“Unsportsmanlike” Posada could be suspended by MLB for role in brawl
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Sep 16, 2009 
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Joe Girardi was not real thrilled with his team and held a meeting after the game to tell them that.
“We’ve already had a discussion,” he said. “I told them there is a lot at stake here and we can’t afford to get anyone hurt or lose anyone or get people suspended. We can’t do that.”
This is a team with a chance to win the World Series and you have a bunch of key players in a melee on the field. With the expanded rosters, you had 67 players out there. It doesn’t take much for somebody to wrench their shoulder or break their hand throwing a punch.
Jorge Posada figures to be suspended and don’t be surprised if it’s five games. MLB will not take kindly to him throwing a forearm at Jesse Carlson.
“As he ran past Carlson, he gave him a little shove with his elbow. It was very unsportsmanlike. The pitcher wasn’t looking for anything like that and he ran past him, didn’t say anything and just gave him a shove with his elbow. It was very unsportsmanlike. It was cheap shot,” umpire Jim Joyce said.
Posada seemed to know he made a mistake, too, based on his tone after the game. He seemed embarrassed, saying he had not set a good example for his children.
“It’s something that shouldn’t happen, you know? You’ve got to carry the weight and hopefully we can end it tonight. … It’s hard to compose yourself,” he said. “I don’t want my kids to see that. Hopefully they won’t.”
Meanwhile, umpire Derryl Cousins had to leave the game because some idiot fan threw a full bottle of soda at him and hit him in the knee.
This is not going to go down as a real proud night for the Yankees. After Mark Melancon drilled Aaron Hill, it’s customary to expect retaliation. Every team does it, including the Yankees. Toronto did it the right way, throwing behind Posada instead of at him.
“I had hoped it ended there,” Girardi said.
But it did not. Posada’s emotion and fire has helped make him a great player. But that got the better of him this time.
“The pitcher wasn’t looking for anything like that …”
Right. Carlson was just innocently backing up any potential throws coming from the Jays dugout to home when Posada sought him out.
Excellent post Pete. I’m glad to hear Girardi addressed this issue. Posada is definitely looking at 5 games. I think Edwar is going to get at least fined for holding onto Barajas’ chest strap. Maybe Shelley Duncan will get something as well for getting into it with Barajas. I didn’t see any other specific Yankees do anything, but I’m sure I’m missing something.
Little ump bump by Jorge won’t help much in the appeal process…but I kind of doubt there will be an appeal.
Good for Girardi… nothing good came out of this. The team needs to refocus now and get back on the winning track.
Guys:
Just because there was a brawl does not allow you to use vulgar words or personally attack somebody via the comments section.
If you have some issue with me or what I wrote, e-mail me. There will be zero tolerance for idiocy tonight, Zero.
Jorge gets at least 5 games and a sizable amount of dough…..Lucky nobody was hurt……I always think back to the Yanks & Red Sox fiasco when Bill Lee had his shoulder destroyed……
Roid rage by Jorge.
Wait until the Kansas City series to serve it.
Posada deserves a suspension but will anything happen to Carlson since he did not leave the dug out until the inning was over. He was purposely being blocked by the players at the top of the dugout. You saw him slumping down a couple of times. The rules say you have to leave the field (including the dugout) after an ejection.
Not to be a typical “media-is-out-to-get-the-yankees” guy, but i doubt carlson gets a significant (more than 2 games) suspension or fine…
I am not concerned about Jorge being out for a few games, we can hit without him. the only time that I am concerned about him missing is the Angels series. Molina would definitely seen time there anyway because of his arm, but for pinch-hitting purposes, it is definitely better to have Jorge available
Hopefully he won’t appeal (even though the appeals system is a joke). if he lays back and takes 5 games now, he will be back by the last of the Angels series. They play the Angels and Red Sox back to back, possibly the most crucial 6-game stretch of the season. I would rather see him miss the Seattle series then have the suspension simply delayed because of an appeal. We need him against Boston and Anaheim
In the 8th inning of a blowout game – what is Posada even doing in there?
Especially after he was irate and drew the walk. Put in a pinch runner and let him cool off.
No one got hurt. In the end, this is what matters. Posada will get his suspension and be back before Yom Kippur, in all likelihood (thinking Youkilis here).
The Yankees survived without Posada for nearly a month in May/June. They can manage a week.
What bothers me a lot more is fans throwing stuff at umpires–no matter how bad a job we might think the umpire is doing.
