Bernie Williams tour dates
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Jul 07, 2009 
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If you’re interested in seeing Bernie Williams, here is where he will be playing in the fall:
Sept. 25: Westbury, N.Y. (Theater at Westbury)
Oct. 6: Albany, N.Y. (Hart Theater)
Oct. 9: Morristown, N.J. (The Community Theater at Mayo PAC)
Oct. 10: Ridgefield, Conn. (Ridgefield Playhouse)
Oct. 17: Avalon, Calif. (Avalon Casino Ballroom)
Contact the venues for ticket information.
For more in Bernie and how to get his new CD Moving Forward, go to Bernie Williams.com
Trade Idea:
Bounced this off Pete not sure what others think:
Could we trade Cano for Josh Johnson straight up? Maybe add Melancon or Robertson with him? Does Cano hold enough trade value to help bring an arm like that in? Let Pena be your 2nd baseman……we have enough offense? We need a 5th starter with Wang down, as we don’t know if and when he will be back and how effective he will be.
This is a story about the Jays “possibly” shopping Halladay. A number of teams will obviously be interested and a deal very difficult… but would you trade say a Joba and a few other prospects for him ??? Very intriguing.
The Jays mush be kicking themselves over the money they gave to Wells/Rios.
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9777314/Jays
“This is a story about the Jays “possibly” shopping Halladay. A number of teams will obviously be interested and a deal very difficult… but would you trade say a Joba and a few other prospects for him ??? Very intriguing.”
No.
“Bounced this off Pete not sure what others think:
Could we trade Cano for Josh Johnson straight up? Maybe add Melancon or Robertson with him?”
Now why would the Marlins do that.
“Could we trade Cano for Josh Johnson straight up?”
Not in a zillion years.
I would not trade Cano
I wouldn’t either but the Marlins aren’t stupid enough to make that deal. Hanley and Josh will get locked up for thier new stadium.
“Hanley and Josh will get locked up for thier new stadium.”
Ramirez already is locked up. Thru 2014 I believe.
As for Roy Halladay. Sure you sell Joba and other prospects and then Toronto builds a better younger stronger rotation. You trade for an ace for a soon to be ace. In what world is this smart. If anything if I’m Riccardi unless he’s an idiot you trade Roy to the NL.
“Ramirez already is locked up. Thru 2014 I believe.”
Yeh I know, I said him and Josh.
Halladay is a FA after 2010 right? I think the Yanks giving up the whole farm system is a terrible idea when he will be on the market in a season. Lets see what our rotation looks like then
Cano for Greike or for Cliff Lee? no go there either?
Grienke is staying put the KC FO already said that. Cliff Lee is not worth Robi Cano and they are looking for more SP in a trade, so it would take Hughes or Banuelos + Robi.
you can’t just trade cano to teams that have second baseman, for guys that are under contract or not being shopped.
then you have to figure that what team in the Al would want to send another frontline starter to the yankees?
this is not fantasy baseball you people are ridiculous.
“Cano for Greike or for Cliff Lee? no go there either?”
Cano doesn’t come close to getting a Greinke type starter.
As far as Lee goes, the Tribe is fine at 2B with Asdrubal Cabrera.
Other thing about Cano is that he makes real money now. That serves to diminsh his value.
Heyman even went 15-20 mins. on WFAN how CLE is not going to deal Lee unless they get a boatload of pitching back plus a ML ready position player. Not gonna happen.
According to Chad Jenning’s blog, Sergio Mitre is definitely pitching tonight vs. Buffalo in AAA which leaves him out of Thursday’s game.
It looks like Aceves will be the starter.
A trade will be very difficult to get done of course, I would also imagine JP Riccardi would avoid the AL at all costs. My point is if the package somehow came together, given how this is a team is built to win now, I would make the move – I wouldn’t give up Hughes/Joba, but a package with one of them sure.
I’m biased towards Hughes myself but am far from a talent scount – its a wild idea which will probably not materialize.
I can’t believe now people are trying to create a rift between Jeter and Joe because of Joe’s post-game comments. First, Bill Madden starts it (I didn’t read it – I’ve read maybe 2 articles he’s written in the last 5 years), now Brandon Tierney is picking up on it (granted, he doesn’t agree, but he thought enough of it to lead his show off with the topic). All Joe said was that it was a good play (attempting to steal 3rd with no out)IF you make it – I don’t think Joe in any way threw Jeter under the bus and I don’t think Jeter cared what Joe had to say. You know this idea of a rift is going to pick up momentum and it’s sickening (sickening because the media, led by Madden, has nothing better to do with their time than to find something negative to pick apart with the Yankees).
The Jays are not trading Halladay and if they do, they are not trading him to a team in the East.
“I would make the move – I wouldn’t give up Hughes/Joba, but a package with one of them sure.”
I wouldn’t give up either one !
WTH you think Roy Halladay is going to have better days in the future ? he’s likely on his down swing, enough of going after this. The veterans at 30 that hit FA are not worth a boatload of prospects.
“All Joe said was that it was a good play (attempting to steal 3rd with no out)IF you make it”
Seems like a backhanded way of saying it was a dumb move…which it was. Joe’s right, Jeter was wrong and both guys know it. Doubt that causes a rift though. They’re both professionals.
I am also guessing Halladay has a giant no-trade clause that would require waiving. He didn’t seem that enthralled by pitching in the new Yankee Stadium Saturday
“According to Chad Jenning’s blog, Sergio Mitre is definitely pitching tonight vs. Buffalo in AAA which leaves him out of Thursday’s game”
Yankees could throw Josh Towers on Thursday too. Aceves is a bad move, IMO. Won’t give you more than 4-5 innings and won’t be available in Anaheim for starts by Joba and Pettitte. Yankees stand to need 10-12 innings from their pen Thursday, Friday and Saturday whether Aceves starts or not. If he starts, he gets none of those 10-12 innings.
“I am also guessing Halladay has a giant no-trade clause that would require waiving”
No NTC per Cots, but he’s nearing 10/5 status. He’ll have it by the end of the year, so if he’s going to be moved it will be this month or else he controls the process.
We’re going to need Aceves more to shadow the SP in Anaheim. I hope he’s not the 5th SP. He helps us better from the BP.
Oops! Possibly stand corrected. Cots references no NTC in Halladay’s deal, but Rosenthal’s piece indicates there is one.
Its probably Aceves and he would be able to throw 60-70 pitches.
At his current rate of production, that’s 5-6 innings.
If they need him earlier because CC or AJ get knocked out early in one of these two games, they probably go to Plan B.
For one start prior to the break, it probably makes the most sense to pitch Aceves in the slot and then insert him into the back end of the rotation after the ASB.
Preferably between Pettitte and Joba since neither guy goes deep in most of their home starts.
Steve B, I expect him to be traded to Phillies. They got the players and will likely want to pull away from the pact.
The old Yankees make this move, but these Yankees know that if you trade Yussse or Joba, Halladay is only one SP, look at the Mets, 1 guy isn’t saving them. And just the thought of Joba or Yussse in that future Jays rotation, w/ Cito managing, your handing them a future pennant.
Steve B-
I am guessing he would definitely be traded this month anyway since the trade deadline is 7/31 which looms big. But I just don’t foresee him waiving a NTC for the Yankees. I am pretty sure he has one. I could swear I heard Suzyn and John talking about it this season
Hallady is fantasy. He isn’t getting traded by the Jays to any AL East team unless that team is stupid enough to give up their Top 4 prospects to do so.
