Today in The Journal News
Posted by: Peter Abraham - Posted in Misc on Sep 20, 2009 
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CC Sabathia survived a line drive off the chest as he and Mark Teixeira led the Yankees to a rout of the Mariners.
Ian Kennedy is back in the majors after a medical scare. This notebook also has updates on some Yankee football fans and today’s rookie hazing.
Is Derek Jeter the MVP of the American League? He might not be the MVP of his own team That’s the question raised in the Baseball Beat column.
Brett Gardner’s value off the bench could be significant for the Yankees in the postseason.
I must admit when CC got hit( I thought at first it was in the face) for the next 20 seconds after that I couldn’t even move my legs. I was like here goes our season. Until I saw the replay and him walking it off. I was like speechless.
VOTE IN THE POLL: WHICH TEAM DO YOU WANT TO SEE THE YANKEES PLAY IN THE DIVISION SERIES?
* The Texas Rangers
154358% of all votes
* The Detroit Tigers
112442% of all votes
Total Votes: 2667 Started: September 7, 2009
That should be changed to Minny now.
I think Tex is the best MVP candidate from Yanks.
He has better numbers than any one, which do matter.
With his great defense, he made every one else in the infield better, including Jeter.
All this discussion is moot any away.
Mauer is going to win it in a landslide, as Twins are in contention for plyaoffs.
Ya got to put the twins in the poll Pete.
i have to admit. I am totally crushed that pete is leaving.
I just feel like there is going to be a huge void.
I agree Pete is a wonderful objective reporter. I am going to miss him. The Sux fans are getting a good one.
any word on who is replacing pete ???
Nick/Pat M.
Over 42 Carolina/Atlanta
-dennis
i hope the new person is a yankee fan even though i would rather keep pete
pete has done a great job with passion for not only baseball but this blog & us
if this blog stinks after pete leaves we all should infest his new blog
we will see what happens
“any word on who is replacing pete ???”
Chad Jennings, I hope
Being a small newspaper JN does not pay much.
So they can not attract a good name.
For Chad, it will be a huge promotion as he currently covers a small town newspaper.
dennis-Costanza
September 20th, 2009 at 10:12 am
Nick/Pat M.
Over 42 Carolina/Atlanta
-dennis
under
ok bru.
Time will tell.
Happy NFL Sunday.
-dennis
I think we can pretty much consider Texas toast. They are seven back of the Sawx with 15 to play. That’s not happening.
If Minnesota wins today they are just a game back of Detroit and the Tigers are reeling right now. They have four games in Detroit next week. Tigers have the scheduling advantage with seven homes games including the Minnesota series while the Twins play ten of their last 14 on the road.
I think the Yanks will take either of the them in the first round.
“I think we can pretty much consider Texas toast. They are seven back of the Sawx with 15 to play. That’s not happening.”
I wish some here would understand that the same applies for the Yankees and Sox.
“I think the Yanks will take either of the them in the first round.”
I’d rather Twins. Not that Detroit makes me nervous, but Verlander can carry a game.
my concern is the rs & angels
the rs pitching is on fire
but you have to beat the best to be the best
Great day taoday. Yankees, Football, BBQ, and a new Pearl Jam album. Life is good.
Go Yankees!
Go Giants!
go steelers
Go Yankees, Giants and Jets.
i got into sports in 77 or 78 & jumped on the steeler wagon first then the yankees
“Brett Gardner’s value off the bench could be significant for the Yankees in the postseason.”
He should be starting not coming off the bench. He is already a more consistent player then Melky.
Definitely want to see the Giants ruin Jerry Jones’ new palace! that’s my first priority today followed by Yanks, Jets, Orioles and Twins.
So much to root for, so little time…..
oh & they are probably better than the giants with a better Qb
Hey, there’s a book in here somewhere: New England boy covers the Yankees; co-writes a book about a Taiwan sensation; starts a groundbreaking blog – is a leader in the sports blog revolution; covers Jeter and Mo; A-Rod and Pettitte’s PED drama, The Clemens-Mitchell Report Fiasco; Steinbrenner’s stepping down; Cashman’s rise; Torre’s exodus; GI Joe and the new Stadium… He becomes Mayor of Idiotville (or whatever his sister called it), gets record numbers of hits on the blog with a devoted following, then leaves to go “home” and cover the arch rivals.
