Four outs away
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Apr 10, 2010 
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CC Sabathia was four outs away from the 11th no-hitter in Yankees history this afternoon. Kelly Shoppach broke up the milestone with a two-out single to left in the eighth inning. Sabathia threw 111 pitches, 69 for strikes. He struck out five, walked two and got the win in a 10-0 Yankees landslide.
That’s the Associated Press picture of Sabathia after the Shoppach single.
Wow, Chad – very quick today..
Bell’s performance is making me depressed; I don’t know if he’s incompetent or vengeful.
The game took 3 hours 22 minutes.
Now somewhere Joe West is thinking in addition to Yankees and Red Sox, Rays are also pathetic and embarrassing
I’m going to go with imcompetent
Rishi, I hope so – I think you’re right.
Atta boy CC. Didn’t think I was gonna be that excited during a Fox Game. Sooo close for the 2nd time. I’m sure the no hitter will come soon.
I hope Wally Bell gets food poisoning tonight.
Those guys look depressed – I don’t blame them.
And there appears to be nothing you can do abou tit
Um, that’s going a little far…
Makes you wonder if West gets stripped of his crew chief staus and forced out at the end of the year.
I’d like to see a better replay of the Cano/Crawford play from the 7th inning. It looked like Crawford touched second base before over sliding. In which case the no no was over right there.
I wish this game was on YES or even My 9 – no replay
Since I did not see the game, was the hit a clean single?
lol
ok, how about mild gastritis?
What a game! I’m glad I got to see a little of it. But it did make me remember how much I hate Joe Buck.
Fran, totally clean.
‘was the hit a clean single?’
Clean as a whistle. The moment it left the bat it was clearly a hit.
Nobody wants to see Joe West stripped!
Oh,you meant as in losing his position of authority.
Oops.
crew chief ***status***
Fran, but what you really had to see was the defense behind CC. There were some spectacular plays. They really wanted it for him.
GB – we can hope.
Fran,
It was a cleanly hit single. No doubt about it when it left the bat.
The unfortunate things was that as the game went on the ump started squeezing CC more and more.
That cost him at least 10-15 extra pitches.
And it was pretty clear CC was tiring.
The single was on a two seam fastball CC left up in the zone. It was the kind of small mistake a pitcher throws when he’s tired.
Fran, looking forward to tomorrow!
Thanks Trisha and Ohta.
At least it was a clean hit.
Betsy, same here. And it is not even supposed to rain or snow
I don’t get why the umpire would squeeze CC; I just don’t understand it at all.
trisha – OPPC member who sees, hears, and knows all. 28 is on its way!!!!! April 10th, 2010 at 6:41 pm
Fran, totally clean
———————————————————————————————————————-
I still say that Thames would have caught it in his hip pocket.
Ok, hip pocket, only because his glove isn’t broken in, yet. It’s only 4 years old and plenty of leather left on it.
GW Plunkett
How do you figure? He overslid the base and was tagged out. It probably could have been called an error on the throw.
Betsy and Fran, you realize we have a day game tomorrow, yes?
That’s right ………good day all around for me. Freddie Couples is in Masters contention, I found out my already horrid eyes didn’t get any worse since the last time I visited the eye doctor and the Yankees won,lol
BryanHoch Girardi: Shoppach would have been CC’s last hitter no matter what.
3 minutes ago via txt
LoHudYankees Shoppach was Sabathia’s last hitter no matter what.
GB,
LOL. Should have just asked for your perspective.
Trish, we’re getting together for dinner…… Did I read that all games against the Angels are day games? So, I need to take off from work if I want to see the ring ceremony – and I won’t get to see Phil make his debut. What kind of schedule is that?
“Shoppach would have been CC?s last hitter no matter what.”
I wouldn’t believe that on a stack of bibles!
Joe from Long Island April 10th, 2010 at 6:42 pm
GB – we can hope.
———————————————————————————————————————-
I forget what umpire had that happen to him in the last year or so. There is a precedence for it happening.
Oh come on, there’s no way I believe that, Joe…
Trisha,
We know. That’s why we are going out at 6:15 – After the game!
It would have been called an error as the throw pulled Cano of the bag.
trisha – OPPC member who sees, hears, and knows all. 28 is on its way!!!!! April 10th, 2010 at 6:46 pm
?Shoppach would have been CC?s last hitter no matter what.?
