Game 83: Yankees at Twins (Updates: Aceves to start Thurs., Halladay talk and Girardi pre-game audio)
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- July
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YANKEES (48-34)
Jeter SS
Damon LF
Teixeira 1B
Rodriguez 3B
Matsui DH,
Swisher RF
Cano 2B
Gardner CF
Cervelli C
Pitching: LHP CC Sabathia (7-5, 3.85).
TWINS (43-40)
Span LF
Harris SS
Mayer C
Morneau 1B
Cuddyer RF
Crede 3B
Young DH
Gomez CF
Punto 2B
Pitching: RHP Scott Baker (6-6, 4.99).
TIME/TV: 8:10, MY9.
STATE OF THE ‘STRIPES: The Yankees are coming off a 5-2 homestand. They have won 10 of their last 12 and are a game out of first place in the AL East.
SO LONG, METRODOME: Unless the teams meet in the playoffs, this is the last time the Yankees will play inside the stuffy confines of the Hubert H. Humphrey Metrodome. They are 74-64 in the stadium but only 8-11 since 2004.
TWIN KILLING: The Yankees swept four games from the Twins from May 15-18. They outscored Minnesota only 21-16 as three of the games were decided by one run.
M AND M BOYS: Joe Mauer (5 of 16, 2 home runs, 3 RBI) and Justin Morneau (9 of 16, 3 homers, 5 RBI) destroyed the Yankees back in May. The duo scored seven runs and drew eight walks.
GODZILLA RETURNS: Joe Girardi was right, that unwelcome interleague rest did wonders for Hideki Matsui. He is 9 of 18 with six extra-base hits (three of them homers) and 10 RBI in his last six games.
THAT’S CANO AS IN NO RBI: Robbie Cano has two RBI in his last 16 games. He is 20 of 102 (.196) with runners in scoring position and 37 of 152 (.243) with men on base. He is hitting .352 (62 of 176) with nobody on base.
HEATING UP: Jorge Posada is 7 of 16 with five RBI in his last three games.
OH, WHAT A RELIEF: Mariano Rivera (11 games, 11.1 innings, 1 ER); Phil Hughes (9 games, 14.2 innings, 2 ER); Phil Coke (17 games, 15.2 innings, 1 ER) and Alfredo Aceves (11 games, 18.2 innings, 2 ER) have been among the hottest relievers in the game.
BAD BRUNEY: Brian Bruney’s last six appearances: 5 innings, 8 hits, 7 walks, 4 ER. Wonder what K-Rod has to say about that?
BULLPEN BRINGS IT: The relievers have allowed 8 ER in the last 34.2 innings in the last 13 games. They have given up 24 hits, walked 11 and struck out 39.
ONE-RUN UPDATE: The Yankees were once 9-4 in one-run games. They are 2-6 since.
A-ROD UPDATE: Alex Rodriguez is 14 of his last 26 with five homers and 1R RBI.
POWER OUTAGE: Mark Teixeira has gone 84 at-bats (back to June 12) without a home run.
Back with more later. Keep in mind the game is an hour later than usual.
UPDATE, 4:09 p.m.: The Yankees released Angel Berroa today.
UPDATE, 4:52 p.m.: Alfredo Aceves just threw a bullpen and said he was told he’s starting on Thursday.
UPDATE, 6:56 p.m.: While I’m happy for the chatter on the blog, I think people are getting way ahead of themselves on the idea of Roy Halladay coming to the Yankees. A few points:
• He’s three years older than Johan Santana was when the Yankees decided against trading for him.
• Toronto is not going to want to trade him within the division unless they get knocked out by a deal. Think Cano, Chamberlain, Jackson, Hughes, Montero, etc. Players like that. Don’t waste time trying to come up with 17 players the Yankees don’t need. You’ll need to experience pain to make this deal. Real pain.
• Holliday has roughly $7 million left this season. I no longer believe what the Yankees say about budgets. But that’s a lot to add. The Yankees wanted money back from Pittsburgh to take on Eric Hinske.
• The Phillies need him a lot more. And it takes him out of the league.
• The Jays could theoretically get more in December than they could now.
• Halladay has a no-trade clause. So he will want to be compensated in some form for waiving that. That means a contract extension. Think $36 million over two more years or a total commitment of $60 million or so over 3.5 years.
Yes, it’s fun playing GM. But such a trade has a lot of hurdles to overcome.
UPDATE, 7:10 p.m.: Here is Joe Girardi’s pre-game:
Sad news for you Frankie Cervelli fans. The Yankees will not be keeping three catchers once Jose Molina comes back and that could well be tomorrow.
UPDATE, 8:10 p.m.: We’re underway here at the Metrodome. Should be a good series as the Twins seek some revenge against the Yankees, who have been terrific for the last two weeks. CC knows this team and they know him. Fun game to watch. Hard not to admire how the Twins play the game.
UPDATE, 8:22 p.m.: Nobody hotter than Godzilla at the moment. He’s 10 of 19 with 11 RBI. Clutch as always, he has the Yankees up 1-0.
UPDATE, 8:35 p.m.: It is great to watch Cervelli sprint — and I mean sprint — up the line to back-up throws to first base. It’s like he’s racing the runner. A.J. Burnett and I were talking about ‘Frisco before the game. He gets a kick out of him, too. “It’s great to be 23 and have that kind of energy,” he said.
UPDATE, 8:53 p.m.: Yankees already have seven hits off Baker and lead 3-0. They’ve already had eight plate appearances with runners in scoring position. Just relentless.
UPDATE, 8:55 p.m.: A-Rod lets Baker off the hook. It’s 3-0 and the Twins probably feel a little lucky. CC can pound the strike zone now.
UPDATE, 9:32 p.m.: Bases loaded, no outs, up 3-0 and a reliever in. Time to step on Minnesota’s neck.
UPDATE, 9:35 p.m.: Wow, fantastic catch by Carlos Gomez as he robs A-Rod of a grand slam in dead center. Perfect leap, exactly times. Four runs becomes one. Yankees 4-1.
UPDATE, 9:41 p.m.: Yanks work a couple of walks and now lead 5-1. They have nine hits and four walks in this game and only five runs in four innings. They need a soul-crunching double or home run. Alex nearly had it.
UPDATE, 9:45 p.m.: Hey, Robbie Cano couldn’t get a hit with RISP. Give me a few minutes to look up whether that has happened very often.
UPDATE, 9:47 p.m.: By golly, it has. Cano is 0 for his last 21 with RISP according to the estimable Mr. King of the Post.
UPDATE, 10:02 p.m.: Jose Molina was 0 for 1 for Trenton with a walk and a HBP. He caught seven innings and apparently was fine. I would think he’ll be here tomorrow or the next day.
UPDATE, 10:21 p.m.: The odds were with Cano and he delivered a broken-bat single into right field. Yankees 7-1 and CC Sabathia is in the driver’s seat. Yankees could get him go a while, too. Save that bullpen for the next two days.
UPDATE, 10:24 p.m.: Gritty! Gutty! Two-run triple and it’s 9-1. That was like watching the U.S. 200 trials. Gardner was racing around the bases.
UPDATE, 10:26 p.m.: Cisco may be going down, but he’s going down fighting. 2 for 3 with two RBI. Good for him.
It’s 10-1 and the good people of Minnesota are leaving in droves.
UPDATE, 10:51 p.m.: Every starter now has at least one hit. The bottom third of the order — Cano, GGBG and Cervelli — are 6 of 11 with five runs scored and six RBI.
UPDATE, 10:59 p.m.: CC at 99 after seven. Let him go one more? Minnesota has scored one run in its last 24 innings against him.
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Bruney needs to get it together.
Girardi was seen leaving Jeter’s room with a nosebleed.
Tex is saving his HRs for the second half.
Let’s go CC, big bounce back game-
im looking for a big come back start for CC…he knows his job and realizes they lost yesterday and its time to start a winning streak again! Lets get #1!
Those still smarting about Halladay should read this post. Mind, adult language.
http://bit.ly/3gtZRp
Bill Smith completely screwed up the Santana negotiations.
Remember… Hughes, Melky, Marquez was on the table for a 48-72 hour period. Smith said he wanted more thinking he could dupe Hank, and then Hank stepped in with his “teams ask more from us than other teams” rant, then the Twins got angry at Hank and accused him of tampering, then the whole negotiation fell apart and Hughes was off the table.
And remember, for that one night after negotiations with us fell through, it looked like Boston was going to be getting Santana. They exchanged Lester’s medical records and all the news outlets said it was close to a done deal and it looked like a done deal. Then Minnesota wanted Kalish? or someone in addition to Lester and they walked away.
So from Hughes or Lester, the Twins settled with Carlos Gomez. Smith took the Yankees/Sox bidding war too far, he looked like the rookie GM that he was.
It’s amazing that Jeter has never been thrown out of a game- does anyone remember the game (I can’t!) that Bernie was arguing a call and the catcher said something to him and then Bernie started jawing at the catcher? I loved it, just can’t remember the exact game- don’t think he got run either-
If we get Vernon Wells, then what the heck do we do with Gardner and A=Jack, both who deserve starting spots in our OF next year?
UPDATE: Ricciardi showed up on Mike Hogan’s show on the Fan 590 this morning to address this tiresome non-story:
“We’re not putting up a sign that says we’re trading Roy Halladay. I think that’s the furthest thing from what’s going on right now.”
“We’re not out there shopping him, but like any of our players, if someone comes knocking, we wouldn’t be doing our job if we don’t listen.”
“That’s what it’s like this time of year, during the trading period.”
“We’ve always said that a) we don’t want to trade Roy Halladay, and b) if we do decide to trade Roy Halladay, it’s going to be very painful for the other organization.”
JP Riccardi is the same one who made sure that Halladay and Burnett were lined up in every series we played them. Burnett was actually started on short rest in the middle of the season just to face the Yanks, if you remember. Halladay was also often given extra rest so he would line up with us.
Riccardi hates us, he is not giving us Halladay. He’ll take a lesser package from LA, Philly, Mets etc. than give him to us.
# Rebecca–Optimist Prime July 7th, 2009 at 4:20 pm
Those still smarting about Halladay should read this post. Mind, adult language.
http://bit.ly/3gtZRp
———————–
Hah, that’s classic. JP’s right though, if he’s making a deal, it WILL hurt the other team very dearly. Since the starting bid would be two high draft picks, its not like the Jays get zero if he does decide to walk.
Bill Smith has not done much good since he’s taken over the Twinkies, the Santana deal at the top (bottom?) of the list. He also managed to trade Matt Garza (now pretty much an established #2 pitcher in the AL East) for the worst young OFer the Rays produced, and has never addressed their glaring need at 3rd base except for signing a guy with a bad back that constantly needs days off (to play on the TURF home field, no less).
But I guess the fans can’t be too unhappy, since they do have Joe Mauer AKA Ted Williams 2009.
Yes, I have heard the Roy Halladay rumors. Just consider these two factors: If Toronto does want to trade him, it will not be within the division. And the Yankees needed money to come from the Pirates to make the Eric Hinske deal. So they’ll just pick up Halladay’s $7 million and give up a boatload of prospects? I don’t see it.
I put nothing past the Yankees in terms of money. But why would Toronto trade him to a team they have to play 19 times a year?
Joba, Banelous, Jorge Vasquez, and Mike Dunn for Halladay
And if they wanted us to take Wells, they replace Banelous with Igawa.
And on another note, Bill Smith was better off letting Santana walk and get the 2 draft picks instead of getting an overhyped pinch runner and a bunch of B prospects for him.
Halladay if traded, would probably end up in the NL…The Twins are insane for not building a retractable roof for their new ballpark, April and May will be miserable there
I went to the Metrodome a few years back. An almost surreal experience. Indoor baseball is not good IMO.
Dome’s are just sad, depressing places to watch a game.
Never been to the Trop but at least it’s on nice bay.
Hey, it’ll be tough next April in their new stadium but those Twin fans are going to go nuts in the warm weather.
If Halladay is traded to the NL, that would already be a win for the Yankees, it’s one less thorn to worry about.
You’re right Pete. It’ll never happen. But it’s fun to speculate.
Would you give up either Joba or Hughes straight up for Halladay? Utter hogwash, I know, but fun to talk about.
The only way Roy Halladay comes to the Yankees is as a FA.
July 7th, 2009 at 4:26 pm
“Joba, Banelous, Jorge Vasquez, and Mike Dunn for Halladay”
Joba, along with an Low-A player, a 27-year old platoon player in Double AA and a wildly unproven reliever won’t even come close to getting it done.
Weather in Minnesota is supposed to get some T-Showers right around gametime…. there may be a delay to start the game tonight.
JP has 3 opportunities to move Halladay.
Now, the off-season or next trade deadline.
If he doesn’t move him, Doc leaves for 2 first round picks after next year when he becomes a free agent.
The question is, if he decides to trade him, when is his value at its greatest?
Also, if he decides to trade him, since Doc has a full no trade, and will want an extension to waive it, where can he trade him to fulfill everybody’s desires.
That limits his market extensively. Probably why its going to be tough to trade him.
Marcus that will be the first time there are ever thunderstorms inside a dome, in the history of sports.
Spending April in upstate NY is horrid enough; I can’t imagine how awful it will be in Minnesota.
So who wants to bet we open 2010 in Minneapolis/St. Paul?
Marcus July 7th, 2009 at 4:30 pm
Weather in Minnesota is supposed to get some T-Showers right around gametime…. there may be a delay to start the game tonight.
———————-
Metrodome. Emphasis on the “dome” part.
RT @YankeesPR: 7/7 lineup: Jeter SS, Damon LF, Teixeira 1B, Rodriguez 3B, Matsui DH, Swisher RF, Cano 2B, Gardner CF, Cervelli C, Sabathia P
Canó is still out of the five spot…. wonder why Melky’s getting the day off or if it’s just a random day off type thing.
Pete,
No offense, but picking up money from the Pirates says more about Hinske than the Yankee purse strings.
Totally agree with you about the division, though.
I think, too, Doc will have his say. Will be as picky as Peavy?
QUOTE
“You’re right Pete. It’ll never happen. But it’s fun to speculate.”
—–
Sure, like Tex wasn’t even close of coming to the bronx, remeber?
Riccardi hates us, he is not giving us Halladay. He’ll take a lesser package from LA, Philly, Mets etc. than give him to us.
===========================================================
…and 3 days later will be fired for not taking the best package for Halladay…you need to learn from the Twins’ Santana mistake – or else pay the price with your job….
I can see Nolan Ryan making a push to acquire Roy Halladay. Tough to say if it could happen with Tom Hicks defaulting on bond payments and the team ownership in disarray, but Texas has a ton of prospects and they can pull it off.
…
Looks like Baker has never faced the Yankees
http://www.baseball-reference......as=pitcher
joe waster-So Tex played in the AL East?
imagine if the Dodgers got Halladay this season
Nevermind, I’m lying. Stupid Match case was checked.
Baker is 2-0 with a 1.50 ERA against us in 2 starts. He has not faced us since 06, however.
So the fact that Pittsburgh agreed to eat $500k means the Yankees will never take on another big salary? I’m not buying that.
Also, while a trade for Halliday is obviously unlikely, let’s please avoid making any definitive pronouncements about what the Yankees are up to. Remember the Teixeira signing? Pete completely missed the boat on that one. (He wasn’t alone in this, but still.)
I doubt Halladay gets moved in the near future. Too many complications, he let Burnett walk, I don’t see why he couldn’t do the same with Halladay and pick up high compensation picks in return.
Dodgers with Halladay will easily win the WS.
I really hope Riccardi doesn’t help Torre win another ring, but considering he hates the Yanks, I wouldn’t consider it past JP to subtly tick off the Yanks by trading him to Torre…..
Pete, read the last thread. We make some valid points. But ultimately, I think most of us agree that he’s not getting moved (especially not in the AL East).
If we do Offer a very nice Package, there’s no way they turn it down PERIOD.
We got the tools for that deal, any doubt about this?
quote sab
“…and 3 days later will be fired for not taking the best package for Halladay…you need to learn from the Twins’ Santana mistake – or else pay the price with your job….”
If the yankees wants him, they’ll get him.
Twins did us a favor.
Too bad Halladay doesn’t play for Pittsburgh. If he did he’d already be on the Yankees by now. Or the Red Sox.
Let the Halladay rumors fly between now and the end of July to see how Joba changes his game approach if he thinks he’s part of the deal with no leverage whatsoever. This could be a good wakeup call. Joba likes the NYC scene and the serenity of Toronto is not for him.
Can someone fill me in on where all this Halliday talk started? My internet connection was down all day.
Jeter 1-5 (2b), BB, K
Damon 2-6 (2b), K
Teixeira 2-5 (HR)
Rodriguez 0-5, 3K
Matsui 0-3
Swisher 2-9, (2b, HR), BB, 3K
Canó 1-4
Gardner and Cervelli have not faced Baker
joe waster-We’d need to offer everything AND the kitchen sink to get Toronto to move Haladay in the division. I won’t say there’s no way it happens but it is very unlikely.
Halladay IS NOT getting traded to the Yankees.
Frank & Beans
July 7th, 2009 at 4:11 pm
I apologize to Pete about the picture. Im a big fan and would not to dis him.
Forgive me Pete. Your awesome for putting up with our garbage!
Real Pic
http://yankeesvoice.mlblogs.com/
ESPN – The Brewers are not happy with Ryan Braun’s recent call for some changes.
“It was inappropriate for him to say what he said, and I’m not happy about it,” general manager Doug Melvin told the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel on Monday.
“To make the statements he made and also get on his teammates like that, it was irresponsible on his part. It just ticked me off.”
Braun voiced his frustrations on Sunday after the team lost 8-2 to the rival Cubs, calling out the team’s starting pitching.
“[The Cubs] starting pitching is a lot better than ours,” Braun said. “They threw the ball a lot better than our starters did. They certainly swung the bats better than we did. Clearly they were the better team. It’s nice to get the one win but they clearly outplayed us and outperformed us all series.”
Braun then called out Melvin, looking for a bit of a shakeup.
“We’re at the point right now where it would be important for us to go out there and acquire somebody,” Braun said.
“I know [Melvin] is trying to make our ballclub better. I know he recognizes the importance of making a move and making it soon, but at the same time I think everybody’s recognized there’s a lot of teams that are still in the race.”
The Rangers arent going after Halladay. They just had to borrow money from MLB to stay in business.
So does this mean the Cano-#5 spot experiment is over? Hope so.
WYH,
Ricciardi said he’d be open to listening to offers for Doc. He actually had to clarify that he’s not trading Halladay, but that he’d be open to answering the phone and listening to offers.
He’s already talked to Doc about the possibility of being traded.
That means he’s gone.
Pete
I think you may be inflating Alex’s stats above.
The Rangers arent going after Halladay. They just had to borrow money from MLB to stay in business.
=======================================================
hmmm – how about cano and 5 million dollars for kinsler?
WTTCTOHA – you said: “It’ll never happen”
Just remember, the Jays still have to deal with Wells/Rios contracts before signing extension with Doc, that could lead for a huge trade (of course), but let’s say Hughes or Joba in the pack, won’t be hard to fill this package cause in my opinion THEY WILL TRADE.
Marcus
July 7th, 2009 at 4:30 pm
Weather in Minnesota is supposed to get some T-Showers right around gametime…. there may be a delay to start the game tonight.
——————
Ugh, I guess it was too much to ask 5 days in a row without a rain delay….
Reports are JP is putting him on the market to see if the offers are tempting.
The Jays have some issues. Their owner died and the rumors are that the baseball people are being told to shed payroll.
Nobody wants to take on Vernon Wells’ contract. Rios is a guy they still believe in and want to build around.
Doc is a FA after next year and JP is probably looking at when is the right time to deal him since the rumors around the industry is that he isn’t re-signing with the Jays.
Hence, today’s stories about his availablity.
As far as the Rangers? They have the prospects but, they don’t have the cash until they are sold.
So far, no real buyers have emerged for the franchise.
Last I heard, Nolan Ryan is trying to put together a group to buy the team from Tom Hicks.
“The Rangers arent going after Halladay. They just had to borrow money from MLB to stay in business.
=======================================================
hmmm – how about cano and 5 million dollars for kinsler?”
In a heartbeat.
Wave:
Olney and Heyman have both said that Ricardi is willing to listen. And that he asked Halladay if he’d be open to move if the right deal came down the pike. Obviosuly that doesnt mean he’ll get moved. But it did strike up the conversation.
Thanks, m.
It must be awfully frustrating being a Jays fan. Probably the 6th best team in the AL, and the team is already thinking about dumping talent, I guess.
“Weather in Minnesota is supposed to get some T-Showers right around gametime…. there may be a delay to start the game tonight.
——————
Ugh, I guess it was too much to ask 5 days in a row without a rain delay….”
AHAHAHAHAHAHAH
Uh, dude, game’s indoors tonight.
The Twins play in a dome. There won’t be a rain delay.
Hopefully, we won’t have more “ugh another rain delay” posts after folks figure out the dome actually prevents rain delays.
“hmmm – how about cano and 5 million dollars for kinsler?”
Haha sure I’ll take that deal!
If you’re the Blue Jays and you’re thinking about trading with the Yankees, do you insist on Joba or Hughes? (or Aceves
)
Rain delay? It’s a dome.
joe waster-Hyperbole.
I really doubt it’ll happen. But no, I don’t think there’s absolutely no chance whatsoever. I give it less than a ten percent chance of landing Halladay though.
I’d be totally thrilled if we got him, though.
And I doubt they will trade in division. They are a team that is getting better. Why would they trade their bets player to one of the teams that could hurt them the most?
Tank-They play in a dome.
Anyone but Montero for Halladay
They can have Joba or Hughes
What rain delay?
The Twins play in a dome the last time I checked.
Tank is probably thinking two years ahead.
Is that what domes do????????
bets is best.
“Let the Halladay rumors fly between now and the end of July to see how Joba changes his game approach if he thinks he’s part of the deal with no leverage whatsoever. This could be a good wakeup call. Joba likes the NYC scene and the serenity of Toronto is not for him.”
thats an interesting angle…it could either give him that reality check thats says hes not untouchable and needs to perform better OR it could send him into a downward spiraling tube of anxiety and despair (im banking on the first option)
Halladay/Chapman > one of Joba/Hughes
When you have a chance to get a guy like Halladay, you do it.
ITS A DOME!
What rain delay
Guys, I think both people were joking. Everyone knows it’s a dome. Right? Right?!
Imagine playing outdoors in Minneapolis in late March/April?
“# Rebecca–Optimist Prime July 7th, 2009 at 4:43 pm
“The Rangers arent going after Halladay. They just had to borrow money from MLB to stay in business.
=======================================================
hmmm – how about cano and 5 million dollars for kinsler?”
In a heartbeat.
”
so I should hold off on buying a Cano jersey?:(
I’m a big fan of Cano’s swing and hope he can be a little more consistent and successful w/ RISP….but I’m a big fan of Kinsler too, he got hosed w/ the all star vote w/ lucky charm man getting his spot
Jackson, Montero and Melancon should get you Roy Halladay.
JP has said he really doesn’t see the Jays and Halladay having a future after next season.
So the question is: Does JP think they can win a world series between now and then??
If the answer is no…then they HAVE to deal him!
WTTC-
In my opinion whoever takes DOC, must give him whatever he wants for extesion right? So then, you give a bunch of good prospects + extension.
Can you list teams that can afford it? (beside yankees of course)
My prediction:
Yankees
Phillies
Jays (they trade him on the offseason after CY win)
jfinfonsfosnf-No way Montero is being traded.
“Imagine playing outdoors in Minneapolis in late March/April?”
It’s been done before, and in 2011 will be done again.
Will it be raining inside the dome?
What rain delay
jfinfonsfosnf
July 7th, 2009 at 4:49 pm
Jackson, Montero and Melancon should get you Roy Halladay.
++++++++++++++++
Yeah it would. That’s why you don’t offer that much.
Um I think the original poster was joking.
Nice to see Cano dropped to seventh. Mental mistakes, nonchalant attitude and terrible average with RISP deserves nothing less.
Earn it back Robbie. That’s the only way he should move up from that 7 spot.
I think tonight’s game might be delayed, the Minneapolis CostCo ran out of Hefty bags.
If the Yanks trade Monstero I am no longer a Yankees fan.
As addicted as Brandon is to Tabata?
I’m more addicted to Montero.
“Joe Mauer (5 of 16, 2 home runs, 3 RBI) and Justin Morneau (9 of 16, 3 homers, 5 RBI) destroyed the Yankees back in May. The duo scored seven runs and drew eight walks.”
Really? Destroyed? I thought the Yankees swept that series. May have been more accurate to say that they hit well in a losing effort. Or that they were the only Twins who put up a fight in the destruction by the Yanks.
In fact, in an exclusive interview with The Post, Cashman strongly indicated the Yankees will not even sign Sabathia and Teixeira in tandem.
“At the pricetags I have read, that is fantasy land, not reality land,” Cashman said yesterday of bringing in Sabathia and Teixeira. A Yankees executive said the club has not even created scenarios for assembling a 2009 roster in which it signs the most attractive starter and position player in the free-agent market.
“There has been speculation that we can pull down two or three of the top [free agents], and people are just getting carried away. That is not feasible. That is completely unrealistic.”
http://www.nypost.com/seven/11.....138588.htm
I’m coming down from the Halladay trade rumors. . I think the yanks should stand pat. .and look for another solid number 3 pitcher. someone like Doug Davis
Why don’t we go back and get all the Santana threads, and substitute “Halliday” for “Santana”. The arguments will be exactly the same, except now the Yanks have added CC and AJ.
joe waster-There is definitely a “too much” point.
If the Jays ask for (and they very well could) Hughes/Joba, AJax, Montero, Melancon, and Brackman, you don’t do it.
For that matter, you could take out Melancon (just picking a random name) and they still don’t do it.
jfinfonsfosnf July 7th, 2009 at 4:49 pm
Jackson, Montero and Melancon should get you Roy Halladay.
————————-
I’d walk away from any package that included Montero.
Nice job rebutting the myth that Canadians are incapable of being unfriendly Rebecca, poor little Kenneth haha
Domed stadiums should be banned.
Zolio-Bwahahahaha…
Cashman, you kidder you…
“I’m coming down from the Halladay trade rumors. . I think the yanks should stand pat. .and look for another solid number 3 pitcher. someone like Doug Davis”
This I like. What’d it take to get him?
