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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Hasn’t and Can’t

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jan 31, 2010 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Alex Rodriguez heard the taunts, and he knew he had the numbers to back them up. One of the best players in the game had been dreadful in the playoffs, and he seemed to be taking the Yankees down with him. 

Until 2009.

“It was good because I was so tired of hearing that,” Rodriguez said in a YES Network interview. “I mean, it was exhausting, to be honest with you. It was so frustrating to go in every postseason with all the expectations and ambitions to do well, and three, four games (later) and we were right back in Miami and to our (respective) homes. It was frustrating, painful.

“For me, I was just so tired of the whole ‘unclutch’ thing. It was just very annoying, but to come over and be part of a championship team and get some of the biggest hits of my career and to deliver for my teammates when they needed me, that certainly feels really good and I’m very relieved.”

As Jay pointed out this morning, that’s the difference between “hasn’t” and “can’t.”

Javier Vazquez has pitched 15.2 innings in the playoffs, and the results haven’t been pretty, but Vazquez has been a pretty good pitcher in his career. As fourth starters go, he’s been terrific. More than clutch, the Yankees need Vazquez to be available and reliable. They need him to bring stability at the back of the rotation, something that was missing through much of last season.

If he helps the Yankees get to the playoffs, or if his turn in the rotation falls on key dates, the Yankees will have to take their chances that Vazquez can do what Rodriguez did and quiet the naysayers.

Comments

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355 Responses to “Hasn’t and Can’t”

  1. Alvaro Fernandez Ravelo January 31st, 2010 at 12:32 pm

    CC didn’t had great postseason numbers before joining the Yankees.

  2. raymagnetic January 31st, 2010 at 12:45 pm

    Many people said the same things about CC before last year as well.

    If a player is a good as Rodriguez is then given enough opportunities he will quiet all of the naysayers.

  3. Bodhisattva - Destiny Wears Pinstripes January 31st, 2010 at 12:45 pm

    Javy’s a good pitcher whose home park will not be the best for him. I don’t buy, any way, the notion that he’s “soft.”

    But comparing Javy and Alex doesn’t really hold up.

    Alex Rodriguez is a transcendent talent. I would imagine Alex’s biggest detractors weren’t surprised at what he did in 2009 postseason – only disappointed at the inevitable.

    Different deal.

  4. Bodhisattva - Destiny Wears Pinstripes January 31st, 2010 at 12:46 pm

    CC is also at another level, plus our park is much kinder to LHP.

  5. Sara January 31st, 2010 at 12:49 pm

    We lose Melky, Matsui and Damon…..We gain Granderson, Javy, Winn and just MAYBE get Damon back ?….Even without that last nugget, the Yankees ARE improved. Javy will be a HUGE upgrade from last year IF he is the 4th starter, and I think AJ/Andy/Javy is FAR from a guaranteed “order” of the 3 behind CC when all is said and done. Granderson as our everyday centerfielder is a HUGE upgrade from last season. Nick Johnson will be comparable to the production of Matsui, VERY likely this is the case. Having Winn and Gardner as the platoon in left field is NOT as good offensively as having Damon out there, BUT defensively it is an improvement, so that right there is a WASH….and IF, just IF, we can get Damon to take that 6mil offer after all….having Winn and/or Gardner as the 4th OF ( with Possibly Gardner traded mid-season for whatever need may come up at that time ? ) is at LEAST equal to having Melky in that spot. Everyone needs to calm down and bask in this: the Yankees are the World Series Champions, and by all accounts should be favorites to repeat AND COMPETE for that title for many years to come. These are GREAT problems to have and now that we have title number 27 FINALLY in hand, we will see 28, 29 & 30 MUCH quicker than anyone expects, IMHO.

  6. upstate kate January 31st, 2010 at 12:50 pm

    CC was able to get some rest before the post season w/ the Yankees. His prior teams did not have that luxury.

  7. Jim Mason January 31st, 2010 at 12:50 pm

    “Alex Rodriguez is a transcendent talent.”

    with the help of roids and hgh

  8. Jim Mason January 31st, 2010 at 12:51 pm

    No one said that about CC – he had to pitch his team in to barely make the playoffs every turn on short rest. no comparison

  9. Rich in NJ January 31st, 2010 at 12:57 pm

    As Jay pointed out this morning, that’s the difference between “hasn’t” and “can’t.”

    Utilizing the same reasoning, that’s why I expect Cano to perform in a way that is consistent with his true talent level in high leverage situations and start hitting with RISP.

  10. Rich in NJ January 31st, 2010 at 12:58 pm

    “with the help of roids and hgh”

    And your proof is?

