True or false: The Yankees are finished spending
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 22, 2009 
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At this point, your expectation for the rest of the Yankees offseason depends entirely on how much you believe Brian Cashman when he speaks to the media.
“I will continue to look at any remaining piece,” Cashman said during today’s conference call. “But it won’t be a big piece. Any speculation about some high-end player who has big ability and dollars attached on a large scale would be inappropriate.”
We heard some of the same things at this time last year. Then Mark Teixeira signed a $180-million deal.
Cashman called last winter a “once-in-a-lifetime” opportunity to spend, an opportunity that presented itself because of the considerable money coming off the Yankees payroll and because of the considerable talent available in the free agent market. He said this winter will be different. My estimate has the Yankees payroll already over $200 million, and although Cashman wouldn’t say exactly what his budget is, he’s surely getting close to that figure.
“It’s probably not in my interest to say,” Cashman said. “I do have a number that we’re working under. We will be at that number and it will be less than last year. It’s as simple as that. It’s not in my interest to broadcast what the number is.”
Cashman didn’t rule out another move. In fact, he called left field and “evolving situation” and said to “stay tuned,” but he also said that several free agents — including some of the Yankees own, though he didn’t name names — had already priced themselves out of the Yankees plans.
Whether you believe that is entirely up to you.
he simply doesn;t have to tell us anything.
might not be holliday, might be.
my guess is that we won’t know until mid-january
I would not be suprised if the Yanks sign Bay. Holliday did not have a good go of it with Oakland last year, so maybe the AL isn’t the place for him. However, that still would give us 5 OF’s, 6 if Pena is the Utility player.
Hope they go with Gardie and save for next year. Love the pitching staff and the hitting will be fine.
so it shall be said so it shall be done
I’m completely satisfied with Gardner in LF.
Jeter/Johnson/Tex/Arod/Posada/Granderson/Cano/Swisher/Gardner is plenty good to go to war with. GGBG batting .270 with .350 OBP is fine.
Screw Hollidamon.
ts
sounds like they are close to landing Darosa
(repost)
- . At 11 a.m. on Dec. 23, 2008 Cashman offered $160 million over eight years. An hour later, Teixeira’s agent, Scott Boras, called Cashman and “engaged me over details.
- . 12/17/2008 Yankees general manager Brian Cashman denied they were involved in the Teixeira negotiations.
- . 12/14/2008 Rosenthal says the Yankees are aiming to keep their payroll lower than last season. Despite gorging this holiday season, they’re shedding more than they’re putting on.
BJK
December 22nd, 2009 at 7:52 pm
CR9
December 22nd, 2009 at 7:51 pm
Also, Mo and/or Jeter should take less. At least one of the 2 should take less.
———————————————————-
Why should either take less? Neither of them have shown an ounce of decline.”
__
Did I say either showed an ounce of decline??????
Would you not think that Jeter would be willing to take, hmm, let’s say 19 million a year, to help the team reduce its payroll.?
Hey, if they don’t, they don’t. We’re not the Red Sox. We do not get players to take lesser contracts than they can get somewhere else i.e Scutaro. That’s life. So be it. I will not have any qualms if they make the same or more.
Or Mo, maybe 13 or 14 million?
Mo and Jeter will take whatever the market will bear. That is likely to be less than either of them are currently earning.
“- . 12/14/2008 Rosenthal says the Yankees are aiming to keep their payroll lower than last season. Despite gorging this holiday season, they’re shedding more than they’re putting on.”
Need I remind you that at this point he said that going after Tex is just “fantasy”.
Lost-
Thank you.
My efforts are not wasted.
I have never waivered.
Are you feelin me Holliday !
Come home to where you belong.
Make your Father proud.
He’s gonna shed a tear the first time you hit a homer at yankee stadium to win a game.
He’s gonna be so proud watchin you circle those bases.
His heart is almost gonna explode from it.
Dont deny him that joy.
Do it ! Matt
sign Here:
X_____________
No big pieces? Perhaps not, but remember, Cash once said “it would be fantasy to think we would sign both Sabathia and Teixiera at these numbers”.
Additionally, Jeter and Mo may sign some sort of long term “services contract” to cover them after they retire, so the actual AAV of the contract for the MLB portion is less.
MTU
More Than Unbalanced
False. False. false. false.
……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………….
FALSE !
The yankees decided if they had to be vulnerable … it was to be left field than starting pitcher according joel sherman. Bye bye Holliday.
There is one difference between this year and last. Holliday is going to cost roughly half as much as Teixera did…
Until Matt signs with someone else. Sherman is just a chirping bird.
Pete Abe (Extra Bases at the Globe):
“Doesn’t it seem like there’s still a big move to be made? There are still a lot of prominent free agents available and it’s hard to envision the two AL East bullies sitting it out from now until spring training.”
______________________________
Looks like he’s cut his ties to Yankee fans forever.
MTU
I hope you’re not going to be like one of those internet guys that we are going to have to talk down from a ledge if the Yankees don’t sign Matt Holliday.
Too bad we can’t sign Bay for a cheap 2-year deal or something. I guess the Yankees are expecting to maybe utilize the trade market in July for LF. If not, it doesn’t matter. Our lineup and starting rotation is solid.
DaRosa not in the mix. Damon or Reed Johnson unless Hal okays Holliday.
CR9
December 22nd, 2009 at 7:56 pm
__
Did I say either showed an ounce of decline??????
Would you not think that Jeter would be willing to take, hmm, let’s say 19 million a year, to help the team reduce its payroll.?
Hey, if they don’t, they don’t. We’re not the Red Sox. We do not get players to take lesser contracts than they can get somewhere else i.e Scutaro. That’s life. So be it. I will not have any qualms if they make the same or more.
Or Mo, maybe 13 or 14 million?
—————————————————-
You didn’t say they showed decline. I stated that fact as a reason why neither one should have to take a paycut.
The Yankees make billions. Jeter and Mo are responsible for a good portion of those billions.
Why should either take a paycut if they’re still performing at elite levels? Just becayse the Yankeees choose to spend a lot on other players or set an arbitrary budget doesn’t mean they should have to take a cut. There is still money to be had.
Let’s put it this way. Would you want to take a paycut at your job so they can hire other employees?
That’s all I’m saying. Don’t expect either to take a paycut because unless either shows serious decline in ’10, there’s no reason they should.
I would be fine with Gardner hitting 9th. I was fine with Melky hitting 9th. Obviously you had to trade him for a pitcher like Vazquez.
Honeslty the yanks dont really need any big time bat in left. You dont need an allstar to hit 9th in the lineup. If they could find a good defensive right hand left fielder to platoon with Gardner they are fine. The lineup is the best in baseball. And now by adding Vazquez the rotation is very deep and putting either Hughes/Chamberlain in the bullpen the yanks will have the best bullpen in baseball.
The only thing that kind of confuses me is why did the yankees go through all that to monitor Joba innings in august and september if they were going to put him in the bullpen next year.
Let’s toss this into the discussions for OFers. Alden Gonzales suggests as an option to use Ellsbury as trade bait.
Ellsbury played all the outfield positions when Coco came in to play CF. He could be that L for the Yankees. He and Granderson could cover a lot of ground. And that speed. He stole 70 bases in the tough AL East with all it’s great pitchers. His batting average was 301. I want Ellsbury!
correction: LF instead of L.
New York’s 2009 payroll was $226.2 million for the purpose of the luxury tax. That’s their AAV figure or the figure they use to calculate their budget MLB player salary budget. All CaShman is saying is that they will spend something below that figure. If their AAV is at $200 million now they have somewhere in the neighborhood of $26,199,999.00 to play with. I think they might be able to do something creative with that figure on an annual basis between now and opening day.
I say they are done spending the big bucks (for them) & will go for a right hand bat to play LF….Who is the question
And I’m gonna keep rooting him in.
Is anyone else gonna help me ?
Doreen, I don’t think there’s much of a chance Damon gets signed. I don’t like Gardner, so I want another LF, but I also don’t like the idea of another trade; we’ve already dipped into our farm system quite a bit. I have no idea what Cash has up his sleeve at this point.
Joel Sherman said the yanks payroll budget is under 200 million.
Jermaine Dye could be the answer.
Bill Porter.
The $226 million includes benefits, which are about 10%. So the actual AAV number is more like $207 million.
Sorry, I forgot the parenthesis around (MLB player salary budget).
Pitt-
are you gonna help me row or are you just gonna stand there ?
I thought you wanted Matt.
Do you just want more coal in your sock.
I’m not familiar with Reed Johnson, Phil – can you tell me a bit about him? Thanks!
Ok Pitt so they have $19,199,999.00 to play with based on Ca$h’s statement!
Looks like he’s cut his ties to Yankee fans forever.
========================================================
Never had any. New Englander was Abe.
mick,
if the question is name one of two big right handed hitters who have a big fork sticking out of their backs. we also would have accepted Vlad Guerrerro.
Frank from Chatham NJ
December 22nd, 2009 at 8:02 pm
Pete Abe (Extra Bases at the Globe):
“Doesn’t it seem like there’s still a big move to be made? There are still a lot of prominent free agents available and it’s hard to envision the two AL East bullies sitting it out from now until spring training.”
______________________________
Looks like he’s cut his ties to Yankee fans forever.
——————————————————–
He said 2 AL East bullies, which means he’s also including the Red Sox.
And what’s wrong with calling the Yankees a bully? Same thing at a poker table. When you have the big stack, you use it to push around the smaller stacks. That’s just good poker.
Damon or Dye, may the cheaper come on down.
Talk about having the upper hand.
Nicely played Cash.
Mick-
I thought for sure you wanted Matt to be a Yankee.
Help me root him in.
Gardner will not be the full time left fielder. The only thing he can do is run. Can’t throw, can’t hit. With his speed he should be a proficient bunter, which he is not.
Cashman may not sign a big money left fielder, but will get someone to play LF.
Phil
Vlade days in the field are over.
Betsy,
http://www.baseball-reference......html?redir
He hits lefties well and would platoon with Gardy.
mick,
so are jermaine’s, he’s a trainwreck.
mtu
I did but it looks like they want Crawford more next year.
“And what’s wrong with calling the Yankees a bully? Same thing at a poker table. When you have the big stack, you use it to push around the smaller stacks. That’s just good poker”
————————————————-
still trying to figure out what was wrong with what PeteAbe said. There’s some critical people on this site
Phil-
Let’s not settle for hamburger.
We can get steak.
Rose December 22nd, 2009 at 8:10 pm
Gardner will not be the full time left fielder. The only thing he can do is run. Can’t throw, can’t hit. With his speed he should be a proficient bunter, which he is not.
Cashman may not sign a big money left fielder, but will get someone to play LF
————————————————–
BINGO!!!!!!!Gardner is a high Class AAA player at best
phil
dye played 133 games in rf last season
vinny-b (NJ and Granderson – thank you Cashman!)