The Blue Jays have a ton of OF’s in their farm system. I don’t think they are looking for an OF, which takes Jackson off the table.
Hughes or Joba would definitely have to be one part of a deal.
I think another pitcher would also have to be included.
Montero is off limits. Austin Romine could be a deal because the Yankees have a ton of catching depth and the Jays are light in their system of catching prospects.
Jackson, Montero and Melancon should get you Roy Halladay.
————————-
I’d walk away from any package that included Montero.
______________________________________________________
i’m still sticking with take montero out of the deal include wang and romine AND take on Wells contract and halladay will be pitching in a yankee uniform on August 1st
“Why don’t we go back and get all the Santana threads, and substitute “Halliday” for “Santana”. The arguments will be exactly the same, except now the Yanks have added CC and AJ.”
Agreed.
But on that point of view, we will end up with Halladay if Jays has learnt something about the past. Right?
I still remember, I was just a lurker when all the Santana trade stuff was going on. Who was that insider person again? Bobcat? Bobkitten?
Memories
Yanks will not trade Jesus. You dont trade one of the top 10 bats in all of Milb. Those you hold on to.
Igawa for Halladay, stright up!
And Ransom for David Wrihgt, and Pena for Hanley Ramirez, and Swisher (he plays first base) for Pujols, and Cervelli for Mauer, and…
Oh that Bobcat.
You hear what they want you to hear…
Want to create payroll for Halladay? Simple.
Let Damon/Matsui walk and replace them with Monstero next year.
$27 million freed up.
For those willing to give up Joba, Hughes, or both for Halladay, think back to the Santana non-deal. It looked like a bad move last year when Phil couldn’t get anybody out, but with him pitching well now, and Santana starting to lose some effectiveness; I am glad that move was never made. And Santana is younger than Halladay. I think it would be a short-sighted move that would work out for a season or two, but that’s it. Then we would be haunted by the former Yankee pitchers for years to come.
To get someone like Doug Davis . a couple of mid level prospects !. With Joba rocky .. Wang Hurt .and Pettite hot and cold. .We could use another solid pitcher
Rebecca–Optimist Prime
July 7th, 2009 at 4:51 pm
If the Yanks trade Monstero I am no longer a Yankees fan.
As addicted as Brandon is to Tabata?
I’m more addicted to Montero.
***
But you are nowhere near Betsy/Phil Hughes levels
Why don’t we go back and forth on the “Cashman said they will never sign Tex” threads while we are at it.
If Halladay is on the market, really on the market and not just JP talking out of his butt again, the Yankees will be right in the middle of those talks.
Especially if the Red Sox are because that’s what got ownership to give Cash the money to sign Tex. They didn’t want to see Tex in Boston.
Hal Steinbrenner wants no part of Roy Halladay in Boston.
If he’s actually on the market, the Yankees will be all over it.
Mark in Tampa-I doubt Santana is losing effectiveness…more probably a slump.
The Blue Jays have a ton of OF’s in their farm system. I don’t think they are looking for an OF, which takes Jackson off the table.
Hughes or Joba would definitely have to be one part of a deal.
I think another pitcher would also have to be included.
Montero is off limits. Austin Romine could be a deal because the Yankees have a ton of catching depth and the Jays are light in their system of catching prospects.
______________________________________________________
SJ44 you don’t think including a healthy wang instead of hughes or joba and kicking in another high end prospect (melancon?) with romine, and 1 other above average AAA pitcher (mccalister) and they take on Wells contract wouldn’t do it?
Rule of thumb: Any player is obtainable for the right price.
The question is what you are willing to pay.
Yah, I think the Yankees got to kick the tires on Halladay.
And really tough to put the horse back in the barn after you open the door.
There’s no future for Halladay in Toronto, like there was no future for Santana in minny.
Different situation. I doubt Toronto is dealing within the division.
Yankees AND Red Sox will talk, but I don’think either team, or the Rays, or the Orioles for that matter, are going to get Halladay.
“Rebecca–Optimist Prime
July 7th, 2009 at 4:51 pm
If the Yanks trade Monstero I am no longer a Yankees fan.
As addicted as Brandon is to Tabata?
I’m more addicted to Montero.
***
But you are nowhere near Betsy/Phil Hughes levels”
just wait and see…people change…it happens fast..they say montero is like a drug..you get addicted so fast but you dont realize it…soon she’ll be hustling people for money in order for her to get her Jesus tattoo!
Remember: they only Twitter what they want you to Twitter.
“Hal Steinbrenner wants no part of Roy Halladay in Boston.
If he’s actually on the market, the Yankees will be all over it.”
Bingo, SJ. We’re going to be right in the thick of this pursuit. It’s all setup for us to do so.
Should NY consider a Wang OR Hughes trade-combo FOR Roy “Doc” Halladay???
TOR is taking offers.
I’d trade either and then some. Both? Maybe.
-he’s the best ace in the league.
What will Red Sox put up???
Rays???
Yanks on 9 for 11 roll.
Kudos to Jorge “En Fuego” Posada.
“To get someone like Doug Davis . a couple of mid level prospects !. With Joba rocky .. Wang Hurt .and Pettite hot and cold. .We could use another solid pitcher”
Except that Doug Davis isn’t really a solid pitcher. He’s got a solid ERA no doubt, but he walks over 4 batters per 9 innings and would let up a TON of home runs in Yankee Stadium, which isn’t saying much since everybody lets up a ton here.
Montero will not be in the Big Leagues next year until June/July, and that is a stretch, because that would mean he has to get promoted to AAA this year. Maybe a september call up next year, and he starts next year in AAA. He is only what, 19? You dont rush those kinds of players
Ramey-Solid ERA is the important thing.
With or without Halladay, the Jays has no chance making the playoffs, let’s say for the next 3-4 years. That’s my point why I believe they can deal him within the division.
“I doubt Santana is losing effectiveness…more probably a slump”
What about all the talk last season that his fastball was off by @3MPH? Also, he is in the NL. Whether it is a slump or decline, do you think that would play out very well with Yankee fans? Hughes in Minn would almost certainly have been in the rotation the past two seasons. If he was doing well, the pressure on Santana would have been unbearable, IMO.
SJ44-
If you do go back to the Tex threads, you will see me insisting they would sign Tex.
Having signed Tex, CC, and AJ, I am much less sanguine about the Yanks wanting to add Halliday as well. But don’t let my pessimism/realism rain on your parade.
“Let Damon/Matsui walk and replace them with Monstero next year.”
Projecting Montero to hit 29 HR, 34 2B’s, 4 3B’s and 87 RBI’s by July 6th of next year is probably a little aggressive, don’t you think?
Frankly, if Doc is really on the market, the Jays have no better matchup than the Yankees.
It fulfills all they would need to get a big return for him and have him waive his no trade.
They would get their catcher of the future (Romine).
A good, young starter (Joba or Hughes).
The spare parts of the deal would be the spare parts. None of which would be dealbreakers.
JP could tell ownership he got a bigger return for Doc than Minnesota got for Santana. Which would be the truth.
The Yankees get him, still keep one of Joba and Hughes, keep Montero, and can (if they choose) replace the young pitcher they lost by signing Chapman in the off-season.
Its one of those rare moments in these type of deals where the Yankees not only have the personnel to give up….giving up the personnel won’t shut down the farm system for years. That’s how much depth they have in the system at the present time.
The money? I ain’t drinkin’ the Yankee Kool Aid about the payroll anymore.
Two years ago, they anted up for Clemens and paid him stupid money for a half season of work.
This off-season, there was “no way” they could sign AJ, CC and Tex in one off-season. How did that turn out?
When the Yankees turn away from a guy like Doc Halladay because of money, let me know becuase it will be a first.
If he does end up getting traded, and the Yankees don’t get him, it won’t be because of money, IMO.
Brandon probably thinks those Tex threads aren’t too awesome.
Anyone here been to Citifield? Im going tonight (6th row above the Dodgers dugout)and curious to see how it stacks up against YS.
“Montero will not be in the Big Leagues next year until June/July, and that is a stretch, because that would mean he has to get promoted to AAA this year. Maybe a september call up next year, and he starts next year in AAA. He is only what, 19? You dont rush those kinds of players”
Actually it is not entirely out of the question that Montero skips AAA entirely.
Right now–and we need the rest of the season at AA to be sure–but right now it looks like he’ll learn much more, at least defensively from the likes of Tony Peña, Joe Girardi and JoPo than the marginally better pitching at AAA.
Davis wouldn’t be really an “upgrade” over the recent ineffectiveness of Pettitte or Joba. He’s a 5th starter at best, but why would the Yankees trade anybody for that when they could call up the likes of an Igawa or a Mitre who would provide you roughly the same thing; innings.
joe waster-I disagree. They have a shot (outside, but a shot THIS YEAR. Next year I can definitely see them making a move.
Mark-People forget that he won a Cy Young in Minnesota. The AL.
Santana will start pitching consistently like Santana again soon, you wait and see. He always does great on the stretch run.
“And Livan Hernandez keeps getting away with looking good in pitchers parks or good defensive units behind him. He gives up way to many hits and would be a disaster in Yankee stadium.
Don’t know why everyone on this blog keeps advocating him.”
jerkface-
you knucklehead. it’s an inside joke that started when i used livan to point out the folly of cashman pitching hughes and kennedy last spring for 40 % of the rotation.
i was challenged to come up with someone better than hughes and kennedy so i looked and came up with livan. then because he won so much despite not being very good it became the in joke with nick in sf leading the way .
livan is still better than you think though. he’d win 15 games with the yankees. he’d throw that soft little inside fastball to lefties and they’d hit it into the upper deck foul for a strike and he’d own them then. he’s smarter than people give him credit for. he really know how to pitch.
of course with his lack of stuff he has to pitch smart or he’d get killed every time out.
Santana was 29 and was on the decline. He had the highest ERA of his career as a starter in 2007. There were questions about his elbow and he stopped throwing his slider in the 2nd half. He also has a small-ish frame and were questions if he would hold up… he is also a change-up pitcher that was starting to lose FB velocity.
Doc is completely different. He is getting better as he gets older. He has the perfect pitchers frame. No warning signs like they were for Santana. Doc is going to age much better than a Santana will.
If you need to trade one of Hughes or Joba for Halladay, you do it in a heartbeat.
Here is the beauty of all this from the Yankees perspective….
They have to know they have the parts to do the deal.
If Toronto balks, the Yankees walk away, no harm, no foul.
Where does Toronto go?
Doc has a full no trade and isn’t just going to waive it for nothing.
If Toronto doesn’t deal him, they get 2 picks for him. Not a good tradeoff for them.
The economy severely limits legitimate, available suitors.
The Yankess and Doc, more than JP and the Jays, control this situation.
This is why you stockpile the farm system again folks.
It gives you options when a guy like this hits the market.
If you can’t make a deal? No problem.
But, if you can? You own the AL East from a rotation standpoint, for the next 3-4 years.
second parenthesis after YEAR.
Santana was a legitimate contender for Cy Young last year. He pitched otherworldly down the stretch.
SJ-
Sounds like you want Halladay, but who wouldn’t. If you had to give up either Hughes or Joba as part of the deal, who would you choose?
My guess is Joba.
Eric-What about the groin problems this year?
I am a HUGE fan of Halladay, he is my second favoite non Yankee pitcher in baseball besides Linececum.
Figure on signing 32 yo Doc Halladay for 25M/year for 5-6 years, and giving up major league and top quality AAA talent also. Yes I’d like him, but I don’t see it happening.We already spent our Wad on AJ and CC.
We don’t need Doug Davis either, who would cost us very little if we’re picking up his salary.
We need another reliable bullpen arm, keep Cano in the 7 or 8 hole, fast track Pena to learn the OF, as our super utility guy!
If the Yankees got Santana it wouldn’t have been bad for the Yanks, but Sabathia and Burnett ultimately cost less b/c you didn’t have to give up your best prospects to get them.
All’s fair in my eyes.
you knucklehead. it’s an inside joke that started when i used livan to point out the folly of cashman pitching hughes and kennedy last spring for 40 % of the rotation.
—
Well thank the good lord it was a joke then. I thought you all were serious. I understand that Livan is smart enough to work around his deficiencies, that is why he is still employed in the majors. I just wasnt a big fan of his deficiencies or efficiencies :O
And I think Hughes + kennedy last year was absolutely the right move, it just turned into poop.
If you could guarantee me that Joba will grow up and find his missing velocity…. then I will trade Hughes for Halladay, no question.
Buddy Biancalana-I’d give up Hughes.
“Frankly, if Doc is really on the market, the Jays have no better matchup than the Yankees.”
I totally disagree. The Yankees are in the same division, why would they want to give the best pitcher in baseball to a division rival? It makes no sense.
Philly is the perfect fit IMO. Big market team, desperately needs the pitching, have enough prospects to make a deal.
I’ll take it one step further….
Andrew Brackman is struggling coming off TJ Surgery.
Despite his struggles, he has great upside and scouts still believe in him.
What if the Yankees put a Hughes or Joba, Brackman and Romine offer on the table for Halladay?
Who tops that deal AND can pay Doc what he wants?
That’s how much depth is in the system right now.
None of it may happen. However, to have the parts to make a deal happen is 50% of a deal actually being able to happen.
The Yankees have the parts. Its just a matter of whether or not the Jays can do better on the open market.
UPDATE, 4:09 p.m.: The Yankees released Angel Berroa today.
The economy being what it is will see more teams than ever looking to shed payroll and certain teams cautious about adding payroll at the 7/31 trading deadline.
Attendance is down for most teams with many fans making a conscious decision where their sports dollars can go, baseball or football.
Teams don’t like waving a white flag but for some it’s necessary.
Rebecca-There is something to the idea that not making the Santana deal leaves us in better shape (I wouldn’t say good, but better) shape to get Halladay.
Wait till they come to OUR house AGAIN,
I don’t know if Santana is in decline or not, but he went from the AL to the NL, and all of his rate stats are getting worse. K/BB, BB/9, and hits/9 are all worse in a supposedly easier league over a season and a half. His K/9 is better than last year, but still worse than his AL numbers, and he faces the pitcher 3X per game. It is not a sharp decline, but it is noticeable coming from the peak he was; and considering what the Yanks would have had to give up to get him.
I think there is next to no chance that Toronto trades Halladay to the Yankees.
I think our bullpen is set . .Hughes Bruney , Ace , Coke. we are good there .
We really could use another starter .
Wow, Sabathia must really hate pitching to Posada for Girardi to sit him down when he’s so hot at the plate.
Poor Berroa..
“Rebecca-There is something to the idea that not making the Santana deal leaves us in better shape (I wouldn’t say good, but better) shape to get Halladay.”
Indeed.
I still think anyone that deals Monstero for anyone less than Pujols should be taken out back…
Patrick-I’m with you on that one.
SJ44- You make some good points about Halladay, but they only get two picks if Toronto offers arbitration. If Holliday accepts arbitration, he could be looking at the highest one year contract ever awarded a pitcher, which would further weaken Toronto’s balance sheet.
Aura-Or Posada’s getting a break and they figure they don’t need to score as many w/CC pitching.
One of the 2.
“Toronto won’t trade Halladay within the AL east”
:yeah,sure– unlike Cone, Wells the Perfect and Clemens. …Who were the “best in the league” as NY was winning rings.
…”Prospects or compensatory for DOC HALLADAY?”
Get serious.
“We lost Santana”–true, but did so FOR Sabathia.
And are now in place to dish HUGHES (maybe Wang) for Halladay.
Its brilliant. And serious.
Prospects. LOL
NY can solve their future with a serious offer FOR Toronto.
Cano and Wang?
Hughes–straight up?
Etc etc etc
The rotation would be
Doc, CC, AJ, Joba, Pettitte
Wow! Unbeatable.
It would cost hughes and maybe cano or melky.
SJ44,
Even if the Yankees have the best offer TOronto could very easily say “No thanks we’ll wait until the offseason/next trade deadline/we’ll take the picks”
Toronto isn’t going to give Halladay to the Yankees unless they get a king’s ransom. And Cashman isn’t dumb enough to do that.
What are Farah Faucett and Michael Jackson getting for Christmas this year?
There were some red flags with Santana. There are seemingly none with Halladay. He is not your typical 32 yr old starter. Someone like AJ Burnett is probably not going to age very well. A guy like Halladay will. He is the type of guy who can pitch till 40 with his smooth mechanics and pitching aptitude.
It makes perfect sense Patrick because the Yankees are giving up more talent than the Phillies have in any deal.
The Blue Jays have to get back talent in return for Doc. If not, they can take the draft picks.
Doc also has to approve a trade.
He goes to NY, he doesn’t have to learn a new league.
He probably would rather play in NY than Philadelphia.
That’s my point. Its not about trading within the division.
In a perfect world, JP wouldn’t want to trade within the division.
However, he knows the Yankees, and the Red Sox for that matter, have better, closer to ML ready prospects, as well as guys on the 25 man roster right now, that are better than anything the Phillies put on the table.
Plus, he probably knows Doc would approve a deal to either NY or Boston.
The no trade clause is huge in this and Doc will use it to better himself and not the Blue Jays.
I’m not so sure Montero grows up to be a catcher.
Personally, I’d rather save the Halliday money to bid on Joe Mauer when he becomes a free agent. We’ll want to keep him away from the Red Sox, too.
I think the Yanks are going to have a super rotation even without Halliday.
Paddy-A bit different than the Wells Clemens scenario. Toronto are contenders now.
Halladay HAS to be a lock for the Hall of Fame, right? In the last 9 seasons he’s had TWO years with an ERA over 3.25 while pitching in the toughest division in baseball. Over that time he’s had a 3.16 ERA with FORTY ONE complete games and ELEVEN complete game shut outs. His WHIP over that time is 1.13.
Buddy,
I’ve been trying to get people to answer the question of which of Hughes or Joba would Toronto insist on as key piece. No luck so far.
It’s a toss-up, Joba’s got upside, but Hughes has shown flashes as well.
Brackman has very little value at this point. He is struggling in single A and has a major league contract.
SJ44-New Yankee Stadium Launching pad may be a problem. Who’s to say Halladay wants to pitch here?
When is the last time the Phillies paid someone $20+ million?
They have the prospects to get him, but will they pay him? Same thing with the Dodgers.
Halladay is from Colorado. The team that NYY has to worry about would be the Angels, probably more than Boston.
He’s not giving up a kings ransom for him. That’s my point.
Hughes or Joba, Brackman, and Romine for example aren’t a “kings ransom.
Its actually a fair, sellable deal for both sides.
The Yankees still keep one of their young stud starters.
They still have Montero and Cervelli as young catchers in the system.
They still have several well regarded Single A pitching prospects.
Its probably the best deal he can get, unless the Red Sox step up bigtime.
The no trade, limited teams because of the economy, and the tight windows to move him, dictate this deal.
Toronto has to trade him unless they can unload Vernon Wells’ contract.
He’s getting traded, IMO. The issue is, where and the terms at this point.
While no. 27 brings up HOF discussion, here’s an interesting question: If Moose gets into the Hall, who does he go in as, an Oriole or a Yankee? He pitched longer as an Oriole but all his WS appearances and most (if not all, I’m not sure) of his playoff appearances are with the Yankees, as well as his only 20 win season. What do you guys think?
Burnett should privately tell Halladay to try and facilitate a trade to the Yankees. Remember, he has the NTC, the power is in his hands.
I’d say less than 5% chance Halladay ever wears a Yankee uniform. Less than 1% chance he is traded to the Yankees this year.
Trust me guys these numbers are based on highly scientific calculations. You wouldn’t understand, just trust me.
“Personally, I’d rather save the Halliday money to bid on Joe Mauer when he becomes a free agent. We’ll want to keep him away from the Red Sox, too.”
Disagree.
We are LOADED at C in our system. Mon(s)tero will likely be ready first–and a bat that good you play regardless of defense which is not as bad as you think–and Cervelli has shown he’s not an automatic out either.
Then you’ve got Romine, Higashiosa (sp?) Murphy and Sanchez, a 16 yr old who will play THIS YEAR with the GCL Yankees.
Mark July 7th, 2009 at 5:20 pm
When is the last time the Phillies paid someone $20+ million?
They have the prospects to get him, but will they pay him? Same thing with the Dodgers.
—————————
Brewers didn’t have a problem with it. If a team like the Dodgers can win now and next year with Halladay, they’d bite the bullet and take the picks for him when he walks.
Can’t believe Hinski isn’t playing! I thought Girardi stated he was going to use Hinski against RHP. Also, Hinski had a great game yesterday…against a LHP. Is this another case of not being able to believe anything he says and/or another case of Girardi mismangement. By the way, I think its both.
“Hughes or Joba, Brackman, and Romine for example aren’t a “kings ransom. ”
Exactly, and if that was the offer Ricciardi would consider it for about 2 seconds then say “no thanks we’ll wait for a better offer or draft picks, bye. *click*”
Ricciardi wouldn’t trade him within the division unless the Yanks offer a lot more than what you are saying.
Higashioka
___________
They’d move the fences back 20 feet if they had to. They’re probably going to anyway.
Red Sox need pitching just as badly as we do.
I wouldn’t doubt they offer Bowden, Masterson, and Bard for Doc.
Brackman’s struggles hasn’t hurt him among many scouts. A lot of scouts still think he has big upside, making him valuable, ML contract or not.
Joe Mauer will never hit free agency.
The Twins will sign him to a long term deal.
They will generate over 50 million more to their bottom line once their new, publicly financed stadium opens next year.
One of the reasons they dealt Santana was to put that money (for his future contract) toward a new Mauer deal.
Mauer will be a career Twin, as Kirby Puckett was back in the day.
“Can’t believe Hinski isn’t playing! I thought Girardi stated he was going to use Hinski against RHP. Also, Hinski had a great game yesterday…against a LHP. Is this another case of not being able to believe anything he says and/or another case of Girardi mismangement. By the way, I think its both”
Mel, he’s not going to play every day. He’ll play once a week most likely. And if you’re going to criticize Girardi for not playing him, you may want to at least spell Hinske’s name right
“We are LOADED at C in our system. Mon(s)tero will likely be ready first–and a bat that good you play regardless of defense which is not as bad as you think–and Cervelli has shown he’s not an automatic out either.”
Rebecca-
We have a lot of catchers but unless Montero hits paydirt I don’t think we are loaded. I think it’s too soon to say where Montero will play. If he’s not ready, Cervelli isn’t going to cut it, IMO. Joe Mauer is a pretty good catcher.
Patrick,
Then he loses him for draft picks. A much lesser offer than what’s on the table in my proposed deal.
You can always add a few lower level guys to sweeten the pot.
However, few if any teams can put a better offer on the table than the Yankees if Hughes or Joba are one of the components in the deal along with Austin Romine.
Hughes, Brackman, Romine for Halladay?
Without hesitation
I think Mussina is one that will be his decision. The HOF says they take the players wishes into account, but they make the final choice. With Moose, the accomplishments are close enough with either team that I think his choice would stand. That said, it doesn’t look real good for him getting in, unfortunately.
I’m not giving up Hughes or Joba for Halladay – great, now we have the Santana thing all over again. I wouldn’t trade Hughes for Santana and I’m not for trading him now.
“Rebecca-
We have a lot of catchers but unless Montero hits paydirt I don’t think we are loaded. I think it’s too soon to say where Montero will play. If he’s not ready, Cervelli isn’t going to cut it, IMO. Joe Mauer is a pretty good catcher.”
We’ll see when Mauer is a FA, what Mon(s)tero’s doing and the rest.
We can go from there.
Try and get that Hawaiian reliever from Toronto in the Halladay trade
SJ44, I don’t think either the Yankees or the Red Sox will get Halladay simply because it is the best trade that Riccardi can get. I think there will be an in division rival premium for either the Red Sox or the Yankees.
Trading the orgainzation’s signature player to one of the two teams that perennial beat out the Jays would be a tough sell to the Blue Jay fanbase.
It has to look like Riccardi got MORE than a pound of flesh from either Epstein or Cashman for him to pull the trigger.
Personally, I wouldn’t trade Halladay to the Yanks unless I got Hughes or Chaimberlain AND Montero AND another prospect.
And from the Red Sox, I would want Bucholz + A LOT more.
This is Roy Halladay. In division. To a team that kicks our butt every year. If I am selling this to my fan base, the trade has to seem lopsided in MY favor.
” I thought you all were serious.”
jerkface-
just little old me was serious.
a person had to be baseball dumber than a door nail to think kennedy and hughes were going to be better than livan last year.
“And I think Hughes + kennedy last year was absolutely the right move, it just turned into poop.”
the same thing happened inside cashman’s head too.
Hughes, Brackman, Romine for Halladay.
If I’m the Jays I say “NO” and hang up. That’s simply not enough for Halladay.
You’re kidding yourself if you think the Phillies won’t offer more than that.
Mark in Tampa-Really? Moose has I think a decent chance after that final season.
Betsy-Halladay is IMO better than Santana.
“We’ll see when Mauer is a FA, what Mon(s)tero’s doing and the rest.
We can go from there.”
Yep. And if and when that day comes, I want the $$$ to be available to get Mauer.
Trade one of Hughes or Joba, along with a couple of other guys is not excess at all.
This is Doc Halladay, not Jarrod Washburn.
Olney mentions the Yankees too, just like Heyman did.
Said 50/50 he gets moved before the deadline this year and almost “certainly” before ST next year.
“I wouldn’t doubt they offer Bowden, Masterson, and Bard for Doc.”
They actually wouldn’t, Olney just said he spoke to the RS FO and they aren’t likely to deal the young arms for Doc, they’d rather land a position prospect like Hanley or a Justin Smoak from Texas.
Observer283-I agree.
Montero is the only one who should be off-limits for Halladay
Honestly, I hope Mauer is a career Twin. I don’t want the Yankees to sign him.
Is that wrong? It just feels like a sin for him to leave Minnesota.
Brandon-Bet they’re lying.
“Hughes, Brackman, Romine for Halladay.
If I’m the Jays I say “NO” and hang up. That’s simply not enough for Halladay.
You’re kidding yourself if you think the Phillies won’t offer more than that.”
thats fine…let the phillies get him…its not the yanks god given right to trade or sign every good player…we have good players…we dont NEED roy
Brandon… I’M AWESOME ! July 7th, 2009 at 5:32 pm
“I wouldn’t doubt they offer Bowden, Masterson, and Bard for Doc.”
