No Holliday weekend for Yankees?
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Jul 24, 2009 
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According to various reports, it sounds like Matt Holliday could be on his way to St. Louis soon.
He was 1 for 4 with a double against the Yankees last night.
Meanwhile, we’re at the time of the year when fans send me their trade proposals. Most are on the lines of this: Send Toronto Edwar Ramirez, Melky Cabrera, Kei Igawa, John Rodriguez, Mike Dunn, Ramiro Pena and Humberto Sanchez and get back Roy Halladay.
If only it worked that way. Quantity never trumps quality in a trade. This isn’t trading baseball cards, it’s trading baseball players. If the Yankees want to get a star, they’ll need to trade somebody who can become a star.
Because he says it’s unlikely, I fully expect Brian Cashman to make some kind of deal. That’s usually how it works. But don’t expect a big name, maybe a No. 5 starter type. And it might not be until August as waiver deals will be easier to make.
UPDATE, 12:33 p.m.: Deal done. Holliday will not be playing for Oakland tonight. Holliday to the Cardinals for third baseman Brett Wallace, outfielder Shane Peterson and right-handed pitcher Clayton Mortensen. Oakland kicks in $1.5 million.
I still think we should offer Toronto the old Yankee Stadium for Halladay
Why trade for a #5 type? We have Mitre & Aceves.
repost:
WooHoo! A sweep. Well we swept the April series with Oakland.
G. Love, agreed on some of your points. Cano is night and day in terms of his focus from last season. Hitting with RISP is the last part of his game to develop. He also could work on his basepath skills. They can’t make him faster, but perhaps they could work on other things. (btw heads up play by Hinske, if that was Swish he’s thinking 2 all the way and gets thrown out).
Good to see Cano acknowledge a weakness in his game.
Another one who admitted something? C.C. He was glad he only gave up 3 runs. Said that there were 8 hits off of him, so there may be something there (about playing Oakland). I do think though, that the win goes a long way battling whatever buggaboo he has about facing Oakland.
Cliff Lee? Um, no thanks.
Halladay or Aceves.
I ranted last night that Girardi says something last night about being worried about the depth because of Joba’s innings. Yet they also expect him to make all his starts. Yet, it’s the big story of the day. The fact that we need a legit starter is not news.
We needed one when Wang went down. Well, what if Wang came back you ask? Well, wouldn’t you need one if Joba could potentially have IP issues?
cue the washburn rumors yet again
But i thought Igawa was a super star?
Man i would love to see Cliff Lee !
SJ44 who do believe the yankees will target? I believe the yankees will most likely acquire an arm for their rotation.
I think he’s going to get someone for the rotation that hasn’t been mentioned by anyone yet.
Not saying someone big, just someone off the radar.
Exact quote from Yankee fan Brandon Tierney on ESPN radio:
“Multiple sources are saying the Sox are close to acquiring San Diego’s Adrian Gonzalez, no one seems to be too sure of the players going back, but this is a move that scares me from a Yankee perspective.”
I love this team right now – everything about it. The bullpen, the rotation, the lineup, the manager, the front office, everything.
I think that Mitre was serviceable at #5 in his last start and could continue to give us innings for the rest of the year, if needed. He may be older and have little MLB experience, but the guy can throw strikes and he is a groundball pitcher. He’s a good replacement for Chien-Ming Wang on a temporary basis.
Our rotation is amazing. Find me a rotation in baseball that doesn’t have a question mark or two – you can’t. Our #1 and #2 are probably the best 1-2 in baseball and Andy and Joba are a pretty good 3-4 combo. Sure, it would be much, much better if Wang were the real Wang, but he isn’t.
If we have to slot in Aceves, then we have to slot in Aceves. I hope we don’t but it’s something that needs to be considered.
I would trade for Duscherer, to be honest. He may be coming off of injury and be unreliable, but he won’t cost what many others will cost and we do have solutions in house if that doesn’t work.
“I still think we should offer Toronto the old Yankee Stadium for Halladay”
Don’t offer so much! Maybe a couple urinals and the entire tampa yankees minor league team. That should get it done
I would love to see the new ballpark..
Oops. Some of you are probably thinking why no thanks to Cliff Lee?
First of all, it sounds like the asking price is the same as Roy Halladay.
Second, I’m good with how the team is constructed. However, if you have a chance (albeit a sliver of one) to get Roy Halladay, I think it’s something you do. This is the pitching version of Pujols hitting the market.
Expand the deal to include Rios who’s a real ML outfielder who can actually hit. He’s not on the decline. He’s got tools. He can steal bases.
Otherwise, work with what he have. We’re playing great baseball as it is.
Bill from NJ, how has there been no word of this impending Adrian Gonzalez deal from Heyman, Rosenthal, etc, guys that get legitimate leads on trade talks? Also, the Padres have vehemently denied that they are interested in trading Gonzalez. He is a huge draw for their team and he is on an extremely reasonable contract.
Great trade for Oakland. Brett Wallace is St. Louis’ 2nd ranked prospect, per BaseballAmerica.
Matt Holliday is a rental. Even if St. Louis signs Holliday, there’s no guarantee he’s going to live up to the contract.
Wallace, meanwhile, is in only his 2nd yr of pro ball, and is already at triple-A:
http://www.thebaseballcube.com.....ce-1.shtml
I keep saying this but I dont know if he’s available since they are getting a new stadium and he will be a free agent, Josh Johnson.
Multiple sources once said the Red Sox were close to acquiring Johan Santana and Mark Teixeira.
I’ll believe that rumor when he’s wearing a Red Sox uniform.
Oh, Lord. A-Gonz going to Boston is the Apocalypse?
Did I miss something? I didn’t know that Adrian was Manny incarnate.
YankeeFan4Eva July 24th, 2009 at 11:46 am
I keep saying this but I dont know if he’s available since they are getting a new stadium and he will be a free agent, Josh Johnson.
_________________
Free Agent? Yes he will be, in 2-3 years. Why would the Marlins trade their best pitcher???? Enough with the absurd trade proposals. Some of you guys sound like the ignorant mets fans that call WFAN all day and make up trades that make no sense.. Chill and let Ca$h do his thing!
I figured that based on the 100 innings he pitched last year, that joba has about 5 or 6 starts left. Am I right about that? Therefore, with Wang nowhere in sight for returning, whom do you put in that spot? Aceves is going in the Wang spot. Marte is coming back into the pen in a few days. Do you keep Mitre there?
