Closing Time
Posted by: Sam Borden - Posted in Misc on Oct 12, 2009 
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While watching Huston Street fall apart in the ninth inning of the Rockies-Phillies game, it got me thinking about what an awful postseason this has so far been for some of the top closers in the game.
Street saved 35 games this year and had a 0.91 WHIP. He then got knocked around badly and failed to hold a two-run lead in Game 4 as his team’s season got washed away tonight at Coors Field.
Ryan Franklin? He struggled (albeit with some help from Matt Holiday). Joe Nathan? Downright awful. Brad Lidge didn’t blow a game for the Phillies but his back-up/replacement, Ryan Madson, nearly did. And of course no one had a bigger meltdown than Jonathan Papelbon, who had the Red Sox one strike away from extending their series numerous times before ultimately giving it up.
All of this is just a long way of saying that Mariano Rivera is pretty fantastic. And that, especially this year, his presence is going to be absolutely critical. That sheared bat he engineered against Joe Mauer in the eighth inning last night is just the beginning of a stretch where he’ll continue to face the opposing team’s best hitters with everything on the line. And there isn’t a game situation that makes the Yankees feel any more comfortable.
“It was a great feeling as a catcher when he came in, and it’s a great feeling as a manager when you have him doing this,” Joe Girardi said. “You feel really good about when you put him in the game, that you are going to win that game, and that he is going to shut down the other clubs. We all know there is no one perfect, but Mo is really, really good.”
There’s a reason Mo’s the G.O.A.T. or G-d, take your pick.
Gd right, Rebecca
Some things to be thankful for:
We live in a great country
Melted chees on fries
And Mariano Rivera !!!
I think Street’s meltdown may be the worst. He was about to pull his team back to even, and then anything can happen.
Even without Papelbon’s repeated failures through the 8th and 9th, the Sox still would have had 2 more wins to go.
Not to take away from Papelbon’s failure though. It definitely gets entertainment value points.
Doreen,
You go, girl! Why is it so hard to say, “I think the Yankees will win because they’re the best team.”? Is that too boring? Did you read my post this morning? The guy on the radio actually said he thinks the Angels are going to win it because they’re playing for Adenhart. Like other players don’t play for loved ones? Swisher plays for his grandparents. Alex plays for Kate.
I feel bad. I walked in and heard cheering when I turned on the TV, so I figured they were winning. And they were, with Utley at the plate. And it went downhill from there.
Hughes will be fine. No one can possibly say put Joba in there based on 3 outings when Phil’s been doing it for half the season. Joba’s more likely to put guys on base, too. Robertson’s the only one that’s as good or better than Hughes.
Why do they cover the lockers but not the carpet? Do they just change the carpet and charge the visiting club?
===========================
4 good closers couldn’t get the three outs before giving up 2 runs. I know it’s not that easy and these guys are not automatic, but thats a freakish phenomenon.
That’s like you, me, Jose Molina, and Miguel Cairo getting a walk-off GS on the same weekend.
I’ll take Phil’s struggles over those guys right now.
Yankees over Angels in 7
Dodgers over Phillies in 6
Yankees over Dodgers in 6
RS,
I completely understand your sentiment on Giambi at least trying, but his contract was far more of a detriment than Pavano’s. Not to mention I would say Giambi is a even bigger scumbag than Pavano. Pavano is a woose and an idiot (car accident) but Giambi lied and cheated his way to 126 million dollars.
Giambi got paid $20 million a season for the Yankees to be a worse version of Adam Dunn in 6 of his 7 years here.
If you could go back in time you would honestly sign Giambi over Pavano if you had a choice?
Imagine what the Yankees could have done with $126 million.
“I think Street’s meltdown may be the worst. He was about to pull his team back to even, and then anything can happen.”
His and Papelsmear’s are probably even as they were both trying to save their team’s from elimination. It doesn’t matter that BOS would have had to win two more games. They needed to win that day; that’s all that matters. Same with COL.
They just announced Friday’s coverage begins at 7:30 on Friday. Haven’t heard about Saturday yet.
“Imagine what the Yankees could have done with $126 million.”
Sign half of Alex Rodriquez?
Yankees over Angels in 7
Phillies over Dodgers in 6
Yankees over PHI in 6
Giambi was the guy they signed for the 2002 season only. You are right about him and the Adam Dunn impersonation. We are finally remembering this year what it is to have a real first baseman. After Mattingly and then Tino, a lot of us took 1st base defense for granted.