They actually wouldn’t, Olney just said he spoke to the RS FO and they aren’t likely to deal the young arms for Doc, they’d rather land a position prospect like Hanley or a Justin Smoak from Texas.
————————
Beckett and Lowell for Hanley maybe?
If the Yankees trade for Roy Halladay, it can’t be solely to keep him out of Boston.
That reeks of desperation, and the worst trades are made out of desperation.
If the Yankees are in on Halladay, then the Red Sox are going to be in on Halladay, if only to drive up the price. And vice-versa.
Giving up either Joba or Hughes is a given, if Halladay is ever to become a Yankee.
But that deal can’t turn into Joba or Hughes plus, Montero, and Jackson or McAllister because the Yankees don’t want to see him become a Red Sox.
It’s better for both the Yankees and the Red Sox if Halladay goes to the NL. The Phillies seem the most logical fit, and have the prospects to make it happen.
I don’t think there’s anyway the Yankees get Halladay, but…
With Damon, Matsui, and Pettitte free agents next year the Yankees COULD make a really strong offer that would be hard for the Blue Jays to turn down:
Phil Hughes, Melky Cabrera/Brett Gardner, and Austin Romine
FOR
Roy Halladay and Vernon Wells
This gives the Jays 2 very good young players they can control for years and clears both big contracts from their pay roll. For the Yankees, they add another ace at a reasonable price. They are the only team that can afford to carry Wells’ contract with Matsui and Damon leaving.
Red Sox are going to be in the bidding just to tick us off.
They wouldn’t be doing their jobs if they didn’t. Just like the Santana trade.
How many top end prospects did the Twins get for Santana?
Or Cleveland for CC. No one gives up more then one, maybe two high end prospects for anyone. Period.
no.27 July 7th, 2009 at 5:33 pm
I don’t think there’s anyway the Yankees get Halladay, but…
With Damon, Matsui, and Pettitte free agents next year the Yankees COULD make a really strong offer that would be hard for the Blue Jays to turn down:
Phil Hughes, Melky Cabrera/Brett Gardner, and Austin Romine
FOR
Roy Halladay and Vernon Wells
This gives the Jays 2 very good young players they can control for years and clears both big contracts from their pay roll. For the Yankees, they add another ace at a reasonable price. They are the only team that can afford to carry Wells’ contract with Matsui and Damon leaving.
———————–
Wouldn’t go near Wells with a 10 foot pole. Check his rapid decline.
UPDATE, 4:09 p.m.: The Yankees released Angel Berroa today.
I remember seeing him shagging flies at the exhibition game against the Cubs and thinking that this was probably the last day he was going to wear the pinstripes.
He hung around a lot longer than expected.
Got to give it up to the guy. He fought the good fight. Dudes from that generation are as tough as nails.
Patrick-
As a baseball fan I see your point of view on Mauer. But, I can’t see sentiment stopping the Yanks from bidding on him, and if they do, the Yanks like to be top dollar.
So you would rather have one of Joba or Hughes instead of Chapman AND Halalday?
“Beckett and Lowell for Hanley maybe? ”
Exactly, that type.
No matter what Riccardi does, he’s probably gone [fired] by the end of this season.
IMO, if Halladay gets paid his 15.75M due him in his last season, 2010, he’ll be traded by the deadline, because I don’t see the Jays taking the chance offering him arbitration and him getting the biggest one year payday awarded.
m: I have not answered your Hughes/Joba question because, frankly, I’m not sure.
I agree with you that 3 months ago it would have been a much easier question to answer, so kudos to Master Philip for reminding us all how great we used to and again do think he can be.
By the way, I think I’ve read almost every one of these posts talking about potential rotations with Halladay and I don’t think anyone has included Chien-ming Wang. Unless this trade is going down in July, I like him in the rotation too and I do NOT want to send him to Canadia!
The Phillies don’t have anyone as good as Hughes or Joba to offer.
Does TOR want a volume package with a couple of good players or that one super prospect?
SJ, any proposal that starts with Phil is a no-no for me. I wouldn’t trade Joba either – I’m really not interested in trading either of those two kids, so frankly that’s where my Halladay interest ends.
For all the absurd love that y’all have been giving Joba for the past few weeks, you sure seem eager to trade him to a much older fresh off the DL DOC. One day it’s hail Joba in all his glory stay with him and he will be the ace. Next day Doc is on the block and off with Joba’s head. Make up your mind!
I wonder what we can get for Igawa?
a. Bad shades
b. Bucket of balls
c. Shattered maple bats
d. A free one week vacation in Japan
e. Lilly’s j-strap
f. ??
Not a given Chapman’s stuff pans out in the Majors, or that he’s 21 and not 26.
Halladay >>> Joba >>> 90% of other AL starters.
Please explain the difference between Doc and Santana. Some of the same people that didn’t want to give up Hughes (forget Joba, he was never involved) for Santana now have no problem giving him up for an older pitcher. No thanks – I think Doc is remarkable, but…..no.
21-Even if Joba were doing great I’d want to trade him for Halladay. And Joba is one of my favorite players. Still, right now he MIGHT BECOME an Ace. Halladay IS an Ace, in his prime, that dominates the AL East. Halladay, please.
No. 27: Pretend you’re a Jays fan. You just found out that the Jays made the trade you propose. How do you feel?
If you’re honest with yourself, you’d be pretty upset. Especially since Halladay is now a “DAMN YANKEE!!” Most Jays fans would have the same reaction. Riccardi knows this.
Trades are not about pure, clinical, pragmatism. When you are trading the center of your organization to an in-division rival, you have to consider what the trade will mean to your fanbase. Accordingly, you have to get a TON to make this trade.
This. Is. Roy. Halladay.
Halladay is better than Santana and will age better.
Apples and oranges.
Our farm system was not as stacked 2 years ago as it is now either. We can afford to part with some more now.
Joba is greater than %90 of all other starters? Joba looks like John Smoltz the past few starts.
“Halladay >>> Joba >>> 90% of other AL starters.”
Agree.
“Wouldn’t go near Wells with a 10 foot pole. Check his rapid decline.”
Yea, I know he’s been declining, but I think that would make the Blue Jays OK w/ trading Halladay to the Yankees.
At the same time, I didn’t realize he was getting paid $86 million between 2011 and 2014. That has to be one of the worst contracts in baseball.
Betsy July 7th, 2009 at 5:39 pm
Please explain the difference between Doc and Santana. Some of the same people that didn’t want to give up Hughes (forget Joba, he was never involved) for Santana now have no problem giving him up for an older pitcher. No thanks – I think Doc is remarkable, but…..no.
—————————-
Doc puts up otherworldly numbers pitching in the AL East.
Santana had a less than remarkable 2007.
Lastly, the window for the old guard is rapidly closing, more so than when Santana was available.
So how does Sebathia feel about getting another #1? Would it work out as well as Schilling/Johnson? Who would start game 7?
Rebecca-I heard they were taking checking the ages of these guys more seriously.
Betsy-Doc is dominating in the AL East, a division that contains the best offenses in baseball. He has been consistently good forever. Santana, as one blogger pointed out (Mark in Tampa, I think) was showing signs of decline and does not have a perfect pitcher’s body, which Halladay does. Halladay is dominating in the AL, and he’s done it longer than Santana did.
no.27 July 7th, 2009 at 5:41 pm
“Wouldn’t go near Wells with a 10 foot pole. Check his rapid decline.”
Yea, I know he’s been declining, but I think that would make the Blue Jays OK w/ trading Halladay to the Yankees.
At the same time, I didn’t realize he was getting paid $86 million between 2011 and 2014. That has to be one of the worst contracts in baseball.
——————————–
If you think Wells is declining now, I don’t know what kind of player you’ll have in 2011-2014. Ouch.
Wait, even if that’s so, it doesn’t matter to me. I’m firm on this – no Hughes (I wouldn’t trade him for anyone, so that’s no surprise) and no Joba. I’m not all that interested in having Halladay, to be honest……..not at the expense of either of those two. Therefore, I’m not wasting my time dreaming of this.
Santana is reliant on his change-up and his FB velocity. If you watch him with the Mets, his velocity is not nearly the same was it was during his hey-day in Minnesota. As he gets older, they will make a difference. Plus he is built like Pedro, most of these small LA pitchers have short shelf lives.
He also didn’t throw his slider much after the ASB in 07, leading some to believe he was hiding an injury.
Santana was not a no-brainer. Halladay is.
“We definitely need some revenge. We know we play well here [at home], but at the same time, the Yankees are hot right now, so we need to step up our game.”
-Joe Nathan http://www.startribune.com/spo.....=1&c=y
oh, its on.
Nick,
I like the sound of Canadia. But CanadiA wouldnt be bad either.
We don’t even know if Halladay wants to come here-he really seemed to hate that HR that Damon hit, pitching in NYSLP (New Yankee Stadium Launching Pad) might not sit well with him.
Wait till they come to OUR house AGAIN,
I would vote for Moose, Jim Palmer has said he is a HOFer, but many of the voters that I have read or heard say that he just misses. That could change and the guys I heard could also be in the minority.
It really stinks if he doesn’t get in, because if he just hung around for three years to get those 30 wins, he would be automatic. Even if those were the worst 3 years of his career, average 10 wins per and he is automatic. Shouldn’t be the way it is, but it is.
Also, if Moose came back this year, they wouldn’t have brought back Pettitte, so those would have been his wins. If I remember right, Andy has turned a few easy wins into NDs, Moose might have been on his way to two straight 20 win years.
Santana had a higher peak. He never had the consistency of Doc.
Santana takes himself out of games after 100 pitches. His velo. is declining. Halladay is a horse, showing no signs of slowing down.
“No. 27: Pretend you’re a Jays fan. You just found out that the Jays made the trade you propose. How do you feel?
If you’re honest with yourself, you’d be pretty upset. Especially since Halladay is now a “DAMN YANKEE!!” Most Jays fans would have the same reaction. Riccardi knows this.
Trades are not about pure, clinical, pragmatism. When you are trading the center of your organization to an in-division rival, you have to consider what the trade will mean to your fanbase. Accordingly, you have to get a TON to make this trade.
This. Is. Roy. Halladay.”
I did say that I didn’t think he would get traded here. But, the trade that I suggested offers the Jays more than any other trade on here. Getting rid of Wells’ contract would be REALLY valuable in this economy.
it amazing how yankee fans feel about joba…i guarantee if he was on the red sox, all you would see on here is how stacked the red sox are and how joba is gonna turn into an ace in boston, the next beckett they’d say….
but now since hes 23 and on the yankees and not dominating while showing diminished stuff hes a bust and just as good as a 40 year old ex-brave!
Good for debate on Halladay, but doubt the Yankees are taking on his salary plus the potential to be the highest paid pitcher in baseball.
We’d be better off talking about another reliable bullpen arm, preferably a 7th or 8th inning guy, or even a closer type who can spell MO. IMO that is our current main need.
I almost don’t want Halladay because I dont want to be the Yankees “The team with 12 aces that win every game.” Where is the fun in having Halladay Burnette CC? That is like an all star team.
If you think Wells is declining now, I don’t know what kind of player you’ll have in 2011-2014. Ouch.
————–
No worries. Nothing b-12 cant fix.
^^^ thats not to say i wouldnt trade him…that has more to due with the recent days not the halladay trade talk
I don’t think Halladay gets traded until the offseason. That way, more teams can budgeted his contract and extension which might open up more suiters for the Toronto GM to negotiate with.
Boy what happened to the good ole days when Jason Jarvis, Mike Gordon and Marty Janzen could land you David Cone.
For anyone who says that the Blue Jays wouldn’t trade Halladay to the Yankees, would you have said the same thing about Clemens and Cone at the time when they were dealt?
“Anybody know who this “Mayer” dude starting at catcher for the Twins is?”
I think Jennifer Anniston knows.
“Therefore, I’m not wasting my time dreaming of this.”
Dream… or nightmare?
for those who wondered why gardy is starting not melk, hes just starting the hotter bat, gardy was good yesterday and got robbed of an XBH
Also, no way Cashman takes on Wells contract.
Burnett will convince Halladay to come here and alleviate any fears he has.
At his press conference, he said when Doc hits the FA market he would heavily recruit him.
I mean, come on, the guy is 32 and has never been to the playoffs. I doubt he is going to be picky, as long as he goes to a contender.
I realize being a Yankee fan I should expect we have tons of all stars but to have all those great now pitchers? Let’s keep things the way we are going with the rotation/bullpen. We finally picked up some solid vets in the rotation, now lets see what our organization can think up to get us to a “winning the right way again” type of team.
21 July 7th, 2009 at 5:45 pm
I almost don’t want Halladay because I dont want to be the Yankees “The team with 12 aces that win every game.” Where is the fun in having Halladay Burnette CC? That is like an all star team.
——————-
I don’t know about you, but I’d have no problem with that lol.
As for Moose, doubt he gets into the HOF. He was a good pitcher who played on very good teams that enabled him to amass wins.
vb03-I agree.
21 July 7th, 2009 at 5:47 pm
I realize being a Yankee fan I should expect we have tons of all stars but to have all those great now pitchers? Let’s keep things the way we are going with the rotation/bullpen. We finally picked up some solid vets in the rotation, now lets see what our organization can think up to get us to a “winning the right way again” type of team.
————————
I’d just like to win a WS again and a parade down the Canyon of Heroes. If it means getting 5 aces and 9 MVP’s on the squad, so be it.
…It would depend on whether or not Halladay would want to be a FA while in NY.
” I don’t think anyone has included Chien-ming Wang. Unless this trade is going down in July, I like him in the rotation too and I do NOT want to send him to Canadia!”
nick in sf-
i’d like to see wang go in a trade simply for him to get away from cashman.
the man doesn’t deserve a pitcher like wang.
Between Hughes and Joba, I would bet most people still choose to keep Joba.
I would trade either for Doc though.
I really hope Moose gets in. He’s really borderline.
vb03-I also agree with your next post.
I apologize to Canadans for the error.
KWAN, he’s not a no-brainer for me.
No matter what Riccardi does, he’s probably gone [fired] by the end of this season.
——————————————————–
I think you are right. Now that the owner (Rogers) is dead, the team will be run by the fiduciaries and they aren’t too happy about the long term committment ($$$) for Wells and Rios. I would expect that if Riccardi doesn’t make a deal that pleases the fiduciaries by the end of the season they will find someone who will get it done. They are all about settling Rogers’ estate in the best finanacial way and don’t have an axe to grind with the Yankees, Red Sox or anyone other team. In the end, cash will be king (as much as the commisioner lets that be the decider).
I miss the days we could win the world series…. with guys like Scott Broski, Shane Spencer, and Ricky Ledee
Folks im late to this party.
Are we playing make believe that the Jays would trade their ace to us a hated inner division rival? Or does Riccardi need to take a drug test? Where did this rumor start and why would they hand him to us unless we are giving back an ace of our own C.C.(ala clemens/wells trade)?
SJ, I’m a little confused. In the Kei thread, you said that a Yankee/Jay trade would not happen and you asked why the Yankees would trade Phil for Doc when they didn’t do it for Santana. Now you seem to be saying that this very well could happen? Would you do the deal? I’m not interested in signh
21-You didn’t enjoy 78′, when we bought every free agent on the market?
randy makes a good point. Maybe we should trade Hughes to Tampa for Neil Allen.
We don’t need to sign Halladay to an extension right away. He is signed through 2010.
Gotta disagree about Joba’s potential. He’s shown that he’s not a savvy pitcher. He certainly isn’t a thinking pitcher. Yes, he’s young, but he’s already been talked to several times and hasn’t yet accepted the wisdom of the advice he’s been given. His personality may hold him back. He’s awfully arrogant regarding his skills and success level — considering how he really hasn’t done much in the majors yet.
I was a big Joba supporter earlier on, but lately, his attitude has really changed how I view his potential success in the future. It’s obviously not enough to have the raw talent; you have to have the character to pull off greatness.
Betsy – I’m with ya, not a fan of getting Doc. I suppose if it were the Sox or us it would have to be us, but let him go to the NL (Minus LA)
Don’t want Vernon Wells if he was free. He isn’t declining, he was just never that good. He had one huge season (’03), and everybody thinks that that is the player he is. But, he is the player he has been since then. A middle of the order type hitter who bats @.260, OBP @.330, doesn’t drive in or score 100 runs, but is paid like a superstar. His D looks good sometimes but is only so-so compared to the other CFs in the league. No thanks.
…The better Outfield (including offensively) is
Melky in RF
Gardner in CF
Damon in LF
Swisher should swap 1st, DH and PH duties.
oops, scratch that last part………
In any case, I don’t think Halladay is coming here so this is all just wasted speculation.
So long Berroa!
I’m headed to the game now. Any Yankees/Abraham fans come by and say hello. Sec 121 row 33, seat 11 and 12.
Will also be at the games tomorrow and Thur.
Cashman and JP have a pretty good relationship, don’t they? Didn’t Cash say that JP gave him rave reviews about Burnett this winter?
“Boy what happened to the good ole days when Jason Jarvis, Mike Gordon and Marty Janzen could land you David Cone.
For anyone who says that the Blue Jays wouldn’t trade Halladay to the Yankees, would you have said the same thing about Clemens and Cone at the time when they were dealt?”
That’s when “CASH” was King, and Cashman could throw around big bucks to any player George wanted. In this economy, Wells is virtually untradeable, and IMHO, I don’t see the Yankees at this time needing to make a play for Halladay.
Get another reliable bullpen arm, and if everyone gets and stays healthy, this team could very well get to the WS.
Betsy, I think SJ’s thoughts here are for the next 4 or 5 yrs. Doc is still Doc, if it’s a 1 for 1 deal for either Hughes or Joba you do it, b/c by the time it’s done, you’ll have another Joba or Hughes being developed or you sign them when they hit the market.
“We don’t need to sign Halladay to an extension right away. He is signed through 2010.”
Actually, I think the Yankees or any team will insist on that before trading off valuable young players.
Our House – I just wanna see us win the games with what we have. I like to see a fighting scrapping young team with role players win games (Which is what we are still holding onto somewhat with our outfield and bullpen). I hate to see players with calculators and investment agents on the field while they watch strike three.
As SJ said, unless Riccardi wants to take a lesser package from someone else just to keep him from the Yankees, he’s going to have to seriously consider us. We match up well with them.
Yankee Trader-Also, was Toronto a contender back then? I don’t remember.
Just a quick calculation from Cot’s – I could have made a mistake or three.
For 2010, the Yanks have approximately $162.5MM committed to ARod, CC, Tex, Jeter, AJ, Mo, Posada, Cano, Swisher, Marte, Brackman and Miranda.
If the Yanks did a deal for Halliday, he’d get a CC like deal – north of $20MM per. Let’s say $20MM though.
That would be $182MM+ right there.
Now they would need to sign a CF, LF, DH, 1 more starter, 5 relievers, and a complete bench.
Do you really think the Yanks are going to do that?
But this isn’t the case. The Jays will not sell him 1 for 1, they’d want your top 5 farm players for 1 Doc and that’s why you don’t even entertain it.
ACE ON THRUSDAY
ACE ON THRUSDAY
“UPDATE, 4:52 p.m.: Alfredo Aceves just threw a bullpen and said he was told he’s starting on Thursday. ”
Andy and Joba better step their games up after Thursday because now we have no “long man” to bail them out.
21-I personally don’t care. I just want to win games.
The point of the game is to put the best team out there. If that means using the farm and role players, so be it. If that means signing tons of free agents, so be it.
“Betsy, I think SJ’s thoughts here are for the next 4 or 5 yrs. Doc is still Doc, if it’s a 1 for 1 deal for either Hughes or Joba you do it, b/c by the time it’s done, you’ll have another Joba or Hughes being developed or you sign them when they hit the market.”
Now you’re thinking like a GM
Does anyone get to watch Andrew Brackman regularly? What kind of stuff are we looking at with him? I really like his size and power but don’t get to watch him pitch.
now we lose a long man for the road series.
If he really is available, and the Yanks could potentially get him, I don’t see how we can pass on him. I hope we don’t at lease
“Just a quick calculation from Cot’s – I could have made a mistake or three.
For 2010, the Yanks have approximately $162.5MM committed to ARod, CC, Tex, Jeter, AJ, Mo, Posada, Cano, Swisher, Marte, Brackman and Miranda.
If the Yanks did a deal for Halliday, he’d get a CC like deal – north of $20MM per. Let’s say $20MM though.
That would be $182MM+ right there.
Now they would need to sign a CF, LF, DH, 1 more starter, 5 relievers, and a complete bench.
Do you really think the Yanks are going to do that?”
What makes you think they need another starter. Doc takes Pettitte’s place and either Joba or Hughes fills the 5th slot with Wang back in the rotation.
Same with the bullpen. They’ll have arms, but might need one more guy.
I think they have CF cover so getting another outfielder is in order.
Because Doc is not your typical 32 yr old starter on the downside. He is a rare specimen. Not some flame thrower who is going to evaporate once his velocity decreases a little.
Halladay is the type of guy who will be effective into his 40s.
Thursday I don’t mind so much.
After the ASB I worry.
Y26,
Andy and Joba better step their games up after Thursday because now we have no “long man” to bail them out.
—————————————————
Yeah, you’re right. By using Aceves as a starter on Thursday, we may run into a situation where we need long relief three consecutive days (Thursday, Friday and Saturday). I hope that the Scranton to Anaheim shuttle has flights scheduled for those days.
If and that is a Big IF…Doc Hallday is on the market the Yankees will do what ever it takes to make sure he does not end up in Beantown and that may be the only reason they would be interested.
If they could get him for something along the lines of what has been talked about, young pitching prospect in the majors, catching prospect and another Grade B-A prospect, the Yankees would have to do it, IMO.
“Now they would need to sign a CF, LF, DH, 1 more starter, 5 relievers, and a complete bench.”
WHATT?!?!? yanks wont be signing 2 outfielders…thats for sure…prbly not a dh…definitly not 5 relievers and a complete bench?…are you insane or just challenged?
…
Peter, you’re a genius!
The order “should be”
1-Cano
2-Jeter
3-Damon
4-A-Rod
5-Tex (forces stikes)
6-Mats
7-Posie
8-Melky
9-Gardner
Nice! I’ve been saying that all year
“…We need another bullpen arm?”
Why, haven’t they won enuff yet?
But, how about Chapman–defector of Social-Communist Cuba.
Yanks are interested, per public comments. Chapman is now inMoami–per reports.
Miami or A-Rod’ville?
Just like the payroll would not be able to support 2 big FAs this winter, let alone 3, right?
Face it, nobody here knows anything about what Hal/Cashman feel about adding or deducting payroll.
After this past winter, you should realize that guessing his fruitless. All the BS about how we have to cut payroll because of the economy and not selling luxury boxes and we spent $423 million dollars.
That was the smart move with Aceves. That gives guys like Mitre, Towers or whomever, at least two more starts with SWB before they have to make a decision either way.
You know what I haven’t been called in a long time as a Yankee fan… A front runner
Cash is King-
My point was there was no payroll included in the $182MM + for all the positions I listed – not that the Yanks don’t have players to fill some of those positions.
wooot! ACE !!!
Now just trade for Halladay and we’re all set!
I mean how awesome would this be…
1. CC
2. AJ
3. Halladay
4. Joba/Hughges
5. Pettite
Having wang,aceves,Bruney,Coke, Rivera in the Pen is awesome
I wonder if Mitre has built up enough arm strength, coming off his TJ surgery. If he comes around, I wouldn’t be surprised to see him in NY sometime this season.
Jackson and Gardner can easily be plugged into the OF
When you have a rotation of Halladay-CC-Burnett-Joba, who cares who is in your outfield?
We still have Tex, Cano, A-Rod, Montero, Jeter etc. What’s wrong in filling out the other spots with some role players?
Wave your hat,
But they have cheap alternatives to fill those slots and still stay around the same payroll as this year if not even lower.
Jake – Why again would Halladay be the #3 starter?
“If he really is available, and the Yanks could potentially get him, I don’t see how we can pass on him. I hope we don’t atleast”
Oh see it’s really easy if it were 1 for 1 sure why not. Although this is not the case hence PASS.
hmm Ace to start on thrusday, good luck ace!
joba better step up his game none of this 5 innings crap.
alby was brought up bc wang was put on the DL, correct? just asking to see if the yanks are gonna call someone up, like edwar.
I vote Halladay to the Nationals for all starting pitchers and Zach Zims.
Hey 21.
Im just putting him there cuz he would be INSERTED into the rotation, so i didnt know where to put him…but hypothetically speaking, if we did trade for him, he would be our #1.
He’s better than CC and AJ
He’s the best pitcher in baseball
Mike-
Be sensible-
I go to the games and see empty seats, especially down in the high price areas.
You think the Yanks are likely to add significant payroll this winter to what they already have?
To keep the payroll at a 2009 level, that’s less than $20MM to replace Damon and Matsui (and Nady/Hinske), give an arbitration increase to whoever of Hughes or Joba you keep, give an arbitration increase to Melky, sign a bullpen and sign a bench.
Do you really think so?
Wow -
You guys really take a suggestion and run with it don’t you?
Who knows?
But, Halladay would only be on this team, and effective, for what, another 3 years? If Joba and Hughes come around (and I believe Phil is there), they’re on this team for a lot more than that.
since this is all a ‘what if’ conversation anyway, ‘what if’ they end up trading the one of the two who goes to be everything they thought he would be? Then, Halladay is gone, they’ve got the ‘other guy’ who didn’t quite get where they thought he ‘d be, and Toronto can still throw a Yankee killer at them for the next, what 5-7 or so years?
There’s a lot to think about.
And I don’t necessarily think it’s a must to get Halladay. As great as he is.
Brandon, thanks……..since it will never be a one for one, I’ve no interest in speculating about that. I’ll believe it when I see it about Doc being on the market – let him go to Philly or Milwaukee.
if ace is starting on thursday they need to take the 1 inning rules off hughes. if they need him for 2 girardi needs to allow that to happen…………….
Jake – I don’t think you pick up Halladay mid season and put him #1.. we paid a lot of money for some guy this off season and pretty much granted him the #1 spot. He would have to fit in #2.
I like this scenario better: Halladay makes his Toronto contract null and void by defecting TO Cuba. Spends a couple weeks smoking cigars and sipping rum. Then defects again and signs with us for the stretch drive.
JP will wait until we get eliminated in the playoffs and knows Cashman will be desperate to keep his job and needs to make a big splash and will give up more at the end of the yr
joba better step up his game none of this 5 innings crap.
alby was brought up bc wang was put on the DL, correct? just asking to see if the yanks are gonna call someone up, like edwar.