“Oh, Lord. A-Gonz going to Boston is the Apocalypse?
Did I miss something? I didn’t know that Adrian was Manny incarnate.”
Don’t they already have a left handed hitter, who hits home runs and has a really low batting average?
Adrian Gonzalez rumors are false.
****
“Matt Holliday is soon going to STL (Thank god I was getting tired of hearing the we should trade for MH fans, he clearly is not the same hitter he was in Denver)”
“This coming from a guy who wants Cashman to ’steal’ Jonathan Sanchez. Isn’t life ironic ”
***
What’s your point? If he’s cheap he’s our #5 SP if not move on.
Sox couldn’t get Tex so I guess they’re trying to make up for it by getting every other 1B man (LaRoche, Gonzalez)!
Maybe they can get Buckner to come back!
Jon Lock
July 24th, 2009 at 11:48 am
YankeeFan4Eva July 24th, 2009 at 11:46 am
I keep saying this but I dont know if he’s available since they are getting a new stadium and he will be a free agent, Josh Johnson.
_________________
Free Agent? Yes he will be, in 2-3 years. Why would the Marlins trade their best pitcher???? Enough with the absurd trade proposals. Some of you guys sound like the ignorant mets fans that call WFAN all day and make up trades that make no sense.. Chill and let Ca$h do his thing!
First off I am not ignorant and second if cashman offered the right deal I am sure Larry will sell. Florida will be in selling mode.
Charlestonchew –
if we have the best 1-2 pitchers in the game, SF is right on our heels with Lincecum-Cain.
Fan4Eva –
Josh Johnson isn’t going anywhere unless we trade Montero, so let that idea go. I’m in South Florida, and the team is building( or planning to build) around both JJ and Hanley.
Guiseppe –
I’m in the same boat you are. Let me know when the trade actually goes down, and then I’ll think about it. Not WORRY about it, just think about it.
“Sox couldn’t get Tex so I guess they’re trying to make up for it by getting every other 1B man (LaRoche, Gonzalez)!”
It takes several of those guys to add up to the value of Tex. We’ve been seeing that first hand since day 1.
Adrian Gonzalez latest rumor
“As with most clubs, we plan to be very active in discussions,” general manager Theo Epstein said yesterday. “Certainly, there are no guarantees we can find the right deal, but it won’t be for a lack of looking. We hope to make another move between now and the deadline, but that doesn’t mean we’re going to.”
If another move gets made, it will be something that can upgrade the Sox not only this year, but for several seasons to come. One baseball source said the Sox have been very aggressive in attempting to deal for San Diego first baseman Adrian Gonzalez, but have been rebuffed. Another source suggested the asking price on Cleveland catcher/first baseman Victor Martinez is, at least currently, too prohibitive.
****
Keyword: REBUFFED
BT was speaking on ESPN about Boston chasing Gonzalez not close to anything being or getting done.
Wait…so Lars Anderson isn’t the future at first?
“If a team has an appetite for the $17 million or so left on Bronson Arroyo’s deal, ‘they’ll be very happy to listen to you,’” an exec of one club told ESPN.com’s Jayson Stark.
Hahahaa Chubbs-cesa….. even the Reds know he blows
Good. Let Matt Holliday be gone sooner than later.
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/articl.....8;c_id=mlb
Pete,
What about someone like a Jon Garland? He’s nothing special but he is a durable guy and would basically only be used as a 4 or 5 starter until the playoffs. He could help Joba keep the innings limit down by taking some of his starts if the inner solutions (Mitre, Aceves, Hughes) work to take Wang’s place. He’s not happy in Arizona, evident by his recent statements that his team is not playing hard. He’s been pitching well recently but hasn’t got many wins because he has no offense behind him. Would the yanks be able to get him for a pair of mid level prospects?
I cringe everytime i hear the name Bronson Arroyo
Selling mode means guys with high price tags
Josh Johnson… yea not so much
“What about someone like a Jon Garland?”
Only if we get the 2005 version of Jon Garland.
“Because he says it’s unlikely, I fully expect Brian Cashman to make some kind of deal. That’s usually how it works. But don’t expect a big name, maybe a No. 5 starter type. And it might not be until August as waiver deals will be easier to make.”
Thank Goodness, I don’t understand why so many commenters want to trade away young, hungry, blue chip prospects for expensive, established stars. CC & AJ are both number 1 starters, protect the future of the club and get a back end innings eater for mid-tier farmhands.
They won’t let Joba go the entire season starting so Yeah we’ll need another pitcher or 2…Why not try to get Zach Duke or someone of that ilk.
Adrian Gonzalez is a lifetime 290 hitter until Kevin Kouzmanoff started batting behind him.
Those of you who think it’s no big deal that the Sox could possibly get Adrian Gonzalez are fooling yourselves.
Put him in that lineup with Jason Bay batting behind him and the guy will go ballistic.
I’m not saying it would be the end of the world or anything but you can bet they’re offense would get a very healthy bump.
Where is Jon Garland pitching this season? You hear absolutely nothing about the guy.
Thank Goodness, I don’t understand why so many commenters want to trade away young, hungry, blue chip prospects for expensive, established stars. CC & AJ are both number 1 starters, protect the future of the club and get a back end innings eater for mid-tier farmhands.
- With Jobas innings cap . Wang going down . and Pettite and Mitre in the backend
I hope Cashman is thinking more along the lines of a solid number 2 or 3 .
I wouldn’t mind seeing the Yanks add Jon Garland or Brian Bannister if the price was right. I wouldn’t hesitate to trade anyone aside from Hughes, Joba, Austin Jackson, Montero and/or Romine (at Class A Tampa). Anyone else is fair game from McAllister to guys at the single A level.
YankeeFan4Eva July 24th, 2009 at 11:53 am
First off I am not ignorant and second if cashman offered the right deal I am sure Larry will sell. Florida will be in selling mode.
_______________
Josh Johnson is making 1.4 million this season and is under Florida control for at least the next 2 full seasons.
I ask again, WHY WOULD THEY TRADE HIM?
And I never said you were ignorant. I said some of you guys sound like the ignorant Mets fans on WFAN.
Send Toronto Edwar Ramirez, Melky Cabrera, Kei Igawa, John Rodriguez, Mike Dunn, Ramiro Pena and Humberto Sanchez and get back Roy Halladay.
——————————————————
Pete,
If the Yankees would simply add Cody Ransom (instead of Ramiro Pena) to that package then it would be the clincher.
