 8:51 pm
“Actually, I found the 3rd inning rather comforting.”
The ump giving us that check swing strike was comforting. That might have been the game right there.
******
I wasn’t watching most of the game. At that point, I was only listening because I was involved in a very intense game of Scrabble.
“Do you really think AJ’s the only one that prefers Jose or Francisco?”
I think that AJ is the only one who can’t seem to get past it. I think that CC could pitch to Jorge and make it work. Pettite most certainly can (when he’s not stinking up the joint). Wang can, Hughes can. The one I’m not sure about is Joba.
Doreen, nope – I had a great day today. Went to the Metropolitan Museum of Art, then had dinner at a nice Greek place in Astoria. I just decided after Boston not to get my hopes up with the team – I’ll get excited when they beat good teams.
Even AJ is disappointing me – from his post-game comments last week to these dumb comments now…..to another 4 walk performance against a weakened Mets team.
Ghosts and demons at NYS!
As long as there are no Angels!
BTW, Nick Adenhart’s tragedy aside, I’m glad that the Angels are not the darlings of the mlb this season. So tired of hearing about how great Scoscia is and how great their system is. They were so great because their division was so bad.
“If a current Yankee pitcher has a favorite catcher, what is wrong with that?”
DT-
I don’t think there is anything wrong with that exactly. My main concern is that his favorite catcher is going to wind up in Triple A soon and I am afraid he will get it in his head that he is the best catcher for him, and have trouble pitching to the two catchers who will actually remain on the roster.
I’m suprised AJ didn’t say he isn’t pitching well this year is because he doesn’t have his catcher from Toronto.
Or this one — where you insult the intelligence of anyone with the audacity to disagree with you.
randy l.
June 14th, 2009 at 5:53 pm
“Frankly this whole catcher issue keeps the LoHud humor level on a high …”
pat m-
You said:
“it’s not really a debate as much as it’s a baseball IQ test ”
Randy l.,
I’m glad that you at least added the smiley face. But it was still just responding with nothing but insult and no facts or constructive discussion whatsoever.
Whether you’re aware of it or not, in my very brief experience on the board, I’ve noticed you do this repeatedly to others and me. And it’s beneath you.
‘I have yet to see a post where trish has been condescending to Randy l. or CB. I’ve seen any number of posts where they’ve been condescending to her.”
jay-
are you going to back up what you say and give us an example?
Laura, exactly. What is AJ smoking anyway? He’s pitched exactly one time to Cervelli this year before today, maybe twice…….he wins with him? The first time (I think the only time) he threw to Cervelli, AJ had a terrible game. I detest personal catchers and if AJ is trying to make a case for one, well……..let’s just say it displeases me. Deal with Jorge, AJ – or would you prefer to pitch out of the pen in the playoffs if the Yankees make it so you don’t have to worry about it?
Erica, hope you had fun at the shows. I made some jokes about the Mac, but you can go your own way.
Erica,
Glad you liked the haiku!
Let’s Go Yanks!!!!!
“Even AJ is disappointing me – from his post-game comments last week to these dumb comments now…..to another 4 walk performance against a weakened Mets team.”
Betsy, I think that you are being a bit too hard on AJ. I would have preferred that he not walk 4 batters, but he didn’t give up any runs. He had his one bad inning and came through it unscathed. That’s an improvement over his last few starts. As for his comments about Cervelli, that’s something that he and Girardi need to work out. If he really feels that he’s at his best with Molina or Sexy Eyes behind the dish, then maybe Girardi needs to accommodate him.
Erica –
If AJ thinks that Cervelli is the cure to his problems and he continues to pitch shutouts with him – the Yanks will gladly dump Berroa and keep the Eye Melter.
They have angered the king! They shake me off. They say no when they should say yes. They should beg for me to be their king but they ask for the minions.
I will destroy them with my ears. I will shake the Stadium and ruin them by calling for pitches that go to the short porch in right. Oh I do that already. Well I will keep doing it.
They have now released jorge’s inner demon!
I remember Nick as being groomed to replace Tino, so I hated him at the same time I thought he was actually a pretty good guy — easily injured, but a good hitter.
I don’t have a problem with personal catchers if they breed success. If the only way AJ can pitch well is to throw to someone not named Posada, I’m all for it. Wins…it’s all about the wins!
They have now released jorge’s inner demon!
Randy l.
If you care to read my posts, you’ll see that I’ve now given two examples where you’ve responded with insults only and no facts or constructive discussion whatsoever. If you’d like me to post them again, just ask. I’d be more than happy to do so.
One of the reasons that Cervelli has had the offensive start he has is because he hasn’t been over exposed. He seldom sees a pitcher more than one game, and, they usually don’t keep indepth reports on A ball and AA ball players. At least not to the extent that they would with major leaguers and high profile minor leaguers. I doubt that many teams even knew his name.
M, that’s just speculation that AJ preferred Molina/Cervelli – it’s not like we have any proof of that. I think it speaks very poorly of him that he can’t get past it……….
Since SA isn’t around…i’ll take the liberty to say “SERENITY NOW!”
I just read all this in this mornings LoHud comics section…I didn’t know there was an afternoon edition…….I thought the nuerons comment was funny, plus there was no malice I thought….
All I know is, on Friday night I was watching the game at a sports bar at Caesars. I was a little upset that the pace moved along ridiculously slow cause I was drinking beer the whole time I was watching, and well- I can’t drink that much beer. It was also a lot of fun cause they had the Stanley Cup final on and the place was packed with Penguins fans.
When that ball got dropped at the end of the game, I was screaming at the pop of my lungs. I have NEVER seen anything like that before.
I thank Fleetwood Mac for the randomness
. I wish I could continue following them on this tour.
“M, that’s just speculation that AJ preferred Molina/Cervelli – it’s not like we have any proof of that.”
Um, I don’t know about that. There are posts on here with snippets from AJ’s post game interview. He doesn’t come right out and say that he prefers Cervelli, but he comes pretty darn close IMO.
I don’t think it’s a done deal that Cervelli is gone when Molina gets back. First of all, Molina is far from being ready. Second, it seems that one or both of Jorge or Jose is usually hurt lately. Third, he would be more of an asset as a 3rd catcher than Berroa has been to relieve A Rod in blowouts. The only thing they complicates this is they will need one of those spots for Nady.
Betsy,
It happens. He’s already said he loves Hosey because of something or another.
Pitching is mental, and if they have to trick AJ’s mind, then do it.
But don’t hate a pitcher for it. Remember the Moose.
“I thank Fleetwood Mac for the randomness
. I wish I could continue following them on this tour.”
Erica, I’m a huge Mac fan, but I can’t go see them on tour without Christine. It’s just not a complete experience for me w/o her there.
DT-
I hope you are right. I actually like the 3 catcher idea a lot. But Berroa does bring so much value to the table. Really. I mean, who else would we make old man jokes about????
By the way, Pettitte has apparently been an outlier. While the average runs per 9 innings given up by Yankee pitchers has been dramatically higher with Posada behind the plate this year, it looks like it’s been lower with Posada behind the plate when Pettitte has pitched.
I don’t mind posting facts when they dispute my conclusion. That should be part of an open, honest, constructive discussion. No insults or name calling necessary.
Laura, I don’t agree – If I’m Joe, I don’t care if I have to lock AJ in a room with Jorge until they get on the same page. If they make the playoffs and AJ hasn’t pitched himself out of the rotation, he’s going to be throwing to Jorge. There’s no way I accomodate any spoiled pitcher. The way I look at it, if you can’t throw to anyone who sets up behind the plate, you’re just not very good (I know about Greg Maddux – obviously he’s an exception – and I didn’t like it when he did it, either)
jorge’s inner demon has the right idea. This is a baseball comment board, not the UN Security Council. A sense of humor goes a long way regardless of the underlying argument.
Randy l.
Do you care to defend the posts you made where you responded with nothing but insults? Or do you prefer to just acknowledge that what I’m saying is true with your silence?
“The only thing they complicates this is they will need one of those spots for Nady.”
Only if Nady can play the field. If he can’t, he’ll be on the DL for the rest of the season. They may even release him.
Jay
June 14th, 2009 at 8:52 pm
randy l.,
I said:
“I have yet to see a post where trish has been condescending to Randy l. or CB. I’ve seen any number of posts where they’ve been condescending to her.”
You said:
“jay-
show the posts.
put up or shut.”
Very happily. How about this beauty?:
“randy l.
June 14th, 2009 at 3:00 pm
” I wish we could dump Posada right now when Molina comes back. Let two defensive catchers work our pitchers. We have enough offense.”
sean-
do everything you can to preserve all your brain neurons.
you may be running a little low on them.”
***Would you care to characterize this post as a sterling example of engaging in constructive discussion***? I see nothing but insult and an utter absence of facts — something I’ve very sadly come to expect from you, despite all your very valuable real world experience.
————————————————————
Actually, in a way, you’re correct. Randy usually doesn’t take the time to show that he cares enough about somebody’s mental or physical well being to comment.
Randy’s growing and showing that he cares.
I knew Cervelli was the real deal when he led his scrappy team to the WBC CSLB Championship.
(CSLB = countries shaped like boot)
Laura, that’s today. Prior to today, I don’t recall reading anything that indicated AJ had a preference. In any case, his comments were out of line, IMO.
Really. I mean, who else would we make old man jokes about????
===========================
John Henry? I mean, he’s 70 something years old.
Laura,
Sadly, I only got to see them with Christine once. I only started listening to them in 1997 when they reunited and I was in high school. My dad was watching “The Dance” special and I happened to be in the room and I realized I knew every song. And it was love instantly.
I have now seen Fleetwood Mac 7 times. Stevie solo 4 times and Lindsey Buckingham solo twice. I would love to see them with Christine again, but really- I will just take them in any form I can.
Erica – newly OPPC
June 14th, 2009 at 9:02 pm
All I know is, on Friday night I was watching the game at a sports bar at Caesars. I was a little upset that the pace moved along ridiculously slow cause I was drinking beer the whole time I was watching, and well- I can’t drink that much beer. It was also a lot of fun cause they had the Stanley Cup final on and the place was packed with Penguins fans.
When that ball got dropped at the end of the game, I was screaming at the pop of my lungs. I have NEVER seen anything like that before.
I thank Fleetwood Mac for the randomness
. I wish I could continue following them on this tour.
