The curious case of Robinson Cano
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- July
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This is just amazing.
Robinson Cano with runners in scoring position: 24 of 117 (.205).
Robinson Cano without runners in scoring position: 94 of 264 (.356).
A 151-point differential? How is that even possible? Maybe the Yankees should have their runners duck down so he can’t see them.
Meanwhile, and I’m serious about this, Cano is playing a Gold Glove-caliber second base. Joe Girardi said last night that he has never seen a second baseman go to his right better than Cano and I’d agree. His ability to make that play is amazing.
Cano is an interesting player. You can make a good case either way for loving him or hating him,
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on Friday, July 24th, 2009 at 10:01 am by Peter Abraham.
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Chad Jennings
Sam Borden
Who….Mitre? Washburn?..Arroyo?…come on that makes no sense at all…I want names of people who can take Hughes role next year…Come on we are all Monday Morning GM’s on here…i want suggestions”
———–
McAllister?
we could have had this same discussion last year and not many would have said Phil Hughes.
the point is, you throw some decent arms at the bullpen wall and see which ones stick.
you don’t waste top of the rotation stuff in the bullpen. you surely don’t do it without first seeing if Hughes can be a successful starter.
Cano is a great player. He is just slacking with RISP right now.
I can’t remember the last time I saw Cano take a first pitch with RISP.
Kevin Long, time for you to report to duty.
yea cano numbers with risp are awful. i think is a product of a poor approach.
i also feels is bad luck as well, when hit good, is been caught
risp stats to be has always been flukely.
cano never been great at iy, but neer say this bad.
i say is a fluke to be this bad
Cano and tex will win a gold glove this year. Thats my prediction.
“Cano is a great player. He is just slacking with RISP right now.”
Yeah, that throw across the body when going to his right looks lazy too…
his year is this year-Hughes is in the ‘pen, end of conversation. Joba is on an innings limit, hopefully he would be able to start a game in the playoffs if his performance justifies it.
2010 and the following years is a totally different matter. CC and AJ will be around and strong for the long haul. The Yankees have tons of good young arms in the minors and on the major league roster. If Joba and Hughes are the best of them they go in the rotation, there is no reason why some of the other starters in the minors can’t become solid bullpen guys while they are waiting for their chance in the rotation (which could be years or never). Phil Coke was a starter until the end of last year, now he’s bullpen guy. Why are so many of you so afraid that no one else can do a pretty simple job in the ‘pen (get a couple of outs at the end of the game)when the recipe is pretty clear-either have one dominant pitch (Mo) or be a starter with plus stuff who can air it out in the ‘pen for an inning or two (Joba, Phil). Don’t you think there are more prospects available to fill this role next year? If you don’t you are really being shortsighted.
Hitting with RISP is the only part of Cano’s game that has not been good this year, but of course it will allow all kinds of people to flog him. There is no second baseman in the American League that I would rather have on the Yankees right now, and that stands regardless of his numbers with RISP.
Yeah, that throw across the body when going to his right looks lazy too…
==================
Yes, it does look lazy…but only because it’s so easy for him. He’s made some awesome plays in the field this year.
Not sure what to say about his hitting though. I’m just glad that Girardi didn’t leave him in the 5th spot.
Freakin’ bizarre move putting him there.
After watching Cano pop up the first pitch with the bases loaded, I said last night if Cano wasn’t such a great fielder I would hate him even more. He drives me crazy at the plate, but man can that guy play 2nd base…
While hitting is the most exciting part of a player’s game, I think defense is often overlooked. It really is amazing how non-chalant Cano can make plays look. He is so smooth. The right side of the NYY infield is like a wall. With Tex and Robbie nothing gets through!
i think its just a case of a young player pressing in the heat of the moment. if there’s one thing in baseball that’s true, it’s that if you try too hard to make something happen, it won’t. he’s going to get more and more comfortable with it over time.
it’s not like he has bad at bats with runners on, and he certainly doesn’t strike out alot. he just seems to either hit the ball really hard right at someone, or get jammed up and ground/fly out. it’s a matter of luck at that point.
can anyone find his BABIP with RISP? i can’t at the moment…
That play to his right will be his calling card like Jeter’s jump throw in the hole at short. The one he made to get Roberts Tuesday was great.
Better off batting him Leadoff..LOL.. At least he will get on and someone else can bring him in.
“There is no second baseman in the American League that I would rather have on the Yankees right now, and that stands regardless of his numbers with RISP.”
I love Cano and I’m one of his biggest supporters, but if I had a choice of having any second baseman in the American League, I’d choose Ian Kinsler.
RMEL, thanks for the link. Maholm sounds interesting, I still think Id rather have Duke…..but hed probably be more pricey than Maholm.
“Cano is an interesting player. You can make a good case either way for loving him or hating him”
Only someone who doesn’t really know baseball would hate him. He’s one of the best second baseman in the entire league.
Can’t see why anyone would hate that he’s on the Yankees.
you also have to remember that guys get pitched to differently when there are runners on. maybe there is somethingt hat they are doing to him, in the way that they are setting him up to try to get that ground ball/easy out… and it’s working for the time being.
Oh God, so are we now on the Phil Hughes is the 8th inning guy?
Of course Phil looks good in the bullpen, he has great stuff to be a starter.
Imagine how good Lincecum would look if he were the eigth inning guy in San Fran
Fill Yooooose is a staaaatah, period.