M, Garland is pitching in Arizona this season. He’s 5-9 with a 4.41era in 20 starts but 14 of his 20 starts have been “quality starts”. At least 6 innings of 3 ER or less. He’s pitching pretty well for a bad team in AZ.
The Radar Gun Mafioso July 24th, 2009 at 12:00 pm
Adrian Gonzalez is a lifetime 290 hitter until Kevin Kouzmanoff started batting behind him.
Those of you who think it’s no big deal that the Sox could possibly get Adrian Gonzalez are fooling yourselves.
Put him in that lineup with Jason Bay batting behind him and the guy will go ballistic.
I’m not saying it would be the end of the world or anything but you can bet they’re offense would get a very healthy bump.
—————
The only problem with that argument is that it makes no sense to get riled up or panic until a trade is made – which appears to be a long shot considering the Red Sox don’t really want to give up the pieces to get him and the Padres aren’t really interested in trading him.
Worry about stuff like that if it actually happens. Most of these rumors turn out to be nothing but noise.
Radar,
Oh, we know that Adrian’s a dangerous hitter. My point is, we knew the Sox were going to make a move. If the deal is actually consummated, it doesn’t change anything the Yankees do. They still have to go out and compete.
Now, if the Sox traded for Pujols, A-rod, or Manny, then you worry.
Otherwise, we knew they were looking to upgrade. And we know they won’t be slumping forever.
I’m available and can give innings…
Speaking of Ramirez….
Can we bring him back up and get rid of Bruney?
“I keep saying this but I dont know if he’s available since they are getting a new stadium and he will be a free agent, Josh Johnson.”
He’s not a free agent or arb elligible for at least 2-3 more years and makes just over $1MM a year. The guy is cheap and locked up and pitching very well. He’s not going anywhere.
Adrian Gonzales is a lifetime .277 hitter in the NL. Not like he’s Pujols or anything.
I cringe everytime i hear the name Bronson Arroyo.
————————————————–
Me too!!! Id rather see us send a box of baseballs to KC for Sidney Ponson than get Arroyo.
BlueShirt,
Thanks for that. In the recesses of my mind I figured he was still with AZ.
But I never hear is name in decisions on espnews recaps or see his name on mlb.com, so literally he hasn’t been on my radar the whole season.
Guissepe
I agree and I too find it very difficult to believe the Sox or any team for that matter could trade for Adrian at his current salary.
I was just making a point that a lot of people have been recently killing Gonzalez as if he weren’t a great player and I believe in a different line up/different ball park he could be in fact a MONSTER
espnews confirming the Holliday trade.
Garland has had 4 BAD starts out of 20, the same as CC. Those starts were Apr 15 vs. St. L (7ER in 3.2IP), May 11 vs. Cin (7ER in 3.2IP), May 29 vs. Atl (8ER in 2.2IP) and June 8 vs. SD (6ER in 6.2IP).
In July, Garland is 1-2 with a 2.73ERA in five starts.
He’s not going to be better than Joba or Pettitte but he’ll eat innings and give the Yankees a chance to win every time out.
Watashi gozen shiyoukanou, Yankee-san. Ichiban nikudzukinoyoi hiki
watching sportscenter right now… Holliday has been traded to the cardinals
Well, Oakland just got a little worse this weekend.
Good for the Yanks.
my hip is good, give me $3M and a private plane to go back home in between starts and I’ll give you 100 pitches every 5 days.
Just catching up on the threads from this morning. Can we please stop all conversations about Mo’s potential successor and the next yankee captain? Both of those scenario’s dont sound fun to me
who can we call up from out Triple AAAA team in Pit?
GF,
Now watch them win the series.
raymagnetic July 24th, 2009 at 12:06 pm
Adrian Gonzales is a lifetime .277 hitter in the NL. Not like he’s Pujols or anything.
Look where he plays and who he plays with.
No he’s not Albert Pujols but let’s make a hypothetical for S and Giggles.
Put in Yankee Stadium and bat him 3rd in front of Alex.
See what I mean?
Over the last 3 yrs, Adrian Gonzalez has hit over .300 on the road. Playing 81 games at Petco is not conducive to big offensive #s (and as Radar Gun Mafiaso points out, he has ZERO protection behind him).
I think Gonzalez would be a beast in Fenway, but apart from Peter Gammons’ wishful thinking there isn’t anything out there saying San Diego is looking to move him. His contract is very club friendly, and he’s the only name brand position player on an otherwise dreadful team.
john,
Before you know it, we’ll be calling up Jose Tabata. And Brandon will be the happiest kid in the world.
“Watashi gozen shiyoukanou, Yankee-san. Ichiban nikudzukinoyoi hiki”
Yeah I totally agree with you…
Well, Oakland just got a little worse this weekend.
Good for the Yanks.
===================================================
The only bad news about this is that Oakland goes to Boston next. That should mean a 4 game sweep for beantowners.
“Adrian Gonzales is a lifetime .277 hitter in the NL. Not like he’s Pujols or anything.”
True. He’s more like Teixeira or something.
Thanks St. Louis . I’m a Yankees fan and now we don’t have to see Holliday all weekend long.
“who can we call up from out Triple AAAA team in Pit?”
I hear that Duke kid is doing well, maybe he can make start or two for us.
m July 24th, 2009 at 12:11 pm
GF,
Now watch them win the series.
————-
Just imagine how insane this place would be if that happened. Panic overload.
Probably similar to the three game set the Yanks lost to the Nats.
Now who do you think are the best 3 4 hitters in the game??
1. Tex and AROD
2. Mauer and Mournou
3. Pujols and soon to be Holliday
4. Youk and Bay
Way to go, Cards!
Right now there are a lot of teams about 5 or 6 games out of a post season spot. In August as teams like Seattle, Colorado or Cincinnati realize this isn’t going to be there year then guys like Washburn or Street might become available.
Getting an 8th inning guy that can be trusted might be the best option. If there isn’t a 5th starter who is going to be a clear upgrade over having Aceves in the rotation then why overpay for a starter instead of simply replacing him in the pen with a good set-up guy?
“The only bad news about this is that Oakland goes to Boston next. That should mean a 4 game sweep for beantowners.”
Yeah, cause the Sux are looking hot right now.
No one is Albert Pujols. He’s on a different level.
Adrian Gonzalez is a excellent hitter and superb defensive first baseman, one of the best in the game.
