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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


The trials and tribulations of Joba

Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Podcast on Sep 20, 2009 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Just received this from a reader:

As a parting gift, please take Joba with you.

That is very funny. This is not: Joba is 0-4 with an 8.42 ERA in his last eight starts and opponents have hit .331 against him.

This is even worse: Joba either doesn’t understand how poorly he is pitching or doesn’t want to admit it. Listen to his postgame interview:

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“My delivery was great,” he said. “I threw some great changeups. My slider velocity was great. My fastball velocity was more consistent. … It’s going to take a lot more than this to get my confidence level down, I’ll tell you that much. You can kick me as much as you want but I’m going to come back fighting every time. That’s how I live this life and that’s how I play this game of baseball.”

Chamberlain was asked whether he was concerned with how he has pitched lately.

“I’m fine, man,” he said. “I’m fine.”

Joe Girardi does not feel the same way. He wanted to use Joba for five innings put pulled him after three because he was pitching so poorly. He criticized his command, saying Chamberlain left too many hittable pitches over the plate.

But Girardi said that if they need a No. 4 starter in the playoffs, it would be Joba. That is a scary thought at this point.

 
 

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95 Responses to “The trials and tribulations of Joba”

  1. Jones September 20th, 2009 at 8:32 pm

    Come on Joba. I hate seeing him not live up. He’s so much better than that.

  2. Laura - Matsui in pinstripes in 2010! September 20th, 2009 at 8:36 pm

    I was out all day so I missed Joba’s latest “great” performance. The thought of this guy starting a game in the playoffs is frightening.

  3. Adam September 20th, 2009 at 8:37 pm

    His velocity was consistently slow.

    Maybe he’s feeling great because he’s going out there on painkillers.

  4. Nic September 20th, 2009 at 8:40 pm

    What’s wrong with this kid. He is starting to sound like a compulsive liar when interviewed after every bad start. Pete is right, Joba as a 4th starter is a scary thought, especially when AJ’s starts depend on what side of the bed he wakes up on.

  5. Jimmy the Saint September 20th, 2009 at 8:40 pm

    Is the taking him out after three innings thing screwing with his head at this point?

  6. yanksfan7788 September 20th, 2009 at 8:40 pm

    Joba, has become worst then arod when it comes to talk to the media. At least arod always took it upon himself to say that sucked when he did. Joba saying he’s been piching good is getting old.

  7. NYY626 September 20th, 2009 at 8:40 pm

    Joba needs to have a sit down chat with Andy and learn how to take accountability when he pitches poorly.

    Pete, do you have any pictures of the rookie hazing?

  8. Ben September 20th, 2009 at 8:40 pm

    The thought of in the ALDS with the Yankees down 2-1 Joba starting to keep the season alive is terrifying currently.

  9. Nic September 20th, 2009 at 8:41 pm

    BTW…go giants

  10. Yankee Collapse September 20th, 2009 at 8:41 pm

    with 12 games left in the season, Joba still has two more loses to pitch.

  11. pat September 20th, 2009 at 8:41 pm

    Denial has to be a coping mechanism. He can’t really believe what he’s saying.

  12. Wang IS Taiwan September 20th, 2009 at 8:41 pm

    Vomit. I wouldn’t let him near a playoff game.

    I expected so much more character from this young man when he first came up. That’s no longer true.

  13. terpbomber September 20th, 2009 at 8:43 pm

    I wish it was as simple as having Joba being sent back to AAA for more seasoning. He looked like the next big thing a couple years ago as the, albeit unintended, set-up man. Then the midges brought him back to earth. He has been rather unremarkable as a starting pitcher. Imposing strict inning/pitch limitations doesn’t make any sense for a starter. Perhaps he should be put back in the pen and have Hughes go back to the rotation. OTOH, Hughes has been too valuable out of the pen to risk it.

    I’m just too uneasy having Joba around for the first round of the playoffs at this point, where the pressure and stakes are going to be much higher.

  14. caryn September 20th, 2009 at 8:43 pm

    I don’t want to see him starting a game in the post season. It really is a scary thought. He has got to admit that he isn’t pitchuing good also!

  15. m September 20th, 2009 at 8:44 pm

    Poor Joba. I hope he finds his way. Even the staunchest supporter can’t deny that he’s struggling.

    As a side note, no one is dissecting what Joba is saying anymore because it’s the same old, same old.

    At the risk of irritating a respected poster, Kennedy would get killed if he pitched like Joba and kept repeating the same thing every time.