Cano is a lifetime .260 hitting with RISP, not great but much better than this year. He’s as good a second baseman as their is in baseball and hits over .300. It’s up to him to raise with batting average with RISP but I’d rather have him on the Yankees, even with this issue, than almost every other 2nd baseman in the majors. Plus, he’s only 26 years old and still learning. This year has been a big step forward in terms of maturity so the constant harping about this just makes no sense to me whatsoever. It is not going to change overnight.
I think Cano’s struggles with RISP is in his head now. He is trying to do too much and is over thinking this situation.
It is odd and frustrating, probably as much for him as it is for us fans.
I think his defense has improved quite a bit. And it was good before.
It warms my heart that the Joba starter/bullpen debate has been replaced by the exact same Hughes starter/bullpen debate
Hate is a strong word. I appreciate what Cano brings to the table and like having him, I just get frustrated not seeing him progress further to reach his potential. The beginning of the season his approach was a lot better and the results proved it as well. Then he reverted back to a bit of what got him in trouble last season. He has tremednous talent, but he needs a little more plate disciline to be considered as good as a Chase Utley who has similar offensive capabilites.
I will take Cano over Kinsler. Kinsler has shown that he at times can be as inconsistent as Cano, and I think Cano can hit for as much power as Kinsler, plus Cano has proven to be more durable in his career than Kinsler. Also, Kinsler absolutely fell off offensively last year once Hamilton got shut down, so I think Kinsler really thrives on the fact that he gets fastballs to hit because Hamilton is usually hitting behind him. Kinsler is a better base stealer than Cano, and defensively I think they are both good, so I am sticking with Robbie over him.
MG,
I don’t think Cano’s approach will change much at the plate. He’ll never be patient, I just hope he starts making contact and getting hits with RISP.
Kinsler is a terrible road hitter.
Cano’s approach could be improved with RISP but it’s not as dramatic as it’s made out to be. It’s not taking the first pitch, either (I guess people don’t really watch these games). He gets into a lot of bad counts with RISP because he seems super conscious of being patient and overthinking a bit. In the Baltimore series, he took two borderline strikes, then worked a nice AB, and then chased a bad 3-2 pitch.
“I love Cano and I’m one of his biggest supporters, but if I had a choice of having any second baseman in the American League, I’d choose Ian Kinsler.”
Ian Kinsler has an even worse OBP than our boy Cano.
Cano is so smooth and graceful that it looks like he isn’t trying, he doesn’t always get credit for how good he is defensively.
Cano doesn’t often strike out, but if he took a pitch or 2 he would get better pitches to hit.
SI_JonHeyman#yankees are latest to inquire about cliff lee. but were told theyd have to surrender joba or hughes plus more. #indians
RMEL, thanks for the link. Maholm sounds interesting, I still think Id rather have Duke…..but hed probably be more pricey than Maholm.
—
No problem…Pete has some really good links on here…should check them out….both are decent young lefties….would not mind having either of them
“SI_JonHeyman#yankees are latest to inquire about cliff lee. but were told theyd have to surrender joba or hughes plus more. #indians” = no thanks…
Andrew-
I definitely understand your sentiment on wanting Cano over Kinsler. They’re both fabulous players. Kinsler definitely did fall off a bit offensively when Hamilton went down and he still managed to hit .319 with 18 home runs and 71 rbi in only 121 games, if he had a full season, he probably would’ve put up a 30/30 and 100 season. Kinsler is a terrific fielder, but Cano just makes it look so easy!
Is “slacking” really the word you wanted to use? I’m not sure Cano doesn’t care or try which is what that word implies.
Not all players are going to be cookie cutters of what the ideal is. I can appreciate his strengths and hope they expand but not willing to hate on him for being something he currently is not.
Cano will get better with the bat and RISP.
Cano will get better with the bat and RISP.
“Ian Kinsler has an even worse OBP than our boy Cano.”
That’s because his batting average is so low. If he was batting .300 like Cano, his OBP would be near .380
In essence, he’s gotten himself into a bit of a psychological bind and because teams are obsessed with “scouting tendencies,” he really is facing two different approaches depending on the runner situation.
But 117 ABs. Keep in mind. That’s not exactly the overpowering weight of statistical evidence that some people make it out to be. There’s a reason why BA with RSP fluctuates dramatically from year to year:
Jeter
2007: .354
2008: .317
2009: .277 (.333 bases empty)
“It warms my heart that the Joba starter/bullpen debate has been replaced by the exact same Hughes starter/bullpen debate”
It gives people something to talk about, since it’s hard to fathom life without Rivera, it’s nice to think that somebody in our organization will replace him (which won’t happen).
SI_JonHeyman#yankees are latest to inquire about cliff lee. but were told theyd have to surrender joba or hughes plus more. #indians
—
Ok at what point did Cash hang up on the Tribe…..joba for Doc maybe….big maybe…..no way for Lee
Guys like Lee & Halladay are going to cost a lot. They’re better off trying to get a back end starter.
Kinsler road:
.200/.277/.394 (2009)
Career road OPS: 185 points lower
Joe B. on WFAN said Cashman called the Indians about Cliff Lee. Of course Shaprio asked for Hughes or Joba . UGHHHHH ..
Ramey-
Seriously. If it wasn’t for:
1) The Joba debate
2) The Hughes debate
3) Roy Halladay
4) Cano with RISP
What the Buccholz would LoHud posters talk about??