Posada will serve his suspension starting tomorrow as soon as Watson gives him his 5 games.
That will give him a week to rest up and another week to get his stroke back before October.
I’ve yet to hear a logical explanation of what Carlson was doing in the direct path between home plate and the Yankees dugout. Yeah, Posada could have easily avoided it, but don’t act like Carlson wasn’t itching for Posada to start something.
Why did the umpires allow Carlson to stay in the game for clearly throwing behind a runner?
This is on the umpires, not Posada. Sorry.
That is such bull. If Carlson “wasn’t looking for anything”, than he wouldn’t of been standing at home plate. Posada was wrong but fights happen in baseball. At least he actually threw the punch unlike Youk the punk who got owned.
People are acting like Posada threw a haymaker. What he did was wrong but under the circumstances 95% of the players would do the same thing. This is not that big a deal. It was interesting to see ARod dancing around the edge of the melee. Probably a smart move but it was funny.
Where is Lloyd when you need him?
i’m not going to sit here and lie….I LOVED IT!!! Showing some fire!! I want to go fight someone right now!!
Posada could use the rest anyway.
Why would they take him out of the game? The benches werent warned until after he threw behind Posada.
you mean he hit this guy???
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_C7v3.....niteez.jpg
They’ve thrown out pitchers for much less. Warnings do not have to be issued to throw out a pitcher.
Guys: I realize you are Yankees fans. But think a little. Carlson threw behind Jorge after Melancon hit Hill in the back with a fastball. That is how teams retaliate every day. Pitchers don’t get ejected for that, they get warned which is exactly what happened. Carlson then backed up the play and when he saw there was no throw, he was walking back to the mound. You’re inventing things.
Jim Joyce is the same umpire who defended A-Rod for that slap play on Arroyo He’s not anti-Yankee. He’s a good umpire, one of the best. Posada screwed this up, plain and simple. Girardi was furious afterward.
You really have to wonder what, if anything, is going through Jorge’s head sometimes.
The fact that he put his own personal feelings above the good of the team at such a crucial time of the season is really inexcusable.
I know I’ll be bashed for saying this, but if you watch Jorge run the bases it’s obvious he’s not the brightest guy on the planet, but this takes it to a whole new level.
There was nothing the Jays did that was outside the bounds of baseball. Getting caught up in the heat of the moment and inciting a bench-clearing brawl doesn’t fly in late-September with the division on the line.
“Jim Joyce is the same umpire who defended A-Rod for that slap play on Arroyo”
Really? What was his defense? That it was worth a try because he may have gotten away with it?
Please, is this really that big of a deal? Posada brushed “Dracula by the bald man” as he scored. And he was straying from his position anyway.
Instead of Girardi backing up his guys, we have quotes about the precious children.
Plus, MLB didn’t give a crap about Youk throwing a helmet at somebody.
What’s the big deal here?
The only newsworthy item was that Cousins left because a soda bottle hit him. Give me a break. There’s an idiot fan and apparently an ump who should have played Samuel Jackson’s role in “Unbreakable”
AJ got suspended 5 games for throwing behind somebody.
Remember? And Padilla got nothing. They should try and lay out some standard penalties. It’s tough because every situation is different but I think they can do better than what’s current.
Personally? You could throw behind me all day long.
I’d probably send the pitcher a gift certificate or something. “Thanks for not drilling me”
Posada gets the instigator penalty here. It could have all been avoided. I bet you he gets 6 games with 1 knocked off on appeal.
“Had the umps thrown Carlson out for intentionaly throwing at Posada, none of this would have happened.”
Where were on Melancon intentionally throwing at Hill?
Lets calm the mood in here.
http://mlb.mlb.com/media/video.....id=6663629
lol
It’s really not that hard to comprehend Pete. I dont understand why people are trying to make excuses for Posada. It’s not as if the Yankees havent thrown back at someone this year. It happens everywhere, but I guess it’s like a parent who believes their child does no wrong. In this case its easy to blame the Jays rather than the instigator.
Regardless, they are lucky someone wasn’t seriously hurt.
Pete, you need to re-watch the play. Sorry, but you’re dead wrong. Carlson was looking to start something and the video shows that, it’s pathetically blatant.
Not only is Carson moving TOWARDS the back stop, he also lifts his arm to meet Posada’s.
Please, watch it again.
Carlson was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Jorge was pissed it happens bench clearing brawls are part of the game too.
Obvious Girardi wont be too thrilled because he doesn’t want to lose Jorge for 5 to 6 games.