  11. Bronx Jeers January 31st, 2010 at 12:58 pm

    ARod seemed to have that kind of year though.

    He was hitting singles up the middle instead of swinging for the fences with RISP more than in the seasons prior.

    That last game in Tampa certainly boosted his confidence as well.

  12. Bodhisattva - Destiny Wears Pinstripes January 31st, 2010 at 1:01 pm

    Jim,

    Alex is a superior athletic specimen. There’s nothing you can do about it, pal.

  13. Bodhisattva - Destiny Wears Pinstripes January 31st, 2010 at 1:03 pm

    Sara,

    Yes, you certainly have to like the Granderson deal.

  14. Rich in NJ January 31st, 2010 at 1:03 pm

    From the last thread:

    Bodhisattva

    “I still would not have moved someone with the upside of Tabata for a reliever, however.”

    I agree. I’m just looking for a sliver lining in an attempt to recoup sunks costs.

  15. lordbyron January 31st, 2010 at 1:04 pm

    Javy will prove to be a very positive addition to the Yankee starting rotation in 2010. Unfortunately, the offensive production lost due to the departure of Matsui and Damon won’t be replaced by Granderson and Johnson – and that will be problematic.

  16. ortforshort January 31st, 2010 at 1:05 pm

    Vazquez was in a funk / slump when he pitched in the playoffs for the Yankees. There’s no question that he has the talent to do better. He was a good acquisition altho’ we may be regretting the price (Cabrera – on outfielder we could use; Dunn – we’ve only got one fragile lefty remaining in the pen; Vizcaino – a nineteen year old righthander with a high ceiling) for gettting a guy for one year and paying him $11m in these budget-challenged times.

  17. Bodhisattva - Destiny Wears Pinstripes January 31st, 2010 at 1:08 pm

    I understand, Rich.

  18. upstate kate January 31st, 2010 at 1:08 pm

    Maybe Alex benefits from having Tex in the line up, taking some of the pressure off.

    As to Robbie, it isn’t as if he never gets hits w/ RISP. I was watching the post game shows I had on the DVR from the 2 games we attended in 08 and 09, and in both Robbie got an important hit w/ RISP.

  19. 86w183 January 31st, 2010 at 1:10 pm

    If you look at Vasquez’ three years in Chicago I think the average of that is what we are likely to see. That means 6-7 innings per start and 3-4 earned runs.

    That is not great, but will give the Yanks a legit chance to win just about every time out. If I were to guess, I would look for 16-10 4.35 considering the talent he’ll be surrounded by.

  20. Bodhisattva - Destiny Wears Pinstripes January 31st, 2010 at 1:10 pm

    I think Alex also benefits greatly from the fellowship with Teix.

  21. Bodhisattva - Destiny Wears Pinstripes January 31st, 2010 at 1:11 pm

    86,

    I think that’s a reasonable expectation from Javy.

  22. Kevin January 31st, 2010 at 1:18 pm

    Early Predictions on Rotation: CC:18-8 3.35
    AJ:9-7 4.65
    Andy:13-7 4.20
    Javy: 15-8 3.95
    Joba: 11-6 3.70
    Fair?

  23. Fran (the original) and OPPC member January 31st, 2010 at 1:21 pm

    Maybe Alex benefits from having Tex in the line up, taking some of the pressure off.
    *********************************
    Kate,

    I was thinking the same thing. And Javy will have CC, AJ and Andy to take the pressure off him.

  24. Warren January 31st, 2010 at 1:22 pm

    Prediction on Rotation:

    CC:20-6 3.35
    AJ:13-5 4.65 – comfort zone can be reached
    Andy:13-7 4.20 – normal
    Javy: 18-6 3.95 -Healthy this time around
    Hughes: 12-5 3.62 – better understanding of the teams

  25. pete January 31st, 2010 at 1:26 pm

    Kevin:

    none of that is at all out of the realm of possibility, although I would probably switch AJ and Andy’s numbers, and then push them a little closer together. I’d put AJ’s ERA at about 4.25, Andy’s at about 4.45. Unless you were thinking AJ would get injured at some point? Which is certainly a possibility. Also, I’d put Javy and Joba at about 4.05 and 3.95, respectively, but not a huge difference there. Regardless of how the stats pan out exactly, I think our rotation will give us 900+ innings of ~4.00 baseball, which is excellent, considering the strength of our offense and bullpen.

  26. Carl January 31st, 2010 at 1:26 pm

    Warren

    I think CC and AJ will do better than that.

