Take Marquis off the list
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 21, 2009 
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Although there was never any indication the Yankees were especially interested in signing him, it seems Jason Marquis is no longer among the available free agent starters.
Marquis has reportedly agreed to a deal with the Washington Nationals.
Earlier this month, Brian Cashman flew to the Winter Meetings with the Levinson brothers, who represent Marquis. Cashman acknowledged that he discussed the right-hander during the flight, but that seemed to be the extent of any link between the two.
Good, he would have gotten LIT up here. Focus on SHEETS, or see if CHC will deal Lilly for Melky and then re-sign Damon for 2 years, 18mm.
Thank God for that – and good luck to him in Washington!
Repost:
“That team is a joke. The fact that the owners are too cheap to can the manager and GM who are hapless at this point is a major slap in the face to any fan who spends a dollar on that team. ”
Yep, Wilpon could had opened up his wallet a little more wider, and signed Manny Ramirez last season to protect Wright while others had went down.
A buddy of mine works with the Mets as a writer and he just said the yankees are ‘about to make a big move’ i am sure chad knows more than a mets writer but he isnt even a yankees fan and he mentioned that the yankees are about to make a BIG MOVE…could be holliday, could be sheets, could be damon, could be a big trade..we will see
Would have been terrible in the AL, good for the nationals.
I actually love that idea, but instead of Sheets I like going after Justin D.
He’s not the Prize. Is he ?
Matt December 21st, 2009 at 2:57 pm
A buddy of mine works with the Mets as a writer and he just said the yankees are ‘about to make a big move’ i am sure chad knows more than a mets writer but he isnt even a yankees fan and he mentioned that the yankees are about to make a BIG MOVE…could be holliday, could be sheets, could be damon, could be a big trade..we will see
=================================================
Anything we do is big.
GLove, there are no pitchers out there besides Sheets. If that doesn’t work, I’m for giving Joba and Phil a shot. In fact, I may be inclined that way anyway. The team really needs to start developing these kids – Phil has already been set back. They’ve not traded him for Santana and Halladay – it’s about time he gets another chance to be a starter. Since most of the pitchers out there are gunk, don’t you think it’s better that we just let them go and see what happens? The upside of Joba and Phil is enormous (though I admit that I don’t have much confidence in Joba).
Mick-
You mean like Big as in Large
like over 6 feet, and more than 2oolbs. Large.
Is that what you meant ?
Not that Marquis was ever an option……..The list of remaining FA pitchers is horrible; better that we should go with Phil and Joba as they have enormous upside (and it would be nice if we could ever develop young pitchers).
Mick, I just don’t see the point of trading Swish and signing Holliday. The idea is to strengthen the lineup; removing a productive player and replacing him with Melky, even though Holliday would be signed, doesn’t make any sense. It doesn’t make the team better – it’s not quite a lateral move because Holliday is obviously better than Swisher, but it’s not far off.
Ed: check yo email. hotmail account
MTU
December 21st, 2009 at 3:01 pm
Mick-
You mean like Big as in Large
like over 6 feet, and more than 2oolbs. Large.
Is that what you meant ?
**********
Maybe he meant big like Big Bird!!!!
Trady Melky for an innings eating starter with comparable salary. Then, use the remaining 10-12 million to ink Holliday and we’re right at 200 million.
LF Holliday CF Granderson RF Swisher Gardner/Hoffman platoon as 4OF.
I like it.
Betsy I think you are making a lot of sense today. I agree wrt the Holliday/Swisher thing and I also agree that the Yankees should give Phil and Joba the opportunity to start the year in the rotation.
Maybe they are about to sign Chapman
Economics Teacher: Bueller? Bueller? Bueller?
Simone: Um, he’s sick. My best friend’s sister’s boyfriend’s brother’s girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who’s going with the girl who saw Ferris pass out at 31 Flavors last night.
I guess it’s pretty serious.
One of the best parts of where the organization is now is that they no longer need to make dumb moves like Marquis due to impatience or desperation, particularly with pitching.
Cashman has learned from past mistakes and with Hal in command there’s no more anarchy in decision making.
They’ve built up depth in young pitching. Sure you can argue that they might need another arm, but right now they could go into the season with Joba as the 4 with no innings limit and hughes as the 5 and that would likely work adquately.
You just knew that the Jason Marquis talk was nonsense.
Mick, I just don’t see the point of trading Swish and signing Holliday. The idea is to strengthen the lineup; removing a productive player and replacing him with Melky, even though Holliday would be signed, doesn’t make any sense. It doesn’t make the team better – it’s not quite a lateral move because Holliday is obviously better than Swisher, but it’s not far off.
===========================================================
Betsy,
You can be sure, if the Yanks want Holliday, they will not let Swisher or Melky stand in their way. Maybe this is the reason for the delay, working these deals out.
Cashman
I have looked in FA bin for a starter
Oh. I dont see anything I really like, or have gotta have.
Hmmmm.
I think I’ll check the discount ailse for a while, and see what i might find there ?
I’ve got the money.
Betsy is right, there aren’t any real options out there for pitchers unless Cashman has a trade in the works…..Once Lackey & Doc were off the market, the Yanks best options are in house……It’s time for Joba / Young Master Hughes to take the next step…The concerning issue is the void in the bullpen, specifically the 8 th inning setup role….Add to that, the overall depth in the bullpen as well…..However the club does have young arms that should be an option…..I still see the 5 hole as the singular most pressing issue …..
vinny b:
got it, and replied.
“You can be sure, if the Yanks want Holliday, they will not let Swisher or Melky stand in their way. Maybe this is the reason for the delay, working these deals out.”
Why would Swisher or Melky stand in the way of signing Matt Holliday? Swisher is our starting RF, Melky would make a perfect 4th OF. And don’t tell me 3-6 million per year is going to stop the Yanks from signing Holliday.
CB December 21st, 2009 at 3:05 pm
One of the best parts of where the organization is now is that they no longer need to make dumb moves like Marquis due to impatience or desperation, particularly with pitching.
Cashman has learned from past mistakes and with Hal in command there’s no more anarchy in decision making.
=======================================================
CB,
This is the reason Cashman wanted autonomy a few years back. The impetuousness of George was an impedance. Interesting how things have worked out for him and the Yanks.
CB-
Remember this line on Cash and Hal:
“Just like Batman and Robin. Only not quite that entertaining”
Good teamwork.
Not sure if anyone was planning to head that way but….
I strongly recommend avoiding Roosevelt Field at all costs unless you have a spare 40 minutes to sit in the parking lot.
Insane holiday shoppers + Poor Snowplowing = Insanity
Betsy,
I totally agree with you. Out of the remaining free agents, if Sheets is healthy he would be the only one I would sign.
I would give Hughes, Joba, Aceves, Gaudin all a chance to win the last 2 spots if Sheets doesn’t work out or a trade for a better pitcher isn’t made.
I don’t think it’s a foregone conclusion that if we don’t get another SP that Joba and Phil have the spots locked down as I can see one of them getting out pitched in the spring by Aceves or Gaudin and giving the Yankees a lot to think about re: the rotation.
If Sheets is healthy though, you sign him. End of story. The only thing I would worry about is he doesn’t want to rebuild his value in the AL East.
And for the people clamoring for Ted Lilly? He’s injured. There is no way the Yankees trade anything for him right now.
Trade Leche for the Big Z. Then we wouldn’t have to worry about losing the DH next year in NL parks.
Was that an Erica sighting?
G. Love, I think that it could be awhile ( late January ) before Ben Sheets auditions for the big clubs
How about Brett Myers in Yankee pinstripes? Could he come on a two year deal… cheap?
erica-
unfortunately for you I was not referring to big bird, or Damon.
Sorry.
And please dont hisssss at me. i have an assignment and I am just tryin to complete the mission.
mick
December 21st, 2009 at 3:12 pm
Was that an Erica sighting?
******
Could be!!!!
“.Once Lackey & Doc were off the market, the Yanks best options are in house……It’s time for Joba / Young Master Hughes to take the next step…”
Pat M.,
I agree. There just doesn’t look to be any options out there that will likely be better than Phil and Joba.
I think you’re selling Dave Robertson a bit short on the 8th inning role. If he maintains that extra hop he found on his fastball mid-season and keeps his command he’s a keeper. Hopefully Marte can build on his post season as well.
The worst costs are investments that don’t generate value. Value is much more important for the yankees than total costs are.
Invest the money where it’s going to generate returns. And right now, that is not on pitching.
Uncle Ellsworth (Expert textpert choking smokers, don’t you think the joker laughs at you)
December 21st, 2009 at 3:05 pm
Economics Teacher: Bueller? Bueller? Bueller?
Simone: Um, he’s sick. My best friend’s sister’s boyfriend’s brother’s girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who’s going with the girl who saw Ferris pass out at 31 Flavors last night.