December 22nd, 2009 at 8:12 pm
still trying to figure out what was wrong with what PeteAbe said. There’s some critical people on this site
——————————————————-
In case I was unclear with my comment, that’s what I was trying to say. We’re on the same page.
Betsy
I am as befuddled as you.
They are going to sign a LF, and it’s either going to be younger and talented (Holliday) or cheaper and known (Hinske, Damon). They are after quality. Replacement level players, like Brett Gardner (flame me if you wish), are not part of their starting vocabulary.
The Yankees could be done right now, and even with their current replacement level LF win 97-100 games. They are that good.
The way they are now constructed gives them plenty of options at the trade deadline, in 2011, 2012, and beyond.
I suspect that thoughts about the 2011 CBA negotiation are going to enter into this. It could be a very, very ugly strike. Their committed payroll for 2012 could be zero. Could the Mayans have been thinking of MLB when they constructed their calendar?
One thing. This is not over.
Agreed, stop trashing Pete. Without him we wouldn’t be here.
He said many times on here: I’m not a fan, I’m a reporter. He doesn’t root for the Sox now that he works there anymore than he did for the Yanks when he worked here.
move Swish to LF & play Dye in RF
Doreen
December 22nd, 2009 at 7:48 pm
I just re-read my post.. I guess I’ve been attending the GB7 school of posting…
============================================================
Gee, Doreen, your post looked perfect to me.
Mick-
Let me ask you this.
What if Crawford resigns with the Rays ?
How do the Yankees get him ?
They steal him ?
Holliday is here now, and he’s better anyway.
And Crawford would be just as expensive as Matt.
And we can work it out.
And Matt WANTS to be a Yankee.
And he’s a perfect fit.
Forget Crawford.
BJK: yes. I understood. Was not alluding to you
If Johnny wants to play for nothing we would certainly take him back.
Even after Teixeira, the Yanks still cut payroll last year. I don’t expect a big signing because the Yanks would like to be under 200 million just for PR purposes.
Cashman all but said that they were going to sign Mark Derosa on mlb network.
Phil, thanks. He doesn’t look that good – no power #s to speak of. Is he a FA?
mtu
it aint my money
Cashman all but said that they were going to sign Mark Derosa on mlb network.
============================================
I could have sworn he said that about damon
GB, how you are you doing?
The Curious Case of Joba Chamberlain December 22nd, 2009 at 8:18 pm
Cashman all but said that they were going to sign Mark Derosa on mlb network.
————————————
Now that’s what I want to hear……
7789 I agree with you. I too was fine with Melky in LF hitting 9th and now if its Gardner, I’m ok with that too. The team is loaded as is.
Although I suspect Mr. Cashman will have more in store for us.
My preference is go as-is and have the cash & prospects ready for any mid-season trades that may be necessary.
LF is too big for swish
The difference between signing a mediocre outfielder and Holliday will probably be around 10 million dollars for 2010. Is that really a big deal if it makes your team significantly better?
Look at my Knicks…a powerhouse up 15.
mick,
yes and he played them horribly.
“Let’s put it this way. Would you want to take a paycut at your job so they can hire other employees?”
Well, I would not.
But, not attacking you, as I respect your opinion, but that is comparing apples and oranges.
I do not make 20+ milllion a year.
Obviously, talk is cheap, but if I was making 20+ million a year, from the Yankees, I would offer to take a pay cut to help bring in other players.
From the Red Sox, I would demand the highest possible, then perform well enough so people did not suspect, but ultimately tank to hurt the Sox with my performances.
If I am not mistaken, Jeter is top 4 in contracts today.
Pete may have been a journalist in his pieces for the paper, but on this blog his objectivity sometimes took the day off – which is fine.
Mick-
A creative account can keep Matt’s price within the budget.
It’s not a problem.
These guys are sharp as a tack.
That means we can afford him.
So Cash isn’t going wildly over budget.
Matt will pay dividends for years.
Dont you think it would be smart for Cash and Hal to do it ?
They can afford the filet mignon.
If Matt wants to play here, he will have to lower his demands.
This is what Cash is trying to say.
mick December 22nd, 2009 at 8:20 pm
LF is too big for swish
——————————–
and Damon couldn’t play the position either,it was a adventure every time the ball went out there
He was not speaking about DeRosa. He was speaking in veilded terms about Nick Johnson who they have not yet announced or spoken. They’re not interested in DeRosa.
“Cashman all but said that they were going to sign Mark Derosa on mlb network”
——————————————————-
please explain. If you are referencing ‘Hote Stove’ Cashman and Verducci were referring to Nick Johnson
Blake-
Thank you.
Horse into the barn. Now !
MTU
From a pure baseball standpoint, from my limited knowledge as a fan and not a baseball front office pro, Matt Holliday would be my pick. It’s a great fit, and the player would apparently be very happy on the Yankees.
I’d take the heat from MLB and the other owners. Cashman did say “God help the rest of baseball,” and he did mean it. He also did say just this year “they can call us anything, but they also have to call us winners.” If that’s not giving the rest of MLB the finger, I’m not sure what is.
This isn’t a relatively (IMO) dumb signing like Randy Johnson, Carl Pavano, or even Gary Sheffield. I think the Yanks did their due diligence, and Holliday was not in their plans six weeks ago.
The situation on the ground changes. I’m not sure anyone expected Johnny D and Boras (we should call him Borat$) to toe the line they did. That messed up a lot of stuff.
Given this, if you have a chance to be so dominant for the next 3-4 years and essentially the only way you lose is with multiple injuries right before October, in my book if you have the $$$ you go for it.
Just one random fan’s thoughts. If I’m right, it’s a game of chicken, and one of Damon/Holliday signs.
Joel Sherman sure threw cold water on the offs-season, whining about how the new guys probably won’t be able to come through…and specifically raving about Lackey. We can presume that he thinks the Sox are better off and the Yankees worse off.
Pete was a disaster. Chad and Sam bring a professionalism to this place that was lacking.
Daveinmd, even if the Yankees cut payroll to 120 million it wouldn’t do a thing for PR. As they cut they will be mocked for being cheap and greedy owners only looking to pocket the profits.
If the Yankees falter this year and one glaring weakness is LF they will get on the Yankees for not spending the money to upgrade that position when they had the opportunity to do so. If they are doing fantastic, they will be ripped for how “the rich get richer”, as had already been stated on ESPN and MLB networks. This was right after the Granderson trade.
I can’t see the Yanks landing Derosa , unless he takes a paycut. I can see us getting Jermaine Dye. on the cheap
phil
dye had 9 assists and 5 errors last year
Crawford is a stud.I wish the Red Sox went after him next year. He is not going to sign with Tampa. After seeing him playing in person I wouldnt hesitate to give him a 17 or 18 million dollar contract. He deserves every penny.
Mick-
They are already there.
He knows he cant get a pie in the sky contract anymore.
WHERE is he gonna get it !
No team has that kind of money to spend now.
no team.
Not even the Yanks.
Of course his demands will have to go down.
He has no choice.
And we are the BEST team of the takers.
The BEST.
Bar none !
yeah on the 14 balls he actually got to.
Why is NJ’s physical taking so long?
In any case, the guys on MLB said the Yankees were close to getting another LF……..still concerned about making another trade.
If Toronto and NY worked a deal out for Roy Halladay where would the yanks squeeze the budget? Who would be DH, the squirrel from the foul pole across the street?
These 2 guys want to know just as bad as their daddy. (sorry couldn’t resist).
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=taodav&s=6
Why is NJ’s physical taking so long?
hes got a lot of medical records to go through
CR9
December 22nd, 2009 at 8:21 pm
“Let’s put it this way. Would you want to take a paycut at your job so they can hire other employees?”
Well, I would not.
But, not attacking you, as I respect your opinion, but that is comparing apples and oranges.
I do not make 20+ milllion a year.
Obviously, talk is cheap, but if I was making 20+ million a year, from the Yankees, I would offer to take a pay cut to help bring in other players.
From the Red Sox, I would demand the highest possible, then perform well enough so people did not suspect, but ultimately tank to hurt the Sox with my performances.
If I am not mistaken, Jeter is top 4 in contracts today.
——————————————————–
No offense taken, just having a discussion about it.
I don’t make $20 million a year either, but then again, my boss doesn’t make billions either.
It’s all relative. Just to simplify, if my boss made $1000, mostly because of my work, and then wanted to cut my salary from $1 to .90 cents because he decided he only wanted his payroll to be $10 and he wanted to hire another guy, I’d wonder why he just didn’t increase his payroll to $1001.
These guys just operate on another scale than we do. A paycut is a paycut. No one wants one.
If the Yankees were really in dire straits and suffering financially, I would think Jeter and Mo would understand that and help out. But they’re not in dire straits by any means, so if the Yankees want them in a Yankee uniforms in 2011 and beyond, I can’t imagine there will be a discount.
Pittsburg, I agree with you, I think either Damon or Holliday is going to fold and will be in LF for the Yankees. If the Yankees are dead set on a certain payroll and they are getting close to it then it probably will be Damon, if not then they may not be able to pass on a wholesale price Holliday.
Cash is saying the right things.
If he were to give the impression he could break the bank Boras would be all over him like a cheap suit.
There is no rush, the longer they wait the more their value declines.
Blake, I agree…..Pitt, with you, too.
I really don’t give a hoot what ESPN and other mediot outlets say about our spending……and I sure don’t care what other fans say. If Cash and Hal are operating with a budget just so they can prove to the world that the Yanks don’t need to spend a billion $$$, I’d be disappointed.
Re: Jeter: I wonder if they can even hold the line with him at $20M for 3-5 years when he just has to point to A-rod’s deal and say, “And you’re paying him $30M till he’s 42?!”
Yes, I know, different types of ballplayers. But since no one really measures Jeter’s worth against other ballplayers, since he’s in a class by himself – how much do we think they will have to pay for that?
All by way of saying: I don’t see him taking a pay cut as long as A-rod is playing on the same team.
Dye is not the answer. His skills are declining in the field and the second half of this season, he was barely batting .200.
Betsy,
the guys on MLB didn’t understand what Cash was talking about.
Damon’s beef is the years.
If they want Crawford next year, then Johnny knows it’s one and done with us.
Pitt-
If you believe in your own arguments then why wouldn’t someone else ?
They make good sense to me.
I think you should have more faith in them.
We are sort of on the same page with this.
Only I believe in our arguments more strongly than you.
I hope Matt/Cash see it more like I do.
It has a certain inevitability to it.
Study the situation.
Their aren’t more than 2 options for Matt.
Us or Them.
knowing what you already know about Matt.
Which do you think he is gonna choose ?
I made my bet.