Don’t worry Cash Money will wait out Shapario
“That’s because his batting average is so low. If he was batting .300 like Cano, his OBP would be near .380″
It would be, but it isn’t. That is like saying Cano would have an OBP of .400 if he walked 30 more times this year. Kinsler is batting .248, but has more walks than Cano, yet his OBP is still less. Are you saying that walks are more important than hits?
“It would be, but it isn’t. That is like saying Cano would have an OBP of .400 if he walked 30 more times this year. Kinsler is batting .248, but has more walks than Cano, yet his OBP is still less. Are you saying that walks are more important than hits?”
Not at all. Kinsler is having a bad year offensively, much like Cano had last year. Cano is a better pure hitter than Kinsler, but Kinsler just has more power and speed.
I think Cano’s hitting even higher with the bases empty.
We’d talk about Ramey’s GF.
Erica, youre forgetting the Aroldis Chapman talks.
Cant wait for that to re-fire up!!
Erica-
LoHud posters could talk about Ramey’s Papelbon-loving ex(?) GF
“Seriously. If it wasn’t for:
1) The Joba debate
2) The Hughes debate
3) Roy Halladay
4) Cano with RISP
What the Buccholz would LoHud posters talk about??”
Why Cody Ransom is still on the roster? Melky/Gardner playing time? Swisher/Hinske playing time? And some people’s affection for Jonathan Sanchez?
…Wait, that happens too??
Robbie Cano just has no killer instinct. Some ab’s he looks like he wants to give up… its sad…
MG
July 24th, 2009 at 10:19 am
Cano is a lifetime .260 hitting with RISP, not great but much better than this year. He’s as good a second baseman as their is in baseball and hits over .300. It’s up to him to raise with batting average with RISP but I’d rather have him on the Yankees, even with this issue, than almost every other 2nd baseman in the majors. Plus, he’s only 26 years old and still learning. This year has been a big step forward in terms of maturity so the constant harping about this just makes no sense to me whatsoever. It is not going to change overnight.
====
That about sums it up.
Not only does harping on it make no sense – considering his overall contribution – but I can’t even take anyone seriously who continues to sound that key.
Considering where the Yankees are and where they clearly WOULD NOT be without Cano, that’s just off-key singing that gives you a headache.
“LoHud posters could talk about Ramey’s Papelbon-loving ex(?) GF”
Hey, if it wasn’t for that, you guys would’ve been REALLY bored during that rain delay!!!!
I don’t mind Cano taking a hack on a first pitch with RISP (as long as the guy hasn’t just walked a bunch of people) because Robbie’s BA is very high when he swings at first pitch strikes. However, he just seems to expand his strike zone when he gets in those situations. That at bat last night he swung at two pitches on his fists. He’s been very good at laying off those pitches this year so it has to have something to do with anxiety, just too much pressure on himself right now.
ADam
July 24th, 2009 at 10:36 am
Robbie Cano just has no killer instinct. Some ab’s he looks like he wants to give up… its sad…
====
What’s sad are generalizations like this one.
Hey, bodhisattva:
Don’t you think he’s lazy and that he lacks killer instinct because he secretly doesn’t like playing baseball and he doesn’t care if he gets hits with men on base because he can’t be bothered to work hard because he’s lazy?
Ramey – Traded his Girlfriend to the Pirates for a PTBNL
July 24th, 2009 at 10:37 am
“LoHud posters could talk about Ramey’s Papelbon-loving ex(?) GF”
Hey, if it wasn’t for that, you guys would’ve been REALLY bored during that rain delay!!!!
====
I thought it was a hoot, myself.
The one thing I found encouraging a couple of nights ago with Cano was that he hit two liners to the opposite field with RISP.
They didn’t drop but he hadn’t really done that for awhile.
If he takes the same approach (driving the ball to all fields) with RISP that he does with the bases empty – he would have much better results in those situations.
But he becomes too aggressive and swings at too many pitches out of the zone. He also gets way too pull happy.
All that said, there’s no second baseman in the AL who is playing better defense than Cano is. He’s been spectacular and it’s great to see that he hasn’t taken his RISP struggles to the field with him.
john_halfz
July 24th, 2009 at 10:39 am
Hey, bodhisattva:
Don’t you think he’s lazy and that he lacks killer instinct because he secretly doesn’t like playing baseball and he doesn’t care if he gets hits with men on base because he can’t be bothered to work hard because he’s lazy?
====
Oh, yes. And don’t forget his friendship with Melky – that pestilence that is infecting the whole team and who corrupts Cano by pulling him out of his Seminary Studies and exposing him to wayward, debauching revelry in Latino nightclubs around the city.
Makes you yearn for something more “wholesome” – like Little Dusty Pedroia – you know – someone who plays the game “right.”
There is no reason to throw Cano anything near a strike on the first pitch with RISP. He almost certainly will be swinging, and almost certainly will make contact. I have been expecting him to settle down in those situations as he sees them more, but he seems to be going the opposite way. The more he fails with RISP, the more pressure he seems to put on himself, the more jumpy he gets at the first pitch.
IDK what can be done. Order him to take a strike? Maybe, but they always say they don’t want to stifle his aggressiveness. But it he does it once or twice and has success, maybe that will help something click on with him in the pressure spots.
theoretically, Cliff Lee is their ace. I can’t blame Shapiro for asking for high-grade talent. That doesn’t mean I’d make that trade, of course. NEVER.
