A closer look at the latest addition
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jan 27, 2010 
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As a follow to his morning post on Pat Venditte, I asked Frankie Piliere for his thoughts on the newest member of the Yankees 40-man roster: Greg Golson.
“I think it’s a fantastic deal,” Piliere wrote. “Zero risk. (Mitch) Hilligoss was pretty limited, I think. Golson can absolutely fly and can play the outfield. I think it’s a great gamble. It wasn’t very long ago that he was a top prospect. He wasn’t awful in AAA, not great but not bad. I think he can continue to develop.”
At the very least, the Yankees have added a plus defensive player who can provide speed off the bench. If Golson grows into his tools, the Yankees might have found a legitimate young outfielder. As we’ve noted before, the outfield depth is thin in the upper levels of the Yankees system. They had to search through independent ball to fill last year’s Double-A outfield, then they traded away Austin Jackson.
Colin Curtis remains an interesting young outfielder, but he’s a little bit like Golson in that he has obvious talent without especially good numbers. The Yankees have also signed 24-year-old power hitter David Winfree, speedy 29-year-old Reid Gorecki and 32-year-old veteran Jon Weber to minor league deals, but outfield depth remains a concern. That’s why it makes some sense to take a shot on Golson.
Piliere said he spoke to a baseball source who labeled Golson as having two plus-plus tools: His arm and his speed. The same source called Golson a premier athlete with great makeup, but noted the obvious: He hasn’t hit. The Yankees are hoping that changes. If not, no real harm done.
At this point, it makes more sense for the Yankees to take a chance on a Triple-A outfielder than a Class-A infielder.
Thanks, Chad! Throw enough OF at the wall and hope at least one of them sticks……
Now if the guy could only hit, he’s young, fast, great defense, good arm, can steal bases (if he gets on,) but needs Kevin Longs help.
Thanks, Frank. Once upon a time, the only OF depth we had was Austin Jackson. Nice to see Cash not only recognize the deficiency, but address it. Great to see him back up his “younger and athletic” pledge.
Hopefully at least one will pan out.
And I agree on Golson. It seems kind of soon to give up on him. Players have been kept for far less performance.
Golson seems like a player if he can gain some plate discipline (which is what holds many players back and is easier said than done at this stage in his career), offensively he can put up Melky type numbers (.270BA, .330OBP, .414SLG) but with more SB and more range in the OF. This trade can only turn out either a wash or good for the Yanks.
Okay that tracks with my thinking from the previous thread, platoon LF with Gardner and Golson if you have to. The one thing I will repeat from the post is this: if Damon is the difference between the Yankees winning and losing next season, the team is in worst shape than I thought.
Hey Erin, if when you announce a new thread you could add the subject of the thread, that would be sweet! If not, well that’s okay too…I guess. ha ha.
trisha – OPPC forever – (new lucky picture from last day at the old Stadium) BRING ON THE GHOSTS!
January 27th, 2010 at 12:37 pm
Hey Erin, if when you announce a new thread you could add the subject of the thread, that would be sweet! If not, well that’s okay too…I guess. ha ha.
*********************
trisha, just for you, I’ll do it
“let’s go-
Why can’t Aceves fill the same role you advocate for Gaudin? And for a lot less money?
How many long relief innings are there going to be on the Yanks for both Aceves and Gaudin? Probably not enough to keep them both sharp.”
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It did not really work last year with Aceves because his body was not able to handle the transition. That one start screwed him up for the rest of the season which ended up hurting the Yankees BP. Additionally, I think Aceves is more valuable to this team as solely a a middle reliever and I suspect the Yankees do as well.
I promise I won’t use the “D” word because the subject has been over-done. But I am not a Gardner fan and as a Yankee fan I hope he proves me wrong. I look forward to the play of Granderson.
Last year’s OF was scary at best but performed when they had to. Melky was a part of that outfield and I was amazed that he was traded, even for a serviceable pitcher. I will miss him and I wish him well. Guess I will be watching Atlanta’s games in addition to Yankee games.
The pinch hitters series has been interesting and I appreciated those written by by Frankie P. Frankly (no pun intended)the statistics articles were a little boring for me. Is there a woman PH in the future??
I am looking forward to the 2010 season and can hardly wait for ST to begin. After a slow start (and some key injuries) the 2009 Yankees performed like the champions we all know they can be. Let’s all hope that the 2010 team will be as successful no matter who is playing LF.
At http://www.i-hate-scott-boras.com
article Hotstove coal: Scott Boras has a clear conflict of interest with Johnny Damon.
What he did this offsrason to Damon is criminal! Cashmam can’t back down, Mariano, Jeter, Andy, and THEIR AGENTS too,are next year, that are watching.
Cashman has to show the Yankees are willing to walk away from unreasonable agents. When Mo and Posada last contracts were up they had the good sense to tell their agents to accept.
Could the Yankees use him behind Jeter YES, but he’s not worth ALL THIS DRAMA!!
I don’t think Aceves is anything special in the bullpen. Sure he eats innings and gets outs but he’s worth more as an innings-eating starter. Gaudin can pitch in long relief quite easily.
I just wonder what the market bears for someone like Alfredo Aceves. Do the scouts project him as a capable 5th starter or even 4th starter in the NL? If so, would a pitching-starved team be willing to trade a decent outfielder for him?
m
I read before Ankiel was signed Boras was presenting him to Cashman, with Damon still not signed. That is a conflict of interest. I also agree Boras is stuck in stupid with Damon this offseason.
m
January 27th, 2010 at 12:27 pm
Thanks, Frank. Once upon a time, the only OF depth we had was Austin Jackson. Nice to see Cash not only recognize the deficiency, but address it. Great to see him back up his “younger and athletic” pledge.
Hopefully at least one will pan out.
And I agree on Golson. It seems kind of soon to give up on him. Players have been kept for far less performance.
————————————————————
He was Philadephia’s #1 pick (21 overall) in 2004, but was traded in late 2008 to Texas John Mayberry Jr. Texas had him on the 40 man roster, but, removed him to make room for Khalil Greene.
If Aceves and Gaudin are one & the same, I’d keep Ace. Cheaper and, frankly, better.
“Last year’s OF was scary at best but performed when they had to. Melky was a part of that outfield and I was amazed that he was traded, even for a serviceable pitcher. I will miss him and I wish him well. Guess I will be watching Atlanta’s games in addition to Yankee games.”
——————————-
The Yankees OF was very good offensively last year, so IDK what you mean by “scary at best.” Their collective OPS+ was 118
And by “serviceable” do you mean a guy who finished 4th in the NL Cy Young last year? If that is only serviceable I cannot imagine what your standard for “good” is.
It’s looking more and more like Gardy is going to be the guy coming out of the gate with lots of backup in AAA if he can’t get it done.
Cash is still sticking to the story that Damon cost too much $$.
Let’s just hope that Grandy and Swish stay healthy because they are the only 2 proven major league OFs on the 40 man.
With yet another good fielding OF in the mix, it really seems like a RH pinch hitter is all that could be added at this point.
NYY will need more than just one swing man/long reliever. You can’t go to one guy for 2 or 3 innings 3/4 times a week. Early last year, that’s exactly what NYY had to do…use long relievers in 3 and 4 straight games. Keeping both gaudin and aceves is a necessity.
gfd
January 27th, 2010 at 12:44 pm
m
I read before Ankiel was signed Boras was presenting him to Cashman, with Damon still not signed. That is a conflict of interest. I also agree Boras is stuck in stupid with Damon this offseason.
—————————————
That is not a conflict of interest. In fact, it is the exact opposite. Boras has a duty to ALL his clients to present them to EVERY team in baseball.
It would be a conflict of interest if Boras purposefully did not present Ankiel to the Yankees because of Damon.
I don’t see Golston as working a platoon with Gardner. His bat is too weak.
Cash has said publicly he has OF’s he can move on as soon as he wants to.
Decoding: Once he feels he’s at the end of the line with the Damon negotiations, one of the RH hitting OF’s still on the market will be signed to platoon with Gardner.
It seems like a bunch of players (Thames, Johnson, etc) are waiting around to see where Damon lands before signing somewhere.
gfd,
Who knows? Perhaps Boras didn’t make Nady as available as he could’ve in lieu of Damon’s interest. i.e. come back with terms similar to what he signed with the Cubs. Although, playing time could’ve been a factor as well.
I like how they are looking for depth in the outfield with some potential young talent. I would still look at Reed Johnson and Thames. I also think they need some infield veteran utility help. Maybe they get it from signing someone to a minor league contract. Hopefully not Ransom.
Calling Javy a “serviceable pitcher” is the understatement of the young year.
One has to wonder, why they would trade Golson for nothing??? was he hitting on the owner’s daughter?
I think that the Yanks should check with the Nats about Willingham.
Aceves out of the pen won 10 games, 84 IP in relief with a 3.54 ERA
ANDY won 14 games starting 194.2 IP with a 4.16 ERA
AJ won 13 games starting with 207 IP with a 4.04 ERA
How could what he contributed be overlooked as NOTHING SPECIAL?
Mo and Marte got it done at the right time.
“He wasn’t awful in AAA, not great but not bad. I think he can continue to develop.”
Frankie, .642 OPS in what is generally a hitter’s league is brutal. Nice that he can run and catch, but there’s zero evidence of any development at all happening offensively. Or what little that has happened stalled. He’s been an out making machine in the minors for the past four years.
Whoever is added to the outfield be a short term deal. I am salivating over the long term plans. Next years crop of free agents with Carl Crawford or Werth. I could see the Yankees definitely chasing Crawford and paying up for him. Werth strikes me as a perfect fit for Fenway and the Sox. But if they don’t I really could see a push to make a major trade for Sizemore if the Indians are blown away. Especially if Sizemore costs them a lot from the farm and Mauer is out there. Yankees sign Mauer and then move Montero to the Indians for Sizemore? He’s a good fit for the stadium.
Regardless getting young guys with speed like Golson is good. Athletisicm is somethign the Yankees have always lacked.
If I were Cashman, after learning yesterday that Boras was going to charge the Yankees more for Nady vs. what he got from the Cubs, I would offer Damon not a penny more than 2 million dollars if anything.
I think it’s reprehensible that the Yankees get a different price than the Cubs. It costs just as much to live in Chicago as it does in NYC and it’s just as much of a headache traffic wise there. The taxes aren’t lower either.