I wouldn?t believe that on a stack of bibles!
=============================
My sister said the same thing
Rish –
Fran, I should have figured you guys wouldn’t miss the game to go and eat!
I’d love to see one game, even just an exhibition game, where lasers and computers make all the calls.
Players have chips in their shoes. There are chips on the bases. Home plate is covered by lasers.
Every call is dead on.
The game would definitely move along quicker.
The unfortunate things was that as the game went on the ump started squeezing CC more and more
*************
CB,
It is so unfair when the umps change their strike zone during the game, especially when you are saying that those extra pitches CC had to throw may have cost him his no-hitter.
Is there GTLU tomorrow?
You guys won’t believe this-
While watching the game, I fell asleep on the couch during the second inning and missed the whole game.
I was so comatose that I heard Cano home run, flinched- turned off the TV and rolled back over. Next thing I knew itw as 6:45 pm.
I missed an awesome game
BBFan
I’m pretty sure Joe West only meant that 27 and 200 million are embarrassing, pathetic, and disgraceful. He just lumped the Sox in there as a ploy.
Trisha
I’m sure CC cares more about the success of the team and his individual health (which both tie together) than a no hitter. Many get no hitters, not many get perfect games. If it was a perfect game, then I could understand the sentiment.
Tarheelyank:
Zobrist was safe at first. Crawford was (briefly) safe at second and that’s all it takes. Over sliding the bag after touching it safely is no different than getting picked off on the next play. I’m not gonna swear that he touched the bag until I see a decent replay. But if he did it appears to be a hit. Or, as you note, perhaps an error. Once Crawford touches the bag and ends the force play it’s gotta be one or the other, no?
The way Rodriguez has played defense so far this year, he may have his eyes set on that Gold Glove of Longoria’s.
Fran, even in a situation where there is no no-hitter, it’s unfair. How do the hitters know what to expect? I think they’d rather an ump be consistently bad than inconsistent. One pitch is a ball – the next is a strike. This job can not be that hard. I blame MLB for letting the umpires get away with this; Bud doesn’t seem to care about the quality off the product put on the field. He sure doesn’t seem to care about the integrity of the game.
Anybody know who the HP umpire was today?
It’s not unfortunate (because they know what they are doing, it’s unprofessional, biased, disgraceful, embarrassing, and pathetic.
Oh, and from the previous thread, that’s very good news on Bleich…
Mr. Wally Bell
Erica,
You are not working this weekend as it is the last weekend of the tax season before April 15th?
GW Plunkett
Crawford touched the bag. No doubt about it. But the play was not over, it was not a pick off, the next batter wasn’t announced. The play should be scored 1-4.
Betsy, I absolutely agree with you. Maybe they were trying to speed up the game. You know how bad those Yankees are for baseball
trisha,
Do you still have my e-mail? I want to get in touch with you.
Erica – always OPPC – Sesame Street Mafia and GTLU supporter April 10th, 2010 at 6:49 pm
You guys won’t believe this-
While watching the game, I fell asleep on the couch during the second inning and missed the whole game.
I was so comatose that I heard Cano home run, flinched- turned off the TV and rolled back over. Next thing I knew itw as 6:45 pm.
I missed an awesome game
———————————————————————————————————————-
Then you missed the announcement that the Yankees have traded Kei Igawa to Detroit for Johnny Damon and cash, didn’t you?
‘Anybody know who the HP umpire was today?’
Ray Charles.
Erica, lol. That’s too bad you missed it, but at least you got caught up on sleep!
Fran, they’ll just have to deal with it as the Yanks and Sox are not going away.
I think I read that MLB is not going to discipline or fine West – ugh, I love the sport, but the people that run it are idiots.
Betsy,
Did you see this?
TAMPA, Fla. — Yankees fifth starter Phil Hughes allowed one run and six hits in six innings in an extended spring training intrasquad game Saturday.
It was the second and final extended spring game for Hughes, who will make his first regular-season start Thursday against the Los Angeles Angels.
Hughes says he’s “absolutely ready.”
Hughes struck out six, throwing 56 of 84 pitches for strikes.
Gary Sanchez, a 17-year-old Dominican catcher, had two of the hits — both singles — off Hughes.