Bodhisattva:
Right on!
everyone likes dirt dogs like Gardner and Podsednik (what a shame that Kenny Williams and Ozzie Guillen had to hold HIM down for so long). I wonder if we could coax Erstad into replacing Melk. The team would just try a lot harder if more of them had high and tight crew cuts.
And Cano…well, he’s just predisposed to laziness. Ship him out for an Eric Byrnes/David Eckstein type. Eric can learn to play 2nd if need be, because he has a love for the game.
bodhisattva – Destiny Wears Pinstripes
July 24th, 2009 at 10:39 am
Ramey – Traded his Girlfriend to the Pirates for a PTBNL
July 24th, 2009 at 10:37 am
“LoHud posters could talk about Ramey’s Papelbon-loving ex(?) GF”
Hey, if it wasn’t for that, you guys would’ve been REALLY bored during that rain delay!!!!
====
I thought it was a hoot, myself.
****
DUH!! I should have included Ramey’s love life on my list of favorite LoHud topics
Cano is better than Kinsler. I like Kinsler, but if you watch him day in and day out, you think Cano’s plate discipline is bad? He definitely is overly aggressive at the plate.
I take Cano over Pedroia based on the fact that Cano has such a high ceiling and I hope he hits it at some point, right now Pedroia maxes out his skill which is much more limited.
Out of all second basemen, the only player I would want out there instead of Cano might be Chase Utley
Mark:
It’s 117 ABs. He’s taken a bad approach on some and a good approach on others. He’s had some bad luck and he’s made some dumb swings. I can’t believe on a team that’s won 44 of 66 people are so intent on savaging a guy that about 27 other teams would instantly slot in as their starting 2B.
I feel that Cano thinks too much when he goes up to the plate with RISP. Instead of reacting to what the pitcher throws, he is pre-meditated and swings at pitches nowhere near the zone… he doesnt seem to have that pressure when he comes up with no one on base.. thats when he takes pitches and walks.. check the pop up yesterday in the 4th inning… The pitch was almost a foot inside.. It looks similar to what A-rod was doing the last couple of years in the clutch..
Is there really such a thing as an ACE on a failed team?
“DUH!! I should have included Ramey’s love life on my list of favorite LoHud topics”
Obviously. It could become a rain delay hot topic. Give it a catchy name like “The Rain Delay Love Hour” and we’re set
Robbie Cano will be just fine. He will probably have a run of hitting with runners in scoring position soon to even things out a bit. That is why you try not to segment a season and critic it. A .300 hitter will eventually approach at least .270 as a hitter with RISP. Too much is made of things. Like with Melky slumping after the AS Break w/o mentioning that he had a 6 game hitting streak which included two games after AS break. He had also hit in 10 of the past 11 games he batted before that. These plugs or critics are just used to stir the pot. Then everyone has an opinion.
We’ve had Jetergate, Posadagate, Melkygate, Canogate (trade him), Matsuigate, Swishgate, CCgate, AJgate, Jobagate, & Joe(s)gate! All seem to be doing fine even though we decided it was broken!
john_halfz
July 24th, 2009 at 10:45 am
Bodhisattva:
Right on!
everyone likes dirt dogs like Gardner and Podsednik (what a shame that Kenny Williams and Ozzie Guillen had to hold HIM down for so long). I wonder if we could coax Erstad into replacing Melk. The team would just try a lot harder if more of them had high and tight crew cuts.
And Cano…well, he’s just predisposed to laziness. Ship him out for an Eric Byrnes/David Eckstein type. Eric can learn to play 2nd if need be, because he has a love for the game.
======
Dude, the crew cut comment is priceless….and wildly perceptive. Perhaps, TOO perceptive
.
“Out of all second basemen, the only player I would want out there instead of Cano might be Chase Utley”
Just out of curiosity, but why do you say ‘might’ be Chase Utley? Is it the age factor, since Cano is 4 years younger?
117 ABs
Call up every GM in the league and offer them Cano. He’s the starting 2B tomorrow on 27, if not 28, teams in the league.
44-22 since return of A-Rod and we’re finding ways to savage players. Good bunch of fans!
On his postgame interview with Suzyn last night Tex called Cano the “most under appreciated 2nd baseman in baseball” This was of course when answering a question about his stellar defense.
The Indians are smoking crack. Have they looked at Lee’s era etc prior to last year.
http://www.baseball-reference......cl02.shtml
Why do people on here get so upset when everyone discusses Hughes in the rotation, or Joba in the bullpen, or Cervelli over Posada?
People. This is SPORTS. These are things people talk about. We all want to be the GM. We all think we make the best decisions. Stop acting like we should all be harmoniously agreeing that Cashman is infallible, or that any discussion is unwarranted. It’s SILLY. Most of the fun of sports comes from arguing stupid, inane points, and beating them to death. Christ.
Cliff Lee for Joba or Hughes plus others? Would you do it?
I know I would. An experienced, great player, and only 30? Toss is A-Jax and one other and that’s steal.
http://twitter.com/SI_JonHeyman/status/2819065150 cited by mlbtraderumors.com
@ Jennifer
Yeah but look at his ERA last year and this year. Career renaissance.