  16. Pat M. September 20th, 2009 at 8:46 pm

    GB, The one glaring difference between Gator and Chamberlain is that Ronnie listened and learned….I’m not getting that from Joba……You have to wonder if the Yankee Brass is getting just a tad fed up with not only the lack of progress, but the clear regressional path that Joba’s on……Maybe the club adopts the Halliday reclaimation program, and just tear it down and start all over…..Should be an interesting off season, as Chamberlain is not where they figured he’d be at this stage…

  17. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 20th, 2009 at 8:46 pm

    What I see with my eyes worries me more than what I hear from him after a game.

    From the little I know of sports psychology, his so-called denial is a way he deals with failure. I don’t expect him to say words that are akin to him publicly donning a sackcloth and putting ashes on his face after a bad start. That’s just paying lip service and appeasing fans who seem to expect that.

    It doesn’t change a thing on the field though.

  18. mick September 20th, 2009 at 8:49 pm

    cannot believe the joba hate.

    no wonder the players think the fans are idiots.

    joba will come up aces in a big spot in the playoffs.

    all he needs his a meaningfull spot, be it starting or in relief.

    you heard it here.

  19. yanksfan7788 September 20th, 2009 at 8:49 pm

    Joba can’t be with the team next year. He needs to start the year in triple a. I’m sorry, but I’m fed up with his lack of progress.

  20. Arliss September 20th, 2009 at 8:50 pm

    Whats really scary is not joba starting game 4 of an ALCS….its starting Game 4 of an ALDS because the Yanks blew the division and didnt get the series choice.

  21. mick September 20th, 2009 at 8:51 pm

    panic in the streets.

    frontrunners.

  22. mick September 20th, 2009 at 8:52 pm

    suck it up and hang with your team.

    this race was never declared over.

  23. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 20th, 2009 at 8:52 pm

    yanksfan7788
    September 20th, 2009 at 8:49 pm
    Joba can’t be with the team next year. He needs to start the year in triple a. I’m sorry, but I’m fed up with his lack of progress.

    ***************************************

    I wonder if Blue Jays fans were saying things like this, when Halliday was struggling.

  24. noonoo September 20th, 2009 at 8:52 pm

    “But Girardi said that if they need a No. 4 starter in the playoffs, it would be Joba.”

    what’s girardi’s email? is there anyway to start a petition to express our displeasure for this nightmare of an option and send it off to both girardi and cashman?

    and if Joba thought he was great today, then someone needs to confiscate whatever crazy pills he’s been taking

  25. Abdababdaserser September 20th, 2009 at 8:53 pm

    It seems Joba has been talking to Ian Kennedy a bit too much. “I’m pitching great, they are just getting hit”.

    Personally, I think Joe should have said that the 4th starter was still up for grabs as Joba has not been pitching well enough to earn it.

    Sometimes Girardi tends toward Pollyanna too much, even if that is only the public face of it.

    Joba has made some very good starts this year, but the poor ones have been so bad that those good ones seem like he was just lucky in them.

    Sometimes you get hit even with good pitches, but when you consistently get hit you need to ask yourself why. Joba isn’t doing that, and he needs to.

  26. pat September 20th, 2009 at 8:53 pm

    “joba will come up aces in a big spot in the playoffs.”

    I hope so but what has he done that makes you so sure of that?

  27. Yanks_Fan- I don't like Joba anymore September 20th, 2009 at 8:54 pm

    Joba is a freaking living baseball cliché. Come on, he doesn’t really mean what he is saying, he is just letting that all out to rid himself from the pain of talking about yet another horrible outing with the media. He seems to believe his spot with the Yankees, make it this postseason and beyond, is a given. On the mound and on the post commentaries, it really seems like he is fine with mediocrity (and that is making it look better than it really has been) and just going out there and pitching, no matter the results.

    He says “all the right things” which is equal to empty clichés, but his pitching has been atrocious and soon the Yankees will get tired of it. Its about the team, not about babysitting him.

    If Joe said Joba is still his 4th starter is mainly because the tryouts are still underway for that spot and he doesn’t want to make it worse for Joba, but Im sure that if Gaudin keeps impressing like he has lately, Joba goes to the bullpen immediately.

    Joba doesn’t really seem to care. And frankly, Im losing my faith in him. I don’t care how young he is, he is regressing instead of improving.

  28. Pat M. September 20th, 2009 at 8:55 pm

    m, At least Ian learned real fast last season…..Kennedy is going to open alot of eyes next March….

