Today in The Journal News
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Jun 17, 2009 
Print This Post
| 
Email This Post
The Yankees dodged what would have been an embarrassing loss as Robinson Cano’s double helped beat the Nationals 5-3 last night.
Chien-Ming Wang had a big day yesterday and hopes to have a big night tonight. This notebook also has updates on Brian Bruney, Jose Veras and Slade Heathcott.
Pete,
Slade Heathcott has to be bigger than Pena. He’s at least 6 feet.
My Heathcott/Pena comment was based on what Pete said yesterday here after seeing Heathcott.
In other news, the shocking development that Sammy Sosa apparently took PEDs. Coming up: the sky is blue and water is wet.
Really rooting for Wang tonight.
That kid has gotten it from both ends (team and agent mistakes), it would be nice to see him have a good performance tonight.
Ellen, Sosa took PEDs??? Really??? Hell, I knew that back in the ’90s. It’s pretty funny how everyone, (baseball, it’s so called commish, the media, etc.), feigned ignorance about PEDs at the time, and then became totally outraged when they “learned of it” ten years later. Meanwhile, I, an average joe with no inside info, am sitting on my couch watching this home run race and thinking to myself, “What the hell are they on, and when are they joining the pro wrestling circuit?”
Sosa, you’re a scum.
“Really rooting for Wang tonight.
That kid has gotten it from both ends (team and agent mistakes), it would be nice to see him have a good performance tonight.”
And because he carried the torch as the ace the last 3 years with a ton of class. If the Yankees get him going, it would be almost impossible to keep them out of post season.
has cervelli ever caught wang & should he tonight just for the sake of exhausting every option?
In spite of CMW’s performance in Fenway, I saw some encouraging things from him. 95 MPH, good sink on the sinker, pitching out of bases loaded allowing 1 run and K’ing Youk and Bay (I think) back to back. He couldn’t find the stike zone but he kept missing in the same place, indicating a fixable problem, as opposed to missing all over the place. I think CMW will give the NYY 4 or 5 good innings, giving up a couple of runs. I don’t expect him to go deep into the game since he hasn’t pitched much. PH will probably follow CMW. I’m a big fan of PH, his time will come. But the NYY won’t win without CMW.
Good article on the Wang situation. I really hope he does well tonight.
http://www.nypost.com/seven/06.....038;page=1
bru June 17th, 2009 at 8:54 am
has cervelli ever caught wang & should he tonight just for the sake of exhausting every option?
*******
Who caught Wangs two 19 win season?
it would be great if wang pitched well after having a new baby.
the question is what do you do with him if he doesn’t?
Thanks for posting the link, Scorpio. Wow, how ways have the Yankees mishandled the Wang situation?
When there are so few good SPs around, why are they so eager to dump on him and perhaps dump him as a SP?
jennifer
i understand that but when nothing is working & wang is on the verge of of going to the pen,getting released,traded,going on the dl or whatever else might happen it can’t hurt to try something different.
posada is just about done as a catcher because we need to maximize his offense & keep him off the dl.
that is why i believe we should catch posada much less not because he can’t do a good job.
Cervelli caught Wang on the June 4th vs. the Texas Rangers. Wang went 4.2IP 7H 5R 5ER 1BB 5SO.
Anyways, I’m nervous for Wang and I am really hoping/rooting for the best from him tonight. The Yankees need to have Wang pitching like Wang again
Oh Bru. So misguided.
at some point it has to be on wang.
he needs to pitch well.
we can’t afford to have him self destruct by the 3rd or 4th inning & having to pull off miracles to come from behind.
we are more than a third through the season.
the yankees have to go with their best options & up to this point it is hughes.
According to an article I read in the Star Ledger today, Girardi said they will be looking at “everything” and they will not rush into a decision after tonight’s game. He said, “It’s not so much the numbers, but the numbers are important, obviously. We’re going to look at numbers, we’re going to look at his pitches, his strikes – we’re going to look at all of it before we run and make a decision too quickly.”
