Hello from the Windy City
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- November
- 8
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It’s actually not all that windy in Chicago. Right now, the weather’s nice and I’m just settling into the hotel, listening to some Bob Schneider and reading through the comments from the previous post. Good to see folks are ready to jump into the hot stove season.
My two cents on two of the topics you’ve been discussing…
Top moment of the year? Alex Rodriguez coming off the disabled list with a home run stands out to me. It was a moment that held up through the year; the relaxed and productive A-Rod. I think the Yankees wanted and needed Rodriguez back in the lineup. They were below .500 at that point.
From the playoffs, I think I’ll always remember Johnny Damon sprinting for third base. A lot of baseball games and baseball plays bleed together, but that was something new. I’d never seen it, anyway. A great heads-up play in a huge, critical moment. Maybe not the most important play of the postseason, but I really good one that gave the Yankees a win. Also, I think A.J. Burnett’s performance in Game 2 of the World Series was huge. I think that’s a bigger game than Game 5. Yankees lose Game 5 — which they did, obviously — and they’re still going home with two chances to clinch. Lose Game 2, they’re going to Philly down 0-2. Burnett was incredible that day. That’s another that stands out to me.
———
As for trade possibilities, I’m not sure about the idea of trading Robinson Cano. That’s an awfully good bat at second base, and while the Yankees have plenty of in-house utility options, I’m not positive they have a guy who can step in and start right now. I’m really high on Kevin Russo and everyone loves Ramiro Pena’s glove, but I don’t see the Yankees handing either of them — or a guy like Jerry Hairston — the starting job at second base. Cano might frustrate fans because he doesn’t appear to be passionate — I don’t know whether he is or isn’t — but he’s a very good hitter at a position where very few good hitters exist.
Felix Hernandez is worth salivating over. Rafael Chaves was Hernandez’s pitching coach his first two full seasons in the big leagues, and when Chaves coached in Scranton, he said Hernandez is everything – and will be everything – he’s cracked up to be. Hernandez is 23 years old and he’s already one of the best pitchers in baseball, so you’d be hard-pressed to find a better trade target. But it’s going to take a ton to get him, and if I were the Mariners, there’s no chance I’d move him. I’m not sure anyone can match his combination of youth, talent and proven success. As for trading Phil Hughes or Joba Chamberlain, it’s impossible to rule it out and in certain situations it might make sense, but my concern would be that their current trade value might be a little lower than their long-term value to the Yankees. I really believe in both of them, and while you wouldn’t be trading them for pennies on the dollar, you might be moving them for 90 cents on the dollar.
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on Sunday, November 8th, 2009 at 6:10 pm by Chad Jennings.
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Sam Borden
Josh Thomson
Bob Schneider is great. His new song 40 Dogs is pure Bob. Good ear Chad!
I don’t expect any trades in Chicago, but you never know as the GMs will discuss potential trades amony themselves.
m
Most teams have a David Robertson type in their system?
So they have a middle relief guy who has actually pitched in the major leagues and has probably 20 more strikeouts than innings pitched, and who has a pretty good K/BB ratio??
I did not know that.
Given it was not much of a sample, but 12.98 K/9 innings.
2nd to only Jonathan Broxton in baseball.
I was wondering why it was so lonely in the last thread.
Nice to see that you arrived safely, Chad. Did you get tickets to the Oprah show? I hear they’re very difficult to get.
Why are people talking about trading Cano?
In the last thread I mentioned that madden said the Yankees might be open to trading montero for a pitcher. Felix is the only one remotely worthy, and it still seems farfetched.
Hughes is still untouchable for me. And Cano, too!
CR9,
Now you know!
Chad: Great analysis.
Chad, welcome to Illinois! You lucked out weather wise-while it’s supposed to rain tomorrow the temps are supposed to be in the high 50s/low 60s all week.
Edit: rain tomorrow, *but* the temps.
CR9,
I’m not trying to insult you or your intelligence.
I just meant that a lot of bullpen guys come from within a team’s system.
And I think I’ve said more than once that Robertson’s done a great job and that I think he can be the setup guy next season. (further reducing the chance of Robertson trade-if that’s what was being discussed).
Forgot the edit. I don’t know what’s wrong with me today.
Sorry.
No way they bait Cano….great talent and will be an important part of the ‘young core’ of the future….maybe Cano was a little burnt out from playing baseball for such a long period….remember he played in the Dominican league last winter…maybe some time off will do him some good
***Joba Chamberlain, Ajax, Austin Romine, Ramiro Pena plus one more prospect and some money incentives worked in for Felix Hernendez!!
Would it really take more than that? If so, then noone’s getting them. The red sox (the only other team i have heard that might trade for him) dont have that talent to offer if they think they are going to get him.
Lars Anderson is a way over rated prospect who has stunk at the AAA level. Bucholz is average.
m
I misunderstood.
No, I was discussing Robertson as having pretty good trade value, an extra piece to make a big deal, if we were to make a deal.
I do not want Robertson traded, and I do not think he will be traded.
OK, that’s supposed to say “forget the edit” not forgot. I think I have ADD today. Sorry again.
I think no one is untouchable from a trade point of view if they do not have no trade clause.
It comes down to are you making your team better by the trade. If Cano along with some prospects nets King Felix, you do it. It is a no brainer. That is not to say Cano is not good. You have to give quality to get quality and both teams can benefit based on thier needs.
Any way I think all this Cano for Felix talk will never come to fruition as Mariners will not trade Felix, at least this year. He will not hit free agency for two more years.
Joba had a 3.58 era through 110 ip last year. He got messed up when the yanks started to skip and shorten his games. I never understood why people are in such a hurry to keep him in the bullpen to be the future closer. Mo is not going anywhere in the near future. You got to find out the next couple of years if he can become a good starting pitcher. If he doesn’t than you can send him to the bullpen and have him be the future closer.
Game 2 versus MN was also amazing. The A-Rod HR to tie it and then Tex squeaking one over the wall, wow. Plus postseason pie = pretty great.
Erin
November 8th, 2009 at 6:33 pm
OK, that’s supposed to say “forget the edit” not forgot. I think I have ADD today. Sorry again.
*******
Ummm.. are you okay?
Heyman said on wfan that he doesn’t thing Felix Hernandez will get traded.
And if he does get traded the yanks would have to put a package like Montero, Jackson and either Hughes or Chamberlain maybe both. Remember the mariners were asking for Austin Jackson from the yanks just for Washburn.
I can’t see the Yankees landing Felix. whether the trade includes Cano or not.
How will Seattle explain that to there fan base. Same reason i can’t see the sox trading for Felix.
This is Roy Halliday all over again. The key for the Yanks is to keep Felix from the Sox.
“Heyman said on wfan that he doesn’t thing Felix Hernandez will get traded.”
I agree. How can they explain to their fans?
Look at the passions here at the suggestion of trading Cano
If Hernandez is determined to test free agency then I don’t see him getting traded. He has a chance to be the first 200M dollar pitcher after the 2011 season at the age of 25. He won’t turn 26 until after opening day of 2012.
What NYY has in the minors at 2nd base are better fits on other teams or other positions, much the same at short and catcher. NYY will move at least one catcher/ probably two into other positions. The best guess is Romine. He’s the fastest and most athletic. Two of the best are in low A ball in John Farnham and Kyle Higashioka. Others like Jose gil and Kyle Anson will be traded off. Montero is going nowhere.
At short, it gets a little tougher because Muruzak and Eduardo Nunez are the best of the lot. Third base should be covered with Rodriguez and Brandon Laird. Add in Corin Joseph and possibly Damon Sublett to infield mix, but, they are at least 2 years off, if they even make it. The major disappointments are Seth Fortenberry, Mitch Hilligoss and most of all, Carmen Angelini.
Outside of Jackson and Medchill, the outfield is thin. Mesa has a ton of power and speed and no clue of the strike zone. Good outfielder, though. That’s on reason to move Romine to a corner outfield spot. Outstanding arm, good speed and a really good bat.
Considering there is only one 2b in baseball better than RC and considering he has a very favorable contact, I have no idea why anyone would want to trade him unless you plan on getting Mett Kemp or Justin Verlander in return.
That is not a very encouraging with our position players in the farm GB
OFF TOPIC: Does anyone know where I can get Yankees Championship wallpaper for my computer?
I think we forget how much Cano’s defense improved this season. His arm is amazing and its so fun watching him turn two ..
“Considering there is only one 2b in baseball better than RC and considering he has a very favorable contact, I have no idea why anyone would want to trade him unless you plan on getting Mett Kemp or Justin Verlander in return.”
Well, people are talking about even a better pitcher in Felix as the return.
Erica-yes I’m OK. Just totally spacing out. One of those days. Thanks for your concern
Erin
November 8th, 2009 at 6:52 pm
Erica-yes I’m OK. Just totally spacing out. One of those days. Thanks for your concern
******
K- Good. I didn’t want to have to send Super Grover to save you.
Anybody else agree with Robinson Cano being better and having more potential than Pedroia?
I knew that the GM’s meetings were always in mid-November, but with the lateness of the Series this season everything just seens on fast forward…..
Just watching the 09 recap on mlb tonight….and I still cant understand how Holliday dropped that fly ball and then tripped…..wth?
Pat M.
Dont you wish you could just fast forward to April!!!
CR9
November 8th, 2009 at 6:55 pm
Anybody else agree with Robinson Cano being better and having more potential than Pedroia?
******
Cano is a natural better hitter. Which is his downfall. He has the Guerrerro-like ability to hit bad pitches which leads to undicipline at the plate. I still believe that Cano has the ability to win a batting title one day
“CR9 says:
November 8, 2009 at 6:55 pm
Anybody else agree with Robinson Cano being better and having more potential than Pedroia?”
I agree…don’t know how that violent swing will work for DP long term. Cano has such a smooth swing and he can hit anywhere while Pedrioa seem to rely more on the Green Monster for his numbers
If he ever learns plate discipline, watch out.
“Anybody else agree with Robinson Cano being better and having more potential than Pedroia?”
Time will tell.
Both have thier strengths and weaknesses.
I really have no idea why people are talking about Felix Hernandez; he’s not available and it’s just silly talk at this point.
Chad, I don’t know if you are aware of this, but Chicago got it’s nickname because of the way the Chicago press talked up the city when they were trying to get the 1893 World’s Fair (not because it’s windy)………..
Also, completely, completely agree about AJ’s game two. Most people remember only game 5, but that game meant very little in comparison to game 2. Huge performance by AJ……
It makes no sense to trade Phil or Joba unless you are getting a Felix back, so forget that……..
Erica – always OPPC
November 8th, 2009 at 6:55 pm
Erin
November 8th, 2009 at 6:52 pm
Erica-yes I’m OK. Just totally spacing out. One of those days. Thanks for your concern
******
K- Good. I didn’t want to have to send Super Grover to save you.
************************
. I feel stupid-I thought I had to edit something, then realized I didn’t need to, etc. I’m ready for this day to be over. LOL
You can always send Super Grover to see me.
BBFan
November 8th, 2009 at 6:50 pm
That is not a very encouraging with our position players in the farm GB
————————————————————
Really, it is, though. Almost all of them can really hit, but, they have defensive issues, mainly because their isn’t enough coaches at the lower levels. Until they get to Trenton, they don’t have fulltime infield and catching instructors. They even use players as base coaches. They have hitting instructors and pitching coaches, but, they all double with other duties. Romine and Laird are impressive young bats. Montero is in an entirely different universe. He’s that good. Others like Russo, Snyder, Curtis, Mesa, The Nunez kids, Joseph, Medchill and Jackson are solid to good bats with different skills.
Erin
November 8th, 2009 at 7:01 pm
You can always send Super Grover to see me. . I feel stupid-I thought I had to edit something, then realized I didn’t need to, etc. I’m ready for this day to be over. LOL
*******
No worries. You can only be called stupid on this blog is you say something baseball related that the rest of the population does not agree with
I am one 1-hour long TV show away from being fully caught up on all of my TV activities. Fringe from Thursday night is my last show to watch online. I am debating saving it. Not in the mood for guts and gore right now
Cano is a very talented player and I like him a lot, but his hitting with RISP is terrible. He was one of the few Yankees to do anything offensively against the Tigers in 2006, but the last few years he’s completely disapppeared. As I have said, the Yankees should not actively try to move him, but if they get offers and if they can fill other holes by doing so…….they should consider it. Yes, I realize they don’t have a 2nd baseman to replace him – they’d have to go get one. My criticisms of Cano have absolutely nothing to do with his passion or lack thereof – I couldn’t care less. I like that he plays with a smile on his face – the man is having a good time out there.
hey Erica! How was the parade?
mick November 8th, 2009 at 3:17 pm
The more I think about Matsui the more I realize how great he is.
To cut him loose after his performance in the Series would be sacrilegious. Something akin to what the red sox have done thru the years to guys like Boggs, Damon, Clemens etc…
In my mind it is bad karma as well as a very difficult bat to replace. I realize the economic side of it and I think that’s what it comes down to. If he settles for 1 year and less money they will bring him back. I do not believe the hooha that they need a place to rest Damon and Posada in the DH hole. They pretty much had that this year and it worked out ok. Keep Matsui, one year at a time, he is a specialist, like Andy, one year at a time. Not after what he did for us.
————————————————————
I am shocked at the apathy toward this man. Not one person even felt strongly enough to comment on Matsui in the last thread.
Surely he is underrated, quiet and not as popular as Damon, Jeter or even Swisher but he will be missed.
Pedroia has two things going for him. His short stature gives him a very small strike zone. He has some speed and moves quickly.
His big swing is going to decline his value over some time. Pitching him inside reduces his power. His speed will decline over time as well.
Cano makes a lot of plays that are tough, but because of how smoothly he moves he is called lazy.
LOL, just watching the Phillies/Yankees game on MLB, still waiting for Howard to touch Home Plate. Man. The strike zone still looks absurd, despite the talk from McCarver and Buck trying to cover for it.
Thanks Erica!!
The one good thing about baseball season being over is being able to catch up on TV.
Maybe this has been brought up before –
both Cano and Cabrera played winter ball last year.
you have to wonder if the longer season after playing winter ball left them both “hitting the wall” at the end of the year.