—————————————————–
The Yankees roster is full right now so no call up is possible. However, if long relief is needed on Thursday it would be Roberston and Albaladejo. They could be sent down on Friday and replaced on the roster by Melancon and Edwar so they could be available for Friday and Saturday. That would really mess up the bullpen at Scranton but the way they are going there they might be rained out on those days anyway.
If Joba or Andy get knocked out early, then Tomko is there to pick them up.
No worries.
Just read Pete’s updates. Good luck and congrats to Ace for getting the Thursday start.
And I thought they’d released Berroa already?
Wilson July 7th, 2009 at 6:10 pm
If Joba or Andy get knocked out early, then Tomko is there to pick them up.
No worries.
————————
I call Tomko the White Flag. Swisher should pitch, he’s the Cy of non-pitchers.
Anyway Halladay will not be a Yankee. I’d really like to know what kind of talking to Joba gets on his breaks between starts. I really hope someone is telling this kid he is nobody until he proves he is somebody. A little tough love never hurt. Jobamania shirts were probably the worst thing that ever happened to Justin Chamberlain.
“The Yankees roster is full right now so no call up is possible. However, if long relief is needed on Thursday it would be Roberston and Albaladejo. They could be sent down on Friday and replaced on the roster by Melancon and Edwar so they could be available for Friday and Saturday. That would really mess up the bullpen at Scranton but the way they are going there they might be rained out on those days anyway.”
Holy Jesus Monstero I hope we don’t need relief those games!
Then again, with it being Anaheim…
JP’s best chance to get a good package is to create a Yanks/Sox bidding war.
And I suspect he will do just that. Too bad Boston is only in it to drive up the price for us. As Olney said, they want a bat, not pitching.
If Joba or Andy get knocked out early, then Tomko is there to pick them up.
No worries.
——————————————————
Why not promote Pat Venditte? He can give us long relief on Friday with his left arm and long relief on Saturday with his right arm.
Albaladejo, Robertson, and Tomko should fill the role of Aceves until after the All Star break.
Mo is the only Yankee pitcher going to the All Star game which is good for the rotation.
If NY isnt going outside the org, than ACEVES is a NO-Brainer to start Thurs.
Who else just went 4 inngs the other day?
He is stretched out.
“Pettitte needs to step it up, we don’t have a long man”
-Pettitte just went 6 yesterday and consistently does so. He’s got the best record on the team.
Joba is under Injury Prevention Program (see Clev Start if u wonder where the heater went).
Better put, he is under diff “Joba Rules” as a 1st year starter. And kudos for it too. See Ben Sheets.
Alabaladejo looking great.
Long man?No.
Tomko or Roberston? You betcha–both are “really” starters from the minors.
“Long men” 4 of them are in the pen now–if counting Hughes and Bruney too.
Go Yanks
Montero is the only player who should be completely off limits for Halladay.
I’m not happy with Aceves starting…….this is going to really hurt the pen. Get ready for mucho innings from Robertson and Tomko in Joba and Andy’s games…..and the Yankees had better hope that CC doesn’t get smoked again and that AJ doesn’t have a bad game.
Its funny when i asked this preseason if anyone would trade Hughes(while he was struggling for Halliday) it was almost unanomous no. Even though some were still crying about the non trade for Santana(im glad we didnt). Now some are willing to unload Joba for Halliday which was only a couple weeks ago the inevatable yankee ace. Im not thrilled about Jobas 98mph fastball dropping to 92. But can you immagine what the Royals are thinking after not trading Grienke these past couple years? Wasnt his e.r.a. ridiculous? Was Grienke stubborn in his struggling years?
BTW, im all for going after Halliday. I would always go with the known vs. the potential. My only problem is the hypocracy.
Hughes for Santana? Should of could of would of
Hughes for Halliday this preseason? Hell no, old, wearing down, etc.
Joba for any ace in the universe this pre season? Hell no
Joba for Halliday today? In a heartbeat.
If Joba and Pettitte bomb again the Yankees are in trouble over the weekend.
Betsy,
You worry too much.
Paddy-That Cleveland start was the only start of the year he was hitting 94 to 96 consistently. Before that he didn’t and after that he hasn’t. He needs to prove he still can throw a fastball. 1 start is not enough.
Wonder if AJ Burnett will be in Cashman’s ear about Halladay
Or I wonder if Cashman will try and get some inside info from Burnett.
21
July 7th, 2009 at 5:40 pm
Joba is greater than %90 of all other starters? Joba looks like John Smoltz the past few starts.
===
But unlike John Smoltz, Joba’s 23 years old.
I seriously dobut the Yankees are moving Joba or Hughes.
If Joba is experiencing young stud hiccups, the Yankees aren’t foolish enough to give up on him.
If he is damaged goods – other teams will also know that.
Either way, it’s highly doubtful he’s going anywhere.
Rebecca — Monstero may be the coolest nickname since I heard Joe Morgan use Kung Fu Panda.
Betsy-I want CC and A.J. and Joba and Andy to do well all the time.
Anyway, Andy went six his last start.
We are the only team that could take back Wells’ contract with Halladay
You might not even need a Hughes/Joba if you can take that hideous contract off their hands.
I hate the move, but oh well…..I agree, no more 1 inning stints for Phil. Everyone else in the pen besides Mo and Coke (right now) stink. I can’t wait for Joba and Andy’s starts when people applauding the Ace move are going to complain because we have no reliable reliever to stabilize the games.
Rob NY July 7th, 2009 at 6:18 pm
Rebecca — Monstero may be the coolest nickname since I heard Joe Morgan use Kung Fu Panda.
———————-
The Kung Fu Panda is the best nickname in the ML.
bodhisattva – I’m not saying Joba, or anyone for that matter, should be moved. I don’t think the Yankees should pursue Halladay unless the Sox are seriously trying to get him. I just think Joba needs to get this “I’m awesome and throw great pitches, always” out of his head. The fact of the matter is, he is not awesome and does not throw great pitches.
I think one off day Pete should set up a post where we talk about evrything that could possibly go wrong or the rest of the year and get all that talk out of the way.
Wait, Andy pitched badly – not impressed with 6 innings of 5 run ball with 5 wallks.
Betsy-Robertson doesn’t stink.
Betsy-
If you want to laugh, look up at my 4:57 post
Nick,
While hes at it, he should get a new birth certificate that states hes 29 and get an 8 year contract.
Does anyone know how to get the Yankee fan rule book?
Hughes for Halliday this past winter? Hell no.
Hughes for Santana? Should of would of could of
Joba for any ace ever made this winter? Not in a million years
Joba for Halliday now? In a heartbeat
PRICELESS!!
Betsy-I agree, but you said expect the pen to be taxed in Andy’s start and he gave us innings.
Betsy,
Both Joba and Pettitte have pitched well on the road and they only pitch once each this week with CC taking the ball twice and AJ once along with Ace.
Cash, I’m not worried – this is just my opinion. I could easily say that those clamoring for Ace in the rotation are looking at things with rose-colored glasses.
CC and AJ having bad starts is simply not an option
“Rebecca — Monstero may be the coolest nickname since I heard Joe Morgan use Kung Fu Panda.”
Kung Fu Panda is AWESOME. Seriously, it’s the entire reason I voted for him in the final vote like 25 times. I voted Kinsler in the AL FTR.
Monstero isn’t my creation, forget where I saw it, but now I can’t stop using it.
Ralph
Mats, Damon, and Nady are all in final yearof contracts.
U don’t think they’ll be replaced?
Why?
Andy pitches great on the road, and in his recent pattern of good start – bad start he’s due for the good start. That would indicate he’ll pitch well in L.A., if you believe in that sort of thing.
21
July 7th, 2009 at 6:20 pm
bodhisattva – I’m not saying Joba, or anyone for that matter, should be moved. I don’t think the Yankees should pursue Halladay unless the Sox are seriously trying to get him. I just think Joba needs to get this “I’m awesome and throw great pitches, always” out of his head. The fact of the matter is, he is not awesome and does not throw great pitches.
====
Try and see through the hubris: Joba is defensive because he knows he’s off and is frustrated trying to solve it.
S.o.S. – I’ve been wondering the same thing… people are just all over getting rid of Hughes/Joba for Doc. It is baffling the change of heart when someone they thought was untouchable, and probably is untouchable to the Yankees, becomes “touchable”
I can’t get enough of Kung Fu Panda in web gems. I can’t stop laughing at how awesome it is that a guy of his build can move like that.
Betsy,
Maybe so, but at least seeing the world in rose-colored glasses is easier on the blood pressure.
Andy and Joba can’t pitch at home
Heck, even CC has a 4.55 ERA at home, for all his greatness.
This pitching staff is different on the road.
Robertson is ok – he doesn’t stink, but he’s very unreliable. I’m just saying that folks that wanted Ace in the rotation had best be prepared, if Joba and Andy can’t give innings, for a very rocky road in those games.
Joba doesn’t seem to be too frustrated? He is still “making great pitches”
Hughes is doing a number on me, one side of me says we should trade him while his value is high for Halladay, but then my better logic says hold on to the youngster. It’s truly a dizzying idea, I just pray the Sawks don’t get Doc
For Halladay what prospect would be off the table? What could they possibly develop into that could more valuable than he is? That is especially true in the case of pitching prospects. He’s at the top of the game. Plus he is old school and therefore big time fun to watch. He would need some kind facial hair exemption though. I don’t see it happening, and I would think that Toronto will be GM shopping in the near future. Money is the x factor since some of the likely suitors don’t have extra money right now. That might be what keeps Riccardi in his job too. Its got to cost money to fire GMs and find new ones, and he might deserve some slack considering the budget stuff and being in the same division as two big spenders.
I’ve become a Washburn believer, but I’m not sure the Mariners know if they are buyers or sellers yet.
The most awesome thing I’ve ever seen:
http://tinyurl.com/mx3q59
The Yankees are not in critical condition. They do not need a “Doc.”
Or we could say some people look at Hughes threw rose-colored glasses……
Montero has to be off the table.
I agree, Cash, but that’s not the point. The point is if I’m not being realistic, it’s equally possible that the rose-coloreds are not being realistic. Removing Aceves from the pen is going to hurt – there is no doubt about it.
lol the Kung Fu panda is awesome, i hope he gets into the ASG.
bodhisattva-I totally agree about Joba. He doesn’t get why he no longer has that ffastball or has fans on their feet screaming and wants that back.
You cant trade Chamberlain or Hughes for Halladay. Yankees are trying to win a championship this year Hughes and Joba are too valuable to this years team. Thats why is if you trade for Halladay the bluejays would probabably want Montero and Jackson because the yanks are not going to trade Hughes or Joba.
# Rebecca–Optimist Prime July 7th, 2009 at 6:25 pm
The most awesome thing I’ve ever seen:
http://tinyurl.com/mx3q59
—————————–
Order: Usually 3rd
I’ve got tears in my eyes laughing at that one. Thanks Rebecca. Guy’s a hoot.
I had the same thought as Doreen, above, that Doc is 32, and has another 3-4 good years ahead of him. Joba or Phil, if they pan out, has another decade plus.
The thing is, that word IF – the biggest word in the English language.
From what we read, Phil was on the table for Santana for a brief period, until that GM got greedy and blew it for himself. Doc has better stuff than Santana.
We’re playing in Anahiem… we’re in for a rocky road even if they pitch well.
Angels are throwing their 2 best pitchers (Weaver/Saunders) at us along with Lackey who has struggled this year but can dominate on any given day.
Dan,
Immagine what it will be like next year if Hughes continues to dominate in the pen? Joba and Hughes will be in their own fan reality show called “should i stay or should i go?” pen that is. Hope they both mature by next year or Frans-whatever his name is will have alot to talk about.
Burger King Al — Do you remember what Pat M. was saying a couple of years ago that Hughes was looked at by scouts as one of the best young pitchers to come out of CA in decades. He is just now starting to reach tap that potential, you’d be selling low IMO.
Toronto isn’t going to give Halladay away. I don’t think Hughes and Joba would be enough.
Betsy: and your preference for Thursday’s starting pitcher is…?
“I agree, Cash, but that’s not the point. The point is if I’m not being realistic, it’s equally possible that the rose-coloreds are not being realistic. Removing Aceves from the pen is going to hurt – there is no doubt about it.”
Betsy,
I said nothing about you being unrealistic, but you have a tendency to worry about things that may or may not happen. People have given you reasons why this is the best move for the moment. You’re not accepting them which is your right, but again, CC takes the ball twice, AJ once, Pettitte and Joba pitch well on the road and are taking the ball only once and then Aceves is on Thursday. One way or another, I think the Yankees will be able to handle these next six games.
Trading one of Hughes/Joba gives you a future rotation of
Halladay
Sabathia
Burnett
Joba/Hughes
Wang (if he rights himself)
You simply cannot pass that up.
Erica, lol – I made that threat about not being a Yankee fan if Phil was traded during the Santana talks……I just don’t intend to go through the wringer that way again, lol. I’m certainly not as big a Joba fan and if forced to, I would trade him first, but that’s only if I had a gun to my head. I wouldn’t trade either of them….
I once (I forgot when, but I was much younger) threatened to quit being a Yankee fan and instead become a Met fan. It didn’t work, lol – my blood is pinstriped, so no matter what, I’m a Yankee fan. I just want Halladay gone to the NL or to remain in Toronto…..
“# Rebecca–Optimist Prime July 7th, 2009 at 6:25 pm
The most awesome thing I’ve ever seen:
http://tinyurl.com/mx3q59
—————————–
Order: Usually 3rd
I’ve got tears in my eyes laughing at that one. Thanks Rebecca. Guy’s a hoot.”
I call ‘em as I see ‘em. (My eyesight is a tad better than Marty Foster’s. But not much.)
Jake
Hughes is not a starter.
And he is what makes the pen “awesome”–unless we should talk about last years’ performance by both Hughes and the pen..yikes!
Betsy- “only 3 yrs of Halladay effectiveness?”
But Hughes will be the man still?
Hasn’t Doc “already proved” his “effectiveness” as a starter?
Has Phil Hughes?
Don’t confuse the bull-pen with the rotation. Some can (Halladay), and some can not start (Hughes thus far).
Doc is a kid still–not 40.
See Clemens, Johnson, Ryan,Smoltz etc etc
Yes, everyrthing on a blog is basically speculation. But “speculators” make a lot of ppl rich too :/
For Halladay what prospect would be off the table?
—–
I would only hide Montero. Everyone else in the minors, look out!!
I would always go with the known vs the potential. Accept for the manchild MONSTERO.
Ihave to be a Yankee fan. I’m the type of person who just has to support certain teams. It’s in my blood. I couldn’t switch even if I tried. Which I don’t because al the teams I support are really good.
Ihave is of course I have.
I agree Betsy. I can’t imagine the Yankees selling their entire system for Halladay. Just won’t happen.
And I know what you mean. I threaten to break up with Brian Cashman everytime I hear a Johnny Damon trade rumor
Heyman:
jays may want top SS prospect in package for doc. thats good for phils (donald), brewers (escobar), chisox (beckham)
Any objective Yankee fan has noticed Joba’s drop in velocity, 97-99 his rookie season, 95-96 his second season and everything since he hurt his arm in Texas has been 91-94. He really isn’t the same pitcher and believe me he knows that he isn’t throwing as hard, he just doesn’t want to call attention to that fact and have the Yanks panic and sit him down.
Saw it mentioned earlier and thought it bared repeating.
The Yankees actually have something to gain by letting Joba’s name slip into the papers as a potential centerpiece of the deal.
The guy loves NYC and loves the whole Yankee thing. I can’t imagine he’d be thrilled about pitching in Toronto where they get 10k for attendance on a good night. He’d like the strip clubs in Canada, but outside of that it’s akin to playing in nowhere-land.
If that didn’t light a fire under his butt and get him to stop being obstinate I don’t know what would.
And the best part about it is he couldn’t claim injury all of a sudden to get himself out of trade talks.
If he did that, it would be the excuse the Yankees need to return him to the pen.
So, he’d have a choice. Listen to the team, pitch better and remain a starter in NY or go to Canada for the next 5 seasons.
In the old days a Yankee official would slip that to a media type to mention an unnamed source in the front office has said that is Joba is in play for Hallyday.
Let’s see if it happens and what becomes of that kind of rumor.
That said, I like the SJ plan of trading Joba or Phil for Hallyday and replacing them with a free agent signing of Chapman. He’s younger than Joba and left handed and throws as hard or harder.
Definitely interesting moves open on the table right now.
And when Pete gives a potential Yankee move his kiss of death on the board it generally happens.
Joba for Rick Porcello straight up
Only untouchable for Doc is Montero
Al from BK-I did not notice the drop from first to second season but I noticed it this season.
Montero is 100% untouchable. Everyone else= fair game.
bodhisattva you are right people are making too much of Joba’s postgame comments. It is pretty obvious he is frustrated and the media has been asking questions about his velocity since spring training. He is just giving the same recycled answers. Joba is not dumb he knows he didn’t pitch well against the blue jays.
If the Blue Jays condition for getting Halliday is to take on Vernon Wells contract I don’t think they will get very many takers – even the Yankees. That contract runs through 2014 and is backloaded. And Wells looks to already be on the decline.
Bronx Bomber-If I were the Toronto GM I’d laugh and hang up the phone for that offer.
At their best, Joba is still better than Hughes.
You can’t teach 100 MPH, 90 MPH slider, 77 MPH curve, and a bulldog mentality.
If I have to give one for Doc, it would be Hughes.
“Al from BK-I did not notice the drop from first to second season but I noticed it this season.”
I mostly chalked up his change in velocity to him starting 95-96 mph fastball is more than enough for a power starting pitcher. However 91-94 just isn’t cutting it hence Joba’s increase in hits allowed and WHIP.
# Rebecca–Optimist Prime July 7th, 2009 at 6:32 pm
“# Rebecca–Optimist Prime July 7th, 2009 at 6:25 pm
The most awesome thing I’ve ever seen:
http://tinyurl.com/mx3q59
—————————–
Order: Usually 3rd
I’ve got tears in my eyes laughing at that one. Thanks Rebecca. Guy’s a hoot.”
I call ‘em as I see ‘em. (My eyesight is a tad better than Marty Foster’s. But not much.)
———————–
I should photoshop a bat in Kung Fu Panda’s hand, but in the meantime this will do:
http://i159.photobucket.com/al...../Panda.gif
Why would the Toronto GM be talking about Rick Porcello?
Heh, glad you guys are catching onto the awesomeness that is the Monstero!
Paddy July 7th, 2009 at 6:32 pm
Jake
Hughes is not a starter.
And he is what makes the pen “awesome”–unless we should talk about last years’ performance by both Hughes and the pen..yikes!
—————-
You obviously didn’t bother watching him pitch before his transition to the pen a few weeks back.
They loved how he was pitching out of the rotation that they didn’t want to send him down because they knew he could help the team in some capacity.
He had one really horrific start – the game against the Orioles.
His ERA combined in his other 6-7 starts was about 3.50.
If they didn’t think he was pitching well when Wang came back, they would have simply sent him down to Scranton and let him stay in the rotation down there.
When was the last time the Yankees traded for a big name player? When was the last time a number 1 starter was traded to a division rival?
Why is this even up for debate?
I’d probably go straight to Detroits GM for that offer. Haha avoid the middle man I guess.
Nick in SF,
Thanks for answering. As the only one who answered, you are the winner!
Cashman didn’t trade Hughes or Chamberlain for Johan Santana. What makes people think he is going to give either one of them up for Halladay.
Al from BK-Well of course a 3 MPH drop is fine and has to happen for him to start and I’d be thrilled with that. But there’s a problem with a 7 or more MPH drop.
You can’t teach 100 MPH, 90 MPH slider, 77 MPH curve, and a bulldog mentality.
===============================
Lately with him it’s been a poodle mentality
RT @bloggingbombers Alfredo Aceves to start Thursday for Yankees. Team will reassess 5th starter situation during All-Star break, but Hughes won’t be in that mix
Halladay >>>>>>>> Santana
Joba has much better stuff
Hughes is more mature
Both have shown they can dominate the pen
Tough… I’d have to go with Hughes for Halladay. You can always mature as you get older, but Joba’s stuff is unbelievable.
Mark – Where is that guy? I agree, if that’s what we have in Joba Chamberlain sure he must stay. But what if we have 92mph fastball 83mph slider and a nibbler? Which is all we’ve really seen this year. Maybe sell high on Jobamania?
jfinfonsfosnf-Because Halladay is better than Santana.
“But there’s a problem with a 7 or more MPH drop.”
Couldn’t agree more. 91-94 for a power pitcher isn’t cutting it. Especially a power guy with suspect control, he needs that swing and miss fastball which has been missing this year.
Happy to see Aceves is getting the start. IMO anything else (like grabbing someone from below) would have been more disruptive than helpful.
It will be interesting to see what decisions are made for after the All Star Break. (If Aceves can pitch the innings it would be great to see him get the go ahead though I can see the wisdom in putting Hughes back into the rotation.)
Halladay is BETTER than Santana
AL East proven. A workhorse. Doesn’t rely on one pitch. Will age very well
Not like Santana at all.
Remember fellas. It wasnt long ago that Hughes man hood was questioned after bombing in baltimore. Since that humiliation he has become the Yankees bullpen savior ala Joba a couple years back. Maybe this is the same wake up call that Joba needed. I hope we all can laugh about this a month from now of how we wanted Joba traded or heading back to the pen after that horrendous outing.
Im still worried about his velocity.
Come on Trisha-
What you really want to say is “I told you so, Erica”. LOL
Just kidding. You were totally right
Oh and many congrats to Alfredo sauce for getting the gig on Thursday
Al from BK July 7th, 2009 at 6:38 pm
“Al from BK-I did not notice the drop from first to second season but I noticed it this season.”
I mostly chalked up his change in velocity to him starting 95-96 mph fastball is more than enough for a power starting pitcher. However 91-94 just isn’t cutting it hence Joba’s increase in hits allowed and WHIP.
————
His velocity out of the pen in 2007 is irrelevant.
All he did was take his two best pitches and throw them as hard as he could until he emptied the tank.
Every pitcher is going to throw harder in the pen than in the rotation.
Why for Halladay, but not Johan?
Halladay’s just awesome.
And we’re not building around the 3 Amigos anymore.
“Halladay >>>>>>>> Santana”
Consider this:
Halladay, Sabathia, Burnett, Joba, Pettitte
What’s with all the people saying he’ll age well? You could guess that but since he hasn’t aged yet we have no idea.
Santana takes him out of games after 100 pitches and is a flyball pitcher
Halladay is a horse, like having another CC. He also gets groundballs.
Halladay is better than Santana or CC.
Wait till they come to OUR house AGAIN
July 7th, 2009 at 6:41 pm
jfinfonsfosnf-Because Halladay is better than Santana.
————————————————
But the team needed an ace when Santana was available. Now they signed Sabathia. Cashman whole point of signing Sabathia and not trading for Santana was because he could sign CC and not give up his farm system.
YESSS! Congrats Aceves, go get ‘em!
“Every pitcher is going to throw harder in the pen than in the rotation.”
Of course, see Phil Hughes. However losing 7-8 mph going from the pen to the rotation is a bit suspect.
Unless the 3 amigos are CC & AJ on a Halladay.
How many of you would trade Joba for Greinke straight up? How many would have even thought about it last year? Didnt Zack have an era above 5 last year? If Greinke can all of a sudden mature. Im sure Joba can follow suit.
Giuseppe Franco-You’re right; 3 MPH harder, like Hughes.
But a 7 MPH drop is more than that, especially when scouting reports from the minors said a 94 to 96 MPH fastball and when he started last season before the shoulder injury he was throwing 94 to 96.
But 91 to 94 (more usually 93) is a problem.
“His velocity out of the pen in 2007 is irrelevant.
All he did was take his two best pitches and throw them as hard as he could until he emptied the tank.
Every pitcher is going to throw harder in the pen than in the rotation.”
Joba’s velocity has declined from 2008 to now and has not shown any signs of abating.
Wait,
Because he is not some flame thrower who is reliant on velocity and shaky mechanics… a la AJ Burnett.
He has a majestic delivery, doesn’t rely on his FB etc.
Of course, this is assuming full health.
“Cashman didn’t trade Hughes or Chamberlain for Johan Santana. What makes people think he is going to give either one of them up for Halladay.”
Because Halladay’s better and that was 2 years ago when both these guys were untouchables.
Doesn’t matter much anyway. Not happening.
It would be a shame to break up ‘Generation Just Us Two’.
Al from BK
July 7th, 2009 at 6:44 pm
“Halladay >>>>>>>> Santana”
Consider this:
Halladay, Sabathia, Burnett, Joba, Pettitte
——————————–
and imagine if Wang every pitches as good as he did a few years ago in there instead of Pettitte
Best. Rotation. Ever.
Our House–
I guess its better than wasting ur time following around losers, huh?
Poor “old” Cub fans.
ever, not every
jfinfonsfosnf-Yes, but our farm system has so far developed that we may not need to sell the farm. And Halladay is a whole different Ace than Santana was.
rebecca_glass RT @ACPressSusan_L Amid news they’re willing to listen to offers on Halladay, Jays have a scout at Phillies game tonight. (via @ScottLauber)
Al from BK July 7th, 2009 at 6:45 pm
“Every pitcher is going to throw harder in the pen than in the rotation.”
Of course, see Phil Hughes. However losing 7-8 mph going from the pen to the rotation is a bit suspect.
—————-
Go look at Joba’s start in Cleveland. He was throwing 97-98 MPH in the 8th inning after he had thrown 100 + pitches.
That old Joba is still in there somewhere. He needs to be better conditioned next year and he needs to get his mechanics down and repeat his delivery.
BTW, have you decided whether Sabathia and Teixeira is a bust yet?
Just curious.
I like:
Doc
CC
AJ
Wang
Hughes
Halladay will age well because he is not a 2-pitch pitcher like Burnett, etc. He has like 5 different pitches and great mechanics.
Joba was hitting 94, 95 and 96 his last start. His velocity was fine against the bluejays, he just had no command of his pitches. That double Chavez hit off Chamberlain was a 96 mph fastball.
From MLB.com
“Sandoval, the Giants’ third baseman, had a slim lead in the NL Final Vote race over center fielder Shane Victorino of the Phillies. D-backs third baseman Mark Reynolds and Dodgers center fielder Matt Kemp each have garnered more than two million votes and were right behind them, followed by shortstop Cristian Guzman of the Nationals.