All by way of saying: I don’t see him taking a pay cut as long as A-rod is playing on the same team.
=============================================
all the more reason to tow the line on holliday
if there were a choice between Crawford & Holliday …give me Crawford
The Yankees make more money so they can spend more money, its called capitalism and if other owners don’t like it then maybe they should sell a private jet or two and concentrate on winning baseball games. The Yankees have built this tradition over many years of wanting to be the best. Its not their fault that other organizations simply don’t care as much.
Holliday’s Dad, both last year and this year said in no uncertain terms that he wanted his son to be a Yankee. Those comments were never contradicted by Matt or anyone on his behalf.
Holliday knows, or should know, unless he too is consuming gallons of Boras’ Kool-aid that the Cardinals deal is the top of the market, if not beyond, to make Pujols happy. He is waiting until the end to see if the Yankees will be in. “If” Cash is in, my bet is that he will sign for less to wear the “NY”, knowing that the endorsements and other benefits from “New York” will more than make up any shortfall.
Anybody else have the World Series DVD set? They’ve included Game 6 of the ALCS, which is great. I never tire of watching Kazmir throw that ball over the first basemen’s head.
Daveinmd December 22nd, 2009 at 8:24 pm
Pete was a disaster. Chad and Sam bring a professionalism to this place that was lacking.
—
Wanna know what Pete was like?
Pete banned me from this blog for the entire season because during spring training I made a joke about him complaining about having to travel to “away” games in sunny Florida in the middle of the (essentially) winter.
And his constant bashing of A-Rod, on a Yankess blog of all places, was very unprofessional.
Btw, thanks to whoever was responsible for unbanning me after Pete left.
knowing what you already know about Matt.
Which do you think he is gonna choose ?
===========================================
The money.
GB7 -
I had an “exra” glass of wine with dinner. Hence the typos.
Betsy -
I don’ know.
I think Damon’s gonna want to be a part of this team more than he’s going to want an extra year or two or an extra few million dollars.
time will tell, I guess.
(I’ve had to correct multiple types before submitting this comment!)
“if there were a choice between Crawford & Holliday …give me Crawford”
Like Smokey Robinson & the Miracles, I second that emotion.
Betsy-
The Yankees do not settle for Hamburger.
They are a team that can afford
the best steaks.
Joeman, if thats your opinion then thats fine but numbers overwhelmingly favor Holliday and the type of player he is projects much better with age than the type of player Crawford is.
Dye is a horrible fielder. Honestly Granderson is not a better fielder in center than Melky or Gardner. Granderson, Dye and Swisher is a weak fielding outfield.
The lineup is so deep I rather go with better defense in left field (Gardner and Reed Johnson) where there is a lot more ground to cover at the stadium.
# Laura – I just got my World Series DVD set. Woohoo! December 22nd, 2009 at 8:31 pm
Dye is not the answer. the second half of this season, he was barely batting .200.
————————
sounds like Gardner
Vasquez had better get off to a good start or else he will be booed vociferously. Fans will never forgive him for 2004…….Yankee fans are idiots (well, not the ones here, lol)
Wanna know what Pete was like?
Pete banned me from this blog for the entire season because during spring training I made a joke about him complaining about having to travel to “away” games in sunny Florida in the middle of the (essentially) winter.
And his constant bashing of A-Rod, on a Yankess blog of all places, was very unprofessional.
Btw, thanks to whoever was responsible for unbanning me after Pete left
=================================================
I too was banned for calling him on his New England bias.
… and afterall we’re only ordinary men
had to chop that up a little…sorry
December 22nd, 2009 at 8:35 pm
Vasquez had better get off to a good start or else he will be booed vociferously. Fans will never forgive him for 2004…….Yankee fans are idiots (well, not the ones here, lol)
=================================================
Please.
“And his constant bashing of A-Rod, on a Yankess blog of all places, was very unprofessional. ”
The worst part was that he would claim that he was just reporting the news. I would have had more respect for him if he had just admitted that he had a problem with Alex.
Ariel
I really think that’s a big part of it. Xmas may be a part of it as well.
… and afterall we’re only ordinary men
===========================================
Who? Us and them?
Laura – I just got my World Series DVD set. Woohoo!
December 22nd, 2009 at 8:34 pm
Anybody else have the World Series DVD set? They’ve included Game 6 of the ALCS, which is great. I never tire of watching Kazmir throw that ball over the first basemen’s head.
Got it for my Neice the 8 disk one?
how is it?
Holliday > Crawford. It’s another one of life’s little IQ tests.
“Honestly Granderson is not a better fielder in center than Melky or Gardner.”
Granderson doesn’t have Melky’s cannon, but I bet he takes better routes to balls, eliminating the need for a cannon.
and in the end its only round and round and round
Doree, if that were the case, Damon would already have signed. His intransigence in the “negotiations” (if you can call it negotiations) spoke volumes – he wanted to return at his price. He knew where the Yankees stood……..and now I know where he stands, on the outside looking in. It’s over.
Like Smokey Robinson & the Miracles, I second that emotion.
================================================
Smokey’s the best.
A-Rod got the last laugh. Most of the new york media would rip and make jokes about A-Rod. No more can they say he is no longer clutch. And say silly things like the team might be better with cody ransom at third.
“Got it for my Neice the 8 disk one?
how is it?”
Yes, there are 8 discs. It’s awesome! I must have watched the final out 10 times!
I don’t want to spoil it for you, but the Yankees win.
but Dad, its Smokey!
Phil, ok – thanks. I have to watch the replay at 10 pm because I only caught the tail end and totally missed Cash
All this talk about Holliday – is no one interested in Jason Bay? I have no opinion either way, but it seems he would be (a little) cheaper and he’s already proven himself in the Al East. Just wondering…
The founder of this blog (I won’t post his name ever again after I got a weird 3 AM email from him) did an excellent job starting it up.
He was a pro who never let his lifelong love of the Sox (worse than his love of the Pats) get in the way of his being a Yankee beat writer.
However, I agree with everyone that his handling of the ARod/Selina Roberts debacle went beyond the pale.
“Agreed, stop trashing Pete. Without him we wouldn’t be here.
He said many times on here: I’m not a fan, I’m a reporter. He doesn’t root for the Sox now that he works there anymore than he did for the Yanks when he worked here.”
————–
Pete is and has always been a big Red Sox fan.
I felt he did an excellent job with the Yankees blog, with a few kinks here and there.
But make no mistake about it, he’s a Sox fan and I imagine he now has something closer to his dream job. Good for him to get there.
if Gardner hits .275 BA with a .350 OBP and steals 40 bases all will be fine….people are going crazy about a 9th place hitter…If we can’t win with the lineup its not because of the 9th place hitter
Johnny Damon kissing that old broad is worth a 4yr 120 million dollar contract
“All this talk about Holliday – is no one interested in Jason Bay? I have no opinion either way, but it seems he would be (a little) cheaper and he’s already proven himself in the Al East. Just wondering…”
I would consider him for a cheaper, shorter contract but I don’t think he fits into Cash’s plans.
“All this talk about Holliday – is no one interested in Jason Bay? I have no opinion either way, but it seems he would be (a little) cheaper and he’s already proven himself in the Al East. Just wondering…”
He’s proven himself offensively, but isn’t the knock on him that he’s not really good in LF?
Kevin,
Bay seems to take a big hit for being poor defensively. I’m not a huge proponent of defensive statistics IF I am able to watch enough games and see for myself.
I saw a ton of Sox games last year and Bay actually impressed me on defense. Granted, he was helped by the Green Monster but he learned to play it quite well and I give him credit for that.
I’ve met the guy and he was really nice. So that helps.
I wouldn’t be opposed to signing him but there is always an opportunity cost. I’d rather they continued to bolster their pitching staff or saved their bullets for another day.
ariel-
IMO you are missing the point.
If Matt were to sign with the Yanks he does NOT have to take less.
Actually the Yankees will beat the Cards offer if it is their desire to have Matt.
What is really at issue for me is not the money but they way the Yanks need to STRUCTURE matt’s deal so they can meet an accounting target.
However, If Matt and Boras are a little flexible in their approach to such a deal, and understand the Yankees side of it.
There will be no problem finding a deal that will work for both parties.
I think that time for compromise is at hand.
And both Parties need to come to the table and just get it done.
Hammer out the details and work on the fine print.
They can do it.
And I think it is in both parties best interests for them TO do it.
I dont see why they wouldnt be able to work it out it they know they both want each other AND are flexible.
That’s the way I see it and I am stickin to it.
Until it is clear that Matt or the Yanks have gone their own separate ways.
I’ll believe it when I see it.
Betsy -
But situations change. And he’s not signed. And apparently he does NOT have a 4-year offer from anyone else. So, in my mind, if he like the Yankees adn wanted to return in the first place, as thing progress, all hope is not lost (if one was hoping for Damon to return in the first place).
However, if the only place for him to return was really DH and not LF, then, well, I guess that ship has indeed sailed.
And as for Pete A and his attitude toward ARod, I do believe he blogged about his particular experiences with Alex at least once. I accepted his bias and ignored his swipes at ARod, because overall, I enjoyed what he did here. This was (and is) a BLOG. If you don’t bring personal biases in this format, where else?
Hmm, I don’t care that Guillen called out Vasquez about being unable to handle big spots, because he’s nuts……but Stottlemeyer did? How classless……….very surprising from a guy like Mel (this per Ken Davidoff).
Looks like our pen just got better with the Vasquez signing.
Either Phil or Joba back in the pen.
Let’s make Holliiday a Yank and give him 90mil because his dad wants him to be a Yank!
sorry it’ll take more than that.
Damon’s ship has sailed! hallaluejah!
Phil
I really respect your opinions and insight, but, REED JOHNSON!!!!!!!!
please we’d be better off to just give the abs to Gritty,Grimy,Gardy!!!
Repeaters!!!!!
The neat thing is that the Yankees are in a no lose scenario.
They either get a clubhouse and fan favorite for a short term, cheap deal, or a RH beast whose dad has dreamt about his playing for the Yankees since he was a kid.
Now it’s just a matter of getting the right price and years.
Boston Dave, et. al:
I agree – I’m not in favor of paying for either Holliday or Bay. We’re in great shape and Gardner at No. 9 is not that much of a downgrade from the late, lamented Melkman. Save the bullets.
P.S.: I stand correct on Pete, apparently…
Holliday’s dad wants him to be a Yank too.
Doreen,
I have a feeling Damon will be back. Maybe for 2yr/$16M with incentives for $2-4M more.
I just think he really wants to come back… and it doesn’t hurt that the offers aren’t pouring in either.
“If Toronto and NY worked a deal out for Roy Halladay where would the yanks squeeze the budget? Who would be DH, the squirrel from the foul pole across the street?”
It is curious with people constantly doing spread sheet accounting about the budget with such certainty how that would have worked.