  29. m September 20th, 2009 at 8:56 pm

    mick,

    You’re kidding, right? There’s not panic. No frontrunning. Joba’s struggles have stretched over months. It’s not criticizing to point that out.

    I have said that I think Joba will pitch in the postseason, and pitch well.

    But he’s not pitching well now, by any stretch of the imagination.

  30. mick September 20th, 2009 at 8:56 pm

    you all need to take a pill.

    better yet, go watch the new Larry David Curb, and come back in 1/2 hour with your sense of humor.

    even if we lose all 3 to LA and Bost sweeps KC I can’t wait for Fri nite as I will be there and there will be juice in the House That Ruth Built (can we still call it that?)

  31. Christina- Pictures of the Girardi and A-Rod ejection + Leiter's Sock September 20th, 2009 at 8:56 pm

    Angel-

    When Halladay when struggling, the Jays sent him back down to the minor leagues to work on his stuff.

    Perhaps this is what the Yankees need to do with Joba.

  32. DYNASTY IS DESTINY! September 20th, 2009 at 8:56 pm

    Phenom of the Pen…

    A gift from the baseball gods…

    Still his destiny…

  33. GreenBeret7 September 20th, 2009 at 8:56 pm

    Pat M.
    September 20th, 2009 at 8:46 pm
    GB, The one glaring difference between Gator and Chamberlain is that Ronnie listened and learned….I’m not getting that from Joba……You have to wonder if the Yankee Brass is getting just a tad fed up with not only the lack of progress, but the clear regressional path that Joba’s on……Maybe the club adopts the Halliday reclaimation program, and just tear it down and start all over…..Should be an interesting off season, as Chamberlain is not where they figured he’d be at this stage…

    ————————————————————

    Yes, but, that wasn’t always the case with Guidry. Nobody ever seemed to get through to him until Lyle took him to the pen (or woodshed). Lyle only told that part of the story and guidry corraberated it. I’m sure that Lyle had some other things to say, but, I’ve never heard it. Never understood why somebody didn’t snap Lyle up as a pitching coach. He was goofy as Hell, but, the man knows pitching. Guidry was able to pass whatever Lyle showed him to Dave Righetti. Something’s not clicking with Chamberlain and Eiland. I might be inclined to let Mike Harkey take a crack at him. They were the same type of pitchers. Maybe that common ground.

  34. Abdababdaserser September 20th, 2009 at 8:58 pm

    Ian has matured a bit, and some of that is because he was back down in the minors. Once that reality set in it helped open his eyes a bit.

    I don’t think Joba is a throw away. He has talent, but he needs some stuffing knocked out between his ears.

  35. m September 20th, 2009 at 9:00 pm

    Pat M,

    Failure is a humbling experience. It may take Joba a little longer, but the Yankees might not be doing him any favors by developing him as a starter at this level. There’s probably a ton of pressure on him.

  36. PJH September 20th, 2009 at 9:02 pm

    Where is the derisive post about the Patriots beating the Jets?

  37. Abdababdaserser September 20th, 2009 at 9:02 pm

    Interesting point there GB. It could be that Eiland just can’t get through to Joba.

    I’ve worked with kids for a long time. Sometimes it just takes someone different to work with them that gets through to them.

  38. Derwood Morris September 20th, 2009 at 9:03 pm

    No matter what division series the Yanks get, Joba goes to pen and Chad Gaudin starts a game 4. That’s my prediction, unless Joba pitches well in his last 2 starts.

  39. Angel - A tale told by idiots, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing September 20th, 2009 at 9:03 pm

    I’m thinking they might need to do that also, Christina. There’s definitely something wrong.

    I was just more pondering if there was the level of disgust and frustration with Halliday by Blue Jays fans then, that is being shown by some with Joba now. I don’t know if there was blogs then like there are now, but it would be interesting to go back in time to see. Did Halliday have the kind of intial expectations on him by Blue Jays fans that Joba does now? Be interesting to compare.

  40. Abdababdaserser September 20th, 2009 at 9:03 pm

    Big goof by Romo there.

  41. DYNASTY IS DESTINY! September 20th, 2009 at 9:03 pm

    I’m tired of hearing that Joba can’t sustain his 98 mph velocity for a whole game…

    Justin Verlander and Tim Lincecum are at least two examples that seem to be able to sustain their velocity throughout…

    The Joba of the pen was unhittable…The Joba that shut down the Red Sox as a starter last year was unhittable, and if memory serves me correctly, he sustained a high velocity for 8 innings…

    So what happened to that Joba? Why isn’t he throwing as hard consistently? And if he pitches out of the pen again in the postseason, will that velocity come back? If not, why not?