A number of top Yankees prospects — including outfielder Slade Heathcott, taken in the first round of the 2009 amateur draft — played in the game.
via espn.com
Am I mistaken or did Girardi predict that Tex would have a big day today? I want to know where he keeps that crystal ball of his.
Waldman just said that garardi says that Shoppach was sabathia’s last hitter no matter what.
GW Plunkett
No it is not a hit.
The play was scored as a fielder’s choice, E-1, PO 4 Unassisted
No hit.
CR9, maybe Girardi said it to make CC feel better about what happened. I agree with what CB (?) said earlier. The only one who was going to make the decision to take CC out of the game was CC. Perfect games are rare, but no hitters are also. Pitchers are competitive beings. Did you see CC’s face when he walked off the mound? It wasn’t the face of a pitcher who was prepared to be taken out of the game had he gotten that out. Girardi was a catcher. He’s caught several no hitters. He knows just how meaningful they are. Nobody will ever convince me that CC was leaving that game. Not now, not ever. It isn’t like he’s fragile.
JMO
BBFan April 10th, 2010 at 6:53 pm
Erica,
You are not working this weekend as it is the last weekend of the tax season before April 15th?
************
I got up at 5:45 this morning to get a badly needed oil change before work.
I got to the car place at 6:30 and work at 8:30. Work was absolutely insane and drama filled today. I left there at 2 and when I walked through the door home everything just kind of caught up with me
This was my last weekend of work though. Thank goodness
GreenBeret7 April 10th, 2010 at 6:54 pm
Erica – always OPPC – Sesame Street Mafia and GTLU supporter April 10th, 2010 at 6:49 pm
Then you missed the announcement that the Yankees have traded Kei Igawa to Detroit for Johnny Damon and cash, didn’t you
***************
Dude, if that happened while I was asleep I swear I would sleep thorugh every game from now on
mel, yankeetrisha@verizon.net
M, are you kidding me? LOL I posted that earlier this morning – I think Phil must be absolutely DYING right now. I just have a feeling when he said “absolutely ready” that he could go out today and pitch….I can’t imagine how excited he must be.
GB, I don’t believe it…..
Tarheelyank
“But the play was not over”
Correct. But the force play was over and that’s what counts. Even though Crawford was only momentarily safe there has to be a scoring response.
“it was not a pick off, the next batter wasn’t announced.”
Also correct. What if Crawford had touched second and continued on to third–where he was thrown out? My understanding is that once both runners were safe there has to be a hit or error. Even though Crawford gave it right back.
GB, I agree about ARod’s defense.
But no jokes about Igawa for Damon. Might make Erica happy, but not me.
Just kidding.
Go Yanks
link for the box that shows error on that play?
So LYBPMD is Thursday?
“if that happened while I was asleep I swear I would sleep thorugh every game from now on”
But there is only one Damon
BryanHoch Cc says it would have been a discussion had he gotten through 8, but admits he probably would have lost that fight.
5 minutes ago via TweetDeck
BryanHoch Eiland says he knew in 7th sabathia wouldn’t complete no-hitter. Pitch count escalated too quickly.
6 minutes ago via TweetDeck
Nick in SF in Eureka, CA April 10th, 2010 at 7:01 pm
So LYBPMD is Thursday?
****************
Lohud Yankee Blog Prime Minister Day?????????
I just woke up- no caffiene in my system yet!!!
(And what should I eat for dinner?)
I just seen the replay, zobrist wasn’t even close to being safe.
# Rishi April 10th, 2010 at 7:03 pm
BryanHoch Cc says it would have been a discussion had he gotten through 8, but admits he probably would have lost that fight.
5 minutes ago via TweetDeck
BryanHoch Eiland says he knew in 7th sabathia wouldn’t complete no-hitter. Pitch count escalated too quickly.
6 minutes ago via TweetDeck
Thank god it didn’t come down to that
GW Plunkett
“What if Crawford had touched second and continued on to third–where he was thrown out?”
I believe the scoring would be 1-4-6.
I understand your point and It’s an interesting thought, but I dont think it’s correct.
Great performance by Sabathia. A-Rod’s defense was great he really has been playing great defense since the playoffs last year. You can tell he has fully healed from his hip injury. Also loved Gardner’s at bats if he can continue hitting the ball to the left side he will get a lot of hits.