Roy is making $16M next year. The yankees would not have moved any significant salary in that deal – i don’t even think the jays would have had any interest in taking on melky.
Vazquez cost the yankees net around $8m given melky’s pending salary increase to around $2.5-3M.
So if the yankees had traded for Halladay he would have cost them 16M + Melky’s salary – 3M.
Let’s assume the Halladay deal would have happened before they signed Johnson.
That’s 19M of salary that would need to be accomadated with holes in LF and DH.
But even with Roy alone they would have been well over $205M and still needing to fill out the DH and the bench.
Yet salary has never been a reason cited for why they didn’t get Halladay.
The Ghost
December 22nd, 2009 at 7:46 pm
Upstate,
according to baseball-reference.com Melky Cabrera was involved in a top 5 play in 2 of the 4 games he played in against Philly. Of course if he traded those two pivotal game changing hits for 4 meaningless hits – in your book – he would have batted .307 and had a “great” series. Nice try, how about getting your head out of that stat book and actually watch a game then maybe you would appreciate the intangibles that a player like Melky adds to a championship team.
———————
You win.
Melky was SO useful.
If-If-If-If…
Oh yeah….I have seen all those inning killing ‘ground balls to the SS with a man on first; the flailing at ball 4 and even ball 5; yup I’ve seen the swinging strike 3’s that the catcher had to jump for…..yes, I do watch the games (really nice TV, too)….and that is exactly why he “is what he is”….a 4th or 5th outfielder that was covered up by the rest of the line-up. The Atlanta outfield will love him; but here he was a cute and lovable (?) albatross.
We wish you and him well in Atlanta (they are on TBS and I probably will now not get to watch his ‘wonderful play’ anymore.)
Keep us posted.
Now, we’re set for a real outfielder !!!
Fill-in-the-blank:_____________. (you’re much smarter than we are)
*response
champ,
that’s not my idea. That’s who they are considering.
No offense taken, just having a discussion about it.
I don’t make $20 million a year either, but then again, my boss doesn’t make billions either.
It’s all relative. Just to simplify, if my boss made $1000, mostly because of my work, and then wanted to cut my salary from $1 to .90 cents because he decided he only wanted his payroll to be $10 and he wanted to hire another guy, I’d wonder why he just didn’t increase his payroll to $1001.
These guys just operate on another scale than we do. A paycut is a paycut. No one wants one.
If the Yankees were really in dire straits and suffering financially, I would think Jeter and Mo would understand that and help out. But they’re not in dire straits by any means, so if the Yankees want them in a Yankee uniforms in 2011 and beyond, I can’t imagine there will be a discount.
__
Yes, it is all relative.
But when you put it like that, that because the Yankees rake in billions, that Jeter or Mo would demand top dollar for their services, you make them seem petty. I might be wrong, but I believe those 2 guys are willing to help the Yankees in any way.
Yes, the Yankees make billions, but they can only spend around a certain amount. If cutting their pay helps bring in better surrounding talent, then I’d think they would be all for it.
Also, look at it this way. Where else are Mo and Jeter going to go. The Yankees have the upper hand with those 2 players. They are not going to leave us. That does not mean that they cant go anywhere else. It is meant that they almost certainly want to remain Yankees for their careers.
My final point is in regards to your original question, of whether or not I would take a pay cut in my job.
I have rethought it and it goes like this….
I am an accountant, was recently unemployed by choice, but not any longer (money is no object to me, NY and Yankees championships are).
If my boss came to me, and said they wanted to bring in someone else at more pay, asked me to take a pay cut to bring in that someone else, and the purpose of that other accountant was to reduce the workload on me, reduce the stress, and help bring in larger and wealthier clients, I’d be all for it.
In the end, the firm would become larger, make more money, and I would benefit from it in the long run.
In the Yankees scenario, bringing in better surrounding talent would be better in the long run for Jeter, as his ultimate goal is not money, but championships.
While championships can not be guaranteed, they would be more likely with more superstar players surrounding Jeter.
Will Buck and McCarver refer to Nick Johnson as a Big Free agent signing.
How does this sound? “the Yanks spent 5.7 million in the off season”
The only skill that Holliday is better at than Crawford is hitting homers…
as Jeter says,”baseball is about more than just hitting homers.
i’d take Crawford over Holliday anyday personally.
To add on, though:
http://www.newsday.com/sports/.....-1.1667358
As for that 2004? He was hurting in the second half, for the first time in his career. Surely, as a consequence of that pain/discomfort and the results, his confidence took a hit. I just spoke with Mel Stottlemyre, the Yankees’ pitching coach that season, who said, “I think it really hurt him that he wasn’t able to put together the second half that he would’ve liked to. His confidence did go downhill. ”
I asked him about Ozzie Guillen’s comments from just two years ago. Vazquez, saying, “I’m not part of the White Sox anymore,” added, “I’ll hopefully be part of another postseason. I’m glad I’m getting the opportunity (with the Yankees) again.”
This whole “not a big-game pitcher” thing fascinates me, so I called Don Cooper, the White Sox’s pitching coach, who worked with Vazquez from 2006 through 2008. Said Cooper, who stressed the respect he has for his boss Guillen: “If you pitch for (13) years, there’s got to be some big games along the line. Or good matchups against some big teams.”
Why are so many on the Holliday trip?
The Yankees are a playoff team as currently constructed.
And while yhey will look to improve their position in LF, It doesn’t have to be the best/most expensive guy available every time.
And it’s not the same situation as Teixiera was last Dec.
Tex was about to sign with the Sox. Cash swept in and rescued him.
Holliday’s going to the Cards. We don’t care what the Cards do.
And Matt is gonna want to make his Father happy.
And he’ll make him proud by htiin lot’s of homers while his pop watches him do it.
from the stands.
And he’ll make himself happy too.
PittsburghYankeeFan December 22nd, 2009 at 8:46 pm
The neat thing is that the Yankees are in a no lose scenario.
They either get a clubhouse and fan favorite for a short term, cheap deal, or a RH beast whose dad has dreamt about his playing for the Yankees since he was a kid.
Now it’s just a matter of getting the right price and years.
=======================================================
I just wonder if it’s feasible for Cash.
Or is he using this leverage to wait them out.
Is it even possible to squeeze another 15-20 mill for even one year.
We know the offer to Damon is below 10.
I wonder if that still stands.
According to what he said tonight, it doesn’t.
RE:
RMEL
December 22nd, 2009 at 8:40 pm
if Gardner hits .275 BA with a .350 OBP and steals 40 bases all will be fine….people are going crazy about a 9th place hitter…If we can’t win with the lineup its not because of the 9th place hitter
—————————————————-
With that kind of production he can score over 100 runs with the top of the lineup behind him. Why take on albatross contract. It fits in with Cashman’s plan of “Younger & More Athletic”
Upstate-
What did Melky Cabrera ever to to you personally?
You seem to have a real problem with him.
Cabrera is a solid ballplayer. Not a superstar, and not irreplaceable, but solid.
Jermaine Dye’s UZR is fugly.
LF @NYS & Jermaine simply do not mix.
Bay also would be a disaster out there.
It’s someone who’s currently not on the 40-man, that’s for sure…
Phil,
Well, Damon or a Gardner/Reed Johnson Platoon is better than DeRosa, Nady, Dye, or Byrd.
(or Melky too, for that matter)
“i’d take Crawford over Holliday anyday personally.”
I would too. We play TB a lot and I can’t tell you how many times I’ve seen Crawford make a play in the field, steal a base or get a hit and hear myself say “Man, I’d love it if he played for us”. Next year, I could get my wish.
And Kazmir just threw the ball over Kendrick’s head. It never gets old!!!
“The only skill that Holliday is better at than Crawford is hitting homers…”
and average, and OBP, and RBI’s, and OPS, and doubles, and runs, and pretty much everything but steals.
Disappointing that Hal is gonna close the purse strings for Holliday.
Signing an aging Crawford to a big deal next winter is a George-type move.
Reed Johnson is not an upgrade from Gardner..sorry
The only young guy out there that wouldn’t be too pricey is Jonny Gomes.
BD, totally disagree. There is no reason on earth for the Yankees to up their offer of $7 million a year to $8 million, nevermind with additional incentives. I don’t want to see him out in LF ever again…..
UpState-
Thank you.
Help mew convince people that Matt has every reason to want to be a Yankee and not a Cardinal.
I am not going to knock the Cardinals they are a great
Franchise with a storied history of their own.
But Matt wants to be a Yankee, and his Dad would Love for him to be a Yankee.
He didn’t grow up dreamin about Stan the Man.
He grew up dreaming about Mickey Mantle, and people like that.
My belief until it can’t be anymore is uneuivocally Matt should be and can be a Yankee.
And I sincerely hope he becomes one.
Because I think it’s in all of their best interest.
That’s my story and I’m stickin to it.
If you want to join me in my conviction I welcome the support.
Doesn’t make a bit of difference what Holliday’s father wants. It matters what Matt wants and frankly, the Yankees are not going to get involved in him anyway, so it’s moot.
Gomes might out-slug him, but Gardner would still score more runs.
CB:
“Yet salary has never been a reason cited for why they didn’t get Halladay.”
You’re on to something. Does that mean that there was a separate budget if Doc was included this year than with out him? Doesn’t make a bit of sense.
Brian’s still playing the game, he himself is not convinced that Holliday is out.
I have a couple good sources, either they got sick of me being nosey today, or something is going down because all of my sources are MIA.
“Signing an aging Crawford to a big deal next winter is a George-type move.”
An aging Crawford? So Holliday isn’t aging? He’s baseball’s version of Dorian Gray. LOL!
Actually, I know what you mean; I’m just being obnoxious because that’s what I do best. I don’t know if playing on turf is making Crawford age quicker than most players. I still think he’s worth the investment.
I just know that I hate the idea of Gardner out there…..
Heard in Tampa:
George: Wait, we just signed Javy Vasquez? Didn’t I tell you to trade him for Randy Johnson? Damon–get him. He just hit that homer to win game 7. What? He turned down our offer? Why? Nick Johnson? Didn’t we trade him to get Vasquez this year? What is going on with you people? I get sick for a few days, and nobody can do a darn thing!
Hal: Dad, it’s 2009, not 2004.
If you want to join me in my conviction I welcome the support.
=========================================================
How do you know what makes Holliday tick?
Didn’t Andy leave here once before.
It is about the money and years.
And I think you know it.
With that kind of production he can score over 100 runs with the top of the lineup behind him. Why take on albatross contract. It fits in with Cashman’s plan of “Younger & More Athletic”
—-
Why are people going crazy on here worry who is in LF and batting 9th…come on…i would want Cash to hold money and chips in case he had to make a dead line move
Bronx-
I dont think so.
You do.