In other words, unless JP can hose an AL East team, he isn’t trading Halladay to a team in his own division. That’s career suicide and JP has not lasted that long in the gig being that dumb.
Oh it’s enticing CC, AJ, Roy….but is it worth it if it costs you Jackson or Jesus + Melancon and Yussse or Joba.
IMO no.
I wouldn’t give up Hughes for Halladay anyway – I wouldn’t have made the Santana trade, so I’m being consistent.
If the Yanks go 3-3 on this trip, I’d be satisfied. Expecting them to do more is expecting a lot – especially when the Yanks are going to Anaheim. I want to win every game, sure, but if you ask most playoff-quality teams (privately, that is) if they would be unhappy with 3-3, I’ll bet they’d say no (unless, for instance, they started off 3-0).
Buster Olney is a joke – he would actually leave Mariano Rivera off his All-Star team and include Randy Choate?
SJ44-
I am with you. A trade between the Yanks and Toronto for Halladay would NEVER happen. But when Halladay hits free agency, that is a whole other story
I’m not complaining about that, Steve B – I’m saying that there is no way that causes a rift between them. In fact, if I were them, I’d have a good laugh at the mediots’ expense
I don’t like Aceves in the rotation – Steve B, I agree with you. Joba and Pettite are 5 inning pitchers (the Yankees need to get a starter – I really want to leave Aceves right where he is) and I’m sorry, Tomko is good in garbage time, but I don’t want him pitching in a close game or where the Yanks really aren’t out of it.
the Yankees aren’t losing too many games these days, so it’s hard to come up with controversies…negative publicity has become the easy way to get attention, readers, listeners, etc so the mediots have to pounce on any chance they get to drum up some interest. Girardi “throwing Jeter under the bus” is a pure and simple example of that
If Halladay hits free agency, AJ Burnett has already said he is going to be front and center recruiting him.
That’s if he hits free agency.
What’s interesting about Halladay’s situation is, no team really can commit to signing him long term right now because of the economy.
So, he can just say, “No thanks, I’ll stay in Toronto thru 2010 and then move on”, if he so chooses.
He’s not going to go to a team that would effect his free agent status. In other words, he isn’t going to a bad team or a team he wouldn’t be comfortable playing with for the next 1 1/2 years.
That’s why I don’t think he is going anywhere. JP will do his job and try to shop him. But, in the end, I bet he stays in Toronto.
SJ,
I disagree with you. I think this whole Hallyday being on the market news is all a ploy by JP to include Wells’ awful contract in any deal a la Lowell/Beckett.
If the Yankees were ever dumb enough to take on Wells they can have Hallyday and not pay the price prospect wise.
I expect JP to hold the opposing teams up to such a deal killer until one of them bites and Wells goes.
I’m not even sure how the media construed that story as Joe throwing him under the bus because im pretty sure Jeter didnt argue the fact that he probably shouldnt have ran in the first place.
And to throw in my 2 cents, trading Joba would be stooooopid.
Trade Cano? Not sure if I’d do that this season, I’d start thinking about it next year. If Cano’s not going to develop at the plate and there’s something pretty good in return, I’d do it.
I don’t know if I’d want to go after Halladay, it would be great to have him, but I still want to see if Joba and/or Hughes can establish themselves and be part of the Yankees going forward.
Wells contract is too expensive to be included in any deal for Halladay. Nobody can afford that type of deal, not even the Yankees.
Rishi,
Went back to sleep, but saw your post. Thanks.
Well, I can’t get too upset, Olney’s listed the young, good players. At least he was kind
enough to put some Yankees on the bench. And I don’t really like how he hedged his bets with two rosters based on which hand the starting pitcher uses. I mean, in the real world your starting team is set, not pick & choose.
And the omission of mo is ridiculous.
As for the road trip? How the Yankees are playing? With their schwaggah, anything less than 4-2 will be a disappointment. But not a surprise.
I love Aceves in the rotation. He has a rubber arm, knows how to pitch, and has four pitches he can throw for strikes to keep hitters honest.
He saves Hughes’ arm from being flip flopped back and forth, and also gives the Yankees another guy that can eat innings.
In fact, if Wang didn’t get hurt, I bet there would be internal discussions about flip flopping Aceves and Joba since Joba can’t give them any consistent innings as a starter.
Pettitte pitches great on the road, horrible at home. At the end of the day, he will still have over 50 more innings in the can than Joba.
The drag on the rotation right now is Joba and not Pettitte because Joba can’t give them length.
Aceves would give them length after the ASB if he is inserted into the rotation.
For right now though, it makes sense to use Ace on TR.
If the choice is between Ace and Josh Towers, there is no choice. You choose Ace every time.
I just can’t believe the Jays would trade Halladay – he’s their franchise. I think it would be a sad thing….
I think AJ was sort of joking about Halladay – and I don’t think he’d have a prayer of getting Doc here.
I’m sure Toronto would eat a portion of Wells’ deal to move him.
I don’t believe they are trading Hallyday straight up for prospects.
There’s another motive here…money. Toronto has no attendance. If they can get the albatross off their necks in Wells they would trade their Ace.
Wang goes down and out come the crazy trade proposals.
Why is everyone’s favorite target Cano?
The Yanks can survive with Aceves as the fifth starter. I’d like to see a trade for a veteran reliever but nothing too crazy. We needed a reliever even with Aceves in the pen, nothing has changed really.
“Why is everyone’s favorite target Cano?”
Because folks are operating under the delusion he brings back a quality starter.
GLove,
I was thinking the same thing. I have no doubt JP would LOVE to tie both players into one deal.
His problem, and he is smart enough to know it is, nobody has that kind of available cash, or salary space to spare these days.
The days of teams taking on bad, bad contracts are over. Even for the Yankees.
The Yankees can’t add that much salary to their bottom line unless they delete significant salary.
If they add anything it will only be a few million bucks.
The Red Sox aren’t doing it either.
Formerly, America’s dumping ground of bad contracts, the Texas Rangers, are also out of the hunt. Especially since they are borrowing more millions from MLB everyday just to keep afloat.
JP is choking on that Wells contract and it really precludes him from doing a lot of things.
The lesson for the children to learn here is payroll flexibility does have its advantages. The fewer bad contracts you have on the books, the more options you have.
That’s why when the Yankees clear the decks of about another 40 million this off-season, I wouldn’t expect them to spend it all on 1 or 2 guys.
Remind me, please, exactly why are we trading Cano?
And Ace is the answer to (insert problem here, but right now it’s a glaring hole in the rotation. Don’t forget-Ace is a staaataahhh).
G Love – That might not be too insane.
Halladay and Wells removes a ton of salary from the Jays. Since the acquiring team will pick it all up the players going back will probably not be as great.
That would be a mighty huge trade though.
Even if somehow the stars fell into allignment and it was the dawning of the age of Aquarius, Halladay is not coming to Yankee stadium in his walk year without a major free agent type contract extension.
They shouldn’t even need a guy like him.
They need a decent mid-rotation arm not another ace.
Thank god Fatcessa is gone this week, he’d lead the charge to trade whatever it is to Toronto for Doc all day.
Toronto also has a dead owner…..literally.
Ted Rogers death changes the way the Jays can do business.
They need to dump, and not add, significant salary.