Sorry but pitchers do not throw behind or at batters every day because one of their guys gets hit. This stuff happens once in a while.
I feel bad for Melancon. He missed in that exact same place to a left-handed batter earlier – he threw one to the backstop wide right and then came back to strike out the hitter (I forget who). Leiter was talking about it – getting on top of the ball or something.
But clearly, it’s a specific, recurrent, mechanical mistake. For a guy with good control in the minors, it’s probably a nerves or mental issue – which might get worse given the results of his errant throw tonight.
Also, was Carlson the one who threw behind ARod after the HA game (before Towers got him) or do I have him mixed up with someone else?
yeah…Youk throwing his helmet at a teenager didn’t seem to bother MLB…they didn’t call that unsportmanlike! Give me a break…this was just an old fashion “we don’t like you…you don’t like us…so lets FIGHT!” brawl
Posada really should have turned the other cheek with this one … Melancon absolutely drilled Aaron Hill and Carlsson retaliated by throwing the ball behind Jorge … it didnt come close to hitting him.
It should have ended right then and there and it escalated into something this team does not need.
It’s not as if they needed to bench clearing brawl to galvinize each other … the team chemistry is very good.
I think Posada let his emotions get the best of him and it will end costing him some games.
Let’s hope while he is out it wont cost the Yankees too much either … in case anyone hasnt noticed, Boston is playing great right now and shows no signs of conceding the division just yet.
While the Yankees are out on the west coast starting this weekend, Boston is playing Baltimore and Toronto. Lead was at 9 on Friday, no down to 6 1/2 … a couple more games shaved off the lead and that 3 game series against Boston next weekend may still mean something.
The Jays had every right to retaliate and did it without head hunting. Jorge was wrong for getting so angry and should have let it go. Making it worse is the fact it’s a blow out game against a nonfactor team. Certainly not worth getting someone injured over.
I agree with you Pete, however, the journalist in you does get a little overly dramatic. After watching the replays over several times, I still can’t seem to find where Posada “threw a forearm” at Carlson. All I can see is Jorge brushing by him. Although, I suppose you and I may just have different definitions of “throwing a forearm”. IMO if Posada threw a forearm while running by a skinny pitcher, it should have levelled him. Not that it matters, I’m just sayin.
DT is absolutely correct: Posada should have been lifted for a pinch-runner. I noted that he wasn’t at the time (to myself).
Posada shouldn’t have bumped Carlson, however minor it was. He should have reminded Carlson that he’s ugly and not bright and Carlson would have barked back and we could have gotten the same brawl with a shorter suspension for our star catcher.
Anyone have audio of Posada?
Also, just to make clear, I’m not saying it isn’t Posada’s fault.
But anyone here who thinks Carlson wasn’t hoping Posada would do something has to be kidding.
He didn’t even hit Posada!! Goodness gracious people, as Suzyn would say! Melancon hit their top offensive guy right in the back.
And who cares where Carlson was standing. Hes not a big guy taking up the whole field. Could have easily just walked around him.
Wish yoy cared that much before the game Joe,when you put that lemon on the mound,and LEFT HIM OUT THERE,so long that your players didn’t have a chance to win.
Clare
September 16th, 2009 at 12:29 am
I feel bad for Melancon. He missed in that exact same place to a left-handed batter earlier – he threw one to the backstop wide right and then came back to strike out the hitter (I forget who). Leiter was talking about it – getting on top of the ball or something.
But clearly, it’s a specific, recurrent, mechanical mistake. For a guy with good control in the minors, it’s probably a nerves or mental issue – which might get worse given the results of his errant throw tonight.
Also, was Carlson the one who threw behind ARod after the HA game (before Towers got him) or do I have him mixed up with someone else?
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I agree it is more neves with Melancon. He looks like at times he is trying to overthrow. His walks are up too he didn’t walk many hitters in the minors.
Dunn though looked a lot better today he was throwing strikes.
Who’s Chris Singleton on BBTN? He countered Krukie’s Krusty Krumbs of Dumbness with this was already a tight knit group and can only help them out because they got each other’s back.
Who knew the team’s new edge was on the brink of a slippery slope?
Yeah…if you don’t think Carlson wasn’t looking for an excuse you are kidding no one.
Carlson could have just let it go after posada gave him a little tap…BUT NO…Carlson starting cursing at posada, from there…FIGHT!!!