Oh well. the refs screwed the Giants.
How many holdings this game? 6, 8?
Best Offensive line in football, played 30+ straight games together.
First and goal at the 3 yard line with the Giants up 3 points, and they call a holding to put them at 1st and goal at the 13. CBS does not even show a replay to see if there was any holding.
f they can fill other holes by doing so…….they should consider it. Yes, I realize they don’t have a 2nd baseman to replace him – they’d have to go get one. My criticisms of Cano have absolutely nothing to do with his passion or lack thereof – I couldn’t care less. I like that he plays with a smile on his face – the man is having a good time out there.
——————————————————
betsy-
would you make this trade? granderson and polanco for melky and cano?
also, would you love cano’s smile if they didnt win the series…know thats a loaded question and not trying to be smart, just curious.
Christina-I don’t know if I told you before, but you got some great pictures!
Trading Cano would be crazy. There is one second basemen in all of baseball that I would take over him; Utley. It’s easy to forget how good he was over 162 games this season because of his bad postseason. He played Gold Glove defense and had an excellent offensive season. Robbie is a top 5 talent at a very, very shallow position.
The Giants said this was a playoff game, and the referees treated it as a playoff game, like the HP umpires treated the Yanks this postseason.
All the holding calls and offensive penalties that attempt to stall drives, and the biggest with a chance to possibly put the game out of reach.
Giants game over, referees win. theeeeeee refereeeees win!
Mick: would you make this trade? granderson and polanco for melky and cano?
Absolutely no way I even think about that trade. That would be an absolute steal for the Tigers. Polanco is not worth much at this point and Granderson is an average defender who hits .250.
CR9, Fast forward to March Madness would work for me…..I know SJ & I disagree on this subject, but I say the Yanks resign Matsui & not only resign him, he’s a priority……
SD 3-20 NYG 9-104
Those are the penalties.
At home.
And that does not count the 4 penalties against us that went declined.
Bravo referees. Too bad your umpiring brethren could not take # 27 away from the Yankees despite their best effort.
The only way I trade Cano is in a trade for a front line pitcher…
If King Felix is on the block, I do Jesus, Cano and Joba or Phil…CC and King at the front for the next 6 years, would be insane.
Keanu Reeves November 8th, 2009 at 7:18 pm
Mick: would you make this trade? granderson and polanco for melky and cano?
Absolutely no way I even think about that trade. That would be an absolute steal for the Tigers. Polanco is not worth much at this point and Granderson is an average defender who hits .250.
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Keanu,
I’m sure the Yanks would love to get Granderson for Melky, although the salary discrepancy is great.
It’s not so much that we lost and got cheated, directly causing our loss.
It’s that the holding call will go unmentioned by ESPN and other networks.
But when the Yankees won, it was “that bad Mauer call” and “the defenses of the Angels just wasnt there” and “the bad baserunning of the Twins” and “the 200 million payroll”
Erin November 8th, 2009 at 7:14 pm
Christina-I don’t know if I told you before, but you got some great pictures!
———
Thanks, Erin. My friend actually was able to go and shared them with me. I had an exam that day so was stuck at home. I was going to tell Erica to check out the one I have up of her pretend children with her pretend bf Johnny Damon. His oldest daughter looks just like him.
I also just spent today putting together a montage of the baseball season from spring training to the parade. They were all pictures I have taken this year. It came out pretty good. Kinda long but considering the season is so long and I went to a handful of games and baseball related places, it wasnt too bad. Its on my blog if you want to see.
“would you make this trade? granderson and polanco for melky and cano?”
with granderson coming off a down year…i dont knw, thats tough..
Joe from Long Island,
I’m doing okay. Had a bit of a setback this week. Not walking as well as I had hoped so it’s frustrating.
I have to be able to climb stairs before they discharge me and I’m nowhere near capable of doing that at this point.
I’m hoping to be here just another 10-14 days but it’s tough to accurately predict a discharge date right now.
Can’t wait to get home and sleep in my own bed. Oh yeah, and watch the championship parade.
Thanks for the concern.
Christina-I will definitely check it out. Sounds awesome!
All these trade scenarios involving players I like(and from the farm) is upsetting me
I hope Cashman doesn’t read this blog when making decisions
I would rather have Pedroia at this moment in time but Pedroia is pretty much at his peak, he’s not going get any better than he already is. With Cano, the sky is the limit. He can be as good as he wants to be so I’d rather have Cano going forward.
DT – OPPC member
November 8th, 2009 at 7:09 pm
Maybe this has been brought up before –
both Cano and Cabrera played winter ball last year.
you have to wonder if the longer season after playing winter ball left them both “hitting the wall” at the end of the year.
————————————————————
I wouldn’t think so. They only played a couple of weeks. None of the teams hit especially well in the post season. Cano did pretty well in the ALCS against the angels. He plated some big runs with his double and two triples.
I can’t think of anyone who hit .300 in all three rounds. Even Jeter was at .259 in the ALCS and Rodriguez only hit .250 in the WS, but, they were quality hits. in 2006 and 2007 Cano hit .300 with RISP, but, this year, he was bad. He didn’t have a great deal of help in front and behind him, because Swisher and Cabrera had such peaks and valleys. They either crushed everything or hit nothing.
Cabrera wasn’t consistant, but, those are pretty decent numbers, overall. They (Cano and Cabrera) are still young, so, I’ll be more concerned about those that aren’t getting better. More concerns with Chamberlain than Cano and Cabrera. Next year, Chamberlain needs to get it together or go. It has more to do with conditioning and stopping with the excuses than ability.
Two things, Did anyone find video of AJ pieing Joe?
And has anyone found the WS wallpaper. I’ve tried to make it since I have Adobe Photoshop, but I am so clueless at that program. Don’t know how to make it.
tampayank
November 8th, 2009 at 7:27 pm
All these trade scenarios involving players I like(and from the farm) is upsetting me I hope Cashman doesn’t read this blog when making decisions
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If Cashman made the trades suggested here he would be trading the Yankees “out” of the WS.
Mick: I’m not sure about that. Melky is younger, cheaper and has a similar ceiling to Granderson. If it was me I’d keep Melky.
If I were the Mariners, here is what I would want for Hernandez from the Yankees:
1. Cano
2. Montero
3. Joba/Hughes
4. Manny Bannuelos
Nothing less would be acceptable. That offer might not even be enough.
I guess nobody cares about Matsui.
The man who singlehandedly won the World Series for the Yanks.
His performance in game 6 was much like Reggie’s in 1977.
Sometimes I don’t get this blog.
Mick, I really don’t judge any player on whether they smile or not – I don’t care. I made my comment in response to Chad’s post that fans are frustrated by Robbie because he seemingly lacks passion. I’m not one of those fans; Robbie should not be penalized because he smiles or is ultra-smooth – that’s what I intended to say.
I am not familiar with Polanco, but no I would not make that trade. I still like Cano an awful lot and it would require getting someone pretty special back for me to trade him. The problem with Robbie is that he is very limited despite his talent. He can’t hit higher than 6th because he’s not a good RBI man – he’s horrible with RISP. I don’t know why he has such problems, but he will never live up to his full potential if this remains the case.
One thing I absolutely give him credit for is that he did not take his hitting woes out into the field with him; Cano deserves a gold glove this year – he’s just tremendous. He worked very hard in the off-season; I believe he was disappointed with his 2008 season and he wanted to rectify it. I give Robbie a ton of credit for that.
7789
November 8th, 2009 at 6:39 pm
Heyman said on wfan that he doesn’t thing Felix Hernandez will get traded.
And if he does get traded the yanks would have to put a package like Montero, Jackson and either Hughes or Chamberlain maybe both. Remember the mariners were asking for Austin Jackson from the yanks just for Washburn.
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if i can get king felix for joba,ajax,montero i do it in a second
we keep hughes & all 3 have proven nothing in the majors
joba not consistent
that would make our rotation unbeatable
Seattle will trade Felix at some point. I don’t know if it will be this year or not but a guy his age and with that ability is going to Free agency. Seattle can’t afford to let him walk away for nothing either so I’m thinking they will listen to offers this year or next until they hear something they like. Now what to offer is another topic..
http://www.flickr.com/photos/4.....3332/show/
Polonco is a FA, and other than base running, there is nothing that Pedroia does better than Cano. Cano is never going to walk 65-80 times a year. There isn’t a stronger, more accurate throwing arm at 2nd base in baseball than Cano’s. About once a year, he has a string of about 6 or 7 games that his errors stack up, and then, they disappear. No reason for it, but, almost all of his errors are on fairly easy grounders. Seldom do they cost games, though.
“I guess nobody cares about Matsui.”
Link?
Betsy
I’m not sure it is acurate to say Cano is limited in what he can do. Look at the progress he made this year from last year. With his talent he can continue to get better.
Cano is night and day better defensively than he was a couple years ago. He makes plays that nobody else in baseball can make because of his arm strength and he turns the double play better than anybody. His only flaw both offensively and defensively is occasional lapses in concentration. If he cleans that up and learns to focus on every pitch and every play then he has MVP talent.
mick November 8th, 2009 at 7:08 pm
mick November 8th, 2009 at 3:17 pm
The more I think about Matsui the more I realize how great he is.
To cut him loose after his performance in the Series would be sacrilegious. Something akin to what the red sox have done thru the years to guys like Boggs, Damon, Clemens etc…
In my mind it is bad karma as well as a very difficult bat to replace. I realize the economic side of it and I think that’s what it comes down to. If he settles for 1 year and less money they will bring him back. I do not believe the hooha that they need a place to rest Damon and Posada in the DH hole. They pretty much had that this year and it worked out ok. Keep Matsui, one year at a time, he is a specialist, like Andy, one year at a time. Not after what he did for us.
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nick—-nobody has any opinion on the underrated Matsui, I find it shocking.
I love Cano’s defense, but, if any 2nd baseman in the AL other than Aaron Hill gets the GG, they need to quite giving them out. He led all 2nd basemen in almost everything but errors. There is nobody else that good. It might be the carpet, but, Hill is as good as they get. The only two that I remember that good on both sides of the ball are Bobby Grich and Ryne Sandberg.
“I really believe in both of them.” As relievers, right?
GB, I agree completely about Joba. He needs to dedicate himself to his career and his team; by that I mean work hard and actually show up to camp IN shape. There is absolutely no excuse for not doing so – remember when Abreu and Damon showed up overweight? Boy, I was annoyed. He also needs to stop being so stubborn and thinking he knows more than he does. Joba has tremendous potential – let’s hope he grows up a bit.
GF, I’m sorry about your setback; I’m wishing you a very speedy recovery.
Guys, don’t forget MLB has a special on tonight called Path to the Championship……..It’s supposed to be on at 9pm, but double check because they don’t seem to be on schedule at this point.
A trade for King Felix is most definitely worth thinking about–and I’m sure that, if it’s possible, Cashman will be thinking about it this off-season–but you need to be realistic.
Felix Hernandez is the best young pitcher in baseball. You could talk about Greinke, but Hernandez is younger. He’s younger than Lincecum, too. He’s the best young pitcher in the game.
If Seattle were to put him on the market, they’d want top young inexpensive talent in exchange. Cano might fit that bill (though he’s already not too inexpensive), but that wouldn’t be a smart move at this time, since Cano is extremely valuable to the Yankees.
What the Yanks do have is Jesus Montero, who is probably the best hitting prospect in the game. Montero is a huge talent at the plate–not so much behind it–and giving him up would be a little painful, for sure. But King Felix is the best young pitcher in the game.
Montero+Hughes or Joba+Melancon would probably get the Mariners’ attention. But I seriously doubt that the Yanks will be able to trade for any top young starter without giving up Jesus Montero.
GB, Robby was brilliant………It’s really hard to judge any other player when we don’t see them every day.
mick, I have no clue what you’re talking about. The good and not-always-as-good commenters on this blog have been talking about the pros and cons of bringing back Matsui for days with the (non-scientific) consensus being that yes, more folks want him back.
I want him back.
Jen, thanks for posting. AJ looks ridiculously funny in Alex’ hat, lol…….
Maine, until Cano can handle pressure better, then yes, he is limited. Right now, he can only hit 6th in the lineup – he doesn’t do well anywhere else. He’s not limited by his ability, but by the things he doesn’t do well that he should do well. There’s no way a hitter of his caliber should be hitting in the bottom part of the order, but thus far, Robby has not shown that he is capable of hitting higher.
matsui has to come back
he hits lefties & is clutch
It’s probably up to Matsui, honestly. If he won’t compromise, then he won’t be back; same holds for Damon.
Chad,
I disagree with you about Cano. He puts up good numbers in teh regular season because there are a ton of bad pitching and a ton of games/at bats, he is doing it all with his talent but sadly I doubt very much he will ever be a GREAT hitter where he hits “smart” instead of just going up to the plate and letting his natural talent only swing the bat. I dont think the kid will ever get it, so if trading Cano gets a young CF or a very good starting pitcher I would do it.
I’m telling ya, Mats will be back…..Damon no where as certain…..
Cano is an inconsistent streaky player. Capable of batting over .400 one month, and under .200 the next.
THAT is what frustrates me about him. I’ll take a steady .280 hitter over him any day of the week.
His performance at the plate this post season was just the icing on the cake for me. I’d part with him for a young arm, or a stud corner outfielder. Let him put up regular season numbers somewhere else.
So what do you guys think the odds are that Halladay gets dealt this offseason? I say they have to deal him, they probably won’t compete this year anyway and he’s not going back to Toronto as a free agent. I think they will take the best deal they can get this offseason.
Why oh why…would anyone want Cano traded. There is just too much upside to him.
He doesn’t look passionate? or does he field so fluidly and smoothly that it doesn’t look like he’s trying?
Never mind about his bat, that’s a moot point. If you argue about his bat in the playoffs, then we should trade Tex as well!