I guess it’s pretty serious.
**********************
Nice Uncle E! Gotta love Ferris Bueller
MTU
December 21st, 2009 at 3:13 pm
erica-
unfortunately for you I was not referring to big bird, or Damon.
Sorry.
And please dont hisssss at me. i have an assignment and I am just tryin to complete the mission.
*********
Okay, I will not HISS at you although I find this development very disappointing
Erin-
Sad Sesame Street news- Olivia died
http://www.upi.com/Entertainme.....261415345/
Happier Sesame Street news- I got my DVD back
You must have escaped from work then, Erica.
the strategy is set
Keep movin those chess pieces Cash.
organize the board.
trade off what you dont really want
so you can complete the checkmate and win.
mick
December 21st, 2009 at 3:17 pm
You must have escaped from work then, Erica.
*********
In a manner of speaking yes…
I am off until January
Erica – always OPPC – Bring Johnny Back!!!
December 21st, 2009 at 3:17 pm
Erin-
Sad Sesame Street news- Olivia died
http://www.upi.com/Entertainme…..261415345/
Happier Sesame Street news- I got my DVD back
********************
Oh no! I always liked Olivia. Thanks for letting me know
Very glad to hear you got your DVD back!!
Yay Erica is here. Is it time for GTLU or GTSPs?
My GTSP: CC, AJ, Andy, Joba and Phil
Poor Olivia, may she RIP, I used to watch Sesame Street with my kids.
“If Sheets is healthy though, you sign him. End of story. The only thing I would worry about is he doesn’t want to rebuild his value in the AL East.”
I don’t like the signals out of Sheets’s camp. Free agents always want to sign as quickly as is feasible – there a big opportunity cost to them to wait – especially in this economy.
But Sheets is holding negotiations until after the throws and scheduled the throw session for some uncertain time in January?
Sounds like he and his agent may not like his offers and also may not like the way he’s throwing right now.
He’s an interesting guy but I don’t like how this is playing out with his camp.
If nothing else – his time table is just a very impractical one for teams that need to make decisions. I don’t see how he can be prioritized at this point in time.
Decision have to be made and they can’t wait around on Ben Sheets being “ready.”
I just don’t see how Sheets things he is going to dictate to the market, but I assume he also things that there’s not much available in the way of arms so he can call the shots and do things on his time table.
Some material appropriate for mocking but Gammons exit interview says nice things about more Yanks than Sox so he doesn’t hate at least some of them.
“…..I’d really like to do is go to Panama with Mariano Rivera. I think he is the most distinguished man that I’ve ever covered. He is the man I consider to be the MVP and Cy Young of the last 15 years. I would love to know more about where he comes from and how he has maintained that incredible balance.”
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c.....z0aM1n6vMP
upstate kate
December 21st, 2009 at 3:19 pm
Yay Erica is here. Is it time for GTLU or GTSPs?
My GTSP: CC, AJ, Andy, Joba and Phil
*******
LOL… Do you mean GTYSR (Guess the Yankee Starting Rotation?). I could get behind that.
Although you reminded me of something very important. I never announced the winners of GWFATYSF. (Guess Which Free Agent the Yankees Sign First)…..
At least The Nationals are trying. What has Omar done for his “almost in last place” team?
Its time to announce the winners of “Guess Which Free Agent the Yankees Sign First”
(Disclaimer- this game ended quite a while ago. I am very off my game)
As guessed on 11/20- the first free agent signed was Andy Pettitte.
The winners are:
NYYROC
Erin
Upstate Kate
Patrick from CT
Congratulations to all!!!!
Laura • Why aren’t more people watching FRINGE?
December 21st, 2009 at 3:24 pm
At least The Nationals are trying. What has Omar done for his “almost in last place” team?
********
Laura… you watch FRINGE!!!!!!!!!!!!
Love the show!! (I spent most of the episode with my eyes covered, but I LOVE it)
Woo-hoo!! I forgot all about “Guess the First Free Agent”. I’m thrilled I was one of the winners
CB, I think Robertson is legit, my concern is can he be effective over the duration of the season ??? Marte is still a question, Melachon is the key to the pen if there’s no Hughes / Joba…..
I watched the first 3 episodes of Fringe and lost interest – has it gotten better?
MTU
Is this a class assignment you are completing?
Thanks Erica! I’d forgotten about the contest.
No Mick-
I am too old for school now.
more like a self-imposed one.
Mick-
You could say I am Old School though.
Is this going into a book you are writing?
Uncle Ellsworth (Expert textpert choking smokers, don’t you think the joker laughs at you)
December 21st, 2009 at 3:28 pm
I watched the first 3 episodes of Fringe and lost interest – has it gotten better?
*******
Depends on your definition of better. For each question they answer on that show, like 20 more questions arise.
But this season the introduced the concept of an alternate universe (there’s two of everything) and that keeps it interesting
MTU
rather not say about my career right now – why do you ask?
This feels like “What’s My Line.”
Are you Scott Boras?
Erica
GTSP= guess the starting pitchers. Your GTYSR is more accurate
I forgot all about GWFATYSF, happy to be a winner
Mick-
Remember what Dorothy does in the the wizard of Oz when she
clicks her heels together ?
What exactly WAS she doing ?
Just clicking her heels together.
I could explain things a different way.
That is part of my assignment.
Erica I’ll give it another shot – nothing is on now.
I just watched 2 episodes of Dollhouse – I might have to watch all that now
The filters seem particularly capricious this afternoon.
Or maybe it’s just me.
Uncle-
cause you are bright and I just wondered how you were using or not using it ?
That’s all.
Can we play Guess the date the Yanks sign Holliday?
GTDTYSH
“putting it out there”
ask the Universe for a Left Fielder and it will deliver –
you should be on Fringe
Nick in SF in Charlotte, NC
December 21st, 2009 at 3:34 pm
The filters seem particularly capricious this afternoon.
Or maybe it’s just me.
********
Stop trying to use crude words!!!!! As-sess yourself!!!!
Nick,
The filters are absurd sometimes.
I’ll write a post with nothing of any serious importance, let alone insult, and it won’t go through for whatever reason.
MTU
What color is the sky in your world?
mick,
my guess on Holliday: hopefully never
mick
December 21st, 2009 at 3:32 pm
This feels like “What’s My Line.”
Are you Scott Boras?
**********************
No, no no, mick-if you’re going to go with a “What’s my line” type of game you have to go with “Here is Your Life” from Sesame Street.
Mick-
part of my assignment for myself was to try to help others to have fun and to laugh while something was going on.
And to have some fun myself in the process.
I hinted at another part earlier with dorothy.
la la land gets filtered out
It’s not any words, it’s anything I try to post using my laptop. Blackberry is ok.
I thought they were filtering “Holliday” but no.
Uncle-
That’s the first one you have missed.
Maybe it was my fault ?
My posts are getting stuck.
I watched the first 3 episodes of Fringe and lost interest – has it gotten better?
========
Must have been the same 3 i had watched. It just reminds me of cheaper version of X files. Could be wrong.
Supernatural is the way to go.
U.E.,
The Bueler reference was classic.
No, no no, mick-if you’re going to go with a “What’s my line” type of game you have to go with “Here is Your Life” from Sesame Street.
=================================================
erica, i was asking mtu who he was….maybe ernie?
“I watched the first 3 episodes of Fringe and lost interest – has it gotten better?”
Yes, it’s gotten much better. The first part of season 1 was mostly standalone episodes but as the season wore on a larger plot started to develop. As usual for shows like this, an overarching plot across several episodes and seasons has increased the quality of the show.
One of the top shows on the air right now, in my opinion.
Nick in SF in Charlotte….Try to get to Rusan’s for great sushi, very unique atmosphere…..Firecracker Roll….
John Noble deserves an Emmy for his performance as Walter.
Mick-
It’s same beautiful blue as Oklahoma.
What color is it in yours ?
“my guess on Holliday: hopefully never”
Why?
la la land gets filtered out
================================
but not today
Thanks Erica.
I’m surprized more of us did not guess Andy.
What color is it in yours ?
Pinstripes.
Some MLB teams are really bottom feeding with their signings this offseason:
Padres acquire C Dusty Ryan
Indians sign RP Saul Rivera
Marlins sign Danny Richar
Pirates sign Javier Lopez $775K (+$550K incentives)
The bullpen is not an issue
We have Robby, Marte, Dunn, Melancon, Gaudin, Aceves, Mitre, Nova, McAllister, Duff, R. Sanchez.
More than enough depth to find 7 very good arms from that bunch… The pen is a strength, it is not an issue.
Worry about who is going to hit 5th, not the pen.
We should play “has anyone heard from LOST lately?” Could there be something going down that he’s too wrapped up in to give us the scoop? I feel like the Yankees are in the dellivery room and we dont know if its a boy, a girl or both. Did i ever tell you guys how much i hate waiting?
mick
December 21st, 2009 at 3:40 pm
No, no no, mick-if you’re going to go with a “What’s my line” type of game you have to go with “Here is Your Life” from Sesame Street.