Sandoval and Victorino actually swapped leads during a dramatic Monday night of major campaigning on the field, with Victorino taking over after his four-hit performance in that 22-1 victory over the Reds — and then falling behind after Sandoval’s late grand slam.”
VOTE THE PANDA!
—–BREAKING NEWS—–
Sources close to Brian Cashman (the dealer station conveniently on my walk home) quotes Cash as saying “Roy is indeed on the market and a deal should be done within the next few days.” All Right!!!….. that guy is on drugs.
Paddy-It wouldn’t matter if all of my teams were sub 500. I’d try and leave, but wouldn’t be able to. It’s in my blood.
Joba has a bulldog mentality but Phil doesn’t? Ok
Why is Sandoval called Kung Fu Panda?
(Vote for the Flyin’ Hawaiian!)
It would be absolutley foolish to trade Joba instead of Hughes just because of some meaningless postgame comments.
Joba’s upside is considerably higher. Can Hughes hit 100 MPH on his 97th pitch in Fenway Park like Joba did?
As usual, people overreacting to a bad game.
Joba > Hughes
The flyin’ Hawaiian is currently taken by Victorino
KUNG FU PANDA!
I hope the deal is with New York.
Seriously, I doubt we get him. But it’s harmless fun to dream, no?
jfinfonsfosnf-Yeah, he hit 95, 96 like once a game.
Come on, we’re talking consistently. People are deluding themselves if they think there is no problem with his velocity.
“BTW, have you decided whether Sabathia and Teixeira is a bust yet?
Just curious.”
Hmmm, I haven’t been here for awhile but I’m pretty sure I never called either of those 2 busts. Sabathia has done about as good as you can do in the AL East 3 and change ERA, WHIP around 1.10. Tex looked like a joke the first 6 weeks and everyone was concerned, it’s awful convenient to look back and call out others for being wrong.
Red Sox would love it if we traded Joba instead of Hughes
Trade the guy with the higher upside and more ML success… brilliant.
Oops. That’s New York Yankees, not the mets.
All Star – Can Joba hit 100 MPH on his 97th pitch like he did in Fenway Park? No.
Joba <= Hughes
KUNG FU PANDA!
I’M ON THE BANDWAGON!
To be fair, outside of a 3-week stretch, Teixeria has done nothing.
3 good weeks does not override 9 mediocre/bad ones.
Nick,
If this continues, we will be out of our money making t shirt business. Before you know it, it will be generation zilch, generation nada, generation finito, you get the drift.
I think Halliday can age better in a dome stadium where theres hardly any run ins with the sun. Good for the skin.
Had a lousy day at work…in need of a good Yankee game tonight
m July 7th, 2009 at 6:51 pm
Why is Sandoval called Kung Fu Panda?
(Vote for the Flyin’ Hawaiian!)
———————
If you see any of his web gems, you’ll instantly find out.
Ace starting does not sound too attractive to me. What if he gets knocked around in his start? We will probably deplete the bullpen and forfeit the Angels series.
Erica, seriously, I do not read this forum much anymore so didn’t know (or care really
) who was rallying for what. And when I do come here I tend to read the title of Pete’s thread and then the posts closest to the end. So if you were rallying against Aceves, I wouldn’t have known that. Truly. Actually when you responded to my post your response was very reasonable about Aceves!
To me, it was just common sense to go with Aceves. I tend to believe in the KISS theory in life. Using Aceves was totally keeping it simple. It wasn’t necessarily meant to be a life-long decision, I didn’t think!
“Seriously, I doubt we get him. But it’s harmless fun to dream, no?”
I just hope the Sawks don’t, they will just walk to another title if they get Doc.
“Can Joba hit 100 MPH on his 97th pitch like he did in Fenway Park?”
Hope everyone reads that if they talk about trading Joba over Hughes.
Bronx Bomber-I hope you realize the typo. He meant 97 MPH on his 100th pitch.
Joba is IMO better than Hughesie.
Bronx Bomber,
I know! Vote for Victorino!
Not to add to the rumor frenzy, but my own sources tell me that significant members of the Blue Jays organization were scouting the Yankees in the Bronx over the weekend!
So is there still a rain delay at the MetroDome?
At worse with Joba if he fails as a starter you still him as the future closer after Mo retires. I never seen Hughes hit 98-100 out of the bullpen. Joba was hitting 97 late in the game against Indians this year that shows he still has his velocity. Even David Cone was saying that Joba is a battler mostly all the time he will keep the team in the game.
Chamberlain >>>>>> Hughes
Dave-I disagree. Yes they do.
Throwing 100 MPH doesn’t require skill
Bobby Parrnell threw 100 MPH in Boston in May too, now where is he? Has a 5+ ERA.
Shouldnt Kung Fu Panda be given to someone like Chan Ho Park? Didnt he do a round house kick on someone a few years back?
jfinfonsfosnf-Who cares about velocity out of the pen?Hughes is getting the same results.
D-Train: Throwing 100 MPH along with a wicked slider and a very good curveball is a great talent.
And even now Joba does not have a 5 ERA.
Joba has, and will always have a higher upside than Hughes
Trying to condemn this kid for a little immaturity at age 23 is foolish. Where were you at age 23?
You can’t teach 100 MPH. You can teach maturity.
Al from BK July 7th, 2009 at 6:53 pm
Hmmm, I haven’t been here for awhile but I’m pretty sure I never called either of those 2 busts. Sabathia has done about as good as you can do in the AL East 3 and change ERA, WHIP around 1.10. Tex looked like a joke the first 6 weeks and everyone was concerned, it’s awful convenient to look back and call out others for being wrong.
————–
Nah, you’re the same guy who kept whining that Cashman didn’t trade Hughes for Santana and proclaimed that you were going to wait until the ASB and decide whether these guys were worth it or not.
You preferred Santana over both Hughes and Sabathia. That’s what you said and people were giving you a hard time for it back then.
You also couldn’t stop whining about Teixeira and his struggles. I told you at the time that he would be fine.
It was a no-brainer for the common sense folks. But not so much for the whiners.
BloggingBombers: Jose Molina likely to return from DL tomorrow. Say goodbye to Francisco Cervelli, as Yankees won’t keep three catchers.
Tex>>Giambi
Tex>>Juan miranda
Tex>>Swisher
Tex>>Posada, Damon, or matsui
And we don’t even know what Joba the Reliever would look like. He’s not exactly breaking out of the gates in the first inning. Is he still doing the pre-game bullpen session? I hope not, because he’s looking better and that means he’s conquered whatever issues he had in the first.
D-Train – I will meet you somewhere and you can fire some balls in to me non skillfully at 100MPH
Dave Eliand toyed with Joba
Once Eliand rectifies that, you’ll see consistent Joba.
D-Train July 7th, 2009 at 6:56 pm
Throwing 100 MPH doesn’t require skill
Bobby Parrnell threw 100 MPH in Boston in May too, now where is he? Has a 5+ ERA.
————–
So did Farnsworth and we know how well he’s worked out.
Bobby Parnell is another Farnsworth, atleast at the moment. FBs down the middle and nothing else.
Joba has a devastating slider, curveball, and changeup. Wake me up when Hughes can say that. I can’t believe people want to trade Joba over Hughes.
“Nah, you’re the same guy who kept whining that Cashman didn’t trade Hughes for Santana and proclaimed that you were going to wait until the ASB and decide whether these guys were worth it or not.”
Obviously Sabathia has hit his stride, while Santana has fallen back a bit. I’ll admit I was wrong for now, however I’d still trade Hughes in the right deal. Namely to keep Halladay away from the Sawks.
I would trade Hughes for Farnsworthless. Throws much harder and is a veteran in the pen.
“Not to add to the rumor frenzy, but my own sources tell me that significant members of the Blue Jays organization were scouting the Yankees in the Bronx over the weekend!”
I heard that too. They had like 30+ guys at the stadium every day for 4 days straight!
A deal must be imminent.
“Dave Eliand toyed with Joba
Once Eliand rectifies that, you’ll see consistent Joba.”
I haven’t heard this anywhere, can anyone confirm Eiland tinkering with Jobber’s delivery?
I don’t get why people are saying Santana is declining after a bit of a bad stretch even though he was totally insane to start the season. I’m sure Santana will end the season pitching totally insane.
Growing pains are not only on the mound, you know. A lot of times, it is maturity issues as well. Learning how to deal with faliure/success etc.
As usual, Yankee fans have no patience, even with our phenom Joba. He has to have Jeter like maturity and Lincecum type dominance from day 1.
““Not to add to the rumor frenzy, but my own sources tell me that significant members of the Blue Jays organization were scouting the Yankees in the Bronx over the weekend!”
I heard that too. They had like 30+ guys at the stadium every day for 4 days straight!
A deal must be imminent.”
Everyone relax, perhaps they were there because we were PLAYING their team! Seriously, lets not get ahead of ourselves.
S.o.S.-All right, I want to know. What up with that comment?
Torro-The fastball velocity drop is the worrying thing.
Ack, you going to force me to somewhat defend MN aren’t you? LOL
As someone who lives in Minnesota and has family in NJ/NY, can I just say that our weather so far this summer has been MUCH better than NJ/NY? There seem to have been way more postponed due to rain, or delayed started games in New York than there have been in MN.
And its really not THAT cold in April/May, especially during the day and especially in the south of the state. Yes, we can have cold spells, but so can anywhere.
I’m actually looking forward to having an outdoor stadium. I agree the metrodome is stuffy and ugly. Although, it DOES have its advantages in knowing you can buy tickets and the game won’t be rained out.
Blue Jays will listen to offers for Roy Halliday.
Best pitcher in AL
Al – That is RIDICULOUS for Jays scouts to be at the game because the Jays are playing. You’re out of your mind deals coming. haha
Bronx Bomber-I doubt a deal, but I would be totally thrilled if they got Halladay.
“Al – That is RIDICULOUS for Jays scouts to be at the game because the Jays are playing. You’re out of your mind deals coming. haha”
I hope so, Halladay would be the missing piece IMO. However if Montero is in any deal, I am personally hunting down Cash.
I don’t want to trade Joba or Hughes. Guess that’s just the sentimental side of me that gets attached to players. I would love Doc Halladay but knowing it would take Hughes or Joba is the bad part for me. Just looking at old posts about the Santana trade people were so willing to throw away Hughes and now Hughes is no longer struggling and Santana has shown some signs of struggle recently.
I hope scouts weren’t at the stadium watching Joba to see if it’d be worth it to make a trade. Didn’t exactly impress.
““Not to add to the rumor frenzy, but my own sources tell me that significant members of the Blue Jays organization were scouting the Yankees in the Bronx over the weekend!”
I heard that too. They had like 30+ guys at the stadium every day for 4 days straight!
A deal must be imminent.”
Where did you guys hear this?
Angel, are the Vikings staying in the Metrodome or are they moving to a new stadium too?
IMO Santana is still a top 3 pitcher in baseball.
Joba is our of shape. Once he conditions himself better, the velocity will be there. He seems to get tired on the mound easily and just give up and lose concentration.
ARK $$
July 7th, 2009 at 7:02 pm
Bobby Parnell is another Farnsworth, atleast at the moment. FBs down the middle and nothing else.
Joba has a devastating slider, curveball, and changeup. Wake me up when Hughes can say that. I can’t believe people want to trade Joba over Hughes.
————————————————–
Joba throws harder than Hughes and has much better secondary pitches. There are a ton of people who want Joba to be the teams future closer and there are people who think Joba can be the future ace of the yankees that how talented he is. Chamberlain also has a lower ERA than Hughes as starters. Hughes is going to be a very good pitcher but I cant believe people are saying he is better than Joba.
All this Halladay-dreaming stuff is giving me a headache.
So, about the game tonight, hopefully CC has a bounce back performance.
Guess I’ll watch the Mets vs. Manny for an hour
I don’t care how hard the Jays try next year they will not make the playoffs…it’s impossible for them in this division. Therefore, if someone is willing to give them A prospects and maybe eat a contract or two then Riccardi has to be even more dumb than I gave him credit for.
They need to trade him now before the deadline because teams like the Yankees/Sox/Rangers/Rays/Cubs ect. are going to be more desperate in a pennant race than in the off season when they can take a step back and think about things while no games are being played. And if either the Sox or Rays start looking if he enters the market you can bet your life that Cashman will be all over it.
IMO – I’d let them have Joba, Romine, and Melancon for Wells and his contract if that’s what it took.
wake me up, when the Roy Holiday talk is over.
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Yeah it would be all right, but I think the Yankees will bluff at Halladay and bring someone else in. I am promising they acquire a starting pitcher, but who not sure.
S.o.S.-All right, I want to know. What up with that comment?
———–
Just a bit of sarcasm. Im worried about Jobas velocity dropping just like anyone else. But what im more concerned about is his control problems. If you cant throw any other pitches for strikes than it doesnt matter if you throw 100. A big league hitter will sit on it and deposit it into the seats. Farns threw hard but his balls were allergic to home plate. I cant predict who will be the better pitcher hughes or joba. All i can say is look at Aceves. Less velocity but keeps hitters guessing by throwing all pitches over the plate at all times.
Would have liked to see Mitre start Thursday just because Aceves has been so useful in his current role. Not that big of a deal, though.
Also, would Toronto seriously consider trading Halladay to an AL East rival? I know the Yanks and Sox could offer some great young talent for him, but still.
“All this Halladay-dreaming stuff is giving me a headache”
thank you.
this blog is too predictable at times.
I could dream about getting Halladay all day.
BloggingBombers(Feinsand): Yankees fans should forget about Roy Halladay in pinstripes. Even if Toronto trades him (which I doubt), it won’t be within the AL East.
Re: Halladay…It would all depend on whether or not Halladay would want to be a FA while in NY.
…..
House:
Try 97 to 98 mph. Google it.
And he reached it throughout the game.
He went 106 pitches and his very last one was 97 mph. Same in Tamapa.
But you can believe that he “just lost 6 mph”..
Also–Tex was an Angel, right? So–yes, he was in the AL.
As was Clemens, cone and wells–who weretraded here.
Tor wasn’t incontention then? Tryagain–theywere winning WSC rings back then. That’s why Clemens went there…
6 back is out of it? Don’t tell NY that…last year and the year prior???
They’re trading as to not lose him for nothing. And looking for TOP talent to re-build. Rogers Fam is loaded too, they’re not Tx.
L8r dude.
No Al,
Those games were totally coincidental. I’ll repeat: 30+ guys/4 days straight!
What uniform # do you think they’ll give Roy? Will he start on Thurs or Fri?
Also, I’m hearing that the Yanks are scouting hard on either Mauer or Morneau! A massive Yankee presence has arrived in Minn.
This is just unreal.
Hughes, Romine and McAllister for Halladay? We lose those guys but get to keep, Montero,Melancon, Ajax and Joba. I think the deal is fair.
Agreed 100% with Pete’s post on Halladay. That’s pretty much what Wave and myself have been saying all day.
First of all I doubt Halladay gets traded this season. The Jays have a good team.
Secondly, if he is traded Ricciardi will make every attempt to get him out of the division.
Third, Philly needs him more than the Yankees and they have the pieces to make a trade happen.
Finally, the Yanks probably don’t want another huge contract for a player over 30. Especially not when they have to give up young, cost controlled talent like Joba/Hughes.
Anyways enough of that subject, GO YANKS
1-0 Oakland
UPDATE, 6:56 p.m.: While I’m happy for the chatter on the blog, I think people are getting way ahead of themselves on the idea of Roy Halladay coming to the Yankees. A few points:
• He’s three years older than Johan Santana was when the Yankees decided against trading for him.
• Toronto is not going to want to trade him within the division unless they get knocked out by a deal. Think Cano, Chamberlain, Jackson, Hughes, Montero, etc. Players like that. Don’t waste time trying to come up with 17 players the Yankees don’t need. You’ll need to experience pain to make this deal. Real pain.
• Holliday has roughly $7 million left this season. I no longer believe what the Yankees say about budgets. But that’s a lot to add. The Yankees wanted money back from Pittsburgh to take on Eric Hinske.
• The Phillies need him a lot more. And it takes him out of the league.
• The Jays could theoretically get more in December than they could now.
• Halladay has a no-trade clause. So he will want to be compensated in some form for waiving that. That means a contract extension. Think $36 million over two more years or a total commitment of $60 million or so over 3.5 years.
Yes, it’s fun playing GM. But such a trade has a lot of hurdles to overcome.
People also need to understand something else regarding Joba and his velocity.
When he’s feeling it, his game ramps up a quite a bit. He had a terrible 1st inning against Boston and he then really started getting into a groove and he was unhittable.
He had 12 K’s that night in 5.2 IP.
We saw Phil Hughes last season rarely throw harder than 92 MPH.
But he worked his ass off in the offseason and he came back much more confident in his ability and was throwing everything with a lot more conviction.
Over Hughes’ last few starts before he was sent to the pen, he was throwing his fastball consistently in the 93-94 MPH range.
He has since been sent to the pen and added a couple more ticks on his fastball.
The point is this – success breeds confidence. Hughes has a swagger right now that Joba just doesn’t. That makes a big difference. It probably doesn’t make a 7 MPH difference but a significant difference nonetheless.
Joba was feeling it in that game against Cleveland and he was rolling. The numbers don’t lie – he was cranking 97-98 MPH cheese in the 7th and 8th innings that night.
You’d be surprised how much getting into a rhythm and trusting your stuff makes your stuff a lot better.
Al from BK,
If I’m the Jays I say NO WAY to that deal. Just my opinion though… I think they could get a lot more for Halladay
Paddy-You are deluding yourself if you don’t think there’s a significant and obvious velocity drop.
And Tex was traded out of the division. He was not traded from the Angels to the Rangers.
Well…Pete told us that Mark Teixeria wasn’t coming to the Bronx after the Swisher trade! LOL hahahaha
If the Yankees want Doc Halladay…they will get Doc Halladay!
Oh, come on, Peter.
The Blue Jays would take Shelly Duncan, Jonathan Albaladejo, and Ramiro Pena for Roy Halladay in a heartbeat!!!!
Just so that it sinks in:
UPDATE, 6:56 p.m.: While I’m happy for the chatter on the blog, I think people are getting way ahead of themselves on the idea of Roy Halladay coming to the Yankees. A few points:
• He’s three years older than Johan Santana was when the Yankees decided against trading for him.
• Toronto is not going to want to trade him within the division unless they get knocked out by a deal. Think Cano, Chamberlain, Jackson, Hughes, Montero, etc. Players like that. Don’t waste time trying to come up with 17 players the Yankees don’t need. You’ll need to experience pain to make this deal. Real pain.
• Holliday has roughly $7 million left this season. I no longer believe what the Yankees say about budgets. But that’s a lot to add. The Yankees wanted money back from Pittsburgh to take on Eric Hinske.
• The Phillies need him a lot more. And it takes him out of the league.
• The Jays could theoretically get more in December than they could now.
• Halladay has a no-trade clause. So he will want to be compensated in some form for waiving that. That means a contract extension. Think $36 million over two more years or a total commitment of $60 million or so over 3.5 years.
Yes, it’s fun playing GM. But such a trade has a lot of hurdles to overcome.
Vinny
Too bad it bores you, however Halliday will be traded and soon.
So either the Yankees are there or not, but it is valid to discuss unless you want to talk about Michael Jackson.
Patrick-You, Pete and Wave are right.
But I hope not.
Franco-There is a velocity issue. There is. It’s an obvious one.
I think I’m with Al from BK. History here tells me there is no deal in the works because I’ve seen too many active imaginations with things that turn out to be nada.
Safest way to do life is to either wait for Pete to tell you something might be in the works (if he did already then I apologize – I didn’t see anything in his lead in) or wait for an announcement from the Yankee organization.
JMO. That works well for me, but I also do well without knowing things until they are officially announced.
Ughh. This Halladay stuff is too much, all Ricciardi did was throw out a line asking teams to surrender their best prospects for Doc. I doubt anything happens, but its fun to dream.
And just as I mention listening to Pete, an update appears.
Yeah, lots of active imaginations on this forum.
Bye Frankie. I’m sure we’ll see you again very soon. Thank you for the wonderful job you did.
WELCOME BACK JOSE, WHEN YOU GET HERE!!!!!
its weird hearing girardi talk and lady gaga sing in the same audio clip…what has this world come to
Wow. I can’t believe people are against a little hypothetical trade talk.
It was quite civil (just one little skirmish) and good fun.
FWIW, Molina doesn’t have a hit in any of his rehab appearances thus far.
i thought he was 1-10 as of yesterday?
Apparently Doc only wants to go to a title contender that leaves us, the Phillies, and of course the Sawks.
Rishi: his BA is .000
“FWIW, Molina doesn’t have a hit in any of his rehab appearances thus far.”
This isn’t much different than when he’s playing with the big club. LOL!
Tell AJ to call him
I heard Cash is gonna sign David Cone to a $4 M. a game deal for the rest of the season. Can anyone confirm this????
fair enough – just going off a tweet I read yesterday…
Pete makes some very good points about any trade for Halladay. However, I think the Yanks will be in, and it will come to whether Ricciardi wants to deal him within the division, regardless of the package offered. That and the orders he gets from ownership, whomever that might be right now. Especially if there’s thoughts about selling the team.
“Where did you guys hear this?”
The original source was a combination of MY9 and YES, but DirecTV was my actual source.
GF, good post – completely agree.
I agree with Pete – I really don’t think he’s coming here. I don’t think the Yankees would part with Hughes or Joba, for one. More importantly, the Jays are not trading Halladay to a division rival – then to have to face him for the next few years? We’ll see if Doc is even traded…..
Al
In Canada they are saying that Halliday has stated he will not resign and the Blue Jays owners want to cut payroll, so Halliday is going to be traded, maybe not the Yankees, but he is going.
Wait till they come to OUR house AGAIN July 7th, 2009 at 7:18 pm
Patrick-You, Pete and Wave are right.
But I hope not.
Franco-There is a velocity issue. There is. It’s an obvious one.
————–
Did you read and understand anything I said? Anything at all?
His conditioning is probably a big part of it. But that Joba of old is not dead. It’s still in there somewhere and it comes back to him on occasion when he really gets into a rhythm.
Maybe an offseason of boot camp will make his velocity more consistent next season.
He also has to get his mechanics down consistently.
Molina hit a double playing for Scranton. So he’s 1-10.
Pretty sure Hosey had a hit.
Halladay would kill in the NL. If I were him, I’d OK a deal to PHI. The Mutts could use him as well, but they won’t pony up the cash nor do they have the prospects to get that deal done.
JMO but I’d take back Wells if it landed Halladay.
However taking back Wells = No Joba, No Hughes, No Jackson and No Montero in the deal.
After that take your pick of the farm.
I don’t care how much money Wells is owed, the Yankees will make that money back once they win the 3 three WS and start a new dynasty.
Wells/Swisher/Melky or Gardner/Halladay > Bay or Holliday/Swisher/Melky or Gardner in my opinion.
i will miss pretty eyes, but carrying 3 catcher is not what this team needs.
that’s what I thought, too, Al & m
oh, and vote for pablo!
Molina hit the ball so hard he broke their drainage system.
He’s ready.
“FWIW, Molina doesn’t have a hit in any of his rehab appearances thus far.”
——
If he had THE EYES it would be forgettable im guessing.
Nick in SF
July 7th, 2009 at 7:25 pm
“Where did you guys hear this?”
The original source was a combination of MY9 and YES, but DirecTV was my actual source.
I thought Fortunoff was the source?
And you can’t dismiss this story. It’s a pretty big deal. JP has already informed Doc that he might be traded.
This is a huge deal. Admitting that you’re open to calls is half the battle.
i would do joba and prospects in a second for doc
Monlina hasn’t had a hit as a Yankee. Hes ready baby!
“Pretty sure Hosey had a hit.”
He did.
Oakland leading 1-0 in the 2nd.
“randy makes a good point. Maybe we should trade Hughes to Tampa for Neil Allen.”
nick in sf-
good one.
all kidding aside why keep wang if they are just going to ruin him and then just let him walk as a free agent or release him. neither cashman nor eiland clearly have any idea what to do with him .
the yankees should get what they can from the rays. i mean how good could wang be just because he was reunited with neil allen? the yankees could trick the rays into taking the washed up wang.
i mean, if cashman and eiland couldn’t get wang back to what he was , who could?
allen really didn’t know what he was doing when he turned him into a star. it was just dumb luck. what’s the chance of that happening again ?
Ken davidoff says that JP is looking for a “Teixeira type bounty” for Halladay…so that basically means at the very least Hughes/Joba + Ajax+ Romine+ Z-mac and who knows what else….maybe even Monstero ( i like that nickname) in place of romine…
its all nonsense to me…i want nothing to do with Roy if it costs that much
“i would do joba and prospects in a second for doc”
Are you kidding? Joba is 23 and under a rookie deal for several years, no Joba, no Montero in any deal.
Oakland WAS leading in the 2nd.
1-1
raymagnetic – good thought. Although I’d try to make it Rios instead of Wells. Although not as much as Wells, Rios is still owed a nice chunk of change. If Ricciardi is trying to cut payroll in preparation to sell the team, then cutting payroll is cutting payroll.
1-1 bos oak tied
Bay hit one out.
Monstero’s reached on an E5 and then went from 1st to 3rd on an E6 I think.
“Vinny
Too bad it bores you, however Halliday will be traded and soon.
So either the Yankees are there or not, but it is valid to discuss unless you want to talk about Michael Jackson”
would prefer to discuss Halliday going to the Phillies, not the Yankees.
as the Yankees are currently on the right course.
“at the very least Hughes/Joba + Ajax+ Romine+ Z-mac”
No thanks JP, you can plunder another team’s farm system were not that desperate. 3 top prospects is more than fair, the Mets got Santana for Carlos Gomez and a bucket of balls.
ray – I misread your post – if we get to keep Joba and Phil, and the others you named, under that scenario, I take Wells with Doc. Absolutely.
Man, I hate Bay.
“I heard Cash is gonna sign David Cone to a $4 M. a game deal for the rest of the season. Can anyone confirm this????”
just don’t put him in the bullpen.
Al from BK
July 7th, 2009 at 7:37 pm
Man, I hate Bay.