    This just isn’t the same Joba, plain and simple…

  42. jake [THANKS FOR bringing back shelley] September 20th, 2009 at 9:04 pm

    Paging Joe Girardi…Paging Joe Girardi…

    “Oh yes, we have message from the yankee fans for you : PUT JOBA IN THE PEN!”
    Use IPK/Gaudin for the 4th starter combo in the playoffs…PLEASE!

  43. Nick in SF September 20th, 2009 at 9:04 pm

    Jerry Jones honors pick with nose pick?

  44. pat September 20th, 2009 at 9:05 pm

    Will the Giants score more offensive or defensive TDs this year?

  45. Rishi September 20th, 2009 at 9:05 pm

    Audi is the official luxury vehicule of the NY Yankees? I had no idea!

  46. m September 20th, 2009 at 9:05 pm

    I’m not mad at Joba. Haven’t given up on him. I’m more perturbed with the Yankees in this whole situation. They knew that Joba would run into IP issues. They knew he hit a wall midseason. They knew we were short a front end starter when we lost Wang. They had their chances to convert 2 relievers back to starters so that Joba could conserve innings and come back for the stretch run.

  47. Doreen September 20th, 2009 at 9:06 pm

    If Wang hadn’t had his unfortunate season and all the relievers at the beginning of the year proven to be inadequate, so that Phil Hughes and Alfredo Aceves had to be pressed into service in the ‘pen, I’d venture a guess that Joba may have been sent down this season. And, had he not had those terrific starts right out of the gate after the ASB, he STILL may have been sent down. But this season has not been a smooth one for the Yankees pitching, both starting and relief pitching.

    I have realized that Joba’s post games are not important at all. Anything of substance is dealt with far from the cameras and microphones. It may not be that he isn’t trying to learn and do things differently, but that sometimes for whatever reasons, those lessons don’t click.

    Joba’s in an untenable and unenviable position. It’s truly frustrating that things haven’t gone well for him this season because the expectations were pretty high. But he was supposed to have the luxury of being the #5 starter. With that advantage gone, his on-the-job training is exposed.

  48. pat September 20th, 2009 at 9:07 pm

    “Jerry Jones honors pick with nose pick?”

    We all saw it but you had to go there. :wink:

  49. bru September 20th, 2009 at 9:09 pm

    throw him in the pen to take over for mo if he can handle it

    let him switch with hughes next year & we need to go out & get a number 2 starter to go with cc,bump burnett to #3 where he belongs,resign pettitte for our #4 pitcher & let hughes be our number #5.

    we got hurt when wang went out,pettitte became our 3,job 4 & mitre & gaudin our # 5.

    we would be ok if joba was doing well but now our # 4 & 5 pitchers stink

    cash had the right idea by fixing 1-4 & taking a chance with only joba but it didnt work.

    maybe go out & get webb & it looks like this

    cc
    burnett
    webb
    pettitte
    hughes

    if we can get a pitcher with less risk even better

  50. Kevin K September 20th, 2009 at 9:10 pm

    He sounds like Nuke La Louche from Bull Durham after he made it to the bigs being interviewed. Its the same crap he says every damn interview. He is a punk. I really hope the Yankees re-evaluate their plan for him moving into next year. No faith in this clown.

  51. Pat M. September 20th, 2009 at 9:11 pm

    Nick in SF, I took Dennis-Costanza’s tip on the overs, I also took the 3 points…..Good friend is in SF and is staying at The Hilton ( ? ) at the Fisherman’s….Is there a good sushi joint near there ???

  52. Mike S. September 20th, 2009 at 9:11 pm

    The Yankees have to share some of the blame for this with the erratic way they handled Joba this year. He looked to be settling into the starting role, pitching more aggressive, and they started talking about skipping turns in the rotation, then they decided to let him pitch, but only a few innings. It is difficult to work through problems, and establish a rhythm when you are pitching 9 innings total every two weeks.

  53. Kevin K September 20th, 2009 at 9:14 pm

    bru…I think the bullpen magic is gone for Joba.

  54. Rishi September 20th, 2009 at 9:15 pm

    :arrow:

  55. DC September 20th, 2009 at 9:19 pm

    Joba just doesn’t get it !!!! What planet is he on.