=================================================
erica, i was asking mtu who he was….maybe ernie?
*********************
mick, that was me who posted that. It’s easy to get us Sesame Street mafia members confused
Fringe doesn’t require as much of a commitment as LOST does (I equate being a fan of LOST to having a spouse), but it does have it’s own mythology to follow.
Pat M, I will consider it, though travelling from San Francisco to Charlotte and getting sushi is counter-intuitive…
Pat M.,
I can see the concern with Robertson holding up over the season – that’s a legit concern.
It may be nonsensical, but small framed guys don’t inspire confidence and he did have the elbow problems late in the season.
He was a different guy when he found those extra 2mph. He stopped trying to paint corners. You could see that he had more confidence and a greater ability to throw strikes because his fastball was playing up.
Hopefully that extra heat didn’t strain his arm – and hopefully he can keep that velocity the whole year.
He’s pretty critical. If he hold up the pen will be good. If he doesn’t then things could get dicey.
Agree that they really could use Melancon to step up. I was concerned by what I saw from him last year. Outside of the control issues – he had a flat fastball that didn’t have much life through the zone unless it sunk. And it didn’t always sink… Hopefully it was just the usual ups and downs of being a young pitcher.
The bullpen is not an issue
We have Robby, Marte, Dunn, Melancon, Gaudin, Aceves, Mitre, Nova, McAllister, Duff, R. Sanchez.
========================================================
Now that you mention it…..that is not exactly awe inspiring.
Patrick from CT
December 21st, 2009 at 3:42 pm
Thanks Erica.
I’m surprized more of us did not guess Andy.
******
The guesses were as follows-
4 Andy Pettitte
)
2 Hideki Matsui
2 Johnny Damon (Guess who one of the two was
I am just sorry that it took me so long to announce the winners. I ummm…. sort of forgot
Nats probably finish ahead of Mets next season.
Laura • Why aren’t more people watching FRINGE?,
I have an answer to your name. It’s because they moved it to Thursdays and it can’t compete with some of the best shows on television. If they would have kept it in its original slot, then it would have more viewers. Now, the show is losing viewers and is in danger of being cancelled, although the network is probably smart enough to give it another chance.
MTU
December 21st, 2009 at 3:35 pm
Uncle-
cause you are bright and I just wondered how you were using or not using it ?
That’s all.
OK thanks
I’m using it – mostly
Are you new here?
Is anyone of you a Salesperson ?
cause if any of you were you would know what i am trying to get at.
What is the most important aspect or quality that a salesperson has to have to sell their wares ?
Dont say BS
Dont say good looks
It’s none of those things IMO.
Why should I not want All-Stars on my team?
I want 9 all-stars on my team because we can afford it. Why settle for 8 all-stars when we have the resources the 9? We also have a need in left field, with no attractive options available next off-season. We just so happen to have the need and money to add the 9th all-star.
It is not overkill. I also don’t understand why Cash and Hal feel embarrassed to have 9 all-stars and need to prove to anyone they can win with a lesser payroll and/or players. And it isin’t like Cash is going to receive a lot of credit from baseball if he does win with Melky Cabrera in LF. They will cite his $200 million dollar payroll and say a monkey could win with that payroll. So, why not just go for the best?
We are one all-star short, as far as I am concerned, and there is an all-star left on the market. Get him. Finish the off-season strong.
Uncle-
Yes.
Was a lurker for a while.
Happy for some I will probably re-arrive at that status.
Wasn’t Jeter supposed to be on SNL recently or something?
“Nats probably finish ahead of Mets next season.”
If Reyes is healthy next season the Mets will look completely different next season. Reyes will have a lot to prove as he’s not a kid anymore.
Still don’t understand why they won’t just sign Holliday.
A healthy Reyes and Matt Holliday would go a long way towards making them legitimate again.
Bad news on the Ben Sheets front. Jason Marquis signed for 2yrs/15M. What are the nats thinking?
Rich Harden can’t be too happy with his agent.
Sheets is going to point to that Marquis contract, injury or not.
I know, Dee. Putting it against Greys and CSI was a typical bonehead Fox move. From what I’ve read, they are happy that it’s doing as well as it is and still believe in it. We will see if they believe enough to renew it.
dee
December 21st, 2009 at 3:47 pm
Laura • Why aren’t more people watching FRINGE?,
I have an answer to your name. It’s because they moved it to Thursdays and it can’t compete with some of the best shows on television. If they would have kept it in its original slot, then it would have more viewers. Now, the show is losing viewers and is in danger of being cancelled, although the network is probably smart enough to give it another chance.
*******
I think they would move it to another time slot before cancellation. Although, FYI Fringe is one of the highest rated DVR playback shows, so people are watching it.
But that 9pm Thursday timeslot is brutal. I give DVR priority to the Office and Greys Anatomy so I have to watch Fringe online, which requires dedication. Although, during the scary parts I can just open a new window instead of actually covering my eyes like a wimp
The Mad Prince in Pinstripes (if you want Holliday, trade Swisher)
December 21st, 2009 at 3:50 pm
Wasn’t Jeter supposed to be on SNL recently or something?
**********************
A few weeks ago he was announced as being the host on Dec 19. That came and went and James Franco hosted. No idea if Jeter just got pushed back to a later date or if he was never hosting in the first place.
“What is the most important aspect or quality that a salesperson has to have to sell their wares ?”
A starving crowd of customers IMO. Doesn’t matter what you’re selling or how good of a salesperson you are if you have customers who want to buy what you’re trying to pawn off.
CB-
are they really comparables though ?
MTU
December 21st, 2009 at 3:50 pm
Uncle-
Yes.
Was a lurker for a while.
Happy for some I will probably re-arrive at that status.
Nah we need more posters who can ligthen up the thread
For those like me who watch too much TV. Here is a link to a guide of when all of your faves are returning after this nonsense holiday hiatus:
http://ausiellofiles.ew.com/20.....eat-sheet/
We have Robby, Marte, Dunn, Melancon, Gaudin, Aceves, Mitre, Nova, McAllister, Duff, R. Sanchez.
Missing from that list are Hughes, Coke and Bruney(out most of year)…don’t be presumptuous, we might need some help.
The only legit guys there are robby, marte?, aceves and gaudin (if not starting) and the last 2 are long men.
Ray-
that’s a good point but i dont think that’s truly the answer.
But Holliday isn’t starving is He ?
“We have Robby, Marte, Dunn, Melancon, Gaudin, Aceves, Mitre, Nova, McAllister, Duff, R. Sanchez.”
LOL
Marte = 5 good games are supposed to inspire confidence?
Robby – legit, but again, a smaller framed guy who has elbow problems last year.
Dunn? Sure, his 2 walks per inning are going to be great.
Melancon? Needs to prove he is worth the hype.
Gaudin? A mop up man/spot starter.
Aceves? Long man who fell off a cliff after the ASB.
Mitre? yeah, sounds like a great option
Nova? Doubt Cash views him as a reliever
McAllister? Stuff doesn’t translate to the pen.
Duff? a guy with mediocre numbers in Double-A.
Sanchez? A Pirates reject who put up mediocre numbers in AAA and winterball.
The pen is a legitimate topic of discussion. We basically need Robertson to stay healthy and maintain his extra velocity, Marte to pick up where he left off, and Melancon to emerge as a legit arm.
CB,
If that pumps up the asking price for Sheets and the Yanks take a pass at him. Who can you see them targeting in a trade or the thin free agent market?
BTW, i agree with you take on Sheets having a work out later on becuase he might not be that impressive or impressed with the offers for now.
“What is the most important aspect or quality that a salesperson has to have to sell their wares ?”
Good ‘wares helps but with perceived sincerity, credibility and reputation, you can sell anything.
Erica – always OPPC – Bring Johnny Back!!!
December 21st, 2009 at 3:53 pm
For those like me who watch too much TV. Here is a link to a guide of when all of your faves are returning after this nonsense holiday hiatus:
http://ausiellofiles.ew.com/20…..eat-sheet/
**********************
I love Ausiello!! The day he came out with that I printed out a copy and highlighted it.
Erin, thats what I thought. Strange.
Erica,
Ausiello is the man. Love him.
Btw, any word on Johnson’s physical? Isn’t he supposed to be taking it today?
There’s always the 7/31 trading deadline if 2 of Chamberlain, Hughes, Gaudin, Mitre, or Aceves doesn’t take the No. 4 and 5 starting rotation spots. It would be a stretch to think that McAllister or Nova would be ready in 2010.
Uncle-
Thanks for that but Nick can accomplish that much better than I would ever be able to.
And i am quite sure after the assignment reaches a successful conclusion as i hope it does. I will no longer be needed here.