I cannot believe people are complaining about a .320 hitter!
i think cashman makes matsui an offer
not sure about damon because he gets hurt a lot & has a terrible arm
nobody knows what will happen
if pettitte retires we will have to scramble to get at least 1 pitcher
if they don’t re-sign Damon then who plays LF. Matsui can’t. They better be prepared to go after Holliday if they don’t bring back Johnny.
dave,
i agree man, Iv been saying this all season long, for the right offer ( a young stud CF and or a young stud starting pitcher) I would certainly trade Cano no question.
the guy is too streaky and our whole offense this playoffs were too streaky and if it wasnt for our starting pitching no way we win the series.
“Cano is an inconsistent streaky player. Capable of batting over .400 one month, and under .200 the next.
THAT is what frustrates me about him. I’ll take a steady .280 hitter over him any day of the week.
His performance at the plate this post season was just the icing on the cake for me. I’d part with him for a young arm, or a stud corner outfielder. Let him put up regular season numbers somewhere else.
lol
The last time the Yanks let a big lefthanded power stick walk away, it set the franchise back 5 years plus……Think back to 1981…….What’s with all this crazy talk about Robbie Cano ???? I’m watching the MLB Network as they’re replaying Game 4 and the great Damon ab & stoloen bases which was the pivital momment of the 2009 World Series in my opinion
cano should not go anywhere
why create another hole
we need to keep the focus on pitching to stay ahead of our competition
if someone in the minors was ready & looked good maybe
Who do you guys suggest they replace Cano with if he’s traded. 2b is so thin throughout baseball. I’d trade him for Felix or Kershaw but thats bout it. Can’t think of a young CF I’d trade him for, not with Jackson and Melky already in the system.
blake
November 8th, 2009 at 7:59 pm
if they don’t re-sign Damon then who plays LF. Matsui can’t. They better be prepared to go after Holliday if they don’t bring back Johnny.
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they can put melky or swisher there & get a cf if they want
Betsy, here’s the chart on ML 2nd basemen. Hill has everyone in all categories except putouts, trailing Cano by one.
Shockingly is Polonco only making two errors at second base. That’s hard to beat.
http://mlb.mlb.com/stats/sorta.....tByStat=TC
Pat, it’s not crazy talk…..at least, I certainly don’t think I’m crazy. I think the points I brought up re: Cano’s weaknesses are very valid. If Matsui wants to stay, then he’s going to have swallow his pride. He’s obviously still a dangerous hitter, but his knees are shot and he can’t play the OF. The Yankees can not tie him for your too many years at too much money. I’m sure the Yankees will make him a representative offer…
mick -
I love Matsui as a player. He has been one of the most consistent Yankees since he joined the team. I don’t want him to leave. I want the Yankees to figure out a way to keep him.
I think other people here have expressed the same.
I think today, there’s a lot less traffic here, and the conversation is going in a few different directions, from what I can see. Don’t be too hard on everyone here.
The only thing is, I really wish he would have addressed the crowd at Yankee Stadium in English – just one sentence would have sufficed – before Japanese.
Theres no available CF who can replace Damon’s bat. Melky has developed into a pretty good defensive CF and I’m fine with him staying there for now.. I’m hoping Damon will accept a 1-2 year deal but I’m just afraid another team will offer him a longer deal and he’ll leave. I know he wants to stay in NY but he left Boston and they loved him there as well.
GB, thanks! I’m not married to Cano getting the gold glove…..but I will be teed off if Tex doesn’t get it.
It’s funny how everybody who is down on Cano wants to trade him for the King Felix’s or Roy Hallady’s of the world. If he’s as bad as you all make him sound, why would other teams want him?
Look at Cano’s numbers with RISP. This is not just about one bad post season.
Hey, didn’t we just win a world series with a young Cano? Leave the guy alone and lets see what he does next year. As for how to improve, I think we can use some more pitching depth (as everybody can), but lets not throw the baby out with the bath. If we can get younger in LF then maybe we do it. But I don’t see how that improves us in the playoffs next year, and this team will waltz into the playoffs no matter who is playing LF (or DH).
I’d rather go with the team we’ve got than mess with what might be out there unless it is an obvious upgrade.
As I said, I would never actively shop Cano; I’m perfectly happy with him (and he’s our only young, homegrown position player)
i like cano…he had bounce back year this year but still needs to grow as aplayer…i really hope they resign damon..he really fits w/yanks and stadium..
Anyone who wants Cano traded should be subjected to watching Chuck Knoblauch reruns.
Cano’s defense can’t be understated.
I too am starting to have doubts about Cano. Id be willing to give him another year but the problem is his value could continue to decline next year. He looks like one of those players to me who doesnt have great instincts and doesnt have the same work ethic as a Jeter. Ive seen him too often get careless in baseball games.
Dave. Cano is still young. No way the Yankees give up on him. There are only a few second basemen in all of baseball that I would rather have on our team.
I am watching Game 4 of the World Series on MLB Network.
Its amazing how given that I know the outcome of the series now, I can just brush off Buck and McCarvers comments.
blake
November 8th, 2009 at 8:09 pm
Theres no available CF who can replace Damon’s bat. Melky has developed into a pretty good defensive CF and I’m fine with him staying there for now.. I’m hoping Damon will accept a 1-2 year deal but I’m just afraid another team will offer him a longer deal and he’ll leave. I know he wants to stay in NY but he left Boston and they loved him there as well.
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then we get a lf or rf
we can & will survive without damons 24 hr & 82 rbi & not being able to throw a runner out from just beyond 3rd base
trust
remember we had charlie hayes playing 3rd base & melky in cf now
Starks in Tampa
November 8th, 2009 at 7:55 pm
Chad,
I disagree with you about Cano. He puts up good numbers in teh regular season because there are a ton of bad pitching and a ton of games/at bats, he is doing it all with his talent but sadly I doubt very much he will ever be a GREAT hitter where he hits “smart” instead of just going up to the plate and letting his natural talent only swing the bat. I dont think the kid will ever get it, so if trading Cano gets a young CF or a very good starting pitcher I would do it.
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You can say that about almost every player in the PS. Let’s unload the streaky Swisher, the streaky Teixeira, the streaky Posada, the streaky everyone else.
For all of Posada’s time and name, he’s been less than average in the post season with a .240 average and 11 PS homers and 39 RBI in almost 400 at bats. Who else can the Yanks unload?
Angel, lol. It’s also amazing how I can now watch these games without an ounce of worry. We should do game threads for the replays – we won’t get any trolls, lol
Well said, GB7
It was a great season and it’s hard to jump into who is going and staying but i guess that’s the business of baseball. I’m sure it will be an interesting off-season. Here is a link to a reflection before trade talks heat up.
http://planetforward.ca/blog/t.....we-belong/
Betsy
November 8th, 2009 at 8:10 pm
GB, thanks! I’m not married to Cano getting the gold glove…..but I will be teed off if Tex doesn’t get it.
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Teixeira’s pretty much a lock, unless the coaches and managers have any biases. I’d also put money on Jeter getting the GG.
You forgot Alex, GB.
What a year Jeter has had, lol. The WS, Roberto Clemente and Hank Aaron awards and now maybe a GG………wow
Wow, Jeter with another GG. That would really top off the year!
I highly doubt the Yankees are going to move Cano anywhere. Who would you even want to replace him with?
Angel – in an Empire State of mind. #27 has arrived!
November 8th, 2009 at 8:17 pm
I am watching Game 4 of the World Series on MLB Network.
Its amazing how given that I know the outcome of the series now, I can just brush off Buck and McCarvers comments.
It actually is fun listening to them knowing the outcome. It’s like a breath of fresh air, that 2 dirty, grimy, slimy people did not get their way!!!!!!!!
Tom, as well as Rodriguez played defense this year, I think that Longoria gets the GG.
(quickly looks around for Erica)
I think Matsui stays. Damon goes.
Damon is more marketable. He can play OF. He still has some speed. He has Boras as an agent. He has left for more money and more years before. (Boston to NY – 3yr vs. 4 yr deal)
I think he’s going to try and get 3 years – Yanks will offer 1 with option. He’ll go to the highest bidder.
Matsui is pretty limited to the AL and DH. I think the Yanks will string him along until they get an answer from Damon.
They don’t want to lose both LH bats.
Matsui will sign for 1 year with option based upon AB’s.
Of course, I couldn’t predict anything right all year. So it will probably be just the opposite…. lol.
Did anybody else ( GB not included )take note of how many beautiful dp turns Cano displayed this October ??? Especially the 5-4-3 variety….And that’s just to start to any debates about moving him and his .300 career ba
If we trade Cano it doesn’t have to be straight up for another second baseman. That is not the way to look at it. He could/should get us a young stud arm, or OF in return. We can plug any affordable, young, + defender into 2B. The offense we’d be losing (as inconsistent and streaky as it is) could be made up by upgrading an OF spot.
The guy eats up poor pitching, but melts against quality, post season pitching… and is a head case whenever someone is on base.
Potential only gets you so far. Cash in on this kid while his stock is high.
DT….Your point about losing all that lefthand power is the central issue…Damon will seek 3 years, but will tell Boras 2 will work…Mats a 1 year deal, maybe a team option of the 2nd year
Pat M. – I bet Brian Cashman noticed
officially I root against all Philly teams.
Pat M.
November 8th, 2009 at 8:30 pm
Did anybody else ( GB not included )take note of how many beautiful dp turns Cano displayed this October ??? Especially the 5-4-3 variety….And that’s just to start to any debates about moving him and his .300 career ba
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I’ve always compared his style and arm with Manny Trillo. You’d swear that Trillo taught him everything. Grich, for a converted shortstop was like watching a ballet out there….plus that bat.
I agree Pat. M –
I think Cano’s defense is vastly under rated.
He goes to his right better than any Yankee 2B I can remember.
He is great at going to his left and then getting the lead runner on tough throws across his body.
He’s got good range at pop-ups. (he saved Swisher many times)
He’s great at turning the DP – and hanging in there.
It would be interesting to look up his errors. It seems like when he gets one (rare) – he’ll get another in the same game or soon after. Maybe that’s just my perception.
Very true, Betsy.
I STILL am just awed by Damon’s 9th inning AB with two outs. It was a thing of beauty – before he even pulled off that 2 base steal – his prolonged AB set that steal up.
Joe from Long Island..It appears that you noticed……I was a ss who was moved to 2nd….Trust me, his foot work is off the charts…I could never get comfortable staying in the sationary position and then move…I have the scars to prove it…..
Bob Schneider?
Is he also the new Sinatra?
At first I thought you were talking about the guy from Dukes of Hazzard.
Two weeks of Jay Z have done a number on me.
Angel, I’m watching it right now…It was the turning point of the Series I believe
they seem to be high on Pena. I want to go find the article but Jeter said something like & don’t quote me that he sees Pena having good things come to him with this team for many years. I’m going to see if I can find the article
DT – OPPC member
November 8th, 2009 at 8:39 pm
It would be interesting to look up his errors. It seems like when he gets one (rare) – he’ll get another in the same game or soon after. Maybe that’s just my perception.
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No perception at all, DT. They come in a group of about 6 in a week and then bookend that stretch with 40-59 without errors. Last year at she, he had 3 errorrs in one game after a 40 game errorless streak, had 3 more in the next 5 games and didn’t make another for more that 40 games. He did it this year with the errors in Chicago. All one was fielding…hardly ever a throwing error.
Freakin’ Giants. What is it 4 in row now? Come on! The Yankees did it, why can’t you!!!!!
Last year at ***Shea Stadium***, he had
“they seem to be high on Pena. I want to go find the article but Jeter said something like & don’t quote me that he sees Pena having good things come to him with this team for many years. I’m going to see if I can find the article”
____________________________________________________
I believe I saw that article too. I think its in Spanish though, you’d have to translate it
Whoever is proposing trading Cano is nuts.
i think there is a good chance they bring back both damon and matsui. both are going to be both relatively cheap and of good value when you look at what else is on the market. i really don’t see the yankees popping for a big FA, and they don’t have anyone from the minors they can just plug into those big spots in the lineup. i think it might actually be harder to land damon than matsui, because damon probably will be able to get more money and more length from another team, and didn’t he have a bunch of money lost in one of those ponzi schemes? but ultimately i still see them both staying. also, i really can’t thnk of a FA on the market i really think is worth goign after. i guess we could try to trade for Manny (Just kidding).
“Freakin’ Giants. What is it 4 in row now? Come on! The Yankees did it, why can’t you!!!!!”
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Haha can’t always have the best of both worlds. The Giants should have won, but man was that drive by Rivers clutch(despite the ints). He’s got a mouth, but the guy stepped up when it counted.
Pat M.
November 8th, 2009 at 8:45 pm
Angel, I’m watching it right now…It was the turning point of the Series I believe
**************************************
Yep, it really was – he fought tooth and nail for that base hit. It was especially important after splitting the first two games at home that they took two out of three in Philly. Maybe it wouldn’t have been quite important if they had won both the first two games at home. But winning three in a row and winning them it in the manner in which they did on a two base steal caused by the shift, was when it became inevitable they were going to win it.
Turning the shift to their advantage – just incredible. It was an incredible heads up play. They guy might refer to himself as “just an idiot” but he’s a smart baseball player
Pat m,
Nice to see you around!
I agree with you on Hideki. If there’s mutual interest, it’ll get done. I don’t think okane ($$) will be a sticky issue for them. I was thinking about it last night (see, I do love matsui, mick!), all of Hideki’s experiences in the states have been in New York and revolved around the Yankees (with the obvious travel schedule). The guys love him, he and Jeter seem to have a good relationship. Would matsui be lonely going to another team, lol? Roger’s a nice guy, but he’s no Jeter. haha.
Re: Pedroia. The league has him figured out. No more mvp type seasons for him.
That Damon at bat and baserunning play were just classic all time great.
YES!!!!!! The Yanks win Game #4. I think they can win the whole deal. Tomorrow could be tough, but, I’ll accept a win in 6 games.
Good stuff GB. It did seem like Cano’s errors came in a bunch.
After watching Knoblauch’s throwing problems, and Soriano’s shot-put type throws – seeing a ground ball hit in the direction of Cano brings no angst.
It’s like night and day. Like going from Giambi to Teixeira.
Cano’s defense is that good.
steveoh
November 8th, 2009 at 8:52 pm
Whoever is proposing trading Cano is nuts.
——————–
Smartest comment of this thread haha.