You’ve got 4 out of 6.
Beckett v Grienke coming on right now. That should be a good watch!
Have a good night all.
Now I am glad that he gave up the hit….
Ahhhhh, Wally Bell. Another notorious Yankees hater, like McClelland, West, and Hernandez!!!
Gotta love ‘em. The Yankees haters are all around!!!!
That’s the price you pay for 27!!
Nick in SF in Eureka, CA April 10th, 2010 at 7:05 pm
You’ve got 4 out of 6.
**************
Just a hunch- Prime Minister was wrong?
Go Yanks
“The play was scored as a fielder’s choice, E-1, PO 4 Unassisted”
Ah, I see. Crawford’s temporary safeness is explained by the error instead of a hit. That makes sense.
So let me get this straight-
Bell is now joining West and Foster on our bad umpire list
The league needs more umpires.
I see a pretend mommy in there!
BTW, I was thinking last night. Who loves Phil the most? Betsy, Pat M or me? And is Pat M considered a pretend mommy?
LoHud Yankee Blog Pretend Mothers Day!
Ledger_Yankees Eiland: “You have to look at the big picture.” On explaining decision to pull CC after Shoppach no matter what. #nyy
Greinke is one of Erica’s Avengers
Let’s go Kansas City!!!!
P= Phil or Pitcher?
A very impressive win today. CC was spectacular. Good hitting up and down the line up and the Yankee defense did everything on could hope for to protect CC’s bid for a no no. Let’s do the same thing tomorrow and make this 2-3 and a 4-2 road trip
GW Plunkett
“Ah, I see. Crawford’s temporary safeness is explained by the error instead of a hit. That makes sense.”
There was no error in that game by any Yankee. There is no temporary safeness, the play was not over, time was not called.
Nick in SF in Eureka, CA April 10th, 2010 at 7:08 pm
LoHud Yankee Blog Pretend Mothers Day!
****************************
OH!!!!!!
Maybe it can be LYBPMD but it is definitely the Happiest Day of the Year regardless
M, Pat M is sort of like an uncle to Phil because he watched Phil when he was just a young sprout of 13 (aww, how cute). You and I are tied, I think. Hmm, maybe Pat M is like a nanny, lol
I guess that means Phil should send M and I flowers…
Tarheelyank
No link, assumed it was error on CC. Checked box score and no NYY errors
So, if the official scorer did not charge error, then it would/should of been a hit as batter and runner both advanced one base safely.
Seems that GW Plunkett would be correct, or at least has a great question.
Bleich has a 6.1 inning two hit shutout going…1 walk and 5 strikeouts and out of the game. 3-0 Trenton.
SS Luis Nunez has a 2-3 game with 2 doubles. 2B David Adams is still hitting everything. 3-4 with a double, 2 run homer, 3 RBI. 6-12 so far on the season.
Romine is 0-4 and Laird is 0-3.
hmmmm, that is a good game.
Greinke in trouble right from the start.
Wow, good going Bleich!
aww, poor Austin. Thanks, GB!
Greinke no-hitter broken up by Ellsbury.
M,
Knew about Betsy and Phil, but did not realize that you were such a big Huhes supporter.
Erica,
Unfortunately your fantasy team didn’t fall asleep as well. Teixeira got you 8 points today and you have Greinke going right now.
And for the record, the list of Hated Umpires is pretty long already. Angel Hernandez, Joe West, CB Bucknor, Wally Bell, Marty Foster. I’m sure I’m forgetting some
That should be Hughes.
Patrick-
Tex was due!!!!!
Now if only Carlos Lee would catch the hitting bug, we would really be on to something……
Heck, I’d be happy if he did anything other than strike out
Fran,
Unfortunately, that’s how the whole ‘pretend mommy’ business started.
I came to the poor kids defense when Damon & SJ were taking turns beating him up.
You girls picked the right guy.
Phil Hughes is an A-1 human.
Forget what he can do on the mound. He’s just a great person.
Erica,
We both know if I had a full week of Reyes and Kinsler I would be dominating the Avengers right now
Awww-
Greinke struck V-Mart out= Win + Win + Win for Erica
“So, if the official scorer did not charge error, then it would/should of been a hit as batter and runner both advanced one base safely.”