===============================
I typed and deleted the same thing
Hank Steinbrenner and Randy Levine for Halladay
“Man, I hate Bay”
word.
he’s not even that good
well, until he got to Boston. grrrrrrrrrr
“Apparently Doc only wants to go to a title contender that leaves us, the Phillies, and of course the Sawks”
Angels? Big market without the scrutiny of East Coast baseball which is more like what he was used to in Toronto. Chance to be a contender, in need of pitching and an owner who isn’t afraid to write a check. Just saying.
“Hank Steinbrenner and Randy Levine for Halladay”
only if we have to throw in Lonn Trost.
http://www.channelsurfing.net/.....p?w=110720
SWB Yanks if anyone wants to watch
“Hank Steinbrenner and Randy Levine for Halladay”
Throw in Lonn Trost too.
Pete,
With due respect to your views on Halladay, you have been wrong before (Tex for example) and any thing can happen. Yes, this year it will be a budget issue, but next year a lot comes off the budget and it is manageable. They got money for Eric Hinske is not a sign of any thing. That is how Yanks valued the deal and Pittsburg was ready to oblige, nothing more than that.
If they get Halladay, Yanks chances of winning WS increase dramatically. That pays for more times than the 7 mil they add to the payroll. Do not forget this aspect of the impact of Halladay on the team.
Ultimately it comes down to what is the price in prospects. If it is manageable like the proposals SJ made, they will go for it. Assuming they have to extend his contract for two years as you say for 36 mil, if they win two WS in the next four years because of this move, it is worth it. With the success and the associated increase in revenues, the budget will take care of itself.
That other Texeira in the Yanks’ system is pitching something awesome tonight.
“Angels? Big market without the scrutiny of East Coast baseball which is more like what he was used to in Toronto. Chance to be a contender, in need of pitching and an owner who isn’t afraid to write a check. Just saying.”
Eh, Angels are on the fringe. They are not as good as the Yanks offensively, or in the rotation. I suspect AJ to be a draw for Doc if the Yanks get involved the 2 were very close in Toronto and AJ credits Doc with helping to fix his pitch selection and style. Also Mo and Doc are always very chummy at the All Star Game, Just Sayin’.
Oh what the heck: Hank, Randy and Lonn for Halladay.
Get on the phone Cashmoney
Re: Halladay trade, think of it this way, why would the yankees want to pick up hallday now, at age 32 when they could’ve have gotten a better pitcher for less in Santana 2 years ago? Santana was 28 when he got traded. And for what? He got traded for sack of potatoes and two so-so players.
BTW, Halladay is on the DL every single year. Albeit he’s a very, very good pitcher, he has at least one stint on the DL every year.
I would trade Doc for Halladay, but I’m not trading Monstero.
noooo ajax got thrown out for the first time this year….14-1
Wow, nice DP by the A’s!
Agree, Al – AJ will help us out with Halladay if the discussions get serious.
“That other Texeira in the Yanks’ system is pitching something awesome tonight”
he looked like he had skills, back in spring training
Ralphie,
Marty Foster was assigned to Scranton?
I want the Phillies to get Halladay, oh man would WFAN be a riot.
Zach: I think he’s refering to AJax attempting to steal.
All of that is true Pete.
Allow me to play devils advocate…..
What if Roy doesn’t want to go to Philadelphia? He has a full no trade and holds all the power. Perhaps he doesn’t want to change leagues and wants to play with AJ, who constantly tells him how “great” it is to be a Yankee?
Perhaps he sees rings and a first ballot HOF nomination if he comes to NY for 5 years. Wouldn’t be the first guy to feel that way. That was a big reason Reggie came to NY in 1977.
Perhaps he’s comfortable knowing the AL and isn’t interested in learning a new league.
With the economy the way it is, fewer and fewer teams will have the means to do this deal even in the winter. That makes it tougher for JP to do the deal in the off-season.
Trading him in the division never stopped the Jays from dealing Cone and Clemens to the Yankees.
Its about landing the right package for him.
Would it take a lot? Define “a lot”?
More than Santana? Well, Hughes or Chamberlain and Romine to start is already more than Minny got for Santana. Any other sweeteners to that package already tops the Santana deal and just about any other deal he will find on the market.
The more time goes by, the less the package becomes in these types of deals. See Bill Smith’s dealing with Santana as Exhibit A on how NOT to trade a marquee pitcher.
The last question to be answered….
“Why would the Yankees make that deal when they wouldn’t deal Hughes for Santana 2 years ago”?
That’s the easiest one to answer.
The Yankees offered Hughes, Marquez and Melky for Santana and got turned down. Had the Twins said, “yes”, that deal would have gone down and Phil Hughes would have been traded.
Fact is, Minnesota turned the deal down. It wasn’t the Yankees refusing to part with Hughes.
Now, you have two young guns in Hughes and Chamberlain. If you deal one, you still have the other. That’s one distinction from the Santana talks.
The other distinction is, with CC, AJ, and Wang already here, and one of the young guns still remaining, plus over 40 million coming off the books, the Yankees could slot him in easily.
Especially if he wants to play in NY.
Last wild card in all this…..Chapman.
If you lose one of the young guns in the Halladay deal, you can always sign Chapman to fill that gap.
Two years from now, you have a 23 year old LH who throws 100 waiting in the wings to be added to the rotation.
The Yankees have a bunch of ways to go here and all of them are favorable to them.
Standing pat is favorable.
Getting Doc is VERY favorable.
Getting Doc and signing Chapman over the winter is also VERY favorable.
The only unfavorable thing from the Yankees perspective is Doc ending up in Boston. JMO but, if they feel that’s his destination, they will make sure they get him. Just as it was with Tex this past winter.
The money? I, like you, refuse to drink that Kool Aid again. I’ll believe the Yankees back out of talks to acquire a marquee player because of money when it actually happens.
If it does, it will be the first time in the history of the Steinbrenner Family owning the team that money stood in the way of doing a deal.
In other words, money ain’t gonna be the reason they don’t get the guy.
E-Rod July 7th, 2009 at 7:46 pm
I want the Phillies to get Halladay, oh man would WFAN be a riot.
Its gonna be a riot if he goes anywhere but the Mets.
Mets just walked in a run
Wow, SJ – long post, but interesting read
Finally SJ… the voice of reason.
Nice to see someone not just echo the robotic “He won’t be traded in the AL East” argument.
To me best case Doc goes to Philly. Out of AL, and torments the Mets.
Mitre is dealing
And Manny just blooped one.
For ANY Yankee fan who thinks the Yankees will swoop in and grap Halladay, FORGET. He hate Yankee Stadium because of that right field porch. If he goes anywhere, it will be in the NL or out in the AL West. Either way, I seriously doubt Roy gets traded THIS year. He has a FULL no trade so it’s his final decision.
We have to be in on the Halladay talks just to make JH’s Twitter short-circuit.
Doc on the Phillies with Hamels? Jeez, the Mets might as well fire-sale and give up the season if that happens.
“Marty Foster was assigned to Scranton?”
haha good one
I don’t want Halladay unless he’s a FA.
Halladay on the Phils would feast! He doesn’t have to battle 3 of the best hitters in the NL bc they are on his team. And besides Pujols and Hanley, who scares him? Manny? He knows him.
Go the NL and become a first ballot Hall of Famer! Go to the Phils and you got a shot at winning a ring!
A Hamels-Halladay combo in the playoffs would be just filthy and a nightmare.
“We have to be in on the Halladay talks just to make JH’s Twitter short-circuit”
: )
and John Henry is a twit
Halladay hates our ballpark but will got o Philly?
Did anyone see the Green GIDP?
Looks like Giambi threw to third for the 2nd out!
Wow!!! I just saw on the MLB Network that the Cardinals have put Mark DeRosa on the 15 day disabled list. I’m glad that we didn’t trade for him. He’s 34 years old and now has a bad wrist.
The Yankees don’t need Halladay nearly enough right now to give up the prospects it would take to get him. It just doesn’t make sense considering they just got CC and AJ.
I don’t think Halladay will go to Phila either….he would win 25 games in a PITCHER’S ballpark though
Halladay-Hamels in a short series will be destructive.
Especially with their offense and if Lidge/Madson get straightened out.
Makes all the sense in the world from their standpoint. But do they decide to empty the farm?
SJ – What of the reports that Chapman is 26? That popped up then died down. Is age an issue with this kid?
To me best case Doc goes to Philly. Out of AL, and torments the Mets.
===========================
Imagine if that happens? I can already hear Joe Benigno screaming “oh the pain!” on WFAN
“The Yankees don’t need Halladay nearly enough right now to give up the prospects it would take to get him. It just doesn’t make sense considering they just got CC and AJ”
100% in a nutshell.
and it should be posted 500 times
As long as he is out of AL East any trade will work. Preferably NL.
Like I said, I will definitely wait for official announcements on anything Yankee. Like vinny b, (I think it was vinny b) I guess I really find all of the speculation pretty boring. I have always had ADD when it comes to fan fantasy/theory forumulation on out-of-left-field issues…
Anyway,
GO YANKEES!!!
GO A’S.!!!!!
Enjoy the game.
“The money? I, like you, refuse to drink that Kool Aid again. I’ll believe the Yankees back out of talks to acquire a marquee player because of money when it actually happens.
If it does, it will be the first time in the history of the Steinbrenner Family owning the team that money stood in the way of doing a deal.”
Well, what about Beltran?
I’d rather have Joba and Hughes instead of Chapman……just not willing to go there for Halladay.
The bottom line is, he’s not going to get a Teixeira style deal for Doc because the times have changed since that deal went down.
Fewer teams can take on Doc’s deal as it is right now, let alone an extension.
Since the Braves got fleeced, nobody else is going to line up and get fleeced again.
An everyday player like Tex will always garner more on the trade market than a pitcher because he plays in 5 times the amount of games per year than a pitcher.
When you cut through all of this stuff, here is what we know….
They have to trade him at some point or they only get draft picks for after 2010. That’s not an optimum situation for Toronto.
He has a full no trade clause. JP could put a deal in place and if Doc doesn’t want to go to that team, it ain’t gonna happen.
When you look at the three factors that have to be in place to deal Doc: He waives his no trade, the players coming back to Toronto AND the team acquiring him signs him to a new deal, there are maybe 3-4 teams that can meet that criteria.
The Yankees are one of them.
Halladay is 32 yrs old and has never played in the postseason or ever been in a winning situation.
I doubt he is too picky on which team he goes to. If he can play in Philly or NY, I’d bet he would absolutely jump at it. He doesn’t strike me as a sissy like Peavy who only wants a comfortable situation and would rather lose than come East in a big ballpark.
Trisha
why is it out of left field?Pete is right in stating that the Yankees are not likely to be the destination, but the Jays have said they are ready to trade, their ownership wants to cut payroll and Halliday will not sign an extension. Perhaps you are wrong.
…
Kanekoa Texeira has pitched four 1-2-3 innings for Trenton. And yes, he started.
I think if you’re a team like Philly, you go for it. You have a legit opportunity to win championships for the next two years. You have a great offense 1-6. Seriously, besides the dodgers and maybe, maybe the Cards, who stands in their way of making it back to the World Series?
Pull that trigger.
The radio in Boston was all excited about a package of Bucholz and Bowden and another 1 or 2 for Halladay.
Will the Red Sox pull off this trade.
Age of Chapman???
Holliday could be a Curt Schilling. I don’t care how old he is. If we can get him, get him.
Lets go Yankees! Rebound CC!
“I’d rather have Joba and Hughes instead of Chapman”
Chapman is a stud, 100 mph, devastating breaking pitches and he’ll only cost money.
Yanks should definitely take this series, let’s hope CC bounces back tonight, I think he will
sj-
may be your best work to date
kudos
Betsy,
You are too emotionally involved to have a say in this! lol
Seriously, Folks can’t prospect hug too much here.
We are talking about Roy Halladay. He is a better pitcher than anybody the Yankees have right now, in or out of the farm system, not named Mariano Rivera and CC Sabathia.
It will be that way for at least another 3-4 years. He’s that good.
He isn’t some hick off the street.
The Beltran deal wasn’t about money. It was about George wanting Randy Johnson when they said they were only signing one big guy that off-season.
It wasn’t the money. It was George priorizing and deciding Johnson and not Beltran was the bigger need.
Vrsce, I probably should have said “extremely unlikely” rather than out of left field. I definitely think KO said it best, and vinny-b echoed the sentiment.
“The Yankees don’t need Halladay nearly enough right now to give up the prospects it would take to get him. It just doesn’t make sense considering they just got CC and AJ”
JMO of course, but I don’t think people always stop to think of reality when a fancy name appears on the scene. All they can see is the fancy name.
Very well-put, SJ44, and I appreciate your saying it.
And let me add that, while signing CC, AJ, and Tex gave the team a great chance to win now while simultaneously developing for the future, trading for Halladay COULD give the team an even better chance to win while the Jeter/Posada/Rivera window is still open but without emptying the cupboard. Extra emphasis on COULD given the highly-speculative nature of the discussion.
Anyway, we play tonight, we win tonight, dassit!
Oops, I meant I’d rather keep Phil and Joba and potentially get Chapman instead of giving up one or the other for Halladay and getting Chapman.
Anyone think that if the twins win there will be some pie mocking? I mean they had to watch us celebrate like maniacs 3 days in a row
. They might be harboring some anger issues.
On the other hand, reality is that poor Dana Eveland is having a tough time. Hopefully he gets this third out…
Let’s go Yankees
Anyone is Chapman 21 or 26??
The Yankees will get him before Boston will. Think Mark Teixeira without the no trade.
It doesn’t matter what the Phillies do. Doc controls where Doc goes. Not JP, Peter Gammons or anybody else.
Where he wants to go is where he will go.
He’s an extreme groundball pitcher who strikes out a lot of guys. The ballpark won’t be an issue.
Personally, I would be surprised if he changed leagues at this point in his career.
LOL SJ, but I’m not saying this out of emotion. I felt it was ridiculous for the Yankees to trade Phil for Santana because even if he didn’t end up to be as good (very difficult to do, obviously), he was a young kid who I believed had the capability of being an ace some day. I was not willing to give up 6 years for a player who couldn’t guarantee a thing (not his fault – NO player can guarantee a thing). Halladay is the best pitcher in baseball, so he’s better than Johan, but my philosophy still holds. This isn’t about prospect hugging, this is about believing in prospects who are going to be huge parts of the future.
Apparently Chapman is listed as 21, however you never know with international prospects.
Al – That’s my point. A report came out that him his age as 26 during the WBC, but then there was no follow up. Be nice if he really is 21.
Jeter!
100 hits
All available information re: Chapman’s age to date is that he is 21 years old.
If information comes forward showing otherwise, it will be national news and you won’t miss it.
Nick,
That’s all I’m laying out here. You don’t have to be a Baseball America prospect groupie to look at the Yankees system, in comparison to other teams that would be in the bidding, add in the other factors to pull a deal off and see they can put together the best package.
Obviously, we don’t know if they would want to do it.
All I can say is, if I’m the GM, here’s my offer to JP:
Hughes or Chamberlain, pick one.
Austin Romine
A list of 10 other prospects in AA and A ball and you pick 2.
If he says, “no”? No harm, no foul.
If he says, “yes”, you starting printing playoff tickets because a rotation of Sabathia-Doc-AJ-Pettitte and Wang puts you in a terrific position to go to the WS.
Ugh.
And that’s what happens when you play the odds. (Eveland just gave up a hit.)
Betsy, JMO and I don’t need to write an endless post to convince you, I’m sure, but I don’t think you have to worry about Hughes. I believe he will continue to be seen as the future of the franchise by the Yankees and he won’t be going anywhere. They are extremely happy with him and likely see him as a necessary piece to their puzzle. JMO again, but then again, everything written here is just that right – JPO (just peoples’ opinions).
I wonder what Vince Gennaro would say about the Yankees acquiring Doc. That’s the real issue here.
“Al – That’s my point. A report came out that him his age as 26 during the WBC, but then there was no follow up. Be nice if he really is 21.”
Sad but true, you just can’t tell “El Duque” is probably celebrating his 50th b-day soon but the way he pitched you’d never tell.
SJ – Thanks.
“If he says, “yes”, you starting printing playoff tickets because a rotation of Sabathia-Doc-AJ-Pettitte and Wang puts you in a terrific position to go to the WS.”
I wouldn’t trade Joba or Hughes. Don’t think you can afford to give up either now, even for Doc.
While Joba may have better upside than Hughes, he’s also more of an injury risk. It’s why teams passed on himin the draft. And the fact is he hasn’t been the same pitcher since he hurt his shoulder last year. All of Hughes’ injuries have been minor and not arm/shoulder.
Texeria will break out tonight….He’s getting much better swings as of late…..Matsui back in the 5 hole, this is a very good thing….Giradi decided enough is enough……Doc Halliday 4 years 100 million to start…Say goodbye to Hughes or Joba, and Jackson as well …Just to start
Tex!
Hey there Tex
that wasnt a strike to damon…hope CC gets the same zone
If things worked out with Gerrit Cole last year and if the Tigers didn’t take Porcello ahead of the Yankees I wouldn’t have mind trading either Joba or Hughes.
“This isn’t about prospect hugging, this is about believing in prospects who are going to be huge parts of the future.”
That reminds me of some dialogue from Woody Allen’s “Love and Death”:
Boris: Sonja, are you scared of dying?
Sonja: Scared is the wrong word. I’m frightened of it.
Boris: That’s an interesting distinction. …
I’m happy about Matsui in the 5th hole as well. I mean we will see if it works out but you have to shuffle the lineup sometimes and Joe has been doing that lately. Ride the hot hand and see what happens.
Terrible job by Alex, let’s go Hideki…
“”UPDATE, 4:09 p.m.: The Yankees released Angel Berroa today.”"
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
SJ,
Would you offer Hughes or Joba + Montero + 2 prospects from the list of 10 in A or AA?
Matsui!!!
good job godzilla!…
Good start boys
Matsui, so CLUTCH!
Mastui starting to heat up.
Matsui. I love.
Sui!
matsui!!
I love when Matsui gets on his hot streaks.
SJ,
How badly do you think JP wants to get rid of Wells’ contract (though I like Rios better)?
work him Swishy
Ugh, Swisher should have let that hit him, that’s a slider, take 1 for the team u have a 1-2 count
Monstero is untouchable
Eh
Baker at 27 pitches
Nick in SF
That is incredibly jejune
I know there are many here who are of the mind set that The LA Dodgers are a paper lion because of the NL West….Trust me, if they manage to come up with another starter, they wqill be the team to beat come October if theyt get to open up the Series in LA……Man they are a very good baseball team, and they’re young……
Time for CC to be the man!
LoL @ Carlos Gomez batting 8th
the crown jewel, in the Mets/Santana trade
c.c lets do it big guy!!
Bret,
Montero is untouchable to me. I’d walk away if they insisted on Montero.
You deal one of the young guns, you get Halladay in return AND keep one of the young guns. You deal Montero, there is a steep dropoff to Cervelli, Romine etc.
To me, Jesus Montero is untouchable in any trade because its rare you have a catcher with that kind of offensive ability at 19 years old.
The only way Vernon Wells gets traded is if Toronto takes NOTHING in return or Toronto picks up a lot of his contract. They could do what the Marlins did and try to package him with Halladay and take less in return for payroll flexibility. I wonder if the Yankees would still be interested if they went that route.
So I live in California and tonight we only get the Twins feed on the MLB Extra Innings package. The top of the 1st just ended and I’m already so aggravated I’m ready to turn the game off!
Will someone please call the Twins booth and tell their color guy to be quiet for 5 seconds! It’s like listening to someone on speed. Their play by play guy barely gets to finish a sentence before the color guy butts in with a pearl of wisdom like “Mauer just bent down to tie his shoe”, or “Baker just tugged on his cap again. See that!!”, or “CC Sabathia is a big guy with a big contract.”
Let’s see…..where’s that mute button?……
let’s label swisher and cano the clutch twins. since they hit so well with RISP let’s all them the clutch bros or clutch twins…
my sources say… Halladay will only go to a city that serves gravy with their fries. It’s a deal breaker.
DT-
Toronto will not accept any deal from the Yankees that does not include an old Yankee stadium urinal and some of the Yankee stadium grass seed
“Toronto will not accept any deal from the Yankees that does not include an old Yankee stadium urinal and some of the Yankee stadium grass seed”
hey watchout!!…the grass seed was MY idea
…i also suggested a brick form monument park…
nice inning CC
Erica – good luck getting that grass past customs.
The dogs will be all over that…
Paul from Cali: do you get your MLB package through a cable provider? I get it via DirecTV and usually get both the home and away announcers for each Yankee game. If you think listening to the Twins announcers is bad, just imagine if we were playing in Chicago…
I’m stuck with Twins announcers on Extra Innings – featuring Bert Be Home By Eleven.
GJ Cano
“Halladay will only go to a city that serves gravy with their fries.”
I read an article this weekend about Gagne pitching for an independent league team in Montreal now and he was eating fries with gravy (they called it putine) during the interview.
Cano- the bases empty batting champ.
that was an EXCEPTIONAL ab by cano…kept fighting and got a double…but it was with the bases empty so it doesnt count
cano got a hit with no one on base. what a surprise!
see – no runner on, Cano hits
I always crack up when they refer to “the baggie” or “the Hefty bag”.
Way 2 go, GGBG!
haha gardners playing dirty
haha…good job gardner..do that all day
Squeeze?
Cano should hit leadoff. He is hitting .419 leading off an inning, .356 with bases empty.
The Yanks can’t acquire Halliday and renegotiate his contract, and replace the offense they are losing, and keep their payroll ae 2009 levels.
I’m not saying it’s impossible, the Yanks have been known to increase their payroll before, but I think it is unlikely,
I posted this on the previous thread but I’ll do it again because not many were on then.
In 2010, the Yanks’ commitments to CC, Tex, AJ, Mo, Posada, Jeter, ARod, Swisher, Rivera, Marte, Cano (and Brackman and Miranda will be approximately $162.5MM. That doesn’t include any pro-rated signing bonuses, and it doesn’t include any reserves against the $$ they will owe ARod once he gets to 660 HRs. It doesn’t take into consideration any $$ they might pay to sign Chapman.
If they get Halliday, they’ll have to rework his contract to give him at least $20MM a year, probably more. The CC contract sets the mark there.
That gets the payroll over $182MM. There payroll is approximately $201MM today, that leaves less than $19MM to replace Damon and Matsui (and Nady/Hinske), to give an arb increase to whichever of Hughes or Joba they keep, to sign another starter (Wang, Pettite, whoever), sign their CF (be it Gardner or Melky, and if Melky give him an arb increase), sign 5 more relievers, and an entire bench.
I don’t think $19MM, or even anything close to that, gets you there.
UPDATE, 8:35 p.m.: It is great to watch Cervelli sprint — and I mean sprint — up the line to back-up throws to first base. It’s like he’s racing the runner. A.J. Burnett and I were talking about ‘Frisco before the game. He gets a kick out of him, too. “It’s great to be 23 and have that kind of energy,” he said.
Cervelli needs a 5 run homer here to cement his job.
almost. 0 out sac fly will do.
good job cisco!
Gardner steal 3rd time.
It’s amazing how a guy like Cervelli can be so productive w/RISP and hitters with all the talent in the world, like Arod and Cano, can look so inept at times.
Nick In SF: Yes, it’s Time Warner Cable. Some nights I get both home and away feeds, but usually it’s just the home feed. TW Cable doesn’t have enough channels to offer all the feeds every night. Plus in my market we don’t get any games in HD. This is what I pay for.
As much as I like Cervelli, he needs to be in AAA and get regular playing time like El Nino.
cone is blind
Oakland just picked up another run.
Now Sox leading Oakland 4-2 bottom of the fifth.
ajax 1 for 3 with a ground rule double…no k’s!
GJ Damon
TEX lets go!
It always amazes me how much quieter this blog is when the Yanks are winning!
Boy, these guys couldn’t get anymore bloopers and lucky hits if they tried.
“I read an article this weekend about Gagne pitching for an independent league team in Montreal now and he was eating fries with gravy (they called it putine) during the interview. ”
Gagne in an independent league. Unbelieveable.
He was born in Montreal – I think it is safe to assume he is now back on the gravy.
“It always amazes me how much quieter this blog is when the Yanks are winning!”
shhh dont stir up the demons
Tex again!
Tex!
Oh I guess they could. What a lucky 3-0 lead.
I’m around
just trying to multi-task here
2 broken bat hits for Tex…I like it!
whoa lawdy
Lots of heads up baserunning by MPB Johnny Damon
I would never want to use Jesus Montero in the past tense. Saying he used to be a Yankee would be extremely regrettable for years.
All talks come to a halt when he’s mentioned in a deal, Halladay or otherwise.
I’m confused. I thought the yankees only scored on homeruns?
I guess when things are going good, you get every break in a game.
What is up with this high strike
Yankees have 7 hits in less than 2 innings. If nothing else, this pitcher SHOULD be gone before 5 innings.
Bob-
After yesterday’s debacle the Yankees are owed lots of baseball good karma
If Cervelli wants to play regularly in the minors, he’s better off in Trenton. Scranton is a tough call these days…lol
Sorry NYY626, but they only score on errors because according to the Twins broadcasters it’s not possible to get an earned run off Baker.
arod is saving his hits for the later innings when it counts more…
SJ,
I am surprised that you would forgo 4 years of Halladay and a chance at 4 rings while Jeter, Arod and Posada are still together and the window is open.
Jesus Montero is our Hanley Ramirez.
I still believe the Sox were correct by locking down Beckett even at the cost of Hanley. He helped them win a ring.
alright, that’s it.
bring in cody ransom.
The streak of Alex never getting a hit off Baker continues.
57 pitches for Baker
Do you think Girardi might wish he didn’t give ARod that day off?
I know it was necessary, but he was on such a roll.
Not sure if I’ve ever seen Alex have such a bad swing, especially with 2 strikes…..He must have been thinking off speed….
Agreed, Montero should be untouchable. There’s still some question over whether he can be a major league catcher, but if so, his projected debut coincides perfectly with the end of Posada’s contract.
If Montero works out, then Romine could be used as trade bait. For now, the Yankees should try and keep both of them because good young catchers are hard to find, and the Yankees need to have a good catcher, it’s part of their tradition.
Paul from Cali July 7th, 2009 at 8:55 pm
Sorry NYY626, but they only score on errors because according to the Twins broadcasters it’s not possible to get an earned run off Baker.
______________________________________________________________
Thanks for clarifying Paul. I knew there was some sort of logical explanation.
