Putting the priorities in order
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 04, 2009 
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The Yankees decision-makers are meeting in Tampa to talk about money, trade targets and free agent interests. Their key pieces are already in place — and this winter isn’t likely to be as momentus as last winter – but there are significant holes that need to be filled. How would you rank the priorities? Here’s my list.
1. Starting pitcher
More important than left field or designated hitter, the Yankees need a starting pitcher to slot behind CC Sabathia and A.J. Burnett. It wouldn’t be a terrible thing to have Joba Chamberlain and Phil Hughes rounding out the rotation — with guys like Alfredo Aceves, Chad Gaudin and Ian Kennedy adding depth — but going into spring training with Chamberlain and Hughes as the Nos. 3 and 4 would be too risky. Andy Pettitte. Roy Halladay. John Lackey. Whoever it is, they just need a quality starter.
2. Outfielder
However you look at it — starter in left field, starter in center field bumping Cabrera or Gardner to left, a primary designated hitter — the Yankees need someone who can play the outfield. Austin Jackson is almost ready, and could play his way into a big league role, but an outfielder is the second-most important target of the winter.
3. Designated hitter
Just a bat. Any bat. Any position. It would be better if it’s a guy who can play the field from time to time, but things worked pretty well with Hideki Matsui last year.
4. Reliever
I’m not convinced they need a reliever at all — especially not a high-dollar reliever — but there’s a solid chance the Yankees will be converting their top setup relievers back into starters. There are still a lot of in-house options, but a reliever wouldn’t be the worst addition.
5. Starting pitcher
We’re into areas where the Yankees don’t absolutely have to make a move. They only need one starting pitcher this winter, but an extra back-of-the-rotation arm wouldn’t be the worst thing, especially if it’s a guy who could play a role in the bullpen if he’s beaten out by Chamberlain and Hughes.
6. Utility infielder
With four young middle infielders on the roster, the Yankees don’t have to replace Jerry Hairston Jr. with another veteran. They could very easily stick with Ramiro Pena or Kevin Russo or one of the other in-house candidates.
7. Catcher
Seems to me that Francisco Cervelli has earned the backup job in New York, but the Yankees might prefer a veteran and will almost certainly sign a veteran to start in Triple-A and provide additional depth.
8. Outfielder
An Eric Hinske type. Someone to provide additional depth. It becomes more important if they bring in a designated hitter who doesn’t play the outfield.
How about Eric Hinske to fill the Eric Hinske type role?
1. Andy Pettitte
2. Curtis Granderson
3. Jermaine Dye
4. In house
5. Duchscherer, Harden, or trade for Gil Meche (I personally like a lot, but there are definite arguments against)
6. In house
7. In house
8. see #3
Is it just me or is #1 the same as #5?
S.o.S.
December 4th, 2009 at 1:16 pm
Is it just me or is #1 the same as #5?
*************
You can never have too many starting pitchers.
I’d like to see NYY pick up Rtan Doumit from Pittsburgh, using a combination of Phil Coke and a middle infielder as the main pieces for the deal. Pittsburgh needs both. Doumit plays three positions (right field, catcher and 1st base). He could also DH. NYY has a replacement for Coke in Wilkins DeLaRosa.
I would say you’ve got the rankings pretty much spot on.
The Yankees got really lucky with the schedule and short series in the playoffs last year that they didn’t need another starting pitcher. I think we all pretty much agree that bringing back Andy is a given – though there’s some dispute about whether adding another big dollar guy would change that – and then I think the Yankees should still go after a veteran for the back of the rotation – possibly a Ben Sheets type.
The outfield is a tough call – I don’t think Damon comes back. And they cannot play Melky or Gardner in the corner – I would still go after David DeJesus via trade. He’s a good fielder and a fine choice for the second spot in the batting order. I also think that it’s possible Jackson opens the season in LF, but then I think Cashman needs an offensive upgrade in CF. I don’t think Matt Holliday becomes a Yankee but it’s entirely possible.
DH – I’m on record for a trade for Adam Dunn here. I don’t think Matsui comes back simply because the Yankees want a DH who can play the field without getting injured.
Relief Pitcher – I would like a veteran arm here. A guy who is pretty interesting to me would be Kelvim Escobar who is trying to comeback as a relief pitcher.
Utility Infielder/Bench in general – The Yankees could end up with a very young bench in Gardner, Cervelli, and Pena taking three spots. I think that Hinske might come back but I’m not sure. It’s possible that Juan Miranda fills this role.
So if I make two trades:
Melky, Pena & two minor leaguers (Whalen and Pope) for Dunn
Aceves, IPK and a minor leaguer for DeJesus
Sign Kelvim Escobar, Andy and Ben Sheets
Here’s my 25 man roster:
Jeter
DeJesus – LF
Tex
Alex
Dunn – DH
Posada
Cano
Swisher
Jackson – CF
Bench: Gardner, Russo, Cervelli, Miranda
Rotation:
CC, AJ, Andy, Sheets, Joba/Hughes
Pen:
Joba/Hughes, Escobar, Rivera, Marte, Robertson, Coke, Gaudin
That’s still going to give me a very strong team and keep the salary about where it was this past season if not lower (a stated goal of Cashman/Hal)
I was just laughing with a friend about how Rooney, Lampard, and Gerrard are going to pounce all over the US in the World Cup.
I have not laughed like this, looking forward to a sporting event, in 9 years.
I thank God every day for 27!!
pick up ***Ryan*** Doumit from Pittsburgh
Red Sox fans are giddy about signing Marco Scutaro. I don’t know why…he’s a 34 year shortstop coming off a career year. I’ve got a feeling this year (at age 35) he won’t have such a good season.
I think Granderson is going to be too expensive in terms of player personnel assets.
I think Harden would be a good signing if they don’t re-sign Pettitte and trade for Halladay.
I hope Jacky Curry is right that Damon will only get $6-7m.
jpb1973
Haven’t you learned by now, every single short stop is better than Jeter according to sox fans.
Nomar
Pokey Reese
Orlando Cabrera
Edgar Renteria
Alex Gonzalez
Julio Lugo
Alex Cora*
They’ll be ‘itching about Marco soon enough.
In the Yankees world a young bench is a dangerous thing. I’m fine with Russo in the utility role, but would love a versatile veteran fourth OF in the Randy Winn mold.
Doumit would be an interesting pickup in that he lengthens the bench with his versatility and can also let them carry Cervelli, too letting Jorge DH aobut 30-40 times.
Pitching wise it all starts with Pettite. Once he commits you’ll have a better picture of what to do next. Will be interesting to see if the Yanks take some of the offense money coming off the books (Damon, Matsui, Nady = $ 32.5 M) and spend it on Lackey or Doc for an elite four man rotation.
1+5. Definitely want to add one starter — but then things are dicey. How do you keep Gaudin and Ace from rusting, esp. if one will be needed to fill in when Hughes nears his innings limit? I’m afraid IPK is back in Scranton. The Yanks have too many number 4/5 starting pitchers, in part because they’re all question marks. They survived 2009 that way. They might survive 2010 this way too, but will the fans? I hope we see some marked improvement in this group to solidify the back of the rotation. And if *everyone* gets better, Cashman has trade bait to boot.
2. I don’t see AJax being full time on the 25-man until 2011. This is a good place to find someone on a shorter term deal (3 years tops). Of the FAs and those likely available through trades. I don’t have a clear choice — so much depends on how well they will fit with Yankee Stadium. But in any case, I want a defensive upgrade. (Yes I’m a bit of a defense guy. But I grew up with Munson, Chambliss, Alomar/Randolph, Stick/Stanley/Bucky, Sanchez/Nettles, Murcer/Bonds/Rivers, and two of the best corner outfield minds in White and Piniella — and there were a LOT of really good infields in those days, like the O’s and Reds and Phils and Dodgers and even the Mets for a while.)
3. I want a short term deal, 1 year or maybe 2, for a DH. Anyone not named Matsui needs to be able to play the field too. If Posada hangs around past 2010 he’s gonna be doing a lot more DHing, particularly in 2012 and beyond, so a long term DH deal seems like a bad idea, unless they’re eminently tradable.
It may be time to bring in the youngsters to handle middle relief and utility infielder — though it would be a good idea to expand Pena’s ability to play the OF too, and that might best be done in AAA to start the year.
I am a big Cervelli fan. Kid has enthusiasm, good head for the game, a surprising arm, and enough legs that he can pinch run too. I don’t think he’ll ever be the hitter Posada is, but he’s okay. There are probably a handful of big league teams he could *start* for. Then again, that’s true of a lot of Yankee backups, and has been for most of the last 85 years.
Why an Eric Hinske type and not Eric Hinske?
I’d much prefer to bring back Hairston as the utility infielder instead of Pena or Russo (the former I don’t trust yet and the latter has zero ML-experience – who knows if he’s any good?).
Why an Eric Hinske type and not Eric Hinske?
I’d much prefer to bring back Hairston as the utility infielder instead of Pena or Russo (the former I don’t trust yet and the latter has zero ML-experience – who knows if he’s any good?).
1. Pettitte
2. DeJesus
3. Matsui
4. In-house
5. either Sheets, Harden, Justin D, etc.
6. In-house
7. Cervelli
8. whoever
“Melky, Pena & two minor leaguers (Whalen and Pope) for Dunn”
So you want to trade 4 players for Adam Dunn and the right to pay him 12 million for one year, when you can just resign Matsui for less?
Yes, that makes perfect sense, or not.
It seems to me that the Yanks don’t need Halliday (assuming they sign Andy), but they do want to keep Boston from getting Halliday cheaply. The Yanks should match Boston’s offers in hopes that Halliday becomes expensive in terms of players, but being careful not to make an offer that Toronto will accept. This calls for some delicate negotiating.
“Aceves, IPK and a minor leaguer for DeJesus”
This trade is even worse by the way.
Shop in the Type B gift basket!
DeRosa would be a good fit all for a spot to plug across many of these holes.He’s been offered arb by the Cardinals, but is only a Type B so that portion of cost is low. He was overrated once but seems to have been forgotten lately. He is 34 and may not accept a utility role but it does not hurt to try with an above-market offer.
I saw enough of Cabrera and Gardner last year to convince myself that neither is a starting CF (and they are not a great platoon pair). Marlon Byrd (another type B) would be a nice platoon caddy for both Gardner and Swisher and allow them to perhaps move the melk-man. Again depends on what he commands.
Duchserer should be a major priority. Haven’t seen more than a handful of guys pitch with his savvy on the mound. He is like a right-handed Jimmy Key. The depression issues actually will make him a steal IMO and limit him to a 1-year deal. Another Type B.
Here’s my suggestions for corner OFer: Willingham or Doumit. They are not Matsui, but either one could protect A-Rod especially Doumit. Still can’t believe the Nationals got Willingham for nothing last season.
If I was Cashman, I would definitely call Cleveland to see what they want for Sizemore or Choo. Cleveland got Mike Brantley to fill the hole, and their OF already consists of Laporta, Gimenez (utilty too), and Crowe.