He has 25 home runs in a the most friendly pitcher’s park in the majors. His home/road splits have traditionally been absurd. Away from Petco, he just destoys the ball.
This year those splits are not as pronounced.
I haven’t seen the Gonzalez trade rumor on any reputable site so I’m going to assume there’s nothing to it right now.
However, Gonzalez is a terrific player, don’t let the .248 average fool you. He has no protection in that lineup, not even a semblance of another reliable hitter. That offense is laughably bad.
It would be a huge acquisition for the Red Sox. If it happens you have to hope that the Padres ask for four or so top prospects – Buchholz, Anderson, Kelly, Bard, etc. – basically make them empty their “vaunted” farm system.
Youk and Bay are both slumping horribly – good times
ESPNews also is reporting that P Matt Holliday has been traded.
Since when was Holliday a pitcher?
Okay, my apocalypse remark was in reaction to the guy who said that A-Gonz to the Sox would “scare” them.
If the Yankees keep playing the way they are, nothing scares me.
Except maybe Halladay to the Dodgers.
Holliday for Wallace, Mortenson and Peterson…
done deal..
what is so great about Holliday to be able to put him at the same level as an Arod or Morneau?
Bay is hitting .252, what’s the big deal about him as well? He was hot early and has cooled off. 49 RBI’s in April/May, only 23 since and a grand total of 3 in July. If he was a Yankee he would be getting ripped on this blog just like Melky is being ripped about his dropping production.
jpb1973 July 24th, 2009 at 12:13 pm
The only bad news about this is that Oakland goes to Boston next. That should mean a 4 game sweep for beantowners.
———–
Don’t be too sure about that. The Red Sox are a paltry 8-16 against the AL West this season and 1-2 against Oakland.
They have been far from a sure thing this season even against opponents they should beat.
The one thing in their favor is that they are playing these games at home.
The fixed it.
they**
I don’t know why SD would move Gonzalez when he’s the cornerstone of their offense. The guy is only 27 years old and just entering his prime. The Red Sox would have to be giving up at least two stud pitching prospects (i.e. Buchholz) to get him for sure.
Pete, I know you probably wouldn’t touch this question with a 10-foot pole, but I’m sure everyone would appreciate it if you did:
how the hell does Peter Gammons get away with being such a Red Sox shill? I know ESPN can just point to the old “He’s a Hall of Famer” defense, but as far as journalistic integrity goes, he has none.
It’s not as if he’s working for the Boston Globe. He’s reporting nationally, there should be no bias. It’s a disgrace.
what is so great about Holliday to be able to put him at the same level as an Arod or Morneau?
—————————–
ALBERT PUJOLS
Leah,
Is there anything more boring than college football coaches media day?
I couldn’t stand it.
Boston has to face Cahill and Anderson. We were lucky enough to avoid Cahill. Unfortunately they also get a freebie against Gio Gonzelez.
Sorry but the ‘protection’ argument doesn’t hold water for me.
You are what your numbers say you are and he’s a lifetime .277 hitter in the NATIONAL LEAGUE.
The national league is TERRIBLE.
Adrian Gonzalez is young, very good, a key draw, and on an awesome contract (3 mil for ’09, 4.75 mil for ’10, and a 5.6 mil team option for ’11); why would the Padres ever move him?
….
They wont move him…Theo wants the Yankees to panic so that they go out and OVER Pay for Roy or Cliff Lee….
If the Padres trade Gonzales to the Red Sox, and I don’t think they will, they will get a king’s ransom and the Red Sox will be forced to empty their vaults for him.
I don’t see it happening. I’m sure Theo is trying to construct come cockamamie 3 team deal where he gives up Penny and ends up with Gonzales but that isn’t going to happen.
He’s young and doesn’t make a lot of money and the Padres would be foolish to give him away for prospects at this point when the NL West has proven to be volatile from season to season and anyone can win if they get pitching.
“why would the Padres ever move him?”
Because Peter Gammons really, really, really wants them to.
Robbykid:
Works for me. And/or usual GMs saying stuff to make them look better.
I dont know who it will be, but I’ll be shocked if the Sox dont pick up a legit bat. The Globe had a bullet point yesterday that said that the Sox have only 2 hitters in their whole system (including minors) hitting over .300 (Youk and Pedroia).
Robbykid July 24th, 2009 at 12:21 pm
what is so great about Holliday to be able to put him at the same level as an Arod or Morneau?
—————————–
ALBERT PUJOLS
HAH
I think he had em ranked right though.
The separation between “odd year season Alex” aka MVP Alex and Pujols is not as significant it would be in an “Even year Alex”
Currently I’d take Tex/ARod over Pujols/Holiday but it’s super close IMHO.
Country Club,
So it has been twittered, so it shall come to pass…
Why are people thinking the Red Sox are looking for another 1st baseman? Did I imagine that they just traded for one a few days ago? Or did they want a $3M benchwarmer?
Stop worrying about the Red Sox adding a bat. My nightmare is that they realise that Smoltz and Penny cant be trusted, that DiceK’s arm was abused when he was young and he is possibly finished, and trade some of their young arms for a real difference maker like Lee or Halladay.
Brian M July 24th, 2009 at 12:24 pm
Boston has to face Cahill and Anderson. We were lucky enough to avoid Cahill. Unfortunately they also get a freebie against Gio Gonzelez.”
Wait a minute
I thought we face Anderson today?
I can just see it now: it’s 3:00 am. P. Gammons is drunk, as usual. He’s combing through every major league roster, looking for that one player that will put his beloved Red Sox ahead of the Yanks. He thinks he’s found him.
The next day he’s on the set of Baseball Tonight reporting that the Sox are looking closely at Player X, and with their unprecedented pitching depth it’s actually a perfect fit for the other team.
Thus, a trade is born.
Brian, I understand your point. But the Sox pitching has been fine for the most point. Their bats have been sleeping for a few weeks now. To be honest, it’s not much of a surprise. Most of their players are overrated (Jacoby), old (Ortiz, Varitek, Lowell) or simply performing to their career norms (bay and Drew).
They need a bat for this year and the future. The FA market is weak this offseason too. So if they can get a big time bat right now, they will.
When Cash Money makes a trade for a starter—People will say, Where did that come from?
The Radar Gun Mafioso
We do face Anderson, we just get to avoid Cahill. Both are pitching well and thankfully both face Boston in their series.
Gio Gonzalez goes for Oakland tomorrow which should hopefully be a big win and get the mop up guys in the pen some work because Braden who we face on Sunday is pitching really well right now.