I wouldn’t trade Cano for a pitcher. Or, for anybody right now.
The guy is having a very good season. He’s playing a Gold Glove second base and, when not hitting 5th, is a quality offensive player.
Those guys don’t grow on trees.
If the Yankees add a Chad Qualls or John Grabow type to their bullpen, and move Ace into the rotation, they have enough to win the division barring any other injuries.
If Wang comes back and is healthy, you can go in different directions in terms of how you fit him into the rotation.
This is the healthiest (knock on wood) the Yankees have been in years heading into the ASB.
Usually at this time, Damon and Jeter are beat up, first base is a disaster, half the pitching staff is hurt, and the bullpen is gassed.
None of that is the case right now.
They just need to get through this week healthy, and look to have a big homestand coming out of the break.
The team is in very good position right now.
Ricciardi has said he’d deal within the AL East.
However, that said, I stay far away. If, in fact, Ricciardi is willing to deal Halladay within the AL East it likely means that he knos something we don’t.
We’d end up paying way too much for a starter on the wrong side of thirty.
“Ricciardi has said he’d deal within the AL East.”
He has to consider it if, for no other reason, two of the few teams who can easily absorb his contract reside there.
he had a groin injury last I checked. Those don’t stop past 30.
To me if you look around the league to find someone comparable to Aceves {I think it would be James Shields of the Rays…Same kind of built same kind of pitches…if he could develop into that kind of pitcher I would be trilled
http://espn.go.com/mlb/players.....erId=28474
In fact, if Wang didn’t get hurt, I bet there would be internal discussions about flip flopping Aceves and Joba since Joba can’t give them any consistent innings as a starter.
————————————————————————————————–
More fighting words from SJ44?
I would expect Cash and co. to fall on their collective sword before that happens.
“he had a groin injury last I checked. Those don’t stop past 30.”
????? No type of baseball injury stops after 30.
Who was the writer that we started panning, and Pete came on to defend? Was that Jason Whitlock?
Whitlock has stepped in it again, as far as I’m concerned. I’m not a big Serena Williams fan, but Whitlock’s crossed the line imo.
His latest? Serena Williams is an underachiever. She could’ve been the greatest female tennis player of all time if she had done something about her weight.
Hello? I don’t know where to begin, but maybe will start with Venus? maybe she was a bigger obstacle than Serena’s weight?
SJ, agreed that Ace would give innings ….and that Joba is a bigger drain that Andy. Even on the road, I don’t have confidence in Andy at all….but he’s better able to battle to give us 5 or 6 than Joba is, even without his good stuff (which he has rarely had this year anyway).
The pen really worries me. I understand intellectually that it is more important to have a 5th starter that can perform respectably than a mediocre starter and a good middle relief guy. By the time the reliever gets into a game, it might be too late. Still – I don’t believe the Yankees can win with a pen consisting of Robertson (ugh in high-leverage situations), Coke, Phil, Tomko and a poor Bruney. I’m not familiar with Qualls or Grabow – can we honestly trust them? We need a guy in the pen who can eat innings (and give us good innings, not crap) – apparently Phil is not going to be that guy, so where is he coming from? A bad pen can kill a team – we saw that earlier this year.
“His latest? Serena Williams is an underachiever. She could’ve been the greatest female tennis player of all time if she had done something about her weight”
Never thought her weight was an issue. For awhile there her commitment could have been questioned, but she’s never impressed me as one whose weight kept her from success.
The problem with moving Aceves from the bullpen is that you end up with a giant hole in the bullpen to fill.
I know some of you have suggested that hey, Tomko et al. can do the job that Acves has done, but if you look at the stats…where right now Aceves is on pace to out-pitch the 1996 version of Mo as we were talking about last night…the answer is that clearly, what Aceves is doing can NOT be easily replaced.
And if you create such a hole in the bullpen you affect every other starter’s starts.
“Joba can’t give them any consistent innings as a starter.”
Seems like that is true, not sure what the solution is there. The bullpen isn’t it. I’d rather send him to the minors than throw him in the bullpen, something is up with him that needs adjustment.
Steve B,
I don’t understand where he’s coming from. She’s a phenominal athlete. She’s all muscle and boobs. How is she going to lose weight?
I don’t think he understands women’s tennis at all. On top of the fact that her sister’s won a bunch of GS herself, the modern era of tennis if filled with contenders.
Forget about Roy Halladay. J.P. Ricciardi won’t deal him within the division. He’ll be a free agent after the 2010 season and be approaching 35 years of age.
By then Zach McAllister and others will be ready.
Halladay :
3 year/$40M (2008-10)
signed extension with Toronto 3/06
08:$10M, 09:$14.25M, 10:$15.75M
award bonus: $0.125M for All Star selection
Halladay to donate $100,000/year to Jays Care Foundation
I think short-term, one start, Aceve is a good choice. And it buys them some time to make a decision for the longer term.
i’ll be at that albany show on the 6th! WHOO!
Fighting words? No.
The Yankees are trying to make the playoffs and win the World Series. If they don’t make the playoffs, Joe Girardi and Brian Cashman are out of their jobs.
That means, any decision that will help them in that quest will be considered.
If a player, Joba for example, doesn’t improve in his current role, his role will change at some point in the season.
They aren’t going to just say, “We are developing him and we won’t change”, just because that’s the current party line.
Here are some other, recent “party lines” from the Yankees…..
“Bubba Crosby is our CF”?
“Brian Bruney is our 8th inning guy”.
“Phil Hughes will not be going to the bullpen”.
“We don’t have money in the budget for CC, AJ, AND Mark Teixeira”.
My point is, everything is fluid when you are trying to win.
Do they want to take Chamberlain out of the rotation? Of course not.
However, what if he can only give them 4-5 innings and no more for another 5 starts?
You think he’s staying in the rotation in August if that happens? I don’t.
Only he way he does is if they have nobody else they can put in the slot.
One thing we see under Girardi. He isn’t afraid to call icons out (Jeter yesterday as the latest example), and he isn’t afraid to make the tough decision.
Hopefully, Joba pitches better and becomes a strength of the team in the second half.
However, if he doesn’t, and the Yankees are better off with someone else in his slot, I have no doubt they will pull the trigger on it, regardless of what they are saying today.
History tells me to ignore a lot of what they say when it comes to making decisions that improve the team.
If Aceves makes the one start before the ASB that’s one thing.
But as a regular starter in the rotation you create a huge hole in the bullpen and I’m not sure how you replace it.
The pen is a concern, but we need to patch up the rotation. It’s much easier to fix the pen. You guys realize that we went from zero long men to 3 to cover the rotation? Hughes, Tomko, and Aceves? Right now we have exactly 3 consistent starters as far as innings are concerned.
I don’t think Wang just breezes back. And he shouldn’t. He needs to do the rehab properly this time. Why doom ourselves by repeating history with Wang?
So, you go to your next strongest starter to fill his spot. Unfortunately, they’re not going to pull Hughes. I can understand the thinking there. So go to your next guy, who’s just as effective and actually more efficient than Phil.
Fill Wang’s slot for the next month or longer if necessary with Aceves.