Maybe the book is called: “The Mayor of Idiotville: Blogging the Yankees.”
Anyone else see Francesa on the TV screen on this Sunday morning? Lucky us. We see him Mon-Fri, and now Sunday bight and early. And I was hoping to catch the Yankee encore..
For at least this year, Gardner helps the team most by coming off the bench and starting the occasional game. His speed off the bench is a huge weapon, as demonstrated in the Angels game- it really is game changing. He was injured during the time the team was playing its best, and Melky really fits into that, which is important.
Bottom line: The reason Gardner is on the bench is that his pinch-running and defense is a greater asset than Melky’s pinch hitting. A team that alrady has Hinske and Hairston off the bench doesn’t need another good but not great pinch hitter. But a team that has Matsui and Posada in the lineup can really really benefit from having the speed of Gardner avaiable to pinch run.
“Anyone else see Francesa on the TV screen on this Sunday morning? Lucky us. We see him Mon-Fri, and now Sunday bight and early. And I was hoping to catch the Yankee encore..”
Forget waterboarding. Interrogate suspects using Francesa’s face and voice.
Cabrera
.275 avg, .338 obp, .419 slg, .757 ops
Gardner
.283 avg, .355 obp, .406 slg, .761 ops
Should you be talking about Melky’s value coming off the bench?
BFARBS,
Gardner is a better defensive player right now and in the post season that matters more to me. Melky can’t make the plays Brett can. Those plays can win games so I want him out there. To be honest I could care less if Melky even made the post season roster but I know he will. Imo the better pitching the Yankees will face will completely shut down Melky offensively.
“As the postseason approaches, Boston is lining up a formidable rotation of Josh Beckett, Jon Lester, Daisuke Matsuzaka and Clay Buchholz.” from pete’s column
i think matsuzaka has to pitch well more than once before he’s considered back.
it is however annoying that the red sox starting staff seems to be peaking at this point.
burnett pitching well the other night is a big step in the yankees getting their starting playoff rotation in gear.
now if pettitte is healthy in his next start things are shaping up nicely.
the thing about the playoffs and the WS is momentum. (being hot) momentum attracts luck. the yankees peaked earlier on and are now slowing ever so slightly. boston is peaking now. they may be over peak by playoff time… the yankees could start another upward curve…
As good as Jeter, Teixeira and Sabathia have been, none of them deserve to win the MVP or Cy Young.
Mauer has overshadowed everyone in the AL, you just can’t compare Jeter or Tex to him. Now that he is in the middle of a division race you can’t even hold that against him.
Now look at the Cy Young race. Greinke has been far far superior to any other pitcher in the AL. There is a massive gap in performance between him and the 2nd best pitcher, Felix Hernandez. Then there is another huge gap in performance between Hernandez and whoever the third best pitcher is. In fact, Greinke deserves some MVP votes for the season he’s having.
If we are being honest here I’d go with this for Cy Young:
1. Greinke
2. Hernandez
3. Halladay
4. Sabathia
5. Verlander
Jackson and Lester deserve some consideration but they haven’t thrown as many innings as the above 5 guys.
For MVP this is what I would do:
1. Mauer
2. Jeter
3. Bartlett
4. Cabrera
5. Zobrist
After that comes Tex, Youk, Morales, Longoria, Lind etc
Randy, what are catchers taught about framing pitches? I ask only because “umpire Rick Reed’s claimed he didn’t punch-out Nick Green the other day because he thought the Angles catcher ‘framed’ the pitch.
scott a. In your batting stats for Melky and Gardner you omitted the number of ABs.
Melky is the better defensive player because of his range and the pattern he takes to get to the ball. Also has a better arm which will be important in the post season.
Gardners value is his speed on the base paths. His numbers are great now but can he keep it up?