————————————————————
OK, Erica…who does Stevie love more, ME or pat m?
“Laura, I don’t agree – If I’m Joe, I don’t care if I have to lock AJ in a room with Jorge until they get on the same page.”
Betsy, some things you can’t force. I’m sure that Torre tried to get Randy Johnson and Jorge on the same page. It just didn’t happen. I’m not saying that it can’t happen between AJ and Posada; just that it might not happen.
Zach in Port Jeff
June 14th, 2009 at 9:06 pm
Really. I mean, who else would we make old man jokes about????
=======================
John Henry? I mean, he’s 70 something years old.
****
Hahaha. I think Henry may even have a one up on Berroa. Technologically speaking, the old man can Twitter
“But Berroa does bring so much value to the table. Really. I mean, who else would we make old man jokes about????”
we would still have GreenBeret7
“Laura, that’s today. Prior to today, I don’t recall reading anything that indicated AJ had a preference. In any case, his comments were out of line, IMO.”
Actually, I think he spoke of Molina in glowing terms during a start before Molina went on the DL.
GB7 and Pat M.
I did ask her your question. She loves you both equally and said she could never choose between such dedicated fans. And I did scream loudly for you
DT – OPPC member (it’s in our blood)
June 14th, 2009 at 9:09 pm
“But Berroa does bring so much value to the table. Really. I mean, who else would we make old man jokes about????”
we would still have GreenBeret7
————————————————————
I’m trying to think of something to say to you that would make it through the filters. even if you read between the lines, it won’t make it.
zack mcallister is pitching fantastic in the minors.
they mentioned it on the radio after todays game.
Laura – All we are saying is give Wang a chance!
Betsy, some things you can’t force. I’m sure that Torre tried to get Randy Johnson and Jorge on the same page. It just didn’t happen. I’m not saying that it can’t happen between AJ and Posada; just that it might not happen.
******
Terrible example Laura. Can Randy Johnson ever really be on the same page with anyone not named Randy Johnson???
“A sense of humor goes a long way regardless of the underlying argument.”
way to keep us employed Rickles.
you Always Have that even keel.
Randy l.
I have work to do. Nevertheless, I’ll do you the courtesy of hanging around a few more minutes just in case you care to defend your behavior of substituting insult for constructive discussion. Otherwise, I’ll just have to assume that you consider it as indefensible as I do.
Hahaha. I think Henry may even have a one up on Berroa. Technologically speaking, the old man can Twitter.
=======================
Yeah, Berroa still sends out his tweets via:
http://weblogs.hollanddoc.nl/s.....essage.jpg
Erica – newly OPPC
June 14th, 2009 at 9:10 pm
GB7 and Pat M.
I did ask her your question. She loves you both equally and said she could never choose between such dedicated fans. And I did scream loudly for you
————————————————————
That you, Erica. That was great of you to do that (though you could have ignored adding pat m’s name). I guess it’s just as well, though. She’s too young for me.
i was at the game today, its was my first time at the stadium and i thought it was beautiful. i expected a 3-2 game but got a 15-0 game! lol
btw for the ladies in here, they had cisco on the big screen and those eyes were just making all the ladies in the stadium swoon lol!
Pay attention Betsy or I will not wiggle my ears for you!!!
June 14th, 2009 at 4:36 pm.
On YES it was reported that AJ & Cervelli was paired ON PURPOSE because AJ is more comfortable with Cervelli and they even noted AJ’s 7+ ERA when paired with Posada.
It’s too late. Burnett has released jorge’s inner demon!!!
“Terrible example Laura. Can Randy Johnson ever really be on the same page with anyone not named Randy Johnson???”
Ok, bad example. LOL!
jay-
didn’t see your post.
if you’ll notice, i was talking to pat m and not you .
pat m who played triple a baseball.
if i was talking to you, i would have addressed the post to you.
pat m found the debate humorous as i do.
i made a humorous comment back to him.
pat m is used to locker room humor and our jokes back and forth are often in that vein.
if you don’t see the humor, i can’t help you.
… but i will say that if i wanted to tell you that you are a dumb ass, i’d just say so.
I give cerdit to jay. Perhaps there is more to this than I know so I won’t comment, but jay was asked to give evidence and he did.
F5…F5…F5…
Correction: ***Thank you, Erica*** .
Ah, and randy l. gives backstory and an explanation.
The plot thickens.
Anyway, did I read somewhere that Hughes pitched today? How many innings? Thanks!
GreenBeret7
June 14th, 2009 at 9:14 pm
——————————————————————————————
That you, Erica. That was great of you to do that (though you could have ignored adding pat m’s name). I guess it’s just as well, though. She’s too young for me.
****
You are welcome! She did an autograph signing at the Barnes & Noble in Union Square in March. I sort of abandoned work and jumped on a train to be there. I waited for 4 hours but I finally got my chance to meet Stevie. It was amazing. And having actually stood up close to her in person, I can honestly say for 61 years old she looks WONDERFUL. Seriously. I can only hope I look anywhere near that good when I am that age.
McAllister will take Wang’s spot one day.
Betsy
June 14th, 2009 at 9:17 pm
Anyway, did I read somewhere that Hughes pitched today? How many innings? Thanks!
***
Hughes “closed it out”. He went one, two hits, two Ks
Brandon- when is the next Cena challenge?
Erica – newly OPPC
June 14th, 2009 at 9:17 pm
GreenBeret7
June 14th, 2009 at 9:14 pm
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That you, Erica. That was great of you to do that (though you could have ignored adding pat m’s name). I guess it’s just as well, though. She’s too young for me.
****
You are welcome! She did an autograph signing at the Barnes & Noble in Union Square in March. I sort of abandoned work and jumped on a train to be there. I waited for 4 hours but I finally got my chance to meet Stevie. It was amazing. And having actually stood up close to her in person, I can honestly say for 61 years old she looks WONDERFUL. Seriously. I can only hope I look anywhere near that good when I am that age.
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Considering how she spent a great deal of her past 35+ years, it’s amazing that she not only looks that great, but, sounds that great. Imagine if she had taken care of herself.
Betsy June 14th, 2009 at 8:44 pm
Beating up on the weak sisters of the NL or whomever the Yankees are facing won’t impress me because – any good team can do that (and at this point, I’m not assuming anything). The Yankees just do not play the type of baseball conducive to winning in the post-season.
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You have to get to the postseason first before you worry about winning in the postseason.
The reason why this team didn’t play in October last year is because they weren’t beating the teams consistently that they were supposed to beat.
This season, they haven’t played well against Boston – but they have smacked around the teams they are supposed to smack around. They play a lot more games against those kinds of teams that they do the Red Sox so they are doing exactly what they need to do.
It’s important to emphasize that point. This team let bad teams beat them at a very alarming rate last year but they played well against Boston and TB.
That lack of consistency against bad teams was the reason why they didn’t play in October last year.
So if they beat up on teams they are supposed to beat over the 100+ games – well, that’s a very good thing. That’s what good teams do and it’s a winning formula if this team wants to play in October this year.
Randy l.,
I’m not trying to pick a fight with you. Far from it. I have no dog in ANY fight on this board. I would just like to see more courtesy and constructive discussion.
This board would be more valuable to all of us with more light and less heat.
DT: based on something I said earlier, I don’t think it would be proper for me even to engage in AH banter. But I certainly appreciate it.
Betsy,
If I’m not mistaken the two hits were borderline playable. One went under the glove of a diving Cano. And the other was an infield hit slowed by the grass. The others can correct me if I’m wrong.
But Gameday showed he hit 95 on his one-pitch out to the catcher. Infield popup.
I value your opinion, Randy l. And I would prefer to hear it than hear insults or personal criticism because somebody has an opinion different than yours or less experience than you. That’s all I have to say.
Good nite Randy l. and all.
Noesi 6.2 IP, 8 H, 2 R, 1 ER, 1 BB, 6 K’s
This kid is starting to become disgusting good.
The only thing Randy I has experience in, is being a moron.
“Randy’s growing and showing that he cares.”
gb7-
once i saw the newer gentler gb7 emerging i made a new year’s resolution to follow.
when i saw sean showing ealry signs of dementia i thought it was the perfect time to follow your example and offer my assistance.
i guess it was the ” i wish we could dump posada right now ” that gave me the clue i could help.
GB7-
Very true!!! The woman does have a hole in her nose from too much powder. Fortunately, she cleaned up well and now talks about the dangers of such a lifestyle
“Brandon- when is the next Cena challenge?”
Thursday.
Cliff lee is dominate today.
Brandon, I will make a note to watch for a change in the standings. I have a strange feeling you will be victorious again.
GB, Are you talking about The Mick or about my girl who sings in the shower for me, Stevie Nicks…My Bella Donna……The shower thing is from a dream sequence….Randy I, ( The Original Tin Cup ), seems to me that we can’t go for than a few months without ruffling som e feathers…..The brain nuetrons was a gas though…..Foe being in the bigs and catching a mere 20 games if that, Mr. Cevelli has a loyal fan base…..Much like Kevin Maas did back in the early 90’s….Yeah, he was going to break Roger’s record….
When Stevie Nicks went straight, the Bolivian GNP went down 6%
“DT: based on something I said earlier, I don’t think it would be proper for me even to engage in AH banter. But I certainly appreciate it.”
Nick, I understand. I hope you will reconsider if Aaron Hill ever takes one of our pitchers deep.
sean-
would you really want to stand up in the yankee locker room and say “i wish we could dump posada right now “.
think before you answer. imagine jeter looking at you. mo looking at you. pettitte looking at you. girardi looking at you. posada himself looking at you.
that’s really what you’d want to say?
randy i, 15-0, got that idiot? What do you have to say for yourself besides the fact that you have no clue about anything in this world. I bet you are really mad at the fact that Burnett had no runs scored against him today, huh idiot?
Three of the teams that the Yanks have to play in the first round of playoffs have been handled by NYY. 4-2 over Texas, 2-1 against Detroit and the Angels. The had two losses to the Phillies, one was a one run game. Three of the Boston losses were by a run. they are 4-4 against Tampa. They have issues, but, not as much as you might think.
“sean-
do everything you can to preserve all your brain neurons.
you may be running a little low on them.”
I’m sorry, idiot, Randy “I” I stands for Idiot, right?