It’s ridiculous that NY has to a premium over another large market media driven city.
Damon is in nowhere land now. He made his bed.
As for Gardner and whoever else is part of the platoon with him, I want them to give him a shot. Melky was a waste of an at bat for the most part in the 9 hole until this season so having a hole there for this season isn’t exactly the end of the world.
Golson sounds like a younger version of Kevin Thompson, but without the plate discipline. Perhaps a better arm but not yet as good a hitter. KT’s best minor league year was at age 25, so maybe Golson still has a chance, especialy with Kevin Long around. If not for Melky (or Torre), KT may have had an opportunity with the Yanks, so it could happen for Golson. Girardi values speed and defense more than Torre did.
“One has to wonder, why they would trade Golson for nothing??? was he hitting on the owner’s daughter?”
If he was, it was the only thing he was hitting.
I think Cash’s comments were a little salvo at Damon and Boras..We’re soon approaching the point of no return re: Damon returning to the Yankees. I just wonder if it’s gotten through to Damon and Boras yet that the Yankees aren’t going to wait forever.
since this new apple tablet will likely impact the blog , some may find this interesting.
live blogging just started.
http://www.engadget.com/2010/0.....refresh=30
GLove, that’s how I feel. Of course, I blame Nady as well as Boras…….Nady must have felt like he was treated badly by the Yankees. Even if not, he got a ring for missing practically the whole year and he probably got a nice WS share…..I’m not expecting that he take peanuts from the Yankees, but taking less from a franchise like the Cubs makes Nady look like a fool.
My dream has always been to have a solid defensive team and outstanding pitching. We have a pretty darned good defensive team and (in my opinion) outstanding pitching. My continuing dream is to have as good a defensive outfield as possible, given what’s out there. Speed in the outfield, well the thought of that brings tears to my eyes.
I understand that not everyone looks for the same in the makeup of a team (for instance, offense takes a back seat for me; I automatically go for pitching and defense – obviously you need all three, but I am saying I favor pitching and defense in what I hope a team will emphasize), so I am trying hard here to understand what Damon offers that people are still looking for. His bat does not offer enough incrementally that the team either needs to win or to make up for the fact that his defense is suspect and he is no longer an every-day player. So then what is it?
That is a sincere question, since I personally don’t feel he adds enough to the team anymore to take him on as a part-time player.
Erin – thanks!
That said, I had no interest in a guy who’s arm could fall apart with the next throw.
GB-
let me know if you find that Koufax video. The guy was Metaphysical.
SJ-
I like your decode.
this o.f. mess will come too an end soon
i think we end up with reed johnson within a few days
damon is not going too play for us & 2-4 million
Good article today by Joel Sherman on merits of signing Johnny Damon….I don’t love Damon but he comes just for money…if they wait until July to fill left field they will have to give up prospects…Hal stop pinching a few bucks now…it will cost more later
Let’s go,
Vazquez is only a one-year project, is he not?? Most fans expect him to be gone next year. His 2009 may have been good but the expectation for him on a loaded Yankees rotation does not is not the same level as CC, et al.
Let’s face it – expectations are always extremely high for any added players. A lot of fans/posters are bemoaning the fact that Granderson can hit lefties.
In relation to the excellent Yankee infield the OF was shaky. JD had some less that stellar adventures in the field and so did Swish. Fortunately, both had good bats but more than one Yankee fan held their breath when the ball was hit out to the corners. Swish did improve as the season progressed and JD as the #2 batter was excellent.
“Next years crop of free agents with Carl Crawford or Werth. I could see the Yankees definitely chasing Crawford and paying up for him. Werth strikes me as a perfect fit for Fenway and the Sox”
I think Werth may be better suited to the Yankees. Much better plate discipline than Crawford. He can spit a ball further than Crawford can throw one. Excellent power to right center, which fits in NYS, and gives the team a little extra righthandedness in the lineup. Alas, he may be a little older than what the Yankees have in mind.
Though nobody can say for sure what Cashman was trying to transmit, if it was other than exactly what he said, my guess is that at this point he was being politic and polite. Personally I don’t think he wants Damon or feels the Yankees need him.
Repost…
Wave,
The point you are arguing in this thread is 100% correct. Spending that $3 million towards Damon is a much better investment then spending it on Gaudin.
Gaudin is more of a luxury, considering the current pitching depth on the team while having another solid outfielder in Damon is closer to being a necessity.
Under any sensible test, it is a conflict of interest. However, Boras, most assuredly, includes in all of his contracts of representation an express and all-inclusive waiver of any and all conflicts by the player.
Chad,
Couldn’t agree more with the take on Golson. The Yankees are so thin at OF in the upper levels that taking chances on guys like Golson, Winfree, and even Hoffmann makes a ton of sense. I’ve mentioned it numerous times, but I would go a step beyond and consider moving Eduardo Nunez to OF as well given his tools and the fact that there’s very little chance of him making it to the Yankees as an infielder.
We all know that Brett Gardner is not the long term answer in the OF and I consider it an almost open competition at this point between him, Winfree, Hoffmann and Golson for the opening LF spot this spring. Obviously Gardner has a leg up, but it wouldn’t shock me in the least if a strong campaign by one of these others coupled with a weak spring by Brett lands him on the bench.
Okay let me rephrase that. If Damon was willing to show up for a pittance maybe Cashman would take him on and let the Yankees use him as needed. Because I don’t want him on the team doesn’t necessarily mean that Cashman doesn’t.
“If I were Cashman, after learning yesterday that Boras was going to charge the Yankees more for Nady vs. what he got from the Cubs, I would offer Damon not a penny more than 2 million dollars if anything.
I think it’s reprehensible that the Yankees get a different price than the Cubs. It costs just as much to live in Chicago as it does in NYC and it’s just as much of a headache traffic wise there. The taxes aren’t lower either.”
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How do you know Nady did not tell Boras he would rather play for the Cubs, so there is no point of presenting the offer to the Yankees?
Correction: delete “does not”
Granderson can NOT hit lefties
less THAN stellar.
I guess I’m not as much of a Swisher fan as others on this blog. He hit some home runs and walked quite a bit — as well as taking a lot of strikes when looking for a walk. He was signed as a utility guy last year and I’m not sure one pretty good year suddenly turns him into an everyday outfielder — especially considering his defense and arm. (His throws to home are rainbows rather than ropes.)My biggest concern is that he’s the type of hitter who feasts on poor to mediocre stuff but shuts down against quality pitching — explaining why he ended up with about three hits in the post season last year. I hope he’s at least as good as last year but I think that’s far from being a lock.
If Damon likes to win as advertised he would have picked the Yanks long time ago. Who else is out there offering a contract that could provide that. If he signs somewhere else it’s because of money and not about winning. Then, you will see the true colors.
“Gaudin is more of a luxury, considering the current pitching depth on the team while having another solid outfielder in Damon is closer to being a necessity.”
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What other pitching depth do the Yankees have. Mitre?
“How do you know Nady did not tell Boras he would rather play for the Cubs, so there is no point of presenting the offer to the Yankees?”
Or whether the Yankees countered at $3M or so?
FWIW, assuming decent health, I’d think the Yankees might have provided a better opportunity for playing time to Nady than he’s getting from the Cubs.
Patrick while I respect what you’re saying I disagree with a few of your premises:
Gaudin is not a luxury. I am guessing that either Joba or Hughes, moved to the pen, will not be stretched out to start but will fill in the way they did last year. That’s my guess. That leaves Gaudin for spot starts and long relief, both of which he showed he can do.
Damon is hardly a solid outfielder. He’s a player who was platooned last season so that he could be productive when he was in the outfield. And even with that he was starting to miss a few steps. He is not a good defensive outfielder and he is definitely not an every-day player.
JMO
MTU
January 27th, 2010 at 1:04 pm
GB-
let me know if you find that Koufax video. The guy was Metaphysical.
SJ-
I like your decode.
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Will do. He describes his motion as a system of levers and pulleys. A few years ago, he went into detail in a book, “Sandy Koufax: A Lefty’s Legacy” by Jane Leavy, with photos and diagrams. It’s a very good read.
I find the banter as to the dearth of quality outfielders in the minor league system not particularly germane to the future in Yankeeland.. We all know that in the final analysis Cashman, most probably next year, will do a free agency deal (and if not, a trade) and fill any and all position holes then existing.
Brett won’t have a bad spring. He can hit minor league pitching and get fat numbers out of the gate vs. the fringe arms he’s going to face at the start of the spring.
His problem is hitting good consistent major league pitching that has an actual plan to get him out.
I still have seen flashes from him when he looked decent. I still remember a series in Toronto where was swinging level and stinging the ball. His problem is consistency. He hasn’t shown that ability often.
Still, it’s not like Melky was Bernie Williams. He was a 9th place hitter who didn’t get on base a lot and had a good year in key spots last season.
The Yankees can afford to roll the dice on a young OF until they can’t afford to do so, i.e. they are falling behind in the standings and other players are underperforming.
I wanted Damon back here, but this dance that’s going on is ridiculous and Damon has already lost. He will make less money than he thought he would and he may end up on a team he never imagined he would playing for scraps.
Ariel, hear hear!
If Nady didn’t want to play for the Yankees, then I don’t think Boras would’ve presented a final offer of $5m.
“It did not really work last year with Aceves because his body was not able to handle the transition. That one start screwed him up for the rest of the season which ended up hurting the Yankees BP. Additionally, I think Aceves is more valuable to this team as solely a a middle reliever and I suspect the Yankees do as well.”
Last year was Aceves’ first year working in the role. Who knows how he body will react this year, he may be preparing himself to be able to adjust to the role better THIS year.
And what makes you suspect the Yankees view him as more valuable as a middle reliever?
Got it GB. I wish you well I know you miss the dog and changing the twin’s diapers..
mel, I consider everything Boras does as suspect. Like the little boy who cried wolf. Who knows when and if the wolf is actually there.
If the Yankees had a number for Nady in mind, likely it was sub $3.3M so if Boras asked for $3.3M, $5.5M or $25M, it probably is irrelevant.
“What other pitching depth do the Yankees have. Mitre?”
After the starting five: Hughes or Chamberlain, Aceves, Mitre, Nova, McAllister.
My question to you, who is the starting LF and who is behind him? The pitching depth looks a lot better to me than the OF starters and depth.
trisha,
Damon is still an excellent hitter and he’s passable in the field. He was not platooned last year, not sure what team you were watching.