  56. bru September 20th, 2009 at 9:35 pm

    there is just no way to know for sure

    just because joba is not doing well now means absolutely nothing

    look at clay b for the rs & there are many others

    it might take another pitching coach,more time,etc….

    we just dont know

    do we start mitre or gaudin in a game 4 & will it come back to haunt us??
    we dont know.

    joba has shown after the asb that he can do it.

    he also beat out becket in fenway 1-0.

    i know one thing you never have enough pitching

    not long ago it looked like we had too much & the rs were hurting but how fast things can change.

    do we stick with joba or send a message that we will go another route & maybe look to trade him?

  57. Jay September 20th, 2009 at 10:04 pm

    Chad Gaudin should be the 4th starter come playoff time, hes done more for this team in the time that Joba accumulated those hideous number.

  58. M.K.J. September 20th, 2009 at 10:13 pm

    5 GAME lead.going against teams more hungrier than Joe.
    He’s routine,predictable,and sinking his team with boneheaded moves,by sticking with Joba.

    If he blows this lead,he should be fired.

    Joba is lost this year,and yet the mgr wants to gamble and hold the team back with Joba continuing to be put on the mound.

  59. jsbrendog September 20th, 2009 at 10:15 pm

    Send joba to minors

  60. rich September 20th, 2009 at 10:15 pm

    First of all congrats on the new job.

    As a Yankee fan I am concerned about Joba. He is delusional and should be shut down. Why Towers is not used more is a confusing to me. I think Joba needs a good wake up call. Joe Girardi needs not to worry about innings or pitch count but how to get this guy.

  61. M.K.J. September 20th, 2009 at 10:31 pm

    I can’t take another season of Joe win or lose.This should be a fun time of year,yet the worst teams in the AL/NL have whipped the Yankees butt!!

    Games they are suppose to win,suddenly are a struggle.
    Get ready for another postseason flop.

    World Series: Cards vs Sawx DONE.

  62. kkm September 20th, 2009 at 10:39 pm

    Joba used to take the mound with some bravado. Now it seems like he’s trying too hard to conserve his adrenaline. He looks timid and defeated. Send him back to Nebraska for a week…seemed to work over the ASB

  63. someone September 20th, 2009 at 10:55 pm

    I think Gaudin has made a case to be #4.

    Aceves has been pretty solid out of the bullpen as a long reliever, I don’t know how he has done as a starter if he has started at all?

    Mitre has had some good nights and bad nights but you can’t depend on the luck of the draw. Everytime he pitched bad he pitched just well enough to keep the #5 spot in his next outing. Joba shows up in streaks, and being that there is no indication he can perform, there’s no reason to take a chance in the playoffs.

    Gaudin started with this team very strong and has had a couple of rough outings since then. But he has consistently limited the other team to few runs and doesn’t have terrible performances. A pitcher who can be consistent in only giving up, say, 3-4 runs, is better than a pitcher that will give up 6-7 runs sometimes and only 2 another time.

    Go with gaudin. For next year, all this young talent on the Yankees is going to have to be evaluated. There’s no doubt in my mind, for one, that Hughes should be taken out of the bullpen.

  64. M.K.J. September 20th, 2009 at 10:58 pm

    Is there any other team,vying for a playoff berth that still
    is trying to get their staring pitching to just effectively pitch? AJ hot then cold, and Joba ,a mess!!

    I’m bracing for epic fail,and embarrassment,being the laughingstock of Baseball.

    Joe can’t or won’t take Joba out of the rotation.

    So he (Joe) has to be wacked hard to finally get it, unfortunately at the teams expense.

  65. M.K.J. September 20th, 2009 at 11:06 pm

    How can Joba take the mound with bravado,when he’s been smacked stupid on the mound.

  66. Maverick September 20th, 2009 at 11:08 pm

    Look, as a former commander I am familiar with this situation,and have made this mistake myself. Its all pretty much a case of over estimating Joba’s maturity to handle the situation he is in. It shows in his comments. What he is really saying is that he is doing the best that he can. And I believe that. In defense of Joba, I am not saying he is immature; he had enough maturity to get this far. But he has reached his maturity limit at this point in time. He just can’t do what they asked of him.

    Joba has the skill set needed to do the job. He’s even got more skill at this point than a lot of other pitchers. Girardi and Cashman figured that he had the maturity to make the plan work. But he just didn’t. That does not make Joba a looser nor a slacker nor anything but a talented individual without the maturity he needed to complete the task given him.