But Crawford did not advance one base safely. he was out at second before any stoppage of play.
m,
Like any good mother would do
One more note on Bleich’s game…9 groundouts and only 4 fly balls along with his 5 strikeouts. That’s great news for any lefty.
Patrick April 10th, 2010 at 7:17 pm
Erica,
We both know if I had a full week of Reyes and Kinsler I would be dominating the Avengers right now
****************
Ummm- Sure. If telling yourself that makes you feel better
Erica’s Avengers are just a force to be reckoned with
Crawford’s overslide was a continuation play and still a live ball until the umpire calls the play ended. Tar is correct on his call.
You’ve got to be cruel to be kind.
– Nick Lowe
Nick in SF in Eureka, CA April 10th, 2010 at 7:21 pm
You’ve got to be cruel to be kind.
– Nick Lowe
******************
In the right measure!!!
Ledger_Yankees Girardi: “It’s not the fun part of the job. I knew what I had to do.” #NYY
3 minutes ago via TweetDeck
“But Crawford did not advance one base safely. he was out at second before any stoppage of play.”
But he did advance a base safely. He was safe before he was out. The fact that Cano had to tag Crawford rather than touching the bag for the force indicates that a scoring event happened. The Yanks lost the force play. That the play continued doesn’t erase the fact that both runners did safely advance.
Ledger_Yankees Girardi: “It’s not the fun part of the job. I knew what I had to do.” #NYY
Ledger_Yankees I believe Girardi: Keep in mind, he had Park up the inning before. Imagine the reaction though. #NYY
Fran,
There was a time when Phil was a child of a lesser god. He needed lots of love and support! haha.
Pretty sure the umps got it correct (shock!), as the Buck & the idiot didn’t say anything.
Z, have you ever met him? I know that it’s true based on his interaction with fans when he had his blog.
It’s a very good sign.
With the great game all around, something got lost about Gardner.
He had a great day with two hits, two runs, two RBIs and one stolen base.
It is amazing that he saw more pitches (27) than any one else including Johnson (25) and Swisher (18).
Nick in SF in Eureka, CA April 10th, 2010 at 7:21 pm
You’ve got to be cruel to be kind.
**************************
I love that song! Every time I hear it I get it stuck in my head for the whole day.
So far perfect game / no hitter / shutout for beckett
I’m starting to really believe Joe..man, if he had taken CC out with a no-no, he would have been lambasted by the fans and the media (even though I completely understand the reasoning).
I believe that Girardi would have removed CC in a no hitter-
I also believe that when doing so, CC would have lunged at Girardi like a wildcat on the mound and when he lost every Yankee fan in attendance would have stormed the mound to finish the attack on Girardi
Ledger_Yankees Last time CC threw a no-hitter? Vallejo (Calif.) H.S. Last time Cervi caught one? ’07 in High-A ball. Two combined no-nos in one week. #NYY
jamie O. April 10th, 2010 at 7:24 pm
So far perfect game / no hitter / shutout for beckett
*****************
Whew- that lasted .2 innings. I was scared. Now its over!!!!
Betsy – Hughes rules (pleading the Fifth) April 10th, 2010 at 7:24 pm
I’m starting to really believe Joe..man, if he had taken CC out with a no-no, he would have been lambasted by the fans and the media (even though I completely understand the reasoning).
**************************
Betsy, I believe him. I would hate to be the one to make that decision though! It’s probably a good thing after all that Shoppach broke it up.
“Crawford’s overslide was a continuation play and still a live ball until the umpire calls the play ended.”
Continuation play that’s the term. Thanks GB
Just the first inning but the ump is squeezing Beckett horribly in KC.
Ledger_Yankees “That was as good as I have seen him,” Kelly Shoppach, Sabathia’s former batterymate in Cleveland, and owner of Saturday’s biggest hit. #NYY
GB,
Is Luis Nunez (SS) considered agood prospect?
How do you rate his defence and offence?
But Crawford did not advance one base safely. he was out at second before any stoppage of play.
TarheelYank,
Yes he did. By touching second base before being forced or tagged out, he did advance one base safely.
What if the exact play happened, but a runner on third scored before Cano tagged the runner, would the run have counted? On a force out no, on the tag out yes.