Worry about that slot, and maybe Joba will round into form.
i’m not a big vernon wells fan (he’s hurt way too much) – but lets not kid ourselves – an OF of melky, gardner and austin jackson next year (IF he’s even good enough to actually start next year) is TERRIBLE..you’ll get 14 homeruns from your entire outfield – and that is if melky can hit 10 of them…which is asking too much to begin with..
is vernon wells (or rios)that much worse than jason bay or matt holliday? – because if you ain’t getting wells or rios its going to be one of those 2 for similar money..at least with wells you are also getting ray halladay….
the yankees are spending 210 million dollars this year – another 15 million is going to what ..break the friggen bank?!?! come on now – the yankees greatest weapon is cash (the green stuff not the nerdy GM) – plus what like 30 million is coming off the books next year – if you have to pick up wells or rios to get halladay thats a no brainer…
the only issue is who do you start in the first game of the world series Halladay or CC – (i go with Halladay)
I think that’s why this Hallyday news is a ruse of sorts. JP has a few bad contracts in Toronto. I’m sure he’d love to dump BJ Ryan on someone as well.
I think his objective is dumping payroll and making the potential trade partner take a poison pill player in the process.
I agree with SJ that no team in this league touches Wells contract.
No team but the Yankees. If Toronto agrees to eat a large enough portion of it I could see the Yankees take him on.
What if all the Yankees had to pay Wells was Nady’s 6-7 million a season for the duration of the deal?
Would you pay him that to be the team that gets Hallyday and presumably wins a WS title this year and/or next year?
He is that good.
I don’t know. It’s a deal with the devil if it’s presented that way and there are so many reasons against doing it but the reasons for doing it are quite seductive.
That said, if Hallyday is going to be dealt for prospects I expect the Brewers to get him. They have young talented positional prospects which is what I think Toronto is looking for here.
Unless they can stablize the back end of the rotation (ie: getting more innings out of them) Aceves will be burned out in a month trying to cover those starts.
He’s better off in the rotation to help stablize that than using him like Torre did Mendoza out of the pen.
Lest we all forget, Mendoza’s shoulder blew out from all that use. Its really not the recommended way to go.
More innings out of the rotation=a more effective and rested bullpen.
“I don’t think he understands women’s tennis at all. On top of the fact that her sister’s won a bunch of GS herself, the modern era of tennis if filled with contenders.”
I think she went a little Kournakova-like for awhile (read: tennis, for a period of time in her life, was a lot less important than fashion and being seen at the ESPY’s, Grammy’s, etc.) and that probably cost her some Grand Slam titles. But I’d never question her weight. Doesn’t look like a lot of body fat and she moves well. One thing I will say is that that body type, with that power should not have gone six years w/o a Wimbledon title, but again I put that on a temporary lack of commitment to the game and her sister as competition.
Don’t throw Rios into the equation with Wells. While Rios makes a ton of money, he still has actual value in this league and could be traded for talent.
Wells is strictly a salary dump player at this point and you are doing Toronto a favor by taking him.
Rebecca =
Yup. I agree with that. I think it’s too easy to underestimate the flexibility Aceves gives the team from the pen.
I think it’s the opposite. If it’s just one start, why upset the balance? Just bring someone up for a spot start.
Thinking medium term, you need a steadying force in Wang’s slot. Someone who’d done if before for the Yankees. Aceves isn’t some kind of revelation this year because of his work out of the bullpen.
He was a machine last season.
“if you have to pick up wells or rios to get halladay thats a no brainer…”
He’s a FA a year from now, end of story. And most people believe Alrodis Chapman is the next big arm the Yankees land.
Another 15 million does break the bank because when you add the luxury tax the Yankees have to pay on it, its more like 30 million for Wells.
That ain’t happenin’.
Their OF next year won’t be Cabrera-Gardner-Jackson.
Vernon Wells won’t be in it either.
“Brian Bruney is our 8th inning guy”.
He was serious about that one. Serious, but wrong.
The Yanks aren’t going to get Roy Halladay.
IF Halladay is on the market, which still isn’t confirmed, I think the Phillies would get him.
SJ44-
Thats because Johnny Damon, my pretend boyfriend is coming back
SWEET. i live in ridgefield, ct. however the ridgefield playhouse charges ridiculous prices for their shows. maybe if the economy straightens out and i can find a entry level job soon…..
“IF Halladay is on the market, which still isn’t confirmed, I think the Phillies would get him.”
Phillies top prosepcts are outfielders, but they do have a little pitching. Happ, Michael Taylor and J. Donald for Halladay? Do the Phillies go that far? And is it enough?
Erica,
Why don’t you use an acronym? MPB or MVPB (my virtual pretend boyfriend).
That way, we’ll know who you’re talking about. And Damon won’t have to get a TRO.
Hey I ‘m always for making any move that helps the team.
I just say fighting words as it brings up the Joba-to-the-pen debate and that seems to be the biggest debate since capital punishment in this town.
Joba, in my most reactionary opinion, seems to be developing into the type of player that I don’t really care for.
Yankees first, player second is always my motto.
I doubt Joba will take kindly to being taken out of the rotation because of performance.
If the pen needed him, it would be easier to explain to him but no way will he be happy about being taken out because he is struggling
Serena and Venus seemed at peace with the decisions they made regarding their careers and lives.
For everyone else, it doesn’t matter what they wanted to see from the women.
I can’t remember which former female player and current commentator (not Chris Evert) said her frustration regarding the Williams sisters was simply her selfishness because she wanted to see more great tennis from them.
What’s to say that Joba would automatically become Joba of 2007 in the bullpen, anyway
Let’s hope that CC and AJ go deep into their games so Ace does not get used.
Ace gets Thursday’s start as it looks right now.
What happens after the break though?
Does Ace go into the rotation and Phil stays in the Pen?
I thought Phil was the #6 starter? I guess they don’t want to strech him back out in case Wang comes back. I thought starters were more valuable?
The Yankees need to get Bruney going or make a trade now.
Let’s hope that CC and AJ go deep into their games so Ace does not get used.
Ace gets Thursday’s start as it looks right now.
What happens after the break though?
Does Ace go into the rotation and Phil stays in the Pen?
I thought Phil was the #6 starter? I guess they don’t want to strech him back out in case Wang comes back. I thought starters were more valuable?
The Yankees need to get Bruney going or make a trade now.
Pittsburgh Pirate players have been so used to players coming and going over the last 2 years that they’ve become immune to it even though they grumble over it.
LH John Grabow will be the next move to be done with the Yankees by 7/31. It appears that Damaso Marte will not return this year. Grabow is bullpen protection if Phil Coke has made too many appearances in a short stretch of time.
Adam:
You wouldn’t want him to be happy about it. But you would hope his reaction will be more of an “I’ll show them” than sulking about it. He’s been coach resistant this season and young players, pitchers in particular, simply can’t do that. He needs a little dope slapping IMO and a temporary trip to the pen may serve as just that. Beats the hell out of starting in northern PA.
Yankees aren’t getting Halladay. Price too high. If they didn’t want to break their farm for Santana, they won’t do it for Halladay either.
SJ44 –
Their OF next year won’t be Cabrera-Gardner-Jackson.
Vernon Wells won’t be in it either.
========================================================
who do you see the yankees picking up/trading for then to put in the OF next year – or is swisher going to be a FT player again next year?
whoever it is its going to cost them money and/or players – so why not wells if it means getting the best pitcher in the game?
i personally don’t like wells (as I said he gets hurt way too much) but if it means getting halladay and not having to worry about joba and pettite as their 3rd starter then to hell with the luxury tax and pay the money – if you give posada 14 million for 4 years at age 36 you aren’t really in a position to worry about vernon wells’s money if it means you have halladay pitching every 5 days..
m-
What is a TRO?