Tom Tresh,
I agree. Cash’s trades are almost never rumors. They just come out of nowhere.
When Cash Money makes a trade for a starter—People will say, Where did that come from?
—————————————————
You’re right…he’ll probably get someone like Doug Davis.
I think we could go out and buy at least 4 or 5 more players just to be on the safe side. That way, hopefully a $300million team salary will definitely make us a wildcard contender and then our annual “out in the first round” team.
Cash!!! Pull that money trigger!!!!!
Come on! We’re just not happy at $205 million in team salaries!!!!
You’re right…he’ll probably get someone like Doug Davis.
- i hope not
Do the Red Sox have a blog like this? I kind of wanna know what the enemy is saying about their potential trades and stuff…
“Do the Red Sox have a blog like this? I kind of wanna know what the enemy is saying about their potential trades and stuff…”
They have one…I think it’s something like espn.com
ray,
You’re too tied up in batting average. Gonzalez plays in the worst hitter’s park in the majors and he’s a 30 home run, 100 RBI guy. On top of that, he’s a gold glove caliber defender.
He’s a star player. He just is. He has no protection in that lineup, none. Name one other above league average hitter playing for San Diego.
Take Gonzalez out of Petco, and he’s on another level.
And, if the National League is so terrible, how come the Phillies are the World Champs. And the Cardinals won the crown in 2006.
You’re right…he’ll probably get someone like Doug Davis.
- i hope not
—————————————————-
Don’t look for Cashman to get anyone thats too good. Its only a 2-1/2 month rent. Next year, the need for starting pitching goes away as Hughes can go to the rotation and Kennedy can be used in a trade for a decent starter.
“Do the Red Sox have a blog like this?”
http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?showforum=5
check out the game threads when the Sox are losing. Think we have bridge jumpers here?
The current issue of SI reported that Cashman inquired about Heath Bell and was turned down. So, the Padres are not making Heath Bell available but are listening to offers for Adrian Gonzalez? Yeah, right.
And Pete, there is no need for a bottom of the rotation guy. We need at least a number 3.
As far as Washburn passing through the waiver deadline? Why would Seattle let him go even if they’re out of it? Won’t he be Type A free agent?
Seattle is keeping Washburn until he files. They will offer him arbitration and collect their 2 picks when he signs elsewhere.
Cashman is not getting Washburn via the August deadline.
“Gonzalez plays in the worst hitter’s park in the majors and he’s a 30 home run, 100 RBI guy. On top of that, he’s a gold glove caliber defender.”
Add in that he is locked in thru 2011 for under $12M total and the question is why would they want to trade him or who would they want back to agree to trade him.
CountryClub, I just don’t see how Boston can replace the underperforming guys in their lineup.
Ortiz is untradeable at this point so they have to hope he remembers how to hit.
Bay is slumping but they have to ride it our and hope he regains his form.
Drew is signed for years (they might actually be hoping his injuries flare up and get them out of the final years of his deal – happily he is injury free)
Varitek is one guy they could replace but Victor Martinez seemed the most likely replacement and since he plays 1st base when he isnt catching I dont see why they’d make the LaRoche deal if there was a chance of getting Martinez.
Looking at the guys they have though and the contracts they are on I think the only other thing they can do is trade Ellsbury for a btter CF. His OBP of .329 is pretty poor s if they package Ellsbury and Bowden they could go after an outfiled bat. Can’t think who though to be honest.
As long as Lowell is healthy I dont see them makig any lineup moves. If Wakefiled turns out to be out for longer than predicted or Bucholtz struggles at all then I can see them moving for an arm. They have bullpen guys and young starters to spare but they need a solid no 3.
Hokiehill July 24th, 2009 at 12:45 pm
“Do the Red Sox have a blog like this? I kind of wanna know what the enemy is saying about their potential trades and stuff…”
They have one…I think it’s something like espn.com”
HAH!!
Line of the day?
“Do the Red Sox have a blog like this?”
From the Boston Globe, good for a few laughs.
http://www.boston.com/communit.....rum%3a9696
jpb1973
Don’t look for Cashman to get anyone thats too good. Its only a 2-1/2 month rent. Next year, the need for starting pitching goes away as Hughes can go to the rotation and Kennedy can be used in a trade for a decent starter.
——–
With Wang Out , and rumor has it his shoulder doesn’t look good and he may miss time next season. Hughes will be on a similar Pitch count as Joba next season. Pettite and Mitre will be GONE. So the person we get in my mind will be more than just a number 4 or 5. Also theres not much on the open market next season.
The Yanks need to trade for a starter. Think about it if the playoffs stared tomorrow they wouldn’t have a game four starter.
With Wang Out , and rumor has it his shoulder doesn’t look good and he may miss time next season. Hughes will be on a similar Pitch count as Joba next season. Pettite and Mitre will be GONE. So the person we get in my mind will be more than just a number 4 or 5. Also theres not much on the open market next season.
—
Precisely. +1
Holiday going to St Louis is good news. Another player who will probably be off the FA market for next year as I suspect St Louis knew they could sign & extend him before trading Wallace. So the RSox will have to pay more to retain Bay or it is more likely someone else will nab him.
Boston needs Manny! LOL! But Boston is kind of stuck right now, although things can change quickly. Ortiz is a shell of himself occupying the DH. They need to move Lowell there. Youk needs to move to 3B or they need a 3B. LaRoche is not a bad hedge pick as he could be okay with moments of great. Drew is better than he is playing and probably will improve. SS is still a question mark as overcoming a wrist injury for a SS is serious. Varitek is cooked, except when he plays the Yankees he comes to life, LOL! Wakefield is injured and is hard to bank on with his back. DiceK is cooked. Smoltz could be ok for half a year, but he will be a 4,5 maybe 6 inning starter who will tax the BP. Penny will be much like Smoltz. Both of them together back to back could destroy a good BP over a long August. I have never been impressed with Ellsbury, but he is ok. Peds is good, but not the version we saw last year.
The thing that may save Boston is that TB is not gaining on them much.
And why would the Padres trade Gonzalez?
a) He’s cheap.
b.) He’s their only dependable bat in the lineup.
If they trade him to the Red Sox, it can’t just be for pitching. They’d need a bat and who are they going to get fron ther Sox?
Lars Anderson? He’s another overhyped prospect who’s not even slugging .400 in his second year in Double AA.
I am available still. Guys? Anyone there?