Carlson threw a punchless punch right? He should get suspended for swinging not for throwing.
meant to say “was looking”
“He didn’t even hit Posada!! Goodness gracious people, as Suzyn would say! Melancon hit their top offensive guy right in the back.
And who cares where Carlson was standing. Hes not a big guy taking up the whole field. Could have easily just walked around him.”
Someone else brought it up.. Against the Rangers this year, Padilla hit’s Teixeira TWICE!! AJ Burnett Throws behinds someone. Guess who got ejected AND suspended.
NOT PADILLA!
Posada was in the wrong here with his forearm, but Carlson wasn’t some innocent bystander either. However with that being said, Posada didn’t do his ballclub any favors here tonight. The Yankees have unfinish business before the playoffs begin by winning this division and finishing with the best record in the AL. Losing one of your best hitters for five games isn’t going to help in that regard.
Posada will appeal any suspension. It will take almost a week for it to be actioned, anyway. He leves him available for the Angels Series and get it bargained down to 4 games.
Oddly, after years of being dart boards for other teams’ pitchers, NYY gets suspension whether they hit batters or not. Without looking, I’m betting this is the first year that not only are the Yankees pitchers leading the league in hitting batters, but, finally, they are hitting them more than Yankee hitters are getting tagged. Nobody’s doing much whining (except for Boston batters) that Boston pitchers are a close second.
DFox is exactly right. Carlson was NOT walking back to the mound, he had his back to the mound, directly in Posada’s path back to the dugout. I, too, am not condoning Posada’s reaction, but Carlson was also exhibiting some acute testosterone poisoning symptoms.
Players don’t like to have pitches thrown behind them. I think Posada would have taken it better if Carlson had just hit him in the butt.
quick numbers re: clinching the division
the Yanks’ magic number for the division stands at 12
they have 16 games left to play
the Red Sox have 19 games left
if the Yanks go 8-8, the Red Sox would need to go 16-3 to win the division.
as hot as the Red Sox are right now, they aren’t going 16-3 for the rest of the season (and in all likelihood the Yanks aren’t going to suddenly morph into a .500 team).
The sad part was they hit Halladay pretty good and got him out of the game in the 6th. They would of destroyed toronto bullpen. But the game was already out of reach because Mitre was brutal. If Gaudin has another nice outing Mitre should be used in the bullpen as a long man and not make another start.
There is no defense for Jorge on this…..There will be several guys from both clubs whose checks will be levied and getting hit with a few games off, however Jorge will be slapped the heaviest…..Be thankful no one was hurt…..
Man, it’s unbelievable to read some of these comments.
Sure, Carlson was just walking back to the mound, an innocent baby child.
Nobody got hurt, Posada let his emotions get the best of him. End of story.
Carlson instigated too. He wasn’t walking back to the mound he was standing next to the plate. And Posada just grazed him and he turned around and started yelling at Posada. You just tried to drill him he sould of known Posada would be angry. He was not an innocent bystander.
Jim Joyce’s reaction is bizarre. Carlson could have stayed far away from Posada as he crossed the plate. Yet somehow Joyce wants to blame the victim.
Pat M.
You do realize that any fines assessed are chump change to these guys, right?
Saying he “threw a forearm” is a little bit over dramatic. He bumped into the guy as he walked by. I’ve accidentally bumped into people at the mall harder than that.
It wasn’t surprising that CC got Jorge out of the pile … he’s the only one big enough!
Girardi seems to have gotten the worst of it …. MacDonald got him right in the face (not intentionally)
As one of the team leaders, it certainly is disappointing to see this happen. I’m glad Jorge sounded contrite.
This was just wacko week starting with MJ, Serena, Federer, and now Jorge.
It’s all Gardner’s fault. He was supposed to lie down and not keep the rally going.
not defending posada but it seemed like carlson seemed to be really enjoying himself in the dugout(where he didn’t belong) afterwards explaining what happened to everyone like he was some sort of hero
Carlson is one of the few people that can have a large bruise on their face and actually have his looks improved.
Posada screwed up. It doesn’t matter if Carlson was at fault or not. The Yankees have everything to lose and nothing to gain in a brawl.
Posada should have followed the WWJD rule! (what would Jeter Do)
I’d like to know what Carlson said to Jorge. I could make out the first two words but after that it gets complicated.
I bet you Shelley gets suspended as well. You can clearly see him trying to land some punches. Plus he’s all tangled up with Barajas near the end.
Maybe McDonald as well. He may be the one who gave Girardi the little knot near his eye. It’s not too clear but he definitely entered the scrum with his left arm flailing.