At least as a poster.
Thanks for the link, Erica! The schedule will get even worse once the Olympics start. Do people even watch the Olympics anymore?
“Sheets is going to point to that Marquis contract, injury or not.”
And some desperate team will probably give it to him. I really don’t think Sheets is going to be an option for us. The fact that he wants to wait so long just to take offers is a huge red flag.
CB, Marquis doesn’t have an extensive injury history like Sheets and Harden do, so the Nats shouldn’t have an issue giving him 2 years at that money.
Patrick, thanks, lol. IMO, the Swisher thing is absolute…..I don’t mean that he’s untouchable if you can get a better RF or some great piece ….but just to trade him to sign Holliday? Boy, if that is not a sign of the times with the Yankees.
I do want Joba and Phil to get a chance, but I admit that it makes me nervous; a lot of things have to break right (Joba HAS to be good and Phil has to be at least as good as a #5) for us to be really good as the Sox have a terrific rotation, with a lot of depth (I like Gaudin, but we have no depth). Still, again, the upside is enormous.
Im still convinced either Hughes or Joba will be the 8th inning guy this year. The loser of the two competing for that 5th spot.
A starving crowd of customers IMO. Doesn’t matter what you’re selling or how good of a salesperson you are if you have customers who want to buy what you’re trying to pawn off.
==============================
some would call that an order taker, not a salesman.
talking of starving….kind of like a waitress, she brings you the food, doesn’t have to sell it.
MTU
December 21st, 2009 at 3:57 pm
Uncle-
Thanks for that but Nick can accomplish that much better than I would ever be able to.
And i am quite sure after the assignment reaches a successful conclusion as i hope it does. I will no longer be needed here.
At least as a poster.
Like Gandalf leaving Middle Earth? Like Shane riding into the sunset?
Ok.
Times up.
Talk to any GOOD sales person and ask them, and I would wager they would say something like the following:
I have BELIEF in my self and my product.
That is what enables me to sell it.
S.o.S.
December 21st, 2009 at 3:59 pm
Im still convinced either Hughes or Joba will be the 8th inning guy this year. The loser of the two competing for that 5th spot.
********************
I agree. I think one of them will be in the pen opening day.
“Who can you see them targeting in a trade or the thin free agent market?”
I don’t see any of the free agent pitchers being worth the investment given their risk and/ or their limited upside in the AL East.
Perhaps Duscherer?
I also don’t see where a good trade is going to come from for a pitcher. There’s just so much demand for arms.
I think people forget how average our pen was before Hughes moved there full-time and stabilized the position.
It is a legit question mark right now. We’re counting on unknowns like Melancon to take a leap forward. Robertson’s health is also key.
I cant wait for Chuck and Lost
mtu
you lost your road map back to iowa?
Laura • Why aren’t more people watching FRINGE?
December 21st, 2009 at 3:58 pm
Thanks for the link, Erica! The schedule will get even worse once the Olympics start. Do people even watch the Olympics anymore?
******
I am kind of grateful for the Olympics. I am deep into busy season by then. NBC is my second most watched network. The less TV I have tow orry about finding time to watch the better off I am!
Cashman acknowledged that he discussed the right-hander during the flight, but that seemed to be the extent of any link between the two.
—————————————————-
This is how that conversation went:
Cashman: Hey Levinson brother #1 how do you spell Marquis?
Brother #1: M-A-R-Q-U-I-S…why?
Cashman – Oh I just wanted to put him on the “No Way In Hell Do I Sign Him” list. Thanks.
dee & Erin-
I love Ausiello too!! I have been following him since he was with TVguide
GLove, it’s not in the Yankees’ best interests to have Aceves or Gaudin win one of those spots. IMO, unless Joba or Phil completely fall apart, it should be theirs. I realize 2008 didn’t work out so well, but IMO, Phil was hurting and Ian? Ian had a lot of other issues. It’s imperative that at least one of Phil and Joba show well in 2009 as starters. Again, I don’t have high expectations for Phil THIS year – he just has to be a solid #5. Joba, on the other hand, is a year advanced and has to do better than he did last year. These are the kids the Yanks have groomed for years – they must get a chance. Aceves is who he is and so is Gaudin – no matter what they do in ST, they are not part of the future of this team. If the Yanks don’t realize this, then I have to ? their ability to develop pitchers
Don’t forget that Wang’s agent has said the Yanks want to match whatever other teams are bidding on him. If he’s healthy, he might be back on an incentive laden deal. One benefit of Wang, even if he gets hurt again at some point during the season, it would probabaly be enough for Hughes to pitch for the rest of the season without an innings limit. And if he puts things back together, he’s a great pitcher.
MTU
Sell Crazy somewhere else – we’re all full up here.
JK JK
Uncle-
I guess it just comes down to that I have a job to do for the moment and I am trying to accomplish it.
If i fail that’s OK.
If i suceed that will be great.
It’s a self-assigned one. No one asked me to do it.
Some people would definitely prefer I didn’t.
Tryin to show myself something in the process to.
To teach myself something.
One poster hear who I have always like but failed to mention
by name is Bohdi.
I think he were here right now he might understand some of what I am trying to accomplish.
Maybe better than anyone.
Thanks for the link, Erica! The schedule will get even worse once the Olympics start. Do people even watch the Olympics anymore?
======
I believe its called reruns. How can someone watch a movie if they were already told what the ending was. That really killed it for me. I knew Phelps won the gold hours before it was televised. They need to put a muzzle on the media and not leak out the results till we see it here.
“Im still convinced either Hughes or Joba will be the 8th inning guy this year. The loser of the two competing for that 5th spot.”
Feel the same way. Especially if the pen looks bad in ST or the early part of the season.
Cubs want Cabrera or Gardner. There is a possible option that gets an even up salary swap and nets us a pitcher from the Cubs who have extra starting pitching. Trade Gardner for Randy Wells.
Then you can complete the roster with a creative monetary deal for Holliday.
Mick-
you tryin to chase me away?
If you build it he will come?
“When you have a job to do you better do it well – you better give the other fella hell”
“arquis doesn’t have an extensive injury history like Sheets and Harden do, so the Nats shouldn’t have an issue giving him 2 years at that money.”
The Nats failed to sign their 2008 first round draft pick Aron Crow over $500K.
Crow was a high floor, relatively high ceiling arm who very well could have been in their rotation this year.
But they can shell out 15M for Marquis? To do what? They won 59 games last year. What will a mediocre starter do for them? Make them a 62 win team instead of a 60 win team? That’s not what the franchise or their fanbase needs or is looking for.
Save the $15M and use it to sign Aroldis Chapman and see if you can catch lightning in a bottle with him and Strasburg.
It’s just a complete mismatch in what that franchise needs given where they are and where they need to go.
Wow, $15 million for Marquis? Forget Sheets……..
Duchscherer might make the most sense because he could start off in the bullpen if they want to give Hughes and Chamberlain a shot to stick in the rotation, but then be stretched out to start later in the year if healthy and effective thanks to his yo-yoing of roles. I do worry that he battled depression and had a lot of off-the-field issues last year while he was also hurt, which makes me think Duchscherer + New York might not be the best combination. But, from a practical baseball standpoint he might make the most sense.
Isn’t it time to begin the process of finding the heir apparent for Mo? I dont want the Yanks to be forced into the free agent market, especially when Papelbon becomes eligible in a couple of years.
I think Robertson can certainly do the 8th inning set up job. But does he have enough to close out games? The Yanks couldnt have handled the Joba situation much worse last year IMO. But despite having no innings restrictions in ’10, I’d like to see what he could do as the 8th inning guy and even have him close a few games out to rest Mo.
Long term, Hughes and Joba are too good to be set up men. Eventually it would also impact their earnings potential and that could become a clubhouse issue in a few years.
The Yanks obviously need to maximize their innings and effectiveness. I’d like to see them use Gaudin the first half,stretch out Phil early in the season and keep Phil in the #5 slot the second half. Also, if CMW is throwing well, match the highest offer. A September rotation of CC, AJ, Andy, CMW and Hughes could be as good as anyone’s, including in Beantown.
CB,
I’d like to think most GM’s and agents see the Marquis deal as an outlier. I know that’s now how it works when it comes to negotiation but theres always a bad contract to be given out (Jose Guillen, Carlos Silva,etc) if you’re lucky…
2/15 is pretty crazy in this market though
Uncle-
It’s much less concrete than the concrete that the stadium is made of.
Dreams aren’t made of concrete are they /
otherwise they would sink.
“Trade Gardner for Randy Wells.”
That would be a good trade in my eyes. Would we have to give up more than just Gardner though?
Cashman probably thought that Joba would be much better this year than he really was and in 2010, he wouldn’t be a question mark anymore so we could break in Hughes because Joba would be somewhat of a known quantity.