For Matt’s sake as well as ours I hope I am right and you are wrong.
We’ll see who turns out to be correct.
Agree to disagree.
The only reason the Yankees should sign Jonny Gomes is for use during those rare bench clearing brawls. The guy is a thug and doesn’t belong in pinstripes.
interesting analysis from Keith Law re: HR Javy’s difficulties & expectations:
“The main knock against him has been his difficulty when pitching in tight spots, as he’s less effective by about 100 points of opponents’ OPS out of the stretch. Still, he’s so good out of the windup and good enough from the stretch that he can be one of the most valuable pitchers in his league in most years.”
Lost in Holliday-in
don’t blow your cover – the walls have ears
I don’t believe a word Cashman said on the MLB channel. He’s working on something else and it isn’t crossing the T’s and dotting the I’s with Nick Johnson.
“BD, totally disagree. There is no reason on earth for the Yankees to up their offer of $7 million a year to $8 million”
————-
sure there is. they don’t have Melky anymore. they need a LF and Damon is coming off a fantastic season.
I think they’re going to trade Mitre or Gaudin to free up some cash in the budget and sign Damon.
I realize this is my wild, unqualified opinion… but I can see it happening.
I’m not suggesting this is you Betsy, but I don’t really understand some of the anti-Damon posts on here.
He was fantastic for the Yanks and if they can get him at a relative bargain while they have a hole in LF, DO IT!
Does anyone have a link to Holliday’s father wants him to be a Yankee?
I’ve read this countless times on this blog, but have not heard or read it anywhere else.
mick December 22nd, 2009 at 8:35 pm
Wanna know what Pete was like?
Pete banned me from this blog for the entire season because during spring training I made a joke about him complaining about having to travel to “away” games in sunny Florida in the middle of the (essentially) winter.
And his constant bashing of A-Rod, on a Yankess blog of all places, was very unprofessional.
Btw, thanks to whoever was responsible for unbanning me after Pete left
=================================================
I too was banned for calling him on his New England bias.
I sent him a picture from a spring training game in Ft Myers. A fellow Yankee Giant fan had a T shirt that said 18-0 and then one Giant Loss. He got really Po’ed about it. It was alright for him the Pat lover to bash the Giants as the JV’s, but he clearly couldn’t take any heat for his comments. Lucky I didn’t get banned also.
By the way, the Yankees need to stay away from Dye. He’s about finished as a ML outfielder.
Does anyone have a link to Holliday’s father wants him to be a Yankee?
I’ve read this countless times on this blog, but have not heard or read it anywhere else.
I’d like to see it too.
Mick-
I am going by what I hope I know which is in the public record about his preferences.
I dont know aht makes him tick.
But I think i know his preferences. And i think they matter in this case.
That’s all mick.
Boston Dave
For some reason,I think enough time has passed for Damon to finally be the cost-effective final piece of the puzzle.
“Does anyone have a link to Holliday’s father wants him to be a Yankee? I’ve read this countless times on this blog, but have not heard or read it anywhere else.”
Neither have I. It could be one of those urban myths.
And Kazmir throws the ball over Kendrick’s head again. Ah, the magic of DVD.
CR9,
http://riveraveblues.com/2008/.....ipes-5782/
He was fantastic for the Yanks and if they can get him at a relative bargain while they have a hole in LF, DO IT!
========================================================
Damon is probably being offered 1 year with an option.
He wants 2 years.
This could be part of the problem.
The conversation here is rotating in the same tight circle for the last 48 hours. I have the Holliday arguments down, as well as the DeRosa hypotheses. Yup, got the Bay Bid and the Damon Dark horse. Vazquez? Cashman is an idiot. No, wait. Cashman is a genius. For cryin’ out loud, move on to something else already. I’m so fed up with all the repetitive posts…
If it doesn’t stop soon, I’m going to start talking politics. You’ve been warned
Doreen,
I agree.
I think Damon never dreamed of playing for any other team. He just wanted to get as much money as he could from the Yankees (as pretty much any other player would have done).
He just didn’t anticipate the Yankees moving on so quickly.
I think they’ll find common ground and Damon will be back and as you said, on a more cost effective deal.
“Lost in Holliday-in
don’t blow your cover – the walls have ears”
I am well aware of that. You’d be surprised who posts on this blog.
Doreen
December 22nd, 2009 at 8:34 pm
GB7 -
I had an “exra” glass of wine with dinner. Hence the typos.
————————————————————
I understand, Doreen. I’ve often used that excuse. Not sure anybody believed me, though. I suppose they thought I was an idiot that couldn’t spell or a drunk. Little do they know that I’m both.
If Rishi is around, care to post the entire Law segment? ESPN is a joke – making people pay for 99% of the content.
mick,
that’s def possible.
the Yanks would have most of the leverage in any hypothetical Damon negotiations right now.
Boras might not advocate it but if Damon wants to be a Yankee, it’s ultimately his decision.
Mick-
And on money I think we can not only match it but exceed it.
It’s just how we structure it.
And the Cards have offered a number of option years.
So what ?
They are only options not guaranteed money right.
So big deal.
We can beat them Mick.
That’s my belief.
Just gonna take a willingness to be flexible and sit down and hammer out the terms.
No problem. It can be done.
crawdaddy December 22nd, 2009 at 9:02 pm
I don’t believe a word Cashman said on the MLB channel. He’s working on something else and it isn’t crossing the T’s and dotting the I’s with Nick Johnson.
GM’s love to throw disinformation all over the place. I suspect there are serious calls being made so don’t believe Brian. It boils down to how bad does Holliday want to come to NY and will they pay him the money he wants. You have to wonder where all these guys are going to bat? You might have to have a starter getting a day off every other day so that everyone stays fairly happy.
murphydog -
Tis true enough, what you say.
But what else is there to “talk” about??????
Thank you Boston Dave.
murphydog December 22nd, 2009 at 9:07 pm
The conversation here is rotating in the same tight circle for the last 48 hours. I have the Holliday arguments down, as well as the DeRosa hypotheses. Yup, got the Bay Bid and the Damon Dark horse. Vazquez? Cashman is an idiot. No, wait. Cashman is a genius. For cryin’ out loud, move on to something else already. I’m so fed up with all the repetitive posts…
==========================================================
murph,
how is your dog doing, fine I hope…
how’s that for changing the subject?
sorry but we have a LF problem that has to be solved.
“If someone would have called me today and said Matt had gotten traded to the Yankees, I’d have been hunting for a place to celebrate.” RAB
We’re assuming he worshipped Mantle and maybe even Murcer because he’s from Oklahoma – not hard to fathom
but that translating to Matt wanting to come here….is tenuous
GB7 -
Well, my mom is visiting or Xmas and staying here. That’s my “excuse”
BD, I love Damon………but the Yankees placed a value on Damon and backing away (no, caving) would be a terrible sign. If he wants to come back, let him come crawling. I don’t feel badly for him for being in a situation where no teams are bidding for his services. He was in a perfect position with the Yankees and instead of telling Boras he wanted to work something out, he (and Boras) told the Yanks to get lost if they didn’t offer $13 million for each of 2 years. Yeah, I resent that. Again, I love how the Yankees are no longer going to doormats for FA – their own and others.
“You’re on to something. Does that mean that there was a separate budget if Doc was included this year than with out him? Doesn’t make a bit of sense.”
Hal has always maintained that for certain, special players they would break the “budget” so there’s always that and I am sure Halladay would have fallen into that category (man is he something else… can’t imagine what he’s going to do to the NL).
The yankees would have been at 199M or so with Melky in LF and with no DH and the bench still to assemble.
I personally don’t believe they would have gone into the season with Melky in LF and a weak hitting DH.
They would have been well over 205M with Roy. Probably around $208M or so.
I think it’s always been the same question – how “special” do they think Holliday is?
We may have found out today. At the same time I do think this budget issues is getting blown grossly out of proportion.
People are making it sound as if the budget is being constrained at some level due to cash flow issues.
I think Sam, Chad, and Josh have been doing a great job with the reporting on this blog. It’s clear that the Journal decided to take this thing to a new level after Pete left. There are more features and more information coming than ever before.
I also have been appreciative of the unbiased reporting that is going on. There was clear snarkiness going on regarding Arod in the beginning of the season, and it made me leave at times. But let’s not forget that many reporters were running wild with the Arod bashing back then. Let’s not forget this gem by our own Sam Borden:
http://www.lohud.com/article/2.....true-phony
We may be able to shed light on the Holliday dad liking the Yankee myth:
When asked by Tyler Kepner in 2008 why he wanted his son traded to the Yankees:
“We wanted him to come to the East Coast so we could get some sleep at night,” he said. “It’s just a different channel on the package for me.””
Not sure this is a lifelong dream, but more investigation is needed.
Doreen
December 22nd, 2009 at 8:52 pm
Upstate-
What did Melky Cabrera ever to to you personally?
You seem to have a real problem with him.
Cabrera is a solid ballplayer. Not a superstar, and not irreplaceable, but solid.
================================
That was a real question ?
Not any more – Bags sent to stinking Atlanta.
Not a solid player.
Certainly nor a superstar.
Very easily replaced.
Never was solid.
Marginal at best.
“Lost in Holliday-in
“don’t blow your cover – the walls have ears”
I am well aware of that. You’d be surprised who posts on this blog. ”
interesting.
“Again, I love how the Yankees are no longer going to doormats for FA – their own and others.”
————
Betsy, I agree with this 100%.
But I respect a guy (if this is the case with Damon) who wants to be a Yankee.
Every player is going to try to get as much $$ as possible. That’s how negotiations work, especially in MLB.
You can’t blame Damon for doing what every other player does, try to get as much as he can.
But I do believe Johnny loves the Yankees, and I respect that.
“I had an “exra” glass of wine with dinner. Hence the typos.”
It all depends on the size of that “exra” glass. Too big a glass and you may be asked to participate in the “Horizontal Gaze Nystagmus” or “Standard Field Sobriety” Tests on your way home by a nice gentleman in a crisp uniform.
“We wanted him to come to the East Coast so we could get some sleep at night,” he said. “It’s just a different channel on the package for me.””
Not sure this is a lifelong dream, but more investigation is needed.
nice one.
BD, I think the Yankees knew very well while they were working on Damon/NJ that there was a good chance that they were going to trade Melky for Vasquez. That’s why Cash didn’t want Dunn included in the Granderson deal. If the Yankees knew this (I think they did), then they knew very well that signing NJ instead of Damon would leave them without a LF. We’ve seen absolutely no indication that they are interested in revisiting Damon as a LF. If he crawls back, maybe……but he wont’t.
I think it would be a major step backwards for Cash if he caved and went back to Damon.
Lost
I think that’s kind of cool.