The box score does lists the play as a ‘force out’ (CC to Cano)
jamie O. April 10th, 2010 at 7:24 pm
So far perfect game / no hitter / shutout for beckett
———-
Ended.
Sweet.
In the bottom of the 8th in Trenton, 1st baseman robs Laird of a double.
Gorecki is 2-3 with a double and stolen base is batting. Walks
Daniel Brewer is batting. Lines out to short and 0-4. He’s going to be a fine hitter.
Kevin Smith is batting. Singles and is 1-4
Marcos Vechianocchi batting. strikes out. 0-4. vechionacci’s career has really bottomed out, both offensively and defensively. still only 23 but, it’s his 7th Minor League season.
BloggingBombers Sabathia: “I didn?t even look at my pitch count, to be honest with you. It was the furthest thing from my mind. But obviously Joe was.”
1 minute ago via web
BloggingBombers Girardi: “Shoppach was his last hitter no matter what.” CC: “It would have been a good discussion.”
2 minutes ago via web
Reply Retweet
CB April 10th, 2010 at 7:27 pm
Just the first inning but the ump is squeezing Beckett horribly in KC.
CB == Troll !
Cerevelli called one great game. So good to see the Yankess shake off a loss and come back in dominating fashion the next day.
Sux have Greinkie and Beckett has already given up a run in the first.
“What if the exact play happened, but a runner on third scored before Cano tagged the runner, would the run have counted? On a force out no, on the tag out yes.”
That is a good question. I think the run would not have counted. Do we have an official Lohud scorer around.
BBFan April 10th, 2010 at 7:30 pm
GB,
Is Luis Nunez (SS) considered agood prospect?
How do you rate his defence and offence?
———————————————————————————————————————-
Luis Nunez is probably a better fielder than Eduardo Nunez and but Eduardo is the better hitter and more speed and power. Both could be very good at replacing Jeter in a couple of years, at least on defense. They could force the Yanks to move Pena.
Major league umpires a a very close knit fraternity and routinely takes a round the wagons mentality.
The nonsense Joe West started this week was very unfortunate. Both the Sox and Yanks responded appropriately.
Today CC got squeezed very badly during a no hitter. Often during a no hitter umpires if anything tend to become more generous. They don’t want to be blamed for breaking up a no hitter on a close pitch that extends an at bat.
Bell did the exact opposite.
Were the Red Sox ace also get squeezed tonight that would be worth noting.
Zack is just nasty.
new thread
There is no way Joe takes CC out of a no-hitter. Especially not a respected veteran like Sabathia.
New post with audio from Sabathia.
Beckett’s era 9.53 CY winner Greinke 1.12 Sawx won’t know what hit them tonight!
CC was great today, simply great!
That is a good question. I think the run would not have counted. Do we have an official Lohud scorer around.
Runner “A” is on first and Runner “B”on third, runner “A” takes off and is caught in run down, runner “B” crosses home before runner “A” is tagged out. Run scores, correct.
I am not really sure, and agree this is interesting.
“Runner “A” is on first and Runner “B”on third, runner “A” takes off and is caught in run down, runner “B” crosses home before runner “A” is tagged out. Run scores, correct.”
That would be correct. But the play in question(thankfully) did not involve a runner trying to score. I believe GB is correct. It’s called a continuation play. I believe 1-4.
“Runner “A” is on first and Runner “B”on third, runner “A” takes off and is caught in run down, runner “B” crosses home before runner “A” is tagged out. Run scores, correct.”
Sure looks that way:
Rule 4.09 HOW A TEAM SCORES. (a) One run shall be scored each time a runner legally advances to and touches first, second, third and home base before three men are put out to end the inning.
Moreso:
APPROVED RULING: One out, Jones on third, Smith on first, and Brown flies out to right field. Two outs. Jones tags up and scores after the catch. Smith attempted to return to first but the right fielder’s throw beat him to the base. three outs. But Jones scored before the throw to catch Smith reached first base, hence Jones’ run counts. It was not a force play.
Just made it back from dinner and finished watching the game. CC was just dominant today with the fastball and change. I think if he hadn’t been squeezed and got his pitch count up he may have been strong enough to finish it off. Great all around performance by the Yankees offensively and defensively as well. Arod couldn’t have made a couple of those plays last year. Great game.
http://yankeesgameday.blogspot.....41010.html
The way CC Sabathia pitched against the Rays today you would have thought that David Price had asked his wife if he wanted to lose that bum for a real man (see the way I paid off that Clubber Lang/Rocky reference I set up earlier?). Had Price gone head to head with CC today we would have had a pitching gem for the ages.