Jim Tracy needs to show more fire and anger at the podium GEEZ his team just lost a devestating game and choked it up. I dont get it.
Laura – I’m going to need valium to get through the next series!
October 12th, 2009 at 10:02 pm
“Imagine what the Yankees could have done with $126 million.”
Sign half of Alex Rodriquez?
***
Which half
92 hours and 13 minutes until Game 1!!!!!!
m =
As I type this, TBS is doing an Adenhart thing.
I didn’t read any posts after about 10 or 11 am. I do have sympathy for Adenhart’s family and his team.
But please. This was not Thurman Munson. This was not a guy who was on the team for years. It is a sad, horrible thing that happened. It must have been a shock to the system.
But this is getting a little too much play.
I’m more impressed that they came back from having 3/4 of their starting staff on the DL to start the season.
I am not hard=hearted by any means. But this constant need to find an angle to sell baseball games is crazy. Who would the team of destiny be if the “little engine that could” (Twins) had beat the Yankees, or the Rockies?
I wonder, seriously, how many of these veterans had actually spoke to Adenhart?
You should see the hilarious preview that they made on Halos Haven
http://www.halosheaven.com/200.....?ref=yahoo
I don’t think these Californians know anything about baseball at all. Hah they think that they can come into Yankee Stadium in a game 7 and have an advantage haha, guess they’ve never met the creatures.
Yankees over Angels in 6
Dodgers over Phillies in 5
Yankees over Dodgers in 5
“Jim Tracy needs to show more fire and anger at the podium GEEZ his team just lost a devestating game and choked it up. I dont get it.”
The Rockies have a lot of young, inexperienced players and I’m sure Tracy didn’t want to upset them or discredit what they’ve done just to get to this point. This isn’t the Yankees, where it’s WS or bust and the players expect the backlash that comes from failure.
Also, this wasn’t exactly a “team loss.” Street pretty much blew this on his own, so ripping this loss would have kind of thrown his closer under the bus since everyone knows he’s the main culprit.
Doreen – If you think this is bad, just wait until Friday night, and our favorite baseball network. FOX will play this tragedy and poor guy’s memory for every bit of emotion that they can. It will be a display of cynicism beyond compare.
Yet another reason to mute the TV, and listen to WCBS and John and Suzyn.
I understand that Adenhart was special to the Angels because he was a pretty big prospect and a big part of their future (nearly on the same level as Hughes/Buchholz), but I also think it’s irritating to hear that the Angels are going to win the ALCS and WS BECAUSE of his death.
I mean, isn’t it kind of an insult to the players to imply that it takes a tragic death for them to get their act together and play their best baseball?
Sawing off Mauer can go on Mo’s Hall of Fame video, in the same section as Chipper Jones openly laughing in the Braves dugout as Mariano kept sawing off Ryan Klesko’s bats in the 1999 World Series.
The whole AROD hate, Giambi love is something that really bothered me about Pete. His bias there was just so utterly ridiculous and clearly his way of expressing some personal vendetta towards AROD.
It also bothers me about Yankee fans. Someone here who really likes Giambi, I would really honestly like to know why. Post 2001 he is probably my least favorite Yankee.
lets go yankees (formerly lets go twins)
October 12th, 2009 at 10:32 pm
The whole AROD hate, Giambi love is something that really bothered me about Pete. His bias there was just so utterly ridiculous and clearly his way of expressing some personal vendetta towards AROD.
It also bothers me about Yankee fans. Someone here who really likes Giambi, I would really honestly like to know why. Post 2001 he is probably my least favorite Yankee.
*****
You have a problem with me because I liked Giambi?? Yeah, I totally had the Giambi mustache last year. Why?? Cause it was fun. And he was a Yankee. And I will root for all of them.
Hear! Hear! Mo!
Hope the Giambino plays for the Rox again next season. Nice run Colorado.
The worst part of it is, it’s making me feel like an awful person because I’m really hating the story line.
And here I thought the Yankees winning 2 of 3 in Anaheim had killed any extra-curricular backstory.
And, oh my goodness, if the Yankees manage to beat the ultra-motivated Angels only to meet the LA Dodgers, I’m not going to be able to stand it, considering all the stuff that can be brought up there.
What’s the Phillies’ angle? Anyone know?
As m said, can’t they just present these teams for what they are – very good, very evenly matched baseball teams?
Erica, the end of my post was worded very poorly. I meant the Yankee fans who hate AROD but love Giambi, like Pete did.