Instead, we have no idea what to expect from either kid next year. I don’t think Cashman thought Joba would come into camp out of shape last year and go into 2010 with more questions than ever. Cash probably thought he would show enough so that Hughes could be broken in next year without worrying about Joba.
“Duchscherer might make the most sense because he could start off in the bullpen if they want to give Hughes and Chamberlain a shot to stick in the rotation,”
Unfortunately Duchserer has said he does not want to pitch out of the pen at all.
He wants to start. And given the market, he’ll have the chance.
And also – he’d be much better off going to the NL to rebuild his value.
If Marquis is getting $15MM for 2 years, then Sheets will probably ask for $24MM for 2 years. Doesn’t make sense to pay him Pettitte money.
Drive 4- 5 December 21st, 2009 at 4:09 pm
Isn’t it time to begin the process of finding the heir apparent for Mo? I dont want the Yanks to be forced into the free agent market, especially when Papelbon becomes eligible in a couple of years.
==================================================
I have no doubt Joba would be annointed closer if Mo couldn’t go.
Thoughts on bringing in Escobar for the pen?
CB-
wouldn’t all this just push Holliday more in our direction ?
Marquis on the Nationals? You sure they didn’t mean naming rights for the stadium for the Mercury Marquis brand? $15 million? What?
So the Yankees are onto something “big?” Like in the CC Subway commercial, “You know who big?”
Well as Mickey Roark said in Diner “if you don’t have good dreams… you have nightmares
If Marquis can get 2/15 then maybe there really is a dumb GM out there for Holliday.
BD,
The outlier argument isn’t going to work. I would really be unhappy if I were Harden.
But sheets is going to use Marquis as a point to go north from.
If MO falls off a cliff this year or gets injured, we have other options to replace him that do not involve Joba/Hughes.
We have Robertson, Melancon, Mitre, Gaudin, Aceves, Nova, Sanchez etc. who can step in to replace MO if needed.
Duchserer dominated in the AL until he was hurt, it was the AL West, but still. And Marquis’ salary isn’t as bad as what the Brewers gave to Randy Wolf (3/30?), who was considered a #4 at best last year around this time. Innings Eater mid order guys are worth 8-11M a year these days.
KC is in need of a CF and has some appealing relief and starting pitching that may work.
This is a nice signing by the Nationals…they could use some experience in their starting pitching. Its hard to believe that the Mets let Marquis get away. They could use him as much as and maybe more than the Nats. Its possible that the Nationals will improve before the Mets do.
“Trade Gardner for Randy Wells.”
That would be a good trade in my eyes. Would we have to give up more than just Gardner though?
————————————————
The Cubs are initiating the trade so I wouldn’t think we’d have to add anything of significance as it’s pretty much an even money swap for two players about the same age and the Cubs want one of our CF’ers.
Manson December 21st, 2009 at 4:15 pm
If MO falls off a cliff this year or gets injured, we have other options to replace him that do not involve Joba/Hughes.
We have Robertson, Melancon, Mitre, Gaudin, Aceves, Nova, Sanchez etc. who can step in to replace MO if needed.
=======================================================
Like your namesake, that is insane.
Duchester already said he doesn’t want to pitch out of the pen?
Then forget him– the attractiveness of him was the fact that we wouldn’t HAVE to put him in the rotation because he has excelled in the pen in the past and would give us options.
If he demanded that he has to start, then he is not an option.
Uncle-
Our product is the Yankees.
Not the satdium.
Who is the salesman.
Cash
What are part of his weapons in selling ?
What was Matt’s Childhood dream ?
We have the money over the Cards.
Is it ONLY the money ?
get what I was trying to say ?
Dorothy.
The POWER of believing.
Ok
Nothing supernatural.
although it can have magical power sometimes.
A good product can sell ITSELF.
Mason, are you telling me you want Melancon to get the ball game 6 of the world series??? The kid was awful when called up last year, no way he’s ready to close for the Yankees this year or probably next year. Robertson had a silly high k/9, so he has a chance, maybe Marte. No one else I would even consider to close outsie of Hughes or Joba of that group.
“We have Robertson, Melancon, Mitre, Gaudin, Aceves, Nova, Sanchez etc. who can step in to replace MO if needed.”
Yeah, just like Ransom stepped right in and filled Arod’s shoes last year.
I can’t wait to hear Cashman rationalize Aceves being the choice at closer by saying-”Well, he fields the positon better than Mariano.”
Yeah, Marilyn Manson…. I’m sure Sergio Mitre or Gaudin could step in and replace MO no problem…..
Mark in Tampa December 21st, 2009 at 4:19 pm
“We have Robertson, Melancon, Mitre, Gaudin, Aceves, Nova, Sanchez etc. who can step in to replace MO if needed.”
Yeah, just like Ransom stepped right in and filled Arod’s shoes last year.
I can’t wait to hear Cashman rationalize Aceves being the choice at closer by saying-”Well, he fields the positon better than Mariano.”
===================================================
Methinks Manson was mocking a previous post stating our pen was secure with those guys.
Uncle-
The yankees are a superior porduct, and Cash is a great salesman because he has a great product to go with the money.
It has gravity for Matt, and I think it will draw him in.
Maybe I am wrong.
That’s what I was trying to say.
if he just wants Money. the Yanks certainly have that too.
It’s all gonna be good either way.
“Unfortunately Duchserer has said he does not want to pitch out of the pen at all.”
So much for that idea, then. I do not think he is worth the money it would take to get him, as a guy only going to start, especially in the AL East. His soft stuff repertoire makes sense as a swingman, but if he is going to get paid as a full-fledged starter, no dice.
DaSaint007-
Other than Greinke, the Royals IMO don’t have another starter better than Gaudin, and that’s including Meche and Bannister.
Soria would be off limits, like Greinke, but Robinson Tejada would be a nice pickup if avaialable.
bring back sidney ponson!!
ok, just kidding. did melancon pitch in winter ball. any reports?
what about guys like roberts or aceves?
“Methinks Manson was mocking a previous post stating our pen was secure with those guys.”
I hope so.
“KC is in need of a CF and has some appealing relief and starting pitching that may work.”
Who did you have in mind?
So far, it seems like the Cubs and KC are the one’s most interested in Gardner or Cabrera.
I’d take Meche on my team, the guy is pretty decent. We don’t need Cliff Lee pitching 5th in the rotation to be a dominant team.
Melancon could replace MO. He’d walk the bases loaded, then hit 2 guys.
That is what we call a “walkoff hit”.
The yankees are a superior porduct, and Cash is a great salesman because he has a great product to go with the money.
====
Why didnt you just come out and say that from the beginning? It would have saved us saleman time wondering and thinking what makes us good salesman.
Am I the only one who is worried about the pen even more than before after seeing the “list” of guys that we have as options?
And it is hilarious that people are posting Mitre as being an option.
MTU
December 21st, 2009 at 4:21 pm
Uncle-
The yankees are a superior porduct, and Cash is a great salesman because he has a great product to go with the money.
It has gravity for Matt, and I think it will draw him in.
Maybe I am wrong.
That’s what I was trying to say.
if he just wants Money. the Yanks certainly have that too.
It’s all gonna be good either way.
Ok – I can see that
S.o.S-
I shouldn’t have had to tell you that then.
Do you disagree with the idea ?
I would like to be a fly on the wall of Cashman’s cell phone.
S.o.S-
also i would have failed in another part of the job.
remeber.
MTU December 21st, 2009 at 4:26 pm
S.o.S-
I shouldn’t have had to tell you that then.
Do you disagree with the idea ?
========================================
Let’s discuss.
Mick-
we already have a fly of sorts.
Meche is expensive ($12 million AAV) and frequently injured. He has chronic back problems that plagued him a lot last year, and I think he developed shoulder issues during the season. The guy is a train wreck physically, but ability-wise, he would give the Yankees some useful innings out of the back of the rotation when healthy.
I think they would have to get creative and have KC eat a portion of his annual salary over the next 2 years in order to make the numbers work, money-wise, to whatever the mystery budget number is (I doubt taking on $12 million for a #4 starter is part of the budget for 2010). And that’s not even taking into account the talent that would have to be handed over by the Yankees.
I shouldn’t have had to tell you that then.
Do you disagree with the idea ?
=====
Is this the who’s on first game?
If KC were trying to trim their payroll, I’d target Meche and, Soria (who’s very affordable however). I’m not that impressed with Tejeda.
I have only 1 more part to complete my self-assigned task.
But it requires waiting. so I wait to find out.
All of us that care one way or another will have to.
Unless the fly relieves us of the trouble.
which I am sure they will if they can.
mick,
I wouldn’t be so sure. You know there is a large contingent of posters who think the pen has no holes and is a lock to do well.
Though people need to realize, just because we have options, doesn’t mean any of them are necessarily good.
I dunno, who’s on 3rd.