    It is rarely the individual’s fault alone. Management put him in a situation he was not ready for. Maybe no one, or only a very few, could have done it. Now they find themselves in the spot of having placed him in a situation that he can’t handle. Girardi is trying not to totally destroy Joba by saying he won’t use him as the 4th starter. He’s just saving his, Cashman’s and Joba’s face with a little retoric. But all three of them know inside that Joba won’t be used as a starter in the post season.

    All the Joba bashing should just stop. He’s not totally responsible, there is plenty of blame to go around for Girardi and Cashman making the error in judgment in the first place. Joba will mature, to the extent that he can be a starter won’t be known until next year.

    Maybe we should all just step back and ask ourselves how would we want our own son treated if he were in the same situation. I wish the young man all the success possible.

  67. The Damon-ator September 20th, 2009 at 11:17 pm

    pretty sad state of affairs when Joba gets outpitched by the likes of sergio mitre

  68. Maverick September 20th, 2009 at 11:47 pm

    someone September 20th, 2009 at 10:55 pm

    I think Gaudin has made a case to be #4.

    Aceves has been pretty solid out of the bullpen as a long reliever, I don’t know how he has done as a starter if he has started at all?

    Mitre has had some good nights and bad nights but you can’t depend on the luck of the draw. Everytime he pitched bad he pitched just well enough to keep the #5 spot in his next outing. Joba shows up in streaks, and being that there is no indication he can perform, there’s no reason to take a chance in the playoffs.

    Gaudin started with this team very strong and has had a couple of rough outings since then. But he has consistently limited the other team to few runs and doesn’t have terrible performances. A pitcher who can be consistent in only giving up, say, 3-4 runs, is better than a pitcher that will give up 6-7 runs sometimes and only 2 another time.

    Go with gaudin. For next year, all this young talent on the Yankees is going to have to be evaluated. There’s no doubt in my mind, for one, that Hughes should be taken out of the bullpen.

    —————–

    EXCELLENT POST!!

    I totally agree with your assessment. In fact, I think Girardi does too, he’s just not saying it.

  69. JZ September 21st, 2009 at 12:12 am

    5 games.
    tick, tick….

  70. wanger September 21st, 2009 at 2:35 am

    aceves should start stretching out… let joba be ace’s backup in the pen next go around…pair them..get them ready and start some competition there

  71. xoxo September 21st, 2009 at 3:45 am

    How stupid must the other pitchers that are performing well feel, to hear that Joba will get the #4 spot as lousy as he’s pitching over them?

    Joe is so distracted with Joba,that he let a 9 game lead,drop to 5 games,wit bad game management.He leaves Joba in way too long to get hit,and when he does pull him,it’s no way to correct the damage.

  72. xoxo September 21st, 2009 at 3:52 am

    Mitre stopped the bleeding when he relieved Joba,who
    shouldn’t be on the roster at all now.

  73. Steve September 21st, 2009 at 4:58 am

    Red Sox will take the division and Yankees will face Twin.

  74. Steve September 21st, 2009 at 4:58 am

    Red Sox will take the division and Yankees will face Twin.

  75. Paul from Cali September 21st, 2009 at 6:05 am

    Joba is the most glaring example of how bad Girardi and his staff are at managing their pitchers. They’ve taken one of the best MLB prospects and completely ruined him. They may as well send him to AAA until he figures out how to get people out again.

    And here’s a warning folks: The same thing will happen in a year or 2 when they try to make Hughes a starter again. If not worse.

  76. JeterJobaCanoFanForever, enough said September 21st, 2009 at 6:35 am

    Paul – so agree with you about Joba. How can a pitcher who showed such electricity and abundant skills be at the point he is now.

    Someone on another thread said that Leyland should work with him and tear him completely down and re-build him. I personally think they did that last ST. Trying to finesse him after another pitcher about his size whose name I cannot remember.

    Joba has been struggling beginning with spring training and you could tell he was not happy. This year he has had some good games and some bad games. No one remembers the good games from this year or last. My personal favorite: 1-0 win over Beckett in Boston.

    Earlier in the season, he would leave the game with 3 runs and the team couldn’t always pick him up or they lost his lead. He has won a paltry 8 games though. For those who are crucifying him, and you know who you are, LET’S TAKE AWAY THOSE 8 WINS FROM THE YANKEE WIN TOTAL. WHAT ARE YOU LEFT WITH? So much for his not contributing to the team.