Damon is far more important to this team than Chad Gaudin. In the last two years Damon has a 3.0 WAR in 2009 and a 3.6 WAR in 2008. For his career Chad Gaudin has a 5.0 WAR.
Randy, think you are right that is one hot product. I would love to have me one of them.
The Yanks need Damon. If Posada, Jeter, Grandy, ARod or Johnson hit the DL. Most Likely Johnson and Posada, then what. That leaves Cervelli replacing Posada, maybe Ramirez replacing ARod/Jeter, and whoever replacing Johnson/Grandy
The 2010 Yankees are comparably offensively to last year’s team and much improved defensively with BG and CG patrolling the big part of the yard. JD had his chance, its done. NJ up, Miranda in reserve as DH. Done, Finite…Thanks for the memories Johnny, at least this year I can get up to get a drink as soon as that pop-up heads towards left field.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/
I am hearing what some of the East Coast writers are: Don’t count the A’s entirely out on Johnny Damon. One source called it “a pipe dream,” but the A’s are going to keep the dialog open just in case. If they can bring Damon in at a bargain rate, they’ll do it and then figure out what to do in the outfield with Damon, Coco Crisp, Ryan Sweeney and Rajai Davis, not to mention top prospect Michael Taylor.
They will sign another OF at some point.
You can’t count Nova and McAllister as major league pitching depth since neither guy has pitched an inning of MLB.
They need Gaudin right now, at least through the spring, more than folks think.
One or two spring pitching injuries, which seem to happen quite often for the Yankees, and you are hurting for arms.
Damon is not a “necessity”, he’s a luxury at this time.
“Last year was Aceves’ first year working in the role. Who knows how he body will react this year, he may be preparing himself to be able to adjust to the role better THIS year.
And what makes you suspect the Yankees view him as more valuable as a middle reliever?”
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That is the point. We do not know if Ace can handle the role so it would not be very smart to trade Gaudin.
I suspect they view him as more valuable there because last year they needed a #4 and #5 starter for much of the second 1/2 of the season, and Ace remained in the pen except for that 1 start. If they wanted him to be a back end starter or even view him as a potential back end starter they would have kept stretching him out.
Here’s another Nady possibility- $$ being similiar, it might be easier to pump up stats in the NL Central than the AL East which brings value added in a contract for 2011 and going forward.
Pat, is the pitching that much better in the AL East?
pat
January 27th, 2010 at 1:20 pm
If the Yankees had a number for Nady in mind, likely it was sub $3.3M so if Boras asked for $3.3M, $5.5M or $25M, it probably is irrelevant.
===========================================
And yet, Boras came back with $5m. Your explanation makes more sense than this ““How do you know Nady did not tell Boras he would rather play for the Cubs, so there is no point of presenting the offer to the Yankees?””
Anyway, the big mysteries of negotiations will continue to elude us.
Everybody believes they have enough pitching in January.
Last year at this time, everybody, especially statheads, were convinced the Red Sox had so much pitching, they would waltz to the World Series.
Its funny what a couple of injuries, and a few guys not panning out, can do to pitching depth.
You never trade pitching for a 37 yr old OF.
The bottom line is, they don’t need to raise 2 million dollars more to sign Damon. The two sides aren’t even in the same ballpark right now.
If they were, Cash would have something to take to Hal.
However, when you are 6+ million apart, the boss isn’t going to say its “close enough” to do a deal.
“It did not really work last year with Aceves because his body was not able to handle the transition.”
Yeah, the adjustment to marriage can be particularly tough for a Newlywed.
I want to be clear on something. It is my understanding that Nady accepted a 3.3 million (plus whatever incentives) from the Cubs, but presented the Yankees with a $5 million figure to open negotiations? In other words, the Yankees did not actually offer Nady $5 million, and Nady did not actually turn down a $5 million offer from the Yankees in order to accept a $3.3 offer from the Cubs, right?
So, it was $3.3 million, plus, offer from the Cubs versus no offer from the Yankees? Or did it happen this way – Nady told the Yankees, through Boras that his asking price was $5 million and the Yankees countered with, well, you know we’re working somewhere in the area of $2 million to fill that spot, so Nady said no thank you and then took an offer from the Cubs for more than the $2 million the Yankees said they had?
You see, to “dis” Nady for selling his services to the Cubs for less money than he would have sold his services to the Yankees is not really fair.
SJ44,
Damon is more necessary than Gaudin.
The starting rotation is more proven than the starting LF. Even if you throw McAllister and Nova out the window the 6th, 7th and 8th starters have more experience and ability than the anyone behind Gardner.
Damon is a lot more important to this team than Gaudin is and it’s really not even close.
Thanks for the support, Patrick!
People, the Yanks obtained Chad Gaudin’s contract mid-season last year for $100,000. That’s $100K, as in 100 grand. Presumably, that’s what the Pads thought his contract was worth.
If the Yanks need a pitcher like Gaudin mid-season, they can go out and trade for one. Maybe have to give up another $100,000, or a player to be named.
The Yanks have an astoundingly good rotation, and likely to be a very durable one.
On the other hand, they have no offensive strength behind Nick Johnson, Nick Swisher, Curtis Granderson and Brett Gardner. Each one of those players has some pretty serious questions attached to them. Johnson has a history of injuries. Granderson has historically not hit lefties. Brett Gardner is essentially a rookie, and one whose bat is far from sure. Nick Swisher – well I spent the first half of last season arguing with most of you that Swisher was in fact a good player. If you think there won’t be some issues there then you are the definition of an optimist.
If Damon won’t play for the Yanks for $4-7MM dollars, well then he won’t for us. But if he would take such an offer, the Yanks would be nuts to let the amount of Gaudin’s salary stand in the way. The Yanks could trade Gaudin today and get something worthwhile back – he could be a fourth or fifth starter for many teams.
The point is not, would Gaudin be useful if something bad happened with the rotation. Sure he would.
The point is, given the Yanks’ apparently constrained resources, where is the last few dollars best spent? IMO, it is surely Damon (and I know, SJ44, the Yanks may not agree, but we are allowed to post opinions on what the Yanks should do as well as predictions of what they will do).
And if it comes to predictions, I do think Damon will be a Yank at the end of the day.
“After the starting five: Hughes or Chamberlain, Aceves, Mitre, Nova, McAllister.”
Hughes/Chamberlain: not starting depth. The loser goes to the bullpen where it will take too long for them to be stretched out in case of injury
Aceves: Maybe. The Yankees needed 2 SP last season, yet they kept him in the BP except for 1 start. I don’t know what would change this year to make it any different
Nova: 12 starts in AAA last year.
McAllister: 1 start in AAA last year.
MTU, here’s a link to a whole host of videos. Most of the instructionals a pay sites, though. Still interesting to watch.
http://www.google.com/search?s.....fax+videos
Patrick – it appears the Yankees don’t agree with your thinking on who is more important. I definitely don’t agree with your thinking. Damon at this point offers offense, something the Yankees have in buckets. Pitching is ALWAYS a necessary commodity, and anyone who watched Gaudin pitch for the Yankees should be in agreement that the guy performed well as both a starter and as a reliever.
About Damon being platooned. 143 games does not strike me as an every-day player. Girardi made it clear that he was sitting Damon so that he would be good to go in the postseason. And even with that, there were balls that Damon couldn’t get to.
The fact that he can’t play every day coupled with the fact that he has lost some steps and has a noodle arm makes me, at least, feel his value to the team is far below that of a pitcher who performed well and who will be there if something happens to one of the starters.
SJ44,
You keep talking about starting pitchers getting injured, what happens if our starting RF gets injured just like last year?
Then the starting OF becomes Gardner LF, Granderson CF, Hoffman RF. That’s simply awful.
Say a starting pitcher gets hurt. The rotation becomes Sabathia, Burnett, Pettitte, Vazquez, Hughes/Chamberlain. Oh wait that’s the same rotation we have right now. Lets say two starters get hurt. We then have Sabathia, Vazquez, Pettitte, Hughes, Aceves (assuming the two injuries are to Joba and A.J.). Pretty good.
The simple fact is, the pitching depth without Gaudin is still pretty good while the OF depth without Damon is horrendous.
And don’t forget, Gaudin was acquired for $100,000 in July. Even if an injury occurs, starters of Gaudin’s ability are extremely easy to get.
I think you keep Gaudin and Mitre and deal Aceves (I suggested to the Pirates for Delwyn Young – switch hitter, decent bat off the bench)
Figure that between Gaudin and Mitre the Yankees have the long relief/spot start position taken care of and with Robertson/Marte/Joba or Hughes – the bridge to Rivera is also taken care of. That means they can afford to move Aceves to fill the need for a veteran bat on the bench.
By the way – for those of you who listen to the Mike Francessa show on a regular basis, he’s already set it up so that he’s going to make Damon this year’s controversy if he doesn’t come back.
So, surprise surprise…ESPN just posted an article picking the Sox organization at 2 and the Yankees at 25. If the Sox are “best at drafting and developing talent” why did they just go to sign a CF, 3B, SS and SP from the free agent market? Where have all these great draft picks gone?
Re: Aceves
Ace was the victim of the Joba Rules. When Joba started pitching 2, 3, 4 innings Aceves was his mop-up man. Ace won 10 games in that capacity. Whether by design, some players seen to be considered interchangeable “as needed” for the best of the team.
trisha,
Right after the world series it was widely assumed that Damon was priority #2 after Andy.
And yet, here we are!
Patrick -
You can play the “what if this guy gets hurt game” all over the field. I mean what if Jeter blows out a knee on day one of spring training – you’re looking at a season of Ramiro Pena at SS, if Jorge goes down you’re looking at Francisco Cervelli. Yes, if Nick Swisher gets hurt or Curtis Granderson gets hurt you’re looking at a thin outfield, but such is life.
Right now the Yankees feel that with their lineup they can survive with Brett Gardner (or one of these other minor leaguers) in the nine spot and that by playing one of these guys in LF they have a better defensive team than they did last year. I can’t say I disagree.
GB-
Thanks again. Something else to do while we wait for JD to make up his mind, or until we see if PH or Joba winds up in the pen.
The Yankees got Gaudin cheap last year because they didn’t really need him. They just wanted him. If they had needed Gaudin (trust me, when a team needs something, other teams know it), it would have cost a lot more than $100,000.
espn is such garbage. dont bother even reading it.