We cannot trade away any pitching right now. Joba + Hughes are off limits. If we want a top shelf starter to help anchor the rotation long term with CC and AJ, Cashman will have to make Montero available. He’s a top 3 prospect in baseball and easily a centerpiece to a blockbuster. I’m fine with Romine + Cervelli.
Jimmy July 24th, 2009 at 10:13 am
Here’s the thing about Hughes. He’s finally consistently getting major league hitters out. I think a season in the pen is going to do wonders for him when he gets stretched out for the rotation next year.
******
Its really good to see Hughes get his mojo back in this role. Hopefully more young starters are brought up this way in our organization : get your feet wet in the BP, gian confidence that you can get people out, then move up to the rotation.
Ramey – Traded his Girlfriend to the Pirates for a PTBNL
July 24th, 2009 at 10:51 am
“Out of all second basemen, the only player I would want out there instead of Cano might be Chase Utley”
Just out of curiosity, but why do you say ‘might’ be Chase Utley? Is it the age factor, since Cano is 4 years younger?
****
Chase Utley is actually really hot. I wouldn’t mind him in Pinstripes. And he curses like a truck driver and it makes me laugh
had a chance to trade cano for matt kemp in da off season .. dat wudda been great ….. and we wudda signed da O dog fo 2nd
People want to see Cano get his uni dirty and suddenly he won’t be lazy anymore like the mighty little dwarf.
Whatever.
Cano needs to bat after Molina in the lineup when he plays. This way you can guarantee he gets a couple of at bats with no one on base per game.
“People want to see Cano get his uni dirty and suddenly he won’t be lazy anymore like the mighty little dwarf.”
Be nice. He likes to be called the little elf.
They are not going to trade Hughes or Joba for Cliff Lee…..Cliff Lee had one good year….
Cano is a great player. I never got the knock on him. They need to teach the guy how to bunt though and stick him as a #2 or #3.
G
I WAS THINKING THE SAME THING LAST NIGHT!
“They are not going to trade Hughes or Joba for Cliff Lee…..Cliff Lee had one good year….”
Exactly – they would be crazy to do that.
Cano’s problems are all mental. I miss having Larry Bowa around to kick his butt.
He’s a monster natural talent, and I know that he has a great percentage on first-swing stats, but he needs to start taking more first pitches with RISP, just as an exercise.
He also needs someone to stay on him a bit more, the way Bowa did.
“Cano is a great player. I never got the knock on him. They need to teach the guy how to bunt though and stick him as a #2 or #3.”
I know you guys want every player to be productive all at once, all the time. But that’s not how baseball works. So long as the Yankees keep winning they aren’t touching Cano.
NO, NO, NO. Let me repeat myself, in case you didn’t read it. NO TO TRADING MONTERO.
is montero good?
Who is Montero?
“They are not going to trade Hughes or Joba for Cliff Lee…..Cliff Lee had one good year….”
And he would be having another good year if he was on a better team.. The guy just pitched back to back complete games and gave up only 1 run in each. He’s pitched well enough this year to win most of his decisions.
Cano sometimes plays like a Met in pinstripes…
He doesn’t seem to get the idea of running out of the batter’s box…He posed on the hit that he got gunned out a 2nd..should have been in for a double.
Compare that to Tex’s rocket off the right field wall, he was busting it from the first step and made 2nd with no problem.
Cano has to learn to take pitches…Not only is his hitting with RISP awful but his OBP is only 20 points higher than his batting average…that is inexcusable.
Here is one potential solution:
The Yankees need to have a sign for “take pitches until there are two strikes (faking interest in swinging or bunting, as opposed to just standing there)” and they need to make sure Cano, Swisher and Melky know what this sign is.
This sign should be used especially when a pitcher is going through a spell of bad control or when the bases are loaded. All three of these guys are comfortable hitting with two strikes, so it shouldn’t be a problem if the pitcher happens to throw two strikes in the first two to four pitches.
This would protect these three from being over aggressive with multiple runners on and swinging at the first pitch. They would be switched to protect mode if two strikes were thrown, possibly cutting down on their swings a little. If desired, it could be taken off with a 3-0 or 3-1 count to mix things up, depending on the game situation.
Getting these three more used to taking pitches with the bases loaded might help them see that the pitcher is the one who is in trouble and they don’t have to help him out by swinging at the first pitch – one that is more likely to be a pitcher’s pitch instead of a drive-able pitch.
If a take-to-two-strikes sign exists, then it is Girardi’s fault for not using it more often for these three, especially with the bases loaded.
This could be just what Cano needs to help him perform better this year with RISP. I really like Cano. How many more runs would the Yankees score if he could hit .300 with RISP instead of .205? My quick math indicates that Cano himself would have 30 – 40 more RBI over the course of a full season, plus it would keep the innings going and keep the pressure on the pitcher.
Mark Teixeira- “We expect to win every night”
This guy is a natural Yankee!!!!
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/re.....mp;prov=ap
“Cano is a great player. I never got the knock on him. They need to teach the guy how to bunt though and stick him as a #2 or #3.”
I think the smooth style of play gives people some illusion that there is a lack of effort…which is silly IMHO
“Mark Teixeira- “We expect to win every night”
This guy is a natural Yankee!!!!”
He’s also a Captain in the making.
Yep, he’s “inexcusably” one of the best second basemen in the major leagues. He “inexcusably” ranges farther to his right than most middle infielders I’ve seen in a long time. He has “inexcusable” power to the alleys.