Bronx Jeers,
It would be fighting words because the Yankees have painted themselves into a corner with Joba. They put a lot of responsibility into his hands, and to demote Joba in any way will be an embarrassment of sorts.
I can’t see the old school managers putting up with any attitude from Joba (if indeed he has any).
It certainly isn’t an embarrassment to be sent down. They used to do it all the time. Cliff Lee did it the year before his career year.
But the Yankees won’t do it.
Burt (IL)
Do you think Piniella was fair with Milton Bradley? I see Youkilis blowing up all the time and nobody disciplines him.
Joe Morgan (11:29 AM)
I have some of the smartest chat guys I’ve had in a while today. If you’re Milton Bradley, your history is always in front of people. What you’ve done in the past comes up all the time. People forget that when Manny Ramirez was there and he and Kevin Youkilis got into it, he came into the dugout saying things throwing things and that’s what, according to Manny, led to them pushing each other. But Youkilis doesn’t have the history. Make no mistake about it, Bradley has earned his reputation, but you should treat each situation as its own. We’ve seen some blowups from Zambrano and other players. Part of it was because that’s how their manager was, his personality. But you have to stop if you’re going to be a good team and just play the game.
Temporary Restraining Order
On a separate note, the Marte/Nady deal turned out to be a major bust for Cashman and co.
We could use Ohlendorf in that bullpen right now.
Why not try and bring back Raser from Japan for Thursday’s start?
m-
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha
I am afraid if I start saying, MPBJD no one will know what I am talking about. What if we do a partial compromise…
MPB Johnny Damon
Erica,
Sounds good. We all know the dealio.
Ohlendorf would be useless to us.
“Phillies top prosepcts are outfielders, but they do have a little pitching. Happ, Michael Taylor and J. Donald for Halladay? Do the Phillies go that far? And is it enough? ”
The Jays would have a lot to choose from. Don’t forget Drabek, Carrasco
I don’t think Halladay is available anyways. Rosenthal always reports this nonsense about Roy and he’s usually wrong.
Erica ,
I think if you just put MPB, all of us should know who you mean by now!
Coach6423 July 7th, 2009 at 12:00 pm
Ohlendorf would be useless to us.
—————————
Disagree. He could fill Aceves’ role if Aceves needs to go to the rotation.
I would trade Jose Molina and Cody Ransom for Roy Halladay’s jock strap.
Joba for Halladay? I’d make that trade.
Joba has not shown ace potential as a starter. Halladay is a certified ace.
End of story.
“Coach6423 July 7th, 2009 at 12:00 pm
Ohlendorf would be useless to us.
—————————
Disagree. He could fill Aceves’ role if Aceves needs to go to the rotation.”
Do you really think he could put up the numbers that Aceves has this season?
I don’t.
“I would trade Jose Molina and Cody Ransom for Roy Halladay’s jock strap.
Joba for Halladay? I’d make that trade.
Joba has not shown ace potential as a starter. Halladay is a certified ace.
End of story.”
HOLY JESUS MONTERO.
When are people going to stop forgetting that Joba and Hughes are all of 23-freckin-years-old?
They are NOT finished products.
They have a lot of growing to do.
It’d be idiotically stupid to give up now.
Just saw a clip of Jeter with Kim Jones.
He’s simply the best. Handled it perfectly.
Joked that it was the right move because he was safe.
Melancon is being stretched a little, Edwar is pitching well in Scranton. Ohlendorf is a disposable part, that is struggling in the NL Central.
“Ohlendorf would be useless to us.”
Yes, but we could actually see him be useless. So much more satisfying than Nady and Marte being useless and invisible.
The trade was a good one at the time. Can’t kill Cashman on that. They were a game out of the playoffs when the deal was made and needs were filled. Just didn’t workout.
# Rebecca–Optimist Prime July 7th, 2009 at 12:05 pm
“Coach6423 July 7th, 2009 at 12:00 pm
Ohlendorf would be useless to us.
—————————
Disagree. He could fill Aceves’ role if Aceves needs to go to the rotation.”
Do you really think he could put up the numbers that Aceves has this season?
I don’t.
———————————
No, but you get low leverage innings out of him so you don’t have to kill the rest of the bullpen.
Melancon and Edwar can’t provide you 3-4 innings at a time, Ohlendorf can.
Finally, Ohlendorf >>>>>> Tomko.
Rebecca, I don’t think trading Joba for Halladay is ‘giving up’ on Joba as a starter.
Joba may or may not be a future ace – who the hell knows?
Roy Halladay, on the other hand, is the real deal. Put him at the top w/CC and A.J. and you would have the first three pieces to the Rotation from Hell.
Here is the story of a young starter and the first two years of his career.
In Year 1, he played in 36 games. Started 18. Went 8-7 with a 3.92 ERA and a 1.57 WHIP.
In Year 2, he played in 19 games. Started 13. Went 4-7 with a 10.64 ERA and a 2.20 WHIP.
Who is this young starter? The illustrious Roy Halladay. The moral of this story??? Do not trade or give up on Joba
Erica – always OPPC July 7th, 2009 at 12:12 pm
Here is the story of a young starter and the first two years of his career.
In Year 1, he played in 36 games. Started 18. Went 8-7 with a 3.92 ERA and a 1.57 WHIP.
In Year 2, he played in 19 games. Started 13. Went 4-7 with a 10.64 ERA and a 2.20 WHIP.
Who is this young starter? The illustrious Roy Halladay. The moral of this story??? Do not trade or give up on Joba
—————————
Don’t forget his less than illustrious trip to the minor leagues.
Not everyone is Tim Lincecum. He is the aberration.
“Roy Halladay, on the other hand, is the real deal. Put him at the top w/CC and A.J. and you would have the first three pieces to the Rotation from Hell.”
Sure, if you’re willing to give up the future to win now.
I’m not. Not, at least, to that extent.
Erica makes a very good point. And there are more pitcher than just Halladay who struggled young, too.
Now, if I had said, “Trade Joba for Joey Votto” THAT would be giving up on Joba as a starter.
Joba for Roy Halladay’s .. . i’d do it in a Heartbeat !!..
CC. Roy . AJ . . GOOD NIGHT !!
Hughes would be in the rotation next season .. WOW
“IF Halladay is on the market, which still isn’t confirmed, I think the Phillies would get him.”
Phillies top prosepcts are outfielders, but they do have a little pitching. Happ, Michael Taylor and J. Donald for Halladay? Do the Phillies go that far? And is it enough?”
I see the Phillies all over Halladay…they have a great system and a lot of talent and do not play in the AL East…I can see that trade during the break
You don’t hear about Marte anymore. Is he officially done for the season?
What seemed like a genius trade has evolved into a collasal waste of money.
Can’t really assign blame. Only responsibility.
Even signing Pavano looked good at the time it happened.
Mets fans would collectively hurl if Halladay lands with the Phils.
“Erica makes a very good point. And there are more pitcher than just Halladay who struggled young, too.”
Yeah, but the vast majority of those don’t become Roy Halladay. Most likely, Joba won’t either. Not saying you make the trade, but if it’s the difference between winning it all this year and not winning it all, you sure as heck don’t dismiss it on the 10%-20% chance Joba becomes Halladay.