    And for all of you who have called him all sort of names because he hasn’t pitched up to your ideals – - may your son or daughter or other relative come home and tell you that he/she was called:

    fat
    mentally challenged
    a bum
    garbage
    a baby
    a liar
    over rated
    flash in the pan

    And that is the short list.

    Anyone who has watched Joba pitch since his call up in late ’07 and knows about ML pitching knows he has the talent to be a great pitcher for the Yankees. But who is the savior that is going to help him?? Not the current coach.

    OMG, some of you are horrible fans. Is it a contest to see who can say the worst about a player for that given day?

    And while I am on my soap box: Just leave Cano the “bleep” alone. He is a great fielder and has the second highest batting average on the team. This constant RISP crap is just that crap. That is he’s one fault. One.

    And Pete, I joined this blog solely because of a favorably post you had made about Joba earlier in the year. I know that people can change their minds but your last post was harsh.

    Rant over!

  77. RZT September 21st, 2009 at 6:39 am

    Guy needs some humility. And some optimism. At the moment he’s all, “No one does it better. Can’t be improved upon.” Reminds me of his DWI arrest over the summer. “Hey, I’m a Yankee…” Ugh.

  78. JeterJobaCanoFanForever, enough said September 21st, 2009 at 6:40 am

    Paul is also right about what could happen to Hughes over the next two years. If you are semi-good and have one good pitch you can dominate in the pen. But it is not easy to carry over that success to the rotation. Hughes fans (Betsy) beware.

  79. JeterJobaCanoFanForever, enough said September 21st, 2009 at 6:48 am

    RZT:
    Guy needs some humility. And some optimism. At the moment he’s all, “No one does it better. Can’t be improved upon.” Reminds me of his DWI arrest over the summer. “Hey, I’m a Yankee…” Ugh.
    ———————————————————–

    And a big UGH to you too RZT. Has he actually said those two quotes you have posted or is that your version?

    And bringing up his DUI is the last straw for any sorry poster who can’t think of anything else. Lame.

  80. 86w183 September 21st, 2009 at 7:56 am

    Remember Baghdad Bob? I think Joba is getting media advice from him.

    That rant was just silliness. Joba is a professional ball player and there is a level of scrutiny that comes with that that is a little more legit than schoolyard name calling.

    Yes he’s been jerked around over the inning count issue and it’s understandably frustrating for him. It also undoubtedly has contributed to him being awful the second half of the season, but it doesn’t change the reality.

    He’s has pitched horribly, put his team in tough situations over and over again and yet he accepts no accountability and shows no disappointment let alone remorse.

  81. PH September 21st, 2009 at 7:56 am

    Note to the Captain, Mo and Giradi – sit this ya-hoo down and tell him he’s not doing great and feeling fine. He sucks of late. Tell him to fess up. If it’s ego then smack it out of him – if he’s delusional set him straight. Didn’t Girardi get called on for this last year? – always telling us every thing was fine? Maybe he needs that same talking to because I am sick to death of this kid.

    I am normally shouting – give this person or that person a break and time when everyone is giving them grief. But Time’s up for Joba. We have not won a friggin’ thing yet and his cavaliar attitude just ticks me off.

    Too much time off, not enough time off, too many pitches, not enough pitches. It’s bad when Sergio is listed as pitching and it’s a sigh of relief for me. Damn!

  82. GiantsCauseway September 21st, 2009 at 8:55 am

    When I see Joba out there & squint my eyes & see him in Toronto & Roy Halliday in pinstripes. What should have been.

  83. robert cepake September 21st, 2009 at 9:08 am

    THE FAST BALL! THE FASTBALL! THE FASTBALL! It is not there. He has lost 6 mph off his
    gas. Everything else worked off his fastball. Hitters could not “sit” on any one pitch.
    NOBODY ON THE YANKEES TALKS ABOUT IT! He is throwing mush at the hitters.

  84. xoxo September 21st, 2009 at 9:24 am

    Joba has lowered his trade value. Cashman showed restraint this year with trades deadline and acquisitions,but it may come back to bite him.

    All these teams will be waiting for that guaranteed win,while Joe still believes in Joba.

  85. Joey's Poodle September 21st, 2009 at 9:27 am

    Maverick, thanks for a ‘responsible manager’ view on handling young people. I agree with you that spankings and added public humiliation (beyond that of being seen to perform poorly and lose) will do nothing for a youngster who is trying as hard as he can. I go back to the animal trainer’s mantra (yes bringing young people along can be a lot like training animals): it is never the animal’s fault. Figure out how he can get over the hurdle in front of him. That’s the job of his coach and manager.