Someone call up Pat Kelly. We need him back. He won’t walk or hit, either. But because no one thinks he could hit .380 with 40 HR power if he “tried,” it won’t be a problem.
More runs per game doesn’t necessarily equate to more wins.
Cano will do better than he has at some point.
on the FAN the guy from the Boston Globe says he doesn’t think Manny did PEDs for his 1st 480+ home runs… pathetic…
At least the Yankees won’t have to worry about facing Matt Holliday tonight. Tim Kurkijan just said on sportscenter the deal is almost complete and it won’t be long till he’s a Cardinal
Youuse is the new Jobber
“Mark Teixeira- “We expect to win every night”
This guy is a natural Yankee!!!!”
Remember a few games into the season when he said “we” some people on here jumped down his throat about “how can he say “we” when he’s only been on the team a couple months?! blah blah blah!”
I think back on that and laugh, laugh, laugh
He has an “inexcusably” quick pivot on the slow-developing DP. He has “inexcusable” range on shallow outfield pop-ups. He has “inexcusably” quick wrists. It’s truly “inexcusable” that this man is allowed anywhere near a team that’s won 67% of its last 66 games.
Mike Francesa July 24th, 2009 at 11:11 am
Who is Montero?
====================
You know, da kid
Mark Teixeira- “We expect to win every night”
=====================
Thumbs up from me
What about
Gardner, Kennedy + Alan Horne for Lee?
You give them two young arms, Horne with a short window at 26 already, and an outfielder who could turn into a poorman’s Grady Sizemore. Then..we get Cliff Lee.
Well then the yanks are in trouble, they can’t beat Boston or the Rays, they should go for 5th starter- someone like Arroyo who can give you innings and is not afraid to pitch in the AL east. Maybe deal the kid w/ Hughes and Joba?
Holliday traded to St. Louis for Brett Wallace + Other Prospects
By my quick calculations, Robinson Cano could bat .415 with 43 HR and 177 RBI if he only tried a bit harder. He should be stealing at least 25 bases every few weeks. And it’s his lazy, nonchalant, hey-look-at-me attitude on routine grounders that infuriate me…and I can’t stand that little sidearm flip to first after he’s ranged in the hole to get a ground ball. Hey, Robi…you got to the ball, great! Now square up like a man, and burn a fastball through Tex’s glove.
I mean, you field four or five chances a night and you can barely be bothered to train your eyes on Tex. Whatsa matter, scared to look at a hard working true Yankee grit machine?
Laura
July 24th, 2009 at 11:15 am
“Mark Teixeira- “We expect to win every night”
This guy is a natural Yankee!!!!”
He’s also a Captain in the making.
****
Laura- I think you just may be right on that. However, that requires imagining a Yankee world without Derek Jeter which I am unable to comprehend at this current time
Can you imagine how filthy hughes will be once he starts commanding his curve (at will) in the 8th???
“Joe B. on WFAN said Cashman called the Indians about Cliff Lee. Of course Shaprio asked for Hughes or Joba . UGHHHHH ..”
Didn’t I tell you guys Shapiro isn’t an idiot. What did you expect?
Matt Holliday is soon going to STL (Thank god I was getting tired of hearing the we should trade for MH fans, he clearly is not the same hitter he was in Denver)
Which hallady???
Matt K
July 24th, 2009 at 11:22 am
Holliday traded to St. Louis for Brett Wallace + Other Prospects
****
Well, that would certainly remove him from tonight’s lineup
Can we give out letter like hockey?
C – Jeter
A – Tex
A – Posada
Runner’s up
A-Rod
Damon
Cano deserves praise for the job he does. He’s a great batter, horrible at getting walks, doesn’t know how to steal or doesn’t have the speed for it, better than average defense etc. He shouldn’t be taught to be more patient, it’ll just backfire and make him a worse hitter with more walks. He needs to work with Long about hitting the balls for more power, and staying calm in tough situations. If those two things are fixed (not that he’s totally off these days), Cano will be an elite player, an all-star, and possibly a HOF one day. I expect atleast one of the two to be fixed (perfected) within the next two years. At that point Cano probably will be hitting 2nd, or 3rd (followed by Teixeira and Rodriguez in some order) in the lineup. The way he’s progressing it might happen sooner. But for all this to happen, Long must work hard with him. Hopefully that will happen soon. Until then I’m still glad we have Robinson J. Cano on our team. Hopefully a lifetime Yankee. (added by Mobile using Mippin)
“Holliday traded to St. Louis for Brett Wallace + Other Prospects”
Yep. Sure makes that Oakland lineup look even less impressive. Couldn’t have happened at a better time with our series having 3 games left!
Benny Blanco July 24th, 2009 at 11:23 am
Which hallady???
Matt Holliday the outfielder, not Roy Halladay the pitcher.
It’s not finalized yet..but both Gammons and Kurkjian said it was as good as done.
The Athletics and Cardinals are close to completing a trade that would send outfielder Matt Holliday to St. Louis in exchange for third baseman Brett Wallace, outfielder Shane Peterson and right-handed pitcher Clayton Mortensen, league sources told ESPN The Magazine’s Tim Kurkjian.
FROM ESPN
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/.....id=4353256
Leave it to Bodi to subtly make it racial again. You’re a broken record dude.