And I rooted for Giambi as well when he was a Yankee, because obviously if he did well it helped the Yankees. My comment was really meant for the people who continue to root for him.
I never liked the Giambi signing, but Giambi has a winning personality. I rooted for him. And I root for him now. I’m just glad the contract ran its course and we now have Tex!
Doreen,
I think you and I are on the same page. By all accounts, Adenhart was a great kid.
I just think it’s foolhardy (and a little wishful thinking) for anyone (especially an analyst) to say that this tragedy is one of the x-factors that will help them beat some pretty darn good teams, be it the Yankees in the ALCS or the NL champion in the WS.
M, how is Robertson as good as Hughes………or even better?
lets go yankees (formerly lets go twins)
October 12th, 2009 at 10:40 pm
Erica, the end of my post was worded very poorly. I meant the Yankee fans who hate AROD but love Giambi, like Pete did.
And I rooted for Giambi as well when he was a Yankee, because obviously if he did well it helped the Yankees. My comment was really meant for the people who continue to root for him.
****
I understand. My theory is, to truly love a team and be a real fan you have to love the team in its entireity. In good times and in bad, for better or for worse.
If you want to cheer for A-Rod as he ties the ALDS Game 2 in the bottom of the 9th, you need to stand by him as he strikes out. If you want to cheer for an AJ Burnett strike out, you need to deal with his walks.
Its a common saying that baseball is the only profession where you can do your job well a third of the time, but still be considered great. Well, if you want to be there for the glory. You need to watch the failures.
Okay.. I just went off on a major tangent. I am done now
m -
We are on the same page.
It’s television sports broadcasting at its worst. Just a hook.
Also Ken,
Not rooting for AROD at this point is essentially not rooting for the Yankees. What does AROD on a personal level have left to prove? He has a $300 million dollar contract that will take him to the end of his career. Aside from the HR record he has nothing left to do on a personal level and no more money to make. It is all locked up.
His success in the next 10 years has basically everything to do with the Yankees and nothing to do with him. Love it or hate it AROD is basically the Yankees until he retires. If he sucks then the Yankees are in big trouble. At this point, you can not really be a Yankee fan and at the same time not root for AROD. Case and point, the series with the Twins.
people who rooted for giambi, rooted for his character, his ‘type’ of person. He was real, he had personality, he had tattos, drank, said some goofy things. He was different than the rest of the corporate machine. He was a ‘real’ guy, relatively speaking…much like people can relate better to a character like Indiana Jones over someone wth inhuman abilities, like superman. rooting for him was rooting for your neighbor or your brother to do better and become the hero we want them to be.
unfortunately, as his abilities went downhill relative to his dollar value, he kind of just became a big waste of a space. Remember when he wouldn’t go down to the minors?
At least im consistent – i hate BOTH a-rod and Giambi because they cheated the game. To me, cheating is the worst possible thing in sports. I can deal with losing as long as effort is being shown but I have no tolerance for steroid usage. I was very dissapointed to learn so many of the boys of summer were doping. I have to be consistent. It started with McGuire. I was dead set against him getting into the Hall. Sadly for A-Rod he lost his credibility in my eyes. I cant root for the guy.
I think Yankee fans need to stop getting upset or concerned every time Mo walks someone or gives up a hit – he can’t be perfect and frankly, 99% of the time, Mo ends up giving up nothing. What we saw tonight and from Franklin and Paplebon, well – that is what almost all fans have to deal with on a fairly regular basis. Maybe the leads won’t always be blown, but these guys will put runners on and give the fans agita.
I’ve always wondered how closers who blow games like this look their teammates in the faces…….
Full count walks were key in three of the closer meltdowns: Franklin (Casey Blake/winning run); Papelbon (Figgins/tieing run); Street (Utley/tieing run). Nathan didn’t walk anyone to blow his save but he did go 3-0 on Alex before the HR. Mo usually (usually) doesn’t hurt himself that way.
I can totally understand why someone would be jaded by Giambi. It’s possible to cheer the situation and the moment and not the player. I never liked or trusted Clemens, but whenever he was on the mound from 99-03 I rooted hard for him as anyone. Same thing with Randy Johnson, Raul Mondesi, or any of the other mercenaries who have come and gone.
I don’t know about anyone else, but when anyone strikes out, I curse and yell and, yes, boo. It’s a natural reaction. If you’re one of those people who say “Oh well, you may have struck out to lose the series, but we stil support and love you” right after a tough less, more power to you. My immediate reaction is anger and frustration.