The Phillies need the starting pitching that badly
ya, i agree with the guy up there…i dont think anyone has a chance 2 sign him as a free agent if we go after him b/c of AJ…
but i think a package of ian kennedy, brett gardner, austin romine, andrew brackman and takin on his contract would get it done!
those are a ton of high prospectsfor a guy they are gonna lose in a year, face it they arnt going to win with him, but they may think they can win in the future with these guys, and it would take $$ off budget.
Signing Marte and Nady helped get them in the playoffs in 2007. Not sure they were getting there without that trade being make.
I hope the Phillies do get Halladay. I will cheer tremendously to see Halladay out of the AL
Hey can we trade Kei Igawa for the ump who told Jeter he didn’t have to actually be tagged to be called out? At least we can use the ump for a pinata, or he can be told to carry Jeter’s bags the rest of the season. And if he turns out to be a better pitcher than Igawa (which is not saying much) then it’s a bonus.
Wait. That wasn’t nearly as much fun as it used to be. I just realized that unless he makes a comeback to the big leagues, taking pokes at Igawa has jumped the shark.
“but i think a package of ian kennedy, brett gardner, austin romine, andrew brackman and takin on his contract would get it done!”
You’re dreamin’.
Jake July 7th, 2009 at 12:23 pm
ya, i agree with the guy up there…i dont think anyone has a chance 2 sign him as a free agent if we go after him b/c of AJ…
but i think a package of ian kennedy, brett gardner, austin romine, andrew brackman and takin on his contract would get it done!
those are a ton of high prospectsfor a guy they are gonna lose in a year, face it they arnt going to win with him, but they may think they can win in the future with these guys, and it would take $$ off budget.
———————————
Kennedy, Gardner, Romine and Brackman for Roy Halladay?
The fantasy trades on here can really be hilarious.
“Signing Marte and Nady helped get them in the playoffs in 2007. Not sure they were getting there without that trade being make.”
They actually picked them up in ’08 Erica and failed to make the playoffs.
Steve B July 7th, 2009 at 12:25 pm
“Signing Marte and Nady helped get them in the playoffs in 2007. Not sure they were getting there without that trade being make.”
They actually picked them up in ‘08 Erica and failed to make the playoffs.
—————–
The trade itself wasn’t a terrible decision.
Signing Marte to a long extension, on the other hand, was.
Good assessment,vb. Trade was the right thing at the time. Extending Marte was a blunder.
Steve B-
You are right. These years tend to blur together. Oops
Steve B July 7th, 2009 at 12:28 pm
Good assessment,vb. Trade was the right thing at the time. Extending Marte was a blunder.
——————
Committing big money to non-closers is always a big risk considering the volatility of bullpen arms. Cashman should have known that, not really sure why he felt the need to extend him three years when he could have gone on a year to year basis.
Committing big money to non-closers is always a big risk considering the volatility of bullpen arms. Cashman should have known that, not really sure why he felt the need to extend him three years when he could have gone on a year to year basis.
—
Its possible he considered Marte as a potential closer replacement should Mo’s health fail, and knew that the rest of the bullpen was going to be comprised of cheap, minor league pieces.
Erica – always OPPC
July 7th, 2009 at 12:23 pm
Signing Marte and Nady helped get them in the playoffs in 2007. Not sure they were getting there without that trade being make.
———————————————————————————-
Giambi sized swing and a miss on that post.
I guess time flies when your team is missing the postseason.
Can someone refresh my memory- what was wrong with Marte?
No one ever talks about him. So strange
The trade for Marte & Nady was actually a good one. It just turned out that both of their arms went south.
Unless the Pirates saw a good probability of looming arm troubles in them both, then it was a real good deal for the Pirates.
Sort of like when Pettitte was ‘allowed’ to sign with Houston half and it wasn’t long before his elbow went. He made his comeback, but it looked like Cashman made a wise non-move when he did that.
Hey, it could be bad luck too.
Bronx Jeers-
I am not going to lie- 2007 and 2008 as seasons really blur together for me. They were really similar if you think about it. The Yanks had terrible starts to both. The only real differences between the two were the managers and in one year the Yanks turned it around successfully and the other they couldn’t. And even in 2007, they only bought a 4 game extension to the season.
edit button …. ‘half’ ???
yaarghhh !!
The Phillies are watching Pedro . and signs say if the price comes down Pedro will join the Phils . And a chance to get back at the Mets. It could happen
Which may knock the Phills out of the Roy H. Sweepstakes
Mike July 7th, 2009 at 12:36 pm
The Phillies are watching Pedro . and signs say if the price comes down Pedro will join the Phils . And a chance to get back at the Mets. It could happen
Which may knock the Phills out of the Roy H. Sweepstakes
——————
Pedro won’t command more than the minimum at this point. If they sense they can get Halladay, you bet they are going to make a hard push.
vb . do you think the Yanks take a look at Roy . .or do you think this is the media throwing in the Yanks name to make everyone nuts
LOL at this idiot caller on WFAN (I guess he’s a Met fan, not sure), who complains that Girardi is too mechanical (I really don’t know what they want from this guy – I like him personally, I don’t see him as a robot), but that he LOVES Jerry Manual because he’s REALLY good with the media and seems like a REALLY COOL guy. This is the NY fan in a nutshell….then the host, Adam the Bull said you can’t get on Joe too much because the Yanks have the 3rd best record in baeball, but that he is overly mechanical.
It doesn’t get better than this, lol
—
Its possible he considered Marte as a potential closer replacement should Mo’s health fail, and knew that the rest of the bullpen was going to be comprised of cheap, minor league pieces.
———————————————————————————————–
Don’t know why he would think that. Marte barely filled his role of lefty specialist.
That signing sucked but it’s sort of a tradition.
Bad contracts to overrated set-up guys are one of Cashmans signature moves.
Gotta be done.
What if Roy went to the Rays? That could make things really interesting.
Yeah, but who would win in a fight – Manuel or Girardi?
The Yanks should start Nick Swisher on Thursday. There. Problem solved.
Whoever it is, it shouldn’t be Aceves. Having him make a short start before a Joba start is not a good idea. I’m guessing someone gets called up, Albaladejo or Robertson get sent down (assuming the have options left–don’t know) and then they get called back on Friday.
The best case scenario is for Joba to get the message and work with his catchers and for Wang to be out short term.
Aceves may have what was once known as a “rubber arm” but it might be a mistake to flip-flop his roles too much.
go get a lock down 8th inning RP & the Yanks would distance themselves from the Sox & TB
“who complains that Girardi is too mechanical”
Mechanical? Not even sure what means. Joe G is dull with a big D. Mechanical suggests he’s forcing it and not being himself. I don’t see that as the case.
Mike July 7th, 2009 at 12:40 pm
vb . do you think the Yanks take a look at Roy . .or do you think this is the media throwing in the Yanks name to make everyone nuts
——————–
All you have to do is look back at the Santana deal. The Jays will ask way more from the Yanks than a team from the NL. I think that a trade for Halladay would require at least 2 of our top prospects (Austin Jackson/McAllister) plus a young big league ready starter/position player (Joba/Hughes).
The Twins demanded Hughes, Wang (the 19 game winner version) and Melky from Cashman for Santana. The price would be even more steep for Halladay.
The Dodgers are in town this week to play the Mets and staying at the Parker Meridian.
I met Manny this morning as he came into the gym I work at and was with him for about 30 minutes, talking girls and baseball.
what a character.