Melky is my choice for CF. Melky also has more experience facing the better pitchers which no doubt will affect Gardner.
gardner won the job didnt he out of st?
also gardner has not had a chance to prove himself
they both are very similar but gardner is way faster but melky has more power
i think the yankees need to get a better cf next year
can they survive with them? yes but.
i see damon coming back
molina leaving
matsui leaving
nady gone
cervelli is ready to be a backup
i think we should target a good pitcher in fa or a trade along with bullpen help
we have tons of players to trade for what we need to really have a great team again
miranda
kennedy
mcallister,etc….
JeterJobaCanoFanForever, enough said
Dude I didn’t put up any stats. I said that Gardner being the better defensive player should play. To me defense in CF matters more in the post season. I need someone to run balls down in the gaps and also to be able to come in on balls and make catches. Melky sucks at coming in on balls.
we played the rs last year tough with a laughable pitching staff
pettitte is better this year & we have cc,burnett.
joba will pitch well in a big game.i believe that.
if cc wins a game one i like our chances.
we have trouble against clay & lester.
our offense is also better by a mile.
theyankeecourant.blogspot.com
Another forum to voice some Yankee opinions.
Playing in the Central division is far different than playing in the East. The competition, pitching and offense, are higher. That has to come into the equation.
The Central is going to pad stats. Kind of like playing in the NL.
Gardner and melky both bring different skills to the table. Melky has a better arm, and Gardner has more speed. Melky has more power, Gardner is better on the basepaths. This team needs both of them to win, and just trust that Girardi knows what hes doing and knows how to manage the 2 of them together
“As the postseason approaches, Boston is lining up a formidable rotation of Josh Beckett, Jon Lester, Daisuke Matsuzaka and Clay Buchholz.” from pete’s column
__
Beckett hasnt won a game in over a month, dice-k has been out most of the year, and the great buchholz has all of his wins vs. toronto and baltimore. beyond lester, hardly formidable.
scott a. Aplogies to you I thought you had, but your post is the one below. That said, I still think that Melky is the better CF for this year. Gardner is doing well now but I don’t think he can continue to do so. I cringe when I see him in CF. Agree with BFARBS on his/her post. Makes a good point about Matsui and Posada in the line up and that Gardner can pinch run for them.
greinke cc
210.1 220.1
180 188
59 87
50 81
11 18
44 60
224 186
2.14 3.31
1.06 1.13
.231 .232
very close
baa the same,whip close,hits per innings
sabathia can make it very interesting if he pitches lights out over his next 2 but greinke has a small edge
tom in nj-
well , i didn’t have to frame any pitches in the bullpen, but i got taught glove work by some pretty good catching teachers. stan cliburn ,the long time twins triple a manager, taught me the most though paul casanova taught me how to catch a knuckler .
catchers that are good framing pitches have to want to do it. they have to be going for every edge. that’s why cliburn was so good at showing me things like framing pitches . he went after every edge all the time( which is something he’s passed on to the a lot of the present major league twins players)
you have to have good body movement in addition to turning the glove to reach out and catch and imperceptibly flick the ball back in closer to the strike zone and you have to hold it , but not for too long like you’re begging.
the umps are right on a catcher’s back too and if the catcher isn’t smooth in movement the ump will feel it and the pitcher won’t get the call.
another little known fact is that a good catcher can get an ump thinking along with him. if the ump is say expecting a change up down and away to fool a hitter on an 1-2 count, even though it’s off the plate a little , if he’s in tune with the catcher and expecting the change in that location, he’s more likely going to call strike three.
add a little artful framing and it’s a done deal.
i think rick reed was just telling stories because he blew a call.
Tex’s look at as he rounded 3rd base yesterday was priceless, lol. Cervelli and Cano’s hits had hit the top of the wall I beliee , so why couldn’t his have done so? That’s what it looked like he was thinking – his grimace was hilarious.
Sherman doesn’t have Jeter in his top 3, but he has Youkillis, who isn’t even a member of a 1st place team (either is Mauer, but he’s just having such a great year)? Not that I ever take him seriously………..and intelligent? I’m not sure I would go that far.
My guess is that Girardi will use Melky as the starting centerfielder in the postseason and have Gardner come off the bench as a pinchrunner.