Cano plays a premium position and is one of the three best 2b in all of baseball. Trading him for an OF makes no sense at all. OF’s with good bats are a dime a dozen. Look at any free agent class and there are at least 2 great OFs. Not to mention a ton of above average ones. OF is the easiest position on the entire roster to fill.
By trading Cano you essentially put a black hole in your lineup, because there is no one to replace him. You are going to put Ramiro Pena at 2b? Great, on days when Posada sits you will have Pena and Cervelli at the bottom of your lineup. That is brutal.
The reason the Yankees have been so great for so many years is because they have developed great players at premium positions. Jeter at SS, Posada behind the plate, and now Cano at 2b. You do not trade proven players at SS, C, or 2B or you end up like the Red Sox searching for a real SS for like 7 years now.
Finally, you can not great wrapped up on his performance in the postseason. It is such a small sample size it is ridiculous. He has had 100 at bats in the postseason. You do not judge players on 100 at bats.
I said a lot there but I will sum it up with steveoh’s comment: Whoever is proposing trading Cano is nuts
Keep up the yappin’.
No GM worth their salt (like our current GM) is trading a .320/25 HR second baseman under his control for the next 4-5 years at $6 million per year. Ain’t happening. RISP? Please. Makes the fans unhappy, but not the GMs. If Cano came on the market, Cashman’s phone would be off the hook. Any columnist suggesting it is just a lackey (not a John Lackey) for the other GMs, or for the agents.
Find me a 30/100 LH DH who can play in NY for under $10 million, and then I’d tell you to let Matsui walk. Can’t? Then offer him $8-10 million x 2, and be done with it. Yes, the knees scare me (as they should), but any talk of production decline has not yet materialized. Worth the risk, given the current market.
Find me a LH .280/OBP .350/ 20-25 HR guy to bat second at a decent price, then you can let Damon walk. Yes, he’s 35, but the market’s been set (I can believe that the Angels screwed Boras on this one, but they did) with Abreu. Give him that or below. he should take it, since where else is he going, honestly, for that price? Boston? I don’t think so–they already have the albatrosses that are David Ortiz and JD Drew.
JUST SAY NO TO PITCHING. For those of you who want extra SP for 2010, ask yourselves one thing. Why would Brian Cashman, who has spent the last three years building to a point where 40-60% of the rotation is home grown, suddenly change course now? Especially after winning a WS?
http://translate.google.com/tr.....ry_state0=
Found it. I used Google to translate so it probably won’t be 100% accurate
He won a WS on purchased pitching.
Jones and Mikey
Rivers is a bum. They won that game because the Giants had a 3 point lead with the ball on the SD 3 yard line on 1st and Goal and the refs called another drive-stalling holding penalty.
Every year that we lose, it is holding penalties that stall our drives, special teams penalties that pin us back in our own half of the field, cheap def. holding or illegal contact calls. It’s the same garbage.
I am not a Jets fan, but I watch their games, and the same holding call (in which a replay was showed and showed no holding) was called in overtime against the Bills in which the Jets put the ball inside the Bills’ 20 yard line. The holding penalty knocked them back to the 33 yard line or something like that, and stalled the drive and the Jets eventually lost.
DT – OPPC member
November 8th, 2009 at 9:02 pm
Good stuff GB. It did seem like Cano’s errors came in a bunch.
After watching Knoblauch’s throwing problems, and Soriano’s shot-put type throws – seeing a ground ball hit in the direction of Cano brings no angst.
It’s like night and day. Like going from Giambi to Teixeira.
Cano’s defense is that good.
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Cano’s defensive style should concern nobody. His offense shouldn’t either, though, he does get a liitle jumpy at the plate sometimes. It’s not like he hasn’t had very good years with runners on base, though. .306 in 2006 and .290 in 2007. Even in 2008, he was in the .260s.
At times, it was like he’d try to be patient and get into a hole and then swing at everything. That’s not him to be patient. He’s a controlled hacker. He’s never going to walk, and they need to try forcing it. Cabrera is much the same way, but, with less talent.
I just can’t see them in the front of the order, because guys like Jeter and Damon could never run. But, Lord, what a beautiful swing when he hits it into the gaps.
For all of the homers this year, though, he didn’t seem to get caried away with them. That’s the difference between him and Cabrera. I almost dred seeing Cabrera hit a couple of homers in quick succession. He gets homer happy.
m, just think about the Yankee TV bank in Japan….I understand that MLB splits on memorabilia, but there’s a ton of other coins the Yanks are pulling in from Japan….He’s on top of the world in the eyes of the Japanese….Besides he still projects to be a 30-100-.275 hitter…..His knees were much better in the 2nd half of the season…The fluid buildup was due to pushing too hard to fast after surgery……3 years is too long for Johnny however….
I agree with that completely, but as much as I hate to admit it, Rivers is good. His team sucks, but I always thought he is a very elite QB. The Giants should have won this game. Those calls by the refs were unbelievable. They better redeem themselves next week.
From what I have read and heard the Yankees do not really make that much money from Japanese revenue. Between 1-3 million is the most consistent answer I have seen
The only way I can see trading Cano is if it is to free up a spot for Jeter to move into. A Cano for Rollins Package with Jeter moving to second might make some sense. If Jeter is going to stick around for 5 or more years he will have to move to another position at some point. He would probably make the mobe to accomodate Rollins. But the Phillies won’t make that trade.
NY24,
“http://translate.google.com/tr…..ry_state0=
Found it. I used Google to translate so it probably won’t be 100% accurate”
——————————
Nice article. Jeter is awesome
WTH would you trade Cano for Rollins? Rollins had a .296 OBP this year.
JUST SAY NO TO PITCHING. For those of you who want extra SP for 2010, ask yourselves one thing. Why would Brian Cashman, who has spent the last three years building to a point where 40-60% of the rotation is home grown, suddenly change course now? Especially after winning a WS?
=======================================================
ummm, i agree with your points on cano, matsui and damon – but did you see any of the postseason? or the regular season for that matter….you had only 3 starters all postseason because the “homegrowns” as you said, stunk. if the yankees go into 2010 with joba and hughes in the rotation they are asking for trouble – not that i think they won’t eventually become good – but thats asking too much from them – joba had maybe 7 good starts all year – and by that i don’t mean the ones where he left with the bases loaded in the 5th inning and the relievers bailed him out…phil hughes was going to be sent back to the minors (for ching ming wang) if it wasn’t for the yankees needing someone in the bullpen not named veras, edwar or melancon –
for at least 2010 the yankees need a reliable #2 starter – no doubt about that – go get lackey or trade for halladay, ..or (gulp) sign high risk high reward guys like ben sheets or rich harden or someone similar….they’ll also need some relievers if joba or hughes aren’t going to be in the bullpen – out of the 7 guuys in th ebullpen in the postseason only 2 marte and mo didn’t make people look up to the heaven’s and ask GOD to “please let them pitch OK today…”
plus where is it written that 60% of your rotation has to be homwegrown?
Dave
He did win with purchased pitching, but CC was in his sights for 2 years, just like Roy Halliday is now.
That he wants to give Phil and Joba a decent chance is obvious by the fact that Johan Santana is not in pinstripes.
Why go after Lackey now? The Mariners are not giving up King Felix. They are going to ride him until he’s a FA, as they should. It may take them to the playoffs.
Hideki has been key part of Yankee branding in Japan. Japanese tourists visiting New York probably buy a ton of Yankee gear.
It was just so cool to see Matsui have the night of his career and help the Yankees win a championship.
Lots of people were ready to say “see ya” and presumed his departure was a foregone conclusion.
Why trade for Hernandez when you can sign Aroldis Chapman? Only half kidding.
I used to be a “trade Cano” guy. He can still drive me crazy with the first-pitch swinging and occasional vapor lock/brain cramps. But he’s great to his right, better than average to his left and that arm is really one of the best at 2d base. Ultimately it’s hard to improve on Cano at second unless you’re talking about Utley power. Cano is signed through 2011 (but it’s not a paltry $6 mil per year) with club options/buyouts for 2012 and 2013. The Yankees are in a great cost position with him. Just take him for what he is and stop waiting for him to change.
As for Matsui, I’d hate to see him go. A gentleman and supremely professional hitter. But there is a traffic jam at DH and he is not getting younger/healthier in the knees.
Jones
Yeah, you’re right. Rivers is not that bad. He’s pretty good. But I do not see him leading any team to a Super Bowl victory.
And one could bring up Trent Dilfer, but he had one of the greatest defenses of all time, and he made absolutely sure to not detract from his defense’s efforts by committing stupid turnovers.
sab
I saw about 110 games this year, and every pitch of the postseason. It drove my wife nuts.
In my opinion, Brian Cashman has a long term plan. Right now, Joba and Phil are part of it. Nothing in their development so far suggests that they will not be good.–their first few years are comparable to many great pitchers (like Roy Halliday and Johan Santana). They need a few years to come into their own.
My guess is that Roy Halliday is part of the plan as well, as a Pettitte/Wang replacement. Who knows, it could even be Josh Beckett in the FA class of 2011!
I just don’t see Cash abandoning his long term plan for Lackey (will want too many years) or some other long term “high risk” commitment. One Carl Pavano per decade is enough, thank you.
I’m sure that Cashman loves nothing more than having to decide what players need to stay because they are as good as they are and he might have better options. It’s got to be better than having so many decision to try making to fill holes.
“But there is a traffic jam at DH…”
How so?
Mats brings in more than 3 million a saeson…..There’s alot of Japanese who now know where Yankee Stadium is….Besides all the Yankee games that are televised in Japan, Mats is still one of the best hitters in the game….
Seattle is the most improved team in MLB and they’re not trading their King Felix anytime soon.
And if Andy re-signs they may not be players at all in the pitching market.
pittsburghyankee –
thats what i mean – hughes and joba are like what 23 years old? lets say pettite signs on for one more year, and the yankees sign lackey or get halladay – so next year they have – cc, aj, pettite, lackey (or halladay) and JOba(or hughes) – you know someone is going to get hurt so then you have hughes/joba (whoever is not starting) to step in
in 2011 – you’ll have cc, aj, halladay (or lackey), joba and hughes and maybe wang – joba and hughes will still only be 25…
so if cashman has a plan its still in place in 2011 and beyond…plus at that point you never know what can happen – Aj going to the DL – cc needing TJ surgery, joba never panning out as a starter, hughes pitching like he did in the postseason..
cashman needs to worry only about 2010’s rotation at this point – if he absolutely wants to keep joba and hughes thats fine – but not getting at least 1 more good starter is a huge mistake…
the yankees got lucky that they were able to win the WS with only 3 starters – if either the twins or the angels series went just one extra game (especially the angels series)they would have been cooked…
Sab, how do you propose the Yankees get Halladay and still hold onto both Joba and Hughes?
lets go yankees (formerly lets go twins)
November 8th, 2009 at 9:21 pm
WTH would you trade Cano for Rollins? Rollins had a .296 OBP this year.
I stand corrected. I didn’t realize Rollins had such a bad year or that he is 31 years old. Its hard to believe that just a few months ago everyone was complaining about Jeter stealing time from Rollins at the WBC.
We can substitute Hanley Ramirez or a healthy Reyes for Rollins in my proposed deal. Not very likely there is any way to make that work work either. My point was Cano for a world class shortstop might work. But there aren’t very many shortstops out there that could make Jeter move to 2nd.
PittsburghYankeeFan: What you said. It’s natural to be feeling a letdown after the emotional high after an outstanding postseason for the Yanks. We all hope the Yankees rinse and repeat in 2010 to win #28. But as you point out, none of these proposed trades make a whole lot of sense given the talent and production the Yankees would give up and the economics. That’s just not how they roll these days. And it’s hard to imagine why Seattle would trade away an elite young pitcher of King Felix’s caliber under any circumstances.
Zach, I was skimming through comments while on the fly and saw yours about the happy Yankee fans in the HK airport. Very nice post.
I don’t have anything as exotic as that to add, but I did attend a (bad) football game in Berkeley last evening and there were a number of Yankee fans in my section. I got a couple of random ‘woo woo’s and a “number 27, baby!!” but no hugs.
The collective joy — and relief — in the Yankiverse is palpable.
http://www.fangraphs.com/leade.....mp;month=0
youtube video “Drunk Joba in love with Johnny Damon,” just emailed to me from a Yankees hater.
Yankees really need to speak with him before his drinking ruins his future and takes over his life.
By the way, that player I was referring to back in 1981 was Reggie Jackson……Yanks let him walk after the 81 WS loss, mostly due to injuries…..The entire infield was gone after game 2……Yanks are solid up the middle, as all contending teams need to be….Cano is a future BA Title winner…..Get another starter ( back of the rotation ) put Hughes in the rotation, resign Wang…Look at Webb or some other quality arm in rehab….They can win next year just on what they have now…It’s in 2011 / 2012 when things get dicey..
Forget Matt Holliday. He’s going to get paid like he’s a superstar, but he isn’t a superstar. He’s just a very good hitter and an OK defensive player.
No one on the FA market is a perfect fit for the yanks’ LF. But here’s a guy who’s probably available in trade that I’d like to see: David DeJesus. The yanks don’t need a big bopper. they just need a guy who’s a good hitter, a good #2 kind of hitter, who can play a solid OF.
(And i don’t think the Yanks are too high on Austin Jackson, by the way. I mean the guy hasn’t shown a lick of power, yet.)
C’mon–that Joba scene was a riot!
How about this? If they don’t sign Matsui, why not Vlad? It would cost a bit more per year, and he will be undervalued after this year. Cash has always loved him…hmmm.
It’s fun to go back and read the Lohud blog updates from LAST year at the GM meetings.
http://yankees.lhblogs.com/200.....ana-point/
(The big news then was the signing of Sergio Mitre!)
“Because of the money they have to spend, the Yankees are the team everybody wants to talk about. There are teams that believe the Yankees will simply re-invest all their money and sign CC Sabathia, A.J. Burnett and Mark Teixeira.
That would solve a lot of problems, obviously. But keep in mind that the Angels felt Teixeira was a key for them and will likely do all they can to retain him.”