Noreaster
January 27th, 2010 at 1:38 pm
So, surprise surprise…ESPN just posted an article picking the Sox organization at 2 and the Yankees at 25
****************
“The Yankees got Gaudin cheap last year because they didn’t really need him. They just wanted him. If they had needed Gaudin (trust me, when a team needs something, other teams know it), it would have cost a lot more than $100,000.”
My memory isn’t what it used to be, but my recollection is that when the Yanks traded for Gaudin, Mitre was our fifth starter. That’s as much need as we’d have this year.
Given the Yankees woes in the area of pitching (the proverbial revolving door of mediocre and less pitchers), I would say that one can never err on the side of having too many pitchers ready to go. Right now, most the of “extra” pitchers they have all have ML experience. And all are a bit better than Sidney Ponson (who I do not mean to disrespect – I thought he gave his all when he was here and I appreciated his accountability). The way it stands now, they shouldn’t have to dip into the AAA pool immediately.
The “what if” concerning injuries to position players ring sort of hollow to me. Yes, it is a possibility that any player or even multiple players get injured. But no team is expected to be three deep in ML-ready-quality guys. For short-term injuries, they will be covered. For longer term, heaven forbid, they will deal with it if the need should arise. May they pay more? Probably.
You can only plan on so many contingencies. And in my mind, planning for pitching shortages makes the most sense. You can never have enough pitching.
January 27th, 2010 at 1:20 pm
Got it GB. I wish you well I know you miss the dog and changing the twin’s diapers..
————————————————————
Well, you’re half right. I’m here to tell you, though, that ain’t gold in them thar diapers. I have no romantic notions about how precious diaper changing can be.
“If Nady didn’t want to play for the Yankees, then I don’t think Boras would’ve presented a final offer of $5m.”
—————————
Boras did not present a “final offer” of 5 million. Boras did not get the 3.3 million dollar offer from the Cubs and then go the Yankees and say 5 million. 5 million was just the number Boras floated the last time they spoke.
There is nothing unfair here. It is in Scott’s best interest to “shop” that offer and it is most definitely in his best interest to do nothing that screws with his biggest client.
There is a reason Boras did not go to the Yankees to see if they would match or beat the Cubs offer.
Chip,
Well the whole reason for having Gaudin on the team is in case someone gets injured. As it stands right now, with everyone healthy, Gaudin is the 12th or 13th pitcher on this staff. He’s here simply if someone is injured.
Lets put this another way. Gaudin does nothing to upgrade the current starting staff. He does very little to upgrade the bullpen. Johnny Damon would have an immediate impact on the starting lineup. He is a significant improvement over Brett Gardner – our starting LF. He also provides insurance against injury or slumps.
It’s pretty obvious that Damon is far more valuable than Gaudin. I don’t think any rational and un-biased baseball fan would disagree with me in this case.
Noreaster -
I’m certainly no Boston fan or apologist, but in recent years they’ve done quite well developing talent (though some of it may be overrated)
1. Dustin Pedroia has an MVP
2. Jon Lester is probably the third best LHP in the AL
3. Youk is a very strong all around player
4. Hanley Ramirez (whom they developed and then turned into Josh Beckett) is one of the best players in baseball
5. Jonathan Paplebon is one of the more consistant closers in the game
Patrick -
I see both of them (Gaudin and Damon) as luxuries. Yes, you’re right – Damon improves the Yankee lineup – but only at the 9 spot and, because he would have to play LF everyday, he actually downgrades the team defensively.
Gaudin provides depth in an area where teams are always looking for depth (pitching). Think of it this way – because the Yankees have so many spot starter/long reliever types in Gaudin, Mitre and Aceves – they can move one of those guys this spring to help them in a position where they’re weaker, like on the bench.
I’m certainly no Boston fan or apologist, but in recent years they’ve done quite well developing talent (though some of it may be overrated)
1. Dustin Pedroia has an MVP
2. Jon Lester is probably the third best LHP in the AL
3. Youk is a very strong all around player
4. Hanley Ramirez (whom they developed and then turned into Josh Beckett) is one of the best players in baseball
5. Jonathan Paplebon is one of the more consistant closers in the game
_____
Really?
Pedroia had no business winning the mvp. (We have Cano)
Papelbon (We have Joba would would be the closer if we didnt have rivera)
Ill give you lester
Youk has been around for a few years now.
Who exactly does boston currently have in the minors? Jed Lowrie?
On Yankees Hot Stove last week, Girardi said there is an open competition for the #5 spot in the rotation among Hughes, Joba, Aceves, Mitre and Gaudin.
Just sayin.
Wave Your Hat
January 27th, 2010 at 1:44 pm
“The Yankees got Gaudin cheap last year because they didn’t really need him. They just wanted him. If they had needed Gaudin (trust me, when a team needs something, other teams know it), it would have cost a lot more than $100,000.”
My memory isn’t what it used to be, but my recollection is that when the Yanks traded for Gaudin, Mitre was our fifth starter. That’s as much need as we’d have this year.
————————————————————
They still didn’t have a dying need for him. They still had guys like Hirsh and others in the minors and pitching well. Gaudin was just a useful arm at what amounted to zero cost. Mitre wasn’t great, but, he wasn’t costing the team wins, either.
“You keep talking about starting pitchers getting injured, what happens if our starting RF gets injured just like last year?”
Pitchers get injured much more often then hitters. The Yankees having a starting quality OF on their bench last year was a huge luxury and something that almost never happens.
“The simple fact is, the pitching depth without Gaudin is still pretty good while the OF depth without Damon is horrendous.”
The pitching depth is not pretty good w/o. You need to stop bringing up Hughes/Chamberlain as depth. They are not depth. One of them is in the BP. It would take weeks for them to get stretched out and be ready to start. Hughes was in the BP last year and was not SP depth. The same thing will happen this year.
Without Gaudin all they have is Mitre, a guy that got hurt as a spot starter last year, and 2 VERY unproven kids in the minors.
mel, I guess that goes to show that the saying about assuming still has some value!
I personally wanted both Matsui and Damon back and was hoping we’d get both. But once Matsui was gone, I saw Damon as possibly a one-year acquisition and when we got Nick J. back I saw Damon as totally expendable – as I do now. Damon’s value for the Yankees is totally with his offense. His offense is not incrementally necessary for the Yankees to win – IMO. That and his four-year demand (first I laughed and then I barfed) caused me to hope he would be anywhere BUT with the Yankees. My fervent hope is that he isn’t brought back. Time will tell.
*****************************
SJ, anyone crowing about how easy it is to get effective pitching has done a total mind melt on the fact that players don’t automatically perform in the Bronx and has also conveniently forgotten how the Yankees set a record for starters in 2008 – that would be the one year in the previous 13 that they didn’t make the playoffs.
Every GMs mantra is that you can never have enough pitching. That’s because they’ve all lived through the nightmare.
“Just sayin.”
What’s your implication by that though? That Gaudin is actually more valuable than we think?
We all know that Hughes or Joba will be in the starting rotation come opening day.
lets go yankees,
Yes Hughes and Chamberlain are depth. Gaudin would be in the bullpen yet you list him as depth. It would take him awhile to stretch out as well. You can’t have it one way with Gaudin and the other way with Hughes/Joba.
GB7-
Well if a starter got hurt, and for some reason Hughes/Chamberlain or Aceves couldn’t start instead, guess who would be the fifth starter? Sergio Mitre. Same as last year.
And if the Pads could have gotten more from another team for Gaudin last year from another team they presumably would have. In this case I believe my point stands.
Noreaster:
Read Law’s piece. He seems to have a different rationale than some of the others who engage in these rankings, and I agree 25 seems too low. The pinch hitter from the last post, Frankie Piliere, posted his rankings yesterday and had the Yankees at what I think was a more reasonable #15 ranking. Oddly, both guys indicated a lack of high impact talent (after Montero of course). Law also suggested the Yankees ranking was impacted by trades of two Top 100 prospects (presumedly Jackson and Vizcaino). Piliere indicated good depth in the system. Link to Piliere’s rankings is:
http://mlb.fanhouse.com/2010/0.....-rankings/
I think most of us are operating on info that was tweeted. Boras offered $5m, and then Nady signed for $3.3 + incentives.
Which might be comparable if he reaches his incentives. Nady might earn more than Damon!
Look, I’m not crying because we didn’t sign Nady. And I really think playing time has something to do with it. Just saying that it must be, um, challenging to have at least 3 clients that play the same position in a crowded market.
Just saying that it’s a little
“You can only plan on so many contingencies. And in my mind, planning for pitching shortages makes the most sense. You can never have enough pitching.”
Doreen I don’t think it’s much of a stretch to say that teams absolutely embrace that premise and attempt to operate around it as much as their budgets (and the availability of pitchers) allow.
I’d take defending World Series Champions over having a ‘top five minor league system’ every season.
The Yankees didn’t have a top 5 system last season and Pena, Robertson, Cervelli, Gardner, Coke, and Aceves all helped them win a title. Plus, Jackson, Kennedy, Melky, Vizciano, Coke, and Dunn were traded for tagible major league players in Grandeson and Vazquez.
Thanks Frank, I’ll check it out.
Patrick -
Just that the Yankees appear to place at least some value on Gaudin. And just like “what if” players a through j get injured, let’s play, what if neither Joba nor Hughes has a good showing – nay – let’s say both have poor showings this spring for one reason or another?
Likely, you’re correct; Hughes or Joba will be the 5th starter. However, I don’t think Gaudin is viewed as chopped liver.
But Girardi did say that even though he has some idea of who he thinks will be #5, he said he will be keeping an open mind.
And no, I don’t think Gaudin is going to be their #5 starter.
But it seems every spring the Yankees encounter some issue with their pitching. Having Gaudin, who is able to spot start or long relieve, is not a luxury.
From an offensive-only standpoint.
Good:
GGBG
Better:
GGBG + ?
Best:
JD
There’s one other thing you’re not really considering and that’s that Gaudin is under contract and Damon’s not. The Yankees can’t simply ask for a “do over” and free up Gaudin’s money to give it to Damon.
Yes, if Damon wants to come to the Yankees and say to Cashman “I’ll take 2 mil” then he’ll be here…but I doubt he’s going to do that. It sounds like he’s going to Oakland. And before he signs there for 4 mil and people start with the “I can’t believe we let him go over 2 million dollars” consider that it might be easier for Damon to go somewhere else for 4 mil than to come to the Yankees for that same amount of money. It’s hard for your ego to accept a paycut that substantial from a place you were just recently so successful.