GW Plunkett
What you are giving examples of, are not what happened. I agree about the examples, but that is not the play that happened today.
l nunez is a far better fielder than e nunez, but the reverse seems to be true for hitting potential!
I think a better example would be a hitter that runs past 1b safe, but turns the wrong way and is tagged out by the first baseman. how do you score that? IMO that is NOT a hit. It is a continuation play.
Tarheelyank
“What you are giving examples of, are not what happened.”
Yes, because I’m trying to figger out how the rules work here.
7.01 A runner acquires the right to an unoccupied base when he touches it before he is out. He is then entitled to it until he is put out, or forced to vacate it for another runner legally entitled to that base.
I’ve seen the replay now. Crawford definitely touched second before over sliding and getting tagged. It could easily have been scored an error for CC’s throw. But it wasn’t. It could have been scored a FC and an error, but it wasn’t. I don’t see how Zobrist doesn’t get credited with a hit. I’m guessing that folks were caught up in the excitement of watching a potential no no and ignored an obvious point.
“It is a continuation play.”
Which means that play continues. It doesn’t mean that when Crawford was tagged out it was a continuation of the force play. He touched second before he was out. End of force. Just as prescribed in 7.01 above. We aren’t discussing whether the play continues. It does until time is called. But when both runners arrive safely at their bases it’s gotta be scored somehow. Even if both of them are caught off base as part of the same, continuing play.
How is the example I gave above scored?
“How is the example I gave above scored?”
That’s a hit. No difference between being thrown out making a turn towards second and being thrown out sliding into second. If the batter runner touched first safely that’s gotta be a hit (or an error).
i think you are right. That would probably be a hit and out attempting to go to second.
I am having a hard time trying to find an example of the play in question today. Oh well at the least it’s a good question.
“I am having a hard time trying to find an example of the play in question today.”
I suspect what makes it rare are the circumstances. Over sliding bases happens fairly frequently. But how often does it happen in the 7th inning of a no no.
“Oh well at the least it’s a good question.”
It struck me right away. And I’m still not sure I’m correct. Perhaps one of out blog hosts could ask one of the umpires tomorrow. I’d like to know the answer even if I’m wrong.
“(c) When the batter attempts to make a two base hit or a three base hit by sliding, he must hold the last base to which he advances. If he overslides and is tagged out before getting back to the base safely, he shall be credited with only as many bases as he attained safely. If he overslides second base and is tagged out, he shall be credited with a one base hit; if he overslides third base and is tagged out, he shall be credited with a two base hit.”
Ok this is getting close. ” If he overslides and is tagged out before getting back to the base safely, he shall be credited with only as many bases as he attained safely. ”
Also if a runner attempting to steal is put out after an overslide do not credit him with a stolen base.
” If he overslides and is tagged out before getting back to the base safely, he shall be credited with only as many bases as he attained safely. ”
Which seems to suggest that the question is whether initially touching second is considered attaining the base safely. Also, the rule may not be the same for a runner and a batter runner. Crawford was forced to advance. A batter runner is on his own.
“if a runner attempting to steal is put out after an overslide do not credit him with a stolen base.”
That seems a bit quirky.
GW Plunkett
It’s the best I could find.
It is the simple answer of course. It was a fielder’s choice. Had CC went to 1b the batter would have been out. Therfore it makes no difference if he was safe at second or not. He would not be credited with a hit. So simple, and we were trying to make it more difficult than what it was.
It does appear that way:
‘FIELDER’S CHOICE is the act of a fielder who handles a fair grounder and, instead of throwing to first base to put out the batter-runner, throws to another base in an attempt to put out a preceding runner.’
Doesn’t seem to matter whether the attempt is successful.
“Had CC went to 1b the batter would have been out.”
Not if he had made that same throw. But I understand the logic.
“we were trying to make it more difficult than what it was.”
I don’t think we were actually trying to do that. Sometimes it happens anyway. The FC scoring rule takes precedence–which seems counterintuitive.