Nick, it was very amusing…erased all my memories of being cramped in economy for 15hrs from JFK to HKG. It was a terrible terrible flight. I went to game 6 with my dad, and then 8 hours later I was on a flight to Hong Kong with nobody to celebrate the victory with. The old Chinese lady sitting next to me wasn’t interested in going beer for beer with me, so…i went beer for beer…with myself.
Very sad. Until I met the ny-expats!
I think that Cashman would rather gouge his eyes than sign Vlad over Hideki.
Vlad’s an interesting one, but his knees are worse than Hideki’s even though Guerrero can still technically play the field.
damon enjoy 27…think 28
November 8th, 2009 at 9:50 pm
youtube video “Drunk Joba in love with Johnny Damon,” just emailed to me from a Yankees hater.
Yankees really need to speak with him before his drinking ruins his future and takes over his life.
————————————————————
Perhaps the people that follow players around to bars and get drunk should get control of their drinking and stalking issues before they ruin their lives, and I’ve seen enough old drunks that write for newspapers that need to worry about their drinking, too….not to mention, minding their own business.
Seriously–what ever happened to Humberto Sanchez? Is he gone?
Chad:
We loved the updates on the Yankee players and prospects in Arizona and Winter Ball. Please make that a weekly feature.
Thanks.
Joba? Drinking?
Ugh. I have no problem with a euphoric, drunken clubhouse celebration.
But nothing but good would come from Joba abstaining from alcohol for the forseeable future. And his waistline would thank him.
If that joba video is from the clubhouse who cares…I saw that on the YES postgame…just messing around and was like 30 minutes after the game…no way he was throwed yet
Pat M.
November 8th, 2009 at 9:54 pm
By the way, that player I was referring to back in 1981 was Reggie Jackson……Yanks let him walk after the 81 WS loss, mostly due to injuries…..The entire infield was gone after game 2……Yanks are solid up the middle, as all contending teams need to be….Cano is a future BA Title winner…..Get another starter ( back of the rotation ) put Hughes in the rotation, resign Wang…Look at Webb or some other quality arm in rehab….They can win next year just on what they have now…It’s in 2011 / 2012 when things get dicey..
————————————————————
George M. S. said that letting Jackson go was the biggest mistake in judgement that he made as far as players went. He made a lot, so, that’s saying something. Signing Dave Collins and Ed Whitson, letting Jerry Mumphrey and later, Ken Griffey were big mistakes. Hated the Murcer for Bonds deal, but, it brought in Mickey Rivers, Ed Figeroa, allowed NYY to trade Doc Medich for Willie Randolph and Doc Ellis.
That has to be the only time two docs had traded places, unless you talk about wife swapping doctors on the soaps.
Oops. That ‘ugh’ is that it’s a story.
Of course it would be a non-story if Joba didn’t have that DUI.
Expect Matsui on the Angels,if Yankees let him go!!
I sure hope I’m dead wrong.
GB7,
Don’t forget the Steve Kemp signing as a great judgement. Or paying a convicted felon to get dirt on his own player.
Pitt yankee- Sanchez waa released early this year, and then re-signed. He is with the organization still, I believe, but I do not know where. I can’t imagine that he is being counted on for anything at this point.
DT-That is an awesome quote, and correct; it solved a lot of problems!
Matsui on the Angels makes perfect sense, actually.
“Expect Matsui on the Angels,if Yankees let him go!!”
I am expecting Matsui to be back with the Yanks, if not here, then I think he will go back to Japan for the really big money as the conquering hero. With all the DHs on the market, I don’t think there is big money in his near future in MLB.
Humberto Sanchez is still with the Yanks. He’s playing Winter Ball in the Caribbean Leagues.
http://mlb.mlb.com/milb/stats/.....amp;y=2009
I used to think Matsui brought in a lot of revenue as well, but I am just telling you what I have read and heard and it makes sense. Most of the money he brings in is shared between the teams. And more Japanese people attending the games barely brings in anything.
I am sticking to my $1-3 million number
Hey, did I totally miss the Braves signing Proctor? Could Torre be heading south?
Mark in Tampa
November 8th, 2009 at 10:11 pm
GB7,
Don’t forget the Steve Kemp signing as a great judgement. Or paying a convicted felon to get dirt on his own player.
Pitt yankee- Sanchez waa released early this year, and then re-signed. He is with the organization still, I believe, but I do not know where. I can’t imagine that he is being counted on for anything at this point.
————————————————————
I had forgotten about Kemp out of necessity. I wanted to slit my throat….between Kemp and Steve Trout.
Hard to believe that as late as the 88-89 season, GMS was close to bankruptcy, and, then turned everything around by stopping with the high dollar bad signings. about the same time he was banned from baseball and Gene Michael took the reins. He finally listened.
nothing wrong with that joba video
The Yankees can sell anything they want to sell with a playuer’s name or Yankee Logo they want without sharing….as long as it doesn’t have the MLB logo on it.
Sanchez is a bust
The only one getting a piece of that pie would be the player.
Like someone said earlier, re-sign Matsui to a short term contract, one to two years. He can be your regular DH but since he needs his rest too, the other DH candidates like Posada can spell him a couple times a week. Plus for everybody.
As for Damon, as fond of him as we’ve all become especially because of that play, we must remember that he was playing for a contract this year. In other words, this year is the best you’ll see from Damon. The Yankees should let him go.
Ralp
I would agree,if not for his DUO earlier this year,he has a problem.
But…. at least he’s not Tim Lincecum,busted for Pot possession,a day ago.
Starting pitchers for 2010??
2 for certain:
-Sabathia
-Burnett
3 from this group:
-Pettitte
-Hughes
-Chamberlain
-Kennedy
-Aceves
-Gaudin
-Wang
-Josh Towers?
I am comfortable with working with this plan.
Is that too big a risk?
I’d love to see the team continue to develop from within.
In addition to the general “good feeling” benefit of that, oromoting from within, when viable candidates exist, provides so much positive motivation for the rest. The dollar value of the benefit must be huge!
Is it necessary to give up someone to get fill the number 3 slot? How much, and who would we have to give up?
“Hated the Murcer for Bonds deal, but, it brought in Mickey Rivers, Ed Figeroa, allowed NYY to trade Doc Medich for Willie Randolph and Doc Ellis.
That has to be the only time two docs had traded places, unless you talk about wife swapping doctors on the soaps.”
Ellis, D has that other hysterical story he is famous for too.
Yankees got Andy for a bargain this year,he was crucial for game 6.
He should get a raise,for his solid performance.
Mats is pure gold right now in Japan….Wonder how many commercials he’ll be doing donning the NY Pinstripes….Nobody cares about Dice-K anymore…
DT is a traitor
HISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
Dave,
“Cano is an inconsistent streaky player. Capable of batting over .400 one month, and under .200 the next.
THAT is what frustrates me about him. I’ll take a steady .280 hitter over him any day of the week.
His performance at the plate this post season was just the icing on the cake for me. I’d part with him for a young arm, or a stud corner outfielder. Let him put up regular season numbers somewhere else.”
You don’t know what the hell you are talking about.
In 2009, Cano batted .272 in May and .270 in June. The rest of the season his months were: .366, .330, .347, and .339.
Even in his down year in 2008, he started the season off terribly, but didn’t hit below .287.
Trading a young 2nd baseman locked up to a reasonable contract that was third in the league in total bases while providing great defense is a terrible idea.
Christina-
I had a great time at the parade. Although, I don’t think that I was made for standing in one sport for three and a half hours in cold, I had a great time. I got to tell Johnny that I loved him too. LOL
I even spotted myself on the back of the Daily News in a very intense game of “Where’s Erica”
Betsy
November 8th, 2009 at 7:07 pm
Cano is a very talented player and I like him a lot, but his hitting with RISP is terrible. He was one of the few Yankees to do anything offensively against the Tigers in 2006, but the last few years he’s completely disapppeared.
===
Cano hit .333 with a .375 OBP and .800 slug against Cleveland in that ill-fated ALDS vs Cleveland in 2007.
Cano likely will go down as the greatest second baseman in Yankee history.
“DT is a traitor
HISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS”
I am not a traitor!!
I regret that I have only one Yankee life to give for my team.
I didn’t say I WANT Damon to go!
I’m just afraid Boras will lead him astray with the smell of new fresh minted green moola.
I saw Humberto Sanchez pitch at Trenton late in the season. He was very impressive. I wouldn’t call him a bust just yet.
Anybody speak spanish? Enrique Rojas wrote this about Matsui on his twitter….
“Los Yankees no han decidido si retienen a Matsui, quiene s un negocio mas que un pelotero”
http://twitter.com/enrore
12 hours later, still on the trading Cano subject?
Mike R
November 8th, 2009 at 10:34 pm
“Hated the Murcer for Bonds deal, but, it brought in Mickey Rivers, Ed Figeroa, allowed NYY to trade Doc Medich for Willie Randolph and Doc Ellis.
That has to be the only time two docs had traded places, unless you talk about wife swapping doctors on the soaps.”
Ellis, D has that other hysterical story he is famous for too.
————————————————————
Ellis was a character. Not sure that I believe him saying that he pitched a no-hitter while on LSD, but, with him, anything was possible. He was a pretty good pitcher, though.
Tom, the only thing that I can make out of that was that the Yankees had not decided whether to retain Matsui or not.
DT – OPPC member
November 8th, 2009 at 8:39 pm
I agree Pat. M –
I think Cano’s defense is vastly under rated.
====
Only by people who don’t understanding what they’re watching.
The Yankees have non decided on retaining matsui, when they will more negotiations will be is a mystery.
That’s my non-spanish speaking translation.
Thanks, gb. I really should learn Spanish.
Mel, thank you too.
Angel, yep – and I just watched the 2 hour WS recap. I’m still incredulous over that play and game 4 – the true turning point of the series. It just ripped the heart out of the Phillies fans – I loved it, lol.
I’m in a quandry. Trying to decide on watching cartoons or a movie called, “Being Erica”. I know who not to ask, though.
Relief pitchers for 2010
Need 9 (7 + 2 or 3 injury replacement/fill-in)
– Rivera
– Marte
Need 7 more, probably 3 from this group (if they don’t win starting jobs)
-Hughes
-Chamberlain
-Kennedy
-Aceves
-Gaudin
Need 4 more from this group:
-Melancon
-Coke
-Bruney
-Albaladejo
-Zach Kroenke
-Michael Dunn
-Edwar Ramirez?
-Mitre?
Maybe should sign one or two more mid-range relievers to compete for these spots?
Maybe should sign one high-end reliever as possible future replacement for Rivera?
Tom in N.J.
November 8th, 2009 at 11:00 pm
Thanks, gb. I really should learn Spanish.
————————————————————
Me too, Tom. I can pick out about one word in ten. I feel like Joe Rochford trying to break the JN-25 Navel Codes in WWII.
“The only way I can see trading Cano is if it is to free up a spot for Jeter to move into.”
No.
Tom in N.J.
November 8th, 2009 at 10:53 pm
Anybody speak spanish? Enrique Rojas wrote this about Matsui on his twitter….
“Los Yankees no han decidido si retienen a Matsui, quiene s un negocio mas que un pelotero”
————————————————————
The Yankees have not decided if they are retaining Matsui, who is a business in addition to a player.
Rollins saying he still thinks his team is better is so disingenuous. All his teammates admitted we were the better team, why can’t he? Personally I think they had a better team last year with Meyers, Moyers and a healthy Hamels. It was all about the pitching and we were far superior.
Also, The Yanks should think hard about bringing Hidecki back and do not treat his value lightly. He was their best clutch hitter and is all about winning. There is no player out there that could replace that.
Perhaps if he hit 3 HR’s like someone else once did, it would be a no-brainer, but this was just as good. Bring him back. Don’t worry about fitting Posada and Damon into the DH spot. LOck up Matsui and Damon for 2 years each(both could have a team option for the 2nd year) and address them and Posada when his contract expires in 2 years. No need to shake this team up, youth is on the way, go Yanks.
Ok, then what do you do in a couple of years after Damon and Matsui are gone? The Yankees have very few top notch position players as prospects……AJax is their best OF right now and he won’t be ready for probably a year or so. Even with that, scouts are split on this guy. This team has to get younger – I really don’t see how anyone can deny that.
Robbie Cano Lacks one real trait… and that is the Killer Instinct that Jeter, Posada, Matsui, Damon and most recently Arod have..
You cannot tell me he goes up to the plate every at bat with the will of wanting to get a hit… He puts together some of the worst at bats… esp with RISP… He is Dreadful with RISP… and don’t give me the ” that’s just his style” Michael Kay apologist line… Im not saying he doesn’t care… I’m saying that he doesn’t care 100% of the time…
He reminds us alot.. that his head is somehwere else a decent amount of the time…
“Cano likely will go down as the greatest second baseman in Yankee history.”
I don’t know about that since two former Yankee second basemen are in the HOF.
Tom, lol. Lots of typos in my translation, would be easier to understand if I typed it correctly and had added that matsui is a business in addition to being a player.
GreenBeret7
November 8th, 2009 at 11:03 pm
I’m in a quandry. Trying to decide on watching cartoons or a movie called, “Being Erica”. I know who not to ask, though.
*****
Don’t waste your time. Its not about me. If it were, it would be much, much cooler
Pat, the rotation should be even stronger in 2011/2012 if Joba and Hughes develop properly………I’m not sure if you saw my posts about Phil earlier, but in case you didn’t: how do you think they should go about limiting his innings next year? 1) start season in pen, then into rotation or 2) start season in rotation, then into pen (I HATE this idea) or 3) start season in AAA, then come back up to join rotation or 4) skip some starts early, but have him stay in the rotation all year.
DT – OPPC member
November 8th, 2009 at 10:45 pm
“DT is a traitor
HISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS”
I am not a traitor!!
I regret that I have only one Yankee life to give for my team.
I didn’t say I WANT Damon to go!
I’m just afraid Boras will lead him astray with the smell of new fresh minted green moola.
***********
I have said all season that Scott Boras was the one wild card in the return of Johnny. I am however, confident that Johnny will come back and prevail over the Scott Boras factor
We need to get younger and more athletic, no doubt. But it would be very tough to compete with a significant dropoff in production if we were to lose Hideki AND Damon.