“But it seems every spring the Yankees encounter some issue with their pitching. Having Gaudin, who is able to spot start or long relieve, is not a luxury.”
But having him for close to $3MM is a luxury.
And Doreen, what if Gaudin pitches to the 5.13 ERA he gave San Diego in 105 innings last year instead of the 3.43 ERA he gave us in 42 innings? His career ERA is 4.50.
Point is, it is unlikely that Gaudin will have a chance to start for us, and then in the case that he does get that chance, there is a definite possibility he won’t pitch all that well. That’s a lot of chances, if the cost is Damon, IMO.
I won’t continue the silliness of deciding that Gaudin needs to go to give the money to Damon. he has value to the team, he costs very little now and even less to acquire. You don’t get a young and flexible arm that did as well as he did in NYY, last year. I certainly never expected it. We’ll find out if it was just a flash, or, did he really learn a few things from the wise old minds of Pettitte, Rivera and Sabathia? He was no more the same pitcher at the end of the year that he was when he joined the team. He picked something up, and that may have been the cutter. Mitre, they can unload as far as I care. I’ll take Hirsh over Mitre.
The debate isn’t who has more value Gaudin or Damon.
The debate is, the Yankees have no interest paying Damon double of what he is asking for at this time.
Nor do they have any interest trading Gaudin or anybody else, to fill any “gaps” Boras/Damon feel there are between the Yankees offer and their demands.
That being the case, Damon’s “value” is much less than his asking price (at least right now) since NOBODY has met his price.
As far as trading pitching, you don’t see a lot of teams trading pitching prior to ST because everybody wants pitching insurance in case guys get hurt.
If they don’t, and you start the season with a full complement of pitchers, you can always wheel one to a team looking for an arm.
Clearly, Cashman is looking to have enough pitching depth to provide him with possible options down the road.
He has already said that he can “move tomorrow” (his words from an interview the other day) on an OF option “at the right time”. Again, his words. Probably meaning when he has exhausted all opportunities with Damon.
They aren’t going to pay him anything close to his asking price. Which, as of last week was 10 million dollars for one season.
If he and Scott are reasonable, they can make a deal. If not, I hope Oakland has money left over for him.
MTU, I don’t think anyone would argue that at this point in time, especially since it’s impossible to evaluate a question mark,
Based on that, I am thankful that the Yankees are not offense poor. I’d hate to think they’d have to be juggling dollars to choose between pitching and offense.
m
This link is a good read for those thinking if Damon doesn’t come back it will make or break the Yankees.
http://www.nj.com/yankees/inde.....eaded.html
Article:Johnny Damon, NY Yankees, headed separate ways.
What’s most telling is Boras’s silence, he’s been unavailable for comment. The fact that he can’t figure out a way to spin the situation speaks volume!
When Cashman used Damon’s physical abilities / and his financial limits quote, it has to be the most polite way of saying “You suck,” to a player in recent memory.
Boras and Damon are trying to engage the Detroit Tigers and Cincinnati Reds as possible alternatives, a baseball source told ESPN.com’s Jerry Crasnick.
Trisha-
Though it may not always seem like it. I am a pitching first type of guy.
Interesting if the “nickname” of the yanks became “The Bronx Pitchers” instead of the “Bombers”.
I don’t think so though because most chicks dig the long ball.
Trisha -
I would never want to witness 2008 again. 2 healthy starters and Andy pitching through pain for half a season, and then roll the dice.
I thought Gaudin and Mitre both did fine jobs for the Yankees last season. Well, Mitre definitely had/has room for improvement, but once he learned that he had to field his position, things got a little better.
I expect him to be more consistent this year, with more time under his belt since his surgery.
I wanted Matsui and Damon back, as well. I think Matsui’s agents were very smart to move him sooner, rather than later, but I will say I was somewhat surprised about how aggressive the Angels were in going after him. Though I shouldn’t have been, I guess. And I thought the initial offer by the Yankees to Damon, which gave him 2 years (even at a reduced salary, the 2 years seemed key to me), was more than fair and I thought he’d take it. When he didn’t, and when Boras started spouting off about Damon’s genetic superiority, I thought the situation was a bit ridiculous. However, I never anticipated this situation. Thought Damon would be long gone.
I like Damon, generally. And if they do end up reaching a deal, it’ll be nice. But if they don’t, I don’t think the Yankees will be too much worse off, if at all. I’m not a huge fan of Brett Gardner, but you have to take the perspective that he’s a #9 hitter who can run a ball down really well, and he can throw better than Damon.
No team can have an all-star at every position plus an all-star waiting in the wings.
And I would safely guess that either Joba or Hughes would be 3 and 4 starters on another team. Both have the talent but are on a stacked rotation of the Yankees. Both pitchers have been highly valued at some point in their careers, But the Yankees do not have the inclination to give them the proper time to develop. High expectations again.
This year Joba or Phil will be the #5. My guess is Joba. If Andy does retire next year that leaves one place in the rotation which management seems to want Lee to fill. And what if good old #4 has a fantastic season – will they keep him??
What then happens to Phil or Joba? Both are too good to be in the pen. Any rotation pitcher worth his salt will make a good bp pitcher.
Does anyone else agree that whoever loses the contest for #5 goes to the pen permanently? What a waste of talent.
gfd,
Wow. That’s the clearest, explicit explanation & timeline of what’s been going on. Thanks for that.
So it really has been chatter, huh?
“Damon’s agent, Scott Boras, was unavailable for comment. Meanwhile, reached by text message on Tuesday night, Damon also said talks never got off the ground since the Yankees’ mid-December acquisition of Nick Johnson.
“Never started again,” Damon said of any negotiations. “They have their budget.”"
GB I totally agree. Obviously the Yankees were happy with what they saw in Gaudin and didn’t see him as a flash in the pan. I think it is downright silly to say that because someone didn’t work out for the Padres, it means they won’t work out. The Yankees are not a stupid organization, nor did they just start in the scouting market yesterday.
If there is a blind spot here, it’s not with the Yankees.
Why ever would you not bring someone back who has just performed well for you, ESPECIALLY when that someone is a pitcher?????????????
The streets are littered with the names of pitchers who came to the Bronx with great promise and couldn’t get the job done. Gaudin got the job done.
Sorry, but duh.
Sherman says Yankees management would’ve presented a $3.3MM expenditure for Xavier Nady to Hal Steinbrenner, had Nady offered to play for them for that amount. Sherman believes the Yanks should find $6MM to offer to Johnny Damon, and Damon ought to accept if they do.
(from mlbtr)
MTU – I swear that you have one chick here that is not at all enamored with the long ball!
Give me a game though where one of our starters is blowing it right by the opposition, I’m coming out of my skin!
Tom in NJ
January 27th, 2010 at 2:11 pm
Boras and Damon are trying to engage the Detroit Tigers and Cincinnati Reds as possible alternatives, a baseball source told ESPN.com’s Jerry Crasnick.
********************
Cincinnati is the new mystery team??
personally I like small ball, I think it is more exciting. I like the games where you have to take chances and manufacture runs, rather than wait for someone to hit a HR. Of course the HRs are fun too.
Doreen, once again you’ve stated it beautifully. I would add to that, not only do teams not have all stars at every position, they don’t need all stars at every position!
Check out your 2009 New York Yankees!!! Nick Swisher, Melky Cabrera, take a bow.
Wave Your Hat -
That could happen. Gaudin could turn out to be awful if he’s called upon.
But the point is anything can happen or anything won’t happen. It’s all “what if” and I don’t do well with “what ifs.”
You plan the best you can within all your limitations and you take as much into consideration as you can and configure your team accordingly.
Sometimes, everything works out and you have a year like last season. Sometimes nothing seems to work out and you have 2008 (or worse).
I’d rather the Yankees head into 2010 ST with a lot of pitching options.
Frankly, for someone who talked about for a year how much he wanted to remain a Yankee and who said it was just a matter of working out a deal, he sure didn’t operate that way at all. And it’s his right to try and get the best deal he can get.
But Damon wasn’t perfect last season. His September was non-existent and his defense was “entertaining” most of the season. I have to wonder, if not for the two-stolen-base play, including the great at-bat preceding it, would as many people still be all in on Johnny? He is not a 100% full-bodied athlete anymore. His biggest value to the Yankees in 2010 was supposed to be as a DH and part-time outfielder. And in that role, 2 years/14 million was a good salary.
Boras tried to sell it as the same Johnny Damon the Yankees got 4 years ago. And as much as I like Johnny, that guy is long gone. He is no longer a premier centerfielder. And his calves and vision and other maladies are beginning to take a toll on his playing time, which now has to be “managed.”
I think I’m talking myself out of Johhny D!
(Of course, that means I expect to hear that he’s re-signed any minute now.)
Please, for the love of all that’s holy let this Damon thing end this week. This is getting so redundant I find myself longing for the good old days of discussing whether or not Joba should start or relieve.
I like exciting catches in the outfield, OF assists to homeplate, and our pitchers making other batters look silly!
Down to Reed Johnson, Rocco Baldelli, and Randy Winn. Chip, you must be in heaven.
I do not think the Yankees are sunk with Gardner in left field. However, anyone who thinks that Gardner has value like Damon isn’t watching the same games I watch. Gardner is a valuable 4th outfielder. He will, as I and others have expressed, be exposed if he bats 500 times.
I believe the pennant race will be close and a good left fielding hitter can certainly make a difference. If the Yankees truly cannot afford Damon, so be it. To “teach Boras a lesson” as some have suggested is quite a foolish way to do business.
Further, to suggest Damon has a value of $2M flies in the face of signings such as Cameron, Nady, Ankiel seems inapprropriate. I predict he will be signed, and likely by another team, in the $5-6 M range.
Cashman has convinced me that the Yankees will not be a player for Damon.
m
How Boras has handled this whole offseason, his misreading of the market, and of Cashman’s willingness to stick to his budget
.Boras as someone said on earlier threads should be sued for malpractice if Damon signs anything less than 2/14.
Damon,his wife, and Boras chose to speak to the press instead of Cashman. Boras was too busy looking for his infamous ” mystery sucker team” to buy into his fantasy.
I hope he goes to an NL team, because he will have to play the field, which will show what objective people know about his defense. An AL team could use him for as a DH, and low ball his pay him accordingly!