BTW under the radar move but remember awhile back I told you guys 2 cubans stayed in the states. One of them is LHP Noel Argüelles compared to Francisco Liriano and YES the Yankees are persuing him hard.
http://cubanballplayers.blogsp.....aking.html
He is rumored to hit 93 mph on the gun, might be a little out of shape, but 19 according to his agent and the scouts love him, he was clocked at 91 by some, so not sure what it is that makes him Liriano-like.
DT: I don’t think it will be a permenant detente, especially given the comments – or lack of comments, actually – that were made.
randy l.
June 14th, 2009 at 9:26 pm
“Randy’s growing and showing that he cares.”
gb7-
once i saw the newer gentler gb7 emerging i made a new year’s resolution to follow.
when i saw sean showing ealry signs of dementia i thought it was the perfect time to follow your example and offer my assistance.
i guess it was the ” i wish we could dump posada right now ” that gave me the clue i could help.
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See? You can do it. Acting like me and having me as your mentor is never a bad idea. And, it doesn’t hurt a bit, does it?
Just remember, there’s no extra credit for correct spelling or typing.
Erica, thanks! 2 hits? Eh – but he’s just a kid and he did strike out two. I’m glad he pitched – I guess he can go 3 or 4 innings in Wang’s next start?
GB, very good points……
Turn to ESPN.
OOps, sorry GF – I want to credit you with that great post, lol
No hitter through 7 for cliff lee
Randy I,
For now on, do not address me in a condescending way. I don’t like it. If you want to meet at a Yankee game, I’m all ears. Then we can talk about who’s stupid and who’s not.
M, thanks!
GB, good points…
Betsy
June 14th, 2009 at 9:36 pm
Erica, thanks! 2 hits? Eh – but he’s just a kid and he did strike out two. I’m glad he pitched – I guess he can go 3 or 4 innings in Wang’s next start?
GB, very good points……
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I assume you were referring to Hughes’ game, today. One of the hits was an infield bouncer that Berroa cut in front of Pena for and the other just a little liner to center.
“Mike Ashmore says *Chris Garciais off to see Dr. Andrews* . I give up.
RAB”
Carl Pavano Jr.
“See? You can do it. Acting like me and having me as your mentor is never a bad idea. And, it doesn’t hurt a bit, does it?”
GB7>>>>>>a mentor???????
What the %&*#@+% is this world coming to?
Hey GB, just giving you your daily minimum requirement of harassment. See how I care?
Good thing I don’t live in Vegas. I would have bet big bucks that Santana would have defeated you guys and that Beckett would have beat the Phillies today.
I see that Randy I, ( The Original Tin Cup ) is getting frustrated by all the shaking off from first Jay and now Sean…..Maybe this is why they want Cervelli, he just gives them what they want…..Randy I, is too set in his ways…..Personally, I think he’s forgotten more about the game than either of these two have shown they know about the game….You cannot go by 20 games and make such a case about a 12 year veteran catcher who by the way has been to several All-Star games…..You’re just chasing your tails about this right now…..
1. the time to ask not to be condescended to usually comes *before* you call someone an idiot.
2. If Odem is hitting 3’s, the Magic might as well give up now.
“Just remember, there’s no extra credit for correct spelling or typing.”
GB – it’s really amazing you are still here.
I figured one day I would come in and hear that you got banned for life for trying to type “duck duck goose”
Good grief about Garcia. But that’s why I wasn’t counting on him for anything this season.
Garcia has the type of luck that he may need TJ again.
Has any major league pitcher ever had two TJ surgeries?
“I assume you were referring to Hughes’ game, today. One of the hits was an infield bouncer that Berroa cut in front of Pena for and the other just a little liner to center.”
Berroa had been cutting off Pee Wee Reese and Luis Aparicio in his career what made El Nino think he wouldn’t cut him off.
jay-
myself, pat m, gb7 and a few others like to throw out a few barbs from time to time.
i’ve been on the end of many from nick in sf as he has with me. we’re not always going to be politically correct ( well maybe nick in sf) because that would be kind of boring and not nearly as much fun.
i do have to admit on a serious note that i can’t take a discussion seriously that wants to bench a borderline hall of fame catcher with four rings while he has over a .900 ops.
do i like to see posada working closely with a catching coach? yes ,i do because it brings out the best in him. gary tuck used to work with him and he would keep posada tuned up.
hopefully pena works with him as tuck used to.
DT – OPPC member (it’s in our blood)
June 14th, 2009 at 9:45 pm
“Just remember, there’s no extra credit for correct spelling or typing.”
GB – it’s really amazing you are still here.
I figured one day I would come in and hear that you got banned for life for trying to type “duck duck goose”
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I’m not even stupid enough to try that one. I’m just happy that there’s never been a reason to type firetruck.
I’m not even sure if this will get to the filters. This computer may get confused and try to correct your spelling.
Nick,
You spelled it wrong. It’s O-damn
“When Stevie Nicks went straight, the Bolivian GNP went down 6%”
Nick-
I so wish I had a witty comeback for that, but I just don’t
“I’m not even stupid enough to try that one. I’m just happy that there’s never been a reason to type firetruck.”
Good GB. stay away from firetruck. Don’t let Randy bait you with those Randy Tuck references either.
Gary Tuck either…
Nick in SF in Larkspur, another Posada homer, I didn’t even know what he said about me in the other thread until a red sox fan of all people made me aware of it. I don’t like it. I don’t come here to be harassed.
If you or Randy I want to meet me in front of Yankee stadium to clear the air, I say let’s do it. I can meet you guys there on July 2nd, two days before I go on a cruise. I can’t meet this week but July 2nd is perfect.
The old farts here seriously like Stevie Nicks? If I were a guy, I’d prefer Dirty Debbie Harry.
GB, thanks! I’m just glad Phil got in and that it looks like he continues to throw well……
I guess Marte sees Dr. Andrews tomorrow? I’m crossing my fingers because I do think a healthy Marte can help us
Do you know that that Lindsay Lohan attempted to purchase the rights to play Stevie Nicks on the big screen?
Stevie Nicks, when reached for comment, responded with “Over my dead body!”
True story.
“When Stevie Nicks went straight, the *Bolivian GNP went down* 6%”
Nick-
I so wish I had a witty comeback for that, but I just don’t.
Who knew? I always thought the Landslide brought it down….
ray (sox fan)
June 14th, 2009 at 9:44 pm
“See? You can do it. Acting like me and having me as your mentor is never a bad idea. And, it doesn’t hurt a bit, does it?”
GB7>>>>>>a mentor???????
What the &*#@+ is this world coming to?
Hey GB, just giving you your daily minimum requirement of harassment. See how I care?
Good thing I don’t live in Vegas. I would have bet big bucks that Santana would have defeated you guys and that Beckett would have beat the Phillies today.
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You know, you could use a little of my computer manners and politeness yourself.
Evening, Ray. Hope all is well in Oz today, and all is well in the (sox fan) family household.
I sort of thought that NYY would score off of Santana Claus, because as good as he is, NYY has always had a bit of luck in hitting him. It came down to how well Burnett would be, today. Had it not been for the third inning, he’d probably had a complete gamer. /Those 30 plus pitches cost him. Other than that, he was, dare I say, Beckett-like.
Nick, if Odom is hitting 3’s Magic might as well give up. That’s like watching Posada hit an inside the parker.
DT-
Thank you. That was perfect
Hahahaha
“Gary Tuck either…”
DT-
damn, if you wouldn’t have said something, i would have had gb 7 all set up
m June 14th, 2009 at 9:53 pm
The old farts here seriously like Stevie Nicks? If I were a guy, I’d prefer Dirty Debbie Harry.
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Stevie Nicks was a hottie in her glory days with Fleetwood Mac. But I’m 35 years old so she’s a little older for my taste these days.
” If you or Randy I want to meet me in front of Yankee stadium to clear the air, I say let’s do it.”
Sean – Randy and Nick are tight and usually go to the game together – three may be a crowd.
Go look for them in the Posada Truthers section or under the O’Neill banner.
Betsy
June 14th, 2009 at 9:54 pm
GB, thanks! I’m just glad Phil got in and that it looks like he continues to throw well……
I guess Marte sees Dr. Andrews tomorrow? I’m crossing my fingers because I do think a healthy Marte can help us
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My pleasure. 94 MPH fastballs and sharp curves. I just can’t see him going back to Scranton unless it’s for a 2 start stretch ‘em out tuneup. He’d possibly need that in two months if they need to put him back in the rotation (according to Cone).
I think Sean needs to be banned.
“If you or Randy I want to meet me in front of Yankee stadium to clear the air, I say let’s do it. I can meet you guys there on July 2nd, two days before I go on a cruise”
sean,
don’t go too close to the railing.
Guiseppe,
She’s preserved herself very well. I saw her on something in the last month or so. She looks the same. Same hair, same clothes, and same voice.
She still looks like she’s in her 30’s. Wonder if Henry tweets about her?
Nice……I just hope the velocity will remain when he returns to the rotation (wherever it is). Do you think that this velocity jump is due to Phil being in the pen and being able to air it out? I know he’s a kid who does better in warmer weather, plus power pitchers always take some time to get going anyway……….I guess it doesn’t matter because Phil can get swings and misses throwing 92-93, but it’s sure nice to see him throwing this well.
I think Stevie has aged sooooo much better than Debbie Harry.
So, interesting run here… 2 of 3 from first-place Rangers, the Rays and the Mets. 0-3 vs. Sox. I would have rather we got swept by the Mets and took 2 of 3 from the Red Sox… hopefully we feed off the bad NL East teams now that we are done for a bit with the two good ones (until Citi Field)
Sean, thanks, I didn’t know anything needed to be cleared up. I’m probably not going to be able to make the July 2 game, but thanks for the invite! The first time I meet someone from LoHud will probably be more of a friendly occasion. but good luck finding a game buddy.
And to think we thought the K-Rod / Bruney thing was the event of the day…..Now we have Sean calling out Nick in SF & Randy I…..And down goes Frazier !!!!!
Hey, this guy ain’t fooling me. Sean is really Joe Francisco’s little brother, isn’t it?
I should also say that I watched AJ’s post-game comments and I sort of need to issue something of an apology as I was very hard on the guy. He was just answering questions from Kim Jones and I think he just wanted to compliment Cervelli – I don’t think he meant to denigrate Jorge. According to AJ, the clubhouse was pretty wild today…..unfortunately, he wouldn’t reveal anything.
So I guess the 2009 Internet Tough Guy Convention is July 2 at Yankee Stadium???