“If KC were trying to trim their payroll, I’d target Meche and, Soria (who’s very affordable however). I’m not that impressed with Tejeda.”
I have always been an advocate for Soria. Perfect 9th inning guy IMO. But, I don’t think they will deal him. Unfortunately. Meche is more likely however.
Isn’t it time to begin the process of finding the heir apparent for Mo? I dont want the Yanks to be forced into the free agent market, especially when Papelbon becomes eligible in a couple of years.
——————————————————-
Yeah, I agree. I knwo that everyone wants to address LF but I think making the bullpen more bulletproof is important. last season, once our bullpwn got straightened out we were able to make a big seciond half run with Sergio Mitre as our 5th starter. If we can inmprove the bullpen with someone who would eventually replace Mo then I’d recommend that. We could be dynomite with a rotation of CC, AJ, Andy, Phil & Joba if the bullpen can be made bulletproof.
A short contract (2 or 3 years) for the Houston close Jose Valverde might be in order. We could put him in the 8th inning role until Mo retires (possibly as soon as next year). My dream replacement for MO is Huston Street. He would be worth trading Montero, McAllister and Melancon for…if we could get him to sign a long term deal.
what good are options if they’re no good?
*Perfect 8th inning. Sorry. Not 9th. Although he could be a possible Rivera replacement if the Yanks did go that route. You never know lol.
s.o.s-
it’s whatever game you would like it to be.
I have my assignment and humor is certainly a part of it(at least the attempt at it).
But not the most important part for me at least.
Joakim Soria.
One can dream.
I actually think they’ll sign A. Chapman and groom him as a closer. He is volative and erratic but his fastball can be harnessed and slider refined.
Bret the Hitman
December 21st, 2009 at 4:35 pm
Joakim Soria.
One can dream.
I actually think they’ll sign A. Chapman and groom him as a closer. He is volative and erratic but his fastball can be harnessed and slider refined.
————————————————————
I like Soria more than I like Street, actually, as he’s more affordable and younger. Chapman may be a good option too. Lefty and power pitcher. Baltimore loves lefty closers, for whatever reason. I think they’re now on their third, Mike Gonzalez. Prior to that it was George Sherrill and before that it was BJ Ryan.
Depending on his performance this year, I could see Rivera signing a 2 year contract. A good complement to him may be a good idea by 2011.
Give Rivera 2 more years and groom Chapman to close. A power lefty closer in the NY Stadium plays to our advantage.
Also, the monetary cost of Chapman is less than Street and cost in prospects (zero) is less than trading for Soria.
Boston may be targetting Chapman for the same reason the Yanks are – as a replacement for their closer.
KC would be dumb to trade Soria, they need someone with talent on the team. And to be honest, it won’t take that much for them to compete in that division.
I would trade McAllister or Romine for Soria if I had to.
The guy is a stud and is one of the best young closers in the game.
The only thing that scared me this year about Rivera is his velocity dropped. Can the cutter still be as effective if the velocity continues to dip for him? I know he was still very effective, i just dont know if the decline in his velocity will finally make him human.
I love it when Cashman is in “stealth” mode.
Cue the Jaws theme music…..
KC should give Soria a shot at starting. He’s being wasted right now on that team in that role given his stuff.
How muchy longer is Soria tied up w/KC? I assume he would be arb-eligible pretty soon.
MTU,
A good salesman must have belief…in what they sell.
They must beleive their own hype.
Otherwise they are peddling the BS you mentioned.
much**
damn keyboard
S.o.S. – Good point.
He’s already 40 and been doing this about 10 years longer than anyone expected him to. He’s got to fall off the cliff at some point, doesn’t he?
His ERA and blown saves were down this year, but he was putting many more guys on base than before. He had to work for most of his saves, not the vintage 8 pitch 1-2-3 innings.
Until he does fall off the cliff, we have to assume he is going to be automatic. But we just don’t know when it finally will happen.
Marquis in the AL East? Um, no.
Marquis to the Mets? Omar? Omar?
Bueller?
Bret the Hitman
December 21st, 2009 at 4:41 pm
Give Rivera 2 more years and groom Chapman to close. A power lefty closer in the NY Stadium plays to our advantage.
Also, the monetary cost of Chapman is less than Street and cost in prospects (zero) is less than trading for Soria.
Boston may be targetting Chapman for the same reason the Yanks are – as a replacement for their closer.
———————————————————–
I agree. Adding a power arm to complement Rivera now would be a good idea. Melancon has been mentioned in terms of capability, but I’d like to see that over the course of this season.
Ken Davidoff
Heard #Yankees did ask #Cubs about Zambrano, as NY Post reported – a few weeks ago. Would’ve worked only if CHI supplied $. No active talks. 49 minutes ago
Hate to open up this can of worms for the millionth time, but Mo’s heir apparent wears #62 for the NYY.
It ain’t Street, it ain’t Pimplebutt, it’s probably not even Soria.
Regarding Rivera’s velocity, I could be wrong, but it seems to me that he’s been down around 90-92 mph (at least according to the speed guns shown on TV) for a couple of years now. It’s certainly been a while since he hit 95 regularly. And it doesn’t seem to have detracted from his effectiveness.
I would be hugely disappointed if we don’t sign Arnold Chapman. I’d rather give him money than signing someone like Sheets/Duchester. With where we pick in the draft, the chance to get 100 MPH throwing lefties is impossible. It is so rare to get the chance to get a guy like this.
So if Rivera’s era climbs to 3.5 and has 35 or fewer saves. Velocity hovering around 90/91. Do we still sign him for 2 years?
Jeter bats .280 with 14 homers. Do we sign him at the 20 mil mark?
I guess the question really is, do you pay legends for their past or what their doing at the present time.
I wonder if the Yankees have any interest in Jarrod Washburn. I know they did last year. I’m not saying that would be a good or bad idea, I just wonder if he’s on their radar.
Conflicting reports on Yankees inquiry of Cubs’ Carlos Zambrano
Chapman to the bullpen debate?
Too soon.
“So if Rivera’s era climbs to 3.5 and has 35 or fewer saves. Velocity hovering around 90/91. Do we still sign him for 2 years?
Jeter bats .280 with 14 homers. Do we sign him at the 20 mil mark?”
Nope. If that is the case, they come back on our terms.
Only way they name their own price is if they have great years like they did in 2009. If they slip the way you are portraying, there is no way Cash will let them control the negotiations. As iconic as they may be, they have to keep the payroll in control and giving those guys huge deals coming off mediocre years is not the way to go.
•ESPN’s Jerry Crasnick reports that Justin Duchscherer has received contract offers from three unnamed teams, and he expects to decide on his 2010 home within a week.
Never too soon to chatter about unwarranted shifts to the pen. Sad thing is that right now he really has closer’s stuff more than he does starter’s stuff.
The whole worry about who was the “heir apparent” to mo started around, what, 3-4 years ago now.
That would have been quite an apprenticeship.
MO’s next contract needs to be year to year. We’ll pay him a lot of $$$ and keep renewing his contract (like we do with Andy) as long as he performs. We cannot give a 41 yr old closer a multi-year deal for big money. Too risky.
Jeter’s next contract is going to be a lifetime achievement award. It is going to be a brutal contract, but there is nothing we can do. He isin’t taking a paycut. I don’t think MO will either, but you can at least play hardball with him because of his age.
Washburn has always been of interest to the Yankees. I wouldn’t say it’s impossible that they consider him as a #4, but he’s coming off injury also, and much prefers Seattle. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him return there.
Chapman offered a 15 million dollar yearly salary by the red sox http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/ru.....mlb,210116
“His ERA and blown saves were down this year, but he was putting many more guys on base than before. He had to work for most of his saves, not the vintage 8 pitch 1-2-3 innings.”
That’s completely untrue. Yes, his WHIP was higher than 2008, but 2008 was the best WHIP of his career, and in 2009 it was still under 1.000 (for the 7th time in his career), and was less than his career WHIP. Look at the last 10 years:
2009: 0.905
2008: 0.665
2007: 1.121
2006: 0.960
2005: 0.868
2004: 1.081
2003: 1.005
2002: 1.000
2001: 0.905
2000: 1.097
Career: 1.013
2008 was an outlier, mostly because he gave up so few walks (an absurdly low 6 in 70.2 innings). In 2009, he gave up 12 in 66.1 innings. Twice as many, yes, but still a superb number and right in line with the rest of his career. And, as I recall, a lot of them were in the last month or so, and many people here (including me) thought he was being squeezed all the time.
Chapman’s not an Ace!
Give McAllister OR Romine for Soria??
I’d give BOTH and then some….
Give Mariano an infite team option like Tim Wakefield, 10 million each year.
Im not so sure about going after Zambrano and his contract. He seems beat up and his era has been climbing. What about his teammate Dempster instead? One more for you. Most of you love players that came from our farm and we need a left fielder. Yes!! Soriano!! Is he worst than Bay out there?