I did not like Cano last season because he did not play hard or even remotely play consistent defense like this and required the manager to bench him to set his head straight. The first young Yankee that needed a disciplinary benching to set his head straight in a very long time.
This season he’s a different player. He is incredible in the field and if he doesn’t earn a gold glove for defense this season it’s a joke.
As for the hitting issues I think he has trouble with pressure and he needs to work on that. That’s it though.
He’s shown he has issues when he’s moved up in the lineup and he has issues with guys on base this season. Even he admits it. When he got that RBI in Minnesota I didn’t know if was going to laugh or cry that it took so long to knock someone in for him.
I don’t think it’s from a lack of trying though.
He’s a big part of why this team is doing well. What he and Tex have done to their side of the infield is incredible to watch.
What impressed me about last night was he is not taking his hitting woes into the field.
I don’t know who gets through to him about pitch selection in pressure situations. Hopefully, it’s something he develops.
Matt K July 24th, 2009 at 11:21 am
What about
Gardner, Kennedy + Alan Horne for Lee?
You give them two young arms, Horne with a short window at 26 already, and an outfielder who could turn into a poorman’s Grady Sizemore. Then..we get Cliff Lee.
———————————————–
Is this a joke? Would you trade your Cy Young winner for that? Can’t tell if this is sarcasm..
Meanwhile Joba and Hughes are not close to being finished products. Cliff Lee is, and he’s a very good one at that. He would give our rotation a consistent #2, and pack up a lot of the slack left by Wang’s injury and Joba’s eventual innings cap. If the Yankees can make this happen without selling the farm (ie. only giving up Hughes or Joba plus maybe A-Jax and a lesser prospect) it’s a steal. His value is far greater than Halladay’s in my opinion, cheaper and younger.
I think Lee would be an awesome fit for us but we definetly should not trade Hughes Joba, or Jesues.
Seems like the Cards gave up an awful lot of talent for a 2-month rental. I guess they are finally listening to LaRussa’s constant clamoring for another bat to hit behind Albert.
Benny Blanco July 24th, 2009 at 11:22 am
Can you imagine how filthy hughes will be once he starts commanding his curve (at will) in the 8th???
*****
I’d love to see him command it at will THROUGH the 8th.
Just saw the last play of the Yankees game yesterday.
The play that Robinson Cano made – well that was beautiful.
“Seems like the Cards gave up an awful lot of talent for a 2-month rental. I guess they are finally listening to LaRussa’s constant clamoring for another bat to hit behind Albert”
Brett Wallace is one of their best prospects, but he didn’t really have a place on the team. They said his range was terrible and he was a first baseman, trapped at third. Because of that, he was expendable in the end
WooHoo! A sweep. Well we swept the April series with Oakland.
G. Love, agreed on some of your points. Cano is night and day in terms of his focus from last season. Hitting with RISP is the last part of his game to develop. He also could work on his basepath skills. They can’t make him faster, but perhaps they could work on other things. (btw heads up play by Hinske, if that was Swish he’s thinking 2 all the way and gets thrown out).
Good to see Cano acknowledge a weakness in his game.
Another one who admitted something? C.C. He was glad he only gave up 3 runs. Said that there were 8 hits off of him, so there may be something there (about playing Oakland). I do think though, that the win goes a long way battling whatever buggaboo he has about facing Oakland.
Cliff Lee? Um, no thanks.
Halladay or Aceves.
I ranted last night that Girardi says something last night about being worried about the depth because of Joba’s innings. Yet they also expect him to make all his starts. Yet, it’s the big story of the day. The fact that we need a legit starter is not news.
We needed one when Wang went down. Well, what if Wang came back you asked? Well, wouldn’t you need one if Joba could potentially have IP issues?
Prediction for Joba tonight:
7 innning, 5hits, 2runs, 2 walks 8 SO.
Okay, I know I’m reaching but I have a good feeling about Joba’s psyche right now.
Cano is a weapon at second base- he’s played like a gold glover for sure this year- he hits over 300 routinely with decent power numbers.
People complain about RISP (I think it’s an aberation that has snowballed a bit) and that is fine. But not every hitter is going to take pitches like Nick Swisher- people can’t mold everyone into what they think is right- he’s a dam fine player who I’m excited about having at second base for the forseeable future-
Erica – always OPPC and Laura…as I said the other night, I think he will be too.
Vader
July 20th, 2009 at 10:05 pm
I am going to go far out on a limb and say that before the end of Texs’ time in New York…Captian will be next to it.
new thread up
Obviously GM’s will want to start with Joba or Phil in trade talks and depend on the Jon Heyman’s of the world to be the town criers.
Cashman is well aware of this and it has no bearing on what his thoughts are. Heyman doesn’t sit in or have a 3-way discussion in any teams talks. No now – not ever.
Oakland made out pretty well w/this trade. Brett Wallace is a legit power-hitting 1B, and Holliday is a rental.
Basbeballcube rates Wallace’s power @95 (he’s the #2 ranked St. Louis prospect according to BaseballAmerica). St. Louis overpaid on this one, imho.
TommyH,
I don’t think we want Cano to take pitches and try to work out a walk.
That’s not his game.
What he needs to do is relax and wait for his pitch. Tex is actually very good at this. He hits for a lower avg. than Cano but I consistently see Tex get himself into 3-0, 3-1 counts and then deliver.
When Cano gets himself into those kind of counts and the opposing pitcher is forced to throw a cookie to him, he will most likely be the best 2b in baseball with the kind of defense he is playing right now.