Come on Nick, we can have a beer.
Grr- can we move it up a day???? I am going to the game on July 1st!!! I would love to see some rumbling under the O’Neill banner
I would of went there and tried to be your friends because it’s not cool having enemies.
“Hey, this guy ain’t fooling me. Sean is really Joe Francisco’s little brother, isn’t it?”
I’m waiting for him to challenge Randy on July 4th – under the Carnival Cruise banner. No weapons. Bring your own passport.
One bad thing about today was…Chip Caray.
He must’ve mentioned, insinutated, dropped the hint, whined about the stadium about 100 times.
Every freaking opportunity, and then some.
It was yuck. But I kept it on because I wanted to hear Buck talk nice about the Yankees even though it pained him to do so.
Isn’t this the second time there was a scheduled bout under the Paulie banner ??? I thought in early April we had a scheduled main event ???? And to think the Yanks had a banner day, 15 zip over Santana and the Mets…. Well the post game entertainment is better than usual….Debra Harry of Blondie is no contest for Stevie Nicks of Fleetwood Mac….
Think we need it again:
serenity now
Come on Orlando. Yikes
“It was yuck. But I kept it on because I wanted to hear Buck talk nice about the Yankees even though it pained him to do so.”
danger GB – stay away from quoting m there…
I still have a thing for Linda Ronstadt.
Please, I can’t fight. I have pulmonary hypertension, heart failure and lupus. If I walk fast, I lose my breath. A five year old kid could beat me up.
Sorry S.A., you weren’t around earlier so I had to chime in on your behalf.
dammit Kobe is going to win another title.
DT – OPPC member (it’s in our blood)
June 14th, 2009 at 10:18 pm
“It was yuck. But I kept it on because I wanted to hear Buck talk nice about the Yankees even though it pained him to do so.”
danger GB – stay away from quoting m there…
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You’re scaring me.
Zach in Port Jeff June 14th, 2009 at 10:20 pm
Sorry S.A., you weren’t around earlier so I had to chime in on your behalf.
====================
LOL
No worries
Good night folks! I am wiped from all the excitement this weekend. We can debate Stevie Nicks vs. Anyone more tomorrow in the absense of baseball
Can’t believe I’m going to say this but it’s more fun here when people turn on the players than on each other.
I just hope that Dwight Howard doesn’t foul out. That would be tough.
Sean, no hard feelings, I hope. I have enough enemies on here.
Heyman twitter:
“yankees and angels are scouting huston street. if he goes to NYC, he can change pronunciation to house-ton st.”
Congrats, Laker fans. I hope Shaq revises his rap.
According to Ken Rosenthal, Scott Boras has just announced that Kobe Bryant has opted out of his contract.
Kobe Bryant, when reached for comment during a time-out, responded with “Boras isn’t even my agent!”
Pat M.
June 14th, 2009 at 10:17 pm
Isn’t this the second time there was a scheduled bout under the Paulie banner ??? I thought in early April we had a scheduled main event ???? And to think the Yanks had a banner day, 15 zip over Santana and the Mets…. Well the post game entertainment is better than usual….Debra Harry of Blondie is no contest for Stevie Nicks of Fleetwood Mac….
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In case you missed it, Erica was here after the Fleetwood Mac concert and said that she only remembers vaguely a time in Phoenix about a time when some old geezer tried using the “can I buy you a drink” pickup line, and that she was terrified with the guy drooling all over her. I have a date with her tomorrow. She’s driving the Macmobile down to see me…
Nick in SF…When I went to game 1, it was obvious to me that Orlando was to small under the basket , then there was the Kobe Factor…..
Brian Cashman said the solutions to the Yankees’ problems, particularly with their starting rotation, may not lie elsewhere.
The general manager said he didn’t have a sense of the trade market yet, with six weeks before the July 31 non-waiver deadline, but he said Sunday that the return of Brian Bruney from the disabled list Tuesday, plus the hoped-for revival of Chien-Ming Wang, would alleviate most of his concerns.
“If we fix ourselves,” Cashman said, “there might not be anything we need to do.”
He said he would run any proposals by general partner Hal Steinbrenner if it meant adding payroll.
Cashman said Wang’s start Wednesday against the Nationals would be a big factor in determining what happens next.
“We need Chien-Ming Wang,” Cashman said. “This is an important step. We know what he’s capable of. The velocity and the sink are there. Maybe his confidence isn’t there.”
After Wang flamed out again in Boston on Wednesday, Cashman, Joe Girardi and pitching coach Dave Eiland met to decide Wang’s future. They chose to give him one more chance at starting before demoting him and returning Phil Hughes to the rotation. Hughes pitched a scoreless ninth inning yesterday.
“Clearly, our bullpen and our team can’t continue to deal with this issue,” Cashman said, “especially when we have someone who can do the job better.
http://www.newsday.com/sports/.....?track=rss
Nick, I don’t come here to make enemies. Only talk baseball. I have to admit, I shouldn’t of said what I said about Posada. I should of known that what I said would get people pissed off. I actually did know that people would get pissed off and that’s why I probably said it.
I’m stubborn, like you Nick, come on, you have to admit, and when some one has a different point of view than me that I don’t like, I try to force my view on them. It’s a bad habit I have.
Pat M: Orlando gave a couple games away. That always helps too. The Lakers are ready for their close ups… Orlando not so much.
Orlando
Congrats to the Lakers
Jeff van Gundy sounded depressed there talking about how the Lakers showed their greatness in this game.
At least it wasn’t Boston that won.
“Sean, no hard feelings, I hope. I have enough enemies on here.”
sean-
nick in sf isn’t kidding. he can be really annoying sometimes
Big Chief Triangle rides tall again…
Yes, Sean, I can be stubborn too. But I like beers more than fistfights. Again, no hard feelings.
MLB-TV is showing a program on Cubs legend, Ron Santo, who’s about 30 years past due for a HOF vote. It’s a great piece and highly recommended, if only because of the person.
After Wang flamed out again in Boston on Wednesday, Cashman, Joe Girardi and pitching coach Dave Eiland met to decide Wang’s future. They chose to give him one more chance at starting before demoting him and returning Phil Hughes to the rotation. Hughes pitched a scoreless ninth inning yesterday.
“Clearly, our bullpen and our team can’t continue to deal with this issue,” Cashman said, “especially when we have someone who can do the job better.
———————–
Ouch. This start is very important for Wang.
Maybe I should have said one is enough?
Nick in SF, The LA Lakers are young and are going to be a factor some the next 3 / 4 years……Bynam will only get better…..
Wang’s first 2 starts were against the 2 top teams in the AL— Texas and Boston.
He did well against Texas until he ran out of gas, and even when he won 19 games, he never pitched well against the Sox.
How is it fair that he basically has one more start to prove himself? They brought a 1\2 baked Wang in to face the 2 top teams and offenses in the league in his first 2 starts.
He should ATLEAST get to face the Nationals, Braves, and Mets/Mariners (wherever he is lined up) before he gets re-evaluated.
Hey GB, I was 48 when we had our encounter in Sedona….Hey I got a smile & then of course the thanks no thanks rountine….She was beautiful, oh those eyes, that voice, Bella Donna….
Scott Shields out for the season
Yikes…. Angels are going to be in heavy on Street now.
I only hope that Wang shows enough progress that the course becomes clear. But it hobbles the team to have to give a roster spot to Hughes just to shadow Wang. It’s not great for Hughes either, except that he gets to stay on the big club.
i wont mind Jeter celebrating like Kobe in september
those eyes, that voice, that Sufi dance… they call her the Gypsy…
Pat M,
They did it. I’m a little weepy. Hopefully we can have some magic in October, too, no?
Even if you’re not a Laker fan, I hope you can be happy for those with NY/NJ ties. Odom and Bynum. And of course, ex-Knickerbocker and Net Phil Jackson, who passed the great Red Auerbach tonight.
Cool Nick, and you too Randy, I have no hard feelings. I’m done with it.
If anyone plays fantasy baseball, it might be a good idea to start your Yankee pitchers against Washington.
What an awful NBA finals. You just new this amateur Orlando team wouldn’t take down Kobe and Phil.
Really wish we saw LeBron vs. Kobe
“Clearly, our bullpen and our team can’t continue to deal with this issue,” Cashman said, “especially when we have someone who can do the job better.”
kind of an odd thing to say when it’s cashman’s fault that wang is still in spring training shape and pitching in the majors instead of scranton.
Pat M.
June 14th, 2009 at 10:46 pm
Hey GB, I was 48 when we had our encounter in Sedona….Hey I got a smile & then of course the thanks no thanks rountine….She was beautiful, oh those eyes, that voice, Bella Donna….
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Hey, Pat. She’s one of those that never gets old or always looks like you remember. She’s like Sophia Loren, Ann-Margret, Rachel Welch and Barbara Eden. Always classic beauties.
Stevie says she loves my smile and my teeth. I’m gonna have ‘em bronzed and give ‘em to her.
no problem sean. have a good one.
Cashman shouldn’t really talk about people who can do certain jobs better.
(I just said that cos randy didn’t)
m, I am and I forever will be a NY Knick fan… The days of Clyde, Earl The Pearl, Willis Reed, Dollar Bill, Dave Debush….Saw many a game at what at that time was the New Madison Square Garden…..Lakers are an odopted team since I live here, besides they’re a class organization…..
When you listen to Cashman and Eliand talk, you wonder if they have ever taken a lesson in PR in their life.
Girardi has been slightly better, but he too goes off the deep end often enough.
Zillo needs to teach these guys how to talk to the media.
As a Knicks fan, playoff basketball seems completely alien to me.
I’ve yet to forgive John Starks for his 2-18 performance in game 7.
Oh the pain.
Way to show support for your 2-time 19 game winner, Mr. Cashman
Charles Smith… under the basket… Charles Smith… under the basket… Charles Smith… under the basket…
Maybe Cashman and Eiland think that nothing they say will be translated into Mandarin?
“Cashman shouldn’t really talk about people who can do certain jobs better.”
that’s crap nick.
cashman has nothing to learn by being an apprentice at starbucks.
wake up and smell the coffee!
Charles Smith… under the basket… Charles Smith… under the basket… Charles Smith… under the basket…
=============================
The Ewing finger roll…
“Charles Smith… under the basket… Charles Smith… under the basket… Charles Smith… under the basket…”
Damn you Nick, you looking for a fist in the face !