Pujols/Holliday: when Holliday starts hitting again
I can relax knowing that the value of Sox prospects in the eyes of real scouts vs. ESPN analysts (*cough*Gammons*cough*) are worlds apart.
“Kei Igawa
July 24th, 2009 at 12:54 pm
I am available still. Guys? Anyone there?”
Kei Igawa + new Yankee stadium = japanese suitcase nuke
With Wang Out , and rumor has it his shoulder doesn’t look good and he may miss time next season. Hughes will be on a similar Pitch count as Joba next season. Pettite and Mitre will be GONE. So the person we get in my mind will be more than just a number 4 or 5. Also theres not much on the open market next season.
—————————————————-
The Yankees have Mitre under contract for one more year. I don’t think they are going to dump him…if he does well this year they can include him in a package with Kennedy to acquire an upgrade.
Also, Jason Marquis will be a free agent this winter. He won’t be as expensive as CC or AJ…I would expect them to pursue him if Wang’s ahoulder is still problematic.
the red sox do have a message board called SOSH- check out the comments on the game threads. they make us look tame
http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?showforum=108
rconn – I can’t imagine Theo cleaning out the farm system for Adrian Gonzalez. The farm system is Theo’s pride and joy. San Diego probably needs at least two of Bucholz, Bowden, Bard, Kelly and then a couple of other guys like Kalish or Anderson.
Think similar to the Yankees – Hughes, Melancon, Romine, and Ajax.
“ray,
You’re too tied up in batting average. Gonzalez plays in the worst hitter’s park in the majors and he’s a 30 home run, 100 RBI guy. On top of that, he’s a gold glove caliber defender.
He’s a star player. He just is. He has no protection in that lineup, none. Name one other above league average hitter playing for San Diego.
Take Gonzalez out of Petco, and he’s on another level.
And, if the National League is so terrible, how come the Phillies are the World Champs. And the Cardinals won the crown in 2006.”
Actually I also managed to see that he has a lifetime .354 OBP.
Now if he is as great as you all seem to think he is wouldn’t his lifetime OBP be closer to .400? Being that he has no protection around him why would he ever get anything good to hit?
Meanwhile he plays in the NL in the worst division in baseball I might add.
He’s a good player. Is he great, no not by a long shot. Is he going to put the Sox over the top if they get him? I don’t think so.
Are you really judging a 7 game series and deciding how good a league is?
Really?
If I’m Boston I make Varitek the backup and trade the farm for Victor Martinez. The problem is Boston really can’t afford to trade pitching for VMart because losing a Buchholz type pitcher can cause pitching troubles down the line even if such a move rescues their offense.
Coke is it!
A little bit off topic and slightly out of the box. How about Phil Coke back to the rotation. I know that few talk about it, but Phil Coke was a starter for almost all of his career. Granted he took off after the conversion to being a reliever, but he is older (than Hughes), left handed and was a starter. If Marte comes back and is in form, do the Yankees even consider this route.
Whoa. Who knew Bostonians can be so mad? I always thought they were pleasent beings..
Believe it or not the Red Sox are getting a bit thin in the rotation as well.
Wakefield on the DL. Penny being very mediocre. Smoltz not back to form – his numbers the second time through an order are abysmal. Dice-K following the CMW road to nowhere fast.
They have Beckett and Lester and the ???????
Trading some of the pitching depth made come back to bite them.
“A little bit off topic and slightly out of the box. How about Phil Coke back to the rotation”
can’t do it. The bullpen works. You cannot tamper with it. (Much like the orgiginal Coke formula)
“Coke is it!
A little bit off topic and slightly out of the box. How about Phil Coke back to the rotation. I know that few talk about it, but Phil Coke was a starter for almost all of his career. Granted he took off after the conversion to being a reliever, but he is older (than Hughes), left handed and was a starter. If Marte comes back and is in form, do the Yankees even consider this route.”
I don’t think so. He’s the bullpen lefty Joe goes to.
Five Iron, That would be an option if Dunn were lights out, but he ain’t and Marte is not for sure known…sadly sunglasses might be back in the Bronx
I think the yankees should def. sign Holliday in the offseason (assuming St. Louis don’t extend his contract, which I doubt). I also think the yankees should sign Damon for 1-2 years, until crawford becomes free agent in 2011. Now that would be the sickest lineup ever.
“I don’t think so. He’s the bullpen lefty Joe goes to.”
His scenario hinges on Marte coming back and being decent in the bullpen.
It’s a plausible scenario IF Marte comes back and pitches well.
Do the really need a lefty though? Phil Hughes and Alfredo Aceves get both lefties and righties out and they can both pitch multiple innings.
Who knows how good Coke would be in the rotation but it’s not an absurd notion.
soon the NL West and Central will react to the Matt Holliday deal.
Whomever said that the Cardinals will extend him…
When did he fire Scott Boras?
I know most of us don’t want to see this, but Igawa deserves another shot at starting. (WOW, I said that!) I mean if the Yankees were willing to give Pavano chances again, surely 1 start for Igawa is in order. If he does well, perhaps he could be traded or maybe be a #5 starter. The Yankees have other options for August in Nova and McAllister as options too.
Regarding our pitching this year, why not go after John Lannan of the Nats. He’s a new york native and he has 7 wins with a crappy team.
i wonder if the St Louis stadium plays like a band-box?
how will Holliday fare
When is McAllister due to come off the DL?
If you want to consider your bullpen well rounded, you need a lefty guy in there. So I wouldn’t move Coke just to risk it with Marte.
Kennedy and Wang will both be with us next year because their potential far outweighs their trade value. But pickups for the run in this year don’t have to be part of the plans for next year.
Guys like Bedard, Lackey, Duscherer, Harden, Mike Gonzalez and Rafael Soriano are free agents after this season.
Next year we will hopefully look for an upgrade to Pettitte and assume that between Hughes, Joba and Wang the 4 and 5 spot will be OK, Aceves and Kennedy can offer cover and guys like Novo and McAllister should appear on the radar after the break.
I doubt that we will get anyone better than Pettitte before the offseason though so I expect a midlevel minor leaguer or two sent to a team for a no 4 or 5 starter type with a few million left to pay, once they drop out of contention. Best case scenario is a Washburn trade in August.
I see Marte returning as a lefty specialist.
I’d rather they sign Paul Byrd than pitch Kei Igawa @NYS, or any other MLB park for that matter.