***STOP PROMOTING DUNN ALREADY***
If Cashman did wanted him, he would had signed him last season.
I think IPK is going to establish himself as a ML #3-#4 starter this season.
Oh, and btw, at this point, AJax does not project as a major league contributor in 2010. He badly needs a consolidation year in AAA where he puts up better numbers offensively, especially with his power. If I could get great value for him in a package trade for Halladay or equivalent player, I would do it. He’s no Montero.
“If Cashman did wanted him, he would had signed him last season.”
With Matsui and Damon under contract and being able to get Swisher in a salary dump, there was a <0 chance that Cash would have signed Dunn.
“With Matsui and Damon under contract and being able to get Swisher in a salary dump, there was a 0 chance that Cash would have signed Dunn.”
let me rephase that, Dunn would had been a plan C if Texieria and Ramirez signed elsewhere.
If the priority is winning #28 and not lowering payroll then the rest will work itself out.
I would like to see Hairston back as the utility guy as well. Was he an every day player for the Reds? Would he be happy as a back up?
So the sox have yet another short stop…that posittion is like the “Defense Against the Dark Arts” professor, a new one every year, and something bad always happens to them.
1. John Lackey
2. Damon, Gardner/Jackson, Swisher
3. Miranda
4. In house
5. Andy Pettitte
6. In house
7. In house
8. In house
Jerry Hairston is not a good baseball player.
Moose
December 4th, 2009 at 1:54 pm
Duchserer should be a major priority. Haven’t seen more than a handful of guys pitch with his savvy on the mound.
***He is like a right-handed Jimmy Key.***
The depression issues actually will make him a steal IMO and limit him to a 1-year deal. Another Type B.
————————————————————
Duchserer is closer to being Francis Scott Key than he is jimmy Key.
I like Hairston, too. The problem is, he’s not a very good shortstop. Neither is Russo.
Pena is important, especially with Jeter a year older. We need to be at peace giving Derek his needed days off. Pena is a plus defender at SS – neither Hairston or Russo are that.
If Damon and Matsui move on a quality LH bat is an absolute must. Dunn would have to be a DH, he makes Abreu look like a gold glove candidate
Sheets would be my choice of the reclamation projects. By far the best talent of the group, so aim high!
Of course if they are willing to take a $ 5 M gamble on Sheets they might as well take a shot at Wang too.
Re-signing Hairston, like re-signing Molina, would be a waste of money.
How about signing Tejada and move Jeter to left field.
Excellent analysis Chad.
1. I really hope Pettite comes back, and I see the need for another top end starter (I would prefer a costly Halladay over an injury prone Lackey). The Yankees were fortunate Wang was the only injury in their rotation last year. Wang’s season was a bust, and they team had to sort through an erratic Chamberlain and a few different 5th starters.
2. I have to think that the Yankees are saving CF for AJax, so I don’t see them picking up a CF while they have Melky and Gardner. An in-house for LF could be Hinske. When AJax comes to the big team, Melky/Gardner can easily shift over to LF, and Hinske goes back to the bench. All that said, I wouldn’t be surprised if Holliday comes in to patrol LF and provide protection for ARod by hitting 5th.
3. I’m still a big believer in Matsui. This isn’t sentimental or World Series MVP hype. The man has proven he can play in NY, and can do the job on bum knees. Excellent protection for ARod if they don’t sign Holliday. Excellent protection for Holliday if he does get signed.
4. Don’t see a need to sign a reliever. Lots of guys showed what they could do last year, and they should be given the chance to do it again.
5. If they bring in Halladay and re-sign Pettite, then I don’t see a need for a back end pitcher, unless they can get someone on a minor league contract. Chamberlain/Hughes need a chance to start, and Kennedy is still in the mix for the last spot, or at least as a call up from the minors. If the Yankees fail with Halladay or Pettite (or both), then they will definitely need to bring in some sort of insurance with a back-end pitcher. Lots to choose from out on the market.
6. I really liked what Hairston was able to do off the bench last year, and have no problem with bringing him back for the utility IF/OF role. That said, Pena has been playing some OF in the minors, is younger and faster than Hairston, and better defensively on the IF. Either player, or Russo with the better bat, would be fine. No need to look outside the team for a utility player.
7. I really like Cervelli. He got derailed two years ago in spring training when he got run over and injured against Tampa Bay. He is not the future of the Yankees when it comes to catching, but I think he is definitely the player to spell Posada when he needs a rest, and will be a better option than Molina, or any of the other catchers available this year.
8. This is ranked 8th on Chad’s priority list because it is really dependant on if the Yankees pick up a real LF like Holliday, if they bring up AJax out of spring training to play CF, if they keep Hinske on the bench or have him start in LF, if they keep Hairston as a bench player…this can all be sorted out in spring training.
If the priority is winning #28 and not lowering payroll then the rest will work itself out.
Two thoughts on that:
1. The additions I suggest would put a winning team on the field
2. Easy for you to say since you don’t write the checks. Hal on the other hand has said numerous times that he wants the payroll under 200 mil.
So you want to trade 4 players for Adam Dunn and the right to pay him 12 million for one year, when you can just resign Matsui for less?
3 Things:
Don’t be so sure Matsui will take less than 12 mil. Two awful players just got 6 mil a year contracts, why would Matsui take less than 12 mil?
Yes, I want to trade a fourth outfielder, a utility infielder and two AA relief pitchers for Adam Dunn.
As for the proposed DeJesus trade – how is a long reliever, AAA starter who is right now a 6th or 7th starter and a low level minor leaguer for a starting LF in his prime a bad deal?
Jeter is not moving to LF
One player overlooked for CF is Rick Ankiel…Coming off an injury plagued season, but this guy is a great CFer with a cannon for an arm. He’ll hit about 25-30 HRs too.
It sure would be nice to have one stud outfielder with a great arm. It’s been a while.
Betsy -
I have no problem with bringing Hairston back, but I think he’s going to prefer going somewhere he can play more regularly than he would with the Yankees. An NL team where there are more opportunities to get into games seems like a logical fit.
If you want a veteran guy – a Miggy Cairo might be more likely.
Here’s my suggestions for corner OFer: Willingham or Doumit. They are not Matsui, but either one could protect A-Rod especially Doumit.
–
So you want to trade for Dunn lite or Doumit ? Who is not in the same stratosphere as Matsui?
Lets review:
Dunn – .267 .398 .529 .928 , 38 HR in 546 AB, 32% k rate, 17% BB rate
Willingham – .260 .367 .496 .863 , 104 K in 427 AB 25% K rate , 12% bb rate
Doumit – .250 .299 .414 .714 , 10 HR in 280 AB, 6% BB rate
Dunn is far superior in everything except Defense when compared to Willingham and Doumit. And he’d be a sick DH.
Willingham isn’t a bad choice though. Doumit would be a good utility player, he isn’t a starter on the yankees
Or they could try to get Willie Bloomquist as a throw in to a DeJesus deal.
Chip, did the Yankees not have increased revenue with the new stadium? If that’s true them why would they need to reduce payroll unless Hal and the other partners just want to keep more for themselves (and I guess that could be why)
bodhisattva-
I had to laugh just a little. It is not we who need to relax about Jeter getting a day off now and again – it’s Jeter!
Duchserer is closer to being Francis Scott Key than he is jimmy Key.
________________________________
I was referencing pitching style, but you also underestimate the Duke’s abilities:
Career WHIP of 1.12 (!)
HR rate of 1 per 9.68 innings
Lifetime Opponent BA of .234
Lifetime opponent OPS of .655 (!!)
Career ERA of 3.14
He’s Key-lite if you like not FS Key. I’ve been to two of his starts and it was like watching a surgeon work, fun stuff to see him carve people up with an 88 MPH fastball.
He lacks durability so you have to use him judiciously. But he’s a perfect fit for the Yanks who need someone like him so they can work in Joba/Hughes within reasonable limits. Spot starter, 7th inning guy, maybe Ramiro Mendoza was a better comp. But this dude can really pitch.
upstate kate owes Cheetah Woods a beer.
Chip
No Cairo, please!
One player overlooked for CF is Rick Ankiel…Coming off an injury plagued season, but this guy is a great CFer with a cannon for an arm. He’ll hit about 25-30 HRs too.
–
He isn’t overlooked. He can’t hit, but he can run into some, and is a good defender but not great. Its really just his arm.
Cameron is Ankiel but far superior at defense and offense (and will hit 25-30 hrs)
Rich
why?
upstate kate December 4th, 2009 at 2:14 pm
Jeter is not moving to LF
=============================================
He’s gonna have to move to another position, soon.
I can’t see him playing short at 39. It’s gonna be iffy at age 38. Might as well start moving to the outfield now. Plus, there’s a lot less wear and tear that goes in playing the outfield, which will extend Jeter’s career.
Can someone give me an argument against a 2 year deal for Mike Cameron move Melky to left, and put Dye in right. Don’t resign Damon or Matsui.
Why do people keep wanting to bring in low OBP players? The Yanks don’t win with them.
Hal has never said anything public about a specific payroll target. If he was determined to get under $ 200 Million he could have done that by ignoring CC last year… or Tex or AJ.
I like debating the baseball merits of acquisitions and sensible or somewhat sensible trade proposals. But it’s annoying when people pretend they know a damn thing about someone else’s thinking…. that includes but is not limited to the Steinbrothers, Cashman, Halladay and so on
Isn’t Miguel Cairo 50?
Red sox keep signing players, makin moves..yankees doing nothing.
Doreen
December 4th, 2009 at 2:17 pm
bodhisattva-
I had to laugh just a little. It is not we who need to relax about Jeter getting a day off now and again – it’s Jeter!
====
LOL, Doreen. QFT. Although he was a bit more mellow about it last season.
Happy Holidays to you.
Red sox keep signing players, makin moves..yankees doing nothing.
–
The Red Sox are a skooner caught in the path of the Dreadnought New York Yankees. They are taking on water so of course they need to make moves.
The Yankees have to decide which type of guns to stock the starboard side with for next season, they aren’t worrying about much else.
boat analogies itt
kate, are you drinking buddies with Tiger? lol
Awais December 4th, 2009 at 2:23 pm
Red sox keep signing players, makin moves..yankees doing nothing.
=========================================
Red sox buying everyone in sight, trying to buy another pennant!
I’d definitely like to see them get Doumit as well.
Chip, did the Yankees not have increased revenue with the new stadium? If that’s true them why would they need to reduce payroll unless Hal and the other partners just want to keep more for themselves (and I guess that could be why)
Much as I would like to be a decision maker for the Yankees I’m not so I can’t really give you an answer to that. I do know that in addition to their payroll they also shell out a lot from luxury tax (I think it’s 1 dollar for every dollar over $140 mil) and that’s not insignificant.