I think all hit-by-pitches should get reviewed for possible suspensions.
And all head shots should get mandatory suspensions except in the case where the batter actually moves into the pitch.
Accident or not, you should be responsible for your pitches.
This works in hockey. Your stick hits somebody above the shoulder, penalty. Doesn’t matter if you meant it or not. You’re responsible for your stick. And these infractions have dropped dramatically since the rule was changed.
Who is rushing to clinch the division,to be booted out in
the 1st round.The Yankees still,this late need pitching.
The 1 yr Cashman shows financial control,when he needs pitching.
xoxo
Cashman doesn’t set a budget, the owners do.
Posada was classless here. The Jays had every right to hit somebody, and he should have let it go once Carlson did it the right way. Now he gets suspended and makes the organization look poorly.
The Jays had every right to hit someone? That’s actually kind of funny.
Pete, the guys on ESPN (John Kruk) also pointed out that Carlson was out of position to back up a play at the plate and shouldn’t be blocking the route from the plate to the dugout. Kruk said it looked like Carlson was hoping Posada would do something and Posada didn’t disappoint.
Pat M, good call on the SF Giants. My timidity cost me a few extra sheckels.
“The 1 yr Cashman shows financial control,when he needs pitching.”
That might be the stupidest thing ever written on this site. Congrats.
Carlson was not walking back to the mound. He should have been walking back to the mound or behind home plate, he stood where he did for a reason, he knew what he was doing.
Mike R says:
September 16, 2009 at 12:43 am
Saying he “threw a forearm” is a little bit over dramatic. He bumped into the guy as he walked by. I’ve accidentally bumped into people at the mall harder than that.
==============
Exactly, don’t stand in my way during my rush hour subway ride.
Threw an elbow…sure.
Sounds like Carlson should have a broken rib or two.
Wait, did Posada’s “thrown elbow” give Carlson that red thing on his pasty white head??
The BBTN guys were actually pretty fair.
Carlson wasn’t backing up the throw. He was on the wrong side of the plate.
Is Chris Singleton related to Ken? There’s a close likeness.
“The Jays had every right to hit someone?”
Are you saying that if 2 Yankees were hit in the back in the same game, you wouldn’t think we’d have the right to hit them? Give me a break. This was basic, customary retaliation that Posada should have expected.
after much further review i give edwar ramirez the graeme lloyd award for the moment where hes dragging barajas by his chest protector strap and cito gaston put his hands on him from behind which prompted edwar to turn around and give him a look that seemed to terrify cito enough to surrender his hands in the air. who knew he’d have it in him.
I think it was the pitcher that should get the huge suspension. You can’t tell me that pitcher was there to back up the throw. He was so out of position that its not funny. Now Posada may have been steamed but he should show a little restraint. The Jays are not playing for anything and they can afford to lose a player for standing up for his teammates we can’t lose Jorge. As for why Carlson should get a big suspension 2 things one he initiated this fight and two he didn’t leave after he was ejected the league office with get a tape of him in the dugout so you can have a 100 players standing in front of him you can’t hide from the camara. Nice try
I just watched the replay. Carlson was not in the correct position backing up the play. He stood, unintentionally perhaps, between home plate and the path to the Yankee dugout. Maybe it was unintentional,but either he or Posada was going to have to move sideways to get past one another in order to avoid close contact. Carlson could have moved away from Posada but looked right at Posada and made no effort to move. Posada then stuck out his arm and intentionally struck Carlson. Posada was dead wrong but Carlson didnt have to be in Posada’s path either.
Posada should have followed the WWJD rule! (what would Jeter Do)
==========
He did, Jeter was in the middle of this one.
nature boy,
LOL. Cito must’ve seen the movie Alien, too.
Is Chris Singleton related to Ken? There’s a close likeness.
————
Nope. He said in an interview with Michael Kay several months back that he’s asked that question about 100 times a day.
The answer is always no.
“Carlson then backed up the play and when he saw there was no throw, he was walking back to the mound. You’re inventing things.”
If they’re inventing things, then you’re seeing things Pete. Carlson was “backing up” the throw directly in the path between home and the Yankees dugout. He was looking for a piece and he got one. No one got hurt, the Yanks move on with fire in their bellies.
Edwar is a stick. Even as a 70 year old man, Cito could still probably beat that reliever up.
m, Chris isnt related to Ken Singleton. Ken does have a son Justin who was part of the Jays affiliation back in the day. I think hes out of baseball now though.