If anybody in here ever becomes a sportscaster, and gets the opportunity to do post game interviews during a champagne celebration…don’t wear a lime green plastic poncho.
What a schmuck.
It does make it difficult to not root for one of the guys on “your side” but I was the same way with Clemens. Never cared for the guy. He head-hunted Jeter for years and then got on the juice in Toronto and revitalized his career. I was shocked to see how many fans “forgave” him simply because he was wearing pinstripes. Absolutelty two faced in my eyes. I wasnt the least bit surprised when the allegations came out about him doping. Im very glad his chance for the Hall was destroyed by his greed.
People already hate the Yankees – they don’t need reasons to root against them. I’m truly sorry for Nick Adenhart’s death, but that does not make them a team of destiny and it’s pretty sick of mediots to imply that it does. I’m sure FOX will play the heck out of that story and that’s too bad. However, the games are to be played on the field and the Yankees are going to be tough customers.
Giambi? I don’t care about him……..he wasn’t close to being a fan favorite of mine. I’m so glad he’s gone…….and I don’t give a hoot what he does in Colorado.
Erica, I agree with you. You take the good with the bad in players……Anyone that can’t even root for Alex as a Yankee, well…..I won’t even go there.
Ken,
But as I said in my post. How can you possibly root for the Yankees and at the same time root against AROD?
Betsy,
How is Robertson not as good? I mean it’s all relative. Robertson used to walk a ton of guys. He doesn’t now. Robertson strikesout a lot of batters, misses a lot of bats. Pretty automatic, nice curveball (lol).
Hughes is good, a little more vulnerable in the last few weeks, but nothing to be alarmed about. And certainly not worth losing his job over.
Bottom line is that Robertson is more than capable of setting up. And you, as a Phil to the rotation type of girl, should cheer for Robertson to win the job next season.
We need a test for HgH or this discussions becomes moot… We dont know how many of these guys have simply switched to Hgh because there is no blood testing thanks to the Players Union. I worry they have just switched to different dope.
E:60 running a segment on CC on ESPN2 (season premier)
It’s funny how fickle fans can be. One minute you’ll cheer for a player, the next minute boo him at the slightest sign something is amiss.
I remember at the beginning of the season, Pettitte would be getting trashed by a slew of individuals and anytime he would do anything remotely good they would bring up how he faded last season and it was because he was washed up, not becuase of any injury. Then, he comes up big in the playoffs and all season and suddenly those same people were praising him last night and acting as if they backed him up all season.
The same can be said for anytime Joba has done anything. When he does good everybody is on the bandwagon. The slightest sign of trouble, it’s time to throw tomatoes at the guy.
Here’s the ALCS page at espn.com
Lots of goodies, check out the expert picks lower right of the page…
http://espn.go.com/mlb/playoff.....ls-yankees
Cursing, yelling and booing is a natural reaction? No, it’s a learned reaction and crowd mentality at it’s worst.
Lets go Yankee, I love the Yankees but I dont have to love each and every player on the team. Im not an ARod guy. He always came across as a bit of a phoney and I couldnt warm up to him even before the allegations. After the steroids came out I lost all respect for him. Its irrepairable damage in my eyes. I just cant root for a steroid guy. I drew the line with McGuire after I was fooled into watching the home run chase with him and Sosa. Cheating makes the game meaningless. I cant forgive ARod for what he did. A hot post season is not going to make up for what he did.
Wait, I don’t think anyone’s throwing tomatoes at the guy.
Just don’t think that Joba with his proclivity of putting men on base shouldn supplant Hughes based on what Joba did 2 years ago out of the bullpen.
The truth of the matter is that, at times, Joba has not been very good. In fact, people have gone out of their way to say all kinds of nice things about him. No one’s throwing tomatoes at the kid. If anything, people are trampling each other to get on the bandwagon. Which is funny, because he’s got a lot of work to do to fill his potential as a front end pitcher.
Jeter holds no grudge against Clemens head hunting him and the whole lying cheating steroids thing didn’t seem to bother him when they were hanging out together last off season.
Hating a persons actions does not mean you have to hate the person.
Nobody got to celebrate at home in any of the division series.
M, there is no way Robertson has been as good as Phil…..he just hasn’t. We can agree to disagree.
I’m not a Phil to the rotation girl – there is nothing to debate there.
I do think the Yankees have completely messed Phil up by keeping him in the pen. He’s dumped his curve and who knows if he’ll get the feel back for it again? Now he also has to learn a change…….they have really set him back for next year.