    If you put him in the spotlight too soon, it is not the animal’s fault. If you exposed him to tasks beyond his developmental level, it is not the animal’s fault. If you did it because the zoo as a whole was lacking, that also is not the animal’s fault.

    If Girardi needs to be frank with the public about anything (I say IF) it would be his own role in setting this up, not the ‘failures’ of this kid to jump higher than he can.

  86. Joey's Poodle September 21st, 2009 at 9:28 am

    That said, I have to add that in truth I would be happy not to see Joba on the field for the big team again this year.

  87. xoxo September 21st, 2009 at 9:40 am

    Yankees need Felix Hernandez,Sawx want him,and according to MLBtraderumors will make a play for him,if SEA can’t extent his contract.
    Roy is great and 32,Felix is in his a 20′s and a
    southpaw and a real stopper(ACE).

    Yankees need to part with JOBA,GET THEY YOU CAN.

    This season is really important to all of Yankee Universe.

    If he can’t help when the team needs him most,while keep him around?

  88. xoxo September 21st, 2009 at 9:43 am

    Meant, Get what they can for him!!

  89. xoxo September 21st, 2009 at 9:51 am

    I hope Joba,Edwar, and Bruney are nowhere near postseason,they always throw runs.

  90. Yankee Bloodline September 21st, 2009 at 10:37 am

    I would take Gaudin or dare I say it, Mitre, over Joba right now.

  91. BigBoy September 21st, 2009 at 10:49 am

    @xoxo- Please tell me when Felix Hernandez started throwing left-handed……….moron

  92. Carla September 21st, 2009 at 11:30 am

    The Joba post-game interview had me yelling at my TV…

  93. Sports Geek September 21st, 2009 at 11:32 am

    OMG!!… I have all the hope in the world for Joba to be successful, but it seems to me he needs work both on his performance, and on his understanding of what is actually happening.

    I am totally amazed at what he says in the interview. He basically says, “I pitched well, but the batters just happened to beat me on a couple of pitches.”… OMG, how can he say that??!!??

    Baseball is interesting and exciting because the balance between offense and defense is so close. The difference between a winning team and a losing team is often very little. The difference between a pitcher winning an at bat vs. the batter can often be just one pitch (refer to Mo’s blown save Friday night, where 2 batters beat him on one pitch each).

    The best pitchers are the ones who win those battles with the batters more than 75% of the time, and ideally better than 80% of the time (which would be a ‘BAA-Batting Average Against’ of .200). I say to Joba, “go check your BAA for the last 6 weeks, then come back and tell me you have been doing great. While you’re at it, compare your BAA to CC’s, to Andy’s, to Mo’s, to Hughes’… then try to tell us you have been doing great.”

    I have not had the time to organize the data and then calculate for all of those pitchers, but for Joba’s latest game– .462/.500/.846/1.35 (BAA/OBP-A/SLG-A/OPS-A)
    … This certainly doesn’t sound like a pitcher who was getting the job done!! Maybe he actually had good “stuff”, but he certainly didn’t beat many batters.

    ((Note- these OBP-A and OPS-A figures are approximate because the regular Baseball-Reference data does not have all the info required to do a complete calculation- SF and SH data are not shown for pitchers.))

    ((A question for the readers of the blog– Does anyone know if any Sabermetrician follows OPS-A = OPS-Against? Seems that would be a very good stat to follow.. better than BAA for sure.))

  94. Sports Geek September 21st, 2009 at 11:55 am

    I agree with Maverick (11:08pm) and Joey’s Poodle (9:27am).

    But, I add to that- there’s 2 different dimensions of “the problem” at this time:
    (a) proper development of a young pitcher (which is pretty much consistent with what’s right for the Yankees in the long run).. and some would argue that the Yankees have screwed up so far.
    (b) what’s right for the Yankees in the short run- this season.

    Clearly, (a) needs a lot of work right now. I sure hope the Yankees are doing a lot of thinking about this right now, and over the winter. AND, I think they need to call in a lot of resources- the best baseball minds (beyond current Yankees staff) PLUS some outside resources (psychologists? others?).

    Also, I think that (b) calls for maybe not using Joba in the post season at all. If he does extremely well in his next 2 starts prior to post-season, I might change that point of view, but because of his inconsistency, I might not.

  95. Tom September 21st, 2009 at 12:02 pm

    I am a huge Bombers fan and had high hopes for Joba, but he is more and more looking like the most over-rated and over-hyped pitcher ever.


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