‘Japanese suitcase nuke’ – lol
Regarding our pitching this year, why not go after John Lannan of the Nats. He’s a new york native and he has 7 wins with a crappy team.
–
He’s young and on the cheap. Same as Josh Johnson.
“I know most of us don’t want to see this, but Igawa deserves another shot at starting. (WOW, I said that!) I mean if the Yankees were willing to give Pavano chances again, surely 1 start for Igawa is in order.”
Welcome to the club. I’ve been saying that since May haha
Best case scenario is a Washburn trade in August.
—
If Seattle thinks he’ll be classified type A, I bet they keep him in August.
RayVT
July 24th, 2009 at 1:09 pm
I know most of us don’t want to see this, but Igawa deserves another shot at starting. (WOW, I said that!) I mean if the Yankees were willing to give Pavano chances again, surely 1 start for Igawa is in order. If he does well, perhaps he could be traded or maybe be a #5 starter. The Yankees have other options for August in Nova and McAllister as options too.
****
I agree too. What’s the worst that happens? We lose ONE game
McAllister has had a pretty quick rise through the system, he isn’t ready for the big leagues. And until this year Novo was wild.
We might see them as Sept call-ups to let them see the bigs and soak it up, but I seriously doubt they will get more than an inning or two in major blowout games before getting sent back down.
Probably a full year away from being able to contribute any meaningful innings.
the great thing w/SoSH is they can be as filthy as they want to be, and trust me, the get Phil Hughes filthy in the game threads.
Kei Igawa July 24th, 2009 at 11:44 am
I would love to see the new ballpark..
You will in September…
assume that between Hughes, Joba and Wang the 4 and 5 spot will be OK
—
Risky assumption. CC and AJ are the only reliable pitchers in next year’s rotation.
Washburn is almost 35 and will be looking for a long term deal.
Bedard is always injured.
Aroldis Chapman supposedly requires some developmental time.
I don’t see any safe solutions for the 2010 staff on the free agent market and I wouldn’t go in next year with only 2 reliable starters. Hughes + Joba have shown extreme inconsistency and even regression at points this season. Wang hasn’t pitched a full season since 2007.
The problem with the Igawa argument is someone would have to get bumped from the 40-man roster to make room for him.
All for a guy who has proved he can’t pitch at the big league level.
“Japanese suitcase nuke’ – lol”
thank you. I thought it was a good one
Bret –
‘If Seattle thinks he’ll be classified type A, I bet they keep him in August.’
Maybe but this is the first time in years his ERA has been under 4 or he has had a chance of winning more than 10 games. I haven’t seen the latest rankings but I dont see how he could be more than a type B.
In arbitration he’d get a raise for sure and that’d have his services starting at $11M. Seems like a risk Seattle might rather avoid.
I know I’m beating the Gammons thing into the ground, but I will say this:
when the Yanks had their great run in the late-’90s, he always gave them their proper respect. It just seems that since ’04 he’s not even trying to hide his bias.
I’m on the wagon of giving Igawa a shot if we really need a pitcher in a tight spot, but right now we don’t…I wish we had done this for Ace’s spot start (or at least pitched Mitre). I still don’t like the sound of stretching out Ace as our emergency option. Not because I don’t think he could be a good starter, but because it kills our BP if Pettitte, Joba and Ace all pitch short games back to back to back like the did before the break
The Yanks put Igawa on waivers because they wanted him off the 40 man so badly.
Unless they absolutely have to, I don’t see them adding him back on now.
“All for a guy who has proved he can’t pitch at the big league level.”
He’s proven it in 71.2 career innings? Wow he had a real short hook on his career
There’s no reason at all to speculate on the Yankees trading for a young, cheap, solid starting pitcher. Nobody trades guys like that. Common sense still tells me it’s Halladay, Lee or nothing. Keep in mind, Mitre might be decent, so whoever you are getting has to be viewed through the prism of “how much better” is he than Mitre.
One posswible exception is Justin Duscherer who carries a much smaller price tag but no one knows (yet) if he’s healthy.
Coke was moved to the bullpen because they were convinced he was as good as he was going to get as a starter. What sense would it make to backtrack? Weaken the pen in the event he’s an upgrade over Mitre? Nope.
The 40-man roster isn’t an issue. We can 60-day DL Nady or cut Kevin Cash.
I haven’t seen the latest rankings but I dont see how he could be more than a type B.
—
I think his classification is partly based on the other starting pitchers available on the market. The market is weak for starting pitchers in this next free agent class. I bet Washburn and Marquis get tagged with Type A status, along with Bedard. The Angels will pick up Lackey’s option.
From SWB
On who else stands out to Cashman on the Thunder roster… “Nunez, Corona, Austin Krum has just come up here and he’s done a great job down in Single-A and now he’s showing what he can do here. Pitching-wise, McAllister…Nova just got shot up to Triple-A and he’s having an outstanding run out there. He’s a guy who had all the talent, but the performance didn’t follow it in the Florida State League last year. Now, after a Rule 5 selection and pitching in cold weather for the first time in his career in Double-A and now in Triple-A, this guy’s done well. We’ve got Dunn…a number of different guys are standing out in performance. Texeira, the reliever, the guy we got in the Swisher deal, he’s now got his feet on the ground and he’s taking off. Kevin Whelan’s starting to find his way with his dominant stuff. We’ve got a number of guys that we’re excited about. Tony Franklin and this coaching staff have done a phenomenal job. Whatever players come through here, they get better and that’s a good thing. I’m sure I’m missing people right now off the top of my head, but we’ve got a lot of prospects here that are going to play in the big leagues. No doubt in my mind about that.”
Common sense still tells me it’s Halladay, Lee or nothing.
—
Most likely.
86w183 i agree 100 percent .
Brian M
July 24th, 2009 at 1:22 pm
The 40-man roster isn’t an issue. We can 60-day DL Nady or cut Kevin Cash.
***
Exactly correct. Thank you Brian.
Wang is also on the 15 Day DL and depending on what Dr Andrews says he might be a great 60 Day DL candidate
Okay, I’m not real familiar with Holliday, so this is a serious no-snark required question.
Who do you take if you’re the Yankees? Rios’s current contract or Holliday’s potentially bigger contract?
In most cities Igawa would have had another shot by now, but the risk of him getting shelled and the outrage that would follow, together with the fact that he is a flyball pitcher in a launchpad stadium mean he ain’t getting near this team.
With Seattle’s Japanese connection and huge ballpark I can see him working well as a throw-in in a Washburn deal with Seattle (although we’d have to pick up his salary for next yr).