Melky as playoff experience and his overall AB’s have improved so much this season from past years. I believe that Girardi will reward him for that.
And as we saw last week, Girardi’s not afraid to take out his best player to be pinch run for in the late innings, so I’m sure Gardner will have plenty of use in the playoffs.
Once again I lean toward defense. Everyone remembers the great catch Gardner made at the stadium not long ago. Melky can’t make that play. That play won that game imo.
Now look at Friday night at the play Gutierrez made on Swisher which again imo won the game. Melky does not make that play but Gardner can.
Youkilis? Arod has basically the same numbers despite coming off of hip surgery and missing about 40 games.
I agree about Dice K – and I still want to see Bucholz pitch well against teams other than the Os and the Jays. To assume that he’s going to (he’s still relatively inexperienced) pitch lights out in the playoffs is an assumption I’m not ready to make.
That all said, the Sox have played extremely well for a long period of time and I would not be surprised at all if they made it to the WS.
Bardos, how did the Yankees peak earlier? Up until recently, they’ve played lights out……they’ve played incredibly since the ASB and, for the most part, going back to Alex’s return. Racehorses can peak early, but not baseball teams.
Bardos, how did the Yankees peak earlier? Up until recently, they’ve played lights out……they’ve played incredibly since the ASB and, for the most part, going back to Alex’s return. Racehorses can peak early, but not baseball teams.
The Yankees have trouble with Bucholz based on 1 game he pitched this year? They’ve hit him hard in the past…….
Thanks, Randy. I never really thought of the idea that a catcher can influence the umpire so that they are thinking in concert with each other. It makes sense though. Much appreciated.
i think melky is more valuable in certain situations & gardner others
when we need a run with speed gardner blows melky away
also dont discount gardners defense & the fact that melky has had years to get used to ml hitting that gardner has not
i think you keep doing what girrardi is doing
play melky for his power,arm,defense but when it is late & we need a run you put gardner in & hopefully it wont take the bat out of melkys hands & we lose his clutch hitting
girrardi has done it perfectly.brin gardner in late specificlly to steal & score
People need to stop acting like Melky isn’t a good defensive player. Besides Nick Markakis he has the best arm in the AL East. Anyone remember that game against torotno a few years ago when he threw out 2 runners at the plate to save the game in extras? WHat about the catch on manny? I completely understand that bad defensive players make some great plays, but these are just examples. Before Gardner came around, lets not forget people liked melkys glove a lot.
the yankees & rs are going to go back n forth no matter who pitches
history has shown that even last year when our pitching was lousy
but now we have an offense,bench & gardner for speed
CC is an ace, a horse, gets the big outs and goes deep in the game. He gets a knock for not being able to pitch consistently early in the year and for not having more Ks. He also gets a knock for pitching for a very dynamic Bomber offense – his job is too easy, say the uninformed. And, obviously, he plays for the Evil Empire and makes gobs of money so he gets a big knock there.
But CC is in the AL East and his team is going to the playoffs. IMO, those two things cancel out Greinke’s point and change advantage in ERA. Unless you want to make Cy Young about being the best pitcher on a team that’s going nowhere.
To get the Cy Young, when your tree falls in the forest, it ought to make some noise.
tom in nj-
umpires are almost always fans of the game. they like good baseball. if you can get them thinking along with you as a catcher all the better.
the best thing i ever did for understanding umpires was have a beer in the parking lot with some umpires after a semi pro game .
they told me things like they expanded the strike zone at that level with bad pitchers because the game would take forever if they didn’t. but the thing that came through was what fans of the games they were.
if you think about it ,to put in the time they do just for a chance at the major leagues they’d have to love the game. why not take advantage of that and use it to your advantage as a catcher.
Sherman’s intelligent, that’s really not up for debate. The fact that he uses his intelligence to be disingenuous or contrived and contrary is a different story.
Sherman doesn’t rank Jeter in the top three because he is a slave to power hitting for MVPs. A lot of MVP voters are, despite the fact that SS is still not really a power hitting position, like corner OF or 1st or 3d base.