What I can tell you is that in addition to saying over and over again that he’s trying to lower payroll, we’ve seen things from Cashman that show he’s working off a budget (getting the Pirates to pick up part of Hinske’s contract, backing off a trade for Mike Cameron because the Brewers wouldn’t take back Igawa to offset the salary) which in the past wouldn’t have been an issue.
Zaun signed with the Brewers. 1 year deal.
1. Resign Andy as your #3.
2. Sign Mike Cameron for either LF or CF. Play Melky/Gardner/Jackson accordingly.
3. Resign Matsui as DH. He can’t play in the NL. His market is limited.
4. Fine, don’t sign a reliever. But I’d like Mike Gonzalez. There, I said it. Again.
5. Sign Sheets as depth.
6. Resign Hairston (OF, 3B, 2B) to pair with Pena (3B, SS, 2B). Don’t want Hairston? Fine, then Pena and Russo.
7. Cervelli as backup. Montero & Romine are 1 to 2 years away.
8. Eric Hinske can not only play OF, but 3B and 1B. Resign Eric Hinske.
9. I hate missing these new posts!
I’d over pay Damon and Matsui to get them for one year deals. Then go after Harden, Sheets and Duchserer. Try and sign all three pitchers. That gives us depth. Lack of depth with starting pitching almost derailed us last year. I really like Harden and Duchserer. If we can resign Pettite for reasonable dollars, say 11 million we should still try and add a couple of starters for short term contracts. In all probability we’ll only get one which leaves one starters position open for Hughes or Joba. I’m comfortable with the two of them competing for one job and the other in the pen.
There’s no-one better out there than Damon and Matsui. DeRosa is neither player, just a good sub.
“3 Things:
Don’t be so sure Matsui will take less than 12 mil. Two awful players just got 6 mil a year contracts, why would Matsui take less than 12 mil?
Yes, I want to trade a fourth outfielder, a utility infielder and two AA relief pitchers for Adam Dunn.
As for the proposed DeJesus trade – how is a long reliever, AAA starter who is right now a 6th or 7th starter and a low level minor leaguer for a starting LF in his prime a bad deal?”
Last year Cabrera didn’t put up 4th outfielder numbers. His numbers were perfectly fine for a CF. Oh, and he’s 25 years old.
Again, why trade for Dunn when you can sign Matsui for money even if it’s the same 12 million? Makes no sense to use your assets for trades when you can just sign a player for money.
Just because you view Aceves and Kennedy in that manner doesn’t mean that’s how the Yankees view them. Aceves was fine until the spot start he made. Up until that point EVERYONE was saying he’s another Ramiro Mendoza, who was an extremely valuable player for the Yankees.
If the Yankees are going to trade for Dejesus, it won’t involve Kennedy and Aceves unless other pieces are coming back.
Dunn makes too much money and he’s one dimensional.
Cameron, like Dunn, is a K king and too old.
29 other teams not named the Nationals had an opportunity to acquire Dunn last season and chose to abstain. They all have access to stats and have an army of scouts and wanted nothing to do with him. Dunn wasn’t even offered arbitration and no one bit. Only the Nationals in an act of desperation hoping to give the DC fans something…anything to bring them to the stadium gave Dunn the time of day. This is of course after they struck out on every big name FA they tried to get. People need to ask themselves why a perennial 40 hr guy in his prime was essentially left out in the cold?
Dunn makes too much money and he’s one dimensional.
–
His one dimension is: scoring boatloads of runs
Thats a good area to be one dimensional in. Many players that are being bandied about could be considered 1 dimensional, in that their 1 dimension is ‘defense’ or ‘plays a lot of positions’, but not necessarily ‘good at not making outs’ or ‘good at scoring/creating runs’
Adam Dunn does the one fundamental thing of baseball right, he gets on base. Therefore, he scores runs, he knocks in runs.
Can someone give me an argument against a 2 year deal for Mike Cameron move Melky to left, and put Dye in right.
1. Melky isn’t a good enough hitter to play both him and Cameron
2. If you sign Cameron and Dye who is batting in the 2 spot?
3. Dye probably shouldn’t play the OF everyday anymore
4. Cameron is at an age where you should only give him a 1 year deal
I know you asked for one, but in the holiday season I felt like giving four.
Miguel Cairo
Chip, I’m sure they are working from a budget. What I’m saying is if they have any opportunity to sign a player that will help them win then they should be able to since theu are bringing in more money
Baseball remains one of life’s little IQ tests.
Figgins and the M’s closing in a 4/36M deal.
Here’s my suggestions for corner OFer: Willingham or Doumit.
If I was Cashman, I would definitely call Cleveland to see what they want for Sizemore or Choo. Cleveland got Mike Brantley to fill the hole, and their OF already consists of Laporta, Gimenez (utilty too), and Crowe.
What do you think we would have to give up for Choo? He’s a great option, but we could give up less for Willingham or DeJesus.
Damon and Matsui will not be ‘overpaid’ on 1 year deals. If the Yankees wanted to do that, they would’ve offered arbitration. The notion of bringing back either on 1 year deal seems highly unlikely.
“What do you think we would have to give up for Choo?”
Earlier this year SJ44 wanted to trade Phil Hughes for Choo.
Last year Cabrera didn’t put up 4th outfielder numbers. His numbers were perfectly fine for a CF. Oh, and he’s 25 years old. and the year before that he was so bad that he was sent to the minors and he’s about to start making more money (through arbitration) than he’s worth
Again, why trade for Dunn when you can sign Matsui for money even if it’s the same 12 million? Makes no sense to use your assets for trades when you can just sign a player for money. because Matsui would strictly be a one year stop gap. If the Yankees trade for Dunn and like what they see they could extend him and have a middle of the order of Tex, Alex, and Dunn for the next five years
Just because you view Aceves and Kennedy in that manner doesn’t mean that’s how the Yankees view them. Aceves was fine until the spot start he made. Up until that point EVERYONE was saying he’s another Ramiro Mendoza, who was an extremely valuable player for the Yankees. Ok, and if I could get a good LF for Ramiro Mendoza I would do that too. And for Kennedy to have a role in the rotation two of the following have to happen: The Yankees don’t sign another pitcher, Someone gets hurt, Hughes and Joba both fall flat, Kennedy stays healthy. And exactly what has Kennedy done other than dominate AAA hitters?
If the Yankees are going to trade for Dejesus, it won’t involve Kennedy and Aceves unless other pieces are coming back. Ok, so swap out one of them and replace him with another player
I’m as big a Yankee fan as anyone but the gross over-hyping of some of the Yankee prospects and fringe players is really astounding
I would love to get Shin Shoo Choo.
Sign Holliday for LF, trade for Choo for RF and make Swisher the DH.
The problem with trades though is that they’re uncertain, while free agents are more of a sure thing.
I’d like to see them acquire Choo or Granderson or Doumit but it’s easier for them to just throw money at Holliday since he’s more of a sure-thing and we don’t know what other GM’s are demanding in return for their talent.
Chip, I’m sure they are working from a budget. What I’m saying is if they have any opportunity to sign a player that will help them win then they should be able to since theu are bringing in more money
I’m sure Brian could go to Hal and say, “look, this guy’s available and can help us win, we should go after him but it will put us above budget.” But I’m not entirely certain it will work. And really can any of us complain if Hal draws a firm line at $200 mil?
bodhi -
Thank you. And Happy Holidays to you and yours.
A decision with Andy returning would be better sooner than later. It sets the wheels in motion for one slot in the starting rotation.
Kevin Russo and Ramiro Pena appear ready to battle it out in spring training for a utility role.
Picking up a veteran catcher for insurance at AAA is advisable.
Frankie Cervelli will work hard to assure himself as the backup to Jorge.
Marlon Byrd would be a good signing. Can play any OF position with an adequate bat.
Roy Halladay ??? …… next week could tell the story.
Here are some video highlights of Ankiel in CF. I would welcome him here. Good coverage of CF, and a difference maker in his arm
http://stlouis.cardinals.mlb.c.....5072655396
Choo would be extremely hard to pry away from cleveland. They have an excellent catching prospect at AAA so we can’t entice them with our catching depth.
Choo is young, good, and under control.
You guys realize that Chad covered Austin Jackson last yr in Scranton, right? While I also think he needs more time in AAA, it’s silly to dismiss Chad’s opinion since he’s seen him a hell of a lot more than us.
“and the year before that he was so bad that he was sent to the minors and he’s about to start making more money (through arbitration) than he’s worth”
Yeah, the year before that is ancient history as far as I’m concerned. He’s just about to enter his prime so there’s a good chance he’ll get better. Last year he earned MUCH less than what he was worth, so what’s your point?
“because Matsui would strictly be a one year stop gap. If the Yankees trade for Dunn and like what they see they could extend him and have a middle of the order of Tex, Alex, and Dunn for the next five years ”
Or, they could just sign Matsui for this year, not trade any players, and then sign Dunn when he’s a free agent next year.
“Ok, and if I could get a good LF for Ramiro Mendoza I would do that too. And for Kennedy to have a role in the rotation two of the following have to happen: The Yankees don’t sign another pitcher, Someone gets hurt, Hughes and Joba both fall flat, Kennedy stays healthy. And exactly what has Kennedy done other than dominate AAA hitters?”
Considering Kennedy was drafted in 2006 and made it to the majors in one year I’d say he’s done plenty thus far. I would also trade Mendoza for a good LF. But I’m not trading multiple players for Dejesus. I would trade multiple lower level prospects however.
A lot of If’s there. If if were a 5th of whiskey I’d be drunk right now.
” Ok, so swap out one of them and replace him with another player
I’m as big a Yankee fan as anyone but the gross over-hyping of some of the Yankee prospects and fringe players is really astounding”
Dont’ think I’ve hyped up anyone thus far. But the old adage is you can’t have too much pitching and Kennedy’s entire pitcher resume he’s been an Ace and I like his future as a ML pitcher.
I’m as big a Yankee fan as anyone but the gross over-hyping of some of the Yankee prospects and fringe players is really astounding
Overhyping the value of guys like DeJesus and Dunn are equally astounding.
“Cameron, like Dunn, is a K king and too old.”
Dunn just turned 30. I was shocked to see he is only 10 days older than Ryan Howard, but had hit 113 MLB homers before Howard hit his 1st. He’s been around awhile, but he’s not old.
That said, I wouldn’t go scooters trying to get him. Matsui is the more complete hitter, will likely come a little cheaper, and doesn’t require moving anyone.
It would def be difficult to trade for Choo or Granderson or maybe even Doumit. That’s why the Yankees’ offseason plans usually revolve around 1 big free agent signing. They can’t rely on trade negotiations panning out since their complex and unpredictable.
That’s why I think they’ve slotted in Holliday and Pettitte and will work from their to address the other needs.
Every one is high on the Yankees young talent. They have a lot of it. Never before has this organization had so many good young players and or trade pieces. AA and AAA championships over the past few years to boot.
Dunn is like Cameron in that he is a K king. Cameron is old. Dunn is not. That’s what I meant.