““If someone would have called me today and said Matt had gotten traded to the Yankees, I’d have been hunting for a place to celebrate.” RAB
We’re assuming he worshipped Mantle and maybe even Murcer because he’s from Oklahoma – not hard to fathom
but that translating to Matt wanting to come here….is tenuous”
Believe it or not Tom, Josh and Matt are very very close. Also, Jackson (Matt’s oldest son) is the next to be drafted by the MLB.. he may be young, but if you saw the swings he’s taken at the TV set, the dents alone would be enough evidence that he is going to supersede his fathers power.
If Damon comes back it’s going to be on a deal that is worse for him than the 2yrs/14M he turned down.
Uncle-
we know that his Dad wants him to be Yankee.
It is somewhere in the public record.
Is it tenuous to think that all else equal or better he might want to take that into consideration ?
Especially when its likely the apple didn’t fall far from the tree.
It that a WILD speculation, or is it reasonable ?
Even in his down years, Javier Vazquez has been a pretty good pitcher, giving around 200 innings of league-average performance to his employers. But twice in the past three years he’s been significantly better than that. The Yankees will hope the trend continues.
Vazquez is durable and consistently misses bats — he finished fourth in the American League in strikeouts in 2006, 2007 and 2008 while with the White Sox, then second in the National League in 2009 — working with a true four-pitch mix and plus control. The main knock against him has been his difficulty when pitching in tight spots, as he’s less effective by about 100 points of opponents’ OPS out of the stretch. Still, he’s so good out of the windup and good enough from the stretch that he can be one of the most valuable pitchers in his league in most years.
For the Yankees, Vazquez provides more bulk innings to a rotation that worked its front three starters very hard in 2009 (including short-rest work in the postseason), allowing the team to shave a few pitches off their starts in 2009 because manager Joe Girardi doesn’t have to be prepared for a three-inning outing every time the rotation’s fourth spot comes up.
The key player in this trade for Atlanta is Arodys Vizcaino, who becomes one of the top five prospects in the Braves’ system and gives them a trio of potential No. 1 or No. 2 starters in the low minors with Julio Teheran and Randall Delgado. Vizcaino, who pitched at short-season Staten Island this past season, has a live fastball that sits 91-93 mph and touches a little higher. He throws a curveball that flashes plus and should miss bats at the big league level when he reaches it. He already has good feel for pitching and just needs experience and a little cleanup in his delivery, as he often finds his arm slot drifting down, at which point he starts to sling the ball instead of just throwing it.
The Braves also get a few years of control of Melky Cabrera, a capable fourth outfielder who can play an average center field and has a plus arm. I don’t think Cabrera has the offensive skills to play every day in a corner-outfield spot, particularly because of his willingness to expand the zone and chase pitches that most hitters wouldn’t consider. Atlanta could use him as a platoonmate for Matt Diaz, a right-handed hitter who has a 200-point career platoon split, or as a backup at all three outfield spots, playing him behind Diaz, Nate McLouth and — assuming he makes the club — Jason Heyward, the top prospect in baseball.
Cabrera was a Super Two (eligible for arbitration with less than three years of service) this past offseason and should earn between $2.5 million and $3 million this offseason in arbitration, which is fairly pricey for a fourth outfielder. The third piece going to the Braves, Mike Dunn, is a converted outfielder with arm strength — he hit 94 repeatedly when I saw him in the Arizona Fall League — but he has 40 command at best on the 20-80 scale. He also has an inconsistent slider with some late break but that he has trouble finishing. It’s possible he’ll improve his command and/or control with more experience, but after nearly 400 pro innings, he’s still below-average in both departments.
Atlanta’s need to make this deal dates back a full year to the signing of Kenshin Kawakami, to whom the team owes more than $13 million in the next two years. The Braves signed Kawakami despite having Tommy Hanson knocking on the door of the majors last winter and Tim Hudson returning from injury — a situation perfect for a one-year stopgap but one that made signing Kawakami (along with Derek Lowe) superfluous. Kawakami is untradable given his contract, and to clear a roster spot and payroll, they had to move their best starter from 2009. It’s a salary dump, and one in which Atlanta is lucky to get a young pitcher as good as Vizcaino, who is among the top 100 prospects in the game.
For the Yankees, adding Vazquez means either Joba Chamberlain or Phil Hughes will start the season in the bullpen. It probably also signals that the Yankees feel one of them belongs there, most likely Hughes at this point. If the organization believed that both pitchers eventually would work out as starters in the majors, it would be more willing to give both rotation spots and back them up with a lesser option than Vazquez, who was, as you might have heard, the second-best pitcher in the National League this past season.
At this point, the Yankees have a rotation close to that of the Red Sox, and they could very well enter 2010 a better team on paper than they were at the same time before 2009.
People always say that Damon chose the money when he bolted Boston for New York.
That was another misconception put forth by ESPN and others.
IIRC, Damon was only offered 3 years from the Red Sox.
If that is correct, then all he did was choose the extra year’s security.
BD, of course not…….but telling the Yankees to get lost unless they offered exactly what he wanted is a ludicrous negotiating tactic. IMO, it’s not even negotiating – it’s trying to bully. Bill Madden (who I don’t like at all) had it exactly right. Damon wanted $$ more than he wanted the perks, the comforts, the chance to defend his title. I am always a players person -I have no problem with them trying to get whatever they can. I just have a serious issue with how he went about it.
murphydog -
Fortunately I am not driving. Cooking, but not driving. My “exra” glass(es) of wine usually come at the home table.
This ones on Hal. Cash has done his job and played this off season perfectly. To not make him look like a liar Hal should swoop in and order Cash to sign Holliday if the price is right.
Then it’s on Holliday to give the Yanks a little discount to make his dad happy. What a story that would be and he would get the benefit of a slow start from the fans.
Another Oklahoma boy making good in the bronx.
Everyone happy and a Happy Holliday to all.
If Holliday negotiations are ongoing, Johnny must sit and wait.
He is the 2nd option.
If Holliday doesn’t work out, and it could take time, Johnny will probably still be waiting Yankee cap in hand, for the phone call.
Johnny, come on down, it’s one year at 8 mill, take it or leave it.
mick:
I know you meant well to change the subject to the dog, but unfortunately I had to put the dog down a few weeks ago. A real shame, but she had a good run and was a real sweetheart.
I think it is pretty much of a given that Cashman will add another outfielder. But the thing is to what degree? Will he add a high end like a Holliday or middle end like a Derosa or a lower end like (Reed Johnson to platoon with Gardner).
I think he will try to get Derosa. Derosa can also backup the infield and allow A-Rod or Jeter to get some days off you can then put Gardner in left. He can also play right and give Swish a day. Derosa has a lot of flexibility that is what Girardi likes. And Gardner will get a decent amount of playing time too because Derosa can move all over. That seems like the most logical signing.
Another Oklahoma boy making good in the bronx.
———————————————–
YankeeRay
How about giving Matt #6, Mick’s original #?
Doreen
December 22nd, 2009 at 9:10 pm
GB7 -
Well, my mom is visiting or Xmas and staying here. That’s my “excuse”
————————————————————
You stick to that excuse, Direen. It’s more genteel and lady-like. Old soldiers are expected to be drunks. That’s why we get the high pensions…so we can afford it.
“I think it would be a major step backwards for Cash if he caved and went back to Damon.”
Betsy,
That’s where you’re wrong if Damon comes back. Cashman won’t be going back to Damon, it will be Damon/Boras caving and going back to Cashman. Remember, which party is in the power position.
CB:
“I think it’s always been the same question – how “special” do they think Holliday is?”
There is doubt that everybody thinks he is special, but 7/130 thereabouts, isn’t happening. Granted, so far offers have been extremely low, which is probably why Boras is hitting so high still. He wants the 9 digits.. no question about it.
Yo ho ho (love that name!), thank you!! I detest Law, but it looked like it was going to be a positive analysis, so I had to see it.
Betsy,
I realize Damon is responsible for Boras because he chose him as his agent, but by now, everyone knows that this is Boras’ MO.
The Yanks have dealt with Boras before and I’m sure they knew what was going on.
I don’t blame the Yankees one bit for moving on, but I also don’t blame Damon for trying to get as much $$ as he could from the Yankees.
Perhaps my 2/$16M estimation was a little high, but I still think Damon really wants to come back and I think 2/$14 is well worth it.
CB -
You think DAmon woudl ahve to take that bad deal?
yo ho ho -
I heard that Melky would play left field for the Braves. (courtesy of XM radio)
Betsy -
I like the Yankees new hardline with FAs too.
They just showed Nick Johnson at Knicks game on MSG
I know you meant well to change the subject to the dog, but unfortunately I had to put the dog down a few weeks ago. A real shame, but she had a good run and was a real sweetheart.
===================================================
I am so sorry about your dog, I know the feeling all too well.
RIP.
Craw, that’s what I’m saying…..If Damon comes back and takes the same or a lesser offer, then fine. However, BD and others were suggesting the Yankees and Damon just split the difference and agree at some agreed upon amount. I think doing so would be caving. At this time, it should be on Cash’s terms or not at all.
Also, I do not want Damon for two years. One? I don’t even know about that – he’s awful in LF, just torture to watch.
Doreen:
“Fortunately I am not driving. Cooking, but not driving. My “exra” glass(es) of wine usually come at the home table.”
I actually do some cooking at my house. I find that a nice glass of wine – or two – helps start the “creative juices” as I stand before the cutting board, Ginsu in hand.
Lost-in
MTU
sure its a factor
UpState December 22nd, 2009 at 9:13 pm
Doreen
December 22nd, 2009 at 8:52 pm
Upstate-
What did Melky Cabrera ever to to you personally?
You seem to have a real problem with him.
Cabrera is a solid ballplayer. Not a superstar, and not irreplaceable, but solid.
================================
That was a real question ?
Not any more – Bags sent to stinking Atlanta.
Not a solid player.
Certainly nor a superstar.
Very easily replaced.
Never was solid.
Marginal at best.
Lots of potential, but his inability to learn the strikezone and swing at good pitches was his downfall. I liked Melky, but it became apparent that it’s just him and I don’t think he will get beyond it. It became easy for pitchers to get him out and he didn’t do anything to protect the guys hitting in front of him.
“They just showed Nick Johnson at Knicks game on MSG”
So he had his physical today and they’ll probably announced his signing tomorrow then.
“I am so sorry about your dog, I know the feeling all too well. RIP.”
Thanks, mick. Much appreciated. Better to have loved and lost.
Javy and Nick…the Reunion tour.
Holliday dad link http://zellspinstripeblog.com/.....big-apple/
“So he had his physical today and they’ll probably announced his signing tomorrow then.”
Or he failed his physical and he decided to take in a Knick game to make himself feel better.