Why would you remind me of that 
WHY ! 
“The Ewing finger roll…”
You want a fist too
…and why can’t we get a televised OJ Simpson car chase during every NBA finals?
When will the Knicks be playing competitive basketball in Late May and June again?
Sorry, Brandon. These are painful memories for me too. My folks almost named me Willis. I have a great vinyl record of Marv Albert narrating the story of the first Championship season.
YES!!!
I miss the NBA.
What’s up everyone?? I’m over at IMG (I start working tomorrow) – I’ve asked around about our 2nd round draft pick JR Murphy. They are SO excited about him. My question to everyone has been: “Is he as good as advertised?” and all anyone has said is “much better.”
I’ll try to get an actual break down from some of the coaches but they are VERY excited around here.
“cashman has nothing to learn by being an apprentice at starbucks”
He’s only working at Starbucks to keep an eye on Jeter.
Derek will pick up little babies all day long for those photo ops.
Hey, the Knicks will be back. Just as soon as they clear Larry Johnson’s salary off the books…
Brandon, two words for you:
Isiah…
Thomas.
This is actually very therapeutic for me.
all kidding aside, why would you give a pitcher who has been your best pitcher over the last three years an ultimatum to pitch well or else the day after his first child is born?
even if he pitches a perfect game on tuesday and wins the cy young next year, do you really think he’s going to stay when he’s a free agent in 2010?
brian cashman is losing his mind.
Sometimes I wonder if Wang kidnapped Cashman’s dog or maybe Wang spit in his coffee? I dunno.
Haven’t been feeling too much love/support from Cashman to Wang.
Yes I agree it’s hard to continue like this, but part of the reason things are the way they are right now is because of the Yankees and the decisions they have made.
Whatever.
Here’s hoping we see continued improvement from Wanger on Wed.
http://lebronjamesin2010.com/images/lebron.jpg
2010?
Please Lord?
Being a hard core Celtics fan it hurts to say this….but congratulations to m and all the other Laker fans on here.
Hmmmm, it seems like the common thread here with Cashman is coffee. He must have some bitter memories of the early days in the organization.
But if the Yankees want Wang back after 2010, that’s when they will show him the love. I think Wang the Yankee is a bigger deal than Wang the Dodger or Wang the Mariner. Lot of cround to cover between now and then.
even better.
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/up.....hoto02.jpg
Lebron to the pen?
ill wind blowing on the Lohud.
Posada debate rages.
fisticuffs threatened but no mention of the O’Neill Banner
what is the world comming to? So what the Banner is as useless as the UN.
As per YESnetwork.com
Francisco Cervelli: A bloop single gets the Yankees on the board against Santana. It’s no surprise Cervelli is catching A.J., who just doesn’t pitch well with Posada behind the plate. (7.48 ERA in four starts with Posada. 3.81 in eight starts with Molina or Cash.)
Nick-
Can I be your best man when you wed Trisha under the O’Neill banner? Just kiddin’
even better.
http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/up.....hoto02.jpg
Lebron to the pen?
===================================
Lebron-Bruney-Mo?
Could work
Alex Cora’s quote was awesome
Then Cora remembered that when the Subway Series has its second round in two weeks at CitiField, the bullpens are side by side.
“Put a ring in there, and Ultimate Fighting,” he said, then shook his head.
“It was a long day, boys. We’re talking about Bruney and Frankie? We got our asses kicked today. We move on.”
Wang has lived off the Sinker for years, and it finally has caught up with him. There is definitely some kind of tension between him and the club. But for Wang to survive he needs to develop another pitch. Whether he is refusing or unable to do so could be another problem. It would make sense for him to go to Scranton to work out his issues, but he’s out of options, and would probably not clear waivers. They could try and DL him, but they tried this once already, and MLB frowns upon this. Maybe Selig starts trouble, since it’s the Yankees.
Either way, long term Wang is going to be a 4th or 5th starter…if he’s lucky. He lost his sinker, so now he’s going to have to get crafty, and throw alot of junk. That’s what he has to get mentally adjusted to…fast.
Just for the record, the voters for the HOF should be absolutely ashamed of themselves for the failure to vote in Ron Santo, Bert Blyleven, Jim Kaat and Tommy John. If they were stupid or uninformed enough to vote for the likes of Bill Mazeroski, (Tinker, Evers, Chance – these guys got in because of a stupid poem), PeeWee Reese, Phil Rizzuto, Ross Youngs, Dizzy Dean and Rabbit Maranville, don’t compound that by ignoring these four guys. I’d even suggest that Kenny Boyer should be in before that second list of names.
Buddy, the O’Neill banner is for fussin’ and feudin’ — I will wed under the Munson banner, where my heart lies.
AJ needs to deal with Posada, period……so do the other pitchers. What wimps, I’m sorry. What, AJ couldn’t throw his change to Jorge? You’re the pitcher, you’re in control………you throw it.
“Hmmmm, it seems like the common thread here with Cashman is coffee. ”
you don’t suppose one day in the locker room that jeter told wang that if he wanted a coffee just ask cashman to get it for him. you know how that derek is always playing practical jokes on wang teaching him bad english words and such.
When so many pitchers are having problems, maybe it is the catcher who needs to change.
It’s not specifically Cervelli. It was Cash too, and Molina. Basically anyone but Posada.
I think Cashman told Wang “Coffee is for closers!” and Wang hasn’t had any life on his sinker ever since.
If Cervelli keeps it up, he could soon have his own banner.
I can see it now…Hundreds of females, young and old, standing beneath the Cervelli banner….transfixed.
I’m getting into a trance just thinking about it.
Those eyes.
Maybe Cashman has his eye on Big John Lackey who is in his walk year in Anaheim…..Making The Wang-Man expendable…I do doubt that any of this is true…..
Eliand came out and said that the ballpark was in the pitcher’s head and that’s why they are not throwing strikes— check the gamepost.
AJ and Andy have made comments talking about how the ballpark affects them as well, as has Joba.
How is that Posada’s fault? The pitching coach says it is the stadium.
I think Wang will get more than one start unless he gets totally rocked.
i think if cashman throws wang under the bus , he’ll be laying the groundwork for his own demise and firing.
cashman himself mishandled wang so badly he can’t hide it. the press will be all over him if wang doesn’t come back this year.
if i were wang, i’d say screw it and be with my wife and new child and tell cashman where to shove his start.
there’s times when the player as a person is more important than the player as a yankee.
Cashman’s quotes about Wang have been very odd. First that “his contract says baseball player, not starter. He has a 20 ERA”, now this.
It’s like they refuse to support him or throw him a bone. Are they trying to motivate him? Considering that Wang’s problems seem to be mental at this point… maybe that is the case.
Still pretty odd to see his own GM kind of apathetic towards him.
Cliff Lee was untouchable for quite a while tonight. I actually thought that he was going to throw the no-no after he got by Pujols in the 7th.
Lee was killing the Cards with the high fastball, especially on the first pitch. Rick Ankiel was the most over matched hitter of the night. He looked horrible in his first 3 at-bats.
Lee showed the form that made him last year’s AL Cy Young winner.
And congrats to the Lakers!
“What’s up everyone?? I’m over at IMG (I start working tomorrow) – I’ve asked around about our 2nd round draft pick JR Murphy. They are SO excited about him. My question to everyone has been: “Is he as good as advertised?” and all anyone has said is “much better.””
Very much better. I thought the kid was a bust but there is legit pure hitting talent there. The kid has a choice Miami or the Yankees, they think he’ll sign.
7.48 ERA in four starts with Posada. 3.81 in eight starts with Molina or Cash or Cervelli.
People wanted stats right? So those are the stats issued by the team. I posted it so that all the antagonistic posters on the previous thread can see that pairing Cervelli with AJ was done purposefully . It wasn’t to give Jorge a day off.
This debate grows old, let the numbers do the talking.
Who is going to fire Cashman?
Hal just gave him a new contract and admittedly knows nothing about baseball. I doubt he even knows anything about the Wang situation.
“.Making The Wang-Man expendable”
pat m-
maybe cashman should trade wang to tampa bay for whatever he can get.
i’m sure that wang being reunited with neil allen wouldn’t result in any more than 15 victories a year for rays the next 5 years.
LeBron as a lockdown reliever, yes! That is how he will help bring glory to New York this year!
Watching highlights of the game now, is it just me or does AJ look a little like gollum from LOTR?
Watching the K-Rod/Bruney video, I mean seriously?
Maybe The Cervelli Banner should have eyes that follow you as you walk past it?
An occasional wink possibly?
Carl, that’s just not true…….It’s the pitchers’ fault if they can’t execute – there is no gray area for me. Andy’s been lousy for weeks now – that’s not on anyone other than him. All AJ does is throw HR balls and walks – that’s on him, no one else. Joba is a kid and is going to be up and down. Wang’s problems are obviously not related to any catcher.
He doesn’t know if it’s the catcher? That actually is a very damning statement. Seriously- how about AJ taking responsibility for his piss poor performances? If he wanted to, he could have mixed his pitches in good counts, but he chose not to………
two best kept “non” secrets in CT to live in are Monroe and Milford if you are going to commute to Stamford/Greenwich area… still affordable, Milford surprisingly quaint yet fun town center and great beaches BY CONNECTICUT STANDARDS
also Monroe is still affordable and there are backroads to avoid traffic. Milford can be a train commuter town or drive if you time it right. Wife did a year of Milford to Darien and it was not too bad at all.
Girardi tried to force the Posada/AJ experiment early on… now he is realizing the error of his ways.
The numbers are startling. If you listened to the pregame, it was obvious that this pairing was done purposefully.
“Still pretty odd to see his own GM kind of apathetic towards him.”
even though wang was signed in taiwan while cashman was the gm , he really wasn’t that good until neil allen who was hired by the tampa faction converted him to a sinkerball pitcher.
cashman did not hire allen. wang is more a product of the tampa faction than he is a cashman find.
Rex Ryan to be in studio with Francesa for you Jets fans on Mike’d Up
Diet coke breaking down the subway series.
“The Castillo”
7*7
June 14th, 2009 at 11:33 pm
Girardi tried to force the Posada/AJ experiment early on… now he is realizing the error of his ways.
The numbers are startling. If you listened to the pregame, it was obvious that this pairing was done purposefully.
————————————————————
Giving Posada two straight days off is the purpose.