I can accept Alex’s past, doesn’t mean I like it. But I can accept it because nothing’s going to change it. You just have to take it and any accomplisments with a grain of salt.
I’ll never worship the guy because not only was he phony (before the steroid scandal), but it turns out he was a fraud. But I’ll still cheer for him, because if he’s good enough for his manager and teammates then he’s good enough for me.
What I mean is, there is no debate as to whether Phil is going to be a starter or not, so I don’t need to be on the bandwagon for him to be in the rotation. The idea of him as a full-time reliever is ludicrous, IMO.
And I don’t get the scorn some people are getting for expressing their opinions. It’s absolutely possible to cheer for your team without liking and cheering for everybody.
Ken, so what do you do when AROD hits a HR, wins a game, gets an RBI, makes a great defensive play, etc.? What did you do when he hit that HR off Nathan as someone asked before?
I can see how it is possible that you can love the Yankees and not root for, I don’t know, let’s say Eric Hinske. But Arod? He is the best player on the Yankees and has been the entire time he has been here and probably will be for the next 9 years. Like I said before because of his role on this team, his talent, and his contract it is pretty impossible to separate the Yankees and AROD at this point.
CC segment on E:60…EPSN2
M, we had this discussion with AJ. You thought that because I was angry with him, I wasn’t rooting for him to do well on the mound. That was never the case. I can’t respect anyone who hates a player so much that he can’t root for that player as a member of the team he roots for. If that player doesn’t do well, then it hurts the team. How is that being a good fan?
m
Fans don’t have to like every player but they should be supportive of them if they want the team to do well.
Watching E:60, CC says Tex is his pick for MVP this year.
This isn’t a response to this post, but just a comment about the game posts. I was at the game on Friday, but checking LoHud from my blackberry and I found that once you began a second post, I couldn’t get to it. I’m not totally sure that it wasn’t something I did, but I couldn’t find a link for the second post. The first page has links of all of the most recent posts, but it didn’t have that… Just thought I’d let you know incase there was something that could be done differently.
Thanks & I love reading…
Could one root for a team and not like the best player on the team? Any Laker fans here?
m October 12th, 2009 at 11:11 pm
I can accept Alex’s past, doesn’t mean I like it. But I can accept it because nothing’s going to change it. You just have to take it and any accomplisments with a grain of salt.
I’ll never worship the guy because not only was he phony (before the steroid scandal), but it turns out he was a fraud. But I’ll still cheer for him, because if he’s good enough for his manager and teammates then he’s good enough for me.
—
I agree, m.
http://espn.go.com/mlb/players.....erId=28638
Hughes: Last 15.1 IP he’s given up 5 ER (some were given up by Mo)
http://espn.go.com/mlb/players.....erId=29172
Robertson: Last 14.1 IP he’s given up 4 ER
“Could one root for a team and not like the best player on the team? Any Laker fans here?”
I think that’s impossible. If you like a team, you obviously enjoy when they’re playing well, and usually the best player on the team is the person making those good things happen.
I’ve been very hard on A-rod, but when he hit that bomb off Nathan, I immediately posted that I was happy for him. Because I know what it meant to him personally. That it tied up the game is just a minor detail.
Just felt that it was nice for him because he went through a lot personally. The steroid scandal was his own doing. But going through a divorce and serious surgery were bad enough.
I’m a Laker fan. What kind of question is that? Am I supposed to not root for Kobe or something?
I guess that’s where the saying “rooting for laundry” comes from because, truth be told every team has at least one person on the team who compromises the ethical system of the fan who roots for them.
Angels approach- make teams make plays.
http://www.newsday.com/columni.....-1.1519414
this should effectively end the Papelbon/Rivera comparisions for awhile.
the sox might be wise to trade him and re-up with Wagner while grooming Bard for the job.
No, m. I was talking about Ron Artest.
The rapist never entered my mind.
91 hours and 51 minutes until Game 1!!!!
Good night Yankee people!!
Erica – always OPPC October 12th, 2009 at 11:39 pm
91 hours and 51 minutes until Game 1!!!!
—————
Gonna be a long 91 hours. I was hoping I could at least see a game for my birthday. I just hope we can skip the entire day in general then.
I appreciate the countdown, but 3 days sounds better than 91 hours.
m
October 12th, 2009 at 11:25 pm
http://espn.go.com/mlb/players…..erId=29172
Robertson: Last 14.1 IP he’s given up 4 ER
————————————–
Phil Hughes wishes he had David Robertson curveball. Robertson will be the future 8th inning guy.