“Craw, that’s what I’m saying…..If Damon comes back and takes the same or a lesser offer, then fine. However, BD and others were suggesting the Yankees and Damon just split the difference and agree at some agreed upon amount. I think doing so would be caving. At this time, it should be on Cash’s terms or not at all.
Also, I do not want Damon for two years. One? I don’t even know about that – he’s awful in LF, just torture to watch.”
Betsy,
I don’t think Damon is coming back, but if he does, he won’t receive a two year contract. At best it would be one year with an option for a second year. Furthermore, I think the contract will have incentives in it too so that the base salary is less than 7M.
Zach, cool……NJ wanted to come back to NY and JV is very happy to be back. Isn’t that nice that we have players WANTING to come back?
BD, we’ll see……if Damon re-signed, I wouldn’t be unhappy (and he’s a great guy). His OF play would seriously concern me though – and we’re going to need a LF after his tenure. It screams Holliday because I don’t want to trade ANY more minor leaguers – our ML depth is now depleted to a good degree. The problem with Holliday is he’d be yet another long -term, bulky contract.
Gary -
I read today, actually, that Melky initially had a pretty good feel for the strike zone.
i have a feeling that the power surge he had in (was it 2007?) the beginning of a season a couple of years ago got him HR happy and messed with that quite a bit.
Plus, he usually hovered around a .300 BA for 3/4 of a season and then puttered out. Couldn’t sustain it.
I’d love to see him put it all together, and I wish it was for the Yankees. But, we’ll see how he does going forward. He’s still a youong guy. I love his enthusiasm and was very impressed by his intensity in 2009.
murphydog-
Gotta watch those knives!!!
mick
December 22nd, 2009 at 9:19 pm
Another Oklahoma boy making good in the bronx.
———————————————–
YankeeRay
How about giving Matt #6, Mick’s original #?
——–
Present this option to his dad and that would probably knock 2mm per year off the deal
GB7 – Hey, how have you been? I can’t get the blog at work, like I used to, so I’ve been catching up, after dinner.
Hope your recovery is going well.
the upgrade of Damon’s bat over the guys being discussed – Gardner, jonny Gomes, jermaine dye, etc would more than make up for the difference he’d make in LF defensively.
if the budget is $7M or less, Damon is the way to go, IMO.
He’s a good fit for NYS, a good fit in the clubhouse, a professional Yankee-style hitter (gives you good AB’s) and he loves the Yankees.
I can see where Johnny would be hurt, getting a paycut.
The Yanks are playing hardball as did the RS, with the aging LF.
“He wants the 9 digits.. no question about it.”
I think this is the minimum criteria for “success” for Scot. He gets the deal to 9 digits and he can spin it as a success.
If he can get $100M+ it will be disappointing but not an “embarrassment” for Boras.
If he can’t get $100M this could easily be seen as one of the “worst” client deals boras has ever done.
Teams would be signing a perennial all star to an undervalued contract. Hard to believe that could happen to one of Scot’s elite guys but it’s happening.
Cosmetics aside, I can’t imagine Holliday is pleased.
And as an aside – given that the deal will be worth much less than anticipated the opportunities for endorsements in NY might be more attractive than they otherwise might be.
This is a really strange situation. Barry Zito got $126M. Soriano $136M. Carlos Lee $100M.
Last year Ollie Perez got $37M and Derek Lowe got $60M.
It’s remarkable that Holliday may get only 13% over the AAV that Derek Lowe signed for in an equally bad economy a year ago.
I truly can’t believe Boston or the Mets aren’t trying to sign this guy. What a mistake those two clubs are making.
Boston Dave,
I agree, if the budget is flexible enough for Holliday then I’d go that route but if not Damon is the best second option. I’d much rather have him back than anyone else.
Betsy,
his D is a real concern.
at this point though, I’m looking at the alternatives and there aren’t many great ones. Holliday is out of the budget and rightfully so.
If you agree they need a free agent LF on a short term deal, you could do far worse than Damon.
Craw, could be……I’d be ok with that, but it doesn’t help as far as how we proceed with LF in the future. I don’t want Crawford…..
Yankee Ray
That link is just quotes the 2008 Kepner article which says his dad would love the Yankees since MLB Home Plate on cable games would be on in EST at the end of the article.
Present this option to his dad and that would probably knock 2mm per year off the deal
=====================================================
Get me his #.
It will be a honor to watch Nick Johnson hit. Him and his 400 plus obp is getting me excited!!!
I really hope the yanks hold a press conference for him.
# Betsy – high on pie December 22nd, 2009 at 9:29 pm
Craw, could be……I’d be ok with that, but it doesn’t help as far as how we proceed with LF in the future. I don’t want Crawford…..
======================================================
Now you are starting to sound like Jerome.
CB,
very interesting take on that.
For the thousandth time.
I shout it from the rooftop.
There does not need to be a discount relative to the only other offer out there.
And the market will not bear what Boras originally was thinking.
It is not possible for him to get Matt 180 mIll or whatever from ANY team.
There is NO such team.
No team has that kind of money to spend right now.
Not even the Yankees.
I’m tired.
I have the courage of my conviction.
I have tried to make reasonable arguments based on what little I know.
I have enlisted the support of some.
And I have tried to mix in a bit of common sense and inference.
and some humor.
If I am wrong so be it.
I am peace with whatever happens.
I wish the best for Matt, and the Yanks.
And that is why i have tried to make my case so strongly, and have not waivered in my belief that this would happen.
Believe what you will.
That’s fine with me.
I bear you no ill will and all I ask is that you bear me no ill will for what i choose to believe.
I’m done trying to convince
anyone else.
It’s ALL GOOD.
peace.
And Lost-
Thanks !!!!!
It seems like you know Matt.
Please give him a message from me.
Tell him I can’t wait to see him in pinstripes, and when he signs he is gonna be rich, and even more important he is gonna be happy.
He’s got a destiny to fulfill and it’s wearing pinstripes.
BD, that’s true…..
Whew, I’ll be back later – I need a break from the computer, lol
Boston is at payroll maximum. Lux tax time, chowderboys!
Mets are the serious ones here. Is it a fit?
Nobody is really sure how much the Wilpons lost in the Madoff scheme. This could really be affecting their spending this offseason.
Laura – I just got my World Series DVD set. Woohoo!
December 22nd, 2009 at 9:25 pm
“So he had his physical today and they’ll probably announced his signing tomorrow then.”
Or he failed his physical and he decided to take in a Knick game to make himself feel better.
————————————————————
The ball will be thrown out of bounds and hit Johnson on the arm, fracturing it in 4 places. He’ll be out for the year. These players should now the rules about basketball games by now, especially after old teammate Aaron Boone
There’s no budget.
It’s simply a question of value. Period.
“You think DAmon woudl ahve to take that bad deal? ”
Doreen,
If Johnny wanted to come back now it would be on the yankees terms.
I think he’s only get a one year deal at this point in time. 1 yr/ 5-7M.
There is not going to be any market for Damon. If the yankees want to they can really put the screws to Damon should he want to come back.
“That link is just quotes the 2008 Kepner article which says his dad would love the Yankees since MLB Home Plate on cable games would be on in EST at the end of the article.”
I thought that was a joke. Did he backpeddle to maintain bargaining position?
“And as an aside – given that the deal will be worth much less than anticipated the opportunities for endorsements in NY might be more attractive than they otherwise might be.”
Thats a very good point and something that I would consider if in his shoes. You aren’t going to get the contract you want but where are you going to have the highest earning potential off the field, NY or St. Louis.
I say give him 6/100 and lets go win a couple of world Series. (not my money)
MTU
Are those your last words?
Poor Johnson. The injury jokes will keep adding up.
Maybe he tripped on the scale at the physical, and fractured his toe, for example.
blake,
agreed. I feel like you know what you’re gonna get with damon. solid top of the lineup bat which seems built for NYS, average (to slightly above average?) defensive coverage in LF and a horrendous throwing arm.
Signing anybody short of Bay or Holliday carries plenty of risk.
I just don’t see much risk in bringing Damon back. Maybe it’s just the Yankee fan in me wishing he’d stick around but I do think he’s a good player.
Mick-
what do you mean ?
Guys, why do you believe the budget thing ? Cashman would not have an incentive to lie, right
Not that it matters mch but I just ran across some intersting facts. According to Maury Brown (the Biz of Baseball) total baseball salaries have increased by about 38% since 2004. According to Cots Basball Contracts over that same time period the Yankees opening day salaries only increased by 9% and the Red Sox salaries decreased by 5%. So it appears the Red Sox really have been particularly cheap since they won that first world series since 1918 and the Yankees salaries are growing a slower rate than the average team.
CB,
I think Damon can get a 2yr deal once Holliday and Bay sign.
Jason Marquis got 2/$15M
you’re telling me Damon isn’t worth that?
(and yes, I’m being somewhat facetious, though I think 2/$14M is more than fair for both sides at this point)
the deal
Joe from Long Island
December 22nd, 2009 at 9:27 pm
GB7 – Hey, how have you been? I can’t get the blog at work, like I used to, so I’ve been catching up, after dinner.
Hope your recovery is going well.
————————————————————
hey, Joe Hope all is well at your home. I’m feeling mean and cantankerous….ueah, I’m back to normal…I’m my old self.
Old being just figurative, of course.
Just thinking about it, we really do need a 5 hitter.
I do not know about Johnson or Granderson being 5, but I do not think the 5 spot is a favorable one for Posada.
GB-
are you being good to your brother ?
CB -
But given how good a “Yankee” Damon has been (including his recruiting efforts), do you think they’d really “put the screws to him?” Or might they be a little more lenient? Meaning, one year with an option.
Doesn’t look like we are going to solve this problem tonight, good night all.
Boston Dave, exactly Damon is much lower risk than a guy like Dye or Derosa (ugh) because we know he can get it done in NY. As CB said, there is no market for him so if Holliday ends up really not being an option then Damon can probably be had cheaply if he is willing to swallow his pride a little.
I remember Holliday’s father said this last December:
“If someone would have called me today and said Matt had gotten traded to the Yankees, I’d have been hunting for a place to celebrate”.
Anybody want to talk about how the Giants actually played a FOOTBALL game last night?
Uncle
His dad did say just that. While he would like his son to play for the Yankees, he said at the time that an East Coast team would be fine.
Here is the link:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11.....=1&em
Yankee Ray
Read to the end of the linked article, which has both quotes:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11.....=1&em
YankeeRay-
Thank you for your continuing support.
signed,
Bartles and James
BD,
I don’t know. Let’s put it this way. The Braves were desperate for an outfielder. Desperate.
They showed no interest in Damon and instead traded for Melky. Think about that.
Now much of this was the ridiculous pickle Wren got himself into by resigning Hudson and of course Lowe last year, but that to me is a pretty negative statement on how a team desperate for an outfielder perceived Damon’s value.
Same thing for the Giants – they have no hitting at all and their outfield is horrendous. No interest in Johnny.