I would think Barajas’ gear weighs more than Edwar. That was actually impressive in the middle of the stupidity.
Christina,
Thanks. I see a resemblance that’s not there.
Upon further review, a “What the bleep are you doing? Get outta my bleeping way!” would’ve been the correct course of action.
Richie, The fines are indeed chump change, but the suspensions aren’t as they’re salaries are docked for each game they’re not at the park…..In Posada’s case, that’s more than what most people earn annually……
UK says:
September 16, 2009 at 12:54 am
Peter:
1. Against the Rangers this year, Padilla hit’s Teixeira TWICE!! AJ Burnett Throws behinds someone. Guess who got ejected AND suspended.
===========
Pete????? Comments please.
Thank you.
I just saw the video of the fight. Posada was wrong to “elbow” Carlson, but trust me – Carlson was there waiting for it. He was supposed to be behind home plate, not off to the side close to the Yankee dugout. He was looking for a fight and unfortunately for us, Jorge gave him one.
“If they’re inventing things, then you’re seeing things Pete. Carlson was “backing up” the throw directly in the path between home and the Yankees dugout. He was looking for a piece and he got one.”
Agreed.
I’m in no way saying that Posada is in the right and doesn’t deserve to be suspended, but Carlson certainly isn’t a martyr in this. I’d put 55% on Posada and 45% on Carlson.
I’m glad everyone sees the stupidity of the “Carlson was innocent” crap.
Carlson wanted a throwdown, and so did Posada. They wanted it equally. They both got it. It’s that simple. They are both guilty.
Carlson put himself in the path of Posada, put his arm up, hoped Posada would take the bait and make contact, and sure enough he did. And if you watch the replay VERY closely, you can see Carlson take an adjustment step forward to make sure he was positioned right in Posada’s projected path.
Also, I’m glad Girardi aired the team out. Starting a brawl and risking injury this close to the playoffs isn’t the only careless play they have had recently. They played terrible, sloppy baseball in the Orioles series. They have lost track of outs twice in 3 games now. The Yankees haven’t won anything yet and I’m sure Girardi reminded them of that fact.
Edwar pulling Barajas by the elastic on the back of his chest protector.
nature boy September 16th, 2009 at 12:55 am
after much further review i give edwar ramirez the graeme lloyd award for the moment where hes dragging barajas by his chest protector strap and cito gaston put his hands on him from behind which prompted edwar to turn around and give him a look that seemed to terrify cito enough to surrender his hands in the air. who knew he’d have it in him.
—————————————————————
Like when Graeme Lloyd scared Armando Benitez enough to get him scurrying back to his dugout only to get TOTALLY JACKED IN THE NOGGIN by Darryl Strawberry.
I’m sorry but you could say that the brawl tonight was silly but that one was 100% mother approved.
Benitez was a punk. I’m still bothered that the Yanks gave him a shot. I guess it worked out as he was just basically booed into oblivion.
The calm, steady hand of Mr. Joe Torre was what was missing in this equation. Girardi’s a hothead! Hot tea would have broken up that brawl.
http://www.wfan.com/pages/223566.php
Posada Audio
I do agree that Jorge should be suspended big time for this, he should have taken the high road, he should not have let himself be provoked…but Pete painting him like a thug is completely ridiculous. Not even one mention of Carlson instigating, standing right at home plate, needlessly close to Posada who DID have to touch the plate to score. There’s no elbow bump or so-called “”"”throwing a forearm”"”" if Carlson didn’t purposely go where he did not belong.
Wrong is wrong – that means Jorge was wrong and so was Carlson. Pete, you’re missing the mark unless you call them both on it. Hopefully MLB will be a little less one-sided when they review the tape. You might benefit from doing the same.
On a side note, I shouldn’t promote violence, but I kinda liked that guys who usually aren’t so involved in fights like Jeter and Pettitte were in there backing Jorge, trying to pull people away. That said, it’s woah scary that all the Yankee starters were in the middle in that brawl – even if it was just to break it up. It’s a miracle none of them got hurt, let’s hope they don’t all get suspended.
I think Jorge was in the wrong in this thing – but a couple of things Carlson did jumped out at me. First, why was he backing up a ball hit to right on the first base side of home – that tells me he was looking for something. Then, why did he feel like he had to turn around and yell at Jorge. If he had just walked back to the mound, benches never clear. Jorge started it but Carlson could have ended it right there. If you watch Baseball Tonight, both players on it tonight (Kruk and Singleton) felt that Carlson was as much – if not more – to blame for what happened than Jorge.