  27. raymagnetic January 31st, 2010 at 1:29 pm

    I never commented on the Winn deal, but to me it makes no sense. If they weren’t going to sign Johnny back they should have kept Melky and tried to work out a different trade with the Braves.

    Basically I see Melky as very likely to have a better year than Winn is going to have. JMO.

  28. pete January 31st, 2010 at 1:29 pm

    Warren: I’d say that’s a little bullish on Hughes. I personally don’t see him in the rotation over Joba (though I personally hope he starts off in AAA so that at least by 2011 he’s ready to go a full season in the bigs, but if not, we can deal with hughes’ rules, ’11-style), but if he does, it’s hard to expect anything better than around 4.20 ERA from him, and 12 wins is going to be tough for a young pitcher who hasn’t started in a year and whose innings cap is probably at most 150

  29. trisha - OPPC forever - (new lucky picture from last day at the old Stadium) BRING ON THE GHOSTS! January 31st, 2010 at 1:29 pm

    “But it’s laughable that the Yankees are taking flak for not working out a contract with Johnny Damon — if you consider what happened, as it happened, rather than the historical revision of those covering tracks.”

    :D :D :D

    Hey Wave and Pat M. What do you think of the historical revision of those covering tracks???

    I laughed my butt off reading Buster’s column. Thanks Rish!!!

    This is a rhetorical question, but what the flip was Damon thinking of? When Matsui signed elsewhere, did he think his over-the-hill (or almost there) services were in great demand by the Yankees? Anyone with a modicum of intelligence could have known that the Yankees would not have gone anywhere near Damon as their starting LF since he can no longer play on a daily basis (witness last season when Girardi sat him to save his legs for the postseason), can no longer get to all the balls he needs to, and could never thrown worth a damn. What he had to offer, so it seems, is really great offense.

    So then the question he needed to ask himself was this: can the Yankees get the job done without my offense? It appears he came up with the wrong answer.

    Johnny overvalued his services and thought the Yankees were playing chicken I guess.

    For future reference Johnny, the New York Yankees are willing to pay for players they really want – and need. Just ask CC, AJ, and Tex. But when they think someone is expendable, unfortunately for the expendable player, the Yankees hold the cards.

    Damon is a mercenery (his right), Damon is a player (I want the Yankees, I want to help another team win a ring, nobody wants me, I want the Yankees), and Damon is an at-the-end-of-his-career dope. He has the right to be all of those things. He just shouldn’t expect to outplay a savvy organization while is being all of those things.

    I am making a strong prediction that Johnny Damon will never see the inside of Yankee Stadium again unless it’s as a paying customer or as a member of another team.

    If I end up being wrong, I will welcome him back with open arms because that’s the kind of guy I am. Once the organization wants him, then his real estate goes up again for me. I will never understate who he was when he was here. But that was then and this is now. A bunch of injuries and a lot of missteps later, he is a former Yankee player.

    Thanks for listening!

    :)

    *****************

    Anyone who wants to play the season predictions game is welcome to start whenever he or she wants to. Wait as long as you want. I’ve alredy taken some predictions, so the chart is open. Just please PUT MY NAME IN THE POST when you do make a prediction so that I don’t miss your post.

  30. 56Bomber January 31st, 2010 at 1:30 pm

    Chad – off topic question…

    has there been any information regarding changes that the Yankees are planning for the new stadium given the feedback from last year?

  31. Kevin January 31st, 2010 at 1:32 pm

    Yea I’m figuring A.J. to get injured and/or decline. His fastball is his strength. Without that his curveball you can just layoff and at age 33 you have to think hes going to lose something on his fastball.

    As far as Andy, I think he has another 2 years left him. His pitching smarts and flat out grit I think will allow him to suceed even with diminshing stuff. Joba I believe is really going to have a solid season. The innings limit messed with his head I believe.

  32. Fran (the original) and OPPC member January 31st, 2010 at 1:32 pm

    Hi Trisha,

    OK. I’ll play early on. I say 99 wins.

  33. pete January 31st, 2010 at 1:38 pm

    raymagnetic:

    I highly doubt that the Braves would have taken anybody the yankees were willing to part with over Melky. Melky is a MLB-average all-around outfielder. In other words, he’s somebody who is capable of starting. The yankees don’t have any other MLB-average outfielders that they could have offered. As far as the winn deal goes, the yanks will be looking for some combination of Winn and Gardner and to a lesser extent Hoffmann and Golson to provide average-ish offense and great defense from the LF position. IMO, they will get both. The speed of gardner, winn, and golson and the sheer multitude of options (meaning there’s a decent chance that one of them is hitting ok pretty much all the time), I’d be willing to bet that they can accrue a wRC+ of about 105 out of the 9th spot (!!!!!) this year, combined with very strong (probably +15 or better UZR) defense in Left. All of that adds up to a left field combination that very well could (and in my opinion, will) out-WAR Damon in 2010. And that combination is not replacing ’09 damon, it is, as you’ve accurately pointed out, replacing ’09 melky cabrera. So yes, randy winn may not provide more production than melky this year, but there’s a very good chance that the combination of winn, gardner, hoffmann, and golson does.