To me, that’s encouraging. To me, it means CMW doesn’t have to worry about being perfect. I would think, though, he’s got to go more than 3 or even 4 innings. I’m keeping my fingers crossed for into the 6th.
Go Wanger. I love this guy and I hope he can piece together a good start today.
It’s funny how having a baby is good luck in Taiwanese culture. What kind of luck is it here? Rotten?
Wow.
June 17th, 2009 at 9:10 am
Oh Bru. So misguided
———————————————————–
does anybody pay attention?
i didn’t think so.
i asked a simple question if cervelli ever caught wang.
i did not know if he did or the results & am not saying that the results would be better for any pitcher if cervelli caught.
i am saying that if cervelli did not catch him up to this point & every other attempt failed to get wang back on track then i would have cervelli catch him so in our minds there would be no doubt.
you are the misguided one.
Good lord, Posada is not “almost done” as a catcher.
This is when blogs, talk radio and 24/7 info go off the rails.
Francisco Cervelli is not a better catcher than Jorge Posada. He’s not. He’s a kid who has done very well as a backup when Molina went down. That’s it.
He’s not going to be the starting catcher next year. The team isn’t better with him behind the plate, and he isn’t the solution to pitchers who can’t throw strikes.
Honestly, only Yankee fans can want to bench a borderline HOF catcher for a career backup. This fan base has really become Pre-2004 Red Sox fans in its panic and foolishness.
Wang’s problem is, he had a SERIOUS foot injury. Liz Franc fractures have ended careers. The Yankees also messed up his rehab and messed up by bringing him back too soon. He also had an agent who didn’t get involved enough to keep the Yankees from messing up Wang and that also hurt him.
Combine all of that, with his loss of confidence, and you have one messed up pitcher.
None of that is on Jorge Posada.
Some of you either have to learn more about baseball or figure out a way to find new scapegoats because the one’s you find dont hold up under logical review of their work.
Did someone mention Sosa using PEDs? What’s next? We find out he was using a corked bat? Oh wait…
That’s pretty neat that Cano went 4-4 after promising the school kids at PS 55 that he’s have a big day as long as they promised to improve. That’s twice this year that a Yankee player made a public pledge to kids (Gardner said he’d hit a HR for a kid in the hospital). I say that they do this more often!
Wang’s primarily a sinker ball pitcher. What difference would Cervelli make? It’s not as if Posada’s the reason Wang has had little arm strength, a messed up arm slot, weak hips, or a long stride.
Wang has always been “messed up” in big situations. He could never successfully handle the pressure of pitching with runners on base and he choked on his own vomit during the postseason vs Cleveland, humiliating the whole city with his pitiful performance.
He’s just not that good. He can never get a strikeout when needed and depends way too much on luck in having hard hit balls go right at a fielder.
Good riddance to the crybaby.
SJ44
posada is 37 yrs old,38 soon.
wether you wan’t to believe it or not he is almost done as a catcher.
i am not saying cervelli is a better option.
what i am saying is that unless posada is a great catcher going forward & to possibly maximize his offense & have him play more over the last few years of his contract i would dh him next year if possible.
i am also not suggesting benching posada.
I stand by my assertion…Oh Bru. So misguided.
Bru,
Posada didn’t start catching fulltime until he was 27 years old in the big leagues. His body is not as beat up as other guys at similar stages in their careers because he has not been a catcher throughout his career.
He can catch another 2 years easily if he stays healthy. It may be closer to 100 games rather than 120 but, he is still MORE than good enough to hold his own at the position.
Fact is, he’s the second best catcher in the AL behind Joe Mauer right now. He already is a GREAT catcher.
You don’t make him a DH for a career backup with less than 150 major league AB’s.
SJ,
Don’t you know, Panic and overreaction is the new Yankee way.