Damon might be on another team, at this late stage who ever the team is , are looking for a bargain at their price.
“No team can have an all-star at every position plus an all-star waiting in the wings”.
i’d be happy with a decent ml lf & a 4th outfielder
“Frankly, for someone who talked about for a year how much he wanted to remain a Yankee and who said it was just a matter of working out a deal, he sure didn’t operate that way at all. And it’s his right to try and get the best deal he can get.”
———————————————————
I think Damon has a history of doing these things.
In the final year of his contract with Boston he said the same things and even publically stated at a news conference in the spring that he would under no circumstances sign with the Yankees.
I don’t fault a guy for signing the best financial contract….just don’t say you are not going to do something and then turn around and do it.
“No team can have an all-star at every position”
No team with Swisher starting needs to worry about this.
Well, Nady obviously really wanted to be a Cub; perhaps he thinks he’ll be the one to break the jinx.
ESPN is a disgrace. The Yankees just won the WS and they are considered near the bottom of the mid-pack amongst organizations while the Sox are #2? IMO, it’s not worth reading – why waste valuable time?
trisha – OPPC forever – (new lucky picture from last day at the old Stadium) BRING ON THE GHOSTS!
January 27th, 2010 at 2:13 pm
GB I totally agree. Obviously the Yankees were happy with what they saw in Gaudin and didn’t see him as a flash in the pan. I think it is downright silly to say that because someone didn’t work out for the Padres, it means they won’t work out. The Yankees are not a stupid organization, nor did they just start in the scouting market yesterday.
If there is a blind spot here, it’s not with the Yankees.
Why ever would you not bring someone back who has just performed well for you, ESPECIALLY when that someone is a pitcher?????????????
The streets are littered with the names of pitchers who came to the Bronx with great promise and couldn’t get the job done. Gaudin got the job done.
Sorry, but duh.
————————————————————
I don’t know if Gaudin will repeat his last half a season or not, but, whenever they showed the bullpen on camera, Gaudin was sitting next to Rivera and Robertson and Hughes was on the other side. They weren’t just watching the game, either. More than a few times, they all had a baseball in their hands, copying Rivera, so Mo had his class in session. Gaudin was always there. He also spent a lot of time talking to Pettitte. Again, there is that Loosiana connection. Pettitte isn’t just some big, dumb swamp kid. He’s smart and he knows pitching. I see a long line in that connection from guidry to Ray Fontenot to Pettitte and now Gaudin to maybe Jeremy Bleich. All Louisiana swap kids. Interestingly, Gaudin and Bleich are from the same city of Metairie, Louisiana.
Betsy
January 27th, 2010 at 2:40 pm
Well, Nady obviously really wanted to be a Cub; perhaps he thinks he’ll be the one to break the jinx.
*********************
I think he just really loves the city of Chicago
Tom in NJ
January 27th, 2010 at 2:11 pm
“Boras and Damon are trying to engage the Detroit Tigers and Cincinnati Reds as possible alternatives, a baseball source told ESPN.com’s Jerry Crasnick.”
I find that rumor interesting. What came out wasn’t that the Tigers/Reds are interested in Damon, but that Boras is “trying to engage” them. I think people in baseball are enjoying seeing Boras in this position. When there have been leaks about supposed interest in Damon, we usually see a quick denial–like the Tigers previously saying they had no contact or talk about the Braves not having any free money or most recently after the A’s signed Sheets and Olney reported that they were still talking it came out that Beane considered a utility infielder as his priority. I think Cash is also taking part in this with his recent statements. Basically, these people are ensuring that Boras doesn’t manufacture any leverage by falsely linking his client to their team.
DaSaint –
I’m fine with it.
It’s not that I think any of those guys are great players but I’m realistic about what the Yankees need. A right handed hitting outfielder to fill out their bench and bat in the 9 spot from time to time (and maybe keep Brett Gardner honest this spring). Not exactly a job you need an All-Star for.
By the way – I’m now on a Alfredo Aceves for Delwyn Young kick…just to keep you current.
mel, I’ll tell you what takes my breath away, besides all of those things you’ve mentioned. A really beautifully turned DP. Or Robby effortless reaching his glove out and catching a ball that was probably not going to be caught by another 2B!
This is truth as we speak. Of all the things I’ve watched happen at the Stadium, one that stands out in my mind was watching a Travis Fryman, Omar Vizquel, Robbie Alomar infield turn one of the most amazing DPs I’ve ever seen turned at the Stadium, or probably ever seen turned. I remember calling it at the time “poetry in motion” and the sheer beauty of it actually brought tears to my eyes. Literally. (We know I cry easily but I don’t remember that many DPs actually moving me to tears.)
Great defense and pitching absolutely blow me away. Maybe it helps explain why I don’t really care whether we see Damon again. Well one of the reasons, anyway.
Offense, it’s okay.
Upstate – I absolutely feel the same way about small ball. The beauty of a successful sac fly – someone beating out a bunt. Give me it any day of the week.
“ESPN is a disgrace. The Yankees just won the WS and they are considered near the bottom of the mid-pack amongst organizations while the Sox are #2?”
One has nothing to do with the other.
It’s one guy’s ranking of the minor league systems as presently comprised, not the organization as a whole (where undoubtedly the Yankees would rank very high).
DaSaint007
January 27th, 2010 at 2:26 pm
Down to Reed Johnson, Rocco Baldelli, and Randy Winn. Chip, you must be in heaven.
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Are you kidding? NYY missed out on Ryan Church. He’s crest fallen.
The Yankees do need another OF. That is true. A good bench guy. (Sure wish Hairston was still here.)
If you get Damon, Gardner is on the bench, but all he offers, right now, is speed and someone to give Damon a break.
I don’t know…
Well though I’d take you guys every day of the week over shopping at the mall, I did tell a friend I’d go shopping with her and she has just arrived.
STOP CHEERING!
Later y’all.
m
The only people I’m sad about losing is Matsui. Cashman acted too slow in reaching out to his a,gent and Wang. I can live with the others even if I don’t agree with some who left.
Don’t think for one moment the rest of the team’s players aren’t paying attention to the Bors/Damon saga play out.
Jeter/ Mo will get good contracts, because both are still at the top of their games.
trisha – OPPC forever – (new lucky picture from last day at the old Stadium) BRING ON THE GHOSTS!
January 27th, 2010 at 2:46 pm
Or Robby effortless reaching his glove out and catching a ball that was probably not going to be caught by another 2B!
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that’s my favorite thing!!! There aren’t enough words for how much I love Cano
More than a few times, they all had a baseball in their hands, copying Rivera, so Mo had his class in session. Gaudin was always there.
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I think Rivera’s next contract should be as a player/bullpen coach.
Catching up on Heroes yesterday. They brought up the name Bruce Banner. Wasnt his name David Banner in the old hulk shows with Ferigno? Who is Bruce,his son?
that’s my favorite thing!!! There aren’t enough words for how much I love Cano
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Oh boy!? First we have Erica with Damon now this. Who’s Igawas pretend boyfriend?
My bad meant girlfriend. Or did i?
S.o.S.
January 27th, 2010 at 2:52 pm
that’s my favorite thing!!! There aren’t enough words for how much I love Cano
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Oh boy!? First we have Erica with Damon now this. Who’s Igawas pretend boyfriend?
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LOL
I don’t know if you’ll have any takers on Igawa. Ladies, any volunteers??
I may not see things as clearly as the experts on this blog but this is how I evaluate who is more important between Damon and Gaudin (if that is what the argument is).
Would you be more comfortable seeing:
1) Damon at bat bottom of the 9th bases loaded 2 outs with the yankees losing 2-1 (papelbon pitching)
2) Gaudin pitching bottom of the ninth bases loaded 2 outs with the yankees winning 2-1 (youkilis batting)
Damon did speak about wanting to stay with the Yankee, they are the best team he’s worked for, he knows he’ll have to take a pay cut.
Until Scott slapped his butt back to BORASVILLE quick! Then he started talking out the side of his head. You know the rest
S.o.S.
January 27th, 2010 at 2:50 pm
More than a few times, they all had a baseball in their hands, copying Rivera, so Mo had his class in session. Gaudin was always there.
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I think Rivera’s next contract should be as a player/bullpen coach.
Catching up on Heroes yesterday. They brought up the name Bruce Banner. Wasnt his name David Banner in the old hulk shows with Ferigno? Who is Bruce,his son?
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Bruce was David’s life partner.
S.o.S.
January 27th, 2010 at 2:52 pm
that’s my favorite thing!!! There aren’t enough words for how much I love Cano
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Oh boy!? First we have Erica with Damon now this. Who’s Igawas pretend boyfriend?
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Christina25. It’s a guarantee that’s not her age.
Doreen,
I know that Gardner’s bat is a big question (gotta remember he’s barely graduated rookie status), but sitting Gardner means sitting one of the team’s best defenders.
I will welcome Damon with open arms (if Erica doesn’t knock everyone down trying to get to him), but I’d like to see if Gardner can be an everyday player.
“No team can have an all-star at every position.”
I don’t remember anyone saying the Yankees could do that. I believe what is being said is that Gardner is not good enough to be a starter on a good major league team. Is that clear?
I also think the question of who starts if an outfielder is injured. Does anyone really want Hoffman who couldn’t make the Dodgers’ 40 man roster to be starting in that event? Nor do I want any of the other leftovers in that position.
I have a different take than others on Nady. I presume Boras is being told over and over by Cashman than they have only $2M to spend. Why wouldn’t Boras gladly accept a deal from the Cubs that guarantees more and can make Nady $5.3M?
Don’t we have a fast gritty, gutsy, plus defender with an arm who can also hit at least .270 already?? And isn’t he being ignored for a starting role?
I mean I know it is good to have as many people as possible for OF but lets not pretend this is something new for the Yankees.
Betsy –
The Yankees take a hit because evaluators hold their money against them. the theory is that they don’t have to be great talent evaluators because they can use their money to cover up mistakes and that it doesn’t take much strategy to go out and say “buy me Sabathia, AJ and Tex.”
It’s BS but I would rather win WS than the respect of writers.
Man I’m glad Cashman is not in love with Damon, bag calves and noodle arm an all.
Thank You Cashman for a clear objective head!
Beret –
I’m fine with Church going to the Pirates – just means the Yankees can trade for him midseason.
It’s one guy’s ranking of the minor league systems as presently comprised, not the organization as a whole (where undoubtedly the Yankees would rank very high).