An interesting, um, dynamic to this whole thing is that weasel Boras.
If he’s interested in playing out the string, Cash may have to move on. Considering that all three big FA OF are all Boras clients, it could get kind of interesting.
crawdaddy November 8th, 2009 at 11:10 pm
“Cano likely will go down as the greatest second baseman in Yankee history.”
I don’t know about that since two former Yankee second basemen are in the HOF.
——————————————————–
Bobby Richardson was a helluva good 2nd baseman too.
Robbie is still young as is his buddy Melky. They could both get even better with maturity. Robbie is a pure hitter who has trouble focusing at times, that’s why is fast start was crucial this year.
Ah, Erica and I are thinking along the same lines. Except I’m not having naughty thoughts about Damon.
no.27
November 8th, 2009 at 11:06 pm
“The only way I can see trading Cano is if it is to free up a spot for Jeter to move into.”
No.
====
No.
Erica – always OPPC
November 8th, 2009 at 11:12 pm
GreenBeret7
November 8th, 2009 at 11:03 pm
I’m in a quandry. Trying to decide on watching cartoons or a movie called, “Being Erica”. I know who not to ask, though.
*****
Don’t waste your time. Its not about me. If it were, it would be much, much cooler
————————————————————
It was about a cute little red-head with a shoe problem and a off-kilter boss. I decided that a CSI: Miami rerun would be less confusing. Of course Emily Proctor and Eva LaRue make the show a little more interesting.
Matsui’s first name Spelled Hideki,respect please!!
Hideki Matsui
I have said all season that Scott Boras was the one wild card in the return of Johnny. I am however, confident that Johnny will come back and prevail over the Scott Boras factor
———————————————————-
Erica, tell JD to speak to Arod concerning Boras.
GB, after I get off the computer, I’m going to watch my Patty Duke show DVD…………but I would go with cartoons. Which cartoons are you contemplating watching? Scooby Doo? Smurfs ?
Betsy, I did see your post regarding Young Master Hughes….I’m not certain how they’ll proceed other than it’ll be different from how they misused Joba……Maybe something similar to how the Tigers used Porcello….
Erica, do you get the Food Network? You should watch tomorrow (I think it’s at 7 or 8pm, not sure)….they have a show called Challenge where teams of pastry chefs/cooks/whatever compete in certain categories. Tomorrow’s categorie is Sesame Street cakes……!
By the way, Erica, I always preferred the Electric Company to Sesame Stree. The Spiderman segments were the best…….Of course, Mr. Rogers rocked his sweater, too, and I loved the trolley.
Pat, I hope so because although I did not criticize the Yankees this year, I don’t think they helped Joba at all and I don’t want the same thing to happen to Young Master Phil. I hope regains the “force” next season that he seemed to have lost in the post-season (every time you refer to Phil as Young Master Phil, I think of him as a Jedi Knight).
mick
November 8th, 2009 at 11:16 pm
crawdaddy November 8th, 2009 at 11:10 pm
“Cano likely will go down as the greatest second baseman in Yankee history.”
I don’t know about that since two former Yankee second basemen are in the HOF.
——————————————————–
Bobby Richardson was a helluva good 2nd baseman too.
Robbie is still young as is his buddy Melky. They could both get even better with maturity. Robbie is a pure hitter who has trouble focusing at times, that’s why is fast start was crucial this year.
====
Richardson did not possess Cano’s natural ability.
There are many Yankee fans who have no idea what the Yankees have in Robinson Cano.
In fact, if he were LESS talented, and needed to summon more volatility to make plays – diving for balls his range allows him to glide to, etc. – the perception would be that he was BETTER than he actually is.
Even Joe Morgan, an avowed Yankee hater, has been compelled to acknowledge Cano’s greatness – yes, greatness.
The smoothness of a great player is inversely proportional to most fans taking that smoothness for a lack of virtue.
You need more than natural talent to become a truly great player. We’ll see in due time whether Robinson Cano can achieve that status.
crawdaddy
November 8th, 2009 at 11:10 pm
“Cano likely will go down as the greatest second baseman in Yankee history.”
I don’t know about that since two former Yankee second basemen are in the HOF.
=====
He’s also the best pure hitter the system has produced since Don Mattingly.
Erica, remember that Boras works for Damon, not the other way around. I think Damon has already told Boras that he has no intention of signing a bad contract with a bad team (meaning, he’s not going to just sign for big bucks if it means not being on a winner). He really wants to be a Yankee and I know the Yankees would love to re-sign him; it’s just a matter of him being able to compromise. He’ll have to give a little bit to stay here.
By the way, I’m a big Cano fan and you won’t find any posts from me criticizing him. However, with that said with his natural ability, he has a way to go before I’ll classify him as a great player. He’s very good, but can be so much better.
crawdaddy
November 8th, 2009 at 11:23 pm
You need more than natural talent to become a truly great player. We’ll see in due time whether Robinson Cano can achieve that status.
====
He’s already a great defensive 2B man. He’s a thoroughly natural hitter. His issue is he is somewhat uncomfortable owning his talent as a hitter.
There have been some unbelieveably unperceptive comments through the last few years about Cano. “He doesn’t care,” etc. In fact, he cares too much – beats himself up, gets down, feels unworthy.
He is not comfortable with the mantle “great player.” He will have to overcome THAT.
Betsy
November 8th, 2009 at 11:18 pm
GB, after I get off the computer, I’m going to watch my Patty Duke show DVD…………but I would go with cartoons. Which cartoons are you contemplating watching? Scooby Doo? Smurfs ?
————————————————————
I haven’t seen those old Patty Duke shows in forever. Not sure if they ever showed up on Nick At Nite. Others that I’d like to see are “Man With A Camera” with Charles Bronson or “M Squad” with Lee Marvin.
“He’s also the best pure hitter the system has produced since Don Mattingly.”
No, he isn’t, I think Jeter is a better pure hitter.
What bothers me about Cano is his lack of production with RISP.
This shows he does not hit well under pressure.
He needs to be relaxed and carefree like he usually is when not under extra pressure to produce.
Maybe he should have a talk with Arod too.
Anybody know where you can find Yankees championship gear for a pet?
I have searched on google and different sites and cannot find anything.
Boras was the one who told Damon to leak to the press,that he wanted to come back.He knows That Damon is close to retirement and doesn’t want to relocate his family.
Robbie is still young as is his buddy Melky. They could both get even better with maturity. Robbie is a pure hitter who has trouble focusing at times, that’s why is fast start was crucial this year.
====
Robi and Melky are a different level of player – and I’m a person who believes that Cabrera has a decent amount of ability, and not the scrub he’s generally perceived to be.
But Cano has transcendent ability. I’ll say this – if Cano had his best friend’s hutzpah, he’d be a killer.
The obvous places for upgrades are outfield and pitching. It is very difficult to upgrade anyplace else.
Of the free agents Bay is the most attractive offensive player becasue he helps us and hurts Boston at the same time. Holladay is another reasonable candidate.
For starting pitchers Lackey is the best in this free agent class but Harden, Bedard and Chapman make sense to consider.
Beyond that a trade for a good young outfielder like Granderson or Upton may be possible. Or possible a releif pitcher like Huston Street.
I can’t see a trade for a name brand starer like Halliday or Felix Hernandez, Josh Johnson, Lincecum or Cain but you never know the Yankees could probaly get any of them if they want them badly enough..
There are a couple of players that Cano lines up favorably too as a player with his experience at his age and number of years played. Look up the name Roberto Clemente and read the highly unfavorable remarks made by the media about him. It’s not pretty, and, more to the point, they were baseless.
crawdaddy
November 8th, 2009 at 11:27 pm
“He’s also the best pure hitter the system has produced since Don Mattingly.”
No, he isn’t, I think Jeter is a better pure hitter.
====
Different kind of hitter. Both great. Cano has more natural ability.
But Cano has transcendent ability. I’ll say this – if Cano had his best friend’s hutzpah, he’d be a killer.
—————————————————–
Bodhi,
True. Melky did excel under pressure this season. He really became a good clutch hitter, even relishing the situation when he could win a game with a big hit. He seemed to bear down with RISP something Robbie needs to work on.
I think they should just start Hughes late so he doesn’t have to go through what Joba did this year. Figure out how many innings they are willing to let him pitch during the regular season and assume he’ll give them 6 innings a start. That could mean not participating in spring training and using the minor leagues to get ready, but that’s better than spreading out his starts and limiting his innings per start.
What’s good for Matsui is good for the Yankiverse.
nick
I get the sinking feeling they might not bring him back.
GB, Nick at Nite (when it was still good) aired the Patty Duke show……it hasn’t been on tv in a dog’s age. I was shocked and pleasantly so when I found out it came out on DVD.
I feel much better now about the chances of bringing back Hideki than I did, say, a week ago.
GreenBeret7
November 8th, 2009 at 11:31 pm
There are a couple of players that Cano lines up favorably too as a player with his experience at his age and number of years played. Look up the name Roberto Clemente and read the highly unfavorable remarks made by the media about him. It’s not pretty, and, more to the point, they were baseless.
======
That’s an interesting comparison.
The whole Cano debate becomes disingenuous, because the people who are down on him don’t realize they are victims of their own emotional expectations.
Cano’s style of play – and level of ability that renders him spit-less, sweat-less and gasp-less – is emotionally alienating to observers.
They are stuck on an ideal that insists players need to “show” distress when accomplishing something. Didn’t someone say he doesn’t “show passion”?
That sentiment is a dead giveaway regarding that poster’s lack of understanding of what he’s seeing. Players aren’t obliged to “show” anything – they’re obliged to make the plays.
Cano’s ability to pivot and throw seamlessly doesn’t satisfy the fan’s emotional needs. Therefore, not only is his greatness undermined – if it’s recognized at all – it becomes a lack of virtue, a lack of “effort.”
You just cannot have an honest discussion/debate with such people because their minds are operating illogically.
CR9
Sportsauthority.com go to pet gear,then MLB
Also bing.com search: yankees pet wear lots of sites.
http://www.bargainist.com/deal.....ship-gear/
There are a couple of coupons for online use at Modells.
Anybody with a site for Yanks stuff for pets?
thanks damon
If I have to increase the frequency of my ramen intake to get Matsui back, I will do that.
I’m not talking about Ichiban boil-water-for-3-minutes ramen, I’m talking about going to a restaurant and getting the good stuff.
CR9
Just4pooches.com
Bodh, I remember Kevin McReynolds experienced the very same type of criticism when he was on the Mets – this was, I think, the mid to late 80’s. He was smooth and made things look easy……..and fans were hard on him. It’s unfair to Cano to blame him for being talented. Cano is sometimes like Bernie Williams – totally spaced out.
I would rather my second baseman makes plays with a cool aplomb than throw himself around the infield like a rag doll because that’s the only way he can get to the ball.
CR9
fufufashions.com
mick
November 8th, 2009 at 11:33 pm
But Cano has transcendent ability. I’ll say this – if Cano had his best friend’s hutzpah, he’d be a killer.
—————————————————–
Bodhi,
True. Melky did excel under pressure this season. He really became a good clutch hitter, even relishing the situation when he could win a game with a big hit. He seemed to bear down with RISP something Robbie needs to work on.
=====
Melky wants the big spot – that’s clear. The most promising aspect to Melky’s season was his going from slapping the ball as a RHB to driving it. It really has changed everything regarding his status as a hitter. He has always had hitting talent – which I think most people miss. His bat is quick – which is why he was able to start fouling off the high outside heat, and why he was less apt to get tied up in.
What was disappointing was his .336 OBP, or whatever it was. He got into a good amount of full counts, but he didn’t walk nearly enough. I see his OBP improving, however.
CR9
Spoilurpets.com
I don’t think the Yankees have any problem with Cano’s effort in the field anymore.
I don’t know why the fans continue to bring it up.
Nick in SF in Larkspur
November 8th, 2009 at 11:44 pm
I would rather my second baseman makes plays with a cool aplomb than throw himself around the infield like a rag doll because that’s the only way he can get to the ball
====
You’re the exception. And I think even the fans who operate this way would agree, but unconsciously, they don’t feel the player “put out.”
But baseball isn’t football. “Cool aplomb” keeps you in the present. Bearing your fangs and “grrrrr” ing at the pitcher turns you into Jimmy Rollins
.
Position players for 2010?
Need 13 all together
-9 starters plus backup catcher plus 3 more
Catcher
-Posada
-Cervelli as backup (unless management wants to give him one more year minor league development, OR as trade bait)
-Molina if Cervelli is not available
Infield
-Teixeira
-Cano
-Jeter
-A-Rod
… No argument there…
… unless Cano is trade bait for something
Outfield – need 3 + 1
-Swisher
-Cabrera
-Gardner
-Damon (1 year or maybe 2 yr “value” contract with incentives… yes-no? I’d sure like to see him back)
-Nady?
-somebody new?
DH
-Matsui (1 year or maybe 2 yr “value” contract with incentives… yes-no? I’d like to see him back, too)
-somebody new?
Reserve/utility – need 2
-Peña
-Hinske?
-Hairston?
-Duncan?
-someone from AAA?
-someone new?
Cano should be considered an untouchable ballplayer
I don’t mind Melky’s OBP so much, just because he is 60 points higher on his OBP than batting average. Cano is the problem with OBP.
M, because fans have to blame something or someone. I’m not sure they realize that baseball is game of failure…..so, when a player (heaven forbid) doesn’t come through, it must be for lack of effort.
Bodh, Clemente spent almost half of his career living down the lazy hypocondrac and being a showboat. How they came to that is beyond me. He was just physically gifted. He always complained that his back hurt, and, years later, they found that he had a degenerative back problem. He was somewhat highstrung, but, that came with the era in which he lived. Nobody was more highstrung than Willie Mays, though.
Cano doesn’t have the racial issues, but, the idiotic stereotyping of the lazy Latin player still exists. Notice that Clemente seldom walked and if he could reach it, he’d hit it. Ever notice that Vlad Guerrero is the same type of hitter. seldom walks, swings at everything?