SJ you are soooo right about Jorge. What he needs to do is avoid catching more than four days in a row. If Cervelli can make AJ Burnett happy he can start every fifth game and maybe sub in ocassionally elsewherre.
NExt two years my guess is it’s Jorge for about 2/3 of the starts (108) and Cervelli for the rest. Could be that Cervelli catches Wang and Burnett while Jorge backs up for CC, Joba and Hughes. It’ll work out.
As for DH next year, I think it will be Damon more than anyone else.
Go get ‘em tonight Wang…
Coach,
No question about it.
86,
This is where Girardi being a former catcher can benefit Jorge. He seems to have a good feel when to give Jorge time off.
I’ve noticed that when Jorge’s bat is a little slow, Joe will give him a day off before a day off. That gives him 2 days to get stronger.
There is no doubt in my mind, without any more serious injuries, Posada can catch another 2 years effectively. They will probably back out his games to between 100-110. However, no question he can physically handle the workload because he isn’t as beaten up by having been a catcher since he was a kid. Big, big advantage and a big reason why he received the contract he got as a FA.
I don’t understand why the idea that Cervelli share a little more time with Posada is such a controversial one? Posada has already broken down 2x in 2 years. His backup has broken down. Now the Yankees cannot leave themselves open to a 3rd time. They need to develop a young healthy option that is capable of carrying at least part of the massive load Posada carries for this team. There is no denying that Posada is a better hitter than Cervelli. What is up for debate is whether Posada’s superior bat trumps Cervelli’s superior defense. I don’t think anyone is saying that Posada should be benched in favor of Cervelli, are they? I just think that Cervelli needs to start more games to get him prepared in case Jorge goes down again and also to give Jorge a rest so he doesn’t break down again.
There is no debate about whether Posada’s bat trumps Cervelli’s glove except on this blog.
CB broke down the win shares yesterday. Posada being in the lineup over Cervelli is a +6-7 games in the Yankees favor. Its not even close.
Also, catcher is not a shared position. Jorge Posada shouldn’t have to split time with Cervelli because he’s a better player than Cervelli. Its not even in dispute, given what each guy has done, even this season.
You break in a young catcher EXACTLY how the Yankees are doing it right now. S-l-o-w-l-y. That’s how they grow and get better.
Not to fan the flames any more about Posada’s predictability but I just read this quote from Bruney in today’s Daily News:
“Zimmerman put a real tough at-bat on me,” Bruney said. “I felt like he was seeing my pitches very well. I felt like he was on everything I threw. Fortunately I got him out.”
This quote is in stark contrast to what pitchers tend to say after Cervelli starts.
SJ, do you think the yankees will make a play for Mauer after next year, or look at internal options such as Romine, Montero, Cervelli etc.
Now really, how do you read into that a problem with Posada?
Did you see the AB from Zimmerman last night. They worked him in and out and up and down and he was on everything.
How is that the catchers fault? How else do you want them to work the guy?
Ryan Zimmerman is an excellent hitter and he put together a great AB. Believe it or not, that happens in MLB every night because these guys, especially the good hitters like Zimmerman, are great players. The tops in their profession in the world.
In the end, they got him out. Posada gets no credit for that?
Part of the problem with this entire “debate” is most of you don’t have the foggiest idea what a catcher does, the dynamic between pitcher and catcher, and what goes into attacking hitters.
For example, last night, all the 10 year olds in the game thread second guessed CC’s pitch to Anderson Hernandez that resulted in the HR. Classic case of not having any idea of what you are talking about.
If you know anything about the way CC Sabathia attacks hitters, his back leg (to the hitter) slider to righthanders is his strikeout pitch. Like Mo’s cutter, it doesn’t matter if the hitter is looking for it. If he executes the pitch, the hitter has no shot because its an unhittable pitch for a RH hitter.
He actually shook off Jorge to throw that pitch. He just didn’t execute it. It happens. That’s baseball.
Yet, all the cries from the crybabies on this blog were, “Posada screwed up again”. 100% wrong.