  34. Doreen January 31st, 2010 at 1:40 pm

    Trisha -

    Are you going to set a deadline for the predictions? I think I’d like to see some ST games before I commit to a number. :)

  35. pete January 31st, 2010 at 1:42 pm

    trisha: In the AL East: 99 wins for the yanks, 96 for the sox, 91 for the Rays, 76 for the Orioles, 70 for the Jays. Don’t care about the central. In the AL West: 91 wins for Texas, 90 wins for LAA, 86 wins for Seattle, 81 for Oakland.

    The eastern and western divisions in both leagues should be terrific races in 2010

  36. Joe from Long Island January 31st, 2010 at 1:42 pm

    randymagnetic – I understand what you’re saying about keeping Melky.

    The thing is, it appears the Yankees really wanted to get another reliable starting pitcher, and they picked Vazquez to fill that role. I think Cash and Girardi consider themselves lucky that they were able to make do for the back end of the rotation last season, but don’t want to try their luck again, especially after Boston got Lackey. Obviously, they felt that giving up Melky was an acceptable price to take care of that issue. Don’t know if Atlanta would have taken a lesser package.

    The current trend in baseball appears to be for speed, defense, and “run prevention”. Theo, up in Boston, has alluded to that, as has Jack Z. in Seattle. Sherman has recently written that it wouldn’t surprise him if, late in close games where the Yanks are ahead, Girardi uses an OF of Winn, Gardner, and Hoffman. The moves that Cash has made to get plus-defenders to play OF seems consistent with that.

  37. trisha - OPPC forever - (new lucky picture from last day at the old Stadium) BRING ON THE GHOSTS! January 31st, 2010 at 1:42 pm

    If I ever decide to try to write a guest column, I have two topics at the ready:

    1. How in can anyone know for sure how player A would have worked out in the Bronx, based on what he ended up doing elsewhere? Conversely, how can anyone know for sure that because player A’s replacement doesn’t do well in the Bronx and player A does well elsewhere that the same thing would have happened in player A was still in the Bronx?

    Maybe that wouldn’t be a very long article because the answer is YOU CAN’T EVER KNOW.

    2. Who decided that an OF has to be a power hitter and under what theory has that myth been allowed to continue?

    Thank you!

    :)

  38. rover January 31st, 2010 at 1:45 pm

    It will be interesting to see how Joba responds to “Heres the ball kid, go and pitch it. Without all the crap that has come with innings limits etc. Could be the make or break year for Joba. I did say could be not would be.

  39. trisha - OPPC forever - (new lucky picture from last day at the old Stadium) BRING ON THE GHOSTS! January 31st, 2010 at 1:45 pm

    Doreen – I’m with you. I’ve already said that I am not ready to throw my hat in the ring and would like to see some ST before I decide. I’m thinking that by the end of ST, all predictions should be in.

    By the way, good point about Javy’s first half in the Bronx. Jay’s chart about his records with runners on base was very interesting nonetheless.

  40. Matt January 31st, 2010 at 1:49 pm

    I seriously doubt if any Yankee pitcher is concerned with run support and they should certainly feel better about pitches hit to left field.

  41. Frank January 31st, 2010 at 1:57 pm

    “Joba: 11-6 3.70
    Fair?”

    No. 3.70 is a lot to ask of Joba at this stage.

    I think Hughes ends up #5 anyway.

  42. pete January 31st, 2010 at 1:58 pm

    trisha:

    Eh, I’m not really all that sold on the “ability to succeed in NY” stuff. I just haven’t seen any examples of this yet that didn’t have much more likely and logical reasons for their lack of success in new york.

  43. pete January 31st, 2010 at 2:01 pm

    Frank:
    why do you think Hughes ends up the #5 next year over Joba? He hasn’t started in a year, he has an innings limit that the yankees worked so hard on getting off Joba’s back last year, and he’s never had the success that joba has as a starter. I know he had his fair share of trouble in ’09, but in ’08 he was truly DOMINANT as a starter before he got hurt, consistently allowing 0, 1, or sometimes 2 runs and striking out 8 or 9 in six innings. I personally believe he’s a year away from being at the point where he can do that over a full season, and don’t see him at 3.70 next year, but I’d be very very surprised to see him A) out of the rotation, and B) with an ERA over 4.30 next year.