Dealing with Jorge is easier said than done.
He doesn’t have the warmest personality in the world
“Giving Posada two straight days off is the purpose.”
Girardi, Burnett, Yesnetwork. NY media all say otherwise but you know better so of course, it’s to give Jorge 2 days off.
I guess if you repeat it enough it will be true.
Just for a change of subject I want to mention Grit Gardner. Quitely putting together a good first season as at least a quality 4th OF – 275 BA, 350 OBP, good defense. And just to stir the pot a little – Fangraphs has him valued at 5.3 mil vs Melky at 3.3. Hey, I’m just quoting stats.
“I have pulmonary hypertension, heart failure and lupus.”
http://images.southparkstudios.....s/102a.jpg
GreenBaret – Did you watch the pregame? It was done with intent.
Would The Cervelli Banner be framed better than The Posada Banner?
GGGB
June 14th, 2009 at 11:42 pm
“Giving Posada two straight days off is the purpose.”
Girardi, Burnett, Yesnetwork. NY media all say otherwise but you know better so of course, it’s to give Jorge 2 days off.
I guess if you repeat it enough it will be true.
————————————————————
You’re using some idiot that writes a blog on YES and the NY media as examples of reliable information? The same papers that swear by the quality and integrity of Selena Roberts? Good choices.
Cash needs to be looking for bullpen help. That said, I wouldn’t trust anyone to come to NY, in the middle (hopefully) of a pennant race and do well. Yankees traded for Nady/Marte, how’d that work out? They traded for Pudge…..how’d that work out? Nothing ever works out for the Yankees the way they should…….
Rex Ryan may not be intimidated by The Patriots, but his belt buckle sure looks intimidated by his stomach.
Damn.
Maybe Mike can give him some Diet Cokes.
You people honestly believe that the Yanks are going to win 90 of the remaining games with Cervelli catching?
I guess we know who is playing Santa for the next Jets Christmas party
I don’t think the Yanks will match the need or the talent that will be required to give up to get a guy like Street. The Angels might. They have the talent, but, it comes down to it being worth the expense.
Why not?
Boston went to game 7 of the ALCS last year with Varitek. They have the best record in the AL with him.
You don’t need all-stars at every position.
Rex Ryan isn’t afraid to talk, that’s for sure. I thought that Channing Crowder was going to have to come and rough him up the other day.
When Cabrera, Gardner and Cervelli become all-stars, let me know.
GB7 -
Get over yourself, Kim Jones is a REPORTER, not an idiot. You are looking more like one as you continue to use declaritive statements that you have NO knowledge of. The stats are there, Yankee mgmt STATED it. Fight whatever you want.
No one is calling for Cervelli to catch everyday. Everyone knows Posada’s bat is superior. The discussion is about who does a better job at catching.
7.48 vs 3.81 – do the math, genius.
End of story. Tired of writing truth to oblivious fools.
From another site…Keith Hernandez was absolutely on fire, describing an ugly third inning by Joba as “like watching A ball.” Later, after Gary Sheffield questioned a called strike on the inside corner, Hernandez said “That’s the old Derek Jeter move, who never saw an inside fastball he didn’t think was a ball”
Jeter doesn’t strike me as a complainer – is that what people really think?
Aww, GGGB – you’re such a sad, angry man. Go to bed.
GGGB
June 14th, 2009 at 11:57 pm
GB7 –
Get over yourself, Kim Jones is a REPORTER, not an idiot. You are looking more like one as you continue to use declaritive statements that you have NO knowledge of. The stats are there, Yankee mgmt STATED it. Fight whatever you want.
No one is calling for Cervelli to catch everyday. Everyone knows Posada’s bat is superior. The discussion is about who does a better job at catching.
7.48 vs 3.81 – do the math, genius.
End of story. Tired of writing truth to oblivious fools.
————————————————————
I don’t care who wrote it. It’s cherry picking stats to twist a point of view. You’ve seen it done here often. Posada will produce tp win more games than Cervelli and Molina together will win defensively and offensively.
I love it, The Cervelli banner will be a close up of his eyes, Georgy’s should have ears.
GB, maybe the Yankees pitchers should start realizing that. I don’t like any of their attitudes……
GB, maybe the Yankees pitchers should start realizing that. I don’t like any of their attitudes……
Wow. – Did I hurt your feelings?
sad angry?? LOL.
Yes. You wound me, GGGB.
“cashman himself mishandled wang so badly he can’t hide it. the press will be all over him if wang doesn’t come back this year.”
I dont understand this way of thinking. Wang wasn’t just losing his starts, he was getting completely and utterly obliterated. He was lasting 2.2 innings AT most each time around, letting up 4-6-8 runs and completely wearing down the bullpen.
Then he goes on the DL and Phil Hughes comes up and pitches OK. Was he pitching phenomenal? Not by any means of the imagination. But certainly much better then Wang.
The idea is to WIN games now, not baby protect and throw away a game for a pitcher to get himself back to where he was.
Hughes was pitching much better then Wang and giving the team a chance to win, so they stayed with him. What is wrong with that??
Flash forward to Fenway this past week. Wang ONCE AGAIN let the game get out of hand. How is this, in anyway, Cashman or the organization’s fault.
If anything I think they were extremely nice about it all, considering. Any other pitcher in that situation is traded or DFA’d. They had respect for Wang’s past accomplishments and decided to keep him in the bullpen AND give him more starts.
He is killing us right now. And screwing with the continuity of the team.
At some point you have to forget that he is a two- time 19 game winner and deal with it accordingly. Im sorry but this is a business of winning. Its a business of “what have you done for me lately?”
AJ and Jorge
TB 8 inn 2 er
Bos 5 inn 8er (6 run lead)
LA 7 inn 4 er
Tex 7 inn 3 er
Bos 2.2 inn 5 er
Seems to me that AJ’s problem this year is with Boston not Jorge.
Pete,
Just thought I’d mention that Springsteen just sat in with Phish at Bonnaroo tonight. They played Mustang Sally, Bobby Jean, and Glory Days.
I haven’t heard it yet, but I’m sure it was awesome. I’m not the biggest fan of Bruce, but I can’t complain about one of the best bands on the planet playing with one of the best singer/songwriters on the planet.
FIYAH!
So, you’re saying a catcher’s defensive worth is based on a pitching staff’s era ??? Well tell that to the HOF….Carlton Fiske’s never had a good staff both in Boston as well as Chicago…The same holds true for Johnny Bench’s Cinn. Reds staff…..I’m certain there’s many more examples that prove your theory incorredt…..
Betsy
June 15th, 2009 at 12:04 am
GB, maybe the Yankees pitchers should start realizing that. I don’t like any of their attitudes……
————————————————————
If the pitchers throw the ball in the strike zone that doesn’t hang like a Japanese lantern, they’ll get outs. Unless a pitcher actually hates the catcher, maybe there’s an issue. Seems as though Rivera and Pettitte, Clemens, Cone and Orlando Hernandez must have loved Posada. They won enough games with him catching.
As far as complimenting the catcher after a well pitched game, every pitcher will talk about how well they worked together. No veteran pitcher is going to trash a catcher, especially a young catcher. Cervelli and Molina have “called” their share of homers, walks and clunkers.
Uncle,
The Tampa game was Molina
S.A.-
Link for the Bruney video?
Eliand’s explanation that the ballpark is in their head and that’s why they can’t throw strikes is sooo lame
so instead of giving up solo shots, they want to give up HRs with guys on base?
Posada’s CERA over his career is just as good as those of his backups over that time. Did he suddenly forget how to call a game?
Amazing how smart Norm Sherry and John Roseboro were as long as they were catching Koufax, Drysdale, Podres and Osteen.
Sort of like pitching coaches. Ray Miller and Leo Mazzone where geniuses as long as the were instructing Palmer, Martinez, McNalley, Cuellar, McGregor and Flannery or Maddux, Smoltz and Glavine. No so much when those guys were gone and Miller and Mazzone had to ibstruct others.
Eric sorry my bad
Buddy:
Here is a link:
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/articl.....p;c_id=mlb
“Uncle,
The Tampa game was Molina”
He had PG/no hitter stuff that night. I knew it wasn’t Georgy, didn’t want to upset GB7.
I am really pleased that this discussion on Posada came up and people are thinking about game calling as a skill. This is not something that you can cite as stats other than pitcher’s ERAs. But consider this: Varitek is half the offensive player Posada is yet Boston who rightly are respected as knowledgeable continue to resign him. Why would they do that? He’s not that much better defensively than Posada. There was an article that cited that the pitcher, pitching coach and Posada sat down and broke down the pitching plan and then Posada would call pitches as if he was hitting and what he would expect. This is not good. This is ignoring compiled information for gut feeling. There is a situation brewing and Posada will have to deal with it. If he lets his ego get in the way this could prove ugly.
I spent the last 40 minutes reading the game thread and a ittle of this thread and I can see that Posada’s catching is still the main topic de jour. AJ finally rights his ship and people think its because Cervelli was catching. oy.
I have tried to use reason and statistics to point out how Posada is not the reason why the Yankees give up runs. But, due to circumstantial evidence the jury of LoHud still feels he is a horrible catcher. I give up.
If people don’t want to listen to the opinion of a guy who raised the TOP drafted catcher in this years draft (SJ44) or a retired catcher (randy l.) then a little old thing like logic and facts will not sway you.
It’s also funny how a very Mets fan who calls up the WFAN and has heard this ridiculous debate all say the same thing….ALL TAKE HIM ON MY TEAM! Yeah, no kidding.
GB 7
That was an oops on Hernandez, he and Posada came to blows over game calling. Check your famous memory.
Bo, the Red Sox resigned Varitek because there was no one else. It was a last resort type thing.
Hard to believe that the Yanks have won an average of 96 games a year for the last 10 years with such a dim witted catcher like Posada.
Thnx S.A.!
Someone posted this a while ago:
2007: +.01
Team ERA- 4.49
Posada CERA- 4.50
2006: -.04
Team ERA- 4.41
Posada CERA- 4.37
2005: +.15
Team ERA- 4.52
Posada CERA- 4.67
2004: -.04
Team ERA- 4.69
Posada CERA- 4.65
2003: +.11
Team ERA- 4.02
Posada CERA- 4.13
2002: -.07
Team ERA- 3.87
Posada CERA- 3.80
The only years Posada’s CERA was significantly above the team ERA was in 2003 and 2005. In 2005, Randy Johnson was the Yankees best pitcher and Posada didn’t catch him. If you take out Johnson’s stats, the team ERA is 4.65 compared to Posada’s 4.67 CERA. Not significant.