Jeter got robbed in ’06. IMO, he ain’t getting that close this year.
murphydog
cy young is for the best pitcher not mvp
it as nothing to do with how well a team plays
if it is close there could be an argument but greinke has better numbers this year
Randy 1 – Let me be clear that I thought the pitch to Green was a low strike (but not a slam dunk call).
The Angel’s catcher didn’t actually “frame” the pitch, which I take to be tilting the glove toward the strike zone, but not really moving it.
The Angel catcher lost the strike call when he reached down to get it, and then pulled it back up. The umps think that, if the catcher moves the pitch back towards the strike zone, the catcher is acknowledging that it was a ball.
Nobody who throws a helmet at at skinny pitcher right before being body slammed should be involved in the MVP discussion. Unless we’re talking about a different “P”.
That’s ignorant.
http://www.southparkstudios.co.....el+Jackson
greinke still had to face basically the same competition cc did
cy is for the best pitcher that is why the pitcher with the best numbers wins all the time
cc can make it close
mvp is different
If it’s all about defense than Damon or Matsui is the DH because the best defensive OF is Swisher, Gardner, Melky. You have to strike a balance.
Patrick — Batlett and Zobrist ahead of Tex for MVP? Talk about a credibility killing comment.
Pretty cool to know a playoff berth could be cilnched by the end of the day!
bru:
I’ll spot you the playoff-bound argument for now.
Given the unbalanced schedule, isn’t there a meaningful difference in your mind between pitching in the AL East and the AL Central, where the best team has a grand total of 78 wins, the lowest for any team leading a division?
IMO, when you play more of your games within the division, all numbers are relative, even Greinke’s.
And the pressure of pitching meanlingless games in front of a bunch of water fountains is not the same as the pressure of facing down the AL East and of anchoring a staff, especially a staff with a couple of knuckleheads.
“especially a staff with a couple of knuckleheads”
I thought they ditched Pavano
Greinke has faced Boston how many times so far this year?
I think the pressure argument is a better one than the divisional one as far as the Cy Young Award unless someone actually calculates the average records of the teams each top starter has faced.
The divisional argument is better for position players because they play just about every day but some starters in the East could end up missing a lot of divisional opponents for any mumber of reasons.
brian (red sox fan)-
varitek ,himself, has the little flick move that i think a catcher has to have to frame a pitch. the glove very quickly just turns out of the zone to snatch the ball and with a flick of wrist the catcher brings it back in the zone to hold it there to give the ump a good look . if done right the ump doesn’t see the flick with it being kind of a magician’s move of the hand being quicker than the eye.
i actually never saw a replay of the pitch to green, but if the catcher is actually moving his arm and glove to make it look better that will only annoy an ump. too obvious isn’t good.
from all the flack he received nationally i’d guess the ump blew the call.
on another note, is being a red sox fan a mental illness or just a personality disorder?
there was some discussion earlier of the difference between the two things
Grienke has made 15 starts within his division with six against the AL East, six against the AL West and three against the NL.
His six starts against the AL East have been two each against Baltimore, Toronto and Tampa Bay. He has not faced the Yankees or the Red Sawx. He is schedule to face Boston Tuesday and pitch again on Sunday, missing the Yanks again.
CC has made 12 starts in the division. 8 VS AL Central, 8 VS AL West and 4 Vs NL. He’s faced the Red Sawx three times.
murphydog
i dont see a difference much in offense in our division compared to others in the al & in some years our division is not as good.
it is still the al with ml hitters
the nl might be different that is why there are 2 cy.
sabathia has gotten beat by crappy teams just like greinke
if you took the approach & give it to sabathia this year every year the pitchers with better numbers would get robbed every year
if greinke was on the yankees & cc on the worst team in the al but had far supperior numbers should cc not get it?
Greinke DOES NOT face the same competition that CC does time after time after time. Remember, the AL East is the toughest division, period…
Wrong. There are actual calculations of quality of lineups faced: http://www.baseballprospectus......cid=520412
Opponent quality OPS:
Greinke .752
Sabathia .749
Simply disgusting. Won’t be surprised if Boston catches us next weekend.