He’s shown a lot this season that he cares more and is more dedicated to his defense than he was last season. I think the RISP will take care of itself in time. At least I hope it does.
Defense >>>> offense
Cano is playing great D and can bat 9th for all we care.
What is the problem?
Like when Pete blathers on about Posada. He’s a great hitter & is a perfect DH next year and occasional catcher. We have enough bats and don’t need defensive liabilities behind the plate or at 2nd.
Defense & consistent pitching is what the yankees have lacked fundamentally during their recent years.
“Matt Holliday is soon going to STL (Thank god I was getting tired of hearing the we should trade for MH fans, he clearly is not the same hitter he was in Denver)”
This coming from a guy who wants Cashman to ’steal’ Jonathan Sanchez. Isn’t life ironic
I love Robbie for his defense but at times, his approach at the plate infuriates me. He bats with no brain whenever we have RISP. At a time when the pitcher is under pressure, he gives him a free out by popping up the first pitch. Last night was a prime example, when he failed to build on our 6-3 lead with the bases loaded and only one out. This is my concern: When you fail to tack on against the lesser lights, more often that not you get away with it. Against teams like the Sox and Angels, you don’t. I don’t want to be critical with the Yanks going so well but there should have been no need to use Hughes last night. We should have been out of sight by the 8th inning.
I’ve thought this for a while. Why not switch Cano and Damon in the lineup?
There is less a chance of hitting w/ RISP in the 2 spot. That and his hitting ability may put him on before Tex and Arod.
Or, you know, do nothing. After all, this team is playing at a .600 plus winning
G. Love
July 24th, 2009 at 11:27 am
Leave it to Bodi to subtly make it racial again. You’re a broken record dude.
===
I don’t have to “make it” anything.
Read the constant “lazy” “slob” “no BB IQ” comments for yourself.
THEY are the broken record.
Sorry – I’m not gonna let people use baseball to get their bigoted jollies off, or be scared off by apologists like you. If you have some guilty conscience, see a priest or something.
They say it – I’m gonna cal them on it.
I’m the broken record?
What do YOU make of post after post
If the other 4 pitchers stay on regular rest, Joba could finish the season with just 11 more starts. If they limit him to 5 innings/start that would put him at just about 150 IP for the season.
I could see them doing something where as he gets closer to his innings limits he still makes starts, but maybe only goes 3 innings with someone ready to come out of the bullpen to piggyback his starts. I’m not sure where that would leave him for the playoffs though.
It makes sense that the Yankees don’t want to put Joba in the bullpen as he gets closer to his innings limits because bullpen innings are harder on an arm than innings as a starter.
Ideally, the Yankees will build a big lead in the division so that they can get Joba extra games off when the roster expands.
Maybe for the playoffs they end up using Aceves and Joba as 1 starter with Hughes and Mo in the pen?
When Robbie finally gets it through his head, asuming he does of course. That there is no more pressure on him to hit with risp than there is with the bases empty, his risp numbers will begin to show it. Those hitters who believe the pressure is all on the pitcher in risp situations seem to fare much better over time.
I don’t hate Robbie, root for him like crazy. He’s just got to break this RISP cloud hovering over him.
love ‘em. i fully support any successful homegrown player.
the RISP thing will not be longterm.
He’s always hacking on the first pitch with RISP. He always gets behind 0-1, 0-2. No wonder he doesn’t drive anyone in.
with respect to innings limits, the ideal would be: at the correct moment switch Joba and Phil around. Phil starts and Joba relieves. I know it takes stretching out…
this would occur in an ideal universe.
A 1.7 UZR/150 now qualifies as elite defense?
There’s nothing to do with Cano’s RISP. He’ll just have to figure it out and learn how to relax and be patient in those spots, if he ever does again. Meanwhile, he’ll help the Yanks with his hitting with no RISP, like his HR against the O’s on Tues. night, or the single in the 7th of Verlander on Saturday, with 2 outs and no one on, that becames the winning run 2 batters later.
Of more concern to me is his propensity to make that throw on the run play when it’s not necessary, when he has enough time to plant and throw. It almost cost them a big runner last night in the 8th (especially no Mo available), but Tex bailed him out with a good scoop. He makes that play routinely, and I wish he’d save it for plays when there’s no time to plant and throw.
Heck, even Jeter has learned to save his famous jumpthrow play for when there’s no alternative; he’s taking the extra step and planting and throwing when he has the time now, like all the great shortstops do, on the play in the hole. I wish Robbie would do the same.
============================================
I might not want Kinsler ahead of Cano. That one’s close. But I sure would like to have Pedroia ahead of him. Don’t even bother.
My guess is this has something to do with his lack of patience at the plate. After all, if you know he’s going to swing, why throw a strike? It would be interesting to see if there is a correlation between low difference between batting average and OBP (signifying lack of patience regardless of BA) and large difference between BA with RISP and without RISP. Anyone have any numbers on that?
Pete, a normal person CAN’T make a good case for hating him. Compare him to every other starting 2B and tell me you hate him. He can be frustrating, but it could be waaaay worse.
Why not try having Cano take BP with men on base? Let him get used to it…
Bobby Abreu clone, great player physically, don’t ask me where his mind often is. When Broadway re-casts the Wizard of Oz, they’ve found Bobby’s replacement as the Tin Man.