That’s why I find this “debate” so humorous because most of the people involved in it have no idea of what they are talking about or what they should be looking for to know if there are issues. They just look at the result and try to draw conclusions. Unfortunately, you can’t do that and have an idea of whether or not there are problems.
Fans just expect fast outs and 15-0 games. Absent that, it has to be somebody’s fault. This week, its Posada, next week, it will be somebody else.
SJ44, what I like about having Cervelli in the lineup is that the Yankees are forced to play a different game without Posada’s big bat in the lineup. Yes, I agree that when the Yankees are better with Posada – when they are hitting – but I think in the long run they are a much more dangerous team when they are forced to manufacture runs and that’s what Cervelli brings to this lineup. The Yankees have been a streaky team for the past 6 years because they have relied on the 3 run HR to anchor their rallies. When the big hit doesn’t come runners get stranded. They won championships when they were a team of opportunists who scored runs even when they weren’t hitting well. 3 run home runs are few and far between against superior pitching in the playoffs. The teams that win are the ones that manufacture runs. If this lineup focuses on manufacturing runs then addition of the 3 run hr will make them the most dangerous team in baseball
I think there is a 99.9% chance Mauer stays a Twin for life. I don’t see the Twins letting him go.
Then Ghost, you like the Yankees fielding a weaker team every night. I don’t. I don’t believe you win by fielding a weaker team every night.
The whole, “the team doesn’t hit” stuff is a fallacy. They have hit for most of the year. EVERY team has rough spots over the course of the year offensively.
Also, in the post-season, you are facing the best pitchers on the best teams. Its natural the offensive production will be less.
They won championships in large part because of having a guy like Jorge Posada in the lineup. You don’t sit him for a AA catcher with no power, no eye, and limited offensive skills.
Well, you can but, you won’t win anything.
SJ wrote:
Now really, how do you read into that a problem with Posada?
========
I’m not saying it’s a problem at all. I actually don’t think Posada is a horrible game caller. It’s just interesting that pitchers have been going out of their way to discuss how Cervelli’s game calling keeps the hitters guessing. I don’t think it’s a conspiracy it’s just something they aren’t used to with Posada. There were a lot of hard hit balls last night and the defense picked up Sabathia (and Posada) on more than one occasion. This is the major leagues and any team can beat any other on any given day but CC is supposed to be a top 5 pitcher and he was very close to getting the loss last night against the worst team in baseball…
That happens ghost. Geez, Johan Santana gave up 9 runs the other day in 3 innings. I don’t care who he was playing, that’s baseball.
Its not a video game. Every night you have to play, regardless of the competition.
Some of you read selective quotes and decide to take it to a new level.
How about this….Why don’t you guys ask Pete to ask Girardi and guys on the team if the Yankees are a better or worse team with Jorge Posada out of the lineup.
So Pete doesn’t look like a complete idiot when he asks such a dumb question, he can phrase it as something the bloggers are debating.
He will need his I-Phone to be catch to capture the laughter from guys when posed that question.
You have veteran players praising a young guy, to keep his confidence high, and folks on here take that as a slam to Posada. Amazing.
Although, I like Cervelli’s energy and presence behind the dish, he would be exposed as a weak hitter by playing him everyday. He can give the Yankees a lift by playing one or two days a week. But with 3-400 at bats I’m afraid he would be a 230-240 hitter.
SJ, you know what I would love Pete to ask Girardi? If he thinks that the selflessness and lack of ego that he showed in the late nineties was part of the reason why the Yankees didn’t lose a step when the transition was made from himself to Posada behind the plate in 2000 – and does he feel the Yankees would benefit from that same kind of selflessness now from Posada as his career winds down.
Why should Jorge give up his job when he’s the better player? That doesn’t make any sense at all.
He is the second best catcher in the AL and you want him to give up his job to Francisco Cervelli. Amazing.
One last point on this…..