Baker’s pitch count is 57 for two innings,can you say JOBA
Did anyone see Manny just flip his bat and helmet after k’ing?
Wave,
The Yankees can simply choose to make a verbal deal with Doc that they will do a new deal with him to take effect in 2011 prior to or during, the 2010 season.
They can just work off the existing deal and be committed to 22 million over the next 18 months.
Wouldn’t be the first time they did something like that.
If they want him, they have the parts to get him and pay him.
Obviously, we don’t know if they want him.
If they do, they can work out a deal that works for everybody.
“It always amazes me how much quieter this blog is when the Yanks are winning!”- Erica
What do you suppose we say when we are winning?
“Oh, the Yankees are doing so well. They are just doing everything so perfect.”
When they are doing bad, it is easier to point out what they are doing wrong. When you are winning, it’s not as easy to point out what is going wrong. When things aren’t going perfectly there is debate about how to fix it, discussion about why it’s not working. When you’re winning, you can only post so much. Not many people are going to post “we’re doing so good” “good job Derek!” “great HR” over and over all game. So naturally, when the team isn’t on fire, more posts will be made.
Also, this thread has nearly 800 posts and it’s only the 3rd inning. The game threads usually make between 1000-1500 posts, this game thread will as well. So, really, how much quiet is it?
It’s amazing how often Halladay’s name is misspelled – people get him confused with Holliday, lol.
I admit that I drool at the thought of Doc in pinstripes, but the price is just too high. If the Yankees choose not to give up Hughes or Joba, I don’t think you can blame them even if you disagree. I don’t even know how much influence AJ would have on Doc – they are not the same types of people. Perhaps Doc wouldn’t enjoy NY – he seems like a quiet guy. From his reaction, he probably wouldn’t enjoy the stadium, lol.
Love Cervelli – he needs to go back to AAA and play everyday. I like Molina – I’m in no way regretting his return.
Scratch that…It’s only the SECOND inning.
D’oh!
“Not sure if I’ve ever seen Alex have such a bad swing, especially with 2 strikes…..He must have been thinking off speed….”
That’s the problem with Arod…he thinks way too much.
Oh, and he got tossed from the game for doing so.
Doreen-
All I know is that I currently have 5 Mets fan friends on facebook who currently all have status updates saying how depressed they are.
the good news – it was a solo job.
DT – OPPC member (it’s in our blood) July 7th, 2009 at 9:02 pm
the good news – it was a solo job.
Pettitte and Joba should take notes.
But not before driving in 3 runs so far tonight.
TB beating TOR 1-0. That team always looks like the defending champs when they play at home. Good thing they can’t win on the road.
Eights-
The bulk of the earlier posts are GMs proposing Halladay trades. It also may be the 3rd inning, but the game started an hour later which left more time for chatter
Personally, I enjoy pointing out what’s right with the Yankees a lot more than hearing what’s wrong. But that’s just me. I am an optimist
Bahaha just throw Young non-stop change-ups
Wooo CC! That change is nasty
Doreen
July 7th, 2009 at 9:01 pm
Oh, and he got tossed from the game for doing so.
Doreen please elaborate.
Bret,
Jesus Montero isn’t the Yankees Hanley Ramirez in a Halladay deal. Hughes or Chamberlain is because the Jays can slot one of those guys right in the rotation and have something of substance to sell their fan base for dealing Doc.
You don’t trade 19 year old light tower power catchers when you have other assets you can use to make that deal.
If JP, who doesn’t have a lot of leverage here, says, “Montero or no deal”, you say, “no deal”.
Let’s get a few more runs now
“the good news – it was a solo job.”
Exactly. Mauer and Morneau must have hit about 4 or 5 homeruns in the series at Yankee Stadium. Except all of them were solos and didn’t hurt the Yankees.
that homerun off cc was just him not wanting to fall behind 3-0 with a 3-0 lead..but he did miss his location…
CC is 27 pitches lower than Baker for the same amount of innings,great.
Erica -
We always flip over to the Mets a few times during the night. My father-in-law was a huge Mets fan and so, and so there’s a connection. They should be depressed. Tonight, I have yet to see the Mets at bat when I do flip over. It can’t be any kind of fun to watch them at all.
I find myself conflicted. I sometimes get angry with Michael Kay, yet I feel like something is missing from the game when he isn’t in the booth.
Swishy!
Swish is getting agressive early in the count. I like that.
Betsy: the price is too high? We don’t even know what the price is… or if there is a price. It’s just speculation right now. All is well!
Erica,
Understandable. I just wanted to show why threads get more posts when the Yanks are losing. I find it a lot easier to get in a discussion about how to change/fix things, rather than agreeing with someone over and over again.
When you’re winning, debate isn’t as prevalent, and debate is what makes the blog’s activity skyrocket. Simple posts like “nice hit, Jeter” and “big HR there” don’t bring about as much discussion, so naturally days when we’re winning are going to be more quiet than days we’re losing.
It’s not that people aren’t paying attention, or posting on the blog, it’s just that there isn’t as much to talk about.
There is no “good news” about CC giving up that HR. Thanks to Arod, the Yanks haven’t blown the game open and it’s still close.
Uncle E -
Manny was 2 for 4 with 3 RBI on the night and struck out twice. On the 2nd K, he tossed his bat up and over umpire and then tossed his helmet adn then the umpire tossed him.
Ron Darling speculated that Manny’s only been taking 4 at-bats a night, and may have known he wasn’t coming back anyway. He also said Manny had the opportunity to play in 10 minor league games adn chose to play in only 5 of them. Still Manny being Manny? I guess so. But, hey, the guy’s a good teammate and just loves the game and wants to have fun playing it.
Are you kidding me? Alex got thrown out of the game? Wow – that’s dumb. Well, now he’s got another day off………….Doreen, I have no problem with the Yankees giving him a day off even though he was on a roll. It’s too easy to keep him in there when he’s hot, but he’s hot because he got those days off. This is just how it’s going to have to be……
Target Field?
That reminds me, go to target tomorrow
Erica – always OPPC July 7th, 2009 at 9:07 pm
I find myself conflicted. I sometimes get angry with Michael Kay, yet I feel like something is missing from the game when he isn’t in the booth.
_______________________________________________________________
its a lose-lose situation?
Doreen,
The current state of the Mets is a great example of why you need a strong farm system. They were obviously not prepared for the injuries they are dealing with. When it came time to call guys up, its a giant disaster.
Their accuscore chances of making the playoffs plummets from 25.1% to 8.9 last week. Ouch
Betsy – MANNY got thrown out of the game
Betsy-
Calm down. It was Manny that got tossed for throwing his helmet after a K
Bob, do you think CC is going to throw shutouts the rest of the game? If that’s all he gives up, he’ll be ok. He’s an ace and he has the lead – there’s no excuse if he gives it up.
Target Field looks really nice. Saw some photos on the internet.
Calm down? I’m perfectly calm………
and I meant season, not games.
Alex wasn’t thrown out of the game.
Manny was in the Dodgers/Mets game
I enjoy listening to Michael Kay.
I may not always agree with him, but I like what he brings to the table. He’s got a nice personality, albeit he’s too much of a nice guy and gets ripped on by Cone a lot.
I just enjoy listening to him. (in a non gay way,
)
Swisher is such a dope. I guarantee Girardi wants him to run here. Cano rarely strikes out but he hits the ball on the ground a lot and GIDP’s quite often. There is no reason for him to not be running here
Eights-
Gotcha.
Damn. Cano is pretty unlucky.
Cano should’ve let that go.
Hey Nick, I’m not fretting because I honestly don’t think the Yanks are going to get Doc. Of course we don’t know what the price is, but it’s going to be brutal……assuming Ricciardi is semi-competent, which Bill Smith is not
” I sometimes get angry with Michael Kay, yet I feel like something is missing from the game when he isn’t in the booth.”
Look on the bright side – there is more head room.
Paul O’Neill is definitely my favorite broadcaster.
Michael Kay may be infuriating sometimes but he seems livlier than Ken Singleton. I find it dull when he is not around
Baker only has one inning left. He’s closing in on 80 pitches.
Betsy -
Oh, I have no problem with it, either. It’s just kind of an interesting predicament to be in. There’s no way I’d want them to take a chance of playing him too much.
Just think of other trades that are comparable…..Clemens, Schilling come to mind right away….Toronto is under economic pressure…..The price in return players will be lower than what we think because Vernon Wells will be part of the package……It’s about dumping big dollars for the Blue Jays…..Hughes or Joba will be in the equation I would suspect…..At what price do The Yankee Front Office view World Series titles to be worth…..
Thanks Doreen
Model Citizen
Thanks for the info about Manny – well, I guess we know it’s not roid rage
Thanks to Arod they haven’t blown the game open? LOL
That’s pretty funny.
Its always Arod’s fault isn’t? Even when it isn’t.
Knowing our luck, we will trade for Holladay and get him. The thing is though, he will be on the list lol
Betsy-
I wouldn’t be surprised if he moved on to the less detectable kinds to help with his erectile problems
No question, Doreen – it’s just not an ideal situation. I guess we should be grateful he can play at all.
75 3 innings pitches this was the shortest 18 pitches,Joba has a twin it seems.
Since Mike Lowell is back on the DL, the Yankee brass is probably following the Sox blueprint very carefully. I am sure they will try to be a lot more careful with A-Rod’s surgically repaired hip after seeing Lowell sputter
please dont walk the 9th batter punto
Betsy -
I just re-read your post and saw where you thought we were talking about Alex getting tossed. No, no, Manny R. in the Dodger/Mets game.
I’ve never seen Alex pull a Manny. Manny was called out on strikes – Alex swung and missed – no real argument there. 
Toronto ties itup
thanks cc
If everyone tries to spell Halladay’s name right, it might convince him to come to NY.
Blue Jays tie the Rays in the 8th inning.
And how many times have our pitchers walked the #9 hitter?
walking the 9 hitter with 0 homeruns on 4 pitches…joba is that you?…jk i love both joba and CC
Pat M,
You are hittin’ on the major points. Economics and the package the Yankees can put on the table.
Couple that with a no trade clause and the price, while high, won’t be insane, if you know what I mean.
I was a partner in a minor league franchise when Doc was in the minors. He reminded me of Clemens in the way he worked.
The guy’s work ethic was incredible.
Very nice guy, quiet and intense.
Could he play in NY? Without a doubt. NY wouldn’t bother him at all.
Squeezed
Betsy: you’re probably right, the odds have to be stacked against Halladay ending up here. But when the GM of the team says publically that the best pitcher in the league might be availble, it’s pretty natural that folks on a baseball blog for one of the few team that might get him would want to speculate about it. That’s kind of what this blog is meant for.
Erica – I can’t wrap my head around that. It’s just way TMI….
Pat M – Vince Gennaro, author of the book “Diamond Dollars” and mentioned by Pete now and then, is a financial wizard in this area. I believe he is a consultant to the Cleveland Indians. He is a professor of sports management in NYC, I think Manhattan College. If I were the Yankees, I would be crunching these numbers with the help of Gennaro, or someone very similar, to see just what is the financial gain of bringing in Halladay, vis a vis dollars from playoff games, WS, increased TV and merchandising, selling more luxury suites, vs. what is paid out in salary, and compare that to keeping Joba or Phil.
It’s a complex series of calculations, I’m sure, but well worth doing the math.
Halladay hearsay…
Murmurs in the Metrodome…
Fodder for haiku…
HALLADAY sorry
great inning cc
good job CC…39 pitches
and it works out in CC’s and the Yanks favor
38 pitches for CC
LOL Sorry Betsy.
I still think its hilarious that Manny would rather tell the world he was taking hormones for “man problems” than just fess up to doing PEDs
CC’s taking care of business
Nice Haiku!
CC Pitched a 9 pitch inning,yes!
Phil Hughes or Joba
which prospect do you unhug
for Doc Halladay?
I would take on Wells’ contract to avoid giving up Phil or Joba……..Remember also that, during the Santana talks, Hank was front and center (though Hal played a big part, he was the quiet man). Hank is more like his dad in that he just wants the big players without caring who he gives up (not that I think he knew who any of the players being discussed were. The only thing he knew about Joba was how well he did in the pen in 2007 – doubt he knew anything about him as a starter in the minors). Well, Hal is in charge now. I think he certainly wants to win, but I also think he really loves the idea of building a core of young studs. I would not be so quick to assume he’s going to want to give up either Phil or Joba.
GJ Cervelli
good job cervelli
I love how people on this blog like to beat things to death. No one in their right mind believes that TOR is trading Halladay to us, yet everyone wants to talk about it for hours on end.
haiku-man
July 7th, 2009 at 9:24 pm
CC Pitched a 9 pitch inning,yes!
***
Even more amazing considering that inning contained a 4 pitch walk
good job angel eyes
The Halladay buzz is understandable.
To put it in context:
Just think what other baseball blogs around the country would be saying if it was rumored Cashman was ready to move Kei Igawa.
Erica, I agree, but then Manny also had no problem going to the bathroom in the Green Monster. I think he’s pretty much “out there”, lol and marches to the beat of his own drummer
I’m going to start a rumor saying that BOS is looking to move Beckett. One ridiculous rumor deserves another.
Joe,
That’s a great idea. Pete should get a quote from Vince, one of the all-time nice guys, on this issue.
Would make for interesting reading.
Pat M,
The nephew is hitting .353 with 5 RBI in 5 games in Full Season A Ball so far. 4-5 in throwing out baserunners.
Sitting out tonight but so far, the early reviews from the Pirates people have been real positive.
Oh, I have no doubt Doc would thrive in NY performance-wise – it’s just a matter if he would enjoy it.
can we blow this freaking game open please.
They are looking to trade Beckett to the Pirates for all of their prospects
Montero with the hat-trick tonight; 3 K’s.
Just think what other baseball blogs around the country would be saying if it was rumored Cashman was ready to move Kei Igawa.
==============================
The buzz would be epic..EPIC!
Nick, I’m not trying to prevent anyone from speculating. For me, it’s just much different than the Santana situation. I’m just not convinced he’s coming here and I really don’t think the Yankees are going to be willing to pay what I think Toronto is going to ask for.
wow this is something else
And that should do it for Mr. Baker
wooo Go Tex
Laura: it seems unlikely, just like the idea that they would ever trade David Cone or Roger Clemens to us. Who knows?
seems like as soon as the montero buzz reached a fever pitch here on the blog montero has gone into a tailspin…cant be unexpected though…dude is still a beast
Baker is doing a wonderful job tonight, especially this inning.
Laura,
You mean how Toronto wouldn’t trade Cone and Clemens to the Yankees? There is precdent.
Betsy,
I’m 100% certain there is no way the Yankees can get Doc without surrendering either Joba or Phil.
If Brian Cashman could do that, he would be Houdini and not a baseball GM. lol
i must say :
the sny announcers are a lot better then the yes announcers. hands down.
I even like how they have a sideline reported during the game. Evan roberts is a good dude, kinda funny and knows his baseball.
This Halladay thing reminds me of a few weeks ago, when someone joked that they should trade for Jeff Francoeur. And then for the next 3 days it was constant Francoeur stats and trade deals
“Laura: it seems unlikely, just like the idea that they would ever trade David Cone or Roger Clemens to us. Who knows?”
Anything is possible, but this seems EXTREMELY unlikely to me. I mean, think about it. People actually believe that TOR is going to trade their best pitcher to a division rival. I guess PHI is thinking about sending Hamels to the Mets too huh?
Too bad this wasn’t an AJ start – we could have had
Baker versus the Pie Man.
Boooo this man!
HOLY POP-OUT BATMAN!!
SJ, I agree…..not saying that was realistic. I guess we’ll just have to wait and see how this plays out.
How much influence do you think AJ would have on Doc? Even if it’s a lot, it doesn’t mean it will be enough for Doc to force his hand to the Yankees. We saw with Santana that, despite the rumors that he wanted to play for the Yankees, he had no problem accepting a trade to the Mets. In any case, I admit that it would be neat to see AJ and Doc together…..
OMG!!! what a catch!!!
wow what a play
What a catch.
That’ll be on SportsCenter.
Holy *&^%$#!
wow nice play. DAMN TWINS
WHAT A CATCH!!!!!!!!
That was a granny, but he was robbed.
All I care about is that the run scored.
Robbed of A GS. Darn!
SJ, Tony will be in Pittsburg by September 2011….He’ll be tested with offspeed pitches as he moves up the food chain….
Gomez just completely robbed A-Rod of a grand slam.
Gomez is off my holiday card list now!!
YOU HAVE TO BE KIDDING ME. Only to Alex.
I saw that coming. He had lined up all the way.
wow
That is some low wall out there.
Laura, your comments suggest that you are unaware that the GM of the Blue Jays commented today about the possibility of trading Roy Halladay. Beckett/Hamels comparisons are misplaced.
what’s up with those awful Saran Wrap outfield walls?
Nice catch Gomez.
Amazing. Waiting for someone to blame Arod for not being “clutch”! lol
Cant wait to hear sterling.
That was a great play by that Met scrub. Stole 3 runs from the yankees
Stupid nice catch
If he was still on roids he would have hit it a little further! JK
What a catch. That wall is low but Gomez had it tracked the whole way it’s like I saw it coming but was hoping it wouldn’t happen. Alex was robbed.
Well, on the positive side, Alex killed the ball and they did score a run. What can you do?
Great catch there in center by Gomez. Wow. Hey Pete – Min has a run. It’s 4-1, not 4-0.
Meanwhile, that would have been a grand-slam if we had traded for Santana!
But we might be losing anyway.
Ok lets try that grand slam again
There’s precedent for trading in the division – it’s just not at all common.
As Pete said, no one has more incentive to get Halladay than the Phiilies. They need him more than anyone else and have the prospects to make the deal.
A duo of Hamels and Halladay would gift wrap the division for them, and make them the favorite to make the World Series.
Can Nick work a count here for a change with the bases loaded?
“Laura, your comments suggest that you are unaware that the GM of the Blue Jays commented today about the possibility of trading Roy Halladay. Beckett/Hamels comparisons are misplaced.”
No, Nick – I heard it. It is entirely possible that Doc will be traded. I just don’t buy that Riccardi would trade him to us. In my mind, no GM in their right mind would trade their number 1 pitcher (particularly a pitcher as good as RH) to their chief rival. I could be wrong. We’ll see.
Sterling probably called it a HR. And then said ‘oh did he catch that ball? he caught it. I thought that was gone. Suzyn…’
“UPDATE, 9:35 p.m.: Wow, fantastic catch by Carlos Gomez as he robs A-Rod of a grand slam in dead center. Perfect leap, exactly times. Four runs becomes one. Yankees 4-0.”
Pete – you keep forgetting to give Minny credit for their homer off CC. It’s 4-1.
Swish worked the count and got one of the runs that were stolen.
RBI BB
i’ll take it.
SJ44
July 7th, 2009 at 9:39 pm
Can Nick work a count here for a change with the bases loaded?
***
Is that worked enough for you
good job swish..even though you didnt have to do a thing beside not swing
Swisha!!!!
Ok, walk – nice. Oh boy, Cano…..
Pathetic. Nick Swisher walks. Not getting the job done with the bases loaded, passing the baton AGAIN.
Trevor
July 7th, 2009 at 9:39 pm
Sterling probably called it a HR. And then said ‘oh did he catch that ball? he caught it. I thought that was gone. Suzyn…’
He did a good job on that one but missed a few others -
At least we managed to score 2 runs with the bases loaded/nobody out.
Can Cano get a hit here?
maybe cano will do something.
Is Robbie due, or is he due?
walking in a run can be fun
Robbie next
That’s Nick’s strength. Nice to see him go back to his strength.
That’s right Nick, play to your strengths:)
inning over with cano as always
I’ll say this – if Halladay was traded to us, that would end the “Joba to the bullpen” debate because that is exactly where he’d end up.
“Susan can you watch the replay and tell me if he caught the ball”. says john sterling.
Well, thats a completely gross stat on Cano. YUCK
0-21 with RISP and longest streak in the league. YUCK YUCK
Cano is so bad!
How many RBI would Cano have if he hit .280 w/RISP? Probably around 50-55.
LOL 0-2 already. The worst hitters do better with RISP than Cano. He needs a sports psychologist because it has to be mental at this point.
S.A.–The sun will come out tomorrow; I’m down with the OPPC July 7th, 2009 at 9:41 pm
walking in a run can be fun
Robbie next
_______________________________________________________________
Mo knows best
“Pathetic. Nick Swisher walks. Not getting the job done with the bases loaded, passing the baton AGAIN.”
You can’t be serious.
At least Cano is having a good AB.
Yes, Laura, but neither Beckett nor Hamels are on the block, so I don’t know what you were talking about.
“I’m going to start a rumor saying that BOS is looking to move Beckett. One ridiculous rumor deserves another.”
Halladay getting traded is not a ridiculous rumor. And I don’t think anyway has suggested that the Yankees are involved in talks or anything like that. Just speculating about what it might take.
Robbie’s problem is that he tries to hit everything. And usually does. His talent is his worse enemy in these situations.
I keep thinking all streaks come to an end sometime, right? Right?
Cano doing what he does best.
I’m convinced that Robbie is not going to get another hit with RISP this year.
Just terrible
ca-no-no
surprise…cano choked with RISP
Robbie Cano, how did I know that was gonna happen
Its gotta be a mental thing for Cano now.
Not this time Doreen
So apparently a hitter is supposed to try to hit pitches that are no where near the zone.
Alex Rodriguez…
Gomez jumping, grand slam gypped…
Yet Yanks score two more…
Better AB but still no results for Cano with RISP.
That’s why he can’t see 5th in the order again. Just not that kind of hitter.
You can’t be serious.
–
I am, of course, not. I love swisher. He has good ABs. I would love to go back and find posts by those cheering for that RBI BB when he got 3-2 in similiar situations but made an out. Everyone would kill him for being too patient.
And with Cano, you get the opposite end of the spectrum from Swisher. Hacking at pitches out of the zone again,
refusing to take a walk.
That’s not battling, that’s poor plate discipline.
That’s why he’s a .300 hitter batting 7th in the order.
Not yet. I guess.
“Yes, Laura, but neither Beckett nor Hamels are on the block, so I don’t know what you were talking about.”
That’s not my point. Beckett and Hamels are the best pitchers on their teams. RH is the best pitcher for TOR. It wasn’t about whether they are on the trade market. My point was that BOS and PHI aren’t trading those guys to division rivals. I’m sorry if I didn’t make that clear.
Laura,
Or Joba could end up in the Blue Jays bullpen! lol
Sorry, couldn’t resist.
Cano has ZERO killer instinct. IMO. Ive been trying to figure him out for 4+ years. No Fire, No killer instinct.
Instead of getting on Cano’s case – blame all his dopey teammates for getting on base before he comes up.
They know he has a problem. Do they try to help? – No.
This is as bad as Jeter not dealing with Arod’s boos.
Help a brotha out – stay off base.
The Gypsy Anti-Defamation League will not like that last haiku.
Jerkface,
I’m a Swisher guy too. He can be maddening at times, but I’ll take his approach at the plate most days.
LOBinson Cano:(
CC is my big homie true story!
Does anyone throw the ball to 3B after a strikeout faster than Cervelli does?
they are up 5 to 1 but let’s be real they should be up like 9 to 1 if they could get a big hit..
cano is so clutch at this point it is beyond ridiculous.. look at his BA with the bases loaded, staggering bad…………
even tonight with everything going well they cannot hit with RISP. it is a joke.
so TV options limited here in the hotel and I’m stuck watching the Michael Jackson Memorial…that is some depressing stuff
they are up 5 to 1 but let’s be real they should be up like 9 to 1 if they could get a big hit..
—
A-rod got one. But it was stolen!
“Laura,
Or Joba could end up in the Blue Jays bullpen! lol
Sorry, couldn’t resist.”
Good point!!! If I were TOR, I’d take Phil Hughes in the deal before Joba.
Full moon tonight so strange things can happen. Robbie is going to get a hit with RISP.
If Cano is up with RISP, let’s just have everyone mark a groundout to either the 1st or 2nd basemen in their scorebooks and move along with the game
Great inning
a sample size of 22 is an anomaly, not a statement.
cc is a beast.
Laura: in this case, I think it just wasn’t a great point. I still like you.
And I look still look forward to getting whatever it was we agreed you were going to send me once we see that Miles is still alive in season six.
good inning for CC right there
“so TV options limited here in the hotel and I’m stuck watching the Michael Jackson Memorial…that is some depressing stuff”
I actually thought that it was better than I thought it would be. I thought it would be cheesy, but it actually turned out to be quite moving.
OT but Dbacks deal Tony Pena to the WSox
KO July 7th, 2009 at 9:51 pm
If Cano is up with RISP, let’s just have everyone mark a groundout to either the 1st or 2nd basemen in their scorebooks and move along with the game
If Girardi was a good manager he would PH Hinske! Then put in Ransom who plays a good 2nd base imo
Sabathia cruising
Yanks hitting
Good start to the road trip
arod did get a big hit, I am not complaining about him.
The Cano defenders have to try really hard to defend him
The guy hits 340 with no one on base and under 200 with RISP and that is pure happenstance, not him gagging….
“And I look still look forward to getting whatever it was we agreed you were going to send me once we see that Miles is still alive in season six.”
Wasn’t it Moose bars? If I win, which I know I will, I’d actually like a case of Reeses Peanut Butter cups. They are my Achilles Heel. I have the hips to prove it too.
50 pitches after 4 innings for CC. Might get a CG.
Cano’s about to break out, if only to follow the law of averages…
don’t pop the corks yet. minny battles for 27 outs….
Gardner has great bat speed, but his swing is atrocious.
Carl I agree with you if it was later on in the game. Sadly right now, I would much rather have Hinske up w/ RISP than Cano. However, I doubt Girardi would ever pinch hit for Cano.
“Does anyone throw the ball to 3B after a strikeout faster than Cervelli does?”
In a pregame earlier this season, tell said that to GI Joe and he said yes Frankie keeps our inf on thier toes
, he nearly took Al’s head off at 3B a few games back.
I get home the yankees are winning CC is throwing great and people are still not happy on this blog AMAZING!
Stuart,
You have to do what I do when Cano comes up with RISP.
Assume an out and be surprised with a different outcome.
It gets you through the games easier! lol
i cant wait to see cisco in spring training next year.
Cervelli hit the ball hard 3 times today. Be prepared to wait for a month for Molina to do the same.