  44. vinny-b January 31st, 2010 at 2:05 pm

    jim mason:

    it’s kewl you don’t like Alex. I don’t like him either.

    the question is, who do you like?

  45. Frank January 31st, 2010 at 2:11 pm

    Pete:

    Just a hunch.

    Don’t see innings limitations as an issue because #5′s aren’t asked to go much more than 150-165 innings and there’s no reason to think both guys can’t manage that.

    As for Joba being dominant in ’08, I agree he was for a very short period of time….before getting hurt. Certainly not enough to say he can be that guy over an extended period. Combination of reduced velocity and marginal command last year has me wondering about a little. We’ll see, I guess.

    I agree a 4.3ish ERA is a far more reasonable expectation for him, should he end up being the guy.

  46. trisha - OPPC forever - (new lucky picture from last day at the old Stadium) BRING ON THE GHOSTS! January 31st, 2010 at 2:12 pm

    pete -

    Jeff Weaver
    Ted Lilly
    Jose Contreras
    Ricky Ledee

  47. lets go yankees January 31st, 2010 at 2:14 pm

    Like murphydog pointed out in the last thread, the Javy post does not really tell you much without putting it in context or diving deeper into the stats. You are not going to find many pitchers in baseball that do not pitch better with the bases empty. Additionally, you are not going to find many pitchers in baseball who are not at their worse with the bases loaded. That does not mean they are unclutch, but that is just the nature of pitching. “Clutch” guys like Andy and “elite” pitchers like CC, the vast majority of them pitch better with the bases empty.

    Additionally, it seems the numbers with men on are skewed by Javy’s numbers with the bases loaded. His 141 number is really high. For comparison instead of the bases loaded, but just with RISP his career tOPS+ is 110. CC for his career with RISP is 104, Andy 107, and AJ 106.

    So, how much is his really “unclutch” performance with the bases loaded going to affect 2010? Well, in 2009 Javy pitched to 9 batters with the bases loaded. In 2008 11 batters. In 2007 7 batters. For about 10 at bats in 2010 I will hold me breath.

  48. trisha - OPPC forever - (new lucky picture from last day at the old Stadium) BRING ON THE GHOSTS! January 31st, 2010 at 2:15 pm

    let’s go yankees, just thought I would tell you that I am definitely a dog lover.

    :)

  49. upstate kate January 31st, 2010 at 2:26 pm

    Me too Trish, it finally warmed up enough for me to take my 2 “girls” out for a long walk :)

  50. lets go yankees January 31st, 2010 at 2:29 pm

    “His tendency to pitch better when the game isn’t close might indicate he doesn’t respond very well to anxiety (which says more about how he is hard-wired than whether or not he’s mentally tough). But does this mean won’t pitch well as a Yankee this time around?”

    ——————————–

    Also, I do not really understand this. His numbers tOPS+ when the game is tied all the way up to a 4 run margin is basically identical. The largest deviation is 3 measly points in tOPS+. By these numbers he is basically the exact same pitcher in a tie game, 1 run game, 2 run game, 3 run game, and 4 run game.

    The only time, we see any real difference is when the margin is greater then 4 runs. So he is really comfortable pitching with a margin of 5 runs or more. Who isn’t?

  51. Joe Vogel January 31st, 2010 at 2:29 pm

    Rich in NJ
    January 31st, 2010 at 12:58 pm
    “with the help of roids and hgh”

    And your proof is?
    —————————————-
    Rich, maybe I didn’t catch the full meaning of this conversation as I only glanced through the comments, but are suggesting that Rodriguez never benefitted from his PED usage?

  52. Joe Vogel January 31st, 2010 at 2:30 pm

    Sorry, I forgot the “you” in the final sentence.

  53. lets go yankees January 31st, 2010 at 2:31 pm

    Haha Trish,

    Thanks for letting me know! You get a a big bump up in my LHBLOG+ stat for that.

  54. Octavious January 31st, 2010 at 2:46 pm

    Rich in NJ
    January 31st, 2010 at 12:58 pm
    “with the help of roids and hgh”

    And your proof is?””””

    ———————————————————–

    Now I know you are a shill for Aroid and brainless fan to boot. What a laughable young lad you are. Go back to recess.

  55. Pat M. January 31st, 2010 at 2:48 pm

    Nick in SF……Early entertainment numbers from Las Vegas…….Yanks 14/5 to win the WS…..2/1 to win AL Pennant…..To win 100 games, 5/4……Alex over / under on HR’s ( 38 ) Texeria 36…Granderson over under on triples 12…..