“Hot tea would have broken up that brawl.”
Only if it was poured on them.
More wrestling match than brawl. As many elbows as punches were thrown.
Hot teabags applied to the eyes can reduce swelling!
Only if it’s Bigelow Green Tea ……..
Nick in SF….Zito has been much more than servicable as of late….I’ve been off the Yanks since Jeter broke Gerhig’s record……I see The SF Giants as my new horse for the stretch run….They come here to LA next, and I expect the Rockies to have a late season slide…..
How the hell did Joyce defend A-Rod after the slap play?
Wrong is wrong – that means Jorge was wrong and so was Carlson. Pete, you’re missing the mark unless you call them both on it. Hopefully MLB will be a little less one-sided when they review the tape. You might benefit from doing the same.
============
Agree there.
Carlson knew what he was doing.
We have a game against Texas and a game in Boston (Youk throwing a helmet at Porcello) to show us that this SHOULD be no big deal to MLB.
And yet it will be.
Calson is from New Britain, CT… I would imagine he was a Sox fan growing up.
Where is Jim PR when we need him?
Dodgers-Giants could be interesting. LA can’t even finish off the Pirates tonight.
Meanwhile, umpire Derryl Cousins had to leave the game because some idiot fan threw a full bottle of soda at him and hit him in the knee.
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Probably was a drunk. Some fans get too rowdy. Its great to defend your team, but why do you have to get violent?
Posada acted irrationally but lets be real. The dude wanted to keep on jawing and while staring at Posada standing on the Yankee dugout side of home plate.
Carlson was trying to disrespect Posada. I can’t blame him for throwing a forearm there, most guys would. Posada then proceeds to bruise him up a little bit. I have no problems with that.
What would you do if someone threw behind you then stared and stayed in your way while you scored? Posada does not need to apologize to anyone.
I love the “Blue Jays suck” chants lol
Carlson was looking for a fight and Posada gave it to him.
You expect this type of stuff from Shelly Duncan, not our team leader.
Posada has been around the game long enough… his pitcher hit their best player and Carlson threw behind him. Standard baseball play.
Posada wayyy overreacted
Posada picked up bad habits in Alabama.
Some of you guys including pete are taking this too seriously. Really who cares ! Posada will serve his suspension, and the Yankees will win the division while the Blue Jays as always sit at home during October.
Fights happen. You know how many times during the dynasty years they had fights ? A lot. So who cares at least the Yankees fight back, something they have lacked for some time.
“Pete, the guys on ESPN (John Kruk) also pointed out that Carlson was out of position to back up a play at the plate and shouldn’t be blocking the route from the plate to the dugout. Kruk said it looked like Carlson was hoping Posada would do something and Posada didn’t disappoint.”
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To me it doesn’t matter if Carlson instigated or was looking for it or not, Posada still shouldn’t have elbowed him. His emotions got the best of him. Posada is one of the best, but its hard to defend him here. His temper gets in the way sometimes.
What kind of message was Posada sending to young kids?
What am I going to tell my imaginary 1 yr old son?
Message: I care.
Bottom line it’s going to cost Hip Hip about 500 k if he’s bounced out for 5 games……I’m basing this on Jorge’s 16 million a year salary….
To me it doesn’t matter if Carlson instigated or was looking for it or not, Posada still shouldn’t have elbowed him.
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Srsly, if that’s considered elbowing somebody, you must not take the subway ever.
And how can it not matter? Nothing Carlson did makes Jorge less wrong, but you cannot completely absolve him for his own role in this incident.
Nick in SF
Yeah and where did Torre being calm lead the Yankees from 2002-2007 ? I like Torre but he never responded when Yankee batters got hit by Boston pitchers. Pedro taking out Jeter and Soriano was horrible. Torre was a good manager but he sucked in terms of stading up for his players.
sorry-standing
Where was Torre when Pedro threw Zimmer to the ground?
I’ve been looking at this all for a while, and I think before we get all caught up with the little bow that Jorge threw, let’s remember that Carlson put the “I’m right here” arms out after he threw behind Jorge. Then, he’s out of position, waiting for Jorge to do something and Jorge took the bait. Honestly, is there a guy in here that can honestly say that they wouldn’t have given Carlson a little shove going by there? The guy is waiting on you, and you can’t let him show you up like that. We all like to believe that these guys are emotionless and have the patience to just let things slide, but sometimes things like this happen.