“I get home the yankees are winning CC is throwing great and people are still not happy on this blog AMAZING!”
Whose not happy? I’m happy. I’d be happier if Gomez hadn’t caught that ball, but other than that, I’ve got no complaints.
Are you people watching the game? Cano has had great at bats today, but people are so busy pounding the keyboard that they haven’t got time to look. Engage brain before mouth flapping.
But Moose Bars are very similar to Reece’s Peanut Butter Cups, just in bar form with higher-quality chocolate.
is it me, or does the YES network love joe mauer?
SJ, one day Robi will make you eat those words.
“But Moose Bars are very similar to Reece’s Peanut Butter Cups, just in bar form with higher-quality chocolate.’
I did not know this. OK, Moose bars it is.
Q: What’s the abbreviation for Robbie Cano?
A: RBI NO
“is it me, or does the YES network love joe mauer?”
Jesus doesn’t care.
Joe Mauer is baseball’s golden child u didn’t know that
Poor Robbie.
In 22 ABs with RISP you would think he would accidentally get a hit. LOL
If only Kevin Long could get Gardner to have a good level swing he might be a decent gap hitter and well suited for his speed.
We are watching the game.
He’s 0 for his last 21 with RISP. He’s hitting .196 for the season with RISP.
He’s 2-13 with the bases loaded.
Not exactly cause for celebration.
Its a season long problem for him.
That’s why he’s no longer the #5 hitter in the order.
Good player, awful hitter with RISP.
Just the way it is.
Can’t expect people to ignore it.
“Joe Mauer is baseball’s golden child u didn’t know that”
I thought that was Derek Jeter
“Are you people watching the game? Cano has had great at bats today, but people are so busy pounding the keyboard that they haven’t got time to look. Engage brain before mouth flapping.”
Cano has had great at bats when no one is on board. His plate appearances with RISP are atrocious.
Why do the announcers always comment when fans of the opposing team sit with one another? Is this a rare occurrence?
The need to teach Gardner a Mickey Rivers style tomahawk chop
Becket went 6.2 innings 107 pitches RS 5 A’s 2
oh no, Kenny & Coney talking abt how great Cervelli & CC have worked together this year, 9th time pairing up…where’s Trisha? lol.
NYY626-
I think they are hoping they would turn on each other in the stands
Brandon,
I hope he does. Although I would like it to be soon enough so I can remember it since my memory fades in my old age. lol
The fact that Robbie talks about it in interviews tells you that even he knows that it’s a problem. He is also leading the team in DPs, something that I’m sure comforts Derek Jeter.
Derek Jeter used to be baseball’s golden child but he’s too old now… I mean he’s like what 34 or 35 he’s practically ancient
“Cano has had great at bats when no one is on board. His plate appearances with RISP are atrocious.”
You realize RISP is his last step in becoming the most dangerous hitter in this division. His hit tonight put him in RISP so more times than not when he doesn’t hit w/ RISP he puts himself in scoring position.
Yanks just announced Aceves starts Thursday
And I don’t expect a whole case of Moose Bars. I found out that’s a LOT of Moose Bars when I bought two cases before Christmas. A packet of Moose Bars will be fine.
The Mets should ask for Gomez back. They could use him now
What a stupid trade for the twins
Would having Pena up here challenge Cano? Ramiro is a great glove who has shown to have a bit of a stick and plays the game the right way. Cody Ransom can’t challenge Cano that way, even if Cano has more talent than Pena.
Coney w/ a Vida Guerra reference.
Robbie’s last AB was good. The results were just bad.
Erica-
I agree. He’d be better than the garbage they are running out there.
Nice play Alex
For all of Cano’s issues, he’s still on pace to knock in 90 runs this year.
that arm on a-rod beats a lot of speedsters
Cano 21 pitches in three at bats.
pat July 7th, 2009 at 10:05 pm
Robbie’s last AB was good. The results were just bad.
Sorry I don’t agree with that.
>Robbie’s last AB was good. The results were just bad.
can’t help a broken bat
5 straight balls to Punto…. ugh
GB7-
I would be a lot more impressed with that if it wasn’t for the amount of time he spent in the 5 spot. Plus, you know, what my eyes actually see
“Would having Pena up here challenge Cano? Ramiro is a great glove who has shown to have a bit of a stick and plays the game the right way. Cody Ransom can’t challenge Cano that way, even if Cano has more talent than Pena.”
El Nino’s bat is nowhere near challenging Robi territory. Nowhere. Hopefully more playing time in the minors gets him to be consistant w/ the XBHs and hopefully he becomes a solid switch hitter not just his left side.
“And I don’t expect a whole case of Moose Bars. I found out that’s a LOT of Moose Bars when I bought two cases before Christmas. A packet of Moose Bars will be fine.”
Okie dokie.
Nice job Carsten
good job CC
“Sorry I don’t agree with that.”
You don’t have to but it’s true.
68 pitches for CC
On the road, the Yankee pitching staff looks awesome.
Erica – always OPPC
July 7th, 2009 at 10:07 pm
GB7-
I would be a lot more impressed with that if it wasn’t for the amount of time he spent in the 5 spot. Plus, you know, what my eyes actually see
————————————————————
One third of Cano’e at bats have come in other slots than #5.
Coney w/ a Vida Guerra reference.
i love coney!!
lol @ this subway commercial
CC and Johan subway commercial!!!
Brandon,
No one is saying Pena can hit with Cano. He’s a different type of player. But the idea of having another option to play as opposed to Ransom might at least give the Yanks an option and get Cano thinking. Cano is obviously the far better talent.
“For all of Cano’s issues, he’s still on pace to knock in 90 runs this year.”
Imagine what his total would be if he actually hit consistently in that situation. He’d be a 120+ RBI guy. From 2B, that would be awesome!
Brandon,
Look at the hitters in the AL East.
I think its safe to say that Robbie Cano will never be the most dangerous hitter in the division.
At this point, be happy if he hits .250 w.RISP, continues to play good D, and hits with nobody on base.
He has virtually no shot at being the most dangerous hitter in division given the talent that’s in the AL East.
Why I never saw that commercial before.
I don’t expect any changes to the NYS until the old one is knowcked down. But I would not be surprised if those fences mysteriously move backwards around the start of the 2011 or 2012 seasons
Coney w/ a Vida Guerra reference.
also, singelton with a sam jackson refrence
UPDATE, 10:02 p.m.: Jose Molina was 0 for 1 for Trenton with a walk and a HBP. He caught seven innings and apparently was fine. I would think he’ll be here tomorrow or the next day.
Maybe CC was smacked by not making the All Star Game,he’s 68 pitches thru 5 innings.
What kind of strike is that?
If Cano were just having a bad season hitting with RISP I would just write it off as bad luck, a series of random occurrences that didn’t work out well.
Usually, poor hitting with RISP is just bad luck and not worth getting worked up about.
The weird thing with Cano is, with the exception of 2007, he just hits worse with men on than with the bases empty. At this point, the pattern is just too obvious to ignore.
Career basis, season basis, he hits better with the bases empty. Who knows why? Maybe he picks up the ball better from the wind-up than the stretch, I don’t know.
At this point, I wouldn’t fight it. Bat him leadoff, maximize his production.
How often is the letter high strike called?
Someone record the subway commercial and put it on youtube!
“No one is saying Pena can hit with Cano. He’s a different type of player. But the idea of having another option to play as opposed to Ransom might at least give the Yanks an option and get Cano thinking. Cano is obviously the far better talent.”
WTH are we talking about Ransom for ?
El Nino “supposively” is learning to play the OF and getting more ABs so he can help us come August or Sept. that’s why he’s down there.
“Career basis, season basis, he hits better with the bases empty. Who knows why? Maybe he picks up the ball better from the wind-up than the stretch, I don’t know.”
He probably is pitched to differently as well with men on.
Robbie Cano has to be the most complained about player in the history of MLB who is on pace for 95 rbis and 200 hits plus plays great defense.
Please let up on Cano.
Cano today has changed his whole approach at the plate. Obviously recognizing the problem and trying to adjust. Anyone want to cut him some slack seeing as he’s a Yankee and all. Swisher the walking RBI machine who’s as bad as Cano is used as an example, it is to weep.
al’s OBP is wonderful
“On the road, the Yankee pitching staff looks awesome.”
Yup, and if you take away the games at Fenway it looks even better.
Laura – And the Oscar goes to….Optimus Prime!!
July 7th, 2009 at 10:10 pm
“For all of Cano’s issues, he’s still on pace to knock in 90 runs this year.”
Imagine what his total would be if he actually hit consistently in that situation. He’d be a 120+ RBI guy. From 2B, that would be awesome!
————————————————————
That could be said about a lot of hitters. Until the last 5 days, Matsui was hitting .200 with RISP. Even with this short run, it’s .237.
gomez is starting to get on my last nerve
Yes, Gomez is definitely off my holiday card list now
They are flirting with that 408 baggie.
lol @ CF
Dear Yankee hitters,
Please stop hitting the ball to Gomez in CF.
Thanks.
Signed,
Yankee fans everywhere
Oh wait….
Cano is also on pace to score 100 runs, have 40 doubles, 25 hrs.
As a great defensive 2nd baseman.
This sucks. Should be 10-1
Like against the Jays yesterday, they’re just being robbed of hits.
11-1 I mean
Srsly that scrubby Mets CF is pissing me off, I want a HR to CF
The Twins announcers are morons.
They are harping and harping about how this year’s all star game is “clean” because A-Rod and Manny are not included. Do they realized Ryan Franklin tested positive for PEDs
“al’s OBP is wonderful”
Especially when you factor in what his BA is.
Get over the Mendoza Line in those situations and then we will talk.
The guys career numbers with RISP and guys on base are awful.
Its one of those unexplainable situations.
However, ignoring the 2,000 lb gorilla in the room doesn’t change the results.
Come on Cano!!!!!!!!!!!!
pitching around Swish to get to Cano?
Okay, no one say anything about Cano.
come on robbie, you need a hit with runners in scoring position
Poor Cano.
Swisher passes the buck… again!
Can-do!!
Can-do!!
I’m not in any way saying that Cano’s not having a problem, he does, but, he’s driving runs in from somewhere. He doesn’t have 43 solo homers.
bases loaded for cano again!
Cano will:
a.) Pop out
b.) Ground out
c.) Strike out
d.) Actually get a hit!
Cano cannot escape RISP, so he better get acclimated.
Can’t make this stuff up! Cano up with the bases loaded again! lol
Frank July 7th, 2009 at 10:18 pm
The Twins announcers are morons.
They are harping and harping about how this year’s all star game is “clean” because A-Rod and Manny are not included. Do they realized Ryan Franklin tested positive for PEDs
Owned
If Minnesota had any heart at all – they’d walk Cano intentionally.
Think positive thoughts!!!
“They are harping and harping about how this year’s all star game is “clean” because A-Rod and Manny are not included.”
Tejada’s going. Does he not count?
YAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Finally!!
HALLELUJAH !!!
OMG CANO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
The answer is:
d.) Actually get a hit!
Cano!!!
I don’t believe what I just saw.
There we go!
That’s what I’m talking about, baby!!
Still broke his bat.
haha he is mocking himself! good sport cano
nice!
A herd of pigs just fly by my window!
finally cano.
Well, I can die now.
I’ve seen everything.
Cano is a beast!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Our long international nightmare is over!
That bat died for a good cause!
Robbie needs to give that bat a proper sendoff. It did its job! lol
That’s what happens when you think positively.
Laura-
It was totally my “Can-do” that did the trick!
I don’t believe what I just saw!
Look at that line drive!
Full moon!
Babies are born and Robbie hits with RISP!
Robbie
oh boy here comes RBI NO. 7 LOB perhaps?
fail
Zooboy July 7th, 2009 at 10:21 pm
A herd of pigs just fly by my window!
***
Herd of pigs? I think it should be pog of pigs.
I am so happy for him. I think I actually jumped up in the air like it was a walk-off. Good job, Cano.
I take that back, it can also be called a herd.
WEll hopefully that hit will lead to more for Cano in those types of situations. I mean i’m not going to hold my breath, but good hit for him and the Yanks. Good for him to get a little weight off his shoulders maybe.
Knuckleballer, R.A. Dickey, takes the mound.
Finally! I’m happy for Cano – even though he lost a bat, lol. Maybe this will get him going……..
Yay – Robi!!!!
I was one off. Streak done, new one begun! He looked so happy!
Monkey’s off his back.
I think the temperature just dropped a few degrees in here. Is anyone else feeling it? I’m not sure, but I think Hell might have frozen over.
Good job, Robbie.
What do ya know,Cano knocks in two
“Tejada’s going. Does he not count?”
He got Roy Oswalt’s blessing.
hallelujah there is a g-d. cano got a hit with RISP.
miracles occur all the time.
Zooboy
July 7th, 2009 at 10:21 pm
A herd of pigs just fly by my window!
————————————————————
Hopefully, one of them dropped by his copy of proper grammar for you to study.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hzI_aBATO8
Chris russo on RA Dickey
“They are harping and harping about how this year’s all star game is “clean” because A-Rod and Manny are not included.”
I heard that. Those guys are major tools. He was claiming that Manny and Alex being there would be a distraction. It’s the frakin’ ASG! It’s an exhibition game, which unfortunately is tied to the World Series. Other than that, nobody takes it seriously. You think the fans would be upset if those guys were there?
BG!!!
Gardenhoser beats GOMEZ !
Cano connecting…
Gardenhire gesturing…
Piling on the runs!
GGBG!!!!!
Finally triumph over Gomez!
That’s gonna be a triple.
WOOOOOOOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Gardner and his atrocious swing did his thing.
GGBG hit it off the Saran Wrap for a triple!
SJ, I just noticed that part of my post was deleted or lost….Tony has already posted some insane numbers…Is he staying in the Sally League or is there a chance he gets bumped up later in the season ?????
Gardner has some POP at times, nice. He can get so many triples if he gets it in the gap.
Finally, Gomez can’t get to one. Serves him right.
Okay – that’s what we’ve been waiting for, right? More hits with RISP.
man gardner can fly
I can’t believe Gomez didn’t catch that. Not that he SHOULD have – just that he didn’t for once.
It’s pretty funny how, after Cano kept finding himself in bases loaded situtations batting 5th, Girardi moved him down to 7th to presumably take the pressure off him. And what do you know, he finds himself up with the bases loaded again twice tonight.
Wow
dang, it stinks that we have to send down cervelli…
how can you complain about the last few weeks?
and this team is likable!!!
it could be great summer
Cervelli with the shovel!!!!!!!!!
Cervelli!
Cervelli is going out with a BANG!
Cervelli on fire…shame he’s going down.
Cisco we’re going to miss you and your samurai swing
Okay, there’s the 10-1 game someone was asking for earlier.
“Cervie” doesn’t want to leave, does he??
Take your time Molina, Cervelli is doing fine.
Sox just won 5-2, it looks like the Yanks are still one back.
Cervelli with parting gifts. Ain’t that sweet?
Okay question. CC is in very good shape pc wise. But we have a huge lead. How long do you keep him in the game? Especially knowing you will need the pen tomorrow, maybe as early as the 4th 5th inning.
angel eyes!
RS, it’s kind of like when the ball always finds u in the field if you’re making a lot of errors and you don’t want it hit to you. When you’re struggling in a certain type of situation, you tend to always find yourself right there again.
Nice hit Cervelli! Can’t wait to see Molina hit like that ;-(
who was asking for the “killer” string of hits?
Cisco Kid!! keep him with the team…..Are you sure you’re OK, Jose?
Ok, it really would be unfair to send Cervelli down after today. It might take Molina a month to give the same production Cervelli has given tonight.
Sox/Oakland game is over. Sox win 5-2.
It doesn’t look like there will be any changes tonight in the standings between the Sox and the Yankees.
Interesting article by Ken Rosenthal that says once Toronto starts the discussion of trading Doc that it will almost certainly happen.
Molina, needs to rehab some more.
Sorry to say but i hope he breaks a leg..
I love this kid.
He brings energy, defense and hard hit balls.
Keep him in the lineup
We’re 7 for 14 with RISP. Not bad. Getting the job done half of the time.
Cervelli does not want to go back
cervelli has such a sound level swing. still to early to see where the holes are in his swing – and scouts will find it, but his swing is condusive to making contact and putting the ball in play.
a blow out thank g-d. save the pen, maybe rest arod in the 7th, they are good on occassion..
Keep CC in as long as the pitch count is reasonable and he keeps pitching well.
Save the bullpen for tomorrow
i think we can take out a-rod, give him some more needed rest.
Who’s Molina? Past history
Can Molina stay on the DL?????? I love the guy but Cervelli is younger and better….
Deja Vu Minnesota,Yankees in your house,hello!
Can Girardi waste Tomko today, or will he be needed for long relief on Thursday?
Cervelli would be 3 for 3 with 2 HRs in NYS, clubbed 2 balls down the line around 330 feet
Gotta get ARod out of this game now. Give him the rest of the night off.
Pat M,
I believe the plan is to stay in the SALLY the rest of the year.
He has a shot of being in Altoona (AA) at this time next year at this growth rate.
Hopefully, he keeps it up.
Hitting with RISP (vs. hitting in general) is probably just about all luck. 21 AB samples is definitely all luck. Why do you all care about this?
I would love for someone to explain to me why Cervelli is going to be replaced by Molina when he is doing so well… WHy fix something that isnt broken? I understand Molina is under contract for much more money, but is that reason enough??
Matt…?
Is cerveli going down a done deal? The guy is playing like he belongs to be in the bigs
The Mets lost again. I’m starting to feel sorry for them, but only a little.
GGBG > Melky Cabrera
Melk-dud is going nowhere but down the rest of this season, he always peaks in June before hitting a wall and going into a tail spin. He’ll be hitting .240 in a matter of weeks.
pat
July 7th, 2009 at 10:27 pm
Okay, there’s the 10-1 game someone was asking for earlier.
————————————————————
Only thing left to do now is to start slowly pulling away in the 7th inning.
I found myself consoling Mets fans at work today and telling them their team still might have a chance.
I didn’t believe myself either
Those in Minnesota leaving the game early, head to Manny’s downtown. One of the best steakhouses in the country.
The night is still young!
“I understand Molina is under contract for much more money, but is that reason enough??”
Molina makes 2mil I believe. Cervelli probably 400K. You don’t sit 2mil in favor of 400K unless you absolutely have to. Rich people don’t like paying guys to do nothing.
oh you tub of lard
Brandon,
I’ll grant that it’s better for Pena to be in AAA and get playing time. But the Yankees are a better team right now if Pena is the back-up infielder as opposed to Ransom. And that might light a fire under Cano.
“Can he beat Span to the bag??”
Is that a rhetorical question?
CC was slow lol
Brandon
What is this Gardenhoser thing? Once was funny, then got tired in a hury, now it’s just obnoxious. Is this reverse racism or are you just challenged.
“Hitting with RISP (vs. hitting in general) is probably just about all luck. 21 AB samples is definitely all luck. Why do you all care about this?”
Because hitting with RISP is how you win ballgames.
I am officially putting an Amber Alert for Matt.
CNN will pick up the story soon.
Hopefully, he is still alive!
So he gives baker that call but not CC?
Why does everyone have to compare GGBG vs. Melky? Neither is a supreme CF yet both have their positive qualities. I like how Joe G has been mixing them both, it seems to be working. Both are contributing which is most important.
CC’s shows command and is ahead on the count…I hope Joba is taking notes
“GGBG > Melky Cabrera
Melk-dud is going nowhere but down the rest of this season, he always peaks in June before hitting a wall and going into a tail spin. He’ll be hitting .240 in a matter of weeks.”
i like gardy as much..prbly more..then the next guy but thats just not fair…melky has had a ton of big hits this year and is having a very solid year overall
Montero is now in the longest slump of his career. 0-17 with 7 strikeouts.
I take out CC after 7. While it is tempting to save the pen, CC needs bullets for September and October.
Agree with SJ about taking Alex out. Same reason.
“Molina makes 2mil I believe. Cervelli probably 400K. You don’t sit 2mil in favor of 400K unless you absolutely have to. Rich people don’t like paying guys to do nothing.”
I agree that rich people hate wasting money, but wont winning more games and going further into October more than make up for the 2 mil lost??
Span-dex beats Baggy Pants.
Keep CC in. He has a low pitch count. You may need the bullpen a lot on Thursday
Alex is a different story. Take him out to rest the hip when you can
Cervelli is being sent down to get regular playing time. He won’t get that up in the majors playing once/twice a week. It has nothing to do with Molina’s $2M.
“Montero is now in the longest slump of his career. 0-17 with 7 strikeouts.”
didnt he have like a 1 for 4 with a double the other day?
good job CC.
CC continues…
Tossing trouble to the Twins…
Metrodome malaise…
CC in spandex? We don’t fill the legend seats with sexy women now do we?
Pedroia missed yesterday’s game because his wife who is 7 months pregnant went into early labor. I really hope she is okay. I hate hearing stories like that.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/ne.....;type=lgns
>didnt he have like a 1 for 4 with a double the other day?
i believe you’re right
85 pitches for CC
I say 1 more inning? Then have Bruney get some work in
Mo-Butter, I agree that it shouldn’t be about the money unless the other guy was somehow making like 4 mil +… I mean 2 million to the Yankees is nothing…. It would be really disrespectful to send Molina to AAA at thsi point in his career, idk if they even could… and keeping 3 catchers on the roster would be lame and not necessary… They want Cervelli to develop more also, even though he is already probably one of the best backups in the league
I love Cervelli >Molina.
Anyone interested I started a Lohud Yankee Blogger Group on facebook.
http://www.facebook.com/home.p.....0459611724
>I say 1 more inning? Then have Bruney get some work in
suddenly, 10-9 Yanks.
85 pitches 6 innings, CC is smokin,
Who’s Matt?
Manny’s…If you’re going to spend even one night in the Twin Cities, make it a point to get to Manny’s…..SJ, I’m with you on Manny’s
Hitting with RISP is definitely a good thing and mostly necessary, but it IS possible to win games without doing so.
So Damon is out, might as well take out A-rod too.
Wow that’s only a few years ago and Melky looks a lot skinnier back then. Maybe he should hit the gym a little harder…
RalphieD (OPPC)
July 7th, 2009 at 10:38 pm
“Montero is now in the longest slump of his career. 0-17 with 7 strikeouts.”
didnt he have like a 1 for 4 with a double the other day?
————————————————————
Yes, my mistake. He’s 1-17.
“Cervelli is being sent down to get regular playing time. He won’t get that up in the majors playing once/twice a week. It has nothing to do with Molina’s $2M.”
I would rather see the Yanks play for the 09 season… i understand that you have to manage your talent and guys like Pena need to play every day, but Cervelli can help right now. The starting staff loves him and he has shown he can put the ball in play. Not to mention he isnt a liability behind the dish…. what do you consider major league ready?
Matt’s a “glass half empty” kind of poster. Doesn’t go over here real well.
if CC’s pitch count stays 120 and under, and it should, he should be allowed to go the distance tonight
CC’s a horse- ride him
Give Ransom some mop up duty, its a good chance to sneak in some rest for arod
“Brandon
What is this Gardenhoser thing? Once was funny, then got tired in a hury, now it’s just obnoxious. Is this reverse racism or are you just challenged.”
You ever watched “Rookie Of The Year” ?
Maybe Melky went to Manny’s before the game? Always dangerous going that route.
hitting with RISP is not luck. It is when comparing a lifetime 240 hitter that has a a 1/2 a season when he hits 330 with RISp. But there are some guys that for a career hit close to there avg. or even some who hit better then there career avgs. because they concentrate more, go to the right side, shorten there swing, etc with RISP..
You think Jeter has been lucky in his career to have such a good avg. with RISP and with the bases loaded? I think it is because he is a smart hitter, does not try to hit HR’s and the pitcher is at a disadvantage with RISP and he realizes that….
CF is death valley
Stupid Gomez.
Really?
Almost slipped like a true Met
Keep aiming it at him
Alex is out of the game after this AB. I doubt he takes the field
I never seen one real tear during the MJ memorial. Not one. It was completely fake. His little girl even fake cried at the end. Call me what you want but you know I’m right. By the way, nice job out there tonight, Yankees.
A-Rod baby!
Damon’s out and Arod’s still in there?
rest the golden hip!
hitting with risp is how u win games, granted… but 0 for 21 is simply too small a sample size to get excited about. mr cano has probably been up over 1000 times in this position over his career. give the guy a break. we all know what a fine hitter he is.
Jweav July 7th, 2009 at 10:45 pm
I never seen one real tear during the MJ memorial. Not one. It was completely fake. His little girl even fake cried at the end. Call me what you want but you know I’m right. By the way, nice job out there tonight, Yankees.
Yeah fake crying. Fake cry when you get banned
No pinch runner for A-Rod???? Lame
GB, Is Montero going thru his 2nd turn thru the league ???
is Johnny hurting and we didn’t know it??
Wouldn’t this be a good time to see Hinske play 3B?
To be fair, it’s possible that the CAPS LOCK button on Matt’s computer wore out and he will be back once it’s repaired.
Erica – always OPPC July 7th, 2009 at 10:47 pm
is Johnny hurting and we didn’t know it??
He has a bad calf muscle as far as I know.
I’m not taking a position on Jeter, but sure hitting with RISP, even on a career basis, can be a matter of luck. Plate appearances with RISP are a subset of total plate appearances, and you’d expect a normal bell curve distribution of results hitting with RISP.
That would make some hitters appear clutch, and others appear to choke, when really it’s just a random distribution of results.
I don’t understand the mind of Joe Girardi
I have not been as critical of Girardi as many but there is no reason for A-Rod to still be in this game. Especially on the turf.
I would rather see the Yanks play for the 09 season… i understand that you have to manage your talent and guys like Pena need to play every day, but Cervelli can help right now. The starting staff loves him and he has shown he can put the ball in play. Not to mention he isnt a liability behind the dish…. what do you consider major league ready?
………….
I hear what you are saying Mo-Butter but Cervelli, as good as he’s been in this small sample size and debated unendingly on this blog, he will not make or break the 2009 Yankees. Prior to his stint here, Cervelli was not much of a hitter, I’m guessing they feel that he needs more “seasoning”. Molina is a highly regarded back-up and also well liked by the staff.
Why do some people make a big deal about Montero being too big to be behind the plate. Look at flippin’ Mauer!
Hitting is some luck, mostly skill, and a lot mental. Rob