___
even so, i would love to know what boston has that makes them second to texas while the yankees with all the talent they have in the minors (minus aaa outfielders), is somehow 25th.
Bruce was David’s life partner.
========
GB7,
Im thinking he was David morphed into Hulk and came back as Bruce. Seriously, stop pulling my leg. You probably watch the shows(not sure if they had some episodes in black and white). The original Hulk was David, isnt it?
Thanks GB, I can imagine how he feels.
Chip, thanks for the update. Ok, I was about to throw one at you, but you know, I’m ok with the roster right now.
Do I think Hoffmann sticks? No.
Do I think Boone Logan sticks? No.
Do I think Gardner will be the reason the team loses a bunch of games? No.
Do I expect Mitre and/or Gaudin to be traded? Yes.
Will there be mid-season pickups? Yes.
Can we win 100 games with the current team? Yes.
Can we win a WS with the current team? Yes.
Frankly, that’s all that matters.
Its an apples and oranges comparison since Mo, and not Gaudin, would be pitching in a 2-1 game against the Red Sox.
Try again.
I got a geek alert, what’s up?
Oh, Hulk question.
His name was Bruce Banner in the original comic (Stan Lee was big on alliterative names: Peter Parker, Reed Richards).
I don’t know why it became David Banner in the tv show. I think it was later established in the comic that David Bruce Banner was his full name.
I was never much of a Hulk fan; he rarely had much to say.
m
January 27th, 2010 at 2:59 pm
Doreen,
I know that Gardner’s bat is a big question (gotta remember he’s barely graduated rookie status), but sitting Gardner means sitting one of the team’s best defenders.
I will welcome Damon with open arms (if Erica doesn’t knock everyone down trying to get to him), but I’d like to see if Gardner can be an everyday player.
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Erica is not a happy camper today and is continuing her boycott of everything!!!!!!
However, I am getting a ton of work done!
LOL
I don’t know if you’ll have any takers on Igawa. Ladies, any volunteers??
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If all else fails, we can always have a sketch competition. Winning sketch goes to Kei.
Besides, as I’ve said before…two more moves to make before ST.
m -
As much as I am “hedgy” about Gardner, I would prefer him to be the “almost every day” player in lf at this point. I think he was making a good showing last season just as he got hurt, and he does deserve that chance this year. I think his development as a player suffers if Damon comes back.
Like you, if Damon comes back, it will be a warm welcome, but if he doesn’t, I (and the Yankees) will survive. Erica, not so much.
Erica,
GTK! And on a side note, I’ve already done my taxes!
It is ridiculous to rank the farm system #25. It defies everybody who does that kind of thing for a living and speaks to a larger agenda.
The writer though is welcome to see the 2009 World Series Trophy at the Stadium anytime though.
Thanks, Frank. Still,the Sox at #2? From what I’ve read, almost all of their talent is in the very low minors. Eh, it’s ESPN – it’s annoying, but I don’t take anything they say seriously.
Chip, it is BS…..especially since the Yankees talent evaluation has been much better since Cashman grabbed full control. Given that our youngsters played a key roll in the Yankees winning the WS, I’m very happy with where we stand.
“2) Gaudin pitching bottom of the ninth bases loaded 2 outs with the yankees winning 2-1 (youkilis batting)”
I’d be troubled by the number of injured pitchers it would require to create this particular scenario.
S.o.S.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:08 pm
If all else fails, we can always have a sketch competition. Winning sketch goes to Kei.
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Sounds like a plan
Putting money (or salary) aside, Damon is NOT a difference maker. You don’t hold Damon in the same breath as Mark Teixeira who despite some rocky times at the plate during the postseason, never let it affect his value with his glove at which he excelled in critical occasions.
Curtis Granderson is a nice addition to the 2010 team but Cashman may have already secured his difference maker in Javy Vasquez who has clearly solidified the No. 4 spot in the starting rotation as a true innings eater. That one move did fill a void and allows time for Chamberlain and Hughes to sort themselves out.
i know that if we can get past a month or so of gardner’s inability to hit, he will get better, we just have to get past that point. since there is no melky (which is sad) to take the job back from him, this could be his chance, although i feel that at the least, there will be someone sharing lf with him (unless he plays cf and grandy plays left).
“Its an apples and oranges comparison since Mo, and not Gaudin, would be pitching in a 2-1 game against the Red Sox.
Try again.”
All right, I’ll take a stab. Would I rather see:
1) Damon at bat bottom of the 9th bases loaded 2 outs with the yankees losing 2-1 (papelbon pitching)
2) Gaudin pitching top of the fourth, Yanks down 8-2 (don’t care who’s hitting; don’t care how many outs).
Ooh, let me think hard here.
jk, don’t go all serious on me here.
Thanks Geek Squad for clarifying it. My last option was going to be getting that number they have on commercials(if you have any questions, not sure if it was only sports related)where Buckner was the answer. Im glad it didnt come to that.
Get this:
http://insider.espn.go.com/mlb.....id=4861174
15. New York Mets
It’s fashionable in New York to bash their system, but productive international scouting continues to bail out their draft efforts, which are repeatedly hamstrung by ownership’s refusal to exceed slot in the first few rounds.
25. New York Yankees
Lost picks and trades depleted the system; they traded two guys currently in the top 100. After Jesus Montero, the next impact guys are probably Slade Heathcott and Gary Sanchez, with three pro games combined to date, while their highest-ceiling arm, Andrew Brackman, struggled with command in his first full year back from Tommy John surgery.
DaSaint -
I disagree with you on Hoffmann not sticking with the club. The Yankees targeted him for a reason and given the way the bench looks right now there’s no reason they can’t carry a good glove man like Hoffmann on it as the 25th man on the roster.
I also think Logan will probably stick around to give the club a second left handed option.
I think Mitre and Gaudin stick and Aceves is the one of that trio to be traded (simply because he’s going to have the most value given his contract)
I do think they’ll look to upgrade their bench at some point (maybe bring in both Hairstons from San Diego)
Javy Vazquez will not be as great as he was last year, but we know he will likely eat innings and be decent, but 225 innings wont matter if he stinks it up. that being said, i think he can put up a sub 4 era and that should be enough.
Putting the Mutts ahead of the Yankees is bad enough (please), but the stuff about the Yankees is insane. I’ve never liked Keith Law – actually, I detest him – but this is bad even for him.
m
January 27th, 2010 at 3:09 pm
Erica,
GTK! And on a side note, I’ve already done my taxes!
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The IRS is on my crap list too this week cause they lied last year about the 2009 deductions available to people who bought cars in 2009.
I can’t even do my taxes yet cause I am still waiting on 1099s. Which is kind of annoying cause I would really like my refund.
Betsy -
It’s Keith Law – you’re giving him way too much thought. He understands very little about baseball and a great deal about how saying idiotic things gets people to talk about you.
Doreen – Ain’t it Just “Grand”?
January 27th, 2010 at 3:09 pm
Like you, if Damon comes back, it will be a warm welcome, but if he doesn’t, I (and the Yankees) will survive. Erica, not so much.
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I’ll survive in the end but the all out hissy fit will not be pretty.
25. New York Yankees
Lost picks and trades depleted the system; they traded two guys currently in the top 100. After Jesus Montero, the next impact guys are probably Slade Heathcott and Gary Sanchez, with three pro games combined to date, while their highest-ceiling arm, Andrew Brackman, struggled with command in his first full year back from Tommy John surgery
____
Like usual, ESPN does next to no research. i can think of 5-10 people who are closer to the top than Brackman, and while Montero is way about the others, there are still above average miLB players on our team waiting to move up.
Remember, if Law was any good at talent evaluation then in this era when teams are looking for young, stat oriented guys to run their front offices Law would be working in baseball rather than for ESPN.
Erica – always OPPC – Bring Back Johnny!!!!
January 27th, 2010 at 3:16 pm
Doreen – Ain’t it Just “Grand”?
January 27th, 2010 at 3:09 pm
Like you, if Damon comes back, it will be a warm welcome, but if he doesn’t, I (and the Yankees) will survive. Erica, not so much.
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I’ll survive in the end but the all out hissy fit will not be pretty.
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Don’t worry-if that’s the case I’ll send Ernie and Bert along with Super Grover to see you
Erica – always OPPC – Bring Back Johnny!!!!
January 27th, 2010 at 3:16 pm
Doreen – Ain’t it Just “Grand”?
January 27th, 2010 at 3:09 pm
Like you, if Damon comes back, it will be a warm welcome, but if he doesn’t, I (and the Yankees) will survive. Erica, not so much.
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I’ll survive in the end but the all out hissy fit will not be pretty.
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Don’t worry-if that’s the case I’ll send Ernie and Bert along with Super Grover to see you
austinmac -
If the Yankees could find better than Gardner, that would be wonderful. But right now, for their budget, they’re not going to find anyone who is all that much better.
And no, no one ever comes out and says the Yankees must have an all-star at every position, and one in the wings as well. However, a funny thing happens when people start talking specifics. No player is ever good enough. And if there is a need, there is always the “why can’t the Yankees go after (fill in the blank all-star)?” refrain.
I am not a rah-rah GGBG person. To me he is lacking in some skills. But he didn’t fail miserably last year (until after his injury) and he is not being asked by the Yankees to do more than he can do. He is being asked to play LF, and most likely to platoon in LF, and bat 9th. The season will not hinge on Gardner.
And it will not hinge on not having Johnny Damon.
Texas and Tampa have had top minor league systems for the last ten years. They can account for 1 division/league title between them.
Sorry for the double post. I hate it when I do that.
If Gardner is the starting lf or cf, my hope is he shows enough promise to play everyday and not platoon unless we need a homerun late against a lefty. i think it is better to have 8 players who know they are starting everyday unless they have a rest day.
So im looking at some mock drafts. As a Colts fan it really sucks winning a Super Bowl and having the last pick. All the good guys have already been taken. Then the Raiders ruin them and start all over. Sort of like what the Clippers do. Hope we find a diamond in the ruff.
Erica, if it makes you feel any better, you can put HISSSSS in the memo line when you cut me that $25 check.
DaSaint007
January 27th, 2010 at 3:08 pm
Besides, as I’ve said before…two more moves to make before ST.
……………………
A good guess would be a complimentary LH in the bullpen for Marte as one of the moves along with a leftfielder.