  56. Frank January 31st, 2010 at 2:56 pm

    “Nick in SF……Early entertainment numbers from Las Vegas…….Yanks 14/5 to win the WS…..2/1 to win AL Pennant…..To win 100 games, 5/4……Alex over / under on HR’s ( 38 ) Texeria 36…Granderson over under on triples 12….”

    Lousy odds on WS, pennant and 100 wins render those bets just not worth it.

    Arod and Tex = over

    Granderson = under

  57. 86w183 January 31st, 2010 at 2:56 pm

    Since MLB established a drug program with testing and penalties Alex has not tested positive in six years.

    There is no evidence of HGH use whatsoever.

  58. Frank January 31st, 2010 at 3:00 pm

    “There is no evidence of HGH use whatsoever”

    No test for it.

  59. Octavious January 31st, 2010 at 3:02 pm

    Aroid isn’t going to fess up either. That will be for the book he writes after he retires and then all of the Aroid shills will be pretending that they always knew he used PEDs. This is the laugh of the century.

  60. 86w183 January 31st, 2010 at 3:02 pm

    So it’s okay to accuse people of things they cannot prove they haven’t done even if you have no basis for the accusation?

  61. lets go yankees January 31st, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    Kevin
    January 31st, 2010 at 1:32 pm

    Yea I’m figuring A.J. to get injured and/or decline. His fastball is his strength. Without that his curveball you can just layoff and at age 33 you have to think hes going to lose something on his fastball.

    ———————————

    This is not really true.

    AJ’s fastball in terms of value is actually one of the worst fastballs in baseball. While, his curveball is one of the best curveballs, and up there with the best pitches in baseball.

  62. Octavious January 31st, 2010 at 3:07 pm

    Since there isn’t an HGH test with specificity it’s okay to be an ignoramous? You shall be a great criminal lawyer if you’re not already one of the sharks.

  63. Frank January 31st, 2010 at 3:07 pm

    “So it’s okay to accuse people of things they cannot prove they haven’t done even if you have no basis for the ac cusation?”

    No, not really. Hasn’t stopped many on here from pointing at others who were similarly exposed but also have gone 6 years without a failed test. Fair or otherwise, guys who have been exposed for making a choice to skirt the rules in the past will be viewed with greater suspicion than others.

  64. Rich in NJ January 31st, 2010 at 3:11 pm

    Joe Vogel, here’s my reply, but it’s more fun to respond to Buffoonious, I mean Octavious.

    “Now I know you are a shill for Aroid and brainless fan to boot. What a laughable young lad you are. Go back to recess.”

    I love the internet because it brings out the best in so many people, and btw, thanks for calling me young.

    I deal in facts. Stats are facts. The years of Alex’s PED usage, as far as we know, were when he was in Texas. If his stats are a creation PED usage, why did they only help him at home and not on the road?

    2001

    Home: .361/.439/.677/1.116 (AB:253 HR:21)

    Road: .276/.359..567..926 (AB 257 HR:14)

    2002

    Home: .323/.403/.700 /1.103 (AB:313 HR:26)

    Road: .277/.381/.547/.928 (AB:319 HR:26)

    2003

    Home: .314/.407/.621/1.028 (AB:309 HR:26)

    Road: .282/.384..577/.961 (AB:298 HR:21)

    Thanks for playing.

  65. Octavious January 31st, 2010 at 3:12 pm

    Arod has probably used every last PED to get an edge. Just because Arnold Schwarzennegar never failed a test doesn’t mean he was on PEDS? It’s amazing how many future lawyers read this blog!!!!

  66. m January 31st, 2010 at 3:12 pm

    Rich & Bodhi,

    No one can change the facts. Alex did it. He admitted it publicly.

    There’s nothing to prove. The rules in the court of public opinion don’t require it.

    It’s sad, but if Alex doesn’t do it, then would be nothing to debate.

  67. 86w183 January 31st, 2010 at 3:14 pm

    Octavious —

    Not a lawyer, just a fair minded person. You are not being fair and there’s no evidence you have a mind.

    Look up ignoramus before you misuse and misspell the word again.

  68. Frank January 31st, 2010 at 3:15 pm

    Not for nothing, Rich, but your “facts” only prove he hit better at home than on the road, and say absolutely zero about how his PED impacted his numbers.

  69. Octavious January 31st, 2010 at 3:17 pm

    Your facts and data are a foundation built on sand. Invalid my friend.