Robertson K/9 12.99
Hughes K/9 10.05
m
October 12th, 2009 at 11:42 pm
I appreciate the countdown, but 3 days sounds better than 91 hours.
******
I considered changing the format, but I have been doing it this way on all of my countdowns. I do not want to mess with what is winning. Look at this this way, it was 105 hours when I first updated this morning. We are making huge strides already!
Okay.. now good night Yankee people!
“The rapist never entered my mind.”
I know, Kevin Garnett is a sick human being for raping that woman, if he did in fact commit the crime.
What a heartbreaking loss for the Jets. But they can seemingly score at will. They are a scary, scary team. And no one can accuse the Patriots of stealing all the good players. Braylon Edwards had a terrific debut. But word of caution, he and LeBronze are in a catfight right now.
Twins cite Yankee coolness in sweep
“Every time we put up a run or two or we scored, they don’t panic,” outfielder Denard Span said. “They seemed like they just took a deep breath. It’s almost like they relaxed even more and answered back. They always answer back.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10.....twins.html
Did anyone see the 2nd and Goal play for the Dolphins on their last possession. It was a clear intentional grounding, of which the Jets were penalized earlier in the quarter, and they got away with it. It essentially gave them the victory.
pat,
Personally? I appreciate the Pavlovian response to being scored on. But I’d like to have a wire-to-wire win once in a while!
m
I’ve gone on record as saying runs close and late don’t impress me as much as the stat people.
I prefer runs early and often. It makes my stress level watching games lessen.
Pat, that’s a great article; thanks for posting!
First of all……..Denard Span was 12 years old when Jeter was just starting out. That’s scary in that I can’t believe how long ago it was, lol. Jeter is now playing with kids that had posters of him on their walls. Wow.
Secondly, this is article should give all Yankee fans confidence in their team.
pat,
But, this season it feels like we’re playing with an ace in our back pocket. Even in the games we lost, we’ve had chances late or gone down to the last at-bat. I think they’ve rolled over just once (seattle?), maybe twice. No panic as a fan.
“I prefer runs early and often. It makes my stress level watching games lessen.”
Near the end of games, my fingers are burning as my fingernails are bitten all the way down, my lips are bleeding from biting the skin off them, and my heart is beating a mile a minute and feels like exploding. But, that is playoff baseball.
And yet, there will still be people jumping off bridges when we lose our first playoff game.
Amos Moses
October 12th, 2009 at 10:21 pm
You should see the hilarious preview that they made on Halos Haven
http://www.halosheaven.com/200…..?ref=yahoo
I don’t think these Californians know anything about baseball at all. Hah they think that they can come into Yankee Stadium in a game 7 and have an advantage haha, guess they’ve never met the creatures.
———————————-
That is really funny. This is my favorite, “Mariano Rivera is better in every statistical category, but Brian Fuentes has more saves, and has been in a World Series more recently than Mr. Sandman… something to think about there combined with all of the knowledge above.”
BTW it was so hard to pick a favorite. From Bobby Abreu being a much better defender than Swisher to the look for Ayabar to outperform Jeter and Cano being “garbage” at 2b this is just too funny. But to even think for a moment Fuentes is even in the same stratosphere as Rivera is ludicrous.
I’m not convinced in this team yet
Yes, we can beet a mediocre Minneappolis team, but can we beat Boston or the Los Angeles Anaheim’s in a big spot?
We shall see later this week. Round 2 is a different beast from round 1.
“Phil Hughes wishes he had David Robertson curveball. Robertson will be the future 8th inning guy.
Robertson K/9 12.99
Hughes K/9 10.05″
Agree 100%
For those interested in the progress of our Ian Kennedy,
He will open the season for the Surprise Raptors of the AFL tomorrow.
The Yanks have 6 other players on the team:
Romine, Dunn, Duff, Kroenke, Laird, & Curtis.
How quickly we forget. It was Mo who cost us the World Series in 2001, and the ALCS in 2004. Those are two of the biggest blown saves in the history of the sport.
A 90% conversion rate in the postseason is awesome, but the man is far from infallible.
No true Yankee fan has forgotten 2001 or 2004 — or 1997.
“Someone here who really likes Giambi, I would really honestly like to know why.”
And “I would really honestly like to know why” you’re on Giambi.
The man posted a 143 OPS+ for us over seven years. That’s basically what Tex gave us this year.
So what the heck’s your beef, buddy?
Nick in SF….WHAT KIND OF NUMBERS DO YOU HAVE ON THE UPCOMING SERIES’S
PatM.