If Boone Logan doesn’t prove out then Royce Ring is a consideration.
Chip, Law just despises the Yankees. I’m sure Romine (my favorite prospect) is going to a good major leaguer, if not better. I just hate his attitude – he’s so obnoxious. It also didn’t help his cause with me that he’s trashed Phil Hughes for the better part of 3 years, lol.
igawa should have a chance to be the second lefty.
SJ44
January 27th, 2010 at 3:06 pm
Its an apples and oranges comparison since Mo, and not Gaudin, would be pitching in a 2-1 game against the Red Sox.
Try again.
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SJ44 I realize that but for comparison sake I used those situations. I also would prefer about 4 or 5 other yankees (or ex yankees – i.e. matsui) at bat in that situation – but again the argument was who is more valuable between Damon and Gaudin. Maybe i should have said the 17th inning which would be more the case that Gaudin would be pitching.
Also not wanting to be a smarta** but its not all that unreasonable to assume that Mo won’t be able to pitch every 9 inning during a 162 game stretch – what if Mo had pitched the last 4 games and wasn’t available for that game. Again its just an exercise that I would use to determine who is more valuable to the yankees – you can totally disagree with my thinking and you wouldn’t be wrong.
Chip, Law just despises the Yankees. I’m sure Romine (my favorite prospect) is going to a good major leaguer, if not better. I just hate his attitude – he’s so obnoxious. It also didn’t help his cause with me that he’s trashed Phil Hughes for the better part of 3 years, lol.
___
Laird, Pena, Corona, Montero, Romine, the other 3 catchers, a bunch of starting pitchers, Melancon, and then the guys in low A.
Say it again GB! OK, I’ll repeat what he said:
Texas and Tampa have had top minor league systems for the last ten years. They can account for 1 division/league title between them.
Stop overreacting folks! Speaking of which, GGBG will be an insignificant problem if he’s the full-time LF. How many of you clamored for Swisher to be on this team before Cashman stole him anyway?
“Javy Vazquez will not be as great as he was last year”
You never know. He’s easily the 2nd best starter on this team. I think he does pretty well this time around. 15-18 wins with an ERA in the high 3′s.
And I still don’t understand what’s the difference whether Gardner plays CF or LF, since I imagine the lineup itself wouldn’t change at all. I will never, ever understand that logic. The only way it makes sense is if DEFENSIVELY Gardner is a better CF than Granderson. Right now, I would go with the guy who is most comfortable taking charge out there and that would be Granderson, I would think.
Erin
January 27th, 2010 at 3:18 pm
Don’t worry-if that’s the case I’ll send Ernie and Bert along with Super Grover to see you
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Awwww- this post makes me happy. I am glad you sent it twice!
tex’s friend
January 27th, 2010 at 3:23 pm
igawa should have a chance to be the second lefty.
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Actually, he does. He has three chances. Slim, none and somewhere else.
Nick in SF
January 27th, 2010 at 3:22 pm
Erica, if it makes you feel any better, you can put HISSSSS in the memo line when you cut me that $25 check.
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Still not convinced it will come to that, but if it does….
I just might do that
If we just trade for Pujols and convert him to a left fielder. Ill be able to sleep better at night.
This has gotta be one of the slowest most boring month of action ever. I enjoyed the Clemens wife is on roids more than Damon this Damon that. Gardner cant hit a ball past a little league infield.
BTW, does Erica know that Erica talks like Rickey Henderson at times?
According to http://www.detroit.tigers.mlb.com Austin Jackson was only signed to a 1 tear contract along with 6 others. They traded Curtis for a 1 year trial contract player, whoa.
Brewers just claimed Joe Inglett off minors.
FYI…Damon is 0-13 lifetime vs. Papelbon.
May have to try another example to express your displeasure.
Slim
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GB7,
This reminds me of the movie Dumb and Dumber when he asks the girl “what are the chances of a guy like you and a girl like me hooking up”. She says 1 and a million. His response is “Yes!! So your saying theres a chance!!”
Dont give him false hope.
You never know. He’s easily the 2nd best starter on this team. I think he does pretty well this time around. 15-18 wins with an ERA in the high 3’s.
__
i agree with this but my point is last year his era was sub 3 and there is almost no chance he does that in the AL East.
16-18 wins and sub 4 era is what i consider more than enough.
braeden January 27th, 2010 at 3:28 pm
According to http://www.detroit.tigers.mlb.com Austin Jackson was only signed to a 1 tear contract along with 6 others. They traded Curtis for a 1 year trial contract player, whoa.
Uhhh, might want to read up on how MLB contracts work and report back…;)
Doreen – Ain’t it Just “Grand”?
January 27th, 2010 at 3:25 pm
And I still don’t understand what’s the difference whether Gardner plays CF or LF, since I imagine the lineup itself wouldn’t change at all. I will never, ever understand that logic. The only way it makes sense is if DEFENSIVELY Gardner is a better CF than Granderson. Right now, I would go with the guy who is most comfortable taking charge out there and that would be Granderson, I would think.
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I believe that some think that Gardner’s speed will help Swisher cover more of the right center field gap. It very well may, because that’s what Gardner does best….run very fast to his right and left.
“Austin Jackson was only signed to a 1 tear contract along with 6 others.”
He’s under the Tigers control for the next years. A one year deal is usually the way it’s done when a player is at the stage in his career where Jackson is.
Chad Gaudin won’t be pitching in save situations for the Yankees.
The issue isn’t who is more valuable. The issue is money.
The Yankees have no intention of paying Damon the money he is looking for.
As of right now, neither is anybody else.
Fans may not like it but, the Yankees correctly evaluated the market for Damon.
He can sign with the Yankees for what they believe his value is or he can go elsewhere.
Either way, the Yankees aren’t bidding against themselves on this one and aren’t exactly hurting as a team going into the season.
*next SIX years
SJ44
January 27th, 2010 at 3:30 pm
FYI…Damon is 0-13 lifetime vs. Papelbon.
May have to try another example to express your displeasure.
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So what you’re saying is that he is due for a hit!! (insert winky smily face here)
Last Time I checked it was still January and the Yankees still have an open slot on the 40 man roster. Also, Damon has had almost no interest from other teams.
I believe the Yankees have the luxury of time. We on the other hand want to know now!! LOL! Damon may or may not be back.
Possibilities are:
1. Bring Damon back.
2. Sign a few potentials OF on FA market to a minor league contract with an invite to ST.
3. Go into the Spring with the motley crew of youngsters. Trade for someone after AS break if needed.
4. Trade for a Starting corner OF before ST.
None of these options seem that bad to me, except the basic I don’t know what they are thinking thought. I believe the Yankees have several plans, including Pitching options. Unfortunately, since we are the 25th rated Minor League system, we will just have to wait and see.
Pujols played the outfield , wasn’t good before St Louis decided to spare his arm, that constantly requires a tune up evety offseason.
“FYI…Damon is 0-13 lifetime vs. Papelbon.
May have to try another example to express your displeasure.”
Dang, who knew SJ44 was conversant with the “vs pitcher” split function?
OK, Johnny Damon up, bottom of the seventh, two out, two on, Yanks down 3-1 vs King Felix.
How’s that?
“i agree with this but my point is last year his era was sub 3 and there is almost no chance he does that in the AL East.”
Got it. You’re right. Doubt he’ll even be sub 3.5, but I do think he improves on his career AL ERA of around 4.50. More mature pitcher, and still has the goods. I think he has a nice year.
S.o.S.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:30 pm
Slim
=======
GB7,
This reminds me of the movie Dumb and Dumber when he asks the girl “what are the chances of a guy like you and a girl like me hooking up”. She says 1 and a million. His response is “Yes!! So your saying theres a chance!!”
Dont give him false hope.
————————————————————
Not sure that’s the most flattering comment that I’ve ever had. Now, you make me feel like I just ripped off a line from one of the stupidest movies ever. I need to watch something more intelligent, I guess. Something with Rodney Dangerfield, I think.
S.o.S.
January 27th, 2010 at 3:27 pm
BTW, does Erica know that Erica talks like Rickey Henderson at times?
***************
Yes, she is aware. But Erica sometimes feels the 3rd person is the best way to voice her feelings
New post.
SJ44
January 27th, 2010 at 3:33 pm
Chad Gaudin won’t be pitching in save situations for the Yankees.
The issue isn’t who is more valuable. The issue is money.
The Yankees have no intention of paying Damon the money he is looking for.
As of right now, neither is anybody else.
Fans may not like it but, the Yankees correctly evaluated the market for Damon.
He can sign with the Yankees for what they believe his value is or he can go elsewhere.
Either way, the Yankees aren’t bidding against themselves on this one and aren’t exactly hurting as a team going into the season.
**************
My apologies for arriving to the party late but I think the issue that was brewing on this blog between Gaudin and Damon was about the money. I think the issue was why not trade Gaudin and his $3 million salary so that you can offer Damon that 3 mill plus the other 2 million that was available.
I personally don’t think either one is going to make much of an impact either way (unless there are injuries of course)I was just trying to express my view of how to determine who would have a bigger impact to the team.
CHIP WINS..
Yankees just signed Randy Winn – start the complaining…
Chad-
Where is the link to the new post?? (Even though I know what it says and I don’t like it)
MLB Traded Rumors
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/.....-winn.html
Doreen–I agree Gardner didn’t “fail miserably” before his injury. That does seems to me to be too low a standard on a championship contending club. I’d like at least average. Chips recommendations are looking okay to me, but I always liked DeJesus.
Erica–Whatever happens, we at Lohud are here for you. Well, most of us anyway.
GB7,
“I just ripped off a line from one of the stupidest movies ever.”
Take that back. It might have been Dumb, but certainly not stupid.
Yankees just signed Randy Winn – start the complaining…
=======
Erica,
Third person time!!
Winn made his Major League debut on May 11, 1998 as a pinch runner for the Devil Rays. On October 3, 1999, he hit an inside-the-park grand slam against the New York Yankees. No player has hit one since.
Sab
2) Gaudin pitching bottom of the ninth bases loaded 2 outs with the yankees winning 2-1 (youkilis batting)
i guess in this scenario Mo suddenly and without warning retired the day before or that afternoon right?
Sorry Erica.
Golson a Bubba Crosby redux?
I don’t like the Winn signing at all and it has nothing to do with not bringing back Damon. I would have liked to have seen them go younger.
I suppose all this is to make a run at Crawford next year.
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