I would have no qualms with bringing in Cameron on a short term deal or Ankiel to play CF, upgrading LF with a David DeJesus and sending Melky either to the bench or out the door in a trade.
Melky’s a decent player and he can have a nice ML career, but he shouldn’t be starting everyday. The reason the Yankees are able to carry him is because they surround him with very good players. We saw what happens to Melky when he’s asked to do more than bat in the 9 spot two years ago – he falls apart. And this is coming from someone who used to defend Melky and say that we should be patient with him because he reminded me of Bernie Williams at that age. Here’s the difference, Melky’s not a worker and now that he’s going to start getting paid I can see him becoming very satisfied with himself and regressing.
Ankiel has been below average in CF by UZR/150 the past 3 years. His arm is his greatest asset.
If you got Ankiel AND Cameron, Ankiel would have play left, where actually projects as a positive defender. And his bat can’t hold up at any outfield position. The dude barely hits or gets on base.
Tom,
Have you ever heard of decades called the 1930′s, 1940′s and 1950′s?
Dunn is like Cameron in that he is a K king. Cameron is old. Dunn is not. That’s what I meant.
Striking out is all they have in common.
A better comparison for Dunn is Ryan Howard. You surround Dunn with the kind of guys who are surrounding Howard and he’s probably going to wind up with a BA closer to what Howard’s is than where Dunn’s career numbers have been.
Upstate Kate, Hairston was very happy here. The only kind of team he’d be a starter on would be a bad team – does he really want to be in that situation again, where the whole season is an exercise in playing out the string?
Matsui’s OPS is .967 in “late and close” situations during his Yankee career (503 PA, 25 HR, 85 RBI). He has a lifetime OPS of .824 against LH pitching. Matsui’s postseason OPS is .933 in 235 PA (including 1.136 in 2009).
The Yankees should offer Matsui a $7 million base salary to DH in 2010, with incentives of a few million more. Have a team option with a buyout for 2011.
Matsui could DH for 100-120 games in 2010 (depending upon if the Yankees re-sign Damon), and pinch hit in another 15 games or so. It might be a year too early to let Matsui walk.
Of course they have a budget. My point is that no one here or in the media knows exactly what it is. Last year we were told $ 180 Million was the target… how’d that turn out?
I believe they want to keep payroll relatively flat and to do that you have to make more finance-based decisions. Because of the length of the deals already signed to Alex, Tex, CC and AJ I doubt more than one additional major acquisition arrives this year… and maybe ot even that.
Dont’ think I’ve hyped up anyone thus far. But the old adage is you can’t have too much pitching and Kennedy’s entire pitcher resume he’s been an Ace and I like his future as a ML pitcher.
You and I are going to have to agree to disagree on IPK. Kennedy lost me when he got rocked for the umpteenth time in 08 and said he didn’t feel like he needed to adjust anything because he was having so much success in the minors.
I do think Kennedy could pitch in the majors but also feel that with guys like McAllister, Betances, Brackman, Mitchell, Heredia, Buellos (or how ever you spell it), Bleich, etc…they can also move him because by the time they need him, one of those guys will probably be ready – and if not, the Yankees have the ability to go out and get someone else.
As for why not just wait a year on Dunn – because if I’m given the choice between a 30 year old who is going to give me at least 40 HR and 100 RBI or a 36 year old who has bad knees I’m going with the first guy. Especially if it’s not costing me anything but two reserves and a couple of fringe pitchers who may never make the majors.
Chien-ming Wang doesn’t make any Priorities Lists????
Matsui could DH for 100-120 games in 2010 (depending upon if the Yankees re-sign Damon), and pinch hit in another 15 games or so. It might be a year too early to let Matsui walk.
“It’s better to let a player go a year too early than a year too late” – George Young, GM of the NY Giants.
so about 3 weeks ago I started playing a drinking game – i take a shot of jack everytime Chip mentions David Dejesus, Brad Hawpe, Adam Dunn or Randy Winn in a blog entry…
my doctor today said i have early signs of cirrhosis..
thanks Chip…
I’ve missed so much. The last sports thing I saw was a highlight of Sanchez sliding head first.
Scutaro? A real shortstop? He’s hurt the Yankees in the past a couple of times, but not an earth-shattering signing that strikes much fear. One thing down, six to go for the Sox.
As for the Yankees? I saw someone put Ian in as a #3-4. I’d like to see him at least crack a rotation first. And I hope that person meant a 3-4 type because he’s below Joba and Hughes on the depth chart. Another thing, Ian has even more IP issues than the other two, and coming off serious surgery. Don’t know that he’ll be pushed that hard towards the majors.
Andy, yes. Halladay, yes. Sheets? I’d rather have Aceves. Sorry, guys. Sheets has never pitched out of the NL Central as far as I know. He’s coming off surgery as far as I know.
If they resign Damon, then I don’t think they can afford to spend too much on CF. Platoon might work again. I’d rather get a real CF and move melky to LF.
Hideki is a resounding yes. For reasons I’ve stated too many times to repeat.
Rosenthal is reporting that Figgins and the Mariners are close to a 4yr/36 mil deal. I hope this is true.
Nick in SF
December 4th, 2009 at 3:03 pm
Chien-ming Wang doesn’t make any Priorities Lists????
*********************
He makes mine!
And watch figgins decline…
Why do you hope it’s true, CC?
If you are judging Ankiel by 2009 during his injury, yes, he had problems hitting. But hte year before he hit 25 HRs in 413 ABs, with 71 RBI, and a .337 OBP (so-so)
I think he might hit 30 HRs in Yankee Stadium…but I’m not his agent and don’t need to harp on him
What about Milton Bradley? Why don’t we just get him for the OF !
You take a chance on a guy like Sheets. he had the same elbow surgery that Pettitte had when he was in Houston. it wasnt TJ surgery. When Sheets is right, he’s dominant and he goes deep into games (unlike Harden). If you can get him for 1yr at 8 – 10 mil, you jump on that and roll the dice.
Sal
December 4th, 2009 at 3:08 pm
What about Milton Bradley? Why don’t we just get him for the OF !
******
The only Milton Bradley that should ever be allowed in Yankee Stadium is the kind thats a board game
As long as the market is open, it behooves the Yanks to float budget concerns.
I respect George Young too but he never won a World Series.
Chip didn’t want anything to do with Andy Pettiitte a year ago and preferred a broken down anyone else who didn’t have the track record Pettitte did.
I don’t think Cashman wants anything to do with Adam Dunn. They’ve already got Swisher fill that big pop with high OBP, lots of K’s, and suspect defense role.
I dont think Figgins will age well. He depends too much on his legs. i didnt want to see the Yanks sign him for 3 or 4 years. Just my opinion.
Plus, it takes him away from the Halos next yr.
“Can someone give me an argument against a 2 year deal for Mike Cameron move Melky to left, and put Dye in right.”
Dye is a player in rapid decline and can’t play the field effectively. You don’t sign Cameron, a 37-year old centerfielder to a 2-year deal – no matter how good his zone rating is and you can’t count on Cabrera to replicate his numbers again in 2010 – which, were barely league average.
Braves interested in Marlon Byrd.
“Plus, it takes him away from the Halos next yr.”
He and Ichiro may be real pain in the ass atop that Seattle lineup. However, the 3-4-5 hitters may be a pain in the ass for the Seattle fandom.
If you are judging Ankiel by 2009 during his injury, yes, he had problems hitting. But hte year before he hit 25 HRs in 413 ABs, with 71 RBI, and a .337 OBP (so-so)
–
He hit terrible all year. Injury or not he was a liability at the plate. He has declined each season, regardless of injury, and failed spectacularly at hitting lefties.
GF -
I didn’t want anything to do with Andy for mostly non-baseball reasons.
Andy had really disappointed me by the way he handled his 2008 contract and I didn’t want the Yankees to reward him for that.
And comparing Dunn to Swisher is foolish. I gave you a comparison for Dunn – Ryan Howard. And if Dunn is playing mostly at DH who cares how suspect his defense is? Do they award Gold Gloves to DHs?
“It’s better to let a player go a year too early than a year too late” – George Young, GM of the NY Giants.
“I respect George Young too but he never won a World Series.”
Actually, that quote was first made by Branch Rickey. I think he did OK baseball-wise.
That said, I am on the record as wanting Matsui back for 2010, with full understanding of the risks. Also, those quotes by Young and Rickey were made with the trade market in mind. Obviously, Matsui will never be a possible trade chip for the Yanks.
Im sorry but in my opinion there’s no way NY gets payroll under 200 Mill and stay competitive as long as Jeter, Posada, Mariano and Pettitte are on this team. They are just too overpaid for their ages. The reality is…these guys are year older…still making boatloads and with every new season comes that chance of a team crippling injury.
There’s no reason for this team to have such a mediocre outfield with this kind of payroll. We have one of the worst outfields in the AL as a whole in terms of defense and offense. They cant play this Melky in left, gardner in CF nonsense. They simply cant. Some of you are so high on this in-house stuff it boggles my mind. Swisher hitting 2nd, melky hitting 8th and gardner hitting 9th? Yeah that’ll be the day.
I can see taking a chance on the guy. But not for that much. And if the Yankees did it for that much, I’d croak. They didn’t give that to Andy. Appears that Wang will be left by the wayside. Sheets for $8-10M? Yikes. That’s a pretty expensive gamble. At least I know what a healthy Pettitte and Wang will give me.
Chip,
Both Cashman and Girardi have said several times that they would like to have more flexibility at DH in order to give the older guys some days off.
Signing Dunn to strictly be a DH doesn’t sound like something they have any intention of doing.
If they want to sign someone to strictly be a DH – they’ll go with the reigning World Series MVP since he’s the proven guy despite his bad knees.
The more I think about this the more I think the Yankee do spend to aquire pitching this year.
Going into the 2009 season, they had the following starters:
CC the new 161mil Ace
Wang the 2 time 19 game winner and former Ace
AJ the new 85mil #3
Andy the former #2 now slotted #4
Joba #5
Phil#6
Ace#7
and so on…
They are not likely going into 2010 with a lesser pitching staff.
If Andy comes back and 90% of the people say he will, we’ve got:
CC
AJ
Andy
Joba
Phil
Chad ?
Ace
and…
Not Likely, they are going to get another arm that can slot toward the top of the rotation, not the bottom.
Earlier I said that if Andy comes back at 10-12mil, it is not likely they would spend for a guy like Lackey or Halladay too. I’m not so sure that is the case…
On another note – I do love the Mariners. They just get out from a bad contract they gave to an overrated 3b and what do they do? Give a bad contract to a 3b.
Figgins to M’s? If they go all in on Lackey, they may be going for it this year while Felix is still there and Ichiro is still pesky.
Both Cashman and Girardi have said several times that they would like to have more flexibility at DH in order to give the older guys some days off.
Signing Dunn to strictly be a DH doesn’t sound like something they have any intention of doing.
If they want to sign someone to strictly be a DH – they’ll go with the reigning World Series MVP since he’s the proven guy despite his bad knees.