Oh and so this doesn’t turn into a “Joba at the Xmas party” type of dilemma between Fritz and Flam, I do have proof.
TO July 7th, 2009 at 12:42 pm
What if Roy went to the Rays? That could make things really interesting.
——————
He’d have to change his name to Ray Halladay.
Thank you, thank you, I’ll be here all week.
I have a better fight me & Franco..
SJ44
July 7th, 2009 at 11:30 am
Unless they can stablize the back end of the rotation (ie: getting more innings out of them) Aceves will be burned out in a month trying to cover those starts.
He’s better off in the rotation to help stablize that than using him like Torre did Mendoza out of the pen.
Lest we all forget, Mendoza’s shoulder blew out from all that use. Its really not the recommended way to go.
More innings out of the rotation=a more effective and rested bullpen.
————————————————————
Not going to get a disagreement started that last for 2 weeks, but, Mendoza’s shoulder was in good shape until he got to Boston. Unless he was doing a Houdina act for 2 or 3 years in NY. That’s another injury that can’t be hung on Torre.
http://www.baseball-reference......ra01.shtml
yikes !!! forget that . .thx VB03
Erica,
Just try and remember 2008 as the Betemit era.
Then remember the phrase “Betemit was not to our benefit”
I didn’t think the Marte/Nady trade was bad at the time. It just didn’t work out.
Don’t sell Ohlendorf so short though. He may not have the magic in his arm that some others do but he has 7 wins and a WHIP lower than Joba, Wang, AJ and Andy.
He would have been just fine for a few spot starts.
Don’t know why he would think that. Marte barely filled his role of lefty specialist.
—
His prior experience and stuff have more to do with it than his ERA in a short stint in our bullpen. Bullpen arms are volatile and he probably thought his performance last year was a blip.
K/9 over 9, career whip of 1.2, limits HRs, and has an average walk rate.
He should be able to thrive in the setup role but his health and ineffectiveness conspired against NYY
We’re on a 96-win pace and at least a wild card berth. Let’s mortgage the future and trade for a 32-year-old guy coming off an injury who we just smacked around the yard the other day.
Makes perfect sense to me.
Bronx Jeers-
I don’t think Betemit was to anyone’s benefit. Except the opposition.
After the CWS released him, a scout called him the worst player he has ever seen
joeman July 7th, 2009 at 12:45 pm
I have a better fight me & Franco..
————-
Since I’m much bigger than 95% of the people I meet on an everyday basis, I would imagine that ratio is probably pretty similar on a Yankee blog – which likely includes you.
So it would probably not be wise on your part.
pat July 7th, 2009 at 12:50 pm
I didn’t think the Marte/Nady trade was bad at the time. It just didn’t work out.
Don’t sell Ohlendorf so short though. He may not have the magic in his arm that some others do but he has 7 wins and a WHIP lower than Joba, Wang, AJ and Andy.
He would have been just fine for a few spot starts.
————————
He’s also an ideal multiple inning long man if Ace needs to be plugged into a rotation spot.
Cougar Tabata would also likely be in AAA at this point and may have become a September callup.
Marte injured himself while lifting 25-pound weights training for the WBC (not exactly an Iliad-esque tale):
http://www.nydailynews.com/spo....._fr-2.html
You know the application on Facebook that asks who you would like to punch in the face and you have to pick 5 people mine would be,
Francisco Rodriguez, jose Reyes, Josh beckett, K. youkilis, J. papelbum.
How about yours?
Cougar Tabata would also likely be in AAA at this point and may have become a September callup.
—
Based on what? He is struggling mightily in the pirates system. He wasn’t doing well in our system by the time we traded him due to the injury/craziness/whatever
YankeeFan4Eva July 7th, 2009 at 12:56 pm
You know the application on Facebook that asks who you would like to punch in the face and you have to pick 5 people mine would be,
Francisco Rodriguez, jose Reyes, Josh beckett, K. youkilis, J. papelbum.
How about yours?
——————————–
Carl Pavano (no explanation needed), Wally Bell (for horrendous calls at 2nd base yesterday), Randy Levine and Lonn Trost (for making tickets ridiculously priced) and of course, Jonathan Papelbon.
‘How about yours?’
Tony Womack. Kevin Brown. Tony Clark. Tony Womack again. Tony Womack for a third time.
Jerkface July 7th, 2009 at 12:57 pm
Cougar Tabata would also likely be in AAA at this point and may have become a September callup.
—
Based on what? He is struggling mightily in the pirates system. He wasn’t doing well in our system by the time we traded him due to the injury/craziness/whatever
—————————-
Kid is 20 years old, and did hit .348 with an over .400 OBP at AA Altoona last year. Not inconceivable that he would turn it around.
Glenn posted,
Aceves may have what was once known as a “rubber arm” but it might be a mistake to flip-flop his roles too much.
—————————————————-
Great post, Glenn. I agree fully. To think that Alfredo Aceves is immune from arm miseries is pure hubris. He can blow out his arm/elbow just like anyone else. He has the long relief role down to a “T”. Don’t mess with him.
In regards to Thursday’s start I think it would be dumb to start Aceves. First of all, he’s only had 3 days rest since Sunday’s 4 inning relief appearance. To ask him to throw 60 pitches 4 days after throw over 40 pitches is ridiculous. Also, we will need a long reliever in the Thursday game (Aceves wouldn’t go more than 4 innings) and we potentially need a long reliever for Joba’s Friday start and Andy’s Saturday start. I know that aceves can’t be the long reliever for all 3 starts but the situation gets even worse if the Yankees start him on Thursday…then he can’t relive in ANY of those games.
Why not give kei Igawa a start on thursday?lol
I’d rather throw Sergio Mitre out for Thursday’s start, cross fingers and have Ace waiting in case disaster strikes.
YankeeFan4Eva July 7th, 2009 at 1:03 pm
Why not give kei Igawa a start on thursday?lol
—————–
Who is Kei Igawa? Is he on the Yankees?
“Dr. Cox July 7th, 2009 at 12:44 pm
The Dodgers are in town this week to play the Mets and staying at the Parker Meridian.
I met Manny this morning as he came into the gym I work at and was with him for about 30 minutes, talking girls and baseball.
what a character.
Oh and so this doesn’t turn into a “Joba at the Xmas party” type of dilemma between Fritz and Flam, I do have proof.”
cool, he seems like a fun guy to hang out with
LOL at this idiot caller on WFAN (I guess he’s a Met fan, not sure), who complains that Girardi is too mechanical (I really don’t know what they want from this guy – I like him personally, I don’t see him as a robot), but that he LOVES Jerry Manual because he’s REALLY good with the media and seems like a REALLY COOL guy. This is the NY fan in a nutshell….then the host, Adam the Bull said you can’t get on Joe too much because the Yanks have the 3rd best record in baeball, but that he is overly mechanical.
It doesn’t get better than this, lol
=========================
I was in the car and heard that delusional dude.
Just comical!
Kid is 20 years old, and did hit .348 with an over .400 OBP at AA Altoona last year. Not inconceivable that he would turn it around.
—
And now he is hitting .260 with no power. I think the change of scenery worked but now he is settled in and right back to his old tricks. I like Tabata a lot but I think he has a lot going against him to succeed. His mental stability, personal life, attitude problems, etc.
I see him getting dropped down a level if he doesnt pick it up or wallowing in AA for a few years before being cut or taken in the rule 5.