  70. 86w183 January 31st, 2010 at 3:19 pm

    Rich in NJ

    Great post. alex had a little boost in his road numbers but a big boost in his home numbers during the Texas years.

    His HR average went up 10/yr compared to the three years before and three years after. SEVEN more HR/year at home and three more HR/year on the road. The small park and hot air in Texas helped more than “Boli”.

    I’m not endorsing PED use, but I do know that players have used things to get an edge for years. Some went from OK to good players to stars (McGuire, Palmeiro, Sosa) and others went from great to greater (Alex, Bonds and most likely Clemens).

  71. Octavious January 31st, 2010 at 3:20 pm

    Your argument is based on spelling and not on your invalid facts?

  72. Rich in NJ January 31st, 2010 at 3:21 pm

    m

    “No one can change the facts. Alex did it. He admitted it publicly.”

    You’re missing my point. Granted, A-Rod did PEDs, but where’s the proof that they boosted his stats?

    In 1996, he put up this line:

    .358/.414/.631/1.045

    Was he doing them then?

    The guy admitted taking them while in Texas, a haven for ‘roid users. That’s more than a lot of other players have acknowledged and it lends him some credibility. I don’t think it’s fair, or that are facts to support the contention that he did them five or even ten years earlier because there is no proof about that either. Facts matter.

  73. Joe Vogel January 31st, 2010 at 3:22 pm

    86w183
    January 31st, 2010 at 2:56 pm
    Since MLB established a drug program with testing and penalties Alex has not tested positive in six years.

    There is no evidence of HGH use whatsoever.
    ——————————————
    By that token, Manny Ramirez hasn’t tested positive for a steroid or HGH since 2003. He was cited for using Clomid, a female fertility drug that is often used by steroid users to restart their testosterone production. As he had no documented medical exception for using this drug, his usage was considered illegal under MLB’s drug testing program. To note, he and his agent both claim that he had passed numerous PED tests over the past several seasons. It is not beyond reason to believe that Ramirez (and many fellow users) have been employing other means to mask their steroid usage. In Ramirez’s case, it appears that he failed to secure the necessary medical exemption for Clomid usage, and thus he was caught. From a fan’s perspective, I find it unfortunate (although highly understandable in the light of HIPAA), that we are not privy to the medical exemption lists of MLB players. Anecdotal information about this are suggests that MLB players have an inordinately higher incidence of ADHD (necessitating the use of Ritalin) and certain endocrine disorders (allowing for the usage of drugs like Clomid). It certainly leaves one wondering about the validity of these exemptions.
    In Rodriguez’s case, he may simply have been employing an effective masking agent for any steroid usage and as a previous poster noted, MLB does not currently test for HGH usage.

  74. 86w183 January 31st, 2010 at 3:29 pm

    I’m not claiming to know whether or not Alex has ever or continues to use HGH. My point is that is is unfair and irresponsible to accuse him from doing so.

    The Manny situation is irrelevant. He tested positive for a banned substance, one that IS used as a masking agent. It is not a stretch to assume the purpose of using that drug was to either mask steroid use OR get pregnant.

    OBSTUSE-AVIOUS — You obviously don’t know the meaning of a word that you improperly used. That’s not my argument, that’s documented fact.

    I think the demonization of players that used PEDs ranks with the most hypocritical nonsense I have seen in years. A sport that was built on racism and fueled by ampthetemines suddenly gets religion? Please.

  75. Bodhisattva - Destiny Wears Pinstripes January 31st, 2010 at 3:29 pm

    Octavious,

    Hadn’t you better occupy yourself with the fate the boy who swallowed a lake up there in Beantown?

    Your team really needs him to up those shakes he depends on. And even then, I’m thinking it’s third place for your boys.

  76. Octavious January 31st, 2010 at 3:31 pm

    Any information that has been reported on PED use is most likely the tip of the iceburg in terms of total disclosure per player. Why would Arod want to reveal he was on stuff in 1996 after being forced to reveal his twenty first century gorge on PEDs?

  77. Bodhisattva - Destiny Wears Pinstripes January 31st, 2010 at 3:32 pm

    I wouldn’t waste my time trying to engage in earnest dialogue with someone who is just a hate-mongering troll.

  78. Joe Vogel January 31st, 2010 at 3:33 pm

    Rich in NJ
    January 31st, 2010 at 3:21 pm
    m

    “No one can change the facts. Alex did it. He admitted it publicly.”

    You’re missing my point. Granted, A-Rod did PEDs, but where’s the proof that they boosted his stats?

    In 1996, he put up this line:

    .358/.414/.631/1.045

    Was he doing them then?