First, congrats on the sweep. It was a tough day to be at Fenway yesterday. Amy and I broke up 3 times on the train ride back to Portland and the ferry to the island…:)
I took the over this eve in MNF (big surprise) and asked about the yanks/angels and all he had was the money line at this point which was yanks -170 angels + 145.
Again, congrats yankee fans.
-dennis
Pat M: my book doesn’t have the lines up yet.
Pinnacle has the Yankees at -171 and the Dodgers at -127.
I bought the Yanks ALCS winners before the ALDS started at 4/5.
Thanks, dennis.
I passed some condolences your way yesterday, but I must admit I have enjoyed some moments of Soxenfreude since then.
Nice over tonight and a nice teaser middle as well.
Rough break on the 5-star yesterday. I forgot to take into account the mutual ineptitude of the Redskins and Panthers. It seems like the Skins are always involved in some pointless goal-line stand/turnover one way or another when points are needed.
Nick..
Other than the .5 loss on Sunday the 5-stars have been solid. 8-3.
However, the sox, pats, bc, not so much. Tough Sports weekend.
I did not see the condolences…Sarcastic?
Sleep is for the weak.
-dennis
The condolences were sincere on a personal level.
Not so much for the Nation at large. My comment for that was:
“Where have you gone, Justin Masterson
our Nation turns its lonely eyes to you”
I had the 5-star spread over a dozen teasers, so it wasn’t a total loss, only the straight bet.
I don’t recall the voter who was the only one who did not vote for Cal Ripken, Jr. But he said something like – he couldn’t vote for Cal because he didn’t believe anyone should have 100% of the vote. At the time I thought it was extremely petty.
Does anyone else remember this particular incident in the voting Cal Ripken in to the HOF??
Has anyone just a little bit, thought that Phil’s problems in the past two games might be that he is following Joba?
In the early part of the season Joba followed Phil. When Phil had a great game, Joba would also have a great game. For years although most people won’t admit to it – Joba and Hughes have been pitted against one another.
Who knows – had Phil remained in the rotation they might have pushed one another to 20 wins! Lol.
Hmmm, posts caught in filters twice. Must be a sign to pass out.
The World Series schedule does not allow for a 3-man rotation, unless you have every start after game 3 on short rest.
Say the Yankees use a 3-man rotation for the ALCS. Does that mean Gaudin pitches for the 1st time in a month in game 4 of the World Series?
“The man posted a 143 OPS+ for us over seven years. That’s basically what Tex gave us this year.
So what the heck’s your beef, buddy?”
Teixeira did it with a much higher batting average, and much better base running. That doesn’t even consider his amazing defense.
Yeah Street wasn’t any good. But Jim Tracy screwed up even more. Ryan Howard has extreme splits against different-handed pitchers. Against righties, he’s Albert Pujols. Against lefties, he’s a backup catcher. Tracy allowed the Pujols to explode out of him by ignoring Joe Beimel and instead using Street. btw, that matchup is the sole reason Beimel is on that team. tracy f’d up big time.
“Teixeira did it with a much higher batting average, and much better base running. That doesn’t even consider his amazing defense.”
Batting average is a poor man’s meter of success. OPS is really the most important offensive meter of success.
I liked Giambi, as his offensive production was at the top of the game. He is the classic example of why batting average is NOT a good meter of offensive production. Despite an avg in the 200′s, his ops was at the top of the league. Additionally, he had some of the best set of eyes in the game.
Having said that, Tex is a lot more valuable for a number of reasons, the most important being his glove. Giambi was a liability on the field, while Tex contributes to our win share with his gold glove caliber defense, the best since Donnie baseball.
Tex’s situational hitting is much better. Additionally, he makes AROD infinitely better because he is always on base. I could go on and on. Giambi was one of the best offensive producers, while Tex is a bona fide MVP candidate.
We will miss him when he’s gone. We have a generation that grew-up thinking the 9th inning was almost automatic and a good time to head to the car or grab some food from the fridge.
Met him in 1998 during a signing event in Tampa and he helped me carry my autographed memorabilia to the lobby. Curiously, none had his signature which was probably one of the the largest mistakes of my life.
All respect to the captain, he is the most valuable Yankee since Mantle and maybe since Joe D.
In the big picture, this means nothing….
But did anyone notice Giambi’s RBI hit??
Opposite field RBI hit?
Countering-the-shift opposite field RBI hit?
When did he learn how to do that??