There’s this sick part of me that really wants to see Igawa get the ball this week.
I know…I have issues.
Igawa just dominated the AAA Red Sox, and he has a history of troubling the ole red stockings. I think we need him up here to snap our 0fer
Re: Aceves.
I would wager that no one would be more thrilled at being pulled from the bullpen than Aceves himself.
Straight from the burro’s mouth, his initial reaction was that he wasn’t quite sure what the irregular, frequent work would do to him.
And then of course, he said he’d do whatever he could to help the team.
But I sense that Aceves is more comfortable pitching on a regular schedule.
“Cano for Greike or for Cliff Lee? no go there either?”
Cano for Greike should get you banned.
Cano for Cliff Lee, I wouldn’t do. And i dislike Cano
Here’s the reason I don’t like the idea of Aceves going to the rotation:
The Yankees have the third best record in baseball with Wang and Hughes (the combined #5 starters) going 4-8. Aceves, as a reliever, has gone 5-1.
Thus, Aceves’ role in the bullpen has been far more valuable to them than the #5 spot in the rotation.
Bring up a guy from AAA and maybe you’ll strike gold (like Aaron Small, Chacon, or Nieve on the Mets). Even if he’s mediocre, he’ll at least replace the production (or lack of) provided by Wang.
The Yankees don’t NEED a good #5 starter. They’ve gotten this far with absolutely no production from that slot, as well as almost every other starter in the rotation underacheiving. What they do need is to keep Aceves in the bullpen, because his rubber arm will help them multiple games a week.
Yanks worked too hard to get Igawa off the 40 man roster to put him back on now.
RS,
That’s faulty logic. Wang had issues and Phil was inconsistent.
I just feel it’s harder to fill the #4 spot than it is to find someone to fill Aceves’ role. He’s not even the setup guy. He was coming in when the starters were ineffective. It was to the Yankees benefit that the offense rallied, but I truly think that Aceves is more valuable as a starter than a reliever.
The Yankees have the third best record in baseball with Wang and Hughes (the combined #5 starters) going 4-8. Aceves, as a reliever, has gone 5-1.
—
This is backwards logic. If Aceves started in the rotation in place of Wang / Hughes he might have done a much better job than 4-8. In fact, I would wager he would definitely have done much better. Even if a completely average reliever took his place, the team would have been better served with him in the rotation.
If Aceves pitches more innings, then the yankees as a team get more quality innings. His 5-1 record tells me that the offense is very good, because Ace has been the long guy and they usually get in when our starter is knocked out. So Aceves pitches well, keeps the score close, and the offense goes to work.
If he is in the rotation maybe the score is reversed in our favor and he gets a bunch of wins. Even right now as a reliever he can either pitch 1 inning (not very valuable) or he pitches 3-4 innings (value depends) and if he pitches 3-4 he has to be rested for a couple days so its not like he can go right out and ‘touch some more games’.
Thats why I never get this fascination with leaving valuable starters in the pen. They come in and do some nice long work and get a win and you hear ‘WOW WE NEED THIS GUY IN THE PEN!’ But most of the time they either pitch 1 inning or they can’t pitch in multiple games in a week.
I’d rather have Phil Hughes for 1 5-7 IP stint per week than 2 1-2 IP stints.
I believe Eric Hinske’s nick name should be E-Roc or E-Rock.
What do you people think?
The Yankees don’t NEED a good #5 starter. They’ve gotten this far with absolutely no production from that slot, as well as almost every other starter in the rotation underacheiving. What they do need is to keep Aceves in the bullpen, because his rubber arm will help them multiple games a week.
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Good point!!! The Yankees first goal should be to win the AL wildcard. That means beating Texas, Tampa and Toronto and I don’t think the Yankees need to jeopardize their bullpen to achieve that end…they can do it with the 4 current starters and a guy from the minors.
One thing I’d suggest is, that if the Yankees decide to trade for a starter and don’t want to give up a lot, I’d try to get Ross Ohlendorf back from Pittsburgh.
1. It wouldn’t take an arm and a leg to get him.
2. They don’t have to pay him much.
3. They can trade him easily next season if they don’t need him.
Joe and Evan really ripped into the umps….good for them
jpb1973 July 7th, 2009 at 1:24 pm
The Yankees don’t NEED a good #5 starter. They’ve gotten this far with absolutely no production from that slot, as well as almost every other starter in the rotation underacheiving. What they do need is to keep Aceves in the bullpen, because his rubber arm will help them multiple games a week.
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Good point!!! The Yankees first goal should be to win the AL wildcard. That means beating Texas, Tampa and Toronto and I don’t think the Yankees need to jeopardize their bullpen to achieve that end…they can do it with the 4 current starters and a guy from the minors.
One thing I’d suggest is, that if the Yankees decide to trade for a starter and don’t want to give up a lot, I’d try to get Ross Ohlendorf back from Pittsburgh.
1. It wouldn’t take an arm and a leg to get him.
2. They don’t have to pay him much.
3. They can trade him easily next season if they don’t need him.
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I say send Nady and Marte to the Pirates for Ohlendorf, McCutchen and Tabata.
Yanks as a team batting a rousing .214 against Scott Baker.
42 ABs, 9 Hits, 2 BBs, 8 Ks and 6 of the Ks belong to Swish and Alex. Ouch!
I say send Nady and Marte to the Pirates for Ohlendorf, McCutchen and Tabata.
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And make the Pirates throw Jeff Karstens into the deal.
Yanks as a team batting a rousing .214 against Scott Baker.
42 ABs, 9 Hits, 2 BBs, 8 Ks and 6 of the Ks belong to Swish and Alex. Ouch!
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It sounds like today might the day to give ARod his day off.
“I just feel it’s harder to fill the #4 spot than it is to find someone to fill Aceves’ role.”
#4 starters have a 4.00+ ERA and give you 6 innings. The Mets got that with Livan Hernandez for pennies. I’m sure there are a couple of NL guys like that who can be had for a few B level prospects.
I think it will be much harder to fill Aceves’ role because he has a rubber arm that gives innings AND he has a sparkling ERA. Not only has his good pitching helped the Yankees win many games, but his ability to throw 2+ innings allows the other guys in the bullpen to get days off.
YankeeFan4Eva
July 7th, 2009 at 12:56 pm
You know the application on Facebook that asks who you would like to punch in the face and you have to pick 5 people mine would be,
Francisco Rodriguez, jose Reyes, Josh beckett, K. youkilis, J. papelbum.
How about yours?
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I’m not going to lie, I filled this out on Fb months ago:)
Mine was: Papelbon, Youkilis, Manny, Beckett and Al Sharpton (i tried to include one non red sox player)
Starting pitchers who can give you 6 IP at a 4.00 ERA are immensely more valuable than an arm out of the pen.
It’s not even close.
New thread_——>
“LOL at this idiot caller on WFAN (I guess he’s a Met fan, not sure), who complains that Girardi is too mechanical (I really don’t know what they want from this guy – I like him personally, I don’t see him as a robot), but that he LOVES Jerry Manual because he’s REALLY good with the media and seems like a REALLY COOL guy. This is the NY fan in a nutshell….then the host, Adam the Bull said you can’t get on Joe too much because the Yanks have the 3rd best record in baeball, but that he is overly mechanical”
thankful we have Girardi.
and thankful we don’t have Jerry Manuel. Even tho he’s gangsta!! LOL