I believe I know what Phil will give us as #5 starter this year – he’ll be up and down, but his ups will be fantastic. That should be fine, but Joba is the great unknown; I have no clue about what he will give us next year and that’s a shame. First thing – he better show up to camp in shape and stop acting as if he knows more than everyone else (like, no shaking off Posada)
“Hate to open up this can of worms for the millionth time….”
OK, then don’t.
Let’s see how this season plays out before re-igniting those talks. If the Yankees’ decision makers thought he was best suited for the pen, then he wouldn’t have gotten 31 starts this year. It’s obvious the Yankees want to see if he can make it as a starter, and this year will be his first without and restrictions.
His previous career high in IP was 112 (in 2007). In his first 110.2 innings this year he had a 3.58 ERA. He didn’t always give the team great length (and he walked too many guys), but in the AL East, it’s hard to complain when you’re talking about a 23 year old.
Of course, to be fair, Phil had a few immaturity issues at the end of last year, too…..but that’s not the norm with him.
Yanks weren’t in on Lackey at all. They didn’t like his elbow.
CB
December 21st, 2009 at 5:03 pm
Never too soon to chatter about unwarranted shifts to the pen. Sad thing is that right now he really has closer’s stuff more than he does starter’s stuff.
The whole worry about who was the “heir apparent” to mo started around, what, 3-4 years ago now.
That would have been quite an apprenticeship.
———————————————————-
…and will continue for about 3 more years. Sounds like Med School and Residency or Architecture School and Apprenticeship.
Are the pitching options that are available any less of a risk than joba and hughes would be? If the answer is no or not significantly so then why waste the money?
Yanks have seemed to always like Washburn.
Despite his abysmal Detroit stint, it wouldn’t surprise me in Cash added him.
I know most here would hate that, but Yanks seem to stay liking guys once they’re liked… if you know what I mean.
Marquis would have been lit up like a Christmas tree in this division. I was terrified that we were going to get him.
CB.
Hope you are well.
NickSF.
If you are staying downtown I have a good recommendation that is a hidden gem to watch the game and have great food with a pop…
Pat M.
I will be back with some OVERS for the Bowl games. Hope you had a good rest of the season.
GB7.
Amy and I are back in SAV so if you need anything, email Amy through her website. We can bring anything you may need from downtown. We hope you feel better.
Cheers. -dennis
Since Mo plans on playing for 5 more years (according to him)
….hopefully we can shelve the debate for a while.
Um, Montero, Melancon and McAllister for Huston Street? Wow…..
Zambrano is a headcase.
Great arm, but great risk.
Not worth trading for with that contract.
Don’t want Zambrano – awful contract (I don’t care how much the Cubs eat) and just as big a head case.
I could see him jumping in the stands at Fenway during the first heated exchange that goes on.
Lots of talent, but pass.
now that lowell is staying with the sox, does that end their beltre acquisition hopes?
how many wins does beltre project over lowell?
When did Deutscherer say that he didn’t want to pitch out of the pen? Well, in any case, he’s out. The Yanks just need to forge ahead with their kids….The Sox did, why can’t we?
Betsy, who proposed that trade? Steve Phillips?
Here is the thing about Rivera. Now over 40, some fans are going to judge him by an appearance by appearance basis, with any hint of humanity being interpreted as a sign of decline.
But he’s so preposterously good, fans should constantly remind themselves that even with some eventual drop-out, he’s got a LOT of room to work with before he even “falls” to league above-average.
And I still think one year he’s going to break out the change-up for real.
No thank you on Washburn…….
L to the 2nd, a poster above…..I don’t remember who, lol
Imagine Mo adding an effective changeup? LOL that’s not even fair.
It’s kept Hoffman in business all these years.
CB
December 21st, 2009 at 5:03 pm
“The whole worry about who was the “heir apparent” to mo started around, what, 3-4 years ago now.
That would have been quite an apprenticeship.”
But 3 or 4 years ago Mo wasnt staring down at the year he turns 40. I only brought it up because at his age it wouldnt hurt to cut his appearances down closer to 60 than 70. In ’09 he appeared in 66 games,but only finished 55 games. That’s the most he was used in non save situations in his career.The Yanks have talent that appears to be capable of easing Mo’s burden.They’d be wise to use it and perhaps learn about the contenders to the throne.
I mentioned this guys name the other day as a possible pitcher i would look at to trade for. He’s coming off an injury season and wasnt part of his teams playoff run. What do you guys think about Billingsly and would they even consider trading him?
Zambrano is pricey but if the Cubs took back, say Nick Swisher, in a deal, than the total cost of Zambrano averages out to 14 million per season for 4 years.
Now would you rather have Lackey for 17 million per season and 5 years or Zambrano for 14 million per season for 4 years?
Zambrano is 28.
Lackey is 31.
A short contract (2 or 3 years) for the Houston close Jose Valverde might be in order. We could put him in the 8th inning role until Mo retires (possibly as soon as next year). My dream replacement for MO is Huston Street. He would be worth trading Montero, McAllister and Melancon for…if we could get him to sign a long term deal.
–
Montero+ for Houston Street. Now I’ve seen everything. You don’t trade a premium bat for a reliever, I don’t care how good.
“how many wins does beltre project over lowell?”
I haven’t seen any projections for Beltre playing his home games in Fenway vs. Lowell. The home park factor is so significant for right-handed batters in Fenway.
Also, maybe the better question would be “how many wins does a healthy Beltre project over an injured Lowell?” Lowell’s injury needs to be figured out first.
It would be worth getting Zambrano just to see the look on CC’s face when Zambrano loses his mind lol
Now would you rather have Lackey for 17 million per season and 5 years or Zambrano for 14 million per season for 4 years?
Zambrano is 28.
Lackey is 31.
–
But its not Lackey vs Zambrano, its Lackey+Swisher vs Zambrano. Why are we trading for Zambrano’s albatross AND giving up swisher?! And so now we have a headcase, declining pitcher AND no right fielder?! Ridiculous.
Any trade for Swisher on this blog is ridiculous.
Sheets is the only free agent pitcher that’s any better than what they already have.
If he’s too expensive then sign Holliday and throw the kids in the fire with an unbelievable offense behind them.
“My dream replacement for MO is Huston Street. He would be worth trading Montero, McAllister and Melancon for…if we could get him to sign a long term deal.”
back down buddy..sure give em mcallister and melancon but MONTERO? top 3 offensive prospect in baseball for a closer?
the blue jays wanted montero for arguably the best starting pitcher in the game and you want to deal him for a closer?
Where is this Montero for Street idiocy spewing forth from?
I only brought it up because at his age it wouldnt hurt to cut his appearances down closer to 60 than 70.
=======
With MO being the best closer ever and close to 40. I think its time for him to close games on appointments only. They call the bullpen. He checks his appointment book to see if theres any room. Girardi,I would recommend calling 24 to 48 hours in advance to book a close.
“What do you guys think about Billingsly and would they even consider trading him?”
That would be a decent pickup. But, who would we trade?
I wouldn’t give them Melancon or McAllister – forget it, I don’t want Huston Street, esp. after that epic job against the Phillies. Even if he was good against the Phils, there’s no way I’m trading those kids for Street.
CB December 21st, 2009 at 4:11 pm
“Duchscherer might make the most sense because he could start off in the bullpen if they want to give Hughes and Chamberlain a shot to stick in the rotation,”
Unfortunately Duchserer has said he does not want to pitch out of the pen at all.
He wants to start. And given the market, he’ll have the chance.
And also – he’d be much better off going to the NL to rebuild his value.
————————–
Did he really say he only wanted to be a starter? Well, there goes that idea. I think his versatility is what appealed to Cash.
Hey dennis. I’m staying with family in Eastover, but what’s your hidden gem?
The place I’ve gone to watch games before is Picasso’s in Dilworth.
Brett – you are only looking at 1/2 of the equation. Swisher is productive. If you trade him, you still have to fill that position, which has a cost. Secondly, if you fill it with Melky, you are reducing your offense, which has a cost too. If you put Melky in RF, then who plays LF? Factor that in……..
So any gains from Zambrano, need to be offset by the cost of losing Swisher and replacing him with a lesser player.
Your analysis would be okay, if Swish had $0 value and was just a cost. Since that is not the case, your analysis is incomplete.
vin,
thanks. in the absence of a healthy lowell, the red sox are in some trouble. youk can play third, but then first is a serious weakness. they might be a third place team in that senario
Can we stop trying to trade/sign for relievers? The pen is fine as is… we have so many options like Robertson, Melancon, Marte, Nova, Dunn, Sanchez, Gaudin, Mitre, Aceves etc.
We don’t need any FA relievers, the pen is fine as is.