Oh brother……….Jayson Stark on Mike and Mike just said he picked the Yankees to win the WS, so he’s “stuck” picking them, but he feels there is some kind of destiny thing going on with the Angels. Ugh – give me a break. I’m so sorry he’s “stuck” with the Yankees. Destiny? Yeah, right…based on what? I could easily say the Yankees are destined to win the WS if I believed in that garbage.
sounds like the NYTimes thinks the Angels are going to win, too http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10.....=1&hp
two thoughts:
1. didn’t everyone think the Red Sox were going to sweep the Angels anyway
2. how often are these prediction people right??
Most of the ESPN guys picked the Yankees……I wasn’t upset at Stark for potentially picking the Angels, I was annoyed at him for saying he was “stuck” with the Yankees like it was a bad thing…….Also, the destiny thing is really ridiculous. As someone mentioned on another board, what – the fates didn’t want to see the 2001 Yankees win the WS? They couldn’t have lost game 7 in a more painful manner. There is no such thing as destiny – and you had to hear Stark to believe how idiotic he sounded.
When his bat got so slow he couldn’t pull anymore?
Big Johnson —- OPS might be the best measure of INDIVIDUAL success, but runs and RBI are the most important stats in baseball. You don’t win games with a higher OPS, you win games with more RUNS. To me RUNS is the least appreciated stat in baseball
People love to debate this, but I find the debate ridiculous. OPS measures what an individual does, but runs and RBI are better measures of how meaningful a player’s production is.
A slow footed player who hits .200 with RISP is far less productive than his .875 OPS might indicate. Giambi’s high OPS has always been vastly overrated because his inablity to run the bases makes his OBP far less valuable.
It’s all about context.
Betsy -
If you read what I wrote last night and yesterday afternoon, you know how I feel about “destiny.”
The Angels swept the Red Sox because the Red Sox played terribly. They played like a tired team, which they were. If the Red Sox were the Red Sox of old, that series goes 5. Angels may have still prevailed, but the Red Sox should have won at least one game at Fenway Park.
And you’re right; if fate and destiny and karma had anything to do with who wins WS, the Yankees CLEARLY were the karmic favorite to win in 2001.
Intelligent baseball fans know it will come down to which team is able to play their brand of baseball in the crispest fashion. The team that makes the least mistakes usually wins.
I am annoyed because I feel that Nick Adenhart’s death is being exploited, not by the Angels, who have every right to be motivated by this tragedy, but by the people who stand to make ratings/money by introducing a “hook” to the games to give “cusp” fans and playoffs-only fans and even some non-fans a reason to tune in.
They seem to need a storyline above and beyond two really great baseball teams putting their best on the line.
3 qualifications to be a favorited player for me.
You must be a yankee
You must be on the field
or you must be at the plate
simple i think
Yeah, Mariano Rivera is awesome.
Game 7, 2001 WS.
Game 4, 2004 ALCS.
It all comes down to starting pitching–it always has, it always will.
Karma, memories of “dead” players, “clutch” hitting–all interesting from a human perspective, all useless from a baseball perspective.
The Yankee players got this one right: if your pitching keeps you to within a run or two going into the late innings, you always have a chance. That is the MO of a championship club, and that’s been the MO this year.
I like the matchups this year between the Angels and Yankees. Don’t listen to the “CC lost 2″ talk that supposed “experts” on ESPN and BBTN will throw at you–take a closer look, and a lot of the Yankee lack of success was pre ASB, when this was a different team. Also, I don’t think guys like Gaudin, Saunders, Joba, and Mitre are going to be playing big postseason starting roles in this series.
Yankees in 6.
Dudes October 13th, 2009 at 9:31 am
Yeah, Mariano Rivera is awesome.
Game 7, 2001 WS.
Game 4, 2004 ALCS.
—–
LOL 2 blown saves out of how many????
There are no sure things in baseball, but Mo’s the closest one. No one does it better than him in the history of baseball and I have a feeling no one will get quite as good as him from now on either.
“Teixeira did it with . . . much better base running.”
“Giambi’s high OPS has always been vastly overrated because his inablity [sic] to run the bases makes his OBP far less valuable.”
“[M]uch better”? “[V]astly overrated”? What nonsense. Tex is a pretty awful baserunner. He may not be any dumber on the paths than your average player, but he’s no faster than Giambi was.
As for “LOL 2 blown saves out of how many????”–you can’t be serious. Mo has been great in the postseason, no question. But you can’t discount the three SERIES he’s blown.