    The guy admitted taking them while in Texas, a haven for ‘roid users. That’s more than a lot of other players have acknowledged and it lends him some credibility. I don’t think it’s fair, or that are facts to support the contention that he did them five or even ten years earlier because there is no proof about that either. Facts matter.
    —————————————————
    You surprise me Rich. I would never have pegged you to deny the effects of PED’s. While I share your same reverence for facts, the greatest difficulty in dealing historically with the PED-era is the ascertainment of accurate facts. This whole business wreaks of misdirection, misstatements, half-truths, minimizations, and out and out lies.
    Certainly using A-Rod’s numbers circumstantially to tell his PED story is relevant. One big problem arises however. We don’t know exactly when he started his usage. He claims his usage was limited exclusively to Texas due to the pressures associated with his new mega-contract, a claim that I personally find challenging. Did not being traded to the most historically relevant franchise in North American team sports history also invoke a bit of pressure? There certainly were other active steroid users on his team in Seattle (vouched for by OF Shane Monohan). Considering that he and I are approximately the same age and that I grew up in a very small Midwestern community where even there in the early ’90′s steroids were available, certainly he had access growing up as a high profile athlete in the city of Miami.

  79. Octavious January 31st, 2010 at 3:35 pm

    86w183
    January 31st, 2010 at 3:29 pm
    I’m not claiming to know whether or not Alex has ever or continues to use HGH. My point is that is is unfair and irresponsible to accuse him from doing so.

    The Manny situation is irrelevant. He tested positive for a banned substance, one that IS used as a masking agent. It is not a stretch to assume the purpose of using that drug was to either mask steroid use OR get pregnant.

    OBSTUSE-AVIOUS — You obviously don’t know the meaning of a word that you improperly used. That’s not my argument, that’s documented fact.

    I think the demonization of players that used PEDs ranks with the most hypocritical nonsense I have seen in years. A sport that was built on racism and fueled by ampthetemines suddenly gets religion? Please.
    ————————————————————

    I think you don’t like being called what you are my very good friend. Spelling is your only argument. How is your 7th grade spelling competition treating you?

  80. Joe Vogel January 31st, 2010 at 3:37 pm

    86w183
    January 31st, 2010 at 3:29 pm
    I’m not claiming to know whether or not Alex has ever or continues to use HGH. My point is that is is unfair and irresponsible to accuse him from doing so.

    The Manny situation is irrelevant. He tested positive for a banned substance, one that IS used as a masking agent. It is not a stretch to assume the purpose of using that drug was to either mask steroid use OR get pregnant.
    ——————————————-
    Correction:
    Clomid is not used as a masking agent. Rather, it is used by steroid users post-cycle to restart their testosterone production.

  81. Bodhisattva - Destiny Wears Pinstripes January 31st, 2010 at 3:40 pm

    Poor Octavious.

    Having to deal with the Yankees being World Champions again.

    Poor Octavious.

    Having to deal with Alex Rodriguez’s finest hour, having slayed all the papier mache dragons.

    Poor Octavious.

    Pathetic appearances on a Yankee board with passive aggressive posts about Alex.

    Poor, poor Octavious.

    Now crawl back home to Yawkey Way.

  82. 86w183 January 31st, 2010 at 3:41 pm

    You are not my good friend, my not so good friend or anything of the like.

    You are a judgmental clown who is obviously incapable of backing up his blather with facts or rational debate.

    Have a nice day, I’m done.

  83. Octavious January 31st, 2010 at 3:43 pm

    86w183 can you explain clomid to us again?

  84. Pat M. January 31st, 2010 at 3:44 pm

    By the way, the numbers for the BoSox……11/2 ( WS ) 11/4 AL Pennant……100 Wins 5/1

  85. Rich in NJ January 31st, 2010 at 4:04 pm

    Joe Vogel

    “One big problem arises however. We don’t know exactly when he started his usage”

    Exactly, so why do we necessarily have to view the facts in the light most unfavorable to A-Rod?

    ” Did not being traded to the most historically relevant franchise in North American team sports history also invoke a bit of pressure? ”

    Alex’s 2004 stats:

    .286 .375 .512 .887

    Again, where are the facts that demonstrate that his stats were artificially boosted?

  86. GiantsCauseway February 1st, 2010 at 9:43 am

    Well as I have a keen grasp of the obvious, in the play-offs you’re facing play-off caliber teams.

  87. Maureen February 2nd, 2010 at 6:47 am

    How about the “Jim Masons” of this blog, sing different tune of HGH and ROIDS in the same sentence with A-Rod..That’s old news, and everyone who love the Yanks know it..Move on…Bastante…

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