Francisco Cervelli is not the future catcher of the Yankees. That role belongs to Jesus Montero.
Guess who spent a lot of ST working with Montero this year? Jorge Posada.
SJ, where did I say I want Posada to give up his job to Cervelli? You are taking other’s words and putting them in my mouth. I still think that Posada should be the ever day catcher I just believe that Cervelli has played himself into sharing more time than a guy who catches when Jorge needs a rest. I think the Yankees would be foolish to depend so much on a 38 year old catcher who has broken down 2x in 2 years. Cervelli needs to be groomed.
As far as Montero is concerned – the Yankees history is full of “can’t miss” prospects that can’t make it on the ML level. Cervelli is doing the job right now, and what’s more important is that his style of play complements Girardi’s strength as a manager – and the reason he was brought here. Montero is at best 2 years away. A lot can happen to Jorge in 2 years and the Yankees can ill afford to have rent-a-catcher until Monetero is ready.
Baseball Prospectus had a very telling analysis of AJ Burnett today:
“A.J. Burnett was supposed to avoid being a victim of Yankee Stadium v2.0, but that was before he stopped inducing significantly more grounders than fly balls. This year has seen Burnett’s G/F drop to its lowest point since 2002, and to go along with that he has also stopped getting hitters to pop up on fly balls. Sure, it doesn’t help that he’s faced the stiffest competition in the league according to this stat report, but at the same time, Burnett’s not doing himself any favors by handing out free passes to 4.6 hitters per nine. Combine that with the homer rate, and it’s easy to see why Burnett hasn’t had an easy time of it for his new team. I’m not so sure Burnett is going to have a serious rebound during this season, as he’s fooling fewer hitters—his strikeouts have dropped by over one full K per nine, and opponents are swinging at fewer pitches out of the zone while making more contact. Getting his walk rates back under control would be a good first step, but as it is he has actually been a little lucky, as his FIP is over a half-run higher than his ERA; improvement would move him from the level of a 5.00 ERA pitcher down to his current level.”
One of the best parts of AJ’s game in the past was his ability to induce ground balls. That’s not happening right now. When he’s right hitters don’t get any lift of him and he starts inducing ground balls at rates close to Wang (when he’s right…) And AJ’s striking out fewer guys while walking more of them.
AJ’s got to turn it around. He and Wang are the two most important guys on the team right now. Alex will start to hit. I think the bull pen can work itself out.
But if AJ and Wang aren’t firing on all cylinders the team is handicapped in an absurdly competitive division.
Jorge 60-67 percent of the time is about right and that remain the case for two more seasons. I love what Cervelli brings to the field and I suspect he will be the # 2 guy for the next two seasons.
No question AJ has been less than expected, but that last start was a good one so maybe he’s ready to get on a run. CC was great last night except for one sloppy slider. Bruney is back, so all that’s left is a strong outing from the new proud papa. Good team to try and have it against, too!
Is anyone concerned that CC almost lost the game to this 262,avg ,nothing team,20 games out of 1st in their division?
Last wee he lost to Brad Penny,another wannabe.
*I hope Wang pitches great* ,the Yankees need it.If not,and JOE leaves him in,giving up a lot of runs,that cause a loss,this will be a huge embarrassment to the Yankees.
Joe has a tendency to leave a pitcher in way too long after he gives up runs,or load the bases when the pitch count is high.
*It was great when he pulled CC,last night,his pitch count* *was over 100,and he walked the person* after throwing 7 o8 pitches.
*Last week he wrestled with Pedroia (10) pitches* , before giving up the walk,which led to the win. *He was at 123* pitches when *Joe finally pulled him*.
Why didnt ARod try and steal when Cano was up to get rid of the double play. i realize he didnt want to try when Cano was 0-2 but after it was 2-2 he had an opportunity to go on the pitch when Cano hit into the dp. ARod stole 3 bases in the last week or two so why not here. oh well. dipper nyc