—
They also said that having Matsui as just a DH still provided them that flexibility and worked out just fine. Alot of you are miscontruing the idea behind a ‘flexible DH’. They have to sign someone to play the position. You need a guy who will fill in 140 games at DH.
To clarify my Sheets comments, I expect Andy to be back next yr. I’m not suggesting they sign Sheets instead of Pettitte.
Both Cashman and Girardi have said several times that they would like to have more flexibility at DH in order to give the older guys some days off.
Signing Dunn to strictly be a DH doesn’t sound like something they have any intention of doing.
If they want to sign someone to strictly be a DH – they’ll go with the reigning World Series MVP since he’s the proven guy despite his bad knees.
—————————-
Ok, I’m cool with saying this for the 20th time – see if you can stay with me:
1. Adam Dunn is not a good outfielder
2. Adam Dunn can play the outfield (or 1b) without hurting himself
Therefore Girardi can play Adam Dunn in the field if he needs/wants to rest another player by DHing him
1. Matsui is not a good outfielder
2. Matsui’s knees are so bad he can’t play the outfield without hurting himself (he can’t even leg out a double without limping)
Therefore Girardi cannot play Matusi in the field if he needs/wants to rest another player by DHing him
Thus we reach the conclusion that Dunn (while not a good fielder) gives the Yankees more flexibility than Matsui (not a fielder at all)
If you want adam dunn in the OF, why not just get Holliday…..Dunn is pointless.
Guys. even with Pettite coming back. The Yanks are getting another starter.
CC,
Of course, I was just saying that for comparative purposes.
I hope Andy comes back and gives us close to what he did last season. I still can’t get over the season and postseason he had. It was really a pleasure to watch. Even when the incentives kicked in.
Nice, Chip. I’m glad you are cool with repeating the same nonsense 20 times because it’s still just that – nonsense.
Which means there’s a better chance Megan Fox shows up on my doorstep than Cashman trading for Adam Dunn.
I’d bet the ranch that both Cashman and Girardi would rather keep an aging and immobile Matsui.
If you want adam dunn in the OF, why not just get Holliday…..Dunn is pointless.
I don’t want Dunn in the OF – I’m saying he is physically capable of playing the OF. If Girardi wanted to give Swisher for example a day at DH, Dunn could play in RF. Or if he wanted to give Tex a day at DH he could play Dunn at 1b (or RF with Swisher moving to 1b) or if he wanted to play Posada at DH he could give Dunn a game in the OF to keep his bat in the lineup…etc.
megan fox is hot !!!
To be honest, if the Yanks dont get Halladay (probably won’t) or Lackey (and I hope they don’t), I’d love to see them sign Pettitte and Sheets.
Im sorry I just dont see the point of giving up prospects for another Giambi type.
…..Halladay or Granderson on the other hand….those make more sense.
Im sorry I just dont see the point of giving up prospects for another Giambi type.
…..Halladay or Granderson on the other hand….those make more sense.
–
Well for one we still need to retain or replace Matsui and Damon’s production. For two, the cost of acquiring Adam Dunn is much cheaper than acquiring Halladay or Granderson.
Well for one we still need to retain or replace Matsui and Damon’s production. For two, the cost of acquiring Adam Dunn is much cheaper than acquiring Halladay or Granderson.
—————-
So you’d rather trade for Dunn than trade for Granderson and re-sign Matsui for 1-year?
Agreed, Corey.
Those deals would make A LOT more sense, especially Halladay.
Can someone give me an argument against a 2 year deal for Mike Cameron move Melky to left, and put Dye in right. Don’t resign Damon or Matsui.
___
Because Damon and Matsui are better than Cameron and Dye, we still have swisher, and why get rid of two lefties who thrive at YS to bring in two righties?
makes ZERO sense.
I’d bet the ranch that both Cashman and Girardi would rather keep an aging and immobile Matsui.
You’re still assuming Matsui is going to jump at a 1 year offer in the $5-7 mil range I assume?
Why? Because he loves NY? Because he loves the Yankees? Yeah, that’s nice – and I think it’s garbage. Two old players who aren’t very good just got multiyear deals for 6 mil per. Why wouldn’t Matsui want at least a 2 year deal? Why would he settle for less money than he made last year?
So if the choices are to sign Matsui to a “fair market” contract or trade for Adam Dunn on a 1 year deal – I’m betting the ranch that the Yankees go for Dunn.
Remember when Cashman made all those comments about how post season performance wouldn’t heavily weigh on his decision making about who to bring back and who to let go? Yeah, that was directed at Matsui.
This is why Holliday…as costly as he is, makes sense to me. You can plug him in the LF hole….he has better defense than Damon, a better arm than Damon….is only 30 years old….hits for power so he can protect A-Rod OR you can put him in front of Teixeira in the #2 because he has a career batting average of .318
….Not to mention it puts Boston at a major disadvantage and forces them to sign Bay to a long-term deal…..and if they dont they have to trade prospects for a bat
Jeter, Posada, Mariano and Pettitte are on this team. They are just too overpaid for their ages
____
WHAT!!!
Rivera deserves every dime he is paid. Definitely same for pettitte in 2009. Jeter may make too much, but get used to it because another 100m will be coming his way over the next 5 years once they come to a new deal. posada is overpaid, but by standards of baseball, not by too much.
Well for one we still need to retain or replace Matsui and Damon’s production. For two, the cost of acquiring Adam Dunn is much cheaper than acquiring Halladay or Granderson.
————
They don’t need to go for the cheaper option. If they make any deal at all, it has to be for talents who best fit your ballclub.
Halladay or Granderson are unquestionably better fits than Dunn.
So you’d rather trade for Dunn than trade for Granderson and re-sign Matsui for 1-year?
–
Huh? I’d re-sign Matsui before I do anything. If matsui won’t re-sign, then I’d explore trading for Dunn. Granderson is unrealistic because Detroit is not shopping him, he is just available. Halladay is being shopped but the price is steep.
Dunn is a replacement @ the DH position. He could ‘field’ in Left but he’d be a liability.
Trading for Granderson still means signing a leftfielder and a DH in my mind. Unless you move Melky to left. Then you’re counting on Granderson+Melky replacing Damon+Melky.
If Derek Jeter is the captain and great guy he claims to be….he should acknowledge his age will be becoming a factor soon and take a pay cut so the team can sign some younger more athletic players. No position player deserves a 4-5 yr deal for $100MM at 36 years old. Not even the almighty derek jeter.
Chip
December 4th, 2009 at 3:17 pm
GF -
I didn’t want anything to do with Andy for mostly non-baseball reasons.
Andy had really disappointed me by the way he handled his 2008 contract and I didn’t want the Yankees to reward him for that.
And comparing Dunn to Swisher is foolish. I gave you a comparison for Dunn – Ryan Howard. And if Dunn is playing mostly at DH who cares how suspect his defense is? Do they award Gold Gloves to DHs?
——————————————————–
he took a team friendly contract in 2009 & if you don’t wan’t to sign players based on their contract demands what about cc,arod,burnett & almost every other player we ever signed
arod cost us money from texas & we gave him a raise for it
who cares
do you wan’t pettitte to pitch for free?
They don’t need to go for the cheaper option. If they make any deal at all, it has to be for talents who best fit your ballclub.
Halladay or Granderson are unquestionably better fits than Dunn.
–
Dunn’s talents fit extremely well into the yankees mantra of getting on base and hitting for power. He also sacks up nicely with RISP.
Granderson is actually an acquisition that would be moving away from philosophy a little bit, as we’d be decreasing our ability to get on base, but doing it to increase overall team athleticism and speed (assuming we continue to play melky in the field despite getting granderson)
By all accounts, Matsui loves New York. It’s the only home he’s had in the states.
Hideki won’t have many suitors, so who knows what he’ll accept?
Of course nothing is set in stone, like Hideki’s adamance to play for the NYY. Or if the Yankees even want him back.
But it would be nice if the two sides could come to an agreement. If a deal can be made, it’ll be a good one for New York. Because there’s not much of a market for Hideki. Unless he finds an AL team willing to sign him to DH exclusively. And that’s not too farfetched. He’d certainly have more power than guys like Ortiz and Burrell. lol.
Chip,
I never said Matsui would jump at anything. Not one syllable about what it might take to get him back.
You’ve got me confused with someone else.
My only point is that he’s a better fit for the Yanks than Dunn and Girardi and Cashman probably think so too.
And for the record, there were supposedly a lot of negative innuendos by Cashman regarding Pettitte last season (which drew cheers from you because you thought they were “moving on”) and they ended up signed him anyways.
It’s a business and that’s what GMs do.
The Yanks can’t acquire Halladay and Pettitte, replace both Damon and Matsui, and maintain a bullpen at the level it was at the end of the year. If you are advocating the above, say what you think the Yanks have to have, and what they can do without.
If the Yanks get Granderson, they will either become much more vulnerable to LHP, or they will need to get an a RH OF to pair with Granderson. If you want Granderson, which option do you like better?
The Japan revenue pays Matsui’s salary! All the production he brings is a bonus! RBIs and protection for Arod! Better than free!
No follow-up questions, please, I’m very busy.
It will be interesting to see how Scott Boras overhypes Holliday and Damon at the winter meetings next week.
Signing Matt Holliday would be idiotic, especially if you’re paying him in the $20 mil range.
He’s not that good. He just isn’t.
Not worth it.
As mel stated above, there’s not a big market for Matsui.
He might end up having to take whatever he can get – similar to Abreu a year ago.
Personally….I’d rather NY not trade for Halladay and give up prospects. I’d rather them get Matt Holliday for LF, Re-Sign Andy, Re-Sign Matsui, and get another guy like Duchscherer and be done with the offseason.
They dont have to do as much as you people are claiming……
Rotation: Sabathia, Burnett, Pettitte, Duchscherer, Hughes,
Lineup: Jeter, Holliday, Teixeira, Rodriguez, Matsui, Posada, Cano, Swisher, Cabrera
Bullpen: Rivera, Chamberlain, Robertson, Coke, Marte, Aceves, Gaudin
Bench: Gardner, Cervelli, Pena, Hinske
Nick, don’t you remember the boy who cried wolf? If you don’t take these issues seriously then no one will take you seriously when you want to get serious! Then you won’t be able to post on an internet blog anymore. Then what? Move on? Not likely.
If the Yankees want a DH who’s capable of playing the field at multiple positions when the veterans need a rest, then they need to move Swisher to the DH role since he can play all 3 OF positions (granted not very well) and first base. He’s a versatile DH, if there is such a thing.
When the roster is viewed with Swisher as the DH, the Yankees need to find 2 outfielders. Again, Holliday is more of a sure thing than a trade so he’d be 1, the other must come via trade.
I’ve said this 1000 x but I like the idea of signing Holliday, trading for Granderson and moving Melky to LF because the Yankees would be upgrading all 3 OF positions and replace the void on offense left by Damon and Matsui.