“Wang is also on the 15 Day DL and depending on what Dr Andrews says he might be a great 60 Day DL candidate”
but erica, remember, igawa is garbage, 71 innings into his career, it’s over for him. never to be heard from again.
I think all of those SWB records for Igawa must be worth at least one more start
“I think all of those SWB records for Igawa must be worth at least one more start”
100% agreed. Even if he’s nothing more than a AAAA starter, it takes a whole lot more than 71.2 innings to determine that.
Kei Igawa schooling Hideki Matsui-san in ’02:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....re=related
Holliday is a much better hitter than Rios but in this economy and with his slow start in Oakland I cant see him getting close to $100M unless St Louis win the Series and he gets Series MVP.
Abreu is playing for $5M, and Ibanez about $10M per yr. Holliday is just unlucky with his timing.
“Common sense still tells me it’s Halladay, Lee or nothing.”
It’s gonna be someone else.
“I think all of those SWB records for Igawa must be worth at least one more start”
I would agree with that, particularly in an emergency situation (assuming no trade) where your other option is basically stretch out Ace or Hughes.
I’d like to see Igawa get another shot in the bigs, but only on the road. He cant pitch in this stadium.
“I think all of those SWB records for Igawa must be worth at least one more start”
not in this stadium.
just as well, would have changed your mind by inning 3
I’d like to see the Yanks try to pick up John McDonald. Talk about a late-inning defensive replacement, it wouldn’t get any better than him.
Any talk about Hughes or Joba being Mo’s replacement in 2010 is missing a vital aspect. Sure it may be what some people think it would be great, but it disregards the fact that…Starters make more money!!! Lots more money!!! (Its MONEY, MONEY, MONEY, MONEY, MONEEEEEEEY. (Sing it).
I would imagine that Hughes has an agreement with the Yankees that he will be moved back to the starting rotation next year. Thus his great initial attitude about being moved to the pen. Regradless of how great he has been down in the pen, he is starter (…SV no big deal, CC deserved the Belt more).
Although Phil and Joba have done well in the pen, that is not where their heart is. Nor their future earning power.
I’d say Cashman and Girardi see next years, and many years to come, rotation will be CC, AJ, Joba, Hughes, and (?). Just think about that as our future….WOW!!!
Also, the offense and pen are doing great and thus no real need for knee jerk reaction at this point. Nothing on this front is going to happen until August at the earliest, if at all. Thats where Cashman’s head is…and its in the right place.
Hughes wont have any agreement with the Yankees about being in the rotation. remember when Wang was in the pen and getting upset about it Cashman said his contract says ‘baseball player’, where he plays is up to the coaches.
Nobody especially a young player gets guaranteed spots on a team. I imagine they have told him that they still expect his future to be as a starter, but if they change their minds, there is nothing he can do about it.
After the Boston series – Skip Joba about three times and see if you could limit his IP to about 150 – leaving with a potential 10 to 16 innings for the post season. It won’t kill him.
Either trade for a back of the rotation guy – Davis, Garland – Harang, Arroyo (who both give up a ton of HRs.) – Bannister, Snell, Lannan, and of course Washburn.
Or
Center a young package around Austin Jackson and get a top of the rotation pitcher – but for who? Lee (indians want pitching.) Vazquez (do the Yankees want him and again Braves have two top OF prospects and McLouth.) Haren (not on the market, but will cost one of joba or hughes) … which all seem unlikely.
The Yanks internal options are Johnson, Igawa, & Nova. they are not good…
Garland would cost us the least in prospects. Harang might be most interesting make sure he pitches on the road. Snell could be a steal, but it won’t come free. I love bringing the hometown kid, Lannan, but the Nationals will not just give him away.
If the yanks are NOT trying to deliberately bury Igawa in AAA (IMO I believe they are- sending a message to Igawa that he will never see the big leagues ever again), then I think the best option would be to see if Igawa has anything he could offer during the Seattle trip in mid august. Big park and maybe you could skip Joba during that trip.
If the yankees don’t Igawa would be
John McDonald?! He ain’t much better than Ronald McDonald. How he is in the ML is beyond me. He can’t hit at all. Ramiro Pena is better and a better bat, which ain’t sayin much.
I think Joba has struggled for consistency so much that skipping him might be a bad idea. Just decide at what point he goes from the rotation to the pen, and leave enough innings for October.
The main decision is can the stretch Hughes out to take his spot in the rotation?
Assuming we make playoffs we don’t have a good no 4 option right now unless we stretch out Hughes or trade for someone like Washburn – assuming Wang won’t be back.
Brian M July 24th, 2009 at 2:02 pm
Hughes wont have any agreement with the Yankees about being in the rotation.
—————
Right you are. I meant Understanding. What about the rest of the post?
I agree – the Yanks need another starter and there are some good options available such as Harang, Snell and Gorzelanny to name a few. Snell and Gorzelanny have been shipped to AAA primarily because of personality conflicts with the new
Pirate front office and are dominating Interntional League hitters. Both can start and relieve and are rather cheap.
Lets ask Mussina to come back!
great read on Jim Rice:
http://www.bostonherald.com/sp.....it_his_way
even as a kid, I was a huge Yankee fan. Jim Rice was the one guy that scared the hell out of me. He was menacing, in an Albert Belle kind of way.
This article, though, shows how different he is from Belle as human being, and that’s what really matters.
I don’t think Hughes is going be be stretched out. Cash and Girardi love him right where he is for now. Why take any chance, if anything happened to him, or it didn’t work out…Girardi would be crucified. The only talk, of course just talk, is about Aceves moving out, but only if something arises.
darn I was hoping Holliday would stay with the A’s and have a subpar year, this way we can offer him less money when he plays LF for the Yankees next year.
Jeter
Holliday
Teixeira
A-Rod
that’s just….not fair… lol
You can’t stretch hughes out -
He’s on a Innings limit as well – He is up 80 and pitched less than 100 last season. If you stretch him out you are losing about 20 to 25 innings to Scranton. Leave Phil alone.
I disagree with skipping Joba – look at how strong he looked after the allstar break.
You skip his turn in mid august – west coast trip – Again after you expand rosters in september and skip him again at the end of the month.
There are 65 games left and potential 13 starts – if you skip Joba three times and averages about 5 to 6 innings a start that brings him to about 150. Then you roll the dice in the playoffs… most he pitches would be somewhere between 10 to 16 IP or about 3 starts.