Cano can be as good as he decodes to be. It’s up to him, but, he’s never going to walk. His numbers on the first pitch are beyond insane. That’s who he is. Cabrera is the same, with good but lesser talents.
m
November 8th, 2009 at 11:49 pm
I don’t think the Yankees have any problem with Cano’s effort in the field anymore.
I don’t know why the fans continue to bring it up.
=====
I think for the reasons I just detailed. Cano does not satisfy their emotions. Someone like Dustin Pedroia, though clearly inferior, does.
You cannot convince those people that Pedroia isn’t a more virtuous player – even though it’s just utter nonsense. The point is – they believe it.
I really have nothing against Pedroia – even though Trisha and I have fun with our “little Dusty” chatter – but watching him take that big swing and produce a feeble popup to bury the Red Sox made me laugh out loud.
Watching Cano flip Mo’s induced grounder to Teix with “cool aplomb” (;)) to clinch the World Series was even more fun.
CR9,
You’re welcome!!
BTW, Trisha – thank you for your post.
Soul bonded, absolutely. Whatever the discussion, there’s no wavering there.
Thanks to all for the help.
Tell me this is not the cutest thing ever made:
http://spoilurpets.com/index.p.....mp;pID=386
Night All!
When one is down over a Giants loss, just think 27!
From what I see, Cano does look like a player that isn’t always focused. But that’s only one side of the story. Not every player needs to make a Hulk look-a-like facial expression to show that he really is running hard and diving hard for a play. Now, maybe he really isn’t focused, but there is no way you can tell just by merely looking at him field a ball.
However, Larry Bowa always went through drills with him, to help him keep his focus.
bodhi,
Cano was quite raw when he came up, and like lots of young players had bad habits. And like lots of talented players, depended on that talent to get him through. But his teammates and coaches wouldn’t let him get away with it for very long.
He’s made vast improvements every season, and he’s improved so much and contributed very much to the team that I can’t even complain too much about his RISP issues. imo, it’s the last thing for him to conquer and he will be as close to perfect as we can expect.
I don’t need him to walk. I just need him to avoid striking out at a very high rate. Which he’s done, because as we’ve seen he doesn’t make it to strike 3 too often, lol, the ball gets put into play much earlier than that. But I remember a very bad stretch when he was striking out a lot (’07 maybe?). And another time when he worked out with his dad and made some big strides.
He’s definitely figured out that you have to work hard in this game and even the greats like Rodriguez and Jeter work their tails off.
GreenBeret7
November 8th, 2009 at 11:17 pm
It was about a cute little red-head with a shoe problem and a off-kilter boss. I decided that a CSI: Miami rerun would be less confusing. Of course Emily Proctor and Eva LaRue make the show a little more interesting.
**********
I have dark brown hair and my biggest shoe problem is that my feet are too giant to fit in most shoes
Betsy
November 8th, 2009 at 11:19 pm
Erica, do you get the Food Network? You should watch tomorrow (I think it’s at 7 or 8pm, not sure)….they have a show called Challenge where teams of pastry chefs/cooks/whatever compete in certain categories. Tomorrow’s categorie is Sesame Street cakes……!
*****
Thank you for the heads up. I will set my DVR before bed!!!
Loving this celebration of Sesame Street everywhere!!!
GreenBeret7
November 8th, 2009 at 11:53 pm
Bodh, Clemente spent almost half of his career living down the lazy hypocondrac and being a showboat. How they came to that is beyond me. He was just physically gifted. He always complained that his back hurt, and, years later, they found that he had a degenerative back problem. He was somewhat highstrung, but, that came with the era in which he lived. Nobody was more highstrung than Willie Mays, though.
Cano doesn’t have the racial issues, but, the idiotic stereotyping of the lazy Latin player still exists. Notice that Clemente seldom walked and if he could reach it, he’d hit it. Ever notice that Vlad Guerrero is the same type of hitter. seldom walks, swings at everything?
Cano can be as good as he decodes to be. It’s up to him, but, he’s never going to walk. His numbers on the first pitch are beyond insane. That’s who he is. Cabrera is the same, with good but lesser talents.
========
Agree with all of this, but I think Melky will become more disciplined. He does not have the nearly insane Vlad-like eye-to-hand that Cano does to not only get to ridiculous pitches but put them dangerously into play. Even Cano has scaled back on being a bad ball hitter.
The Latin stereotype does persist – but people will moan and wail that it has nothing to do with their judgments. To paraprhase Gertrude, those detractors “doth protest too much, methinks.”
Mario Lemieux received the lazy latin treatment his whole career – except it was the cavalier french canadien tag; same idea. His natural ability – he’d arrive at the post just as the puck did while everyone fell and crashed like dominoes around him – and send it home. Or he’d sneak into the zone, get lost, and re-emerge to stuff the game down his opponents’ throats. It was considered “lazy” because he didn’t carve up the ice with his skates.
Talent will always be the most under rated thing in sports, because non-athletes addicted to the frontier spirit dictate the narrative.
m
November 8th, 2009 at 11:17 pm
Ah, Erica and I are thinking along the same lines. Except I’m not having naughty thoughts about Damon.
*******
You can’t prove that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Very few players that play with Pedroia’s frantic energy last long. You see that in small guys for than the normal sized players. The long swing with every ounce of strength will get longer and less quick. Rose had that energy, but, you never saw it in his swing.
the OF FA this season all just seem like your classic mediocre and overpriced Boras clients. except probably Damon… the yanks aren’t going to make the mistake of signing holliday or bay, but i’ll be interested to see in the end how much more they get than damon. i just don’t see too many gm’s wanting holliday and bay over damon, all things considered.
Betsy
November 8th, 2009 at 11:21 pm
By the way, Erica, I always preferred the Electric Company to Sesame Stree. The Spiderman segments were the best…….Of course, Mr. Rogers rocked his sweater, too, and I loved the trolley.
*******
Mr. Rogers used to infuriate me. As a child I had a bizarre obsession with the color green. At the start of every show, he would enter the room and go to his closet to put on a cardigan. He would ask the camera which color he should wear and I would scream at the RV “Green. Green”. And then he always went for a brown one. Still angers me.
My favorite part of that show was when the little trolley came to take us to the Land of Make Believe. In retrospect, that probably should have concerned my parents
Erin!!!!!!!
It’s The Count von Count today in the google doodle!!!!!
Pat M.
November 8th, 2009 at 11:50 pm
Cano should be considered an untouchable ballplayer
====
I think as far as management’s concerned, he is.
The guy is remarkable. Those who don’t see it, that’s their problem.
Girardi has patiently explained to the viewers that Cano is smooth, not lazy. And that was when he had less of a stake in him – in the broadcast booth.
Trade Cano? Hell no. If he can maintain his focus, he’s a potenital Hall of Famer.
Heyya,
I’d like to see him put up .280 with a .360 on base, as he did in 2006. Had the same OPS as 2009, but the trade off this year was more slug. I’d like to see both slug and OBP rise, and I don’t see why they shouldn’t.
Pat M. November 8th, 2009 at 9:39 pm
Mats brings in more than 3 million a saeson…..There’s alot of Japanese who now know where Yankee Stadium is….Besides all the Yankee games that are televised in Japan, Mats is still one of the best hitters in the game…
=============================================
There are a lot of Japanese who know where Safeco Field is too. M’s do need a DH – hmmm….
‘t would be pretty interesting to see Ichiro and Hideki as teammates…. talk about Mystique and Aura
Bodh, your description of Lemeuix sounds like the same thing that Bobby Hull was labeled with when compared to Gordie Howe. Hull was a style, grace and speed, Howe was perceived as better because he “worked” at it. Amazingly, Mantle was perceived as lazy and a dumb hick, while Mays was the intelligent, smart ball player.
I am working on getting a double HISSSS from Erica.
*** Breaking news *****
Bert and Ernie have signed with super muppet agent Scott Boras. Their return to Sesame Street is now in question.
Big Bird and Oscar say if the superstar duo leave, they may follow suit as well.
DT – OPPC member
November 9th, 2009 at 12:16 am
I am working on getting a double HISSSS from Erica.
*** Breaking news *****
Bert and Ernie have signed with super muppet agent Scott Boras. Their return to Sesame Street is now in question.
Big Bird and Oscar say if the superstar duo leave, they may follow suit as well.
*******
You know what DT…. I always thought Bert and Ernie deserved more of the spotlight than they get. Especially since Elmo hijacked the show. I hope superagent Scott Boras can help them
m,
Cano really doesn’t strike out much at all. In fact, his ability to make contact gets him out at times.
I think you’re right about him not becoming an OBP machine, though. That’s not even desirable, in his case.
I’ll never forget the first time I got a look at that swing – I literally got goose bumps. Where were they hiding this one? I remember saying. You see that caliber of hitter just once – and you know.
“You know what DT…. I always thought Bert and Ernie deserved more of the spotlight than they get. Especially since Elmo hijacked the show. I hope superagent Scott Boras can help them”
Elmo has changed. Ever since the scandalous news, the ill fated book, and the orange face interview – Elmo is now a team player. The days of Elmo kissing the mirror are long gone…
Matsui a Mariner?
But why would Matsui want to leave the premier franchise in baseball to join an also-ran and play with someone with whom he is not reportedly friendly?
I suppose anything is possible, but… that would not be anything close to a lateral move for Godzilla. I would hope that he would be more interested in going for another World Title than in fighting to sniff the lead in the AL West.
GB, Here’s my concern for 2010….How does Giradi jump start some of the younger players to refrain from being complacent after reaching the summit….Of course the Old core guys will keep pushing…..Ichero will never co-exist with Matsui so forget the Mariner interest….It’s NY Yankees or Japan……Cano is a perennial All-Star 2nd baseman
GreenBeret7
November 9th, 2009 at 12:16 am
Bodh, your description of Lemeuix sounds like the same thing that Bobby Hull was labeled with when compared to Gordie Howe. Hull was a style, grace and speed, Howe was perceived as better because he “worked” at it. Amazingly, Mantle was perceived as lazy and a dumb hick, while Mays was the intelligent, smart ball player.
=====
Lol. I remember the Hull-Mikita years but Howe was past it by the time I started watching.
I do know that people fairly lost their minds when it was even suggested that Gretzky was better than Howe. Heresy, as far as the writers were concerned.
It’s funny how the English Canadian press finally embraced Gretzky when Lemieux came along. But it took a french canadien to make them finally rally around Gretzky, who, until that time, wasn’t an “honest” hockey player.
One other player that Cano compares to favorably is Tony Oliva, though, Oliva had a little more power.
Pleas go to http://www.mlbtraderumors.com
now 2010 top 50 free agents ,and where they might go.It’s a good read for a debate.
bodhisattva – Destiny Wears Pinstripes
November 9th, 2009 at 12:26 am
GreenBeret7
November 9th, 2009 at 12:16 am
Bodh, your description of Lemeuix sounds like the same thing that Bobby Hull was labeled with when compared to Gordie Howe. Hull was a style, grace and speed, Howe was perceived as better because he “worked” at it. Amazingly, Mantle was perceived as lazy and a dumb hick, while Mays was the intelligent, smart ball player.
=====
Lol. I remember the Hull-Mikita years but Howe was past it by the time I started watching.
I do know that people fairly lost their minds when it was even suggested that Gretzky was better than Howe. Heresy, as far as the writers were concerned.
It’s funny how the English Canadian press finally embraced Gretzky when Lemieux came along. But it took a french canadien to make them finally rally around Gretzky, who, until that time, wasn’t an “honest” hockey player.
————————————————————
Loved the Hull-Hull-Mikita Blackhawks. It was always a bloodbath when Howe, Mahavolich and Delvecchio played Hull and the boys.
I remember when Howe came out of retirement to play with his kids. Somebody hip-checked Mark howe into the boards and Gordie came blowing up the ice and got to the guy (I’m thinking it was Dave Schultz) and Howe stuck two fingers in the guy’s nose and lifted him up onto the tips of his skates and you could read his lips, “Don’t Eff with my kid.”
If Howe hadn’t been such a great shot, he could have been looked at as a Dave Scultz goon.
Oliva is a good comparison, as ideally Cano is a doubles machine.
BTW, why do you like Vasquez better than Miranda? Haven’t seen too much of the former, but he’s a RHB and he seems to strike out an awful lot.
The two keys to the Yankees rotation plans are Pettitte & Wang. If Andy returns, and Wang can start a throwing program this winter, returning in spring, we have our 3/4 starters. Then we can insert Hughes in the 5th spot, with Kennedy & Gaudin as depth. Obviously this leaves Joba in his 8th inning set up role, learning at the knee of the Greatest.
I’m not the biggest Cano fan, but if Damon & Matsui leave, there’s no way you trade him.
That’s a great story, GB. One thing you have to admire about Gordie – as dirty a player as he was -and he was – he could and would fight. Can’t say the same for the dirtiest player to ever lace on a pair of skates – Bobby Clarke.
I did get to see Howe with the Whalers in his dotage. I covered the sport for quite a while, too, and Howe was a delight as an interview.
Mikita was just one of the best centerman I’ve ever seen.
Cash probably won’t do anything at the GM meetings other than see what may be available and what it might cost in trade. They haven’t had their scouting meeting yet, those will be after the meetings, so unless someone offers something crazy it will be a fact finding trip for Cash.
Lackey to the Yankees,no way.Mlbtraderumors are crazy!
Good night Yankee people!
(PS- not convinced Elmo has changed. I am not buying the story that all of that tickling was due to it being a more loosy-goosey time)
Boogie Down
November 9th, 2009 at 12:40 am
I’m not the biggest Cano fan, but if Damon & Matsui leave, there’s no way you trade him.
====
Not a fan of a prolific hitter with great range and an unreal glove?
How come?
Goodnight, Erica.
Sweet dreams.
Here we go with the Cano overrating and underrating again.
When he breaks Jeter’s record for hits as a Yankee, then we can talk about him being the best pure hitter they’ve developed. Let’s not hang any wreaths on him just yet.
To me hitting isn’t just hitting the ball hard to all fields. It’s also about the ability to transcend your natural talent and apply it to situational moments. Moving runners over. Getting the flyball to get the sac fly. Seeing a hole on the left side of the infield and nailing it like Jeter often does when they play him too far to the right.