Another possibility is signing Holliday and trading for Doumit who can play RF but then Melky’s stuck in CF and Doumit is not much better than Swisher in RF.
Or they can maybe sign Holliday and trade for David DeJesus but DeJesus is an inferior fielder in CF to Melky and he (DeJesus) doesn’t make much sense as a RF.
But one can’t discount the advantage of having Jesus and DeJesus on the same team so as to appease fans of ‘The Big Lebowski’.
I personally don’t like Swisher in RF and prefer him as the DH so I hope the Yankees can sign Holliday and work out a good solid trade for another outfielder to go with Melky.
edit: Melky to RF
Of course nothing is set in stone, like Hideki’s adamance to play for the NYY. Or if the Yankees even want him back.
I agree with you – Last year everyone said that CC was going to the Angels because he was a West Coast guy. Bottom line is that if someone is willing to pay you, you’ll make your home almost anywhere.
I think the Yankees would like him and Damon back, but at their terms. 1 year deals, less than $10 mil for each and I just don’t see it happening – Damon won’t even be close and like I just said on Matsui, if I’m Hideki why the heck would I settle for less than what Bobby Abreu got?
In terms of what teams might be looking at Matsui we’ve heard rumors of the Mets and also the White Sox. I’m sure the Angels would have interest in having him replace Vlad at DH.
Randy Wolf? I don’t remember who it was crying for him, but no thank you.
I don’t know, I just can’t wait for a move. Any move. For any one. I don’t care anymore. Officially. I just want something real to talk/read about. There is nothing new to say anymore.
Yet, I keep checkin’ in. So, who’s the dummy?
You never know – I woke up to news about Marco Scutaro. Maybe one of these visits I’ll find out Damon signed with the Mets and Matsui’s headed to the Angels. Something. Anything.
I could live with Bay to the Mariners and Holliday to the Cardinals.
I know it would take SOME wishful thinking that crawford doesnt sign an extension with TB but…..Signing Holliday sets up a possible ridiculous outfield for years to come.
2010: Sign Holliday….2011: Sign Crawford….2011: Call up Ajax.
LF: Crawford
CF: Jackson
RF: Holliday
Somewhat a dream, but bloody awesome in theory.
Corey -
Holliday in the #2 spot of the lineup is a misfit. Holliday’s a slugger and you want him in the middle of the order, he’s not a table setter.
Chip ….Holliday is just as much a contact hitter as he is a “slugger” I dont consider him just one or the other…..like Dunn who is all or nothing. Holliday in front of Teixeira can be a MAJOR threat.
Ledger_Yankees Cashman says Yankees meetings have concluded. He has a set budget. “Now we’re in position to start engaging.” –Carig
34 minutes ago from TweetDeck
Doreen-I know exactly what you mean. I’m so glad the Winter Meetings start next week; I’m hoping SOMETHING will happen. I realize the Yankees aren’t in any hurry to make any moves, there’s no reason for them to be. But it’s very frustrating just waiting. lol
Holliday in the #2 spot of the lineup is a misfit. Holliday’s a slugger and you want him in the middle of the order, he’s not a table setter.
–
I disagree. That scenario we got Holliday AND Matsui, so if you have Matsui and Holliday you put Holliday in the 2 spot because he will get on base and has speed. Its fine, because Matsui can hold down the 5 and you want your best bats getting the most ABs.
If you believe the stat sites that do this sort of thing, Jeter has outperformed his current contract. And if his 2010 season is close to his 2009 season, there is no way he’s taking a pay cut. 4 yrs at 80 mil is probably what you’re going to see.
Corey –
I say if you’re going to dream dream big:
2011
Jeter
Crawford – LF
Mauer – C
Alex – 3b
Tex – 1b
Dunn – DH
Holliday – RF
Cano – 2b
Jackson – CF
rotation:
CC, Halladay, AJ, Lee, Hughes
If that lineup existed outside of fantasy land it would score 2000 runs and be voted ‘most sexiest lineup’
Mauer, Holliday, Tex, A-rod, Jeter oh my!
The Yankees first offer will be to Pettitte. He’s their initital concern.
Doreen,
LOL. The Yankees heard you and responded. They are locked and engaged.
Where is Chone Figgins going to bat? Behind Ichiro?
No Halladay, no Holliday, no big or long contracts this year.
I just think signing Holliday for LF & the #2 spot in the order, Re-Signing Pettitte & Matsui, and getting one of Sheets/Duscherer/Harden is the best offseason NY can put together…..all while keeping all their prospects.
Don’t blink and make a panic move, Doreen; that’s just what Theo and Gammons and the Socks fans who have infiltrated Yankee media are hoping for.
Erin -
I’m glad someone else feels the same. I feel like I’m going to go crazy if I read one more outfield scenario. (I know I don’t have to read them, but what else am I gonna do in between putting up Christmas decorations? I need a break, even one guaranteed to drive me to insanity!
)
Well, at least now there’s a set budget and a set plan. Now, they’ll send Brian on his way to Indianapolis to do some shopping.
Yay, finally!
Corey –
Frankly neither Holliday or Dunn should be batting ahead of Tex, but that’s not the point. And I would be thrilled with either Holliday or Dunn batting in the 5 spot. I just think you’re wasting a great deal of Holliday’s talent to put him in the 2 hole.
If you sign Holliday then you pass on Matsui and bring back Damon as the DH and go with a lineup of:
Jeter
Damon
Tex
Alex
Holliday
and so on…
m -
I saw that. Wasn’t it nice of them to accommodate me?
It’s so weird to think about the Yankees playing the Angels next season and not have Figgins leading off.
Corey –
Frankly neither Holliday or Dunn should be batting ahead of Tex, but that’s not the point. And I would be thrilled with either Holliday or Dunn batting in the 5 spot. I just think you’re wasting a great deal of Holliday’s talent to put him in the 2 hole.
If you sign Holliday then you pass on Matsui and bring back Damon as the DH and go with a lineup of:
That makes no sense. Matsui is cheaper than Damon will be and it would help offset the cost of Holliday per year…..and I dont see Holliday as the #2 hitter as a waste….the man hits .300+ EVERY season…..you want guys like that at the top of your order.
Nick in SF -
Panic? What, me? Panic??!!!???!!!??
I’m just worried I’ll be asleep when some real news actually comes our way!
Jeter was one of the best players in the league last year.
He was certainly the best Yankee on the team.
Best players in the league usually get best player money.
It’s nonsense that people think the guy is overpaid.
Frankly neither Holliday or Dunn should be batting ahead of Tex, but that’s not the point. And I would be thrilled with either Holliday or Dunn batting in the 5 spot. I just think you’re wasting a great deal of Holliday’s talent to put him in the 2 hole.
–
Is it really that much of a waste when you have Jeter and his .380 OBP infront of Holliday? As well as Swisher and his .380 OBP batting in the 8 spot?
Depending on how the lineup flips around, Holliday will be in the middle of a dangerous bunch but also at the end of a 4 spot that will see 3 batters with a .370ish+ OBP and it will be right before 2 batters near .400 and 1 (matsui assuming) who is .370, all who slug over .490.
Holliday anywhere 2-5 is a good bet I think.
@Doreen: just set your Twitter feed to “Yankee vibrate mode”, though that could be annoying if there’s a leak from Taiwan in the middle of the night.
Think about this though – without giving up anything of consequence or locking the Yankees into a long term contract Cashman can get younger and healthier in LF & DH and still have enough flexibility to make a move next year if Crawford does hit the free agent market
Trade for DeJesus (1 year 5 mil with an option for next year), Trade for Dunn (1 year 12 mil)
Yankee lineup:
Jeter
DeJesus
Tex
Alex
Dunn
Posada
Cano
Swisher
Jackson/Gardner
If Crawford doesn’t get to free agency you pick up DeJesus’s option and still have a solid LF.
How about signing Bengie Molina and moving Posada to DH? Then Posada can be the backup C with Cervelli next in line.
Doreen
I’m looking more for April and real baseball.
And hopefully all the snow gone by then.
Doreen,
Very accomodating. Now if they can just get me Pettitte, Halladay, Hideki, and an OF…a little much?
With no disrespect to certain Damon “fans” (erica), I would rather have Bay or Holliday for 4 rather than Damon for 2.
I think I like Bay better than Holliday. I think. To me they’re one and the same, but Bay’s a little older? I don’t know. Convince me, guys.
How much more can Cashman take? I bet he can’t wait for the plane to Indianapolis for the Winter meetings.
Having him make a GM Christmas wishlist is one thing.
Dressing up Hank Steinbrenner as Santa Claus and having Cash sit on his lap for a Yankee promo pic is another….
http://tinyurl.com/y95nshf
Nick in SF
December 4th, 2009 at 3:55 pm
The Japan revenue pays Matsui’s salary! All the production he brings is a bonus! RBIs and protection for Arod! Better than free!
No follow-up questions, please, I’m very busy.
———————–
lol
Doreen
December 4th, 2009 at 4:18 pm
I’m just worried I’ll be asleep when some real news actually comes our way!
*********************
Doreen-my brother still holds a grudge that I found out about CC accepting the Yankees offer before he did. He was at work, so I called and left a message on his cell. He says it was the best message he’s ever gotten, but then started whining that I found out before him. What a baby. LOL
I think I like Bay better than Holliday. I think. To me they’re one and the same, but Bay’s a little older? I don’t know. Convince me, guys.
I dont know how this is possible. Bay is 2 years older than Holliday….is a worse defender….strikes out more….and is a career .280 hitter……Holliday is a career .318 hitter.
the man hits .300+ EVERY season…..you want guys like that at the top of your order.
The man’s also capable of driving in 100 runs every season and has a slugging percentage of .545 – I want that in the middle of my order.
From my number 2 spot I want a guy who gets on base, knows how to situationally hit, and can score from first on an extra base hit.
I’m not saying Holliday’s a bad player, I just think you’re wasting so much of what he does well taking him out of an RBI spot.
” Damon won’t even be close and like I just said on Matsui, if I’m Hideki why the heck would I settle for less than what Bobby Abreu got?”
because as you’ve pointed out 10000 times Matsui can’t play the field
olney reported yanks are cutting payroll to $185M?
that’s interesting.
DT – OPPC member
December 4th, 2009 at 4:21 pm
How much more can Cashman take? I bet he can’t wait for the plane to Indianapolis for the Winter meetings.
Having him make a GM Christmas wishlist is one thing.
Dressing up Hank Steinbrenner as Santa Claus and having Cash sit on his lap for a Yankee promo pic is another….
**********************
LOL
How about signing Bengie Molina and moving Posada to DH? Then Posada can be the backup C with Cervelli next in line.
That’s not an awful suggestion giving Posada’s health; especially since the Giants didn’t ask for arbitration on Molina. That said, I think Molina is going to want a multiyear deal and I can’t see the Yankees giving him one.