In 2003, Posada’s CERA was .11 higher than the team ERA. I’m not sure why that would be. At the same time, you could look at Jason Varitek’s CERA for 2005. He’s supposed to be one of the best game callers in baseball and his CERA that year was 5.03, much higher than the team ERA of 4.74.
http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com/?p=3621
Bo knows
June 15th, 2009 at 12:29 am
GB 7
That was an oops on Hernandez, he and Posada came to blows over game calling. Check your famous memory.
————————————————————
No, Bo (sorry for the rhyme), I didn’t forget their fights, arguements and “discussions”, but I don’t forget how well he pitched with Posada catching, either.
Both Johnny Bench and Carlton Fisk were not known for their game calling skills. Now Jerry Grote of the Mets, there was a classic catcher.
I also remember Posada telling not to throw that eephus pitch to Alex Rodriguez and Rodriguez put dents in the ambulance parked past the bullpen.
I also remember Posada telling ***Hernandez***
GB, I totally agree. Just to clarify, I have no problem with AJ complimenting Cervelli…….just didn’t like the way he complimented him. As far as I’m concerned, it’s up to the pitchers to execute….if they don’t, it’s on them. It’s up to them to throw the pitches they want to throw. If the team makes the playoffs, Jorge is catching……so they’d better darn well get used to him.
Bo, it’s not hard for a catcher to look good when you’re catching Seaver, Koosman, Matlack, Gentry and McGraw.
Try looking smart being the Wahington Nats catcher.
***Washington***
Mo, do you know why it fluctuated from year to year? Becaue CERA is completely circumstantial. The amount a catcher affects a pitcher from throwing strikes and located is extremely minimal.
Sure, he might frame a pitch really well or have a great relationship with an umpire and get a few borderline calls or even calm a pitcher down when he needs to, but he has no control over a pitcher making his pitches.
When MLB comes up with a stat that shows how many pitches go for a hit that were thrown where they were supposed to be as called by the catcher then you will know.
We all know that it’s impossible to tell.
anyone else see Arod grab his hip on fridays game? it happened when cano was on his back after celebrating his “pop up” walk off. just thought id throw it out in case anyone saw it
that elston howard could sure catch one heck of a game.
Betsy
June 15th, 2009 at 12:46 am
GB, I totally agree. Just to clarify, I have no problem with AJ complimenting Cervelli…….just didn’t like the way he complimented him. As far as I’m concerned, it’s up to the pitchers to execute….if they don’t, it’s on them. It’s up to them to throw the pitches they want to throw. If the team makes the playoffs, Jorge is catching……so they’d better darn well get used to him.
————————————————————
Burnett’s no country bumpkin. He knows that giving his catcher praise after a game like that only helps the team. Sabathia does the same thing. It has to be a great confiedense boost for a rookie. A young Posada got it all the time from Pettitte, Clemens, wells and Cone. Brown, Mussina and Johnson never complimented anyone. Quick to point fingers though. I doubt that Posada loses much sleep over it. He wouldn’t help Cervelli out if it was a concern. Posada and Jeter and most of the others care about one thing…wins.
Does anyone realize how badly we tanked last year after we lost Posada to shoulder surgery or the little run we went on in June of last year was right after Posada..his mean and nasty self…ripped the team for being ok with losing?
Jim, I heard a few people mention that..Right after Cano jumped on him right? I hope we can get him at 100% this year but that’s probably wishful thinking.
Wow.
June 14th, 2009 at 11:59 pm
From another site…Keith Hernandez was absolutely on fire, describing an ugly third inning by Joba as “like watching A ball.” Later, after Gary Sheffield questioned a called strike on the inside corner, Hernandez said “That’s the old Derek Jeter move, who never saw an inside fastball he didn’t think was a ball”
Jeter doesn’t strike me as a complainer – is that what people really think?
——————————————————-
Hernandez is a coke head watching Santana pitch today was like watching a ball. The mets drop pop ups, they miss touching third base and they dont slide into bases. All Keith says is “Oh No”
DB
June 15th, 2009 at 12:47 am
Mo, do you know why it fluctuated from year to year? Becaue CERA is completely circumstantial. The amount a catcher affects a pitcher from throwing strikes and located is extremely minimal.
Sure, he might frame a pitch really well or have a great relationship with an umpire and get a few borderline calls or even calm a pitcher down when he needs to, but he has no control over a pitcher making his pitches.
When MLB comes up with a stat that shows how many pitches go for a hit that were thrown where they were supposed to be as called by the catcher then you will know.
We all know that it’s impossible to tell.
————————————————————
Today’s RBI single by Cervelli is a perfect example. A nearly perfect pitch that he should never have touched or at least gotten it to the 2nd basema The other was the hit to Jeter that was about 8 inches off the plate and down that ended up on a line drive single.
I would probably weigh in on Posada as a bad catcher – great player, bad catcher. I have spent a lot of time yelling at Posada on TV. Talk about conflict. We saw what the Yankees did without Posada last year. A great hitter at the Catcher’s position is very valuable but Jorgy don’t go to the Hall of Fame for his catching skills. They are below average. From the late set up, blocking pitches, framing etc, etc. Cervelli could use some time at AAA but he is better than Molina already. Molina is slow behind the plate, Cervelli is cat quick. But I don’t understand the Posada-Cervelli or Melky-Gardner war. They all play for the Yankees, this is great. But it’s about time people appreciated the value of catching skills and knowledge not catchers that played bat with average catching skills and big egos.
There might be a discussion if Posada was Piazza bad, but, that’s not the case.
I suspect that, given sufficient determination and ingenuity, an intrepid reporter could get Mike Mussina to open up on the subject of Posada. That is an analysis I would like to hear.
why the heck is a guy with arm problems throwing 111 pitches in a 15-0 game??
yeah, im not making excuses for him, but people have to realize if something like cano half way on his back, then he is hurting. just his presence means a ton in that lineup
GB 7
Yes, but they didn’t start being Seaver, Koosman etc. That’s where Grote was so valuable. He was able to develop them. Where is Randy I now that I need him? Catchers develop pitchers not pitching coaches. Coaches talk mechanics, catchers talk in game pitching. Cervelli is already good on sequence of pitches and he’s a young kid, he’s going to get better. Mariano goes up and down the strike zone to change the angle. How come none of the other pitchers do? When was the last time you saw a NY pitcher go up the ladder, etc.
Who has arm problems? Bite your tongue!
I guess we shouldn’t read too much into AJ’s comments. Whenever a pitcher has a good game, they compliment the catcher.
But I don’t see any problem letting Cervelli or Jose catch AJ once in a while since both of them are in synch with AJ. Why make it any harder?
agree with leo… ur up by a ton, why not get him out. cannot understand that move.
Bo Knows,
The last time a pitcher went north/south/east/west?
With Hosey.
Posada is worthless as a catcher. He is a horrible game caller, that is the most important part of being a catcher. I dont care that he has a weak throwing arm or is slow. Pitchers hate throwing to Posada.
Posada needs to platoon with Matsui as the DH and recall Kevin Cash as the backup catcher.
Bo Knows…I’ve watched Hughes do it quite alot this season…..Watch how he gets his K’s now…He’ll go upstairs and go 2-2 and then goes down and away…I noticed this since the Baltimore disaster when 4 times he had 0-2 counts and lost the out…….
Bo, that’s just it, Seaver was ROY and won 16, Koosman won 19 in his rookie year then next year. Still can’t understand how Koosman wasn’t voted the ‘68 ROY over Bench.
m: comments like the 1:22 suggest you want to tangle more than comments like 1:20 suggest you don’t.
Wang is someone who should throw a high fastball to change the eye level of the hitter. Because all he throws is a sinkers and sliders hitters.
Hey, this is a great post and you have an excellent blog here. This is a great info center on the Yankees for my forum http://www.nysportscrunch.com. We are trying to connect all New York sports fans.
Nice win, but I need to see more
They better win again tomorrow. The Nationals STINK. I want a sweep.
Dr. Cox June 15th, 2009 at 12:10 am
“cashman himself mishandled wang so badly he can’t hide it. the press will be all over him if wang doesn’t come back this year.”
I dont understand this way of thinking. Wang wasn’t just losing his starts, he was getting completely and utterly obliterated. He was lasting 2.2 innings AT most each time around, letting up 4-6-8 runs and completely wearing down the bullpen.
Then he goes on the DL and Phil Hughes comes up and pitches OK. Was he pitching phenomenal? Not by any means of the imagination. But certainly much better then Wang.
The idea is to WIN games now, not baby protect and throw away a game for a pitcher to get himself back to where he was.
Hughes was pitching much better then Wang and giving the team a chance to win, so they stayed with him. What is wrong with that??
Flash forward to Fenway this past week. Wang ONCE AGAIN let the game get out of hand. How is this, in anyway, Cashman or the organization’s fault.
If anything I think they were extremely nice about it all, considering. Any other pitcher in that situation is traded or DFA’d. They had respect for Wang’s past accomplishments and decided to keep him in the bullpen AND give him more starts.
He is killing us right now. And screwing with the continuity of the team.
At some point you have to forget that he is a two- time 19 game winner and deal with it accordingly. Im sorry but this is a business of winning. Its a business of “what have you done for me lately?”
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That’s a dumb way to view this situation with Wang.
It’s absolutely in the Yanks’ best interest to get Wang pitching like vintage Wang because the reward is huge.
Wang pitching like vintage Wang makes this a much better team and kills two birds with one stone because he gives this team length when he’s right (which helps out the bullpen significantly) but it also adds another good arm in the pen in Hughes to shore up a weakness.
Getting Wang back to pitching the way he’s supposed to pitch could be the difference in this team getting to the postseason or not – perhaps the difference between winning the division or winning the wildcard.
They need Wang back because he makes this team a lot better. It makes no sense to toss him aside since he’s such a valuable commodity when he’s pitching like he did from 2006 – 2008.
No win for the Bombers tomorrow, I can guarantee it.
Nick,
Nobody can deny that Posada is worth his weight in gold with a bat.
But nobody can deny that Jose is very good behind the plate. I base some of what I say on what the guys in the YES booth say. They say pitchers love Jose behind the plate. They point out how well he frames pitches, varies the look, etc.