Cano has not mastered that ability. He can hit a ball hard. Very hard. But his eye isn’t the most selective and he doesn’t hit to what the situation calls.
He also has a phobia about being great. He can’t hit above the 6 hole or he goes into a tailspin.
For some reason he thinks he doesn’t belong that high in the order or he doesn’t want the pressure of it.
Whatever it is, his problems are and always will be between his ears.
That said, his problems don’t outweigh his value as a player.
Would I trade him? Sure. For Felix Hernandez. For Josh Johnson. For Hanley Ramirez.
Outside of that kind of return, he’s not worth trading since if he somehow puts the mental part of his game together he could be positively David Ortiz in his prime-like.
His defense this season was exceptional. His arm contributes to a lot of outs that might be a lot closer.
That was my biggest argument about his 2008 season. The hitting and the defense were uninspired. And uninspired doesn’t mean not diving as some myopic types like to tell us it is. Uninspired was when the guy looked like he’d rather be in bed than playing 2b of the Yankees as he looked at times in 2008.
It’s just amazing how so many fans drew the same conclusions about the player in 2008 and the manager decided to bench him for that kind of play the same season, but we’re all apparently wrong for seeing what we did and reacting to it like the manager eventually did.
Cano isn’t going to be traded anywhere unless someone knocks Cash’s socks off with an offer.
Not a fan of a prolific hitter with great range and an unreal glove?
How come?
==================
Lol
Uninspired was when the guy looked like he’d rather be in bed than playing 2b of the Yankees as he looked at times in 2008.
===
Except that your definition of uninspired and how a player “looks” is a BS piece of crap subjective interpretation that shows no correlation, but is just the same old hot air BS we hear over and over again about this guy.
Vazquez doesn’t strike out too much, but, he has enormous power and a much better idea of the strike zone. Miranda, is a glove hack, but better than Vazquez. I think that in a trade, though Miranda could be worth more because he can play a little defense….like Giambi. Basically, though, they are the same except for the sides they bat on.
Someone posted that Wang could start his throwing program in the spring (sounded like this was actually ahead of schedule). So I wouldn’t look for Wang to be a real option for the Yankees until midseason. Whatever they do, they need to not rush Wang.
It’s a shame Miranda doesn’t play another position. I guess he’ll be a victim of numbers, since that 40-man is going to be a challenge for Cashman as it is.
For me, giving up that lefty power bat is like Whoopi having to let go of the million dollars to the nun.
My GF just told me Bill James picks us to stink next year.
Gee, think I’ll hang myself.
m
November 9th, 2009 at 12:50 am
Someone posted that Wang could start his throwing program in the spring (sounded like this was actually ahead of schedule). So I wouldn’t look for Wang to be a real option for the Yankees until midseason. Whatever they do, they need to not rush Wang.
====
It would be great if Wanger makes it back and regains his form, right about when Hughes’ innings are winding down. Of course, they have to want him back, first. Kid really wants to be here.
bodhisattva – Destiny Wears Pinstripes
November 9th, 2009 at 12:40 am
That’s a great story, GB. One thing you have to admire about Gordie – as dirty a player as he was -and he was – he could and would fight. Can’t say the same for the dirtiest player to ever lace on a pair of skates – Bobby Clarke.
I did get to see Howe with the Whalers in his dotage. I covered the sport for quite a while, too, and Howe was a delight as an interview.
Mikita was just one of the best centerman I’ve ever seen.
————————————————————
Mikita was not only a great hockey player, but, a gentleman and nice guy. I have his autograph in with my Mickey Mantle. Mikita wasn’t a milquetoast though. He’d drop somebody in a heartbeat if provoked. Now, Dennis Hull had no problems with decking somebody because of bad breath, though.
bodhisattva – Destiny Wears Pinstripes
November 9th, 2009 at 12:53 am
It’s a shame Miranda doesn’t play another position. I guess he’ll be a victim of numbers, since that 40-man is going to be a challenge for Cashman as it is.
For me, giving up that lefty power bat is like Whoopi having to let go of the million dollars to the nun.
My GF just told me Bill James picks us to stink next year.
Gee, think I’ll hang myself.
————————————————————
I’m sure that James has worked out a formula that tells him that. He’ll make a small fortune selling it to Boston and Philadelphia fans.
Getting Wang back around the All-Star break and being decent to good, not great would be like getting another pitcher in a money dump without giving up a player.
Now she says it was a hoax.
She was about to buy some James book online, but I told her the profits go directly into Red Sox player development.
Yeah, Stan the Man was tough, and a superb playmaker. Hockey in those days was so different than it is today. In those days, the “skaters” were few and far between. Now, everyone can skate.
Maybe the greatest sports story ever is the Rocket Riot at the Montreal Forum. Well before my time, of course.
Well, goodnight, all.
i’ll see your “relaxed and productive a-rod” and see you a “lax and reproductive a-rod”
CompassRosy
November 9th, 2009 at 12:15 am
Pat M. November 8th, 2009 at 9:39 pm
Mats brings in more than 3 million a saeson…..There’s alot of Japanese who now know where Yankee Stadium is….Besides all the Yankee games that are televised in Japan, Mats is still one of the best hitters in the game…
=============================================
There are a lot of Japanese who know where Safeco Field is too. M’s do need a DH – hmmm….
‘t would be pretty interesting to see Ichiro and Hideki as teammates…. talk about Mystique and Aura
——————————————————-
matsui wont get along with ichiro
they are complete opposites & rumored to not get along
Mats goes back to Japan ( maybe SF Giants / slim shot ) before playing in Seattle…..It’s The Bronx Bombers or nothing…..
Finally got a look at that list.
1. Holliday-in light of recent financial woes of the owner, wouldn’t it be morally reprehensible to shell out $100m for Holliday?
2. Lackey-in light of recent free agent signings by the Yankees, wouldn’t it be morally reprehensible to shell out another big contract for the big Texan?
8. Scutaro-Yankee killer to the Sawx?!
9. Beltre-would be a smarter signing for the Phillies
10. Harden-just the kind of pitcher a certain populace of the Yankee fans would want.
17. Aroldis Chapman-is there any international free agent that the Sox aren’t heavily involved in?
27. Matsui-an option in LF for the Mariners? Huh?
39. Smoltz-in the AL. Really? REALLY?
48. Nady-Best of luck wherever he ends up. Tough break for him.
So then why did Girardi bench Cano oh great one?
Hmmm?
Why? To appease the bloodthirsty?
You actually think a a man who won titles as a player, manager of the year in his first season of managing and knew what it took to win would listen to hue and cry of the subjective uninformed fan and bench this misunderstood genius of a 2b in 2008?
You really think that?
Where’s your explanation for the benching?
You never even acknowledge it. You gloss over it.
Why you cannot call this one particular player out for his flaws and yet disparage other Yankee players is so see through it’s not even funny.
I make it a point not to address you directly because you are exactly the type of pompous jerk that gets off on that kind of attention. You’re a egotistical blog bully and you’re wrong about Cano. He dogged it in 2008. His manager and GM (who make their decisions together) felt he needed to be disciplined and he was.
You think they take their cues from the fans?
Sure they do.
To call him the best hitter the Yankees developed of late is so sad and it’s completely disrespectful to Jeter and Bernie.
Cano isn’t in their class yet. He’s got a ring from a post season he was invisible in with the bat.
He can’t even sniff Jeter and Bernie’s locker yet.
Calm yourself down bud.
If Matsui doesn’t come back, I’d like to see him get an NL contract. He crushes that league.. I’d be very curious to see what he would do with an entire year there.
As far as Seattle goes, I don’t see why HE would want to go there. I understand why other people want him there for the Ichiro connection but why would he want to go to a team that doesn’t make strong attempts at competing.
Matsui: doesn’t Ichiro dislike Matsui? where did Mats going to Seattle start from anyways?
Lackey: I thought we wanted to get younger, even in the 1 spot.
Also, what the latest on Wang? Have the Yanks given up on the Wanger?
What’s the latest on Austin? Is he coming up for sure in ‘10?
Aroldis Chapman: is the hype real? can we trade Igawa + and a monthly subway pass for his rights? (Igawa would be considered the freebie)
Tarde CANO and Melky and Kennedy for CAIN!
Taht would be great!
Cano isn’t in their class yet. He’s got a ring from a post season he was invisible in with the bat.
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Maybe they should take away Cano’s ring, then.
While they’re at it, take Swisher’s, Teixeira’s, Cabrera’s, Gardner’s, Hinske’s, Cervelli’s and Pena’s away, too. Cano outhit them. Take away Hughes and Cokes. They did nothing. Take away Girardi’s for overmanaging in one inning.
crawdaddy
“November 8th, 2009 at 11:27 pm
“He’s also the best pure hitter the system has produced since Don Mattingly.”
No, he isn’t, I think Jeter is a better pure hitter.
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Different kind of hitter. Both great. Cano has more natural ability.”
So they’re too different type of hitters, but Jeter is great while Cano is still trying to reach that plateau. As far as natural ability, how did you quantify that ability?
There are some around here that give Cano too much grief, but then there are those like you that give him a little too much credit. Somewhere in the middle is where I think the true value of Cano lies right now. His next five years of his career will define if he’s ready to reach the plateau of greatness.
1. Biggest play of the world series…the final out by mo which ended it.
2. You can’t trade Cano”dontuKnow”, he’s too valuable at 2nd base..him n tex in the infield have a great flow..plus whens he’s hot..he’s a powerhouse in the bot. Of line up.
3. I would trade joba..but then again, I can’t picture him playin anywhere else..hughes is a great player more valuable then joba.
4.We need anohter startin pitcher…we have aj,cc,guadin, we need to bring andy back for anohter year..and bring in 1 more pitchre to make it 5.
More thoughts..as I’m on the train headed to penn station.
Oh ya we have wong..umm trade him…yaa he won all those games..but he’s been full of injuies..not the same player..or send him to the minors for a couple of months n bring him up.
I m not a big fan of matsui..I think he’s very streaky..he either plays very well..or poorly. He deserves the mvp…but I don’t want him bck next year..to open up that dh spot.
Johnny should be resigned for an aditional year..he has proved he can hit n be effective…and is one of the truley nice guys on the yankees.
Nady. Umm kinda wierd when he got the “key to the city” becuz he didn’t contribute at all..and he prolly felt the same way..although nady is great..swiss adds more flavor..soo that’s going to be tricky if yanks want to bring him back..
I always knew D-Marte was good..his delivery is soo consisted..u knew if he can be accurate..he would be great..ask Ryan howard how good he was.
I don’t see the Yanks in the LAckey market unless Pettite retires in which case a strong # 3 is an important priority. He’ll cost about what Pettite/Wang combined for so there’s nothing out of line about that.
Wang, my assumption is will be non-tenured with an effort to sign him for $ two mlllion with incentives based on innings and days on the MLB roster.
Really got a feeling that Joba or Hughes stays in the pen. But it might just be indigestion. Both in the rotation probably means 12 pitchers instead of 11 and we saw last year how limiting that was in terms of the bench.
The only way I see Cano getting dealt would be for a young start/corner OF. If Matt Cain or Andre Ethier were available you’d have to at least consider it, wouldn’t you? Ethier in YS with Alex in front and Joge behind might hit 40+.
I havent seen anyone cover this… but what do the yankees do with Phil Hughes Next year? He through like 80 innings this year… that doesnt translate well to being a starter in 2010.
What does the yankees rotation look like next year?
1. CC
2. AJ
3. Petitte ??
4. Joba
5. Phil Franchise?
I still think the yanks need to look at adding someone.
Cano fooled me this year. I didn’t think he would ever play good defense. He did though and can get even better. But a trade for a pitcher like Hernandez would be welcome.
So Cano didn’t hit much in series, so what ? Whole team can’t produce in any short series. Everyone thinks because you don’t hit in a certain group of games you’re a bum ! Remember A-rod ? It’s still a marathon, not a sprint ! Yanks need more pitching for future and you have to give to get. ( especially Yanks ) One outfielder also needed. ( not Holiday! )
As much as I love Andy Pettitte, he’s nearing the end. Not to becounted on for much more. Was fairly lucky in playoffs and series. Too many walks and mistake pitches in key situations. He did well overall, but future ???
Maybe B.Wagner for a year or two would help in pen. Hughes should stay where he is for now. Chamberlain in pen also. Starting job for either maybe later.
Hope we don’t trade for any injury prone starters.
Anyone who thinks Cano needs to be traded is ignorant. He’s one of the elite hitting 2b in the game. He sucked it up in the playoffs. So did a lot of other guys as well. He’s also one of the reasons we were playing in the playoffs. Don’t be so quick to judge based on such a limited time span.
I definitely think Yanks in the Lackey chase ! Wang probably done as Yankee. J. J. Putz would be a good risk !
For those who think Damon was playing for a contract : Do you think he played harder for it ? If so, why would you want him back ? Matsui a class act and should be primary DH next year. Bay ? Good to go after.
Chicago has been dubbed the “Windy City,” not because of the weather, but because of the politicians back in the day. They used to stand up on their soap boxes and “blow hard” at one another.
Game 2 of the ALDS will be the standout moment for me. My first foray into the new stadium, in section 203 no less, was a great experience. when a-rod’s home run cleared the wall..pandemonium. that was the moment that made this team feel different than the ‘02-’07 version for me.
Like Doc Halladay over the summer, the asking price for Felix is far too much. And my opinion on Damon and Matsui is that Damon is the way to go. For once, we need to emulate the Red Sox model of abandoning our heroes when their time has past. With Jeter, A-rod, Posada and Damon getting up there in age, the DH spot will need to be freed up to give them more time off. Let Matsui’s MVP performance in game 6 be a swan song, and we can free up some of the payroll for some younger talent.
A lot of clubs are trying to reduce payroll, so they will be non-tendering more players than usual. This should be a great opportunity for the richest team in baseball to sign excellent free agents. So, I don’t favor trading Cano or anyone else. I think the Yanks can get most of what they want without giving up players.
Don’t forget that any trade would involve giving up equal value. For King Felix, I think that would mean something like Cano, Melky, Hughes, and Chamberlain.