Doreen
December 4th, 2009 at 4:14 pm
Erin -
I’m glad someone else feels the same. I feel like I’m going to go crazy if I read one more outfield scenario. (I know I don’t have to read them, but what else am I gonna do in between putting up Christmas decorations? I need a break, even one guaranteed to drive me to insanity! )
Well, at least now there’s a set budget and a set plan. Now, they’ll send Brian on his way to Indianapolis to do some shopping. Yay, finally!
————————————————–
You need to hope Cashman does his shopping in time for Christmas.
Corey,
Thanks. Don’t know much about Holliday. Just that he looks a lot better in the NL than he did in th AL. (I know, the Colliseum is cavernous). Did his road split troubles follow him to STL?
If they cut to $185MM…….that basically means they dont do anything. lol
I think I like Bay better than Holliday. I think. To me they’re one and the same, but Bay’s a little older? I don’t know. Convince me, guys.
–
Bay is the worst leftfielder in defense by any defensive metric. Bay had knee surgery and is on his way to a Matsui like run of injuries. They provide the same power, but Holliday hits more line drives. Bay is more patient, but he has to be because of his average.
Holliday is younger. They are both going to command the same salary.
Holliday > Bay
” Damon won’t even be close and like I just said on Matsui, if I’m Hideki why the heck would I settle for less than what Bobby Abreu got?”
because as you’ve pointed out 10000 times Matsui can’t play the field
_______
Fair point but it still doesn’t mean he’s going to take a 1 year deal from the Yankees. There are at least two other teams that are going to want/need a DH and would prefer Matsui to the other FA options. For the record, I too prefer Matsui to Jim Thome, Vlad, or Delgado – I just don’t prefer him to Adam Dunn.
Bay IMO is a perfect fit as a pull hitter for the Red Sox.
Holliday hits to right center and could be a weapon,albeit expensive one, in YS.
“Now if they can just get me Pettitte, Halladay, Hideki, and an OF…a little much?”
Probably. I believe you forgot someone unless you’ve given up on a certain Taiwanese runway model.
olney reported yanks are cutting payroll to $185M?
that’s interesting.
–
Impossible. Also no to Bengie Molina. Posada sucks at DH and Molina walked 13 times in 520 PA’s. And 3 of those were intentional. He hit .265/.285/.442. We could get that from Cervelli for free. Did anyone pay attention last season?
Molina is a guy that bad teams sign because they don’t have anything better. We have 3 catchers *right now* who could hit that or better (Posada, Cervo, Jesus)
Nick in SF
No comment on another Molina at catcher?
tex’s friend
December 4th, 2009 at 4:26 pm
olney reported yanks are cutting payroll to $185M?
**************
is that even possible?
Holliday is younger. They are both going to command the same salary.
Holliday > Bay
———————————————
Agree Holliday is the better player but my guess is Bay signs for 15-16M/year and Holliday for 18-19/year x 4- 5 years.
“If they cut to $185MM…….that basically means they dont do anything.”
Cashman has clipped all his 20% off coupons for shopping and if a BOGO sale breaks out in Indy, stand back.
Brett Gardner in left field is a tremendously awful idea…
to appease AJ, the Yankees should sign Alfred Molina on the cheap.
holliday in lf,melky in rf,ajax in cf,swish at dh
sign holliday & pettitte for around 25 million total
payroll at 195 million
then trade joba with some prospects for the best pitcher we can get
joba,???,???
for cain,etc….
or sign a fa pitcher
MaineYankee, that idea is beneath comment.
But I like the leak that the Yanks are cutting payroll to Bubba Crosby.
Cashman was a very good Santa last year. I don’t expect the same type of surprise this season, but I’m hoping at least there’ll be something shiny and new under the tree.
m -
Holliday. I used a very scientific method to choose. (Bay played for the Red Sox and looks like one of them.
).
Plus I think it would be really cool and very funny if the Yankees were to end up with both Holliday and Halladay. It’ll drive everyone crazy!
If you factor in raises for Jeter, Cano and Swisher, plus arbitration raises for Gaudin, Cabrera, and Bruney[ if brought back] and eliminating salaries of Damon, Matsui,Pettitte,Hinske, Molina, Hairston, and Ramirez your starting point is around 170 million.
Erin- 170M and above is luxury tax territory, but I find it hard to believe the salary will be set at 15M above where it is at present.
Chip,
I was half joking with the Bengie/Posada to DH idea. But’s it’s not half bad. Posada could still catch 35-40 games a year, plus he’d be a switch hitting DH. But you’re right, Molina is 35 and the Yanks probably wouldn’t want to give him more than 2 yrs.
If they cut to $185MM…….that basically means they dont do anything. lol
Exactly.
Payroll last year was at $206
Guys coming off:
Matsui 13 mil
Damon 13 mil
Andy 11 mil
Hinske, Hairston, Molina, Nady – about 5 in total
so that’s about 45 off bringing the payroll to $160. That’s $25 mil to fill out the bench, find a LF, DH and SP (or two) before any players file for arbitration or get regular raises.
Essentially it means if they sign Andy the Yankees will be looking at using some combination of Swisher, Miranda, Montero, Jackson, Gardner and Melky to fill OF and DH. Do you really see the Yankees leaving Tampa with a batting order that includes:
Swisher – RF
Montero – DH
Melky – CF
Jackson – LF
I don’t.
I think Buster is talking out of his rear.
Halliday/Lackey and Holliday.
Last year the CC/AJ/Tex won us the WS again, so for the moment you can’t fault success and it seems to be a winning formula.
Chip
Matsui can only accept the best offer presented to him…here’s what’s going on in this market nobody wants to pay 10-12mil for a DH…including the Yanks which is why Dunn(who is no Ryan Howard just so you know) will not be a wearing the pinstipes next season….
also I’m confused why is it that melky can’t be a LF’er in your eyes but DeJesus can? Offensively they are equivalent players, defensively Melky in LF would be an upgrade to DeJesus and he’s 5yrs younger, improving and approaching his peak years whereas DeJesus is plateauing, and is currently and will be for the next 2-3yrs cheaper than DeJesus…please explain.
and for all the people that want Hairston back…the team has stated that they want to reduce payroll right? then explain the logic of paying guys like Hairston and Hinske a couple mil year to sit on the bench and play once every two weeks when you have younger guys making the league minimum who can ride the bench and play once every two weeks?
please people if we really want to speculate on the roster construction at least use the factors that the team is considering like payroll,luxury tax issues,and long term roster construction.
Cash is not just looking to build a team for 2010 but he’s looking at what will we look like in 3yrs/5yrs
Raymagnetic
December 4th, 2009 at 4:19 pm
Jeter was one of the best players in the league last year.
He was certainly the best Yankee on the team.
Best players in the league usually get best player money.
It’s nonsense that people think the guy is overpaid.
———————————————————-
as much as i love derek jeter – there is no team…NOT ONE TEAM..outside of the yankees that would pay him 20 mil per year….thats why i think the “lowering payroll” mantra is BS – the only way you are lowering payroll AND paying jeter 20 million is by having an outfield of melky, ajax and gardner – and that means finishing in 3rd place…
if the yankees are dumb enough to pay jeter 80 million for the next 4 years starting in 2011 then the payroll is about 225 – 235 million starting in 2011 IF they still want to be competitive…this lowering payroll by nickel and diming matsui and damon to save 3 million dollars but then paying jeter 20 million will result in the yankees becoming a bad team again…
I was half joking with the Bengie/Posada to DH idea. But’s it’s not half bad. Posada could still catch 35-40 games a year, plus he’d be a switch hitting DH. But you’re right, Molina is 35 and the Yanks probably wouldn’t want to give him more than 2 yrs.
–
Also Molina is terrible.
pat,
I just want Wang to be healthy.
$185M? Leaking that’s one way to try bargaining with Damon and Matsui.
Pete tweeted that Scutaro took a discount to sign with the Sox.
SI_JonHeyman #yankees decided they will bid on halladay. tor wants some combo of hughes, joba, a-jax and montero. #redsox have best chance, tho
____
I still dont think you want to lose joba/hughes, jackson AND montero. just too much. stick to sheets/harden/duscherer.
Who knows though –
Maybe the Yankees do go into spring training without making any major additions – just bring back Andy and maybe another pitcher and some bench help and who knows, maybe Montero blows the doors off the competition and emerges as a 19-year old Miggy Cabrera and Austin Jackson is the second coming of Torri Hunter.
As strange as it sounds is it any stranger in retrospect than the Yankees leaving Tampa with Hughes and Kennedy in the back of the rotation in 2008?
Whoa -
Budget shopping?
Perhaps they’re going with Pena as the utility guy, Cervelli as the back-up catcher, Jackson in LF. What? Sticking with Joba and Hughes. Pettitte, I guess.
Hmmmm…..
Well, not so shiny this year, I guess.
DT – OPPC member
December 4th, 2009 at 4:35 pm
to appease AJ, the Yankees should sign Alfred Molina on the cheap.
******************
I’m assuming he’d bring his Doctor Octupus costume, right? A glove for each arm?
here’s what buster actually said:
Buster_ESPN Yankees finished org. meetings — they’re cutting payroll. I’m not sure yet by how much, but during season, expectation was to $185 mill.
3 minutes ago from web
let’s make sure we are quoting sources accurately
no one believes they will hold down payroll is the perfect deal comes to them.
Quoting them inaccurately leads to more exciting discussion though.
Rishi-
Thanks for that. You know, it’s those little words, like “I’m not sure” and “last season” and “expected to be” that make all the difference.
Thanks Rishi!
Jerkface
December 4th, 2009 at 4:46 pm
Quoting them inaccurately leads to more exciting discussion though.
=============
fair enough
“here’s what buster actually said:
Buster_ESPN Yankees finished org. meetings — they’re cutting payroll. I’m not sure yet by how much, but during season, expectation was to $185 mill.
3 minutes ago from web”
I’m sure they would love to cut it to 185M, but I don’t see how they can do that without seriously weakening their batting lineup and not strengthening their starting rotation with external help.
Yankees Cutting Payroll
By Tim Dierkes [December 4 at 3:45pm CST]
A tweet from ESPN’s Buster Olney:
Yankees finished org. meetings — they’re cutting payroll. I’m not sure yet by how much, but during season, expectation was to $185 million.
According to Cot’s Baseball Contracts, the Yankees began the 2009 season at about $201MM. My own rough estimate has the Yankees at about $170MM committed if Chad Gaudin, Sergio Mitre, and Chien-Ming Wang are non-tendered. If they re-sign Andy Pettitte for $10MM, it might be tough to fit a top-end reliever and decent left fielder into a $185MM budget. So maybe it’ll go a little higher but still fall under $200MM.
I hope that means Ajax will be the everyday center fielder.
“I’m assuming he’d bring his Doctor Octupus costume, right? A glove for each arm”
Doc Octopus truthers has a nice ring. Plus he has movie star eyes. Cervelli needs competition.