I don’t pull this stuff out of the air because I don’t like Jorge. I love Hip, Hip, Jorge!
So, no, I’m not calling for a replacement at all. I just want the pitchers to be happy. Because happy pitchers are better pitchers.
I’m not knocking Posada. He is who he is. But true stars continue to develop even after they’ve made it and once Posada was established he remained static. Why did Jeter take agility training before last year and not sooner. These guys, justifiably, come with monster egos. Posada has a great defensive catcher, Pena, sitting on the bench, one of the best I’ve ever seen, Girardi was no slouch. Why doesn’t he tap the knowledge that’s right there. Next time there are two strikes on a hitter on high fastballs watch where Jorge sets up. A lot of that nibbling is by Posada, he’s trying to trick hitters. I could go on but I’m not trying to convince anybody,
Bo knows June 15th, 2009 at 1:37 am
I’m not knocking Posada. He is who he is. But true stars continue to develop even after they’ve made it and once Posada was established he remained static. Why did Jeter take agility training before last year and not sooner. These guys, justifiably, come with monster egos. Posada has a great defensive catcher, Pena, sitting on the bench, one of the best I’ve ever seen, Girardi was no slouch. Why doesn’t he tap the knowledge that’s right there. Next time there are two strikes on a hitter on high fastballs watch where Jorge sets up. A lot of that nibbling is by Posada, he’s trying to trick hitters. I could go on but I’m not trying to convince anybody,
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It’s amazing how this team won three rings and five pennants with Posada as the starting catcher.
All the blame on Posada is extremely misguided.
m: I can’t discuss the merits of the arguments tonight because of a previous promise, just that your two posts presented a ‘peacemaker vs. provacateur’ dichotomy that was curious.
Also: have you watched each game in its entirety since Molina was injured to allow you to make a statement that the “last time a pitcher went north/south/east/west” was when he was catching?
Nick,
No. That was obviously a hyperbolic joke thingy to a legitimate rhetorical question.
I see.
Pat M
Very true on Phil. But if I’m any good as a hitter I’m waiting on that low and away one. Didn’t Manny say he’d purposely miss a pitch setting it up for later in a game. If Ortiz can’t catch up to the high hard one, why would you go to a slider away? Look at today’s game. The bottom of the order won it. I would hazard a guess that they didn’t overswing. The other day the Yankees had six hits, 4 HRs and 2 singles. You get losing streaks that way. Junkballers eat the Yankees alive, there’s a reason for that.
By the way, Cervelli must be a genius – he got AJ to throw a change up today.
Mel, do you think that Randy Johnson, Kevin Brown, Mike Mussina, Nolan Ryan, Steve Carlton and Bob Gibson would have been 300-400 game winners if the had been happier?
Nick,
What did you promise and who was it to? Was it trisha?
I saw some jawing, but I didn’t read the whole thread…Were there fireworks?
I’m pretty sure that the reason Burnett working on his changeup had a lot to do with a 4th inning 13 run lead instead of a 3 run lead or instead of a 4th inning 6 run lead at Fenway.
GB7,
Yes! Definitely. Especially moose.
The yankees brought in new pitchers and they cant stand working with Posada. David Cone in his yes network chat said Girardi was his favorite catcher to throw and was the quickest thinking catcher he ever throwed to. I think when Posada is catching Girardi should call the game from the bench, but he wont do that because it will hurt Posada’s ego.
Burnett has pitched great to Molina/Cash/Cervelli, CC has pitched great with Cervelli. They both haven’t clicked with Posada. Also, Posada gets blame too for Joba’s terrible outing on Friday they were both on different pages it was embarrasing to watch.
Hopefully Giardi lets Cevelli catch Wang start if this is going to be a do or die start for Wang please have the better game caller behind the plate.
I don’t know what the story with AJ’s changeup is.
But there’s got to be a reason. And I don’t think it’s because he’s a chicken**** like many here love to accuse him of.
Smurfette just emailed that she thinks you’re an idiot.
Also enough with Posada offense will make up for his bad defense. When Posada is catching the ERA of the staff is a whole 2 runs bigger. Posada offense will no make up 2 runs every game.
m
June 15th, 2009 at 1:54 am
GB7,
Yes! Definitely. Especially moose.
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Ryan was only miserable on his game day. The rest were just miserable every day.
m: I made a unilateral offer to not discuss the particular merits of this or other baseball issues that she and I have disagreed about for the rest of the… either game or day. I’m thinking day.
Or I think that’s what I offered, now I can’t remember exactly what I said or how I said it.
No fireworks during that part of the discussion. I was hoping to get a little closure on some earlier comments, but it was not to be.
If it was game or day, you’re in the clear. We go by EST here.
GB7, You are so damn funny !!!!!
Smurfette comment is a classic
DT LA is burned down
That’s why I post very little overall. The more I try to explain a point of view, the more I fail to communicate. That drives me.. Jeter has been a below average defensive SS all his career, at times the worst in the Majors, his bat made up for it, the Yankees won pennants and your point is? When it comes to the post season ie quality teams, you can stop offense, you can’t stop defense, Philly says hello. Any sport you start with defense. Last year’s team was pitiful defensively and getting older. They replaced Giambi with Teix, great. They need to revamp the whole OF next year. The Yankees are competing with Boston who have half their payroll and a Penny for sale. They have a top of the line pitching staff, pitching in a wind tunnel and the stars are older. We need a large amount of luck this year.
The “Yankee Stadium is a wind tunnel” BS is just that. Last time I looked, Bartlett, Mauer and Zobrisk don’t play here and they all reached career highes with less than two at bats. They all have had at least 5 years to have more than that. Hill and Kinsler are within 3 of their career highs. Adrian Gonzalez has 22 in an airport. That’s almosy 60 over a season. Check the balls and see if they say Titleist or Top Flite. Better yet, check the pitchers. Scoring is up everywhere and so are home runs. The shocking part is who’s hitting them.
I agree that the baseballs are responsible for some of the increase. However, the Trost foundation built a boondogle hotel. That is true also. I haven’t seen so much backtracking since Ferdinand the bull got into a scrap. As Cashman kept saying on the interview “Check with Lonn Trost on that issue” re stadium. Anway midnight’s gone it’s pumpkin time.
So it seems this year when Posada catches, if a pitcher coughs up a hit it’s Posada’s fault. Oh, ok I get it. It has nothing to do with anything other than that. A whole two runs per game are directly Posada’s fault. Yeah, that makes perfect sense. Posada is a moron, he doesn’t know how to call a game or frame pitches. 15 years in the majors as an all-star catcher hasn’t taught him anything. He’s too proud and thinks he knows it all. Does that about sum it up? Ridiculous.
As Bo knowa pointed out, Posada’s CERA has been both higher and lower than his replacement over the years. There is nothing wrong with the way he calls a game. Don’t take this years stats and tell me he is all of a sudden brain dead and forgot how to call a game.
GB, actually I seen a study done on RAB that superimposed the dimensions of the old and new stadium and the difference was startling. If you further superimpose the homers hit out so far there were 20 homers that would have not made it. That was a month ago. ARod’s homer and that light hitting guy the Mets have who hit one out yesterday definetely would not have been homers.
We now have a band box. But, all things being equal, we still have to hit more than the opposition.
Btw, don’t you find it ironic that Eiland’s admission that the pitchers don’t want to throw strikes because of the park came right after Joba’s start when he couldn’t find the plate and was not in sync with Posada? But, I forgot, Joba was erratic because of Posada. How silly of me.
Accuweather estimates that there have been 20 more homers. They have no way of knowing since they don’t have accurate measurements of each home run. They’re guessing…just like those that are guessing that the poor pitching is because of Posada’s pitch calling. Awesome scientific study. Accuweather?
GB:
“The “Yankee Stadium is a wind tunnel” BS is just that. Last time I looked, Bartlett, Mauer and Zobrisk don’t play here and they all reached career highes with less than two at bats. They all have had at least 5 years to have more than that. Hill and Kinsler are within 3 of their career highs. Adrian Gonzalez has 22 in an airport. That’s almosy 60 over a season. Check the balls and see if they say Titleist or Top Flite. Better yet, check the pitchers. Scoring is up everywhere and so are home runs. The shocking part is who’s hitting them.”
I’ve been thinking the same thing all year. Zobrist is a prime example. And Mauer, who missed all of April with injury and in a month and a half has his career high in homers? I think the balls have been juiced for a long time now, the bats have something to do with it too and the fact that ballparks are smaller, for the most part. Don’t get me wrong, Mauer’s a great hitter and some guys just figure out how to hit with power over time. But Mauer’s hitting a lot of his to the opposite field. These are line drives that are going out too. The ball just seems to be carrying farther.
Papa Smurf: “Girardi was his favorite catcher to throw and was the quickest thinking catcher he ever throwed to.”
If you want to make this stupid argument, that’s your business, but for God’s sake, “throwed to”?
More from Papa Smurf: “Posada is worthless as a catcher. He is a horrible game caller, that is the most important part of being a catcher. I dont care that he has a weak throwing arm or is slow. Pitchers hate throwing to Posada.”
What, do you have lunch with Chamberlain? Get your tattoos done at the same place as A.J. Burnett? You “know” so much. Where does this knowledge come from? The same place you got the tidbit about Posada’s “weak throwing arm,” which has produced a .319 caught stealing rate so far this year, which, if he had played enough games to qualify would place him 6th among all MLB catchers? He’s “worthless” as a catcher, the guy who world-series winning pitchers loved pitching to and still rave about, yet you know better than them? I don’t know why I even bother responding to self-aggrandizing morons who make idiotic statements like this. At least some of the people making this argument have the brains to say, “I believe certain pitchers don’t like throwing to him” or something like that. But guys like you, who claim with absolute certainty things like “Posada has a weak arm” and “Posada is worthless as a catcher”…
i’d be willing to be that what you know about catching could be squeezed into a thimble. Posada poops out more catching knowledge every day than you’ll ever acquire in your entire life. So do yourself a favor and at least allow the possibility that maybe, just maybe, an all-star catcher like Posada, and Joe Girardi — who you have the stupidity to cite as a catcher superior to Posada, forgetting somehow that he’s the manager who’s actually writing Posada’s name in the lineup — might just know a little bit more than you do, Papa Smurf. Otherwise, you just expose yourself as a clown who knows nothing about what he claims to know everything.