I really think NL teams are going to be very weary of Damon. That cuts down his market a lot.
Damon’s in for a potentially very tough road. I think he’s only going to get a 1 year deal.
One more thing:
One night after blowing a 35 pt lead and losing, the Bulls are 1 pt down after coming back from a 22 pt deficit in the 4th, to the Knicks.
Say no to Matt Holliday. We don’t need another big bat. Plus we don’t need another player’s father (ala Jason Giambi) wanting his son to be a Yankee. Holliday is very overrated and next years FA class is a hell of a lot better. Resign Johnny and go with that team into Spring Training.
Just watching the Knicks blow a 22 point lead the night after their current opponent blew a 35 point lead.
I know the Knicks have no chance of doing anything, but listening to this sick loser commentator (not Walt Clyde) is disgusting.
Always nice to hear the bias for the opponent of the NY team on the NY network.
Then again, he is the same guy that cleansed the Celtics along with 2 other former Knicks (Van Gundy and Mark jackson) during the 2008 NBA playoffs.
Far cry from listening to Tommy Heinsohn complain about the referees cheating the Celts all game long.
MTU
December 22nd, 2009 at 9:38 pm
GB-
are you being good to your brother ?
————————————————————
Of course I am, MTU. I’m treating him just like one of my troops.
ANyone Read Pat Conroys new book? (about Charleston)
Or John Irving’s?? (about new hamshire and tamed bear)
“Mick-
what do you mean ?”
It’s no Holliday to do this,
there… it’s a clue.
The key is to seem to be saying something without saying anything.
I am only allowed to communicate with believers
The rest will get headaches from
these ramblings.
That is all I can say.
No, wait. There’s more….
Have I taken up enough space today?
Not yet? OK.
I can only tell you the things I am told.
These things are said and unsaid but are heard nonetheless.
This much is true: One does not need to count the birds
To know where the droppings are from.
But I stand at the bottom of the birdcage to
find out anyway.
End Transmission.
“But given how good a “Yankee” Damon has been (including his recruiting efforts), do you think they’d really “put the screws to him?””
Doreen,
Let me clarify what I meant by “put the screws to him.” Johnny has made his decision.
He elected to reject the yankees offer and now test the market.
And I think that market is going to be ugly.
And I don’t think the yankees are going to pay more than the going market rate for Damon should he want to come back.
That’s what I meant by put the screws to him. I’d guess they are going to let the market decide on Damon because that was the decision Damon made himself.
Now Johnny’s going to have to live with the consequences. I don’t see the yankees doing him any above market favors.
Kind of like the idea of a platoon, or right handed bat in LF. Gives the line-up extraordinary balance.
I was on the Tex wagon last year and until he signs with the Cards I will be on Hollidays this year. It just makes too much sense. I don’t care for Crawford next year and I doubt Mauer will be in play.
Trade Mitre for a bag of balls saving another 2mm and find a way to backload the contract.
Read this article. makes it clear the Yanks gave up more for Vazquez then the Mariners gave up for Cliff Lee. I would think 100% of baseball people would agree Lee is the better pitcher!! http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c.....index.html
Jeter
Johnson
Arod
Tex
Holliday
Posada
Cano
Swisher
Granderson
Ok, so lets assume that the Yankees do sign a stopgap type LF’er and pass on Holliday. Whats then the plan for LF next year? Melky is gone and there is nothing in the minors. They would either have to sign another stopgap type player or sign Crawford or Werth who are lesser players and could end up being more expensive if the economy is better.
I don’t think this decision is just about this year and this year’s payroll. Its about filling a need that is going to be a recurring if not filled.
CB =
Gotcha.
good one murph!
Looks like my Knicks are gonna do it. Yes!! As Marv would say.
84-81 Gallinari to the line
2 shots and the ball…clear path foul…game over
What …is … a Knick?
GB-
I needed to take a break so I came to you for a little cosmic relief.
It’s been battle tryin to convince the whole Universe along with myself that Holliday makes sense for us.
I know people have differing opinions on the subject, and that’s cool with me.
I am just gonna settle back now and wait for the news to break.
And hope the domino falls my way.
I will be disappointed if it doesn’t but it’s ALL GOOD.
Hope you are feeling stronger each day, and funnier.
The physical urge to smoke disappears in about 2 weeks.
Feels like several Millenia
if you are on the back side of it.
All the best to you. Thanks for keepin it light.
mick:
I remember the days when red wine and a big fat home rolled cigarette would make people speak like that post. It seemed like fun at the time, over thirty freakin years ago. Sic transit gloria mundi
stopgap this year…crawford next year.
crawford on base in front of jeter + tex + arod has me salivating…
A Knick is a once and future proud team that has much better days ahead.
Yes, Holliday is Beltran all over again. Right player, right position to fill a long term need. But because of last year’s FA haul, Yanks do not want the appearance of gluttony. So whatever solution they come up with will have to wait until next year (or the year after that).
CB,
those are good points.
how do you personally think Damon fared defensively last season (aside from his arm)?
I’m a little surprised that SF or Atlanta didnt pursue him. I’m not sure Atlanta is desperate for an OF (McLouth, Schaefer, Diaz, Heyward) but they could definitely use a more reliable guy since they are very young there.
I’ve learned never to try to understand Brian Sabean.
We’ll see I guess. If I were a GM of a smaller market team, I’d love to add Damon at this vastly reduced rate.
Read this article. makes it clear the Yanks gave up more for Vazquez then the Mariners gave up for Cliff Lee. I would think 100% of baseball people would agree Lee is the better pitcher!! http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c…..index.html
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No one knows if Cashman tried for Lee and was rebuked, or if they asked for more. Additionally, Vizcaino is good but so is Aumont, and Aumont is closer to the majors. The only other ‘big piece’ is melky, and he just isn’t good enough vs his rising cost.
go new york go new york GO
murph
By a big fat rolled cigarette well I think I get your drift man, groovy, got the munchies, peace…
go new york go new york GO
==============================
Dancing Harry?
Lost,
I don’t know who your people are, but whenever I don’t hear back from my people, something is up.
“Yanks do not want the appearance of gluttony. ”
I hope they don’t make moves based on what other people think of them.
I heard the news of this trade break on Boomer and Carton this morning.
After a day filled with wrapping up projects at work and scrambling to finish my Christmas shopping I finally got a chance to comment on this trade.
Wow. I mean, Cashman is like a fine wine, just getting better and better with age in relation to his time here as GM. This trade is a monster coup no matter what aspect of it you consider.
Vasquez. People keep thinking about 2004. I look at his entire career and particularly his 2009 season and I think Vasquez could easily be our #2 starter by the all star break. Huge durability, nasty swing and miss stuff, and a man returning to NY much smarter and more experienced than his first go-around. Joining a loaded staff.
Just a phenomenal acquisition. Reasonable salary for his results, one year remaining on his contract so not only is he playing for his next deal but your team’s flexibility going into 2011 isn’t hindered. And if he leaves you get draft picks because he’s definitely getting offered arbitration unless he blows out his arm.
Losing Melky means virtually nothing. Yes he had big hits last year, played a decent CF. But if he was really going to get around $3 million in arbitration this year, that might be a little pricey for a guy who is made infinitely better by the hitters around him in the lineup. So they free up $3 million there.
They lose Dunn (who cares really) and get a decent lefty in return, and a guy with more ML experience.
Arodys is the key here. Huge upside but a long way to go. IMO worth the risk losing him. We have a ton of high upside arms and you have to give something to get arguably one of the 3 best starters in the NL last year. Yes, that’s right. Vasquez is that good. You’ll see with your own eyes come 2010.
I heard the news today, oh boy…
“Read this article. makes it clear the Yanks gave up more for Vazquez then the Mariners gave up for Cliff Lee. I would think 100% of baseball people would agree Lee is the better pitcher!! http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c…..index.html”
I find it very curious as to why a number of sabermetrics oriented writers have made such a big deal out of Arodys Vizcaino.
It’s very puzzling – not because of Vizcaino – but because sabermetrics oriented writers often put minimal value in a prospect like Vizcaino.
And what even more puzzling is that Tim Marchman has no particular expertise in minor league baseball. And Marchman dismisses Melky and says value in the deal for the Yankees is related to Vizcaino.
This is particularly ironic because the phillies in fact did get back more for Lee than the Braves did for Vazquez. Aumont alone is a more highly ranked prospect than Vizcaino.
It seems like they’re downplaying the deal Cashman made and playing up the deal that Jack Z did.
Or maybe this is another way of implicitly praising Jack Z.
Yeah a guy who was merely good in Staten Island is an absolute lock to be an all star major leaguer…. please!
I think this is a terrific trade for the Yanks and chances are they could free the cash for a one year deal with Damon or whomever to be an OF piece. Figuring that out and/or building the bench is all that remains.
It would be hard to convince me that the that the Yanks are not significantly better (on paper) than they were when the W.S. parade finished. Offense may drop some, but pitching and defense is significantly better.
I’ll be happy if Vasquez is just the guy he was for his first 23 Yankees starts in ’04… he was 13-6, 4.16 before his shoulder and eye gave him trouble
New thread >>>>>
I think Vizcaino does represent an overpay, unless they are down on his future based on his back.
blake, I think it’s a practical concern because what other people think could cause those other people to vote for changes to the system that would make the competitive situation less favorable for the Yankees than it now is.
CB,
If the Yankees aren’t going to do Damon any “above market favors” (and I’m not suggesting that they should), do you think they’ll bring him back at all?
Cashman had that quote a few days ago about the potential for attitude problems with players resigning with a team at a reduced salary. Pettitte didn’t let it affect him last year, but Damon has had motivation problems in the past, i.e. spring training 07. I just see him being really unhappy with a market rate – 1 year 5-7 million deal.
I’ll say it one more time tonight and then I’ll be back for more tomorrow.
This is Hals deal now. Cash is done and no way do we go into season with Gardner in LF.
Hal has to follow dads footsteps and demand that they sign Holliday on what should be considered the cheap.
“I remember the days when red wine and a big fat home rolled cigarette would make people speak like that post. It seemed like fun at the time, over thirty freakin years ago.”
I remember those days fondly.
Carl Crawford is overrated. The Yanks may wind up with him next year if they don’t get Holliday but he is not worth 15 million. Not by a long shot. Even his speed is overrated. He somehow managed to steal like 10 bases in the second half. You really want an aging OF who relies on speed? No thanks.
Vasquez is a great number 3/4 for this team. Melky was a good but certainly not great outfielder. Pitching was a big priority – now they have depth in both the starting 5 and bullpen. As for LF – Cashman was referring to Nick on MLB not LF possibilities. Gardner, who is young, fast and inexpensive will be your LF. Give him a chance to win the 9-spot on this otherwise loaded team.