Maybe they are cutting payroll by 185 million and next season our lineup is going to be
Pena
Jackson
A-rod
Miranda
Vasquez
Melky
Gardner
Cervelli
Russo
Rotation of:
Hughes, Chamberlain, Kennedy, McCallister, Nova
Bullpen of:
Robertson, coke, aceves, dunn, melancon, duff
I like Heyman’s tweet a looooooooootttttt better than Olney’s.
m -
Me too, except for the part about the Red Sox having the best chance at Halladay.
$185M for Halladay, Holliday, Pettite, Matsui, Wang? That’s the tweet?
Buster Only has announeced the yankees have cut payroll for the rest of major league baseball by acquiring all free agents
DT – OPPC member
December 4th, 2009 at 4:48 pm
“I’m assuming he’d bring his Doctor Octupus costume, right? A glove for each arm”
Doc Octopus truthers has a nice ring. Plus he has movie star eyes. Cervelli needs competition.
**************
LOL
Doc Oc’s got the arms but Cervelli’s got the eyes.
Doreen,
Never mind. I thought that said that the Red Sox still have a chance. lol.
trade for matt cain
sign pettitte & matsui
patroll around 190 million
o.f. of melky,ajax,swisher
dh matsui
rotation of
cc
burnett
cain
pettitte
hughes
“tor wants some combo of hughes, joba, a-jax and montero”
How about 0% of each.
$$ 200 million is and will always be the Yankee payroll neighborhood and upward……This is the Yankee way since the days of George Herman “” The Babe” Ruth…..Fannies in the seats…..
there are ways to get better AND cheaper, but one has to assume they cannot have Halladay AND pettitte, which would be tough because you would give you hughes or joba + meaning you arent gaining a starter.
How about 0% of each.
–
Thats a terrible combo. I’ll give them 30% of Joba (the indian part!) , 40% of jackson, and throw in 15% of Jesus and Hughes.
I see no problem with cutting payroll.
Right now, it is $170.
1 yr and $9 mil for Andy
1 yr and $6 mil for Matsui (who else is going to offer him a contract)?
Let Gardner/A-Jax start in LF. Joba/Hughes in the rotation… and go for #27…
A tweet from PeteAbe.
Scutaro says he took less money to try and win a ring. Another team made a big push. #redsox
34 minutes ago from Tweetie
“… and go for #27…”
Yup, that’s the problem.
If the Yanks announced they were raising the payroll while the market is open, it would create a frenzy.
Has anyone noticed how Lou Dobbs looks like an aged Brian Leetch?
That’s my contribution, folks!
Let Gardner/A-Jax start in LF. Joba/Hughes in the rotation… and go for #27…
*********************
Ummmm…might want to check your numbers there.
I actually can understand the Yankees rationale.
For the first time in 8 years, they don’t have a lot of pressure on them to win. They don’t have to hear about the “drought” or the Red Sox winning 2 WS since we have won, or how the Sox are the model franchise, or how 2004 has “cursed” us, or any of those things.
We are the champions and if we don’t win the WS next year, it will hurt, but not as badly as it hurt these past few years because we have tasted it recently. We can use this opportunity to slash payroll and get younger because the pressure on us is less this year than in any of the previous 4-5 years.
If you can’t cut payroll coming off a WS win, then when can you?
Yeah, Sev. Good luck getting Matsui and Andy combined for $15 million.
And who plays LF? And you want Joba AND Hughes in the rotation?
We can use this opportunity to slash payroll and get younger because the pressure on us is less this year than in any of the previous 4-5 years.
===========
Getting younger is what the Yankees must do, especially when it comes to developing young pitching, if they are interested in long-standing success.
That’s why I would prefer to see Joba and Hughes BOTH start in 2010.
So Heyman and Olney are contradicting eachother….
If we’re going after Halladay, then cutting payroll can’t be in the cards. Unless we’re going to let our other 3 FAs walk. If that is the case, we’re robbing Peter to pay Paul…
I tend to believe Olney more than Heyman.
Is there a Wild Card ring?
Nick in SF
December 4th, 2009 at 5:15 pm
Is there a Wild Card ring?
—————————————-
There is a Wild Card Champion hat so maybe a ring too.
I don’t understand .. We are cutting payroll. but we are making a bid for Halladay.. which one is it ??
What about Leftfield ??
Um, $185 million? I hope that’s not the case….
As far as Heyman goes, if the Yankees want Halladay, they will have to engage in some sort of negotiations and hope that the Jays drop their asking price. A combo of Hughes, Joba, Ajax and Montero is insane. The Yanks maybe can get the Jays to take a bigger package that still has quality players, but not more than 1 (if that) of their best.………. As to whether the Sox have the best chance, did Heyman explain why?
It’s funny – I wonder if the quality of the Yankees farm system hurts them here. Let me explain because it sounds counterintuitive. The best players that the Yanks have that the Jays would want (or any team) – Hughes, Joba, Ajax, Montero – are better than what the Sox have………..So, while the Jays would ask for the Sox best prospects, the Sox best prospects don’t equal the quality of the Yankees’ best prospects. Does that make any sense?
No surprise— Hal is a cheepskate.
Bring back George. We don’t need Hal “Wilpon” Steinbranner.
Alex.. if it wasn’t for Hal. we wouldn’t have Arod
every corporation is tightening the straps
it is not like we are cutting payroll while everybody or anybody else is spending huge
look at the rs their highest payroll was 143 million in 2007 & they will not pass or match that
they start 2010 at 124 million
bay alone will take them to 140 million
if i am cash i play melky in lf,ajax in cf,swish in rf & dh miranda/posada
sign pettitte for 9 million & try to trade for the best pitcher we can get
we will sit around 185 & maybe get lucky
& land a good young pitcher for joba,kennedy & others
how about joba,montero,kennedy for matt cain
if we can get him for less great
IF the Yanks are going to cut payroll off of a WS, then they really don’t intend to defend to do much, if anything, to defend their title….sheesh
They won’t actually lower the payroll until the best players start coming up from the farm. They’ll be around 200 again this year.
He probably thinks the Sox have the best chance because they have a better chance of parting with what is necessary than we do considering they are more desperate.
Let’s put it this way… I’d imagine they relent on Buchholz and/or Kelly easier and sooner than we do Hughes/Joba/Montero.
Cashman has talked about wanting to cut payroll for YEARS. You have to figure he is going to back up his word one of these years. What better time than coming off a WS?
And remember, Hal outlines the budget, not Cash. If Hal wants to cut payroll, Cash can’t argue.
Jon Heyman is a legitimately great guy and but prospects are just names to him and he doesn’t realize that the 4 Yankee prospects he ticked off are better than anything the Red Sox have. He’s not a stats guy, so he doesn’t really know who’s good and who’s bad unless it’s blisteringly obvious.
Since the beginning of the offseason, I’ve been saying that the Yankees would get to around $195 million as their payroll. $185 million, if to be believed basically means that you can’t go after either Bay or Holliday, as both expect more than $16 million/year.
In my scenario, after subtracting expiring contracts and adding typical raises,I gave Pettitte $10 million to stay in the rotation, Nady $5 million for LF, Hairston $1 million as my utility infielder/outfileder, and Damon OR Matsui $10 million as my DH. I also added Cervelli and Pena. And THAT was $195.1 million.
Trades for cost controlled players (like Swisher) looks like where they’re heading. IF it’s true, then THEY take the economic woes seriously.
That being the case, trade now for Crawford OR DeJesus like Chip says, or sign Nady. Sign Pettitte, OR trade for Halladay, but you can’t have both starters, IF this is true.
i just dont see how the rs get any major pieces except retaining bay or signing holliday
124 million to start 2010 & just doc or bay/holliday takes them to 140 million only 3 million away from their highest payroll of 143 million in 2007
adding bay & holliday takes them to 156 million & they need a few pen arms
Chip
December 4th, 2009 at 4:09 pm
Corey –
I say if you’re going to dream dream big:
2011
Jeter
Crawford – LF
Mauer – C
Alex – 3b
Tex – 1b
Dunn – DH
Holliday – RF
Cano – 2b
Jackson – CF
rotation:
CC, Halladay, AJ, Lee, Hughes
*********************************************
you do realize that this 25 man roster is costing about $300mil?
the Yanks can absolutely win with a $185mil payroll…
resign Pettite for 1 yr 10mil
sign Ankiel for 5mil to play CF until AJax is ready then move him to RF….
Play the combo of Melky/Gardner in LF who’s combined production equals Damon’s with more speed and much improved defense…
Juan Miranda is the “primary DH” for 535k
Cervelli,Pena,Russo make up your bench so that we’re not wasting millions on guys that will play once every 10 games
Lastly and MOST importantly JOBA and HUGHES are our #’s 4 & 5 starters.
as for the pen we stay in house w/Melancon and possibly Dunn or Whelan coming up to pitch in
JJ
December 4th, 2009 at 5:27 pm
He probably thinks the Sox have the best chance because they have a better chance of parting with what is necessary than we do considering they are more desperate.
Let’s put it this way… I’d imagine they relent on Buchholz and/or Kelly easier and sooner than we do Hughes/Joba/Montero.
—————————
great point
gammons always thinks the rs have the best shot at every single player
thats all i ever heard out of his trap
i think tex ends up with the rs
i think cc ends up in boston
ag in boston
prince fielder in boston
burnett in boston
pettitte in boston
matsui in boston
That is exactly the case. Which is why the Heyman’s of the world say “if the Yanks are willing to part with Montero or the Sox willing to part with Kelly” in the same sentence, implying that they are some sort of equal.
My own projections of Yankee payroll were as follows:
2009 – $205-209 million
2010 – $195-197 million
2011 – $196-198 million
2012 – $171-175 million
Ankiel is terrible and you forgot Swisher
“how about joba,montero,kennedy for matt cain”
Bru you are clearly High and Drunk!
i wouldn’t trade Joba straight up for Cain as i think Joba will be the better pitcher over the next 2yrs…
If Joba pitched in the NL west he’d be sick…cain just has the advantage of 3yrs headstart and maybe 90 more starts under his belt than Joba….but if Joba/Montero/Kennedy is TOO MUCH for Halladay or Josh Johnson why in the Hell would i give that up for Cain?
I didn’t forget Swish he’s on the bench and maybe DH’ing some….
How is Ankiel terrible? in ’08 he had a better season than Swish had for us last year and he’s a plus-plus glove in RF/CF…..
Last year he hurt his shoulder crashing into a wall making a great catch and then lost his starting spot to Colby Rasmus the Cards #1 prospect who they wanted to transition in with Ankiel in his walk year.
I’ve seen Ankiel hit 2 monster Homers off of Johan and i think if we can get him hooked up with Kevin Long he may be able to produce for us like Ethier is doing for LA after hooking up with Mattingly. When Ethier came over from the A’s he wasn’t anywhere near the hitter he is today.
“If you can’t cut payroll coming off a WS win, then when can you?”
I thought most teams tended to increase payroll after a WS win, because of the added revenue from playoff games, and the fact that season ticket sales generally go up after a championship season.