Also, it’s remarkable how many people are putting the Yankees at fault in what’s supposed to be a Yankee fan blog. Come on, get behind your guys here. It’s not like Jorge ran into the stands and kicked a 4 year old, he went after a guy that was barking at him. You can’t promote this kind of behavior, but we should be able to understand it.
Pat M.
That’s true about Posada, but I was referring to the costs that other players might incur in fines as a result of Posada’s actions.
Mark
Where was Torre when Pedro threw Zimmer to the ground?
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Torre was actually a very aggressive manager prior to working out his anger issues that related to his father’s domestic abuse towards his mother. Since he has overcome that horror, he has been quite passive as a manager, probably as a result of overcompensation.
Richie, You’re right about the other guys and their pocket change fines……Unless they are suspended, it’s laughable what they’ll have to pay……
I love how Andy, sore shoulder and all, was at the bottom of that pile getting dirty.
Such a gamer
Pat M.
Since only Posada and Carlson were ejected, and the other players appeared to be peacemakers, any further suspensions would be the latest example of Bob Watson’s animus toward the Yankees.
Srsly, if that’s considered elbowing somebody, you must not take the subway ever.
And how can it not matter? Nothing Carlson did makes Jorge less wrong, but you cannot completely absolve him for his own role in this incident.
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I didn’t say he wasn’t at fault. They both are, I just thought it could of been handled better.
Very good point Richie about Torre…..
Where was Torre when Pedro threw Zimmer to the ground?
I don’t remember, but there were many examples of Torre being weak and not responding when the team was attacked. At least this team defends itself instead of lying down and doing nothing.
o’Realy
Some of the fans on here won’t defend there team because they are passive like Torre was from 2002-2007. They believe that the Yankees should continue the corporate culture of going about there business and not responding when a team attacks them or challenges them.
It’s not like Jorge beat a kid, and who cares what other people including kids watching the game are going to think. Some people act like we live in some perfect society.
Just last week Youk and Big Papi replied to media comments about rhem now settling for wildcard spot. They shot back that they are going for 1st place and the last series of the season with Yanks is going to decide it all.
Well after 6 Sox wins in a row and Yanks now backsliding as might be expected, their prediction sounds more and more accurate as each day passes.
I fully support Jorge. If some dude throws at me, I’m giving him an elbow too. And good for the guys who got in the middle of the fight. Way to stick up for your teammates! This is a close-knit team. I love it!
Brian in San Francisco
“This was just wacko week starting with MJ, Serena, Federer, and now Jorge.” Seriously.
Man, do i miss the old days. Some scrub fan would of threw a bettery instead of a $7 coke plastic bottle.
Note to yankee fans, stop being so soft. Bring the batteries for REAL justice!
It was terrifying to see CC in the middle of that scrum. He could have hurt a shoulder or elbow and that would have been it for the season.
Posada should be smarter than that. He is a veteran. The Jays are a bunch of losers with nothing better to do than pick a fight against the best team in baseball.
The Yankees need to stay focused. I am glad that Girardi spoke to the team.
Why was Jesse Carlson even near homeplate? I feel Jorge was provoked.
Carlson was looking for trouble when he was out of position and in jorges path!.. Jorges was wrong maybe but you throw a ball at me give me a bunch of lip and act all big and bad and then get in my path for no other reason than to provoke me ?..They would be CARRYING you off the field!…WHILE WE`RE at it the Jays manager should be suspended for allowing his pitcher to stay in the dugout after being thrown out of the game …There is no excuse for that if you are thrown out of the game you have to leave the dugout period!…
“Jim Joyce is the same umpire who defended A-Rod for that slap play on Arroyo He’s not anti-Yankee. He’s a good umpire, one of the best. Posada screwed this up, plain and simple. Girardi was furious afterward.”
i think i can agree. when they announced who the umpires were, i noticed none of the names really rung a bell with me..
and the ones that do ‘ring a bell’ in my head, are usually the lousy ones.
i think that crew may be one of the more credible ones.
Good for Damon for standing up for his teammate, but he might be the most fragile out of all of them.
If Jim Joyce thinks the pitcher is innocent, then maybe he can explain why on earth the pitcher would be standing in that spot. There is no reason at all for him to be there except to antagonize. That is NOT the spot to back up home plate. And further, why is Jim Joyce saying anything at all. When umps blow a call, which seems to be getting more frequent, you cannot find them because they are not required to face the media, so he shouldn’t be commenting on this either.