Next FA class of closers (courtesy MLBTR):
Scott Downs (35)
Frank Francisco (31)
Jason Frasor (33)
Brian Fuentes (35) – $9MM option vests with 55 games finished in 2010
Trevor Hoffman (43) – mutual option worth $7-8.5MM; buyout at $500K-1MM
Chad Qualls (32)
Mariano Rivera (41)
Rafael Soriano (31)
Huston Street (27)
Billy Wagner (39) – $6.5MM option vests with 50 games finished
Kerry Wood (34) – $11MM club option, vests with 55 games finished in 2010
Why trade for a closer, when you can just wait? I’d only trade for a Joaquin Soria.
SoS
“They call the bullpen. He checks his appointment book to see if theres any room. Girardi,I would recommend calling 24 to 48 hours in advance to book a close.”
LOL. At least then Mo would be sure to have that hot water bottle that he was hugging in the playoffs ready.
“What do you guys think about Billingsly and would they even consider trading him?”
I love him. No.
Simple, huh?
Actually, he’s headed for his first year of arbitration this off-season. He’ll be relatively cheap the next couple of years, with year 3 potentially getting pretty expensive (if he stays healthy). The Dodgers would be selling “low” on him, given the way last season ended for him.
IMO, he’s too valuable to trade – especially given the lack of financial wiggle-room the Dodgers have. 5 million for a guy of Billingsley’s ability is well worth the money.
But its not Lackey vs Zambrano, its Lackey+Swisher vs Zambrano. Why are we trading for Zambrano’s albatross AND giving up swisher?! And so now we have a headcase, declining pitcher AND no right fielder?! Ridiculous.
Any trade for Swisher on this blog is ridiculous.
—-
Not really, because moving Swisher’s contract and locking up a starter more talented than Lackey to a bargain long term deal allows the Yankees more flexibility after signing Holliday heading into the 2011 free agent market.
Blake-
“Sheets is the only free agent pitcher that’s any better than what they already have.
If he’s too expensive then sign Holliday and throw the kids in the fire with an unbelievable offense behind them.”
Smart man.
it could go that way. Each time I watch another pitcher drop
I think how much closer it brings us to the GRAND prize.
Keep your eyes on the ball.
“But 3 or 4 years ago Mo wasnt staring down at the year he turns 40.”
The same arguments were being made 3 years prior. Mo is now staring down turning 37 or 38.
It was the same argument being made then as now.
And Mo hasn’t lost any of his stuff over the past three years.
People seem to be constantly trying to push him out the door when his performance on the field doesn’t warrant it.
Allocating talent to make up for someone who isn’t declining is takes away from other areas where it could be used.
If Joba had been made the “heir apparent” three years ago the yankees would be forced right now to overpay for a guy like Joel Pineiro which would turn into another awful contract.
All that so that they could have not only Dave Robertson (who led the AL in strike out rate) in the 8th inning role but also Joba.
“Why trade for a closer, when you can just wait?”
Why sign a free agent until you’re sure you don’t need another closer? That’s exactly my point.
Betsy
The RS have only two home grown starters and didn’t they just sign a FA in Lackey?
new thread
“I guess the question really is, do you pay legends for their past or what they’re doing at the present time.”
IMHO they should not be paid for the past nor for the present. They should be paid for what they can be expected to do in the future, during the term of the contract being offered.
In the old days, when salaries were much lower, a player who had a good year would be rewarded by getting a big raise in his next year’s contract. Today, salaries are too high to reward players for past performance. Looked at another way, legends should be re-signed not far above what they could get as a free agent from another team.
Blake-
remember the game we played last night ?
It’s a process. Cash may not even know where it will lead him.
or the eventaul outcome. He follows a process.
“Mo is now staring down turning 37 or 38.”
Mariano Rivera was born on November 29, 1969. He is 40 years old now.
“thanks. in the absence of a healthy lowell, the red sox are in some trouble. youk can play third, but then first is a serious weakness. they might be a third place team in that senario”
Yeah, I agree. Youkilis gives them some nice flexibility – Can’t find a 3B? Then move Youkilis to 3B and get a 1B. Can’t find a 1B? Then move Youkilies to 3B, VMart to 1B, and get a catcher. Of course VMart is really a DH, but they have Ortiz for another year. A guy like Bengie Molina might make some sense for them. Varitek is done.
“Montero+ for Houston Street. Now I’ve seen everything. You don’t trade a premium bat for a reliever, I don’t care how good.”
Well said – a guy that pitches one inning every other game is not as valuable as a guy that plays 18 innings in those games, or a guy that pitches 7. Relief pitchers are an overrated commodity in baseball (yes, Mo is valuable, but overall you are smart to take the starter or everyday player over a reliever).
(this happens to be why I want to see Joba and Hughes as starters by the way)
dennis,
So good to hear from you? Hope things are well. I was wondering where you might be the past few months. I was going through some posts and saw that you’d gone through some difficult times. I’m sorry about that.
Hope things are getting better.
Right now, the Bullpen is:
Mariano Rivera
Dave Robertson
Damaso Marte (L)
Alfredo Aceves
Chad Gaudin
Michael Dunn (L)
Sergio Mitre
Figure that if Cashman gets that #4 starter, it’s likely that Hughes will be in the pen most likely replacing Mitre. And if Melancon wins a spot in ST, then someone else has to be replaced.
Right now, the Bullpen is:
Mariano Rivera
Dave Robertson
Damaso Marte (L)
Alfredo Aceves
Chad Gaudin
Michael Dunn (L)
Sergio Mitre
Figure that if Cashman gets that #4 starter, it’s likely that Hughes will be in the pen most likely replacing Mitre. And if Melancon wins a spot in ST, then someone else has to be replaced.
Not really, because moving Swisher’s contract and locking up a starter more talented than Lackey to a bargain long term deal allows the Yankees more flexibility after signing Holliday heading into the 2011 free agent market.
–
So now we are signing Holliday AND trading for Zambrano? So an additional 36 million to the payroll? And we lose swisher? I’d sooner just sign Holliday and keep Swisher.
Zambrano being better than Lackey is debatable. Both are injury risks. He has an atrocious walk rate, which is saved only by his HR rate. Lackey has a superior k:bb and similiar HR rates, and has done so in the AL. Zambrano’s GB:FB ratio has declined each of the past few seasons.
This is a fool’s trade.
NickSF.
Alexander Michael’s in the 4th Ward on 401 W. Ninth St. I had coroporate housing a few doors down from there 7+ years ago and fell in love with the place. Amy and I go back every time we are in Charlotte. JMO.
Safe Travels.
-dennis
CB.
Thanks. Things are OK. My folks were in and out of the hospital for much of Oct and Nov and I lost a good pal to a cancer battle in OCT.
Good perspective check but I still have a heavy heart.
We are back in Savannah from Maine for the winter and Spring and trying to stay positive!! I will fly up to Maine and check on my Mom and Dad every 2-3 weeks. Luckily my two sisters are in the area to be there for them full time.
Congrats again on #27. As always, your posts have been enjoyable to read. I just have a lot less time right now to read and post on a daily or for my sake a “nightly” basis.
Kind Regards.
-dennis
Duchscherer is deciding between three teams and will announce next week. Full story here. Also, the Yankees are apparently not in on Ben Sheets, which friggin’ SUCKS, unless they know something we don’t regarding his health. Anyone heard anything bad about Sheets? I thought he was recovered. No reason not to kick the tires.
A short contract (2 or 3 years) for the Houston close Jose Valverde might be in order. We could put him in the 8th inning role until Mo retires (possibly as soon as next year). My dream replacement for MO is Huston Street. He would be worth trading Montero, McAllister and Melancon for…if we could get him to sign a long term deal.
–
Montero+ for Houston Street. Now I’ve seen everything. You don’t trade a premium bat for a reliever, I don’t care how good.
========================================================
Huston Street and Joe mauer are the only two guys I would consider trading Montero for. The reality is that Maraino Rivera is going to be 40 years old. Despite what he said after that last game of the World Series, he is near the end.
A bulletproof bullpen is absolutely necessary if a team is going to win a World Series. Hitters are a dime a dozen. Give up whatever it takes to get Street before Mo retires. If we don’t we’ll be a highs scoring mediocre team. Good free agent pitchers won’t want to come to the Yankees if teh bullpen is unreliable.
And, no…I don’t think Joba is going to be a reliever. The Yankees didn’t spend the last two years stretching him out to throw him back in the ‘pen. If he fails as a starter the Yankees will trade him.
Seattle might be looking to move Brandon Morrow. They are reportedly looking for a cheap corner infielder(1b)or DH that is MLB ready. According to sources the Brewers turned down Morrow for Matt Gamel. Yanks should see if they are interested in a deal centered around Morrow for Juan Miranda. They were supposedly in on Nick Johnson but didnt want to spend that much. Morrow, Hughes, and Joba (perhaps even Gaudin) can compete for 4 and 5 with the looser heading to the pen to help set up.